holy shit
#High Science Multiplier
steep spindle
vagrant anchor
Probably 100 crafts as well
steep spindle
So the stages are (All requiring power)
S1: 500 (take 
out)
S2: 100 ( 
,
,
, 
, 
) ( byproduct)
S3: 500 ( 100% ( 
/ 
/ 
15% per craft for 5 ore) take out of building
S4: 100 ( , , 
, 
, , )
S5: 100 ( 
, , 
, 
, 
, )
S6: 50? (
Electric Engine Unit, Refined Concrete, Radar)
steep spindle
Probably 100 crafts as well
yep...
wonder if the first rocket is free
LOL
um I think it was less than 100
but now its normal
haha
vagrant anchor
@steep spindle can you send me your 2lane chunk aligned rail bp
im too lazy to make my own
steep spindle
which one?
its this book
which still has a few issues with junctions tbh but I've just been building around them
steep spindle
this issue exists to much
because of all the rail changes I am waiting and will also be making my own come 2.0
quiet sandal
need this pic so I don't landfill the wrong spot
modern citrus
Rail changes is one thing I am EAGERLY AWAITING 2.0 for…. That and the quality stuff
steep spindle
Rail changes is one thing I am EAGERLY AWAITING 2.0 for…. That and the quality s...
due to also running one of these world come 2.0 outta the gate (yeah I'm crazy) I'tll be one of the first things on the todo list
modern citrus
Can’t wait to play with and decide how exactly I want to incorporate the el-way into my rail BP’s
vagrant anchor
Welp... Guess I'll just afk today after setting up rare metals
Still have only like 2 electric furnaces because stack inserters are stealing all the damn steel
steep spindle
this is blowing my mind
quiet sandal
Landfill Plus is an essential mod
steep spindle
why so?
steep spindle
remove the placed landfill?
quiet sandal
yeah
though it does cause graphical glitches when walking near the edges of landfill
vagrant anchor
Landfill isn't even that expensive
Just make sure you don't accidently landfill stuff you didn't need to
quiet sandal
Landfill isn't even that expensive
that's not why you'd want to pick it up
vagrant anchor
You can do that by simply including the landfill in your bp
Just include the landfill in your BP and make the bots build it
quiet sandal
and including landfill in blueprints is not exactly easy to do
steep spindle
NOICE!
modern citrus
Sure it is. You just have to make the blueprint on landfill in the first place. Load up a test world and make your blueprint, then take it back to your real world
vagrant anchor
and including landfill in blueprints is not exactly easy to do
Editor
steep spindle
this thing gonna rip when I get this research done
steep spindle
waterfall tech
vagrant anchor
Yeah but each is using a full belt right?
vagrant anchor
Even if no you have a a balancer
It should just balance itself out after stuff backs up
No need to use so many splitters
steep spindle
guess thats where we differ, I hate manifolds
but factorio is a lot of manifold builds
which is kinda funny
stuck dove
hello
stuck dove
decided to do 2 full belts of red/green science
getting blue inserters, then I will actually unlock green science
long mauve
goodnight
long mauve
1M blue science, the factory is growing
quiet sandal
I've really shrunk this patch
long mauve
always fun to see them shrink
long mauve
the factory must grow!
quiet sandal
I'm nearing 90 hours in and I don't have it built yet...
long mauve
I havent afked much at all so that could be a difference
quiet sandal
just have so many other things to build
long mauve
I do also use companion drones so building isnt painful
steep spindle
<:laugh:671580469766258698>
That's gonna be... Yeah, insanely interesting
long mauve
not as insane as doing a 1000x science run though :P
steep spindle
not as insane as doing a 1000x science run though :P
True did you see that mod?
mossy saddle
That's gonna be... Yeah, insanely interesting
Yeah I'll made a dedicated prod for those
stuck dove
I've been using Tiny Start, which just starts you with a small modular armor and personal bots
long mauve
no
long mauve
I've been using Tiny Start, which just starts you with a small modular armor and...
that is way less powerful than companion drones
steep spindle
mossy saddle
Imagine doing an x1000 science run couldn't be me
steep spindle
And that mod was like ok, no fuck you
stuck dove
lol
this "challenge" reminds me of a mod called Omniscience, which adjusts science costs to be exponential or something
long mauve
except this is painful from the start :D
stuck dove
yeah
steep spindle
#1188693488464834623 message is a little bit better laid out, that front number is the required amount of crafts to advance to the next stage
stuck dove
I had fun making a full-yellow-belt-of-red-science base without splitters and undergrounds though
steep spindle
And then the actual rockets can start
long mauve
ah ok
steep spindle
Yeah I'll made a dedicated prod for those
Currently trying to think of a way to have all the requirements beforehand
long mauve
I had fun making a full-yellow-belt-of-red-science base without splitters and un...
it was torture yeah
steep spindle
I had fun making a full-yellow-belt-of-red-science base without splitters and un...
Fun yeah? 
stuck dove
I had basically normal furnace stacks, I just had to make separate miners for each one
I wonder if I can find screenshots I posted
stuck dove
steep spindle
That works too
steep spindle
That explains why your stuff was everywhere
stuck dove
wym why my stuff was everywhere
steep spindle
Unable to use splitter so you have to route belts everywhere
stuck dove
oh, yeah
then I unlocked logistics (and lights) and was able to create my completely full main bus
if you look closely, you can see that the 16x16 blueprint I was using had a backwards underground that took me ages to notice
stuck dove
ya
I found it eventually when it wasn't working right, I had assumed it was me turning it into a 15x15 that broke it at first
steep spindle
People get confused why I take forever to build, it is because I want to build it and leave it
And try to design myself
5 bps in the base aren't mine, rest I figured out
stuck dove
my current base is just ratio'd out for 2 belts of red + green science
though I haven't researched green yet
so all I have is my lonely single-item-sushi
steep spindle
I'd show you Galaga science but I logged for the night
That might be next on the beacon to do list
mossy saddle
Currently trying to think of a way to have all the requirements beforehand
Put some of the rss in storage chests and bot them over?
steep spindle
Put some of the rss in storage chests and bot them over?
How would you bot the water?
mossy saddle
Barrels
I got the pump anywhere mod too
Is it possible to destroy it while it's building?
Or can you move it later on
steep spindle
I didn't try that
quiet sandal
nearly done building my new power plant
steep spindle
But I'd hope it's moveable
steep spindle
Is it possible to destroy it while it's building?
You can destroy it, but it take forever too, it's one of those mods your have to know for damn sure that's where it goes
steep spindle
nearly done building my new power plant
Wow, neat looking
stuck dove
im considering beelining to trains and nuclear
however, I have installed discovery tree for some reason
also qol research which has 150k science for tier 1
mossy saddle
You can destroy it, but it take forever too, it's one of those mods your have to...
Even if it's T1?
steep spindle
Even if it's T1?
Didn't try that either I tried it when it was fully done and it made me rebuild it
When I get there Imma do a few tests in editor extensions to see
steep spindle
Yw, if not that's good to know knowledge
stuck dove
beautiful, almost got Logistic Science Packs
also turns out that this can NOT fuel 600 labs
oh wow logistic science consumes packs at 1 per 5 seconds
long mauve
yeah that research is the quickest in the game
mossy saddle
When you get to like 30s a science it should be good
quiet sandal
once my new power plant is built it'll add 576MW to my power grid
not enough though
I need to build another one after this
mossy saddle
Never enough!
stuck dove
I'm currently at 200 Steam Boilers, which is 5 Offshore Pumps
180 MW
I'm using just over a third of that
stuck dove
I'm just 1800 SPM on red rn
30 seconds from Green science, which I already have the materials for
mossy saddle
Ooh you should have plenty then!
stuck dove
I have my funny 2 full belt sushi machine as well
mossy saddle
I've got like 250MW of power on 3 sciences 1.8k
You could use a 2-4 balancer then when you don't do research you got some big buffer
vagrant anchor
I've got like 250MW of power on 3 sciences 1.8k
i use like 900MW with a mix of asm1s and asm2s for 3.6k red/green/blue just for your reference
you might want to build more than 1GW for some extra power in case
mossy saddle
I haven't gotten blue yet 🥲
Maybe today!
My block should be able to make 3.6k not sure though just made the starting rss
vagrant anchor
also make sure to make a lot of steel for mall
1 yellow belt of iron ore gives so little steel
mossy saddle
Oh I thought you already used reds?
vagrant anchor
it was my bootstrapped steel
and i havent gotten around to making more
ill probably just get a mine hook up another red belt
long mauve
hopefully this is enough iron ore until purple science
mossy saddle
never enough!
vagrant anchor
3.6k spm is still so incredibly slow
still like 20 hours of continous research away from all the stuff i need to build the new base
mossy saddle
time to double!
vagrant anchor
dont have the ups to 😭
and im also just too lazy
ill do like 10.8k with dupeboxes for new base
mossy saddle
still crashing ups?
does wood have the same effect as coal in the fuel processor or will I need more coalN
vagrant anchor
55 if I don't do anything else and zoom fully into empty space, this is after replacing some asm1s with asm2s and some inserters with stack inserters
It is any burnable fuel other than processed fuel itself iirc
mossy saddle
so every fuel you put in it has the same value?
since all my coal patches are biter territory almost
vagrant anchor
so every fuel you put in it has the same value?
It just increases fuel value by 20%
So put in 10MJ of fuel get out 12MJ
mossy saddle
oh alright
mossy saddle
froggy do you have meteors?
vagrant anchor
cant turn it off, so i just made the max interval as big as possible
unless theres some option that i missed
it is like once every 10 hours
last night when i was afking a meteor striked my base luckily it was in my mall stuff area that had roboport coverage
would have been really mad if it striked my science belts and stopped science for like 10 hours
mossy saddle
was thinking about it just now since you said you didn't have emf
steep spindle
Today after work I think I'll be doing power and waiting for 
mossy saddle
I've officially booted my brick layout up
steep spindle
Nice
modern citrus
Got stack inserters last night. Need to get military and blue sciences researched so o can start getting those techs
steep spindle
Might go get military just to run over a train with a tank
steep spindle
Naw train deaths I got a vengeance with them now. Need tank 😂
Oh
That makes sense
modern citrus
I don’t have trains (yet) in my game lol
steep spindle
Ah
mossy saddle
I got sniped my meteors 3x in my research setup in the past hour.. x-x
languid stump
I got sniped my meteors 3x in my research setup in the past hour.. x-x
Aren’t the point defenses unlocked early on?
languid stump
Ah nice!
quiet sandal
setting up these three coal patches, and the radar I placed down reveals another patch
languid stump
Oh to the water ok
quiet sandal
it's not that far so I don't really think it needs a train
but, maybe I should use one anyway
it would save me like 3K red belts
mossy saddle
setting up these three coal patches, and the radar I placed down reveals another...
you got loads more luck then me
mossy saddle
But I also have zero trains lol
you don't have trains yet?
quiet sandal
nah he has trains but doesn't use them
mossy saddle
ooh that's interesting
so he belts all the ore patches x-x?
that's gonna be atleast 50k belts
languid stump
I process near the ore patches which compresses most the bulk
But yeah I do use a lot of belts
Like purp science is 31 belts of iron ore but I belt steel plate long distance and iron plate short range to the red chip plant
So the only long belts are like 4 stone ore, 3 stone brick, 6 steel
2 coal
mossy saddle
can I see the total production of how many belts you've made xd
languid stump
Yeah sure I’ll post it soon xD
quiet sandal
But yeah I do use a lot of belts
I mean, why though
mossy saddle
thank you!
languid stump
Because these ore patches are hundreds of million and trains suck without investment
quiet sandal
trains are faster and much cheaper very versatile sushi belts
languid stump
They need stack size upgrades, unlocking them in the first place, etc
I would have had to hand built twice as much to get to bots
Then after bots, I asked myself if I even need them… I think no.
steep spindle
People tell me to go bots then do trains
I have yet to put a bot in my base
Being considered only for train mall
mossy saddle
xD I don't have bots either I found trains much more usefull..
steep spindle
Also preps shenanigans if the cargo rocket in 2.0 can be train load/unload
mossy saddle
this is all I have 🥲
languid stump
The dreaded city bricks
mossy saddle
brick blocks!
it's my first time using them though
I got no designs preplanned I just build as I go
quiet sandal
languid stump
Have you considered what that is doing to your north south traffic?
languid stump
So many left turns just to go straight :p
mossy saddle
I took inspiration from my spinal column
steep spindle
I'm at the NEED to get done
mossy saddle
how much research left?
steep spindle
because this goes from 2.7 belts to like 4.2
mossy saddle
ooh that's a good buff by 50%
stuck dove
ore patch running out :(
steep spindle
Yeah Wavetrex helped last night
languid stump
Ore being everywhere and free for the taking is kinda why I have no trains :p
Whatever I need, there is a set of ore patches somewhere with the stuff relatively close
stuck dove
I may have to actually go look for iron
there is only soup
steep spindle
I may have to actually go look for iron
there is only soup
what is that mod in the top left?
stuck dove
YARM
steep spindle
O.o ty
stuck dove
thats the list of ores
steep spindle
yah
stuck dove
Yet Another Resource Manager or something
the one in the actual top left is GUI Unifyer
with Factory Planner, Module Inserter, and YARM buttons
aha, I knew the Big Brother research was worth it
2.9M just on what's revealed I think, I wonder how big the actual ore patch is
I'm probably going to run like 20 yellow belts or something to my base lol
unless I have enough to get trains, which I might
oh wow my 200 steam engines are already at their limit
guess I should prepare another 200
steep spindle
Yikes
quiet sandal
finished my power plant
640 steam engines
576MW of power
all the coal mines are now built
oops
I may have forgotten an important part of the rails
one of the most bizarre things I've seen
why does that inserter have a fish in it???
woooo
936MW of power!
and it's still not enough!
languid stump
100%
Nuclear???
You crazy :D.
I guess it doesn’t matter that much in the scheme of things but I’m pretty sure it’s about 1000 blue science to get you prod2/speed2/ beacons
Or well 1000* 1000 ofc
And the cost of these (not coal) power plants is basically tech cost + cost per MW
In vanilla the equal MW for solar and nuclear is 40 MW!
But if you make it 1000(tech cost) + cost per MW… does the equivalent MW become like 40 GW??
Anyway, that’s why I chose solar fields 
steep spindle
I guess it doesn’t matter that much in the scheme of things but I’m pretty sure ...
It's a million
Science packs
languid stump
Or well 1000* 1000 ofc
Mhm.
modern citrus
Might be interesting to see a cost analysis between solar, nuclear, and solid fuel boilers in a X1k game … I am honestly not sure if I want to bother with nuclear instead of just doing oodles and oodles of SF fueled boilers. And I dislike the space requirements of solar
languid stump
Solid fuel seems nice, I didn’t give myself as max of oil as I did other things or would have just used that
In fact I will probably research coal liq to help with yellow science
Solid fuel requires no additional tech, comes out before the others…
modern citrus
Yea
languid stump
I’m Considering solar to need construction bots, at these scales
Also since you only need a power line to move power, you can just drive the car far from home placing poles for more juice
stuck dove
solar also has no additional tech
since you're getting solar panels and accumulators for the satellite, and there's no way you're not getting bots
languid stump
I guess you’re right about that
It felt a bit additional compared to getting beacons, though
Could like, get beacons on solid fuel, drop a new red / green maker near the end to surge out solar and accumulator
stuck dove
also I have created a new balancer for my ore
now it will be balanced
languid stump
That could also allow you to buffer some purple and yellow while you get solar / accum instead of making it at full speed near the end
languid stump
@mossy saddle
stuck dove
are you making normal tileable solar blueprints?
or are you doing sushi blood vessels with isolated roboports? I remember you did something similar
languid stump
I’m just doing it normal style
But yeah I think sushi would be really really good for this
My essentially infinite resources available let’s me run a degenerately huge roboport grid and thousands of construction bots
6000 rn
Building up to 10k as needed
Might even allow more
But it would have been really nice for not walking back and forth to the mall so much in the earlier game…
mossy saddle
<@285689884985786368>
wahaha nice!
you still use the yellows?
don't you need yellow for red
steep spindle
https://mods.factorio.com/mod/Rocket-Silo-Construction @mossy saddle List of materials is in the mod portal page
languid stump
just reds!
the yellows were from before red
the pitiful pre module circuit flow
languid stump
Ok I just gotta connect some stone, smelt some stone brick, steel, purple science should start 
I got my prod2s started getting made now
Shoulda done that a while ago, oh well
stuck dove
ok instead of fixing my iron problem, or researching something like red belts, engines, assembler 2s, solar power, or steel furnaces
I got some circuits so I can make a sushi mall
stuck dove
ok my iron is low
I got circuits
now my iron and coal is low
hm
steep spindle
languid stump
everything workin
slowly, haha
only 161 spm 
7 hours for beacons welp
I guess its fine since rocket fuel is gonna take me 5 hours anyway
steep spindle
Speed and Prod 2's
languid stump
languid stump
only slightly
No prod modules in the purple machines??
That’s wild 
I think I know something that could help the shortage :D.
Seriously prod1 pays for itself in ohh 5 min :D.
stuck dove
behold, this is awful
steep spindle
if only I could keep it stable
long mauve
behold, this is awful
beautiful
steep spindle
🤔
long mauve
free output
steep spindle
free x3 of the science?
languid stump
Yep lol
I’ve got prod2 in mine even
But I maybe Should temporarily put in speeds to unlock beacons faster
I need to now design yellow science though as purple is practically done
Just needs more steel input as it speeds up
Taking a look at yellow science, seems pretty manageable if I split it up into 3 regions, 1 for each input. 1 iron and copper patch for the robot frames, 1-2 iron / copper for the lds and 1-2 for processing unit, and im good to go I think
Pretty much have those around… shouldn’t be too bad
stuck dove
egg
quiet sandal
trying to copy my entire factory brings my FPS down to 11 lmao
vagrant anchor
Yeah don't hold a big blueprint in the world the rendering is very expensive
You can hover it over the minimap to make it not show on the screen
steep spindle
rate calculator on my hold base hits 1.5fps
quiet sandal
You can hover it over the minimap to make it not show on the screen
that's exactly what I did
I didn't even copy it
just using the copy tool over my entire factory does that
quiet sandal
661MW on the furnaces
damn
so sulfur doesn't require a ton of water
I think I'll just use a train for it
steep spindle
not really no
I know we can't normally GIF in places
and I prolly sound like a 2yr old, but all I picture when adding solar to the base is "MOAR POWER" from the stupid spongebob episode
steep spindle
time to crank it up
long mauve
steep spindle
long mauve
thats the plan for mine, I did include landfill just under roboports and power poles though
over ore patches 
long mauve
yeah thats why i dont crank ore patch frequency up a lot
steep spindle
QoL research while we wait for a 
buffer
long mauve
thats why trains are good, buffers are built in :D
quiet sandal
I found a way to make my sulfur setup really compact
steep spindle
not wearing headphones be like....
vagrant anchor
just using the copy tool over my entire factory does that
You can zoom in in map view start the selection zoom out go over to the other corner and end the selection
Your fps will still drop but it's much faster
quiet sandal
You can zoom in in map view start the selection zoom out go over to the other co...
ok you seem to just not understand
vagrant anchor
I do understand
It's just a faster way to do it
Unless you don't have radars over your entire base
quiet sandal
for one thing there's no reason why I'd actually want to copy my entire factory
but two, just copying the whole thing no matter what situation or way I'd do it drops my FPS to 11
which again, isn't a problem because there's no reason I'd actually want to copy my entire factory
vagrant anchor
It'll drop your fps either way but I just told you a trick to do it if you really needed to
quiet sandal
(which is what I had already done)
stuck dove
I haven't really done much with megabases
can I stick with 1800 spm without having to do ups stuff?
quiet sandal
easily
stuck dove
I'll scale up later
quiet sandal
but 1800 SPM is kinda slow for later researches
tame adder
Wait so if you’re making 1800 spm on a 1000x setting, does that mean you’re actually making 1.8 mil science (in terms of resource consumption) or just that your research speed is 1000x slower
modern citrus
The craptop I’m playing on is doing fine with 1800 SPM (though I dont have the lab speed for that amount of consumption with only 800 labs on any science slower than 30 seconds)
tame adder
like does the 1000x setting mean you need more resources or more labs
candid shadow
yes
modern citrus
Not dropping below 59.9 UPS
candid shadow
1000x research cost
so both the cost of resources and the labs needed to process the science packs
tame adder
I see
quiet sandal
Wait so if you’re making 1800 spm on a 1000x setting, does that mean you’re actu...
1000x just means you need 1000x more science packs for the same research, so the time spent is equivalent to 1.8 SPM, but your resource requirements are far higher
vagrant anchor
With 1.8k spm you might need to do some ups stuff since you don't have access to a lot of the later game stuff
tame adder
But you don’t need, say, 1000 gears for 1 red science?
vagrant anchor
No, the research itself is more expenisve
quiet sandal
the cost of the science packs does not change
vagrant anchor
1.8spm is horribly slow though
quiet sandal
yes
tame adder
Oof 😭
vagrant anchor
Maybe even 5.4k
tame adder
Why are you using multiples of 1.8?
quiet sandal
belts
tame adder
?
quiet sandal
900 SPM is one yellow belt
tame adder
Ah
tame adder
how many hours has it taken y’all to get to this
vagrant anchor
You can finish <100h vanilla if you are fast
quiet sandal
I'm quite a bit slower doing this
tame adder
Oh lmao I feel out classed
quiet sandal
currently at 92 hours, have ran out of stuff to research and am currently building chemical science
long mauve
I have more experience than you though
steep spindle
I'm at 255hrs (granted a bit of afk time) and (1k hours played total)
tame adder
Ah, fair
vagrant anchor
Well here people usually turn off biters and have maxed resource settings so yeah
long mauve
time doesnt really matter, no need to speedrun the game
quiet sandal
once I have bots and advanced oil processing I'm going to be immediatley going for production science
the only time limitation imo is if you run out of stuff to research
which I have, so I'm going too slow
vagrant anchor
Make your design beacon compatible from then on
long mauve
im wondering if I should do that for future smelting lines now
quiet sandal
I'm gonna have to build a dedicated module mall
quiet sandal
<:eyes:491870186866212864>
10x more!
steep spindle
we can yeet 2GW now
vagrant anchor
Haven't really started using beacons I assume?
vagrant anchor
Ah
steep spindle
trying to let purple back up slightly
quiet sandal
eh.....
my petroleum gas trains are running out of coal...
the only place they actually get coal from is my plastic build but it's not guaranteed they'll consistently go there, especially not now when it's idling
vagrant anchor
If you can use solid fuel for trains, they have more acceleration
quiet sandal
well I guess I could
vagrant anchor
You can use a refueling stop, or you can bring the fuel to the stations
quiet sandal
my plastic build is near my refinery though so I think for now I'll just run a belt over there
refueling stop requires a mod atm
quiet sandal
I just split off the coal train whenever a build uses it
quiet sandal
You just make them go to it every few cycles
well I guess it'd work if I used time passed or an inactivity timer but having them consistently go there will just be a pain
vagrant anchor
Yeah, so you can also just bring the fuel to the stations
Most your stations won't have a burnable thing lying around
modern citrus
for train refuelling, I pick one of (pick up, drop off) and just send fuel to that type of station. That way they always get fuel whenever they go to that type, which is every other stop. I usually choose drop off because pick up would mean taking fuel to every mine and IMO that is just silly
languid stump
Every once in a while something like sulfuric acid makes sense to fuel at the pickup
But yeah just depends
stuck dove
just sulfuric acid as far as resources go
builder trains or supply trains would be fueled at pickup too
quiet sandal
oops
tame adder
lol
steep spindle
grrrr.. almost got me again
quiet sandal
how does the bot train work
or mall train
is it just a personal train you drive around?
steep spindle
currently
I'm looking into a mall train a legit mall train very shortly
I need to go clean this one out
LOL
vagrant anchor
I'm still thinking about how an actual mall train will work
The big issue is I don't have requester chests
steep spindle
I have a design idea in my head
vagrant anchor
Which is really annoying to make a mall train since my mall design isn't exactly train friendly
steep spindle
I just dont know how to properly make a mall
vagrant anchor
I might just wait until I have requesters for a mall train
Though at that point I probably don't need it anymore since beacons make builds much smaller
steep spindle
like, I'm trying to think of a mall that is belt based, and can do a mall train
because its a builder, and a mining outpost train too
languid stump
Include a sushi belt to output your product onto
quiet sandal
Though at that point I probably don't need it anymore since beacons make builds ...
at that point I might just do everything remotely
vagrant anchor
Include a sushi belt to output your product onto
Good idea
steep spindle
Include a sushi belt to output your product onto
hmmm....
quiet sandal
my engineer doesn't need to take a single step
steep spindle
that actually isn't a bad Idea because its a mall based item
vagrant anchor
I'm still not sure if I should keep the robot networks seperate though
steep spindle
and I have a belt mod that would make that a cakewalk
vagrant anchor
It'll be hard to make them seperate
Especially since I'll need to supply the local network with bots that won't really ever be used after building it
vagrant anchor
Have you done a builder train before?
steep spindle
Have you done a builder train before?
me personally? no
steep spindle
2 closest things I have to a mall is this
vagrant anchor
Without the 2.0 changes I feel like a builder train won't really help a lot
languid stump
I’ve done automatic construction sushi belts, trains, network boundary -inserter boxes, and SE cargo rockets
I love making automatic construction systems tbh
But I still did a degenerate roboport grid for some reason this game 
lol
languid stump
Without the 2.0 changes I feel like a builder train won't really help a lot
I dunno, it can be really strong
languid stump
2 closest things I have to a mall is this
Make your own! It’s not that hard tbh
vagrant anchor
I don't want to seperate the networks because that means a lot of bots are wasted and just stuck there though
vagrant anchor
And also I can't really know what stuff I'll need there
Will end up having buffers of stuff that just won't be used
And with the expensive buildings later on don't really want that
languid stump
well, you can go for more of a dynamic train system
vagrant anchor
I could use inactivity and disable stations yeah
languid stump
my construction sushi belt is pretty dynamic like that
steep spindle
hmmm
vagrant anchor
im just not sure how much itll really help if its all on the same network
languid stump
you can also run signals on your main circuit network, if you only use the 'special' request train that runs off signals on the electric poles on one outpost at once, it can run from mall to outpost with rare items.
vagrant anchor
because all the bots even super far away will still try to construct
languid stump
then you can use a generic train for the standard bulk items you wont mind buffering in excess.
languid stump
because all the bots even super far away will still try to construct
thats now how it works ?
languid stump
im just not sure how much itll really help if its all on the same network
oh nvm
yeah no with a builder train you make different networks
thats like the whole point xd
how to move items into a new network?
vagrant anchor
yeah i supposed that as well, but a lot of wasted construction bots
languid stump
eh not really, you need so few to build things in small networks
because theyre small
vagrant anchor
and also just isolating it is hard because i want my rail bp to include ports
languid stump
honestly small networks save bots (imo)
vagrant anchor
ill see what i can do ig
languid stump
and also just isolating it is hard because i want my rail bp to include ports
thats possible!
thats what my sushi rails system is all about
but ofc it uses sushi construction
vagrant anchor
maybe ill use the vehicle roboport to place the roboport isolated
quiet sandal
very simple way to move water around
vagrant anchor
ill probably use a wire for showing what i dont have enough supply of, and use another wire for builder train requests
and only have one stop active at a time
stuck dove
I just dont know how to properly make a mall
I have some advice: do not do this
it sucks
i researched circuits just for this while my base was dying
vagrant anchor
that throughput 
languid stump
yeah lol
if you do sushi you wanna take the most common things and still give them dedicated belts
sushi for like.. stone ore, batteries, processing units, concrete, etc is nice xd
but not iron plate and gears and green chips i think!
or sushi for the output is nice too
steep spindle
car placing solar array
steep spindle
still not a bot in this base 🙂
modern citrus
would be even easier than car … though I dread the research cost of the thing!
steep spindle
not even that many to get to it, but its a metric fuck ton of science
modern citrus
Yea, I just looked it up myself
steep spindle
350k 
just for a tank
modern citrus
Only reason I want to research is for the armor. Who needs a tank in a x1k game without biters?
steep spindle
all trees must die
modern citrus
Nades
Or bots to gather the trees up and send them to the furnace (boiler) for CL steam, or just to waste electricity on a small dedicated power grid
Alternatively .. remove the Alien Biomes mod from the game’s modlist
steep spindle
I dont have that mod
modern citrus
I like the variety it offers for terrain. Removing it mid-game, however, clears all rocks/trees from generated chunks and turns all generated chunks to grassland. Though I did not check to see if that included landfill
quiet sandal
god damn it
steep spindle
muahahah its contagious!
stuck dove
which starting settings should I use?
(I am making a new game because tinystart and rso are actually upsetting me)
vagrant anchor
Even the game is telling you to watch your step
Recommend turning water to both minimum
You get some pretty common small water patches you have to build around but you can just landfill later and you also always have water quite nearby
stuck dove
alright, figured having a lake nearby-ish would be useful for nuclear
even if I'm not sure I'll ever get there : ^)
oh wow that looks annoying
it's like cliffs
vagrant anchor
alright, figured having a lake nearby-ish would be useful for nuclear
even if I'...
By the time you get nuclear you'll want to use solar for the ups
vagrant anchor
oh wow that looks annoying
it's like cliffs
You can turn up scale if you want, but this usually isn't too bad to build around until you have landfill
Landfill is quite early in
modern citrus
I always turn both water settings to max, actually. Largest size, largest frequency. Means I’ve got large oceans, not a marsh of many tiny ponds
long mauve
purple science is starting up!
stuck dove
so companion drones are just burner construction bots with guns?
I see they fuel themselves with deforestation but is there any way to automate it?
long mauve
automate refueling them? it hasnt been an issue for me, if they run out I just pick up some coal
quiet sandal
god damn it
yeah, thanks, milestones.
now that I have nothing to research, my factory is completely idling
vagrant anchor
Steel production is still killing my mall
But at least I have modules and stuff now
Just need to wait for portable solar panels for trains
vagrant anchor
For the builder train, I'm thinking of doing 1 loading and 1 unloading station on at any time, should be enough throughput I think
Probably will do a cycle thing which will then check if a supply is needed
modern citrus
When using Enable/Disable, make absolutely sure that at least one station on the train’s route is NEVER turned off.
@vagrant anchor
steep spindle
Man I need to get the asm3's today
mossy saddle
do you have it researched yet?
steep spindle
Nope
But I have 6 machines ready to create it
Ran into a circuit issue
That can only fix itself with
If I would have let it afk I would have it, but I don't want any more afk hours
build
stuck dove
would like about 12 more coal miners to get a belt of red science without stealing from my mall, but I don't think it's going to happen lol
also my spawn is dangoreous
quiet sandal
I specifically chose a world that didn't have mixed ore patches
using that in general sucks, waiting until you have 20,000 red packs to get logistics is even worse
stuck dove
yeah it took me half an hour for it to finish lol
modern citrus
I had 20 red science makers and 40 labs and it took me forever to get those 20k for splitters/undergrounds
quiet sandal
well, yeah
20 red science makers is 4 SPM
SPS*
120 SPM isn't much
my "starter" red science was 450 SPM
modern citrus
In retrospect it was insufficient, but I’ve got 800 labs atm and I’m making 1800 red+green. Can’t consume it all on any researches that are more than 30 sec per set, I need more research speed but need to get blue for that. Or I could rejigger the entire factory and go from 20x20 lab squares to 30x30 lab squares. Don’t really want to move stuff to make room for that
Sulfur, military science, and blue science are my next three techs to research 😛
stuck dove
my starter base was 900 spm
quiet sandal
I had to rebuild my labs for green science and now I'm gonna have to rebuild them again for chem science, but now that I'm using a train base anyway I am planning this one to support all sciences
steep spindle
My starter was 1200
steep spindle
Quickly amped to 1800 after splitter then 3600
quiet sandal
targetting 3.6K SPM right now
steep spindle
targetting 3.6K SPM right now
Good number to shoot at tbh
quiet sandal
my current tech level would require 2,400 labs
long mauve
Thanks for reminding me, I can now steal them from purple science
quiet sandal
trying to figure out how to design my red circuits
long mauve
i would design it in a way thats easily scalable
steep spindle
@mossy saddle its being tested not in a test environment haha
also needing to figure out a design for labs
vagrant anchor
There's plenty of megabase lab blueprints you could just grab if you want
vagrant anchor
speedy though
quiet sandal
ok so half a red belt of output for red circuits is 120 machines, and that would use one belt each for green circuits, plastic, and copper plates
quiet sandal
I built this on the left but after checking the blueprint I already made on the right all I had to do was switch the wire and green circuit/plastic belts for it to work at full throughput
mossy saddle
<@285689884985786368> its being tested not in a test environment haha
How did it go!!
steep spindle
How did it go!!
Didn't get very far lol got distracted
mossy saddle
XD oh! I fell asleep to early yesterday sadly to play
quiet sandal
just barely fits on my screen fully zoomed out
steep spindle
XD oh! I fell asleep to early yesterday sadly to play
It is a metric fuck ton on stone tho, like 50k I think
vagrant anchor
Wood?
vagrant anchor
What you need wood for
vagrant anchor
It gives you that amount
The silo construction mod?
mossy saddle
What you need wood for
Tech cards xD
vagrant anchor
You are meant to recycle that back as stone bricks I think
vagrant anchor
Tech cards xD
Basic tech gets gone quite quickly
steep spindle
Ummm... You use more stone bricks than that
vagrant anchor
Im already kinda starting to run out of techs lol
mossy saddle
Is it more then 50k in Stone bricks?
vagrant anchor
Really need to get the new base going
mossy saddle
Are you in space already or still nauvis
vagrant anchor
Ummm... You use more stone bricks than that
Yeah, so you need to feed the byproduct stone back into the stone brick production first
vagrant anchor
Are you in space already or still nauvis
Still working on rail base
Designing stuff rn
mossy saddle
Oooo show me what you got!
vagrant anchor
Builder train design should be almost done
mossy saddle
Don't kill your ups xD
vagrant anchor
Not built yet just designing my rail blueprints
I'll use dupe box and go from ore to science which shouldn't kill my ups much
And then I'll cut all inputs to old base and deconstruct the entire thing
mossy saddle
I'll try not using dupe box
vagrant anchor
You will need it lategame
Deep space science in normal multiplier already requires pretty large scale
mossy saddle
We'll see 
vagrant anchor
The really annoying part of this run will be getting to space scaffolding
mossy saddle
Ouchhhh
vagrant anchor
which means probably need to go to asteroid belt to build science
100spm in the norbit asteroid should be doable but a pain
itll take like an entire day of afk just to get space scaffolding
mixed rocket is going to be used for sure to save some space though
vagrant anchor
maybe i can do some shenanigans with the few extra requesters and buffer chests
long mauve
I have made purple!
steep spindle
Is it more then 50k in Stone bricks?
I don't think it'll be more than 50k but I could be wrong
steep spindle
Your recipe looks like hell
steep spindle
Yeah, not to much more. But enough to matter
mossy saddle
The rocket control Unites and heat shielding 
steep spindle
The rocket control Unites and heat shielding <a:Dieopps:1175376473159376936>
Oh God
mossy saddle
Well if you don't see me those killed me
steep spindle
Yikes
steep spindle
Well if you don't see me those killed me
They aren't till stage 6 tho
Think of that mod in 2.0 haha
mossy saddle
😆 they won't add that to 2.0 right?
steep spindle
😆 they won't add that to 2.0 right?
What if they did something like it
I think that would be fun
I need to go to sleep tho gnight
quiet sandal
damn
quiet sandal
red circuits
steep spindle
Oh, nice
quiet sandal
5400/m
quiet sandal
now I just need to design the train system before I build this
quiet sandal
Well it’s not gonna work for a while anyway
I still need to build copper smelting, more iron smelting, then green circuits…
After that I have to design and build chemical science, plus build red and green science
Then the labs…
stuck dove
ok I'm basically back where I left off, just gotta wait for green science, then I can just set the assemblers and then I can get landfill and actually make the base work at full power
vagrant anchor
circuits are such more of a headache than coding
ill just not use a builder train for now
wanted to do a smart and easily expandable system and everything just ruins my day
steep spindle
Nice
steep spindle
Factoriolab is on crack. 29 silos needed for 5k/m 
vagrant anchor
fully t3 speed beaconed one silo should be 1k/m
long mauve
980* it’s just short of 1k
mossy saddle
not allowed yet!
long mauve
oh yes.
I guess I dont have to double my production.. its just so slow in the beginning without beacons
I might preplan 3600 spm of red/blue/green with beacons, double purple, to account for it. And also design beaconed designs for smelting and circuits
yeah still lots to do. Need some blue chip production and more modules
languid stump
Yeah, I got the purple science for beacons off 160 spm xD
Finished now, gonna go improve purple production and start assembly mk3
steep spindle
If my circuits worked my purple would be 900/m
mossy saddle
@vagrant anchor do you have a good automation core build?
languid stump
If my circuits worked my purple would be 900/m
I wonder what I’ll get with beacons
steep spindle
I wonder what I’ll get with beacons
long mauve
have you not tested it with beacons? that what I did with mine and stripped it down
also im considering rushing blue belts so i can belt weave more easily in beaconed designs and dont have to upgrade designs again
long mauve
oh true same
languid stump
looks like every beacon I have ghosted will be built in 1 hour.
long mauve
thats really fast
languid stump
well, I guess its time to start working on yellow science xd
yeah I only have beacons on circuits and purple science
long mauve
im gonna work on beaconing everything before I get to yellow I think, or do them in parallel
time to hit the editor and steal a bunch of premade endgame prints to strip down
steep spindle
im gonna work on beaconing everything before I get to yellow I think, or do them...
I'm beacon everything to get more production
long mauve
yeah thats the plan, I desperately need it
I also need to be way more careful with where I place train stations. I had to redo an area do to train throughput
languid stump
use the space!
long mauve
yup, I was doing it way to close because bots are slow
switching to a rail 96x96 grid with solar attached should help alleviate that problem
stuck dove
should I try doing a rail grid? I can make rails, I'm just not really sure how to make a grid base
stuck dove
does chunk aligned do anything?
long mauve
https://cdn.factorio.com/assets/img/blog/fff-357-blueprint-snapping.mp4 and they can snap like legos
stuck dove
yeah I like having absolute alignment for that
long mauve
does chunk aligned do anything?
It is just a size i picked, it doesnt do much
Its nice because I can then do 96x96 for solar fields like I did in that game, or walls or something that also snaps to a multiple of chunks so it is nice and easy to expand everything
stuck dove
oh having it the same size as solar bp sounds nice
I have this one that I stole from someone else, and I never made my own because it just looks so nice
long mauve
thats a neat print
48*2 = 96 so paste 4 of those and itd be really good for chunk aligned if you go that path
can I have that print actually? itd fit nicely in some tight areas
upbeat sluiceBOT
stuck dove
not sure what the ratio is, I assume I named it 18:15 for a reason
which I think is more accumulators than necessary, but that just means it's laser-turret-able
oh wait duh I found the ratio
long mauve
another tip for grid aligned rails specifically if you want to make them yourself: start with a 4 way intersection then strip it down to 3way, 90 degree turn, straight, etc to build an easy book
stuck dove
ya
I end up not being happy with them so I made a bp book of 4-ways to get me started faster
long mauve
you will probably want to stick to 1 spacing instead of switching it up
quiet sandal
stuck dove
you will probably want to stick to 1 spacing instead of switching it up
yeah I usually pick 4 spacing
(I thought you said "stick to 1-spacing", was really confused)
stuck dove
oh wow those rails look nice
I kind of want a comprehensive rail bp book
what parts do I need? I'm thinking
building blocks 4-way, 3-way, straight, curve, u-turn
diagonals diagonal, diagonal-to-straight (135 degrees), diagonal-to-straight (mirror image)
stations station (not sure if I should build for train limit 1 or 2), stuff to paste on station (load, unload, fluid load, unload)
not really sure how to bp stackers, I assume I need a "straight" and a "u-turn" kind? the latter in the image above
long mauve
do you want my rail book? ( no stations, I suck at those ) to look at? I have all the things you listed
stuck dove
I don't flip stations since I have them built off the side of rails
quiet sandal
I'd have to make multiple variants of stations to cover every situation
stuck dove
my stations are all like this, not sure what other types there are
I try to build long enough for train limit 2
quiet sandal
train limits are what I am not sure on for how much I need
stuck dove
I usually have the no stacker type of design, though it doesn't have a u-turn (iirc I tried that but trains kept going through the station to u-turn lol)
quiet sandal
my stations are all like this, not sure what other types there are
ones like these are called sidings
since it's just a rail coming off and then reattaching to the main line
languid stump
Beacons coming in, up to 300 sci / min
Not full speed yet
Mk3 assembler is just 150,000 science (134,000 with my prod2 labs)
That should be another big boost I think
long mauve
Beacons coming in, up to 300 sci / min
is that speed2 beacons or speed1
languid stump
Speed2!
long mauve
dang I thought itd be higher than that
languid stump
It’s not all done yet!
long mauve
not all beacons placed?
languid stump
Yea
long mauve
makes sense then yeah
languid stump
I think i should make some yellow sci prints in editor
I think I’ll stick to lower tier prods kinda because I don’t wanna improve my mall anymore
I’ll do a few prod3 for the best stuff
long mauve
what level of onsite vs onsite are you planning on? 1 giant print with LDS, frames, and chips made onsite or imported?
im planning for all prod3 speed3 becaus I want to megabase at the end
languid stump
Probably 3 different factories, one robot frame, one lds, one processing unit
I might make the purple science at the robot frame place
long mauve
thats what Ill do as well I think
languid stump
At the same time making it in one place might be nice because I could kinda cannibalize old things if I can buffer 1.3M of that science pack first
And take stuff from the mall too
Actually more like 1M with prod3
long mauve
the problem is so many ore belts you have to move over
languid stump
Yeah… but if I steal circuit and steel and petro gas pipe…
stuck dove
a while ago I figured out some weird jank 8 beacon setups for full belts of science
not sure if I should use them or make something less ugly
here's purple for example
long mauve
use them! they already exist
languid stump
They may be hard to use since they’re surely planned for max inserter stack size
But if you tech that, may as well
stuck dove
oh true they probably are planned for 12 stack
languid stump
Oh yeah I need Beaconed lab
It has sooo many prod2 in it
So that’s actually really nice yeah I can reclaim those and kinda use them in yellow science
stuck dove
the only one I've actually used is the one that gets me an uninterrupted belt of space science, with circuits to make sure it doesn't overfill
steep spindle
obo Prod 2's will happen with the labs, but that just feels like too many beacons
steep spindle
it is tiled lol
languid stump
languid stump
Looking at yellow science, the robot frames are fairly easy. Could be made from my existing mall comfortably. Which means, I can ignore it. I just need processing unit and lds outposts.
3 red belt iron, 1.5 copper, some oil - robot frames for 1.8k yellow science.
10 hours of 1.8k yellow science - rocket silo unlocked
Processing units - 8 belts iron, 6 belts copper, half a belt coal, plenty.
steep spindle
49
long mauve
10 hours of 1.8k yellow science - rocket silo unlocked
how many hours do you have in your game so far?
steep spindle
120
steep spindle
maldingly cant choose
long mauve
im around 60 I hope to launch before 100, i havent afked though
steep spindle
these are all 60/c based
languid stump
So I just need to find 2 clusters of iron / copper next to each other, and with my speed1 miners, I’m good to go.
languid stump
im around 60 I hope to launch before 100, i havent afked though
I think you can do it!!
Yeah I have afkd a lot xD
I also think I have enough solar power now but im not sure
long mauve
yeah I dont like to AFK because something always gets messed up immediately
languid stump
Yeah the gap between the labs
steep spindle
which is why this existed but it felt to much
compared to that mess
supporting all 7 science in here
is the tough part w/o the weaving
I was tempted to rip this one
but it sucks too
languid stump
I just got one from @stuck dove
steep spindle
steep spindle
sushi
languid stump
Sushi supreme
steep spindle
🤔
long mauve
thats cleaner than my version lol, I like it @stuck dove
stuck dove
I'll post it here too then
long mauve
or is it mine
upbeat sluiceBOT
steep spindle
will that keep it all going?
long mauve
it seems almost identical down to the combinator lol
stuck dove
I made it myself, the combinator is stolen from codegreen
long mauve
yeah you used diff power poles, same concept though
languid stump
Now I just gotta come up with processing unit and lds
long mauve
those are so expensive..
languid stump
Processing units - 8 belts iron, 6 belts copper, half a belt coal, plenty.
Eh.
stuck dove
or is it mine <:engithink:800737127121551380>
#930147588160782436 message
actually we might have collaborated I do not remember
long mauve
true