programmers-off-topic

[cinder karma]

(That's the bridge after making everything cheaper....the original didnt break lol)

[sand frost]

ok try beating this; I still can't get the leaderboard to register this score tho for some reason

[hushed raven]

ive had that and had to restart the game for it to actually post, it's annoying

[cinder karma]

Wow

[sand frost]

restarting the game didn't work so now I'm restarting steam

[hushed raven]

Oh weird? games filled with jank it seems

[sand frost]

yay it loaded now!

now atra can stare at my score in the game as opposed to just on discord 😛

also look at my level 1

99.1% max stress

[cinder karma]

I'm challenging you on 3-3

[cinder karma]

this one absolutely sucks

[hushed raven]

Thanks line based autocomplete, you make it sound so easy, exactly what I want in my todo XD

[weak obsidian]

Is this Cursor or Antigravity IDE?

I swaer I've seen a tab to auto complete before

Unless that's a local LLM connected to VSC

idk

[hushed raven]

That is Webstorm, Intellijs web dev IDE, but it comes in like all of their IDEs, I've just been too lazy to turn it off so far, plus it has some funny things like this

[weak obsidian]

ohhh

sorry, only Vim here

https://tenor.com/view/i-use-vim-i-use-btw-giga-chad-gif-27466354

[hushed raven]

tried it, wasn't a fan XD I like not having to learn new keybinds, would love to love it though, I'd get double the programmer bragging rights I already have

[weak obsidian]

This may sound like "larping", or however the internet kids call it nowadays, but I use Vim, on Arch, BTW.

Vim used to be on Atari MiNT, that's interesting..

[lethal walrus]

i am really surprised discord search actually found those two words next to each other, exclusively

[sand frost]

i decline, i hate that level 😛 and i'm only 5k worse than you

[safe dragon]

just got the mr beast crypto scam dmed to me from a friend's account

heartbreaking

[little furnace]

Why is everyone insistent in beating me? Look at me, I'm not interested in beating me, I'm just interested in beating everyone else.

[safe dragon]

weird how that works

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by irocendar as #7869 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1492611964440936540)

[little furnace]

Good enough.

[safe dragon]

good enough = first place

[little furnace]

I more meant the difference of 2$.

[little furnace]

I did a thing...

You can't really see it right now, but apparently the car doesn't really have a hitbox.

Same setup, but this time one car is spinning.

[terse galleon]

what if we were both cars and we kissed i mean fought i mean jumped off a cliff i mean--

[little furnace]

You're gonna like this.

[terse galleon]

there's a lemon demon song about this

[little furnace]

I feel like if I try long enough, one will suddenly succeed.

[hushed raven]

Are you aware of the definition of madness? this feels like the definition of madness XD

[little furnace]

This only applies if the result is either proven to be deterministic or the results vary so little that it doesn't matter. This is obviously not the case here.

[hushed raven]

okay you're not wrong there XD

[little furnace]

Though I do get this wrestling move very often:

[terse galleon]

mutually assured destruction

[little furnace]

There's some beauty in this.

[little furnace]

If I replace one of the steel beams on the left side with wooden beams, the car on the right side won't jump far enough for some reason.

@terse galleon

[terse galleon]

it’s like when you find insects having sex on the sidewalk

[little furnace]

Oh true. Didn't think of that.

[lethal walrus]

that's a sentence i didn't expect to read in here, of all servers

[terse galleon]

i was surprised it got past auto mod lmao

[rain apex]

Rules of nature

[little furnace]

Honestly, this server is incredibly relaxed about its rules (in a positive way). I've been in a server where discussion of Egyptian Mythology was banned because it was "religion". I felt that went too far.

[lethal walrus]

i just meant that its not a topic that's discussed in here often lol

[little furnace]

True. But I only have one server where I actually expect to find that topic at all.

[steel kraken]

I am not going back to this level again

[errant comet]

goodnight everyone

[steel kraken]

tied?!

[rain apex]

Is this what they call linear regression

[steel kraken]

and my budget save for 1-5 isn't even working anymore

or 1-6

[prisma flume]

this is very Now and extremely Then
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMBg0j1GGgI

[little furnace]

This doesn't feel possible.

[cinder karma]

I had saves be intermittent tbh

God i hate the big trucks

[cinder karma]

Wood is springier and absorbed some of the energy

I can't wait for you to get to 3-3

[little furnace]

But on the other side?

I edited the left, and the separate right half changed.

[cinder karma]

Oh no idea the game is jank

[little furnace]

It certainly feels janky.

[cinder karma]

You have no idea how long the damn skip jump puxzle tool me

Took me

[rain apex]

This bridge is ribbon

[steel kraken]

I hate it so much

I want to go back to polybridge 3 where this isn't possible

[little furnace]

Yeah, I don't accept that for myself. Good job getting to the top of the leaderboard there.

[sand frost]

Ah, I put an extra road chunk on the right but otherwise did the same thing

[cinder karma]

this is how bridges work, right?

[cinder karma]

I also grabbed graveyard mumble when it was free but need someone to submit a 5k before I can play it

("Can't you submit your own 5ks?" "HUSH")

[cinder karma]

Iro, you may have noticed a tiny little lip on the tower

It is indeed to prevent the car from driving off the tower until the tower has properly fallen over

Under budget! But...may be a use once bridge....

[tranquil grove]

atra building a bridge into lisbon, 1147 AD

[cinder karma]

Gooood morning!

[safe dragon]

I work

[devout vault]

I make the more advanced group of customers suffer more in the short term so they can thrive more in the long term

including myself

[safe dragon]

I spend my workday desperately trying to convince engineers not to use excel

[devout vault]

Successfully, right?

[safe dragon]

clearly you haven't met engineers

[devout vault]

I was doing the meme 😔

[safe dragon]

😌

[marble jewel]

Currently, nothing

[devout vault]

Atra said poorly explain

You gotta do something sillier, like “well I guess I’m not alive then”

[sand frost]

I bait people into doing math with cool stuff

[safe dragon]

a criminal

[weak obsidian]

I work on expensive consumer merchandise that was issued around 1995 and later

[cinder karma]

I annoy electrons

[weak obsidian]

Product manager?

[devout vault]

Harbinger/Architect of the Modpocalypse

(hyperbole, won't be as bad as when MP was added, or the int -> string item ID change)

[rain apex]

Can't believe [redacted] will end [redacted] forever

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by atravita as #7870 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1492915152318632078)

[cinder karma]

1995?

[weak obsidian]

Any expensive consumer merchandise from 1995 and newer!

we can go all the way to 2026, but, I mostly get 1995-2015ish

you have 1 guess

after that no refills unless you pay me 50 hugs

[weak obsidian]

about 60% is 2015 and older, and 40% is 2015-2026+

and some 1995 merchandise was brought in as well to be "examined"

a considerable amount

[cinder karma]

I have no idea I'm sorry

Medical imaging?

[weak obsidian]

very vague hehe

data forensics

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by atravita as #7871 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1492904016672325763)

[weak obsidian]

im working with a lot of old machines

and some newer

[cinder karma]

Nice!!!

[weak obsidian]

the oldest is windows 95!

but we mostly get windows 7

sometimes xp

but yess

https://tenor.com/view/kekw-twitch-twitchtv-twitch-emote-kek-gif-19085736

[cinder karma]

Nice!!!!

[long verge]

Never heard of Windows 1,03299784882×10¹⁴⁸

[little furnace]

Breathing.

[hushed raven]

I really need to up my speed with those scams

[cinder karma]

Gooooood morning

What are y'all up to

[little furnace]

Eating dinner and going the bed.

Just kidding, I won't be going to bed for another six hours, my schedule is messed up like that.

[hushed raven]

On the contrast I have just woke up, so I shall be wanting to melt away into the dark come nightfall, so that is what I shall be up to today

[cinder karma]

you know the real magic is that the cars are indestructible..

[sand frost]

Also the balloon being solid

[safe dragon]

and stationary

good luck doing that with a hot air balloon

[dusty pollen]

you're both making a lot of assumptions. what if it's a sculpture

[terse galleon]

really weird cloud. just go through it it can't hurt you

[little furnace]

Within the last weeks I started playing four games again I haven't been playing for ages. What's going on with me? Will the next one be Spore?

[safe dragon]

i love spore

[little furnace]

Spore is such a good bad game. The beginning is awesome, but then you notice that you've been building up to a boring space sim. And somehow starting from sketch is no longer that cool because if you don't care about the space part, then nothing really matters. I want a game that is like Spore, but only the Creature Stage.

Cell Stage is alright as well.

Huh. It actually exists.

Steam

Strange Seed

Strange Seed is a creature evolution game inspired by games like E.V.O.: Search for Eden and Spore’s creature stage. You begin as a humble blob: the “strange seed” that fell from a very unusual tree. While many blobs exist, you’re not quite like the others.

Evolution…

Price

$14.99

Recommendations

339

[heavy dagger]

Title result: Strange Seed on Steam

[safe dragon]

creature stage is definitely where it peaks even though technically I guess its really not that special

mostly just being able to customize and recruit and just seeing whatever odd creatures you find

[little furnace]

It's like an early open-world without the Ubisoft formula.

Apparently the same publisher has a different but very similar game scheduled for release.

Steam

Adapt

Adapt is a survival evolution game designed to simulate the constantly changing environments which life must navigate to thrive. To succeed, your species will need to find food using a multitude of dietary strategies, seek out habitable environments, and react to changing seasons, and global climate. Your competitors will evolve alongside you, vy…

Release Date

To be announced

[heavy dagger]

Title result: Adapt on Steam

[little furnace]

And another one...

Steam

Ecosystem

Ecosystem is a game about life. At its heart are evolving virtual lifeforms, who grow from synthetic DNA and live in a physically-simulated ocean. This DNA encodes everything about a creature: their skeletal structure, their mental processors and even their combat prowess.

Simulation

The nervous system of a virtual lifeform is a pipeline com…

Price

$19.99

Recommendations

564

[heavy dagger]

Title result: Ecosystem on Steam

[red crest]

Tangentially related, but I feel like if your marketing material includes "This game is like [Game X] and [GameY]" or something like that... you need better marketing material

[little furnace]

Weird...

[cinder karma]

"This game is like filing taxes mixed with the tedium of driving long distances."

[red crest]

I would honestly be more intrigued by that description than one that compares itself to other games I could be playing instead

[little furnace]

Kinda? Though to me this sounds much more useful than a bunch of buzzwords. I know which games I like, and if I know it's similar, that's better than if it uses weird genre terms that could mean anything.

[sand frost]

to be fair, i have been thinking "hmm, i want terrascape with the graphics and theming of a more east asian setting"

[cinder karma]

What's terrascape

[sand frost]

so i could be susceptible to some marketing

[cinder karma]

That legitimately sounds like the software I had to use at school

[sand frost]

game where you put down buildings to score points

you start with an empty land and build out a city

[little furnace]

Catan?

[sand frost]

there are building combos

no, terrascape

[red crest]

I'm not sayin you can't describe it as similar, but I don't think the basis of your marketing should be doin it. Makes me less interested or trusting of it if they can't describe their own game without comparisons

[sand frost]

yeah, that's very fair

maybe somewhere in the lower text

but not the headlining tagline

steam for a long time tried to get me to play video games that weren't stardew

but the problem is i didn't want knockoff stardew

so this was a very unsuccessful effort

[little furnace]

"This game is like Gollum but good."

[cinder karma]

This game is approaching the interesting news of folding laundry

[little furnace]

https://store.steampowered.com/app/3144450/Laundry_Simulator_2026/

[heavy dagger]

Title result: Laundry Simulator 2026 on Steam

[cinder karma]

....

Why does that actually exist

[little furnace]

This artwork looks AI-generated...

[hushed raven]

There is a simulator for everything

[little furnace]

It was one of several.

[little furnace]

Do I need to delete the embed?

[cinder karma]

This game is about soldering one million resistor by hand

[red crest]

Either you can or I can, thems the breaks. I understand it wasn't intentional tho

[little furnace]

Done!

[cinder karma]

This game is a simulation of Walmsrt during black friday

[red crest]

Where's my spore-like but instead of evolving creatures for civilization purposes, I evolve them to be better adapted to functioning as living bridges for low poly vehicles

[rain apex]

is there excel simulator

[red crest]

EVE Online, yeah

[rain apex]

thats too 3d

[red crest]

not if you're only looking at your spreadsheets

[little furnace]

https://store.steampowered.com/app/2777000/Excelios/

Steam

Excelios

Excelios

Dive into the world of Excelios, a unique 2D puzzle platformer where you become a self-aware file on a mission to save your company’s corrupt data! With the charming and nostalgic help of Clippy, you'll navigate through broken Excel sheets, chaotic graphs, and mind-controlling mice, all while evading the relentless Windows Wizard and…

Price

$7.99

[cinder karma]

Is turbotax a video game

[heavy dagger]

Title result: Excelios on Steam

[rain apex]

https://taxheaven3000.itch.io/tax-heaven-3000

[lethal walrus]

that's

[long verge]

The hell is that

[lethal walrus]

something

[rain apex]

4 yrs outta date unlucky

[lethal walrus]

that sounds.. interesting at least

[little furnace]

Why is it called 3000 when it's for 2022?

[long verge]

Can we fraud this IRS (in-game) ?

[red crest]

People are allowed to use Clippy commercially?

[little furnace]

There actually is.

[heavy dagger]

Title result: Spreadsheets and Nothing More on Steam

[cinder karma]

Scary

[safe dragon]

I build one yes

[rain apex]

I thought u make the Oracle© Simulator

[safe dragon]

that's a war crime

[rain apex]

Im sorry for libel

[little furnace]

© is for copyrighted stuff. Brand names are either registered (®) or trademarked (™).

[lethal walrus]

but dont you know you're allowed to copyright 16 characters!

[supple ether]

Aurora 4x
https://www.aurora4x.net/wiki/index.php/Aurora

[lethal walrus]

so 6 characters is basically 16 characters

[cinder karma]

What is the wost concept of a game you can think of

[supple ether]

Desert bus but its retail

[dusty pollen]

online argument simulator

[supple ether]

Clicker game but there's no upgrades

[fleet wren]

league of legends

[weak obsidian]

raid shadow legends

or WoW

[little furnace]

Hey, ARAM can actually be quite fun. But that's why I stopped playing, people were way too toxic, even though I never played any ranked games.

[cinder karma]

Mine would be FanDuel tbh

Or online sourdough simulator

[supple ether]

Pitch drop experiment idle game

[prisma flume]

technically calico desert bus is retail since you have to buy the game..

[steel kraken]

tbh I was let down by the fact its mostly just a normie platformer and not actually an excel game

[errant comet]

Game where you learn basic ms excel functionality would be great

And maybe not so basic

I really love all the things that can he done with it

[cinder karma]

What about "shopping in a supermarket"

[steel kraken]

I've already seen videos of people playing that

[sand frost]

I play “shopping in a supermarket” like every week

[weak obsidian]

im sorry i got ptsd from tomodchi life

the lobotomii

npc goes into clothing shop
they never come out.

(cause its demo)

[cinder karma]

What's that

[weak obsidian]

From game demo

People made memes thst

Since the official game isnt out yet

And only the demo exists

If your Mii character goes into the shop

They'll likely be gone forever until you buy the official game

And ur other last mii will alwaya talk about what you can do in the official game and not the demo

[little furnace]

It's a video game. But instead of building bridges you control little people socializing and touching grass in a whacky world. So like our world, except more whacky and less anxiety.

[dusty pollen]

"it's a video game"
I'm in
"but instead of building bridges"
I'm out

[little furnace]

I mean, maybe the next game this channel will adore will be Tunnel Builder 2015?

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by kittycatcasey as #7872 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1493062007216275608)

[cinder karma]

what about city planing

also this is my least favorite level in the game

[sand frost]

fascinating

i don't think that's what i did

but also, have you finished the game?

i am sure there are least favorite levels to go for me

i mostly hate the hack-y ones

like the car flip over the balloon

like at this point we're not building bridges, we're building deathtraps

[cinder karma]

I have not

[sand frost]

i also have not, because i'm kind of stuck on some of the upper levels

[cinder karma]

But in the first three worlds it's easily my least favorite

What did you do anyways

[sand frost]

what level is this again?

[cinder karma]

4-9

(unrelated) LOOK WE HAVE TO CUT COSTS WHAT IS SAFETY.

[sand frost]

huh...my solution no longer works, but this used to work

you can imagine how it went, if it didn't collapse

i was basically banking on elasticity to save the day

[cinder karma]

I basically pixel by pixel placed the four roads until the car didnt get stuck

[sand frost]

here's a working version don't ask me what changed

I think I also did a lot of very delicate and frustrated tweaking to determine the max distance the car can fall, then the same for the number of flips

(at a certain distance of falling, it's not that the car breaks, but that any bridge will collapse under the force)

[cinder karma]

Yeahhhhh

Like the little flip I did for the looping one

3-3

What's your 3-3?

[cinder karma]

Ngl this one was funny

Literal thought process... can I save money if I take out the hydraulic? Yes. Yes I can

Fricken even works better since the car doesnt try to flip

[sand frost]

I also disliked 3-12, that one had a lot of tweaks

[cinder karma]

3-12?

[sand frost]

dump trucks...

[cinder karma]

Oh that one

[sand frost]

here's my 3-3, I actually enjoyed this one

[cinder karma]

Haha you did it as intended. I did a flip

3-12, 3-3

getting the second dump truck to carefully drive on the bridge was such a pain

[sand frost]

yeah that'swhy i curved my bridge

it kept smashing the bridge unless i got the slope juuuuuust right

[cinder karma]

it's the most expensive of the lot but this one was fun

this one was amusing to get under budget

and this one is actually engineering challenge

[dusty pollen]

here's a challenge for you guys: do level 2-4 but make the first drawbridge go down into the water instead of up over the ship

it's possible to do that and make the ship clear ||I just can't get it to connect again once it goes up lmao||

[dusty pollen]

one of my favourite stupid ideas, but still no :(

[dusty pollen]

sure, your solutions may have been "better" in "every way" but did they look this cool

do I get style points

(and yes I did find a solution that didn't involve breaking anything, boring as that may be)

[tranquil grove]

I was gonna say something about requiring ships to use that specific side, but that pointy rock is an issue anyway, carry on

[dusty pollen]

luckily for me, this game only requires me to account for ships that are exactly the size, position, and timing of the ones shown

[serene portal]

Hello everyone, I hope you are doing great, I just wanted to ask something related to a windows setting.

So does anyone know if the setting Mono Audio (which combines the audio of both ear phones into one stream, meaning you will hear the exact same audio in both side), can decrease audio quality?

[elfin linden]

enabling Mono Audio can decrease perceived audio quality by merging

stereo channels into a single stream, which eliminates spatial depth, directionality, and the immersive "surround" effect typical of stereo sound. While the setting ensures all sound plays equally through both ears (useful for users with hearing loss in one ear or those using a single earbud), it does not improve sound quality and may make music, movies, or games sound "flat" or centered inside the head.

[serene portal]

OOO okey thanks a lot for letting me know and for the reply

[elfin linden]

Ofc ^^ i hope it helps anyway.

[frosty echo]

Is that from an AI?

[safe dragon]

does seem right

[little furnace]

It doesn't really decrease beyond the expected though. Like, you merged left and right audio, what did you expect, a fuller sound?
It's certainly better enabling that if you only use one half of the earphones anyway.

[serene portal]

Okey thanks for letting me know

the main reason I wanted the setting was because there are certain times when I am listening to songs where like I can only hear a certain part of the song (instrument or vocal) on only one part of my headset

that is why I wanted the setting in the first place

[little furnace]

That's intended. They want it to feel like you're on stage and the instruments are left and right. Or they are just feeling fancy.
Enable it and see if you prefer it that way. The downside is that in games you will no longer be able to tell whether the audio came from left or right.

[serene portal]

True true, I did feel it in games

Is there any software that allows us to limit the setting to certain software (like Spotify or YouTube)?

[rain apex]

I think it depends on your sound driver which may be os specific

See if there's any option to output mono

[little furnace]

Voiceemeter Banana seems to support it.

I can confirm that it sometimes does magic. It's good for using two Bluetooth headphones to watch a movie and setting audio delay per device.

Or you can install Arch (recommended solution).

[serene portal]

Okey I will look into it thanks

[serene portal]

Okey thanks a lot I will also have a look at the Voicemetter software. (I probably won't be installing Arch , thanks for the recommendation though)

[cinder karma]

https://youtu.be/zMpn9ICagdE?si=creRkvR2d6EDF04V

Fucking joy :(

[cyan shadow]

It's apparently been fixed already, if that's any consolation!

https://github.com/vim/vim/security/advisories/GHSA-2gmj-rpqf-pxvh
https://github.com/califio/publications/blob/main/MADBugs/vim-vs-emacs-vs-claude/vim.md

[little furnace]

"This editor, that you see here, this editor, and that might surprise you, is nothing but a browser window."
I hate visiting lectures I only need for credits.

[cinder karma]

Btw Pink Serenity, ball is in your court

[safe dragon]

electron? browser window. CEF? browser window

(Tauri? browser window. Blazor WebView? browser window)

[supple ether]

Search menu? Browser window

[safe dragon]

[supple ether]

Html file preview? Browser window

[little furnace]

Not just the preview though.

[safe dragon]

HTML stands for hWebsiTe Markup Language

[little furnace]

I take it back, this is not a lecture I only need for credits. This is about PHP. I hate PHP.

[safe dragon]

you'll be an expert at WordPress

[little furnace]

Nooooooo!!!

[cinder karma]

.q 6573

[heavy dagger]

#6573

I have a new respect for PHP

• Pathoschild (Jump)

Aug 19, 2025, 8:24 PM

[little furnace]

How do you know all of them by heart?

[safe dragon]

flashcards

[little furnace]

I improved the design to 1657$:

Gosh, we need to use XAMPP. Why?

I'm an Nginx fan.

[safe dragon]

smh caddy is the hip one

[little furnace]

Oh, okay, we can install other stuff.

[safe dragon]

meanwhile I use the evil bad iis

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by kittycatcasey as #7876 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1493260473070522538)

[devout vault]

I am once again hating on VS2026

How did it manage to freeze for several minutes (and still ongoing!)

[little furnace]

Because it's cold?

[devout vault]

It's FL

74 F outside

.wolfram 74 F in C

[heavy dagger]

23.33 °C (degrees Celsius)

[little furnace]

That's cold.

I want 26°.

Or more.

[devout vault]

.wolfram 26 C in F

[tranquil grove]

rolled back to 2022 after about a week of it, just more LLM knobs and major bugs

[heavy dagger]

78.8 °F (degrees Fahrenheit)

[devout vault]

The high today is higher than that

[tranquil grove]

(granted I only use it for sdv right now)

[little furnace]

What about 95°?

.wolfram 95 C in F

[heavy dagger]

203 °F (degrees Fahrenheit)

[little furnace]

Oh my gosh, it updates automatically.

[cinder karma]

Consider....rider

Or VSC

[devout vault]

You can even cheat at .choose that way

[devout vault]

If rider had my beloved dropdown, I would

.choose do something boring, do something boring-er, do something fun

[heavy dagger]

Choose result: do something fun

[little furnace]

@heavy dagger You're best bot!!

[cinder karma]

I might as well ask real people

I have a script I want to pipe into less

But less stops consuming from the pipe as soon as a page is filled, and I want it to continue consuming until the script is done and then give me a nice paged view

It's about three or four pages rn, I'm doing some warning cleaning

Google and Bing have not gotten me the right flags

The poor Bing AI literally sounds like it's having a seizure

Who wants to put out suggestions for the next game the channel plays

[devout vault]

Would just doing <someScript> | echo | less work?

Less would still stop I assume, but maybe echo would do all the consuming as far as the script can see

[little furnace]

What the... draws means I'm second?!

[little furnace]

I feel like we'd need a game where we could compare scores.

Let's play Wingspan together.

[cinder karma]

Wingspan | Board Game | BoardGameGeek https://share.google/JEQDtRXQVvTkaTAIN ?

[long verge]

I thought you were Maru's Robot at first

[little furnace]

There's a digital version on Steam that seems to be really good.

[cinder karma]

Tbh I'll likely go back to trying to 100% opus soon

[vernal sentinel]

I love when i finally start to understand shit and i advance in my code.
My lexer and parser are working well for now

After 2 days of not understanding what the hell i was doing

[hushed raven]

I am going to melt this computer down into slag, is it too much to ask for a working device?

[cinder karma]

Yes

We must use all the computers for Ai

[hushed raven]

At least this is giving me a reason to checkout nixos, I'm not happy about it, but I'm not as mad as I would be

[rain apex]

Birb

I do enjoy the steam version it has voice acting (birb calls and birb facts lady)

[cinder karma]

No go. It makes new pipes

Neither did less <(my script)

[cinder karma]

Alright who wants to walk 5k

[safe dragon]

just for you of course

[rain apex]

What does 5k mean

[safe dragon]

5 km

[rain apex]

Is there a time limit

[safe dragon]

24 hours

[cinder karma]

No, just a single walk of that length

"The warning message W RNQUIE indicates the stimulation has completed successfully"

Why is this a warning

[safe dragon]

it's scary

[devout vault]

Oh is there a pipe shortage in addition to all the economy nonsense? /s

[devout vault]

less < ... just uses ... as a file into less, right?

[cinder karma]

Casey I'm still waiting for your 5k :P

[devout vault]

Am I misremembering that someCommand \someOtherCommand`` pre-executes someOtherCommand and uses it for the parameters?

[cinder karma]

Yeah, the hope was it would finish the script before handing it over to less

[devout vault]

Hmm.

echo `ls -la` | less

Seems to destroy the newlines

[dusty pollen]

less -F

[cinder karma]

-F?

[dusty pollen]

continues piping output after it’s done

[cinder karma]

Hmmm

[dusty pollen]

follow

[devout vault]

I found that when I googled it but thought it sounded slightly different than what atra wanted

[dusty pollen]

it is a little different

it won’t stop once it is truly done

but tbh I’ve never had this problem with less so I’m guessing the script atra is using is just terminating in a weird way

[cinder karma]

Yes! Thank you

[cinder karma]

:( it's just python :(

[rain apex]

Why not just subprocess run less

[cinder karma]

I'm paging the warning logs from my parser lol

Hmmmmm

What if.

This is the standard logging module

[hushed raven]

I am disliking nixos so far, why is it so hard to get graphics working??? I feel like I'm going in circles

[cinder karma]

Guess why I still go for Intel processors and no graphics cards

[hushed raven]

I wish I could go for no graphics card XD finally managed to get it all working though! issue was openGL wasn't being installed so that would've made doing pretty much anything and everything not work

[cinder karma]

Look if a game cant run on shit hardware from 2016....

Annndddd if I cant convince a discord friend to walk 5k

It's just 5km!

[fleet wren]

see i like cachyos so far because it manages to be arch but just works™

[cinder karma]

That's my normal running distance

[fleet wren]

nix seems like "linux but it doesn't work by default" from what i hear

[hushed raven]

ye it also seems like that to me, I was too interested in the package manager and decided to go all in (for some reason I am still yet to understand) instead of just using nix on what ever I was using originally XD

[steel kraken]

I've never had problems with command-with-long-output | less

That is it's one job

[cinder karma]

Apparently the python logger module will pause the script and wait for you if you do that

[steel kraken]

Sandwich tee in the middle maybe

[cinder karma]

-F works

I can also edit the python stream handler tbh

Now I need to figure out my elaboration etrors

[little furnace]

Too much university, currently.

[cinder karma]

Dont worry it's just my mission to get people to touch grass.

Take care 💖

https://youtu.be/yR5mR-KoNzA?si=oQk9yW1fjdoVgVkV

I fucking love science

[hushed raven]

I have no sound!

[cinder karma]

U don't need sound 💖

[hushed raven]

I'm veering on that conclusion too, at least for now XD

Side note, does anyone know of a decent image viewer/manager for linux that lets me add custom tags to images? I have assets everywhere, all with terrible naming conventions like "item<number>.png" and it's really difficult to find what I want, and I have yet to find one that fits my need

[little furnace]

Does XnView support that? I've never tried it.

[hushed raven]

it has support for editing metadata so I could use that for "tags" I shall check that out thank you!

[little furnace]

I don't understand why some professors have such a weird schedule that their lessons start at 8. AT 8! How am I supposed to be up that early?

[steel kraken]

I do not miss the 8:30am lectures

but I also didn't miss the lectures ending at 8:30pm either

[cinder karma]

My worst days in high school

8am to 9pm

Death

[hushed raven]

I absolutely loved 8pm lectures, it was dark out and the lab was a whole vibe

[white turret]

whats the general consensus on this server on private recreational use of AI (just to be clear, local offline stuff and not paying any company for scam AI queries and shit like that. No enterprise shit)?

stuff like people running ST on their laptops or whatever to talk to the funny chatbots.

I would like to know the temperature of that topic here before adjusting my conversation topic for it

[hushed raven]

There is no general consensus, some people are very against it, others are for it more than cloud based AIs, and other would prefer cloud over local. it's very much a mixed bag

(Do make sure to follow rule 12 though, so you don't get bonked )

[white turret]

well rule 12 already aligns with my guidelines for use of it regardless. I have a personal strict set of ethic rules regarding the recreational use of these tools and one of them is that this system is quarantined, nothing generated is to ever leave networks or devices that I personally own (no sharing/uploading results even if all parties agreed to it beforehand)

This is just private use for myself and me alone

[little furnace]

I dislike people using it excessively and without knowing the limitations. But I understand that it's well suited for analyzing a big amount of text and generating some fitting output.

[white turret]

I'm a programmer by trade so luckily that checks out. I know how these systems work in and out and can adjust my workflows to accomodate its actual strengths

(well, technical strengths anyway, I wont argue artistic ones)

My experienced languages also: I know C, Python, a bit of Java, Lua, and at least 5 flavors of assembler

MIPS, ARM Thumb, Regular ARM, PowerPC, and x86

[cinder karma]

Ooooooh data on Artemis 2's heat shield

Ngl after Artemis 1 the heat shield was a worry

[hushed raven]

While a lot of people here have reservations against AI (more specifically genAI) I'd hope we have tact to not be malicious towards people who do use it and certainly know that what anyone person does can't be applied to anyone else

[hushed raven]

Ooooo data! yes!!!

[cinder karma]

https://youtu.be/oAkbRS26W4o?si=KJts9Prqtt7nvu5Z

[white turret]

something something its a tool something something mankind can use it for good or evil something.

I'm just a guy that finds fulfillment in tricking the machine to get it to do what I want. I just look at it like wrangling a bull that I have little to no control over

If I can get it in the pen, I'm happy

[hushed raven]

Humans tricked rocks into thinking using an invisible force, and still to this day we are wrangling those rocks to do our bidding XD

[white turret]

And whats more important than doing things that make you happy anyway

anyway, all i wanted to do was replace the portrait of somebody ingame with a specific anime character but in the stardew valley style. I did lookup to see if one already existed, and i would have used it if it existed obviously, but sadly it didnt exist so...

the sprites however i did edit in GIMP, i know how to edit pixel art

[fleet wren]

100% all of Opus Magnum (again), now just waiting for new journal pages

[white turret]

I think the last "programming" video game I played was TIS-100

I did beat that one

[steel kraken]

I toy around with it occasionally mainly for silly things like helping with building Alliterations like SinZational sequences synthesizing some strikingly seamless sonic symmetry or naming my skyrim characters

I'm personally not too interested in it for actual code generation

[white turret]

I'm in the decompilation scene (for N64/Gamecube specifically) and actually AI code generation has a surprising use case there since we actually match our code to the original compiler to get the exact same registers/codegen

So because of that, it prevents any AI generated code from behaving any differently if verified in the original compiler because.. if it makes the same assembler, it cannot function differently, its literally the same

So some of our projects actually started incorporating AI assisted matching for finding matching functions which has massively sped up these projects

Of course, we lint away the names/comments etc and re-label everything, we still manually review everything before merging, we're not idiots

Once we verify a match then we can just redocument it

[steel kraken]

Language/instruction set translations like that does seem like a good usecase and what the tech was more originally aligned for prior to chatgpt hype train took off

[white turret]

Claude Code has been surprisingly really instrumental in helping Super Smash Bros Melee decomp gain like 30% alone in progress metrics in the last 12 months

Its found an insane amount of matches

Of course it only works if you already have an established decompilation that has put in some minimal amount of human work to nail down the style of programming the devs have used and have done quite a bit of decomp matching already

If you havent done that, it wont have a style to pattern extrapolate from

and wont work lol

It also depends on the compiler. Besides GCC and clang back in the day there were quite the number of compiler families

Gamecube games tended to use either a variant of GCC called ProDG, or the Metrowerks compiler, which is proprietary and sucks super monkey balls to match against

But we've gotten decent at it with enough work

[devout vault]

Wind Waker decomp 100% completion for PC port for modding, when? 😔

[white turret]

Wind Waker decomp is like 65% iirc last I checked

[devout vault]

61

(Well, 60.96)

(It's been much slower than TP 😔 )

[white turret]

Those 3 games help we have quite a lot of debug symbols for them like Wind Waker had a JP demo disk with a debug map

yeah, well, we dont have an unoptimized build for Wind Waker

TP had literal cheat sheets

[devout vault]

Yeah I've heard about the debug map

[white turret]

the Nvidia Shield version of Twilight princess had optimizations off

[devout vault]

Didn't know about the unoptimized build for TP though

[white turret]

That was a big reason why it even reached 100% in the first place

[devout vault]

I've almost got a working Wind Waker modloader for Dolphin, using the decomp

Haven't gone back to it in ages to finish it up, though

[white turret]

but yeah. AI has been surprisingly helpful with matching (as long as your project properly primes it to recognize the original dev's code writing patterns and you havent been fakematching stuff)

[devout vault]

(Cheating a bit 😛 - also "almost" is an exaggeration - I found the spot and got code running there, and need to do the actual loading)

(Much easier than with KAR, since WW already has multiple rels and stuff)

[white turret]

Melee is written in boring old C instead of C++ plus no symbols for anything but some sysdolphin things that dont even apply that much to Melee

so we dont have symbols actually

Its so rough thats why the progress was incredibly slow every year. Maybe 5% a year if you were lucky

but we were doing our best

Plus the Metrowerks compiler aggressively inlining TUs and doing stupid shit

in the early days it was even worse, because melee used a hotfix version of the compiler that was literally lost media

so we had to literally guess and re-implement the patch by hotfixing the compiler to get the correct behavior for melee

[devout vault]

Oof

That sounds incredibly rough

[white turret]

twice, because the MetroTRK debugging library had the same issue but in reverse, which Melee used and linked against the binary

So we had to solve this issue twice, once and again in reverse

[devout vault]

One of my friends from another server has worked on KAR decomp stuff a fair bit. And has poked at some other decomps, I think?

I was going to take a stab at the KAR decomp at one point, but got interested in other things before I really got into it. I had mainly poked around at trying to make a script that would make the disassembly relocatable

Wanted to do crazy stuff with KAR so bad

And now we have KARs 😌

(KAR = Kirby Air Ride, KARs = Kirby Air Riders = the switch 2 sequel)

[white turret]

KAR is mostly stalled due to lack of interest by willing contributors unfortunately. Its a bit complicated also since apparently the game modes are each separate "programs"

Top Ride is written in C++ while the others are C

I myself mostly have been working on recomp projects these days

Mainly Bomberman 64 and (currently) Bomberman Hero

[devout vault]

Yep

[devout vault]

Yeppppppppp

(KAR is the one my friend and I have talked about the most)

However my interest in things fluctuates tremendously, hence why I never ended up sticking with it

(Also because I don't have the skillset for that type of thing, and I'm only just recently getting to the point re:mental health where I could actually spend time learning new skills)

Years ago I wrote a gecko code for KAR that lets you swap to a second City Trial stage at runtime, but we still don't have the tooling to actually make them, I think

[hushed raven]

I don't supposed anyone could take a guess at what this image is? it was part of an asset pack on itch.io with around 1k different sprites and it's between the foods and the crystals, I personally am absolutely clueless

[devout vault]

Amber?

[hushed raven]

I'm struggling to think of a category to put it in

Oooo amber may be it!

even if it isn't I'm tossing it in there, ty!

[devout vault]

It's between food and crystal because it's a crystal that's soft enough to be food! ... or something

[hushed raven]

obligatory mention of Indium which is a metal soft enough to bite that also has a crystaline structure

[red crest]

That's a rotisserie chicken

[hushed raven]

it's now an amberized rotisserie chicken

[devout vault]

Amber-marinated rotisserie chicken

(* Must de-fossilize the amber first)

[hushed raven]

I do love this asset pack even if the organisation is a bit buggered, theres so much stuff! https://glionox.itch.io/items16 is the link to it

[cinder karma]

is this for a stardew mod :P

[devout vault]

Are we getting gamedev atlas???

[red crest]

That would be too on topic, I'd have to ban Atlas

[hushed raven]

Nope! we are still very firmly in off topic XD this is for minecraft XD

[hushed raven]

Thank you for thinking I have the skills for that XD

[devout vault]

gotta start somewhere

join khloe in exploring godot

Discover why we are still waiting

[hushed raven]

I have been thinking of godot and did look into which languages it has bindings (?) for so it's certainly not out of the picture

but it's also not in for a while yet

[devout vault]

https://tenor.com/view/doja-cat-star-wars-gif-25078126

[devout vault]

you take that back

[red crest]

I installed Godot like a month and a half ago and just never opened it to do anything with it

[cinder karma]

Waiting for the perfect time

[hushed raven]

I have zero ideas if constraints aren't put on me, I need to some pre existing limits so I can break them into many tiny peices

[cinder karma]

Oh my god the joke is too obvious

[cinder karma]

Well, pick smth easy to do that you're interested in

[red crest]

Is it a waiting for godot joke

[hushed raven]

ahh yes brb, quickly making [REDACTED FOR TOO ON TOPIC] 2.0

[red crest]

Are you keeping another $40 from me

That's the only thing I can think of you needing a 2.0 for

[devout vault]

game jam

(I have similar problems at times... but also problems coming up with things for a given theme, sometimes...)

[red crest]

I can't even joke about "server modjam when?" anymore because That's Me Too now

[cinder karma]

what's the difference between google pay and google wallet, asks confused atra trying to figure out this cashbash bonus

yeah, button, when's the modjam

[red crest]

Too on topic ask again later

[cinder karma]

google pay doesn't exist and is now google wallet

google

plz

[red crest]

Google pay doesnt exist anymore?

[cinder karma]

I just want my $20 back for spending $100

[hushed raven]

nope, it was deleted off the face of the earth, it now exists soley as wallet, and now auto grabs your fake gift cards scams send to your email!

[hushed raven]

they do impose some restrictions but time limit is too short XD (at least the ones I know about) maybe not for text based things which I do quite enjoy

[red crest]

I still have Google Pay

[hushed raven]

2.0 will be made to use a better language, I'm thinking pure JS and it runs in your browser

[cinder karma]

so rust

awesome!

rust is perfect language

(I don't even know what 1.0 is, or 0.1, or I guess you may be version 1.2.453345)

[devout vault]

There are different duration ones

I see more week long ones than weekend long ones

And also 2week or month long ones at times

Seriously, just browse https://itch.io/jams

[hushed raven]

hmm i thought they changed the name but I'm looking at the wallet apk and it looks like the package is actually called android.apps.wallet, I wonder why I'm thinking of that

[hushed raven]

Oh good lord thats a long (yet very nicely laid out) graph of them

[cinder karma]

I mean, there is apparently a literal pet rock video game so

if you want, you can scroll up to find a list of terrible game ideas

[devout vault]

Have you not seen that before

That's like THE place I check

(besides ludum dare, but that's literally just the one jam)

[hushed raven]

I have not, I usually hear about jams from other people

[red crest]

I usually hear about game jams after they've ended

Hm

[devout vault]

Perfect one just for you not liking short time limits
https://itch.io/jam/trijam-368

(/s)

[red crest]

It didn't tell me that when I opened it just now

[cinder karma]

America only apparently

[sand frost]

As a professor, hard same

[hushed raven]

it takes me 3 hours just to write the first bit of code XD

[cinder karma]

Drink a monster or smth

Or borrow Casey's brain

[devout vault]

Oh I missed that conversation.

✨ academic bureaucracy ✨ (though I'm sure you know that Elizabeth)

[sand frost]

My life goal is to never teach before 10am

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by atravita as #7883 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1493436211338018977)

[devout vault]

Remind me in 9 hours to ask Elizabeth to teach me about matrices

[heavy dagger]

[blinks] what now? yeah uhhh sure thing boss (#7144965) (9h | <t:1776165818>)

[cinder karma]

That's before 10am

[sand frost]

Those were fine

[devout vault]

(don't remember what timezone Elizabeth is in, so fudged it to 7:30 for me)

[hushed raven]

my monarch peach flavoured monster is my life fuel, if I drink enough I may get it done by jitters alone akin to monkeys writing shakespeare

[devout vault]

(can't wait for that ping tomorrow morning)

[cinder karma]

You need to wait 11 hrs

[cinder karma]

8am to 9pm

Could you

Would you

[cinder karma]

Hmmm

What type of game do u like to play

Tbh if you want me to generate complete code in 3 hrs....:fear:

[sand frost]

No

[sand frost]

Also no

I do regularly pull 11am-8pm or on bad days 9pm

[cinder karma]

Actual atra senior year high school schedule

Death

[sand frost]

Usually it’s more like 6pm and then go home and do a bit more

[cinder karma]

Late night labs :(

[hushed raven]

The games I like usually require a bit more than what is usually completable in a week, rich story, or sandbox mechanics, or idle games are usually my go to, do love a stupendous story and lovely lore

[sand frost]

Senior year of high school is famously full of good choices

And reasonable schedules

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by atravita as #7884 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1493437451782590545)

[sand frost]

I did 40 hours per week on robotics on top of school as my senior year bad choices

[cinder karma]

🫂

[hushed raven]

Ooo robotics are cool! not when sleep deprived and overworked though

[sand frost]

Yeahhhh I was running the team senior year so that was a lot

I’m sure you’re shocked

[devout vault]

My senior year bad choices was... my minecraft modding era, I guess?

[cinder karma]

Very shocked. Probably shouldn't have licked a battery

[devout vault]

I dunno, not much big choices during that period of time for me 😛

[sand frost]

Known overcommitter Elizabeth doing many things, a real shocker

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by kittycatcasey as #7885 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1493437896101990521)

New quote added by atravita as #7886 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1493437939915685978)

[devout vault]

dang it atra

I was just about to quote that one too

[cinder karma]

Anyways

Button, when is server wide modfest

[cinder karma]

Smh

gooood morning everyone

[hushed raven]

Good very early morning

[devout vault]

I'm about to hop in bed

sleeepyyyyyy

[hushed raven]

I should also probably sleep, whether I actually will is another question entirely

[cinder karma]

what time zone are you in lo;l

[hushed raven]

I'm in UTC+1 (I think?) so it's 03:46 which is way too late given I have stuff to do tomorrow

[cinder karma]

U sure because you seem to be sleep wise in the east coast usa

Was west cost earlier

[hushed raven]

it's an issue that keeps happening XD

my sleeping schedule would probably fit better on the ISS

[hushed raven]

after some fussing I'm back on arch where everything just ✨ works ✨ did try out nix on arch but it broke gcc, very unfortunate

[safe dragon]

nix not working is its default state

[little furnace]

I would like to try Guix, which is Nix but by GNU and without systemd.

[safe dragon]

that probably makes it even more likely to not work but certainly interesting

[little furnace]

The package manager is also available for other systems, like Nix. Maybe that doesn't break stuff?

[little furnace]

I'm absolutely aware of that. I have experience with Artix.

I like how easy systemd is, but I don't want it to become synonymous with Linux, so as long as more and more software relies on it I will push towards other init systems.

[hushed raven]

I have only ever used systemd and I rarely interact directly with it, a different one would be fun to try out but only when my system breaks like yesterday

it's so lovely seeing only 16gb used on my home drive

[little furnace]

https://mainichi.jp/english/articles/20260414/p2a/00m/0na/021000c

Because the title is cut off: Japanese fire official suspended for forcing colleagues to play board games while working

Apparently those were 10+ homemade games.

[heavy dagger]

@devout vault: ask Elizabeth to teach me about matrices (9h ago)

[cinder karma]

Huh

https://github.github.com/gh-stack/

Gooooood morning!

I have had Katseye's pinky up stuck in my head all day and is mot even a good song

nothing says built for one boat in particular more than this.

[cinder karma]

Where can I get one

[devout vault]

Step 1: become obscenely rich

[fleet wren]

and note that being rich doesn't facilitate the "AI clone" part, it facilitates the "people are obligated to let you get away with crap like 'AI clone that stands in for you in meetings'" part

[weak obsidian]

LMAO.

The lizard has done it again..

if anyone plays oblivion

the left is the remaster

the right (dense area) is the fan made skyblivion

which comes out sometime this year

u can tell which group put more love into the remaster

I wont point fingers on what was done, but some textures are not lore accurate in the oblivion remaster, like the dark brotherhood door having too many characters when it wasnt that, i wont say what they used to make the game come out faster

but, i prefer love in my game like the original oblivion, or skyblivion which comes out soon

anyways ive depositied my thoughts, as an orange

https://tenor.com/view/peace-out-gif-3584473422170938815

[pliant snow]

Does anyone know of a tool where I can copy files back to my host over ssh, without having to start another shell. Right now, I'll be remote logged in, then find a file I want, then have to open a separate sftp shell just to get it. I want to just run some command over ssh and grab the file immediately

[cinder karma]

rsync

[hushed raven]

Scp From the remote? I don't remember needing another shell to do it

[safe dragon]

*nreal eng*ne

obviously

[pliant snow]

What would you invoke with rsync? I know you can scp back towards the host, but that feels kinda clunky, and requires the remote to have ssh access to my host, which it might not have

[cinder karma]

Tbh I think I actually used to just rsync back from the host lol

[safe dragon]

could use something like wormhole

bit silly but possible

or taildrop

[pliant snow]

At that point its still easier to sftp, I'm just lazy

[cinder karma]

Samba?

[pliant snow]

Maybe kitty has a plugin

[devout vault]

I do not. Sorry.

(yes people really call me that online instead of casey sometimes, for some reason)

[safe dragon]

hi kittycat

[pliant snow]

Do you offer other plugins

[devout vault]

Yes, you can find most of them here: https://www.nexusmods.com/profile/spacechase0/mods

(And some older ones at https://spacechase0.com/mods/, of course)

[steel kraken]

I'm team sftp

[dusty pollen]

at the very least they should add "(of spenny renown)"

[devout vault]

Very tempting to replace " - code crime queen" with that

[dusty pollen]

do it

[devout vault]

But my throne

And my crown

And my crime

[dusty pollen]

https://tenor.com/view/doja-cat-star-wars-gif-25078126

tempting...

[devout vault]

Discord needs a title system, so I can have it rotate to a different suffix every time you re-open the server

Or just automatically every day or so would work

[cinder karma]

Zephyr had a signature system

That would run a random bash script lol

[dusty pollen]

as for the caution, I'm doing both. I am enforcing the requirement for honesty and getting rid of the nickname that doesn't have a correct title

[cinder karma]

Don't abuse your powers iro

[devout vault]

How is it incorrect

Have you seen my crime thread

[dusty pollen]

I mean that is possible via a bot but it might be a tough sell for the other mods

[dusty pollen]

missing critical information

[devout vault]

Have you seen how SDV modding got introduced to Harmony

[dusty pollen]

the critical information being spenny

[devout vault]

The other one would be too though. Hence the need for rotating titles

[devout vault]

Yeah I figured 😔

[dusty pollen]

on the plus side, it would make me laugh. on the minus side, I fear it may be my last moderation action

[devout vault]

So you need to save it for when you're ready to resign. Got it

[rain apex]

Can u change this place to #programming-off-spenny

To go with #making-spenny-general

[fleet wren]

what's the spin of the Spenny elementary particle

[devout vault]

Somebody hasn’t played the mod of all time, smh

[cinder karma]

+2

[fleet wren]

so Spenny obeys the Bose-Einstein statistics and multiple Spennys can occupy the same quantum state

[steel kraken]

Getting dangerously close to on topic conversation here

[cinder karma]

OK! Cosrco is selling a sourdough kit

[pliant snow]

Bouncer accepts bribes...

[lethal walrus]

farm computer also accepts bribes

[hushed raven]

it's is very possible as a bot but does mean the bot has to have privileges above the user being changed which I'm glad I managed to blag my way into having not on my own server XD

[devout vault]

in what currency

[pliant snow]

Gold bullion

[lethal walrus]

FC accepts bribes in spaceship account credit

[devout vault]

How about bull-shaped gold ions

[pliant snow]

The size of a car, sure

[devout vault]

😔

[cinder karma]

That's like....54,000 kg of gold

[devout vault]

you know, I think that's a bit outside my budget

[hushed raven]

ahh but 24 karat was never specified, it could be pyrite which is fools gold!

[devout vault]

Bullion is 24 karat from a quick google search

Sometimes 22, which brings it down to $7513397688.36

[hushed raven]

Oh.. I thought bullion was just the shape, ahh well, looks like you have a few trillion dollars to manifest

[devout vault]

I think your math is a bit off

[hushed raven]

8 and 7 trillion is a few trillion

[devout vault]

Not like that

By like. A factor of 1000

[hushed raven]

hmm yes, it appears I am

[devout vault]

$8,196,433,841.85 - if that helps

[red crest]

Yeah you meant quintillion

[hushed raven]

At least you have to find 1000 times less dollars! XD

Isn't the whole downscaling thing destructive by nature?

[devout vault]

That depends. Are we using the rules of reality, or the rules of Steins;Gate time leaps?

that explanation of the compression hurts so much

[hushed raven]

Well the first result for googling Steins;Gate is

I love Steins Gate, but I wouldn't recommend it to anyone
so I shall go with our rules of reality XD

[lethal walrus]

Downscales your textures to a lower resolution non-destructively. Use your high-resolution source textures, while previewing and exporting them as their downscaled low-resolution counterparts.
i think.. it means so your asset is still the original?

[devout vault]

It's one of my favorite anime that I will never rewatch because of one specific episode. (not that the entire thing is perfect, there's definitely another part I'd skip, and some other anime tropes I'd skip)

[hushed raven]

Do I need to add another thing to my watch list? It's already so long

[lethal walrus]

yeah i think it's so it's the original on disk but when you use it it's downscaled

[hushed raven]

I- this is a way of thinking that I didn't think was the usual when talking about downscaling hmm

[devout vault]

Anyways, for why the steins gate one is such an egregious example: || let's losslessly compress over 3 TB of data into 36 bytes, by sending it through a blackhole in the LHC ||

[hushed raven]

Ahh yes that's perfectly resonable method of compression

[devout vault]

And we kinda know it's lossless because of how critical it is that it be exactly the same

And don't even get me started on the decompression

[hushed raven]

I was going to make a joke about compression the human genome but it's no where big as I thought it was

[devout vault]

Oh it's worse

So ||they are sending their brain data back in time, essentially - memories, etc.||

|| And it comes out of time travel as a phone call at the given time, that the target then answers ||

|| And then it just... decompresses itself and overwrites their brain. Magically, I guess ||

[hushed raven]

I think that's the definition of "suspension of disbelief"

[safe dragon]

why? are you poor?

[devout vault]

yes

[safe dragon]

work harder

[devout vault]

It's a lot harder when it's something I know well

Don't get me wrong, I loved the series

But man, that is just... so ridiculous

[safe dragon]

just really good compression

[devout vault]

I'd rather hardly work, thanks

[safe dragon]

damn...

[devout vault]

Also apparently there is an IRL study that is using some temporal data for AI video generation, and they called it steins gate
https://openreview.net/forum?id=8WS5nDWIWE

Steins gate is a specific worldline though, so how does that make sense as a name. smh

[hushed raven]

Oof I do not have time based knowledge to understand that paper, as interesting as it is, I may never understand itXD

[cinder karma]

Just get your alchemy machine going

[little furnace]

I'm inching slowly forward through the B-Side of Summit in Celeste, which is incredibly weird because I use the metric system.

[safe dragon]

centimetering through

[lethal walrus]

im slowing cenimetring

[lethal walrus]

:<

[safe dragon]

soz

[fleet wren]

celeste mentioned
I finished every lvl btw

[little furnace]

Did you do the Golden Strawberries?

[fleet wren]

not that good unfortunately

[little furnace]

But you did the C-Sides? Congrats. I feel like they will be too hard for me.

[fleet wren]

that i did

[little furnace]

Yay.

[lethal walrus]

im stuck on either summit b-side or the one before the summit

[little furnace]

I still think the game should have won against God of War in the music category of the British Academy Games Awards.

[little furnace]

Both are really hard.

[lethal walrus]

mhm

[little furnace]

I recently returned to it after an almost three-year break.

[cinder karma]

Having fun playing your library?

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by atravita as #7891 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1493691811930312894)

[little furnace]

Absolutely. There are so many games in there I still need to play. So many works of art. Why is life so short? Every piece of art deserves to be admired.

[hushed raven]

Yay compiled my first c++ program!
-# it was just dolphin with less than 1 line changed so it doesn't blur pixel art but it worked!

[lethal walrus]

dolphin file manager or emulator?

[hushed raven]

Good point, file manager XD

[white turret]

friendly reminder C++ started as a guy going: what if structs in C could do even more?

[devout vault]

I assumed the former since most of the games people pay with dolphin aren’t pixel art

[devout vault]

Ah yes, c with classes.

[little furnace]

I think the OOP already existed back then, so I think he explicetly thought of classes.

[prisma flume]

unfortunately bouncer is already compromised by the spenny syndicate
https://www.nexusmods.com/stardewvalley/mods/44513

[prisma flume]

what if integer incrementing could do even more?

[fleet wren]

people consider operator overloading to be one of c++'s great evils but tbh it's not even top 10

[white turret]

^ oh yeah, I forgot to post this.

Look at that insane climb

And I want to stress that its not counted towards the % unless its a verified match against the compiler

[rain apex]

What's the logic behind the squares

[white turret]

Larger square = bigger file. The size of the .text section specifically (executable code).

Bigger square, larger file or more code.

[rain apex]

So it's like ELF sections kinda

[white turret]

Green = completed, 100% matching (usually linked). If its blue/grey, its incomplete. The closer to grey it is, the less finished it is. The more blue it is the more done-ish it is

Helps visualize how much we have done overall

And entirely dark grey means the file has not been attempted yet

Full blue could also indicate we have all functions implemented but not all of them match yet

Register swaps, etc.

We also assign scores to our differences ie the function differences vs the original asm and lower is better score. 0 is the ideal score because 0 = matching

Certain differences are higher score aka a worse difference

The lower the score/diff is the easier it generally is to be sure that its equivalent

[dusty pollen]

oh interesting, so it's attempting to generate code and compile it to see if it matches the compiled binaries?

I suppose for things that for some reason can't be decompiled in other ways, that is an interesting approach

[devout vault]

As if people won't misuse any sufficiently complex feature

I mean... <gestures at the thinking sand that I am currently typing on>

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by irocendar as #7892 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1493742191070281728)

[cinder karma]

Overloading the division operator to become a path separator is fun

[white turret]

yeah, its very brute forcey though. For example look at this

//...
int i, j;

for(i = 0; i < 4; i++) {
    //... code here
}

for(j = 0; j < 4; j++) {
    //... code here
}

// assume the values of i or j arent used after these loops```

vs

```c
//...
int i;

for(i = 0; i < 4; i++) {
    //... code here
}

for(i = 0; i < 4; i++) {
    //... code here
}

// assume the value of i isnt used after these loops```

equivalent, but the compiler could decide to use different registers

effectively this means this is 2 permutations of the same set of C functions with a given X functionality

and we have to "permute" through this set to find a member that matches when compiled with the original compiler and settings to the exact machine code

[rain apex]

Is the compiler a specific version of gcc or something bespoke

[white turret]

It depends on the game. It takes a lot of guess work to identify the compiler and settings

Most Nintendo 64 games used either the Silicon Graphics computer compiler (called IDO) or GCC from either the 2.7.x family or 2.8.x family (it depended on the developer)

Those 2 GCC versions codegen wise are very different, as 2.7.x pre-dates the EGCS refactor of GCC

and 2.8.x was just after that refactor

and in the case of the SGI compiler it was either 5.3 or 7.1 for technical reasons it could not be any version before, between or after those 2 versions

The technical explanation for that is weird

[rain apex]

So u have to know this before u can let the llm go

[white turret]

Not just that but the repo needs to have a certain level of human work put into it to give the AI something to go off of

you cant just let it run on a new untouched game

Its gotta be fed before it can work the actual magic

[devout vault]

I too need to be fed before I'll do things for anyone

Don't ask me to think about things before I eat breakfast

[hushed raven]

is it just one LLM doing it or is it like a hierarchical system with an orchestrator and sub-LLMs (?)?

[white turret]

Most Gamecube decomps using AI are using a Claude Code workflow that melee came up with which works pretty good for matching assists

Even N64 projects like Goldeneye which have been stalled for well over a year with no new matches recently let Claude look at their project: and it immediately solved 2 of their nonmatches

Which is crazy

[rain apex]

How expensive is the endeavor

[hushed raven]

and which model is used? I'm guessing there needs to be some work of Opus in there for sure

[white turret]

Also generally speaking we dont throw functions immediately into the AI it is at the very end of manual permutation

We generally do:

manually decomp func -> clean up -> early attempts to match -> manual experimentation -> post to decomp.me to let other people look at it -> (repeat that some level of attempts) -> if the function is close to matching, run it in the decomp permuter ( https://github.com/simonlindholm/decomp-permuter , a tool we wrote to randomly random permute C functions to better match) -> and only after all of this do we actually ask the AI for help if its still not matching

Uh costs im not sure

I can ask later

[long verge]

Looks like a fossilized spider to me

[dusty pollen]

it's a good additional tool to have in your arsenal for things like this for sure. I never got the obsession with ai being all or nothing

(for code. I get why people want "nothing" for other things)

[white turret]

The record for the most frustrating match ive personally done has got to be a Mario Kart 64 function

It was a 20-30 line function that just drawed a red square to a framebuffer when the game crashed

it took 3 years to match

[dusty pollen]

jesus

is the issue that there are no decompilers for the compilers used or something?

[white turret]

No, the compiler did something extremely strange. It loaded the constant 6 into 5 different registers instead of reusing the same register for it

[dusty pollen]

oh I meant in general, but yikes

[white turret]

The sane version of the function is just ```c
void crash_screen_draw_square(u16 *framebuffer)
{
s32 size = 6;
s32 min;
s32 max;
s32 x;
s32 y;

for (min = 40, max = 46; max != 44; min++, max--) {
    for (y = min; y < max; y++) {
        for (x = min; x < max; x++) {
            framebuffer[y * 320 + x] = (max - min == (size ? size : 0)) ? 0xf801 : 0xffff;
        }
    }
}

osWritebackDCacheAll();
osViSwapBuffer(framebuffer);

}```

But no matter how many times we rewrote that or made changes, the IDO compiler was just too smart and reused the 6

We made it volatile, we used the register keyword, we wrote a pointer to that 6

Nothing

[dusty pollen]

ohhh, you're using a more modern compiler than was originally used I guess?

[white turret]

It was clear what was going on was IDO unrolled the loop in such a way it duplicated the 6 load

But we couldnt get that to work

No

IDO is a 1994 compiler

version 5.3, anyway

[dusty pollen]

ah, I see

[white turret]

It's actually fairly competent for the time

Like, im serious

[dusty pollen]

except it doesn't have a decompiler(?) (just trying to understand haha)

[white turret]

That didnt matter. We actually wrote our own custom decompiler and have gradually been adding more languages to it over time

[dusty pollen]

though I suppose if your goal is exact recompilation, a lot of decompilers wouldn't achieve that

[white turret]

https://github.com/matt-kempster/m2c

thats right, we wrote a decompiler specifically targeting the matching workflow

You can give this decompiler context (pre-processed header stuff, structs, etc) and the more context you give it the better the result

[dusty pollen]

basically what I'm asking is why this is a challenge compared to normal decompilation /gen

I'm not too familiar with decompilation so I'm curious

[white turret]

Since we do matching we run our file through the compiler and then check the asm differences vs the original asm

Let me grab an example of what a diff might look like

[dusty pollen]

so the challenge is jut getting an exact recompile rather than a "close enough" decompilation that compiles to slightly different code, I'm guessing for better emulation?

[white turret]

Left asm column is the original game machine code

Right is what was compiled

Yeah we dont just want equivalent code. We want it to generate the same machine code

That guarantees its equivalent, there is no ambiguity

[dusty pollen]

yeah that tracks

especially with older hardware/cpus where these changes would have made an even bigger impact

[hushed raven]

Getting it to compile back to the original asm is needed to make sure it works on the original hardware right? or have I misunderstood that?

[white turret]

Grey color is "this asm is unchanged", red means subtracted asm, green generally means added instructions, and other colors are for stuff like changed labels or register swaps

A perfect match will show up as a purple checkmark

score 0, aka 100%

[dusty pollen]

sorry about all the questions btw haha, this is quite interesting!

[white turret]

With that out of the way I eventually did figure out what the dev did for that stupid crash screen draw square function

[dusty pollen]

do tell!

[white turret]

#define WHITE_COLOUR 0xFFFF
#define RED_COLOUR 0xF801

// (x,y) of top left pixel of square
#define SQUARE_X 40
#define SQUARE_Y 40

#define SQUARE_SIZE_X 6
#define SQUARE_SIZE_Y 6

// width of the square's border being drawn.
#define BORDER_WIDTH 1

#define SQUARE_X2 SQUARE_X + SQUARE_SIZE_Y
#define SQUARE_Y2 SQUARE_Y + SQUARE_SIZE_X

// Here's to you, Yoshimoto, for writing this stupid function. 3 years. 3 years to match.
void crash_screen_draw_square(u16* framebuffer) {
    s32 h;
    s32 i;
    s32 j;

    for (h = 0; h < 2; h++) {
        for (i = (h * BORDER_WIDTH) + SQUARE_Y; i < (((SQUARE_Y2 - (h * BORDER_WIDTH)))); i++) {
            for (j = (h * BORDER_WIDTH) + SQUARE_X; j < (((SQUARE_X2 - (h * BORDER_WIDTH)))); j++) {
                framebuffer[(i * 320) + j] = (h == 0) ? (RED_COLOUR) : (WHITE_COLOUR);
            }
        }
    }

    osWritebackDCacheAll();
    osViSwapBuffer(framebuffer);
}``` They had a bunch of defines, but in particular, they were doing `h * 1` inside of the loop

That should be optimized out, but the * 1 confused the compiler

[dusty pollen]

I love vindictive code comments

[white turret]

I worked on this function on and off must have been like 11 times over 3 years each time i had an idea

Eventually one of them worked

What I realized was a later function in the same file (this file handles the "crash screen") was very similar to this

[dusty pollen]

"oh god they couldn't have been this stupid, could they?"

[white turret]

So I was like.. maybe I should try writing this function like that later function

That caused the behavior I was looking for

And from there we got it

[devout vault]

I mean, native decompilers in general just are much further behind stuff like JVM or .Net ones

[white turret]

Its more like the same dev tends to write code the same way

Habits

thanks to the credits lists of various Nintendo 64 EAD games we know who wrote this crash system too and who to blame

I believe this to be Hirohito Yoshimoto's work

[devout vault]

I mean, in the days before constexpr, #define is a very reasonable way to do it

[white turret]

https://themushroomkingdom.net/credits/name/345

[devout vault]

Since it can be optimized by the compiler in various ways even if it did not do so here

[dusty pollen]

(I was more making a joke about the process of realising these things lmao)

[white turret]

IDO has enum but enum basically is a fancy keyword for signed 32-bit integer, and so we rarely use enum as that can affect matches due to the associated type

#define is much better for maintaining matching

[devout vault]

(Ah)

[dusty pollen]

(at least for me when I do slight pentesting stuff haha)

[devout vault]

The days before type-specific enums, too...

[dusty pollen]

I'm far from a professional pentester but I have found stuff here or there