programmers-off-topic

[cinder karma]

I mean, like, it's a great little laptop to give to a high schooler

Or your grandma

Or if you're just planning on checking email, etc levels of work

Which is, like. Me these days

[regal ingot]

Apple is really good at having the product they just unveild actually available the next day or week.

[devout vault]

why did you think that

[weak obsidian]

Id say its packs a lot more power, high schoolers dont need that, its powerful enough for college and lightweight gaming, it can handle i believe video editing and 20+ tabs open with Adobe software in thr background

[devout vault]

(but also, sometimes it's just setup mods -> play that day -> forget until next time)

[cinder karma]

Well, what would you give a high schooler otherwise

[weak obsidian]

Whats a mod u cant live without?

[devout vault]

("setup mods" being "download a wabbajack pack" these days)

[prisma flume]

i'm of the opinion that schoolkids don't need laptops and i would've been more productive with a book

[hushed raven]

fair point most of my time spent is just installing mods and working out the load order

[weak obsidian]

...chromebook 200 dollar, high-school shouldnt use mac

They log into canvas

[little furnace]

... nobody should use Mac.

[devout vault]

I'm not invested enough in skyrim modding to care about manually curating my own setup 😛

[weak obsidian]

College? Actually working in ur field kinda work

[weak obsidian]

I hate mac. But the neo changed my mind

[cinder karma]

The neo changed your mind?

[hushed raven]

I was but I just can't be bothered anymore, tried yesterday but the aformentioned wabbajack didn't agree XD

[weak obsidian]

It demonstrates how optimixed the OS is

[cinder karma]

Oh, my mom has a Mac now lol, and so does my dad

[little furnace]

I was given a Macbook for free and never use it because it's awful. Scrolling with mouse and with touchpad always is in the same direction. You can't say that you want to swipe up on the touchpad to scroll down but turn the wheel down on the mouse to do the same.

[prisma flume]

that's an odd hill to die on

oh now i think about it that does sound annoying though

[little furnace]

If you use both mice and touchpad a lot, you will start to hate it if you are used to different behavior.

[regal ingot]

totally agree. I hear there's some 3rd party software that can fix that but it's never annoyed me quite enough to try it out.

[devout vault]

That has been annoyance for me at times

[cinder karma]

Tbh here are the possibilities

1. Use my current laptop until it breaks
2. Use my current laptop until the work lottery gives me a new laptop
3. Eventually pick up a second hand desktop.
4. Eventually pick up a cheap laptop from ebay

Work buys Dells

[prisma flume]

i've been waiting for a lenovo carbon x1 for weeeeeeks from work

[cinder karma]

5. Buy myself smth nicer.

[prisma flume]

by the time it gets here it won't even be hot enough that this p14s is cooking my hands while i work

[marble jewel]

I use a Macbook and can confirm that quite a bit of third party software makes it usable for me

[weak obsidian]

High end builds consists of intel celeron or pentium III, 2-4GB DDR3, 32-64GB eMMC

(Joke)

[devout vault]

just like windows

[prisma flume]

celeron and pentium. what a time to be alive

[cinder karma]

I mean there is option 6..... wait for mom or dad to give me their macbook

[devout vault]

Option 7.... build your own

[weak obsidian]

Windows 11 sucks

[devout vault]

https://tenor.com/view/obadiah-stane-tony-stark-was-able-to-build-this-in-a-cave-with-a-box-of-scraps-tony-stark-box-of-scraps-iron-man-gif-23963164

[cinder karma]

How much building do you think I'm gonna do....

[marble jewel]

Macbook works well for me at work because I often find myself unplugged and it lasts all day. Compared to my Lenovo that could barely be a few hours off the charger.

[cinder karma]

Again, I dont need a top of the line machine. I dont do serious cad work and I don't game

Matt, I cant imagine working away from my giant monitors

[devout vault]

exactly - mips should work fine for your case, right?

[cinder karma]

At all

[weak obsidian]

If u wanna go super cheap PC

[marble jewel]

tbh, my current role at work mostly has me using a browser with a ton of tabs, attending Teams meetings, and checking emails

[weak obsidian]

1080 gpu

I7 7th gen

16gb ddr4 ram

[little furnace]

Not a modern CPU with an integrated GPU? That's what I chose.

[weak obsidian]

Ryzen 3250U

...my laptop uses that awful cpu

[prisma flume]

a gtx 970 is perfectly fine for 1080p still

[weak obsidian]

Its horrid

[weak obsidian]

I mean 1080 can go for 70 bucks if ur lucky

100 if ublociy

I snatched one for 63 bucks a year ago for a spare pc

Since the guy wanted to get rid of it

[little furnace]

i3-1215U would be my pick.

[weak obsidian]

...i3?

Whats it compared to for an i7

Is that like an i7 6th gen power?

[little furnace]

It outperforms the i7-10510U, apparently.

[weak obsidian]

..woah

Im stunned

[little furnace]

And depending on the benchmark even the i7-1165G7.

[weak obsidian]

Can it run doom

[little furnace]

Probably.

Can it run Crysis?

[marble jewel]

Forget Crysis, can it run mega modded SDV?

[hushed raven]

yes it can

to both crysis and mega modded SDV

[weak obsidian]

I mean

My intel celeron laptop runs heavy mod packs for stardew

Stardea is like can it run doon

Doom

[little furnace]

But does it have Blast Processing?

[weak obsidian]

Idk

[hushed raven]

at risk on being dangrously ontopic,The only thing causing slowdown on my 6th gen i7 was onTimeChange but most games ran on medium with a GTX 970 pretty damn grand, great mix of hardware

[prisma flume]

it doesn't even have Sixty Four Bits, which is far more than thirty-two

the 970 is still very capable for sure, the 3.5gb memory doesn't particularly matter if you're on HD/FHD

[hushed raven]

for the games I play I rarely went above 2GB, it's only within the last 3 months that I have was somewhat in need of a new GPU, but that was more because drivers being depreciacatted than games needing it

[prisma flume]

deprecated*

legally required to fix that typo in #progo

[regal ingot]

for some reason I always spell that wrong. And I know it's wrong, so if autocorrect doesn't fix it then I have to go figure out what the right way is.

[hushed raven]

made it worse

[hushed raven]

I don't have an excuse, I did actually just think they were said and spelled the same way, I am quite wrong XD

[rain apex]

im sad that C# wont let me do (boolCheck ? MethodA : MethodB)(arg1, arg2)

[frosty echo]

Python will

[cinder karma]

(boolCheck ? MethodA : MethodB).Invoke(arg1, arg2)

[rain apex]

thats still illegal atra

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/dotnet/csharp/language-reference/compiler-messages/cs0173?f1url=%3FappId%3Droslyn%26k%3Dk(CS0173)

i got bonked by this

[worn remnant]

reflect to get a methodinfo and Invoke it?

[rain apex]

is that gonna be one line

atm i just gave up and did (boolCheck ? MethodA(arg1, arg2) : MethodB(arg1, arg2))

[cinder karma]

Ugh

That sucks I'm sorry

[rain apex]

its finnneeee

if im bothered by it later ill just make a static method

[safe dragon]

doing it via methodinfo should work yeah but then you have reflection overhead

[rain apex]

which would be silly for this

hm but im not sure how u would write it with reflection

do u just boolCheck ? nameof(MethodA) : nameof(MethodB)

[red crest]

AccessTools.Method(typeof(Thing), boolCheck ? nameof(MethodA) : nameof(MethodB)).Invoke(arg0, arg1, arg2)

[rain apex]

ah yea what i was imagine

the one that im confuse about is

why does as Func<object, object, string> no work

the casting of method group to delegate seems mysterious

[red crest]

are you able to technically explain why it should

[rain apex]

see i thought problem here is just no knowledge of type

but i know that A and B have same method signature

so i thought ((boolCheck ? MethodA : MethodB) as Func<object, object, string>)(arg1, arg2) could work but shrug it still bonk me

[safe dragon]

I've never tried casts to a Func but yeah that'd break regardless. You'd have to do the cast within the ternary expression for each

cause now it'll still fail to resolve at the same step before the cast even gets to happen

[rain apex]

ah nice a new bonk https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/dotnet/csharp/language-reference/compiler-messages/lambda-expression-errors?f1url=%3FappId%3Droslyn%26k%3Dk(CS0837)

The first operand of an 'is' or 'as' operator may not be a lambda expression, anonymous method, or method group.CS0837

ig this cast is just illegal

[safe dragon]

you're doing very funky things

[rain apex]

yea im doing snakeypls things

(funcA if boolCheck else funcB)(arg1, arg2) is valid snek pretty sure (but there is too much things which are valid snek so this doesnt mean much)

[red crest]

object mth = true ? MethodA : MethodB;
(mth as Func<object, string>)!.Invoke("wow");

this works apparently

[safe dragon]

that makes sense

[red crest]

only if you do object mth though not var mth

[rain apex]

oh do i just gotta cast methodA and methodB to object first

[safe dragon]

that's ultimately vastly worse for readability and likely performance than just doing what you were doing as a workaround though

[rain apex]

that is also a snakeypls thing 😌

[safe dragon]

you've now also lost getting any compilation errors if the arguments to the methods change

[red crest]

((true ? (object)MethodA : (object)MethodB) as Func<object, string>).Invoke(arg1 , arg2);
what a beautiful one liner

enterprise quality code

[safe dragon]

don't think that's getting through a code review I'm afraid...

[red crest]

oh i didnt change the method names there oops

chu doesnt do code reviews its ok

[rain apex]

i reviewed it and gone with this thanks for the merge request

[red crest]

ill circle back to my version in a few more sprints

keep up the good synergy out there

[cinder karma]

Ew.

[hushed raven]

sorry I don't speak programmers corporate

[safe dragon]

I only speak Dutch programmer corporate

[fleet wren]

please update your design doc with the code change and a timeline for prod rollout

[rain apex]

What's agile in dutch

[safe dragon]

time spent implementing feature: 30 minutes
time spent doing all the fluff around that: 3 days

[hushed raven]

don't forget unmessing up what the corporate AI forced upon you has messed up

[safe dragon]

we do just call it agile since it's just the name of the methodology

in normal regular English context "agile" would be translated as behendig

[cinder karma]

Did you see the Amazon thingies

[safe dragon]

that's so vague

that could be anything from an AWS quantum computing instance to a new cat toy

[cinder karma]

Amazon Admits Extensive AI Use Is Wreaking Havoc on Its Core Business https://share.google/NJDuFway2WcghWAva

[weak obsidian]

AI is amazing

....if used properly

AI helping with docs? Unit and integration tests? Count me in

Multiple agentic agents coding an app without human interaction? Good luck maintaining that

[safe dragon]

Junior and mid-level engineers will now require more senior engineers to sign off any AI-assisted changes

were they not before this

is that not just how code review works

[hushed raven]

I have much less faith in amazon than I did before, which is extraordinary given I thought I had no faith in them

[cinder karma]

I'm hearing i should go buy my car new headlights fast

Also go buy the cabin air filter I didnt realize my car had

[rain apex]

I thought the recent big aws die event is cus 2 data center got hit by missile

[safe dragon]

this definitely reads as "we're not actually changing anything meaningful but people wanted to get out of the damn meeting so some random shit was agreed upon that no one has any intention to actually act on"

been in many such meetings

[hushed raven]

I figured their data centers would've been in asia, and not the middle east, unless I missed things happening outside of the middle east

[rain apex]

I also assumed all companies bigger than a tiny startup need ppl to sign off on changes i.e. do code review

[rain apex]

No the dubai one is kill

aws is everywhere

[hushed raven]

Ahhhh

[rain apex]

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cgk28nj0lrjo

[safe dragon]

their datacenters are everywhere cause they need to be able to advertise low latency

[cinder karma]

The AI can do code review

[safe dragon]

they're good at role playing code review

[frosty echo]

Probably delegated that to an AI too

[worn remnant]

role playing is, like, the one thing generative AI does

[cinder karma]

The AI can be the manager

[safe dragon]

but the managers don't want that

[hushed raven]

and in some cases, required fire suppression activities that resulted in additional water damage.
I thought non-water fire suppression was the standard everywhere where server infrastructure is housed

[cinder karma]

The AI can write poetry on the beach

[safe dragon]

also I'm afraid I've now experienced an actually good manager and have realized they can actually be generally beneficial

not just a pain in the ass

[cinder karma]

The AI can be the CEO

[safe dragon]

agreed

[cinder karma]

The AI can be the customer

[safe dragon]

dear god

[cinder karma]

The AI can be the banker

The AI can fly the plane

[prisma flume]

i thought it would be a good few years before amazon declared war

the future comes at you fast

[devout vault]

RIP my money, I guess

[cobalt shore]

Holy COW that is insane

sry about your money

[sand frost]

Honestly that’s too many words

They repeated themselves a bit

[hushed raven]

about 4 to 5 times per point if my count is correct (likely isn't)

[dusty pollen]

-# the middle east IS almost entirely in Asia by most definitions

[hushed raven]

-# Middle east and asia minus middle east in the case XD

[steel kraken]

dubai was previously considered mostly safe and a lot of comically rich customers there to justify

[lethal walrus]

It's probably excessive to run a windows VM to use its native support for a specific vpn protocol instead of figuring out how to deal with it properly in Linux right

[long verge]

TLDR

Did u get your money back or not ?

[lethal walrus]

We are not in a position to refund the entire project, as huge parts were already spent on game and asset development, paid out to royalties, and for project overhead, but we do want to do what we can to make things right, in whatever way we tenably can. We'll try to have more on what that might look like in the near future.

[sand frost]

They spent some of the money and they don’t really have enough to pay it back

Honestly what could they have spent it on

Paying people not to do very much?

[worn remnant]

extremely plausible, given how hard it is to receive a working product in exchange for money https://danluu.com/nothing-works/
(as usual, do not read danluu.com unless you enjoy despairing about moloch)

[devout vault]

What's moloch

[supple ether]

it's the name of a deity but I suspect that's not what it means inthis context

[devout vault]

I did mean in this context, yes 😛

[frosty echo]

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Moloch 2. (figuratively) A person or thing demanding or requiring a very costly sacrifice. maybe

[devout vault]

As someone who read the bible way too much growing up (by choice, not forced to by anyone), I am familiar with that being a deity of some sort

[rain apex]

I thought it's a metropolis reference

As in the moloch machine

[sand frost]

I think this is some concept like the basilisk that is shorthand for..something? Bigger concept of some kind

[fleet wren]

these newgens smh back in me days we offered sacrifices to baal

[cinder karma]

https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=d19gPl-1z74&si=MfkoAsuC9O8c47D0

[rain apex]

In the movie it's "the industry/capitalism is eating people"

[cobalt shore]

I think mammon machine bc ChronoTrigger

[cinder karma]

What movie

What's a movie

[sand frost]

It’s when things in a little light box move around

[devout vault]

A video game that you can't influence (or interact with, besides watching)

[sand frost]

Like an RPG but you don’t get to roll dice

[cinder karma]

Anyways

I've been listening to that song on repeat for literally like

Hours

[devout vault]

-# ~~ technically "RPG" is more about the RP than dice rolling. After all, how many video game RPGs involve rolling dice?

[cinder karma]

They nailed the LP feel

[rain apex]

All of them when u random anything

[devout vault]

1. You aren't rolling the dice
2. I think it could still technically count as an RPG without any sort of randomness

[cinder karma]

Is larping a rpg

Does larping use dice

[devout vault]

.8ball what atra said

[heavy dagger]

Ya never know...

[worn remnant]

hey everybody sorry for skipping out after dropping lingo, this is what i meant

[cinder karma]

Wrecking ball is such a good metal song oh my god

[worn remnant]

the inescapable grinding of industry/society/etc. that can cause sadness and suffering even without explicit bad actors

[rain apex]

We gotta have fritz lang metropolis movie night

[cinder karma]

What is a movie?

Tbh I assume neopets ttprg people like hired artists, etc

How much was the kick-starter

[rain apex]

Atra u can't play this card when it's older than u

[cinder karma]

I cant play that card for video games either then

[rain apex]

You can't play it for super mario nes but I'll allow it for super mario odyssey

[cinder karma]

I actually dont know the movie u talk abour

[rain apex]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metropolis_(1927_film)

This one

[cinder karma]

1927!

[rain apex]

I never seen it but I thought it's like, one of those things everyone knows about

[worn remnant]

i have also not seen it. i just know about the thing

[rain apex]

This is like 99% a metropolis homage too

[cinder karma]

I never heard about it tbh

[cinder karma]

Also wouldn't i like

Be more likely to knoe about smth populare while I'm alive

People also like Mario Galaxy

[rain apex]

Yeah but the gist of the bit is contrarianism

[cinder karma]

I listen to Miley Cyrus!

[devout vault]

Initial goal was only $40k, but then ended up with $427k

[devout vault]

I've never heard of it either

[cinder karma]

That's....more than I expected

Do they have accounting

Two full years, huh

[vestal hull]

@rain apex first one I made 😌

All of my mounts are like. River, Ocean, Pond.

I thought it was cute...

[lethal walrus]

i thought someone just had abroken image emoji

[vestal hull]

Great app.

Also great idea for an emoji

[hushed raven]

I am very tempted to steal the broken emoji idea

[vestal hull]

Remember to share...so I don't have to make it...

[weak obsidian]

For anyone wondering

The Razer BlackShark V3 Pro is the worst headset to ever buy, 220 dollars

Bought, tried it out

Sounds like a tin can

My 40 dollar headset has insanely better quality

[rain apex]

[weak obsidian]

It clamps very hard, got a headache in the first 20 minutes, don't recommend any blackshark headset

[vestal hull]

Another blob for my collection.

[weak obsidian]

I tried the 2.4 GHz low-latency wireless and Bluetooth modes, both were awful. Weirdly, Bluetooth sounded slightly better than the 2.4 GHz dongle, even though Razer claims the opposite. Wired mode was still horrendous.

Compared to my old Logitech, the BlackShark V3 Pro feels like hearing out of a tin can, everything sounds distant, like the audio is bouncing back to you rather than hitting your ears directly. Even with heavy EQ adjustments, the treble is weak, the highs are thin, and there’s a lack of punch and depth. It gives this “recessed soundstage” effect where instruments and vocals feel far away, rather than forward and present.

It suffers from:

Weak tonality: bass and midrange are recessed, highs are thin
Recessed soundstage / imaging: sound feels distant, not upfront
Compression / driver issues: even wired and wireless modes sound lifeless, almost “canned”
EQ limitations: boosting doesn’t fully restore warmth or impact

Trying to raise the tremble and fix its recessed feel only worsened the audio quality

[marble jewel]

Ew... yeah I wouldn't get any Razer product anymore. The BlackWidow was my gateway into mechs, and I had one of their gaming mice as well, but quickly learned that there were much better options for just about everything they make.

They just have been one of the most successful companies at charging a premium for having their products be "gaming"

I think I might've even had one of their headsets at one point.

[safe dragon]

I had 2 razer mice fail in exactly the same way and stopped trusting the brand

this logitech mmo mouse has at this point lasted longer than both of them combined

[marble jewel]

I forget if it was drift or extra clicks or something that happened to me, but all of my Razer products eventually failed or were just hindered by their horrible software

[weak obsidian]

dangg

[safe dragon]

both of mine started dropping inputs while I was dragging

[weak obsidian]

Yeah, it was really expensive, and feels cheap

[frosty echo]

^

[weak obsidian]

I personally use wired mice (idk if that's the one you are referring to)

So I never had issues with mine

[safe dragon]

mine were wired too

I had deathadder mice

[marble jewel]

It's kind of like how outside of the mainstream, everyone knows Beats aren't the best headphones, but they're one of the most successful at marketing themselves

[safe dragon]

I avoid wireless peripherals like the plague

[marble jewel]

I think this is the one I had as well

[weak obsidian]

Got a random question for yall

Has anyone here ever coded before, or understands a bit about it?

[safe dragon]

I think you're a few years out of date...

[hushed raven]

the only wireless I don't avoid, is in ear headphones, and mice, everything else wired

[marble jewel]

You don't need to miss it this time

[hushed raven]

What's coded? not a clue what that is

[weak obsidian]

Coding in general

is what I mean

[marble jewel]

No, this is #programmers-off-topic we don't know how to code

[safe dragon]

only my travel headphones are wireless, anything else I have is wired. Even if it has a bluetooth mode I don't use it

[hushed raven]

no clue what coding is either, nope not a scooby

[weak obsidian]

Oh. I never..read the name

😭

[safe dragon]

what the hell is code

[fleet wren]

Same, I've never written a line of code in my life

[lethal walrus]

coding is like when youre encoding data into the audio streams for radio right

[weak obsidian]

yeahh!!!

[safe dragon]

I only write Typst which is markup and thus not code

[weak obsidian]

I was writing a policy for my application, and was curious to get your opinion on it

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by atravita as #7681 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1481715665273618673)

[hushed raven]

Oh actually I lie I have done a tiny bit of scratch

[dusty pollen]

no coding is when hospital machines in bad tv shows go beeeeeeeeeep

[marble jewel]

My skills have atrophied. I only know how to prompt now.

[weak obsidian]

Was wondering how the community views this

Section

[marble jewel]

@hushed raven why?

[hushed raven]

-# omg it;s me!

Bahaha same idea XD

I did only read the first word, the 5th word is not me XD

[weak obsidian]

Would you say this isn't good?

I'm attempting to be very transaprent and

reasonable to a community

And wondered if this wasn't transparent/good enough

[weak obsidian]

Yeah, I use you to help

ty for all the effort you've put into it

i give u golden star

[rain apex]

Wow smh chatgpt calling the ruse

[dusty pollen]

wait, where is it getting this data from? github?

[weak obsidian]

Previous convos

waiiiiit a minute

I knew it, LeFaux is a vibe cocer!!

coder*

(JK)

[marble jewel]

Here's a fun prompt that Claude uses to import from other AI:

Export all of my stored memories and any context you've learned about me from past conversations. Preserve my words verbatim where possible, especially for instructions and preferences.

## Categories (output in this order):

1. **Instructions**: Rules I've explicitly asked you to follow going forward — tone, format, style, "always do X", "never do Y", and corrections to your behavior. Only include rules from stored memories, not from conversations.

2. **Identity**: Name, age, location, education, family, relationships, languages, and personal interests.

3. **Career**: Current and past roles, companies, and general skill areas.

4. **Projects**: Projects I meaningfully built or committed to. Ideally ONE entry per project. Include what it does, current status, and any key decisions. Use the project name or a short descriptor as the first words of the entry.

5. **Preferences**: Opinions, tastes, and working-style preferences that apply broadly.

## Format:

Use section headers for each category. Within each category, list one entry per line, sorted by oldest date first. Format each line as:

[YYYY-MM-DD] - Entry content here.

If no date is known, use [unknown] instead.

## Output:
- Wrap the entire export in a single code block for easy copying.
- After the code block, state whether this is the complete set or if more remain.

[weak obsidian]

Understood.

[marble jewel]

It's basically like a - summarize everything you know about me

[weak obsidian]

First, pause -- you're human, and that's rare ✨

[little furnace]

I wish you could export vectors.

[weak obsidian]

(pls dont use softening AI personalization or your gonna get spoon fed these coments)

[lethal walrus]

i imagine distilling would be a lot more effective then?

[hushed raven]

I mean, it's becoming the standard, I have a very strict set of rules I follow for AI stuff (none unless I am being forced to use it and certainly no GenAI), I will say that the doc is the best case scenario for using GenAI for programming related topics though and I would trust the repo more than if AI was one of the main contributors but I would still be semi unlikely to use it, unless theres no other alternative and I don't have the skills to make it myself

[cobalt shore]

hubby reached out for support with a mouse he'd gotten because it wasn't working and Razer support asked him for something which he sent and then they acted like he didn't send it and their ultimate answer was "well does it work on a different machine?" - his response was "the point of reaching out was that I wanted it to work on this machine" and we haven't bought anything from them since

[little furnace]

Probably. If that means what I think it does.

[weak obsidian]

Yeah, fully understandable. I used it originally as a mentor (dangerous if you keep chat history, it will get very soft), that

gosh I did it again (sent message to fast)

thats when I learned about ADR's

and architecture MD's, pep 8/257

im trying to learn ISO 9001 for my project

[lethal walrus]

training other models off a model's outputs

[weak obsidian]

and I dont wanna setup a CI/CL pipeline just yet

im too dumb

[cinder karma]

I think this is fine. I may add smth about requiring all PRs to have a human in the loop

[weak obsidian]

Yeah! That's a very good idea

Forgot about that part

[marble jewel]

I think what I was trying to do with ChatGPT was to get JetBrains Debugging+Hot Reload fixed, which I was never able to do

At least that's what it indicates in my memory dump:

[2024-05-31] - BetterChests — The user is working on a project called 'BetterChests' and uses both JetBrains Rider and Visual Studio for debugging. They have a minimal repro class where hot reload while debugging does not work correctly in JetBrains Rider (changing a variable doesn’t trigger expected hot reload behavior). They also encounter an ENC2014 error in JetBrains Rider but can successfully debug and hot reload without restarting in Visual Studio.

[weak obsidian]

ChatGPT sucks at coding

It hallucinated that Linux did not have a UI library back in glibc 2.17

and told me that on Windows 95 only raw Win32 existed

[marble jewel]

Yeah it wasn't a coding task, it was more of a troubleshooting exercise since I had already exhausted other options at that point

[weak obsidian]

(It forgot Delphi even existed)

[weak obsidian]

yeah

Id recommend Gemini or Claude for it

[marble jewel]

I have a multiple years long history of issues with Rider + Hot Reload

[weak obsidian]

less issues

[cinder karma]

Awwwww

Gemini doesn't know me :(

[marble jewel]

I'm sorry to hear that

[cinder karma]

No one understands me :flounce:

[marble jewel]

You can take comfort in knowing that Google knows everything about you

[cinder karma]

:loud dramatic sobs:

[weak obsidian]

I gave them my facial ID

and my phone uses face ID and fingerprint

gets to a point where I dont care

[cinder karma]

I'm too cheap to get face ID on a phone

[supple ether]

those are actually stored locally believe it or not

[cinder karma]

Also tbh faceID works terribly for east asians

[weak obsidian]

a nice 500 dollar Samsung S24 I got had it which was nice

[weak obsidian]

I typically wouldn't comment on it, but this is incredibly true

[supple ether]

I don't trust faceID to not lock me out of my phone if my face shape changes due to age or hrt

[weak obsidian]

On my phone through a heavy encryption yes

[supple ether]

fiongerprints don't change

[cinder karma]

I've also lost like a lot of the fat in my cheeks (finally!)

[supple ether]

unless you take them off I guess

[weak obsidian]

Thankfully android requires you to have a pin, still, it goes like this:

Face ID
Fingerprint
Pin

u cant take off a pin

[cinder karma]

It only took turning <redacted> to not look six fucking teen!

[supple ether]

well I use a pattern instead of a pin but yeah

[hushed raven]

thank you for bringing up my biggest gripe about facial recognition, How racist it can become without the intention of that

[weak obsidian]

what phone?

[supple ether]

I still get mistaken for being younger than I am. it's less bad than it used to be, but still

some kind of samsung

[weak obsidian]

I saw a video where a sister used her face to unlock and it worked (cheaper phone)

[cinder karma]

It's terrible lol all white people think all Asian people look the same

[weak obsidian]

I think the latest iphones have it better?

idk, havent used iphone in a while

[cinder karma]

I've heard horror stories of scammers walking into a bank with an obviously bad ID, lol

[hushed raven]

I remember using a dataset for some project where I was using image recognition to sort my images and half way through I realised how many of the humans were literally just generic white people, the lack of literally anyone alt, non-white, or with drastic visual distinctions was appauling

[cinder karma]

(Also, yes, I do like that my cheekbones have finally come in. )

Still have the acne problem

Smh

[weak obsidian]

just lazer it off

i heard using lasers work

(kidding)

[weak obsidian]

If it still persistant, might be what we are eating

I forgot what I used to eat but it just, left

I got no idea, dont ask me, im no genie

think was cause I was taking in an insane amount of sugar daily

...: D

[weak obsidian]

Tested it on wired, didn't improve the audio quality, tho when listening to music, it produced an incredibly high pitched sound similar to an excessive whine coil. I believe it's their drivers being pretty bad, because while my volume is at 50%, its about 15% volume strength if used on my old headset, could be how windows is registering it, I should never have a screal on a 220 dollar wired headset. When selecting game/music modes on apps, it instead disables audio, plays it, stops, plays again, switches to default (flat), and finally goes into bluetooth (even when wired)

Returning this today

I do not know what Razer did, but this is not normal

[sand frost]

Hot tip: spend all your time on a college campus and you can get mistaken for 18 instead of 16

[devout vault]

wait I thought you were ageless

[sand frost]

Hot tip: spend all your time on a college campus and you can get mistaken for 18 instead of 16

[long verge]

oh that sucks

[cinder karma]

Today and yesterday the documentation will randomly send me to a 404 page while I'm trying to use the search bar

Trying to use the in-program docs frozen the program?

[cinder karma]

At least the $1 bakers are gonna get their avatar?

[sand frost]

booo thanks discord for double sending

[devout vault]

I was very confused because I could’ve sworn I had already seen that message but didn’t look up to find it even if it was only two messages. Wondered if it was a riff on the previous one but couldn’t notice a difference

[sand frost]

no, my phone weirdly glitched in terms of signal so it thought it didn't send the first time even though it did

and then when i left the building and had better signal it sent again

also everyone can congratulate me on finally fixing the low tire pressure light!!

it only took me like 4 months

[hushed raven]

Yay! no more light!

[prisma flume]

smh have we learned nothing about transactional idempotency

[sand frost]

apparently my phone has not

[cinder karma]

Did you fix your tires

Yayyy!

Congratulations!!!!

[sand frost]

thanks!!

it only took me 2 hours of being trapped at costco

my husband is the best so he helped us navigate "oh our groceries are melting"

[cinder karma]

Anyways

[devout vault]

I'm sure anyone who joins the server will have a much clearer idea of who you are from your new nick

wait when did blueberry become <REDACTED FOR ON TOPIC> georg

[rain apex]

the age of JADGA is over elizabeth!

[rain apex]

me Yesterday at 10:10 AM

I think there's avg 0 item data definition in C# mods
But releasing your mod may push it to 0.01

[devout vault]

Does blueberry have a lot of them

You better not be saying no other mods have done it

[rain apex]

enough that bluebs started namespacing them

[devout vault]

That would be MM erasure

[rain apex]

BB_HIKAWA_*

[devout vault]

mine were namespaced too

SC0_MM_N

[rain apex]

(i said 0 mostly as a ref to the original spiders georg meme, i am aware that other mods have used custom item def)

[devout vault]

(Okay, good)

[cinder karma]

Btw

Why were people Jane

I was gonna pretend to be Jane Street but i think the real Jane Street wojld have gotten mad at me

[sand frost]

JA still launches!!

[cinder karma]

Anyways

Casey how is the Stardew board game

What is your opinion on Stardew ttrpg

[devout vault]

It's pretty hard

[devout vault]

I think the idea could be fun, though I imagine it wouldn't be combat focused

[sand frost]

there's quite a bit of combat in stardew depending on playstyle

but i can see how it might not be rpg-flavored combat

[cinder karma]

I have never ttrpg

[devout vault]

Well yes - I love doing skull cavern runs. But proportionately? Way less than the typical TTRPGs people know

[steel kraken]

assuming this is the existing stardew board game, I've played it 5 or so times and enjoy it

[devout vault]

Yeah, but it's definitely not as "take your time and do what you want" as the video game

(Although some people feel stressed by time stuff even in the video game...)

[prisma flume]

enough that i gave up on registering them manually and just fetch them from the assembly

[cinder karma]

I feel stressed by time stuff of life

[prisma flume]

which is going to bite my ass when i do another mod and wonder why all my serialised types and item data definitions aren't being added automagically

[steel kraken]

I mean in many ways the board game plays how we played stardew trying to do it in min time

[devout vault]

Throw it in a source generator and call it a feature

[red crest]

Add the automagic to your dotnet template

[devout vault]

Dotnet template? What's that?

If you aren't manually copying all the files and csproj stuff into your new project, are you even programming?

[supple ether]

what are you using them all for?

[prisma flume]

serialised types and items, mostly

i don't particularly like patching my unique object behaviours onto Object and Tool with harmony so i have to go through the subclass mire

[cinder karma]

I looked at the new icon and seriously thought it was Minecraft

[hushed raven]

I also did and was very confused

Oh it just changed again

I think? I may be going crazy

[cinder karma]

It's not April yet!

.... I'm actually considering what it would take to make my own flour

[hushed raven]

2 heavy rocks and a decent amount of arm strength, both of which I would say you have access to XD

[cinder karma]

Smh

Look I'm gonna build my own windmill

[sand frost]

Mortar and pestle?

[prisma flume]

all it takes for a mill is friction and force, you can just run over the wheat with your car

[cinder karma]

I also need to like

Grow wheat

[runic kraken]

Spending the morning documenting System F typing rules for my small language. It is extremely relaxing

[safe dragon]

my daily shilling for typst continues

[dusty pollen]

I do like that typst seems to be the answer to latex's refusal to become a full scripting language

[safe dragon]

I could not have used it if typst hadn't had the scripting capabilities it does

[cinder karma]

No, the answer to latex not being a full scripting language is luatex

[safe dragon]

oh and it also placing things where I say it should place them instead of 6 pages later while latex screams to me about my badness value

[cinder karma]

It only screams because you're a bad person

[dusty pollen]

latex, screaming: why do you do this to me? why do you put me through this? what moral failing has led you to this point--
crumble, who forgot a single &: ...

[safe dragon]

me: I know this table is ugly it needs to fool people into thinking it was generated with Microsoft Access

[rain apex]

badness 10000

[safe dragon]

in LaTeX I sometimes feel like a junior web dev putting !important behind everything in CSS

[dusty pollen]

wdym junior, that's clearly the ultimate senior web dev technique

[cinder karma]

I'm trying to figure out when it's a good time to point out to a coworker he needs needspace

[dusty pollen]

css needs to add !evenmoreimportant

!ultimate

[safe dragon]

!specificity(number)

the z-index approach

[fallen field]

!force no-really-i-want-this-one

[cinder karma]

(He also needs to turn up the badness of hyphenated words)

!sudo

[safe dragon]

!ignore no-really-i-want-this-one

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by atravita as #7690 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1482056155579551815)

[cinder karma]

I searched local indexing methods today

Do you think I'll get fired if I pull all the documentation and feed it to a local (LOCAL) indexer

[safe dragon]

no

go for it

[cinder karma]

It's literally not my job anymore. But I want to fix these tables

[devout vault]

new atra name drop?????

Atra is self sufficiency in the same direction as insanity, or are you having to ascend back from the descent into insanity

[cinder karma]

What do you think of "growing maize" and "look into flour production" and "potatoes "

[sand frost]

Potatoes sounds by far the easiest

Growing maize means learning nixtamalization

[cinder karma]

Tbh I mostly want the pretty ones that make popcorn

[sand frost]

Ok that should be easier then

It’s hard to get the dryness level right for popcorn iirc

It has to be dry enough to pop but no so dry it’s out of the water that expands to cause the pop

[little furnace]

It took me a while to warm up to TIS-100, but I find it amazing now.

[dusty pollen]

how much have you played so far?

[little furnace]

I think 16 levels? Maybe? I now need to implement a sorting algorithm.

[dusty pollen]

oh with the two list nodes?

[little furnace]

Yeah.

Not going to do it today. It's pretty late.

[cinder karma]

Interesting

Slowmode means you can't forward with a comment

[worn remnant]

forward with a comment is sent as two messages, so the second one gets eaten

[devout vault]

-# nom

[prisma flume]

excuse me what the fuck happened to minesweeper

after the popup login spam travesty that is daring to try and use Xbox Accessories without creating an account for the xbox controller in my hand with 100% vertical stick drift i have just about mcfucking had it

incredible that it tells you to login on the Xbox App which is preinstalled, but does not open the Xbox App and instead takes you to the Microsoft Store to download the Xbox App, and opening your existing Xbox App gives you An Error and pressing Try Again does absolutely nothing

[hushed raven]

Oh yay they've enshitified minesweeper as well as solitaire, I was wondering how long it would take

[devout vault]

Minesweeper has fallen

Honestly kinda surprised me, I’m surprised they remembered it

[prisma flume]

it honestly looks like a parody

i suppose we're past that point now

[devout vault]

If you’re going to involve money in minesweeper, please do it after pulling a balatro with it or something

[safe dragon]

cool, best windows update in years

[devout vault]

https://tenor.com/view/doubt-press-x-la-noire-meme-x-button-gif-19259237

[safe dragon]

we did nothing, trust

[devout vault]

Can't wait for someone to look closer and discover it's the Telemetry AI+++ Update (now with bonus enshittification!)

(How can Telemetry be AI? That's simple - an AI is actively inventing new forms of telemetry personalized to you, specifically, to get even more data!)

(or it will try. it will actually break your computer)

[safe dragon]

like a gossip finding random shit to tell everyone that no one even knew one could care about

[devout vault]

The lack of changes in question:

(From https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/release-health/status-windows-11-25h2#issue-details)

[safe dragon]

that one doesn't seem to be resolved

oh wait yes I get it

[hushed raven]

Users might encounter the error, “C:\ is not accessible – Access denied”, which prevents access to files and blocks the launch of some applications including Outlook, Office apps, web browsers, system utilities and Quick Assist.
I'm sorry but doesn't loosing the C drive also lead to yanno the OS not starting?? XD

[safe dragon]

eh minor bug

[devout vault]

Yeah there are much bigger problems, like the telemetry only collecting 97% of your data

(for legal reasons, this is hyperbole)

(unless you have recall on, I guess)

[pliant snow]

We still have A:\, don't worry

[rain apex]

is there a way to do this in C#

void ModifyInPlace(ref SomeTyp val);

foreach (ref SomeTyp val in listOfTyp)
{
  ModifyInPlace(ref val);
}

atm i just do for (int i = 0; i<len; i++)

[cinder karma]

Yes

[rain apex]

how do i make it happen then

[cinder karma]

Can you try using CollectionsMarshall to grab the underlying array of the list as a span

Then this

Which might be a later version of c# than stardew, I dont recall

[rain apex]

An unsafe class nice

the reason why i was thinking about this at all is cus

[tranquil grove]

I was about to suggest the linq foreach, but it just silently doesn't edit them (at least with strings)

[ivory shadow]

You may as well just use an array directly

[cinder karma]

But resizing :(

Spans are there.

[rain apex]

it's very legal to do this in rust

for &mut typ element in slice.iter_mut() {
    modify_in_place(element);
}

or in C where u just have the pointer

[cinder karma]

I was thinking of it because I do have one case where I edit the animation frames on farmer in a mod

And just went with that collections Marshall ref stuff to actually edit it because it was a value type

[rain apex]

the thing im doing is like

bootleg content patcher TargetFields

ill just make this reflection interface more complicated and remember the parent

[runic kraken]

System F implemented in my toy language

In terms of type systems this annihilates almost every production language (C, C++, C#, Java, TypeScript, Go) and puts it closer to Haskell or Rust than anything it should be

[weak obsidian]

Got my mom stuff for her birthday :3

Hope she likes

She's been wanting brooches

So this is relating to programming, all merchandise was coded in Rust

[safe dragon]

beautiful

really neat pins

crazy what the rust programming language is capable of

[rain apex]

The chinese on that third one is concerning

WuJinkun (品牌已备案,跟卖必投诉封店,绝不和解)

I think they r promising to report anyone who is resell same thing as them

[lethal walrus]

thats an interesting thing to put in the brand name

[safe dragon]

they put their whole disclaimer in the brand name

[hushed raven]

certainly one way to do it

[prisma flume]

another fine order from Don't Fuck With Us LLC

[weak obsidian]

very weird, but yeah just translated it

[rain apex]

@weak obsidian https://bevy.org/

[weak obsidian]

thanks!

LOL

Rust

strikes again!!

ah yes

Chromium browsers dont allow u to save passwords/cookies

Unless you enter ur password to save a CSV file or wahtever

so sad for my backup app

[prisma flume]

excellent. the controller setup guide webpage link printed on the box for my brand new Xbox Controller is a 404

this company is held together with string and enterprise contracts

[ivory shadow]

... do I want to know what statistical anomaly you've committed to earn the title "item data definitions georg"?

[prisma flume]

i'm fairly sure just using item data definitions makes you a statistical anomaly

[ivory shadow]

You can imagine my concern, then, at the thought of what it would take to become a statistical anomaly among a group that's already a statistical anomaly.

[prisma flume]

most of them are in a single private repo, but most of the public ones have at least one too

[ivory shadow]

Ah, private repos... now those are some places to hide some code crimes. Not that I'd know anything about that.

[safe dragon]

code crimes are preferably put inside legacy codebases that some poor guy has to maintain 30 years into the future

if you set Nullable to false for a newly created C# project though you're getting sued

that is deliberate sabotage

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by atravita as #7701 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1482710635308646451)

[runic kraken]

The Dolphin was programmed in Haskell, I was there

[runic kraken]

C# still not having a Maybe type pisses me off

In Rust/Haskell/Ocaml you can do Maybe.map or fmap

[safe dragon]

explicit nullable and all the null handling operators we've got do a pretty solid job serving the same use as Maybe/Option

The lack of Result is a lot worse to me

[runic kraken]

It's still ape tier

Why the fuck can't they just port F# computation expressions over

[safe dragon]

reasons probably, but discriminated unions are coming to C# as well either next release or the LTS release after

which should make implementing a Result equivalent trivial

if they don't make one to begin with as part of the standard library

Result was basically used as the core standard example in the proposal after all

[runic kraken]

until then there's always the abstract sealed record hack I discovered and intentionally causing namespace collision

[safe dragon]

there have been funky libraries to try and hack it in for a while

in an actual professional environment I'd rather wait for something properly supported though

[runic kraken]

I use it in my library where I force category theory into this language, to give you some idea of how little i respect it's "best practices"

public abstract record Maybe<A> : HKT<MaybeW, A>
{
    public sealed record Just(A Value) : Maybe<A>;
    public sealed record Nothing() : Maybe<A>;

    // Projection function to extract the Maybe<A> from the HKT.
    public static Maybe<A> Proj(HKT<MaybeW, A> h) => (Maybe<A>)h;
}

/// <summary>
/// The Maybe type represents an optional value, either Just or Nothing.
/// </summary>
/// <typeparam name="A"></typeparam>
public sealed class Maybe
    : Eq<MaybeW>,
      Functor<MaybeW>,
      Applicative<MaybeW>,
      Monad<MaybeW>,
      Semigroup<MaybeW>
{```

[safe dragon]

oh I am well aware

[runic kraken]

if you strip away the C# syntax crimes i committed that would make Uncle Bob want to send a hitman after me, you can see how i get around lack of discriminated unions

So needless to say myself and a friend want them as soon as possible @safe dragon

[safe dragon]

so do I

[runic kraken]

I'm not sure why it's taking them so long

It's an easy feature to add

[safe dragon]

getting hundreds of people to agree on the exact details of every part of it is hard

it's not implementing it that's hard

it's getting people on one line, agreeing on how edge cases should be treated, endless meetings

and making sure the compiler treats them as well as it can performance wise

make sure exhaustiveness checking is handled properly in all sorts of odd scenario's....

probably want to make sure they are handled well by the reflection apis as well

make sure evil people like modders can't sneakily add more cases to a union at runtime since that'd break a core principle of their design

[runic kraken]

I call C# ape-tier for a reason and that is because it is a socially designed language

If you look at Rust or Haskell, the goal is to design for efficiency, logic and type safety

Granted it's not as bad as Go, the latter which only got generics relatively recently in the grand scheme of things

[dusty pollen]

iirc haskell is far from efficient? I know rust is but haskell is very high-level and considered pretty unoptimised if I remember correctly (I forgive it though 😌 it’s fun enough to accept a 2gb compiler)

[runic kraken]

Efficient in terms of implementation, not performance necessarily

System F omega makes incredibly powerful abstractions very simple to implement

[runic kraken]

Also you'd be surprised, if you write good code, it can get close to C++ performance I've heard

[dusty pollen]

tbh I haven’t done anything in haskell after my uni course, as much as I loved it. but yeah, tbh that’s true with many languages, isn’t it? even python can be speedy in certain contexts (if you use numpy a lot)

[runic kraken]

yes and no

[runic kraken]

play around with it, it's improved a LOT

the package manager situation is basically almost fixed

[dusty pollen]

oh I never did try out packages tbh my mental health was so bad I never even did the section on monads, which is unfortunate for how much I loved that course. maybe I’ll try it tbh

have you tried scala, char?

it’s supposed to be a more functional version of java. it certainly has its quirks but there’s some charm to it

[runic kraken]

Yep but I only like it with cats-effect

[runic kraken]

A monad is a monoid in the category of endofunctors

[safe dragon]

idiomatic haskell isn't particularly fast no. Generally the whole lazy evaluation thing is more a crutch than a benefit for performance and for memory allocations it's a lot worse

[dusty pollen]

unfortunately not having reached monads means not having reached monoids or endofunctors either, but I will definitely take a look at it at some point

[safe dragon]

ignoring the State monad, immutable language design isn't paritcularly well suited for high performance in general

[dusty pollen]

oh my lecturer introduced functional programming to us by informing us that no language is truly functional because writing to screen is a side effect

[safe dragon]

it does allow for some unique optimizations, pure functions can have a lot more compiler magic done with them since you can guarantee they will do the same thing every time

[safe dragon]

which is why basically every haskell program starts with an IO monad

[runic kraken]

Partially true, but we can atleast label the disgusting side effects

Which is why I like monads

I don't have to scan 500 lines to spot the issue, i can just read the type signature. Which is crucial when I don't store a mental movie of my code

if it doesn't use State, it is IMPOSSIBLE for it to change a variable

[dusty pollen]

type signatures are handy, yeah. I never realised how much when I started programming because I started on python etc but even c# means I can't go back now

[safe dragon]

typst actually requires pure functions since they do a lot of caching to make the document generation more performant

it doesn't support mutation outside of counters

[runic kraken]

C# is actually annoyingly painful for me, i had to force category theory into it to make it so I could write C# code and then just not forget what i was doing the next week

[dusty pollen]

that being said I once sidelined a functional programming tutorial by getting the tutor to go on a tangent comparing nodejs and python error messages

[runic kraken]

Id rather read 15 nested generics than not knowing if i am dealing with a loose variable

[dusty pollen]

10/10 most fun tutorial

[safe dragon]

C# is roughly middle of the pack as far as type systems go. You have to resort to reflection a little quicker than I'd like

[runic kraken]

Here's an example of my library

https://raw.githubusercontent.com/megabytesofrem/catnip/refs/heads/main/Catnip.Sandbox/Program.cs

[dusty pollen]

I learned it because there's this game called "stardew valley" that you can mod with it, which idk if you've ever heard of--

[runic kraken]

This is actually EASIER for me to deal with than native C#

[safe dragon]

sorry I don't want to talk about harvest moon clones

[dusty pollen]

[safe dragon]

rust doesn't quite do higher kinded types but I do like what you can do with traits

it's pretty solid

[dusty pollen]

I liked scala traits because they felt vaguely criminal

my uni made the utterly mysterious decision of teaching OOP with scala, a language that is very much disinterested in OOP conventions

[safe dragon]

ignoring that async traits in rust took 700 years to be possible at all and are still extremely limited. That's a thing where c# is certainly ahead... you can have async functions in interfaces just fine

[runic kraken]

My toy language will support HKTs

It's basically almost there already

I have a System F implementation that works

[dusty pollen]

but js has all the asyncs I need-

[runic kraken]

Based language choice

[safe dragon]

but does js have the non-async you need

[runic kraken]

OOP is a mistake, that's why it's called OOP

[dusty pollen]

technically yes

[runic kraken]

(exceptions are given to CLOS, Objective C and Smalltalk)

[safe dragon]

even C# knows much of OOP was not a great idea

[runic kraken]

C# knows much of it was not a good idea

It's why they also made F#

[dusty pollen]

scala does things like singletons and extension objects and indexing arrays using parentheses and the last one has nothing to do with OOP it's just weird

[runic kraken]

And F*

[dusty pollen]

oh and implicit returns. and implicit function calls???

[runic kraken]

https://fstar-lang.org/

[dusty pollen]

implicit function calls was a terrible decision and iirc they ended up removing it

[safe dragon]

implicit returns are in a lot of languages including rust (and typst)

[rain apex]

I think it dum that u need reflection to get generic type out of a Type value

[cinder karma]

Is typst a 🦀

[safe dragon]

actually I don't think typst has explicit returns

[dusty pollen]

like if you put an object on the last line of a method it becomes the return?

[safe dragon]

typst was written in rust yes

[runic kraken]

F# and F* are the only languages I respect from Microsoft

[cinder karma]

Smh. Crimes!

I should redo my resume in typst maybe

[safe dragon]

anything really. Whatever the last line returns is the return. Perhaps with some difference in whether you end the line in a semicolon or something that depends

[safe dragon]

shouldn't be too difficult

[cinder karma]

For work we do use a lot of LateX but redoing our style guidelines for another program will be Work

[safe dragon]

there's a billion resume templates too

[dusty pollen]

implicit function calls though is where I draw the line. absolutely criminal behaviour

[safe dragon]

idk what that is

[cinder karma]

What's an impli....yes

[dusty pollen]

so if you have a function with no params and you write just the name of the function without () it still calls it

rather than referring to the function as an object

[safe dragon]

ah

[dusty pollen]

criminal

[safe dragon]

languages do do that sometimes

[dusty pollen]

cri mi nal

[runic kraken]

Typst is cool but i don't like its syntax as much as LaTeX and it doesn't have enough mathematical type setting features for me yet

[safe dragon]

of course languages like haskell forego any brackets in general. But they also have the whole currying thing

I suppose python has currying too though in an odd way

typst does too actually

[cinder karma]

Oh verilog does this too

[runic kraken]

I actually like how verbose LaTeX is

It's the same reason I dislike Markdown

[cinder karma]

If the function has no arguments

[runic kraken]

dislike ≠ bad

[cinder karma]

I've shown this before, right?

     sum=a+b;
endfunction

[safe dragon]

I'm mostly bothered by the semicolon after the arguments here

[runic kraken]

This is disgusting

[cinder karma]

Spot the return statement

[runic kraken]

The sum=a+b

And that's why it's disgusting

[safe dragon]

I think visual basic for applications does this too

[runic kraken]

Code should either read like a mathematical equation, or a set of imperative steps and nothing else. This reads like a hallucination

[safe dragon]

you assign the result to the function name or something weird

[cinder karma]

No, vba doesnt do this

[safe dragon]

god no it's VB.NET

not VBA

you can pick

vb.net is painful in many ways

[cinder karma]

It's because what I posted is sugar for

sum = a + b;

endfunction

(Also the return statement does exist for functions, I'm being a little snarky)

[devout vault]

My one private mod repo is cleaner than many of the public ones.

It's also not nearly as progressed, though.

[devout vault]

Shall I forward you my contact information so you can start the process? /s

If I start a new game project at some point I'll probably give nullable an actual try, but not while I'm doing with mods

[rain apex]

when did nullable get added

[cinder karma]

Last Tuesday

The entire world was created last Tuesday

Along with nullable

Real talk

Every time someone mentions Skyrim around here they make it seem actively terrible

What do u mean it takes three days to set up and then crashes all the time

[devout vault]

That's because hardly anyone plays it without modding it a lot

And a lot of the times that setup is from making your own modlist

The collections/modpack situation is much more common there than SDV though, and if you don't pick a bad one it's often pretty stable

[devout vault]

yes I'm somewhat committing a

.xkcd 2501

[heavy dagger]

xkcd #2501: Average Familiarity

Published 11 Aug 2021 | How could anyone consider themselves a well-rounded adult without a basic understanding of silicate geochemistry? Silicates are everywhere! It's hard to throw a rock without throwing one!

[rain apex]

I played skyrim with small amounts of mods before

It's ok video game/10

The main thing that bothers me lore wise is that you are the chosen one of every notable institution in the province

My headcanon is that my character thinks the chosen one stuff is nonsense but likes the attention so they put up with the kayfabe

[cinder karma]

Look it took me the better part of a month to gather the ingredients and make one single pizza

I'm not going to even attempt anything more complicated with my work life balance

[safe dragon]

C# 8, so 7 years ago

[rain apex]

Ah so it didn't exist for at least 3 years of [redacted]'s life

[devout vault]

Everyone wants a piece of that Dragonborn fame

[rain apex]

Ok but a lot of these chosen one things have nothing to do with dragonborn-ness

[devout vault]

I imagine it didn't exist for at least 3 years of the lives of everyone here

[devout vault]

Yeah but they can get a lot of fame for their guild/whatever by attaching themselves to the most famous person 😛

[rain apex]

But maybe it's like how mora keeps miraak around

The daedra all want their own pet dragonborn

Very fashionable

[devout vault]

I never played through any of the DLC

...actually, I might've eventually gotten through the vampire one

[rain apex]

I don't care much about the vampire one

[devout vault]

Like within the past few years. Certainly not the first several playthroughs

[rain apex]

But i like the funky elf island

[devout vault]

I've also never completed the main story, though

[cinder karma]

You forget redacted uses net framework 4.0

https://fxtwitter.com/i/status/2033038595808964624

Killed by Google (@killedbygoogle)

oh dear god

Quoting Andrew Carr 🤸 (@andrew_n_carr)
︀
This is the worst news I have ever heard. Prepare for the price hikes and throttling :/

**💬 31 🔁 315 ❤️ 4.2K 👁️ 125.5K **

FxTwitter · Mar 15, 2026, 4:32 AM

[supple ether]

:(

[safe dragon]

🌈

[runic kraken]

It is actually terrifying how close my language is to supporting higher kinded types

As in, it will be done today

Its really just taking what I did already (the hard work) and adding a small extension on top of it to represent types as values

[pliant snow]

is jujustu worth looking into

i know some people love it

[little furnace]

Isn't that a martial art?

[safe dragon]

it is a martial art yeah

but I'm going to guess aquo means the anime jujutsu kaisen?

or

it's a tech library

[cinder karma]

Aquo means the martial art

[safe dragon]

oh

he means this https://github.com/jj-vcs/jj

I only ever see people call it jj

everyone I knokw that has used it likes it

but I have not used it

[pliant snow]

yes that

[little furnace]

I use Sapling, which seems to be more polished as of now.

[maiden mesa]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[little furnace]

Hii and welcome to the dungeon of coding cats or something.

[weak obsidian]

I like how I have 1xxx-2xxx classes

and a 3xxx class sitting right here

I think its the second hardest class for my college, the hardest is Advanced Kernel Development, which requires 4 prerequisists, after that I gotta go to a big uni

[safe dragon]

damn

there was no systems programming in my uni curriculum at all

[weak obsidian]

ooof

[weak obsidian]

Mine ends at advanced kernel development, the uni i'd transfer to teaches "CS 6420 - Collaborative Kernel Development", where at the beginning you pick 3 people for your group and work on developing a kernel throughout the whole class

That is my end goal, I'd like to get there in a few years or less

[safe dragon]

🌈

good luck

[weak obsidian]

i will cri t ho

ty 😭

[safe dragon]

I became an application dev no kernels

[weak obsidian]

ooo nice

Desktop? Web?

Mobile?

[safe dragon]

yes

[weak obsidian]

😭

[devout vault]

Only kernel I want is popcorn

Let me pretend everything else doesn't exist, in peace 😌

[safe dragon]

APIs, desktop programs, web applications, mobile apps...

currently building a report generator

[weak obsidian]

I don't know much about web applications built in Electron, I'm more familiar with desktop applications with UI frameworks (not electron tho, like Qt, GTK (linux), etc)

I mostly use Qt

[weak obsidian]

nice!

[safe dragon]

I've been cursed with windows gui toolkits in the past

[weak obsidian]

I mean ,Electon can classify as a desktop app

but

i personally dont deem it as such, I have a grudge with electrons ram usage

[weak obsidian]

Winforms?

[safe dragon]

understandable

yeah winforms, wpf, MAUI

[weak obsidian]

ooof maui

yeah i gotchu

[weak obsidian]

I build my apps as just standalone .exe or linux binary, but I'm thinking of learning Inno and AppImages (Inno for Windows installer, I dont think I need the power of NSIS)

cause I'd like my app to be somewhat installable, with shortcuts made etc

[ivory shadow]

Everyone has a grudge against Electron's resource usage. Webpages were not meant to live in exe files. They want to be free.

[weak obsidian]

I feel you, I consider apps built in Electron to be more on the web application side, some consider it still a fully fledged desktop app, even tho your rendering a miniture browser (tiny fork of chromium)

[safe dragon]

"modern" windows installers were a massive pain in the butt. Microsoft desperately wants you to use the Microsoft Store for distribution but this was a company application to be distributed internally

[weak obsidian]

Hmm, is it UWP based?

[safe dragon]

it was the MAUI thing

[weak obsidian]

In companies, I only really see NSIS or Inno

[safe dragon]

I don't work there anymore I don't care if it burns to the ground

[weak obsidian]

But I am not around web apps

So that's all I know

Inno is amazing, even works on XP

cause around 3.1 and 95 we had issues with no true installer for WIndows

youd manually move files to directories (yes!)

especially 3.1

then Inno and NSIS came out

which really helped

[safe dragon]

MAUI was extremely buggy at the time and that included the publishing step

[weak obsidian]

dangg

[safe dragon]

it was early access to be fair

it's not much better now either tho

[weak obsidian]

ooof

[safe dragon]

xamarin died for this

[weak obsidian]

I dont like doing UI..

its so harsh

I make exact pixel specific measurements for my UI, works great on anyones devices, but hates high DPIs

so I recode it to work with high DPIs, modular flow for the UI

took a lot of work to make it look similar

Then guess what, my backdro pwont work

[safe dragon]

UI is the most difficult work I've done I'll be real. Making something intuitive and feel good to use is hard

[weak obsidian]

cause png, and it was for a specific window sized (i disabled maximization)

so i thought, maybe make the backdrop an SVG?

tho the svg can look stretched when maximized, great, but stretched

but i suck at svgs, so its a struggle

[weak obsidian]

Honestly, simplicity is great, I love GTK's style (linux only really)

Qt is amazing, too, if you want cross platform

I use Qt for my app, cause I dont wanna recode my entire app just for it to look "cooler" on Linux (GNOME specifically)

[safe dragon]

making it work is the easy part... I guess what I wish we had was UX designers

[weak obsidian]

Yeah, thats whats needed

[safe dragon]

design the interface such that people from different backgrounds and experiences figure out how to use your application in the right ways without waving a documentation pdf in their face

cause they won't read the pdf anyway

[weak obsidian]

https://pastebin.com/MtzfZr4V

My UI is simple, which I am glad about, but I am deeply suffering with determing to make the app be able to be maximized, or keep it a specific size, if I make it maximized, I need to make a really good SVG, if not, I stick with png

(I dont care about a portion of my UI code in the pastebin, it's a personal project anyways that will be open sourced)

Its so many factors to think of

and this is just the initial development on my end, I need to really make it better to scale properly

then I got an entire section dedicated to handling the UI

a themes.py to handle the environmental variables on Linux and to also add dark theme support for windows

[safe dragon]

the ultimate dream goal for the main thing I work on rn would be that it makes engineers actually use it instead of exporting it to excel

[weak obsidian]

LOLOLL

[safe dragon]

an unrealistic goal

[weak obsidian]

Oh gosh, excel

they always want excel?? 😭

[safe dragon]

yes

[weak obsidian]

i wonder if they want it to edit the statistics

[safe dragon]

these are electrical engineers, they seemingly live and breath excel

[weak obsidian]

[safe dragon]

this whole application is application started as a big excel document that got out of hand

but that was like 25 years ago

it does vastly more than excel ever could now but when engineers want to do some data manipulations they still like to export, edit and then paste it in from excel

mostly to do things the application already supports but it's old and very poorly designed so no one even knows it's possible

[weak obsidian]

wow

sounds like u need a team to recode t he whole project

[crystal wren]

I see someone opting for something like Qt over Electron, this happens:

https://tenor.com/Sa4x.gif

[weak obsidian]

Qt is amazing

I recommend Qt over Electron for a desktop app

Else, it doesnt feel like a desktop app

(If only linux, do GTK)

also ram usage is stupidly lower on Qt than Electron

[crystal wren]

My first time ever really digging into it was making a couple custom tweaks to OBS for some friends. It was, uh... jumping in the deep end for sure, but nice.

[devout vault]

No love for wxwidgets? 😔 does anything still updated even use that besides Code::Blocks

[crystal wren]

I like WxWidgets and GTK!

[weak obsidian]

I have heard of Wx but I dont know what its for 😭

I think for Windows 95 I heard of a UI library caled Wx smth

but never looked into it

[safe dragon]

that's what we're doing

Microsoft Access needs to die

[weak obsidian]

Correct me if I'm wrong. did Microsoft sunset that recently? Or was it another project of theirs

I know they sunsetted just recently a large thing

I don't think it was that, though

[safe dragon]

they've been threatening to for a decade but as far as I know it still lives

it's ok if they sunset or now we'll be ok

[weak obsidian]

Turn off the servers

: (

[safe dragon]

by the the time itd actually stop working it'd be phased out either way

the replacement is pretty far along

the report generation was the last big hurdle

[devout vault]

senses a typst glazing on the horizon

[safe dragon]

it actually got approved at work today

[devout vault]

Nice

[weak obsidian]

yay

[safe dragon]

it's genuinely great

[devout vault]

I still haven’t actually looked at it yet, despite you mentioning it being good for something I’m interested in at times

(Usually just small tools for my mom, but still)

[safe dragon]

a colleague of mine already started converting a different report today to a typst template

[weak obsidian]

Let's go ahead and work on a project.

Goal: Develop an application using Electron to better visualize the companies analysis, we'd also have a "Save to file" button, allowing users to save the analysis as an excel file, the only thing this Electron app will do is just visualize excel, not re-invent it

Features: Allow users to get weekly emails about the companies statistics, of course, sent as a standalone Excel file, as we only know Excel, Excel is life

[safe dragon]

excel our beloved

[weak obsidian]

No I'd rather bang my head against a wall

Or my favorite sentence:

"How can we incorporate AI into our company?"

"And how can we incorporate AI into our workflow."

[safe dragon]

the answer for us is "fuck no. This has to work on airgapped servers, no internet"

[weak obsidian]

Their answer is: "That's fine! We can upgrade the equipment, and train an LLM ourselves locally!"

[safe dragon]

in the application approval process in the security section it actually asked if the application advertises AI features

it doing so being a bad thing of course

[weak obsidian]

How does it advertise AI features, if no internet...unless your running a local LLM

sorry im dumb, so mind me

ohh

gotchu

[safe dragon]

the application approval process isn't necessarily for the airgapped environments that's just something I personally also have to deal with

[weak obsidian]

Are these airgapped environments perhaps running on DOS?

(A lot of airlines still use DOS for some of their software, airgapped)

[safe dragon]

they're running good ol windows server 2016

[weak obsidian]

At least upgrade to Linux LTS 5.15, older, but extremely stable

so sad..

welp some companies dont change their OS, which is...okay to a degree

tho running XP and older should

youd be surprised how many important systems run on XP, 95, and DOS

[safe dragon]

alas

[worn remnant]

i don't think i would be, actually

[safe dragon]

they did hire a new IT guy with a background in Linux and docker deployments

[weak obsidian]

Unique..

[safe dragon]

so there's gradual change

[weak obsidian]

When going to Cracker Barrel, a restaurant, I saw Windows 10 2019 on their screen, which is a good thign

[safe dragon]

I'll be very happy the day the node server can move into a Linux environment

[weak obsidian]

For Dairy Queen, one time their display went weird and didnt maximize its window, and I saw windows 7

[safe dragon]

the asp.net core api is gonna be harder but hopefully eventually