programmers-off-topic

[cyan shadow]

I'm a small woman, okay

But I was STARVING

My seat was fantastic, but the person who decided the menu for these flights needs to be forced to endure them

My apple juice was just fine, luckily

[safe dragon]

usually the Netherlands is pretty ok at at least having a vegetarian option

at least 1...

[cyan shadow]

BUT BOTH OF THEM SHOULDN'T BE

Give us one chicken dish, dammit

[little furnace]

We have heard your words and the second meal will now be vegan.

[cyan shadow]

I had to eat palak paneer even though I didn't really want palak paneer

[safe dragon]

oh wait I finally read it right

[cyan shadow]

The second meal was in fact vegan

I'm not opposed to vegan food, but I just want options

[cyan shadow]

I wanted it, actually

It was a nice pasta in tomato sauce

[little furnace]

Oh, wow.

[cyan shadow]

But because it was nice, it got over immediately

They later gave us one empanada

[safe dragon]

luxurious

[cyan shadow]

And a smol wedge of carrot cake

[little furnace]

My brain lagged for a moment and I wanted to ask "with cheese?"

[cyan shadow]

Oh they did give us a lil piece of Beemster kaas tho

[safe dragon]

vegan cheese ain't it idk why they even dare to call it imitation cheese

[cyan shadow]

I don't buy it on a daily basis because it's expensive, so that was a nice treat

[little furnace]

It should be banned by the Geneva convention.

[cyan shadow]

I eat enough cheese that the Boi calls me his little mouse, but the sheer volume of the cheese I eat means I can't afford beemster

I buy a copious amount of dodoni feta, on the other hand

And whatever Dutch cheese is on bonus

[safe dragon]

I buy the volume deal packs of cheap cheese slices at the Plus that cost like half of any other cheese

it's not very good but it's good enough for a quick sandwich

[cyan shadow]

No Plus near me

I did find out the existence of a nearby Jumbo, though

[safe dragon]

I'd imagine Aldi or lidl would have cheaper

don't have those near me

[cyan shadow]

Which promises 75% fewer weirdos judging by the location

[cyan shadow]

Me neither, the Lidl needs a car

Aldi is closer but it's still a long bike ride

On a windy road, too

[safe dragon]

there is no Aldi in my city at all

[cyan shadow]

I'm easily blown over by wind

[little furnace]

Cat sleeping on my arm, can't really type, sorry.

[cyan shadow]

You can take one of ours, we apparently have two

[safe dragon]

there is a Lidl but it's a little too far away to walk and that means I never go there

[cyan shadow]

Pet the kitty for us

[little furnace]

Gladly.

[cyan shadow]

What is it with Lidl and putting itself out of the way of everyone

It's like they don't want us shopping there

[modest steppe]

please pet every kitty in my honor

[safe dragon]

petting rn

[cyan shadow]

One of my friend goes, but she literally lives out of the way of everything too so it makes sense

[devout vault]

Mozart is off committing mischief, so unfortunately I cannot pet him at the moment

[cyan shadow]

Living on a ringbaan seems a grim fate

[modest steppe]

cat crimes, cat crimes

[crystal wren]

If a cat cannot currently be pet, it must be found for pets to be given. That is the law.

[safe dragon]

the Lidl is close to other people... though even though it's right in the middle of the city it requires crossing a parking lot and feels a little weird to go to without a vehicle

[cyan shadow]

That's a bit shit, yeah

Our Lidl is just far away from civilization, is all

The other thing that's far away from civilization is that damn package point that UPS keeps sending my packages to regardless of my chosen pickup point

[modest steppe]

that seems like a dumb place to put a supermarket

lidl is a supermarket right

[cyan shadow]

25 minutes by bike, and the neighbourhood is godawful

[modest steppe]

its always good to stay connected knowing every single postal and delivery system sucks, no matter where you are

[cyan shadow]

Always being dug up, so I always get sent on a grand tour of the place via diversions

[modest steppe]

them: we have delivered your package
us: where?
them: ... its been delivered

[cyan shadow]

I never have issues with DHL, PostNL only sucks during the holiday season, and John UPS personally hates me, apparently

[modest steppe]

i don't think ive heard a single good thing about John UPS

[cyan shadow]

He's very unpleasant, I've heard he smells

[safe dragon]

yeah, though they don't sell branded products as far as I know at all

[cyan shadow]

Their veggies are cheap as hell, but the farmer's market is better for that

[modest steppe]

the delivery location for us changes every time, like they spin a wheel for it

[safe dragon]

DHL is seemingly very location dependent. If you live in a building they don't like delivering to they'll fuck it up every time

[cyan shadow]

My DHL guy is chill as hell

[modest steppe]

do supermarkets do this by definition

[safe dragon]

PostNL has always been very reliable for me

UPS is rare but they've never not fucked it up

[cyan shadow]

The one delivering to my old address was great, he knew I was a bit of a waif when I first moved in so if the package was too heavy he'd carry it up for me

[cyan shadow]

You should've seen what happened with my raspi

[modest steppe]

that's nice

[safe dragon]

idk

[modest steppe]

sometimes the delivery people refuse to wait and just put the package next to our gate </3

[safe dragon]

DHL always does that for my mom

[modest steppe]

u ever picked up a heavy, wet cardboard box?

don't rec

[cyan shadow]

Wouldn't get dropped off at the package point for like 5 days before suddenly being delivered

Keep y'all's fingers crossed for my mom

She's going upstairs with clothes to put out on the line and there's a lizard

[modest steppe]

🤞

[cyan shadow]

He is apparently in a position that guarantees him a freefall right onto her head

Update: she came back down

I suspect my dad will be dispatched

[modest steppe]

don't do it lizard!! it'll be funny but at what cost

[cyan shadow]

She'll scream like a banshee, it's almost 11:30pm

Idk about you but I don't want the neighbours thinking there's a murder

[modest steppe]

fair

neighbors here make more noises than us but that's another thing

lizards have a really good jumpscare factor with how fast they are

[cinder karma]

I dont think so?

Not sure

Legalese is not my strong point

[cinder karma]

What

[steel kraken]

https://youtu.be/INZybkX8tLI?si=ms7Gf8TFeFaaz0zd

[safe dragon]

it sucks

[thin estuary]

i've had maybe 2 cups during my lifetime. didn't like it, don't plan on trying again

[robust quarry]

this is a very entertaining convo to stumble into ty

[safe dragon]

tbh I do want to someday try one of those fucked up coffees people my age drink nowadays that are like 3% coffee, 97% milk and sugar

I've only ever had coffee that was made to actually be coffee

where they turn the amount of coffee in a small cup of espresso and make it a 0.8L container of drink

🙏

[prisma flume]

australia is actually completely bonkers about coffee. the town i lived in longest has like 4 coffee shops on its one and only road, and the next sizeable town has more than you can count

sizable isn't big

that said i got hooked on coffee in my last year at uni and never stopped. i have one pretty much daily now. all hail the $10 shop display coffee pot and the tiny whisk for sort of frothing milk

[safe dragon]

I believe the netherlands is up there in coffee consumption

[little furnace]

Here in Germany it's more popular than beer.

[prisma flume]

japan was an odd one for coffee, in hokkaido you could only get it out of a watery coffee machine anywhere you went, and in tokyo the cafes only opened after 9 (all the way up to 12 just outside kyoto near mt. hiei), but you could get it from a vending machine on every street

i did find a bike rental shop in kyoto that doubled up as an australian style cafe on weekends

truly the aldi nord-suden split of germany is rivaled in japan by the north-south split of whether you call a milky coffee a kyapuchino or a kafé ō rée

[little furnace]

Well, it's no surprise that you can get it from a vending machine in Japan. You can get everything from a vending machine there.

[steel kraken]

McDonald's only survived in inner city Melbourne because they started selling coffee, and was so successful they started doing it everywhere else

[prisma flume]

another strike against melbourne

[safe dragon]

another day, another big vulnerability

this it seems to be just being able to read any server memory unauthenticated in mongodb

with an easy to run python script to do it for you

released on christmas

[steel kraken]

Has MongoDB ever been secure

I know it's protocol is popular but the actual original implementation from memory was always a meme

[safe dragon]

all I really know mongodb for is that companies keep using it regardless of whether it's a good fit for something

like a company we work a lot with whose main application is backed by mongodb despite being relational structured data that was directly inspired by an existing application they used before that which had an rdbms

[fleet wren]

too many people saw "mongodb is webscale" and thought it was unironic

[steel kraken]

document databases do horizontally scale well, but thats also because they don't do joins and other stuff that is hard to when you have scaled horizontally

[prisma flume]

it's at this critical moment that i have to say it's funny how unironic is now apparently synonymous with genuine

derailing the most programming chat there's been since christmas

[fleet wren]

yeah it literally means something different now

[steel kraken]

as someone thats still upset about literally literally meaning figuratively now, I don't see the problem with unironic = genuine

[cinder karma]

Isn't it ironic, don't you think

(Belts, off key) LIKE RAIN ON YOUR WEDDING DAY

[devout vault]

why use database when you can do

var data = this.Data
  .Select( d => new Tuple<string, float, string, int, string, float>( d.Name, d.Weight, d.Color, d.StrandsOfFur / d.SurfaceArea, d.Type, d.Age ) )
  .Sort( t => t.Value1 ) // can't recall proper sort lambda syntax
  .Where( t => t.Value6 < 1 )
  .Where( t => t.Value5 == "cat" )
  .Sort( t => t.Value4 )
  .GroupBy( t => t.Value3 ) // I have never used this one so don't actually know how it works
  .ToDictionary( d => d.Key, d => d.Values.ToList() )
  .FirstOrDefault( kvp => kvp.Key == "black" )
  .Value
  .Select( t => t.Value1 )
  .Shuffle()
  .FirstOrDefault();

// You now have the name of a random black cat less than one year old!
// Or null if there were none, because everyone here loves null values and hates having nullability enabled

(yes I made that as terrible as possible intentionally, thanks for asking)

(one very good technique for that is changing the end goal multiple times while writing, without changing the preceding code at all)

(also I tried to put the most computationally expensive stuff before filters that would reduce it, not after)

[prisma flume]

irony is more about apropos than sincerity or sarcasm

[devout vault]

(also redundant unnecessary sorts, etc.)

[prisma flume]

you may as well just link to my github if you're going to share my code

[devout vault]

One could make an argument that it could be worse if the first Select was later, due to cache locality. But then readability is improved, and we can't have that

[prisma flume]

pathos picking the linq out of my PRs like someone picking around bad jelly bean flavours 🙂‍↕️

[devout vault]

The PR from today?

[devout vault]

.s/jelly bean/skittles/

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by irocendar as #6879 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1454268668052508835)

[prisma flume]

oh no, i haven't pushed any recent PRs, just thingken bout thos jelly beans

[fleet wren]

skittles taste differently?!

[devout vault]

Oh that was Button's PR today

I didn't actually look at the PR author

And it was a PR from June

ponders if that means my MR pile for contract work will be processed soon

[devout vault]

YES

I will not eat the brown or green ones

To be fair I don't eat them all together. I eat them one at a time

continues to look anywhere but the channel list

[cinder karma]

Joining what's his face and the brown m&ms

[devout vault]

who what huh

[cinder karma]

Van Halen and the Truth Behind Brown M&M's – Candy Favorites https://share.google/zS5fCHmTQHOAjybjy

[devout vault]

It's hard to tell from the google share URL, but the embed sounds like an article I definitely don't have the attention span for right now

[fleet wren]

tl;dr van halen demands in their venue contracts that they are not given brown m&ms as a way to test that their venues actually read the contracts

[devout vault]

Huh

Reminds me of what I've heard about companies printing coupons for fake products to catch grocery stores that try to use items they never sold

(for the uninformed, manufacturers do pay back grocery stores for manufacturer coupons (which are different from store coupons))

[cinder karma]

It's super short!

And about candy

[devout vault]

Candy is not one of my "things to read about" interests. It's only one of my "things to eat" interests

[cinder karma]

https://harpers.org/archive/1932/10/in-praise-of-idleness/

[devout vault]

That sounds a lot like another long article

("long" being "casey can't focus on almost anything right now")

[cinder karma]

Article says idleness is good

Amazon.com: Four Thousand Weeks: Time Management for Mortals: 9780374159122: Burkeman, Oliver: Books https://share.google/Kpfh19FfQm2azZ3r1

This is also on my to read list

[devout vault]

You mean making sure my mind is doing something every waking moment until I can fall asleep within 5-10 minutes of putting my phone down, isn't a good thing?????????

[steel kraken]

That is valid way to query a database with Entity Framework, though it will do the database query and return the result on your ToDictionary call and everything afterwards will be in-memory normal linq

I actually really enjoy writing database queries with linq (in method/fluent api mode, not the syntax mode)

[devout vault]

So you're saying I need to add a ToList() to that chain at the very beginning, got it

(also did you look at the actual query, so much stuff there isn't used in the actual result even transitively)

[steel kraken]

Entity Framework doing linq with its fancy IQueryable is very fun, as I like to think of it like a schrodingers query, where due to its lazy evalation you don't know the results until you observe it via some method like ToList()

and I've spent a good amount of time delibrately observing it or delibrately not observing it to get the desired behaviour I want

[devout vault]

Look, I was trying to make the code as bad as possible. Any suggestions or stipulations that make it better (or more acceptable) are not allowed.

[steel kraken]

one of the nice aspects of linq expression chains is that you can't really 'undo' earlier expressions in the chain, which make easy and safe to make nice utility methods that spit out a starter query with user/tenant constraints baked in and then do other stuff afterwards.

and stuff like OData can apply the userland filters on top and give the precise filters directly to the database.
and if you have different data structures in your database than what you to expose to users, put automapper in the middle.

[little furnace]

If you want to make it worse, add more gotos.

[devout vault]

hot take but there are legitimate uses for goto

(Especially since one of the few things that C# doesn't have but Java does is being able to break out of outer loops)

[fleet wren]

labeled loops my beloved

[devout vault]

C# doesn't even have to worry about the destructor woes that C++ does

[prisma flume]

honestly saw my first ~ method in c# the other day and was shook

never going into TitleMenu again

[devout vault]

I thought I had used it before in a mod, but apparently not

Must've been one of the game projects

[cinder karma]

Have you not use them in a mod before

[devout vault]

...wait is just the destructor

or finalizer or whatever C# calls it

[cinder karma]

Is TitleMenu IDisposable

[devout vault]

Yes

And fun fact, that code has not been touched since 2016

For console stuff, it seems

I missed "method" and thought blueberry was talking about the bitwise not operator, though

[cinder karma]

According to my new short term disability insurance, if i break a leg I get $3k

If i lose a hand I get $20k

Getting hospitalized for coronavirus (4-10 days) is $3k

[prisma flume]

surprisingly no, i don't think i've ever had the need. i doubt 99% of mods do honestly

[cinder karma]

What's an "accidental common carrier death "

[devout vault]

"average C# modder uses 3 ~ a year” factoid actualy just statistical error. average C# modder uses 0 ~ per year. Retired atravita, who lives in a silicon mine & optimized over 10,000 nanoseconds each day, is an outlier adn should not have been counted

(got the conversion backwards for micro vs nano)

[prisma flume]

spritemaster, who is a pixel mine & deconstructs every individual Color struct created somehow, is an outlier

[devout vault]

10,000 microseconds saved each frame would be a huge gain

Most (but not all! like the pathfinder stuff) of atra's optimizations felt more micro than that

(And thanks to that, atra knows much more about performant C# than me, rather than I who just uses it as a tool to turn Penny into Spenny)

On that note, meme that just popped into my head

(getting dangerously on topic though)

[cinder karma]

Well apparently someone (not sure who) gets $200k if I die while taking public transportation

[devout vault]

This is starting to sound like some streams I watched in the past where viewers could bet on how/where/why the streamer died in a roguelike

“1 million on atra getting struck by lighting!”

(Please don’t get struck by lightning. Or otherwise die, for that matter)

[cinder karma]

I'm just reading my new short term disability/accident/hospitalization insurance

[sand frost]

Generally you get to pick who

[devout vault]

Oh I figured

[sand frost]

If you die intestate the order depends on your state but is usually spouse (if any), kids (if any), parents (if any), siblings (if any) iirc

I would assume life insurance follows the same

But it probably depends on the state and the terms

https://theonion.com/cat-clinging-to-side-of-christmas-tree-admits-that-was-1849899567/

On topic because cat 😛

[devout vault]

Yeah that checks out

Is side of tree the current fashion though?

Growing up, one of the cats preferred climbing it from the inside and poking her head out

[hushed raven]

That's increadibly cute, I would die for any cat that did that

bonus points for if they have dinner plate sized pupils

[devout vault]

This cat

(Takes longer to scroll back that far now. My frequency of taking pictures has increased ever since moving in with parents who have a cat, for some reason)

[hushed raven]

Adorable, no notes, the fluffiest of friend

[devout vault]

Don’t know if I have the in tree picture, don’t even know what year it was

Couldn’t find on a very cursory check of social media, but have a photo of when Kirby was like a year old

Yes that is Lego Yoda riding a Lego Giant Spider from Harry Potter riding him

[hushed raven]

triple threat. force-weilding, spider hoisting, allergy inducing threat

[devout vault]

You’d think after spending over half my life with almost cats 24/7 I’d have acclimated. Alas, allergies don’t work that way

anyways zzzzzzzzz

[hushed raven]

I wish alergies worked like that

zzzzzz well!

[steel kraken]

I deeply miss PHP's break that has an optional number argument for how many layers to break out of.

[cobalt shore]

(very late but I LOVE TECHNOLOGY CONNECTIONS)

[safe dragon]

excellent

this is a technology connections fan channel

we use powder detergent in here

we'd use heat pumps but that costs money to install

[dusty pollen]

in what context are powder detergent and heat pumps interchangeable

[cobalt shore]

The never ending war against traditional outdoor holiday string lights XD my mom felt very validated in her powder detergent supremecy

Side note: I successfully made my first discord bot using python! Now I move up and attempt to code something very basic in C#.

[safe dragon]

in the context of listening to the gospel of technology connections

ideally you have both

a heat pump and powder detergent

[steel kraken]

I'm ac inverter (heat pump) but it's also much more normal here as we don't have the extreme cold to deal with but do get extreme heat

[cinder karma]

Ah, the lands of the spiders

[cobalt shore]

it's 12 degrees here but it feels like 2 because 20mph winds T.T

[devout vault]

qt requires you to sign up to use the installer

why

[safe dragon]

to fuck with non Linux users

go install via a package manager

wouldn't be surprised if qt was available on winget

winget is a good exercise in patience as you try to reconsider your life as it spends an entire hour updating like 8 applications

while you watch arch update 185 packages in a minute

[devout vault]

Package manager? I'm on windows, how frightening

[safe dragon]

winget does exist

[devout vault]

(I found an old offline installer for 5.14.2, and I only need 5.12+)

[safe dragon]

also chocolatey and scoop of course

[devout vault]

(I did have to turn my internet off to use the offline installer)

okay maybe I do need a newer version, ugh

[devout vault]

I didn't realize vcpkg was building all these locally, this is taking forever and I would've just signed up for the installer had I known

[devout vault]

All that time, and I get an error

😔

[devout vault]

Oh boy, the person who hasn't watched a single anime episode this season is so excited for this

[uncut seal]

Me: I wonder why my eyes are this tired lately, it isn't that bad usually...
The brightness setting set to 100% that I forgot to lower at some point:

[devout vault]

Sounds like you're due for a session of whatever Mozart was doing in that photo

[dusty pollen]

contemplating

[orchid wigeon]

Does anyone have guides or advice on how to code dive? I'd like to get into it, but I don't even know how to open the xnb files. (Im on mac btw)

[terse galleon]

are you aiming to make mods for sdv? (btw, in the future you want #making-mods-general )

[little furnace]

Step one: Install Vim
Step two: ... I now feel like that cat in the Christmas tree

[supple ether]

Do macs not come with vi/vim like Linux usually does?

[hasty sinew]

No

Also vim doesn’t come with most distros

[little furnace]

Linux comes with Vim? I only know of Nano.

Or Ed.

[supple ether]

Probably not all distros, but all the ones I've used have

Usually vi though and not vim

[lethal walrus]

Most come with vi- yeah

[little furnace]

I don't really know the difference. But my Arch systems don't have a bad text editor.

[hasty sinew]

I swear I feel like a clown, but I know I’m doing the right thing. It still makes me feel like a dumbass

I write xUnit tests, one fails, I spend hours debugging it.

Finally find the issue, fix it, yay.

Make more xUnit tests to make sure my implementation is completely bug free

New failure 😐

Vi and Vim are quite diff. Vim is a fork/clone of vi with a LOT of quality of life changes

It’s a bigger jump than Vim to NVim

[supple ether]

I'll be real, I don't know the feature differences between vi and vim, I just know that vi came first and vim is based on it

[hasty sinew]

Or standard NVim to LazyVim

[little furnace]

Don't test your code. Then it is bug-free and buggy at the same time.

[supple ether]

I only ever use it for basic text editing over ssh and for git

[little furnace]

I use nano for that. That's basically always installed.

[hasty sinew]

True and real

I’ve completely moved from Nano to Micro, but not without tweaks

[supple ether]

The only testing I do is integration testing because most of my projects are games or mods

[hasty sinew]

I made Nano alias to micro

And I changed all of micros key binds to nano’s

Micro just looks nicer and has much better plugin support

[hasty sinew]

It’s my current integration testing that’s failing lol

Factorial program is giving incorrect hazards, and accidentally forwarding them. That’s in turn causing infinite looping behaviour.

5 instead of 120 ☹️

And then I have a failing triple buffer hazard test

[little furnace]

Microsoft introduced a package manager with Windows 10 called winget. It's actually just a wrapper for exe files. Basically, if you do winget install firefox, winget will look up the entry for firefox in the repository, fetch the URL to the installer, download it and execute it. That's basically all.
While it does have version control, it's still not reliable. Do not recommend.

[supple ether]

It is nicer than just using an installer normally

It's nice because I don't need to go find the install page, some things have headless or cli installers, and it deletes the installer afterwards.

Also it feels cool to watch it go

[prisma flume]

i would prefer it if standard windows terminology didn't have me discuss with the Wizard when i want to install some exciting new toolbars

[supple ether]

I miss install wizards

Or really just anything-wizards

[prisma flume]

why must i write winget firefox instead of summon paintdotnet

[supple ether]

Oooo fuck yeah

Lotta purple in this chat rn

[little furnace]

Technically yes, but then it always needs input anyway for admin permissions. Which is why I use Uniget (formely WingetUI), not because I need a GUI but because it can start an elevated daemon that runs in the background and installs stuff that needs admin rights.

[safe dragon]

never ever make the mistake of trying to update visual studio through winget on a work machine where you get a confirmation popup every time anything tries to request admin access

visual studio installer will give you literally hundreds of confirmation popups

in a row

[supple ether]

Didn't they add a sudo command specifically to fix that sort of thing

[little furnace]

Kinda, but it doesn't work that well yet.

[supple ether]

Not that I would install vs from winget anyways, that sounds horrible

[little furnace]

I do.

[safe dragon]

even if you do it from an admin shell it doesn't seem to work

I have to launch visual studio installer directly as admin and then like 50% chance I don't then get barraged by hundreds of confirmation popups

even if you don't install visual studio via winget, if you run winget upgrade --all it will also try to update visual studio

[supple ether]

I used vs 2019 until a few weeks ago, and I'm probably going to use vs 2025 for the next 5 years too :P

[safe dragon]

it's pretty astounding how slow updating via winget is when you're used to linux package managers

[supple ether]

It's Microsoft, so "worse than oss" is almost a guarantee

[safe dragon]

you don't usually notice because on windows everything seems to try to update quietly behind the scenes but when you're actually queueing a bunch of updates in a row and just sitting there waiting for their completion it's horrendous

[supple ether]

Frankly I am surprised c# turned out as well as it did

[safe dragon]

even basic things like updating git somehow takes a few seconds

[devout vault]

wow is there a secret VS 2025 that I missed out on (/s)

[safe dragon]

exclusive

I should try vs 2026

[devout vault]

I'm still annoyed by the fact that the drop down I use a lot is so slow now in 2026

There is an update pending apparently, but I'm doubtful that they would've fixed it

[safe dragon]

I thought they made vs 2026 fast smh that's the 20% of their marketing that isn't AI

never in my life have I experienced them fixing a bug I had in visual studio

[devout vault]

Literally the only change I've noticed in 2026 vs 2022, besides newer .NET being supported, is that that dropdown being slower

[supple ether]

Yeah I'm in the mirror world where Steve Jobs made Microsoft

[devout vault]

Even the AI stuff I've learned to ignore so much that I don't even notice it if it's new

If it doesn't blatantly get in the way, like the vscode sidebar pop up

[safe dragon]

but claude code opus deluxe 4.5 premium edition is going to change your coding experience forever

[devout vault]

Premium edition? I'm not paying for that

Also is it gonna change it forever for the better or worse

[supple ether]

I havent really noticed any changes, except that the general visual style is slightly less ugly, and some of the menu options make more sense

[safe dragon]

it's going to change it forever

[devout vault]

😔

[lyric bloom]

don't worry, GPT6 Qwen will solve your problem

[devout vault]

...are you making things up or are they giving GPT a name

[lyric bloom]

https://www.wired.com/story/expired-tired-wired-gpt-5/ it's a chinese model that will probably surprass GPT-5 in adoption according to Wired.

[safe dragon]

are we going back to the Siri/Alexa strategy of giving them names

[devout vault]

The only AI boom I want is the part where they blow up

[safe dragon]

you're very wrong if you thought I knew there was a gpt 5

[devout vault]

I mean we've got Claude, Gemini, etc. already, it's not new (I don't know them all)

[supple ether]

oh, sidenote- I've noticed that if you have the quake console enabled, and have the default setting for new console processes set to "new tab", launching SMAPI will put the console output into the quake console.

[safe dragon]

true

[supple ether]

(which is nice because it means less window clutter)

[devout vault]

What's quake console in this context

[lyric bloom]

Incidentaly, Nexus is back to pushing their app, and I saw this and went "why": 'Coming soon

Keep your mods safe from game updates

Updated game files are backed up letting you choose exactly which game version to run.'

[safe dragon]

why you playing quake in your visual studio console

[supple ether]

it's one of the features in the new windows terminal, where you can enable a console window that stays open in background and can be toggled with win + `

[lyric bloom]

ooh, that's neat.

[supple ether]

like this

you can also use f11 to get fullscreen terminal

[devout vault]

Everything goes in the version control we used because it's a bad idea. Everything

(Yes, I said "because", not "despite")

[lyric bloom]

hah

I was just going "That would be a nightmare to support"

like for us it's not too bad, since we ask for a log, but imagine mod loaders that don't g enerate such a detailed log. >_>

[little furnace]

I'm disappointed. I actually thought you were playing Quake.

[dusty pollen]

I know this one! nexus do the equivalent of sticking your entire game folder in a git repo

[lyric bloom]

...

[dusty pollen]

not an actual git repo but equivalent idea

[lyric bloom]

https://tenor.com/uOXlgtTOyiV.gif

[dusty pollen]

yeah I'm with you

[devout vault]

Fun fact that isn't at all relevant to the ongoing conversation

Apparently there are MMOs made with MonoGame on steam

[lyric bloom]

that explains their other planned feature of being rollback your mod folder.

Oh that's neat

I've been staring at a Pokemon MMO that I kinda want to try before Nintendo inevitibly kills it

[safe dragon]

they built yakuake from KDE?

[dusty pollen]

yup. it's also kind of the reason they can't fully support mods that are not installed through their app

[devout vault]

Why can't they just use the same approach MO2 uses, I wonder

[dusty pollen]

they also do something with a custom archival format, it's strange

[safe dragon]

the game engine of the future

[lyric bloom]

This feels like a self induced problem.

[supple ether]

sorry, I'm not a sweaty-dorito-fps type gamer, I'm a pastel-kneesocks-social type gamer /lh

[dusty pollen]

-# tell me about it

[lyric bloom]

This is Even funnier when the main dev of NMA was the main dev of MO2.

[devout vault]

I mean the top steam game of all time uses it!

when did stardew get to the top

[supple ether]

Terraria uses it and it's one of the best selling games of all time

[devout vault]

Also true

[safe dragon]

neither chose to use it but it just kinda ended up that way

[supple ether]

(although apparently terraria still runs on .net framework 4.4 on windows??? yikes.)

[devout vault]

Also also true

Also also also true(?)

does it really

[supple ether]

yes

I decompiled it in ilspy and checked the target framework

tmodloader uses .net 8

[safe dragon]

I don't remember there even being a 4.4

[lucid sundial]

KDE?

I have been summoned, my dear linux friends, what does thouh needith of me? For I am but a humble servant of Linux

[devout vault]

We get it, trauma happens

We all have things we blocked out

Like me and making a modloader for a java game

[supple ether]

sorry, 4.0, not 4.4

[safe dragon]

ok yes 4.0 I know

[dusty pollen]

maybe I should try terraria

[supple ether]

it's so fucking good

[safe dragon]

terraria is great but be prepared that it's a wiki game so you'll probably have a browser open on the side

[dusty pollen]

the graphics are putting me off for some reason

[dusty pollen]

it's okay I always do

[devout vault]

The 1.4.5 update is coming out probably next month

Just FYI

[safe dragon]

the final update fr fr

[supple ether]

I disagree. there are a few things that are difficult to discover naturally without the wiki, but I think it's worth playing blind

[devout vault]

They'll probably say it's the final update again, who wants to take bets

[little furnace]

I'm also the latter, but I'd really like a whimsical pastel rainbow Quake. All other online multiplayer games require me to think. I don't want to think in my multiplayer games. That makes my brain hurt. Thinking is for puzzle games only.

[dusty pollen]

my current game of choice is inscryption but I doubt it will last much longer

[supple ether]

between the guide, achievements, npc dialogue, and exploration, the game can guide you through most things without a wiki

[safe dragon]

fair enough

[devout vault]

Which app is NMA. The new one?

[safe dragon]

I've been playing terraria since before there was a hard mode so I don't really have a good perspective of the new player experience

[lyric bloom]

yeah

[devout vault]

Take out social and I'd be the same

[devout vault]

wat

[devout vault]

Oof

(Me too on having played back then, though)

[devout vault]

(This also very strongly relates to why I was looking at steamdb stuff to begin with)

[safe dragon]

I made a steam account to play terraria. My steam account age and the terraria release date are like 2 days apart

[supple ether]

Terraria is nice because despite how old it is, it's still very much its own unique thing. Kind of the perfect blend between a sandbox game and a conventional rpg. It is deep and expansive, but doesn't feel overwhelming. (and of course there's modding)

[devout vault]

(yes I looked again, this is very much a "look at the kitchen fridge over and over despite nothing changing" situation)

[safe dragon]

there are games in the same vein I suppose like necesse and core keeper

[devout vault]

Also why I made my steam account

[supple ether]

I can't remember why I made mine

[lyric bloom]

I uh..

[supple ether]

I think for portal, maybe?

[lyric bloom]

I can't remember why

[supple ether]

terraria was really early on though

[devout vault]

My gap is closer to a week, though

I remember my older brother joking about being a traitor for playing the 2d minecraft game

[lucid sundial]

Is it:

A: TehrAriah
B: TurAuriUh

[little furnace]

What about Visual Novels?

[supple ether]

I made my account in 2013 apparently

so I might have made it just for terraria

[safe dragon]

572k reviews is insane btw

[devout vault]

(He no longer thinks this way, we used to do a playthrough each update)

[supple ether]

I probably uh, tried before buying

[safe dragon]

stop right there criminal scum

[safe dragon]

I'm a casual

[devout vault]

Dang, you have me beat since I haven't actually played much in years

[safe dragon]

I almost beat these hours just this year alone for runescape but we don't count that game it's not real

[devout vault]

I have seen very few visual novels in VR either.

I have nothing against visual novels, and enjoy them sometimes, but I'd say they aren't quite interactive enough to qualify

I mean, they're games

But like, they don't even pop up as a category of game in my mind without prompting or searching a list

[devout vault]

If it has a sequel the original is considered not real. Just like spelunky vs spelunky 2

[supple ether]

yeah this is me with minecraft. the numbers there are so high I just dont pay attention to them any more

[little furnace]

I feel like Visual Novels or Walking Sims like What Remains of Edith Finch would be perfect for VR.

[devout vault]

even though I feel like I like spelunky 1 better, though that might just be because I'm bad at spelunky 2

[safe dragon]

walking sims are a good fit for VR

[supple ether]

edith finch would be SO GOOD in vr

[little furnace]

I still need to play it (apply that sentence to 500 other games).

[devout vault]

be the change you wish to see (using UEVR I guess)

Walking sims might be a good fit for VR, but they aren't what I want to play usually

[supple ether]

the other day I saw a post talking about how influential Binding of Isaac was, and someone had commented on it like "was it really that big of a deal?" and it made me feel old

[devout vault]

Thank yoba that MC hours haven't been tracked since... whenever I bought the game

[devout vault]

See, I've never played it, but I'm not gonna deny it being influential

[supple ether]

multimc/prismlauncher tracks it, but obviously doesn't account for other launchers

[devout vault]

Yeah most of my time predates prism

[devout vault]

And before you say "you should get it while it's on sale", I have had it for ages thanks to the golden age of humble bundle

But the aesthetic of it turns me off a lot

[supple ether]

this is just since 2019 or so when I built this computer

[devout vault]

...wait is prism that old?

I mean most of my hours probably still predate it, but wow

[supple ether]

no, but it's a fork of multimc

[devout vault]

Ah

I never used multimc

[little furnace]

To be fair, I'm basically the generation that grew up with Minecraft and I don't understand how it was that big of a deal.

[devout vault]

Binding of Isaac released the same year as MC's not-beta-or-earlier release, technically

[supple ether]

I mean... it was the first game to ever do anything like what it did

[devout vault]

But I figure that's not what you mean 😛

[supple ether]

a fully destructible infinite world

[devout vault]

Binding of Isaac was when indie games in general really took off, right? Like uh... Super Meat Boy and Cave Story? (Also never played those)

[devout vault]

oh you're talking about MC not binding of isaac

[supple ether]

yeah lol

BOI was very influential in its own way though

[little furnace]

Yeah, maybe, but I don't remember it as that big of a deal. Basically, it was already 2017 when I realized all my friends have played it for years.

[supple ether]

it pretty much paved the way for modern roguelikes

[devout vault]

Unfortunately, even if it is a really good game I would like otherwise, art style is super important to me

[supple ether]

ah yeah I started playing it back around 2011 when it was still really new

[steel kraken]

super meat boy was one of the games that benefited from the xbox 360 era being pro indie, as part of the original XNA push

[devout vault]

Probably the main reason why I don't play most AAA games

[supple ether]

oh for sure, I don't blame you for that at all

[devout vault]

Like the only AAA games I feel like I tend to play are Nintendo ones, and even then it feels weird calling them AAA

[supple ether]

yeah same

[devout vault]

Even though they very much are

[supple ether]

I don't like flashy graphics

[little furnace]

What do you mean, they are super realistic ?1!!? (\s)

[devout vault]

I like flashy graphics!

Just not realistic ones

[steel kraken]

flashy as in fancy, or flashy as in Binding of isaac being adobe flash

[supple ether]

okay yeah that's more accurate to what I mean. I don't like pushing for high graphic fidelity just for the sake of it. Having a consistent and fun art style is way more important

[devout vault]

I will drink a smoothie of particle-slurry-so-bright-it-will-blind-you for breakfast, lunch, dinner and every snack

[steel kraken]

(I've been locked in a room playing skyrim for the last few days, god rays are great)

[supple ether]

Also I don't like games that market themselves on content-volume merits. Core mechanics are more important than overall playtime or replayability

[devout vault]

I have a skyrim VR setup I need to get back to

[hasty sinew]

Never make the mistake of Visual Studio

[devout vault]

Never make the mistake

[supple ether]

would you believe me if I said that I have yet to play skrim

[devout vault]

Given I get you iro and ichor mixed up all the time? Yes, yes I would

[supple ether]

when it came out I was like "oh that looks cool, I should play it sometime" and then I never did

[steel kraken]

I was many years late to skyrim, so I can believe it

[devout vault]

I technically was late to skyrim (still pre special edition), because it was rated M

[steel kraken]

I was originally very anti-skyrim as I have a kneejerk reaction whenever anything is too popular

[hasty sinew]

Modded Skyrim btw 🙏

[devout vault]

I don't quite get anti- about popular stuff, but I can exhausted despite not trying it

see: me and Create mods for MC

[supple ether]

yeaaaah

[hasty sinew]

Create was smth I didn’t like originally, but if it’s well integrated into packs it’s great

[devout vault]

It's funny because you posted that and I saw only the first half for a moment and not who posted and thought atra posted a hiking trip or something for a moment

[hasty sinew]

Create + Gregtech modern + Terrafirmacraft is a beautiful combination of mods

[devout vault]

My hyper realism complaint extends to modded skyrim too by the way

[little furnace]

I want to try Skyrim, but I want to play the series in order and Arena is exhausting and I basically stopped trying at this point.

[devout vault]

[hasty sinew]

There’s no value to arena, dagerfall is fun but the story isn’t fulfilling, it’s more a novelty

[devout vault]

The stories don't build on each other, I think? Beyond vague world building stuff

[supple ether]

oh no you misunderstand. I love create. Have since it came out. What annoys me is a bunch of mostly unrelated maybe-vaguely-steampunk mods naming themselves Create: Something or Other for visibility reasons

[little furnace]

But, but, but, chronology...

[steel kraken]

I liked create when it first came out mainly because I was never a fan of artifical tech tree that gregtech and stuff had, and create was a breath of fresh air

[devout vault]

how do you feel about Create: Estrogen

[supple ether]

I make an exception for that mod for what is perhaps obvious reasons

[steel kraken]

the last time I saw fancy innovation that create had was the original redpower2 stuff before the dev went crazy and went mia

[hasty sinew]

Create + Immersive engineering is also a nice duo of mods

[devout vault]

They're working on their own game, actually.

...or were a few years ago, anyways

[steel kraken]

they were working on their own block game back in like 2012

[hasty sinew]

Or even Create + Ars nouveau can give a good medieval + steampunk feel, akin to Arcanum

[devout vault]

And their twitter was still talking about working on it, up until like 2.5 years ago apparently

[supple ether]

lately I've also been way into Pastel/Spectrum

[devout vault]

I have been meaning to try that for quite a while

[hasty sinew]

If chronology is an issue, the games aren’t fully in-order anyways

[steel kraken]

turned out modding games is still easier than making original games

[supple ether]

and supposedly we're finally getting another Thaumcraft at some point

[devout vault]

Soon™

[hasty sinew]

YESSSS

YESSSSSSSS NEED THAT

[supple ether]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkaY4fV6z_M

[hasty sinew]

I just hope rune research doesn’t take forever

[devout vault]

Hence why I'm modding stardew into 3d/vr before I consider making my own 😂

It's easier even adding the 2d -> 3d conversion

[hasty sinew]

Give me all the warp

I will be warping final boss

I also miss when Tinkers was a more well integrated part of game progression, tetra doesn’t scratch the same itch

Anyways

I’m procrastinating writing unit tests and de bugging my pipeline hazarding

[prisma flume]

i am shocked. shocked that apparently noone here has played quake to know what the quake console is

[little furnace]

I played Quake. I just thought that for some reason SMAPI would appear in that console and was confused. I didn't know that people stated calling other drop-down consoles Quake consoles.

You want proof? Q3DM17?

[prisma flume]

and equally shocked that nobody mentions cave story as the definitive breakthrough indie game. my beloved

[devout vault]

uh

[prisma flume]

excellent choice, sir 🍷

[devout vault]

???????????

Literally 20 minutes ago

[little furnace]

Technically, the breakthrough of indie games was Adventure.

Or maybe not a breakthrough. But Elite was a breakthrough.

[prisma flume]

oh well i didn't read that post for reasons

mostly because I do not look at binding of isaac

[devout vault]

I have cave story even if I haven't played it, does that count?

(Well, technically Cave Story+, apparently)

[prisma flume]

no ❤️

[devout vault]

😔

[sand frost]

I’ve heard some of these words in this order before, does that count?

[safe dragon]

which words

actually you know what, it counts

[devout vault]

...but owning it didn't?????

smh

[sand frost]

I’ve heard of binding of Isaac

Dunno what it’s about

Same with cave story probably

My husband suggests https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colossal_Cave_Adventure as an early indie game

Which I did play some version of as a kid

I found it a bit frustrating, I didn’t get very far

[steel kraken]

binding of isaac is one of the iconic bullet hell roguelikes

[sand frost]

It took me a long time to learn that roguelikes are not games where you get to be a rogue from dnd

[steel kraken]

and until very recently also loved to just not be helpful and tell the player what anything did

one of the most popular mod was putting actual item descriptions on everything and showing your stats

[sand frost]

I don’t think I would enjoy it

I don’t feel drawn to “bullet hell” as a description

Recently I’ve been playing bridge building puzzle games

[steel kraken]

only late game is actually bullet helly, most of it is mostly reasonable.

[sand frost]

It turns out I like them more than just puzzle games in general because you get to build a bridge

[steel kraken]

but if you struggle with journey of the prairie king, then isaac will be hard

and in turn, practising isaac also makes journey of the prairie king easier

[sand frost]

I have never gotten past the first level of jotpk except when I installed a mod to make it slightly easier, forgot to configure it, and then it didn’t let me die

I couldn’t figure out how to exit and just kept running around screaming for like 2 hours

It took me a while to realize what was happening, too

[steel kraken]

I'm still happy that I got fector's challenge on the 1.6 modding alpha and got to make the joke that the steam achivement still worked

I've enjoyed letsplays of bridge games, mainly aliensrock on polybridge 1-3

[sand frost]

I want to at least try the levels before I see other people’s solutions

[steel kraken]

I do have 3 hours in https://store.steampowered.com/app/684410/Bridge_Constructor_Portal/ which is a very cute game

Steam

Bridge Constructor Portal

Enter the Aperture Science Enrichment Center and experience Bridge Constructor Portal – the unique merging of the classic Portal™ and Bridge Constructor™ games.

As a new employee in the Aperture Science test lab, it's your job to build bridges, ramps, slides, and other constructions in 60 test chambers and get the Bendies safely across the…

Price

$0.99

Recommendations

6224

Metacritic

77

[heavy dagger]

Title result: Save 90% on Bridge Constructor Portal on Steam

[sand frost]

Some of them are not so fun though imo, if you have to launch the cars it’s not real bridge building

[steel kraken]

having the bendys drive the forklifts is so cute

[sand frost]

I had poly bridge 1 for ages and recently got poly bridge 2

[devout vault]

average lost-in-IKEA experience

[sand frost]

I do think the controls are much better in poly bridge 2

[devout vault]

(note: I've never been to an IKEA)

[sand frost]

IKEA is fun!!

If you like shopping

IKEA actually has super clear signs

The thing that gets you is the sheer size

It’s not that you don’t know how to exit, you don’t know how long it will take

And you keep entering new rooms

[cinder karma]

Wait wut

Look I can escape my ikea

[devout vault]

I mean it sounds like you do know how long from experience (2 hours)

[steel kraken]

polybridge tech like muscles and doing the specific placements of pistons and stuff to get rotation out of linear movement to build crazy contraptions is fun to watch though

[cinder karma]

Bridge builder 0.0

[sand frost]

If you’ve been to ikea like 10x and you read the signs it’s no problem

[steel kraken]

Unless australian IKEA's are built different, I dont see how you get lost in them

[sand frost]

I think most people don’t go that often though

They’re also all the same

[steel kraken]

its pretty much a linear track

[cinder karma]

I've been considering installing zombies run again

[sand frost]

Up to slight changes

There’s shortcuts

[cinder karma]

But apparently (according to my aunt's running group) it's bad now

[devout vault]

have we found a new game for atra

[cinder karma]

Anyways to leave an ikea just follow your nose

[steel kraken]

if you want a mostly one off game, I did enjoy my many hours in https://store.steampowered.com/app/3083300/Proverbs/

[sand frost]

That only gets you halfway

[cinder karma]

I'm not in the market for a video game

[prisma flume]

walking in an ikea is facing the miserable reality that timber furniture isn't for the poors

[steel kraken]

proverbs is in some aspects one single 54k tile minesweeper puzzle (with slightly different rules as numbers are also tiles that need marking or flagging) or 150-200 depending on perspective

[prisma flume]

swedish meatballs are the compromise

[cinder karma]

Low Tire Pressure actually plays video games you know

[sand frost]

As long as you only get pine and no drawers and not too big you can get timber

[cinder karma]

Dont you own a $5k desk

[sand frost]

I got a $30 side table/tiny set of drawers in unfinished pine

[cinder karma]

None of us in chat are the poors

[prisma flume]

you may have marked it up by 500%

[cinder karma]

XD

Anyways, I believe in the power of Facebook marketplace and

[sand frost]

Mine is a RAST

[cinder karma]

Like

Estate sales

And stealing my dad's table saw

Do not tell dad

[sand frost]

I won’t buy fluffy stuff second hand

I won’t tell your dad as long as you don’t cut off any fingers 😛

Table saws are no joke sadly

[cinder karma]

I promise to use the guard

[sand frost]

And a push stick?

If needed

[cinder karma]

Yes, mom

[little furnace]

What about board games? I know a few board games.

[cinder karma]

I'm more in the market for a side hustle ngl

[sand frost]

Etsy store?

Probably not very profitable

[cinder karma]

Personal trainer?

[sand frost]

Possibly more profitable

Yoga instructor?

[cinder karma]

Hmmm

[sand frost]

Tutoring?

[little furnace]

I've heard some people earn money by programming, but that would be too on-topic.

[cinder karma]

I already have a day job

[sand frost]

I think some people do freelance websites

I personally hate websites

[cinder karma]

Also i want to be orthogonal to my profession

And preferably exercise related

[little furnace]

Dog walking?

[devout vault]

Olympics athlete? /s

[cinder karma]

Not that good, unfortunately

[steel kraken]

start up a cracking the cryptic competitor youtube channel

[sand frost]

Part time mover

[hasty sinew]

Logging Enabled and Disabled, all prime numbers from 1 to 1000

[dusty pollen]

erastosthenes sieve or checking one by one?

idk which would be faster on modern computers tbh

[lyric bloom]

One of the most annoying things about modding in general is when the splitting in half method no longer works to find a CTD

[dusty pollen]

well I guess erastosthenes is the same just fewer checks

[lyric bloom]

I managed to find out the first mods that cause a CTD.

[dusty pollen]

ctd?

[lyric bloom]

...and when I did one-by-one testing they ALL WORKED.

Crash-to-Desktop

[dusty pollen]

ah

I assume it’s too quick for the log to catch?

[lyric bloom]

cyberpunk's logging is .. not great.

[dusty pollen]

oh cyberpunk not stardew haha

[lyric bloom]

if this was SDV, I'd be talking in #modded-stardew lol

Testing: Reimaged... OK
Confirming: Restore Clothing Slots..... working???
Testing: Streaming Bug Workaround... working?????

???
Added: They Will Remember, Unique Eyes to CCXL, Unlimited Carry Capacity, Unlock Me The Mods CTD

Removed: Unique Eyes to CCXL CTD.

Removed: Unlimited Carry Capacity CTD.

Removed: Unlock Me The Mods CTD.

Removed: They Will Remember CTD. ???????????????????????

This is my annoyance.

there's a CTD thebre.

So time to remove all of those and see what happens

anyway, this is the joy of bifuricated mod stuff, which is why I super love the SMAPI is very obvious mostly about what mod failed

[steel kraken]

The origin story of profiler was me being upset with people bifurcating to find out what mod is causing problem in stardew

[lyric bloom]

ah

[cinder karma]

Crime cat

[cinder karma]

https://youtu.be/b5Xgw_DqmEw?si=GAm0LIUMDy7eXR_g this looks amazing...

[modest steppe]

look at all the yard space

[devout vault]

Man I hate VS 2026 specifically because of the issues with that dropdown

Not only does it hang a while, it interferes with other windows while it's stuck!

[prisma flume]

vs2022 17.4.16 often leaves the intellisense(tm) 💡 hint on my screen above everything else. you can always trust microsoft's own products to mess with microsoft's own window manager

[devout vault]

I've had that too, but this is much bigger and therefore much more annoying

[prisma flume]

nothing is worse than the processes it leaves behind with locks on the files you need 🙂‍↕️

[devout vault]

I have that happen while modding sometimes

Can't redploy a mod because it has the DLL locked from the previous run

[prisma flume]

drives me slightly mad 🙂‍↕️

[cinder karma]

slightly

welp discord is permamute

currently duolingo is showing me ads for this shitty arrows game that I can't even figure out how it's a game

like

what's...the...gameplay

[devout vault]

Can't you turn that off

You could for halloween

[frosty echo]

That message says exactly that

[cinder karma]

now the question remains

should I (

(A) log into steam to see how hilarious my steam year in review is

(b) keep the "not online since 330+ days" until casey finishes 3d mod

looks like EnderTedi has voted

Atra does not open steam until casey finishes 3d mod

[prisma flume]

your honour, that was clearly an uppercase B reaction to a lowercase b option

[cinder karma]

The voters have spoken. I will listen to their mandate

[little furnace]

If you use the website it won't sign in to that Steam Friends thingy so it will keep showing you offline.

Technically, you can also disable it in the Client, but for that you have to sign in or edit config files.

Or block the connection to the Friends server.

[devout vault]

I was kinda leaning towards this as well

It's funnier in the long term

[rain apex]

i mean u can still see 2024 reviews right

log in and check 2025 review whenever casey finish 3d mod

[devout vault]

Hmm, true

[cinder karma]

awesome! Let's see how big number gets

[prisma flume]

i think i got to about 1100 days offline before steam signed me into friends in its own great wisdom

[cinder karma]

what if I never launch the steam process

or install it

[rain apex]

then ur xiaolongbao will be cold forever

[cinder karma]

also: re: my name

I haven't done new years resolutions for yearsssss

[devout vault]

I'm not sure I ever have

[cinder karma]

Anyways I'm finally doing round 2 of Sock World Championships, lol

[lyric bloom]

It is amazing, but the time concerns to make it are pretty involved

[spring ether]

finally learning 3d development yahoo

Model, rig, and animation is all from total scratch

[hasty sinew]

thoughts on this CLI? I may change the efficiency text, IPC and CPI text to not light up

but otherwise

[dusty pollen]

I actually like having some stuff colourful, otherwise it’s a single block of text

[hasty sinew]

I just mean the letters

not numbers

here's what I landed on

nvm figured it out

im being a dumbass cause CLI is new to me

[long verge]

I prefer this

[long verge]

over this

[hasty sinew]

why? just cleaner?

[little furnace]

Yellow isn't good in light mode. Have you implemented some of the common checks to check the background color?

[hasty sinew]

I may use a TUI library to force it dark

[safe dragon]

light mode terminals

[little furnace]

As somebody with astigmatism (which admittedly for some people works the opposite way) I can't read text on a dark background.

[safe dragon]

funky

haven't noticed astigmatism affecting my ability to read either way but I've always found text on a dark background a lot more comfortable

[little furnace]

I admit that it's more comfortable. But it affects my ability to focus. If my work is too comfortable I stop working.

Kinda like when my cat comes to cuddle while working. Sooner or later I no longer work but cuddle.

Like... now.

[cinder karma]

If you're using color codes and not exact colors I expect most users to have picked a palette that works anyways

Actually, this is a minor annoyance at work

The version control system has inherited my color codes but not the fact the terminal should be in dark mode

Which means I cant read code in the version control system, the keywords are yellow

[little furnace]

Not really. I pick a palette that correctly displays colors. I won't just make yellow blue and blue yellow. There is already a system for semantic palettes. If a software doesn't support light mode correctly I simply don't use it. Luckily, most stuff does (just that I often need to enable it, which is hard if I can't read the text correctly).

[cinder karma]

This is Solarize

The yellow is still a yellow, but a very dark one

[little furnace]

I tested it. It still is harder to read than if the software supports a light theme and allows to display text that would usually be yellow in blue or green.

[long verge]

Cleaner and less flashy.
The 2nd screenshot has too much different warm colors imo it’s screaming « look at me » every line why is more confusing than readable. Even tho I get your idea of using green/orange/red for performance related statistics

Btw is your project a whole assembly compiler or some sort of debugger ?

[devout vault]

My reddit feed has a lot of programming and TTRPG stuff, so I read a post title as "Why is C++ still introducing standard healers?" and was thinking "...did someone make a C++ TTRPG?"

(the post was actually "headers", not "healers")

Someone should make a ttrpg where all the classes are programming languages

[rain apex]

Wouldn't they all be caster classes of some sort

[devout vault]

Depends on what the person making it wants

Maybe the lower level language classes aren't casters or only half casters.

COBOL is a rogue because nobody can find them and they secretly run the world in the shadows

okay well maybe something along the lines of rogue/bard hybrid for the running the world part, who says we need to stick with D&D archetypes

[rain apex]

Well i guess they can all be casters but different magic schools

And it impacts how exactly u cast

I feel that's more fit for arpg tho

[devout vault]

Yeah that's another option I guess

I'm not against non-casters having "magical" effects from their actions though, even if some people would complain about it being too anime

Yes, my punch shook the mountain and knocked over every tree on it, what about it?

[rain apex]

Oh i think the reason why i associate programming languages with caster is just cus you chant some stuff and then the effect happens

A lot of shonen manga battle system is like

Everyone's a mage and gotta shout their attack names (spells)

[devout vault]

Fair, but I wasn't thinking of that much of a 1:1 "translation"

[rain apex]

But they call themselves ninjas pirates swordsman etc

Would make basically no difference if they called themselves programmers

[devout vault]

I prefer the idea of systems that don't need verbal components for everything. Some stuff, sure, but everything? Nahhhh

[devout vault]

Anyways, off to get lost in a new game getting a VR mod

[cinder karma]

Mild life complaint

Discord, the platform for gamers...excellent syntax highlighting, can send dates and times in the recipient's local timezone

Outlook, built for work: lol nah nope on either

(In particular, I dont want a meeting, just a datetime converted to local time in the body of an email.)

....I can't even find this on teams smh

I did find the approval flow....

[rain apex]

Discord's syntax highlighting and markdown support is better than slack

They should market harder to companies

[cinder karma]

So far my best workaround is to literally send a meeting :dies:

[safe dragon]

I hate how both teams and slack handle code block editing. They desperately try to hide the backticks from you but that makes them a nightmare to escape or edit afterwards

Oh you want to add some text below the code block that isn't in the code block? Sorry I really dont want you to do that

the solution would be so simple. Just don't hide the backticks

alas

[little furnace]

Considering there's no end-to-end encryption, I doubt any company actually wants to use Discord.

[safe dragon]

that didn't stop anyone from using zoom smh

[little furnace]

True. Companies are stupid and lazy.

[safe dragon]

I think some folks at work have been arguing for us to host a mattermost instance

especially after we were banned from discussing any potentially confidential information via Teams

[little furnace]

How successful are they?

[safe dragon]

no idea

considering I haven't seen one and this was months ago

not very succesful I imagine

[rain apex]

Yeah that'd be part of the marketing

[safe dragon]

we now are in a weird spot where none of the voice/video chat applications we are allowed to use are allowed to be used for confidential information

which like, makes work difficult for a lot of people here

not me thankfully, I don't know shit

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by atravita as #6885 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1455253783486660883)

[devout vault]

https://github.com/minimaxir/big-list-of-naughty-strings

Fun list to read

Shoutout to ||Human injection - Strings which may cause human to reinterpret worldview ||

[round plume]

Have any of you been Ṱ̺̺̕o͞ ̷i̲̬͇̪͙n̝̗͕v̟̜̘̦͟o̶̙̰̠kè͚̮̺̪̹ ̖t̝͕̳̣̻h̼͓̲̦̳e͇̣̰̦̬ ̢̼̻̱̘h͚͎ive-mind repr̼̞̻̭̗e̺̠̣͟se̯̞̲ǹ̬͎ti̪ng̴͉ ͏͉ch͡a̫̻̯o̟̖͍s. Farm? I heard its a nice place.

[devout vault]

It's surprisingly hard to find a 3d collision library for C#, which doesn't also include a bunch of physics stuff

Still a bit heavy but oh well. https://github.com/NewWheelTech/geometry4Sharp

[hasty sinew]

Customizable RISC-V compiler and cpu simulator

[long verge]

So cool

fuck rars btw ✌️

[hasty sinew]

It can run either as a pipeline or as a simple atomic runner,
You can choose the branch prediction algorithm

You can choose whether it logs

You can choose if it’s 32b or 64b mode, so on

[hasty sinew]

That was the whole point, replace RARS, Venus and Ripes

[long verge]

github link ?

[hasty sinew]

I’m currently adding super-scalar support

It’s a very early WIP still, but the long term goal is to give it a Blazor webassembly front end and make it able to parse ELF files

One sec

https://github.com/ArshiaS1381/AetherRISC

It’s still in very very rough alpha stages

[long verge]

enjoy the star mate

[hasty sinew]

🙏🙏🙏 we love C#
i’ll lyk when it’s closer to complete

[long verge]

fire

I liked to do RISC-V for school but having to use rars was not so enjoyable

[hasty sinew]

Exactly, it’s this ancient clunky thing. I want a Blazor web server, and then a Maui desktop app that just uses Blazor webassembly view to run locally

And ofc the CLI tool, which is the current focus of work (and the engine itself)

[prisma flume]

you make it sound like some kind of CABAL

[rain apex]

this sounds very cool but i have -2 idea what i would use it for

perhaps i should start with owning more than 1 cpu

[hasty sinew]

I’ll give a simple example:

A branch is like an if statement in code, you either “pass” or fail a condition. Your computer has 5 stages it’s doing at once. It only “resolves” the if statement in the 3rd stage, and, if you actually should “jump” or move to outside the for-loop.

If it has to jump out of the for loop, it has to get rid of the incorrect data it fetched into stage 1 and 2, wasting 2 cycles.

So, we implement a “strategy” for predicting for loops, called branch prediction. There are various of these algorithms, and they can, depending on the program, help or hurt your performance (usually help)

My tool can calculate how much they help and how much they fail (and tell you their success rate) for various algorithms

Or it can make similar predictions, or be used to demonstrate how these algorithms work, or how CPUs work under the good for education

As Stitch said, they had to use RARS for school, this legacy engine with very limited support, made in Java8

Perhaps a more real world, less engineering example is this:

every new generation of CPUs, computers get faster. But sometimes, we haven’t changed the Ram, the cache, the core count, or even the frequency, so why is it running better?

Usually, it’s because of optimizations to internal speculative execution (Out of Order execution, super scalar execution, branch prediction and memory dependence prediction being umbrella terms under this)

Learning how optimizations go Tomasulo’s Out of Order algorithm compare to a simple scoreboard OoOE, or even to “in order” execution (what my engine currently runs on) is critical to understanding hardware

But also, how to write compilers, and optimized code

[rain apex]

Oh so it dun go on a real cpu then and instead just simulate the instructions?

Almost like a DPS simulator for assembly

[hasty sinew]

Yes

It’s actually designed to eventually run in web assembly lol

[rain apex]

Exciting

[hasty sinew]

It’s like a platform to simulate a CPU cycle-accurately

And even create your own custom instructions for the CPU

[rain apex]

Pls tell crumble, local blazor hater, about this project/lh

[hasty sinew]

Mentioned it 😭

Luckily I’m not dealing with that

That’s my CS buddy

I’m the CE/EE

[long verge]

What prediction method are u using btw ?

[hasty sinew]

it's totally adjustable

Static, Bimodal 1, 2, or 3 bit, or GShare, with every bimodal letting you choose the initial value of the PC's BP increment

[devout vault]

haha jk it doesn't have intersection code for it's oriented bounding box stuff

s u f f e r i n g

(different library, but it's also hasn't been updated since 2004 so I'll give it some slack)

Am I missing some reason why oriented bounding boxes are basically just as hard as generic mesh collision?

Because I can't think of another reason why this would be so difficult to find

[hasty sinew]

1 vs 2 vs 4 vs 8 wide superscalar

0.8 vs 1 vs 1.08 vs 1.08 IPC

[devout vault]

It's not hard it's just that it's literally just SAT.

I assumed there was something more optimized specifically for that use case

[heavy dagger]

@devout vault: (or whenever it comes out)) (5mo ago)

[devout vault]

It is, in fact, a good game

[hardy jewel]

no way

[hasty sinew]

the newest CLI

[long verge]

looks great

[devout vault]

Saw this again and somehow my thought this time was about the marketing treats device thickness as Ω() when really θ() or O() would be better to optimize for.

I did have to look up which of the not-O-alternatives was which, but still

(For those fortunate enough to have never needed to learn that notation, Ω() is 'best case', θ() is 'average case', and O() is 'worst case'. Oversimplification, but enough to understand what I mean)

[sonic mirage]

Similarly, I would prefer my phone to not have a giant slab of heavy glass on the back. Plastic is light, also transparent to radio signals, and less prone to shattering. In what world is a heavier, more fragile material more "premium"?

If it's glass then more people are just going to put it in a case and hide its "premiumness" anyways

[devout vault]

Similarly, I saw something along these lines lately about phone thickness trends

[fleet wren]

glass being more scratch resistant is the usual rationale

[devout vault]

(not that exaggerated in the original)

[fleet wren]

ppl dont like their premium phones looking scratchy

[devout vault]

And like, yeah, that is very much one of the things I dislike about modern phones

I would be prefectly content with phone cameras from a decade ago

...also something is weird about my phone in that it in general is worse than an older phone camera

I can't do close ups

They get blurry

It's weird

[sonic mirage]

I got the Pro version (Pixel 9 Pro) just so I have the 10x optical zoom since I don't have any other cameras, so I don't mind the bump, as long as it doesn't make the phone rock on a table

But it's literally double the weight of my previous phone (Pixel 4a), which was smaller and had a plastic back

[devout vault]

I have an iphone 15, and my previous was like an 8 or something I think?

I was quite baffled when the camera was somehow always worse

[sonic mirage]

They tend to separate product tiers by the cameras these days

[devout vault]

I mean I would've assumed the baseline camera would've gotten better in the (according to various google results) 6 years between the two

[sonic mirage]

Everything else being the same is helpful for both their economies of scale and for developers not having as many hardware differences to target

I'm surprised you find it lacking; iPhones are known for their good camera quality

[devout vault]

That's why it's so surprising

[sonic mirage]

Do you have some macro mode disabled maybe?

Or does the higher tier phone have a macro lense that you don't?

[devout vault]

Dunno. Whatever mode makes photos not instantaneous is something I avoid

Getting any closer (finger for scale) makes the text blurry

[fleet wren]

yeah like hollywood movies are being filmed on iphone cameras that's how good they are

[devout vault]

My old phone could've gotten half that distance fine, maybe a little less

[sonic mirage]

My phone auto switches from macro to main to telephoto, maybe you have that turned off?

[devout vault]

I don't need professional photo quality, I need to be able to take pictures of cats being dumb

[devout vault]

There's some setting I recently turned off

(after being made aware of it in this channel)

But this has been a problem since I got the phone 2-3 years ago

[sonic mirage]

I'd mess with the settings both in the photos app as well as in the settings app for the camera (if any)

[devout vault]

Eh, I'd rather just whine about it /s

I have my old phone upstairs somewhere, so in theory I could set it up again (since it was wiped) and test out the difference

[sonic mirage]

Google says that iPhone 13 and up have macro lenses on the Pro

Could also just be a case of needing to clean the lens, which I often forget to do

[devout vault]

I've tried

Like I said, it's been the case since I got the phone

Also this isn't a pro

[devout vault]

(unless I misunderstand this message, thought you meant "only the pro variants of 13+")

[sonic mirage]

Yeah I'm saying it might be worse because they only put the macro on the Pro

[devout vault]

Ah

I guess that'd make sense

[sonic mirage]

15 Pro lists "Macro photography", but no such entry on 15 tech specs page, so seems intentional

[devout vault]

then why not use the old algorithm or whatever on the not-pro models

[sonic mirage]

because give us more money for the same thing, kthxbai

[devout vault]

If I were made of money I'd get a custom android phone made

(and many other custom things)

[cinder karma]

This is a massive amount of cat photo talk without any cat pictures

Just saying

[devout vault]

Mozart is upstairs, and I am not

Most recent photo I have is the one I already shared of him going under my monitor to get behind them

[cinder karma]

We have to judge camera quality

[steel kraken]

Glass backs are for wireless charging

[safe dragon]

there's many phones out there with glass backs that don't have wireless charging

considering almost everyone puts a case on their phones I don't think the looks of the back actually matter that much

but it probably does for sales

[devout vault]

When are we getting framework but phone

smh

[pliant snow]

I don't want a framework butt phone

[rain apex]

I think there was one

[devout vault]

Fine, how about a framework phone?

[rain apex]

But it didn't take pff cus phone is too integrated and u be buying custom parts anyway

[devout vault]

ah

😔

[pliant snow]

you mean the fairphone?

[devout vault]

It'd still be fun even with buying custom parts I feel like, if only because you could prioritize components based on what you need, and even upgrade later if you decide you want to

[cinder karma]

I'm a little biased for obvious reasons

[rain apex]

I think one of the appeal for framework is that the ram and ssd are off the shelf components

[cinder karma]

But the connectors/etc necessary to make this work would make the phone really bulky

[rain apex]

As in u can pull a ram stick from desktop PC and shove it in framework or vice versa

[cinder karma]

Iirc phones are likely to have custom chips too

[cinder karma]

Isn't this the case for 97% of all laptops lol

[rain apex]

Even so the framework mobo + cpu + fan is custom and gotta upgrade through them

[cinder karma]

My laptop has standard RAM which I never upgraded even though I planned to five years ago

[rain apex]

A phone would be all custom so like why bother modularizing

[steel kraken]

Desktop and laptop ram aren't the same even for framework

[devout vault]

Kinda but I don't see a way to say "I don't mind a dingy camera if it'll bring the price down", smh.

It does look neat though

[steel kraken]

Sodimm vs udimm

[cinder karma]

Anyways, from the school of $250 Chinese phones, lol

[devout vault]

To be honest I'd also be interested in, like, the "core" of a phone being sold standalone, and then I could just add my own screen and actual buttons and such

But I've talked about wanting to make a custom phone before here, I think 😛

[steel kraken]

But there is a growing list of laptops with soldered ram, or doing apple shenanigans and taking the memory controller off the SSD and putting it in the CPU instead so you can't buy off the shelf ssds

[cinder karma]

Also, phones are more glued iirc so the fact that you carry them everywhere doesnt break them

Anyways

I see your glass back and raise you a teensy screen on the back

Xiaomi 17 Pro Max smartphone review – Does the giant phone's second display help it step out of Apple's shadow? : r/Android https://share.google/yJcq0bfJxX85klFiW

[devout vault]

I just want a phone that caters exactly to the niche desires of me specifically, while still being a smartphone, but not including all the smartphone features disliked by me specifically.

What, is that not a large market share or something?

[cinder karma]

Does that phone handle phone calls, casey

[steel kraken]

All the attempts I've seen have just been really shit phones when you put their gimmick to one side

[devout vault]

I live in modern society and not fantasy utopia society, so yes

[steel kraken]

Worse software, ancient CPU/soc so performance sucks, bad radio/antennas etc

Before being larger and clunkier and probably worse battery life

[devout vault]

Ah, but consider: fun thing for me to impulse buy because it seems neat, but not actually end up using it much

[cinder karma]

What features do you want