programmers-off-topic

[cinder karma]

Oh my god this language is great

[hushed raven]

we have different definitions of great XD I am struggling to figure out how the example code makes FizzBuzz!

[cinder karma]

Tutorial | Rockstar https://share.google/Tmy6udmEZpuWWDHv8

[devout vault]

I'm not strugging to figure out how.

Because I'm not even trying

[lethal walrus]

im impressed that google share inks are only 2 http redirects

[cinder karma]

Dont worry

Google didnt pay me for my soul

[safe dragon]

how do you even keep turning everything into google share links

and why

[lethal walrus]

i imagine it's the share button in chrome

[hushed raven]

the only time I've come across a google share link is through atra XD

[safe dragon]

there's a share button in google chrome?

[lethal walrus]

most browsers do

[safe dragon]

do I have chrome installed

I do

there is but it just gives you the url

seems like a lot of menus to achieve something you can do straight from the url bar

[lethal walrus]

https://pillow.rocks/

[lethal walrus]

thats me sharing and then pressing discord

[lethal walrus]

also raw url for me

[hushed raven]

That "stuff" in the embed is holding a lot of weight behind it XD

[lethal walrus]

just a couple things

don't forget https://pillow.rocks/blog

which i have an idea for a thing actually now

[cinder karma]

Hmmm

[safe dragon]

lemme grab my phone and try to do whatever it is you're doing to end up with google share links

[cinder karma]

Now I cant figure out how i did it

Anyways

Google didnt pay me for my soul unfortunately

[lethal walrus]

other than this smash hit https://pillow.rocks/blog/post/1-hello-world/

[hushed raven]

I quite like the two placeholders on there XD

[lethal walrus]

they're amazing thank you

[hushed raven]

procedes to not show colours

[lethal walrus]

uhhh

i have no idea what thats referring to tbh

[safe dragon]

are u a professional front end designer

[lethal walrus]

define professional

i have made.. a very small amount of money off a svelte app

most of my professional developing is serverside java though

[hushed raven]

Sure that counts, even if it's a few pennies

[safe dragon]

yes I'm counting it

[lethal walrus]

ok

in which case yes i'm a professional full stack developer

[safe dragon]

excellent

[lethal walrus]

please dont look at this https://pillow.rocks/unused/

[hushed raven]

now that is defo an IP grabber

[lethal walrus]

it's not actually

i dont have access to the logs

[hushed raven]

do you like my IP, I chose it myself

damn thats a shame

[lethal walrus]

why are all my redirects broken

https://p-i.li and https://transgender.boo are supposed to redirect there

[safe dragon]

I gave u the ip to my mom's hope you like it

[lethal walrus]

at least http://stardew.rocks works

oh https://🏳⚧🏳⚧🏳⚧.ws does redirect thoguh

[hushed raven]

wait is the "rocks" part supposed to mean "is cool" and I've only just realised?

[lethal walrus]

(although i can't use it, 🏳️‍⚧️🏳️‍⚧️🏳️‍⚧️.ws encodes differently in chrome and porkbun, so chrome visitors can't go there and firefox doesn't even try)

[lethal walrus]

i guess

i think it was just available and cheap on route 53 a while ago

but it's a nice domain

i'm not actually that much of a geography nerd

[hushed raven]

Ahhh gotcha

thats what I thought it was referencing! XD

[modest steppe]

wait pillow were you always a rock

[lethal walrus]

🪨

[hushed raven]

what are you using for displaying markdown on https://pillow.rocks/docs/?page=Home

[lethal walrus]

pollow

uhh just astro's mdx i think?

https://docs.astro.build/en/guides/integrations-guide/mdx/

[hushed raven]

I fat fingered it XD

Oh ace ty, I've been looking for one for a while but none really have a nice set it and forget it system i could find

[lethal walrus]

oh the docs

oh theyre not

markdown

and this is an iframe 😭 https://pillow.rocks/docs/?page=svelte-discord-messages#

[hushed raven]

Ahh, the blog posts still look like something Id use so it works

[lethal walrus]

mhm

the sidebar is react so all the blog has to be react, since you can't import svelte into react, but you can import svelte/react into astro

so the example of the svelte component needs to be an iframe

[hushed raven]

Ahhh gotcha

[lethal walrus]

tbh the only reason i'm using codeberg pages anymore is bc i have the username pillow lol

it's not very pleasant to use

since there's no actions that can publish afaik

[hushed raven]

iframes have been a lifesaver to me for a while now, it's a bit of a lazy way but it works

[lethal walrus]

mhm

[fleet wren]

first we got no GPUs, then we got no RAMs, now we got no SSDs

if you have (built) a PC hold it tight

[steel kraken]

the RAM and SSD problems are the same problem

[fleet wren]

yeah the gpu price hike is from crypto

since gpus are great at mining coins
this new shortage though seems to be hitting everything in the consumer market

if it's useful in an AI data center, it's going

[steel kraken]

There's a general silicon wafer shortage and so companies like micron are looking at the books and they can sell 100k consumer ssds for minimal margin or use the same wafers to sell products with 6000% margin

[fleet wren]

said margin is via openai promising money they don't have right

[steel kraken]

Its the same thing that hit the car market during pandemic where the bottleneck for cars was their computers, and as it's the same computer for the entry level car and top end car they tried and mostly failed to move their supply chain to just in time manufacturing

[steel kraken]

Enterprise parts in general are insane compared to their consumer equivalent

The consumer high end GPU is 2k, that same GPU with a bit of extra memory is now 30k

High volume low margin skus for consumer and low volume high margin skus for enterprise

Once you are selling to businesses that will make money with the asset you can charge way more as long as the customer can still make a return on that purchase over it's deployment duration

Its why amd/NVIDIA have historically been very protective in ensuring consumer cards can't virtualise well, to ensure enterprises stay buying the high margin product instead of just buying the consumer stock in bulk

[fleet wren]

yeah makes sense, my post was an orthogonal musing over how OpenAI is signing these contracts for exclusivity over the RAMs while not actually having the cash to cover them at all

[steel kraken]

Oracle got roasted on their quarterly earnings over the risk they have with openai

But the SSD/memory companies are making the safe play to just mostly temporarily fuck over consumers and participate in the infinite money glitch with a clean exit plan.
As they are just diverting their existing capacity instead of trying to build new fabs to cater for this probably temporary demand

When the ai bubble bursts they go back to making the existing products and aren't sitting on expensive fabs now going idle

[safe dragon]

deceit is going? 🙏

[safe dragon]

yeah I get it and I also hate it

hard to ignore the potential of being offered a gazillion dollars even if the companies offering that don't actually have that money

[steel kraken]

You just need to take their money for a few cycles, aren't dependent on them being a long term customer, their debts are their own problems

[safe dragon]

yup

[steel kraken]

As long as they don't increase their costs to scale with it, and set expectations that this is a temporary surge in revenue/profit then you just make free money

And after the crash, probably build new consumer brands as you have torched the reputation for the existing brands

[safe dragon]

probably not in the case of Samsung

they'll truck along under that name

[steel kraken]

samsung will just probably not sell consumer SSDs going forward

they already dont do consumer memory anymore but still do it wholesale

[safe dragon]

they were definitely the largest in the consumer SSD market

guess we'll see

maybe when AI crashes they'll figure out how to somehow continue this self destructive investor cycle anyway

[steel kraken]

Thats why I think Micron and to a lesser extent Samsung are making the much safer play compared to Nvidia

while for the most part nvidia has made a lot of actual money from the AI bubble (and one of the only companies to do so), they are also got a lot of risk

[thin estuary]

@crystal wren @ivory shadow i have a friend who's somewhat interested in a Framework, but is a bit worried Linux drivers may be a problem. is that the case?

[crystal wren]

They won't have a single bit of a problem. Fedora, Ubuntu, and Bazzite are all officially supported. Anything else could obviously be made to work with maybe a bit of fiddling about.

Arch (btw) has been without issue, though.

[hushed raven]

I'm gonna guess most of the hardware of framework is able to work with generic drivers, even then the community is big and the crossover with Linux enjoyers is quite large so it won't be long for drivers to appear the hardware I would say

I can't wait to be able to grab one (when prices go back down)

[crystal wren]

Yeah, the RAM...

[hushed raven]

Oh how I wish I could transplant ddr4 to a ddr5 slot

[crystal wren]

90 GBP for a 16GB DDR5 SODIMM right now is... at least not as bad as what I've been hearing?

[hushed raven]

Which model were you looking at?... A few days ago the 360 framework laptop was 60 GBP for 8gb, and 120 for 16gb

[crystal wren]

Oh, the RAM on their site was already close to DOUBLE what you can just buy yourself. That was before RAM went crazy.

There's fully zero reason to ever look at buying one with the RAM.

[hushed raven]

That's an option? It wouldn't show me the price of the DIY one without ram?

That may have been my internet having issues, I'll be looking back at it and removing so much in that case

[hushed raven]

I would like to buy it without a discrete GPU too, that would cut costs decently

Ahhhh the options at the bottom I think I missed that

I saw 120 quid and just blanked the options below it XD

[crystal wren]

Yeah, their RAM was a garbage price even before RAM prices went crazy.

[hushed raven]

TBF 5600 is very high aswell I've been running on 3333 for the last 10 years XD

[cinder karma]

I wonder how much all this is just Intel's collapse

Samsung has fabs. Nvidia is fabless

TI made a play for fabless too and I think they regret that

I'll miss my Samsung SSDs but I don't blame them for focusing on that market

[hushed raven]

TI?

oh texas instruments?

An issue with the US specifically is the high import fees recently introduced which makes switching to fabless less than ideal rn, and when the US market changes, most of the world is soon to follow which is a tad bit of a shame

[cinder karma]

Oh, the TI revert is before the tariffs came in

[hushed raven]

Ohhh okay gotcha

[devout vault]

A new forced AI use has hit the tech industry.
https://www.tomshardware.com/service-providers/tv-providers/lg-tv-update-adds-non-removable-microsoft-copilot-app-to-webos

(Found on reddit but reddit doesn't show the title properly in the embed...)

[frosty echo]

Meanwhile, https://www.extremetech.com/computing/microsoft-scales-back-ai-goals-because-almost-nobody-is-using-copilot. Maybe paying other companies to try to increase use?

[worn remnant]

i've never felt better about my rule that a television in my house never touches the internet

[sand frost]

the tv at work is so weird and shitty about "updates" so i feel better about telling it no all the time

[rain apex]

Aren't TV just big monitor

[sand frost]

and also good about not having a tv at home

somehow they're all "smart" these days

aka try to sell you things

and connects to netflix

[worn remnant]

you would think! a tv has one job: receive and display pixels.
however, tv manufacturers seem to think otherwise

[devout vault]

Unfortunately, I live with people who enjoy smart tech

The kitchen light is hooked up to Alexa. The light switch has to always stay on, but you have to use Alexa to actually turn the light on

I just live in darkness not-as-brightness (since the dining room light is safe... for now)

[devout vault]

And sound! I get that's optional if you have a speaker setup, but I'm not an audiophile so I don't care, I just need to hear my opponents blow up in KAR

[safe dragon]

my TV is too old to be able to connect to the internet if it tried

[devout vault]

I have two pings in #making-mods-general now, and I'm scared to check them

Especially since I can't even see the context, so the second one I don't know what it's about. (The first is pretty self explanatory)

[sand frost]

it's just about save serializer

[rain apex]

Someone's doing crimes on your crimes

[safe dragon]

ur needed

[rain apex]

Nah u can keep hiding

[safe dragon]

as an avid smart home hater I'd cry

[rain apex]

If u want casey I'll just send in PR for what I wanted re: texture overrides

I'm not sure i should because of reworks

[safe dragon]

we already invented the solution to turning on lights why we adding a home assistant step

[devout vault]

I mean I'm a hater of it for sure, but I kinda need the stability that living with my parents provides at the moment 😛

[safe dragon]

[devout vault]

Yeah seriously, if you really need audio activated lights, just get one of the clap activated ones

[devout vault]

Spooky

[sand frost]

if i wanted smart home i would make smart home at home i feel

it's not that hard to wire up sensors

[safe dragon]

it's ok I'm a hypocrite I have a roomba which is absolutely a smart device

[devout vault]

I don't think texture override is getting a rework? Unless you meant the serializer stuff

[rain apex]

Spacecore in general right

[devout vault]

I mean it's gonna be split, but that won't actually release unti l1.7

[dusty pollen]

the one smart home thing I ended up admitting was useful is the smart radiator thermostat my dad installed

[devout vault]

It'll be split in my repo using shared projects to prepare for it, but not soon

[rain apex]

The thing i wanted is confined to like 2 cs files and i could probably do it in a day

[devout vault]

I dunno, the roombas I've seen don't seem to have a modicum of intelligence...

[rain apex]

So i could just open my PR for ref when u do get around

[sand frost]

the thermostat in my apartment is probably haunted, we set it to 80F this week and it does 70F, we set it to 70F last week and it did 80F

i don't think making it smart is possible tbh

[worn remnant]

oh, fair play. i also use my tv's built-in speakers

[devout vault]

Feel free to PR it for an outright merge (both features you mentioned), I'm going to be doing another release of things once PR 545 is ready anyways

But I'll stop talking about that now, or Crumble might run away

[dusty pollen]

you don’t replace you current thermostat, you replace the radiator knob thing with their thermostat

[rain apex]

Kk I'll do that then

[devout vault]

Because of how on topic it is

[rain apex]

The plan to defeat scale up 2 forever

[safe dragon]

it knows what my kitchen is and how to get there, that's enough

[rain apex]

I like smart homes in hotels actually it's fun for the 2hrs im there

[sand frost]

yeah, tragically renting might mean that's not allowed (also we have baseboard heat? so no radiators)

[devout vault]

* "how to get there" optional depending on the weather, the amount of threads in the clothes you're wearing, and an RNG coin flip

[rain apex]

I don't want it for my actual house voice controls r kinda cringe

[dusty pollen]

I hate voice controls

said radiator is controlled via app

[devout vault]

Dming you chu since I said I'd stop being on topic 😛

[safe dragon]

voice controls are a great option for people with motor skill issues but apart from that

you'll never catch me using them

let me type it

[devout vault]

(smh I can't send chu a friend request)

[safe dragon]

or buttons of course if it didn't need to involve words to begin with

[dusty pollen]

voice controlled terminal emulator when

[worn remnant]

voice controlled terminal emulator is just the star trek ship computer

[safe dragon]

cee dee tilde backslash config backlash niri backslash config

[devout vault]

There are some very niche use cases I can think of, but I would still want alternatives.

Video game nonsense of course, like "casting spells in combat (probably VR) when your inputs all do other combat things"

[devout vault]

Backslash for file paths? In my #programmers-off-topic ?

[dusty pollen]

it all goes back to that one eleven skit

[devout vault]

The what now

[safe dragon]

oh sorry brain tired

I've been dealing with windows file paths at work

[dusty pollen]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbDnxzrbxn4

[devout vault]

I deal with windows file paths almost exclusively, and I still know better

[safe dragon]

at least windows file paths aren't case sensitive so that makes voice commands easier

[devout vault]

You're sentenced to 1 month of doing full stack javascript. No libraries

[safe dragon]

wtf

[devout vault]

...that's a bit harsh

3 days

[safe dragon]

but I already do Javascript work

that's just punishing me to a life without svelte

[rain apex]

Ok but one of the classic isekai cheats is non verbal casting

[safe dragon]

[devout vault]

I mean if it were a punishment for me I would've said Rust, but too many people here enjoy that for me to say that

[devout vault]

You can have nonverbal casting when you get isekaid

[safe dragon]

also in Harry Potter

[rain apex]

Harry Potter is the ur-isekai

[devout vault]

I mean the thing there is its actually harder and takes skill, so not quite a cheat

[rain apex]

Actually it'd be cool if they make a fullmetal alchemist VR game and you gotta clap your hands to do alchemy skills

[safe dragon]

usually it's also harder in the isekai. The protagonist is just built different

[devout vault]

Yeah, I'd love something like that (even not necessarily that method of casting), but a big problem is that a lot of times how the cast turns out depends on your mental image, which we don't exactly have the tech for

[rain apex]

Brain chips... Scary

[safe dragon]

I mean I like rust but full-stack rust development would absolutely be a punishment

the offerings out there for front-end in rust are limited and not great

[devout vault]

Ex. the owl house (S2 spoiler)

[rain apex]

I guess in current tech you'd have to make VR flavored take on something like totk building system

[devout vault]

And this one is from a fan comic for TOH based on the same concept (ie. getting distracted can affect it) (spoiler because S2 also)

[rain apex]

Then have gestures become hotkeys to put down stuff you built

Vancian magic trust

[devout vault]

<flashbacks to when I tried C++ web development using the CGI stuff... using nothing but the STL>

(I did not try for long)

[crystal wren]

Who hasn't toyed with C++ via cgi-bin?!

[devout vault]

Sane people

[crystal wren]

Oh. I don't know what that's like.

[devout vault]

Yeah, me neither. As evidenced by my copious code crimes

[safe dragon]

I have no idea what that is

🙏

[devout vault]

Code crimes?

I can probably show you some /s

[safe dragon]

oh no I know those

they're very useful

[devout vault]

Oh right, you consider all of SDV modding to be code crimes

[safe dragon]

not necessarily

[devout vault]

https://tenor.com/view/doubt-press-x-la-noire-meme-x-button-gif-19259237

cgi-bin/ is a folder you can put basically any program in, and it'll run it for said web request

[safe dragon]

I consider programming via a json object a crime

[devout vault]

So if you compile a C++ program and put it in there, it'll receive the request in stdin I think, and your output is the response

[worn remnant]

can confirm, you can absolutely write a web backend in C++ that way

[devout vault]

It's been ages since I tried

Like, over a decade at least

[safe dragon]

and to make modding possible without a real modding API you gotta do code crimes I acknowledge that...

[devout vault]

And nowadays, you can do the frontend too, thanks to wasm!

Amazing how technology has advanced

[safe dragon]

can you do file streams

[devout vault]

"Full stack C++ developer"

[devout vault]

You can do anything you want

[safe dragon]

incredible

[devout vault]

You can send a push notification to the server owner and wait for them to approve that IP for seeing said page, if you wanted

...assuming the request doesn't time out first I guess

[safe dragon]

step 1 of web development: assume everyone has a stable connection to make your life easier

[devout vault]

step 2 of web development: assume everyone is using the browser you do to make your life easier

[safe dragon]

I do work with the assumption no one will ever use what I build on safari

[devout vault]

I remember when I had to debug a mobile issue

For iphone

It was nice because I found a free tool to let you use your desktop's element inspector in chrome(?) when your phone was hooked up

Then the next time I needed it, said tool only had a paid version and the free version was long gone

And I couldn't find an alternative

[safe dragon]

as far as I know that's built in by default in chrome for android

[devout vault]

Ah

But this is iphone

Because the apple tax means everything needs to be unnecessarily difficult for developers

(and often users too, but anyways)

[safe dragon]

ur gonna use xcode and ur gonna like it

[devout vault]

<flashbacks to trying to get Rider to cooperate with the debugger for mobile SDV>

(I literally had to use a native debugger and inspect C++ exceptions to figure out the .net exception that tracked, and couldn't find a stack trace)

[safe dragon]

I can thankfully fairly reasonably assume there are no iphones or even macbooks that will be using the applications I build for work

[devout vault]

(And had to launch all of these separately and not use rider)

(And console output? Ha, that's funny)

...kinda reminds me of when I poked 3ds homebrew recently.

No debugger nor console output

Well

Console output could be done if you told the OS to put it on screen. But the emulator just could not show it to you otherwise

[safe dragon]

the debugging experience of "nothing happens... I have no errors or anything to work with... what now"

[devout vault]

Which is... a choice

[devout vault]

"what now" = the "comment out stuff until it starts working" game

Bonus points if you do it without source control and don't have an old copy to go back to

(not SDV, just me being dumb for homebrew stuff)

[safe dragon]

when I implemented giftcard provider integrations at my old job there were a few where if you did something wrong you just got a 400 bad request and absolutely no further information

and no documentation beyond a shitty pdf, possibly half in chinese

[devout vault]

Those are always fun

[safe dragon]

actually the chinese manual was for an automated cash handling machine

[devout vault]

Vaguely reminds me of my IRC bot which I believe followed the spec, but only worked on some servers but not others

And modifying it broke the other half of servers

Couldn't figure out the right order to log in / authenticate to make everyone happy

[safe dragon]

😌

authentication issues are often fun because they're usually by design not very helpful in telling you what you're doing wrong

[worn remnant]

this seems like something they should have considered along the road to where they are now

[devout vault]

Me: "I can't remember if I registered on this site, and if I did, if they wanted username or email" (because sometimes your email is the username)
Site: "Your username or password was incorrect."
Me: "Thanks, that's incredibly unhelpful."
Me: does 'forgot password' to check
Site: "If a user for that email exists, a reset password link has been sent"
Me: ...

[worn remnant]

maybe they did, and they decided printf debugging is Not The Way

[devout vault]

I mean I think that was one of the platforms that technically had gdb support but I couldn't get it to work

To be clear, it had a console it logged to. It's just that the program you ran couldn't go there no matter what settings I tried

It was a console purely for the emulator itself, and nothing for the actual emulated thing

[cinder karma]

This is when I stick in an obvious error just to make sure I'm even editing the right file

[safe dragon]

the classic log line to make sure the code is even being executed

[cinder karma]

I mean

[devout vault]

.choose learn vivecraft controls because Reasons™, play skyrimVR

[heavy dagger]

Choose result: learn vivecraft controls because Reasons™

[devout vault]

(sorry, other server doesn't have uber 😔 )

[supple ether]

Please use breakpoints

Or tracepoints

[cinder karma]

I would if I could....

[dusty pollen]

[lethal walrus]

That'd require me to figure out how to use let alone connect gdb

I will instead try and barely manage to write a log file

Because I don't get printf's output in the emulator terminal

Honestly, it's not as horrific as I remember

[safe dragon]

disgusting

(I use breakpoints extensively in C#)

in JS I often end up finding them more annoying than not for some reason

I prefer spamming console.logs

[lethal walrus]

I actually use them on the frontend sometimes

Although it's more when reverse engineering I'd use them tbh

[steel kraken]

I use them a decent amount for frontend

[supple ether]

Js is just Hell Language in general
Fine for scripting but horrible for anything even moderately complex

[safe dragon]

with typescript I think it's honestly pretty ok

[supple ether]

My crusade against web apps is unending

[safe dragon]

unless you're like me and get upset when you're knowingly allocating memory you feel like should be avoidable

cause JS has like no good ways at all to avoid memory allocations

[supple ether]

This is only true until you start trying to use Map and realize that it doesn't deserialize back into a map and you have to do horrible hacks to make it work

[safe dragon]

yeah then you use a library called devalue

[steel kraken]

I feel like pretty much every time I've used Map I've kinda regretted it and want an object back

[safe dragon]

I do use maps with some regularity

[steel kraken]

I just find .get("asdads") more clunky than ["asdads"]

[safe dragon]

I do sometimes use objects instead

but I'm not at runtime setting arbitrary key names to be properties of an arbitrary object

if I'm using objects that means it was defined at compilation time what's inside it

or it's deserialized api data I suppose

I'm aware Javascript lets you get away with it but it feels nasty

[steel kraken]

I use typescript Record<string, Stuff> a lot (or Record<MyEnum, Stuff2>)

[safe dragon]

I've got quite a few of those

[steel kraken]

and it is very convenient having data structures that can cleanly serialize/deserialize without further post processing

[safe dragon]

it feels wrong

objects shouldn't be like this

but js doesn't care

[steel kraken]

its literally the object in javascript object notation

[safe dragon]

you could add a property called horse to a UInt8Array and it'll say ok

[steel kraken]

if objects are good enough for json they are good enough for my data structures

[safe dragon]

doesn't mean I like it

[cinder karma]

Lol don't look at me 🐍

[supple ether]

The thing is though that it's the only way to get dictionaries in TS as far as I know

[steel kraken]

maps are kinda like a dictionary

but in a json viewpoint, objects are dictionaries

[pliant snow]

That says more about json

[cinder karma]

Smh if your not abusing getattr then who are you

[devout vault]

https://tenor.com/view/savingprivateryan-ww2-old-soldier-matt-damon-gif-4203998

[devout vault]

(They were talking about google code)

(They didn't know what it was)

[fleet wren]

anyone rember sourceforge

it's apparently still active but calling it a zombie would be generous

(re: the google code talk)

[red crest]

i just used it today to download something

dont look at me, the official download link for clonezilla uses it

[fleet wren]

interesting, that's a name I havent heard in a while

filezilla is the one other name I was think of for "software I downloaded off sourceforge in the olden days"

still there

w(hy)tf apache openoffice is still a thing

are there real professional software developers who decided that their time is best spent developing apache™ openoffice®

sorry my hater programming got activated seeing that name on the sourceforge front page

[lyric bloom]

i use it randomly a lot for older projects

[cinder karma]

I downloaded a pdf optimization program from source

What's filezilla

[fleet wren]

an FTP client/server

used it to transfer files between windows computers back in the days

[cinder karma]

Smh scp my beloved

[fleet wren]

i needed something fast and dirty who needs security when it's just over lan anyway

[devout vault]

On the rare occasion I come across it again I still hate it because the layout makes no sense

FileZilla is what I used for FTP for basically any web server back then

[cinder karma]

Smh just dont use windows

I'm pretty sure I actually usually used rsync

More robust because the wifi sucked

[thin estuary]

But then you gotta write commands

Commands scary

GUI not

[steel kraken]

I think two weeks ago was the first time I actually had to do sftp on command line

Its doable but very inconvenient compared to FileZilla

[worn remnant]

i still use rsync! it's a good tool!

[cinder karma]

It helps when you have ssh or kerb tokens and don't have to retype a password

Rsync is amazing I just work for a company who doesn't let me use it

[worn remnant]

smh just dont use company /lh

[rain apex]

I use rsync instead of cp lol

[cinder karma]

It's a "security issue"

I try to avoid copying but we tend to actually tar/untar

Due to the fact that there are physical disks moving stuff

[hushed raven]

rsync seems like something that would be very useful to me, scp is bit of a pain with big files, awesome!

[cinder karma]

I used it a lot in college because our wifi wasn't stable

• I had ssh keys/kerberos on all servers I cared about, so no login

[main hearth]

any cheap laptops for sdv, roblox and maybe smth else?

i was looking into the Lenovo Ideapad slim 3

[worn remnant]

if you care about modding sdv, get as much ram as you can afford, and single-core performance with what's left over. if you don't care about mods then it will run on almost anything, so cheap out to your heart's content

i guess you need to have a way to output audio or the game will crash, so make sure you have that too

[cinder karma]

Are you in college? If so, the cheapest machine you can get is by emailing your IT department asking for decommissioned machines

[hushed raven]

That also applies to many Universities and secondary/ high schools, especially around the end of the academic year when they start to get replacements for the next year

[cinder karma]

(it also applies to work, btw.)

[pliant snow]

tar is the secret hero of the modern world

[heavy tree]

zinkle is vastly superior to f&#, you guys

[devout vault]

That's how I feel when y'all get into linux discussions, and I live here

[cinder karma]

You bought a framework

You've joined the club

[devout vault]

Yeah and I'm using windows on it

[cinder karma]

Welcome

We have cookies.....what

[devout vault]

"What" for what I said, or for cookies?

[crystal wren]

Could be weirder. Could have bought a System76 and installed Windows on it!

[cinder karma]

Tbh I kinda figured since you were doing stardew dev on it

System76 that's not a name I've heard since my first attempt at college

[devout vault]

Yeah, stardew dev on linux worked fine until I had to figure out how to get the content to build

Got some weird errors from dotnet or mgcb or something

[crystal wren]

Ah, with the required Wine prefix shenanigans?

[devout vault]

Wasn't using wine since I didn't need to build audio or shaders

Only needed to build data

[crystal wren]

Huh, weird then.

[cinder karma]

Guess what

I have to upload stuff to SharePoint to transfer stuff off the server

[crystal wren]

I mean I get only having one potential point of data transfer for like... security and auditing, but...

[safe dragon]

they have their own desktop environment now

sharepoint scares me

[crystal wren]

I've never touched it!

[cyan shadow]

I fucking hate sharepoint, and I only use it for Dutch class

[safe dragon]

we use it at work but really I don't ever touch it unless HR uploaded some info there that I need to get

[cyan shadow]

It always craps out when I'm trying to access the study material

[safe dragon]

you use sharepoint for class??

[cyan shadow]

For some reason, they uploaded everything to it

And use microsoft forms for the tests

[safe dragon]

[cyan shadow]

This isn't university

[safe dragon]

the dutch have fallen so low

[crystal wren]

I mean it is the Netherlands. /j

[safe dragon]

my only knowledge about sharepoint is that we were moving from sharepoint 2012 to 2019 and somehow we actually lost features from that process and we now need a new system

now they're removing things from sharepoint because beyond 2019 there's no On-Premise version anymore and using a cloud service would be disallowed for some of our data

tough life not being allowed to use cloud services in a world where every damn company that exists wants to stop providing on-premise versions

[crystal wren]

because beyond 2019 there's no On-Premise version

I'm... actually slightly shocked by that.

[safe dragon]

ikr

the intranet service

no longer possible to be hosted in your intranet

[crystal wren]

Like yes, they absolutely want everything possible to be cloud based for their control and data harvesting, but that's all stuff they won't and can't do because of terms in enterprise licenses anyway.

[cinder karma]

It's exactly that

[cyan shadow]

It's the International Centre, I don't think they have the funds for more than this tbh

It's run by two people and a bunch of teachers

[safe dragon]

back in my days we just made a shitty free google drive folder

[cyan shadow]

Look, I don't know why they did it, but I just downloaded everything so it's fine

[safe dragon]

🙏

[worn remnant]

re: system76 mentioned

[devout vault]

Yeah names need to match /[a-zA-Z0-9_\- ]/+ to be permissible

(Spaces are replaced with _, or just outright removed if it would work as some camel case variant)

(Same for dashes)

[lethal walrus]

So what about arch linux

[devout vault]

No (btw), so you're disqualified

[lethal walrus]

what about linux mint

[rain apex]

arch_btw

[pliant snow]

Programmers: I love C#, what an elegant and lovely language. It's simplicity and functionality gives me joy in how I work
Also programmers: I went to work on my Linux machine today, breaking the primordial pact I made with Microsoft. 27 GB of malformed package abominations sprang forth and consumed my drive, destroying the spirit and will of four text editors and an IDE before I subsumed to its will and returned to Visual Studio

[safe dragon]

yup

great language

[fleet wren]

microsoft has many faults but c# and typescript are genuinely stellar languages

[cinder karma]

My HSA redid their website lately

[crystal wren]

I have a genuinely great time working with it on Linux, too... except with Stardew/SMAPI. That's the one situation it's less great.

[cinder karma]

The site now is ..../DotNet/.... which amazes me

also I cant find the transfer button

[safe dragon]

they put it in the name damn

[cinder karma]

The new website is so much better

[worn remnant]

i remember when C# was pretty new (mid-'00s) and a friend of mine was excited about it. i said something like "i already don't like java. why would i like Microsoft Java any better?" (this was approximately the height of my annoying-linux-user period)
well, in the fullness of time, C# is very good and java still isn't. i don't know where i'm going with this

[cinder karma]

I hear kotlin is good

[safe dragon]

telling the story of the only time microsoft improved a product over time

[crystal wren]

I mean that was a logical assumption at the time. Why would Microsoft do Java better?

[safe dragon]

I don't think I even knew microsoft made C# when I started using it

and then I went in the opposite direction for a while and thought microsoft also made C and C++

[crystal wren]

What about J#, though?

[safe dragon]

I was unaware of its existence

but I like it

[crystal wren]

Also, I like Java...

https://tenor.com/bCEVr.gif

[worn remnant]

it's okay. nobody's perfect

[devout vault]

I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're refering to as C++, is in fact, C++/CLI, or as I've recently taken to calling it, C++ plus CLI. C++ is not a programming language unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning CLI system made useful by the Common Language Infrastructure, garbage collection and vital interoperability components comprising a full development environment as defined by Microsoft.

Many computer programmers run a modified version of the C++/CLI system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of C++/CLI which is widely used today is often called C++, and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the C++/CLI system, developed by Microsoft.

There really is a C++, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. C++ is the programming language: the syntax in the file that allocates the machine's resources to the programs that you create. The programming language is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete development environment. C++ is normally used in combination with the CLI: the whole system is basically CLI using C++, or C++/CLI. All the so-called C++ distributions are really distributions of C++/CLI!

(Y'all probably know the copypasta original, and I modified it to fit with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C%2B%2B/CLI of course)

(also, re:Java, shout out to it not being painful, ie. Chord by @ivory shadow )

[cinder karma]

KittyKARcasey, C++ ambassador

[devout vault]

(plz ignore that I still haven't tried it like I said I would)

[ivory shadow]

It's okay, I've been fixing a bunch of things.

Today I've been working on getting enums to a better state.

Since I was dumb and made two enum types.

[devout vault]

Wait, how are you making it work instead?

I thought enum = C++/C# style, and enum class = Java style?

[ivory shadow]

Yeah, that's how it works.

I've been cleaning up C# style to fix issues.

[devout vault]

Ah

I thought you meant you were merging them somehow

[ivory shadow]

Like ToString() is handling names.

Instead of the underlying primitive.

Requiring explicit casting, even if the casts turn into a no-op in the compiled code.

Making sure nullable and arrays work. Stuff like that.

It's tricky with the type system because C#-style enums are just kind of... bolted on top of primitives.

[devout vault]

If only boxed primitives weren't final 😔

[rain apex]

I don't think i hate java but i just hate how me work use it

Autowire confusion

[ivory shadow]

Anyways, once Chord is in a good state maybe we can all just move to that for any Java related needs

[crystal wren]

You mean you don't love control being taken away from you and put into a semi-opaque box?

[cinder karma]

Isn't c# similar

Like

You carefully count your jumps and stress every allocation

And GC stalls you

[devout vault]

I have never counted my jumps and allocations

But https://github.com/MichalStrehovsky/zerosharp has a version with... basically nothing (including no GC!)

[fleet wren]

the people yearns for a modern language that's both memory safe and isn't burdened by a runtime to enforce it

[rain apex]

No the autowired stuff is like C# annotations but more ???

[cinder karma]

Rust mentioned

God it's a crime I'm not allowed to use rust more

[crystal wren]

Just give me Rust with C#-like syntax, please. Thanks.

[dusty pollen]

I had stackoverflow genuinely get mad at me over this a few years back

[devout vault]

You don't need to add "over this", we all know that's just stackoverflow's default state of being

(Also I'm not sure if you mean C++/CLI, or the original copypasta's GNU/Linux)

[dusty pollen]

yes but I specifically mean over saying "C++" instead of "C++/.NET" (iirc?)

[devout vault]

It's not .Net, for some reason. It's CLI

[dusty pollen]

and yes I'm aware of the original

[devout vault]

It's very weird

[dusty pollen]

maybe that one? idk

[devout vault]

I mean I literally linked the wikipedia page titled C++/CLI 😛

The only other way I've heard it referred to is "Visual C++"

[dusty pollen]

no I mean I remember something about .NET or C++/.NET but they may have been both angry and wrong

[cinder karma]

I actually like rust syntax

Minus lifetimrs

[devout vault]

hisssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

When are we getting a language where we can invent our own operators 😔

[cinder karma]

Is mozart around

[devout vault]

Probably in my room, where I was about to head to

Do you need a picture?

[cinder karma]

I thought i heard a cat hissing ...

[crystal wren]

I don't hate the syntax, at least. I like it a lot more than a fair few other languages!

[fleet wren]

I read this as "C# with Rust-like syntax" and was about to recommend Verona

[crystal wren]

For those unaware like me... https://github.com/microsoft/verona

[pliant snow]

In unrelated news, I have a coworker who is diving down a massive rabbit hole converting files to C++ rather than do some C string handling

[fleet wren]

C++ is just C but plusplus right so it should just work™

[steel kraken]

Understandable, I would procrastinate instead of work with char[] in C as well

[rain apex]

That was me back in jan but i gave up cus clang and gcc forbiddenlove didn't work out

[cinder karma]

I raise you scanf in verilog

[pliant snow]

Im pretty sure the end of this journey is that some of these files are going to be required to be in C after all, either for technical reasons or their owners will be mad

[crystal wren]

CAT.

[safe dragon]

cat

[cinder karma]

Cat

[fleet wren]

cät

[cinder karma]

100% innocent of all crimes

[fleet wren]

more cǎt

[crystal wren]

VOID KITTY.

[steel kraken]

She's a lot less void than she used to be, but she is still the Abby..ys

[crystal wren]

She has the brown-in-the-light void fur, but definitely still void.

[cinder karma]

Looks toasty

[cinder karma]

Sun blonde

[rain apex]

Cat

[lyric bloom]

apparently, firefox is ALSO becoming a modern AI browser now

mozilla is also pivoting a bit on trying to find support

[steel kraken]

Firefox already can't afford to continue being Firefox, how are they going to afford the ai

Though at least the courts did decide Google's allowed to keep throwing stupid amounts of money at them

[lyric bloom]

I think it acutally uses Gemini and ChatGPT under the hood.

[fleet wren]

hoo boy is it "rant against Mozilla's boneheaded corporate decision" hour

[safe dragon]

I think the idea is that this would get them that funding

then put in the minimal effort necessary to appease the new investment money

[cinder karma]

God bankers are annoying me today

Look it's called a recharacterization or a removal of excess contribution

Not a dispersal

Why the fuck do I know the law better than you do it's not even MY job

[steel kraken]

Unless you charge the end user for said ai, it's just setting money on fire, and Firefox users famously don't like spending money

[lyric bloom]

their VPN failed, iirc

[steel kraken]

Their email product is the only thing that is sustainable iirc

[devout vault]

Thunderbird? Is that still a thing?

[safe dragon]

technically, yes

[dusty pollen]

there are three different conversations going on right now and this is my only contribution to any of them

[fleet wren]

düg

[safe dragon]

ur so right

[lyric bloom]

yeah, that doesn't surprise me

[steel kraken]

An important aspect of the off topic channel is to be off topic with the ongoing conversations

[safe dragon]

do not participate in any conversation just say things

[lyric bloom]

(I'm too busy cleaning up my room prior to a windstorm to do acutal progamming work today, sadly.)

also need to redo wiring near my desk so I can just plug in the new eGPU dock

_>

[devout vault]

me half the time when another conversation is going on in here

[cinder karma]

why do i know the law better than these bankers

[safe dragon]

to know how to commit crime

[fleet wren]

egpu fascinates me
we need a startup for a backpack computer for truly mobile gaming with pc-like performance

[lyric bloom]

there was a comment osmewhere that regulators often hvae to teach banks about crime again because each graduating class reinvents fraud from first principles

[fleet wren]

it can double as a body heater in winter

[crystal wren]

Not knowing the law or just not caring about it... I wonder how many of them fall into the latter camp.

[cinder karma]

I'm super interested in that treadmill Casey has

[crystal wren]

Casey got a fancy treadmill? I'm intrigued!

[devout vault]

I don't think I've mentioned that here 😛

Got one of the katwalk ones for VR to try ("to try" as if they aren't really expensive...)

It's mostly here but I ordered the wrong shoe size (converted wrong direction for womens -> mens), so waiting for proper size

[crystal wren]

Welp, that rules that out for me probably unless they have super wild shoe size options.

[rain apex]

Oh is it like prevent you from escaping living room while VR

[fleet wren]

wow 👀

[cinder karma]

Please, it's not real gaming unless you throw your wiimote into thr TV

[fleet wren]

I slapped my nephew in the face once while gaming in VR that's close enough

in my defense he barged into my room and against all good judgement ran up to me while I was unaware

[cinder karma]

Also minor employment complaint

The entire room's heating is coming from a single vent

Over my head

It is both very loud

And also my desk temperature swings like crazy

[fleet wren]

wow how much was the entire thing

[devout vault]

The important part is the sensor, which people have made DIY shoes using the sensor in the base shoes

[devout vault]

More than I should've spent on a whim.

[rain apex]

How do they work

Im confused where the tread is on this mill from product photos

[devout vault]

It's not actually a treadmill

I don't know why they call it that, the surface doesn't move

[fleet wren]

"slippery surface that detects feet motion" doesnt flow as well probably

[devout vault]

Basically the bowl shape and the special shoes means you step in one direction and slide backwards

It's not quite normal walking

[devout vault]

I mean I know why realistically, I meant "I don't know why it could be called that in a reasonable world" 😛

[fleet wren]

hmm their site is telling me if i order in the next 10 hours i get it 50% off

[cinder karma]

That is a genre of treadmill

[devout vault]

Yeah they basically always have a ridiculous looking sale going from what I hear, best ignore it and treat the sale price as the normal price

[rain apex]

Is it powered

[devout vault]

Not that part. Sensors and stuff, I assume so

But not for locomotion

[cinder karma]

Ah yes, set ro sets RO and set RO fails

[sand frost]

If you have a board that looks like it has surface mounts to solder to but an identical board looks like it has thru holes in the same place

What are you supposed to do?

Solder to the surface mounts? Drill tiny holes then solder?

[cinder karma]

It Depends

[sand frost]

I’m making the student look up the documentation rn but they might not be able to find it

This one really looks like it has thru holes

[cinder karma]

I wouldn't drill

[sand frost]

It didnt seem right to me either

I wasn’t sure if “surface mounts that you can push a wire through” is a real thing

Or maybe the board isn’t truly identical?

[cinder karma]

Are you talking the tiny hole under the word SDA?

Or the bigger ones to the left

[sand frost]

the four on the right side

they look entirely like they go through the board

[cinder karma]

Try wicking

Chemtronics 80-5-5 Rosin ESD Desolder Braid, Brown 5' Length, .145" Width https://share.google/5WaeUmGA0OX3F2Zb4

[sand frost]

Wicking? Ah I see

I tried melting them but they didn’t seem melty enough

[cinder karma]

Place this stuff on top, press solder gun too

[cinder karma]

How hot are you going

[sand frost]

700F

at least nominally per the iron

[cinder karma]

Hmmm

Which tip

It looks to me (from blurry imagel) closer to filled with solder

Than truly filled in

[sand frost]

Wicking didn’t seem to do much, tip is crap

But pointy

Yeah I also sort of suspected that? Just can’t seem to melt it out

[cinder karma]

I tend to want a bigger tip, smth like the 1-2mm chisel

You can also add more solder

Or flux

[cinder karma]

Adding a bit of extra solder will likely help heat transfer bettse

[frosty echo]

They do, they're vias. They connect traces on one side of the board to traces on the other side. They aren't designed for soldering to, but can be used for that when making modifications or something.

[cinder karma]

No, the four to the right look like spots to solder to

The small ones under are vias

[frosty echo]

🤔 draw round them or something maybe?

[cinder karma]

Four to the left sorry

[frosty echo]

Oh, on this photo rather than the others?

[cinder karma]

Yeah

[frosty echo]

Those? Yeah they look like holes that have been used before

[sand frost]

That’s just me poking them

They looked fresh before that

But also totally solid

[cinder karma]

Do you have solid core wire

Another option is to heat it up, add more solder, then force a solid core through

[frosty echo]

Or add more solder so you can heat it better then thwack the board against the desk or something to throw the solder out of the hole, but not so easy with such a small board

[sand frost]

We got it!! Bigger tip + more solder

We were using stranded wire bc it’s a connector we’re soldering in

But maybe the poking tip for next time

It also seems like a 2-person job

But idk, maybe advanced solder-ers know how

[frosty echo]

Soldering often does

[sand frost]

The student seems like they'll be able to recruit a friend to help out next time, so that's good

[cinder karma]

If you have a clamp it helps

Helping Hands https://share.google/FeDPYfhBgVIXjFAQm

[sand frost]

Yeah we had one but I can't see both sides of the board at once

So carefully holding the soldering iron in place + carefully poking the wire on the other side is hard

[dusty pollen]

clearly you need a mirror on one of the arms

[cinder karma]

Hold the board vertically

[frosty echo]

Or heat on the same side you poke?

[cinder karma]

Tbh it gets easier

[sand frost]

I do expect practice effects, to some extent

But this isn't my student so really I send them on their way with best wishes

[devout vault]

Let it be known that Mozart has killed Godot

The face of a murderer

[sand frost]

What a cute murderer

[cinder karma]

Y'all should share steam year in review

[steel kraken]

Guess its back to unity

[devout vault]

(my steam review is mostly just "wow, we were depressed this year!")

[devout vault]

Wow, so few stardew sessions

[steel kraken]

my steam in review last two years have looked very different compared to prior years since osrs took over

[rain apex]

you can tell that i am filthy linux user with no hot reload

[cinder karma]

Pkill steam plz

[steel kraken]

also in my defense my stardew has been in .net9/.net10 for the last month or two and I only fixed it being able to be tracked by steam yesterday

[devout vault]

skill issue

[steel kraken]

I havent had hot reload work in a long time, as I keep just my code off so I can breakpoint anything

[cinder karma]

How js net 10

[steel kraken]

The load times went from 200 to 120 seconds to being ingame post daystarted

half of that is just in CP initial startup loading content packs

.net9 and .net10 have been mostly very similar

but haven't given either too much stress

[cinder karma]

How is osrs

[devout vault]

Oh boy. While I can't say I've ever cared a whole lot about maximizing privacy / minimizing data collection, this making me consider changing to a FF fork simply because of the change in direction. First part is odd enough, but the FAQ removal too.... yikes

From https://www.zdnet.com/article/the-firefox-i-loved-is-gone-how-to-protect-your-privacy-on-it-now/

So uh, everyone shill your favorite non-chromium FF alternatives, I guess? (Modern browser extension support like uBlock Origin, RES, and Tabby Cat is very important. I'm not switching to one that has only the old style extensions 😛 )

[sand frost]

yiikes

unfortunately i use chrome, FF, and safari

so probably not anything you'd want

(i use safari for personal stuff, FF for this one website that hates chrome, and chrome for work stuff)

[devout vault]

I only use safari on iOS where apple won't allow anything that doesn't use it internally

(ie. firefox and chrome are both just reskinned safari, as far as I know)

Firefox for everything else, except the occasional website that needs chrome and I can't not use said website

Currently thinking Waterfox but haven't really looked at it or the other options closely

[sand frost]

Safari seems to be decent at privacy, with the obvious caveat of it being apple-locked

[devout vault]

I don't think safari makes sense on windows

[sand frost]

yeah nope

[devout vault]

I just don't trust apple to integrate with windows well 😛

[sand frost]

lol

[devout vault]

...if safari on windows is even still a thing

(also I need to sleep so I will be investigating any suggestions tomorrow)

[sand frost]

i don't trust windows to integrate well either 😛

[thin estuary]

at the very least it used to exist on Windows

[sand frost]

i think apple has killed some of the windows apps

i know it killed itunes for windows

[devout vault]

Yeah I know it used to, just not sure if it still is

[sand frost]

my husband is still mad

[devout vault]

??????????

[sand frost]

or at least made it unusable?

[devout vault]

Can you not do that stuff without a mac now

[sand frost]

i don't know the details

[devout vault]

Like backups of your iphone

[sand frost]

due to being staunchly anti-windows

but he used to use it for music

[thin estuary]

they made a new app that's on Windows Store and sucks

[sand frost]

and it stopped being good at that

ah, that would explain it

[thin estuary]

and Apple Music is its own app now

which makes sense i guess

[devout vault]

I only used itunes for apps and backups

[thin estuary]

the Apple Music app is also not great, buuut it's where my music library lives, sooo

[sand frost]

it's also one of the few places we found to buy drm-free music when we looked around a little for our wedding playlist

like it's not great but it works

[thin estuary]

they have DRM-free music?

[sand frost]

i mean it seems to work? you can buy mp3s and move them around/out

[thin estuary]

huh

[sand frost]

i am not an audio snob so idk if being mp3s is bad or something

[worn remnant]

it isn't

something like 25 years ago, back when mp3 was still encumbered by patents (it isn't anymore!), the only available encoders were pretty low quality, and most people used a pretty low bitrate (128kbps) to keep file sizes down, so if you cared you could absolutely hear the loss in quality

[marble jewel]

@devout vault https://youtu.be/lsBxWYDspV8?si=6mNWbeDXAXnhQXuI

Imagine having Minecraft as your desktop window manager in VR

[worn remnant]

nowadays, the encoders are better and space is less of a concern, and those (plus variable bitrate being better supported) mean mp3 quality is Fine

[devout vault]

I saw that and almost posted it here

[worn remnant]

of course it's possible to ruin an mp3 by encoding it poorly, but such is true of every lossy compression

[devout vault]

honestly their comments on a response to their pinned made me not want to give them more attention, even if it was perfect for this channel

I also saw this earlier
https://v.redd.it/ds111d2sqh7g1/CMAF_1080.mp4?source=fallback

From https://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimvr/comments/1pnsij3/skyrim_works_inside_of_skyrim_vr/

[devout vault]

but also this, good night plz send non-chromium browser suggestions for tomorrow

[marble jewel]

Yuck

[marble jewel]

I use Floorp

[safe dragon]

ew wtf

I wish I had browser suggestions

[dusty pollen]

ah. charming

imagine being able to like people like that because they don't directly impact your actual existential safety

[cyan shadow]

Zen

[lethal walrus]

I also use zen

And helium, when zen decides video playback won't work until I restart my machine, ut that isn't non-chromium

[steel kraken]

I'm basic and just live in edge

[safe dragon]

at home I use Firefox and at work I use chrome, Firefox and edge to make sure what in building works and renders correctly in all 3

no floorp or zen yet

[dusty pollen]

I refuse to believe floorp is real

[frosty echo]

Vivaldi https://vivaldi.com/blog/keep-exploring/, which I think still has manifest v2 support for proper uBlock Origin. Oh, non-Chromium?? So, a modern Firefox fork that isn't Firefox? Is there any?

[crystal wren]

Floorp!

Well, and Zen like others have said.

[cinder karma]

I used to use waterfox but it was way behind main Firefox when I did and that was 10 years ago

https://www.waterfox.com/blog/no-ai-here-response-to-mozilla/

Looks like the Firefox AI integration can be disabled though

Fwiw I'm so far in the Google Ecosystem that breaking out of it seems too much work lol.

Anyways, Google. I am NOT in the market for a new car or a new laptop. Have I made myself clear yet.

[worn remnant]

(insert maciej anecdote about being shown an ad for zipcar alongside an ad for carmax, guaranteeing that at least one of them is wasted)

uh, happy belated 10th birthday to "the website obesity crisis", an absolute banger of a talk by the same maciej

[long verge]

Zen is great

[worn remnant]

found it! the anecdote is in here. it was geico (insurance), not carmax

It's one thing to get the targeting wrong, but the ad engine can't even decide if I have a car or not!

[long verge]

I always used Firefox, switched to Zen a month ago and it’s really good

[worn remnant]

obviously this was from over a decade ago, so maybe it's gotten better since (not in my experience)

[cinder karma]

If I cared more about privacy I would use Brave tbh

I do need to find the AI controls on Firefox and disable it though at work

[safe dragon]

brave gave me the ick cause of its integrated crypto wallet

[cinder karma]

Btw, this is what I meant when I said TI regrets trying for fabless

https://www.wfaa.com/article/money/north-texas-sherman-texas-instuments-semiconductor-factory/287-7df034f7-152d-4b02-ac7b-4d3cfc0d013b

[frosty echo]

I'm guessing they won't be making memory?

[safe dragon]

I'm confused how that links opens YouTube

[frosty echo]

301 Moved Permanently. Even https://www.wfaa.com does that. Maybe their site is broken?

[safe dragon]

permanently no less

I've never used 301 before

[little furnace]

Didn't that change with EU laws?

[devout vault]

There are people who like having multiple cars.

Strange, I know

[sand frost]

I think very few people want to habitually rent a car AND own a car though

I certainly canceled my zipcar membership when I got a car

[cinder karma]

Have you guys seen adssettings.google.com

[hushed raven]

It seems to think I have a highschool diploma, while I do, it's not my highest qualification XD

[safe dragon]

riveting information

the only thing it seems to have actually figured out is that I know Dutch and English and am between 25 and 34 years old

[crystal wren]

I dislike the age group it's picked for me.

[cinder karma]

It got almost no info for me

[safe dragon]

idk why it figured nothing out for me when I basically live on YouTube and am typing this on a Google Pixel phone

[worn remnant]

(see above link to the talk from 2014 about how much adtech sucks considering how much data they are hoovering up to improve it)

[sand frost]

cause it's wrong, or just cause you don't like it? 😛

[cinder karma]

It got my age correct and got correct one of the languages i speak

And no other data

[crystal wren]

Oh, it's very correct!

[safe dragon]

"yup ur fluent in Chinese. Idk about English tho"

[cinder karma]

I did take the opportunity to turn off alcohol ads

[safe dragon]

that was not even in the list for me

[cinder karma]

In the Sensitive tab?

[safe dragon]

oh there

[crystal wren]

Yeah, I just have all of the sensitive categories turned off because I'm literally never going to be interested by anything in any of them.

[safe dragon]

fuckin advertise life threatening drugs to me I won't see em anyway

I wonder if disabling the gambling one deletes all mobile game advertising

[crystal wren]

That's a good joke.

[cinder karma]

Lol

[safe dragon]

imma guess it doesn't consider genshin impact a gambling game like I do...

[devout vault]

Wow, google is transphobic confirmed.

(Also featuring: no, I don't know german. I'm an american, which means I'm monolingual, obviously)

It also thought I worked for a large employer (250-10k employees), which has never been the case

[safe dragon]

I like how large employer ranges from 250 to something 40 times larger

[cinder karma]

YouTube really wants me to buy fancy exercise equipment

.qp I'm American and know more than one language

Google doesnt even have a gender for me!

[devout vault]

AABG (assigned agender by google)

[safe dragon]

supply shortages hitting everything damn

[fleet wren]

https://overclock3d.net/news/gpu-displays/nvidia-plans-heavy-cuts-to-gpu-supply-in-early-2026/

i love not owning things

[devout vault]

I saw something about that on reddit

Yet another reason to hate the AI boom

[devout vault]

I think MS is lying to me

...nevermind I think FileSystemWatcher just hates having multiple filters

[cinder karma]

Yes (sincerely)

I keep thinking about moving into my car

[marble jewel]

#van-life is like a 2021 trend

[cinder karma]

Smh

[devout vault]

Okay actually actually it's because visual studio doesn't write the file directly for ctrl+s, it just does rename shenanigans

[cinder karma]

We're just in the 69th month of March 2020

[safe dragon]

nice

[cinder karma]

Oh my god

Look up www.brow.sh

[marble jewel]

smh you couldn't even hyperlink it for us

[devout vault]

smh indeed

...huh

This looks a lot like code crimes to me

[safe dragon]

the ultimate browser

I'm kind of fascinated that this isn't just a meme projecct

they seem to list actual reasons why one might use it

[marble jewel]

It kind of makes me think about the e-reader browsers with terrible refresh rates and fidelity, and yet they "can display" youtube videos and such

Also, with the kitty graphics protocols, there's no reason a terminal browser couldn't have feature parity with traditional web browsers

[fleet wren]

I think lynx browser has been around for longer

1992 apparenrly

[cinder karma]

Yeah I found this because I was trying to use lynx

[lethal walrus]

aw

[devout vault]

Is there a good one-or-two word equivalent for the “building a plane while also flying it” analogy?

(Asking here because it’s for a library name)

[safe dragon]

continuous development...

[hushed raven]

A bad idea?

[safe dragon]

premature release

[marble jewel]

Agile Methodology

[hushed raven]

Wright Brothers?

[dusty pollen]

seat of your pants/shortened to PantSeat?

[devout vault]

I want a funny name

[hushed raven]

PantSeat is a great name

[devout vault]

This is actually better than the alternative, which would perform horrifically 😛

[devout vault]

Hmm. Can’t wait to see PantSeat.DLL in my SMAPI install

[dusty pollen]

Munchausen is unfortunately associated with the condition now so not as many people are familiar with the boot story, and Bootstrap is already a framework

[safe dragon]

it's time to integrate bootstrap into smapi

[devout vault]

(For slight context, library is for runtime generation of types and methods in a much less painful way)

[dusty pollen]

(fun fact: that's what "lifting yourself up by your bootstraps" was SUPPOSED to mean. in the story he gets himself out of mud by lifting himself up by his boots' straps, which is obviously nonsensical)

[devout vault]

(Isn’t “popularizing analogies to mean the opposite of what they were supposed to” the intention for every analogy?

[dusty pollen]

"HorseBeforeCart"

[devout vault]

…that even kinda makes sense, since the “horse” determines what “cart” will be used

But doesn’t sound Library Name enough. And PreemptiveHorse doesn’t have the same ring to it

[dusty pollen]

PurpleCrayon

Harold's Purple Crayon! you people had no childhood

[safe dragon]

HorseCart smh the horse is already before the cart

[dusty pollen]

he regularly builds things around himself

[safe dragon]

no idea what you're talking about

[devout vault]

See, Pintail is a good name since it even looks like a reasonable name if you don’t think about too hard. But you do, it’s obvious it’s a silly name

[marble jewel]

tbh idea generation like this is something that I've used ChatGPT for

[dusty pollen]

here he is bringing a boat into existence while on said boat

[safe dragon]

Just like DoodleBob from SpongeBob

[cinder karma]

Look bird names are great

[dusty pollen]

harold was first 😌

[rain apex]

.jojai name casey's project pls

[devout vault]

Could also do something like Spontaneous Manifestation, I guess

[devout vault]

Joja AND AI?

[marble jewel]

Couple that came up LiveBuild, InFlight, WingIt

[rain apex]

What does ur crimes do

[devout vault]

.

[red crest]

clearly its called the Gromit method

https://tenor.com/view/train-tracks-tracks-collect-get-gromit-gif-11667864

[devout vault]

Maybe if I actually remembered enough of that to actually be fond of it

[marble jewel]

https://tenor.com/view/buster-keaton-train-stunt-the-general-gif-24323720

Buster Keaton is the OG

Back when comedy like this was live and dangerous

[red crest]

i think that is distinctly different to building the tracks as the train moves

[devout vault]

Also, if I was too young to really remember much of Gromit, do you really think I'd remember that at all

[supple ether]

that's cool, I kind of want that
although I'm surprised it doesn't have terminal image support.

[cinder karma]

Go meta. Archaeopteryx

[cinder karma]

What

[fleet wren]

my only exposure to harold's purple crayon is that terrible live action movie where harold's a grown ass man

[marble jewel]

I'm old enough to know about the book. Didn't watch and don't care to watch the live action film.

Partially because of who is in it, but also it's just not something that needed to be made into a movie.

[fleet wren]

i didnt watch it either to clarify
i have far better uses of my time

[cinder karma]

1955

[hushed raven]

I am wayyy to young to know about it, wow

[cinder karma]

70 years

I think we are all too young

[sand frost]

I read Harold's purple crayon as a child

[hearty plover]

Hi! I'm a retired modder, I wanted to start creating mods again, but I forgot everything and lost all my old mod files. I used to program content patchers, Python, and Visual Studio Code.

someone can help me to use content patcher and visual studio?

[fleet wren]

oh no, something on topic, quick everyone hide
#making-mods-general is the right channel

[heavy dagger]

New quote added by atravita as #6828 (https://discordapp.com/channels/137344473976799233/1215712021207720006/1450967410902433842)

[dusty pollen]

I was born in 2000 and loved the book so much that my parents ended up hating it I don’t think it’s an age thing

[cinder karma]

TEENSY

Anyways

[cinder karma]

//this is the dumbest foreach syntax I've ever seen

It's so dumb that the tutorial I'm reading literal says //yes this is really the foreach syntax

[safe dragon]

the worst I've dealt with is just javascript where you have to really remember to write for value of list not for value in list

else you'll be iterating the properties of the list object instead of the list values

[steel kraken]

I dont mind it too much, but I was doing js prior to of being a thing

[safe dragon]

it's not terrible but it definitely messed me up a few times

[dusty pollen]

love js

[steel kraken]

still better than list.forEach(value => {})

[dusty pollen]

my favourite part is that "of" is the one I would intuitively call "in"

[safe dragon]

unfortunately in was already taken...

they fucked that up first and then had to think of something else

[dusty pollen]

that's it, that's js in a nutshell

[steel kraken]

smooshgate is the history of js

the hard rule of dont break the internet means it can get spaghetti when old but bad shit took the good realestate

[safe dragon]

can't wait till javascript has two completely separate apis for handling dates and time

[steel kraken]

it does

[safe dragon]

cause they can't change the old one even though it's horrendous

[steel kraken]

https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/JavaScript/Reference/Global_Objects/Temporal

[safe dragon]

that's what I meant with having a second one

that one can't be used yet so it effectively does not exist

the amount of scenario's where you only need to support firefox are close to 0

[steel kraken]

the chromium family will have it in stable in mid jan

[safe dragon]

yup I'll be happy to welcome it into my codebase

though it still doesn't look very good

just not what borders on weaponized incompetence

[devout vault]

wait are talking about JS or C++

[safe dragon]

yes

if it's from me tho it's JS cause I have never used C++

[steel kraken]

from what I've heard C++ has the similar problem of having 5 ways of doign everything due to history

[safe dragon]

tbh C# has its fair share of that too

C#'s date api is pretty good though even then you have DateTimeOffset vs DateTime

and the evil and incorrect choice where InvariantCulture formats and expects dates the american way

if only we had an established standard date format that is not tied to any specific culture

[steel kraken]

I havent had problems with needing to deal with american formats as I always go in/out via iso86001 / RFC3339

[devout vault]

C++ example: Now you use unique_ptr/shared_ptr/weak_ptr(/timetravelling_ptr or something idk) instead of auto_ptr