programmers-off-topic

[dusty pollen]

I’m glad I don’t have hour counting for stardew

[safe dragon]

I played a decent amount again later when they released farm varieties instead of just having 1 option

[dusty pollen]

I played some amount on apple arcade on my ipad back before it was ported to 1.5 and some amount on gog on my laptop without the gog client running

[rain apex]

Ancient history

[safe dragon]

I have never finished the community center before

I have never reached year 2 before

[devout vault]

gasp

[dusty pollen]

now they’re unlimited with custom modded farms 😌

and there’s post cc content

[safe dragon]

I've had 3 playthroughs end in the first winter cause winter is just fuckin lame

[dusty pollen]

a whole island of it

[devout vault]

Do you not yearn for the mines

[red crest]

this is getting far too on topic i wanna go back to insulting peoples games opinions /j

[fleet wren]

ngl before I entered modding I never used any farms beyond the default
they, frankly, ||all suck||

[dusty pollen]

gib name of game and I tell you if I’ve heard of it 😌

[safe dragon]

I finish the regular mines within like 2 weeks of it opening up and don't even know how to get into the skull caverns

I only once unlocked the desert I think

[fleet wren]

quick what do you think of Darkest Dungeon

[devout vault]

too sad looking

[dusty pollen]

-# of what

[red crest]

the first one or the second one

[fleet wren]

either is fine, but let's try second

[safe dragon]

I know the desert has a character called sandy which I think is honestly just a rude name to give to the one character in a desert

[dusty pollen]

are you guys making things up again

[fleet wren]

(my hot take is it's not half as good as 1)

[devout vault]

I mean I think she moved there

[red crest]

i think the second one is.... eh.... bad. or at least very not for me. however i also recognize that they really couldnt do anything BUT try something very different if they didnt wanna just repeat DD 1

[devout vault]

(before the game started, but still)

[fleet wren]

yes exactlyyyy

[red crest]

so like, im sure the game is for someone, but if you really liked DD1, then you shouldnt have ever expected to like DD 2

[safe dragon]

hey I'm blaming CA not her imaginary parents

[red crest]

because if they made DD2 exactly like DD 1 then why bother

DD 1 is very very good though i think

[dusty pollen]

my question is can you get there from other places or was she literally stranded

[fleet wren]

I had about 200 hours in DD1. I haven't gotten past the 3rd boss in DD2

[safe dragon]

also I do actually know ginger island exists

[rain apex]

DD1 was 3hard5me i think

[devout vault]

For my game I'll make Sandy live in the frozen areas, and Frost live in the desert areas. Is that better?

[red crest]

i dont actually have too many hours in Darkest Dungeon but i did get both DLCs for free bc i was a private alpha tester for them

[devout vault]

I mean, there's literally a road

[safe dragon]

is there a character called Frost in stardew

[devout vault]

And the buss doesn't reverse to go in or out, so its not a dead end

[rain apex]

Something about the intended loop of getting rid of ur guys makes me really sad so i feel demotivated after my first pair of guys out level most dungeons

[devout vault]

no

My game, not SDV

[red crest]

i take it you also dont like xcom chu

[safe dragon]

oh ok

ok I learnt to read I understand now

[rain apex]

i also liked it until i had to say bye to me guys

But the real reason why I never finished is cus

I played xcom on discord games

[red crest]

i can empathize
i also get very attached to my squads and dont like having to use different squads

[fleet wren]

on what games

[rain apex]

They shut that down b4 i finished

[red crest]

(squads in both xcom and dd. though i still likew both games plenty.)

[rain apex]

https://discord.fandom.com/wiki/Store

[safe dragon]

the only way to play games like xcom is to reset the second anyone dies and refuse to engage with that mechanic

[devout vault]

I remember playing xenonauts (the first one) and it was just at the time.

No I never finished it

[rain apex]

It lived 1 whole year

[fleet wren]

my first xcom 2 clear I gave lore and backstory to every soldier that joined, regardless if they died, saved them and used them for future campaigns

[safe dragon]

I actually own a game in the discord store

[devout vault]

Somehow have 50 hours in it, which is more than I feel like I remember

[red crest]

i idnt do this bc i was just Good 😎 but the problem then arises when you actually need more than one squads worth of people trained up for later things

i didnt like having to train up a whole second or third squad

bc i liked my main guys

[red crest]

bc i also did the same thing as Selph with naming then and giving them light lore and story to get even more attached

[devout vault]

nuh uh

you can also mod it in so they teleport to the ICE on "death" so they don't die

(or if you can't, you make a mod where you can)

[safe dragon]

I almost never mod games soz that's not an option

[devout vault]

I had this problem with xenonauts

[fleet wren]

I remember the cold sniper that was very good at her job, but she never socialized with anyone, until she died on a mission via sacrificing herself so others could evacuate

she got replaced by a dude who for some reason only speaks spanish

[devout vault]

I still need to play the CrossCode DLC, don't tell @earnest cairn

[red crest]

pour one out for unnamed cold sniper

[devout vault]

And the Alabaster Dawn demo, for that matter

[safe dragon]

I also haven't played the dlc

nor that demo

[red crest]

CrossCode has dlc? i didnt know this

[earnest cairn]

how dare you

[earnest cairn]

HOW DARE YOU

[rain apex]

The other thing about the training up a squad bit is that it feels kind of grindy sometimes

That was why i never finished disgaea

[safe dragon]

as far as I can know the dlc is honestly more to just wrap up the story in a more satisfying way

[devout vault]

It's the epilogue, essentially. Which is certainly a choice to have as the DLC

[earnest cairn]

and its so good

[devout vault]

It's also why I struggle with any party based game these days to be honest

[red crest]

ive only seen a bit of CrossCode gameplay and never played it myself

always fascinated with its programming though

[safe dragon]

I had to buy crosscode twice because my first install is stuck in the discord store, impossible to even press the install button on a linux machine

[devout vault]

2d graphics 3d world go brrrrr

[red crest]

not so much that and more the fact that they used Javascript

[devout vault]

Can you install on windows?

Download on windows and run on linux. The game is literally made in JS

[safe dragon]

I'm sure I could

but I just ended up buying the game on steam instead

[devout vault]

I really should sort my steam library into "things I actually intend(ed?) to play" vs "things I got because they were in the bundle too"

I also need to go and redeem my humble monthly backlog

[safe dragon]

I have never bought a humble bundle in my life

my method of acquiring games is to do nothing and just open steam one day to see my sister bought it

[red crest]

i have like 10 pages of humble bundle keys unredeemed bc i only wanted one or two games each from like 12 bundles

[devout vault]

I'm browsing steam looking for a farming sim that's 3d and not unreal or unity nor unmoddable and also fits my tastes. So hard to find 😔

(3d = easier vr modding, maybe?)

[safe dragon]

3d but not one of the two most popular 3d engines that exist

[devout vault]

Yes

Because I'm a hater

I find it hard to navigate unity code when modding and I don't really know how to add stuff, and unreal is doubly like that

That or CA should suddenly release a 3d version of stardew

Which I imagine likely won't happen without me knowing ahead of time, given, uh

[safe dragon]

I find it mildly amusing that you're picking a game based on whether you would enjoy making mods for it

[fleet wren]

dwarf fortress with stonesense technically counts as a 3d farming game

[rain apex]

1. 3D sdv
2. Actually nothing is different but now all Vector2 are Vector3

[devout vault]

Well no, it needs to be a game I would enjoy too

[safe dragon]

damn

[red crest]

why change to vector3s, everything already has a layerdepth, just use that

[devout vault]

Like coral island (okay, it's also UE, but) doesn't quite have the vibes I want

[devout vault]

Not playing as a single character, denied

I guess there's adventure mode but does the seam version even have that yet

[safe dragon]

it's stardew valley but it got that octopath traveler/dragon quest 3 remake look with 2.5D HD

[rain apex]

Layer depths r immensely jank

[devout vault]

Button, chu, if it were that simple I wouldn't be so far behind on my crime thread 😛

[fleet wren]

I think it does now

[red crest]

it can be that simple if you have no standards for quality

[devout vault]

Ehhh only because of how SDV uses them differently in some cases than others. If you make it always the bottom pixel or something, it'd be fine

Equivalent to Vector3, even

[devout vault]

Ah, but you see, that won't work in first person when I look behind me and the back of the buildings don't exist

[safe dragon]

why would you want it to be first person

[devout vault]

VR

[safe dragon]

that's valheim

[devout vault]

lol no

[safe dragon]

wait no valheim is third person

wait

[devout vault]

I mean valheim is at least 3d

[safe dragon]

is it

[rain apex]

Casey i feel like minecraft is what u r describing...

It's got farming

[devout vault]

It's missing a pretty core part though

The social aspect

[fleet wren]

villagers

[devout vault]

(It's why I'm not really playing Garden of the Sea - it's missing that, and also combat/mining)

[safe dragon]

the primary thing you farm in minecraft is villager trades

[red crest]

maybe what you need is... a server

[devout vault]

I meant the NPCs, not actual socialization.

Come on now, I'm not even gonna pretend to touch grass

[red crest]

go old school yogscast and pay people to pretend to be npcs

[safe dragon]

I know gambling company behind gambling game genshin impact made a farming game maybe that's good!

[rain apex]

infinity nikki

[red crest]

isnt infinity nikki a dress up game

[safe dragon]

that's a different gambling company

[devout vault]

If I knew about it it still wouldn't work 😛

[devout vault]

Oh boy! Gambling!

[safe dragon]

I feel bad for everyone whose primary game device is a phone or tablet

it's all gambling games

[rain apex]

When it had the sdv collab it also released a mode where u decorate ur house n farm shit

[devout vault]

I guess the newest Rune Factory is unreal 3d

[red crest]

thats just house dress up

[devout vault]

But man do I hate unreal

Especially the little I've tried modding it

[rain apex]

Well i can't argue with that

[safe dragon]

I read that as horse dress up as I was tabbing out and thought you were talking about the umamusume gambling game instead

[red crest]

i dont remember if you can even dress those horses up

[devout vault]

Oh, and then there becomes a third problem: I don't want to mod a game with a story (which if a part I enjoy) before I play the story, because I want to discover the stuff naturally

[red crest]

i dont think so

i could be wrong

[safe dragon]

idk either

I know they're horses and also idols for some reason

[red crest]

do they need a reason

[safe dragon]

maybe they're just horsing around ur right

[red crest]

i would say they are not actually idols

they just sing

and dance

[safe dragon]

in traditional japanese idol uniforms

[rain apex]

There's like outfits you can change but it's not a full dress up game

[safe dragon]

on a stage

[red crest]

but you can do that without bein an idol if ur main job is to be a horse

[safe dragon]

with an audience in japanese idol fan attire

[red crest]

the concert is just a celebration after a big race

[rain apex]

That stuff is more like buying skins for ur favorite legoleg guy

[red crest]

are super bowl half time players idols

[safe dragon]

do they wear idol uniforms

[red crest]

musicians maybe but i wouldnt call it idol culture

[rain apex]

Do the super bowl players go up there and sing

[fleet wren]

i havent played it yet but it's funny how the post race concert is never explained, all these elite horse athletes are also talented singers and performers for whatever reason

[safe dragon]

"it was a phenomenal touchdown but he really missed that high note in the after-game performance"

[rain apex]

There's some very reaching irl lore there

[red crest]

i think you should be allowed to celebrate your win in a horse race with as big concert without being saddled with the burden of being an idol, just chomping at the b it to sing and dance bc ur happy and not reined in with contracts

[rain apex]

When horse win usually they get shown off on a stage afterwards

[safe dragon]

in idol uniforms?

where's the horse idol uniforms

[devout vault]

Basically, what I'm saying is I need a hivemind of clones (with tweaked things like "won't get distracted by everything that passes my screen in then some") I can direct to make my perfect video game

[red crest]

they dont wear idol uniforms also is the thing

they are wearing their usual uniforms

[devout vault]

Without it spoiling me as to the games contents

[devout vault]

that or I just get my act together, but like, let's be realistic here

[rain apex]

No they do have idol outfit

[red crest]

wow this is just like my favourite horse girl

[red crest]

but they dont always wear it

many of them perform just in their usual garb

[rain apex]

It's this getup specifically

[red crest]

you're gonna scare away crumble if you post actual pictures of umamusume

[rain apex]

Game lets u choose if u use it tho

[red crest]

just like irl where one can choose to dress up if they want to

without being an idol

[safe dragon]

that's gold ship I know my umamusume lore

[devout vault]

Also, I gotta say, these sorts of banners vs screenshots contrast is always super funny to me

[red crest]

everyone knows goldship [insert that one xkcd experts comic]

[rain apex]

I think the lines between idol and regular singer is pretty blurry

[devout vault]

Gold ship? All I see is an anime girl, no golden nautical nor astronomical ships

[safe dragon]

really I just know one person who's really into umamusume for some reason and then I suddenly get a post congratulating a real life horse on their bday

[rain apex]

Button has a purist interpretation

[red crest]

i definitely think the horses in umamusume do not exhibit idol culture

[rain apex]

But ppl also just consider idol a music genre with various anisong trappings

[safe dragon]

really?

[red crest]

thats just called music

[rain apex]

And that uma musume music is under the "idol genre"

[safe dragon]

to me it screams idol culture derivative

[red crest]

they dont have stans

[safe dragon]

stans is eminem

smh

[red crest]

if you dont have stans you cant be an idol

[rain apex]

There r definitely hors stans

[red crest]

no there are horse music fans

there is a difference

im talking in universe here

[rain apex]

And sometimes it overlaps with stans of the particular voice actor associated with the horse

[red crest]

no one in lore is botting twitter polls to make sure gold ship wins uma of the year award

[rain apex]

Although for gold ship specifically she is a vtuber

[fleet wren]

yeah like each and every story and plotline revolve around the trappings of being an athlete first and foremost, which makes the big budget concert/dance choreography striking
i'll choose to accept that being an uma just means you can do that™

[rain apex]

One of the earliest vtubers that existed even

[red crest]

gold ship is whatever she wants to be

[rain apex]

R vtubers new age idols? Unclear

[red crest]

being a horse girl gives you +1 to musical talent its true

i would also not consider vtubers idols typically

i think you do still need to be primarily music based to be an idol

if it was a singing vtuber then maybe yeah sure

side note but i love when you say "Unclear" like that like the headline of some scientific paper. Research is unclear on this as of yet, but new developments may arise in this sphere in the future.

[rain apex]

We are doing serious academia here trust

[devout vault]

Seriously, there are six results for this, which are:

• generic NSFW game that doesn't even have the two genre tags I specified
• shopkeeper focused (but alchemy)
• "this realism-focused farming sim lets you drive a tractor!"
• farming in your backyard? also EA and hasn't been in over three years
• desktop idle pet that doesn't have VR (and isn't out)
• yet another "immersive social VR experience set in an expanding multiverse" online game (which also isn't out)

[red crest]

i dont even play umamusume

[devout vault]

I get I'm asking for a niche in a niche (VR, and most VR games are just action focused and usually gun games), but still

[safe dragon]

idk I'm basing my statement on it being idol stuff more on that to me they are trying to appeal to the exact same people as idol anime do. Same music style, very similarly inspired uniforms

[red crest]

time to pick up godot again casey

[safe dragon]

what they are considered to be in lore was not really something I considered when saying that

[devout vault]

I mean it's in my "next time I work on a standalone game it'll probably be this" list

But that'll take ages.

And I don't have all the skills for it

[rain apex]

Casey how do u envision controls in this VR farming

[devout vault]

Hence why SDV modded into VR felt the better option

[safe dragon]

the person I know who's into umamusume is also the person I know who's into idol shows

[red crest]

the reason i dont fully agree with this is because the actual concerts and idol adjacent stuff is like a ridiculously small percentage of the lore

[rain apex]

Do you hoe by swimming hr arms

[red crest]

like selph said its all still athlete-focused stuff

[devout vault]

At least I only need to commission art for SDV, and not also figure out a narrative and game design and the world and the characters and and and

[rain apex]

do u think Pokemon contests are idol

[safe dragon]

I admit they also do things that isn't the idol adjacent stuff

[red crest]

like theres a huge difference between Umamusume and something like Love Live

[rain apex]

As in the thing Dawn from gen4 focused on

[devout vault]

You gotta bend over and break your back tilling the soil, of course. (/s)

[safe dragon]

nah there's nothing idol-y about the pokemon contests

[red crest]

the difference for me is that it isnt "they also do non-idol things" but rather "they also do idol things"

the music stuff is the side content to the side content

[devout vault]

(That would technically be an option, but I want options ranging from "full immersion 1000% exertion" to "sitting in a chair just pointing with controllers and clicking")

[red crest]

also the horses have silly phones

[safe dragon]

I guess we agree but just see it differently

[devout vault]

I haven't paid attention to the rest of this conversation but brb buying the game

[red crest]

lucky for you, the game is free

[devout vault]

Oh

[red crest]

its a gacha

[rain apex]

Don't.

[devout vault]

OH

[safe dragon]

free with 17 asterisks

[devout vault]

brb pretending it doesn't exist

[red crest]

also i dont think you see the phones in the game

[rain apex]

The horse game is not good but the anime is nice

[rain apex]

Cinderella grey is currently on

[red crest]

big phone

[rain apex]

I'm enjoying it

[safe dragon]

the most praise I give to umamusume is that it gives cygames funding and I really liked apocalypse hotel

[red crest]

cygames has like 3498657 gachas

[devout vault]

"no games catering to casey's specific tastes" aside, it does make me sad that almost every VR game is either "action focused game where you kill things" or "sandbox social space focused on socializing in multiplayer", with very little in between

[safe dragon]

in beat saber u kill arrow blocks

[devout vault]

exactly

[red crest]

not me. im neutral good, so i nonlethally bisect theblocks instead

[rain apex]

I do enjoy the biannual weird ass anime project from cygames

Akiba maid wars was really good too

[safe dragon]

ah you don't kill in the same sense spiderman doesn't

[devout vault]

All the games are action focused, while I want a more chill game with action stuff on the side

[rain apex]

And zombieland saga, the actual idol anime ip from cygames

[safe dragon]

I did watch a few episodes of zombieland saga

[devout vault]

<flashbacks to BDG video about spiderman definitely not murdering people>

[red crest]

chu they literally own an Idolmaster game

[safe dragon]

but then I was horribly disappointed to see it turn into an actual idol show and quit

[devout vault]

Same here, even on the "a few episodes" part

[red crest]

several idolmaster games

[rain apex]

Yeah but isn't im@s bandai namco

[devout vault]

The ending I heard for the last season so far (or was it just S1) was so bizarre it made me quadruple check to make sure I wasn't being gaslit

[red crest]

well yeah but its not like they have full ownership over Zombieland Saga either

[safe dragon]

I forgot they made a second season of it

[rain apex]

How much does the saga prefecture own

[red crest]

the only thing i know about zombieland saga that almost got me to watch it but i never did is that theres a trans girl zombie or something?

[rain apex]

Yeah lily

[devout vault]

The ending in question being ||literal outer space aliens attacked||

[safe dragon]

I have no idea

this is all I remember

[red crest]

i mean its a show about zombie idols i feel like thats not that out there

[devout vault]

See I never even heard that part

[rain apex]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ukpolitics/comments/bjulnd/joanna_cherry_mp_shares_a_printout_of_a_meme_of/

[red crest]

i do remember this

[rain apex]

She's the girl in this print out meme

[safe dragon]

I feel like there's untapped humor potential in printed out memes

[red crest]

ive seen some taped to telephone poles

or street lamps

[safe dragon]

just go to your friend like "yo have you seen this meme going around" and you grab an A4 piece of paper from your bag

[red crest]

i think itd be funnier if you printed it on a different, more fucked up size

[safe dragon]

A3 paper

[red crest]

like A3

yeah

[devout vault]

I read the title and interpreted it as one of the politicians holding that up at another politician over what they were saying.

But no, it's because they were the target of it. 😔

[devout vault]

how about a binder of cards, like MTG sized

"hey look at my meme collection"

[red crest]

also acceptable

[rain apex]

That requires a significantly more fun world

[red crest]

as long as they dont actually look like trading cards

but literally just printed out memes

[safe dragon]

"oh yes I have a meme collection let me grab my binder"

[devout vault]

unfortunately yes, it was my mistake for hoping it was even the case to begin with

[rain apex]

I should carry uno cards irl

So i can NoU ppl

[red crest]

you should print a custom uno deck that says One on it instead if you really wanna confuse someone

[devout vault]

Would your weapon of choice be "skip" or "reverse"

[devout vault]

and all the numbers are like roman numerals or something (since spanish doesn't have its own numerals)

[safe dragon]

as someone who has never played uno it'd be funny to just carry around uno cards just for the no u

(I have played games played with a regular deck of cards that are essentially uno, except someone just makes shit up halfway through cause of some house rules)

[dusty pollen]

wow discord took away the ability to reply to pfps. literally unusable

[lethal walrus]

oh no :(

[safe dragon]

sue them

[prisma flume]

i can't believe you're mocking zero-indexed houses in #progo

[steel kraken]

Ground being the 0th floor just makes everything work so much better

Ground, first floor, second floor, third floor, basement 1, basement 2 etc

[marble jewel]

Sorry, I code in VBScript, the first floor is 1

[west flax]

maybe im old but i thought the uno reverse meme had been dead for awhile lmao

[uncut seal]

My friend has a sticker printer, and she literally did that at the last party I was at.

[dusty pollen]

-# what is crosscode

[hushed raven]

-# a game written in javascript that doesn't run in a browser apparently, I didn't even know that was possible

[dusty pollen]

aren't you currently using discord, an app written in javascript that doesn't run in a browser?

[hushed raven]

but it's not a game, which is the shocking part, I didn't know js was fast enough for a game

[dusty pollen]

I've written js games before in my internship

probably uses either phaser.js or that other one, uh, d3?

[hushed raven]

Impact JS apparently

-# also I get that games can be made with js, just not that fast paced ones could, that's what was shocking to me XD

[prisma flume]

discord runs on chromium, making it a very limited browser

[red crest]

also you very much can just, go to discord.com and use it in your browser

also if you really wanted you could serve CrossCodes files to an http server and open it in your browser

probably not the recommended experience

[west flax]

minecraft was written in java bud

[red crest]

Java is not at all the same thing as JavaScript

[hushed raven]

so it's like the browser version of Doom, it can run on anything*
-# *if it can run a browser

I would be amazed if javascript was able to run on the JVM without any kind of compat layer

[prisma flume]

well with the current doom rerelease being the officially supported version, doom officially cannot run on any Windows machines below Windows 8.1

the optional dosbox install does not exist for the purposes of this complaint

[hushed raven]

"current doom rerelease" implies there have been more than 1 rerelease, why has doom been officially rereleased so many times? I am assuming you don't mean the sequels

[dusty pollen]

bud

[prisma flume]

because it's doom there's ps3/4 games out there getting remastered these days

[hushed raven]

oh no this is when I realise the ps4 is a lot older than I thought isn't it

[prisma flume]

it's been out for over 30 years and pretty much the entire lifetime of windows

[hushed raven]

oh good lord the ps4 is 15 years old

[prisma flume]

i hate to break it to you but gta 5 isn't even last-gen

[hushed raven]

it was on the ps3 which is terrifying, it's so so old!

[dusty pollen]

people do this regularly with stardew for some reason but surely whatever they’re running on has to be similar ish to a browser?

[prisma flume]

age of empires 2 and age of mythology have been rereleased twice each already

[hushed raven]

I have never heard of them so they don't count, bc the world revolves around me 🌍 XD

[west flax]

how age of empires still lives makes me laugh , that was windows xp days

[prisma flume]

never heard of them.....

[red crest]

it uses chromium under the hood but it's not just like an html file you can open up and you're good to go, is what I mean

not out of the box anyway

[hushed raven]

oo AoE definitive edition is on sale rn, £3.74 ace

[dusty pollen]

oooo found a reddit thread of games with multiple rereleases

[hushed raven]

Ohh do share, I'm expecting some shockers

[dusty pollen]

pacman is obvious now that they said it

[red crest]

"name 5 rereleases"
"Skyrim"
"That's on me, I set the bar too low"

[prisma flume]

aoe 1 is a little funky and mostly catered to southeast asian players, who have been a surprising holdout for some marketing reasons. never played it

[dusty pollen]

castlevania 1 apparently?

super mario bros

[prisma flume]

well pacman has a truly cosmic number of knockoffs, ive no idea how they justify rereleasing it or even marketing the character these days

[dusty pollen]

a game called star fox you guys are gonna bully me for not knowing

[west flax]

castlevania stays alive cuz vampire lovers alone , plus the netflix anime a couple years ago

[prisma flume]

i suppose flash is dead, killing most of them

[hushed raven]

I wouldn't count super mario bros as a re release honestly, they're either different games, or emulators

[prisma flume]

have you literally not heard of star fox

[hushed raven]

you don't know starfox?

[prisma flume]

even in passing

[hushed raven]

even I know it!

[dusty pollen]

I feel like I’ve heard the name? but that’s it

[west flax]

not knowing starfox means you where born in the 2000s plus

[dusty pollen]

pokemon r/b/y apparently

[heavy dagger]

https://reddit.com/r/b/y

[prisma flume]

simply astonishing

[red crest]

iro must have heard of it at least or else why would you already assume you'd be bullied

[dusty pollen]

thank you uberbot

[dusty pollen]

I assume you guys will bully me over not knowing any and all allegedly popular games

and it was on the same list as castlevania 1, super mario bros and pacman

[red crest]

but how would you know it's allegedly popular without having an inkling of knowledge

[west flax]

i refuse to know sims games

[prisma flume]

i suppose starfox only had a single game really, but I figured people knew it from smash bros either way, like fire emblem

[west flax]

lmao

[hushed raven]

I'd get it if it was just a standalone series, but the characters are in ever smash game (I'm pretty sure) and have had a few cross overs elsewhere

[dusty pollen]

because it’s had multiple remasters!

[red crest]

so has pacman but no one even knows what that one is

[dusty pollen]

knew it from smash bros?

[dusty pollen]

I’m so confused, is pacman not well known now

[red crest]

Tetris has had a ton of rereleases

[dusty pollen]

true

[red crest]

why hasn't anyone rereleased Pong in a while

[prisma flume]

so fox, right. you'll never guess what game he's from

[west flax]

my 3 year old had me install a pacman game on his tablet recently

just cuz youtube kids taught him bout it

[red crest]

hidden indie gem

[hushed raven]

These are the starfox characters in smash bros, pretty sure the falcon dude was a majorly played character is eithe brawl or melee?

[dusty pollen]

-# I never played any of the smash bros

[hushed raven]

wow you had no childhood /lh

[red crest]

brawl is the best one anyway don't bother with the rest

fighting game players do not interact I don't care about the fighting game scene

[hushed raven]

Oooo hot take! (but I agree)

[dusty pollen]

ooo this new list has even more games I’ve never heard of

[west flax]

never got into smash bros either had friends that where evil trying to learn against

[dusty pollen]

Dragon’s Lair(?) apparently exists on over 30 platforms and is second only to Doom

[prisma flume]

brawl has the most star foxes in it thoufh

[hushed raven]

-# thoufh

[red crest]

it's up there for sure

[west flax]

idk dragons lair , was a dnd like game i think

[dusty pollen]

Final Fantasy 1 has 12 platforms apparently?

[hushed raven]

Dragons layer looks like it has been rereleased many times, looks like something I would've played on win XP years ago

[west flax]

ayeeeee final fantasy is the shit lololol

[dusty pollen]

next you guys are gonna say you’ve all heard of actual real game bubble bobble

[west flax]

nah

[red crest]

im familiar with bubble bobble yeah

[west flax]

never heard of that what about Q-bert

sonic and megaman gotta be on the list tho

[hushed raven]

I have heard of it, entirely because it was on some kinda of emulation site, like the ones with retro games a plenty, never played it though

[red crest]

bubbles bobble but they don't fall down, everyone knows this

they teach it to you

[west flax]

lmao

im going to have a itch in my brain till i remember the toy reference

mighty beans ?

or somethin like that

[red crest]

bubbles

[west flax]

That famous slogan belongs to Weebles. These were egg-shaped roly‑poly toys introduced in 1971 by Playskool (a Milton Bradley subsidiary, later acquired by Hasbro). Their design featured a weighted bottom so they would wobble when pushed but always return upright — hence the catchy line, “Weebles wobble, but they don’t fall down.” this was the toy that used the same catch phrase

[hushed raven]

Steam I think 3k hours counts as played... gimmie the damn checkmark!

[dusty pollen]

have you played post nomination and post existence of the checklist though

[hushed raven]

I am literally playing it rn, so I would hope so XD

[west flax]

games that good ? looks as old as command an conquer red alert

[hushed raven]

it's a factory automation game, it is not good, it is best, theres only 1 game I have a higher play time in, and thats minecraft entirely because modding

[dusty pollen]

you know a game’s good when it’s a programming language disguised as a game

[west flax]

definitely special interest level of time played lol

[dusty pollen]

stardew valley official discord logo squinting in the background:

[hushed raven]

I like circuitry and the factories you make look like damn complex circuits XD

I'm sorry sdv but it has NOTHING on factorio XD

[dusty pollen]

I feel like you’d like jahoomla’s logic box, it’s free in browser

pretty short but fun

[west flax]

i always went hard into the tech mods with minecraft have fond memories of speed running building nuclear reactors with my best friend and making each others meltdown and destroy half the base

[prisma flume]

i do in fact know bubble bobble, but only from the music as used in vintage 2008 youtube videos about a weird orange guy

[hushed raven]

Ooo I do like it! thank you, going to complete it real quick

[hushed raven]

was the weird orange guy a human or a fruit? bc rn I have 3 people in mind

[west flax]

i do wish digimon world would get remakes , i wanna beat dw4 the others are like tamogachis

[prisma flume]

a fruit but like a fruit with arms and legs and from outer space and he's from a japanese commercial and also a screensaver

also this is still programming ontopic because some linux eggheads were talking about pacman the other day

[hushed raven]

that is not the fruit I had in mind...well now I know if 2 weird orange guys that are fruit XD

[prisma flume]

oh my god is this why weeblsstuff has an egg named weebl

this is like learning dendi is the name of a funky eastern european games console

[dusty pollen]

is it unrelated to their name being weeblsstuff?

[prisma flume]

i mean i'm pretty sure after reading this that the website weeblsstuff spawned from the weebles brand

and then the funny little wobbly egg guy

[steel kraken]

Should play little rocket lab

Baby factorio in a stardew form factor

[hushed raven]

oh this is so cute, it's going on my wishlist until it goes on offer, or if I have spare money after getting a new GPU

Oh it's only been out for like 2 months too, no wonder I haven't heard of it before

[steel kraken]

It had a demo out earlier in the year but yeah

Main critique would be that the belts you start with are the best they are going to be, and so the only reason to change an already efficient supply chain would be to make it more space efficient

[hushed raven]

tbf I use the same basic belts in factorio until I get to the point where I can make the best belts so that would basically be no different to me XD

[uncut seal]

can't wait for AoC to start, I got myself all setup with nvim and clangd

oh no, it has only 12 days...

[safe dragon]

yeah it's shorter this time

Hopefully it means less repetition

I did day 1 of 2024 in preparation

always very confusing with a new language

[hushed raven]

On the 12 days of christmas AoC gave me, 12 coding challenges, 11 stressful days, ... and an aneurysm of the fourth degree

[uncut seal]

I guess it's a good thing since I'll spend less time doing this instead of important™ stuff

[dusty pollen]

should I do AOC this time

never done it before

[hushed raven]

yes, 100%

I'm tempted to toss mine up onto a git repo so I can save it and see how it changes from now to next year

[dusty pollen]

what's with all of you picking obscure languages, anyway

I did some brainf*ck once for a CTF but that's it

[hushed raven]

depending on how much I want to punish myself I may do it in multiple so I can get to practice in my less used ones that I know

[safe dragon]

for me part of the point of AoC is an excuse to try languages I have absolutely no reason to use otherwise

such as haskell

did a full year in that

elixir twice, rust once

[hushed raven]

I noticed when updating my system that I have so so many haskell packages and I have no idea why, given it's installed I may try it

[safe dragon]

C# last year tho cause I'd just started at a new job and had enough on my mind

[dusty pollen]

ghc is massive, just fyi

[safe dragon]

this year it's time for Gleam

[dusty pollen]

idk why but it is

[steel kraken]

I've done typescript every year because its my comfort language

[dusty pollen]

I miss haskell ngl

my favourite language from uni

[safe dragon]

I've been waiting for a language to be AoC ready for like 3 years now but it's not so Gleam is the choice instead

[hushed raven]

eh I've still got 2.5 TB free on my main drive and coding drive combined, I should be fine

[safe dragon]

could probably install every haskell package that exists

[hushed raven]

and nearly another 3 TB combined on two other drives, so I have plenty of space

[dusty pollen]

not that massive just big for a compiler

it was like 2gb iirc? which is bigger than I'm used to at least

[hushed raven]

that is quite big for a compiler, still tiny in comparison to the space I have though XD

[safe dragon]

haskell is the only time so far where I did the < 1 second runtime challenge where that was actually a challenge

[dusty pollen]

yeah haskell is slow lmao

[hushed raven]

unless I decided to do it on my steamdeck in whichcase I need that 2gb just to update it

[dusty pollen]

kind of a clunky language

[safe dragon]

my rust year ended at 0.3 seconds or something and my C# year 0.09 seconds lmao

[hushed raven]

SPEED

[dusty pollen]

wonder what python would do

[safe dragon]

I'd cry

[hushed raven]

not as fast as C# that's for sure

[dusty pollen]

python could definitely do it in 3s max!

[safe dragon]

maybe I can do sub 1 second in python now that it's only 12 days

[hushed raven]

torture youself, do it in assembly

[safe dragon]

instead it's time for gleam

also a slow language but not python slow

[dusty pollen]

can you make logic gates using dominoes

[safe dragon]

probably

[hushed raven]

yes you can

[dusty pollen]

sub 1s that

[safe dragon]

how do I give it my input file tho

[dusty pollen]

the first line of dominoes, of course

[safe dragon]

I need to rent a very large field

[hushed raven]

you have to manually encode it into binary, then cry, then start from the beginning bc you knocked a single domino over

[safe dragon]

not ideal

[hushed raven]

really theres no such thing as knocking a single domino over

[hushed raven]

the grass will eat up a decent portion of the sub 1s run time for sure

[safe dragon]

how do I do recursion with dominos

[hushed raven]

possibly tristate dominos, really nstate depending on how close you pack them, like the fancy brick laying

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Qtao0woX0kM
It would be backwards recusion, but I'm sure that won't be an issue XD

[safe dragon]

satisfying

[hushed raven]

incredibly, lovely sound too, start is a bit slow though

ew not Wails auto adding my email to the author section, it's a github no reply email but still? wtf gross

[uncut seal]

ah yes, C, the most obscure of languages

[uncut seal]

did you find your own sub 1s solution for all days? cuz that's pretty impressive

[safe dragon]

Almost always yes

[uncut seal]

god damn

I gave up on more than one day over the years

and when I tried to go for previous years I got stuck on 2015 day 19

[safe dragon]

sometimes I go back to previous days when there's an easy day to try and improve the runtime

I haven't done every year tbh

don't think I've done 2015

not with the < 1 second challenge requirement at the very least

C# and Rust were both strongly helped by me knowing how to multithread them effectively or in C# case even go for SIMD optimized versions

shoutout to TensorPrimitives in C#

TensorPrimitives and SearchValues were great for pushing performance

btw I mean sub 1s total with all the runtimes added together

So around 40 ms per day

[uncut seal]

yeah I know

[safe dragon]

though usually theres a ton of days that are like... a few microseconds

so I gain headroom

[uncut seal]

there are a bunch of problems I still haven't figured how to solve in less than a year...

[safe dragon]

lmao

[uncut seal]

I feel like the 1s limit isn't a huge constraint once you understand what the solution of a problem is

I guess in some cases you'd have to find an alternate solution to use multithreading

but still

[safe dragon]

it's not that bad no

it's harder in languages like haskell/eilxir/gleam because they don't support mutation

and their "list" is a linked list so indexing into them is slow

there's always a few days where that's a massive problem

for performance

days that can be trivially solved quickly with mutation

technically haskell supports mutation but I honestly could just not figure out wtf I was supposed to do to actually do that and could not get it to even compile

[uncut seal]

oh yeah, that's a very interesting restriction, I'll mention this to the nerd group I know about limiting data structures, I bet they'll love it

[safe dragon]

in elixir I'd often end up using "tuples" because they have O(1) indexing but they had a lot of their own disadvantages

back when I used elixir I didn't even do the < 1 second challenge yet I just try to make things fast cause I enjoy it

since elixir and gleam run on the same VM I assume they will have basically identical performance characteristics

I guess with only 12 days... my goal is sub 480 milliseconds

0.5 seconds for a cleaner number

[safe dragon]

wtf is going on

launching steam is crashing discord

[rain apex]

Electrons repel

[safe dragon]

...?

it's my gtk2 theme crashing

I didn't even know a theme could crash

steam doesn't even use your theme and neither does discord

I didn't even know I had gtk2 installed

I see

gtk2 is being used by some dhcp daemon as a UI frontend

gtk2 has been evicted from my pc

steam works again

lmao

thanks steam but uh

recommended because you've played: the exact game in question

[devout vault]

can't wait for the skyrim live action movie that'll inevitably happen so people can buy skyrim yet again

[devout vault]

I know at least 4 off the top of my head
-# also iro starfox is literally about a fox in space that's all you need to know

[devout vault]

Why would they, when Cat already perfected it with the stardew mod on nexus

[devout vault]

yes
(also atlas it was fox that was the top tier character in melee not falco)

[hushed raven]

Damn, I was close at least, I always went with Kirby one of the various robots

[devout vault]

Kirby was very close to the bottom in melee

Stronger in brawl, but still not even the upper half I think

[west flax]

wut haskell ? you mentioned it an another lang id never heard about (im still very noobish)

also how much of a pain is c++ to learn compared to c#? the nerds i know irl always act like it was dreadful to learn is the learning curve as steep as the memes make it out to be ?

[devout vault]

Memes exaggerate everything

It's definitely more difficult than C# though

But having some programming knowledge already will help

(the extent of which depending on what kind of things you've done with C#, of course)

Though I did C++ before C# so I can't really say how hard to transition is

[crystal wren]

I technically even did D very briefly before C#... C#'s way more recent for me.

[devout vault]

I heard of D before C#, does that count?

[crystal wren]

I think it counts!

[safe dragon]

writing C++ that works isn't hard. Writing C++ that is still maintainable and not prone to issues at scale/in large projects is harder

though that's true for any langugae really

C++ just adds some extra complications you have to keep in mind while designing it

there are definitely a lot of languages that are more difficult to start out with, though usually with some kind of promise that in the long run for a large project they would be comparatively easier to maintain/expand/understand

I fear to mention rust but it's kinda the perfect example of that

[devout vault]

hisses

[safe dragon]

soz

I could've used haskell instead as my example

but that's not a competitor to C++

[safe dragon]

It's unlikely you will ever use that language for any legitimate purpose in your life

it's loved by a specific niche subsection of academic programmers tho, usually more math-y people

haskell does a bunch of cool things but it is at its core a research language where its users and its developers are seemingly more interested in exploring programming language theory than to build something that that is desirable to use in practice

I will still never understand how they took the guy behind haskell of all people when they needed someone to design a language for fortnite programming

taking a guy known for designing a language only understood by academics to design a language to be used by people who want to make fortnite game modes

[hushed raven]

I actually disagree quite a bit, I'm finding c++ pretty decent and quick, where as I have totally given up on c# because of the pain in the rear it has been, mostly due to the tooling that isn't available on Linux, or it is utterly appalling

[crystal wren]

Wow, interesting! What problems do you have with the tooling on Linux?

[safe dragon]

C# was the very first language I ever learnt and had no issues so I don't consider it particularly difficult

[limber jewel]

i'm new but i'm enjoying learning c++

although everyone has different preferences for programming languages

[rain apex]

Not related to atlas' problems but i did find the web stuff of smapi.io difficult to actually test

[crystal wren]

ASP... that I haven't really touched, so I can definitely believe that!

[rain apex]

I also can't build VS extensions but y'know why would i ever

[crystal wren]

That one sounds like a feature to me!

[rain apex]

Other minor jank includes how ppl's mono repos being annoying to build

[crystal wren]

One thing that stands out to me is any of PeacefulEnd's repos, because of the Powershell scripts built into the csproj files.

[rain apex]

That one is 50% cus ppl hardcoding their game paths and committing to git tho

[rain apex]

Yeah i just had to yeet those

[hushed raven]

Oof a lot, visual code doesn't work (obvs) and unfortunately it seems to be the only ide I can use that let's me attach a Debugger to most git cloned c# repos, OScode doesn't have the c# dev kit which is pretty important for learning as it comes with pretty decent autocomplete and code warnings, among other things, I've tried using a work around by exporting it from Vscode and adding it to os code as a vsix but it is licensed for Vscode and it checks for it, not found = not load, the variety of other versions on the os code market place are either completely broken, unmaintained, lacking many features, and or entirely incompatible with other extensions that add the other missing features, debugger also doesn't work, then there's rider, good lord after a recent update it is so broken and even downgrading doesn't fix it, for a start hovering over buttons to get the description of what they do doesn't work, it unfocuses and refocuses the windows quick enough to make it a genuinely worrying experience if someone with epilepsy uses it, debugger also will not attach for some reason, compiling breaks randomly, not changing anything and re running makes it work occasionally, I have literally no idea why as there is no error, it just silently crashes, either I retry a few times or use the cli dotnet build(which isn't bad I actually like the cli), on all of the above breakpoints also dont work. (Forgive any spelling o'r formatting I am on mobile )

[rain apex]

But also pathos and casey voth have weird casing problems

I think it's VS not caring about case

[crystal wren]

Yeah, I ran into the casing issues with SpaceCore's recent alpha build.

[devout vault]

I mean that's just skill issue (on the part of linux not you) /s

[rain apex]

I just manually fix those too

Overall problems exist but are surmountable

[hushed raven]

Bold of you to assume it's also not a skill issue on my part XD

[rain apex]

Except for asp net shenanigans i guess that's probably doom

[crystal wren]

Ahhh, okay, that makes sense! I was thinking you meant like... raw .NET tooling, and not VSCode and the like. I just don't enjoy VSCode even when it works nicely.

[devout vault]

There's some key parts of C++ which make it ten times worse, such as:

• manual memory management (though admittedly I learned pre-C++11, much less modern stuff)
• templated gobbledegook in long errors when you look at a angle bracket the wrong way

[crystal wren]

At least it can attach to SMAPI, unlike Rider, though.

[limber jewel]

i haven't played modded sdv in a while but just recently got into coding and i'm just now realizing the possibilities here 😍

[safe dragon]

oh how I wish C# just had a competent LSP implementation that doesn't break on any real project I've thrown at it

[rain apex]

C/C++ cross platform nonsense is significantly worse because you actually have to think about if you have posix or not

[devout vault]

I was unable to get a custom VS extension to actually do anything when I tried it, so I'm not surprised

[hushed raven]

Oh the raw .net tooling is okay, it's the actual ide experience and debugging surrounding it that's just terrible in my experience

[rain apex]

If i have to write C on windows I'll die

[crystal wren]

Yeah, Rider's the only one I can tolerate for C# on Linux.

[safe dragon]

C# is the one language I stick to windows even though it's far less terrible now than it was back 10 years ago when I started

Generally the rule is that programming is way nicer and more convenient on linux or macos but C# is a big exception...

[hushed raven]

I did like rider and it was going swimmingly until the weird seizure mode started and git cloned repos didn't work with debugger

[devout vault]

I just pretend anything not-crossplatform doesn't exist

(or just do silly insane things I don't have to worry about it for, like the wind waker modding tests)

[crystal wren]

Oh, weird seizure mode with Rider? Change the JRE for the IDE itself to some recent OpenJDK instead of the JetBrains JRE! I had that exact problem!

[hushed raven]

I only keep my windows drive entirely for c# if I need to touch it, even though windows is so so slow

[crystal wren]

Same kind of process for Rider: https://www.jetbrains.com/help/idea/switching-boot-jdk.html

[devout vault]

...not also for your VR that linux hates?

[safe dragon]

I use windows at work but even then I now use a terminal editor (helix) for anything except C# itself...

[hushed raven]

I shall check that out, I didn't know that could be done, Ty!

[crystal wren]

Though funnily enough, it hasn't been an issue for me on the JetBrains supplied JRE for months now.

[red crest]

i will not stop doing this

[hushed raven]

Oh VR is fine it's just my graphics card that can't handle it XD

[crystal wren]

But yeah, I had horrible window flickering, and that sorted it for me when it was an issue.

[safe dragon]

I tend to forget y'all use C# very differently from me

[red crest]

my repo is for me first and foremost sorry chu

[safe dragon]

I'm only really used to C# in big controlled corporate projects

[devout vault]

can't you just do a stardewvalley.targets file like the rest of us

[rain apex]

I just don't want other ppl to know about where i store my crimes locally

[red crest]

nope.

dont want to

[safe dragon]

damn

[devout vault]

But it enables crimes like changing you game folder by launching VS with a different environment variable

[red crest]

ive no need to do that

and if i ever need to do that, i can just do it on that one project by editing its csproj

[devout vault]

please ignore the comments on this part of my common.targets https://github.com/spacechase0/StardewValleyMods/blob/develop/common.targets#L36

[safe dragon]

that doesn't even sound like a crime that just sounds like the beginnings of a proper OTAP CI/CD setup

[devout vault]

Clearly you don't have enough mods you've made which definitely should not coexist with each other

[devout vault]

I don't know what an OTAP is so I'm gonna assume it's criminal

[safe dragon]

uh sorry it's DTAP in english

[red crest]

i just delete them from my mods folder when they conflict

[safe dragon]

development, testing, acceptance, production

[red crest]

theyll reappear next time i build them

[safe dragon]

the 4 stages of a feature's release

[red crest]

is it by design that theres one of the stages of grief in there?

[safe dragon]

yes

[devout vault]

that sounds much too corporate for my silly mod crimes

[fleet wren]

I unfortunately also began committing the "hardcode path" crime when I started building my mods for both 1.6.16 and .15 (it's so convenient though)

[safe dragon]

acceptance is the environment where actual clients have to come to terms with what you implemented

[devout vault]

but that's so much more work

is this how y'all feel when I refuse to use nullable

[red crest]

thats how i feel about a targets file, sounds like much too standardly recommended for my hobby coding

well thats different not using nullable is just incorrect /lh

[devout vault]

I mean I only did that because I have a bajillion mods

[crystal wren]

Saying that in the presence of someone whose mods are literally attested on GitHub now.

Granted it was fun to do...

[red crest]

i dont know what the number of mods makes a difference here

[devout vault]

Well

When you need to update the modbuildconfig version on like 50 mods

You usually don't want to do it one by one

[red crest]

ive never needed to do that

[devout vault]

I didn't say you did

[red crest]

but why did you need to do that

[devout vault]

Because I needed to update the modbuildconfig version on like 50 mods (multiple times)

[red crest]

i just leave my stuff outdated until the next time i need to open the project for somethin

[devout vault]

It was usually for a game update

I've been around since the stone age, remember?

also stuff like this is nice to not need to copy and paste between so many projects

[red crest]

<PackageReference Include="Pathoschild.Stardew.ModBuildConfig" Version="*"/>
ez

[devout vault]

I know I only have like 4-7 mods that are updated right now, but pre-1.6 that was not remotely the case

[crystal wren]

That one's going to have fun on Linux!

[red crest]

mixed path separators

[devout vault]

yeah I don't have an excuse for there

hardcoded path? Including my username?

[hushed raven]

oh i dislike that massivley XD

[crystal wren]

I mean to be fair, I have the exact same kind of thing in mine, just for the run configurations.

[devout vault]

I probably did that because:

1. I was frustrated and just wanted something working
2. it was supposed to be temporary and removed once modbuildconfig updated (since I told pathos about the issue and he fixed it)

One thing that would be really nice for msbuild to have by default is a local-only targets file

Added that for something recently with other developers and its so nice not having to be careful what I commit 😛

[steel kraken]

The modbuildconfig does have local-only target loading

[devout vault]

(or having to undo changes when I have changes to actually commit for the csproj)

[crystal wren]

Because of this shenanigans: https://github.com/Pathoschild/SMAPI/blob/604b2acf3ad2121d4c16fbb895883c5e5538db64/src/SMAPI.ModBuildConfig/build/smapi.targets#L39-L44

[devout vault]

I mean dotnet in general, not modbuildconfig

[dusty pollen]

I feel called out

[devout vault]

This was for something not a stardew mod at all

[crystal wren]

We're only allowed to run our mods in development on Windows. /j

[devout vault]

-# also in my defense the copy-pasta is so tempting some time

[red crest]

aren't you not even a math-y person, i thought you were a maths-y person

[dusty pollen]

I have a maths and cs degree

[red crest]

yeah, exactly. not mathy. mathsy

[devout vault]

@sand frost and @cinder karma are the resident MathPerson s

[hushed raven]

okay so changing to a variety of different java runtimes flavours did not solve the flashing, but it did solve the debugger issue! so theres still a benefit, ty!

[devout vault]

wut

Quick DH, go update your really old jetbrains ticket!

[crystal wren]

Wait wait wait... the debugger issue in this case being what, again?

[red crest]

yknow, the debugger issue

[steel kraken]

Was pretty self explanatory

[hushed raven]

not being able to be attached to the process, at all, button greyed out,

[red crest]

im what now

[crystal wren]

Greyed out... damn, sadly not the issue.

[hushed raven]

you should get that check out, it's not healthy being grey, unless you're a vampire, in which case, I'm so sorry you can't have garlic

[crystal wren]

Unless your name's Dorian.

Then it can arguably be healthy.

[hushed raven]

I'm intregued, you've had issues with it too? what were they?

[crystal wren]

https://youtrack.jetbrains.com/issue/RIDER-112901/Rider-fails-to-attach-debugger-to-an-instance-of-SMAPI-Stardew-Valley

[dusty pollen]

or earl

[crystal wren]

This issue's been around for FOREVER. Basically on Linux, I just can't attach Rider's debugger to SMAPI.

[devout vault]

I mean maybe its just their hair

[devout vault]

https://tenor.com/view/picard-tea-drinking-tea-star-trek-gif-8343771691621442157

[hushed raven]

Ohh okay ye different issue, I haven't tried attaching a debugger to smapi itself yet, only various C# programs like stardrop and some other misc stardew unrelated things

[crystal wren]

Lady Grey's superior, anyway. Sorry not sorry.

[dusty pollen]

lady jane grey?

[hushed raven]

my dad would disagree, he thinks it's too flowery which is odd given earl grey is also really flowery XD

[crystal wren]

That is funny, because the one major difference is the addition of normally lemon...

[rain apex]

judging u cus i have a whole <Choose><When ..></When><Otherwise></Otherwise></Choose> for this /lh

[devout vault]

redirects the channel to my tea-obssessed brother's DMs for a little while

[hushed raven]

personally I'm a fan of oolong more than earl grey, but both are damn good

[crystal wren]

Yeah, I'm criminally not a huge Earl Grey fan... if I DO have it, I prefer an Earl Grey made with a Darjeeling tea instead of "normal" black tea.

[devout vault]

(If you're using tea bags, you're a heathen. And if you're drinking lipton from the store or something like that, never even talk to him.)

[dusty pollen]

tea is only good in bedouin form

which involves about three buckets of sugar

[fleet wren]

hey I do use Choose, I just hardcode for 1.6.15

[hushed raven]

several people are typing I fear I may have angered the comittie XD

[fleet wren]

we can no longer be friends /s

[devout vault]

I mean I'd hazard a guess to say my brother has much better tea snob credentials than anyone here

[hushed raven]

jail

[fleet wren]

(I like my tea green and unsweetened)

[hushed raven]

is he british?

[crystal wren]

If I had to pick a favourite tea... Baihao yinzhen, I think I'd say.

[devout vault]

nope

[red crest]

the more i see people talk about the shit they do in their csproj or targets or whatever the fuck the more my mind goes to the "they have played us all for fools" meme

[hushed raven]

then he does not have better credentials

[devout vault]

He imports tea, if that gives you a small hint on the level he is on. (And not just a little bit occasionally)

[hushed raven]

unless hes chinese actually

[devout vault]

He is not

[dusty pollen]

enough sugar to make it not taste like tea is the necessary amount of sugar

[fleet wren]

brb removing /s from my previous post

[rain apex]

did u know u can metaprogram in gnu make ::::)

[devout vault]

Our veins have nothing but freedom running through them

[hushed raven]

I have tried so so many different teas because my dad has imported them, so many lovely teas in the world

[dusty pollen]

tea is gross and smelly :(

[hushed raven]

That is a new one to me, I shall have to try it

[red crest]

i dont like dealing with make stuff if i can help it

[devout vault]

I've seen people call cmake in their csprojs

[red crest]

dont like that

[devout vault]

Or other compile systems, like zig

[rain apex]

that's criminal

[devout vault]

There's also the weird things the C#-to-java thing I was updating was doing

[red crest]

i can hold my own when it comes to C++ but every time ive had to has been against my will

[rain apex]

i like poking at build systems but as soon as i have to cross 2 different build systems in 1 project i die

[crystal wren]

It's very expensive is the big downside... but it's the best white tea I've ever had, and white tea's already probably my favourite type of tea.

[steel kraken]

Some of the automation shit at my work uses make files for ansible and it makes me cry

[red crest]

isnt Ansible python??

[devout vault]

I have consulted the certified tea snob on your opinion. I will get back to you shortly

[hushed raven]

oof wow it is expensive, it shall have to wait to be a new years treat (or when I next see my dad)

[steel kraken]

I don't drink tea often but when I do it's earl grey

[prisma flume]

there may be many games with star fox in them, but there is only one star fox game

anyway jasmine tea is really the only one worth drinking

[hushed raven]

I'm also fond of english breakfast tea, very basic but decent as a builders tea, it's the only tea I'm able to drink with milk in

[red crest]

arent there several star fox games

[crystal wren]

Honestly, as far as... nothing special every day tea to drink in mass quantities go? Sainsbury's red label is shockingly good.

[steel kraken]

With or without the smash bros franchise

[prisma flume]

they're different

[red crest]

without

[fleet wren]

I like them jasmine pearls

I wanted to switch things up and bought some fruit teas recently. they're fruity alright, goes well with just a teaspoon of sugar
haven't tried cold brewing them (which is apparently the favored method for fruit teas) cuz I'm too impatient

[devout vault]

I'm not talking about "in them", like smash bros.

Like, I assume you mean the N64 one, but there's also star fox assault (the gamecube one my brothers played the pvp mode of sometimes), star fox <whatever the dinosaur planet one was called>, and whatever the one on DS was called. And I'm sure there's at least one or two more

[hushed raven]

I have never tried red label, I do find it kinda amusing that the ingredients are

INGREDIENTS:Black Tea (Tea).
Like I'd sure hope theres nothing else

[prisma flume]

i know, but that's like saying sonic funny hedgehog car racing is a sonic game, when i imagine a sonic game being running on a 2d platform into spikes

[devout vault]

Your opinion has also been logged with the certified tea snob

[red crest]

i would call that a sonic game

[crystal wren]

I look forward to my tea judgement.

[prisma flume]

i would call it a mario kart game

[red crest]

someone did a video on this exact concept but for mario games last year i think

[devout vault]

I mean, I get why you would say that about <dinosaur planet game>, but I'm pretty sure assault and the DS one were fairly close to the originals gameplay, just with some expansions since they weren't limited by the N64

[devout vault]

...also, do they even make 2d platformer sonic games anymore?????

[red crest]

for anyone with a quick 2 hours to spare
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Ddmjcy3lEs

[crystal wren]

Sonic Mania in 2016... and (hot take, maybe) it was the best Sonic game to date.

[prisma flume]

i have no idea. i have never played a sonic game, funny hedgehog racing or otherwise

[devout vault]

This thumbnail makes me think of a video I keep seeing pop up in my recommendations about how much it would cost to watch the entire pokemon anime series legally

[red crest]

apparently this is a sequel video. didnt realize that. dont think its required watching (i didnt watch it and it didnt feel required)

[rain apex]

do you think smash ultimate is a kirby game

[hushed raven]

the only sonic game I have played was sonic colours, that's it, i didn't enjoy it XD

[crystal wren]

And don't make me drag Jade in here and completely derail the subject to Sonic. /j

[red crest]

ive also been seeing this in my recommendations and pointedly ignoring it for now bc im inherently distrustful of the algorithm being so insistent upon a single video

it might be the perfect video for me. i dont care. i dont want it to have the satisfaction of being right about that.

[cyan shadow]

i missed the tea convo

I can't really contribute much, though

[devout vault]

sorry blueberry, I don't make the rules

[crystal wren]

You can submit tastes for the judgement of Casey's brother, though!

[cyan shadow]

my current favourite is an apple cinnamon rooibos from Dille & Kamille that tastes like a warm hug

[fleet wren]

quick, it's not too late to bring it back

[devout vault]

(still waiting on a response to what DH said, I think he missed it at first)

[dusty pollen]

tea gross, yuck

[cyan shadow]

my official submission is the apple cinnamon rooibos, then

it's just nice and cozy for this weather

[devout vault]

Yeah at this point I'm feeling kinda the same way, though I haven't been tempted to at least take a peek

[cyan shadow]

[fleet wren]

my flaming hot take is that "tea" should only be used for drinks made from tea leaves, and other drinks should be relegated to using "tisane"

[prisma flume]

you can't just smite the very heart of yum cha

[red crest]

i drink tisanes in final fantasy, does that count

[hushed raven]

Wholy agree, except infusion would also be valid for none tea leaf based teas

[prisma flume]

if it's in videogames you're legally required to call it virtual realitea

[devout vault]

Congratulations, you might be tolerated by the tea snob if you ever meet him

[crystal wren]

(I'll agree with this hot take. Tea is tea, and everything else is herb soup. )

[prisma flume]

what's coffee, precious

[crystal wren]

Bean water.

[hushed raven]

bean soup

[devout vault]

🤢

[red crest]

☕ this is beans

[devout vault]

I don't see the pokemon series video in my YT recommendations at the moment. It must be lurking. (I was gonna get the thumbnail)

[devout vault]

no these are beans

[devout vault]

(And I don't dare search for it lest it be given untold power)

[prisma flume]

grind them down. into the soup they go

[red crest]

tbh ive seen a bunch of different channels use that kind of thumbnail and im 99% sure its just to get someone to click bc they need to know why its still interesting

preying on my psychology 😔

[devout vault]

The most I'll do is hover over it to see if the autogenerated captions say why quickly enough for me to care

Not for that one, but sometimes other stuff

[cyan shadow]

sleepy time drink

[hushed raven]

those kind of thumbnails immediately make me not click on it, like theres no suspense, I know the answer now, I don't care for your working

[prisma flume]

yeah all these videogame analysis videos have pretty much the same title thumbnail combo these days

i blame witch zullie

i click on none of these derivative time wasters

[red crest]

these thumbnails are different from the ones that tell you the answer in the thumbnail

fwiw i did actually enjoy the one i linked its amusing to see people severely underestimating just how many things could possibly even be considered by anyone a mario game

[devout vault]

Not all of them.

I watched one yesterday about if Wind Waker's water is drinkable, where the thumbnail was just the guy looking at the icon for a bottle of it in front of an in-game island

[sand frost]

I’m pretty sure iro has as much claim as i do

[devout vault]

Have they ever had a MathPerson name?

[dusty pollen]

what if the part I don't qualify for is "person"

[crystal wren]

MathBeing?

[hushed raven]

MathEntity

[crystal wren]

*MathsBeing

[dusty pollen]

right now I'm just cold

[hushed raven]

ColdEntity

[devout vault]

FrozenMath?

[crystal wren]

ColdFusion?

[hushed raven]

Cold Brew

[crystal wren]

Now that's an old one!

[hushed raven]

full circle back to tea

[crystal wren]

(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_ColdFusion)

Wait what, it's still going?

[devout vault]

How dare you bring adobe into this channel

[dusty pollen]

forgot to mention when I noticed it earlier but you can search in discord threads now

[hushed raven]

Finally, that is a pretty basic feature that should've been added with threads

[safe dragon]

they didn't even let bots see threads when threads launched

[hushed raven]

that's just poor planning and implimentation wow

[crystal wren]

I mean they also implemented polls without having any ways to limit or allow them with roles, and not making them detectable via the API for a while.

Pretty standard fare for Discord!

[safe dragon]

at least they didn't implement the permission to remove/give roles such that they can then give themselves admin roles

I forgot what application I dealt with that had that problem

[red crest]

thread search has been in for a little while now

also iro stole my fuckin slitherlegs

[hushed raven]

get deslitherlegged scrub

[devout vault]

Ah yes, the standard "would I have permission to do this thing after it already happened" model.

[devout vault]

And you stole it from me

[red crest]

red is better than the slitherlegs colour anyway

so i was saving you

[hushed raven]

not only is red a better colour, you also have a shiny red! that's much better

[devout vault]

no

[red crest]

luckily itll be a long time before i have to quit this server to prevent getting local legend

[devout vault]

Red is like, near the bottom of the color tier list

Especially if we're only counting the rainbow and not weird cases like "brown" and "gray"

[red crest]

i like it better than a pink/orange combo colour

[hushed raven]

you're just wrong though

[devout vault]

I choose to believe this is in response to button about quitting the server, and not me

[devout vault]

the lesbians would like to have a word with you

[red crest]

i am lesbians

[hushed raven]

it still applies to this message too

[devout vault]

[red crest]

thats a better palette than the slitherlegs one

slitherlegs is like. a salmony orange next to blue. i dont prefer it

[devout vault]

Am I misunderstanding what you said about pink/orange combo

[red crest]

i didnt know how else to describe it bc the colours i see on iros name change depending on when the animation stops

[devout vault]

Hmm, fair

I just scrolled up and it was different than I remembered

[hushed raven]

Oh hey I just realised the slitherlegs colour is one of the rbg presets of my keyboard

[devout vault]

compared to ex. (first I see in the sidebar)

[red crest]

its better than local legend ill give it that

[hushed raven]

local legend is a cool combo, purple and swamp green (?) look great together

[devout vault]

Local legend is amazing. Why wouldn't you want to be wildberry poptart colored?

[red crest]

i hate it so much

[hushed raven]

Mmmm poptarts

[red crest]

if i ever reach local legend i am going to apply for the mod author role bc id rather have the orange purple gradient than the purple blue gradient

[devout vault]

We finally figured out how to make button a cheeto

(a sickly cheeto, but a cheeto nonetheless)

[red crest]

it took me almost 2 years to get desperado so itll be a while yet

if possible i would love the ConcernedApe role colours but uh i think that one will be a little more difficult to acquire than yours even

[devout vault]

We just have to keep nerdsniping you

Then again I don't have local legend and I've been here for ages

(admittedly with many inactive periods)

[red crest]

im kind of surprised at how few people do

there are people who im surprised are local legends and people who im surprised are not

like crumble and blueberry respectively

[devout vault]

I'm only at 1462/2000. Guess I have a way to go

[dusty pollen]

oh no I have to leave the server now

[red crest]

get out /lh

[dusty pollen]

I swore that the day I got yapper of the week I would leave in shame

[devout vault]

You could leave and immediately come back

If you want to abandon your illustrious join date of less than a year ago

[red crest]

are you even sure the role would disappear when doing that

since the leaderboard would still know

[devout vault]

(did you leave/rejoin in the past, because I could've sworn you've been around longer, even taking into account my name discombobulament)

[dusty pollen]

noooo double shame

[dusty pollen]

no, I have been in this server for under a year

[red crest]

iro joined just in time to shame themself map-wise for the holidays

[devout vault]

I don't think the roles are re-bestowed until you talk again? Could be wrong though

[red crest]

i dunno either, i dont wanna find out

[devout vault]

and your first message was in modded-farm-- I mean modded-stardew, gasp

[dusty pollen]

I’m hungry but I’m not hungry. dilemma

[devout vault]

also how do you shame yourself map-wise

[devout vault]

Ah, the munchies. Always a struggle

[red crest]

by checking a ton of things every draw frame

[dusty pollen]

no clue because I’ve clearly never done it don’t listen to her

[dusty pollen]

only if you opened the menu wrong!

[devout vault]

I mean even if you haven't, it appears button knows how one could

[devout vault]

Oh I thought you meant like in tiled or something

[red crest]

it turns out when the difference between a smooth map experience and 2 fps is whether or not you pressed "M" first, you get shamed a lil

[devout vault]

Is "wrong" using one of the games literal official methods instead of the other one?

[red crest]

its bc GameMenu doesnt trigger MenuChanged when changing tabs

[dusty pollen]

in my defense, why are the two ways of opening the map two different things in the code

[red crest]

but opening directly to the map does

[devout vault]

Which way was the 2fps mode

[red crest]

gamemenu way

[devout vault]

My judgement will depend on that

[red crest]

pressing Esc then navigating to the map

[dusty pollen]

using the mouse like a peasant

[red crest]

aka how controller people have to do it

[devout vault]

The casual user doesn't learn keybinds, are you crazy

Get judged

[lethal walrus]

Do you really need more than 2fps on the map though

It's mostly a static image

[red crest]

forgetting npc map locations smh

[devout vault]

You do when most games (including this one, I think) struggle to pick up input if it's shorter than a single frame

[dusty pollen]

I do not mod for the casual user I mod for me and then release a year later on a completely different game version

[devout vault]

(I say, as if I ever have the casual user in mind when I make things)

[lethal walrus]

Oh no I don't know where Robin is at a 200ms interval I'll never find her

[devout vault]

Ah. Well, that's basically what I do (besides different game version), so you get a pass this time

[lethal walrus]

So you should be releasing your first mod in a few days?

[red crest]

goalpost fallacy smh smh

[dusty pollen]

map event markers was written in 2023

[devout vault]

The VR mod players casually dying when opening the map the wrong way because the FPS dropped from 90 to 2 when even 72 is pretty borderline for comfort for a lot of people

[lethal walrus]

I refuse to believe mod authors exist until discord /j

[devout vault]

Everyone knows I joined and then made the MP mod and not the other way around (and much further apart). That would've been silly of me

[dusty pollen]

it was written purely for personal use with no goal of releasing to the public initially

[devout vault]

Totally didn't mainly join because Pathos told me the channel got a #multiplayer-mod channel

(I was on the SMAPI discord (RIP) before the SDV one)

[lethal walrus]

Oh casey I get to join you in doing code crimes

[devout vault]

What kind

[lethal walrus]

Someone is making very good progress on being able to properly mod brute games so I can write everyone's favourite c++ stardew mods