programmers-off-topic

[cinder karma]

Apparently the switch 2 sold 5.4 million units

(How atra finds out about video game news:

1. Friend plays video game
2. Video game company does something worth a lawsuit and the lawsuit is either terrible or funny
3. Stock market and economic research?)

[steel kraken]

It's impressive considering how few games are on the switch2, other than being a switch that's not 10 year old mobile hardware

[cinder karma]

Tbh I'm surprised anyone bought it

[steel kraken]

I bought it at the midnight launch because I like mariokart and knew was going to buy it eventually anyway so may as well buy early

its only useful for experiments currently, nothing vaguely serious can use it until firefox and safari support it

once it becomes part of baseline support, it would be such a nice QoL though

[supple ether]

The new mariokart does look very fun, and since I don't already own tears of the kingdom, it would be nice to get the upgraded version

But got damn those price tags

Console gaming is truly not for The Poors these days

[strange copper]

I wish I could play botw on pc man

[cyan shadow]

My laptop's Bluetooth settings no longer appear

I am so, so tired of Windows

But I have to keep the installation until my thesis is done

[cyan shadow]

It's as if it never existed

[dusty pollen]

this happened to me a few months ago after I updated the drivers. Even reinstalling windows didn't help, I think it killed the chip

[cyan shadow]

And just like that, it fixed itself

I restarted for the 10th time and the settings came back

I'm so tired though

I have an exam in five minutes

I needed my Bluetooth for earphones and more importantly, my mouse.

[dusty pollen]

good luck in your exam, quill

my swipe keyboard decided your name is will now

[cyan shadow]

Thank youuu! Tell your keyboard to check itself tho

[cinder karma]

I was actually thinking tbh "I wonder if my library has this type of thing."

It has a 3d printer

[safe dragon]

my library barely has a normal printer

[devout vault]

I thought I saw Nintendo say something about that was test data and not necessarily indicative of real sales. (Unless something new came out, this was days ago)

[devout vault]

I probably would’ve done it for the latter reason too if not for money stuff lately. Definitely going to once KAR2 comes out

New Mario kart does look interesting but not a system seller for me

[dusty pollen]

is 5.4m above, matching or below what they were expecting?

(ngl after all the negative press around it, when they were announcing record sales in the first three days all I could think was that we should wait for the official data because that’s awfully convenient and a rather biased source)

[crystal wren]

I have, sadly, sworn off the Switch 2. With consequences in play if I cave and buy one.

[devout vault]

Consequences?

[crystal wren]

A three-way actual agreement with a group of two other friends. If one caves, they have to buy one for the other two as well.

[dusty pollen]

I have a switch 1 I only bought last year that I basically never play anyway lmao, and idk if there will be any switch 2 exclusives anyway

[devout vault]

If KAR2 hadn't been teased in that direct it wouldn't even be on my radar until a new smash or zelda game came out. (And for zelda in particular, it'd need to not be another boring open world type and instead be like juyst about any pre-BotW one instead)

[devout vault]

Oh.

Consequences indeed

[crystal wren]

Granted a 3 person boycott of Nintendo's recent... not goodness won't be effective, but it feels good to do.

[devout vault]

I didn't make the connection it was a boycott

[crystal wren]

I mean it sort of is in essence. Not really technically.

[devout vault]

More of a way to get a free switch 2 out of the person who caves first 😛

[crystal wren]

I mean that's also a thing.

[devout vault]

Yeah I almost never touch mine, especially since I don't live with my siblings anymore

Dang it the audio on my PC is broken again (no matter the output device).

Even after restarting

...since when does firefox have sponsored results in the url bar

[pliant snow]

since a while now. There's a setting to turn it around

[devout vault]

It turns out the fancy keyboard my dad gave me gets its own say on the volume, completely separate from the OS volume level and the dial in the headphones????

Every keyboard I've had in the past only changed the OS setting

[dusty pollen]

does audio go through it or something?

I’ve seen keyboards that were also input hubs but if this isn’t one then I’m confused

[cinder karma]

I too am not buying a switch 2

[safe dragon]

a shocker

I won't buy a switch 2 till it has enough games on it to justify the purchase

[devout vault]

Nope. I am incredibly baffled.

And I just got a meme idea

[dusty pollen]

maybe it’s just one of those annoying brand driver apps that handle all of their products so it has a bunch of side effects ig, the logitech driver for my mouse adds an overlay to the screen any time you press num lock, caps lock or scroll lock because it also does keyboards, even though I don’t even have a logitech keyboard

[devout vault]

Perhaps, but their website shows no audio products whatsoever…

[cinder karma]

See, I think the switch 2 will never have enough games on to justify the purchase for me

In part because I think $70 is a wild price to pay

[thin estuary]

technically it plays most Switch 1 games too

[dusty pollen]

most? I thought there was supposed to be full compat

[thin estuary]

but console and console game prices are wild

[thin estuary]

i think there is a small % of broken games right now

[thin estuary]

i guess the console price is fine

but games? absolutely not

[cinder karma]

It's insane

I legitimately do not see how people can afford it

[fleet wren]

well it's selling gangbusters

well mario kart world I mean

voting with our wallet is a nice idea, except everyone else is voting the wrong way

[cinder karma]

To be fair, I've never purchased a Nintendo game before and I'm not about to start so this boycott is mildly ineffective

[ivory shadow]

I will say, the soundtrack for Mario Kart World is an absolute blast if you like Mario music. Not $80 worth of bangers though. And definitely not $500 and $80 worth or whatever it's at currently

[cinder karma]

Hate to say it

What's Mario kart world

[rain apex]

Do u know what a mario is atra

[fleet wren]

it's for if you have always wanted to fist fight your friends irl but never had a good enough excuse to do it

[cinder karma]

But to a banger soundtrack?

(I'm listening to it on YouTube.)

[safe dragon]

this is my first vacation photo editing on my laptop instead of the ipad

should've done this years ago

been so much better

no more dealing with iPadOS

[sand frost]

Out of curiosity, what do you edit in the photos?

I only ever really edit the angle (slightly off angle horizons) and maybe cropping

But I do it all on my phone

[safe dragon]

well I take RAW photos so i'm processing the raw into a jpeg. Vast majority of what I do is just tweaking the colors, highlights and shadows

for example turning this:

into this:

I don't really photoshop the photos, so it's really just color adjustments for the most part

went to an aquarium today so I had these pictures ready to show

Often enough the edits are pretty minor

[sand frost]

Ahh, I see—much fancier camera!

Mine does white balance and such automatically and mostly (not always) gets it right

[safe dragon]

white balance is not something I have to adjust very often either

today being an exception cause aquarium

aquariums are very blue as it turns out

[sand frost]

And I’m not very good at this kind of editing, I have tried it but tend to get some pretty extreme stuff that’s just obviously edited

It’s really hard to color-match to memory

[safe dragon]

tbh I don't think photos need to be completely accurate to how you saw it with your own eyes. Depends on your goal

if it's photos that are just for memory's sake then they should probably be as close to a fair representation of what it actually looked like

[sand frost]

Like this picture the clouds looked super notably pink IRL

But in a picture it’s just normal clouds

Maybe a tiny bit pink

[safe dragon]

yeah common issue

[sand frost]

Mostly I do take pictures just for memories

[safe dragon]

especially with phones that do a lot of "oh that's a sky I should make it bluer" kind of logic

[sand frost]

Sometimes just pictures because something looked pretty

[safe dragon]

really the "unedited" versions I'm showing here aren't really truly what the camera saw either

these would be the true(er) "this is what the camera sensor captured" images

ignoring that there's still a translation layer to a RAW format to a jpg which still goes through some interpretation

phones do a lot of work taking the sensor data and turning it into something visually pleasing and close enough to reality

handy tho

Despite having a "real" camera I do still use my phone if I just need a picture of something

phone pictures I pretty much never edit in any way

taking photos with the camera and editing them is more a hobby than a way to capture memories or anything like that

[dusty pollen]

minor but make a massive difference imo! and there’s skill in knowing when to leave things

[safe dragon]

I've overdone it many times

[dusty pollen]

the final version reminds me a lot of brighton pier

[safe dragon]

I used to throw away the raws cause they're large but I've started keeping them cause I've sometimes looked back and noticed some really poorly done one that I want to redo but without the RAW my options are a lot more limited

alas this one is in copenhagen not brighton

[dusty pollen]

I think it’s legally forbidden for there to be nice weather in brighton pier. Also not enough hyper aggressive seagulls

[safe dragon]

lmao

seagulls are messed up

[dusty pollen]

the brighton ones will beat you up for a single chip

[safe dragon]

I believe it

in madurodam (fun place in the netherlands look it up) there were some seagulls near the restaurant and they were brutal

some kid walked out with their plate of food and the seagull just swooped in and just took the entire thing

[dusty pollen]

if it weren’t for herons, I think seagulls might be top of my “biggest asshole birds” list

but herons do exist

[safe dragon]

uh there's a lot of herons where I live but they've always been chill

[dusty pollen]

yup, that’s the same in brighton

[dusty pollen]

do you own a fish pond?

[safe dragon]

I do not

herons love their fish

that's true

[dusty pollen]

that would be why. fuckers

(the herons)

[safe dragon]

I have some pictures of herons I think

[cinder karma]

Herons are cute

[dusty pollen]

send them, I will edit in the word asshole and a big red arrow

[cinder karma]

https://youtu.be/GKLMqISUIZA?si=WQ2iz7qd-kiMoR1B

YouTube recommendation for me. I'm blaming y'all

[dusty pollen]

I blame casey. this has casey vibes

[safe dragon]

herons

oh the left one also features me taking a picture of a heron

stupid mirror

[cinder karma]

Well YouTube has now stopped showing me pods ads and now wants me to get into futures trading or pilot school

[cinder karma]

Cuties

[rain apex]

beautiful

[cursive sigil]

Birbs

[cursive sigil]

Do let us know what you pick

[devout vault]

Am I cursed to suffer with audio

When I start a YT video it takes a couple seconds before the audio actually works

Not a specific spot. If I pause for a bit, then jump to a spot that wasworking before, it takes a couple seconds to start up again

[dusty pollen]

heron

[devout vault]

Unless it's just YT, but it seems like sndvol is doing it to a lesser extent too

Crunchyroll isn't doing it though...

[dusty pollen]

what if you pause for a bit and then play again without changing spot?

[rain apex]

heron :))))

[devout vault]

It needs to "warm up" again

[dusty pollen]

that's so strange

[rain apex]

Is ur audio card sleep mode

[dusty pollen]

does it matter what audio output device you use?

[devout vault]

Is that a thing?

[devout vault]

Hmm, unsure. This is the same computer I've used for a year and a half though

[rain apex]

Possible depending on the driver

[devout vault]

Though I did just move and have it shipped

[rain apex]

Like it turn itself off cus it believe ur computer is sleep

Incorrectly

[dusty pollen]

and this started after?

[devout vault]

...I did reinstall nvidia high def audio drivers earlier when debugging the other sound issues

[devout vault]

Yeah

[devout vault]

(However my headphones claim to use different drivers)

[dusty pollen]

why are nvidia doing audio drivers

[devout vault]

Good question, I have no clue

I just knew I had it so I updated my graphics card drivers since they're bundled with it

The windows sound device window (the old control panel era one) "Test" function works fine

[dusty pollen]

this is strange

[rain apex]

Did u try different browsers

[devout vault]

There are other browser? /s

[dusty pollen]

what are you using for audio output? wired speakers?

[devout vault]

USB headphones

[rain apex]

Specifically try a chromium and a not chromium

[devout vault]

But but but then I have to try to watch a YT video (for this test) with... ADS

[rain apex]

ads which have sound :))

[devout vault]

For all I know ads work fine though

Maybe YT is spiting me for blocking ads forever

[dusty pollen]

or pick an unmonetised video

[devout vault]

My monitors which claim to have spakers in windows do not in fact seem to have speakers, so can't test that

[dusty pollen]

iirc unmonetised still means no ads for now

[devout vault]

Only other output device I have is my microphone, for some reason

[cyan shadow]

(It does not)

[dusty pollen]

traditionally that would be considered input, I think

[devout vault]

Oh, and in the windows sound panel, it shows the headphones receiving sound even before I hear anything

[dusty pollen]

quilllllll

is this your break

[cyan shadow]

Don't bonk me for being here I had to take a break because the words are becoming soup

[dusty pollen]

what if the issue is actually your headphones and not the computer

[cyan shadow]

I'm crashing out and very not okay rn so I'm just trying to ground myself

[devout vault]

Was just about to say, guess I should try one of my other headphones

I don't know where my other wired ones are at the moment (woo moving), guess I'll try my bluetooth ones I used with my laptop

[dusty pollen]

on an unrelated note, after nexus' announcement a few days ago I looked up the ofcom regulation that led them to implementing it and ngl I'm a bit confused

because they posted the post saying that they're planning on implementing it on July 1st

but July was the deadline for already having implemented it...

[devout vault]

Welp. RIP my wired headphones

[dusty pollen]

nooooo

that's annoying

[devout vault]

I also dislike the bluetooth ones because they're the kind that sit on your ears rather than going around them

[dusty pollen]

have you tried them in a different port? idk why a busted port would cause this but who knows

[dusty pollen]

need a distraction?

[rain apex]

Rip i guess nexus banned forever/j

[dusty pollen]

more like fined into an early death

[cyan shadow]

Yee

Do I get duke pics for my suffering

[dusty pollen]

you can do, I have a sweet one from this morning

[devout vault]

I was surprised when I saw that post if it's the one I'm thinking of. It seems super poorly planned to announce changes like that that were gonna happen anyways right after the company being sold and them saying nothing would change.

I also have qualms with things like "depression" and "body stigma" being put alongside stuff like "extreme violence", but I assume that's related to the legal stuff?

For a brand new site it wouldn't really bother me since I would assume they were going the general content warning route like you see in some inclusive communities, but nexus's culture doesn't really seem like it 'll be like that. (And also, it explicitly says those are considered "adult content")

[cyan shadow]

YAYYY

[devout vault]

Alas, that doesn't fix it

[cyan shadow]

Some of their tags are a bit
Uh
Oddly categorised
I don't know what the regulation specifically says because I haven't had time or the spoons to look into it, tbh, but if mental health and body image have been lumped in with violence I will be writing an exasperated paper on it

[rain apex]

Why he look at me like this

What did i do wrong

[cyan shadow]

Baby

[dusty pollen]

I had a very brief look at it and while I focused more on the requirements and deadline, I think they did have a mix of that in

[cyan shadow]

Didn't give him SNACKS

[rain apex]

He didn't need them!

[dusty pollen]

didn't give him chocolate cake or candles to eat

apparently they seem equally delicious

[cyan shadow]

... Man, now I actually will have to write that paper, huh

[dusty pollen]

as a note, I was looking at the ofcom recommendations, not the act that inspired them

and I'm not entirely clear on how binding ofcom's requirements are

but iirc it is the regulatory body?

[dusty pollen]

does too!

[cyan shadow]

So, this is something no one agrees on

[devout vault]

(My dad does not have any extra of the around-the-ear kind of headphones 😔 )

[dusty pollen]

(it's actually because my dad is petting him in this photo in the censored section and he's giving me the "see? HE loves me" side eye)

[cyan shadow]

Ideally the regulator's requirements should be binding

Courts don't like executive intrusion into their domain, though

And legislators are puppets on a string with think tanks doing the actual writing 90% of the time

Big bally mess, in other words

[dusty pollen]

fun!

[devout vault]

(Which means I'll have to suffer with these bluetooth ones that sit on top of my ears 😔 )

[devout vault]

"ideally"? What's the point of a regulator if you don't have to follow their regulations?

[dusty pollen]

in this case the regulation immediately follows an actual legislative act though so I'm guessing it will be at least a bit binding, but who knows

[dusty pollen]

to get people off your back demanding regulation

[dusty pollen]

quill he wasn't allowed to eat a single candle. not one

he's still upset

[cyan shadow]

... WHY IS WORD ASSUMING I'M WRITING IN DUTCH WHAT

No fucking wonder it hasn't been marking my typos

[cyan shadow]

Not even one!

[rain apex]

he can have -2 candles

[dusty pollen]

they were already used! we weren't even going to do anything with them! it's so mean!

[cursive sigil]

Someone call PETA

[red crest]

RE: the tags for depression and whatnot, if taking their wording in good faith i think it was just worded badly and (incorrectly, imo) not changing their own name for their filters from "adult content" to something more general, bc they just said that implementing these regulatory requirements just presents them with a good opportunity to work on the tagging system in general but not that they are required by law to regulate depression and body stigma and etc. those things arent being regulated, they are just now going to offer more specific filters for what mods you dont want to see

[cyan shadow]

(My main thing is that the law better be classifying these things correctly)

[dusty pollen]

I vaguely remember there being something about those things in the regulation I read but we all know how reliable my memory is

[cinder karma]

Is it a good time to take a walk around the block?

[dusty pollen]

(0%)

[devout vault]

(At some point, the timer moved again.)

[cursive sigil]

It's passed midnight

[cyan shadow]

I'm gonna read it in the morning to keep myself awake while waiting for the postie - no it is 1 am I'm not going out without bestie at this hour

I live in a busy area, but a busy area with many bars

People are wilding out here

[dusty pollen]

one last one

[red crest]

(obligatory "im not a lawyer, this is just how i took the post" ofc also)

[cyan shadow]

I can hear one of them blasting Vengaboys somewhere and I am deeply afraid this country is having a Happy Hardcore revival

[devout vault]

If we're posting pet pictures I should post the ones I showed atra a day or two ago

[cyan shadow]

[devout vault]

(Not my pet, my parents)

[cinder karma]

....my 5% cash back on my card is gasoline and public transport this month

[cursive sigil]

Baby

[cinder karma]

Anyways

[cinder karma]

Criminal?

[cinder karma]

Cutie

[cyan shadow]

Omg kitty

[devout vault]

Bengal named Mozart

[dusty pollen]

he's developed a new Thing where he starts crying towards the end of our dinner because we're taking too long opening the dishwasher so he can lick the plates

[cursive sigil]

He did not look happy with the transplant

[dusty pollen]

unabashed!

[cyan shadow]

I have no pets but have some ducks

[devout vault]

He was cleaning himself in that photo. He was still there when I woke up in the middle of the night

[dusty pollen]

regularly commits fraud

[devout vault]

I only moved him after he woke up a little (because he moved to not-exposed-belly mode)

[cursive sigil]

Wow. Cruel.

[dusty pollen]

did you just give up on your pillow Casey

[cyan shadow]

Note, I am well-educated in happy hardcore lore, including having been forced to watch New Kids Turbo at some point, but uh
I don't like Vengaboys very much.

[devout vault]

(If you're wondering why a pillow was in the middle of the bed to begin with, it was because hard floors do not mix well with knees, so I had stoeln it earlier)

[devout vault]

The pillow with a pillow case was still there 😛

[dusty pollen]

Scarlett we had to buy a new dishwasher recently because he broke the old one by standing on the door

[devout vault]

And also that white pillow wasn't as firm as I liked

[dusty pollen]

I will be very honest and say I have no clue what literally any of that means

[cursive sigil]

That's just natural deterioration over time

[cyan shadow]

Very very happy, hardcore dance music

[dusty pollen]

yeah, like that brown recliner whose holes are also totally natural deterioration...

[cyan shadow]

For some reason Vengaboys made it across the pond with some specific songs of theirs becoming staples at Mangalorean weddings

[cursive sigil]

Of course.

[cyan shadow]

But in general it's just a silly genre to me

[dusty pollen]

what do you guys consider "the pond"?

when brits say it it's the ocean between the UK and US

[cyan shadow]

In my case, the pond would be the Arabian and Mediterranean seas combined

Depends on which coast you're expecting to land on

[cursive sigil]

I've also only heard the atlantic referred to as the pond

[cyan shadow]

Between Chennai and idk
Hong Kong
The pond would be the Bay of Bengal

[dusty pollen]

I've never heard it used for anything other than that ocean so you surprised me

[cyan shadow]

My brain has rotted, okay

My brain is swimming in cyber resilience and dora and nis and bleh

[dusty pollen]

quick say more britishisms

[cyan shadow]

(Not our dora, I mean the financial institution cybersecurity regulation)

[cyan shadow]

Bit bosh, innit

[dusty pollen]

not the explorer?

[cyan shadow]

Not even

[devout vault]

The more things you say the more confused I get.

This time, mainly because Mangalorean seems like a typo for Mandalorian

[dusty pollen]

booooo, 3.21/10

[cyan shadow]

Mangalore is my dad's hometown, Mangalorean is what the people from there are called

[devout vault]

...I saw there was a live action version being advertised on my parents TV when they were browsing for something to watch.

I was horrified

[cyan shadow]

(Mangaluru if we want to use the official name, which I do not)

[cyan shadow]

Aw come on

[dusty pollen]

London is my current home town, and people from here are called tw--

[devout vault]

I wonder if it's as bad as I heard the lilo and stitch live action was

[cursive sigil]

Live actions are not real, they can't hurt me

[dusty pollen]

did you see the Kim Possible live action

[devout vault]

I mean, live action lion king was basically all CGI, which makes this especially true

[dusty pollen]

clips from that one annoyed me so much

[devout vault]

Stop hurting me

[cyan shadow]

Bangaloreans tend to be called "upstarts" by the rest of the state

[dusty pollen]

I don't get that one! it's literally still animated

[cyan shadow]

(Yes, swap out the M for a B and you get my hometown)

[cyan shadow]

The lilo and stitch one looked kinda cute honestly

[devout vault]

Oh, I meant the story

And characters (besides appearance)

Basically everything except looks

[dusty pollen]

they took away the green alien's iconic drag

[cyan shadow]

NO WAY

[cursive sigil]

WHAT??

[dusty pollen]

his disguise is male now

[cyan shadow]

IN THE YEAR OF OUR FRUIT

HOW DARE

[dusty pollen]

the director even had concept art for the drag and everything but they didn't let him

[devout vault]

Then there's the whole plotline between lilo and <sister name I can't remember> being.... a choice

[dusty pollen]

yeah... where nani apparently gives her up to foster care in the end?

[devout vault]

(again, from what I've heard, but it's not exactly a rare thing I've heard about)

[devout vault]

Yeah, so she can go to university in the mainland US.... for marine biology.....

[cursive sigil]

I'm going back to they're not real

[cursive sigil]

Is that a jojo reference

[dusty pollen]

it would be a valid choice for a character to make in a new story! but a strange change to make to this existing one

[cyan shadow]

... Is this song in... French and Dutch.
Brb I need to squint at spotify

IT IS

IN THE SAME SENTENCES, EVEN

[devout vault]

Yeah, exactly.

This like the DC universe where superman turns evil and stuff, but for lilo and stitch

[rain apex]

what a sentence to come back to chat to what

is this movie out?

[cyan shadow]

Hi chu

Yes, with immense amounts of merch

[devout vault]

I was gonna be disappointed if nobody quoted or at least commented on it 😛

[rain apex]

i appreciated the brand new sentence thanks

[devout vault]

...I just had a silly idea (unrelated).

Story where all the villains have the stereotypical twirly mustache, with the mustaches getting more elaborate the more evil they are.

An ally of yours betrays the MC later and has been evil the whole time, and during the reveal they take off one of those "spy masks" that makes you look like you have another face, and suddenly they have the most elaborate mustache seen so far (they've been hiding it underneath the mask)

[dusty pollen]

like this is so sad

[rain apex]

banned for on topic bye

[dusty pollen]

(and yes, their disguises are just regular humans now)

[rain apex]

🚮

[devout vault]

Man, making them keep their unorthodox eye amount in disguise should've been the bare minimum

[dusty pollen]

the disguises being terrible is hilarious why would they get rid of it

[devout vault]

From everything I've heard, that movie is like the epitome of live action revival cash grabs

[dusty pollen]

that's what I've heard too

[rain apex]

well every new live action didney is that but somehow they do it "better" each time

[devout vault]

Yeah, but somehow this one seems to go beyond the others. It's not just lacking charm from the original, it actively undermines the original's storylines / messages

(Not that I've seen.... any of them, honestly)

[dusty pollen]

but also it just looks awful visually

[rain apex]

wow pls spoiler

[devout vault]

...I'm not going to say what that makes me think of because server rules

[dusty pollen]

(a fair few did. The Mulan one gave her special fighting magic and made her the chosen one.)

[rain apex]

i actually never thought the purple alien had hair...

[devout vault]

Also the eyes creep out, especially the visible small one

[dusty pollen]

literally nobody did

[rain apex]

thought they were like a tapir

[devout vault]

Ah. Exciting

[rain apex]

https://tenor.com/view/tapir-skritches-scratch-animal-petting-gif-7107269845576047432

[cinder karma]

Things I am doing today

1. Deleting the account for the todo list i used in my first attempt at college

[rain apex]

like rly short fur

[cinder karma]

Look, if I haven't made that groceries run in five years do you think I will

[dusty pollen]

I thought it was some kind of skin, not fur at all

[cinder karma]

Oh god there is marathon training plans in here?

Anyways

I kinda feel bad. It's a good app. It's just not for me

Why are there five random British pounds in my paypal

transfers all this to savings

[fleet wren]

shave him pls

[devout vault]

And give him some eyepatches. (I stand by what I said earlier)

[supple ether]

Please tag nsfw when posting /jk

[devout vault]

...oh right, it's fireworks night

[dusty pollen]

it's obviously me /j

[sonic mirage]

Are you going hide under the couch like my cats?

[devout vault]

I don't think even the cat would fit under the only couch in the house

One of the beds, however...

[sonic mirage]

Well they keep coming out, running around all low to the ground, then running back under

[cinder karma]

Cat tax

[cyan shadow]

Cat tax!!!

[cinder karma]

sings an off key happy birthday to the country

[cyan shadow]

I SURVIVED
GOODNIGHT

[dusty pollen]

isn't it fantastic how after all the innovations and new inventions in file transfer, my most convenient option to transfer stuff from my windows pc to my linux laptop remains ssh

(especially since my laptops both have a set local host name so I don't even have to get their local IP address)

[rain apex]

scp?

[wet tendon]

i tend to use http 😆 not particularly secure though

[safe dragon]

I want to try tailscale drop at some point since I already use tailscale anyway

it's in alpha rn tho I think

I don't really need it since I already have folders being synced through syncthing and I can just drop a file in there temporarily if I need it elsewhere

[wet tendon]

let foo = x.0.1.0;

let  foo   =     x     .     0.1   .     0   ;
^    ^     ^     ^     ^     ^     ^     ^   ^
keyw ident punct ident punct float punct int punct

yes i would like to access the tuple's 0.1th item please. yes thankyou.

i wish x.1e-1.0 was equivalent to x.0.1.0 lmao

[steel kraken]

scp is on based on / over the top of ssh, so I'd count that as ssh still

same as sftp (but not ftp / ftps)

[dusty pollen]

yup, that’s why I just lumped them together haha

[steel kraken]

its surprising how much of the modern internet is pretty much just http or ssh

to the point that many newer protocols either bootstrap off them, or have interoperable handshakes so they can survive firewall appliances

[dusty pollen]

how many newer protocols even are there though

[steel kraken]

websockets has http looking handshake, and http2 starts off the same before being very different.
h3 has firewall issues as it can use udp and thus the firewalls hate it

and even things like how steam works was previously its own standalone protocol and has largely migrated entirely to protobufs over a websocket connection

theres even dns over https these days

[dusty pollen]

I figure most “protocol” urls I see in the wild are just http(s) renamed so it opens in a specific app (discord:// etc) but I never bothered to look into it

[steel kraken]

protocol uri's like that aren't network protocols at all

[dusty pollen]

…that makes sense

idk why I was lumping them together in my head haha

[steel kraken]

because http:// and discord:// look the same

and http very much is a network protocol

[dusty pollen]

shows how much I know about networking (nothing and it will likely stay this way)

[dusty pollen]

ftp is http-based, right?

or am I misremembering from AS level cs

[steel kraken]

I'm not entirely sure if one is based on another or not, but same time period of text based commands over a tcp connection

to be theorectically telnet compatible and usable as a human

same as IRC

[dusty pollen]

I was made to memorise the layers of tcp/ip at some point but that’s as far as I’ve gone into learning about networking lmao

and I immediately forgot it anyway

[steel kraken]

the tcp/ip stack is physical, network, ip, application iirc (words might be different)
while the osi? layer was 7 long but 5-7 were super wishy woshy and never had great examples

[dusty pollen]

might have been osi then? I remember something to do with “link”

and there were definitely 7

[steel kraken]

osi is the 7 long one

physical, data link, network, transport, session, presentation, application

[dusty pollen]

there’s also a very good chance it was OSI but they called it tcp/ip because the quality of that course was severely lacking

yup, that’s the one

[steel kraken]

looks like my mental model mixed terms between the two

[safe dragon]

damn I'm brought back to uni with that image

[dusty pollen]

(while confirming that discord:// exists and I wasn’t imagining it I found out that up to a certain point discord automatically turned all custom protocols into clickable links, but luckily took that out when they introduced masked links)

[steel kraken]

but in reality they are kinda wishy woshy as theres leakage at every interface boundary on both models

[dusty pollen]

this is why I did maths and cs at uni, so I would never have to look at this again after secondary school

[safe dragon]

tbh I know I was shown this but I don't think I retained any useful information from it

[steel kraken]

I got my start in programming with custom minecraft clients, implementing the network protocol

[dusty pollen]

-# I actually can’t remember if networking was mandatory for straight cs students either, I don’t think it was now that I think about it

that’s one hell of a start to programming

[safe dragon]

damn

[steel kraken]

as a software guy, the tcp/ip model makes more sense in my head as its more practical, though the network people would mildly prefer the network access model to remain split in two, though they never really cared about layers 5-7 anyway and pretty much entirely refer to it as layer 7 anyway

[safe dragon]

reminds me of someone I did a group project with in my first year of uni who seemingly built a peer to peer networking stack for our little game while most of us were still struggling with for loops

[steel kraken]

my "mobile programming" unit or whatever it was called (android development) I did multiplayer monopoly with lobbies, reconnect support, etc

ie, better netcode than what ubisoft has in monopoly plus

[dusty pollen]

damn… I hope you never see any of my uni projects

[steel kraken]

not that is a particularly high bar, they somehow have desync in a turn based game

[safe dragon]

they're very quick turns

[dusty pollen]

I did hack together a multiplayer nodejs turn based board game once as an intern but I doubt that code was anything I would want anyone to know I wrote lmao

[steel kraken]

its possible to get in a state where people disagree how much money a player has, and if that disagreement results in some people thinking they paid rent and others didn't, the game soft locks until people permanently disconnect until everyone is in agreement the turn can finish

[dusty pollen]

tbf, just like real monopoly

[safe dragon]

I've uh... written a custom communication thing between the cash register and customer display on top of tcpclient

that's about it

that was already way more complicated than I expected

[steel kraken]

particularly in the tcp world, networking isn't that bad, its mainly a case of having the right mental model to think about what state each device is in and what knowledge they have

[dusty pollen]

I agree that networking really is pretty easy

I load in the relevant library and it magically just happens

[steel kraken]

udp makes it harder because you have to pretty much reimplement tcp yourself to have something vaguely useful again and has a lot more corner and edge cases to deal with

[safe dragon]

[steel kraken]

that's the nice thing, the OS itself provides the tcp and udp abstraction for you

[safe dragon]

tcpclient was annoying cause the devices it had to run on were sometimes still running windows xp and that meant half of the features Microsoft built into tcpclient weren't available

the docs would tell me about them tho to mock me

cancelation tokens...

definitely wasn't my best work but as far as I know it has never broken before

knowing what I know now I'd do it differently

[cinder karma]

I use a flash drive

I hear samba works well

[devout vault]

That was me. I was that person in the few group projects I had to do

To be fair I'd been programming for like 6 years by the time I started college

[devout vault]

wha

[cinder karma]

Good morning!!!!

[steel kraken]

Monopoly Plus is a great case study on how bad you can implement licensed IP

and not have real competition or incentives to make it good, because people buy it for the name of the game, and there isn't competition for variants

they also have some stupid stuff for online games that to my knowledge can't be turned off, like getting kicked for not ending your turn fast enough, which does include taking too long to propose a trade deal, but theres no fast way to add money to the deal other than holding the button for awhile, so high valued trades are almost impossible without getting bankrupted via DC

[devout vault]

Bankruptcy due to (essentially) paperwork taking too long? A bit too close to reality, monopoly /s

[steel kraken]

also having a monopoly on games called monopoly and having negative effects on the market as a whole isn't lost on me

[cinder karma]

Isn't the point of the game monopoly is that it isn't fun

[devout vault]

What are you talking about, I’ve always enjoyed it with my family. Ignore the fact that I’m basically always the winner

[steel kraken]

the fun and the skill level of monopoly is in the trades

[cinder karma]

I'm very bad at board games in general

Bad at games in general I think

[steel kraken]

I do have my own implementation that's browser based https://monopolis.361zn.is/ https://github.com/sinz163/monopolis-web which was a fun project to build up

not quite monopoly rules compliant, as I don't have auctions, the UI for adding/removing houses and hotels, and a few cards in the deck are missing as they were annoying

[cursive sigil]

This is why i always lose

[steel kraken]

My version also augments trades, in that rather than being between 2 people, you can propose a trade between everyone, and anyone impacted by the trade has to consent to it

[cursive sigil]

Wait is that not allowed in monopoly usually?

[steel kraken]

so if 3 sets are split three ways between the same 3 people they can do a single trade to resolve it without having a prisoners dillema style issue of order of operations

[cinder karma]

#programmers-off-topic plays monopoly when

[steel kraken]

Monopoly's rules are fairly vague iirc on the definition of a trade, but none of the digital monopolies implement it

[cursive sigil]

Oh i've never played a digital version

But multiple people trades always happened irl so i had a moment of "have i been playing monopoly wrong my entire life"

[cinder karma]

That's the fun part of irl board games

House rules

[devout vault]

Yeah I like doing three stage trades to get what I want before anyone catches on to what I’m doing 😅

[cinder karma]

I miss having irl friends to play board games with

[steel kraken]

the main rule that monopoly does have, is you can't give things for free, there must at least $1 worth of value for all parties

[devout vault]

Somewhere I have a web based Pac-Man I made. I followed this technical design document which should’ve made the input patterns from the original work, though I never verified that

[cursive sigil]

That is annoying because if i need to stop playing i can't just give away my shit and mess up the power balance between the remaining players

[devout vault]

The problem with pre made ones that aren’t in something like tabletop sim is that you have to abide by the rules instead of whatever shenanigans your group may want to do.

The way we did free parking was kinda insane

[safe dragon]

tbh ubisoft once managed to release a regular tetris game that lagged

[devout vault]

Give away? That stuff goes in the free parking pool 😛

[steel kraken]

One of the few house rules I do like, and was baking it into my implementation was the "fuck spite" rule, if you are in a position of potential bankruptcy, you cannot give your stuff away to the other players and then bankrupt.

in my implementation, if you did a trade, the bankrupt button will be disabled, and you must find a way to pay the debtor.
Does have the potential to soft lock, and I could add an additional check to disable trading outright if there isn't enough liquidatable money at all to pay the debt

[devout vault]

RTX VR physics-based Tetris with multiverse and time travel?

[devout vault]

Spite is half the fun of monopoly!

[steel kraken]

I did have full intention of implementing house rules, but constrained myself to not add any (other than the bankrupt one) until I hit feature parity

[steel kraken]

yeah but it artifically keeps the game going longer, monopoly is intended to snowball

[devout vault]

So what you’re saying is you don’t like putting money on free parking, and that base amount increasing every time someone lands there? (+the various taxes go there)

And bankruptcy stuff as previously mentioned

[steel kraken]

I'm semi ok with tax money going into free parking.

money also generating from free parking itself is less ok

but house rules like landing on go gives extra money or snake eyes generates money aren't great for the economy

[devout vault]

We started at 500

And went up like 500 each time if I recall

Something something why do you think each game took so long

[steel kraken]

Tax money going to free parking has the moral bonus of "its theoretically possible to comeback" to keep the losing players from just rage quitting the second someone starts becoming powerful, but it needs to be constrained to not just be the first person to land on free parking is the winner

the benefit of free parking shouldn't be the fact you make money, its that you didn't die to the oranges or reds

[devout vault]

“First person to land in free parking is the winner”
That’s totally the reason we increase the money later, so later landers can catch up.

Completely well thought out, totally not just because it seemed like a fun idea

Anyways, brb telling my parents we’re being judged on the internet /s

[steel kraken]

one of the other interesting house rules is the "no rent while in jail" to counter the late game strategy of hiding in jail

but my favorite is probably the "remove the purchase functionality outright" and landing on properties will always do the auction instead

it makes the game less RNG about who lands on what, and closer to hedging your bets on what properties to spend on and what not to, relative to what others are paying

extra fun if theres multiple auction systems available and the person landing can pick which system to use

[safe dragon]

no just normal tetris

[devout vault]

…not receiving rent in jail is a house rule?

[safe dragon]

no fancy graphics

back in like the 2010s

[steel kraken]

Official rules of monopoly doesn't care about you being in jail, rent is rent

[devout vault]

I like my idea better

[devout vault]

Oh.

Well, there’s a good reason basically nobody sticks with the rules. this applies to Uno as well

[devout vault]

Multiple auction systems?

[cinder karma]

to be fair that's how it works irl too

unless you can only go to jail in monopoly if you're broke

in which case garnishment is normal

that said, this is not financial advice, I'm not a financial advisor, I read tax law literally actually wrong last week and now have to claw money back from my HSA

[steel kraken]

Can do round robin increase of bids in a turn based manner, can do 'real time' where anyone can put in bids whenever, do a blind auction where highest secret bid wins, etc

most digital monopolies just do the round robin

[devout vault]

I can see why the real time route wouldn’t usually be implemented digitally, especially since it’s a turn based game

[devout vault]

Kirby carrying a cat around like a SDV player carrying crops. (And screaming while doing it, apparently)

[crystal wren]

I should remake this banner now that there's a black cat in the game, though...

[devout vault]

Black cats are the cutest of the cat colorings (universally, not just Stardew)

I actually would like the black cats fur to be even darker. Back before vanilla had black cats I used a mod that had darker fur

[crystal wren]

Make your first art mod, get that pixelsmith!

[dusty pollen]

is that the shitty mobile one?

[steel kraken]

no its the ubisoft one for steam/switch/xbox one/ps4+

[dusty pollen]

have you seen the mobile Tetris? it was genuinely my "worst way to implement an IP" top choice even before you said this

[steel kraken]

I don't really interact with mobile

though the ubisoft uno also has like a 5% chance to actually survive loading into a friends lobby without timing out or other issues

even when they had a tournament for it, they spent hours trying to get lobbies working just for it to be like a 30 second game

[dusty pollen]

I think mobile tetris is (probably?) technologically sound, I just struggle to believe anyone ever played long enough to find out

I think there’s a battlepass

[cinder karma]

Who games on mobile anyways

[dusty pollen]

idk if I would call mobile games “gaming” but ig I do?

[cinder karma]

Should I buy the card game you play

[uncut seal]

I think that's the one I played with friends (a single time) during Covid, the only thing I remember is being stuck in ubi customer service hell because the launcher was telling me I didn't buy the game or something

also it was slow as hell, especially through Steam play together

[cyan shadow]

I have a few very good strategy card games on mobile, but I'd rather play them on my laptop tbh

[dusty pollen]

depends, do you like solitaire etc?

[fleet wren]

I think a more important question is "do you like multiplication"

[cinder karma]

I do like multiplication

I am a 7th grade physics

[dusty pollen]

very valid balatro question

[dusty pollen]

then yes

[cinder karma]

what about division. I also like division

[fleet wren]

you're in luck

[slender badge]

Number decidedly does not go brr

[devout vault]

I had one of the old ones that seemed alright, but then they sdhut it down for a new opne and made the old one unusable. (Apparently it was always online)

...why did I just hear a firework

[cinder karma]

Someone just woke up

Do i get to graduate to 8th grade physics now

[devout vault]

Did you pass the exam

[cinder karma]

There is an exam?

[fleet wren]

staying in 7th grade it is

[cinder karma]

Awwww

No 8th grade physics for me

[devout vault]

Maybe next year

[cinder karma]

Awww

[fringe cypress]

Hey all odd question, do any of you guys use compression gloves when you’re coding. Do you have recommendations??

[dusty pollen]

no but I probably should because I think I fucked up my wrist

playing blue prince of all things

[winged cape]

i dont use any gloves because Hyperhidrosis Sucks ™ but i do use an ergonomic mouse (like a vertical one) and occasionally use a keyboard wrist rest when my wrist hurts

[deep drum]

I use a zsa moonlander keyboard for that sweet sweet ergonimics

I have everything mapped so I don't have to move my hands from home row

[safe dragon]

I also use a moonlander

I have 2 in fact

one at the office and one at home

[dusty pollen]

this looks so cool but I'm not a "home row" type of touch typer so I just know it would be completely wasted on me

the issue I've been running into depth my wrist seems to also be related to bending my fingers backwards? (like when you try to type a key on the bottom row without moving your hand from home row) so idk what I did atp it's probably just my bones being clicky again

oof that sure is a price alright

[cyan shadow]

That is a hypermobility thing, I think

[dusty pollen]

yeah that tracks

which part did you recognise, btw?

oh if you mean bending your fingers backwards I mean in the normal range of motion way, it just hurts now

[cyan shadow]

Yeah that sometimes happens to me too, even when moving in the normal range of motion

I'll be doing something normal and then everything goes ouch

[dusty pollen]

I don’t really have any extra range of motion in that sense (which is strange because that seems to be the most common one lmao)

[cyan shadow]

I can't move my fingers extra either

Just my wrist

My elbows overextend, too

[dusty pollen]

but I did figure it was related to hypermobility because all my bones have been extra clicky this week

[crystal wren]

Learning in the last few years that most people can't bend their fingers back to a 90 degree angle was fun.

[dusty pollen]

(I don’t have an official diagnosis but I do have very clicky bones)

[cyan shadow]

I have a half diagnosis
My pediatrician noticed it years ago and told me not to push the limits of the extra movement

But it's not on paper or anything

[dusty pollen]

same!

[cyan shadow]

That doc was excellent

[dusty pollen]

specifically because my jaw started dislocating on one side when I was really little and my parents had to take me to the doctor because that shit hurt

[cyan shadow]

Treated me from infancy to adulthood, including one absolutely vile case of food poisoning

[cyan shadow]

ouch

[dusty pollen]

it hasn’t hurt in years because it’s just become flexible enough not to, but it recently happened to my sister and I felt so bad because I can still vividly remember that pain and I was 5 when it started

[crystal wren]

I'm now just imagining that it might not be normal for my arms to feel like they're being pushed inwards sort of... into my shoulder when I'm lying on my side? Maybe? I always just assumed THAT was normal!

[dusty pollen]

I think that’s normal?

but how would I know clearly my relationship with my bones is less than ideal

can you pop any of your joints out of place, dh? without having to put in much force, that is

that’s the main thing for me they dislocate too easily and from that point on they stay clicky

when I accidentally fucked up my knee it was jumping off of like a 20cm thing onto asphalt and I nearly fainted lmao, that’s my most recent one

[crystal wren]

Kinda partially with all of the joints on my fingers?

Was trying to get a video, but the angle is a nightmare.

[cyan shadow]

Mine do that!

[dusty pollen]

oh is that the thing where you lightly pull them out of place? I genuinely have no clue if that’s normal or not

I can do it too though

so… points for not

[cyan shadow]

I don't normally dislocate joints but I did dislocate my shoulder on the bus a few years ago and ouch

It popped right back in, too

[dusty pollen]

I’ve collected a few now

[crystal wren]

Yeah, like it feels as if it's the exact analogue to the shoulder thing? I can do it manually just sitting here upright, too!

[dusty pollen]

the first time you dislocate one is always the most painful, how quickly they stop being painful (if ever) depends on how much they support and how much muscle is keeping them in place

I’d say collarbone continues to be the most painful

[cyan shadow]

Ouch Ouch Ouch

[dusty pollen]

oh I know what you mean by the shoulder thing now, and no that’s not normal

[dusty pollen]

I think it’s specifically on the center side of the collarbone? like the side by your throat

I don’t think that “joint” is even supposed to move though lmao

[crystal wren]

My thumb is weird, though. Video incoming... spoilered for minor grossness to some people, I guess?

[dusty pollen]

I wonder if it’s in the same way as mine are

[crystal wren]

Only one thumb, though! Other one's... not that.

[dusty pollen]

oh no, just clicky haha, my jaw and ankle are like that

[cyan shadow]

My thumbs do not crack

My toes and other fingers do though

And my elbow permanently cracks

[dusty pollen]

it’s like a popping sound for me, I think it’s the same for what dh showed?

[crystal wren]

I can't think of a single joint in my body that I haven't cracked... and do fairly often...

[dusty pollen]

like you pop them in and out of place

[cyan shadow]

Ankles, too

[crystal wren]

Ankle, check. Toes in the same way people crack their fingers, check. Shoulders, elbow, wrist, neck, low back, knees...

[cyan shadow]

Back

[dusty pollen]

for me it’s one ankle but unfortunately on the same side as the knee

[crystal wren]

Shoulder blades, collar bone...

[cyan shadow]

This reminds me that i need to do a big stretch like cat

[dusty pollen]

jesus dh

do any of them hurt, or do they just make noise?

[cyan shadow]

If I rotate my neck it makes such loud cracks other people get scared

[crystal wren]

None of them ever hurt! Just a satisfying pop and feeling nicer afterwards.

Oh, and jaw!

[cyan shadow]

Yeee

[crystal wren]

The jaw's one of the most regular.

[dusty pollen]

I’ve never heard of that except for the normal kind of popping your bones because for me it’s literally just that I can now dislocate my jaw so easily it makes a popping sound

the many types of hypermobility

[crystal wren]

I can do the manual popping sounds that's distinct to joint cracking on the right side of my jaw!

[dusty pollen]

oh, literally the same as my jaw then but mine’s on the left

[crystal wren]

And wait wait wait... do people move their hands down when typing something on the bottom row? I'm not really a home row person either, but... is moving your hand down to do that normal?

[cyan shadow]

I don't

[lethal walrus]

i move mine over to the right if anything to hit b, otherwise i don't move them

[cyan shadow]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-apple-cats-cute-gif-14585088

[safe dragon]

I don't move my hands

they've been in the same place since 1997

[cursive sigil]

hey same

[dusty pollen]

my hands just kinda float, so yeah I guess? I don’t think I rest my wrists at all

[cinder karma]

I type with my mind

[dusty pollen]

mine weren’t in existence back then unfortunately

[cinder karma]

Teensy! Tiny!

[devout vault]

Nyaight of the Living Cat is, in fact, peak

[devout vault]

...why do C# top level statement programs not have Main as the guarenteed method name?

???????

[dusty pollen]

what is a guaranteed method name

[devout vault]

Well I would expect this .cs file:

Console.WriteLine( "meow" );

To produce a Main method, since it runs fine as a program

But for some reason the method name as <> and $ ?

[dusty pollen]

weird

[dusty pollen]

apparently there's also a random component for what comes after >, weirdly enough

[devout vault]

There shouldn't even be a <>!

[dusty pollen]

not random but random ish

that's just how Roslyn handles implicit main methods, apparently

[devout vault]

And I hate it

But good to know I guess

[dusty pollen]

I assume it's to avoid having people try to access them programmatically

[devout vault]

Sounds like a job for ✨ reflection crimes ✨

(Not that I need to access it programmatically at the moment)

[cinder karma]

wanders in

sees crimes

leaves

(good luck with whatever you're doing, casey!)

[safe dragon]

I'd assume it's so that it doesn't break if you were to then manually write a method called main or something

[dusty pollen]

oh, like if your entire file was

var x = 5;

public void Main()
{
    Console.WriteLine("Main");
}

Main();

or something?

[safe dragon]

something like that

[dusty pollen]

yeah, that tracks ig

[devout vault]

Code crimes (more c# to Java stuff, made progress but still can’t run hello world)

Finding bugs in the library I’m updating is fun.

As is not understanding why something is done a certain way, changing it, and then having to change it back after figuring out why shortly after. (The specific case I remember being workarounds for the ref keyword)

[cinder karma]

Nice!

[cinder karma]

I love how broken discord colors are

Lumi gets three different ones here

[steel kraken]

I only count two distinct colours there

[devout vault]

Also, apparently lumina has RNG-based junimo powers

[cursive sigil]

so did iro a while ago

[fleet wren]

the first orange is "Autumn Leaves" and the second is "Fresh Tangerine"
cant believe you dont see the subtle difference smh my head

[cursive sigil]

one is orange one is l'orange

[cinder karma]

Smh

She also had the pop tarts color I just accidentally cropped that out

[cursive sigil]

was it an orange poptart

[worn remnant]

time out atra you cannot drop a cursed phrase like "the pop tarts color" in here and not explain yourself. what the hell is that

[dusty pollen]

I assume old slitherlegs but I’m fascinated to find out how it’s a poptart

[devout vault]

Have you not seen me talking about local legend being wild berry poptarts... basically every time it's come up since it was introduced?

.img wild berry poptarts

[heavy dagger]

https://images.kglobalservices.com/www.poptarts.com/en_us/product/product_4508827/prod_img-8315208_prod_img-8315208.png

[devout vault]

Wow it didn't even embed, how helpful

(ie. the exact same color atra currently is)

Now I'm smhing my head

[tranquil grove]

I was about to guess that one, though "pop tarts color" just makes me think of the sickly gray-brown cinnamon ones

[crystal wren]

Controversial opinion: these are all wildly overrated, because the edges are as dry as a desert.

[devout vault]

Who is eating poptarts without milk

[tranquil grove]

think of it as eating your vegetables, except instead of healthy it's just less sugary

[crystal wren]

...MILK?

[cinder karma]

Can y'all eat these for breakfast

[crystal wren]

That sounds GREAT.

[cinder karma]

Because I can't

If i try that I run out of blood sugar at 10am

[devout vault]

I used to, back in ye olde days

[cinder karma]

It's not pretty

[tranquil grove]

I used to have the cinnamon ones in college when I was like "can't be bothered to warm up the peanut butter"

[devout vault]

You know, the time I had the metabolism of a teenage guy* (because that's what I was)

I like the cinnamon ones too

[crystal wren]

I don't think I've ever had the metabolism of a teenage anything.

[devout vault]

Cinnamon, wildberry, blueberry, and chocolate fudge were my preferred flavors

[tranquil grove]

(now I eat Kind™ bars a lot, which are only marginally better, but still)

(there's a whole protein in them)

[devout vault]

And chocolate chip cookie dough which I'm just now learning has been discontinued

[cinder karma]

You can put my metabolism right up next to a teenage boy's and I wouldn't be too far behind and I still can't eat like that

[cursive sigil]

oh i just noticed atra graduated 7th grade

[devout vault]

I usually had skim milk (non-skim caused issues for my twin so that's usually what we had), but yeah.

[crystal wren]

With the amount of exercise you do, I'm not shocked!

[crystal wren]

I hate to say it, but I'm a full fat milk person.

[devout vault]

Maybe it was just me but I was able to eat as much as I wanted and never gain weight back then. It was glorious

(I wonder why my weight started increasing around the time I went to college... /s )

[cursive sigil]

i have no idea what full fat or skim actually mean, milk is in % of fat here

[devout vault]

The other problem was my twin liked to just... drink milk. Not necessarily with something, just as a casual drink

[crystal wren]

Yup, that's me.

[devout vault]

I mainly like milk with poptarts, cookies, cereal, etc.

[lethal walrus]

skim is usually ~1% fat

[devout vault]

Some things just call for milk

[crystal wren]

Milk's just great to drink.

[lethal walrus]

how do you manage drinking full fat milk

[cursive sigil]

and what's full fat

[devout vault]

Well because of previously mentioned Problems ™ we tended to avoid non skim 😛

[tranquil grove]

milk labels are confusing in the US at least, skim -> 1% sometimes? -> 2% -> maybe others? -> whole milk

[cursive sigil]

here milk is either 1.5% or 3.5%

[devout vault]

Skill issue

[lethal walrus]

3-5%
oh skimmed is <0.3% (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fat_content_of_milk)

[tranquil grove]

(we also just had skim all the time here)

[devout vault]

I kinda wonder if us using skim milk is why chocolate milk with chocolate mix (whether the syrup or the nesquik powder) was never as good as normal store bought chocolate milk

[cursive sigil]

probably tbh

[tranquil grove]

milk fat probably affects the taste of it a lot, w/e they put in the mix

[cursive sigil]

i always drank my nesquik with 3.5% milk and never liked the store bought chocolate milk

[devout vault]

It seemed like a lot of the mix didn't "take" properly. It was weird

Still better than no chocolate milk though

[devout vault]

(Not as bad as it sounds, it just seemed like there would always be some still at the bottom of the cup)

[crystal wren]

Oh, I never end up with any on the bottom. I always end up with chocolate milk foam on the top with some undissolved powder in it.

[dusty pollen]

oh you have to put in just enough boiling water to cover the powder, stir until dissolved, and THEN add the rest of the water/milk

that’s how you get the thing with no chunks

[cursive sigil]

drinking nesquick with water is a crime

[dusty pollen]

(but also hot chocolate and chocolate milk are two different things)

[tranquil grove]

buy normal hot cocoa mix and just eat the marshmallows, got it

[crystal wren]

Though a lot of the time hot and not boiling. If stuff has milk powder in, boiling water tends to make it super clumpy.

But like... 90 degree hot is perfect.

[dusty pollen]

does hot chocolate powder usually have milk powder in it?

[crystal wren]

Nope!

At least the good stuff doesn't.

[sand frost]

I think a lot of chocolate milk in the us is nonfat milk with chocolate mixed in

The main difference with instant stuff I suspect is being able to get much better mixing

[devout vault]

Boiling water? In milk? NO

[dusty pollen]

(the good stuff being options belgian chocolate, obviously)

[sand frost]

Since you don’t have to ensure the powder form is shelf stable if it’s already mixed

[devout vault]

My milk needs to be colder than the artic (not as cold as my water though)

[crystal wren]

That's exactly the type that goes clumpy with boiling for me!

[dusty pollen]

you cool it down with cold milk

[dusty pollen]

I’ve never had that happen to me

[tranquil grove]

never knew chocolate milk was a whole alchemical process

[crystal wren]

It helps to draw a transmutation circle in the cup t-

[dusty pollen]

listen, if espresso people can do whatever mad scientist nonsense they do, I can have an exact recipe for chocolate milk

[tranquil grove]

(I never liked the premade chocolate stuff & just had powder with hot water )

[sand frost]

I guess it’s not nonfat, I looked up the kind I drink from Costco

But it is reduced fat

[dusty pollen]

(my dad is now the proud owner of an espresso machine. He’s super happy with it. He has yet to manage to make espresso that he doesn’t think is disgusting)

[cinder karma]

I have weird food hangups tbh

[crystal wren]

Something something too tightly or too loosely packing the grounds.

[strange copper]

Simply become vanilla latte person so you taste the espresso less

[sand frost]

I like to drink espresso drinks but I don’t like to make them

First of all, I don’t have a machine, and second of all, I dont know how to

[crystal wren]

I just use coffee bags nowadayhs though, so I can have no opinion.

[sand frost]

I either drink whatever my husband makes (I think he also uses coffee bags but sometimes aeropress) or I buy coffee

[crystal wren]

Don't let him see they made a nice new glass Aeropress...

[sand frost]

Haha

I’m scared of too much glass stuff

And i already have so many glass things

Maybe when we stop moving so often

[crystal wren]

It's borosilicate at least, but still a fair concern!

[devout vault]

Me hearing everyone else's chocolate milk crimes in this conversation:

[sand frost]

Is drinking chocolate milk from the individual size bottle from Costco one of the banned actions?

[devout vault]

I haven't tried those before, so indeterminate

[strange copper]

Opinions on fairlife chocolate milk protein shake things?

[worn remnant]

well i'm glad i got everyone going on a milkfat percentage/chocolate milk/hot cocoa discussion

[sand frost]

Hot cocoa mix is often weirdly salty

[devout vault]

I dunno about protein shake ones but I like the fairlife chocolate milk, especially since they don't have a short expiration date.

(Mainly useful when getting groceries delivered since it isn't as sensitive to going bad from not being cold - it's not like chocolate milk ever lasts me long anyways)

[worn remnant]

i am also a whole milk person. i grew up on 2% and later 1% but whole milk is where milk tastes good and fat is not the enemy so i don't expect to go back to caveman times

[devout vault]

Excuse you? I'm the one who brought up skim milk

Which led to chocolate milk discussion

[sand frost]

I like what I grew up on, so either 1% or 2% for me

[worn remnant]

yeah, when you yelled at me for not knowing what the pop tarts color is

[devout vault]

Of course you called out atra's poptart color comment so you win there, except I'll give the win to atra instead for mentioning poptarts

[sand frost]

Pop tarts are brown I think

Like light brown

Was I right?

[devout vault]

That was bewilderment, not yelling.
#programmers-off-topic message
No caps, no exclamation marks.

s. m. h.

[cinder karma]

So what the hell is happening

[devout vault]

On the bottom, yeah. The top varies

[sand frost]

Hmmm

[cinder karma]

Tbh I'm too lactose intolerant for milk anyways

[sand frost]

I do not eat pop tarts

I once had an off brand pumpkin spice pop tart

[cinder karma]

(This may not be true anymore - I can apparently drink fairlife core protein)

But i have a strong anti milk revulsion from being forced to drink it as a kid

Throw it back up enough times and you'll hate it too

[devout vault]

There was a period of time when my family got off brand poptarts too, they were okay

And seemed more filling

Only "okay" in the sense that I had to get used to the subtle flavor differences for the same flavor names 😛

[cinder karma]

Fairlife Core Protein is the best premixed protein shake and it isn't even close. But. They are almost unreasonably expensive

I prefer to get powdered whey protein for day to day

I only get the Fairlife when I'm super busy and lunch is grabbing one of those from a Walmart I drive by

[cinder karma]

Wellllll

In training season it's not uncommon for between training calories and how my metabolism works, I outpace the calories i can reasonably eat.

Even in the off season I'm averaging somewhere between 2.5k-3k calories/day

That....is quite a number

[sand frost]

I can’t recommend eating sticks of butter

It tastes bad

[cinder karma]

I don't eat sticks of butter

I do eat a fair bit of cheese in training season

Like

I buy Costco blocks of cheddar. For myself.

[sand frost]

That’s much tastier

I recommend the Costco dubliner cheese

[cinder karma]

The new phone OS doesnt seem to respect locked portrait mode 😦

[devout vault]

My twin would disagree. (Not that he does that, but he used to want to)

Cheese is amazing

How does Unix timestamps account for leap seconds

[pliant snow]

Unix timestamps are simply the number of seconds since epoch, its up to other software to convert that into a human readable timezone

[worn remnant]

leap seconds come up with unsurprising frequency under this tag https://www.jwz.org/blog/tag/time_t/

[devout vault]

I realize that, but what about cases like converting a human readable timestamp to a unix one? From my brief wikipedia skim there's not a specific pattern for leap seconds, it's decided by some committee/organization 6 months ahead of time, so you basically need an up to date list of all past leap seconds if I understand correctly.

And that's ignoring "what if I convert a time that the leap second happens at".

[devout vault]

Looking at the first few things on that page (which I have no idea what that site even is)... one of those posts is not like the others

[dusty pollen]

he has a tamp, and a little scraper leveller thing, and a scale to use both for the amount of grounds and the extraction, and those metal things that stir up the grounds in the portafilter, and….

[worn remnant]

personal blog for jwz, who worked at netscape when it made web browsers. he made (still makes) xscreensaver, and HTML email is probably his fault

[dusty pollen]

so he’s a prolific wanted criminal

[devout vault]

I mean, html emails might not've been terrible if it stuck with like original HTML level stuff

Something like markdown or even bbcode emails would still be preferred

But unsure if those existed back then (maybe bbcode, but I'm doubtful of markdown)

[worn remnant]

markdown was way later, yeah https://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/

[devout vault]

"way later"
I didn't realize markdown was that old

To be fair I didn't realize git was that old until I googled it just now

[dusty pollen]

I have emails I sent when I was 8 that had massive bright pink lettering still saved in my email account

[devout vault]

I don't have my first email account still

It wasn't hotmail or anything though

Custom email on my mom's business site 😛

(Yes the spam filters were bad)

[dusty pollen]

my dad very wisely made me an account with my actual name when I was 5

[devout vault]

Amazing

Mine was my actual name too

Which is made even worse by it being tied to my mom's business

[cinder karma]

My personal email address is so bad lol

It's so tryhard

(I use another one professionally that is just my first and last name)

[supple ether]

My original email was my real name at yahoo, but it's long lost. These days I have two gmail accounts for public and personal and only one of those has my name on it

If I thought it wouldn't be a massive headache I'd set up a self-hosted mail server

[sand frost]

I have like 8 emails

[marble jewel]

My mom registered my first email address, and it included my name and full date of birth

[fleet wren]

as a kid I dreamt of having my own server to self host everything, my own servers and etc.
as an adult I now fully have the means to realize said dreams, and the knowledge that doing so is a massive pita with no benefits

[sand frost]

It’s probably too many

[crystal wren]

The benefit is that it's cool, though.

[fleet wren]

yeah, same reason I watercooled my PC tbh

that's still less maintenance than running a publicly facing server though

[marble jewel]

It's not that bad, just depends on how far you want to go. You can benefit a lot from an even tiny server on a raspberry pi with just a few self hosted services.

A mesh vpn lets you get all the benefits of a public server, without the security hassles of actually having it be public

[fleet wren]

I do host my password DB, though it's only over LAN so I can only sync at home
I'll probably look into tailscale one of these days

[marble jewel]

I'm definitely on one end of the spectrum when it comes to my investment into selfhosting as a hobby, but this is one of those 90/10 situations where 90% of the benefits of self-hosting came from the first 10% of the investments I made into it

[crystal wren]

I just wish I didn't hate the clients of every single hosted (even self-hosted) password manager.

Give me one that works exactly like KeepassXC, and I'm in.

[devout vault]

The fun part is paying for a dedicated server for that reason and never getting around to it but still paying for it!

In the process of cancelling that

[marble jewel]

Bitwarden+Vaultwarden rivals every paid service I've used

[devout vault]

(If anyone has for some reason bothered going to my old site in the past few days: that's why it's down right now 😛 )

[red crest]

a password manager is like the one thing i specifically dont wanna self host even though i do many other things bc my lil server is so ramshackle i dont wanna put something so important on it lol

[rain apex]

I mean it's better than me and my unprotected txt containing various browser generated passwords

[red crest]

(one of these days ill figure out why it randomly locks up and needs a hold-the-power-button reboot every 16-36 hours...)

[crystal wren]

Something something 13th/14th gen Intel.

[red crest]

sometimes it even makes it a week without hanging!

[marble jewel]

Why use a password manager when you can just make all of your passwords "password123"

The 123 makes it unhackable

[cinder karma]

My password is my lovely face

And my fingerprint

And my retina print

[red crest]

tbh i dont even remember what exact specs are in that server. ive thought about upgrading it but then i tell myself "why spend more money on this shitty little server than my actual PC when it works Fine Enough™ right now?"

[devout vault]

Everyone knows you shouldn't put password in your password, that counteracts the 123 unhackableness.

Just go with hunter2 like everyone else

[devout vault]

See I am an avid avoider of biometric authentication.

The only thing I have is one of my fingers (and I can't recall which) for my parent's front door, and that was because they didn't have time to get me a key before I needed to take care of the pets back then

[fleet wren]

hmm all I see on my end is *******

[devout vault]

See? It's unhackable

[cinder karma]

(I don't do biometrics)

God.

You guys should know I'm never serious

[devout vault]

Are those not considered biometrics

Ah

To be fair your name is "8th grade physics" not 7th grade physics like yesterday, which automatically throws my recognition filter off

Wait I thought you didn't get through the exam

[marble jewel]

TIL Discord doesn't let you share your actual password publicly

[devout vault]

That doesn't look edited so now I'm questioning my sanity

[marble jewel]

Test ********

Cool

[supple ether]

Hunter2

wow it really does work!

[devout vault]

Not lowercase

Oh wait

I ruined the joke

Oh no

[marble jewel]

See for me it says ******** but for you it says ********

[devout vault]

(I'm suddenly questioning if this is a good idea to joke about in case one of the many people on this server randomly looks in here and is unaware of the history)

[marble jewel]

You might not belong in #programmers-off-topic if you don't get the reference

[supple ether]

crash course in internet safety

[marble jewel]

It's kind of like a captcha

[devout vault]

There's no "in the know" check for opening this channel

[supple ether]

I feel like getting trolled and doing something stupid is an internet rite of passage all things considered

[red crest]

have you seen how many people stumble in here when looking for mod stuff?

[devout vault]

^

[marble jewel]

Good point

[dusty pollen]

bitwarden is so good, you can use it for free or pay less per year for the totp feature than you would for basic features in other password managers in a month

[marble jewel]

I'm loving bitwarden's SSH Agent feature

[crystal wren]

(Though storing your TOTP alongside your password is very silly.)

[marble jewel]

It can also store your Passkeys, which yeah I know, single point of intrusion and all

But the convenience is worth it to me

[dusty pollen]

yeah, but on the other hand, I think I only used totp for my uni email, and... they can have that

[crystal wren]

I'd love it if it could have those things locked under a separate password inside the same database or something.

That'd be pretty great, actually.

[dusty pollen]

but then I'd have to store the password to the second database in the first one--

[dusty pollen]

(I don't store the password for the email address the bitwarden account is under in said account tbf)

[marble jewel]

I go "passwordless" wherever possible

[crystal wren]

[devout vault]

Is that the one where they send you the email link to log in?

If so, I get it, but I kinda hate those because of the extra step

[marble jewel]

No it's backed by biometrics usually

[devout vault]

Oh

Yeah hate those too

[crystal wren]

My Microsoft account is passwordless. Relies 100% on the one backup code, or the authenticator app.

[devout vault]

Face ID on my phone? Off. Before that, fingerprint on my phone? Off.

[dusty pollen]

I do sso when I can

and then regularly revoke access to things I don't use any more

[cinder karma]

Is it Runescape

[devout vault]

IRC

[crystal wren]

<Cthon98> hey, if you type in your pw, it will show as stars
<Cthon98> ********* see!
<AzureDiamond> hunter2
<AzureDiamond> doesnt look like stars to me
<Cthon98> <AzureDiamond> *******
<Cthon98> thats what I see
<AzureDiamond> oh, really?
<Cthon98> Absolutely
<AzureDiamond> you can go hunter2 my hunter2-ing hunter2
<AzureDiamond> haha, does that look funny to you?
<Cthon98> lol, yes. See, when YOU type hunter2, it shows to us as *******
<AzureDiamond> thats neat, I didnt know IRC did that
<Cthon98> yep, no matter how many times you type hunter2, it will show to us as *******
<AzureDiamond> awesome!
<AzureDiamond> wait, how do you know my pw?
<Cthon98> er, I just copy pasted YOUR ******'s and it appears to YOU as hunter2 cause its your pw
<AzureDiamond> oh, ok.

[devout vault]

I think

And here comes DH with the full transcript

Gotta say that's some quick thinking near the end by Cthon

[sonic mirage]

Wow, I thought I had a lot

[cyan shadow]

I fucking haaaate Microsoft Authenticator

[devout vault]

(I mean there are no timestamps but I assume that was close to realtime like this conversation)

[cyan shadow]

It's been forced on me by my uni and it can fuck off

[dusty pollen]

you can get around it, quill!

I actually tied mine to bitwarden

[crystal wren]

I actually really like it as long as it's exclusively for signing into my Microsoft account...

[cyan shadow]

I can't! I already tried

[dusty pollen]

there should be a setting somewhere to force it to "use a third party app"

[cyan shadow]

Oh well

I finish next monty

Month.

I no longer care

[crystal wren]

Python?

We're back on topic!

[dusty pollen]

did you know that's what python was named after?

not snek

[cyan shadow]

I made a holy hand grenade reference in modded farmers the other day and no one got it

Wasn't even a smart reference, I just named the grenade

[sonic mirage]

5! (3, sir)

[dusty pollen]

one of my professors once told me off for not recognising a monty python reference

[cyan shadow]

Got a "is that from terraria" type response and felt Old