#programmers-off-topic

1 messages · Page 43 of 1

cyan shadow
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most people can't afford an iphone, however

sonic mirage
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Apple who?, they say

cyan shadow
dusty pollen
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yay, knew it haha. I know that the app usage is different too, though I can’t quite remember what it was. Whatsapp being SUPER popular maybe?

cyan shadow
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my parents both fall into the "use it until it breaks then get something mid-range" phone user category

latent bough
rain apex
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I got a pixel recently and my coworkers were like

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Is that an iPhone?

dusty pollen
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…was India the reason whatsapp had to add the restrictions on forwarding and the note saying “this message has been forwarded many times”? because that might be what I remember

cyan shadow
cyan shadow
dusty pollen
latent bough
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as soon as I was able to I got an android instead of an iphone (my mom is a huge apple shill for some reason)

rain apex
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My parents say i should get the silly 3 fold phone

cyan shadow
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honestly, I'm not a fan of being so completely locked into google's ecosystem, but you can't escape the ecosystem lock regardless of which OS you choose

rain apex
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It becomes tablet sized kasumidetect

cyan shadow
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ooo

crystal wren
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I want a folding phone. I just don't want a folding phone that has a screen I can permanently scratch with fingernails.

rain apex
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I don't like the "fold" in the screen tbh no fold phone for me

cyan shadow
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i don't want a folding phone

latent bough
safe dragon
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my mom had to listen to my sister and I hating on apple so much that she somehow became the biggest apple hater among us

cyan shadow
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what i want is for those cool slidey keyboards to come back so I can stop using a touchscreen keyboard

crystal wren
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I still have this stored... somewhere. SDVkrobusgiggle

HTC_Dream_Orange_FR.png
cyan shadow
rain apex
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Peak performance

cyan shadow
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ooooooo

rain apex
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Huh azerty

dusty pollen
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I’m not fully anti-apple (I am currently typing this on an ipad), I just don’t see the point of using their ecosystem with all its downsides unless it’s something like ipad that just is that much more established than competitors

latent bough
safe dragon
cyan shadow
dusty pollen
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I’m pro-foss but on a practical level, I don’t have the spoons to enforce it in other places where it might cause issues

latent bough
safe dragon
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I can admit that apple does make a few good products but I also hate everything they stand for

cyan shadow
safe dragon
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though I'd love to throw my ipad at a wall anyway cause of how their attempts at locking you to their desired workflow fucks with mine

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one of the major motivations for me to buy a laptop again is just so I don't have to "make things work" on the ipad anymore

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the ipad can just become a discord and youtube machine despite being a "pro"

crystal wren
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(And don't forget the factory seconds Framework stuff if they still have some when you come to buying one!)

safe dragon
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the whatnow

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oh I see

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that's cool

ivory shadow
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A few more months before I can buy a framework using my Nexus money...

safe dragon
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that's a lot of nexus money

crystal wren
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It really does pile up with some decently popular mods!

marble jewel
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I think it took them two major updates before they even enabled proper windowed apps.

dusty pollen
safe dragon
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they did introduce better multi monitor support from what I understand but it's still bad

dusty pollen
sonic mirage
safe dragon
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my ipad pro is from 2018 so no such features

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tbh the framework 16" laptop is expensive enough where a macbook can make sense as an alternative if you ignore the upgradability/repair

latent bough
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fun fact the newest OS version it supported was 9.3.5

safe dragon
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can't wait to buy a framework laptop and then a week later we find out they did something morally reprehensible

latent bough
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and it could download a grand total of zero apps

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because everything required newer OS versions

safe dragon
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my ipad pro still has the latest version that exists

latent bough
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i think it was an iPad 2

safe dragon
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cause they support the pro models for much longer

latent bough
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released 2011

marble jewel
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I mean I use my iPad for a lot of simple things, but the hardware should allow me to do so much more.

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Given it has equivalent hardware to the Macbook Air at the time, I should be able to do SDV modding on it and things like that.

worn remnant
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(seeing hardware discussions) hey are we all talking about the MNT Reform in here

safe dragon
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it was quite funny when the ipad was the only device they sold with an M4 chip. No one understood who on earth that was even for

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all I know about mnt reform is that they exist

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I'm always a little iffy on anything that tries to be 100% open cause that almost always comes at some major cost

dusty pollen
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I know less than you then

sonic mirage
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Frameworks aren't really about immediate bang-for-buck. That comes with the upgrades down the line. I would bet that used M1/M2/maybe M3 MacBook Pros would be pretty cost-effective for the performance you get, but you have to be ok with MacOS and also not being x86

safe dragon
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yeah that's why I added that caveat

sonic mirage
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Buying used obviously has it's own possible issues, though

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I'll be considering the factory seconds from Framework when I get one, eventually

safe dragon
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I'm hoping framework releases new mainboards before I buy one

sonic mirage
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So long as they have ones for the most recent AMD version with the screen and hardware I want

dusty pollen
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regardless of the solution, right now to avoid proprietary bullshit we have to pay some ratio of money to willingness to repair/tinker

safe dragon
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one nice thing about the framework for me is that you can customize the ports and get an actual proper full sized sd card port

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since I'd like to plug in the sd card from my camera without needing to carry around the stupid fuckin dongle I need on my ipad

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I always forget that damn dongle

crystal wren
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You could have four if you wanted.

safe dragon
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6 even for the the 16"

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though 1 usb c port is kinda required so you can like, charge the laptop

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At least one Expansion Card should be USB-C to charge the laptop

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it's honestly funny that they give you the option to not buy any

crystal wren
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Sounds like an optional port to me if you have enough charge. SDVkrobusgiggle

cyan shadow
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Hmm

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Maybe once I've worked a while I'll think about a framework

safe dragon
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actually, it probably gives a warning if you try to continue without

cyan shadow
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Rn, with no salary to my name, that is a no

safe dragon
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alas

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the laptop I got for uni is soon to turn 10

cyan shadow
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No money, only cough

ivory shadow
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Strictly speaking you could take one of the adapters out and plug in a charging cable to the internal usb-c port the adapters use

safe dragon
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true

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"I really needed the 6th ethernet port"

ivory shadow
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Routers too expensive? Buy six ethernet adapters and a framework

safe dragon
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I'm sure that is much cheaper yes

ivory shadow
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I have an all Ubiquiti home network and even I can't joke about that being cheaper

dusty pollen
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I would think about getting a framework if a) I had a salary to use on it rn and b) I wasn’t completely refusing to let go of my old cheap electronics until they literally don’t boot

safe dragon
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my laptop is pretty much in that boat at this point

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if I had been an electrical engineer I might have been able to get it in better shape again

ivory shadow
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The only reason I want to replace my laptop, really, is that half the keys on the keyboard no longer function correctly.

dusty pollen
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mine are both 9yo (I got my dad’s old one too) and going strong

ivory shadow
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Typing is such a chore. Some letters it will take me literally 30 seconds of pressing the key in different ways before one goes through.

safe dragon
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my laptop completely loses all bios settings the moment you unplug the charger which is quite fun

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if the netherlands suffered from more power outages than it does it would be scrap

pliant snow
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lol

ivory shadow
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And I already replaced the keyboard once, years ago when the first one did it.

dusty pollen
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isn’t there a BIOS battery that could be replaced? usually like a watch battery

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or is it soldered

pliant snow
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Yeah, there should be

safe dragon
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yeah

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any kind of battery that exists on the laptop has at this point ceased to function

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be it the CMOS battery or the regular one

dusty pollen
safe dragon
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I don't think a cmos battery is easy to replace though unless you know how to solder?

worn remnant
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i have a thinkpad from (checks notes) 2008 lying around. i don't really use it any more, as you might expect. last time i did use it it was still in "perfect" working condition

dusty pollen
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CMOS, that’s the term I was looking for

safe dragon
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oh wait, a cmos battery is often just a regular CR2032 battery

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hmmm

pliant snow
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sometimes they are soldered in, but many times its just a clip

safe dragon
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a shame I've never managed to get the laptop open before. there's like 15 screws but I must be missing some

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there were several under stickers or rubber feet

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but idk

dusty pollen
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yeah, cmos batteries are usually just watch batteries, the flat ones

safe dragon
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perhaps I'll try to fix it even just so that it sticks around

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it doesn't really work well enough anymore to run photo editing software regardless but it'd be nice if it at least works

sonic mirage
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Yeah I only use my old macbook for taking notes in meetings a handful of times a year. Can't really justify a Framework for that, so just slapped a new battery in it

ivory shadow
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Ah, found it. A few weeks back I was showing my laptop problem to a friend so I typed a-z, 0-9 three times in a row without trying to correct for input errors and got:

abcdfghijlmoprstuwy5678
abcdefghijlmoprtuvwy1568
bcdefghijlmnoprtuvwy15678

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So saying half the keys don't work is a little big of an exagguration, but it's definitely enough of the keys

safe dragon
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it has all you need

sonic mirage
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I'd just plug a keyboard into it at that point

safe dragon
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I never use the laptop keyboard cause the cpu is right under the wasd keys and makes it very unpleasant to use

lethal walrus
rotund violet
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Those 2019-era (Intel/pre-Apple-Silicon) Macbooks made excellent space heaters.

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And provided soothing white noise for restful sleep. Great features.

safe dragon
cinder karma
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God I hate VSCODE git handling

dusty pollen
cinder karma
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The actual problem is that if I happened to have a file open

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And I pull from repo

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VSCode recalls the file I have opened and won't update from djsk

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Even if I reboot the whole computer

dusty pollen
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that’s annoying

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I don’t think that’s ever happened to me though SDVpufferthinkblob

sonic mirage
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Maybe some kind of setting to prevent you losing changes on pull?

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I know Sublime Text has all sorts of settings related to what to do for changed files to help prevent you losing work

dusty pollen
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I hate how most IDEs handle pulling

cinder karma
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I rebooted the whole computer:(

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What's worse is I clobbered....myself lol

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So now I need to pick out what I did and hand merge to what else i did

rotund violet
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You sort of make it sound like it actually did the right thing, preventing you from losing local changes that weren't consistent with the pull. I'm not the biggest VSCode fan but I don't think that's happened to me either in normal use - if it's happening all the time, maybe some CRLF issue?

cinder karma
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There shouldn't have been local changes, I rebooted the computer, did the pull, then proceeded to continue editing the file

dusty pollen
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I think possibly the best thing I ever did for myself was learn to use git purely through the command line before ever messing with the IDE versions tbh, I learned a ton about how to handle it

cinder karma
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Under the assumption I was sitting at the Head, not...two commits behind

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Oh, I have to use the command line to pull/push

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For Work Related Jank reasons

dusty pollen
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couldn't you stash, checkout the head, then apply the stash?

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or was the change on a file that was changed in those two commits

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git stash was my best friend for a while

cinder karma
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See, if I knew the file was cached by vscode I would have done that but

dusty pollen
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oh, I see

pliant snow
cinder karma
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Iro

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You may excommunicated me for this

dusty pollen
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atra

cinder karma
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I use mouse on vim

dusty pollen
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oh, same

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I never got fully converted into vim, I know some stuff but not enough to be a full vim warrior kind of deal

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one of my lecturers once wrote an emacs clone called ewoks though purely so we could change one tiny part of it in a practical

pliant snow
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I sometimes use mouse in vim

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tis not a sin

dusty pollen
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I can do the basic movements without it and since it's running in my terminal I don't think I use it much but I am not a vim purist

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pretty sure some of them would get annoyed at the fact I have a colour theme set for vim and am not cosplaying running on a 60s computer

latent bough
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I justttt started doing the custom macros you can make with q

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they're pretty cool

pliant snow
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ahhh now you're finding the good stuff

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figuring out the advanced movement is when it becomes really worthwhile, then theres the extra stuff like macros and registers

dusty pollen
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I think I'm gonna do it. I think I'm going to bite the bullet and run my update script on my rolling-release distro after like a year of not doing it. wish me luck folks

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I'm glad I added the step that refreshes the signatures to it because it would DEFINITELY have failed because of one of those this time otherwise

pliant snow
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it'll never boot again

dusty pollen
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so far I've managed to avoid ever breaking the whole install by not updating for 6 months, and I do that pretty often

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arch is more stable than it seems ig SBVLmaoDog

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there is a solid chance it won't have enough disk space for the update though now that I think about it...

pliant snow
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Yeah, I've never really borked my arch install

dusty pollen
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ugh I'm having one of those conflicts though were a package is trying to depend on a different version of something, this ALWAYS happens

pliant snow
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is it an AUR package?

dusty pollen
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...how do I easily see which one is doing that

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no, not aur

pliant snow
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pacman should be smart enough to fix it I thought

dusty pollen
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it should but if you spend long enough between updates these things start breaking s_sigh

latent bough
latent bough
pliant snow
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If you install pacman-contrib there's a pactree program you can use to see which packages rely on each other

dusty pollen
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already installed apparently, ty for suggesting!

dusty pollen
latent bough
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ah okay

pliant snow
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Does it not say what package is the problem?

dusty pollen
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it doesn't seem to, but I just piped pactree into xargs for a hint

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hmm, none of these specifically mention the package it's trying to install... interesting. Maybe it's just the preferred package for what it's providing now

pliant snow
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What is the package?

dusty pollen
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nodejs is the one I have installed, nodejs-lts-iron is the one it's trying to install that's in conflict

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maybe I'll update nodejs and see if it helps

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nope SDVpufferthinkblob

pliant snow
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Ah

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if you run pacman -Si nodejs-lts-iron you can see its info

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it provides exactly nodejs 20.18.2

dusty pollen
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I just don't know what's trying to install that

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it's not currently installed

pliant snow
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If you do pacman -Qi nodejs-lts-iron you should be able to see what requires it

dusty pollen
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so can't do -Qi

pliant snow
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oh

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thats... interesting

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what about pacman -Qi nodejs

dusty pollen
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it's possible my aur manager installs dependencies for aur packages before it reaches the aur step? which is unexpected to me

pliant snow
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what wants it

dusty pollen
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like half my system haha, I develop in nodejs, it's an explicit installed package

pliant snow
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I think it will, it'll do the main repos before or at the very latest during the AUR update

dusty pollen
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yeah, I just figured that wouldn't include the dependencies for the AUR packages. Interesting.

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pacman alone gets annoyed somewhere else

pliant snow
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Are you using pacman to update or some AUR helper

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I would try just pacman first and then worry about AUR stuff

dusty pollen
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I'm using a pacman wrapper called paru, but yeah, I've moved to pacman for now

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(I recommend paru if you want to deal with aur stuff btw, it's definitely the best aur tool I've tried)

pliant snow
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pacman can give fresh, new, exciting errors

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yeah that's what I use

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but I'm weird, I first use pacman for my main repos, then I call paru to only do AUR stuff

dusty pollen
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what if I just... uninstalled aseprite... instead of dealing with this libfmt conflict a_sideeye

pliant snow
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I do that sometimes lol, just uninstall and reinstall AUR packages rather than dealing with them

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is it just the normal aseprite package?

dusty pollen
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yup

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I wish paru Qi would tell you if stuff was aur or not (already checked in pacman so I'm just confirming through paru now)

pliant snow
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you can do pacman -Qm to list all your AUR things

dusty pollen
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huh, interesting, I'll try to remember that

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I'm currently updating aseprite on its own before the rest of the system because why not (I know why not but I'm not going to leave it in this state for long)

pliant snow
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pacman -Qn does the opposite, only showing main repo things (n for native)

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If it's compiled, there was a glibc update, which might require you to recompile, idk

dusty pollen
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talking to myself here, but is there a bin version in the aur and if so, why did I install the regular version Squint

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choices were made

worn remnant
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pretty sure binary distribution of aseprite is forbidden by its license

pliant snow
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For aseprite-bin, you have to actually have a copy purchased that you give it, it just installs it

dusty pollen
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oh, I see, that explains it

pliant snow
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And it's funny you should ask, as in this small world, I'm the maintainer of aseprite-bin lol

dusty pollen
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found the right person to ask I see SDVpuffersquee

pliant snow
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actually that reminds me, I have some packages I need to update

dusty pollen
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we're about 2/3 of the way through and at 91C...

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100% cpu usage

latent bough
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for aseprite i've just used the steam version

pliant snow
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I bought mine thru Humble Bundle years ago, but they (at least until very recently) only provided a .deb file that had to be installed

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I think they finally added an AppImage

latent bough
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Oooo how kind of them

pliant snow
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I actually didn't write that particular install script, I was using it and the maintainer orphaned it, and after no one else picked it up I did lol

rain apex
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how does one end up maintaining package

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do u just go "well i want this thing" and make AUR

dusty pollen
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if it's not already in there, yeah

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or you can take over an orphaned package

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I think I did once but I ended up abandoning it again in the end

rain apex
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wow how could you

latent bough
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i've made packages kinda

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just not arch packages

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mine were made for spack

dusty pollen
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ironically, I think the aurphan package might be orphaned right now judging by one of the messages I saw earlier

pliant snow
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Yeah, I maintain like 10 or so

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Basically things I saw and wanted for myself, but no one had put up there

dusty pollen
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(though it could have been unrelated, I was skimming)

pliant snow
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Most of the ones I've written are very simple, every so often someone sends me a message there's a new update and I make the needed changes

dusty pollen
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yeah, I think the one I took on was arduino-bin at some point or something?

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or a specific version of arduino. I don't even own one

pliant snow
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I think I only abandoned one, which I had actually picked up from someone else, because the upstream devs were asses

dusty pollen
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what were they doing?

pliant snow
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Just a lot of weird stuff, like their commit messages were random junk, the icons they had in the repo were like MS paint drawings so they weren't usable, it was a weird set up

dusty pollen
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oh, weird

pliant snow
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Yet the project was rather well known, I wonder if anyone else picked it up

dusty pollen
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aseprite finished!

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why is it still throwing errors 😭 is aseprite looking for a specific libfmt version? that seems weird

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all that work and I had to uninstall aseprite anyway pffft my poor laptop

pliant snow
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Did the main repos update at least?

dusty pollen
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no, not enough storage space pffft

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might give up for tonight and go back to it tomorrow

pliant snow
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rip...

dusty pollen
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okay cleared the pacman cache because this is bad ideas time and that was enough

dusty pollen
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whooo it worked

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wait did it work or did it crash

pliant snow
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the dicotomy

dusty pollen
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uh, I'll leave the rest of this to some other time because paru isn't working now

safe dragon
pliant snow
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Booo

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live on the wild side

marble jewel
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Mac Users, why is it conventional wisdom on MacOS that you need to use a separate 3rd party program to uninstall your applications for real-real?

pliant snow
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Mac applications are pretty self-contained, you should just be able to delete the .app file and that's it

dusty pollen
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I didn't spend a very long time using mac tbf but from what little I did, I don't remember that being conventional wisdom

marble jewel
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I often see App Cleaner recommended as an essential utility, and even in tests I've found that App Cleaner does pick up on remnants that simply deleting an app does not find.

dusty pollen
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I've seen that on windows too tbf

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a lot of "true uninstaller"s etc

pliant snow
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Oh yeah, I've seen people hawking those types of programs. I don't really see the appeal of them, they're mostly to clean up config files left behind (which are also left on Windows and Linux too, so Mac is no exception)

dusty pollen
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I think it was initially necessary for certain types of viruses/nuisance apps that refused to uninstall properly and people ran with it because they realised they could sell it as part of those freemium OS tools

marble jewel
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Oh yeah, Windows definitely leaves behind abandoned data. It's just curious that apps can leave behind things that seem akin to a folder in Program Files. Like bare minimum of what you think uninstallation should handle.

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Even App Store installs leave behind app data

dusty pollen
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(the same tools that do "disk health checkups" that recommend you defrag all the time etc. They just cost too much money when not in free mode for something that you don't really need)

marble jewel
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Well at least Pear Cleaner is free OSS, seems to be well supported, and in my tests has accurately discovered left behind folders by apps which I uninstalled

rotund violet
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It might be "conventional wisdom" in the sense that most people aren't very bright.

marble jewel
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The same developer makes Sentinel for MacOS which is supposed to help deal with Gatekeeper/Quarantine issues, I wonder if that's been used as part of troubleshooting MacOS/SMAPI issues

marble jewel
rotund violet
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Dunno, I've never had any issues. But I know how to take 5 seconds to go into the security settings and unblock an app.

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There's no flaw, it's just unnecessary. Uninstalling a Windows program generally doesn't delete it's AppData either. It's stored in a different place, and is intentionally supposed to get left behind in case you reinstall.

marble jewel
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In case you're not up to speed, SMAPI on MacOS has been a whole deal for people, and simply unblocking hasn't solved it for the majority who encounter issues

rotund violet
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I'm up to speed, I'm just ¯_(ツ)_/¯ because I never had any issue other than the usual "oh this isn't an official Apple-approved app" deal which takes a few seconds to work around.

pliant snow
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What's the SMAPI issue?

dusty pollen
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gets marked as malware

rotund violet
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I think people just get terrified by the word "malware" in there and their rational brain function, to the extent that they have any, shuts down. It's a standard-ish message and you just need to unblock the app in security.

dusty pollen
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no, it's a deeper issue - there's no unblock button

marble jewel
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For some users, MacOS flags SMAPI as malware, and the default steps to deal with it don't work for all

pliant snow
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Time to ban Pathos...

dusty pollen
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the default steps have been more consistent recently but they require users to do things like adding various tools to "developer tools" etc, which most users would never know to do.

rotund violet
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I dunno why some Macs would be behaving so differently. Usually the whole deal with Macs is that it's all uniform.

dusty pollen
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(that's part of the problem and why I'll never use macos as my main os, because the fact that I may have to jump through hoops just to install something I want to install rubs me the wrong way)

rotund violet
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Eh, it's just the equivalent of chmod a+rx

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It's not "jumping through hoops", it's a few seconds of work unless there's some corporate blocker or something.

dusty pollen
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I don't think so? there's a step specifically involving developer tools or something (I'll admit, I haven't dug too deep into it)

rotund violet
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Whatever is supposedly happening with SMAPI is not a typical Mac experience.

pliant snow
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For mod development maybe, but certainly not as a user

marble jewel
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Yeah that's kind of dismissive language for someone who is probably a lot more technically competent than the average user

rotund violet
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I actually like, a lot, that you can set app-specific permissions on Mac OS, and wish Windows had that feature. For example, I like BlueMail on Windows as an app, but it drives me crazy with the way it handles updates with focus-stealing modal dialogs, and on a Mac it either wouldn't be allowed to do that or I'd have to give it specific permission to do that.

marble jewel
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It just work
Well except for when it doesn't
But that's not how it's normally like
But that actually is how it is
The users must not be that smart

That's the Apple attitude in a nutshell. Goes back to antenna-gate where it's the users fault for holding their phone in the most obvious way.

crystal wren
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What I very strongly dislike about the whole SMAPI issue is the wording of that dialogue.

Either nobody at Apple stopped to think for a second about the reputational damage the "will damage your system" wording could have on especially smaller developers, or someone mid to high level dismissed the concerns.

marble jewel
rotund violet
crystal wren
dusty pollen
marble jewel
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I'm just saying, it's not the first time that Apple gets excuses for their known issues

crystal wren
marble jewel
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I mean at least in Windows we can all acknowledge it's shortcomings, but anytime it's Apple, it's like never their fault

dusty pollen
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I have lost a lot of my ability to be charitable towards Apple and their behaviour tbh

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I think they make fantastic devices that are often in concept better than windows, but they're just so controlling and awful about consumer rights that I have no desire to deal with them

pliant snow
rotund violet
#

I've been plenty critical about various things in the Apple system and on MacOS. That's part of why I don't care for the more bizarre criticisms fixating on a single unusual situation, which distracts from very real criticism of very real issues.

dusty pollen
#

the SMAPI thing may have been a specific issue that doesn't crop up much, but it does serve as a reminder for me at least that I'd rather be in a system where I know that nothing is being handled that way and ultimately I am trusted to make decisions about the things I own, ig.

rotund violet
#

It's like people who still gripe about Windows being too unsecure - I mean, maybe? But the real problems with Windows today revolve around being far too intrusive and aggressive on various issues.

dusty pollen
#

yeah, no OS is perfect, I had a much better time on mac than I did windows if I'm being honest, but the part of me that likes being able to control my own things is never going to fully move away from linux at this point. It's just about individual opinion though

#

I have an ipad myself SDVpuffersquee good piece of kit

pliant snow
#

Except for Temple OS, of course

dusty pollen
#

of course

#

maybe I should learn HolyC pffft

pliant snow
#

Although the 8 people who used BeOS also seem to think they were top dog

sand frost
#

I personally do not use any of the "cleaner" softwares and assumed they were all malware tbh

marble jewel
#

I have a Macbook, an iPad, and an iPhone. I'm definitely in Apple's ecosystem. I use each of these products extensively, but Apple definitely has a "they know more than you" mentality when it comes to what you're able to do

sand frost
#

Yeah, I don't love everything about Apple, but I hate almost everything about Windows soooooo

rotund violet
#

I think all the OSes have their pluses and minuses, some more so than others perhaps, but I hate the holy wars more than I hate any individual OS.

cinder karma
#

Apple is probably smarter than I am tbh

dusty pollen
#

yeah, I don't like feeling like I'm not allowed/trusted to do things with my own devices or like I have to disable some kind of childlock that apple imposed on me either, but I think they're very very very slowly being forced to change from that perspective

cinder karma
#

We will allow it

sand frost
cinder karma
#

At this point treating me as a child but not crashing when I try to open a word file would be an improvement

sand frost
#

and the last steps on the list are super annoying

dusty pollen
marble jewel
#

I'm glad EU is pushing Apple towards more openness, I only wish the US could follow suit

dusty pollen
#

I've given up on word documents like five years ago. Text files, take it or leave it

sand frost
#

At one point, I could choose between outlook crashing on launch or never being able to reserve rooms (at a job where I had to schedule meetings in rooms)

dusty pollen
#

my internship still used lotusnotes for email SDVpuffersquee to be fair, the internship was at IBM lmao

rotund violet
# dusty pollen yeah, I don't like feeling like I'm not allowed/trusted to do things with my own...

I just don't get that impression at all, and while Matt has some valid points, you've said yourself that you don't use macs so this is just wild speculation.

You see it as a "child lock", I see it as actually wanting to give me control over what apps do, and prevent them from doing things behind my back, which a lot of developers really want their apps to do. And I guess this SMAPI thing ended up being a clusterfuck of every individual component coming together to do exactly the wrong thing. Sometimes good policies result in bad outcomes when they're misapplied, that's life.

#

As I said, Apple in general and MacOS in particular is far from being innocent or problem free, but being locked into an ecosystem is an iOS thing, not a MacOS thing.

sand frost
#

It's definitely true that I appreciate Apple walling off for privacy in a lot of cases, I generally wish I had a bit more control over the whole thing.

#

Like there's so many apps that request location data just for fun?

dusty pollen
rotund violet
#

It's a tricky problem to solve. Make the permissions too granular and users just end up confused and frustrated with all the permission prompts. Or you can be like Android and have the worst of both worlds, where permissions are both too specific and too confusing.

dusty pollen
#

this is just the subjective impression I got from using macs

rotund violet
#

Don't know if Apple has threaded the needle there, but also don't know if anyone else has.

#

Permissions on Android have come a long way over the years but there are still a lot of apps whose developers have to write help-text explanations of why they want a particular permission, because the thing they're actually trying to do is wildly out of step with how the permission is normally described. So... yeah, tough problem.

dusty pollen
#

oh, my samsung is almost as bad as any apple device, don't get me wrong

rotund violet
#

I've been on both sides of the issue, trying to define the permissions and trying to work around the permissions framework.

marble jewel
#

I'm critical of Macbook even though I genuinely enjoy the experience a million times more than my previous Windows laptop. Like it's superior in a lot of ways, but it also gets in the way of things that I think should be handled differently. I'm not a big fan of Finder trying to hide the concept of a filesystem from you.

dusty pollen
#

oh yeah that confused me

rotund violet
#

Yes, definitely agree there, and especially obnoxious with the Applications folder (which is, in fact, just a folder).

dusty pollen
#

I have a love-hate relationship with spotlight

rotund violet
#

Even having to memorize a keyboard shortcut for your home folder because it never wants to show that in any window or dialog.

dusty pollen
#

I did appreciate that on apple devices, notifications require a permission

#

I wish android did the same thing

marble jewel
#

I haven't built the muscle memory to effectively navigate to folders outside of my user folder, so it's a whole deal every time

dusty pollen
#

iirc I spent like 80% of my macbook time in terminal anyway lmao

#

good practice for when I moved to linux right after

#

I just refused to figure out finder SDVpuffersquee

rotund violet
#

One thing that macs seem to do effortlessly that Windows still can't do after all these years is remember which windows were open, which folders were expanded, where you were in each terminal session, etc. If you spend hours setting it up, you can kind of, almost get something a little like that in Windows, but janky as hell and only works some of the time.

#

Ubuntu wasn't much better when I was running it either, last I remember.

marble jewel
#

Windows is a lot better about that with Snapping windows and such. I use PowerToys and Alt+Snap to supplement the experience.

crystal wren
#

A very (not) fun thing Windows does is refusing to acknowledge the "please don't restart my programs when you reboot because of an update or something like that" setting.

rotund violet
#

Yeah, so do I, but I still have to relaunch half my apps, reopen all the windows, etc. It remembers the placements, that's all. And I still can't figure out how to get Windows Terminal to actually remember the path and/or history of each terminal, so it'll open automatically with 5 tabs, but the 5 tabs are all empty and pointing to the default home directory.

#

Explorer does have a feature to remember which windows were open, which is... something. It's Explorer only, though.

dusty pollen
#

can't relate to any of the options you guys said /lh, ever since I started using a tiling window manager nothing else feels right

marble jewel
#

I'm also glad that Windows Explorer finally has built in tabs

crystal wren
#

I'd still rather have it not perform terribly, though.

marble jewel
#

Peformance is janky, but it's more reliable than a lot of 3rd party software I used to do to add them

safe dragon
crystal wren
#

Of course, now Windows Explorer is Windows Recall: With Explorer. /j

safe dragon
#

you can toggle off notification permissions or sometimes even which specific type of notifications from the application settings on android

#

at least on a pixel but I'd assume any

dusty pollen
#

they're always enabled by default

safe dragon
#

ah fair

#

it's not one they have to ask permission for on install

crystal wren
#

I think they are, yeah, but some apps do still ask you to enable that setting, so I... don't know.

safe dragon
#

I think they have to ask if it's a persistent notification like for a vpn or something

dusty pollen
#

exactly. Apple makes them ask before they first send a notification which I appreciate because I always say no lmao

crystal wren
#

I don't know if iOS does this, but I do love the granularity you can get on Android when apps actually use the functionality.

Screenshot_20250205-185917.png
safe dragon
#

my only conscious experience with notifications on my ipad is that I always swipe in the wrong direction to remove them and then end up on some funky page I have never intended to go to before

crystal wren
#

Like I can individually turn off friend request and DM notifications if I want.

safe dragon
#

yeah though you have shitty apps like instagram that, despite having a lot of notification granularity they love to put random shit in the "priority" category

#

one you're unlikely to untick

crystal wren
#

And always put their spammy notifications in the "general" category.

marble jewel
#

Stardock used to be the company that gave me all the Windows tweaks. I'm not using any of their things anymore.

safe dragon
#

I always use microsoft without messing around too much. I think my IT department wouldn't appreciate it if I installed a bunch of windows tweaks

crystal wren
#

PowerToys is always nice to have around still.

safe dragon
#

I've heard a lot about it

safe dragon
#

remember when

marble jewel
#

It's got this now, but it's far from perfect

image.png
crystal wren
#

That's the one I explicitly turn off.

#

And that it sometimes refuses to listen to.

safe dragon
#

oh that's the kind of setting I set to off immediately

#

doesn't work

#

but it's the idea that counts

marble jewel
#

I rarely restart anyway. I can see the appeal if it did what it intended to do.

#

I want the same apps open in the same state everytime I start it up, and whenever I have to restart it disrupts my flow.

crystal wren
#

Now if it did memory snapshots of programs...

#

That I might use.

#

Oh and Matt, so you had no luck with the hot reload thing? SDVpufferwaaah

safe dragon
#

for like 6 months I had something hogging memroy on windows that I just couldn't figure out cause nothing showed up in task manager at all. I'd done so many shut downs and restarts hoping it would fix itself but it wouldn't.

It was then that I figured out that windows was behind the scenes trying to relaunch a bunch of stuff in the background even after a full restart

#

I looked up some way to do a genuine proper true actual shut down and the problem went away

marble jewel
safe dragon
#

damn

safe dragon
safe dragon
dusty pollen
#

but I'm with you, I'm a clean start kind of person. Don't bring anything back, open a brand new empty session every single time

supple ether
#

I configured mine to do a clean shutdown every time

dusty pollen
#

I've been using my laptop again a little bit and now using windows on my desktop is even more annoying SDVpufferflat I love my arch install

safe dragon
#

I luckily only use windows for work these days

#

I have a fair share of bugs on linux too but they're my bugs and I love them

dusty pollen
#

I use windows on my desktop because it was easier to play some other games on windows than linux and now I just stuck with it ig

dusty pollen
safe dragon
#

I switched to linux only after the initial proton release from steam and I realized I could get away with it

#

proton ended up a lot better than I expected though

#

honestly at this point the games work better than the steam client itself

worn remnant
#

i got hot reload working on linux using ordinary dotnet watch run so i don't have to use a particular IDE, but it is less than ideal in a couple of significant ways so i don't recommend it to others

safe dragon
#

hot reload has always worked fine for me through rider

#

but that does require being able to launch rider

dusty pollen
#

proton works fantasically, I can't remember if it was through proton or wine but you can actually run the sims 4 just fine on linux

#

rider makes my laptop try to start a fire

safe dragon
#

well wine is a major part of it either way...

dusty pollen
#

yeah, I just can't remember if I was directly using it or using proton haha

dusty pollen
safe dragon
#

at least hot reload on js frameworks has always worked for me... Even detecting funky changes like modifying the .env file and rebooting the server automatically

dusty pollen
#

I just have trauma from having a million different :watch scripts set

safe dragon
#

fair

dusty pollen
#

and all calling each other. and nodemon.

safe dragon
#

I hate blazor with all my heart but one advantage it has over every damn javascript library is that it doesn't require a billion configuration files and bundlers and random other shit to function

dusty pollen
#

c#... web frontend? that just doesn't feel right

safe dragon
#

oh man

#

there have been web frontends with C# for a very long time

dusty pollen
#

It's real .NET running in the browser on WebAssembly.

1 fear

safe dragon
#

that would be blazor wasm specifically yes

dusty pollen
safe dragon
#

I've worked with several of them unfortunately

rain apex
#

But crumble i only ever hear u complain about it

dusty pollen
#

I don't understand the why of it tbh. like who thought of this and decided this was the best tool for the job

rain apex
#

Wasm has appeal for people who don't like JavaScript

safe dragon
#

the why is simple. You have a team of C# developers and oh no you want a web interface but your existing programmers either don't know or hate javascript

#

and thus web forms, silverlight, razor pages... blazor

dusty pollen
#

for all the hate javascript deservedly gets... actually never mind it deserves it no matter what

safe dragon
#

lmao

dusty pollen
#

ecmascript can try but at the end of the day it will not unjavascript javascript

safe dragon
#

I'm not opposed to wasm frameworks or even just traditional server side frameworks to avoid javascript as much as possible but microsoft just sucks at making them

dusty pollen
#

I've started to believe that front-end dev was always just destined to massively suck

#

luckily I never liked it anyway SDVpuffersquee

safe dragon
#

I don't really like it either but I've always worked "full stack" so I touch everything from database to frontend...

white raft
#

JavaScript is the great sin of our age

dusty pollen
#

I like for all my code to be at the level where if you put any specific number directly into your code people will look at you funny

#

and ask you why you're using magic numbers and why it's not being set as a constant somewhere

safe dragon
#

I love magic numbers

marble jewel
#

Javascript in the backend was a Monkey Paw wish from backend developers wanting to be able to use the same code on both sides.

dusty pollen
#

and hey, now we got it and it never caused any problems to anyone

safe dragon
#

blazor was a monkey paw wish in the opposite direction

dusty pollen
#

I will say, deploying nodejs apps is very satisfying

#

even if you need like 20GB of server space for a tiny web app SBVLmaoDog

white raft
rain apex
#

Evil

white raft
#

Cast it into the flames

dusty pollen
#

but like I did some devops stuff and it's just so effective for that

safe dragon
#

I'm always a little amused when I run my hobby rust server and it uses like a few mbs of memory total for absolutely everything

dusty pollen
#

plop your code on the server, one command, the exact dependencies are installed that were running on your machine with no conflicts because there can't be conflicts

#

like,,, that's so nice sometimes

safe dragon
#

sorry the server is running a different version of node

marble jewel
#

My humble home server

image.png
dusty pollen
#

never had an issue with that tbh but I can't remember why. There may have been multiple versions accessible in most servers or something?

#

nice, do you run any external/public facing things from that or is it just for home use?

marble jewel
#

I use a VPS for internet facing things

#

This is all home or tunneled traffic for private use

safe dragon
#

those 33 gigs for docker is actually only to run a single hello world app

marble jewel
#

I run hello world on a swarm with an offsite failover to guarantee 100% uptime

safe dragon
#

gotta run it on the edge, it's 2025

marble jewel
#

Yeah I have to make sure it's deployed globally. I never know where I could be accessing it from.

rain apex
#

Is the hello localized

safe dragon
#

no that feature was cut

marble jewel
#

Bonjour World

safe dragon
#

still world

dusty pollen
#

I have a vps set up for some old discord bots I made people but that's it pffft

safe dragon
#

what is world in french

#

monde or something?

#

yes

#

I still remember some french, incredible

marble jewel
#

My VPS mainly does image hosting, short links, and I have it handling my uptime monitoring for my home server.

#

It has a tunnel to a read only proxy to docker so I can get alerted when things are down regardless of my home internet connection.

safe dragon
#

my server is running absolutely nothing except a file server rn...

#

I've considered adding immich to it

#

it looks a little too google photosy to me but it seems nice

marble jewel
#

I think I'm hosting around 70 or so containers

#

Oh and 4 VMs

safe dragon
#

power user

#

I'll have you know that mine will someday probably run a minecraft server again

marble jewel
#

It started with a few things to de-Google my life, and has grown since

#

If you run a MInecraft server, I highly recommend itzg/minecraft-server and itzg/mc-router

crystal wren
#

What, not McMyAdmin? /j

marble jewel
#

You can have a proper server address, and I run dev/prd envs so I can test things in one and deploy to the other

#

I used to use a few different tools including McMyAdmin and lgsm

#

Researched a whole bunch of others too

#

But ultimately, I like that everything in my current setup is configurable in a version controlled system

#

So that when I break things (which I have and will again) I can easily roll back

lethal walrus
marble jewel
#

Shoot, I can share my entire configuration with you in text. It makes it so easy.

pliant snow
#

Ive used that container. Its nice, but it really wants things done its way, which kinda annoyed me

marble jewel
#

Also have a .env with some settings

pliant snow
#

What is mc-router

marble jewel
#

It's a reverse proxy

#

You can map a subdomain to different servers, for example

pliant snow
#

Ah. Is there an advantage over a regular reverse proxy?

marble jewel
#

Regular reverse proxy wouldn't work since they're typically configured for TCP traffic over HTTP/HTTPS

pliant snow
#

You could still forward the port I would've thought

marble jewel
#

It's not just the port though, it's the protocol among other things

pliant snow
#

I swore ive done it with a regular reverse proxy at some point, but its been a while

sonic mirage
marble jewel
#

What a steal

rotund violet
#

People were paying a lot more than that for their 4090s...

marble jewel
#

Who would pay for such a thing... *cough

image.png
cinder karma
#

God that is expensive

supple ether
#

That cost more than my entire computer plus peripherals

cinder karma
#

It's more than twice thr cost of my computer lol

supple ether
#

I assume no gpu in your computer?

#

Otherwise you'd have to cut a lot of corners to get something under $800

cinder karma
#

No gpu yeah

#

It's also six years old

supple ether
#

Mine is also six years old

#

I have a 1660ti, which thus far has been sufficient since my monitor is 1080p and I don't play aaa games.

cinder karma
#

I don't have a gpu at all which works great because I don't play any games whatsoever:P

#

Also I don't have a personality

pliant snow
#

That GPU is now your personality

sand frost
#

There’s all the knitting

marble jewel
#

Knitting is a valid personality, and don't let anyone tell you differently

cinder karma
#

I run long distances, I go to work, and I knit.

rain apex
#

What about the part where you get annoyed by spaget

cinder karma
#

This is the definition of having no personality

#

I love spaghetti! Make my own meatballs too

marble jewel
#

There's not much more to me other than the three Cs - cooking, coding, and cats.

sand frost
#

Cnitting

keen granite
#

does content patcher have problems with .wav files?

#

or something else did they change the audio modding on content patcher Ö-Ö?

cinder karma
keen granite
#

oh damn sry

uncut seal
#

Hoy, I have a C# question about templates:
I have:

bool super_func<T>(ref T param)
{
  // Do stuff
  if (func(param)) return true;
  // Do stuff
}

bool func<T>(ref T param)
{
  // Do stuff for most possible T types
}

bool func(ref Rectangle param)
{
  // Do stuff specifically for Rectangle
}

Is it possible to have super_func use the last method when T is Rectangle? according to how the code runs right now, it looks like it runs func<T> anyway. I tried to put a condition in func<T> to force the use of the last func but it will still call func<T> according to the editor.

rain apex
#

func<Rectangle>

uncut seal
#

where should I put that? I can't call the last function that because it says func<T> already has these parameters

#

And I don't want to put that in super_func since it has to work for every possible T

marble jewel
#

I don't know if there's a better way, but the way I'd go about it is probably to just put a switch on param in super_func.

#

Or even a switch on param in func would work too

uncut seal
# 
  if (param is Rectangle) return func(ref param)

like this? It looks like it would just call func<T> again according to VSCode method proposition. Imma try it

marble jewel
#

That would work. I like the readability of switch which is why I'd do it that way myself.

safe dragon
#

I'm not sure why it doesn't work in the first place

#

I admittedly never really try to rely on C# picking the right method like this

cinder karma
#

I run by the rules where if I have to consult the specific overload resolution rules for a language I'm doing a Bad

#

Tbh

marble jewel
# 
return param switch
{
    Rectangle rect => func(ref rect),
    _ => func(param)
};
safe dragon
#

I'd assume

if (param is Rectangle rect) return func(ref rect);

Would be the most certain to work but yeah...

#

like actually using the casted version

uncut seal
#

I don't even remember if I actually relied on C# to pick the correct method or if I just didn't notice it could pick the wrong method

uncut seal
rain apex
#

Im pretty sure if u have a generic and a type specific overload of said generic it should go to there

#

Define a bool func<Rectangle>(ref Rectangle param) I mean

safe dragon
#

honestly I already avoid ref

#

makes me feel icky

cinder karma
#

Whyyyyy

cinder karma
#

I must ask

rain apex
#

It's fine probably

cinder karma
#

There are no pintails or newtonsoft involved yes

uncut seal
marble jewel
#

ref doesn't seem very SOLID

uncut seal
uncut seal
safe dragon
#

I assume rectangle is a struct

uncut seal
#

I think so, yes

cinder karma
#

It is

safe dragon
#

can't imagine it contains enough data to make passing it by reference worth it but I'd have to benchmark

cinder karma
#

Four floats iirc

safe dragon
#

last time I messed around with small structs like that and looked at the IL in release mode is just completely deleted the struct creation entirely in a few cases and just worked directly with the fields

#

that was in .NET 9 though

#

I know sdv mod developers are stuck with .NET 6

uncut seal
#

I pass it by ref because it's the result of the method : try_parse

#

so that the method return a bool saying if it was successful

safe dragon
#

it follows the standard TryParse pattern except a ref instead of out I suppose

rain apex
#

Yeah why don't u just use an out

uncut seal
#

can't remember tbh

#

I did that in November

safe dragon
#

many moons ago

#

that's when I started my current job

uncut seal
#

I think it's so I don't have to initialize the result in the parsing method. Why did I want that? Idk

rain apex
#

It's gonna get init somewhere LilyDerp

safe dragon
#

why require T to implement new() when you can just ask them to do it for you

#

🙏

marble jewel
#

I'm not into football, but my Superbowl is that I recently tested 5 new browsers, and one of them has replaced my previous default.

#

The last champion has been dethroned.

rain apex
#

What is the criteria of the test

marble jewel
#

Nothing too specific, but I have gotten used to certain features that I can't do without

#

For example, vertical tree-style tabs is one of them

rain apex
#

What does that mean

#

Pls understand that I don't think very hard about browsers and just use chrome

marble jewel
#

Here are my tabs currently. (Had to make sure there's nothing too incriminating in there)

image.png
rain apex
#

Wow it's revolutionary DokkanStare

marble jewel
#

I'm using Floorp as my browser with user.js tweaks from arkenfox for added privacy

#

Floorp has a really cool feature where you can make any extension into a pinned sidebar, as well as arbitrary urls.

#

So for my tabs, I'm using the Sidebery extension.

safe dragon
#

it can fit all 1 tab I have open rn

cinder karma
safe dragon
#

and performance is the guiding light for any programming decision

cinder karma
#

Obviously!!!@

#

Gotta hug my fractions of a nanosecond

safe dragon
#

fractions of a nanosecond would be impressive for a ghz processor

marble jewel
#

You don't need to worry about performance. You just have to make sure that GBs Total outpaces GBs used forever and ever.

safe dragon
#

I don't worry about anything

#

if it explodes it explodes

marble jewel
#

All I know is the answer to every limitation on computers is to make the bottom number in the fraction bigger.

safe dragon
#

slap in an O(n^n) algorithm

rotund violet
uncut seal
uncut seal
marble jewel
#

Gecko is our last hope against Chromium world domination (unless anything comes of Ladybird)

rotund violet
#

You will be assimilated.

safe dragon
#

ladybird seems to be making solid progress fwiw

#

it's still definitely not ready to be used outside messing around but it's progressing quite quickly

uncut seal
#

Any issue with firefox I should know?

safe dragon
#

I haven't really had any

uncut seal
#

it's my default, my favorite feature is the desktop/mobile sync

#

my main issue right now is that whatever the browser is, there's no perfect alternative to google as a SE

#

when I'm in Europe I use Qwant but that's it

marble jewel
#

I like to re-evaluate some of the main applications I use 2-3 times a year just to make sure I'm not locking myself into an option without know what else is out there

#

I made the switch from Chromium-forks to Firefox-forks probably a year or so ago when I moved from Edge to Waterfox.

#

So far, just about everything has worked as expected for me.

#

Except for Google-specific sites nagging me to switch back.

#

But I've also made an attempt to de-Google myself in general, so that's become less and less noticeable.

safe dragon
#

I've tried a lot of search engines including paid ones but at this point all of them seem borderline unusable with the first page being ai generated slop

marble jewel
#

I'm paying for Kagi currently

#

It's my main search engine

safe dragon
#

I did use kagi for a fair while

#

it's certainly better but not... good

marble jewel
#

I find Kagi acceptable 99% of the time, but I will occasionally bring up Google or even throw a question over to ChatGPT

safe dragon
#

I repeated some test some youtube video did where they searched for "glb file format" and went through the entire first page and marked everything that was AI

#

the kagi first page was basically identical other than a single difference where kagi actually listed the glb file specification document from the khronos group

#

which to be fair is probably the best place to go if you want to know about glb files

#

but the rest was still AI generated articles that were both wrong and ridiculously verbose at the same time

marble jewel
#

Even so, I'm still using it for the privacy aspect. Not that I'm doing anything I want to hide, but don't want to be Google product.

safe dragon
#

yeah fair enough

#

I just went back to ddg

#

which is... fine

rain apex
safe dragon
#

I did just make a major decision like two hours ago though. Decided to register my own mail domains so that I am in the future theoretically not dependent on a specific email provider anymomre

marble jewel
#

I do that, but I'm letting Protonmail be the actual handler

safe dragon
#

I switched to protonmail like a year or two ago I think but now I've registered custom domains there

marble jewel
#

Got a few domains for email purposes

safe dragon
#

so same then

#

I already had a domain I used for a few things which I now set up to function for emails and added one that is suitable for personal emails as well

#

both handled by protonmail, for now anyway

rotund violet
# safe dragon which is... fine

I don't find DDG fine, TBH... the results are usually worse than Google. I don't know how it's possible since they scrape from Google, but somehow they are. Kagi is usually at least as good, sometimes better.

safe dragon
#

nah they use Bing behind the scenes not google

rotund violet
#

Used to like Proton a lot as well but the past year or two they've been really starting to creep me out too.

safe dragon
#

same

#

not about to run away but I see it as a sign to own my own email domain finally

marble jewel
#

I switched from Fastmail to Proton, and tbh either seemed like decent enough options

#

I was using both for different domains for a time, and just decided to move it all to Proton

#

But I'd still recommend Fastmail as a pretty good option

marble jewel
rotund violet
#

It's not exactly any one thing, just a lot of messages and politicking that seems to have run contrary to their founding/stated mission.

#

I'd dig up one of those old announcements but I tend to delete them on sight. (That's another thing, they won't stop sending me ad emails.)

safe dragon
#

yeah the CEO shares a little too much about their views on their social media as well let's just say that

marble jewel
#

They definitely have more services than I care to take advantage of. Particularly anything to do with password management, crypto, AI, etc.

#

I do use Mail, Calendar, and VPN however.

safe dragon
#

mail and vpn for me

#

calendar... I legit don't have

#

which is strange perhaps

rotund violet
#

Like, for example, there was an incident a few years ago where Proton silently and mysteriously deleted the lines about not collecting user data from their privacy policy. I'm not sure if they ever put them back. People noticed, and their public response was something like: "pffff, yeah whatever, it's still encrypted 'n stuff".

safe dragon
#

I have a work calendar but not a personal one rn

marble jewel
#

Interesting...

rotund violet
#

I do still use them, mainly for modding stuff, but not for any sensitive personal stuff. Have my own mail domain for that.

marble jewel
#

Anyway, I don't like to get too dependent on any one company, so I'm always keeping an eye out for what's out there.

#

Especially if a company starts acting against my interests

safe dragon
#

yeah me too more and more

#

luckily I'm tech savvy enough not to be scared away by these things

uncut seal
safe dragon
#

yup

worn remnant
# marble jewel But I'd still recommend Fastmail as a pretty good option

the best thing about fastmail is what it says on the tin: it's fast, as if someone there actually cares about what it's like to use.
(obviously that concern doesn't matter if you are using a different client, but if you find yourself logging into the web interface at any point, fastmail's is delightful and (e.g.) proton's is not. proton i think might be slower and have more full content repaints than google, which is an impressive (derogatory) feat. but i haven't actually timed it)

marble jewel
#

It was a pretty even toss up for me, although I do agree that the user experience on Fastmail was a delight. I also like that Fastmail allowed me to use my preferred mail clients (which is mostly on my phone) whereas Proton is only usable through their app. I don't consider the bridging solution a solution at all.

#

The tie breaker was probably that I'd use Proton's VPN so it gets rid of another service that I might be paying for otherwise.

worn remnant
#

fair play. i am in favor of removing eels

dusty pollen
dusty pollen
#

I think I unborked my laptop now. It was pretty minimally borked all things considered, lightdm was just whining because I had 0 free bytes on my root partition

#

now I just need to figure out what's wrong with paru and we're back in the running

#

on the plus side, I found the charger for the other linux laptop, so it looks like that one's getting an update too soon SDVpuffersquee

#

I think it's just very out of date, hopefully a manual build will solve everything SDVpufferthinkblob

#

(that was indeed the issue. Nice.)

ivory shadow
#

The number one reason random VMs I have break is the root partition filling because one random thing doesn't have log rotation set up.

dusty pollen
#

my hard drive is just small but also I have no idea when the last time I rotated my journal was, it's almost definitely in the gigabytes

#

oh, only 600ish M, not as bad as I was expecting

uncut seal
#

I've been using Linux for about 2 years now, but I have no idea what y'all are talking about

latent bough
dusty pollen
uncut seal
#

Arch is the next distro in my crosshair the day I get sick of Nobara

pliant snow
#

today is that day

safe dragon
#

today is the day where I try some weird ass window manager again actually

#

niri

pliant snow
#

cosmic was too mainstream

cinder karma
#

I'm "fuck it I'll just use whatever" years old

safe dragon
#

I'm not just yet

pliant snow
#

a long line seems it would quickly get annoying

safe dragon
#

I mean it's kind of a grid

cinder karma
#

Fun fact: at work, on my linux machine, sometimes the windows manager just crashes

safe dragon
#

you can change workspace

cinder karma
#

the behavior is this: your current windows will remain at exactly the locations they are

#

you can't move them after that

#

sometimes I don't notice for hours since I just have three terminals in specific locations 90% of the time

safe dragon
#

that's quite the window manager

cinder karma
#

but then I go to make one bigger and can't

safe dragon
#

I don't think your window manager manages windows very much

dusty pollen
#

ngl I'm never leaving i3 at this point

cinder karma
#

(for obvious reasons I can't reboot the machine.)

#

but I can restart the windows manager if I can get a terminal open

dusty pollen
#

I have it set up all right and comfy sleepykitty

safe dragon
#

i3 had absolutely horrendous screentearing for me back in the day so I had to use sway instead

cinder karma
#

(I say "my linux machine" I'm actually an instance on a server)

dusty pollen
#

huh, never had any i3 screentearing issues personally

#

does sway have many tiling wms now?

#

wait no sway is a wm

cinder karma
#

(this is the same system where we're goddamn happy we can manage 10fps)

dusty pollen
#

I have forgotten all my linux ecosystem stuff pffft

safe dragon
dusty pollen
#

I did at various points, yeah SDVpufferthinkblob

#

not right now, right now I'm on a laptop

safe dragon
#

hmmm

#

it was always terrible for me on x11 in general

#

but i3 was the worst

dusty pollen
#

(one of the f keys, not all of them lmao)

safe dragon
#

I switched to Wayland primarily motivated by the lack of screentearing finally

cinder karma
#

(we use vim. Actual vim.)

safe dragon
#

not vi

pliant snow
#

never vi

safe dragon
#

but yes it's time for me to use a weird ass distribution again

pliant snow
#

running off of alpine

dusty pollen
#

I also use vim SDVpuffersquee but only for config files etc

#

doing them via an IDE seems wrong

safe dragon
#

i meant window manager instead of distro... I won't leave arch

dusty pollen
#

arch does that to you

#

you get everything all set up and never want to leave again

safe dragon
#

I've tried a lot of others

#

I always go back

dusty pollen
#

I've tried a couple, not many, and not since moving to arch

#

I did manjaro for a while and decided to take all the people in support threads asking "why don't you just move to arch and be done with it?" at their word

safe dragon
#

I too used manjaro

#

also endeavoros

pliant snow
#

I might have wi-fi again today, that'll be exciting

safe dragon
#

damn

#

non borked firmware

dusty pollen
#

I set up windows-style screenshots finally the other day (I had flameshot installed for ages, I just bound it to mod+shift+s haha)

cinder karma
#

absolutely required if you mod stardew

#

because otherwise getting screenshots for mod pages is a pain

pliant snow
#

oh i thought the screenshots were just for flexing

safe dragon
#

I always set up region screenshots as one of the first things on any distro

dusty pollen
#

the weird thing is that because of this, screenshots now work better on linux than on windows for me for stardew pffft windows seems to have issues with the stardew window

#

I always have to open the screenshot tool, it will show the window however it looked before I tabbed out of it the most recent time, then if I close it and open it again it will show it how it was before I tried to screenshot the first time

uncut seal
#

I'm on Nobara, a version of Fedora with dirver management included. I tried Gnome and KDE but I prefer Gnome for now because I couldn't figure out how to setup a Japanese Anthy keyboard on KDE.

safe dragon
#

alright I'm now on niri

#

funky as expected

#

it's a really odd experience to open a window and just have your whole desktop slide sideways instead of windows resizing

#

even full screen windows

#

I can't imagine games handle that particularly gracefully

safe dragon
#

always surprised by how well these really novel funky window managers seem to function

rotund violet
#

I don't understand tiling window managers.

#

I mean obviously I understand the concept, but don't understand the appeal. It's nice to have the ability to maximize a window or put 4 to a screen or whatever, but to be forced into it all the time or have windows pushed offscreen or compressed into tiny little slices because... reasons?

dusty pollen
#

it just fits how I work I guess? I never open enough windows in one workspace for that to be a problem

#

if I need to open more windows, I switch to a different workspace, and that way they're all organised where I need

rotund violet
#

That's the thing, though... if you don't open a lot of windows then what is the point of workspaces anyway.

dusty pollen
#

I open enough for them not to fit on one

#

I open a lot of windows, just not in the same workspace, I stick to max 3, maybe 4 if I use a tabbed layout

#

I always hated dragging and moving windows on top of each other, for me it's easier that way

safe dragon
#

personally for me the biggest feature of tiling window managers was actually the workspace management they offered and not the "tiling"

#

and the customization

dusty pollen
#

for me both are equally a part of it, I just hate moving windows around and dragging them etc

#

I like for anything that's open to be visible at the press of a button

safe dragon
#

tiling window managers do basically always support floating windows though which comes in handy from time to time

rotund violet
#

Moving windows around isn't great, but the only time I do it is when some app demands an entire screen for itself, like a game.

pliant snow
#

Yeah, I've never had a need for more advanced window management than the ability to do splits or move things into their own workspace

rotund violet
#

Guess I'm just never going to get it. I have too many windows to fit cleanly in one "workspace" but they are all related to the same task.

#

And the one or two windows that aren't directly related are kind of universal, every-workflow windows like Chrome or my music library.

safe dragon
#

even back on windows or gnome or kde I basically never used a window without it being maximized

#

I generally got annoyed when a window would forget it was maximized last time it opened and I have to manually do it

#

I guess for me I just didn't really use the floating aspect of floating window managers very much

#

and then windows would end up behind each other and things get annoying

rotund violet
#

I don't see how workspaces solve that better than a taskbar.

dusty pollen
#

I only even use the floating windows for popups like a file dialogue etc, everything else I just prefer tiled. Just meshes better with how I think

rotund violet
#

It's solved by having more monitors, or better focus discipline.

dusty pollen
#

this seems like more of an opinion thing and not something over which to accuse people of not having enough focus discipline?

rotund violet
#

The appeal of workspaces is apparently that you can click a button or press a hotkey to switch around a whole bunch of windows instead of just one window and I can't remember a time I've ever wanted to do that.

dusty pollen
#

I like tiling, you like floating, we can each use our preferred methods without suggesting one is better than the other in terms of skill or personal development

safe dragon
#

it's all down to preference I suppose. A minor extra thing is that all the floating window managers I've used just feel a little clunky and not very smooth other than gnome but gnome has a laundry list of usability problems in other ways

#

while in the tiling world there's a lot of lightweight very smooth feeling options

#

where windows just kinda flow into place

#

I assume macos is also like this but never used it

rotund violet
#

Mac is pretty much like Windows, for the most part. It has a slightly different concept of maximizing.

dusty pollen
#

macos does snapping better than windows iirc. I still personally prefer my tiling though

safe dragon
#

at least when I just see people using macos everything just looks very smooth with nice transitions and the likes

#

which is a minor thing but I like it

rotund violet
#

It has more animated transitions, yeah

#

I think Windows used to, I can't remember if they took it away or I just disabled them.

dusty pollen
#

I also loved my tiling wm when I would work on my laptop with an external monitor, I had a shortcut setup to swap workspaces between the two, it was great

#

now I don't do that and especially on my 13" laptop, screen real estate is a hot commodity (I have another one that's 15" so not as big an issue there but I still prefer it this way)

#

-# haha it's been ages since I enabled gaps on i3, I forgot how cool it looks

safe dragon
#

the original thing that made me return back to tiling window managers despite trying several time to switch back to kde or something was monitor independent workspaces. Basically that every workspace is only 1 monitor in size and and you can swap workspaces for only a single one of the monitors.
Like for example discord I often just want to keep on my right monitor regardless of what I'm doing otherwise.
On GNOME and KDE when you switch workspaces it switches for both monitors together which just makes me never use it.

They offer features to work around this limitation like the "only the main monitor has workspaces" setting or the ability to pin a window regardless of workspace but it's all janky and just a workaround for their limitations

dusty pollen
#

fun vibes (second screenshot has my extra polybar I use for monitoring resources, it appears when I hold down mod+z)

image.png image.png
safe dragon
#

COSMIC does support this but it's newer so it doesn't have legacy stuff holding it back

#

cosmic however is in alpha rn and has a bunch of issues

dusty pollen
safe dragon
#

on kde/gnome I find myself just not using workspaces at all because they don't work how I want them to

dusty pollen
#

I don't think I ever use workspaces outside of i3

#

even windows has them now. Never touched them

safe dragon
#

windows workspaces are a feature I don't think most people know exists despite it having a dedicated button in the task bar for years

dusty pollen
#

it's one of the buttons I immediately hide when setting up a windows install

rotund violet
#

And switching between sets of multiple windows at once is something I can't remember ever having wanted to do.

dusty pollen
#

pretty sure that also works in kde and gnome, the issue is if you want to switch to a workspace that has more open than a maximised window, which I personally do often want

safe dragon
#

yeah that's how I use it on kde. Just have a bunch of maximized windows and switch between them with the taskbar or alt tab

dusty pollen
#

I like having for example, a programming setup in one workspace with an IDE on the left, a terminal running whatever it is in the top right, and in the bottom right a tabbed container with another terminal and a browser for quick references, but then another workspace will be just a maximised browser for looking things up etc

#

or when I'm doing stardew things, the game will be on one workspace, the dev stuff on another and the browser on a third

safe dragon
#

the most minor niche specific thing tiling window managers allowed me to do was make floating windows smaller than their technically defined minimum window sizes which I always used to have a small floating runescape window in the corner

#

they always let you make those windows miniscule lmao

#

it's exceptionally rare for it to actually break the application honestly. I don't think devs think about setting their minimum window sizes very much

dusty pollen
#

I love how little tiling wms respect the app preference tbh, like with firefox I can have it in "fullscreen mode" (with the bar and tabs hidden) without actually being in fullscreen, and in regular mode (with the bar and tabs visible) while being in full screen

safe dragon
#

another thing that I've always found nice about having keyboard shortcuts for navigating your windows is that you can still easily escape a fullscreen game regardless of whether it has captured your mouse or something

#

that's not necessarily unique to tiling window managers but it's certainly more common

rotund violet
#

Alt-tab usually works for that on Windows. Though actually it sometimes doesn't on mac.

safe dragon
#

I'm happy using almost all window management systems that aren't gnome ultimately

rotund violet
#

A lot of that comes down to the OS rather than the window manager though, depending on how the OS wants to treat "fullscreen exclusive" as a graphics mode. (Most newer games are, thankfully, moving to borderless)

dusty pollen
#

borderless/windowed fullscreen is so superior to regular fullscreen in every way

safe dragon
#

yeah and it's very much becoming the norm

#

even random indie games in weird custom engines tend to at least support borderless now

#

gnome I still feel wants you to use some window management system that is just incomplete but they reject any suggestions for change. Like there's just no taskbar but it's also still a floating window manager where windows can overlap...

rotund violet
#

Right, I say "moving" but really it's been the standard for many years, there are just a few holdouts now. Since 2018 or so, really.

#

Ah, yes, I haven't used Gnome in a long time but now I remember about the lack of a taskbar, although didn't they add a left-side dock? Or is that not Gnome?

#

I have Ubuntu in a VM and it's got something on the left side, but I never checked if it was running Gnome.

safe dragon
#

that's not gnome but there's extensions to add them that break with every update

dusty pollen
#

I used gnome a tiny bit, hated it, never going back

safe dragon
#

gnome also just places a bar at the top but then doesn't want to actually put anything in it. Like they don't support the system tray despite the top bar being 90% empty

rotund violet
#

Ah. Well that certainly explains the aversion.

safe dragon
#

the left side dock you're thinking of it ubuntu's addition on gnome to mock their old custom Unity desktops

dusty pollen
#

gnome is like a decent part of what makes people think linux desktops are still janky imo, because it looks like it was last updated in 2009 and doesn't function much better than that either

#

oh are the unity desktops dead?

safe dragon
#

well they had a revival ish

#

but canonical abandoned it yes

#

a long time ago

rotund violet
#

You're right, Unity is what I'm thinking of.

dusty pollen
#

those were equally bad. I hated every part of using ubuntu tbh

rotund violet
#

There was also Cinnamon, which had a taskbar and tray and I think is Gnome based.

dusty pollen
#

(it felt like I was getting the worst of all worlds - not the aesthetic polish of macos and windows but yes the weird defaults and settings)

safe dragon
#

cinnamon is linux mint's desktop environment yeah

#

it was based on gnome... 13 years ago

#

at this point I'm not sure how much of that code remains

rotund violet
#

Well, it wasn't Mint that I ran it on, but I guess they own it officially or something.

safe dragon
#

yeah they developed it specifically for linux mint

dusty pollen
#

I heard good things about mint, but only ever in the context of "this is a good distro to install for someone else" iirc

safe dragon
#

but you can just install it on anything in theory though it might have some issues here and there

rotund violet
#

Fortunately, I wasn't the one responsible for maintaining it.

safe dragon
#

linux mint is just a really good distribution if you just want something very boring and stable that tries to make sure everything you want to do just works

dusty pollen
#

that explains it then SBVLmaoDog

rotund violet
#

I want my OS to be boring and stable, yes.

dusty pollen
#

it's always recommended as the "install this on your granddad's laptop so he can use the internets for his electronic mails" distro

rotund violet
#

Apps can be toys, the OS should not be a toy.

safe dragon
#

I use linux mint on my laptop because on that I just want something that works whenever I do use it

#

on my pc I fuck around and find out

rotund violet
#

And find out often, I'll bet.

safe dragon
#

oh yes

dusty pollen
#

I also fuck around and find out but honestly have not found out nearly as often as I expected to

#

I once half-deliberately caused a kernel panic in the middle of a lecture and managed to bring my laptop back without having to restart it

#

(the half deliberately part being that our lecturer told us not to run a line of code so I immediately decided to run it)

safe dragon
#

I still used windows back when I actually relied on my pc to do work

#

partially because my work is C# related

dusty pollen
#

you can do some c# on linux through rider nowadays, but yeah that's why I'm somewhat on windows too now

safe dragon
#

yeah I use rider nowadays on the rare occasion where I decide to use C# at home

#

especially now that it's free for non-commercial use

dusty pollen
#

I use rider for all c# rn but it doesn't get along with atra's mods repo

#

so I may have to get vs just for that pffft

safe dragon
#

before then I used rider through my previous job's work account cause they paid for the entire jetbrains .NET suite 🙏

#

I would not do that now

dusty pollen
#

nice

#

when I was doing some modding last year I was on a student license iirc

safe dragon
#

I do no modding so I'm safe from any of that

crystal wren
#

I did all of my modding on Linux with Rider, and it was just fine... mostly, apart from debugging being broken with SMAPI for some reason I can't fathom.

dusty pollen
#

I did some modding without knowing c#, decided to learn how to do some c# stuff properly, implemented solitaire in monogame while learning a ton about c# things, left for a year, forgot all my c# and here we are pffft

#

now I'm back to winging it based on general programming experience

#

I'm very proud of my solitaire implementation though, I did it twice while paying attention to different things and managed to get to a point where it worked and the code was organised in a sensible way, with draw code being separate from logic etc

safe dragon
#

I thought I was very knowledgeable about C# and then I saw whatever the fuck pintail and the likes do and I realized there was a lot I did not know

#

I'm not afraid to dabble with reflection code but there's some bizarre stuff in there that I did not know even existed

dusty pollen
#

I still don't fully know what pintail does other than in basic concept, I love the idea of duck typing OO languages though (even if it makes me remember javascript duck typing, which is the worst thing ever)

#

reflection is fun, harmony is even more fun

safe dragon
#

I'll stick to basic stuff 🙏

dusty pollen
#

but you can break so much with harmony all at once...

safe dragon
#

I don't think my employer would even appreciate it if I dabbled in anything deeper than what i already do

dusty pollen
#

I thought that's how you become a 10x developer, by making everything so cryptic and unintelligible that everyone assumes you're smart

safe dragon
#

just slap in fody without any justification in my next PR

crystal wren
#

I've written some disgusting stuff using reflection in Java. SDVkrobusgiggle

safe dragon
#

the most reflection heavy code in my entire work codebase is some helper functions for unit tests

dusty pollen
#

(when I did my gap year internship, people were still going on about an intern from two years prior who was such an amazing coder, nobody else could do the things he could, etc etc. Closer inspection showed he wrote messes that would be an insult to spaghetti were I to call them that, with zero documentation or comments and substantial amounts of hardcoding. But since nobody ever understood what it was doing, everyone assumed he was a genius... I ended up spending hours just tracking down where he put various vba macros)

#

and no, I don't know why he was using vba macros for basically anything either, I have no answers here

crystal wren
# safe dragon the most reflection heavy code in my entire work codebase is some helper functio...

Meanwhile:

public static <T> void updateFieldsWhereNotNull(T source, T destination) throws NoSuchFieldException, IllegalAccessException {
    Field[] sourceFields = source.getClass().getDeclaredFields();

    for (Field sourceField: sourceFields) {
        Boolean sourceAccessibility = sourceField.isAccessible();
        Boolean destinationAccessibility = false;
        Object sourceFieldObj;
        Field destinationField = null;
        sourceField.setAccessible(true);
        sourceFieldObj = sourceField.get(source);
        sourceField.setAccessible(sourceAccessibility);

        if (sourceFieldObj instanceof Collection<?>) {
            if (((Collection<?>) sourceFieldObj).isEmpty())
                continue;
        }

        if (sourceFieldObj == null)
            continue;

        try {
            destinationField = destination.getClass().getDeclaredField(sourceField.getName());
            destinationAccessibility = destinationField.isAccessible();
            destinationField.setAccessible(true);
            destinationField.set(destination, sourceFieldObj);

        } catch (NoSuchFieldException | IllegalAccessException e) {
            
            throw e;
        } finally {
            destinationField.setAccessible(destinationAccessibility);
        }
    }
}

I do not pretend it's good. I do, however, note that it was solidly tested and worked.

safe dragon
#

so far every time any time someone at work raved to me about how good some developer was it turned out they actually left behind some awful unmaintainable solution written in some esoteric way that only they would've found nice

cinder karma
#

Have you looked at my object overlay lol

dusty pollen
dusty pollen
safe dragon
crystal wren
dusty pollen
#

well that's a terrifying title

safe dragon
#

I knew it had to be jdsl

#

jdsl is genius

crystal wren
#

Tom is too, though.

safe dragon
#

oh yes Tom is a genius

latent bough
#

oh god wait I remember that

#

jdsl is such a good horror story

dusty pollen
#

Scott laughed. “You wouldn’t want to ‘just’ run it. It takes a couple days for a new deployment to finish starting up. JDSL can be a little slow, but it’s really powerful. Really powerful. Like I said, Tom is a genius.”
brb sobbing

crystal wren
#

I feel like CP could do with an extension to support JDSL.

safe dragon
#

I don't care whether this article was entirely fabricated

#

I love it

latent bough
#

So real

crystal wren
#

Yeah, it has some real BOFH vibes.

dusty pollen
#

this sounds too close to reality to be fabricated at this point pffft it could go either way

safe dragon
#

I've experienced this in far less extreme ways

dusty pollen
#

same internship, I once had to talk another intern down from choosing for the first thing they built in their unit tests to be an internal framework unit testing the unit tests

safe dragon
#

I shall unit tests m unit tests to verify they unit test correctly

#

end to end unit testing

dusty pollen
#

this person did not realise the circular logic pffft and also named all of their variables thing, thing2 and thingy

safe dragon
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one of our local "geniuses" at my previous job was a gigantic fan of xml and often would figure out ways to throw in xml strings in random method calls.
On top of that he wouldn't use any existing library to write or parse this xml but had instead written some custom xml parsing library that was extremely fragile to any formatting errors

dusty pollen
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why would you write your own xml parsing library...

safe dragon
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idk man

dusty pollen
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I was once asked to give advice on a website code that, upon further inspection, was using some framework where you put the code in html comments in the html

safe dragon
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but he was hailed as a genius for writing the first functioning discount calculator for the cahs registers because some random junior they hired before him failed and left the company

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unfortunately that discount calculator still uses this funky xml to this day

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like 90% of the entire discount calculation runtime is spend on serializing and deserializing this xml with people throwing in random extra fields because they couldn't figure out how to fix the serializer itself

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nasty stuff

latent bough
safe dragon
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there was no logic behind it even needing to be serialized/deserialized. It was literally just a method call and not even to a different project

crystal wren
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Your CPUs must have those newfangled AVXML instructions.

safe dragon
cinder karma
crystal wren
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Wow, that actually does have a similar vibe, huh?

safe dragon
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if he had just passed in the regular transaction state object and built the calculation logic on top of that it would've saved us a lot of pain.
I mean the discount code was still a nightmare regardless for many reasons but it would've fixed 1 issue

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smh can't believe you don't cache .GetProperties()

cinder karma
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Was I so dumb I couldn't figure out a null check lol

dusty pollen
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that xml thing feels like one of those things that will end up leading to comments on code saying "nothing is using this but if you delete this everything breaks"

safe dragon
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pretty much honestly

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even without the xml it would've been some of the most nightmarish code in the application

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all in beautiful visual basic .net

crystal wren
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...oh no.

dusty pollen
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(which is actually an experience I recently had with harmony.PatchAll refusing to run if it was the last call in a method body... solved by passing in an argument that had the same behaviour as the no-argument version)

cinder karma
crystal wren
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I wish I could convince myself to use the Harmony annotations!

cinder karma
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You've found the bullshit I see

safe dragon
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I wouldn't trust any of your witchcraft functionality

cinder karma
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(StackTrace is not reliable in Release compiled code)

dusty pollen
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I was debugging why it wasn't working with someone and the horror of the realisation dawning on me that it might literally just be its location in the method body was fun pffft

crystal wren
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By the way, Atra, did you see that I figured out why hot reload was failing for me in Rider on Windows?

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The fix worked for me and Sheku, but not Matt, weirdly.

cinder karma
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Nope!!!!

crystal wren
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It was the SMAPI change that forced embedded PDBs.

dusty pollen
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is it because rider likes to make things just irritating enough that you're annoyed but still won't leave for visual studio? because I assume everything Rider does is because of that now /lh