programmers-off-topic

[pliant snow]

I would never abuse this power now given to me
-# Free single ladies in your area

fuck

[rain apex]

~# why would they do this

[cinder karma]

My god

[pliant snow]

my cover has been blown

[safe dragon]

there are no free single ladies on your website aquo

[crystal wren]

(But seriously, don't try the Markdown URL thing with this, because you will get an automatic 10 minute time out!)

[safe dragon]

I didn't even know this was markdown

[cinder karma]

Otoh, your silly human eyes won't notice is probably good enough for us

[pliant snow]

was i supposed to get a 10 minute time out

[cinder karma]

Like my png is text and black lines

[safe dragon]

only I got punished

[cinder karma]

Aquo aren't you server owner

[safe dragon]

lmao

poor jade

[waxen cliff]

rip

[pliant snow]

Yes I am

[safe dragon]

aquo just betrayed he whitelisted himself from the filters

smh

[crystal wren]

@bronze fox, imposter spotted!

[cinder karma]

Oh god open source drama

(Between pngcrush and apple)

[pliant snow]

dont be silly

[safe dragon]

wonder how many times I've accidentally triggered the word censor at this point over the years

[pliant snow]

not enough

[safe dragon]

you're right

[crystal wren]

I have officially counted all of the times you have.

I will confirm it's not enough.

[safe dragon]

damn you count quick

[crystal wren]

I mean when it's only happened three times, it goes fairly quickly.

[safe dragon]

does this include with previous censor bots...

the sdv word censor is how I learnt a word was considered bad once

since it's quite normal in non american english...

educational

[crystal wren]

...is it bad enough you wouldn't want to DM me the word to satisfy my curiosity?

[safe dragon]

lmao I don't think so

[bronze fox]

the nerve

[pliant snow]

and yet i have a crown and you do not

[bronze fox]

i do on my pfp!!!

[pliant snow]

no one looks at those

[bronze fox]

mmhm mmhm

[safe dragon]

you can alternate ownership of the crown

[gaunt wadi]

i vote for aquo because he promised me I could post cat hiccups and farts in bb

i also vote for jade if she lets me post cat hiccups and farts in bb

let me post cat hiccups and farts in bb

[cinder karma]

What is bb

[pliant snow]

#bulletin-board

[marble jewel]

#british-broadcasting

[safe dragon]

babybel

[dapper sinew]

I might need to learn Vin

Nano formats code wierd

[safe dragon]

why are you restricted to terminal code editors?

just use vscode or whatever for now

[dapper sinew]

Cause I'm lazy and didn't wanna set up vscode for the 100th time

(new arch install... Again)

[safe dragon]

you'll have a drastically easier time learning to program with an actual proper environment

[pliant snow]

Just back up your settings file and what extensions you have, and setting up vscode takes like a minute. Or you can use their sync thing

[safe dragon]

not particularly different from vim where you’d have a config file you need to copy over every time

[pliant snow]

Could also just keep /home on its own partition to help avoid this altogether

[pliant snow]

wow, i wish I knew this existed back in the day
https://flathub.org/apps/io.github.finefindus.Hieroglyphic

[safe dragon]

reminds me of a similar tool I used for kanji when I didn’t know yet how to search for them

[cinder karma]

We use detexify

[pliant snow]

Back when I was taking notes in classes, I used to just have to scour a big list of latex symbols looking for the one I wanted... then I realized I hadnt been paying attention for the last 10 minutes while i did that

[cinder karma]

Re:linux installs

I wrote a little setup.sh script for that

It only took me three laptops, six hard-drives, countless reinstalls, and about ten years to get the bugs out 😛

[pliant snow]

I for a while maintained a list of packages I wanted to have installed, but honestly it wasn't really worth the upkeep. Now I just have a git repo with some config files that I want to share around and thats it

[safe dragon]

I keep nothing

I start from scratch every time

though now that I have actual stuff configured like syncthing I'm afraid that needs to change

[pliant snow]

you dont even keep a neovim config?

[safe dragon]

nope cause I gave up on maintaining one all together

I used pre-made configs

though my neovim rn is just basic neovim without even a theme

I only use it for editing stuff

[cinder karma]

Weirddddd

I thought the point of linux was to spend nine hours in config files per hour of useful work

[safe dragon]

it is of course

[cinder karma]

(I have a github repo too with my config files)

[safe dragon]

gotta spend 200 hours optimizing your vim workflow so that you can save 10 keypresses a day

[pliant snow]

I keep a few config files backed up, although honestly they only have like one or two changes from default. My fish and neovim configs are the only substantial ones

[cinder karma]

I mean, I have things as weird as "my default gitignore"

And zsh launch screen

Also a custom theme

[pliant snow]

my neovim config is 328 lines

how many plugins do i use

17, not counting dependencies. It sounds like a lot, but I'm probably a lot more frugal than most

oh 18 I guess with the plugin manager itself

[safe dragon]

is a plugin manager a plugin

does a plugin manager manage itself

if a plugin manager manages all plugins that do not manage themselves, who manages the plugin manager?

[pliant snow]

It...

lets see

yes

and in fact it had an update

[safe dragon]

well that’s a paradox solved

excellent

[cinder karma]

Going from almost any language to python feels like someone took half my tools lol

And expect me to be productive

[pliant snow]

you might need some better tooling, I dont think most people would say python is that barren

[ivory shadow]

(not "atraknita"?)

I thought the python meme was that it has a package for everything. Or are you talking about language features?

[crystal wren]

Does Python have an is-even equivalent, or does JS still have that crown?

[pliant snow]

https://pypi.org/search/?q=is+even&o=

apparently theres several lol

the top one has three whole github stars, wow!

[cinder karma]

Language features

[ivory shadow]

That makes more sense then

[cinder karma]

Missing multithreading

[ivory shadow]

Good ol GIL

[pliant snow]

python does have multithreading

[ivory shadow]

But it also has the Global Interpreter Lock, stopping you from doing any python simultaneously on multiple threads.

Unless they finally kicked that?

[pliant snow]

theyre in the process of removing that

ive never really used it, but I know theres a threading module, I'm sure it does something lol

[cinder karma]

Yeah, but there also isn't like built in nice concurrent data structures

[rain apex]

they just pickle everything

[ivory shadow]

Just don't unpickle any random data you find in the wild or you'll end up in a real pickle

[cinder karma]

What, download random exes from the internet and run them?

I don't mean executables. I mean people's exes

[safe dragon]

hi plz test my game demo for me I worked very hard on it

it's this singular exe with no dlls

of like 20 kb

[cinder karma]

You forget that I don't play video games anymore

[rain apex]

What about https://www.mariowiki.com/I_am_a_teacher:_Super_Mario_Sweater

[cinder karma]

That's amazing

"If you try this it will actually output three full tracebacks interleaved in a semi-random fashion, and then you may have to stop the parent process somehow." <- python multiprocessing docs

[marble jewel]

Not even Knitting Simulator 3000?

[cinder karma]

The point of knitting is to end up with finished objects eventually 😛

It's a lot less satisfying when it is virtual

[marble jewel]

Okay, I've got a billion dollar idea. A motion-controlled knitting simulator, and the end result is an NFT.

Knitcoin

[cinder karma]

I was gonna ask if knitcoin was capable of keeping people warm

[marble jewel]

Mining for the coins certainly does

[rain apex]

Are modern motion controls precise enough for knitting

[cinder karma]

Matt

Please recall I'm a luddite

What is that

[marble jewel]

https://tenor.com/view/rainbow-spongebob-imagination-gif-11877335675029242228

They're knitting needles, of course

[ivory shadow]

Wireless bluetooth controllers for a nine year old android tablet, obviously

[crystal wren]

I mean... that's not wrong necessarily...

[marble jewel]

Technically true is the best kind of truth

[rotund violet]

You could say the same thing about farming, and yet here we are.

[cinder karma]

Feel free to try your hand at making a satisfying virtual knitting game then

[devout vault]

You could do a bunch of microgames like Cooking Mama

[cinder karma]

What's a microgame

Also

Like

Doesn't seem interesting tbh

[rotund violet]

I wasn't volunteering to make the game, but clearly there's a market for sims.

If you can find an audience for Goat Simulator, you can find an audience for anything.

[cinder karma]

Yes. But I am arguing that actual crafting and video games are two different niches and my heart is in the former at the moment

[rotund violet]

Well it's Matt's billion-dollar idea; I think he should build it.

[cinder karma]

But more unreasonably

Stardew farming bears almost no relationship with actual farming

Different people play the game for different reasons

Some people like decorating, or npcs

Others like the time management/building an empire factor

For crafts, what we get out of it is the satisfaction of building something with our own hands

Being able to envision and make something

And then, importantly, you have the item around for a while reminding you of what you achieved

[rotund violet]

Yes, I think it's apparent that the intersection of people who would play a knitting sim vs. those who actually knit would be relatively small. Same with all sims, though - I mean, why bother with a sim if it is your actual job/hobby?

[marble jewel]

The one reason I could think of is if your hobby is prohibitively expensive. See PC Building Simulator.

[rotund violet]

Haha. Art Collecting Simulator, AKA NFTs.
(rimshot)

[cinder karma]

I would argue the simulators have very little to do with the real life task

(I enjoy gardening)

[rotund violet]

I don't think anyone's arguing against that point.

[worn remnant]

simulating managing an amusement park with roller coaster tycoon, on the other hand, is almost certainly more fun than doing so for real

[marble jewel]

You're trying to tell me that the countless hours I spent in SDV fishing isn't going to lead to me being good at fishin IRL?

[rotund violet]

It turns out that fishing is also a poor source of diamonds and medieval weaponry in real life.

[supple ether]

well, there's always caliburn

[cinder karma]

Python multithreading feels fucking barren af

[rain apex]

what if you thread in C++ and then boost

[supple ether]

python multithreading is horrible

it does not need to be as awful to use as it is

[floral parcel]

Whenever I've written python, I always forget that I don't need to add semicolons lol
Shows that I don't use the language a lot

[supple ether]

whitespace-as-syntax is the devil

[floral parcel]

Yeah I can't stand whitespace lmao

[devout vault]

NeithercanI,whitespaceissounnecessary /s

(I do genuinely dislike white space control flow though)

[rotund violet]

Kotlin did a pretty good job at this. You don't need semicolons, but it doesn't rely on indentation either. And if you decide to add semicolons anyway, it doesn't choke, just sort of snarks at you.

[frosty echo]

I like the whitespace thing. Means you can't have a discrepancy between how things look and how they actually are

[safe dragon]

is that any different from braces

I don't particularly care about whitespace as syntax but for some reason languages(like python) give awful very useless warnings when you fuck up the whitespace in some way

almost all languages I use don't use whitespace as syntax though

[pliant snow]

oh yeah, you can have all sorts of different appearances with braces, which people have been arguing over for decades

https://tenor.com/bJVJF.gif

[safe dragon]

damn

I just updated my aur packages

[crystal wren]

Gotta check for package gremlins now.

[pliant snow]

when society collapses we shall rebuild the AUR from your packages

[crystal wren]

They come out when servers are going down.

[safe dragon]

those dang package gremlins

[safe dragon]

I've been helping a friend with writing macros for excel(they're not a programmer) and man

vba makes vb.net look like an incredible modern language by comparison

[crystal wren]

@cinder karma, VBA mention!

[safe dragon]

vba doesn't have any error message clearer than fuckin "argument error" or 90% of the time it's "error 1004" which is essentially an undefined error

I'd have nightmares about error 1004 if I did this regularly

it's the equivalent of someone just throwing an error without any message, stacktrace, context or anything

just an empty throw

but in some file owned by microsoft that you can't see

[crystal wren]

I remember the feeling of power when I learned "oh, VBA can make Windows API calls"...

[safe dragon]

vba can do anything if you hate yourself enough

I am not going to be using PInvoke in a vba macro thanks

[rain apex]

i thought excel supports python now

lesser evil

[safe dragon]

I've fucked with pinvoke only 3 times in the last 4 years I think

[supple ether]

PInvoke in excel macros sounds like a security vulnerability waiting to happen if I ever heard it

[safe dragon]

excel 365 supports running python scripts in the cloud now yes

tbh macros are disabled in excel by default you need to enable them in the Trust Center

[crystal wren]

Definitely not how it used to be, though!

[safe dragon]

and even then you can set it to only certified ones

[crystal wren]

The truly spicy days.

[safe dragon]

the fun days

their company is still using 2016 anyway so python is not happening

despite my general dislike for python I would gladly take that over vba

[crystal wren]

I remember my school having student photo headshots on a shared drive with zero security!

[safe dragon]

I'm pretty sure my university still had a way to figure out people's student numbers just by knowing what to type in the url bar of the browser

and then get stuff like portraits with that

I vaguely recall them fixing that when I was in my third year

[cinder karma]

ON ERROR GOTO

Christ, it's surprising I turned out even partially okay

[safe dragon]

ON ERROR GOTO 0

ON ERROR RESUME NEXT

[cinder karma]

Ahhhhhhhh

Anyways

Hi. How are you guys

[safe dragon]

alive

friend is now trying the macro I wrote together with her on the real thing to see if it works

[cinder karma]

I cast on my rainbow cowl!

[safe dragon]

do you have a rainbow cowl

[cinder karma]

God I feel like I'm about to fall asleep standing up

[safe dragon]

one of those days

[safe dragon]

the real world is evil

random ass cells in the sheet had double spaces in them

[cinder karma]

Well the good news is I think i found the problem

The bad news is what to do with the problem

[rain apex]

@cinder karma i have this one (logitech g502)

most useful feature is that side thumb button which i rebound to be middle click for all those middle click = panning programs

[safe dragon]

my mouse has a dedicated button for middle click much like left and right click

this one

the rightmost is a middle click button

as a runescape player it's a life saver 🙏

[rain apex]

grenade mouse

[safe dragon]

yes

[rain apex]

i didnt get one due to aesthetics but i often wish i had all those keys

[cinder karma]

(To no one's surprise I actually want one of those mice crumble has but for work.)

[safe dragon]

I think they stopped producing them

[cinder karma]

Make this button a resistor

[safe dragon]

it's a logitech G600

but there's a few other mmo mice out there

[devout vault]

If it's the right most button is it really a middle click

[safe dragon]

hmm

let's go with third mouse button

I think it maps to that internally anyway

yeah Mouse 3

I genuinely use it way more than right click

it's great for both runescape and path of exile and even minecraft...

[devout vault]

I never used middle click in Minecraft, I guess because I wasn't much of a builder

[crystal wren]

https://3dconnexion.com/uk/product/spacemouse-compact/

Yeah, well, I have a SpaceMouse!

It's a very, very, very, very old version of one... but it's still one.

[safe dragon]

is this like spacemacs

[rain apex]

how do u mouse on that

[devout vault]

I was just wondering the some thing

[cinder karma]

That's a lot of money

[safe dragon]

you don't it seems

it's more a macro peripheral than a mouse

[rain apex]

oh its 3d movement thingy

[devout vault]

https://tenor.com/view/fairly-oddparents-due-fantagenitori-in-3d-in-3-d-the-haunted-volcano-gif-15277565708123345091

[crystal wren]

The one I have probably doesn't even have drivers for anything past Windows 7 though.

That's how old the thing is.

[devout vault]

Oof

[safe dragon]

but that means it might be old enough to have drivers for Linux!

the cad software probably doesn't work but that's a different issue

[cinder karma]

Hmmm

I do need linux drivers

But 126 euro is a lot

[crystal wren]

I'm going to try to find where this thing is stored to know how sure now...

They do have Linux drivers it seems though, which is very nice.

[rain apex]

can you scam convince your job to cover it

[safe dragon]

oh yes I need it for work it will speed me up so much

yes

[cinder karma]

(Unlikely)

[safe dragon]

this rice cooker will also boost my productivity please get it for me

[pliant snow]

you can call clients by dialing with your mouse

[cinder karma]

Well, I would kinda have to make sure it works with the lovely setup we have

Insert sarcasm

[devout vault]

lovely setup (derogatory)

[red crest]

+1 for the Logitech G600 it's what I've got right now and I love it
my right most button isn't used for middle click though it was always set to be the "G-button" or whatever which when pressed all the other buttons get switched to a different profile of mappings as long as I hold it down
very handy

[safe dragon]

I've had it set that way for so long I forgot it was even able to do anything else

[lethal walrus]

I should probably get a new mouse - my current one's middle click has stopped working, but I can just rebind it to my currently unused second middle button

[rotund violet]

Anyone else for trackballs? (he says as he prepares to dodge a barrage of tomatoes)

[pliant snow]

throws trackball

[safe dragon]

idk man they're expensive, don't throw them

I'd rather use a trackball than the monstrosity my mom uses

[rain apex]

as long as you arent one of those thinkpad red nub ppl

[rotund violet]

Love my MX Ergo, don't care what all you haters say.

[safe dragon]

It's a trackpad but you physically move the surface. Like it moves with your finger like some kinda treadmill

my mom loves it but I do not

[lethal walrus]

interesting

which part is the mouse

[rain apex]

how do u go left and right tho

[rotund violet]

Pads seem nice for art, probably; might have some uses as control surfaces for music as well, although I'd rather have an actual control surface. Ergonomically, though, they're kind of shit.

[safe dragon]

you slide it left or right

it rolls forwards and backwards and slides left or right

[crystal wren]

Oh, those things are quite cool!

[rain apex]

fascinating and seems much better than a trackpad

[cinder karma]

There is something super satisfying about reflow soldering

[safe dragon]

don't try it with 3 horizontal monitors next to each other cause I don't think it slides far enough to cover that distance with a reasonable sensitivity...

[crystal wren]

Surface tension is, for lack of a better word, tasty.

[safe dragon]

you know, if it worked reliably it would be

[rain apex]

the design had good intentions, probably

[cinder karma]

I land the part so far off, apply heat. And it just sooched unto place

[safe dragon]

I think it cost my mom's work like 400 euros to buy from some ergonomic supply store

[cinder karma]

Now for the unfun part

[pliant snow]

oh the whole thing moves

like a weird skateboard

[crystal wren]

I like trackballs, though.

[safe dragon]

https://us.mousetrapper.com/product/mousetrapper-advance-2-0/

[crystal wren]

Don't use one... but I like them.

[safe dragon]

trackballs are neat

[rotund violet]

It's laughable that they'd call that ergonomic. It definitely has its uses, but absolutely the farthest thing from ergonomic.

[safe dragon]

I do use an ergonomic keyboard but my mouse is just a regular mmo mouse

fwiw it did help my mom with her shoulder pain somehow

[rotund violet]

Ironically I gave up my ergo keyboard recently to switch to a nice mechanical one.

[safe dragon]

aren't most ergonomic keyboards also mechanical

[pliant snow]

their video told me nothing

[safe dragon]

excellent

[rotund violet]

Maybe some? I wouldn't say most. The one I always used (the MS Natural) was definitely not mechanical.

[safe dragon]

oh

[crystal wren]

Yeah, definitely not most, but there are a decent amount.

[safe dragon]

I have uh

.img glove80

[heavy dagger]

https://joshcollinsworth.com/images/post_images/glove80/mine.webp

[pliant snow]

a concave keyboard looks awful

[safe dragon]

it really nice

it curves with your finger naturally

[pliant snow]

my secret is i dont work hard enough to keep my hands in the same position long enough

[safe dragon]

neither do I but I just find this very comfortable...

and it's very moddable

cause of qmk support

[rotund violet]

When I look at my hands on my keyboard (whether straight or ergo), I see my fingers bending in the exact opposite direction. Inward, not outward. But I suppose if I held my arms very far apart, it could work?

[cinder karma]

https://youtu.be/LCmia0Wsmqg?si=VOU-WtVs-8UL0bw8

Reflow 💖

[safe dragon]

what... your fingers bend backwards?

[rotund violet]

Not backwards, inwards.

[safe dragon]

yes

[rotund violet]

And not the fingers really, the entire hands.

[safe dragon]

your fingers are on the home row bent 90 degrees, you bend upwards for the upper keys and downwards for the lower keys

[rotund violet]

Though fingers would also have a convex shape, not concave.

[rain apex]

ur fingers are perpendicular to the keyboard surface

[rotund violet]

Concave meaning the knuckles are higher than the tips or the wrist.

[safe dragon]

the concavity makes the top row much easier the reach without having to move your hand at all

[rotund violet]

Yes I see. Doesn't seem like my cup of tea, but I can understand why it would appeal to some folks.

[safe dragon]

yeah I like it

but it's niche

[rain apex]

my hands r too small for most of these ergonomic things

[rotund violet]

My digits are naturally very long so I don't really have to move my hand anyway.

[safe dragon]

I could never go back to a keyboard without thumb clusters though. You will never accept the backspace being tucked all the way in a corner spot for your pinky finger after you experience thumb clusters

[rotund violet]

Pfft, backspace is for people who make mistakes.

[crystal wren]

Are you saying this isn't normal? /j

[safe dragon]

I can actually do that too cause I'm hypermobile but yeah lmao

I try not to

I had like a party trick of sort putting up moving my pinky in a very unnatural position and I'm pretty sure it fucked them up a bit

can't recommend it

in general I am enitrely incapable of holding any of my fingers perfectly straight

other than my index finger actually

all the others the top part bends backwards

[crystal wren]

I just wish these things had some unique use!

[safe dragon]

maybe a very niche one somewhere

useful for some random gymnastics move

[pliant snow]

https://tenor.com/uFG5.gif

Crumble at parties, 2024

[safe dragon]

I wish I could hold my pinky straight like that

[rain apex]

would it make you good at piano

[safe dragon]

I doubt it

[crystal wren]

I suppose theoretically we can raise our fingers higher than most people... meaning given the same hand height we could get more key velocity...

So it might make us louder at piano.

[pliant snow]

can you not hold your pinky straight like that

[safe dragon]

I can't hold my pinky straight in general

when I try it kinda flips and locks backwards

I have fucked up pinky fingers

[supple mountain]

same issue I have

it was damn near impossible to find a good ergonomic office chair

I imagine most fancier and more ergonomic mouse options would just be too difficult to use for me bc I have child sized hands (1 octave reach on a piano, for reference)

cried inside when I finally had to replace my old s8 because phones keep getting bigger. I am now a permanent pop socket customer bc pixels are too big to hold with one hand

[rotund violet]

An octave would be larger than child-sized, if we're talking about the average child - some have more reach, most have less.

[thin estuary]

whoever implemented .NET's AssemblyBuilder/ModuleBuilder/TypeBuilder should be fired

[cinder karma]

Y'all might love my new threaded python

It's called "launch 200 subprocesses"

[thin estuary]

hey atra, did you know that calling DefineType on a ModuleBuilder already makes the type show up whenever you call Assembly.GetTypes

except to actually make a type usable, you need to call CreateType on it first

guess what happens if Pintail deems a type is not able to be proxied

it leaves these half-baked Type entries, and calling GetTypes throws

whiiiich is a problem if you do stuff like patching all overrides of a method

[safe dragon]

I'm learning about methods in C# I did not know existed

I mean I know Assembly.GetTypes, I've used it

[thin estuary]

now you wish you didn't know

[safe dragon]

DefineType is definitely completely new to me

honestly C# reflection api is 50 times more massive than I think it is

it's mostly the kinda stuff you wouldn't be caught dead using in most traditional projects

whip out opcodes in your asp.net core api

[cinder karma]

Oh, I noticed something like that

When mods fail to load correctly

[thin estuary]

i think i'll have to do another Pintail patch

build all the required info for the type we're trying to proxy, and if it's all good, only then try to create it

[rain apex]

transactional

[rotund violet]

That's how you're supposed to write source generators as well. Maybe for a different reason (performance/caching) but same principle, it's preferred practice to read the source and build an intermediate model in one shot, then use your intermediate model to spit out the generated code all in one shot. You don't want to fail or run into some slowdown during the generation phase because of a parsing issue.

[cinder karma]

python threading theory #244: what if I wrote a Different Language and just called into it with python

[crystal wren]

Well, it's official. I'm back using Arch.

[safe dragon]

gratz

back to the promised land...

[crystal wren]

I was scared by the... apparent installer script?

That feels illegal.

[safe dragon]

yeah arch is no longer difficult to install

as long as you understand the jargon in the installer

archinstall is wonderful

[crystal wren]

I did not trust it to do the partitioning, though. Especially given I had a specific space to fill from the old Linux partition.

[safe dragon]

at least manual partitioning doesn't lock you out of using the installer

[crystal wren]

I did discover an apparently known Ventoy bug with the Arch ISO, though. That was fun.

[pliant snow]

Ive had lots of issues using ventoy

[safe dragon]

I've never heard of ventoy

[pliant snow]

its a thingy that lets you have more than one iso on the same USB stick

[crystal wren]

Think of it as a bootable drive you can just shove separate disk images into and boot from them.

[lethal walrus]

Oooo

[pliant snow]

I've had it do the partitioning on VMs I dont care about, and while it's not how I would do it, it does a fine job I think

at least for simple schemes

[safe dragon]

I can't say I've ever cared for how my drive is partitioned beyond whether it has a swap partition or not

[pliant snow]

I think it'll ask and do a swapfile

[safe dragon]

yeah

for me it's generally just "take this drive and do what u wanna do"

[crystal wren]

Yeah, I'd trust it for an empty drive even on a real system! But I had a big gap of free space surrounded by other partitions to fill, and its suggestions were "WIPE EVERYTHING, ALL IS NOW ARCH".

[pliant snow]

the correct way to do it

[crystal wren]

I also nearly used btrfs this time.

[safe dragon]

I've used btrfs before

[pliant snow]

one of these days I might switch. I dont like their command syntax tho, and I already know how zfs works, so I'm less inclined to switch to it

[safe dragon]

I had no idea what btrfs was but I did use it

I noticed no difference

commands...

[pliant snow]

it has snapshotting stuff

[safe dragon]

sometimes I suddenly feel like some commoner in a den of nerds even though I'm already far gone myself

[lethal walrus]

What's btrfs, ik it's a filesystem but that's about it

[safe dragon]

should I be doing something with my zfs thing that I'm not doing

[pliant snow]

what do you do with it

[safe dragon]

let it exist while there's files on it

set it up to run from 2 drives

[pliant snow]

Btrfs is a modern copy on write (COW) file system for Linux aimed at implementing advanced features while also focusing on fault tolerance, repair and easy administration.
-# https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Btrfs

[safe dragon]

basic raid setup essentially

[pliant snow]

I have mine pooled together with a raid parity drive

I have a script that runs that does daily/weekly snapshots

you can configure it to use automatic compression under the hood

[safe dragon]

where do you save the snapshots

[pliant snow]

it saves them in uh
gestures vaguely
you dont specify a location for them

the compression ratio isnt bad

my regular boring files have a 1.43x compression ratio

[safe dragon]

99.9% of the files I store are images

[pliant snow]

yeah

I think the snapshots, raid/pool stuff, and the compressions are the main things I have set up

you can also set up NFS easier I think or something

I do like the snapshots tho, theyve come in handy. You dont have to rollback all the way either, it exposes a weird virtual directory you can just go into to browse the file system as it was at that snapshot

then copy files out of it if needed

[lethal walrus]

Interesting

[safe dragon]

I might set up snapshots eventually

[crystal wren]

I just use Timeshift for occasional snapshots.

[pliant snow]

There's a script in the AUR that handles a lot of it. I just set up a cron job to run it with the right parameters and off it goes

as I continue to not understand systemd timers

I have my main project folder on my desktop get synced with syncthing over to the server as a backup, and then that directory has daily snapshots, so even if I accidentally delete something I need, I can roll back each day

[safe dragon]

unless your entire apartment/home explodes

[crystal wren]

Just have your house in RAID 1, easy.

[lethal walrus]

Ah yes my offsite backup house

[cinder karma]

Would that be a townhouse

[sonic mirage]

Buy a vacation house to put an offsite NAS in, got it

[supple ether]

something fun I discovered is that c# lets you do loops without bodies. you can just glue a semicolon on the end.

while(DoThing());

[lethal walrus]

That kind of makes sense? Assuming it blocks execution of the code below

[pliant snow]

I've def done that before

[safe dragon]

I'd assume the method needs to return a boolean at least

makes sense I think though I've never done that

[pliant snow]

returning a boolean would help

[cinder karma]

Yes it needs to return a boolean in c#

[cinder karma]

529 files changed let's gooooo

[supple ether]

yes, you would have to. it's still a conditional

[safe dragon]

i was fairly certain

[supple ether]

yeah it's actually suprisingly useful. sometimes all you really need is to run a for conditional

I think last time I did it with for was something with enumerators, and I used while for a main loop so I could use return to break out of inner loops easily

you could do something like for (int i = 0; i < items.Length && !data.TryGetValue(items[i], out var value); i++);

though admittedly that's not quite as readable as just putting a conditional in the loop body

[worn remnant]

i find that tricks of this nature make code harder to understand and don't bring much benefit, so i try to avoid them

[supple ether]

I don't use code constructs "just because I can" in my actual code, but it is fun to think about possibilities, and once in a great while (like with while(DoThing());) they are genuinely useful and also readable

[cinder karma]

I've done it too

[worn remnant]

of course, i am also a compulsive variable-name-shortener, so my opinion is not useful

[cinder karma]

while dict.containskey($"blah{i++}")

[supple ether]

that is a hard habit to break

[cinder karma]

Is a common enough one

[supple ether]

yeah I've done that for unique file names as well

[pliant snow]

Not in C baby, there are no booleans 😎 we're livin the wild life

[worn remnant]

in C everything is a boolean

[supple ether]

what happens if you put a void return in a conditional in C? UB?

[pliant snow]

Probably UB, but I would guess it would escape as it would return null which is falsy

lets see

It doesn't compile

[worn remnant]

i don't believe it compiles

[pliant snow]

at least with gcc

clang too complains. Alas

[crystal wren]

The real fun is in returning void pointers.

[supple ether]

void pointers are fun. I was looking into them for rust FFI stuff

[pliant snow]

they are the darkest of arts

[safe dragon]

only issue I have with the while(DoThing()); thing is that the intuitive assumption made when seeing a conditional is that it doesn't have side-effects. You could in this case argue you'd figure it out cause there's no body and it's gotta be doing something useful but still

I generally prefer to keep method calls that have side effects out of condition fields like if or while

[pliant snow]

I was going to say, I dont think I have an intuitive assumption that functions dont have side effects at all. I do also try to avoid them, but I always assume they could be doing who knows what

[safe dragon]

the only exception I suppose if stuff like if(int.TryParse()) where the boolean returns whether the attempt was succesful but that's mostly just because it's already a common established pattern in C#

though I suppose that's not really a side effect

but there's more complicated examples

[safe dragon]

a reasonable thing to assume in most programming languages

most aka every single one I've tried other than haskell

[cinder karma]

I try to keep it distinct too

[cinder karma]

Yeah but wouldn't your hackles go up seeing i++

Or like an empty loop body

[safe dragon]

if I see a ++ in a conditional I'm rewriting that shit

[pliant snow]

oh yeah, thats cursed

[safe dragon]

doesn't matter whether it's ++i or i++

[pliant snow]

never trust someone who would write value = array[i++]

[rain apex]

but thats just next

[safe dragon]

that's definitely a crime

[pliant snow]

or even worse, value = array[++i]

[safe dragon]

unless you work in a team where you can somehow know for sure no one is ever going to get confused by whether the value that returns is the value before or after the mutation... just don't

just put it in the line before or after depending

at least you can't do this in vba.... you would have to write i = i + 1

there's not even a +=

I hate it

writing out rowIndex = rowIndex + 1, wasting those precious keystrokes

[ivory shadow]

value += ++array[++i];

[safe dragon]

is this incrementing a pointer and then adding the pointer value to value

I do not know C/C++

[pliant snow]

that would

uh

okay

be the same as value += array[i + 2] maybe?

[safe dragon]

only if moving 1 value within the array also equals upping the pointer by 1 right

[pliant snow]

its also grounds for termination

[safe dragon]

this is the kinda stuff they ask in an interview just to fuck with you and then tell you to never do it smh

[pliant snow]

it would move the array pointer over by one, so that it would now start at the 1st index, and also increase i by one before referenicng the value

[safe dragon]

I have never used C++ in my life so idk

all I know is that it does funky shit with arrays

[pliant snow]

you're gonna make me actually try this

[safe dragon]

in production

[pliant snow]

#include "stdio.h"

int main(int argc, char** argv) {
    int array[] = {1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8};
    int i = 0;
    int value = 0;
    value += ++array[++i];
    printf("%d %d\n", value, i);

    return 0;
}

place your bets

[safe dragon]

I'd assume 3

though you'd have to make the values in the array not sequential like this to really see what exactly it's doing

[pliant snow]

yeah thats true hang on

[worn remnant]

am i watching a programming job interview? i hate this

[safe dragon]

yes for a very cursed job

[pliant snow]

#include "stdio.h"

int main(int argc, char** argv) {
    int array[] = {2, 3, 5, 7, 11, 13, 17, 19};
    int i = 0;
    int value = ++array[++i];
    printf("Value: %d i: %d\n", value, i);

    return 0;
}

Alright the revised version

i also got rid of the +=

[safe dragon]

value would be 5 and i would be 1 I think

[pliant snow]

Huh

Well

no

I wasn't expecting this

[safe dragon]

what does it return

[pliant snow]

Value is 4, i is 1

[safe dragon]

oh so it first grabs 3 from the array, then adds 1

[pliant snow]

its increasing the value in the array itself

yeah

[safe dragon]

that's fair

that's honestly probably better

I'd still hunt you down if you wrote this code

[pliant snow]

I just did

[cinder karma]

That's quite sensible imo

[safe dragon]

wrote it in a professional context...

especially since in this case you could've just written
int value = array[++1] + 1 in the very least

[cinder karma]

Brb writing it in a professional context

[safe dragon]

[pliant snow]

Wrong

#include "stdio.h"

int main(int argc, char** argv) {
    int array[] = {2, 3, 5, 7, 11, 13, 17, 19};
    int i = 0;
    int value = ++array[++i];
    printf("Value: %d i: %d\n", value, i);
    printf("%d\n", array[i]);

    return 0;
}

[ivory shadow]

It's incrementing the value in the array, which is what I expected when I cursed you all

[pliant snow]

In the second printf, array[i] is now 4

[safe dragon]

huh. it ups the value in the array?

[pliant snow]

yes

[safe dragon]

are you actually getting a pointer to the integer not the integer value

again I have never even written a hello world in C/C++

idk how it does things and when things are unboxed

[pliant snow]

if you try to make the array const, it throws a compiler error

[ivory shadow]

I would think it's more just that the compiler has special logic for incrementing values in arrays

It would be pretty annoying otherwise

[worn remnant]

i like C and i use it for things, but not this

[safe dragon]

wait so if you had an array and grabbed the first value from it, an integer and you 12 fuckin functions later add 2 to that integer, will it somehow increment it still in the array

is it still the same integer or is it copied somewhere

[pliant snow]

If you incremented the value stored in value?

[safe dragon]

yeah

[pliant snow]

it would just increase value, the array is unchanged

[safe dragon]

so it's just this niche scenario where it does increment it in the array itself as well

[pliant snow]

Yeah, i guess the prefix operator will increment the array value

we can make it an int * to be spicy tho

[worn remnant]

it's specifically because of the use of ++array[]

[safe dragon]

fascinating

[crystal wren]

Rule 17. No Cursed C++ pls no stop.

[worn remnant]

hey, we're all safe here. this is C

[crystal wren]

...ah shit.

Foiled again!

[pliant snow]

although all cursed C is also cursed C++

[worn remnant]

[worn remnant]

don't talk about my son like that, how dare you /lh

[safe dragon]

I'd assume that if you did array[]++ instead you would've gotten 3 but the value in the array would become 4

[pliant snow]

I think so

[safe dragon]

or is that foolish

[pliant snow]

recreates program since i already deleted it

[safe dragon]

luckily you copy pasted the code here

[pliant snow]

#include "stdio.h"

int main(int argc, char** argv) {
    int array[] = {2, 3, 5, 7, 11, 13, 17, 19};
    int i = 0;
    int value = array[i]++;
    printf("Value: %d i: %d\n", value, i);
    printf("%d\n", array[i]);

    return 0;
}

Like this?

[safe dragon]

yeah

[pliant snow]

Value is 2, i is 0, array[i] is 3

so yeah

[safe dragon]

ok

makes sense

at least within the logic we established

[rain apex]

there's no case where u have to increment more than 1 to get to next value in an array right

[pliant snow]

C arrays are stored sequentially in memory, if thats what youre asking

[rain apex]

yea this all makes sense in C

[cinder karma]

No

Sorry

That was for the xml comments thing

I do prefer pure functions myself, easier to reason about

Probably why I'm more static happy than Pathos

[supple ether]

I use them when I can, but things get messy when you're dealing with game code or i/o

[cinder karma]

(If the static is pure I think it's fine.)

Yeah there is a reason why I'm joyfully not doing this stuff anymore XD

[supple ether]

I use pure functions for data transformation / creation, and for everything else I try to just use consistent logic and document what something does

[devout vault]

Documentation?

[supple ether]

I use pure functions a lot with transpilers actually

[devout vault]

(I need to clean up SpaceCore so much)

[cinder karma]

Meanwhile I put pythons for else loop in work code

I do it joyously

[devout vault]

(JA I can at least pretend is dead since nothing new will happen to it anymore)

For… else?

[supple ether]

it's like a for loop but it goes to else after it's done if you don't break it IIRC?

[cinder karma]

Yes

[devout vault]

Huh

[cinder karma]

for file in file to process:
    If file.poll():
        # do stuff 
    Else: break
Else: break

[devout vault]

The python! It burns!

[ivory shadow]

I just unleashed value += ++array[++i]; on another dev and now they're confused too. I didn't realize I had invented such a powerful cognitohazard.

[cinder karma]

Lol

I might sneak it onto the whiteboard at work

[supple ether]

I do wish python didn't make you do for i in range for numerical loops

[cinder karma]

Just no context

[supple ether]

I think that would get the next value in the array, increment it, and then add the incremented number to value?

[cinder karma]

It mutated the array value too

[ivory shadow]

It's the same as ```
i = i + 1;
array[i] = array[i] + 1;
value = value + array[i];

[supple ether]

yeah I meant to imply that but eh

english is way less concise than syntax

that's part of why I hate writing psuedocode

[ivory shadow]

(There, fully removed any operators besides + and =)

[supple ether]

the other day I was in the tmodloader discord and someone asked about ref and I explained how it worked and then someone else told me I was wrong and that you needed ref to be able to mutate reference types out of scope. they were so confident about it that I actually second-guessed myself and wrote up a test project to confirm it

[cinder karma]

Yeah

Reference types ate already a pointer

Ref on a reference types is a point error to a pojnter

[devout vault]

👵 Back in my day, we didn't have any fancy old modloader for Terraria mods

(That pre-modloader mod I made was fun, I did so much silly stuff. Including refactoring the game code since they said they weren't updating again)

[supple ether]

hey I was playing terraria back then too, modding just looked like a huge headache that I didn't want to deal with at the time

[ivory shadow]

Back in my day we copied our minecraft mods into the jar file by hand, and deleted our meta-inf folders by hand, up hill, both ways

[cinder karma]

So you're writing the HC modloader right casey?

[supple ether]

YES

and ran out of texture indices

and couldn't use them in multiplayer, except flan's mod, which had like, a whole-ass separate install process

[ivory shadow]

I still remember going through mod configs changing item IDs to avoid conflicts

[devout vault]

Risugami's (?) modloader was amazing at the time but so lackluster compared to forge

I remember updating one of my simpler mods before MCP came out with the update

[supple ether]

that isn't even that old. you still had to do manual id assignments for everything that wasn't items or blocks in 1.7.10

[devout vault]

If I can't convince Pathos to do it

[ivory shadow]

It's old if I repress my memories because it was terrible

[supple ether]

it was

[ivory shadow]

And to think, Stardew had the same problem until 1.6

[devout vault]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HylTafcm7U

[supple ether]

eh, it was less ebmedded though

[devout vault]

My first mod

[supple ether]

I REMEMBER THAT

[rain apex]

13 years ago

[pliant snow]

mod old enough to join the server

[supple ether]

don't remind me of how old I am lmao

[devout vault]

My mods weren't very popular for whatever reason

[rain apex]

wow this sponge just deletes a cube water its beautiful

[supple ether]

oh I found your old forum thread and I can't believe I forgot about these

I used biome wands a ton

[devout vault]

I made it for cheesing Forestry bees 😄

[supple ether]

LOL

[devout vault]

My favorite mod of mine was my Tinker's Construct ripoff

Even if the way I did armor was janky

[supple ether]

it was janky but fun

[devout vault]

...and was somehow so broken that my twin using a Witchery voodoo doll to kill me didn't work

[supple ether]

though honestly that describes like, the general modding experiece around that time

I do wish thaumcraft was still around, or something like it

[devout vault]

Supposedly the thermal expansion devs are updating it

Unless they stopped recently

[supple ether]

I miss having a broad, deep, puzzle-based, strongly-themed magic mod

if they do I hope they bring back the older mechanics. getting rid of wands was kind of lame, and the new card-based minigame is way less fun and more tedious

[devout vault]

I hadn't played the most recent version

I wish I could come up with mechanics as cool as some minecraft mods

I'm pretty happy with the user-definable teleportation network I did for S&S recently though (though that's veering on-topic)

[supple ether]

s&s?

[devout vault]

Sword and Sorcery

[supple ether]

oh right!

[cinder karma]

peeks in

Soooo

What's a minecraft

[supple ether]

okay, it's like. a boat. but flat. it still floats on the water. and it's made of finely-cut meat

wait I lied that's minceraft

minecraft is just some shitty shovelware tetris ripoff

[cinder karma]

Huh

Is it anything like fusion 360?

[lethal walrus]

Well it's 3d and you can move around

[supple ether]

it's exactly like fusion 360

there was actually a plagiarism lawsuit

[lethal walrus]

Oh yeah I forgot about that

[devout vault]

I just typed minceraft in the gifs section to try and find one of the title screen when it said minceraft and... there are some cursed gifs there

[supple ether]

wait oh my god there's a minecraft maxwell in here

[cinder karma]

Also Wren do you think I can get a refund on my soul?

Now that I don't do transpilers

[supple ether]

depends on who you sold it to

[devout vault]

Transpilers are fun though

(That's me never being able to get refund on my soul)

[cinder karma]

Well technically I sold it for my assembly skills

Transpilers just was a natural extension on that

[devout vault]

I did transpiler-y things in minecraft land for a while, so by the time I had to deal with assembly (in my college attempt, and brief Kirby Air Ride modding) it was fairly easy to understand

[supple ether]

aaaaargh do NOT remind me of mixins

[devout vault]

This was pre mixins 😄

[supple ether]

what did you use before that?

[devout vault]

Forge core mod voodoo, editing JAva bytecode

Extra fun when dealing with dev workspace being unobfuscated back then, and release versions being obfuscated

[crystal wren]

Is that not mixins with extra steps?

(Genuine question!)

[devout vault]

I don't know what mixins are

[supple ether]

mixins are like harmony but worse /opinion

[devout vault]

I assumed they were likeprefix/postfix patches

[crystal wren]

That's my assumption, yeah.

[cinder karma]

I thought they were like runtime type weirdness

[devout vault]

When I think of mixins I think of like class mixins

[supple ether]

they are, but you can also inject into the middle of a method. you can't change method code arbitrarily, though. you basically have to use annotations to write a matcher that defines the place to insert a method call

[devout vault]

Like copy pasting another class into an existing one

[devout vault]

Ah, interesting

[supple ether]

mixins are Evil

[devout vault]

I like class mixins, MC mixins don't sound fun 😛

[supple ether]

I mean better than coremodding probably but like

[supple ether]

yeah I've not worked with mixins anywhere other than MC

[cinder karma]

https://docs.python.org/3/library/abc.html#abc.ABCMeta

[devout vault]

I was using it for DGA at one point with a source generator I wrote, before Pathos turned it into text template generation (or whatever was pre source generators) for backwards compatibility with an older SDV version

(Since it was on older .net or something)

[supple ether]

man source generators are enough of a headache, I can't imagine not even having that to work with

[devout vault]

https://gist.github.com/spacechase0/94670a81d823d9cbf5d395648ec81f48

Interesting part is Test mixer.cs and Test mixin.cs

I thought source generators were pretty fun, if a bit of a pain

You can see my revolutionary debug method of adding a new file with my log output in C# comments too!

[supple ether]

I like the idea, they're just a bit obtuse sometimes, and being forced to work with an older language version is unpleasant

[devout vault]

(context.AddSource( "mixinlog", "/*" + log + "*/" );)

(I'm joking about revolutionary of course)

[devout vault]

Yeah, working in newer C# versions would be nice

I haven't come up with a reason to use source generators again yet

I guess I could make some Forge-esque stuff like [EventSubscribe(UpdateTicked)]

[supple ether]

I experimented with it a bit for some stardew mod stuff
mainly generating an array of subclass/interface impl instances and a constant count value to make it easier to do compartmentalized but similar things, like harmony patches

I'm still on the fence about it, but I wanted to try it out because it saves having to do runtime reflection, is relatively simple to use, and allows you to use an abstract class or interface to enforce templating,

[crystal wren]

Unrelated, but I've discovered my new favourite display manager.

[supple ether]

very minimalist

[cinder karma]

Unrelated but actually off topic

[devout vault]

I used reflection to power stuff like this: https://github.com/spacechase0/ComponentEquipment/blob/master/com/spacechase0/minecraft/componentequipment/block/Blocks.java (Automatically created and registered everything) But I know there was an argument for not doing that since if everyone did things would slow down a lot. Source generators would've been helpful then

[lethal walrus]

At some point I should figure out what wayland is

[crystal wren]

Like X11, but good. /lh

[supple ether]

does java have sourcegen?

[devout vault]

I don't know, especially back then

[lethal walrus]

X11 is a window manager isn't it

[devout vault]

I only know what wayland is from hearing about it back when I dealt with C++/SFML stuff

[pliant snow]

oh ive used this

[supple ether]

yeah java 8 is no fun for sure

[pliant snow]

ly or something?

[supple ether]

I do NOT miss it

[crystal wren]

It is ly!

[devout vault]

Java my behated

[pliant snow]

yeah its nice and simple

[cinder karma]

Technically doesn't every one have sourcegen

Since you can always just write a parser yourself

:ducks:

[worn remnant]

taking notes this is relevant to my interests

[supple ether]

I'm also hoping that in the future, neoforge makes things easier

[rain apex]

say i heard there was drama about microsoft removing pdb for minecraft

[crystal wren]

I just love that it's terminal based, so there's no need to initialise a window system just to initialise your other window system.

[rain apex]

are servers just not upgrading from now on

[devout vault]

Yeah, the PDB thing was mainly for bedrock servers I think?

[supple ether]

would probably be easier to do an assembly hacking engine

[devout vault]

Java parser would be easier than a C++ parser at least

Though I've heard clang's libraries might be able to be used generically if you need to?

That was ages ago though

I don't know how the Doxygen guys do it... or if it works for everything even

[safe dragon]

just a default ly display manager

I used that for like a year

[cinder karma]

No xmonad?

[devout vault]

Something something don't know what a monad is

[pliant snow]

its spelled nomad I think

[ivory shadow]

(This terrifies me, not because of sponges but because of old water updates. Congratulations your water is now flowing forever.)

[safe dragon]

xmonad is a a window manager not a display manager

which are for some reason completely different things that have essentially nothing to do with each other

display manager is probably one of the terms that has aged the worst

it just makes no sense anymore

[dapper sinew]

how do i allow binary code to run on Linux, keeps throwing segment faults and permission errors :(

even if ran by root

i just wanna print hello world

[crystal wren]

PSA: Windows 7 now is only 3 years younger than the ZX Spectrum was in the year 2000.

[cinder karma]

I just had to spend five minutes arguing my laptop into rebooting

Guys, why did we let computers become a thing

[sonic mirage]

Someone decided to be mean to sand one day and here we are

[marble jewel]

Don't worry. It's just a fad. It'll pass.

[cinder karma]

Please

Release me. Set me free.

[safe dragon]

I do remember thinking smartphones were a fad

[pliant snow]

wow ur older than smartphones what a geezer

[safe dragon]

you're totally not a fair bit older than me

[cinder karma]

I don't think k had opinions of tech before smartphones tbh

Like I didn't really care?

Was more concerned with school stuff

[safe dragon]

I didn't care about tech but I was convinced smartphones were a silly gimmick

which I think was just cause I was jealous

cause I didn't get one till a fair bit later

[cinder karma]

Pretty sure I didn't even know they existed until I got one tbh

Asian parent expectations:(

[safe dragon]

my classmates got blackberry and then ipods and then iPhones

getting a smartphone was something I had to pay for myself though

at the time my parents saw no legitimate reason for me to have one beyond thinking it was neat

got myself a samsung galaxy s4 which still works to this day

all of my old phones still work and I've never had a damaged screen

[cinder karma]

Although for the zero of you following my jank temperature controller BS, we're going with a second thermocouple

So now I can take thousands of measurements per second

Still only one attempt to set the temperature every three seconds

[cinder karma]

https://youtu.be/uhbDfi7Ee7k?si=ZSAQoqZqF7DG4XRH

[rotund violet]

all of my old phones still work and I've never had a damaged screen

What's the oldest one you've tried to boot up? Sometimes the batteries just die. Personally, I'm not inclined to try booting up the old Palm, not even for camp value.

Memories, though. Mostly bad memories. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treo_600

[rain apex]

peak flip phone aesthetics

[cinder karma]

I'm sorry, I think you meant

||this is a joke||

Tbh I still miss the Nokia brick phones

[rotund violet]

And that silly sound they played when you booted them up.

[worn remnant]

thinking about the Palm Pre, a phone i did not use but remember vividly https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5e/Palm_Pre.jpg

[rotund violet]

I remember hesitating to get that because Palm had started to implode.

[sonic mirage]

https://www.summet.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/03/lg-cu500-ss.jpg

Rotating camera, which you could use via the front screen/front media buttons

LG CU500

Got an iPhone 3GS after this, big jump

[worn remnant]

oh man this is the era of phone camera where i remember asking myself "why do they even bother putting cameras in these things"

sort of like the game boy camera. you were too busy thinking about, etc.

[sonic mirage]

I'm trying to find any pictures I took with it but all I'm finding from then is from my 2MP Nikon, an E4600 according to the metadata

[pliant snow]

I never had a flip phone, but i did have some LG with a slide out keyboard

It was this I think, LG Rumor 2

[rain apex]

wow double keyboard

[pliant snow]

I don't think i ever knew the name of the model at the time

[sonic mirage]

I used to sell that phone as a salesperson

[pliant snow]

I liked the hardware a lot, but the software was awful

It had some google maps app that just never ran at all, I was so jealous of smartphones

[sonic mirage]

That was a pretty good seller, especially for Sprint and Virgin

[pliant snow]

I think we were on virgin

[pliant snow]

I seem to remember people really liking Palm phones, although maybe I'm just thinking of the later Palm Pilots

[sonic mirage]

Yeah we'd sell these in the plastic clamshell with some minutes

The few Palm smartphones were good, they just didn't take off and then HP(?) gobbled them up

[pliant snow]

Yeah HP

[sonic mirage]

I bought their tablet once it went on firesale, then thought better of a dead ecosystem and traded it for some PC parts I think,

[pliant snow]

I remember my dad had an old black and white Pilot he used a bunch. He had all the accessories like the folding keyboard and a case with a belt hook lol

I do miss dumb phone designs. That LG phone wasn't great, but the hardware was much more interesting than smartphones are now

[sonic mirage]

Oh, I found a folder of pics from the LG

[pliant snow]

I wish i had my pictures from that camera. I remember having issues getting them off of it...

[sonic mirage]

cat tax

I assumed these would be worse, actually

Not that they're great lol

Oh wow, very period correct

Ok that's enough old pics

[cinder karma]

Cattt!

The oldest picture I have are from 2011

[worn remnant]

the sunset one is shockingly good for a potato. the other three are closer to my memory of these cameras

[cinder karma]

The cat is perfect

No criticisms

[sonic mirage]

Ok I lied but last one, just for atra. Small cat statue I had that I put a fake mustache on.

[cinder karma]

D'awwww

[sonic mirage]

That was the best of the apparent 10 that I took of the sunset. The rest the sun mostly blows out the camera

[pliant snow]

Has anyone tried out python uv

[cinder karma]

No, but I do want to

[safe dragon]

wayland woes today

I decided to open try but apparently my xdg desktop portal implementation does not support a file picker and zed relies on xdg desktop portal...

so I cannot open a project

a minor issue for a code editor

[devout vault]

That sounds like a pretty big thing to be missing

[safe dragon]

yes

it's not ideal...

I've run into it before but it's fairly rare since most projects are older than xdg desktop portal

I did it

you can override a specific part of the backend to use a different one

[pliant snow]

lol isnt that the whole point of a desktop portal

[safe dragon]

I'm now using lxqt specifically just for the file chooser

[pliant snow]

couldnt you just install xdg-desktop-portal-gtk or kde and be fine

[worn remnant]

anything but GNOME's file chooser. just a crime against humanity, that one

[safe dragon]

kind of but installing those comes with a gigantic list of extra packages

[pliant snow]

fair

probably have to install like all of qt or gtk

[safe dragon]

not just that

shit like krunner

[pliant snow]

lol

[rain apex]

what is up with gnome file chooser

[pliant snow]

i like how wayland and pipewire are required for this file picker

[safe dragon]

tbh gtk would've been fine

it's mostly kde that just seems to require you to install essentially the whole desktop environment to use the portal

[pliant snow]

theres a xdg-desktop-portal-wlr

[safe dragon]

that one also does not support a file picker

[pliant snow]

this is why i stopped using hyprland lol

[safe dragon]

once cosmic alpha comes out...

I will try it...

[pliant snow]

but will it have a file picker

isnt it supposed to be like next week

[safe dragon]

oh this is an interesting take

vim mode in zed opens the command palette

[pliant snow]

what do you mean

[safe dragon]

oh I typed half a sentence

in vim mode : opens the command palette

[pliant snow]

the neovim plugin for vscode does the same thing

[safe dragon]

oh the regular vim plugin doesn't

I do love the command palette

[pliant snow]

how is zed

is it worth the hype

[safe dragon]

uh it's functional it seems

[pliant snow]

strong praise

[safe dragon]

tbh it's better than my average experience launching an editor for the first time

but trying rust is probably making it too easy

the whole thing was written in rust, they probably test 90% of the features writing rust

time for c#

well it automatically asks me if I want to install C# support so that's a plus

I think this is just the C# lsp being shit

well the C# lsp seems completely broken but I don't think that's zed's fault

I've never gotten it to work in anything

elixir works fine

even gleam works

[pliant snow]

just not C#

[safe dragon]

yeah but I've never gotten that one to work so it's ok

I've accepted that lsps for C# are just extremely bad

[pliant snow]

because everyone just uses VS

[safe dragon]

or rider yes

copilot is pretty in your face

I rate it "an editor"/10

[cinder karma]

Ngl I was working on a PR for pathos and kept on getting confused due to different repo setup (ie, no implicit imports)

Or VS would fill in a method "my way" and pathos' editorconfig would be like "no we don't use => for method bodies here"

[safe dragon]

I think in this case it just gives up because it's a .net 9 preview project

which I only realize now

It's only a .net 9 preview project because it makes use of the new SearchValues<string>

which is very cool btw

[cinder karma]

I crashed chatgpt asking it for sed flags lol

[pliant snow]

sam altman will be calling you shortly

[cinder karma]

Anyways, I was looking for a sed flag where it was more verbose

[safe dragon]

and here I thought sed was just a string replacement tool

I've never used it beyond sed 's/text/newtext/'

[cinder karma]

Well i was doing bullshit with capture groups

And the syntax for capture groups isn't consistent from OS to OS

[lethal walrus]

it's not?

i mean i've only used it for text in discord but

[safe dragon]

capture groups? like regex capture groups?

seems to be the case

[cinder karma]

Yes

Regex capture groups

[safe dragon]

I wish you the best of luck

I struggle every time I have to do anything with regex beyond the absolute basics

[rotund violet]

<obligatory Zawinski reference>

[cinder karma]

The other issue is that I have to escape one level for the terminal and another for sed

To match \\ (latex line break) I needed 8 \

[safe dragon]

you truly end up in interesting scenarios

[rotund violet]

Latex and regular expressions sounds like a winning combination.

[safe dragon]

piping a latex document into sed at all is an interesting scenario I did not expect to ever encounter

[cinder karma]

More of a winning combination than word documents and sed!

[safe dragon]

and definitely more of a winning combination than a zip file and sed

[rotund violet]

More of a winning combination than word documents and sed!

But is it more winninger than Word documents and VBA?

[safe dragon]

is there a winning combination when word is involved

[cinder karma]

No

[rotund violet]

It's winning for someone. Just not the poor sod who has to maintain it.

[cinder karma]

Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

(This is unrelated to the previous conversation)

(It is related to USB devices)

(No more context will be given)

Hey chat what happens if I change the system python over to python 3.11?

[rain apex]

you win 1 morbillion dollars

[safe dragon]

it will use 3.11

ur welcome

[cinder karma]

I mean it is Linux

I could break everything