What was the prompt?
#general
reef pawn
errant cave
reef pawn
Ohh
golden ocean
LMAO
wicked root
If GPT5 didn't live up to expectations, why is it doing so well on the leaderboard? And why is polymarket acting like Google won the race this month?
ocean vortex
If GPT5 didn't live up to expectations, why is it doing so well on the leaderboa...
Who said it didn't live up to expectations? I think it did live up to them
It's a great model
the best we have
3.5 gonna destroy 3.0
wicked root
the best we have
why is polymarket giving the odds at 80% in favor of Gemini?
Oh, because of Gemini 3.0?
keen beacon
gem 3.0 isnt coming this month apparently
wicked root
gap seems to be narrowing though
keen beacon
but new 2.5 update
ocean vortex
why is polymarket giving the odds at 80% in favor of Gemini?
because it's a market for lmarena leaderboard with style control disabled. 2.5Pro still leads in this specific one leaderboard
wicked root
because it's a market for lmarena leaderboard with style control disabled. 2.5Pr...
yes, but if gpt5 is doing so well in everything else, wouldn't it take over soon?
candid storm
Fortunately i could switch teams just in time
ocean vortex
yes, but if gpt5 is doing so well in everything else, wouldn't it take over soon...
it can but it's close, 2.5Pro is benchmaxxed on lmarena
wicked root
@candid stormI don't see your name.
ocean vortex
and since 2.5Pro is technically leading at this moment on leaderboard with their settings, the odds are that
wicked root
hm I see
candid storm
Im RIC25
whole wagon
Smth that really annoyed me about openai powerpoint is a lot is just totally incorrect. Like here, 50 is the number of tests they ran not the percent. Imagine getting paid 8 figures and messing up smth so trivial
candid storm
ah I see you. Grinch127 here
Nice profit/loss!
golden ocean
barren prairie
Smth that really annoyed me about openai powerpoint is a lot is just totally inc...
And 50 is lower than 47.5
wicked root
🫡 I'm a bit worried if GOogle will be able to keep up the lead until the end of this month
whole wagon
How do you mess up trivial bar graphs
it makes me wonder what other bugs and stuff they have. entire team stayed up all night prepping and cant even spot errors on a bar chart
fickle venture
"Afk money grind" ahh
golden ocean
It's large
It loves language
and it's a model
fickle venture
Ok
golden ocean
are all other models gone
whole wagon
i like im always the very first for literally everything for some reason lol
whole wagon
are all other models gone
yup
fickle venture
anyways i have pro already
My website still didn't updated same with the app
keen beacon
anyways i have pro already
What are you gonna ask the pro model?
whole wagon
no idea
errant cave
anyways i have pro already
I really like that "introducing GPT-5" screen
It could be way better but it's a step in the right direction
Hope we can reach a level of aesthetics similar to Web 2 Gloss again
brittle tiger
anyways i have pro already
Damn I have Pro and only see thinking
rapid merlin
anyways i have pro already
damn nerds
im a plus user and i still only have it on my phone
:((
whole wagon
ye they give me stuff early. sometimes it gives a popup to ask if i want to be early tester for features or whatever
whole wagon
.
whole wagon
people called it crap without trying it? thats kinda weird
blazing bison
bro it's one shotting things that opus was sad trying to accomplish
it's bcs i'm trying with real world shi* now instead of some random create a game or site
brittle tiger
The negativity is due to it not matching the gains seen in previous gpt 2 -> gpt 3 and gpt 3 -> gpt 4 and hype posting leading up to release. It's clearly v good. Sentiment might get better
little narwhal
There’s treatment centers for gambling addiction
rapid merlin
what about the lmarena rating, though
I haven't tested it thoroughly yet as i dont have it on my computer yet
stray aspen
what about the lmarena rating, though
its still SoTA wdym
rapid merlin
it was below gemini for a bit which is a bit concerning
blazing bison
The negativity is due to it not matching the gains seen in previous gpt 2 -> gpt...
bro i think it's matching, atleast for code
stray aspen
anyways gpt 5 is a great model and its better than 2.5 pro
rapid merlin
it was some benchmark i believe
hollow ocean
rapid merlin
but yeah, i will see y'all tomorrow as i'm heading off to sleep
blazing bison
yeah it's better
it's sota
for me is underwhelming codex cli using gpt 5 on a project with 600k + tokens and identifying right files and doing modifications without creating any bug
and my prompt was not even good, it just did
stray aspen
lets see if it is SoTA in livebench
blazing bison
true
o3 was lazy
it's not
well, i didnt try it on chatgpt interface yet
for now i'm burning some dollars on the api
i think it saved me 5 hours of work for $2
🤓
stray aspen
that must be awfully expensive
echo aurora
When we adding Genie 3 ? 😼
Upvote it! #1403076345138774066
hoary elbow
Is genie two at least public?
solar hollow
still not able to solve simple chess puzzles with human words unfortunately
fickle venture
Upvote it! <#1403076345138774066>
is GPT-5 Thinking and GPT-5 Pro coming to lmarena?
fickle venture
still no GPT-5 on my plus account....
Same bro I having trouble wait it will take a while to get to your place
It's just rolling out slowly
Since people live is us and openai is there they got it fast
blazing bison
is GPT-5 Thinking and GPT-5 Pro coming to lmarena?
gpt-5-pro is not even api avaliable
so no
and thinking i think already is?
fickle venture
Oh I see
fickle venture
gpt-5-pro is not even api avaliable
So the pro version aren't on the api?
Like o3-pro
exotic nebula
So the pro version aren't on the api?
Nope
fickle venture
Dang
blazing bison
it's not necessary btw
wheat onyx
Same bro I having trouble wait it will take a while to get to your place
they said EoD for Plus accounts
blazing bison
this model takes more than 10 minutes for asnwer
flint skiff
damn is it just me or is gpt5 pretty meh at UX design?
claude does it a lot better for me
blazing bison
yeah it's meh
flint skiff
so better for backend stuff?
blazing bison
but if you give a example he is really good copycat
blazing bison
idk
i can use a example of a design that i like and gpt-5 can create using that
claude is not so good with this
flint skiff
trying it now
blazing bison
but if you don't have idea of what you want, then claude is better
flint skiff
yeah I mean gpt 5 is useful its just not as versatile as I expected
where are you using it?
flint skiff
its only medium reasoning on cursor rn
why do people even like cursor
I feel like they nerf models hard
everytime
blazing bison
it nerfs
you are not seeing the true potential
bcs they use like 3k tokens and rag
flint skiff
whats ur pipeline
blazing bison
rgn i'm using codex cli
blazing bison
they updated it
the reason i'm testing
claude code still better i think, but i'm not paying for claude anymore so
blazing bison
i think yes
i'm using api credits rgn bcs it was not working
the login thing
but they added it
flint skiff
I stopped my max 20x sub on claude cuz I thought gpt 5 was gonna be way better lol
might sub again
candid storm
and thinking i think already is?
I don't see it on the leaderboard?
flint skiff
it felt so garbage on cursor
blazing bison
I don't see it on the leaderboard?
well idk
flint skiff
holy fkkkk
blazing bison
it felt so garbage on cursor
even sonnet feels garbage
flint skiff
im sure they have it super nerfed
blazing bison
on cursor
flint skiff
cuz they made it free
blazing bison
bro they made it free, what you think?
flint skiff
for a week or smth
yeah
but like thats dumb no?
people that use it gets a bad taste
like this makes me wanna stay away from cursor more lol
hoary elbow
When do you think GPT 5 pro will come out as an api
hoary elbow
All right
blazing bison
i'm not saying never ,but idk
hoary elbow
flint skiff
probably a few months
but it kinda seems like openai is cooked now if this is all they got
flint skiff
I mean ill try it yeah
setting it up right now
are u impressed?
like actually
how does it fare to opus
blazing bison
i'm
opus failed 5 tries and gpt-5 one shotted a task on 600k tokens project
i didnt send 600k tokens btw, it was using cc and now codex cli
flint skiff
hmm
flint skiff
ur using vs code?
blazing bison
bro it was like 8k lines modifications without creating any bug
blazing bison
ur using vs code?
yes
flint skiff
yeah that sounds crazy
blazing bison
i never see an AI do that much modifications without break anything before
flint skiff
its way cheaper than opus too
blazing bison
it's C# btw
flint skiff
ok thats impressive
blazing bison
i run the test just for fun, i didnt believe in it bcs my parament was if opus and gemini 2.5 can't so no model can
sacred quail
i liked too
Still sad that O3 will disappear
Btw in free version on android, you can select reasoning or non reasoning
So which reasoning mode running in mobile app for free version ?
Medium reasoning ?
quartz light
guys
i figured out the true release date of gpt 5
gpt-5: 2025-08-05T20:29:37 UTC
gpt-5-mini-2025-08-07: 2025-08-05T20:31:07 UTC
gpt-5-mini: 2025-08-05T20:32:08 UTC
gpt-5-nano-2025-08-07: 2025-08-05T20:38:23 UTC
gpt-5-chat-latest: 2025-08-01T18:35:06 UTC
gpt-5-2025-08-07: 2025-08-01T19:09:20 UTC```
jade egret
anyways gpt 5 is a great model and its better than 2.5 pro
ofc but how long it would take gemini to catch up? gpt 5 is newer after all.
nah..
quartz light
```gpt-5-nano: 2025-08-05T20:39:44 UTC
gpt-5: 2025-08-05T20:29:37 UTC
gpt-5-mi...
gpt-5-chat-latest was made on august 1st lol
so
yall
stray aspen
```gpt-5-nano: 2025-08-05T20:39:44 UTC
gpt-5: 2025-08-05T20:29:37 UTC
gpt-5-mi...
so on lmarena we are using a version thats 2 days older
quartz light
connect the dots of the models which released like horizon beta n stuff
wicked root
gpt-5 is SoTA
What about gemini?
quartz light
```gpt-5-nano: 2025-08-05T20:39:44 UTC
gpt-5: 2025-08-05T20:29:37 UTC
gpt-5-mi...
can someone connect the dots and using this info figure out which of these models zenith, horizon beta etc could be
stray aspen
What about gemini?
its way below
quartz light
really?
whole wagon
Not in all aspects
Clearly
The benchmark is private
There is 10 public question and 400 private ones. The public ones not used in the testing
stray aspen
grok 4 is actually an amazing model
sacred quail
Guys, in mobile gpt 5 thinking using which reasoning mode ? Medium reasoning or high ? Or do we need to buy plus for able to select high reasoning
quartz light
stray aspen
Guys, in mobile gpt 5 thinking using which reasoning mode ? Medium reasoning or ...
idk how the reasoning levels work
the api just says gpt-5
what about the gpt-5 in lmarena
quartz light
oh, I thought thinking isnt available on free plan at all since they removed model selection
limpid schooner
hey guys, so did anyone figure out here what zenith was?
quartz light
hey guys, so did anyone figure out here what zenith was?
still waitin
fine ill try it
zealous panther
No one can
stray aspen
it was deepseek r2
quartz light
No one can
no, I posted this:
zealous panther
Oh ok
quartz light
this way we can find out what zenith could be
limpid schooner
still waitin
gotchui
limpid schooner
holy
quartz light
^
limpid schooner
i think he kiddin
i know xd
quartz light
hey guys, so did anyone figure out here what zenith was?
gpt-5-chat-latest
quartz light
yeah pretty sure
created 1st of august
likely just an edit of zenith
dingdingding
limpid schooner
so zenith was not a thinking model?
whole wagon
How do people fall for the simple bench 90% GPT5 "leak". They must be incredibly dumb
quartz light
so zenith was not a thinking model?
thinking models are not separate
candid storm
Is zenith gonna be on the leaderboard?
whole wagon
How do people fall for the simple bench 90% GPT5 "leak". They must be incredibly...
Actually makes me lose faith in humanity to see the sheer number of people blindly believing it
Without even a second of critical thoughts
quartz light
Is zenith gonna be on the leaderboard?
why
limpid schooner
thinking models are not separate
wow so when normal gpt 5 thinks in chatgpt it's zenith?
zenith was so good
quartz light
so, zenith was probably gpt 5, summit could be mini and lobster could be nano
quartz light
wow so when normal gpt 5 thinks in chatgpt it's zenith?
there are 2 separate gpt 5 models though
limpid schooner
they said summit is gpt 5
brisk helm
how do we select how much we want gpt 5 to think in lmarena
limpid schooner
lmarena mods
quartz light
gpt-5-nano was made 4 days later
stray aspen
you dont
quartz light
they said summit is gpt 5
o
flint skiff
is anyone using gpt 5 codex cli rn
stray aspen
fr yes cap
sour kiln
A heroic white police dog with shiny blue eyes, wearing a full police uniform, is bravely rescuing a brown rabbit from drowning in a fast-flowing river. The dog is standing in the water, strong and determined, holding the frightened rabbit gently in his mouth while people watch from the riverbank with admiration and awe. The scene is realistic and emotional, with splashing water, dramatic lighting, and a clear sky. The dog is the hero of the town, and everyone loves and respects him
civic flame
well yikes
quartz light
we still have gemini 3 and grok 5
grok 5?
i thought it would be grok 4.1 or 4.5
since its just a coding version
quartz light
i just realised the placement of the lines might actually represent the exact date of release
hollow ocean
@deep adder question 10 is solved
mint relic
Brillant
quartz light
i just realised the placement of the lines might actually represent the exact da...
got this result with gpt 5 thinking twice! i guess using that logic, gpt is really good at figuring out the date but seems like my theory is either wrong or the model is delayed
quartz light
how does genspark have gpt 5 pro
its probably just gpt 5 high
quartz light
gpt 5 on bing is out
hey thats cool
no signup too
deep research pops up on signin
cool
stray aspen
gpt 5 in microsoft copilot sucks
quartz light
gpt 5 in microsoft copilot sucks
really?
stray aspen
yes
quartz light
this one nailed it first try
which site?
stray aspen
you basically get points from rating the AIs
and you spend them points to use the ais
gpt-5 on microsoft copilot is great
but you have to ask it to think deeply first
quartz light
and you spend them points to use the ais
so, https://obl.dev
sacred quail
also in poe app you can select high reasoning mode
blazing bison
so apparently zennith was gpt-5 too, but another version, and summit won for some reason and they killed zenith
😢
stray aspen
so, https://obl.dev
whats that
jade egret
so apparently zennith was gpt-5 too, but another version, and summit won for som...
RIP zenith
plz gemini 3
stray aspen
how does the reasoning effort of gpt-5 work?
the gpt-5 of microsoft copilot is smarter than the one in lmarena
stray aspen
yeah that website sucks
yupp.ai is miles better
if we tallk about using paid models for free of course
jade egret
if i use gpt-5 to prompt engineer a prompt for gpt-5 🤔
sacred quail
yupp.ai
man, thanks for this. I just used for o3 pro. Its nice to able test this
btw on poe app, you can use gpt 5 high reasoning with free for multiple prompts
stray aspen
man, thanks for this. I just used for o3 pro. Its nice to able test this
dont use it too much tho
sacred quail
dont use it too much tho
why
exotic gust
I’m scared of what the future might bring for ai
stray aspen
why
its too expensive
also one thing
if you go here and make your chat public it reduces the cost by half
stray aspen
yes very interesting
sacred quail
if you go here and make your chat public it reduces the cost by half
another nice information, ty !
stray aspen
microsoft launched a 3d model website
sacred quail
LM arena is still my beloved but, its interesting to see someone trying to be competitor
stray aspen
LM arena is still my beloved but, its interesting to see someone trying to be co...
lm arena still wins
its free
no sign up
what i like about yupp is that it has a lot of models
quartz light
DUUUDE WHAT THE ####
https://123.nekoweb.org/ai/GPT5/COPILOTMARIO.html
THE ASSETS LOOK SO GOOD
even though jump doesn't work
stray aspen
where did you make it
quartz light
copilot!!!
quartz light
quartz light
yep
quartz light
deep research pops up on signin
@stray aspen did you sign in?
stray aspen
yes
it hasnt rolled out for my account yet
probably because i created it outside of canada
stray aspen
yes
quartz light
does it cut off
verbal nimbus
but the website is laggy
It's faster than LMArena for me
stray aspen
that fancy UI makes it laggy
stray aspen
It's faster than LMArena for me
thats crazy
verbal nimbus
I'm on mobile, Web Dev Arena throws an error like 50% of the time
Sandbox fails to appear, voting button disappears, lol
ChatGPT app can't copy
Claude input bar still buggy
Why do all these AI apps have so buggy frontends
verbal nimbus
Gemini is so funny
It manages to recreate an entire component from minified and obfuscated React code
But then gets stuck trying how to make an inner div fill its parent
verbal nimbus
But then gets stuck trying how to make an inner div fill its parent
All it has to do was remove max-width
thorn valley
what i like about yupp is that it has a lot of models
yupp has the o3-pro model to use. i found it interesting, I'll try it later."
rare python
FixupX
quartz light
is this genie 3
no lol
its old
@stray aspen @thorn valley @verbal nimbus check this out
opus 4.1
verbal nimbus
https://123.nekoweb.org/ai/GPT5/yuppmario.html
Whoa cool, it runs on mobile haha
But I can't interact with it
quartz light
Whoa cool, it runs on mobile haha
really?
quartz light
i'll try gpt 5 nano to implement nipplejs and a circle button for jump for mobile controls
solar galleon
just like yesterday i could upload images in direct chat i used gemini 2.5 pro but it doesn't let me and only shows the error anyone know why
verbal nimbus
IDK what's up with Web tech, nowadays stuff loads faster on mobile than my gaming PC
quartz light
no lag here too
:D
thorn valley
well optimized, to tell the truth
quartz light
its a whole game with sprites, sounds and levels in a single html file!
thorn valley
but I can't interact either
quartz light
incredible
quartz light
but I can't interact either
i'm trying to get nano to implement mobile support
it might be janky but
@thorn valley @verbal nimbus can yall check if there are mobile controls now? https://123.nekoweb.org/ai/GPT5/yuppmario2.html
jolly raven
How can I use picture to picture.
worthy thunder
Context Arena Update: Added GPT-5 (Thinking, 08-07) to 2needle (#1 @ 128k AUC), 4needle (#1 @ 128k AUC), and 8needle (#1 @ 128k AUC) leaderboards! Also added GPT-5-Mini and GPT-5-Nano. (https://x.com/DillonUzar/status/1953660295559192919)
More model results at: http://contextarena.ai
Overall GPT-5 is great for <=128k! Only exception is 8needle, Grok 4 still performs much better at <=32k compared to GPT-5, but GPT-5's performance at higher context wins out.
2needle: Top results (AUC @ 128k):
- GPT-5 (Thinking, 08-07): 96.7% (#1)
- GPT-5-Mini (Thinking, 08-07): 92.6% (#2)
- Gemini 2.5 Flash (Thinking, 06-17): 91.5% (#3)
- Gemini 2.5 Pro (Thinking, 06-05): 89.6% (#2)
- Gemini 2.5 Flash (Non-thinking, 06-17): 81.7% (#5)
- Grok 4 (Thinking, 07-09): 79.5% (#6)
- o4-mini (Thinking, 04-16): 76.0% (#7)
... - GPT-5-Nano (Thinking, 08-07): 44.2% (#34)
8needle: Top results (AUC @ 128k):
- GPT-5 (Thinking, 08-07): 50.3% (#1)
- Grok 4 (Thinking, 07-09): 48.4% (#2)
- GPT-5-Mini (Thinking, 08-07): 44.7% (#3)
- Gemini 2.5 Pro (Thinking, 06-05): 43.9% (#4)
- Gemini 2.5 Flash (Thinking, 06-17): 33.5% (#5)
- o4-mini (Thinking, 04-16): 30.8% (#6)
- o3 (Thinking, 04-16): 27.9% (#6)
... - GPT-5-Nano (Thinking, 08-07): 11.9% (#22)
quartz light
Context Arena Update: Added GPT-5 (Thinking, 08-07) to 2needle (#1 @ 128k AUC), ...
niiice
stray aspen
thats great
wicked root
anyone know when the next set of votes will be added to the overall rankings?
quartz light
gpt 5 yaps too much
obsidian cargo
Anyone know what was up with Zenith? It seemed even better than Summit, which was GPT-5
haughty siren
When do you guys think Gemini 3.0 is coming?
oblique needle
yeah, I dunno... my guess is 3.0 is pretty much dead in the water unless someone else launches a more powerful model
brisk helm
its a whole game with sprites, sounds and levels in a single html file!
how many prompts did it take?
or did u make it ur self?
quartz light
how many prompts did it take?
one
brisk helm
craazy with opus 4.1 or gpt 5?
brisk helm
yeah thats why i was asking
quartz light
quartz light
trying this
5 minutes ago https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=boJG84Jcf-4
LOL
wait wtf thats literally my generation what?
LOL
DUDE
steady vale
quartz light
wait wtf thats literally my generation what?
nvm i think..
lilac nimbus
In my text GPT5 code is next level
hasty rock
how often does lm update?
verbal nimbus
<@470028951503503362> <@858135822389346344> can yall check if there are mobile c...
Yup, but it's more buggy than the previous version. If you're on PC, you can enable mobile preview on Dev Tools.
verbal nimbus
yeah, I dunno... my guess is 3.0 is pretty much dead in the water unless someone...
DeepSeek R2 is supposed to come out this month
keen beacon
What is the difference between chat gpt 5 nano and gpt 5 mini?
floral comet
Do the gpt5 on llm arena is a thinking model or not?
little narwhal
DeepSeek R2 is supposed to come out this month
Source?
terse shuttle
Do the gpt5 on llm arena is a thinking model or not?
thinking
floral comet
thinking
Cool thanks! I'm trying it right now I'm very impressed, anyways sorry for many question but do you know what variant of gpt5 is this?
terse shuttle
Cool thanks! I'm trying it right now I'm very impressed, anyways sorry for many ...
lmarena have basic gpt-5, gpt-5-mini and gpt-5-nano
floral comet
Oh cool! I thought there's only 1 gpt 5 model.. Thanks !
echo aurora
What is the difference between chat gpt 5 nano and gpt 5 mini?
I see them described as
- gpt-5-mini: cost-optimized reasoning and chat; balances speed, cost, and capability
- gpt-5-nano: high-throughput tasks, especially simple instruction-following or classification
echo aurora
Oh cool! I thought there's only 1 gpt 5 model.. Thanks !
Yeah we added the other two a bit after we added 5
floral comet
Yep i see that now, Thanks!
keen fulcrum
@echo aurora Its hard to keep up with stealth model names. Can you show a stealth leaderboard?
sterile dust
terse shuttle
what is this?
sterile dust
Hmmm...... Maybe they can't really search the web.
Is there other models which can search the web in lmarena?
echo aurora
<@283397944160550928> Its hard to keep up with stealth model names. Can you show...
I can share but overall I think that'd be tough to do. Are you getting at a leaderboard of just stealth models or just a list of all active stealth models?
sterile dust
what is this?
The two models can't search the web, is there other models which can search the web in lmarena?
terse shuttle
The two models can't search the web, is there other models which can search the ...
idk
keen fulcrum
I can share but overall I think that'd be tough to do. Are you getting at a lead...
I would prefer the first option.
The elo scores are never revealed to us until model release
echo aurora
I would prefer the first option.
Gotcha, yeah I'm sure there are some creative things that could be done with that.
mossy drum
Gotcha, yeah I'm sure there are some creative things that could be done with tha...
Maybe let companies, who provide those anon models, decide, whether they want to disclose scores / show model on leaderboard or not... Some anonymity or mystery is fun, keep it that way.
turbid phoenix
GPT 5 is not Skynet..... 🤬
molten cipher
gpt 5 is insane
prime mulch
People say gpt 5 have another update in few days is that real
restive rampart
GPT-5 only won 33% of the 49 battles against Gemini 2.5 pro if I am reading this correclty? https://lmarena.ai/leaderboard/text
lethal current
Is it normal that gpt 5 is not formatting the code? Or is that on the lma side?
pulsar rain
devout vault
primal orbit
GPT-5 only won 33% of the 49 battles against Gemini 2.5 pro if I am reading this...
yep. next line gemini 2.5 wins 67% of times
rapid merlin
i really wonder what's taking them so long to roll it out to plus, especially considering i already have it on my phone
blazing bison
i really wonder what's taking them so long to roll it out to plus, especially co...
Clear cookies 🍪
wicked root
yep. next line gemini 2.5 wins 67% of times
HELL YEAH
blazing bison
And people is reporting that apparently gpt 5 is dumb on chatgpt
The gpt 5 chat model is dumb
hardy lion
GPT-5 only won 33% of the 49 battles against Gemini 2.5 pro if I am reading this...
one caveat is that that is only for decisive votes. ties are filtered out. 67/33 is pretty steep, but of thier 49 battles, we don't acutally know how many they tied. It's technically possible it was 1 gpt-5 win, 2 gemini wins and 46 ties. We should find a better way to report the ties.
A simple one could be to just count it as 0.5 for each. Any suggestions?
rapid merlin
Clear cookies 🍪
damn, now i got it on my pc too, thanks
restive rampart
one caveat is that that is only for decisive votes. ties are filtered out. 67/33...
It is "Battle Count for Each Combination of Models (without Ties)", so I am assuming ties removed from it.
hardy lion
oh you're right! it aught to include tie counts in both places imo
hardy lion
That's for style control, which takes more into account than just the raw wins/losses. You can see gemini's heade to win win-loss advantage reflected in the non-style leaderboards where it is actually above gpt-5
wicked root
That's for style control, which takes more into account than just the raw wins/l...
Im very glad to hear this. Thank you.
primal orbit
could anyone explain what is "style control"?
pulsar rain
is it system prompt?
wicked root
could anyone explain what is "style control"?
Apparently it removed emotes and other ‘human’ elements.
restive rampart
could anyone explain what is "style control"?
rapid merlin
first test of the day on pc, and i can already say it isn't that censored which is nice
it also isn't nearly as lazy as o3 was, wow
wicked root
first test of the day on pc, and i can already say it isn't that censored which ...
What have you found? 👀
hardy lion
It's explained in this post: https://news.lmarena.ai/style-control/
The general idea is that research has found that even if two responses contain the same information, people will vote for ones with more "stylistic features" such as markdown, lists, bold etc.
It's even been found that people will vote for more stylastic responses even if they are inaccurate or wrong. Some companies did RLHF too hard and their models were optimized just for responses that look good
So style control learns two sets of parameters, the model strenths, and the importanes of the style features. And then the model strengths are actuall interpreted as "the model strength if all style features were equal". Those are what is reported on the style controlled leaderboards, which are the defaults. It's similar to controlled trials in medacine where they correct studies for differences in age, or other factors.
cedar tide
rapid merlin
What have you found? 👀
it was able to 1-shot optimize a bot system for a game, and it did by a lot
with no resistance whatsoever
native venture
Hello 👋
rapid merlin
hi
solid brook
Wth
After my i hit limit on gpt 5
It switched to gpt 4o mini
Not gpt 5 mini
Are they high
neon idol
@echo aurora Yo a question. I have found on copilot GPT 5 but i the same that is chatgpt app?
keen beacon
Does anyone know if in the future it will be possible to upload files to the LMArena project?
neon idol
Does anyone know if in the future it will be possible to upload files to the LMA...
Is possible upload files
pulsar rain
astral prawn
Dang. I'm gonna miss 4.5 🙁
keen beacon
Is possible upload files
I think it only allows images, not files as such. I wanted to try with a Word file but it doesn't let me
echo aurora
<@283397944160550928> Yo a question. I have found on copilot GPT 5 but i the sam...
yeah it's the standard model
keen beacon
I am pissed off. People on r/Singularity are posting about their rage about GPT-5 and other models leaving... Then unsubscribing. Some reasons were: It has less personality, answers are too short, it wasn't as big of an improvement... Etc.
I really do not understand how people are like that. They are surely going to update the model like 4o to adhere to people's needs.
Sorry. A bit angered at the moment.
echo aurora
Does anyone know if in the future it will be possible to upload files to the LMA...
yeah it's something we're putting thought into, more file upload options would be nice
neon idol
yeah it's the standard model
So is GPT 5 medium?
torn mantle
is it -chat or -thinking ?
fading moth
So is GPT 5 medium?
I have same question too
neon idol
I have same question too
Lol
fading moth
Also, can anyone confirm the exact model version/variant of GPT-5 that is available via direct chat in lmarena?
echo aurora
I'm going to double check and will followup
fading rover
I am trying lmarena web for image geneation with prompt somehow most engines now a days even if mentiond 16:9 creates only square ratio. can anyone help how to specifically force to have 16:9 or 9:16
torn mantle
Also, can anyone confirm the exact model version/variant of GPT-5 that is availa...
seems to me like its the default one
not the -chat ver
wicked root
SHUT UP
Look at mr fat cat here. Did you go long on OpenAI?
I went long on google man. It’s imperative Altman’s products lose to Google
fading moth
seems to me like its the default one
With thinking?
Or not
So the most most basic gpt5 model nothing else, no thinking?
misty vault
Dang. I'm gonna miss 4.5 🙁
Dang. I'm gonna miss GPT 4 preview 0314 🙁
keen beacon
yeah it's something we're putting thought into, more file upload options would b...
In my case I would like to use it for school, it would be great
torn mantle
In my case I would like to use it for school, it would be great
it would be nice, but why arent you using gemini on aistudio for that?
white hatch
Dang. I'm gonna miss GPT 4 preview 0314 🙁
best model ever 😭
torn mantle
i still think the current gemini is better than gpt5
flint skiff
im using gpt 5 high on cursor, through openai api
is it still nerfed if I do this?
it feels nerfed lol but maybe im just expecting too much from gpt 5
lament radish
someone will tell me how to generate videos here ?
blazing bison
Guys the thinking model of chatgpt is not gpt 5 thinking
The output is worst 100% of the time
There is something wrong with chatgpt interface thinking
😡
blazing bison
is it still nerfed if I do this?
It is, cursor will always use rag with exception when using max mode and it don't work with your own api key
floral comet
Wow i tried vibecoding with gpt, it refused and says the feature I'm requesting is impossible for the current environment, I think that's what set apart between gpt5 and other models.. Other would just most probably agree and waste alot of tokens and my time
flint skiff
It is, cursor will always use rag with exception when using max mode and it don'...
yeah but I used it in vs code and it has no internet access
terse shuttle
@echo aurora just out of interest, are there any plans for a 3d llm arena?
golden ocean
mc bench
stoic ridge
why my videos doesn't have background sound,
solar hollow
The comparisons that open ai doesn't want to show 😶
goes to show that hassabis is the only one not bsing
floral comet
why my videos doesn't have background sound,
I'm assuming its copyrighted
stoic ridge
Then why video long only 4sec and helf, not 5sec🥲
sly estuary
GPT5 model not working right?
i just ask any questions but only get "Something went wrong with this response, please try again." response
upbeat owl
Hello
floral comet
i just ask any questions but only get "Something went wrong with this response, ...
Try sending a second message on the same chat don't retry it. Works fine for me
sly estuary
no, not work for me...
floral comet
Yeah and usually it happens to me when my input is long
prime mulch
Try to reload the page
hollow imp
What is google bard?
pliant cliff
What is google bard?
old gemini
keen beacon
What is google bard?
The OG google model
I tried it when it was new. It was only good for basic stuff
no coding or such were good
Would be nice to see it back for "nostalgia" vibes
rapid merlin
google bard is an absolute joke
it told me it can't produce a script in a coding context since it can only generate text
bright kayak
does anyone know how much worse gpt 5 mini is to gpt 5?
barren prairie
it would be nice, but why arent you using gemini on aistudio for that?
Grmini in Gemini app is better for studying than ai studio because it has a lot of good feautures
Did open ai remove the old features like search and edu mode from chatgpt free tiers who knows ?
keen beacon
does anyone know how much worse gpt 5 mini is to gpt 5?
You can always put them side to side on LMArena and try the same prompts and see the difference. Benchmarks can be a hit or miss at times
bright kayak
You can always put them side to side on LMArena and try the same prompts and see...
oh i didnt notice they added the mini and nano versions
thanks
willow grail
alright. so have u found out what is best way to use gpt5 for swe?
is it cline, cursor, poe, chatgpt?
strange elm
hi i love lmarena :3
keen beacon
Hello again, does anybody know what this pre-release model Velocilux could be? Came by when I was doing battle mode.
glass arch
I got gpt5 to leak its system prompt to me
rapid merlin
so far so bad with the gpt5 in chatgpt
it keeps trying to access variables before even initializing them
shadow jewel
PLEASE make it so that I can share raw github with the ais 🙏
rapid merlin
i noticed claude doing that aswell
glass arch
chatgpt makes it easy
you can just make a zip file and upload it
then it will extract it and view the content
pulsar rain
why chatgpt 5 talks like college students write note in their lectures?
terse shuttle
why chatgpt 5 talks like college students write note in their lectures?
system prompt mb
rapid merlin
the model on lmarena actually wrote the code without minifying it
i dont know why this model does it
or well to an extent
eternal niche
gpt5 sucks
rapid merlin
i have memories and all off so that shouldn't influence anything either
to be fair i didnt really use a three essay prompt, but i think it should pass this (nothing spawns, tried multiple prompts to fix it and nothing)
gpt-5-thinking in chatgpt.com ^
floral comet
Is the gpt5 model in lmarena uses high reasoning or the medium one? Thanks for any answers!
eternal niche
Is the gpt5 model in lmarena uses high reasoning or the medium one? Thanks for ...
yes
floral comet
Alright thanks!
keen beacon
What is considered to be good code? Noob noncoder here
rapid merlin
What is considered to be good code? Noob noncoder here
it's not really about the quality of the code itself, it's the fact it started minifying and making everything hard to read right away, claude NEVER does that
feels lazy to me personally
obtuse heart
to be fair i didnt really use a three essay prompt, but i think it should pass t...
ive seen a video comparing gpt 5 against opus 4.1 with pretty similar prompts to this, and opus 4.1 beat gpt 5 by a mile
keen beacon
it's not really about the quality of the code itself, it's the fact it started m...
Ah, okay. From what I understand, commenting the code is important
Holy jesus
white hatch
I'm not sure, but i feel like gpt-5 was nerfed
terse shuttle
I'm not sure, but i feel like gpt-5 was nerfed
same feel
tribal aspen
I mean the max reasoning only?
terse shuttle
I mean the max reasoning only?
yep
terse shuttle
in #1372229840131985540 already requested to non-think model
tribal aspen
when it reasons in Copilot/gpt website it doesnt take so long
as much it takes in lmarena
terse shuttle
when it reasons in Copilot/gpt website it doesnt take so long
idk
tribal aspen
I wonder which one is nerfed
terse shuttle
maybe because llmarena using not the same provider that using official openai
i don't know
tribal aspen
maybe because llmarena using not the same provider that using official openai
I wonder if Copilot uses a nerfed model or not
as everyone hates copilot
terse shuttle
idk
ripe brook
What are the models in battle mode?
white hatch
random models
ripe brook
still no GPT5 on my plus account..
well, wait until it's not all rolled out yet, it was rolled out to me today for my Pro subscription
ornate ether
lmarena is actually insane bruh
fleet lintel
lmarena is actually insane bruh
how come?
torn mantle
lmarena is actually insane bruh
elaborate
fleet lintel
still no GPT5 on my plus account..
i have it on my mobile but not on desktop
ornate ether
just the damn concept
so many models, many of them paid or limited, image gen, web dev and now video gen all at one place
for free
wthelly
wheat onyx
i have it on my mobile but not on desktop
neither for me
keen beacon
so many models, many of them paid or limited, image gen, web dev and now video g...
I wish there was more promotion about the service to get people test it more
and get more data
ornate ether
I wish there was more promotion about the service to get people test it more
but then enshittification would occur
i like it as it is
keen beacon
but then enshittification would occur
wdym? All kinds of people test it already
not just coders or specialists
ornate ether
isnt mainstream
keen beacon
I am an ordinary day to day user myself
ornate ether
I am an ordinary day to day user myself
yea me too but it isnt really that popular
to be considered "popular"
keen beacon
yea me too but it isnt really that popular
I wouldn't call it enshittification. Dynamic testing is the future for AI models. Though I do understand the concern of models getting nerfed from intentional bad voting
trying to sabotage the list as LMArena gets more popular
I checked the traffic yesterday and it has been increasing steadily
ornate ether
I wouldn't call it enshittification. Dynamic testing is the future for AI models...
qwen 3 randomly popping off at 10000 points
brittle tiger
X
obtuse heart
so many models, many of them paid or limited, image gen, web dev and now video g...
when i asked the opus 4.1 model it said it was sonnet 3.5
😭
ornate ether
when i asked the opus 4.1 model it said it was sonnet 3.5
many models do that
wheat onyx
Huh
https://x.com/AiBattle_/status/1953792181514170750?t=Q6VrBxG_2UYnSfJOyXAyqg...
probably 5pro
ornate ether
even chatgpt on it's official page when asked says it's powered by gpt 4 with a knowledge cut
off at oct 2024
obtuse heart
many models do that
ah so it doesnt actually matter then?
wheat onyx
OAI really made users have the same limits as with o3, even though it significantly reduced its costs internally
disappointing
ornate ether
ah so it doesnt actually matter then?
no no the same it's the model shown in the tab
brave orbit
Check My Website just a driveing game it would be cool if want to try it https://id12b.github.io/
eager crag
Does GPT-5 make images too?
brave orbit
Check My Website just a driveing game it would be cool if want to ...
and its maked by gpt 5 you can not think how good it is
eager crag
Hello?
calm sequoia
keen beacon
Cannot say that it is phenomenal
Quite the same except for hallucination rate
And perhaps coding performance and different formatting when writing an output
Gemini 3.0 is where it is at when it comes out. Also Deepseek R2.
pseudo hemlock
Is GPT5 MoE?
brave orbit
well, wait until it's not all rolled out yet, it was rolled out to me today for ...
just try to clear you browser cookies turst me it will do it
i had the same thing i just cleared my cookies and its done
languid crescent
Is GPT-5 slow at answering? Sometimes I get errors and need to refresh the message and the website.
brave orbit
its diff on what messages since it many think on diff messages for not hard messages it doesnt think for easy messages it just doesnt think
brave orbit
Is GPT-5 slow at answering? Sometimes I get errors and need to refresh the messa...
Trying cleaning you Browser Cookies or its just that openai servers are busy
stoic ridge
When I generate videos some vids are long 8sec,but some have 5sec , why?
brave orbit
however openai stats is ChatGPT
:minor: Degraded Performance soo just so you know that
molten cipher
and its maked by gpt 5 you can not think how good it is
made*
delicate rapids
hello
misty vault
Large Language Model
wintry tinsel
Is king fall definitively better than GPT5
wintry tinsel
So it costs the same as Gemini api when Gemini is free? Lol what a joke
unkempt oak
guy the are a methods for generate video while veo3 audio?
hollow imp
FYI
Whats the difference in performance between free tier and paid tier? The only difference I found was deep research feature
Talking about the Gemini web btw
obtuse heart
no no the same it's the model shown in the tab
okay thanks lol, its crazy how this website is hosting so many paid models for free, its great
i just wish i can use it on cline tho
clever estuary
no difference from what I've seen...
eternal niche
зет
maiden fulcrum
good morning everyone
could you give me a feedback about GPT-5 please, I still don't have it on my end.
balmy mist
could you give me a feedback about GPT-5 please, I still don't have it on my end...
u paid or free version?
maiden fulcrum
u paid or free version?
Paid; Plus tier
molten cipher
i have plus tier but don't see it on my models list
maiden fulcrum
do a hard refresh
How can I do that on my iOS app?
balmy mist
or control shift r
try updating your app
or connect to a diff wifi, sometimes that works
but gpt5 has been good imo
my new daily driver
molten cipher
erm
maiden fulcrum
or connect to a diff wifi, sometimes that works
I have tried those methods but still don't have it
inland cedar
I have tried those methods but still don't have it
maybe delete and reinstall?
i just updated my app
maiden fulcrum
i just updated my app
Is there other way too update the app than from the app store, because it says open rather than update
inland cedar
u shud delete and reinstall
maiden fulcrum
i still don't have it @inland cedar
true condor
So where is Qwen-Image in leaderboard?
fleet lintel
google share is up a bit.. is it gpt-5 effect?
indigo hazel
i dont know guys. im coding since this night with gpt5 and i feel really good with it. it doesnt make many mistakes like 2.5 pro just because for example doesnt hallucinate. im making a program in python, so it's not web
stray aspen
yes its amazing
clever estuary
hmmm 5 pro is really good at counting letters without reasoning
maiden fulcrum
hmmm 5 pro is really good at counting letters without reasoning
you used pro for this question?
clever estuary
I mean why not, doesn't seem there's a limit rn
maiden fulcrum
why not normal gpt-5 instead
clever estuary
just testing it ig
wheat onyx
or control shift r
not helping. Plus - still dont have
maiden fulcrum
not helping. Plus - still dont have
i am in the same boat
keen beacon
just testing it ig
Try a hard math equation to test it for real
balmy mist
not helping. Plus - still dont have
I have plus and had it since yesterday around 3pm
i dont use the app version tho, only web
wheat onyx
i dont use the app version tho, only web
have both versions - no upgrade on either yet
maiden fulcrum
do you guys think grok 4 heavy is better than gpt-5
solid brook
Guys i have a problem with chatgpt. Once i hit the limit on gpt 5 it switches to gpt 4o mini
No gpt 5 mini
Gpt 4o mini is garbage
obtuse heart
do the paid models in the website have any limits when youre using them?
stray aspen
eternal niche
guys gpt5 sucks
molten cipher
guys gpt5 sucks
no thank you
keen beacon
guys gpt5 sucks
You still going at it?
solid brook
guys gpt5 sucks
It is good idk why people hate it
eternal niche
You still going at it?
solid brook
Lie
molten cipher
DEMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM
eternal niche
I uh don't think you actually worked with the models thats why
ok
obtuse heart
gpt-5 has went on the top of the list, this is an old screenshot posted here bro
solid brook
0/10 ragebait
eternal niche
gpt-5 has went on the top of the list, this is an old screenshot posted here bro
bro
eternal niche
gpt5 sucks
solid brook
Yeah whatever you say
eternal niche
theyre the same rank
dude
keen beacon
gpt5 sucks
Say something new, dude.
eternal niche
Say something new, dude.
why
eternal niche
solid brook
Say something new, dude.
Ignore this guy
obtuse heart
okay lol hes just tryna get people mad
eternal niche
just accept that gpt5 sucks
solid brook
Yeah man
brisk helm
gpt5 sucks
nuh uh
eternal niche
i am happy
keen beacon
just accept that gpt5 sucks
Bro is tweaking
molten cipher
https://lmarena.ai/leaderboard/text/overall-no-style-control
no style control
obtuse heart
i cant believe somebody has the free time to actively ragebait on discord for like 2 minutes worth of entertainment
eternal niche
no style control
so
molten cipher
so overall gpt 5 is better
eternal niche
why
molten cipher
google might just make a AI that will just take over the internet
eternal niche
skynet
obtuse heart
cant wait for gemini 3 tho, theyre cooking with it
eternal niche
because it sucks at text
solid brook
I agree with gemini 3 beating gpt 5
keen beacon
I agree with gemini 3 beating gpt 5
I am sure about that.
eternal niche
yeah because gpt5 sucks
molten cipher
I agree with gemini 3 beating gpt 5
i agree claude 54000 will be better then gpt 5 and all other models made yet
solid brook
I am sure about that.
I mean google is just so ahead. Genie 3
obtuse heart
claudes good but like the price is craaaazyyy
eternal niche
https://tenor.com/view/yukleniyor-gif-18955750
who is it
molten cipher
claudes good but like the price is craaaazyyy
lmarena gonna gib us free access
keen beacon
I mean google is just so ahead. Genie 3
Would be nice to see it used in game development and such
obtuse heart
if gemini 3 releases with a lower price range than claude right now and pretty much guaranteed the best ai model overall, then anthropic is in trouble
solid brook
if gemini 3 releases with a lower price range than claude right now and pretty m...
Bruh for sure will happen.
eternal niche
everyone who said that already changed their minds
they are brainwashed by 5g
molten cipher
tbh wait till gpt 6 comes
stray aspen
they are brainwashed by 5g
my bielarusy mirnyja ludzi sercam addanyja rodnaj ziamli
maiden fulcrum
do you guys think Grok 4 Heavy is better than ChatGPT-5?
solid brook
do you guys think Grok 4 Heavy is better than ChatGPT-5?
No
stray aspen
do you guys think Grok 4 Heavy is better than ChatGPT-5?
no
brisk helm
do you guys think Grok 4 Heavy is better than ChatGPT-5?
hell naw
stray aspen
and its horribly expensive
misty drum
Noooo
brisk helm
yh
obtuse heart
do you guys think Grok 4 Heavy is better than ChatGPT-5?
absolutely not
brisk helm
Its a 300$ or sth agent
just to post antisemetic tweets 😂
solid brook
That garbage is overpriced af
obtuse heart
what are yalls thoughts about gemini 2.5 deepthink
stray aspen
grok 4 heavy is just a lot of groks talking to each other
maiden fulcrum
Compare it to gpt 5 pro at least…
Performance and intelligence wise?
zealous panther
just to post antisemetic tweets 😂
Idk why people glaze it so much like its so expensive
zealous panther
Performance and intelligence wise?
All
solid brook
what are yalls thoughts about gemini 2.5 deepthink
I think gpt 5 pro beats it
zealous panther
Gemini 2.5 deepthink is catered to logic and math thouhg
zealous panther
Which is better?
Gpt 5 pro
The benchmarks says it
In the last humanity test or sth gpt pro still outscored grok heavy im pretty sure
zealous panther
I know
zealous panther
ChatGPT-5 is better than Grok 4 Heavy?
And cheaper
maiden fulcrum
And cheaper
Is it worth the 307 CAD for Pro Plan?
zealous panther
Is it worth the 307 CAD for Pro Plan?
Yeah no
solid brook
Man i cannot imagine google not beating gpt5. They just have to with gemini 3. If not they fall behind a lot
zealous panther
80 gpt 5 prompts every 3 hours
zealous panther
Then how to use ChatGPT-5 Pro
You cant without a pro sub
But its not worh it generally…
Its a big plan for minimal increase in peformance
zealous panther
Man i cannot imagine google not beating gpt5. They just have to with gemini 3. I...
Theres only 1 possibility and thats if the ai peak has reached
maiden fulcrum
You cant without a pro sub
I've got ChatGPT-5 and ChatGPT-5 Thinking in Plus plan
zealous panther
Like it will just slow down
zealous panther
I've got ChatGPT-5 and ChatGPT-5 Thinking in Plus plan
Thats good enouh mate
solid brook
Theres only 1 possibility and thats if the ai peak has reached
I doubt that
zealous panther
Pro has like a 4-5% increase
maiden fulcrum
Thats good enouh mate
I wanna know where can I use ChatGPT-5 (high)?
zealous panther
But still though i felt like gpt 5 was focusing on web dev a lot
stray aspen
anguilla must be getting rich from the AI domain
zealous panther
Isn't it the same as ChatGPT-5 Thinking?
I think you can use high there ? Some dude said chatgpt thinking is locked at med
In app
leaden sun
if gemini 3 releases with a lower price range than claude right now and pretty m...
If anthropic keeps being obsessed with alignment crap then they’re definitely doomed, instead of obsessing with alignment they should focus on their competitive edges, expand them and scale while keeping the costs fair and reasonable…
maybe they know what they’re doing? 🥺
patent aspen
I think OAI was wise to deprecate all of the old models. If they didn't, their capacity crunch would be much worse
brisk helm
is yupp better than lmarena
maiden fulcrum
I think you can use high there ? Some dude said chatgpt thinking is locked at me...
where "there"?
zealous panther
where "there"?
On the api mate
stray aspen
is yupp better than lmarena
no its limited
but it has a lot of models
and you need google signup
zealous panther
I think that people dont include like the response time of gpt into account
maiden fulcrum
On the api mate
Link?
zealous panther
Or the fact that they improved the webdev score by like 200
zealous panther
Link?
I think openai definitely doomed itself by not focusing on the webdev enough…its so good
I would say for like a simple task it would be faster from 10 seconds or more ?
O3 always thinks very hard
Depends on the prompt
If its a thinking prompt
Relatively the same time
If its just a general prompt
Gpt 5 can be faster by a lot
eternal niche
gemini 2.5 pro better anyway
zealous panther
I mean i can test rn if you want me to test a prompt. I have gpt 5 on my ipad and o3 on phone
zealous panther
gemini 2.5 pro better anyway
Its not
eternal niche
it is
stray aspen
gpt-5 is greater than gemini
zealous panther
Yeah ? If you dont use webdeb that is