#Company Bloat

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hasty plover
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Monolith has a lot of companies.
And companies are great, they effectively act as a sub-faction, it adds or forms character identity to promote LARP, they add new content like ships and gear and let the playerbase influence the lore and setting to some degree. I'll always point to UI as being the template for a good company. ZoB (RIP) is another good example, for different reasons.

However, I think there's too many. I think there's a lot of overlap in purpose. A lot of them are not actively maintained or contributed to in any way. And, I think it adds to the take: companies are just funny IFF colours

If we are to improve companies, I think we need to cull some. We've got a lot more in the works. (Pirate tide)

I stole this list from Old Man Dandelion, it's not complete (maybe).

Share your thoughts, channel your mald, who stays, who goes, what should the minimum bar for a company be? All things to yap about.

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void plover
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Like aetheron dynamic, drake industries, Horizon energy(less so), nosske-eien, steel hammer and ullman all feel the same imo

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Research-manufacturing company

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Same with Blackhawk and CDM

delicate cargo
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I like Harmony because it shows that I'm working with the MD even when I'm using a non MD ship for mining or a MIL ship for helping people in drone territory.

hasty plover
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CDM had a unique angle in that they were effectively the police of the sector
I feel like that's overshadowed by CC Sec now
I'd say UI is one of the better industry companies, DI is an OG and has a lot of ships and drip, but not a lot of LARP direction. The others aren't very memorable or notable imo (Horizon is Atmos focussed, I think that has a place)

void plover
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Blackhawk, Harmony, Horizon (for atmos), paycheck, hive, USSP, ullman and the US of A are all fine imo

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DI has sick cloak

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That I like

hasty plover
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I'd agree, the rest are very eh

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So the current chopping block would be:

  • Aetherion Dynamics
  • Dark Matter Enterprises
  • Midnight Arms
  • Nosske RnD
  • Steel Hammer
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Leaving us with 8 (?) companies if I'm right

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9 if we count Viper Group

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Who technically still exist but are getting a fresh coat of paint

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Removing them is a comment out YAML change AFAIK
The harder part is item/ship references
But mainly just busy work

velvet niche
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theres bound to be a lot of overlap if you just let players make companies

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and company vril is usually measured not by what they do but rather how active they are

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imo you should look less at what companies are doing and more at how active they are

hasty plover
velvet niche
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why r companies cool? cuz they give you & your friends a presence in the game based on your effort

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companies in the state they are rn is kind of fucked though cuz they are competing for space with factions

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by space i mean - a player can only be aligned to 1 thing

hasty plover
velvet niche
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either they're
independent civ / companyless
companyful civ
faction

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if they were just cool iff tags & identifiers that encouraged people to roleplay, by design, that'd be fine

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but how viper group gets hardsuits & (eventually) special mechanics - or UI gets items and a lore presence

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now u have half-baked factions that are riding alongside half-baked official TSF/PDV

velvet niche
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imo companies got 2 paths

north mortar
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make company colors a category instead of their unique colors, the engineering ones some form of yellow/orange, medical bluish, research purple etc. so you can at least tell what the hell they are

velvet niche
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  1. focus them as "cool identifiers for groups of people" and not much more than that, so that ppl are encouraged to make tiny companies and add a little content, but the fact that they're "not that important" is enforced too. then u can have as many companies as u want, even if its just 2 ppl

this way u are catering to the "i'm playing in a company because my friends are in it" type of player

  1. nuke almost all of them and identify player subgroups that u can cater to, i.e.
    pirate company
    trading company
    exped company
    atmos company

and keep them to a bare minimum with no overlap. u have now created semi-official semi-player-ran subfactions

this way u are catering to the "i'm playing in a company because i like the company's playstyle/populace/purpose", ala how USSP and viper group and Redsail Corsairs do

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imo 2. is much better for the game but loses out on monolith's unique "hey u can make a company and it'll 90% of the time make it into the game"

hasty plover
# velvet niche imo 2. is much better for the game but loses out on monolith's unique "hey u can...

2 is also my preference to some degree

Ultimately, what I want from companies is:

  • an Identity I can build a character around
  • a clear motivation or goal, in which I'm encouraged to cooperate with others in my company (and the tools to support that)
  • content around that, potentially
  • rivalries or allies, in the vain of ZoB, certain companies should dislike each other

With 2, the only thing I think we would miss out on is my first point, you are defined based on the activity only to a degree, USSP for example, has a strong identity around culture/ideology/background
It actually lacks any specific activity it caters to, except squatting in Camelotclueless
-# I don't accept the humanitarian angle I see occasionally

velvet niche
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theres also an issue with 2.

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you gotta maintain this shit from a game design perspective

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since u are effectively adding official subfactions

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and PDV and TSF, the "official factions" dont have vril as-is

paper ledge
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They have a lot of ships that are in for their faction
They just don't tag them CDM because CDM is civilian militia
Funded by themselves

patent mauve
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i feel each department in a base station server should have 1-2 companies, atmos has its companies, sec has like 6, engi has its companies, medical has its companies, tons of ship building ones, only one research one interestingly, and USA is kinda just a meme company that IMO isnt very fitting and hard to read on IFF

hasty plover
# velvet niche and PDV and TSF, the "official factions" dont have vril as-is

Yeah, there's that too, we're sorely lacking in content/support of that aspect of the game, beyond ships and balancing passes
If the faction roadmap is implemented, I'd like to see Companies worked on after that. Given that the majority of players in most rounds tend to be Civ/Merc players, it makes sense
Realistically I can't see much changing with Companies tbh, not soon (TM) at least

hasty plover
# paper ledge CDM is maintained

Yeah, I just sort of threw it on the list to gauge if people actually wanted it
CDM has ships, any Merc gear sort of fits with their aesthetic I guess

I think CDM should stay tbh, they have a unique angle compared to Industrial company no. 2353

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It'd be nice to have stats that show how popular certain companies are
The only way I can think of doing it is a headcount in ghost mode for a couple of weeks
But I ain't doing that

hasty plover
paper ledge
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I do agree companies need an overhaul badly

velvet niche
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they only need an overhaul if u go for 2.

hasty plover
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1 is effectively the same as current (if I understood correctly), but just a lower bar for entry, in terms of numbers, lore and basically try and encourage more people to contribute to them
What I find happens is (The Company lifecycle):

  • Company is introduced, with some ships or hard suits or whatever, will likely hit it's highest player count in the first week or 2
  • Company might get some more content, some people basically main a certain company
  • the creator of the company leaves, company goes unmaintained and has no new content added, it's a 50/50 if people continue to play it or if someone picks it up, like Viper Group
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So basically, 1 would be to embrace that cycle
The side effect is more content generally (potentially)

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I'll also throw in ideas that could be applied to companies in general, I don't know how feasible or beneficial it would be, but I think:

  • Each company having their own Comms would be nice (See USSP, Viper Group are potentially going to do this with Syndie Comms as well)
  • Free or unique traits associated with particular companies, the example I always use is USSP/PB should know Nova Cygnia by default

I think that, would be a good addition in general

velvet niche
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accept that they'll never be anything more than metagroups and focus on that

jade meadow
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Yea we should probably clean up companies. How many of these are actually used & have organization behind them? Should player-run companies even exist? probably not . But it's also kinda sovl so

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Also a lot of these companies follow the same gimmick/aren't unique

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Companies have a lot of potential but currently theyre just loresloppers & metafriend groups

hasty plover
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Companies are very sovl imo
I think they add a lot of flavour to Monolith, it really sells the lore piece that a lot of groups are interested in the Colossus Sector

I'm always for factions/companies being a way to build a character that is less OC slop and more grounded in the setting. In reality, I don't think this happens very often. Factions do this a little better imo.

We need to get rid of the overlapping/slop companies, then work from there.

hasty plover
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I think companies driven by ideals are generally better than activity based ones:
USSP, CDM, ZoB are examples

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ZoB, in my opinion was probably one of the best companies, it had a good gimmick that actually influenced the round

paper ledge
umbral quail
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Franz is still around aswell i just re-opened the lore post since the old one was closed

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most of VG stopped playing though i think post-PDV introduction though i'm not sure

tacit frost
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some companies exist only to provide a playable tag for obscure things like specific shipguns

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Aetherion dynamics for example

placid tiger
# hasty plover Monolith has a lot of companies. And companies are great, they effectively act a...

Companies are pretty much community contributions to soul. I agree that some should get axed.

The issue is giving them personality, which comes through personal player contributions. However, it's not something easily done. As you can only do that for SPECIFIC stuff, for instance, for Drake Industries, I made the following to enhance it's presence in game:

  • a full clothing set (which is ass to find because loadout bloat)
  • Custom ships with unique looks, purpose, design & furnitures
stray peak
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not all companies need to be playable

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you don't encounter all the historical figures in dark souls you can read about

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sometimes it's okay to have your lore be reduced to an enigmatic blurb in a rusty dagger nobody uses

north mortar
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all i ask for is to not have a rainbow on the radar because engineering companies have 5 different colors

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also the colors that are really dark that are almost unreadable

valid solar
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I'll be honest, I feel like most industrial companies should not be playable and most should be axed

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Ullman at least has an angle as a shady syndicate ish weapons company

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Companies don't need to exist for the weapons to be created by them and be in our tidbit lore

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I of course don't know how many are actively being played, so I can't make a judgment call on who needs axeing beyond the industrial ones (imo the stupid USA memey one should go)

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But I like having them tagged by type rather than a special color for each one

jade meadow
nova spoke
# velvet niche 1. focus them as "cool identifiers for groups of people" and not much more than ...

I heavily agree with the way you see it. Too many companies are essentially the same thing but with a different name. I think the true way we get them populated, active, engaging, and get people to make content for them, is to have one for every niche. Redsails is your pirates, you can have one for Mercs who strictly want PVP (hired by factions), one for Atmosians, well the same examples you gave. Just bare minimum with no overlap. im just regurgitating what you said but its based

tacit frost
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I have a company niche thats pirating mixed with merchandise

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MAWC exists to be basically aggressive corporate traders, who are also raiders. They boast about having a 100% successful sell rate when really they just show up, force you to buy their gun crates, beat you up and rob you if you deny before giving you the guns anyways, and then leave with money or your FTL drive and silo

nova spoke
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i personally at least dont find it would be something people would want to rp out often

hasty plover
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I think we'll keep it to current companies, I know pirate tide will be upon us soon (in terms of companies)

Just to summarise things so far:

  • I think people have no problems with my revised list, generally
  • Although, it's fair to say, we are removing these without much of a reason besides there's too many and leaves us with player contributions needing to be repurposed
  • Path forward on how to improve Companies is up in the air, got a few suggestions, but unless we get the Dev hours in and change how companies work on a fundamental level, things will be largely the same.
  • The things people like about companies are that they got Sovl, add to the setting, immersion, lore, etc. and some have good gimmicks or a strong identity
  • The things people don't like about companies are lack of unique content, overlap, and they can promote metacliques/groups

So theres 2 possible outcomes from this:
Embrace the bloat
Or axe some to combat bloat/overlap