Star-Crossed World (and Forgotten Land Switch 2 Edition)

[toxic delta]

not if I steal it and make it rat channel

[random tendon]

I mostly translate the interviews though because I remember during KSA days those nintendo dream interviews they posted on web would be shared a lot and many people would either go "I machine translated this part so I don't know how accurate" or "well I don't know japanese so I will ignore what this says since I don't know if it's true". there used to be misinfo about the whole part of void making kirby's face or whatever. and also to make it easier for people to find info of these interviews I wanted to do full translations

like yeah I may not be the best translator, but having something fully in english and easy to share with others and with my trying my best to translate these neutral I hope at least people go like "Oh but what is the full sentence"

I also like adding translator notes

please continue being based and adding references like that kuma 🔥

[slate scarab]

The accursed boatloads of interview lore days. The horrors

[toxic delta]

tbh we haven't gotten that much recently

[random tendon]

I do legit like translating though. but kumazaki japanese (and now for novels, occasional colloquial japanese) makes my mind melt sometimes

[vagrant hound]

Why is “elected” blue marked 😭

[slate scarab]

Which I'm very happy about we are mostly free

[random tendon]

so if I finish a long day at work, often the last thing I want to do is overthink japanese LOL

[random tendon]

because google docs is stupid

[vagrant hound]

Created

[toxic delta]

moreso that aren't scanned and/or translated (and some are in English to begin with)

[slate scarab]

All we need now is better localizations cause I was speculating about that Starry Planet shit for weeks

[toxic delta]

at least we're doing better than SA

[random tendon]

it is better but yeah the funny starry planet 😭

[vagrant hound]

Man I can’t wait for SCW Alarmo

[slate scarab]

I was wondering why it wasn't paid off in game LMFAO

[vagrant hound]

Wrong channel 😭

[random tendon]

but yeah sorry just wanted to vent a bit

<- person who is often not kind to herself and her limits /lh

[slate scarab]

And then I saw Starpunch's doc and was like... oohhh

[vagrant hound]

Starry planet is wilddddd

[toxic delta]

also funny since now we have interview basically just saying they're born somewhere in the galaxy lol

and nothing specifically about a planet

[random tendon]

galaxy... galacta????

[vagrant hound]

Galacta is the mom

[random tendon]

LOL

[slate scarab]

Deep Galacta lore

[toxic delta]

Galacta is both the mom and dad, actually (time-space shenangians)

[gleaming stream]

Just like me fr

[random tendon]

mitosis

[vagrant hound]

Kuma saying he’s not gonna mention about Starries relation with Kirby and Elfilin (he’s never gonna reveal about it) (Elfilin is never returning)

[slate scarab]

Lmaaaooo

[gleaming stream]

Sentenced to Gryll levels of obscurity

[vagrant hound]

Mefilis Dream friend happens with Mefilin and Mefilis split apart

[slate scarab]

Kumazaki loves going "I will not explain the relationship between these two things that have some relation haha"

Wink wink nudge nudge like okay i get it thank you

[gleaming stream]

Ado and Adeleine

[vagrant hound]

KUMA YOU MENTIONED ABOUT ELFILIN AND STARRIES!!!!!!!

[turbid nexus]

Kumazaki hinting at the most intricate lore implications and proceeding to not explain any of it

[random shoal]

wait there is no starry planet

[turbid nexus]

No, apparently that was just a localization error lol

[slate scarab]

I'm so sorry Klu

[random shoal]

dont do this... elfilin must return...

[random shoal]

eh its not something i strongly believed anyway

i just thought its weird that such simple creatures would have a whole homeworld

[slate scarab]

I kinda imagined it like a weirdo planet that only they live on

[random tendon]

starry planet.... no way....

[random shoal]

what the fuck

[slate scarab]

I'm so EMBARRASSED my ass was like "bro at the end of the credits they're gonna reveal it to be New World Pop Star. BLUE Popstar lore."

[turbid nexus]

https://fxtwitter.com/korbyxd/status/1975550315392082230?s=46&t=KjgI8a61BxDiubZJ7PvGsg 😭 😭 😭

The Dingo (@Korbyxd)

What in the actual fuck just happened

Quoting The Dingo (@Korbyxd)
︀
Almost finished Star-crossed world’s main story

**💬 1 🔁 2 ❤️ 51 👁️ 927 **

FxTwitter · Oct 7, 2025, 1:14 PM

[random shoal]

lmao

[gleaming stream]

I wish I lived on popstar

[toxic delta]

real

[gleaming stream]

Oh come on

[slate scarab]

Starry world

[gleaming stream]

[turbid nexus]

Bitches’ Planet

[gleaming stream]

Bastard Planet

[vagrant hound]

Starry World my beloved

[gleaming stream]

A whole world of starries? Yippee!

I was starving

🍽️

[random shoal]

genwel speech bubble

[vagrant hound]

Japanese title being Starry World…

[slate scarab]

Thinking about how the Star Rod was partially made from stars that fell on Popstar... Kumazaki I'm scared...

Blended Starry Theory

[vagrant hound]

Few days until I can eat the meteor at Kirby cafe and listen to tilt and roll cafe remix

[random tendon]

but you can't eat starries at kirby café... mid

[gleaming stream]

Boo

[toxic delta]

anyway yeah there is no known one, JP and translations for reference
Starpunch's https://wikirby.com/wiki/User:StarPunch/Figures_(Japanese) and Faye's https://docs.google.com/document/d/1wbRK3V-ibe_l3g14S2Yo3IqITeQRouME6M6whvlvrVw/edit

[wise flame]

In Kirby Super Star, there were these areas set in crystalline caves.

What's the consistency here? Computer Virus

What do we learn of SCW? The lor was invented in the New World.

What do we know of the Lor? It's a super computer/AI

[slate scarab]

Neichel is actually being replicated by Computer Virus to protect the ancient Starry reserve. They will reveal that she was a gamer in Kirby Dark-Straight Country

[wise flame]

The shuttles are AI controlled and capable of tearing through time and space

[vagrant hound]

I possessed Lor

[wise flame]

Where was the Lor found? Halcandra

[vagrant hound]

Magolor digging through below Haldera volcano to find Lor Starcutter and customized it

[turbid nexus]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1101179848342388797/1425178117705568266/MTsjtmcm.gif

[wise flame]

Who do we fight in Halcandra? Metal General.

What's a quirk with Metal General? Hitting them reveals attack numbers. And what boss is all about numbers?

Computer Virus

[gleaming stream]

Hey save some for me

[vagrant hound]

Delicious Starries

[gleaming stream]

Needs more sugar

[wise flame]

A machine that can traverse through time and space can surely also mess with time and space in unintended ways...

And if those crystals are indeed something special (as they're capable of manifesting things out of nothing), perhaps all these elements put together could have created Computer Virus

Basically: There's bound to be a bunch of abandoned or crashed New-World shuttles throughout the galaxy

But that's just a... idea

[vagrant hound]

So what you’re telling me is

Everything leads back to Magolor

[wise flame]

Always has been

[vagrant hound]

Everything leads back to Magolor

You can make the furthest thing ever and it will lead back to Magolor in some way, shape or form

[wise flame]

Existence is a sphere

Eventually, you come back from where you started

[tardy mortar]

egg

[arctic gale]

Stop eating your bastard children!!!!

[jagged wind]

void reference.....

[slate scarab]

You know I just realized something maybe this was mad obvious. But when the Dream Discovery Tour said that Elfilis threatened the wildlife of the entire world were they referring to the Elfilis Meteor sinking a continent

[shut pendant]

https://youtu.be/To7p-L-q_Eg why have i heard literally no one talk about this banger

[slate scarab]

Cause they said Elfilis was wrapped up by starries like Meteon... and past meteors also sunk continents so...

Peaked away at the peak summit

[slate scarab]

That'd probably explain how they even managed to capture Elfilis cause bro probably was mad nerfed after freshly smashing into a continent

[shut pendant]

pretty sure it specified they were attacking the animals
i assume just trying to absorb them

but google docs for some reason is horrible on mobile so i can't chefk my own document for sources lol

[vagrant hound]

This song is such banger but like it’s overshadowed so much 😭 😭 😭

[slate scarab]

Maybe

I can see I as it crashes, then flies around in blooby form trying to recover as much as it can before its inevitably captured

[shut pendant]

i should make a scw music tier list and put half the soundtrack in s+ tier

[slate scarab]

I heart you Moonlight Canyon Labyrinth and Rally Raid Raceway

And the air ride one from forbidden lands

[vagrant hound]

Can you put unfinished track and star shower in Neichel+ tier

[random tendon]

REAL THIS IS SO UNDERRATED

[fringe mist]

Sentences like this are why I say Melfilis or Nelfilis

I still wonder if I'm the only one who chooses Meteo and not Meteon as the prefix

because the latter makes BOTH "Elfilis" for shorthand and that's annoying

[vagrant hound]

Loooool okay Nintendo Support 😭 😭 😭

https://x.com/nintendo_cs/status/1975759326225870864?s=46

任天堂サポート (@nintendo_cs)

『Nintendo Switch 2 Edition アップグレードパス』を購入すると、対応するNintendo Switchソフトを『Nintendo Switch 2 Edition』にアップグレードすることができます。

アップグレードパスのご利用には、対応するNintendo SwitchソフトとNintendo Switch 2 本体が必要です。ご注意く...

X · Oct 8, 2025, 3:05 AM

I guess a lot of people were confused how upgrade pass works

[tacit saffron]

It works as promotion as well

[twin fog]

No they distinctly wrote the descriptions to highlight that threatening life and sinking continents were two different things the meteors could do

[thorny fulcrum]

What if they were a polycule

[twin fog]

Me hearing a guy go 'b/c he has the spear of Mettatonelfilis'

[ripe bane]

Context?

[twin fog]

The context is somehow no one can pronounce Meteonelfilis

And not just b/c people struggle to pronounce Elfilis

Like the Meteon part is somehow tripping up so many people even when they recognize the Elfilis part as being the name of the game's final boss

[ripe bane]

I think they should have kept his japanese name or localized it as Melfilis.

[twin fog]

It's literally just meteor with an n how do people fuck it up

Unfortunately Melf sounds like shit in English so

Shouldn't have added a random ass l sound to Efillis's name 3 years ago

[broken void]

medianelfilis

[fringe mist]

I read it as "Meteo" because I'm too used to Japanese media using that name

shoutouts to Metal Fight Beyblade

https://tenor.com/view/beyblade-gif-18481038

(for context, this one is Meteo LDrago, the third iteration of the LDrago lineage)

What's annoying about trying to demonstrate this is the fact that Mefilis is the Japanese name of Meteonelfilis

so the comparison from Japanese to Japanese does not work

[slate scarab]

ohhh yeaaaah they did say that i forgooorrr

[turbid nexus]

I swap between saying Meteonelfilis and Mefilis because every time I say the former I feel like a nerd who needs to be stuffed in a locker

[languid cobalt]

A very smort polycule

[lean grove]

you could say Genwel which is shorter and still distinct at the cost of saying the one name that is somehow stupider than Meteonelfilis

i think the one thing preventing me from saying Meteon more is that it makes me think it sounds like a fakemon Eevee evolution

so it feels pretty vague

[arctic gale]

I like saying genwel lol

[coarse arrow]

The solution is to call him Memphilis Tennessee

[turbid nexus]

True…..

[spiral void]

melfilis sounds funny i like using it

[sterile quartz]

Nah, Efilis sounds worse than Elfilis

IMO

It just sounds less complete to me

[toxic delta]

they barely sound different to me

mind you I basically always imagined the l as basically silent

but even pronouncing it more like Elf than just Ef or F, it's only slightly different

[arctic gale]

I have a hard time saying Efilis since my mind really wants a letter between e and f
But that could be since im used to saying elfilis

[vagrant hound]

Lfilis

[sterile quartz]

Elfilis but with L’s face on it

[vagrant hound]

Elfilis’s new brother

[slate scarab]

With all the bonkers lore SCW had I can only imagine what's being cooked

For all we know Kumazaki will completely recontextualize Bouncy by making one that looks like a fucking Starry or something. And then we will look at Halcandra Bouncy and Normal Bouncy slack jawed

The Bouncy Void lore

[mossy crane]

I loveeee melfilis it's so silly

Mel for short

[slate scarab]

I use Meteon because I want him to have some dignity

[fringe mist]

Then drop the 'n'

[lean grove]

then it falls straight into "I know multiple things Meteo could refer to making it very ambiguous on its own"

[fringe mist]

(am I fighting for this name too hard? lol)

(this is why I just go with Nelfilis)

[fringe mist]

True that. Even still, I choose to separate the syllables in the way that I do because I think it helps separate Elfilis from -nelfilis

is it weird to compare it to a Gog and Magog kind of thing?

[sterile quartz]

Speaking of

Elfilis feels like they’re supposed to have some kind of satanic symbolism

[slate scarab]

They are the GOAT so it makes sense

[sterile quartz]

No I mean like

It manipulates the beast pack into doing its bidding, their first boss form vaguely resembles some depictions of the beast of revelation, and their true form brings the “Satan disguises himself as an angel of light” line to question. This is further backed up with the implication that they are the original “evil” in the series, the one that started it all.

[ripe bane]

I can't tell if you mean "bonkers" the english word or Bonkers the character lol.

[ripe bane]

Keep in mind that the original intended romanization was most likely Efillis (because of the morse code in the Lab Discovera audio saying Efillin).

[slate scarab]

Neichel lore

In Revelation 13:11–18, the beast of the earth, later known as the false prophet, comes "out of the earth," exercises all the authority of the Sea Beast, forces everyone on earth to worship the Sea Beast, and convinces the people, through signs and wonders, to make an image of the Sea Beast.

Beast of the earth... the earth has nature... Neichel is nature.... she was used as propaganda to prop up the incredible powers of the Ultimate Life Form

She is an actual prophet though all that shit was true

[ripe bane]

The fact that this book is christian reminds me of Magolor's lore, which Last Song references.

So it's all perfectly tied.

[slate scarab]

Perhaps the false prophet is better paired with the faceless people in charge of the propaganda. Since Neichel does have a line about their falsehoods/bad intentions... hmmmmm might have to read up more another time

[ripe bane]

I'm wondering if there were really other people in charge of the propaganda or if maybe NEICHEL had another reason to not express her actual opinion.

[slate scarab]

If I had to guess it was probably the people who ran Lab Discovera. They clearly have a horrendous moral compass LMFAO

Considering the hamster wheels and them just leaving Forgo instead of idk mercy killing it LMFAO

[sterile quartz]

Niechel never supported Elfilis…

[sterile quartz]

Is it possible forgo had leongar build them after the original generator failed

Unlikely sure

But not impossible

Also it may not have been possible to mercy kill forgo

[slate scarab]

I'm doubtful cause the Beast Pack's architecture is very rudimentary

And it's a big ass room

[sterile quartz]

Do they build anything

Do we see them build anything

[slate scarab]

Little forts and wood sculptures

Mostly in Forbidden Lands

[ripe bane]

I think they could have mercy killed Forgo, considering how the Copy Ability evolutions were made by them in the novels, so they did have things that could damage it.

[slate scarab]

If the game is anything to go by, in which Elfilis dodges death TWICE and just gives up the second time, it probably wasn't worth it to do so

Too much effort even if they had a method

In my eyes the reason for the hamster wheels is that by the time they created the Eternal Capsule to hold Forgo, the facility was already being powered by Waddle Dees from Dream Land

[sterile quartz]

Not sure how canon that is…

[slate scarab]

So in order to restore power, Forgos plan centered on getting the Dees back

[sterile quartz]

IK but they still are animal intelligence

Forgo artificially gave leongar human intelligence when mind controlling him

[sterile quartz]

I assumed that they couldn’t because either it’d brainwash someone into stopping the attempt or it’d be too liquid and absorb them

[slate scarab]

Entirely possible

[sterile quartz]

ehh doubt it

they didnt even know dreamland existed at that point

so the wheels were likely powered by captured animals or something

[slate scarab]

But then that raises the question of why didn't Forgo just put the animals in there

Forgo ONLY puts Dees in there. Everyone else is delegated to field work

[sterile quartz]

it needed waddle dee wranglers and people to catch elfilin

remember

sure, having animals run on the wheels WOULD allow them to stay

but then no one is chasing elfilin down

therefore it made the beast pack its army and made the waddle dees its slaves

[slate scarab]

Worth mentioning that the FL novel does have Wise Waddle Dee mention the idea that the New World was connected to Popstar prior to the story's events. Which is hinted at in game with the Popstar blueprint on the wall in the Weapons shop and the Ability Blueprints with Kirby on them

[slate scarab]

Fair point. But then we also gotta ask how it knows about Dees and why them specifically

[sterile quartz]

The games imply that's because the new worlders are the halcandrans

and it's by like several proxies

that they have a connection.

the popstar and kirby blueprints imply they were made recently and stolen/scattered by the beast pack

[slate scarab]

Well aside from questioning who even would have been studying Kirby to make them, it's also mentioned in the novel that that New Worlders were the ones who made them

[sterile quartz]

the game already proves that wrong

dedede made the masked hammer blueprint

it can THEN be assumed the waddle dees made most of the rest

meta sword was likely from meta knight
and the only unexplained one is the morpho sword one

[slate scarab]

I can imagine the blueprints are like adapted from the original research cause while the novel isn't like canon I don't think they would have filled in that blank with something completely wrong meanwhile the time dilation stuff ended up being accurate

The temporal paradox of the ancients making Wild Bonkers Hammer

[sterile quartz]

remember:

back when FL was new, "the new worlders later went to popstar" was more popular than "the new worlders later went to halcandra"

[sterile quartz]

yeah but like it's blatantly the ancients now

it has to be

starship new world is the lor or a prototype of it

[slate scarab]

Yeah

[sterile quartz]

the novel had to be wrong on that particular detail

the halcandrans cant have made stuff based on the minibosses that didn't exist yet

[slate scarab]

Weeeeelll they did have the prophecy

[sterile quartz]

this isnt deltarune

they dont know every detail to the exact letter

they didnt know the "meteor of doom" was fecto's brother

and niechel probably didnt tell them certain parts of her dream

because the reason she didnt go probably had to do with well

https://tenor.com/view/master-crown-magolor-epilogue-master-crown-tree-sussycado-gif-9294306286782422320

[slate scarab]

And Neichel does mention at the end of Twinkling Star Showers that new life will rise on the planet. And she also has specific details on some things cause she sings about relying on AI and whatnot in relation to her dream in Last Song

She definitely hid the last part

But maybe she could tell them about Fleurina. That's not too personal

[sterile quartz]

but that's still way more broad strokes

[sterile quartz]

the animals likely weren't the beast pack at the time

fleurina did not exist

[ripe bane]

Wait, I wonder how old the minibosses are.

[random tendon]

for the record from the novel I don't recall it ever saying all blueprints were made by the people of the new world. when they first appear, weapons shop waddle dee just says he found them (lol) and later when wise dee/MK go after lore in a library they find books talking about copy abilities, and that they "found a way to evolve copy abilities", so wise waddle dee thinks (that's his own theory) that the people went to popstar and studied copy abilities there and came up with the evos

I don't think it's impossible some blueprints were made by new world people, but not all and the newer ones were made based on the older ones

[ripe bane]

I thought that was the typical theory made by a fictional character that was supposed to be interpreted as true, but I'm no longer sure.

[vagrant hound]

Crack theory: blueprints were made by Magolor, and it flew around with the vortex

[sterile quartz]

wise waddle dee was pretty unwise then

[random tendon]

why

[sterile quartz]

falsely assumed the new worlders went to popstar as their new home aware

[random tendon]

the book said this

[sterile quartz]

we know the halcandrans were there but it was long before kirby's time ever came

[slate scarab]

Yeah that's how I see it they wanna be like "here's a fact but we are having a character who is known to be smart suggest it as an idea"

A classic trope

[sterile quartz]

the book has to be wrong then

[random tendon]

as their new home

never said this

[sterile quartz]

still

[random tendon]

this is wise and MK talking

[sterile quartz]

the ancients got C R O W N E D years before kirby ever was

they could have never studied kirby's copy abilities

[random tendon]

kirby is not the only one who can use copy abilities

and we don't know how old kirby is

[sterile quartz]

kirby is not from that time....

[vagrant hound]

It’s not that the novel is incorrect
It’s that novel is different continuity so it’s not gonna be the same exact story and lore

[sterile quartz]

and do we see anyone else

[random tendon]

source?

[sterile quartz]

yeah that's true

[slate scarab]

Multiple Kibleys

[random tendon]

keeby, gooey, miracle matter, animal friends

[sterile quartz]

it's just how the story is

[random tendon]

?

[ripe bane]

I always thought they went to Halcandra because of the scene where Forgo is met (similar to the heart of Nova), Forgo acting similar to the Fountain of Dreams in concept, Magolor mentioning "magic and technology" when describing Halcandra in RTDLDX and the theme of the outside of the Lor in Halcandra having in its title a syntagm similar to "land of dreams" as what seemed to be the subject of a sentence.

[random tendon]

what? /gen

[high widget]

im MK

[slate scarab]

Trueing

[sterile quartz]

animal friends are using kirby
miracle matter is a farce

[random tendon]

like okay man you are fine to make your own theories but don't go around saying stuff you made up/assume to be true

[ripe bane]

Rick isn't.

[sterile quartz]

ok

[sterile quartz]

i think he probably is...

[slate scarab]

Like I wouldn't say it definitively if there wasn't crumbs of it in game. You can get the idea SOMEONE was studying a Kirby by the visual of the blueprint it's just subtle and more spelled out in a setting where a proper story must be told

[sterile quartz]

kirby's foot tapping on rick's back transfers the stone power through him or some shit

[ripe bane]

But he inhales the enemies himself.

[random tendon]

I do think the novel explanation is not 1:1 with the games, but it likely has some hint of truth

[sterile quartz]

even still......

[random tendon]

yeah exactly

[sterile quartz]

the animal buddies are seemingly not from that era

[random tendon]

https://twitter.com/firubiii/status/1510379629911097351

angie🌙 (@firubiii)

if you wanted to see clearly what's written on the blueprints, here's the texture for them

X · Apr 2, 2022, 10:12 PM

[sterile quartz]

or the waddle dees/dedede/meta knight/morpho knight made the blueprints

[vagrant hound]

Like on one hand, RTDL novel getting used as example for canon lore is like, “yeah sure” since it’s closest to the pre RTDLDX info we can ever get and also Kuma had the closest relation than any other novel
But even so RTDL novel had several differences and stuff that doesn’t make sense that was revealed in RTDLDX
So yeah. And FL novel isn’t same as RTDL novel, FL novel is still the FL story that happened within that novel universe
Nice to take it as what if or possibility but not as full truth or the most serious legit answer ever

[high widget]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1352028144890282087.webp?size=44

freaky

[slate scarab]

I can definitely agree with the fact that some blueprints were either interpreted differently or modified by Popstar people to fit representing people they know

And morpho is just God so it can do whatever and manifest parchment paper

[sterile quartz]

yeah agreed

[sterile quartz]

morpho also seemingly respects kirby's mettle if it was willing to give him a blueprint after the fight

[slate scarab]

Morpho is quite honorable

I like to imagine Popstar people saw the existing ones and were like "oh hey we know all about that" and made some of their own

Morpho does pal around Popstar so makes sense for it to have one too LOL

[high widget]

Morpho Blueprint is probably some like

bullshit like

"Its like a Dream Come True (literal)"

[sterile quartz]

it's also a character development moment because from RTDL to PR

morpho seemed to be trying to snipe kirby out at every chance

[sterile quartz]

either morpho created it and showed some honor for kirby actually beating it or it literally manifested through dream power

again morpho tried to land on kirby multiple times

seemingly to kill him

[slate scarab]

I imagine it as Morpho observing Kirby and wanting to test his strength at some point. And his friends' strength to but Kirby is the main event

[ripe bane]

I always thought that the character in the blueprint texture could be a mysterious character that resembles Kirby (we've seen characters like that several times) and not necessarily Kirby himself (though that possibility is still very likely). Could this be the case?

[slate scarab]

Knights seem to love fighting for sport

I think the blueprint Kirby is a different one

Kirby is a species after all

[vagrant hound]

Batamon /j

[slate scarab]

As far as we know Kirby was plorped into the universe in Kirbys Dream Land cause of a nice breeze

[ripe bane]

I think red butterflies just do that after decisive battles. It might even just be checking if Kirby is dead.

[ripe bane]

I thought this wasn't confirmed, though.

[slate scarab]

I honestly can't even imagine Kirby being around before that it scares me. He's elderly

Clash once again with the layup

Since there are many many Kirbies in clash

[ripe bane]

But we don't know their origin story and they haven't been referred as a species explicitly yet iirc.

[glad path]

Maybe kirby is like the universe's equivalent of a white blood cell idk

[ripe bane]

They could just be coincidentally similar characters or copies.

[slate scarab]

Idk if that's meant to imply something bad happened to other Kirbies since we seem to only have the one on Popstar

I don't think they'd ever address that explicitly that'd be insane LMFAO

[slate scarab]

Well the Clash ones don't seem to have the copy ability unless they just opt not to use it soooo could be imperfect Kirbies who knows

[ripe bane]

But we have seen other Kirbys/Kirby-like characters, even when we don't see Kirby cloning himself (the ones from Mt. Dedede, some goal games...).

[sterile quartz]

also meta knight, MAYBE Keeby (if they're even still a canon character at this point) and galacta knight

morpho seems to be a faker

[slate scarab]

I'll give Morpho the benefit of the doubt

[glad path]

Never ask:

• a woman her age
• a man his salary
• The pop flowers where they get the meat from

[sterile quartz]

i forgot all the details but they have like multiple "wrong" details that kirby/keeby/meta/galacta never have

[slate scarab]

Still waiting on Kumazaki to drop the lore on what makes the Knights different from Kirbies...

[sterile quartz]

magic halcandran plants (aka fecto is once again to blame for this bullshit)

[ripe bane]

Keeby has always been an alternative name from Dream Course Yellow Kirby and, more recently, Dream Buffet Yellow Kirby.

[sterile quartz]

i dont think there is other than that meta and galacta dont use copy abilities

[slate scarab]

Kirby don't got beautiful wings

[glad path]

If kirby ever got wings, I think they should be water wings

[ripe bane]

Appearances of other Kirbys are supposed to be mysterious, which implies they're still "canon" (it should be noted that Kirby doesn't have a clear canon or timeline and that the continuity could be partial).

[slate scarab]

Maybe it has something to do with the kinda energy gathered when they're born or something who knows

[ocean ingot]

"Oh boy, so glad we got off that cramped planet and avoided a cataclysm. Can't wait to have a happy rest of our lives!"

The devious Mistilteinn:

[slate scarab]

Like not perfectly good, a smidgen bad

[sterile quartz]

also void termina and galacta knight beforehand but the crown is what did them in

[glad path]

cue Mistilteinn doing gangnam style

[ripe bane]

Meta does in Air Riders.

[slate scarab]

Cappy does in air riders

[sterile quartz]

oh god imagine tree crown, void termina, and galacta doing it

[ocean ingot]

https://tenor.com/kRaa82NYxGM.gif

wrong character but still

[sterile quartz]

not mine btw

[ripe bane]

Yes, that's my point, Copy Abilities have never been exclusive to Kirbys, since they have never been given lore other than maybe their vague connection to Popstar in the FL novels.

[glad path]

https://tenor.com/view/kirby-fortnite-default-dance-funny-star-allies-void-termina-gif-1558465784420969071

[sterile quartz]

something something super star ultra line that says only kirby can do that that's probably out of date

[glad path]

Not gangnam style but it's something

[sterile quartz]

good enough

[ripe bane]

In what part of the game is that line?

[sterile quartz]

spring breeze beginner's show

[ripe bane]

By the way, I forgot to mention Meta Knight had been implied to be able to use Copy Abilities in Palutena's description of him in Smash.

[sterile quartz]

unfortunately sakurai was not making kirby at the time...

[ripe bane]

Does とくいワザ necessarily mean it's unique to him? Because, if that's the implication, it's really vague (judging from the meanings I could find of that term) and contradicts Gooey and everything from Air Riders.

[slate scarab]

Im pretty sure the copy ability lore is just Void. Ability to copy the powers of things comes from guy who copies powers from things

I do believe that Kirby can share it with others though like he does with the animal friends

[sterile quartz]

ehh idk...

didnt void get the power from kirby...

[sterile quartz]

i was talking about the english version

and already said it was out of date

[sterile quartz]

doubt + didnt kumazaki say that kirby's face on void was due to interference

[slate scarab]

Taking influence from things to change form? No that's it's natural ability

Which is basically the copy ability

Void Termina even sucks up Kirby and/or Kirby's friends for it LOL

Thinking about it the Elfili kinda do it too they just need much more LMAO

Meteon gains Starry powers and features from eating like 100 of them

[gentle pier]

I jumped aroubd the messages here and i saw a bible verse
What is going on here? Like, i know magolor is christian (???) but still
Kirby lore moment?

[slate scarab]

The truth is the Bible is probably the most influential piece of literature and Kirbys just another thing taking influence from some of its stories and themes

The Master Crown boss and Magolor Epilogue in general are the most overtly Bible related things though

Chao jumpscare

[sterile quartz]

not quite....

void's is a mix of being influenced by hyness's deluded idea of a destroyer and having the dark matter power of memory ability

which is similar but not QUITE the copy ability

why void has that power, either it created them indirectly or was influenced into having it

said "memory ability" is also used by DMS Clone in Robobot and M. Matter in 64

iirc kumazaki said the dark matter species had this in a miiverse from 2016

[vagrant hound]

They updated the mouthful video with SCW mouthful https://youtu.be/p_kzJh9AnnY?si=sB5bTpib86fENW7a

[slate scarab]

mouthful mode ❤️

[marsh hull]

This theme is really growing on me, when I first heard it I was on the fence about it

Now I'm like, yeah, this is as great as the rest of the games OST lol

||https://youtu.be/5DP-UNxsp1E||

[vagrant hound]

FL+SCW Alarmo dropped, I can now sleep in peace

[ocean ingot]

That was actually a misconception (as with kumazaki stating it)

It actually more the materialization of the sword when the clone was created. The clone itself did not materialize it, the memories/awareness of the sword taken with the original data caused it to be created alongside the clone.

So it was materialized from DM's memories, but it was the cloning process that materialized it, not DMC

[vagrant hound]

🫶

[vagrant hound]

Alarmo Music I found so far
1: WELCOME TO THE NEW WORLD!
2: Running Through the New World
3: Abandoned Beach
4: Welcome to Wondaria
5: Lunch Rush! A Wave of Waddles featuring adorable wanya noise
6: Meteor Showers Arrival
7: TWINKLING SKATING RINK
8: From Those Who Departed for Space
9: Elfilin
10: A Quick Nap

[ripe bane]

I wasn't expecting an endgame track like Elfilin to show up here.

[vagrant hound]

It plays when you’re in bed 😭 😭 😭 😭 😭 😭

[ripe bane]

Okay, I'll most likely buy Alarmo now, that's peak. Can Alarmo be set to low volume (I can't handle music or alarm clocks when they're too loud)?

[vagrant hound]

Yes

It lets you adjust it

[green crater]

It's honestly one of the most calming tracks, I can see it

[vagrant hound]

And let’s you hear them so you can easily adjust them

You can also change how Alarmo does your morning alarm

Very active and loud vs calm (that only plays music and no 20 min after loud banging noise)

[rocky berry]

mood

[high widget]

so like

are Galactals like a bunch of Genwel cells

[toxic delta]

seems to be that + crystal stuff yeah

[vagrant hound]

Me sitting still trying to listen to the SCW music on Alarmo (I set it as the loudest option and my whole family got confused)

Yeah this thing is gonna wake me 😭 😭 😭 😭

[vagrant hound]

I feel bad… for forcing Kirby to take damage as sign mouth in the alarm every few seconds for not waking up (I wanted to hear the whole alarm)

[tardy mortar]

so you can wake up with wanyas

that's important knowledge

[vagrant hound]

No Magolor, 0/10 Alarmo, literally need refund

/j

[toxic delta]

what if they make Air Riders Alarmo with Magolor

[vagrant hound]

I’d die

OR RTDLDX

ID DIE (Magolor… please Magolor and Kirby walk around in my alarmo)

[toxic delta]

what about Fighters 2 one (everyone beats him up)

[sterile quartz]

i feel like some of the music choices in ucz ex weren't that great
phantom meta having steel winged revenge is fine and morpho having hope of rebirth is ok
but like
why does phantom forgo dedede have the dedede vs meta phase 1 theme for phase 2? Should have had that in phase 1 and Moon Warriors as phase 2
also forgo leon should have had flock of doomers and another domination, not malus pulmina and pain my heart knows well

[turbid nexus]

Hype moments and aura

[toxic delta]

Malus Pumilla directly references Lor sound (in the song itself) and Onward to a Pain My Heart Knows Well directly references Scattered Souls (with their JP names) and is also commonly paired with it

[vagrant hound]

Those 2 are the ones that makes sense the most out of all other music (and Forgo Dedede)

Clearly steel wing for phantom MK confirms phantom MK also likes sweets

[toxic delta]

also Destined Rivals stuff gets referenced elsewhere in FL so fits enough (plus could be partially Masks of Dark Bonds allusion)

[random tendon]

I loved the dream buffet jumpscare

[vagrant hound]

Plus if they reused partners who shook the heavens, that’s 2 game in a row

[turbid nexus]

Dream Buffet honestly feels like FL's little cousin to me lol

[vagrant hound]

Except that game had Galacta knight

[toxic delta]

meanwhile The Prince of Mirrors and Regret fits near perfectly with the situation funnily enough
Dark Taranza being dark clone of Taranza, like how Phantom Forgo Dedede is a clone of Forgo Dedede (which is a controlled Dedede)
(and then D-Mind fight afterwards, so another possible Masked Dedede reference)

• Dedede motif in the song itself lol

[vagrant hound]

I wonder who’s idea was to add music for hard mode tilt and roll

[obtuse berry]

Me

[sterile quartz]

idk malus pumila and the locandra dimension theme don't sound boss theme enough

[toxic delta]

if anything the question should be why isn't D-Mind's theme used for phase 2

[toxic delta]

they sound fine with how they're used

[obtuse berry]

I asked kumazaki to also add starry difficulty but he said all Kirby fans will explode into dust if so

[toxic delta]

also the latter was already a midboss tower theme

[sterile quartz]

no that i'm fine with
i think it should have played in phase 1 instead of 2, moon warriors should have played in phase 2, and revenge of the puppetmaster should have been cut out

[turbid nexus]

Taranza L

[sterile quartz]

because D-Mind has two themes

[turbid nexus]

I'm pretty sure Moon Warriors already played in RtDX's TA didn't it lol

[sterile quartz]

the castle lololo/dynablade remix and the actual d mind theme

[vagrant hound]

So true they should’ve give us double clash

[toxic delta]

well then people would question why they'd didn't use the unnamed Chapter 5 one

[sterile quartz]

yes

[sterile quartz]

that's the same one

like that's literally the same version

[toxic delta]

I'm talking the specific one

[vagrant hound]

The funny vs Galacta phase 1

You hear it for 3 seconds

[toxic delta]

not the one from Landia EX

[vagrant hound]

(Because both MK and Dedede is top tier in TA)

[toxic delta]

they are not

[sterile quartz]

ch4 and 5 have the same one, ch5 only plays it in the non-moon warriors phase

afaik it is

[sterile quartz]

dmind also has two specific themes

the tkcd one and the skc giant masked dedede remix

[sterile quartz]

i still think roar of dedede should have replaced grand doomer's theme, not landia's theme

[toxic delta]

I mean TKCD obviously, Dark Taranza isn't in SKC

[sterile quartz]

tbh he should have been

they had the chance to put him as a party quest only boss and they squandered it

[sterile quartz]

ok then
either revenge of the puppetmaster or the landia ex/giant dedede theme for phase 1 and the d-mind theme for phase 2

i still don't think malus pumila fits as a boss theme
maybe the locandra theme for phase 1 but bring back another domination for phase 2

"but the lor sounds" eternal echoes 3 does that already

[toxic delta]

I mean it wouldn't transition nicely at all

[sterile quartz]

it doesn't really transition?
it just stops and then starts the new theme

[toxic delta]

part of the reason Malus Pumila works is that it's for phase 1 and Onward is phase 2

[toxic delta]

I didn't mean directly

it does it well

the only slight problem is that it feels weird at first that it goes silent but having a different song would not fix that anyway

[sterile quartz]

then cut both and make crowned doomer play over the whole battle, cut the dynamic music entirely just like they did with forgo leon's middle phase

[toxic delta]

if anything I'd say make Onward play for the whole battle by that logic

[sterile quartz]

not intense enough imo

not for that

also crowned doomer theme is underrated af

[toxic delta]

I wouldn't call Another Domination fitting either

like, even less so

[sterile quartz]

how?

[toxic delta]

it works for its fight but not Forgo Leon

[sterile quartz]

why doesn't it?

[toxic delta]

vibe

anyway, I wish they localized the reference in Onward to a Pain My Heart Knows Well somehow but I know it'd probably have been a pain the ass to do correctly

[toxic delta]

oh right I forgot, also Road to Victory stuff
though that isn't as present in ZEX overall but still

[sterile quartz]

how does malus fit the vibe and domination doesnt

[toxic delta]

I was talking Onward but either way
Another Domination has a very....wacky electronic feel
while every theme associated with Leon fights is more orchestral and serious

(and Grand Doomer was already sort of wacky imo)

[sterile quartz]

ok then put tree crown or something

[toxic delta]

that could mostly fit but it doesn't really do anything that Malus Pumilla and Onward doesn't

[sterile quartz]

malus pumilla randomly stops after a while

and it feels just a bit too slow

onward is better but it doesn't feel intense enough compared to raging lion

[toxic delta]

not randomly, it's just when you beat Leon into phase 2

[sterile quartz]

also the chaos-elfilis soul phases should have had hunted by the beast instead of eternal echoes

[sterile quartz]

no if you stall in phase 1 long enough the song slows massively in phase 1

[toxic delta]

okay that one would just be wildy out of place lol
maybe if it was heavily remixed

[sterile quartz]

idk i think it fits

[toxic delta]

it does not fit with the vibe Chaos Elfilis Core phase 1 is going for at all

you aren't being chased, Eternal Echoes is supposed to be subtly creepy (along with emphasizing how Discoveries Tour was to Forgo)

not loud and in your face

[sterile quartz]

they could have added a chase

chaos-forgo

[toxic delta]

I mean that's asking for another/different phase, not a song swap lol

[sterile quartz]

oh ok nvm then

still, there had to be a better choice than malus pumilla and onward

it just doesnt feel right for that fight

maybe landia's theme for the whole fight?
forgo leon is supposed to be semi-tragic

[toxic delta]

Guardian Angel could work, but again isn't really doing much those two aren't

[sterile quartz]

ehh fair enough

point is forgo leon should have felt more intense

malus pumilla and onward don't feel intense enough for the fight

especially malus

[toxic delta]

rewatching fight, Onward is definitely intense, actually I'd argue more intense at times than Leon's actual theme lol

[vagrant hound]

Me hearing the song (Dang Leon is Magolor) (Leon and Magolor is both cat species)

[toxic delta]

oh true, didn't even think about them being cats

[sterile quartz]

it is intense but imo not enough to carry the leongar fight

[toxic delta]

my first thought was actually Forgo = forbidden fruit lol

[sterile quartz]

my doomer suggestions were from the forgo doomers theory

that the doomers were once fecto elfilis species but the halcandrans transformed every one they could find into the doomers

[toxic delta]

Leon and Magolor are also both associated with royalty/crowns (former is one of the leaders of the Beast Pack and has been depicted with crown (and lions are often considered 'king of the beasts'), latter has well, the Master Crown stuff)

[sterile quartz]

leongar never has a crown

he has a robe at one point

[toxic delta]

talking about the cage depiction

[sterile quartz]

oh fair enough

[toxic delta]

why did I use the figure when I could've used the render

[sterile quartz]

why didn't they make a clocker boss

ehh probably out of room

if lab discovera was a full world there'd probably be a clocker boss either at the end of redgar or right before leongar and forgo

[slate scarab]

I think most of the song changes are cute but the Forgo Leon one does bug me I'm picky

Forgo Leon was my favorite fight in base game and the music plays a big part in carrying the energy of it

Doesn't hit the same without it

[toxic delta]

only really feels weird the first time, but otherwise I think it's probably one of the best ones they could have done without straight up making a new song

[slate scarab]

I imagine the goal was representing all the switch games (ignore that the Clash one is from Deluxe) so ig there's no other choice LOL

[toxic delta]

and it's probably one of the most fitting thematically

[twin fog]

And just musically

[slate scarab]

Simply hard to compete with The Raging Lion Roars

But I did really like the other ones

[twin fog]

Had to compete with ultra mid

[slate scarab]

Hope of Birth was cool

[toxic delta]

only other ones that could've fit don't really do anything that those two didn't

[slate scarab]

The Peaking Peak Peaks you mean

[twin fog]

It's peak
For FL

[vagrant hound]

I can barely hear raging lion

[toxic delta]

I think it's good but it's not something I'd really listen to outside the game

sort of similar to Welcome Your New Overlord in that regard

[slate scarab]

Raging Lion get behind me....

[arctic gale]

Im alllllways blasting raging lion

[vagrant hound]

Good song, can barely hear with the loud sound effects and Leon voice

[toxic delta]

if I did, I'd probably listen to Forgo Leon version because I'm a sicko

[arctic gale]

Going for a walk?
Drawing a picture?
Cleaning my counter?
Only leon's screams of agony can save me

[slate scarab]

If only nintendo games had volume settings

[toxic delta]

should've put it in the Alarmo smh

[twin fog]

Me turning Star Allies volume down so it doesn't blow my ears out

[vagrant hound]

Me every time I open RTDLDX and than play KSA right after

[toxic delta]

funny early Switch 1 era moment

[arctic gale]

Still need to know why star allies is so freaking loud

[slate scarab]

I'm glad Kirby finally got his own vs Morpho song that isn't just Morphos theme congratulations Kirby you got the most obvious choice

[arctic gale]

Twinkle stars jumpscare

[slate scarab]

Loud Allies

[toxic delta]

because originally undocked Switch 1 max volume was lower

it got patched to be higher in an update

and iirc that was after SA?

[slate scarab]

Maybe I like the new Morpho more than Forgo Leon

That new fight went pretty hard

They keep making Morpho okay and then crazy good in an update

[toxic delta]

oh wait it was for when using headphones or speakers, not undocked apparently

(and bit before SA but like I assume it was still a factor anyway, either that or they just did not realize how loud it was)

[high widget]

oh sillydillo made this

i think Sillydillo likes Leongar

[toxic delta]

did it? doesn't match its style

also not sure if there's any cages besides the one Handmade Elfilin is in in its stage even

[high widget]

then who made the cages

[toxic delta]

I don't think we know

[high widget]

thats insane

[turbid nexus]

I made them

[slate scarab]

Probably was Sillydillo considering he's the craftsman and uses them a lot in his fight

Probably had help though since a lot his other works look like shit

[gleaming stream]

I thought that's what it was hinting at

[gleaming stream]

also rude

:(

[high widget]

who else would make things out of metal yeah

[slate scarab]

Simply being brutally honest

[high widget]

theres like no one else

[gleaming stream]

excuses

[slate scarab]

[whole dawn]

You know i always had a pet peeve with calling any normal character: universal or multiversal!
Like sure call zeno that but if every dragonball character is that strong how tf has nothing on that scale be destroyed?

Like oh beerus and gokus punch shakes the universe (in fillee btw)
But 0 villains use like 000000.1% of the strength just to destory earth?
Like dragonball makes so much more sense if destroying planets actually takes effort!
I seriously think its a writing flaw to have a character that can destroy universes easily fight against another on that same level and even their charged ki blasts can destroy 1 measly planet?

Like how much do the VILLAINS hold back?

[shut pendant]

https://fxtwitter.com/makroverse/status/1976426491446718809

✨MakeLMcFry✨ (@makroverse)

Kirby Star Crossed World is worth it

**💬 5 🔁 13 ❤️ 40 👁️ 526 **

▶ Play video

FxTwitter · Oct 9, 2025, 11:16 PM

[broken void]

@vagrant hound 🦊

[vagrant hound]

[high widget]

wh

WHY DO YOU HAVE THIS

WHY IS IT LIKE THE SAME FUCKING AREA

HAVE YOU ARLEADY SEEN THIS VIDEO

[vagrant hound]

It’s the same exact section lol

Was in vc streaming and was talking about Elfilin has crazy nose jiggle physics

[gleaming stream]

Ah, Makel’s love for Elfilin could almost match Yukkuri’s love for Magolor

[high widget]

god you knwo what this looks like

[vagrant hound]

No lol I had this emote since the Mefilis spoiler policy lifted

[high widget]

https://tenor.com/view/ena-joel-g-ena-ena-dream-bbq-froggy-yapping-gif-13944599572530939450

[vagrant hound]

😭 😭

[high widget]

i wish i had his energy

[vagrant hound]

I was trying to measure the jiggle physics of Magolor ears and Elfilin nose

[gleaming stream]

Oh

[vagrant hound]

No joke it moves A LOT

Loading the video I took to make gif out of

[gleaming stream]

He’s so cute man

[high widget]

wow

that IS a jiggley nose

you were staring at this for 30ish seconds?

god that really is the closest we've seen elfilin huh

the more i stare at it the more it looks like a weird Kirby smile

ugh

[gleaming stream]

Best Kirby buddy in a long while

[broken void]

https://tenor.com/view/fox-sniff-fox-sniff-fast-fast-fox-funny-smelly-gif-2396101249696858033

[turbid nexus]

Awoofy

[random tendon]

https://tenor.com/view/elfilin-kirby-oblivious-cute-kirby-and-the-forgotten-land-gif-25242424

[gleaming stream]

I remember when people said he would betray Kirby, that was funny

[turbid nexus]

Find yourself a friend who’s actually the fragmented half of a planet destroyer

[broken void]

the fact his name is based on this was prob the most compelling evidence for that theory lol. little did we know it was foreshadowing something else

[high widget]

huh

that explains his species

[random tendon]

funnily enough this may be the origin of "elfilis" yeah LOL

[broken void]

genuinely insane thing to name a character after lmao

[random tendon]

anyway kumazaki when

[turbid nexus]

Such a hardcore word lol

[high widget]

Guess huh

we're fuicking GUESSING

but when we guess we FIGHT EACH OTHE RBECAUSE ITS NOT CANON!!!

RAAAGH

[broken void]

Ooh where's this word used

[random tendon]

last sentence lol (not full paragraph, i'm translating atm)

[vagrant hound]

Every time when Kuma talks in interview /j

[random tendon]

TRUE

[gleaming stream]

Kumazaki used lengthy explanation!
It’s super effective!

[sterile quartz]

Speaking of

Which cup is canon

Ucz or ucz ex

[turbid nexus]

Z EX makes the most sense
Since it basically completes both story lines

Wouldn’t make much sense for the original to be the main canon one now

[random tendon]

as with anything in kirby, there's no official "canon". I think it's funnier if both are lol

[tacit saffron]

ZEX

[random tendon]

I think an official kumazaki answer would be like " they are parallels lol"

[turbid nexus]

He would say that

[slate scarab]

interchangeable. ucz if Chaos doesn't think to nab the spear and z ex if they do

[green crater]

"The customer may imagine..."

[ocean ingot]

New Wikirby april fools idea, everything on Kumazaki's page is change to, "one may imagine what games Kuma directed"

[ripe bane]

Or maybe he'd call it a Parallel Story in katakana without saying if that term has something to do with just Parallel.

[ripe bane]

"It gets to the heart of the matter"

[vital lodge]

Reading the chat from a couple of hours ago, I believe UCZEX's Forgo Leon Music Choice is perfect, reusing Magolor Epilogue's themes really fits Leon. At the end of Isolated Isles, Leon is still a lost soul, just like Magolor was in his Epilogue. Using "Onward to a Pain my Heart knows well" for Phase 2 makes it hopeful, like there is still a chance for him to be saved and redeemed. I really appreciated this music choice.

Then somehow there's Morpho Knight reusing Void Termina's theme, now that I find lazy and without a valid reason.

[jolly lichen]

I thought it was answer(?) of what music would be playing if you able to fight morpho as kirby with guest star mode in legit way...

[vital lodge]

ahh..yes, I kinda like that idea. However, it must imply that Kirby is somehow related to Void...and the fandom really insists on it not being the case.

[high widget]

crazy

[vital lodge]

Thinking about it again, it may suggest there is a relation between Morpho Knight and Void which we have yet to see for ourselves.

[high widget]

also you literally.

fight Morpho as Kirby in the base game 😭

[jolly lichen]

I know...
Just assuming if music choice for morpho was kinda their answer(?) of "own" morpho theme (not default one) like other wave characters... 😅

[high widget]

yeah but the theory falls flat because You literally fight him as Kirby

[sand patrol]

I thought the idea was it used boss music from their debut game

[high widget]

true

[ripe bane]

It's the other way around except for the people who read Nintendo Dream (and even after I read that interview, I kept thinking Kirby could be an incarnation of Void for years).

[random tendon]

people don't deny a connection between kirby and void, and that is even confirmed in that famous kumazaki answer. what people deny is that void became kirby

it's just that void is related to everything as the origin of the origin so being related to kirby is not special

[toxic delta]

or moreso SA Voids mimicked Kirby because it was what it first saw

(hard to tell what the origin riddle actually means, but either it basically means it is everything or that it might as well be....nothing)

[ripe bane]

That was what the interview stated, but I didn't realize that Void being influenced by who he first sees/who summons him was what was happening and I thought Kumazaki implied the reincarnation theory was right.

[ripe bane]

I think the origin riddle is just a way of worldbuilding why Hyness's clan worshipped Void as a god and, since Kumazaki said it's also possible Void isn't a god, the riddle isn't supposed to be taken at face value.

I think we have to wait for new Kirby games to give Void extra lore in order to know what really happened.

[ripe bane]

Or maybe it's just a cryptic way of explaining why SMEX Void was different from Void Soul.

[toxic delta]

moreso I like to think it was how the ancients saw them, but yeah

[slate scarab]

i think the idea is that when a major Void is born a new dimension is born with it. Since that was the basis of Hyness's plot, he wanted Void Termina to make a new paradise for the Jambastion people. To me the whole "Void is the origin of everything" is something similar to how all things evolved from a common ancestor a bazillion years ago, but certain species are more related to that than others.

so Kirby is idealistic Void offspring who can still copy things, isn't a super villain, and also doesn't care about anything but food and friends

[random tendon]

(had typed my original messages sleepy) but yeah this is sort of what I mean, denying ANY connection between kirby and void is just wrong, because of the face thing. the biggest mystery is why that is

funnily enough for this reason I am about to reword the misconceptions page on wikirby

[slate scarab]

its really funny Meteonelfilis has the copy ability too just really really bad

having to eat 100 powerful guys to get their powers and still lose is pretty bad leave it to Kirby lil bro

[random tendon]

in general I like the notion that in kirby's universe copying stuff in general is not something only kirby can do, and it can manifest in different ways. and we saw that clearly in void and (m)elfilis, plus other things like lor are also implied to be similar

[slate scarab]

maybe its like the level of goodness in your soul that lets you use it better LMFAO

dark matter just dont got that they just make shit up. maybe thats cooler, just manifesting stuff. thats kinda cheating though and it hasnt worked a single time soooo not good

Melfilis and Elfilis have it but its horrendous and they got a TEENY bit of goodness

[ripe bane]

Same.

[ripe bane]

But Miracle Matter and Susie are evil and have been seen using Copy Abilities.

[slate scarab]

Miracle Matter calls upon abilities but doesnt actually COPY anything 🧠

like Dark Nebula

Susie is cheating thats Sakurai fanfiction

for video game purposes

[random tendon]

(I think she means due to star allies)

(for susie)

[slate scarab]

does Susie's gun being filled with water count as her having the copy ability

[shut pendant]

man wouldn't it be funny if they just made a game where everyone had copy abilities and not just kirby

heh they would never do that

[random tendon]

they would never do it that is just too silly and would break all the lore!!!!

[ripe bane]

I meant Air Riders.

[random tendon]

ah

air riders copy ability for me is a "lol why not" so I don't take it seriously

and like I just said in air riders thread, I think if they ever explained it would be like "mysterious things can happen in skyah" like how they justified stuff in another dimension like multiple magolors and the hero doors

[slate scarab]

if i MUST ascribe lore to it I just shove it under the "Kirby can share his copy ability with others" table with the animal friends

[high widget]

which is why i want them to make muothful mode a Kirby thing like a thing he can regularly do outside of FL

like ever since KSA i was fine with the idea of Copy Hats being a source of the ability and i always thought "hmm, they should give Kirby something unique" and this is it

his stretchiness

[toxic delta]

yeah, see anyone that can use abilities (Gooey, Droppy, TAC as Helper, Animal Friends (at least RKC are depicted as using them without Kirby), Miracle Matter sort of, etc. + all Riders in Air Riders) plus stuff like Robobot is also influenced by heart of the rider
also got whatever you make of Magolor using Super Abilities
and Dimension Mirror reflecting the darkness in people's hearts

artist characters can also make whatever the fuck they want I guess

(including Yin-Yarn, who basically copied Tankbot Metamortex like that lol)

[vagrant hound]

The evil and menacing Kirby printer that waddle dee cranked for King Dedede

[toxic delta]

oh yeah that too

[vagrant hound]

Yeah overall copy is just everywhere

Copying mimicking whatever people believe in

[toxic delta]

and also copied Waddle Dees (though that one goes for lot of the artists)
plagiarism smh

[vagrant hound]

personally Magolor and Magolor Soul is the most memorable or impactful one of the all example, just pure emotional

No bias

[toxic delta]

oh yeah and there's also stuff like Sectonia (and Taranza)'s species with manipulation magic and bodysnatching

[ripe bane]

Honestly, I also got hyped when I saw Waddle Doo use the Beam Rod in its Air Riders special.

[vagrant hound]

In next 10 years, we will find out dark nebula is the source of every darkness

Or dark nebula turns out to be an fallen star child

[toxic delta]

Dark Nebula is the source of every element, clearly

[vagrant hound]

He tried mimicking Miracle Matter and failed <3

The way he moves around on screen will always be funny

[high widget]

the way dark nebula pops off of Daroach like a copy ability

what if Kirby ate it

[vagrant hound]

Kirby learns how to control puredarkness

(Dark nebula turns into dark warp Star)

[slate scarab]

ancients have the copy ability cause they tried to copy kirby's copy ability

[high widget]

idk but it kinda feels like as the series goes on its going to actually define things

which sounds scary

but its going to happen in the span of like

legitiamtely 100 years

[vagrant hound]

Kirby will end in 20 years

[slate scarab]

i looove when things are defined i loooove it

i love it even more when theres room to define it yourself

[toxic delta]

it'll define things then make 10 more mysteries for each thing

[slate scarab]

As long as every definition fits in with my rigid and unchanging view on the series everything will be a okay

[slate scarab]

Canon

That is to say if the Dream Kingdom being on past Halcandra is ever deconfirmed I'll transform into a mario lore head

A dark place that would be

[toxic delta]

Kumazaki will deconfirm it 86 weeks from now

[high widget]

idk why you think its ancient Halcandra

the Volcano is like

the most important part

like the whole SCW Volcano and the Halcandra Volcano being sort of parallels kind of just

gives less actual credence to Dream Kingdom being anything other than Dream Land (Another)

[slate scarab]

Planets are big

Can you see mount Rushmore from your home go look right now

[high widget]

thank god i never will

[slate scarab]

Landia, the Master Crown, and Decisive Battleflied are the smoking guns. So much smoke I can't breathe

[toxic delta]

what about Taranza

and Ice Dragon

[slate scarab]

Ur telling me the Dream Kingdom MIRACULOUSLY has the same evil artifact as Halcandra and suffers the same fate

[toxic delta]

and the Dimension Mirror

also Decisive Battlefield is more like Dimension Mirror (area) anyway lol

[high widget]

it clearly doesnt suffer the same fate you literally returnto the town unscathed and so is the town

[slate scarab]

It's not in the mirror though it's just in Another Dimension

[toxic delta]

we don't know where it is

[high widget]

like the battleground is "the town but on fire" but like theyre also in Another Dimension

[slate scarab]

Cause Another Dimension is beyond space and time

[toxic delta]

they've literally never said

[high widget]

dude every space can be ruined by fire

[slate scarab]

If the kingdom ever WAS destroyed it would be there

[high widget]

THAT APPLIES TO EVERYTHING EVER AT HTIS POINT !

AD isn't a direct connection AD is a fucking ocean

[slate scarab]

It's context clues. You fight the parallels there and the big spiked balls from Another Dimension in rtdl are there during the final battle

[toxic delta]

(and you could very much argue it isn't in Another Dimension Road at least with the Parallel Susie coming through a Dimension Hole seeming through there and not outside)

[high widget]

Dimension Hole can be in AD we've seen this like a few times already

[toxic delta]

latter is not in the former area

[toxic delta]

true, but still is a point to bring up

[slate scarab]

The King D Mind fight in Deluxe?

That one is on decisive battlefield

[toxic delta]

you know what I meant

[high widget]

the super blue AD is in both TKCDX and SKC

[toxic delta]

anyway it also doesn't work because....those can be outside another dimension lol

and Team Meteors also have a similar shape

and those are straight up from Clash

[slate scarab]

I don't think we have seen them elsewhere aside from a possible Starry connection. But even those don't look the same

[toxic delta]

I mean these don't look the exact same as Dimension Meteors either

[high widget]

wait that reminds me

was there. a rare stone figure in FL

[slate scarab]

The spiked meteors between Another Dimension and Decisive Battlefield are almost 1 to 1. Definitely more similar than anything else that could be compared

[toxic delta]

not on its own but there is 'Rare-Stone Master' one

[high widget]

whats the point being made because just because something is in AD doesnt mean theres a direct connection to it being Halcandra or an alternate Halcandra or a past Halcandra

[toxic delta]

yeah that too lol

[high widget]

from the OG game right

did they not explain the rare stones at all 😭

[toxic delta]

from base FL yeah

[high widget]

"we have these star crystal things"

"and we have this collectible, the rare stone"

and we just stare at it because theres no fucking words whatsoever

[slate scarab]

The point is that Dream kingdoms ruins being in AD means it will be destroyed at some point. AD is beyond the space-time continuum. So the ruins of the Dream Kingdom would always be there if the event ever happened

[high widget]

compared to what

like youre saying all this but we have no idea what that actually means

for all we know this is what happens to all planets and dimensions

[toxic delta]

Halcandra isn't in another dimension, there are some Halcandra stuff at the rock bottom of another sky but like, it looks very different from how either of Decisive Battlefield's areas have it

[high widget]

also yeah Halcandra isnt In

[toxic delta]

most of it's ruined stuff is in like floating island-type shit

[high widget]

like

there's a bunch fo stuff in KSA's AD

that is like grayscale versions of level elements from KSA

did Popstar die?

will Popstar eventually die?

[slate scarab]

Because we specifically see it with Dream Kingdom and Halcandra. Both their ruins are in Another Dimension, they both have the Master Crown

[high widget]

like there is no confirmation from just gleaning that there is Ruins of the Dream Kingdom in an AD background

that it means its Halcandran

again

[toxic delta]

oh yeah that too, and also Towara

[high widget]

KSA AD is right there and it has elements of KSA's level elements

like Towara and Green Gardens

I should know. I made a stage based on KSA's AD

[slate scarab]

The Dream Kingdom ruins being halcandran is the point of what I'm saying 😭

[toxic delta]

and sure Towara was made by some ancient civilization....but like nothing says they have anything to do with Halcandra

[high widget]

there is literally nothing tying both of these

[slate scarab]

Master Crown and gem apples the two things that destroyed the place

[high widget]

the gem apples came from magolor 😭

why od you think the apple is a sapling

in that silly credits image

[toxic delta]

Grand Gem Apple isn't hinted at destroying anything yeah

[high widget]

KSA AD :]

[slate scarab]

the Master Crown used the grand gem apple to do it

thats what the Epilogue flashback was for

[toxic delta]

nothing says that

[slate scarab]

thats why it wanted the apple back

[high widget]

we genuinely do not even know if the gem apple was in the equation in the original destruction

[slate scarab]

its shown....

[high widget]

we only saw its recreation

we saw the destruction but we have literally nothing to go off of the destruction

because as far as they can do they can retcon things that are vague and thats why you can't make these headcanons

like Magolor being fucking Halcandran

and that was the least vague thing Magolor tries to tell you 😭

[slate scarab]

we do have something to go off the destruction we literally see it

[high widget]

Yeah and meteors happen

this ties Halcandra to meteors not gem apples

the only gem apple in that scene is the tree itself thats fighting you

[slate scarab]

the tree is the one who brings the meteors. it flies down from the epicenter of the crisis

and when it yells at the end of the fight more fall

[high widget]

again they can retcon this whenever they want if its vague

[toxic delta]

it's just Grand Gem Apple has 'great power' and 'life power', that's about it
meanwhile we know Master Crown has the hatred and obsession of overlords who once held it, and Magolor also got taken over by it....so I feel like it just went crazy whenever some other ruler held and wore it, not anything to do with the apple

[high widget]

we cannot say anything definitive about that damn tree

we cannot even say anything about the crown

we know they made the crown and it brought them destruction but is this how they did it

like their city is literally steel and metal there's not a lick of gilded jewel apples both in the ruins of Halcandra and that destruction scene and like "it doesnt have to be covered in apples to be destroyed by something with a gem apple" we dont know that

we don't.

[slate scarab]

i really just dont think theres any reason to not think the Master Crown tree boss isnt what destroyed Halcandra. Like why would the Crown have even opened a vortext there in the first place if it wasnt trying to pursue something specific

[high widget]

youre trying to say something specific happens because you believe it is specific

"why did it show the destruction of Halcandra" because of the crown. not the apple

we dont even know how the gem apple like . functions

we know it grows trees because its in both Clashes

we know its energy and fuel and has magic powers and also fucking Explodes

[toxic delta]

they also never mention Master Crown having had it before, it got よみがえ ('resurrected') as that during Epilogue

[high widget]

but where did it come from before Clash

we genuinely dont know

[slate scarab]

the crown uses the apple to make the flashback even happen

[toxic delta]

there's also the whole thing of
if it was that before, what is the Grand Gem Apple
because like, it turns into a sapling after it gets killed

[high widget]

the apple as a power source to make something happen in the present time
does not define its role in a previous event that has already happened

[high widget]

the fact that you have to find slices of it in the first place

its not even growing

it just Exists as slices

[toxic delta]

oh yeah that too lol

[high widget]

we dont know anything about this damn apple

[toxic delta]

why is it slices

[slate scarab]

but thats the whole purpose of why the mode happens. Again, why would the Crown even be pursuing it in the first place. Why would it have created a portal to its location. The fact we are shown as flashback is meant to clue us in that the reason it did that is cause it was at its strongest when it had the apple.

[random tendon]

eats the apple

[toxic delta]

hell why does the Gem Apple Tree not make any Grand Gem Apples???

[high widget]

you keep saying this like you know what the master crown wants

Master Crown is literalyl described as hatred and obsession and some third adjective i forgot

[slate scarab]

this is just how story structure works

[toxic delta]

yeah Epilogue's plot is vague as hell (they did not fix that in interviews or guidebook either)

[random tendon]

anyway I think at this point this convo should move to #kirby-kingdom

[high widget]

You say that and we have the Kirby series

which clearly doesnt follow story structures

[slate scarab]

it does though 😭

[high widget]

I don't know how to tell you that a lot of our information comes from side stories, extra events, descriptions and etc that wouldnt make sense if we tried structuring them as a singular timeline

this is why they made the continuity page on wikirby

[toxic delta]

we're lucky SCW had most things spelled out ingame for once

(including putting some of the FL guidebook info in the game)

[turbid nexus]

Antares💖

[toxic delta]

don't forget, Giant Impact

[high widget]

me looking at the elfilis spear Antares and realizing Elfilis is a duo not with Elfilin but someone else of the same species before the leaks leaked Genwel

[slate scarab]

Yeah the point is to put them together to figure out the reason things happen. This is something that is done in any good story. No good story just tells you everything outright.

[toxic delta]

....and Epilogue is vague af

[slate scarab]

Visuals and music are just as important as plain text

[high widget]

yeah and then they'll pull the rug on us and tell us something different happened

you are not going to win with your headcanon until we get more information that supports the theory

[slate scarab]

You shouldn't disregard visuals just because it's not spelled out what it means in text

[high widget]

until then the likelihood of Dream Kingdom being Past Halcandra is very minimal

especially since they actually poked and prodded Halcandra with a stick using RtDL DX and FL SCW

[slate scarab]

I'm not even talking about dreamcandra anymore I'm just referring to Epilogues premise and the series as a whole

[toxic delta]

like we don't know if the crown wanted the apple or if it just happened to get it
it's implied Grand/Crowned Doomer wanted it but that's different thing

[high widget]

yeah the Master Crown doesn't possess unless you hit it real hard with a sword or something so does that apply to the Master Crown broken bits

?

idk

we just know Crowned Doomer exists and wanted the Apple

[toxic delta]

we also don't really know what's going on with most of the bosses to make them like that, just another dimension shenanigans with elements I guess

but also why do they look like Pop Star bosses???

[slate scarab]

Clash has elemental bosses thats the real reason

[toxic delta]

I mean that's thematical thing rather than lore one

[high widget]

if its anything like KSA's AD and Forgo's AD

[slate scarab]

SPECULATION but they're elemental popstar bosses cause the places just miiight be connected

[high widget]

im guessing Epilogue AD is something something the memories or thoughts or whatever.

one things fo rsure though

[toxic delta]

yeah potentially, but like they don't say shit lol

[high widget]

the elemental stuff is influenced by like

the concept of being a magic user

[toxic delta]

anyway, also like how they brought it back, and emphasized that theming way more

Theia....

[slate scarab]

The master crown is constantly trying to control is wearer. It's explained with Landia EX that the Crown managed to overpower them

[high widget]

yeah by exploding most of the volcano off

well its not good at it until you hit it with a sword considering Magolor has his regular self until that point where he turns into his 2nd form

infleunced by the crown before 2nd form? maybe but not fully controlled by the crown

also ME uses Magolor Soul in a cutscene so thats another can of woirms ❤️

[slate scarab]

But I do think all this info is meant to suggest that the Crown had some control over Crowned Doomer and likely used its dominion over the realm to boss people into gathering the apples

Since they make a point to say the Doomers don't usually go after things that aren't energy spheres

[high widget]

i have no problem with this train of thought i just dont think we know teh apple enough

[toxic delta]

but also consider: Grand Doomer had basically just got its ass kicked and fruit fragments contain life power

[slate scarab]

True true

[toxic delta]

and also fight intro animation sort of makes it seem like they weren't together yet

[slate scarab]

I think the Crown could have been like "they're just as yummy and good like Spheres go get them for me"

[high widget]

we dont know what teh crown is thinking

and we dont know what the apple really is

[slate scarab]

This is not scw ummm scw lore ummmm

[high widget]

SCW uhhh we know what Melfilis was thinking

[jolly lichen]

crown must be hungry at that moment

[slate scarab]

Ai neichel let's debate on that

Neichel dies, ships play music forever, Lor goes "oh thats good music imma be her"

We solved it good job

[toxic delta]

god I really want a guidebook to see the move names

[high widget]

we dont even know if the crown is sentient in a Personality-type of way or just a robotic sort of way

[jolly lichen]

same 🙏

[slate scarab]

Here's a SCW relevant theory I think Meteon will become Galacta Knight due to the positive influence of the Starries as suggested by Elfilin (among other things shared between Meteon and Galacta)

Ofc not the only possible answer

[high widget]

wouldnt it look like Elfilin

or like

if the entire thing gets "Good-ified" by the starries

just Melfilis but without red eyes

also the thing about GK is as far as we know it has no personality

[slate scarab]

I think Meteon would just incarnate using the orb form since that seems to be his true one right now

[high widget]

everything has an orb form

at this point

its a rule

[slate scarab]

Like he's not fully Elfilis cause they've been keeping him from maturing

So he has the opportunity to become something else

[high widget]

thats

[toxic delta]

I mean, Elfilis also has a Core and Elfilin doesn't look like that

nor would I call it a true form

[slate scarab]

The Elfilis one seems more like an anomaly

Since a lot of shit had to go wrong for the Orb to show up

[high widget]

they literally both start out as the flesh goop

and the Orb thing is like

after they eat things

[toxic delta]

in its current form yes, but based on Meteonelfilis they probably always had one

[high widget]

like its pretty established that the whole fetus-looking form or the stone-dark-meteor form is like their like

'Hasn't Eaten Things Yet' form

[toxic delta]

and both Fecto and Chaos has one as well (even if Fecto's contains Elfilin)

[slate scarab]

It could go many ways but how I see it is that Elfilis is fully matured so the weirdo Void Orb part is integrated within it and only reforms once it's Chaotic enough to recreate that core

[high widget]

everything eventually becomes orb but the orb is not a true form

[slate scarab]

Meteon is still baby

[high widget]

what

[toxic delta]

it's also worth noting
Meteonelfilis Core has a shit ton of Starry elements

[slate scarab]

So the orb hasn't fully become him yet

[high widget]

what.

we saying anything atp

[toxic delta]

like, practically the entire thing except the shape

[high widget]

also worth noting is that Melfilis explodes into sucha big blast that it knocks out Kirby while Chaos Elfilis both forms just burst into harmless light (and souls)

[slate scarab]

Meteon is naturally in his larval form. The Meteor is the larva if you look closely. He may be older but he has not matured into the adult Elfilis form. He does so unnaturally with the Starries

[high widget]

uhm

[toxic delta]

unnaturally? that's the natural way

[high widget]

i gotta like filter some of this out before it affects my own train of thought

[toxic delta]

Elfilis just consumed animals instead

[high widget]

Elfilis doesn't even mature with jsut the animals its only until after he eats Elfilin that he becomes Elfilis

[toxic delta]

that was very apparent even before SCW, and it's even MORE apparent now

[high widget]

in fact there's more to be said about Elfilin being the thing that completes Elfilis because thats the part that the Starries infleunced

[slate scarab]

But Elfilis was just Elfilis at some point. The split caused it to revert into a larva.

[toxic delta]

yes but it still consumed animals to become its perfect form

[high widget]

we actually dont know that

[toxic delta]

aka an 'adult'

[high widget]

like was it actually said that Elfilis was in That Form when he arrived

considering we see another Elfilis land on the planet in front of our very eyes

[toxic delta]

Dream Discoveries Tour makes it clear, the guidebook makes it clear, the new figures and Meteonelfilis makes it clear

[high widget]

and it doesnt get That form until after it eats

[slate scarab]

That's fair

I suppose it would stand to reason Elfilis would land the same way

[high widget]

especially since Elfilin literally describes

"oh iw as coevered in this shit btw"

"these. crystals"

[slate scarab]

But that does mean at least that Elfilis spent much more time matured than Meteon... maybe that accounts for something. Or maybe Meteon is just more voidcore cause he's naturally stronger

Herrmmmmmm quite the puzzle

[high widget]

that word dont have meaning not even to people who know what you mean 😭

[slate scarab]

Voidcore

Cmon it's voidcore we all know voidcore

[high widget]

we know Melfilis is voidcore but i would describe that as their aesthetic appearance and not their strength

[ripe bane]

I wonder if Mefillis reverted to larva form due to being sealed.

[slate scarab]

They got spawncamped

[high widget]

considering it turns back into goop after exploding

and then gets sealed

[slate scarab]

Could also be due to the Starries

Meteons orb becomes voidlike by mixing his darkness with the Starries light, creating a form of chaos