Balancing that should be added imo

[ember cargo]

Where a teammate is waiting for an easy 3

[limpid urchin]

Yea because that's all they do

It's a sitting duck

[ember cargo]

I don’t see how that’s balanced but blink isn’t

[limpid urchin]

Waiting for a treat to be thrown

[turbid saffron]

because my SUGGESTION of not allowing the ball to be blocked if its near the hoop doesnt affect the counterplay once so ever

[ember cargo]

Blink at least don’t smack the ball to the other side of the court

[limpid urchin]

Thing is

[shell skiff]

if you balance something it will obviously affect the counter play

[limpid urchin]

U can also pumpfake those

Now let's say

[turbid saffron]

because skyhand almost always turns over the ball and it doesnt goaltend

[limpid urchin]

The player is a smarter than that

[ember cargo]

Zelo why are you talking to me?

[turbid saffron]

its just a sure shot block move if yk what ur doing but the downsides r large

[ember cargo]

You want to ignore me remember?

I’m talking to Block right now

[limpid urchin]

U can pass it around till they waste the move or go for a dunk to throw them off

Someone could go and stun him

[turbid saffron]

tell me how not allowing blink to block at the hoop affects any counterplay you mentioned

[turbid saffron]

but you cant

[ember cargo]

Can’t you argue the same for blink?

[turbid saffron]

because it doesnt

[limpid urchin]

With blink

[turbid saffron]

also if you mess up skyhand it stuns you

[limpid urchin]

U just have to be near the user

[turbid saffron]

it has WAY more downsides than upsides dawg

[limpid urchin]

That's all the requirements

U can play the game

While also not only sit under the net

It's silver but u have free speech

Kind of

So with this U can move freely

[novel shadow]

Skyhand doesn't have the generous window blink has which can be up to five or four seconds with which a perfection player can block the ball.

Also skyhand has a fixed hitbox and doesn't have the capability to teleport to a ball.

Finally sky hand can not goaltend meaning it cannot slap away a downward curve ball as that has iframes

[limpid urchin]

And like

[turbid saffron]

and the ball doesnt go flying it stays in range for anyone to get it

[limpid urchin]

Sometimes a stun isn't even enough

Luka can get through, air cant

[turbid saffron]

instead of sending it to the opponents court

[limpid urchin]

Emp most of the time cant

[shell skiff]

regardless this will get ignored

and it will amount to nothing

[limpid urchin]

Gold maybe sometimes can

[turbid saffron]

ty bro

this is all correct

[limpid urchin]

Ty goat

[novel shadow]

Aw shucks bro we can't make suggestions

[shell skiff]

the suggestion maker is saying counterplay is irrelevant to balancing

[turbid saffron]

so we should delete our suggestions

[limpid urchin]

I mean the devs don't really see it except for a few specific ones

[turbid saffron]

your counterplay that you mentioned doesnt affect what i wanted to change

[limpid urchin]

But it's always style ones

[shell skiff]

i think someone unwilling to debate and argue on how their suggestion is flawed should be like

[limpid urchin]

Never the balance changes..

[turbid saffron]

yeah but theres still a couple..

[shell skiff]

i mean i dont even know why we are discussing about this like

[turbid saffron]

its possible i guess

[novel shadow]

Your point on counterplay is irrelevant to the consensus of the blink nerf. There's no counterplay to stopping a blink from goal tending which is why your point isn't needed or wasn't needed at the time

[limpid urchin]

Some people got hired to work a lil with the dev team from suggestions

[shell skiff]

psychic half court teleport

venom almost guaranteed steal

[limpid urchin]

They've had 1 suggestion on balances I think

Ion think that gets added tho

[shell skiff]

there is counterplay to the outcome of a blink

[limpid urchin]

I might be wrong on this tho

[novel shadow]

There's no counterplay to prevent a blink from teleporting... That's what I said

[limpid urchin]

Maybe they work indirectly not sure how this acc works

[turbid saffron]

the counterplay doesnt guarentee the ball

so its flawed

[turbid saffron]

^

[bleak flicker]

i think its a little harsh to nerf refs foul to only pump passes, it is a miracle after all

[turbid saffron]

thats my issue

[limpid urchin]

In conclusion I would

[turbid saffron]

no no im adding on to it

[shell skiff]

yeah my bad blink should have the perfection play a animation where they grab the ball and come down and give it to the enemy team

[turbid saffron]

so it can stop shots and pump passes

i feel like all passes is a bit too much

[limpid urchin]

Buff perf drib nerf blink (air) buff blink (ground)

Ima go to sleep

Gn yall

[turbid saffron]

what?

[shell skiff]

bro what is the point of a move that blocks the ball and then guarantees the possession to the enemy team

[turbid saffron]

alright gn

bye bye

[turbid saffron]

w

[shell skiff]

legitimately

[turbid saffron]

it doesnt

[shell skiff]

buff the blink teleport

[turbid saffron]

whya re you still on this

[shell skiff]

like the move where it teleports you to the enemy

[turbid saffron]

i explained to u how ur counterplay is flawed

[shell skiff]

and maybe nerf the move where it stops the ball

SLIGHTLY

[turbid saffron]

honestly ill stop wasting my time

were done here

you can stop now ig

thanks for the words

[shell skiff]

lol

dude

im agreeing with you

why are you so salty

[turbid saffron]

so

[shell skiff]

you are unwilling to listen to debates

[turbid saffron]

were done

ty

[shell skiff]

never debate again bro

you clearly cant handle it

you shouldnt be getting upset

and getting your emotions in the way of it

[turbid saffron]

im not salty ive debated you already and you keep bringing up things that dont have to do with my suggestion.

[shell skiff]

because you are clearly immature

and upset

[turbid saffron]

im using common sense

[shell skiff]

and letting it get on the way of your points

[turbid saffron]

no..?

[shell skiff]

i am tryng to bring a new point to the debate

[turbid saffron]

alright

[shell skiff]

and you immediately shut me down

and dont listen to me

[turbid saffron]

sure

bump

[shell skiff]

i am asking for maybe a buff to the teleport

where it puts you next to the enemy

[turbid saffron]

bump

[shell skiff]

and a very slight nerf to blink

shot stop variant

[turbid saffron]

bump

bump

bump

[turbid saffron]

you brought up the psychic half court teleport so i added that to my suggestion

ty for that but we just cant agree with the perfection stuff

no point in arguing about it but at least we can agree there

[shell skiff]

i think if perfection was more available to the public, people would realize

the overall view of the style would change

because as far as the average experience someone has with perfection is they encounter one perfection once in a while they block their shot and they just go "perfection is op!!!"

and then never see it again

[turbid saffron]

yeah

[turbid saffron]

true although i only think perfection is op because of the teleport range AND the dunk being added along with slight buffs

[shell skiff]

the dunk is meaningless tbh

[turbid saffron]

if blink had the same range as of rn but nothing else changed then id let it be

bump

[shell skiff]

let me tell you bro i had perfection since it released, it maybe was op then since the game was very different back then

[turbid saffron]

it was op[ back then when everyone wa susing it but now since its been forever since it came out nobody talks about it nearly enough

[shell skiff]

it was really strong back then since styles werent as overloaded as they are now

but every style now releases with a dash or a bunch of nonsense

or a unblockable shot

or a bunch of stuff

[turbid saffron]

its a big issue with the game itself

and developers

gojo will be op most likely

i like perfection i just wish they never gave it that update where they buffed the shot slightly and added a dunk

because i do see the dunk

if theyre gonna add a dunk release the useless layup move or just dont add it at all

anyways i kinda dont wanna be ont his topic anymore i appreciate coming to somewhat of a conclusion though

bump

bump

bump

[shell skiff]

honestly yes

the developers have misplaced their priorities

the game is in a buggy state

cutscenes are barely even functional

80% of the time they are buggy

the game is plagued with bugs

every new style that comes out is just op

[turbid saffron]

bump

[trim garnet]

They really wrote two bibles about this🥀🙌

[turbid saffron]

💔

bump

bumpl

[trim garnet]

A lot bump

[turbid saffron]

thank you yakub

bump

[trim garnet]

buff spider

Please I need this

[turbid saffron]

Spider is so bad its not even funny 💔

bump

[turbid saffron]

bumpp

[dire herald]

Spider is good wdym

[turbid saffron]

how?

none of its moves r good besides the awakening

[dire herald]

When you fake shot you can move around with one of these spider abilities

It's so much good

[turbid saffron]

it has no iframes and endlag

sadly its not that great

chrollo can do this as well and its just better

[turbid saffron]

bump

[dire herald]

You mean he fix it or rework

[lone tinsel]

don’t nerf perfection it already got rebalanced in the past it’s just useless + not a lot of player have him

and blink is a teleport move it don’t make sense to nerf a teleport move that already have a normal range ngl teleportation is the point of this move

[long wadi]

emperor doesnt really need a buff

rather a change to the janky requirements

rather than needing to look at an opponent which is buggy

just change it to being within range instead

we have foul that does that anyways

another thing id add is removing the eclipse steal's ability to travel vertically

its very stupid

one last thing is that give post-form dribble properties but only when you have two or more dribbles in your bar

thats just my take on it

also yeah blink range needs to be gutted but in return give it an easier way to intercept passes + a buffed overall kit

and realistically spider needs a rework more than buffs i wont lie

totally not a biased take from a spider-man fan

[turbid saffron]

eh, spiders moves r cool just weak

i think buffs are absolutely fair

[long wadi]

theyre dysfunctional at best

[turbid saffron]

exactly

[long wadi]

say hi is a gimmicky tendril dribble

teamwork is just useless

roll away is usable i guess

half of its base kit is nearly useless

[turbid saffron]

teamwork is a good idea for a move but it needs a speed boost

[long wadi]

that warrants a rework

[turbid saffron]

i guess yeah but buffing shot sense/rollaway alone would make spider much more usable

a rework would be nice but they could also just add iframes to spider cuz he has like zero iframes

😭

[turbid saffron]

huh??

wdym

[turbid saffron]

its weak for a miracle

tbh

[long wadi]

heck no it isnt

[turbid saffron]

even if u fix the requirements

[long wadi]

ultimate pass is still one of the most busted abilities

[turbid saffron]

king has a better one

[long wadi]

emperor dribble can reset your dribbles

[long wadi]

nah

ultimate pass gives 30% zone and forced shot is nearly frame 1 and can movestack with nearly everything

[turbid saffron]

perfection and useless in the same sentence

is this bias

[long wadi]

kings is half that good

only thing holding back reach is how buggy the detection is

[turbid saffron]

and u cant activate it in a reactive way

[long wadi]

in a way you can

[turbid saffron]

just gotta hope they shoot into ur red outline

💔

[long wadi]

ive only pulled it off once

just pressing it right as they start shooting

it works

[turbid saffron]

maybe

[long wadi]

its not an issue for me either since most of the good defensive abilities arent reactive

[turbid saffron]

but still crappy detection igu

[long wadi]

emperors dribble paired with any increased dribble speed zone is cracked

you can dribble thrice

use the move

and you have dribbles back

or you can use it to easily score in the perimeter on iso

also i dont think some people get why blink is stupid

yeah its an inconvenience but the fact that you can just walk up to an opponent five full business days after they shot the ball and still have another five business days to blink is not okay

[limpid urchin]

Lowkey might make one of my own balance suggestions

Tho like styled that are do underbalanced like ace I cant buff it it just needs a rework or something

[long wadi]

yeah ace needs a proper rework

the rework they gave it was just badly executed from the start

[limpid urchin]

Ace is so terrible it's more buns than giant

Even tho they lack the same problem

[long wadi]

giant is good to begin with so that should be obvious

[limpid urchin]

Giant js needs a post form refresh

I've got a good idea for that

[long wadi]

just give it a buff

like i said earlier

[limpid urchin]

U mean give post iframes?

[long wadi]

if you have two or more dribbles in your bar it can anklebreak steals

if you have less

then bye bye post form

[limpid urchin]

Ehh

Idk

I had a different idea

[long wadi]

a refresh or a rework isnt really necessary when a buff can fix its problems

either that or just completely replace it with contact dunk

[limpid urchin]

Give it iframes but the posted player can force out a hook/2pt shot instead by getting atleast 2 qtes right out of 3

[long wadi]

ehh

[limpid urchin]

If the giant hooks before the player correctly does 2 qtes then the hook is slightly faster than the forced one

[long wadi]

thats too complicated

[limpid urchin]

Is it?

[long wadi]

well the move is fine as it is now

i dont see why theres a need to overcomplicate it

[limpid urchin]

Not even that complicated tho

[long wadi]

the qtes are nice but id rather not oversaturate the feature as well

[long wadi]

for the style it is

plus id argue thatd make post form even more of a cone than it is now

the game tends to make qtes simple and easy

[limpid urchin]

How about js 1 qte

That comes in the middle of it

Js 1

[long wadi]

how about no qte

the move is fine as it is

[limpid urchin]

Idk

[long wadi]

just give it a buff that allows it to evade steals given the right requirements

and the issues with it are fixed

[limpid urchin]

Doesn't feel like a crushing move like u said it

Then I'd just pass to the giant at the other paint

[long wadi]

giving it a qte that everyone can access only makes it worse

[limpid urchin]

Everyone?

Wym

Just the posted player

[long wadi]

that is everyone yes

[limpid urchin]

Oh

[long wadi]

countering it isnt style specific anymore

[limpid urchin]

That's what u mean

[long wadi]

which is arguably much worse

[limpid urchin]

Rlly??

[long wadi]

the people who can counter post form are already skilled or knowledgeable to begin with

a qte isnt changing anything

if anything itll make it easier

they dont need to counterpick anymore

youll be out here seeing a fetch clamp a post form

[lone tinsel]

it’s just useless to nerf him

he still gon be op

[long wadi]

this is an awful argument

a nerf has hit perfection in the past and it was quite an effective nerf

[turbid saffron]

eh

[turbid saffron]

im advising to nerf what makes him annoying and buff the less weaker stuff

[long wadi]

perfection was garbage after the nerfs before the infinite blink range came

[turbid saffron]

uh huh

so nerfing the blink tp range (not even that much) and buffing the other moves helps the style overall

nobody uses perfect dunk bc how overtuned blink is

[long wadi]

just make it not infinite range and not goaltend

and just replace the eurostep with perf dunk

would be good if the dribble didnt require a target as well

[turbid saffron]

yeah its annoying

this is literally my suggestion exactly

[turbid saffron]

^

[turbid saffron]

if u can do that then u shouldnt be able to use the dunk or shot

[long wadi]

it literally isnt any different

you just have more control

[turbid saffron]

still tho

[long wadi]

shammgod is still a better move

[turbid saffron]

should have 2 different versions

yeah shammgod distance is alot

[long wadi]

so removing the target requirement for perfect dribble shouldnt be an issue

we have like 5 million defensive abilities anyway

[turbid saffron]

if u need a flow for the dribble to be cracked its the same thing as sniper or dealer shot

[long wadi]

it doesnt need the zone

its just better with it

[turbid saffron]

a flow shouldnt be whats making ur point there but yeah u do get dribs back but if the move was better u wouldnt need that

[long wadi]

the difference between sniper dealer and emperor

is that both only have that combo going for them

emperor has much more than that

[turbid saffron]

dealer is good

[long wadi]

mediocre at most but yeah

[turbid saffron]

it needs a flow to be a really good style tho

emp is just good with a dribble flow

[long wadi]

it doesnt need that either

[turbid saffron]

its outdated

[long wadi]

it isnt

its still a very good style

[turbid saffron]

it only creates actual distance in iso

its not good in anything above a 2v2

[turbid saffron]

thats a reach

[long wadi]

the main thing for emperor is playmaking and defending

the dribble cant be guarded 1 on 1 either

literally a free score and if youre doubled

theres one guy open

its not difficult to play emperor properly

and it basically has the best pass itg

literally one of the best all rounders

[turbid saffron]

ehhh best shot pass maybe

i see why its better than kings now

since you have more freedom

[long wadi]

theres no pass in the game that has as much value as it does

[turbid saffron]

but best pass is a reach bc ive presicted the shot a million times

[long wadi]

because people suck at using it

they just spam it right away

i guarantee you if they learn to stack it properly with moves you wont be able to do anything

people say teleport pass is better but it really isnt

its just a safe pass

[hushed kindle]

1.) Blink nerf is fine. Removing the layup is too much
2.) Emp reach is fine as a move. The only problem with it is it's inconsistent due to BBZ itself
3.) Cane just doesn't need to steal when you dribble. That's a terrible design choice
4.) Spider needs everything
5.) Ref needs NO BUFFS
6.) Chuck is meant to be mid sadly
7.) Eclipse needs zero buffs
8.) Giant needs very little buffs. Post form needs no iframes. At most, post hook needs to be faster
9.) Everything about psychic needs a nerf

[long wadi]

miles less value than emperor

[long wadi]

i think theyre referring to replacing the layup with perfect dunk because its kind of just a pointless move

[hushed kindle]

Teleport pass is pretty mid when you consider ultimate pass is quite literally THE ultimate pass

[long wadi]

im saying

[hushed kindle]

30% zone bar 🤣 🤣

[long wadi]

30% zone bar and an ordinary shot you can movestack

its stupid

[hushed kindle]

An emp uses ultimate pass on you and you can pop zone

It's actual cheese

[lone tinsel]

so what’s the point to nerf him again

[long wadi]

to make him less obnoxious

infinite range on anything isnt okay

[hushed kindle]

infinite range on defense

It's quite literally dunk or get blocked

[long wadi]

you dont even need to play defense w perf

you can walk up to a dude after they shoot

and press v

[hushed kindle]

you just need to camp the paint 🤣 🤣

[long wadi]

zero fault tolerance

[lone tinsel]

yea that’s the point of the move teleport defence

[long wadi]

it can be teleport defense

[hushed kindle]

infinite range though 🤣 🤣

[long wadi]

without being infinite range

and goaltending

[novel shadow]

What do you think abt goaltending

[hushed kindle]

It being a teleport move is fine

it's the blatant goaltending

[long wadi]

nobody cares if it teleports

people are just tired of getting shots denied 5 entire years after they shoot

it rewards sloppy defense

[hushed kindle]

every 60 seconds you're guaranteed to get blocked

UNLESS you dunk

which can get easily blocked also

[long wadi]

global cooldown doesnt even matter

[hushed kindle]

So you literally can't score

[long wadi]

literally makes no difference

you either cant score or it just drags plays

[hushed kindle]

Global cooldown makes no difference since perfection itself is rare

[novel shadow]

Also did anyone know psychic's dunk is block able? I've just learned that yesterday

[hushed kindle]

1 perfection on each team is at most what you'll see

[long wadi]

what the

[hushed kindle]

didn't know that

[novel shadow]

Though you would be need to be sitting paint

And hopefully not get stunned

[long wadi]

are you referring to psychic blitz

[turbid saffron]

1. the layup is barely used and im replacing it with a better move 2.reach just needs better detection tbh 3.i guess not being able to steal while dribbling is good since off ball cane effect is still good 4.right 5. ref foul def needs a slight buff or rework 😭

[long wadi]

ref foul is fine

[turbid saffron]

even a range buff would be okay

[long wadi]

its hands up on crack

[turbid saffron]

literally what

hands up is so much better

[long wadi]

no it isnt chief

with the amount of ability passes and separation the game has

[turbid saffron]

hands up stops anything 😭 foul only works on shots and its not instant detection similar to emp reach

[long wadi]

hands up is not seeing any play

not to mention the dookie range

[turbid saffron]

hands up guarentees to cause a loose ball when used right

[long wadi]

no one is struggling against that

no matter how right you use it

its still mid

[turbid saffron]

same with foul

[long wadi]

fouls range looks like a mansion compared to hands up chief

[turbid saffron]

foul is weaker it needs a range buff and its still inferior to emp reach and hands up

[hushed kindle]

The layup doesn't need to be removed

[fossil light]

no nerf to luka or joker?💔

[hushed kindle]

It's always going in if you're not dealing with a paint camper

[turbid saffron]

explain pls

[hushed kindle]

Plus you can delay it

PLUS perfection already has a dunk

[turbid saffron]

same w dunk

but dunks BETTER

[hushed kindle]

it's literally blink on ball

[hushed kindle]

It's a nothing burger change

You might as well not change it

[long wadi]

actually yeah i agree

both do the same thing

kinda pointless

[turbid saffron]

the dunk is faster though

and less likely to be blocked

[hushed kindle]

You can't tell if it'd be faster

You're assuming it would be

[turbid saffron]

it literally is

its a dunk from the 3

[long wadi]

it doesnt really matter regardless

[turbid saffron]

and its faster thsn bbg

[long wadi]

people expect the step back more

[hushed kindle]

People already RARELY block the layup as is

[long wadi]

so theyre less likely to guard the layup

[hushed kindle]

so what's the point in making it a dunk

[long wadi]

this

[hushed kindle]

Do you see the problem with this change

[long wadi]

no point in changing to a very slight update

[turbid saffron]

tbh im fine with just deleting one of these it doesnt matter ig

[long wadi]

the current move works fine as is

[turbid saffron]

should NOT have both

[hushed kindle]

Plus perfection has a dunk

But you never see it because why would you dunk

over using blink

[turbid saffron]

its situational

[hushed kindle]

It's not 🤣

[long wadi]

not reallt

[turbid saffron]

literally is

[long wadi]

maybe in 2v2

[turbid saffron]

sometimes u cant score with ur shot

[long wadi]

nobody is using blink over a dunk

[hushed kindle]

You really should just never use it

[long wadi]

pass the ball

[hushed kindle]

so you pass

[long wadi]

swing the rock chief

[turbid saffron]

but what if u need points

[hushed kindle]

pass the ball

[turbid saffron]

in endgame

[long wadi]

swing the rock to someone that can score better

[hushed kindle]

like literally it's a team game

You can't be scoring everything

[turbid saffron]

well duh im just saying theres situations where the dunk would work out

not much but still

[hushed kindle]

Yeah you dunk for 2 points

[turbid saffron]

it gives options

[long wadi]

might as well just use the layup

[hushed kindle]

and the opposite team scores a 3

you're now down 1

[turbid saffron]

they dont always score 3 big dawg

ur acting like every score is a 3

[hushed kindle]

Considering it's BBZ

[long wadi]

majority is

if you wanna win

[novel shadow]

Yes I think that's the name, you know the move that tramples everyone

[turbid saffron]

ttheres so many dunk moves

[hushed kindle]

They're scoring a 3

[long wadi]

you will score a 3

unless its 2v2

[hushed kindle]

in a close game, people spamming 3s

[turbid saffron]

you might score a 3

✌️

[long wadi]

but that gamemode doesnt matter

[hushed kindle]

in general, people spamming 3s

[turbid saffron]

3s are easy to block

[hushed kindle]

The only time you using dunk moves is if you're up

[turbid saffron]

aside from moves/ flowe

[long wadi]

which

everyone has

[hushed kindle]

so are dunks

and they're not efficient

Plus, your dunk won't matter

[turbid saffron]

3s are def easier

[hushed kindle]

they'd rather let you dunk so they'd score a 3

[turbid saffron]

using a dunk to widen ur lead or win in clutch time is preferred

3s are always more dangerous

[sweet flare]

Did the OP forget abt the weak limited styles?
Like uncle Sam and rubberman?

[turbid saffron]

because ur not always gonna have perfect aim it could bug and miss but if u time a dunk right its guarenteed

[hushed kindle]

So what do you personally do in game more?
Dunk or score 3s?

[long wadi]

rubber man is not weak

[turbid saffron]

rubbermans not weak

[long wadi]

what are we saying

[hushed kindle]

rubberman?
We trolling?

[sweet flare]

He's block is useless

[long wadi]

okay bro.

[hushed kindle]

alright this gotta be ragebait

[turbid saffron]

3s but i know when 2s are fine to use

[sweet flare]

The block is useless

[novel shadow]

Press space and stay behind the three point line

[long wadi]

this is ragebait

[novel shadow]

Problem solved

[long wadi]

wrap it up

[ember cargo]

It’s not

At all

[turbid saffron]

theres a jump tefh that keeps the ball and u can also pass out of it on mobile i think

[hushed kindle]

don't engage in ragebait

[long wadi]

ignore the ragebait

keep the cortisol low

[turbid saffron]

😭

[sweet flare]

Still he can turn around easy and steal it + any ability can steal it

[hushed kindle]

Don't engage with them

[sweet flare]

It was working but they fix it

[novel shadow]

Any is a reach brochacho

[sweet flare]

Ummm
What?

[novel shadow]

[long wadi]

by your logic symbiote snatch is bad

because abilities work on it

[turbid saffron]

yeea symbiote snatch is amazing

[hushed kindle]

the only good move on venom besides maybe tendril leap 🤣 🤣

[sweet flare]

Will atleast symbiote u cannot steal the ball from him
U should use ability to steal it

[novel shadow]

Second most hated defensive move in the game, for me at least

[long wadi]

you also cant steal the ball from gum block if you just... jump during the move

[turbid saffron]

i had someone in here saying venoms kit was good besides snatch

[long wadi]

they havent patched it

[hushed kindle]

what's the first

[novel shadow]

Blink

[long wadi]

its considered "tech"

[turbid saffron]

blink

[hushed kindle]

don't engage with that ragebait

[sweet flare]

Wait fr??

[hushed kindle]

it's the complete opposite

[long wadi]

son...

[sweet flare]

Is that a glitch?

[turbid saffron]

i shouldn't have i genuinely was mad 💔

[hushed kindle]

the only thing symbiote has that's worth IS tendril snatch

[turbid saffron]

right

[sweet flare]

Will I didnt know abt that

[long wadi]

tendril dribble is a janky mess

[hushed kindle]

the awakening is a genuine nerf because you lose tendril snatch

[sweet flare]

But waht abt miku glitch?
Itsss soooo annoying

[hushed kindle]

it's actually preferable if the symbiote gets awakening so they lose tendril snatch

[long wadi]

the awakening is like palpatine to the users

they cant help but nerf themselves for the aura

[hushed kindle]

I do it too lowkey

[turbid saffron]

the awk isnt terrible

[hushed kindle]

I gotta awaken but I know i'm gonna be useless for like a minute

[turbid saffron]

but u lose ur op move so

[long wadi]

the issue is that its a downgrade

[novel shadow]

Just not optimal

[hushed kindle]

a free 3 points, MAYBE 6?

[turbid saffron]

true yeah

[hushed kindle]

yeah that's some mid right there

[long wadi]

even giant has more points

[turbid saffron]

theres way better awks

[turbid saffron]

and he keeps his best move

wayyy better

[hushed kindle]

exactly

imagine using tendril leap and the tendril swing

[turbid saffron]

honestly ill add unc sam to this suggestion probably

[hushed kindle]

yeah you just cross half court just to get ankle broken

[turbid saffron]

that styles so bad

[hushed kindle]

uncle sam needs to get removed from the game

[turbid saffron]

preferably

[hushed kindle]

like delete it from the game

no one has it

Terrible on release
They buffed it, still terrible

[turbid saffron]

maybe itll come in blackmarket who knows

[novel shadow]

Better not

[hushed kindle]

They put uncle sam in the black market, no one buying that mid

[novel shadow]

Waste of a rotation

[turbid saffron]

just a bad designee style

[long wadi]

they boutta drop it in the bm and slap a 3mil tag on it

[turbid saffron]

true true

[long wadi]

they were really out here slapping 3 mil on spider bro

😭

[hushed kindle]

100k for uncle sam 🤣 🤣

[turbid saffron]

just insanity

[novel shadow]

Hope vamp is not next in the bm maybe bbg

[hushed kindle]

at least spider got awakening + shot sense is lowkey some BS if you got no reaction time

you genuinely can't call out shot sense because you don't know when they used it

[turbid saffron]

what r ur thoughhts on vamp

[long wadi]

mediocre central

[novel shadow]

I mean it's okay

[hushed kindle]

Vamp suffers from cyber syndrome

terrible base kit, broken awakening

[novel shadow]

Same problem with cyber imo

Don't get relevant until awakening

[hushed kindle]

If you're not using vampiric with vamp, you might just be trolling

[turbid saffron]

i abuse the freeze tech thats about all i can do w vamp base 💔

[long wadi]

the fact that the road roller move has no iframes is funny to me

[turbid saffron]

whats that buff the cooldowns

[hushed kindle]

25% bro

[turbid saffron]

damn

[hushed kindle]

BIGGEST cooldown reduction buff in the game

[turbid saffron]

holy

well i dont have that

sadly

[hushed kindle]

i use vamp, i'm always on vampiric

[novel shadow]

I think the CD reduction works on freeze too maybe hella wrong tho

[hushed kindle]

i don't care if the rest of the zone is garbage

[hushed kindle]

it's all abilities on vamp

[turbid saffron]

cyber is a good bit better though

[hushed kindle]

including awakening

[novel shadow]

That's fire kid

[long wadi]

cyber has salvageable base

mine is good for shot blocking

[novel shadow]

Yea you can get the inbound steal and hyper thought three

[hushed kindle]

cyber's base kit at least has mine

[long wadi]

try me some dookie doe

[hushed kindle]

that's probably the only thing worth

[long wadi]

implant would be good if it gave ability + buff and not one at a time

[hushed kindle]

i lied, the movement speed buffs are nice

[turbid saffron]

projectile sucks but dash can work on loose balls and the speed buffs are good plus mine

[long wadi]

because its so slow

it progresses too slow

[hushed kindle]

the shot speed increase pretty useless

[long wadi]

only really useful if youre running a shooting speed zone as well

[turbid saffron]

if u combine it with a flow the ball basically tps to the hoop 😭

[novel shadow]

The argument made for cyber's base is you can get instant shots but that's rng and you'd probably get blocked anyway

[turbid saffron]

yeah

[hushed kindle]

better have good aim

[turbid saffron]

and max sens

[hushed kindle]

shot speed be messing me up. I get mad every time someone randomly uses president's zone

[long wadi]

though this is funny to look at

[turbid saffron]

i was so happy to see ppl stop using that slop

[hushed kindle]

we have forced shot at home

[long wadi]

shot speed so fast game thinks its a pumpfakr

[novel shadow]

Before it got removed People were using president zone in pure basketball you can imagine how that went

[hushed kindle]

president zone being actually good in a mode it wasn't meant to be in

[turbid saffron]

shot speed buffs if it has both of them can def make a difference if ur good

[turbid saffron]

yeah nah

[hushed kindle]

the only time i'll accept president zone is if they're also using emperor

I need that quick 50% zone

[turbid saffron]

glad i aint play that bs

[long wadi]

pure basketball wouldve been good if each position had unique mechanics

but its just

barebones

dudes going at it no shoes no socks just bare toes out

[turbid saffron]

yeah i saw a suggestion of that

[hushed kindle]

What's crazy is they could literally add positions in the game

when you join a game, you literally choose your position somewhat

[turbid saffron]

key word could we never getting this with blackstar 💔

[hushed kindle]

we not gonna act like chrollo was doing this either

Also i'm sorry bro, blackstar is actually worse than chrollo

[turbid saffron]

chrollo loves to ditch his most popular games 🫩🫩

[hushed kindle]

Like I never realized how good we had it until we lost it

[long wadi]

they picked up where chrollo left off

i doubt itd be any different if it was still current

aside from maybe more consistent updates

and transparency

[hushed kindle]

the animations would be less bad

[long wadi]

thats about it though

[turbid saffron]

this aint a hot take at all 😭 do u see the delayed updates and how bad some styles look

theres been weeks of just nothing in announcements its crazy

[hushed kindle]

Terrible animations
terrible transparancy

[turbid saffron]

limited problem will never go away

atp

[hushed kindle]

Guys, what if we gave joker the same dribble as ref but with different colors 🤪

[long wadi]

limiteds shouldntve been added

[long wadi]

funny enough ref is the EXACT same dribble as gold

[hushed kindle]

Guys, what if we gave perfection the same dunk as bbg 🤪 🤪

[long wadi]

1 to 1

[turbid saffron]

only for like luka

since its a real collab

[hushed kindle]

not even luka

[turbid saffron]

maybe

i treat it different since its not a random style its a real player and thats cool

[long wadi]

i wouldntve been mad about the fictional styles if they were grounded to basketball

and just gave them playstyles matching their vibe

[hushed kindle]

Nah I disagree personally

[long wadi]

like perfection

[hushed kindle]

They could've made it a base style

[long wadi]

they had shaq

they had dennis rodman

[hushed kindle]

They have styles based on actual players

[long wadi]

this aint nothing new for a base style

[turbid saffron]

but those r inspirations and this is official

[hushed kindle]

Still can be base game

[turbid saffron]

might as well name them shaq and dennis rodman

atp

[long wadi]

they could

[turbid saffron]

if they named luka magician and made him miracle that would be fine yes

im okay w that

[hushed kindle]

Limiteds in my opinion should've just been different reskins of base game styles

[turbid saffron]

yeah but they worked with luka for this style to be added

[hushed kindle]

that would be a higher ranked style

[turbid saffron]

like u cant use anyones name just cuz bc yk how ppl r

[hushed kindle]

or better yet, make it it's own rarity

[turbid saffron]

limited would count though

its technically its own rarity

[hushed kindle]

I guess

If you want luka to be the only limited, fine

I can see the argument

Everything else gotta go

[turbid saffron]

im fine w that yea

king and air maybe could be base styles instead

[hushed kindle]

they 100% could be base styles

[turbid saffron]

since they arent the actual players and inspirations

[long wadi]

rework king and air because i dont like how badly they did them

no other reason

[hushed kindle]

air is so egregious man

[turbid saffron]

yeah air is annoying and king is just bad

[long wadi]

air isnt even jordan

[hushed kindle]

how you make a style based on michael jordan and he's not an offensive threat?

[long wadi]

king is just a caricature

[long wadi]

not just that

it literally does not resemble him

[hushed kindle]

why does air have defense???

[long wadi]

in anyway whatsoever

because jordan

jumps i guess

[hushed kindle]

Like jordan did have defense, but he wasn't known for defense

he's known for the dunks

the fades

[long wadi]

if anything his defense was more on steals

[turbid saffron]

and the fadeaway isnt even a fadeaway right

[long wadi]

i think

[turbid saffron]

no dunk

[hushed kindle]

IT'S NOT

EVEN A FADEAWAY

[long wadi]

its a pumpfake into a pull up

its so weird

[hushed kindle]

It's an actual pull up

Idk who designed air

They gotta get fired expeditiously

[turbid saffron]

ur favorite developers blackstar

[long wadi]

you could rename air and say its damian lillard and id believe that more

[hushed kindle]

Everyone on blackstar needs to be dropped

[turbid saffron]

whole team gotta go

[long wadi]

at least they have one of the suggestion guys as a designer now

[hushed kindle]

no shot they let the dev team of a dead game dev this game 🥀

[long wadi]

but like

goodness

[turbid saffron]

even IF it wasnt much better with chrollo at least we got communication and barely any delays

[hushed kindle]

King is lowkey not even lebron either

It's lowkey disrespectful

[long wadi]

yeah

king and air are just caricatures man

[hushed kindle]

Not to be a lebron glazer bro, but literally EVERYONE flops bro. it's not just a lebron problem

[long wadi]

if anything

[turbid saffron]

if they used their names for it they wouldve gotten sued simply cuz of how bad and inaccurate they r

[hushed kindle]

Plus, lebron is 41 YEARS OLD BRUH

[long wadi]

flop should be a referee move

im just saying

[turbid saffron]

if it was cool i doubt lebron would gaf

and accurate

[turbid saffron]

yeah it spawns a ref so iget thwy

[hushed kindle]

They gave bron a degrading defense move
ugly self alley
reskinned ultimate pass that's worse

[long wadi]

ref awakening should be malice at the palace

[turbid saffron]

is the defense move 50 percent??

[hushed kindle]

2 awakening moves you'll rarely see because the opposite team will just stall

[hushed kindle]

the chance to miss goes up each shot you make

[long wadi]

the chasedown block was RIGHT THERE bro 😭

[turbid saffron]

same thing with flash and luka ✌️

[hushed kindle]

and it resets when they miss

starts off with 100%
goes down to I think 80%?

[turbid saffron]

thats weird

[hushed kindle]

And it keeps going down

[long wadi]

another gripe i have with the game

[hushed kindle]

It's such a weird move bro

[long wadi]

interactivity is just dead

[turbid saffron]

i was told one time it u stand still its 100 percent 😭

[hushed kindle]

Don't ever use that move

[long wadi]

back then youd have to go to the paint to get ace cutscenes off

now the cutscene just does it for you

its just boring

[turbid saffron]

oh yeah ace

[hushed kindle]

yeah but at least back then, people weren't scared of running in the paint to see the cutscenes

[turbid saffron]

thst styles just fine

i think

[hushed kindle]

ace is terrible

[long wadi]

ace needs a rework

[hushed kindle]

calling ace fine is like calling quick a good style

[long wadi]

its so terrible mam

the rework was also awfully designed

they just overtuned one thing and added one good move

[turbid saffron]

i feel like the shot has some skill to it tho

[long wadi]

everything else was awfully done

[turbid saffron]

instinnct dash is good

[long wadi]

if turning your camera is skill then this game is done for

[hushed kindle]

because unless you use camera tech, you're never using it

[turbid saffron]

the dribble is alright

[hushed kindle]

and camera tech isn't even that much skill

you just flail

[turbid saffron]

thats the game we have rn pretty much

[turbid saffron]

fair enough

[hushed kindle]

If you don't use camera tech, ace is a genuine High D tier style
If you use camera tech, ace is a low C tier

[turbid saffron]

i wish theyd rebuff it or preferably full on rework

the awk is amazing no?

[long wadi]

ace, a supposed offensive style's best move, is instinct dash, A DEFENSIVE MOVE

[hushed kindle]

Terrible moveset besides instinct dash and missile, and missible

[long wadi]

mid

[hushed kindle]

nope it's terrible

[turbid saffron]

brutal

[hushed kindle]

100% dribble is terrible

[long wadi]

100% dribble is so bad man

[turbid saffron]

it has 2 3 point moves and a 2

8 point awk is good?

[hushed kindle]

ace is one of the only styles whose dunk isn't a 3 compared to recent styles

[long wadi]

just one 3 pointer

[hushed kindle]

missile can get blocked with abilities

[turbid saffron]

i rarely see it

[hushed kindle]

if you don't go into the paint with 100% dribble you're getting blocked

[long wadi]

yeah becayse its janky

[turbid saffron]

and using the cutscene from corner gives 3

i do that every time

[hushed kindle]

You literally have to eat the 2 or eat the block

[turbid saffron]

so 8 points not half bad if ur seam passes

[hushed kindle]

yeah, you use all 3 moves, and then what

[long wadi]

out of the THREE reworks star is the only style to get a great and proper one

[hushed kindle]

and quite literally, those points aren't guaranteed

Lets think of all the more commonly used styles

[turbid saffron]

by the time u use all 3 youve scored 8 points and get ur base moves back

[turbid saffron]

most of the time they are

missioe is rarely blocked

[hushed kindle]

Psychic is shutting down ace by simply confusing you
Giant is snatch blocking missile

Pretty sure silver can block it

[turbid saffron]

if ur trying to go to 3pt with 100 dribble thats a mistake on ur end

[long wadi]

not uncommon styles either

[turbid saffron]

giants not meta

[hushed kindle]

Perfection blocking it

[long wadi]

son

[turbid saffron]

confuse is offball

[hushed kindle]

Snatch block 🤣

[long wadi]

giant is meta though

😭

[turbid saffron]

eh

yeah bad take

silver i mean

[hushed kindle]

psychic literally has to run up to you while you don't got the ball, ggs

[hushed kindle]

silver isn't meta, giant is

[turbid saffron]

with ace awk ur scoring no matter what if u get the ball

before the psychic gets to u

[long wadi]

with the exception of like

[turbid saffron]

yeah i agree that was a bad take from me

[long wadi]

8 million defensive abilities

[turbid saffron]

hell i play giant and silver

[hushed kindle]

Sure, let's say psychic can't clamp ace awakening

symbiote locking it down

[turbid saffron]

yeah but i just dont see it blocked ever

[hushed kindle]

rubberman locking it down

spider lowkey locking it down

the aforementioned giant

[long wadi]

im positive gum slap bypasses 100% drive

unless im mistaken

[turbid saffron]

no i don't think so

[hushed kindle]

i haven't seen this

unc is locking it down

[turbid saffron]

the ball disappears from ut possession in 100 drive

basically

[hushed kindle]

Ref locking it down

[turbid saffron]

id have to test this

[long wadi]

all of this is a big if

IF the ace gets awakening

[turbid saffron]

ref cany stop missile unless activated before

[long wadi]

which isnt guaranteed

it dont matter its pretty obvious when a missile happens lol

sky leap as well stops it

[hushed kindle]

it's pretty obvious when an ace is going to missile

[turbid saffron]

yeah but they can just not use it and pass if they see ur prediction

dont always gotta use ur moves if theres risk of being blocked

[hushed kindle]

right, so they locked down your awakening by just standing near you

ggs

[long wadi]

the point is for ace to have the ball during the awakening and if they get you to bail out

thats the point

lol

[turbid saffron]

i feel like the startup is too slow for that to be consistent

[hushed kindle]

an offensive style passing the ball in awakening is an instant gg

[long wadi]

gamesense carries i fear

[turbid saffron]

u have to know when the fast shot is coming then use ur slow startup move

[hushed kindle]

a well predicted sky leap is clamping

[turbid saffron]

they could just go for 2 with it still a 7 pt awk

i feel a good ace will not use missile blindly

[long wadi]

even then

[turbid saffron]

so good star wont consistently block good ace

but good giant will

[hushed kindle]

and good players will save their shot blocking moves for ace

[long wadi]

only for missile

you can block athletic fade on reaction w sky leap

[turbid saffron]

well ya

fade sucks

thats a free block unless u get lucky with the flail

camera tech

[long wadi]

i dont think the flail is saving the ace either im ngl

[turbid saffron]

true but not all of them r gonna stop it especially if the ace knows when to and not use it

like giant and silver locking 5hat up

fa

fs

[hushed kindle]

it don't matter if you know when to use it

[turbid saffron]

in rare occasions or against bad players

yea

[hushed kindle]

Giant, silver, symbiote, spider, perfection, and rubberman don't care about your timing

[long wadi]

i think youre forgetting how large sky leaps hitbox is

[turbid saffron]

it does ref emp and star likely cant react if ur not a predictable mess

[long wadi]

the camera tech isnt gonna help

[hushed kindle]

they press the move and you're getting stuffed

[hushed kindle]

ace in itself is predictable

[long wadi]

the rework did nothing to change that lol

[turbid saffron]

i addressed giant and silver, aside from spider i agree

spider gets stopen everytime sadly

[hushed kindle]

It doesn't matter what you do with ace, it's always super telegraphed

[turbid saffron]

stolen*

[long wadi]

jump tech

[hushed kindle]

not with jump tech

[turbid saffron]

oh i didnt know there was one with spider too

mb

good to know ig

so nvm then

[turbid saffron]

sadly

the best bet is rebuffing it so the shot creates considerablly more distance

or rework

[hushed kindle]

Nah we need a full on rework

[long wadi]

or just change the thing

[hushed kindle]

get rid of everything except for instinct dash and missile

[turbid saffron]

the shot is interesting but its slow and predictable

[hushed kindle]

nah just give me formless shot

and let me score from any angle

[turbid saffron]

it has formless tho in awk

kinda

[hushed kindle]

i'd rather have formless in base

[long wadi]

give it something similar to luka

for drives

multiple option ability

[turbid saffron]

id be fine with formless after a reworked ace dribble

like luka

but instead of floater its formless

[long wadi]

now that theyre making zones unique they could probably just turn the zone into a unique shooting package

[hushed kindle]

they about to copy and paste luka abilities with blue vfx and call it a rework 🤣

[long wadi]

and just call it formless

[long wadi]

im crine

[ember cargo]

Damn the base shot ain’t good no more?

[long wadi]

it never has been

[hushed kindle]

it was never good brotato

[ember cargo]

Yall trippin

Well

[hushed kindle]

I think you the one off the juice brodie

[ember cargo]

Yeah used regularly it sucks

[turbid saffron]

good in 500 point lobbies

[long wadi]

not even the tech helps it

we got 50 million defensive abilities that deny it without needing effort

[hushed kindle]

tech don't matter with the amount of defensive abilities in the game

[ember cargo]

True

[turbid saffron]

if it had more distance on the second jump it would be useable

[hushed kindle]

and let's say no one uses a defensive ability

[turbid saffron]

but i think they buffed the shot and unbuffed it

not sure

[hushed kindle]

Opposite team doubling you stuffs the shot

either direction you go with camera tech, it's getting clamped

[long wadi]

we also got block range zones too

[hushed kindle]

block and speed zones

yeah you're not getting that shot off

Devs need to actually watch knb

[turbid saffron]

i mean ace wasnt the farthest thing ever from whatever his name was

i can't rmb

[long wadi]

allen iverson

[turbid saffron]

ace used to be usable way back

[long wadi]

yeah because nobody knew what to do against it lol

[hushed kindle]

when everyone was new to the game

[turbid saffron]

and also less stacked flows and defensive moves

[hushed kindle]

and there was less defensive moves

[turbid saffron]

its just outdated needs a rework into formless

[hushed kindle]

that was when giant was terrorizing the game

[turbid saffron]

✌️✌️

oh yeah fade isnt even guarentees if u dont get shut down it can just go through the hoop and not score

[hushed kindle]

and even then, ace wasn't even really that good still

[turbid saffron]

its happened multiple times

[hushed kindle]

like why would you use ace over flash