#duel_links

1 messages · Page 11 of 1

rocky bluff
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wait only 2 oñdpendulum?

fallen kestrel
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Triple xiangsheng ConcernedFroge

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Lemme send my list areo that I use at the moment

sleek garnet
fallen kestrel
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God I want nobledragon

rocky bluff
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what do i replace skullcrobat with

sleek garnet
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Whatever you have access to

fallen kestrel
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What did u use ur dream tickets on?

sleek garnet
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Aero installed the game literally just now

fallen kestrel
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Oh lol

sleek garnet
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But yea the list with xiangshen was meant to be a "i opened the game for a total of 5 mins, what is the best i can do with that?"

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Skullcrobat was an oversight on my part, i'll admit

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Btw, @rocky bluff, unlock yuya asap, the deck is almost non functional without the skill raging pendulum

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Level up your dm world stage until you can see him in the unlock missions

rocky bluff
sleek garnet
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Shouldnt take longer than like

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30 mins i feel

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Btw, you get more ed slots by going 10 synchro, link, and xyz summons

rocky bluff
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kinda fucked rn cause issue

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lmao

sleek garnet
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Lol

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Try re opening the game

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See if it works

rocky bluff
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i did

sleek garnet
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did it work?

rocky bluff
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nope

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wait what dm level do i need for arc v

sleek garnet
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Should be 10, idr

sleek garnet
# rocky bluff nope

Honestly you might need to reach out to konami then, were you able to at least get the free one they're giving out?

rocky bluff
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yeah

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and i got tjem

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but it's just bugging

sleek garnet
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Wydm bugging?

rocky bluff
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it's just saying i have unfinished purchase

sleek garnet
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Weird

rocky bluff
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yeah

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so basically i can't use shop at all

sleek garnet
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Yea uhh

rocky bluff
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wait what if i refund everything

sleek garnet
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Try that

rocky bluff
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where is refund option

sleek garnet
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Good question honestly

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Cant you do that in the app store?

rocky bluff
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where

quick axle
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You need to get farther so you get the tutorial to use the shop, in which they'll force you to use 50 gems to spend in the very first pack of the game.

rocky bluff
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?

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i did

sleek garnet
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I mean

rocky bluff
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i'm past that

sleek garnet
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I assume they already did that

quick axle
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Ah, okay.

sleek garnet
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Yea

quick axle
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That's weird.

rocky bluff
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where tho

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can i refund

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like is it in game

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i swear it's in game somewhere

sleek garnet
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Pretty sure it isnt in game

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You have to submit a form to google irrc

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Go to play.google.com.
At the top right, click your Profile picture.
Click Payments & subscriptions. ...
For the order you want to return, click Report a problem.
Select the option that describes your situation.
Complete the form and note that you'd like a refund.
Click Submit.

rocky bluff
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i could just reset data

sleek garnet
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Just check your account beforehand to see if you actually spent the money

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Just to double check

rocky bluff
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i'm just gonna redownload data

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and see if that fixes it

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ugh

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i hate waiting for everything to download

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fuck

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i'm tempted to just reinstall with new account

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and just start over

sleek garnet
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Do you have a pc?

rocky bluff
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nope

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choccy

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what do i replace skulls with

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i'm reinstalling rn

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and it's still a fucking issue

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lmao

sleek garnet
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And yea uhh

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At this point you may just want to contact konami

rocky bluff
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i already did

rocky bluff
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eh

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just gonna play on my laptop

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and than i will jujst datya transfger

sleek garnet
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You said you didnt have a pc

rocky bluff
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i dont

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i have a laptop tho

rocky bluff
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just so i can have a completed deck

sleek garnet
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Yes?

rocky bluff
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what od i replace with

sleek garnet
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You just replace the meister with cosmic cyclones

rocky bluff
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how do i get star and timegazer magician

sleek garnet
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Check lifetime missions

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They're either there or they're in tictkets

rocky bluff
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this is what i have rn

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il deal with it later

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i have singing elssons

sleek garnet
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Dont forget raging dragon

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It's a vanilla without the slill but better than nothing

rocky bluff
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yeah i know

sleek garnet
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Also

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Get queen djinn with a normal ticket

fallen kestrel
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She is a ur isnt she?

sleek garnet
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Yes

fallen kestrel
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Oh u mean like not a dream ticket

sleek garnet
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Yea

fallen kestrel
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Well I am dlv 23 with no synchro raging pend

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May the konami designer who made dweller rest easy

sleek garnet
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Gonna be honest i havent lost a single game i've been dweller'd lmao

fallen kestrel
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I dont know, most people I go up against just either scoop or cant play around it when I dweller in draw phase

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Plus the volo to pop any play they did have

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And any backrow I had KEKW

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The metal cockroach and the funny cave water dragon have singlehandedly carried me PoyoyoThumbsUp

brisk pawn
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Any utopia decks

empty tree
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Orcust but its bad

rocky bluff
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@sleek garnet

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this fine for now

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untill i unlock

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also really no sky iris?

sleek garnet
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Oh hey you got the 3rd sd

rocky bluff
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sky iris is like fucking crazy

sleek garnet
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Areo

rocky bluff
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oh wait

sleek garnet
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Read your skill

rocky bluff
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this game

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dosent have revolution

rocky bluff
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one

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need

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umm yuya

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first

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lmao

sleek garnet
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What dm stage are you at rn?

rocky bluff
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4

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legiut

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just got bakc from shit

sleek garnet
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I see

rocky bluff
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i was doing tonight

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and now imma get to 10

rocky bluff
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@sleek garnet i should get umm yuya before doing the wcq

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right?

sleek garnet
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Yea

rocky bluff
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So to recapitulate:
Get 3 of the new odd eyes structure deck, and 2 of the old pendulum sd, this will cost $8 and 2000 gems
Summon 100 monsters, activate 100 spell/traps and buy a bundle for 750 gems, this will get you 300 box chips, get 3 cosmic cyclones with those, do note that you only hold 100 chips at once, so get a cyclone as soon as you get the chips
Go into the the Force of Infinity box and pull 1 Nobledragon Magician and 1 Odd-Eyes Meteorburst dragon

(Optional) Buy special bundles until you get Wisdom Eye(s), each bundle is 950 gems each, wisdom eye is essentially a 0-3 of, good card but conflicts with pend call
(Optional) Go into the the Galaxy of Photon box and pull 1 Abyss Dweller and 1 Steelswarm Roach (Good rank 4s)
(Optional) Go into the Future Circuit box and pull 2 Kozmoll Dark Lady (Box has knightmares, even if you dont want to use lady you will probably open this box anyway)
(Optional) Go into the Stars of Synchro box and pull 1 Trishula, Zero Dragon of the Ice Barrier
-(Optional) Go into the Heart of Xyz box and pull 1 Big Eye
(Optional) Go into the Raider's Requiem box and pull 1 Timebreaker Magician
(Optional) Go into the Fantastical Arc box and pull 1 Odd-Eyes Arc Pendulum dragon

When you eventually get your dream tickets, use the UR ones to get Book of Moon (you could also get stuff like forbidden lance or warning point if you want, book has better use in other decks though), and use the SR ones to get Voloferniges, the Darkest Dragon Doomrider, and Ebon Illusion Magician

Odd-Eyes is a very flexible deck, you can ignore most of the optional cards i listed, but they are nice options to have, depends on personal taste, check dlm until you find a list you like (Orcust odd eyes is probably worth avoiding tho, next list is in 2 weeks and mermaid is most likely eating it)

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ok

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so now im at the optional stuffs

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no im not

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i didnt pull nobledragon

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damniut

sleek garnet
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Damn wind channeler

rocky bluff
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YOUR NOT GARUENTEED A SR

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THE FUCK

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where can i use box chips?

sleek garnet
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Card trader

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It shows up in front of the shop once you lvl up your dm stage high enough

rocky bluff
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ugh

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this is so annoying

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i need to tribute summon a monster

sleek garnet
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I mean

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Oaf magician

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Actually your deck has like 9 high level mons

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Shouldnt be hard

rocky bluff
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your right

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it wasnt

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sorry what again for chips

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cyclone?

sleek garnet
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Yea

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Btw, if you want to get the other 750 gem bundle after you already get 3 cyclones, you could get a forbidden chalice

rocky bluff
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goid

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god

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i hate that odd eyes art

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its disgusting

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@sleek garnet THANK GOD THEY ALL UNLOCK AT 9

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LETS GOOO

sleek garnet
rocky bluff
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time to get him to likle level 15 instantly

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with all the things

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@sleek garnet should i worry about leveling all the worlds?

sleek garnet
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No

rocky bluff
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ok

sleek garnet
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Only reason to do so are gem rewards and some characters that are locked behind stage 7/10 for that world

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Also

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Leveling up dm world makes the bots play better decks

rocky bluff
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what can i replace xiangshing with

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the card is so annoyign

sleek garnet
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Cyclone

pastel lotus
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de-syncho ss multiple monster to the field without negating effects

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the reason why it got hit

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kek

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because fl watery and fl pasty (their new gen tuner) could basically generate free draws

rocky bluff
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fortune lady crazy ngl

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too much draw power

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in spellcaster

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and fortune lady adds so much more

pastel lotus
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de-synchro could ss 2 level 9s from the graveyard if it could

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asssuming one of them was a tuner or been given tuner status and had their level altered

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5ds haven't clamped down on effectless graveyard ss yet

rocky bluff
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BRO IM SO SAD

sleek garnet
#

Btw @rocky bluff forgot to mention

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Leveling up the dm world stage makes more road duelists show up

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You're currently at 5, but the max is 10

rocky bluff
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is there anything

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i can umm

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get fro the free ur

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i was thinking duza and dharma

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buit is there anything more importantr?

sleek garnet
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Get whatever you want

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You get those tickets so often it doesnt matter

rocky bluff
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hmmm

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do u have cubic list

sleek garnet
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I do

rocky bluff
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ohhh

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can i c

sleek garnet
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Hold on a sec

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Sure

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@rocky bluff skill is cubic seeds

rocky bluff
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oh shit

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i cant get most of that

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with the stuff i had

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have

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:(

sleek garnet
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Ok so

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Aigami is a character in dsod world

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Most of this is his lvl ups

rocky bluff
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ah

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i c

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what do i fill last 2 slots with

sleek garnet
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Lemme see

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Ok so

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Funnily enough

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[Performapal minotaur]

vivid waveBOT
# sleek garnet [Performapal minotaur]

level Level: 6 | pendscale Pendulum Scale: 4
[ Insect / Pendulum / Effect ]

ATK 100 / DEF 2300

Pendulum Effect

All LIGHT monsters you control gain 300 ATK.

Effect

Once per turn: You can target 1 face-up monster you control; this turn, it can attack all Special Summoned monsters your opponent controls, once each.

sleek garnet
#

No this one

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The bull

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Not that

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It's a pend

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Yea

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Minitaurus

rocky bluff
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that seems so bad

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weird scale

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OH

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the poeircing

sleek garnet
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Btw

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Why reborn?

rocky bluff
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idk

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open call reborn

sleek garnet
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In a pendulum deck

rocky bluff
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discard a pend off of call

sleek garnet
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Sounds cope

rocky bluff
#

e con than?

sleek garnet
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Yea sure

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Btw, dont forget to check world missons

rocky bluff
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should i unlock worlds

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?

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or jujst leavec unlocked

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rut roh

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ddd

sleek garnet
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Yea

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Btw, i'll move to the text chat in vc

pastel lotus
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unlock worlds if you really want one of their starter character or if you want to unlock any current running event character unlocks

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aki is babe

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dl events lives off of referencing the anime and takahashi's original manga

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anyone thinks character selection/deck selection interface could stand a serious drastic overhauls?

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let me star my fav chars

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its all poorly optimized for pc users

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the back arrow in duels does not need to be in the very bottom left corner

weak bough
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god i hate unlock missions that need a comeback victory

rocky bluff
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CHOCCYU

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THIS POS IS IN THE GAME

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kgnsdkgn

sleek garnet
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Yea?

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What about it?

rocky bluff
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i hate that deck

sleek garnet
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Dw if you cosmic cyclone their equips the deck folds

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Or if you bom their normal and they dont have lance

pastel lotus
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then play soundproof, discord, or [poisonous winds]

vivid waveBOT
rocky bluff
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god

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the targetd hate

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lmao

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i see like machine down

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poisonous winds

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its so funny

pastel lotus
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i like tuner's scheme for free synchro steals

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there's plenty of options to counter a heavy synchro based meta

rocky bluff
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i like that one

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thats qucik effect

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steal dragon or machine

tropic herald
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I don't get how duel links makes money despite so many of the good decks being post-5DS characters/monsters

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most people agree the yugioh anime stopped being good after 5DS

sleek garnet
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Most people havent watched a single episode of sevens

tropic herald
#

see, there you go

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duel links is a game that targets people who like the anime

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yet due to the nature of powercreep, most of the good stuff is after the anime stopped being considered good

quick axle
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And there we go again. Complaining about pointless stuff.

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I'm going to be direct with you. If the game really gets you that riled up, you're better off not playing the game.

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It's bad for your psyche getting like that, just saying.

tropic herald
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I hate how the yugioh card game is cruel to boomers

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that's my beef

quick axle
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shrug

sleek garnet
tropic herald
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I'd be interested in trying it

quick axle
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GOAT format would be outside the scope of DL, however.

tropic herald
#

I know

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at the end of the day, I win against these metaslaves because I'll put out something unique that has the capability of staying within someone's memory. they on the other hand are just a bunch of boring bots who are indistinguishable from one another

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for example I can't even tell you about a particular orcust player that made me mad because they are all the same, but I do remember a dude running krawlers as weevil

sleek garnet
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Like

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Literally

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Every day

mighty bramble
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I just play whatever I want as long as I think it can be fun

tropic herald
tropic herald
mighty bramble
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Well I barely touch pvp

tropic herald
#

then what do you do, battle npcs?

sleek garnet
tropic herald
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I'm using a relinquished deck that KOGed back in December of 2022

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There's a couple differences but it's mostly the same

sleek garnet
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Well, can YOU kog with it though?

tropic herald
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No?

tropic herald
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idk how they were able to do it but I found where I plateaued and it wasnt KOG

tropic herald
mighty bramble
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I’m using Trains rn but I have PK on the side

tropic herald
#

it's not my deckbuilding, or me

sleek garnet
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Have you tried to cover that weakness in any way?

tropic herald
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I've taken advice from people on here but it never seems to work

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like adding magic jammer to my deck to negate book

sleek garnet
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Gonna be honest

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Gospel doesnt really give out good advice

tropic herald
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I honestly have no idea how the person who KOGed with this relinquished deck did it

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they must've been extremely lucky, or maybe things were slightly different in dec 2022

sleek garnet
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Have you tried forbidden lance?

tropic herald
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I'd need to roll for it, I can't ticket it

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but yes, I was told about using lance and I'd definitely do it

sleek garnet
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Yea

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Unlike jammer, it doesnt need to be set first

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Nor does it need to discard a card

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Do you have backrow removal in your deck btw?

tropic herald
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I have two space typhoons

sleek garnet
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Doesnt sounds like you draw them often

tropic herald
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I do draw them but a lot of times they don't hit the right card

sleek garnet
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Decks that are weak to staples usually run 6-8 answers to them

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That way you can draw multiple

tropic herald
#

people will set multiple backrow cards and it's hard to know which one to hit

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I wish harpie's feather duster was in this

sleek garnet
#

Hey trunade is banned

tropic herald
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and hey trunade being banned is just fucked because that was a good answer for s/t

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it feels like people in duel links can just run rampant with spells and traps with little consequence now

sleek garnet
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They always could

tropic herald
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but hey trunade

sleek garnet
#

The first meta deck of this game ran 12 traps

sleek garnet
# tropic herald but hey trunade

Hey trunade was being used in the same format as shiranui that ran 15 traps, if it was so effective then why was shiranui still the best deck?

tropic herald
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all the more fucking reason for them to add stuff like feather duster

sleek garnet
sleek garnet
tropic herald
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duel links just wants people to spam traps

sleek garnet
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Becausw you couldnt always draw the limited 2 card all the time

tropic herald
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because there are no good removals

sleek garnet
#

What are people supposed to play? 20 normal monsters?

sleek garnet
tropic herald
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mst is mid

sleek garnet
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Some archetypes even have built in removal

tropic herald
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because people will set 2-3 fucking cards

sleek garnet
#

Ok so

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There's this super secret deck

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Only pros know about it

tropic herald
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gear golem

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right?

sleek garnet
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It's called "playing defensive and not walking face in into a mirror force"

tropic herald
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I don't even run into mirror force anymore

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in lower ranks I did but the higher you go, the less you see it

sleek garnet
#

Mirror force was just an example

tropic herald
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and I already know how to counter mirror force

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I'd make sure to set some monsters in def position

sleek garnet
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The point is that if you are losing to backrow constantly, you're probably being too aggresive

tropic herald
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there's nothing else I can do!

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what, should I just wait there and be scared of set cards? I already kind of shit my pants when someone sets a single backrow and I don't have mst in hand

sleek garnet
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Simply try playing around them

tropic herald
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how exactly

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how are you gonna play around evac without lance

sleek garnet
#

Try putting yourself in a position where you dont care if x monster gets flipped by book

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As an example

tropic herald
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unless I have an anime plot armor level hand, I can't come back after book

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I have to hit surrender

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I've been booked so many times and seen the results that I know to hit surrender the moment it happens

tropic herald
#

Did you miss the part where I said I'm using a deck that KOGed

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and also, I can't get easy remedies for this like lance because they're fucking locked behind boxes

sleek garnet
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So what? If i hand out an orcust list to a 5 year old and they wont kog with it

tropic herald
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I know how to utilize my deck

sleek garnet
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Then why do you keep losing?

tropic herald
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because staples

sleek garnet
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When they could kog?

tropic herald
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I don't even know how that person koged as I said before

sleek garnet
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So it's the problem with the game and not you

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Because as it turns out, book of moon also existed in december 2022

tropic herald
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I'm aware

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this is the one I use

sleek garnet
#

This looks like it can play around book of moon

tropic herald
#

how

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unless you get lucky with the mst

sleek garnet
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Ok so

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Without mst

tropic herald
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You can use your flipped monster as relinquished fusion material

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But that’s only if you’ve got it in your hand or on the field

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Like I said, you’ve gotta have a lucky hand to come back from book

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Or any of the monster removal staples

sleek garnet
#

Get idol on the field, activate your skill, grab either a fusion spell or a ritual spell, whatever're missing, then ritual summon the relinquished the skill gave you, activate the relinquished, at this point, the opponent will probably want to activate book, since they dont want to lose their monster, activate your fusion spell and now you have a restrict fusion

tropic herald
#

I’ve tried something like that before

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Baiting out book is hard

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And again, it’s all pretty hand dependent

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Meanwhile all these other meta decks can bounce back from so much

sleek garnet
#

The horrors of a two card combo

tropic herald
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What

sleek garnet
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Idol +fusion/ritual spell

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2 cards

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And you play 6/7 copies of each

tropic herald
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Lemme show you the exact deck I use

sleek garnet
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Btw

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You do know you can get 2 cosmic cyclones for free

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Right?

tropic herald
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how

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and why use that over mst

sleek garnet
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The box chip campaign

tropic herald
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oh I used those to help build my black luster deck

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so that's a no-go

sleek garnet
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Oh well

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Btw

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Did you know that dark magician is a really strong deck this format?

tropic herald
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yes but I don't want to play it

sleek garnet
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Ok

tropic herald
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it's really basic, like playing ryu in street fighter

sleek garnet
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Said the game who complained that his deck can only do one thing

tropic herald
#

what

sleek garnet
tropic herald
#

now if I were to play a dark magician deck I wouldn't be keen on using any of the dark magician girl stuff. It'd have to have a focus on magician of black chaos or I'd just do a DM deck that's compatible with arkana

tropic herald
sleek garnet
#

I'm going to sleep

tropic herald
#

disgusting how nobody used grandpa muto when he came out last event but everyone is using this fugo shmuck

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it's criminal how much older ygo, its characters and decks are being powercrept by this mid bullshit

pastel lotus
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who's in ranting mode?

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i hate links but i am never this salty

tropic herald
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dude

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this card game in general is fucking CRUEL to boomers like me

pastel lotus
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you outted yourself as a boomer a long time ago already

tropic herald
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even gx stuff isn't good anymore

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I wanted to play ancient gears

pastel lotus
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if you don't want to take honest advice there's nothing more we can do help you

tropic herald
#

what do you think I was just doing

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I was taking advice

pastel lotus
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not meta not equal unwinnable

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should i ping licia or no?

tropic herald
#

who

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are you threatening to call mods on me or something

pastel lotus
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@drowsy holly can you tell this guy to chill please?

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he even used the f word

tropic herald
#

????

pastel lotus
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i only do this in drastic cases

tropic herald
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Oh you’re just memeing

tropic herald
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Can you make a decent dark magician deck without any of the female magicians

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And if that’s not possible, how about one centered around magician of black chaos/dark magician of chaos

full spade
#

Isn’t at least apprentice needed for free body + DM search

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And either her or DMG as the other target for navigation + fusion material for TDM

tropic herald
#

Welp

#

For the record I’ve got nothing against DMG or apprentice I just don’t like using female monsters in my decks

fallen kestrel
pastel lotus
#

bad players gonna keep playing bad cards

#

you can play your stuff but if you can't out their outs well you need to improve

#

explore ways to get there rather than how book has made your existence miserable

#

i am going to talk about things i enjoy about the game and be positive

tropic herald
#

It’s like almost every monster I’m into, the answer is “they’re bad lol”

#

Ancient Gears? Bad. Black luster soldier? Bad. Gaia? Bad. Relinquished? Bad. Red Eyes? Bad. Black Chaos? Bad. And on and on

#

It’s hard to be positive when almost all of what you want to play is considered bad now

#

Don’t even shit on me for being a negative nancy because I was out here open to playing dark magician if it involved my favorite monster of the archetype, and even then I get shot down

tropic herald
#

I wish all of you were cursed with yugiboomerism like me

fallen kestrel
#

If ur complaining about only liking bad decks, then either dont play competitively or have another deck or two u use for comp grinds

#

Playing decks u know are bad then literally just complaining they are bad without trying to fix ur issue or ask for advice is stupid imo

tropic herald
#

You don’t get it. Damn near every time I try to broaden my horizons and ask about the possibility of using another deck I like the looks of, I get shot down and told it’s bad.

fallen kestrel
#

Then do more research to be honest

tropic herald
#

Almost every “good” deck I’ve seen is meh to me

fallen kestrel
#

Also, decks are highly ublikely to suddenly become good if they are older unless they:

  1. Get new support
  2. Stuff gets released from forbidden and limited list
tropic herald
#

Like Branded is just okay

fallen kestrel
#

The best old deck is probably dm or red eyes

tropic herald
#

It’s better than other stuff I’ve seen but it didn’t make me go “oh shit I wanna play that”

tropic herald
fallen kestrel
tropic herald
#

It’s not about playstyle, it’s about card art and aesthetics

fallen kestrel
tropic herald
#

I’ve played Red Eyes before, it gets clowned

#

Then again mine wasn’t optimized

fallen kestrel
#

If ur playing for aesthetics and cos stuff looks cool, maybe comp isnt ur thing, in which case the tier list doesnt matter

tropic herald
#

So where do I even go

#

Even on dueling nexus you’ve got comp-minded sweaters using meta stuff from what I’ve been told

fallen kestrel
#

I have never used it so I dont know if its what u want but its something to try if u havent

tropic herald
#

I’ve tried it. Full of bots

fallen kestrel
#

What decks do u have

#

Like gimme a list of complete and incomplet

tropic herald
#

In duel links I have relinquished and a semi-complete black luster soldier

#

Why

fallen kestrel
#

Just curious

#

I have like two full decks, pendulum and DDD

#

Then about a billion half complete stuff

peak mesa
#

I'm not even thinking about that when I use other decks that I don't even know how to play

#

I don't even know htf you got into platinum

rocky bluff
#

@sleek garnet is shs in this game

quick axle
#

Yes.

#

But not all of them.

rocky bluff
#

ok

#

what box btw

quick axle
#

Gong's levelup rewards, drops, I don't remember the box, I think it was Judgment Force? And there was another box with further SHS stuff.

#

It was either that one or the one that had Zephyros the Elite on the cover.

#

For the first wave of SHS stuff.

sleek garnet
sleek garnet
#

And scales is in cross dimension

quick axle
#

That's absurdly broken somehow.

sleek garnet
#

Having access to a link 1 means that you can get soulpiercer into the gy immediately

quick axle
#

I wouldn't be surprised if the Link-1 becomes Limited 1 on release

#

Also, thankfully Cybsr-Stein is forbidden here.

rocky bluff
#

@sleek garnet i got 3 dream tickets what do i use on

#

?

#

do i use on staples or use to help get like dweller and roach and trish

#

for the odd eyes deck

sleek garnet
#

Staples

#

Those ed cards you listed are in mini boxes

#

Book of moon and mst for example, are main box cards

#

100 pack boxes are easier to pull than 180 pack boxes

quaint thorn
#

I popped off so hard at the end here

fallen kestrel
fallen kestrel
rocky bluff
#

just give me 3 cards and i'll get

#

im really bad at making descócanos

#

descosió a

sleek garnet
peak mesa
#

Man I wish there was a crafting system man

sleek garnet
#

There is one tho

quick axle
sleek garnet
#

For the 20 oldest boxes : )

peak mesa
#

The box chips right

sleek garnet
#

Yea

peak mesa
#

Would be awesome to be able to just dismantle cards for box chips

#

I'm literally sure I have thousands of common cards I don't mind them being dismantled for one chip

pastel lotus
#

i thought the ping was from licia

#

but i can see i was sorely mistaken

#

mr "everyone has to play so much worse decks than me so i can win"

peak mesa
#

Whats the definition of a pet deck btw@pastel lotus

pastel lotus
#

anything that don't aim to cram 3 of staples

peak mesa
#

Ah

#

What are the staples today?

pastel lotus
#

anything that tries to use minorly used cards as a core strategy

#

like a maiden in love

#

i just use her in a yuma tsukumo deck to activate skill

peak mesa
#

[maiden in love]

vivid waveBOT
# peak mesa [maiden in love]

level Level: 4
[ Fairy / Effect ]

ATK 850 / DEF 2000

Effect

Offer this face-up card as a Tribute to return to your hand 1 of your monsters destroyed as a result of battle during this turn.

pastel lotus
#

its game card

#

p[maiden in love]

peak mesa
#

Ah

vivid waveBOT
# pastel lotus p[maiden in love]

level Level: 4
[ Fairy / Effect ]

ATK 850 / DEF 2000

Effect

Offer this face-up card as a Tribute to return to your hand 1 of your monsters destroyed as a result of battle during this turn.

pastel lotus
#

yugi[maiden in love]

vivid waveBOT
pastel lotus
#

check yp

peak mesa
#

Is it a stall card?

pastel lotus
#

any roleplaying deck also counts or mishmash of any 2 character's decks like yusei/yugo

peak mesa
#

Ok I guess I'm making a pet deck lmao

#

But still like synchros

#

I have dream ticket ur and sr

#

Should I try getting stardust warrior? Or link slayer?

#

Warrior is on a box and slayer is on a structure deck

pastel lotus
#

i'll let the residential meta players here handle the recommendations

#

dk what brazilian time zone is

peak mesa
#

This kind of deck

#

But there's also quasar deck type

#

But it needs to be turn 3 to get it

#

Sample deck kind nice

pastel lotus
#

i run junk giant and junkuriboh

#

neither of which shows up on meta decklists

#

junk giant prevents cards that activate on summon aka bth and fth

#

its a personal favorite of mine

#

i want to put [extra net] in my exodia deck but i keep forgetting to do it because i am to concentrated on farming skills for dsod bakura

vivid waveBOT
pastel lotus
#

dl should really have some sort of personal notes function

#

much weaker than insect handtrap since it must be put on field and stay on field for the draw to happen, it's not a simple activate from the hand on their turn

#

but the aim is the same

#

you are rewarded with 1 draw if your opponent ss something from the ed

#

how did the old something that grows in the graveyard deck function again?

rocky bluff
#

wasn't it just like

#

black rose shit?

pastel lotus
#

i distinctly remember that deck using [goyo defender]

vivid waveBOT
# pastel lotus i distinctly remember that deck using [goyo defender]

level Level: 3
[ Warrior / Synchro / Effect ]

ATK 1000 / DEF 1000

Effect

1 Tuner + 1+ non-Tuner monsters
Once per turn, if all monsters you control are EARTH Warrior Synchro Monsters (min. 1): You can Special Summon "Goyo Defender" from your Extra Deck. When this card is targeted for an attack: You can make this card gain 1000 ATK for each EARTH Warrior Synchro Monster you control (other than this card), until the end of the Damage Step.

pastel lotus
#

bring back the kino pre-zexal world release meta pls

fallen kestrel
pastel lotus
#

is the raging pendulum hype dying down?

#

dragonpit magician seems to be that deck's main backrow removal

#

oafdragon magician is the ed retrieval

#

techically raging would die to a starlight road

#

trap stun is funny for being a trap that negates traps beside itself without being a counter trap

#

its funny how certain cards released in the synchro era work better against pendulum summoning

#

see [giant trap hole] and [extra gate]

vivid waveBOT
# pastel lotus see [giant trap hole] and [extra gate]
Effect

When 2 or more monsters are Special Summoned at the same time: Destroy all monsters on the field.

Effect

Declare a Level between 1 and 12; your opponent banishes 1 monster of that Level from their Extra Deck. If your opponent does not have a monster of that Level in their Extra Deck, you discard 1 card.

rocky bluff
#

@sleek garnet i dont see this odd eyes list on bom

#

u sure its correct choice?

pastel lotus
#

i can't wait for sugoroku mutou to get released mainly because he is a dm world character

#

dm world character has the largest level cap at 45 so that's more gems

#

they can raise zexal char level cap to 40 now

#

i keep forgetting entermate king bear has a (slow) graveyard retrieval effect for any level 7 or higher monster

#

i might need to adjust my sin rainbow dragon deck a bit

#

i can't think of any monster level 7 or higher in dl that could be handtraps besides nekroz

dapper grotto
#

I just saw someone use Electric Virus of all things to take on Orcust, Odd-eyes and Speedroids.

#

That is big brained.

sleek garnet
#

Besides, still one of the best generics of the game

rocky bluff
#

ah

#

i crafter lance

#

i thought i was better imo

sleek garnet
#

Also a good coice

#

Lance is a bit more deck dependant tho

#

Odd eyes doesnt really have any staple space anyway

quick axle
#

[Maiden in Love (Duel Links)]

vivid waveBOT
quick axle
#

Mainly because it's an anime card exclusive.

pastel lotus
#

yes

#

[cat girl magician (duel links)]

vivid waveBOT
# pastel lotus [cat girl magician (duel links)]

rank_star Rank: 4
[ Spellcaster / Xyz / Effect ]

ATK 2000 / DEF 1800

Effect

2 Level 4 monsters
Once per turn, during your Battle Phase: You can detach 1 material from this card; halve this card's ATK until the end of this turn, also this card can attack your opponent directly this turn.

pastel lotus
#

still no ojamagic in this game

fallen kestrel
empty tree
#

Stop playing timelords they suck

pastel lotus
#

yeah

#

i stalled out one

#

2 sphere kuribohs and 1 ddd oracle king d'arc was all it took

#

timelords can't accomplish shit w/o attacking

#

probably one of the worse decks to play pure

#

you basically are manipulating mutiple yubels around

#

i didn't get to unlock z-one so i haven't been able to play them myself but... its not that good

#

you basically are manipulating multiple yubels around

#

both z-one and yusei were stall players, so i guess thematically it makes sense for z-one to play high level 0 stats field manipulators

#

that concludes my assessment of the timelords

quick axle
#

Discord is shatting on itself.

pastel lotus
#

i thought it was my connection

#

too much latency i am assuming?

quick axle
pastel lotus
#

lolz

#

anime deck loses to battle proof monster

#

kek

#

here's another eyebrow-raising one:

#

aka chain max 16, it can't handle anymore blocks of instruction after that, any excess unprocessed effects proceeds to go into a 2nd chain, and so on

rocky bluff
#

hmmm

#

imma try to build pk

quick axle
#

@rocky bluff I would actually recommend against investing in any decks right now.

#

We're in KC Cup period, and usually after that, a banlist gets released.

rocky bluff
#

oh

#

ol k

#

when would a bannlsit be than?

quick axle
#

In less than two weeks on my estimate.

peak mesa
pastel lotus
#

i get pinged for a non response?

silk hatch
#

Dinomorphs would be so cool in dl

quick axle
#

Dinomorphia, as in another floodgate.dek?

#

Konami has put in record they don't like stall at all.

#

Also, IIRC, Dinomorphia is related to the Albaz lore, so... we won't probably see them until much later.

#

Right now we're in the path through the World Legacy storyline.

quick axle
#

Got it.

pastel lotus
#

did they even release amorphage?

#

a series 9 archetype that floodgates ed ss

quick axle
#

No. They released Graydle support, though.

#

I know, completely unrelated.

dapper grotto
#

Holy crap, I got THREE prismatic URs from my UR deals!

tawdry crown
#

Big sparkles

#

👀

dapper grotto
sleek garnet
peak mesa
dapper grotto
#

The 4 Packs + UR Deal on separate boxes lmao

#

Spent about $7.50 today to get those random URs.

#

In each box right now, you can buy "4 packs + 1 random UR" for $1.39 CAD.

peak mesa
#

Crap

pastel lotus
#

piggy collector's deck oink oink

#

i'd like to direct your attention to the pure dragon ed this chad packs

rocky bluff
#

REQUIRM IS IN THIS GAME

quick axle
#

Yeppers.

pastel lotus
#

yes

#

it was the cover legendary for raider's requiem

#

its a main box so that's a lot of digging

#

its not limit 1 on release because it needs its rum to hit the field

quick axle
#

Which is Limited 1.

#

The Phantom Knights of Rank-Up Magic Launch.

pastel lotus
#

oh yeah

#

i haven't actually seen it being used so that escaped my notice

rocky bluff
#

i know

#

kinda crazy tho

#

3 monster negates

#

just by activating treason phantom?

quick axle
pastel lotus
#

why does carly have ska music as her duel theme kek

quick axle
#

Because she's whimsical.

#

Her Fortune Fairies may be pathetic, but she tries to be happy-go-lucky.

rocky bluff
pastel lotus
#

she's poor people comedic relief

#

just like dm's jounouchi

rocky bluff
#

oh wait

#

nvm

sleek garnet
rocky bluff
#

requiem isn't opt

sleek garnet
#

And yea, skill got nerfed so that drawing the rum is a brick

sleek garnet
vivid waveBOT
# sleek garnet [Rank up magic launch]
Effect

During the Main Phase: Target 1 DARK Xyz Monster you control with no material; Special Summon from your Extra Deck, 1 DARK Xyz Monster that is 1 Rank higher than that monster you control, by using it as material, and if you do, attach this card to it as additional material. (This is treated as an Xyz Summon. Transfer its materials to the Summoned monster.) During your Main Phase: You can banish this card from your GY, then target 1 DARK Xyz Monster you control; attach 1 "The Phantom Knights" monster from your hand to that monster as material.

rocky bluff
#

OH

#

IS THE OTHER ONE NOT IN THE GSME

sleek garnet
#

No

rocky bluff
#

ah

#

i c

#

i jusr assumed it was

#

lmao

#

also no bard hurts

#

oh and no torn scales

#

deck feels mid

quick axle
#

If Bardiche comes, it's going to go straight to Limited 1.

sleek garnet
#

No fog blade too

#

Btw

rocky bluff
#

oh

#

crazy

#

yeah deck sucks

#

lmao

sleek garnet
#

The skill carries dw

pastel lotus
#

wut's bardiche

quick axle
#

[Phantom Knights of Rusty Bardiche]

vivid waveBOT
# quick axle [Phantom Knights of Rusty Bardiche]

Rating: Link-3 (➡↙↘)
[ Warrior / Link / Effect ]

ATK 2100

Effect

2+ DARK monsters
During your Main Phase: You can send 1 "The Phantom Knights" monster from your Deck to the GY, then Set 1 "Phantom Knights" Spell/Trap directly from your Deck to your Spell & Trap Zone. If a DARK Xyz Monster(s) is Special Summoned to a zone(s) this card points to, while this monster is on the field (except during the Damage Step): You can target 1 card on the field; destroy it. You can only use each effect of "The Phantom Knights of Rusty Bardiche" once per turn. Cannot be used as Link Material.

quick axle
#

This thing.

pastel lotus
#

k

quick axle
#

This monster combos well with their Quick-Spell RUM.

sleek garnet
#

It also makes any dark deck have access to a negate

quick axle
#

If Yuto needs more power and Fog Blade decides to come to the game, that is.

pastel lotus
#

how do you counter black magician besides breaking circle?

#

eternal soul makes the deck so much harder to deal with

quick axle
#

Be thankful we don't have Dark Magician the Dragon Knight, BTW.

#

That would have made the deck even more obnoxious to deal with.

pastel lotus
#

circle banish tho

#

free no costs and can still attack

sleek garnet
pastel lotus
#

screams unfair favoritism

sleek garnet
quick axle
#

Dark Magician is quite a decent deck, but the problem is consistency, since Rod is still Limited 3.

pastel lotus
#

its a deck to look out for on ranked

quick axle
#

Oh, for sure.

#

I'm not denying the power of the deck.

pastel lotus
#

but since its screams out its skill, you'll know when you face one

sleek garnet
#

Btw

#

Magicians magic locks you out of using eternal soul on the opponent's turn

quick axle
#

As you can only summon Level 6 DARK Spellcaster monsters.

#

In other words, stuff like Dark Magician Girl.

pastel lotus
#

is warning point a common staple now?

#

2nd most used trap by ranked stats

quick axle
#

Yes.

pastel lotus
#

but i can still ss stuff like p[eitom]

vivid waveBOT
# pastel lotus but i can still ss stuff like p[eitom]

level Level: 8
[ Thunder / Effect ]

ATK 3000 / DEF 2500

Effect

This card cannot be Normal Summoned or Set. You can only Special Summon it by Tributing 1 Level 7 or higher monster you control. This card can directly attack your opponent. When doing so, the Battle Damage to your opponent is halved.

quick axle
#

[Plasma Warrior Eitom (Duel Links)]

vivid waveBOT
# quick axle [Plasma Warrior Eitom (Duel Links)]

level Level: 8
[ Thunder / Effect ]

ATK 3000 / DEF 2500

Effect

Cannot be Normal Summoned/Set. Must be Special Summoned (from your hand) by Tributing 1 Level 7 or higher monster. This card can attack directly, but when it does so using this effect, the battle damage inflicted to your opponent is halved.

pastel lotus
#

warning point is not a limit 3

quick axle
sleek garnet
#

it isnt

brisk pawn
#

Easy otk

sonic nimbus
#

bruh

#

opp opens 2 BoM, 1 Chalice, 1 Cyclone and a Neos into my board of Solda, Evilswarm Nightmare, Lance

#

Cyclones the Lance, I let it resolve then goes cl2 BoM target Solda, cl3 lance target solda, cl4 BoM target Nightmare

#

actiavtes Fav Duel, pitches Neos, sends Sparkman grab Miracle, fuses for Neos Knight, Solda eff on summon, he Chalices my Solda

#

but forgets it's under Lance

#

literally hand looped himself for 5

rocky bluff
pastel lotus
#

ygo text do be complicated sometimes

#

like extra gate

#

it has no cost persay

#

but you cannot activate it on an empty hand

#

because the effect for guessing "wrong" is a hand discard

#

and let's not even get into forked effects

rocky bluff
#

[extra gate]

vivid waveBOT
# rocky bluff [extra gate]
Effect

Declare a Level between 1 and 12; your opponent banishes 1 monster of that Level from their Extra Deck. If your opponent does not have a monster of that Level in their Extra Deck, you discard 1 card.

rocky bluff
#

how is this confusing

#

it's very simple ink

#

imo

pastel lotus
#

so for the most used character wcs campaign i chose dsod kaiba, yuya, yusei

rocky bluff
#

your cost is declaring and eff is discard

pastel lotus
#

its something that catches newbies off guard

rocky bluff
#

if you cannot complete eff at time of activation

#

you can't activate

#

pretty simple imo

sleek garnet
pastel lotus
#

oh i am glad its crystal clear for you

#

when did gaia fall out of the meta?

#

it had a skill

quick axle
#

A long time ago.

sleek garnet
#

about 6 months after the sd came out

quick axle
#

Power creep and all that jazz, and plus, the skill got nerfed.

pastel lotus
#

what was the nerf?

sleek garnet
#

you cant shuffle away backrow for the cost

quick axle
#

Only monsters.

rocky bluff
#

wait do you guys think pk will get hit?

sleek garnet
#

not really

#

deck fell off

pastel lotus
#

no

#

i barely see yuto

rocky bluff
#

so km prob safe to build it

pastel lotus
#

its only as strong as the xyz it can go into

#

now a pk using dark armed dragon would be kinda funny

sleek garnet
#

trying to decide if i build speedroids or rokkets

pastel lotus
#

dl formats hurts combo potential

sleek garnet
#

eh its manageable

#

never really missed zone space outside of stuff like infernity

#

hmm

#

could also build chronomaly

pastel lotus
#

i feel like mirror force is pretty weak for a limit 1

#

using it means you forego all the much stronger limit 1 you could be running

#

for a battle trap that can only destroy stuff in attack position

#

too crud to be a hard limit 1

sleek garnet
#

its meant to be new player bait anyway

#

doesnt matter too much if it is on the list or not

pastel lotus
#

i would play it if it was limit 2 or greater

#

it could take treacherous's old limit 2 spot

#

why isn't raidraptor hot stuff?

#

revolution falcon wipes stats to 0 against ss'd stuff

#

is it like galaxy no op skill no play

sleek garnet
#

it kinda does nothing t1

pastel lotus
#

must be because it's a retaliation deck

pastel lotus
#

feels like none of zexal anime decks have longevity

small fern
#

sounds bout right, tho afaik onomatopoeia is quite potent and underrated

#

(not just speaking utopic either)

pastel lotus
#

trains do get some use outside of anna

#

mainly because 6000 is really high

small fern
#

ye

#

honestly surprised i don't see timelord trains often

pastel lotus
#

that would be because its an archetype that has problem maintaining field

#

their trap is the only thing that anchors them

small fern
#

also wish non-synchro malefics weren't garbage

pastel lotus
#

that feeling when you almost win but you lose due to doble passe

small fern
#

there was a duel where i was using almost authentic wheeler deck (excluding legendary fisherman and insect queen in favor of mystical sheep and labrynth of kline), and ended up having to use each and every one of my cards to even survive

given that was a private duel and not representative of DL meta

pastel lotus
#

i think sin rainbow dragon is alright

#

tons of ways to search it, lots of dragon tools it can take advantage of, pair with enough removal or stat wipes and it will make lethal

#

put dragon on field, ns vylon prism, use share the pain, select vylon prism, equip vylon prism to dragon, 1000 more attack

#

you can always play seal of oricalcos if you really fear destruction backrow removal

#

losing the ed isn't too big of deal if you have a 4500 beater

small fern
#

yop

pastel lotus
#

i hate farming skills

#

takes forever to get the full sets

#

no i don't have more skill chips

pastel lotus
#

finally last skill

#

now i am so done with farming rio

#

now onto girag

pastel lotus
#

i love how arc-v gate characters react to who you challenge them with

#

if you duel sora with a zexal character, he will say something like, this is xyz i don't recognize

#

pretty sure yuya have different dialogue if you challenge him with edo, asuka, jack, crow, and kaito

pastel lotus
#

sora also reacts with synchro i don't recognize when challenged by a 5ds character, gonna check for gx later

#

with gx he says, this is an academia i don't know about, let's see how good your fusion summoning is

#

damn this a level of detail player-owned duel sims could never accomplish

#

kind of funny how arc-v character do react to duelists from a different show despite never actually crossing over with other shows

small fern
peak mesa
#

Any cheap auto duel decks

white stirrup
#

Anything with 1800ATK or more equipped with [Power of the Guardians] is often the easiest thing

vivid waveBOT
white stirrup
#

Red Eyes Slash Dragon is a pretty good monster for it too

sonic nimbus
#

threw a game so hard v Orcust but my opp threw harder

#

pass a crackback turn on Revolution Falcon, opp links 4 into Orcustrion

#

goes BP, swings into Revolution Falcon for game

tawdry crown
#

No one ever reads the Revolution Falcon

#

First hand experience

sonic nimbus
#

oh man we go way back with that LMAO

#

won this game too leggo

quick axle
pastel lotus
#

raidraptor rum is basicially just their mask change yes

#

kinda sucks the last bingo sheet requires me to unlock bleh world

#

i have ocd about my skill list

#

and pretty much every new character has a character lv 1 skill

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i want to finish farming the character completely before moving on to the next one

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i get the feeling galaxy cyclone isn't as good as the other 2 because its a normal rather than quick-play

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meta too fast for main phase use only cards

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if they give garbage lord they can also give [kuriphoton] right?

vivid waveBOT
# pastel lotus if they give garbage lord they can also give [kuriphoton] right?

level Level: 1
[ Fiend / Effect ]

ATK 300 / DEF 200

Effect

(Quick Effect): You can send this card from your hand to the GY and pay 2000 LP; you take no damage this turn. If this card is in your GY: You can send 1 "Photon" monster from your hand to the GY, except "Kuriphoton"; add this card from your GY to your hand. You can only use this effect of "Kuriphoton" once per turn.

pastel lotus
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it has those little clear wing like spears

pastel lotus
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i think i'd be okay with no wind witch this year if they released dennis

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but idk how many anime xyz users they want to release in a given year

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we got bird guy

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zexal's only new add was v, who added kozmo but not really any new xyz

pastel lotus
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i love how no one really bites at the prospect of any further gameplay discussion besides the strength of the current cardpool and skills

quick axle
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Because it would be rather pointless, as what we have at present is what it exists and what it would be compared against, and besides, that only Konami knows what they would bring to the game.

rocky bluff
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i rly wish i had 1 ur dream

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it's comming along

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so i could get requiem without needing to go into bo

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i need 750 for launch

fallen kestrel
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I have that irl

small fern
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what do people often miss when hitting stage 50 but not having all achievements? the 100 prismatic cards thing?

pastel lotus
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i find it poontless you still discuss something you dont engage with

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its a game clearly aimed at anime fans and i donno maybe you were a formerly such a fan, but you are clearly not that

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i find competitve discussion get toxic or incomprehensible very quickly so i generally veer away from that

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everyone speculates

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like hp books before hp was even finished

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they don't just throw up a "only the creator knows" excuse to stifle the conversation prompts

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horchata guy can have a go at this

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i want rin but she's an endgame character so she is unlikely to be realized quickly

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i don't care about serena

karmic crescent
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uh what's up

pastel lotus
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so logically i want dennis

karmic crescent
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from a quick read i don't either side was aggresive, so i suggest just blocking the person and moving on

quick axle
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If you say so, then NVM what I said.

karmic crescent
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no, it's fine to call a mod

quick axle
pastel lotus
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certified non-aggressive ygo fan

quick axle
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So you think my opinion is invalid because I don't play the game? That's what you're saying?

pastel lotus
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idk which answer makes you less butthurt

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like he said you can block oe not answee

quick axle
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Just be honest, please tell me what's wrong.

pastel lotus
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i just like to talk about game desigm more

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which doesn't seem to be well a hot take

quick axle
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Which is fair.

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It's good to talk about game design. The thing is, with Konami, we don't know what they're going to bring to the table.

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They can bring whatever, either too early or too late.

pastel lotus
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i play speedroid on girag rn, its funny using lesser known chars to masquerade what you playing

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also hands are hard to build without going through that box

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magic hand seems cute, yet i doubt its something you want to leave on the field for more than 1 turn

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[magic hand]

vivid waveBOT
# pastel lotus [magic hand]

level Level: 4
[ Spellcaster / Effect ]

ATK 800 / DEF 1600

Effect

When your opponent adds a card(s) from their Deck to their hand, except by drawing them (except during the Damage Step): You can send that card(s) to the GY, and if you do, inflict 800 damage to your opponent. This effect can only be used once while this card is face-up on the field.

pastel lotus
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slap that card into their graveyard and then slap them silly for even trying with 400 burn

quick axle
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@pastel lotus Anyway, sorry if I seemed butthurt, I was just expressing how I was seeing stuff from what I know and I have seen about the game.

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I'm free to express my own view, and you're free to express your own. No opinion invalidates another.

pastel lotus
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i only rejoined the game or a week or so

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that's why i am still discussing months old characters lol

quick axle
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No, it's okay to do it so.

pastel lotus
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girag's taunts are also legendary

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destiny draw not in the top 10 skill use rankings any more

quick axle
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Destiny Draw just doesn't cut the muster, and so handtraps aren't the hotness they once were.

pastel lotus
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yeah i know dd doesn't setup your field or graveyard

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and board wipes like dark hole are probably not that good any more without specific strats in mind

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i thought chow chow chan was a good handtrap until i realized it doesn't activate if you attack the player

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it only disables a normal trap when your monster is attacking their monster

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at most you probably use it against mirror force and magic cylinder

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although i'd love to see it no sell doble passe

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like i'd said before, zexal was very battle-focused, yuma, shark, and kaito's aces effects all activate in the battle phase

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i think most of the zexal character decks don't get played is that they would crumble when they don't get to make their xyz

quick axle
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Effects during the battle phase are so outdated nowadays. Battle traps fell out of style, since those are kinda slow.

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Wall of Disruption, Drowning Mirror Force... those were the days.

pastel lotus
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umm i just faced someone using disciple pass timelord burn the other day

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something like this

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purely tilting

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shows how much better disciple was at being a nuisance than it's actual intended use

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now they have an easy lp half to use

quick axle
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Disciple used as a floodgate, how original.

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Ra's Disciple was used in stuff like Branded Despia in the original game with Branded Expulsion still legal, and that was pretty obnoxious.

pastel lotus
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one of the few ranked decks that doesn't use searching

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granted its a troll deck

quick axle
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Skill sounds like "Bring it!"?

pastel lotus
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its mokuba's skill

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see ya later or something

quick axle
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Can be used when your Life Points decrease by 1500. Select 1 monster you control and which you are the original owner of. Return the selected monster to the hand. This Skill can only be used once per Duel.

pastel lotus
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dsod characters don't have a lot going for them

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although i used heroic challengers with dsod jounouchi for my warrior buddies

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it was great on release

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now its just generic onga bunga deck

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again, its one of the decks that exmplifies zexal's battle mania fetish

dapper grotto
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Yeah, they need to give DSOD characters better skills lmao.

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Hopefully they get something new once the new main box comes around.

pastel lotus
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kind of hard to do when they didn't even duel except for the main 3