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#Magic the Gathering
golden plover
WAIT NO THIS IS STRAIGHT UP BETTER IN MODERN
It gets around one ring
Since it doesn't target
fallow citrus
no because you need the lifegain in yawg
which is the only deck that uses blood artist to any effect
golden plover
I mean you'd just split the two, but this can kill them through a ring
lost widgetBOT
fallow citrus
so the deck can already do this
like sure being able to drain from artifacts is cool but it's not replacing anything
fallow citrus
fetch reprints are also cool tho
lusty trench
Ye love when I can pick up good cards for less
trail anvil
1/4th but yeah, I'm sure you're running this in all the same decks
fr, and I just got hakbal up to date too lol. more toys are fun
trail anvil
holy fuck lmao
copper pecan
wow that's strong
trail anvil
white ragavan? /s
twilit canyon
its dogshit
trail anvil
it actually is insane how much they put into 1 mana though, this card is crazy pushed
trail anvil
it's okay, it'll be viable when they ban bowmasters tomorrow 
twilit canyon
even ragavan is begrudgingly played
fallow citrus
at least you can dash ragavan
granite badge
This seems good in commander
It'll probably snowball out of control pretty quickly but also be inocous enough it dodges removal
copper pecan
fallow citrus
we got that bad aluren out here
although there might be an interesting energy deck forming out of everything we have
not good but interesting
granite badge
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/948945646524710942/1239315727626797066/...
ah classic enabler for instant payoff
fallow citrus
someone pointed out you can combo this with
and then you could use a storm payoff or have some etb shit going on
golden plover
someone pointed out you can combo this with
Isn't this mandatory?
fallow citrus
I don't follow
you have 0 energy
then you gain 2
then you pay 1 to play rampager
you can't pay 2 to keep him there, so he bounces and gains 1
then you pay 1 to play it
twilit canyon
keep looping
each cast is a storm count
you have to pay the 2 energy on the elephant
but since you cant
lusty trench
Combine that infinite with something like this
Instant speed game win
3 card combo and 4 mana tho
Don't even need to be running black and white cause the enchantment plays it out for free anyway
copper pecan
i'm not looking forward to playing against disruptor flute in brawl
sudden lava
confirmation that ||dragons are just reptile cats||
fallow citrus
oh that sucks
copper pecan
idk it seems pretty good for draft
sudden lava
draft card for sure, but cute
fallow citrus
I just do not evaluate draft at all
golden plover
Weird to see prototype back already
fallow citrus
why is it weird
copper pecan
war of the bruh came out like 2 years ago
fallow citrus
I hope they put a battle in here
sleek ferry
Battles are high key my favorite new card type/mechanic they’ve released
glad peak
With modern horizons being the type of set it is, I’d be surprised if they didn’t have a bunch or at least a couple in lower rarities
golden plover
We won't see Battles for at least 2 more years they said
That's only if they're popular too
sleek ferry
The lore also technically has to call for it too, which makes battles harder to print
golden plover
Also, the set has to have a DFC theme
I wouldn't be surprised if we don't see that many battles in the future
fallow citrus
that's a shame cause they are really cool
golden plover
They're neat, but there's so much criteria required to print them into another set
sleek ferry
Well mh would be the place where you could get away with a 1-2 of
But they would have to do like a legacy battle call back
fallow citrus
I think they could also just do whatever they want
wonder if we could get like uhhh
battles of ideas and shit, like a competition instead of a war
sleek ferry
That sounds like something for strixhaven 2 lol
lusty trench
copper pecan
We won't see Battles for at least 2 more years they said
maro confirmed they will be comming back at some point
fallow citrus
That sounds like something for strixhaven 2 lol
could be a kaladesh invention fair too
golden plover
I think they could also just do whatever they want
Printing DFCs requires speciality printers
It means the set has to have a theme of them to do it
Bolas the Ravenger was an exception because they had a whole sheet just for Bolas and sprinkled them in the mythic production line
fallow citrus
ig
sleek ferry
I mean, also helps you assemble tron if they still play it
copper pecan
Printing DFCs requires speciality printers
this set has double faced cards in it so they could do it here
also battles don't necessarily need to be double faced
fallow citrus
sleek ferry
Eh, it wouldn’t make much sense for them to not be double faced tbh
It would defeat the purpose of the counters on them, unless we just give it an effect once it loses all counters on the front side
copper pecan
It would defeat the purpose of the counters on them, unless we just give it an e...
battles don't necessarily need to be of the "you play this and your opponent defends it" variety. under the current rules, non-siege battles default to having the person who casted the battle defend it. it's just that right now there aren't any non-siege battles so that rule never comes up
granite badge
Tbf sagas used to be like
copper pecan
if you somehow remove the siege subtype from a battle it functions basically the same as a planeswalker
granite badge
Nonexistent
But eventually they made it work both flavorfully and gameplay wise in kamigawa
Actually kaldheim before it
hidden ermine
Tbh battles are just kinda ... niche?
Theres not really that much design space there especially if theyre not DFCs
copper pecan
fallow citrus
oh neat
granite badge
Tbh battles are just kinda ... niche?
Word
copper pecan
the only non-siege battle we've seen so far was this playtest card
fallow citrus
😔
lusty trench
fallow citrus
the only non-siege battle we've seen so far was this playtest card
something like that would be fun
lusty trench
I dub that card soul mister btw
sleek ferry
Ngl, set seems solid so far, but I’m still waiting on the bombs
Like the obvious bombs
Like guide of souls could be nuts in theory, but it’s not a card that I can immediately see seeing play in a deck
fallow citrus
I can kind of maybe see this in amulet titan
sleek ferry
Btw, this would be deserted temples debut in modern right?
fallow citrus
think so?
sleek ferry
Me and my friend weren’t sure if it was modern legal before and just not seeing play
copper pecan
yeah it is
sleek ferry
But it looks like the only 2 printings were odyssey and lotr commander
So it would make sense
twilit canyon
buff to that annoying mono white life gain deck
sleek ferry
Also 2 toughness is greatly appreciated
copper pecan
fallow citrus
giving lands dredge is crazy
twilit canyon
if only it was gb
fallow citrus
yeah that does suck
glad peak
I love tacking on a random color for commander (I don’t)
trail anvil
tbh I wonder if part of that is balancing around dredge, as much as they usually like making stuff for commander
twilit canyon
holy
that is quite strong for sure
there has to be some sort of infinite with the retrace
glad peak
In mono green I don’t like it but with other colors I can see it being good
A permanent that gets a land to your hand and/or sacs itself and some mana/ways to make mana is what you need to get a loop
Sounds like a lot but if you can set up enough shouldn’t be a problem
zinc shard
Without the context of Wrenn, it's funny to have a creature just called "Six"
twilit canyon
i wonder if six is afraid of seven
sleek ferry
Probably, especially if it’s true that seven eight nine
sudden lava
Who would win, 11 or 6?
fallow citrus
fallow citrus
rigid scarab
For all intents and purposes this is just Teferi Pro copy 2 in EDH decks
fallow citrus
yep
trail anvil
teferi's protection x fierce guardianship
copper pecan
all cards that bring stickers or attractions into the game (especially mind goblin) are now banned in legacy and vintage
all that glitters is now banned in pauper
golden plover
So my judge friends were right
But they expected the errata for Mind Goblin
Also, good
Stickers and attractions should never have been legal
I wonder if the RC will ban them too
Would be funny
copper pecan
the rc never bans anything, i doubt they'd ban these
golden plover
Either way, this was the right call
fallow citrus
all that glitters is now banned in pauper
can't believe they literally banned fun
fallow citrus
?
trail anvil
noooo mind goblin
fallow citrus
sure
golden plover
Also it's not mentioned in the article but all sticker cards are also banned in pauper
Mind Goblin being the only relevant one
fallow citrus
kind of a shame because there was a neat attractions deck in legacy
but makes sense they did that
copper pecan
something gavin's article brings up is that there is apparently a reprint in mh3 at common that has a high likelyhood of needing to be banned in pauper
fallow citrus
fallow citrus
I think maybe the important part is hexproof from every colour and annihilator
fallow citrus
no you won't gain from him cause it's on cast not etb
golden plover
I think maybe the important part is hexproof from every colour and annihilator
Yeah the hexproof is what matters, but in limited 8 life is a lot
golden plover
tron + land + him
Do you run this in Tron tho? I'm only assuming you get the 8 because you're playing it in draft, the only place I can see it being worthwhile
sudden lava
wither and bloom doesnt make a pest token
golden plover
I guess you can sometimes gain 6 if you draft him, frogmyr, and the ancient tomb
twilit canyon
its fine
fallow citrus
why would it
golden plover
"Wither and Bloom" is a DnD spell
twilit canyon
i think its a solid tech option for tron
golden plover
It's based loosely on what it does in DnD
fallow citrus
oh sure
twilit canyon
especially since its on cast
vs a particularly aggressive murktide list
its not the best but it works
sudden lava
"Wither and Bloom" is a DnD spell
From which book source
golden plover
From which book source
One of the new 5e supplements
twilit canyon
strixhaven iirc
sudden lava
^ As Misty said
twilit canyon
but again
what does wither and bloom do 
where in the fuck does the spell make a pest or anything equivalent in dnd
golden plover
It doesn't make a pest in DnD
sudden lava
twilit canyon
pull it back before you keep typing
the spell itself in dnd
does it make pests
no
golden plover
Yeah, it just makes a healing/damage radius
twilit canyon
why would a reference to that spell make pests
golden plover
Like the card does
sudden lava
Why doesnt it do actual damage and healing?
golden plover
Also, they generally try and avoid one-off tokens
-3/-3 is the "damage" and the +1/+1 is the "healing"
sudden lava
Oh and the spell is tied to witherbloom who uses pests
golden plover
Black doesn't get direct damage to other creatures
twilit canyon
beledros would be a very shitty elder dragon if they could only make pests
[[cruel ultimatum]]
lost widgetBOT
lost widgetBOT
Artifact — Equipment
Equipped creature gets +2/+2.
Equip 
Ghostfire Blade's equip ability costs 
less to activate if it targets a colorless creature.
If you fear the dragon's fire, you are unworthy to wield it.
sudden lava
beledros would be a very shitty elder dragon if they could only make pests
Pests are the mascot
golden plover
Dina hasn't made pests on either of her cards
sudden lava
you're the ones that said "its a reference to the D&D spell" which is from witherbloom
sudden lava
Yes make it green/black and sacrifice creatures
golden plover
The name are directly a reference to the DND spell tho
twilit canyon
which has nothing to do with pests or sacrifice
twilit canyon
so why would it reference pests
golden plover
I was only making the sacrifice joke since that's what Dina does
twilit canyon
who cares that its a mascot
thats not the point of the card. its not meant to brainrot reference one of strixhaven's schools
itd be way more annoying if it was
sudden lava
If it was referencing the spell from strixhaven it would be referencing witherbloom. Sacrifice there would make sense
golden plover
It IS referencing the spell tho
The spell is a druid and warlock spell
Players can use it
sudden lava
warlocks dont
twilit canyon
its not in the warlock spell list
its druid sorc and wizard
warlock and the shittiest spell list known to man name a better duo
sudden lava
unless you are a witherbloom student, then you get it through the feat.
twilit canyon
You invoke both death and life upon a 10-foot-radius sphere centered on a point within range. Each creature of your choice in that area must make a Constitution saving throw, taking 2d6 necrotic damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one. Nonmagical vegetation in that area withers.
In addition, one creature of your choice in that area can spend and roll one of its unspent Hit Dice and regain a number of hit points equal to the roll plus your spellcasting ability modifier.
imagine spending a feat on this spell
sudden lava
imagine spending a feat on this spell
the feat adds more then this
golden plover
This is like a fine spell, but it's not a great spell
rigid scarab
> You invoke both death and life upon a 10-foot-radius sphere centered on a poin...
Please tell me this scales at higher levels
twilit canyon
yes
rigid scarab
And the feat goes up with it
twilit canyon
barely
golden plover
It does
rigid scarab
?
golden plover
It adds to the radius and damage iirc
twilit canyon
At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 3rd level or higher, the damage increases by 1d6 for each slot above 2nd, and the number of Hit Dice that can be spent and added to the healing roll increases by one for each slot above 2nd.
1d6 per 2 levels
golden plover
Oh doesn't add to the radius
twilit canyon
thats so shit lol
rigid scarab
Wait per 2???
golden plover
It's like... Whatever
twilit canyon
i will always take an opportunity to shit on dnd
and wotc has not figured out how to make interesting spells for a while
golden plover
If I was playing a witherbloom druid I guess I'd like take it...
rigid scarab
Well there are defo some feats better than others in dnd
You take it bc it looks cool not bc its good
rigid scarab
Lots of TTRPG is built on you taking cool stuff instead of the best stuff
sudden lava
Oh right, not specifically if you take the feat
twilit canyon
tbf this is just a dnd issue
rigid scarab
Alongside you getting to do optimal builds
twilit canyon
Lots of TTRPG is built on you taking cool stuff instead of the best stuff
for sure but this spell isnt all that cool
and it sucking as time goes on when your character is actually supposed to be cool hurts it more
rigid scarab
I'm looking at a Pokemon TTRPG system
And Im looking to like
Homebrew 10+ rules into its combat system
twilit canyon
Homebrew 10+ rules into its combat system
take a look at pathfinder 2nd edition's rules to see if they have something to help
the system has more rules for things you don't expect it to
so ur bound to find something to help your homebrew rules
rigid scarab
I would love to but I also have to make sure my DM doesn't go "Noooo information overload what about the children"
golden plover
I wish more DMs would wanna try shit outside of DnD
twilit canyon
i mean u can just present pf2e rules individually
twilit canyon
I wish more DMs would wanna try shit outside of DnD
real
golden plover
I've been trying to organize shadowrun for a while
sudden lava
I still never finished strixhaven (we started a bit of the beginning) and probably never will cuz the D&D discord I was in just kinda ended things permanently
golden plover
But half the people I wanna play with are just "Oh why don't we homebrew this in DND"
Just learn another system
twilit canyon
especially compared to 2e or lancer
rigid scarab
I mean I get it
There's definitely a rift between DnD fans and TTRPG fans
People don't like starting from square 1 onto unfamiliar territory in the name of theoretically better mechanics
twilit canyon
i will always shit on dnd for being unable and unwilling to add new classes
rigid scarab
The specific thing about DnD is a lot of its players can handwave its flaws bc they can homebrew
twilit canyon
"guys... its just so hard... are these lameduck subclasses not enough?"
rigid scarab
People get more unwilling to homebrew if they're not super familiar with new rules
twilit canyon
yea for sure
ive read stories of dms just homebrewing most pf2e rules and players not batting an eye at all
but when they get asked if they would play 2e they go "nah i dont wanna relearn a new system"
sudden lava
"guys... its just so hard... are these lameduck subclasses not enough?"
there are cool subclasses tho
golden plover
2fe is really close to DND too, it's wild
twilit canyon
its just better dnd across the board
martials and casters are properly balanced around each other, they actually release new classes and new content for each class
spells feel good
its hard to describe it but having played a wizard and going into the high levels in 2e hits so different than anything dnd has ever done
rigid scarab
I guess the thing is most players don't see a need to learn systems outside of DnD, like how most people don't see a need to learn board games outside of monopoly
golden plover
Tbf I feel like materials get ignored by a lot of DND campaigns
twilit canyon
and having come from dnd, learning that 2e's fighter is arguably one of if not the best class
golden plover
People don't like having to track extra stuff
twilit canyon
and that monk and ranger are also very very good at base
sudden lava
Order cleric, circle of the moon druid, dragon monk, genie warlock, battlemaster fighter, the one wizard subclass where you modify your spells, armorer artificer
rigid scarab
Tbf I feel like materials get ignored by a lot of DND campaigns
Most DnD campaigns I run into does not care aboutt material component
twilit canyon
and the warlock equivalent being actually good
golden plover
its hard to describe it but having played a wizard and going into the high level...
Have you played Shadowrun at all? Mages in Shadowrun feel very good now
twilit canyon
not recently
golden plover
They used to not, but the most recent editions have made them feel a lot better
twilit canyon
i remember yeah they didnt feel great
golden plover
I usually learn towards like Deckers when I'm not DMing, but I wanna play a Shaman next time
All of their stuff got revamped so they just feel solid now
twilit canyon
dnd will put out their best subclass and still it feels way shittier than playing a pf2e character it is crazy
i had this experience in a one-shot and i realized "oh i have infinite choices even at level 1"
thats another thing
system is more than good at level 1
level 1 dnd is a fucking joke
cant believe one of the most recommended ways to play the system is to skip until 3 and then cut off at about level 10
sudden lava
Never got to play hobgoblin order cleric 
twilit canyon
Most DnD campaigns I run into does not care aboutt material component
this is so right as a whole
golden plover
Spell slots have always been weird to me too
twilit canyon
theres very little reason to engage with the actual system
golden plover
I get the idea behind them, but they end up feeling really limiting in campaigns too
twilit canyon
mhm
golden plover
"Oops you prepared for the wrong type of encounter, guess you're just useless"
rigid scarab
Players very often mould DnD into whatever they feel like rather than shaking their fist at the mechanics they don't like
Again I do understand why a lot of people don't feel like moving away from DnD
twilit canyon
theres also no reason not to bring the best spells bc outside of niche scenarios the worse options just totally blow
sudden lava
"Oops you prepared for the wrong type of encounter, guess you're just useless"
thats not how spell slots work
rigid scarab
They just don't feel like taking up more of their brain with TTRPG
twilit canyon
thats not how spell slots work
that is how wizards work in dnd tho
golden plover
theres also no reason not to bring the best spells bc outside of niche scenarios...
Pretty much. You just lock in the good stuff and never change it
golden plover
thats not how spell slots work
The idea is that a wizard prepares for an encounter and brings a specific set of spells in advance.
sudden lava
pope said spell slots, not wizards.
twilit canyon
theres little power in cantrips proper and most of it is in leveled spells
this is across the board for casters
cantrips are super ass for the most part
sudden lava
The idea is that a wizard prepares for an encounter and brings a specific set of...
Im aware, you said spell slots.
twilit canyon
your power is in your actual spell slots
if you have the wrong spells tough luck
you are not doing shit
golden plover
cantrips are super ass for the most part
I mean, that's kinda the biggest upside to warlock
Your cantrips are like... Fine?
They're still not great, but they're better than everyone else's
twilit canyon
one trick pony yeah
sudden lava
"fine"? They have the best offensive cantrip
golden plover
In exchange for having the worst spell options
twilit canyon
"fine"? They have the best offensive cantrip
yeah thats not good
cus it boils all warlocks down to exactly one character
"i cast eldritch blast"
lusty trench
Darkness eldritch sight combo 
golden plover
"fine"? They have the best offensive cantrip
Yeah, but it's still like mediocre and also, you don't always need an offensive spell
twilit canyon
no reason to do otherwise
and you will always be worse than the wizard or druid or cleric
twilit canyon
everyone talks about caster-martial disparity
but we should also talk about the caster to caster disparirt
*disparity
golden plover
There's like not enough rules or anything to actually make the non-combat parts of the game fun
twilit canyon
real
golden plover
Meanwhile I've ran whole Shadowrun sessions where the group doesn't get into a fight once
twilit canyon
pf2e has camping, fishing, and heavy social encounter rules too
hunting and cooking rules
we have spent sessions just adventuring
lusty trench
I can kill all the goblins I want but I can’t navigate a difficult diplomatic mission without being told to roll insight and persuasion/deception over and over
sudden lava
When we ran strixhaven I was gonna have a pest named peanut butter, but we never got far enough for Avril Laville (If I recall her name correctly) to get the feat to summon peanut butter 
golden plover
I've done heist planning, infiltration missions, horror themed shit, and a social deduction missions over the course of a campaign where a player was a spy for a corp (we agreed upon this well in advance)
Having a heist where the group actually had to THINK about how to do the heist and not just "attack all the guards" felt great
sudden lava
My top 2 favorite strixhaven schools being witherbloom and prismari
third probably silverquill
rigid scarab
I think there are some elements of non-combat that players would like to be more free-flow instead of game-ifying them
Heck one of DnD 4e's biggest complaints was it wanted to be a video game too badly
granite badge
in my eyes "d&d" and "ttrpg" are colliqually the same thing
golden plover
I think there are some elements of non-combat that players would like to be more...
That's a big advantage Shadowrun and others like WoD have
golden plover
In Shadowrun, if you're talking to a character, you just TALK
lusty trench
I recall doing a one shot campaign and the dm was just not ready for darkness eldrich sight, which is fair
granite badge
the bit of experience I've had has basically been "we're using 5e as a framework but we're going to ignore half of it for fun factor okay?"
golden plover
You're not rolling shit unless you've got some reason to believe you're trying to do something else
twilit canyon
it can def leave people tho especially new dms completely in the dark about some things
golden plover
No "roll persuasion" or anything
If you wanna bluff, you've gotta make your bluff sound believable to a character
rigid scarab
Like if you're gonna talk to an NPC you wouldn't want to announce "Alright gentlemen time to enter talking combat! If you insult their physical appearance you get -2 to your next roll!"
lusty trench
If you wanna bluff, you've gotta make your bluff sound believable to a character
The issue comes from the gap between what a character should know vs a person
rigid scarab
"But if you praise their history your next roll will be doubled!"
twilit canyon
yeah i like pf2e's handle on it
it only makes you roll when its a reasonable situation
golden plover
The issue comes from the gap between what a character should know vs a person
That's true. And there are checks you can do for that kind of stuff, but it really comes down to DM discretion
twilit canyon
ie: you are in an actual debate
golden plover
But I've had to do stuff like tell players "hey your character shouldn't know this" in the past
twilit canyon
it helps create non-combat encounters too
rigid scarab
But there have been moments in DnD where I'm like "There is no possible way my character would flub this"
twilit canyon
yeah thats actually another part too
lusty trench
But I've had to do stuff like tell players "hey your character shouldn't know th...
Have you considered that my character is just simply cool enough to know things they weren’t there for? 
golden plover
Yeah, it also doesn't feel compelling to me to have to intentionally flub a conversation because I rolled poorly
twilit canyon
dnd being so objective with what constitutes a fail or a success
its just a simple yes/no
rigid scarab
I mean its DM discretion
If they were incredibly close to DC they'll give them a slight win in most cases
lusty trench
Damn it now I want to make a dnd character
golden plover
That's an issue I do have in Shadowrun too, it's "yes/no"
twilit canyon
that is fine if the system encouraged it basically but the system doesnt work for it
lusty trench
I don’t even have a group to play with
golden plover
But each individual die can be assigned a "hit/miss"
So you can sorta work in that a little more
twilit canyon
Damn it now I want to make a dnd character
this long convo has been about how u shouldnt build a dnd character
golden plover
But it's not like super open to that
rigid scarab
Damn it now I want to make a dnd character
Looked at an entire convo shitting on dnd
Decides to go into dnd anyway
Unfathomably based
golden plover
The character building is the best part of DND
lusty trench
this long convo has been about how u shouldnt build a dnd character
I used to read shit isekai I can draw inspiration from even the most driest of dry wall imaginable
twilit canyon
lancer too
golden plover
It's actually having to play that character that... Sucks
twilit canyon
<:cheems:683182129668292685> I used to read shit isekai I can draw inspiration f...
play fabula ultima or lancer or pf2e instead
itll be better if thats your source
twilit canyon
It's actually having to play that character that... Sucks
"what do you mean i cant play levels 1 and 2 because they suck?"
lusty trench
If I did it’d probably be pf2e but damn that character sheet is beeg and I’d have to learn it… oh well gotta learn it eventually when wotc finally lets 5e die (2060)
twilit canyon
"what do you mean my cutoff point is level 10 or 11?"
dnd is completely unplayable at levels 1 and 2 and levels 10+ is crazy that they still make levels and options for that
golden plover
I will say, 3.5 wasn't bad
lusty trench
The level 1 dream of dying instantly to a kobold contraption
golden plover
Well for DnD standards
It's also a lot harder to find people who wanna play 3.5 over 5e
twilit canyon
thats just the case for anything non-5e
golden plover
3.5 was the last time DND felt really solid
twilit canyon
at least pf2e is picking up traction since paizo is extremely based
golden plover
And Pathfinder just takes 3.5 and makes it actually work
rigid scarab
I mean if you want to play 5e you should not be judged for it
twilit canyon
its actually 4e and makes it work
rigid scarab
Despite pathfinder circlejerking
twilit canyon
I mean if you want to play 5e you should not be judged for it
for sure. i think 5e is a solid beginner to ttrpg system
rigid scarab
From my experience the whole "Roll to win" aspect makes it incredibly beginner friendly
You couldn't figure out a damn thing about the actual system
Just do a thing and roll
If you roll high you do good
twilit canyon
that said, pf2e is also really good for beginners i noticed
golden plover
Inventing a new ttrpg where we don't have dice and have full control over the story
Calling it "a writer's room"
twilit canyon
lol
golden plover
See the grand idea here is that there's players, but no one has their own character
Everyone chimes in with what they think each character should do for maximum plot engagement and we go off the best ideas
lusty trench
Calling it "a writer's room"
If the players collectively disagree with the DM of this game, they can enact the a motion to delay the game until the dm compromises
golden plover
Oh also the DM has to pay the players
rigid scarab
If I had to say another thing
I personally don't like the feeling that me picking up a game feels like me taking a stance on an unrelated topic
Like I know I have full right to just pick up PF2e because I like the system
I know people who play it aswell
And I know it's wrong but I can't help but feel like me picking up and learning PF2e would be me going "Nyehehe fuck you dnd I hate you"
Like
No
I can pick both and I can play both
If I want to play a game I want the reason to be I think the game is good
Not because a big corpo man did a no no and I'm sticking it to them
twilit canyon
thats kind of a you thing i guess
golden plover
twilit canyon
lol
rigid scarab
thats kind of a you thing i guess
Yeah it is
I don't like my game choices being a statement
rigid scarab
Definitely not
There's a good chance those are just intrusive thoughts going "You're only doing this because of current events"
trail anvil
can you not name creature types that only contained banned creatures?
that's an interesting ruling
rigid scarab
Oh
So you're saying Unfinity has literally no value now
Tbf it was extremely stupid that it was objectively incorrect to not bring a sticker deck
golden plover
can you not name creature types that only contained banned creatures?
I think you can still name Gamer
But it theoretically reveals information now that you did
trail anvil
?
golden plover
So you're saying Unfinity has literally no value now
True, there's like the shocks, but
golden plover
?
Declaring Gamer reveals you have no legal targets
Well except changeling
But before, you could theoretically declare gamer with 1 legal card it could be used for
fallow citrus
So you're saying Unfinity has literally no value now
I'm sure it has value for commander players
but other than that no
it might be a fun draft experience too
and it has the really nice shocks
golden plover
It's actually miserable to draft
Stickers are not fun in draft and don't really add much
Looking at the cards from the set on EDHrec outside the shocks, it's just [[Magar]] and [[Saw in Half]] that are worthwhile I guess
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Legendary Creature — Minotaur Performer
: Note the name of target instant or sorcery card in your graveyard and put it onto the battlefield face down. It's a 3/3 creature with "Whenever this creature deals combat damage to a player, you may create a copy of the card with the noted name. You may cast the copy without paying its mana cost" and "If this creature would leave the battlefield, exile it instead of putting it anywhere else."
3/3
golden plover
There are now 21 cards from UNF legal in eternal formats
And really [[Space Beleren]] probably shouldn't be
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fallow citrus
why
this card is literally not doing anything
I think the only other card from the set I've seen played apart from mind goblin in a non-commander constructed format was
[[comet, stellar pup]]
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fallow citrus
I'm not tracking it because it isn't being played in any game of magic
golden plover
That's fair. I played against it in draft once and it was annoying
fallow citrus
also you simply just put cards in columns
like ygo is based entirely around that it's not a difficult concept for people to understand I don't think
golden plover
Yeah that's the case, but I imagine it gets worse if the board gets too big
We just have the precedent of "things can be banned for being annoying" now
But it'd take a really weird deck playing Space Jace for that
fallow citrus
well most of the "annoying" bans have some greater precedent behind them
yorion was hit because big decks make rounds overrun because of shuffling, deck checks etc
sensei's top because people took too long to use the card so it basically encouraged slow playing etc
golden plover
Yeah, I'm just going off the rest of the set getting banned
Unfinity really shouldn't have been legal
rigid scarab
Definitely not
It had black border cards specifically for commander
But Im sure most commander pods would rule 0 your silver bordered cards anyway
golden plover
The argument I'm seeing people say a lot is "(The reasonable) silver border cards should just be legal by default"
But what's reasonable for one person varies
And unless you have the RC sit down and determine every silver border card, it's pointless
twilit canyon
i generally agree with that but its up to wotc to decide not the player base so its impossible to know what they think would be reasomable otherwise
golden plover
And even then, you'll get people going "what do you mean [[Enter the Dungeon]] isn't reasonable" or whatever
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golden plover
Like I might think [[Syr Cadian]] is reasonable, but the RC might not because most commander games are played at night
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Legendary Creature — Bird Knight
Knightlifelink (Damage dealt by Knights you control also causes you to gain that much life.)
: Syr Cadian, Knight Owl gains vigilance until end of turn. Activate only from sunrise to sunset.
: Syr Cadian, Knight Owl gains flying until end of turn. Activate only from sunset to sunrise.
4/4
lusty trench
Dear god the tutors have started taking the lands
lusty trench
That's pretty decent
twilit canyon
they do?
p sure ur just seeing the horn of a dead animal in the background
hmmmm
its not super clear
lusty trench
It's got like brown spots on it
And so do they
TBF I am going for an eye exam tomorrow so I could be seeing things wrong
fallow citrus
are these not just cool oops all spells buffs
twilit canyon
ye
less tapped lands and getting duals is good and having an interaction spell also helps them out a lot
golden plover
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/699074975948341258/1239642584343777372/IM...
Lmao these were mythic last time
lusty trench
Nah not all of them
golden plover
The bolt lands were
golden plover
Tbh they always probably could have been rares
But they probably wanted to test it
Before immediately doing shit like the Deans two sets later
twilit canyon
yeah they needed to make sure they wouldnt really break anything
now its totally fine to make simple cards that can be untapped
golden plover
True
The Zendikar ones and the Kaldheim ones were really well designed tbh
Didn't like the Strixhaven ones tho
Felt like 2 random cards stapled together
twilit canyon
thats cus they kinda were
trail anvil
I was mostly sad that the deans weren't standard playable, I wanted to make a meme deck with them
golden plover
5c too many effects deans
I honestly can't even remember what they do because none of them have synergy with each other
I think the witherbloom green one gains life and the black one is a phyrexian arena or something?
And I think the Silverquill ones do something with +1/+1 counters?
The white one adds them and the black one takes them off to draw cards maybe?
lusty trench
Silverquill Black draws whenever a creature with a +1/+1 counter on it dies
golden plover
Oh wait how do you set that up then
golden plover
Play the white one to put counters on it and then play him?
I guess that's technically synergy
lusty trench
The black side also places counters tho so
twilit canyon
the rw deans also work toether
*together
iirc so does the gb deans
and ur deans
lusty trench
The green black deans do too
twilit canyon
so just the ug deans dont really work
glad peak
The deans were weird designs, they work well together but you can only have 1 out at a time if you’re playing commander like they’re probably designed for
twilit canyon
yeah its like they wanted partner
lusty trench
Nah the UG deans do work together
twilit canyon
or partner with
glad peak
And for other formats you only have 4 total which is about 2 total average
golden plover
I guess the idea in commander is you play one, then when they die, flip them to the other side
golden plover
I do like [[Extus, Oriq Overlord]] tho
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Legendary Creature — Human Warlock
Double strike
Magecraft — Whenever you cast or copy an instant or sorcery spell, return target nonlegendary creature card from your graveyard to your hand.
"Join me for the dawn of a new age."
2/4
Awaken the Blood Avatar 
Sorcery
As an additional cost to cast this spell, you may sacrifice any number of creatures. This spell costs less to cast for each creature sacrificed this way.
Each opponent sacrifices a creature. Create a 3/6 black and red Avatar creature token with haste and "Whenever this creature attacks, it deals 3 damage to each opponent."
glad peak
If one of them dies then the other costs much more which makes them even more awkward
golden plover
If I didn't already have a bunch of Mardu commanders, I'd build him
He enables his other side and then the other side actually has a cool payoff?
glad peak
Building this guy soon, just good stuff combo with a aristocrats plan b and beatdown plan c
lusty trench
My perception on commanders has twisted to the point where if they're not giving me card advantage I don't play them
twilit canyon
vihaan is highly praised as a really cool commander to build
lusty trench
It's painful to break away from
twilit canyon
My perception on commanders has twisted to the point where if they're not giving...
brainrot
golden plover
Yeah looking at the deans there's like 3 that have synergy
lusty trench
TBF I am champion of brainrot
golden plover
Quandrix, Silverquill, and Prismari
The Witherbloom ones SORTA work together but not really
lusty trench
Can we talk about the legendary dragon cycles
golden plover
And what the fuck is going on with [[Plargg, Dean of Chaos]]
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Legendary Creature — Orc Shaman
, Discard a card: Draw a card.
, : Reveal cards from the top of your library until you reveal a nonlegendary, nonland card with mana value 3 or less. You may cast that card without paying its mana cost. Put all revealed cards not cast this way on the bottom of your library in a random order.
2/2
Augusta, Dean of Order
Legendary Creature — Human Cleric
Other tapped creatures you control get +1/+0.
Other untapped creatures you control get +0/+1.
Whenever you attack, untap each creature you control, then tap any number of creatures you control.
1/3
lusty trench
And how they're all boring
golden plover
These cards have like anti-synergy
twilit canyon
attack to untap to tap to discard draw or pay the mana
golden plover
Like they outright do not work together at all
glad peak
The colors for vihaan are good enough I think and vihaan being a secondary win con just works
twilit canyon
you can either have plaarg be a 3/2 or a 2/3 if you want
glad peak
But probably bad compared to dihada
golden plover
But they're not both at once outside of commander or multiple copies
twilit canyon
well thats the problem yes
golden plover
And there's really better things to be doing than 3 mana for Augusta being a bad anthem
lusty trench
The colors for vihaan are good enough I think and vihaan being a secondary win c...
Oh I'm absolutely not saying don't build him, I'm just saying my mind has been ruined because I'm a greedy bastard of an izzet player and if I don't see words akin to "draw a card" on my commander the izzet gremlin in me gets upset
golden plover
These two just do not work together
twilit canyon
untapped things after you attack has synergy with extra combats
its not the worst card
golden plover
Yeah but you've got better options in that color for that effect as a commander
And in standard, neither of these even did what Lorehold wanted
Plargg loots, which at least helped so Lorehold's "artifacts in your graveyard" theme
lusty trench
I love how for aftermath they were like "how about we put two deans in the same colour together"
twilit canyon
plaarg def helped the lorehold thing
golden plover
But Lorehold didn't go wide
lusty trench
golden plover
I love how for aftermath they were like "how about we put two deans in the same ...
Can't forget Plargg died canonically
lusty trench
Like damn this card goes hard even if it is Timmy central
golden plover
Like before this card was printed, Plargg got killed by Killian
lusty trench
No he didn't what are you talking about he's right there see
I see him so he's fine
golden plover
Me when I fall off a roof and get impaled by ink magic
lusty trench
I'd revive myself too if I died to Killian tbh
twilit canyon
Plargg was one of the surviving professors after the New Phyrexian Invasion and took part in the restoration of Strixhaven.
golden plover
But it's okay because they forgot to print this team up card in the main set
twilit canyon
golden plover
Wait it's Nasari then
I forgot which one died
But Killian pushed one of the red deans off the roof
twilit canyon
nope
nassari was compleated and then uncompleated cus ifrits can just like
reshape their body upon death
since they cant actually die die
lusty trench
She said "I do not vibe with this, begone"
golden plover
But it fixed her so it's okay
twilit canyon
nassari was thrown off the roof once quint completed his big spell
golden plover
Yeah
There were a bunch of random "this character got killed off screen" moments in MOM
twilit canyon
no wait
After being compleated during New Phyrexia's Invasion of the Multiverse, Shaile's tongue and beak were replaced by a spreading web of metal filaments.[1] She attacked the remaining students but was thwarted by Embrose Lu.
lusty trench
The word kill isn't in Killian's wiki
golden plover
Because Killian is kind of a nobody character and it just randomly happened
Oh wait it's the lady who didn't even get a legendary
This one
She's named in one of Killian's stories and he fights her in MOM
lusty trench
I’ll always praise strixhaven for giving me veyran
Who sadly looked infinitely cooler when I thought the blue part was their head
glad peak
Oh I'm absolutely not saying don't build him, I'm just saying my mind has been r...
Yep, eventually I landed on the thought that if I rule of law people then it becomes extra draw 
lusty trench
Hopefully your playgroup is kind on stax
glad peak
Eh it’ll be similar amounts they’re used to
sleek ferry
[[veyran]]
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sleek ferry
I’m confused as to which blue part you thought was their head
Thank god for that eye exam
lusty trench
One moment
I thought that was the head with flames behind it
Didn’t see the face
I might actually pick up a pencil for the first time in a while and draw what I think they looked like
copper pecan
we need a tefurry planeswalker that costs uwu
golden plover
I'm like p sure I recognize that artist despite resolution being shit
I think they just outright actually got a furry artist
(I know Ilse Gort already does art for the game)
trail anvil
"But it's not the furry set tho"
didn't we already establish jace and ral both have fursonas
granite badge
I think they just outright actually got a furry artist
Its very much not the first time lol
I mean heck the main one posts their art on FA
sudden lava
Building this guy soon, just good stuff combo with a aristocrats plan b and beat...
The Brode commander
golden plover
https://www.furaffinity.net/view/41372865/
That's Ilse Gort, yeah
copper pecan
atomic harness
can't believe they literally banned fun
Right?? nooo
copper pecan
yet another "classic broken card but it uses energy"
sleek ferry
This is kinda just a handloop no?
sleek ferry
Ah didn’t see the may
Nvm
This is kinda eh then
Also it’s hard to judge when we don’t know what color a potential energy deck would look like
We assume green def
golden plover
Nah this sucks since it's "each player may"
You've gotta go all in and it only ever benefits the opponent
twilit canyon
x cannot be less than the amount of cards in your opponent's hand
golden plover
Oh yeah, this is dogshit then
trail anvil
well it can be, I just imagine people wouldn't take that unless they really wanna dump a shitty hand
paying 7 energy sounds like a lot lol
twilit canyon
if your opponent has 5 in hand
and you pay 3 energy,
they can keep their best 2 cards and mull the other 3
it needs to match their hand size overall to discourage them fixing their hand that way
atomic harness
you said it
golden plover
Even at 7, the "may" means they can choose 0
golden plover
they can keep their best 2 cards and mull the other 3
It doesn't work that way. It's all or nothing
But they can choose to not discard if you'd be giving them less cards/they wanna keep what's in hand
trail anvil
yeah I was confused lol
trail anvil
rip to anyone who gets this as their rare
granite badge
Opp will never choose to wheel unless they get more cards/unflood their hand
golden plover
Yeah, it only ever benefits them
It only benefits you if you sink 7+ energy into it
And even then, they get to draw 7 for free
sleek ferry
Yeah this is probably the worst rare we’ve seen so far
Probably the worst new card we’ve seen
golden plover
I think its unplayable
sleek ferry
A casual commander player will tell you that this card is everything mtg is about
Probably
glad peak
A casual commander player will tell you that this card is broken because wheel of fortune is broken and this is clearly close enough
modern minnow
Once they read it nobody will think it's good dw
atomic harness
its so much worse wow nvm
It's wheelover
glad peak
Well at least my energy minicube is eating good
clever sun
What will this wheel's impact be for the Penny Dreadful meta?
copper pecan
it will impact the trout population
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copper pecan
i remember opening that in my first draft of rna and thinking "wow this card is awful"
i had only been playing for a few months at the time so i wasn't very good at evaluating cards yet
golden plover
I mean, you're right
But if you really wanna wheel in Penny, I guess you play [[Wheel of Fate]]
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Sorcery
Suspend 4— (Rather than cast this card from your hand, pay and exile it with four time counters on it. At the beginning of your upkeep, remove a time counter. When the last is removed, you may cast it without paying its mana cost.)
Each player discards their hand, then draws seven cards.
golden plover
Penny has [[Dark Confidant]] apparently
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Sorcery
Search your library for a basic land card, reveal it, put it into your hand, then shuffle. You get 
(two energy counters).
"I've never seen a world where aether weaves through every aspect of nature."
zinc shard
Oh nvm that's a bad rate
sudden lava
golden plover
Tbh the sticker cards were a hassle to play with
And having to bring extra decks to every event sucked
golden plover
Even in limited, they were really annoying
The stickers fell off after like the 2nd match
And they slowed the game down too much
Attractions were fine in limited tho
copper pecan
i feel like unfinity would have been a lot better if it focused on either stickers or attractions but not both
having both was way too much
golden plover
Yeah, and honestly stickers were just a dud mechanic
Felt like they wanted to copy LCGS too hard
broken fjord
I appreciate stickers if only because it spawned Wicker Picker and its Sticker Kicker ability. What a silly joke.
trail anvil
heist really is everywhere rn tho huh
do you just play more fun 1-ofs to dilute the pool
crokeyz seems obsessed with pillage the bog
waxen timber
I wish they would have just errata-ed Sticker Goblin to be the MTGO effect.
That would fix the problem of everyone feeling like they had to bring stickers to events while keeping around very cool decks
Sticker Goblin into War Cry Goblin is peak magic
fallow citrus
golden plover
This is like almost pauper playable
If it gave you a bit of energy on ETB it'd be good, but I don't see a pauper energy deck popping up
golden plover
Also weird to see umbra armor on a card that isn't umbra based
golden plover
Definitely fake then unless it's the first ai art on an actual card
But the umbra armor feels too wrong for me to buy it
lusty trench
That and this feels like a reactionary creation to both all that glitters ban and them saying there is a card that could get banned in pauper
golden plover
This wouldn't even get banned in pauper
It's like fringe playable unless there's a pauper energy deck
copper pecan
this is also way more parasitic than any of the other energy cards we've seen in this set
golden plover
Energy is inherently a pretty parasitic mechanic
But this just doesn't feel like a design that'd be used
Especially with the random umbra armor and the ai art
If this ends up being real, I'll be stunned
copper pecan
all of the other energy cards we've seen in the set give you energy instead of just expecting you to already have it is what i mean
lusty trench
WUMPUS
sudden lava
theft ramp
lusty trench
This card is a machine that turns kozileks into draw 10s
bronze bronze
what are some good cards for a klauth commander deck?
golden plover
Wait this card is stupid
It makes your elementals ramp
And it makes your affinity creatures draw
Thought Monitor becomes a 1-2 mana draw 5
Wait it also draws 3 off murktide
fallow citrus
I hate to inform you that thought monitor already draws cards
so it would be a draw 5
but also no enchantment is touching my affinity list
golden plover
I read the thing as "draw 2" and forgot how to type
But yeah, probably not affinity
But that seems dumb as hell to let murktide draw 3 and the elementals ramp
Actually is this not just stupid good in affinity?
Frogmite makes 2 bodies that you can crack to cast bigger guys
Sojourner's companion draws 3 and thought monitor draws 5
Synthesizer and Frogmyr help you fill gaps
And then you kill them with Kappa
twilit canyon
no one is playing this is in murktide
or affinity
3 mana is too much to spend on something not immediately impacting the board
golden plover
I mean it turns all your cards into ancestral recalls
That feels like it should be worthwhile
twilit canyon
it isnt
golden plover
I don't know enough about modern to know why, but I feel like in any other format this is wacky
I've seen legacy players talking about it for affinity there
Not sure why it wouldn't work in modern but would in legacy
twilit canyon
cus legacy has fow
they can defend a shit card
modern does not
even in legacy its not really going to be good
its not up the beanstalk
golden plover
Beanstalk draws 1
This draws 3
Beanstalk has more MV, but this fills those slots with minor ramp
twilit canyon
beanstalk draws 1 on etb too
and is infinitely easier to keep chaining
this only draws on creatures with mv 7 or higher
golden plover
Yeah that's fair, but that's fine for most affinity creatures iirc
Thought Monitor, Sojourner's Companion, and Frogmyr are all 7+
twilit canyon
outside of murktide, what creature is being actually cast at that mana value? affinity creatures already struggle vs obm
golden plover
And you've got the new ancient tomb
lusty trench
Frogmyr on etb (he has 200 archers aimed on his position)
golden plover
He doesn't need to live, he's drawing you 3 cards
twilit canyon
he does...
golden plover
0 mana draw 3 sounds cool
twilit canyon
its 3 mana draw 3 also the card didnt contribute to making it cost 0
golden plover
Yeah fair
I dunno, it's probably not as good as it reads, but it feels like it'd be crazy in the right shell
twilit canyon
also on top of that its drawing cards (redundant to a deck that is known for drawing cards) and is only going to help you die to obm more than you do
fallow citrus
cus legacy has fow
also you can definitely go ancient tomb petal into it t1 if nothing else
like it's just easier to drop the card in legacy but like
my other 3 drop option in affinity is [[simulacrum synthesizer]]
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fallow citrus
which has infinitely more synergy
twilit canyon
you play synth over this every single time
sudden lava
you think we will get Jeskai George Washington?
copper pecan
chill dude it's just a card game
fallow citrus
jeskai george washington sounds funny ngl
golden plover
I mean I'm exaggerating
I just think it's almost guaranteed
And having real people on magic cards is gross
Since this is a "direct to modern" set, I'm curious how many non-legends there are gonna be in AC
There's kinda like.... None in the franchise?
Like I guess they'll make a couple random uncommons for revolutionary war soldiers or whatever (weird) to fill the gaps
sudden lava
Twitter
golden plover
But it's not like LotR where they can do thematic uncommons
Also... Every creature is gonna be human
That's weird
sudden lava
jeskai george washington sounds funny ngl
yep, and wouldnt be the first time we got a clearly america card in the colors
golden plover
There's like a couple aliens in AC but I don't think they'll do any of them?
Because no one likes the alien lore
trail anvil
I just don't like the various themes put into magic
everyone always brings up secret lairs for cards done in different styles, but those are variations of existing cards anyways so they aren't as common and usually they have much better art
trail anvil
also sometimes I randomly have to rechoose art styles when ordering cards because it defaults to the most recent printing in a universes beyond product 
golden plover
But Dr Who and Assassin's Creed are a ton of real world and sci-fi stuff
It's like super jarring
trail anvil
dr. who to me is even fine usually just cause the art looks fine
golden plover
Especially for AC since almost all the story characters are real historical figures
trail anvil
assassin's creed, fallout and jurassic park just annoy me
ezio in particular just feels like a custom card
golden plover
Going "Oh I block your Leonardo Da Vinci with Alexander Hamilton" feels... Wrong
golden plover
ezio in particular just feels like a custom card
100%. It's the shitty wubrg effect so you can play him as a 5c commander
Like just make the assassin typal stuff all in Mardu or Grixis or whatever
I guess they want you to be able to run Conner with Washington tho and the lame ass Greek ones with the Simic Plato or whatever
Honestly, assassin's creed is just such a tonally bad franchise for MTG
Honestly, assassin's creed is just such a tonally bad franchise for MTG
Fixed it
trail anvil
sudden lava
hoping we get something new in terms of pirate commanders, and not the same old
golden plover
Nah, you know they'll just be a Dimir "steal things" guy
I don't remember much about black flag, but I don't think they'll do anything new there
And it definitely won't be typal
The only typal for the set is assassin
sudden lava
The only typal for the set is assassin
thopter
Da Vinci aside, we could get a couple if they give us Yasuke and Naoe (and the previously mentioned Kenway is confirmed)
broken fjord
Built Pride of the Hull Clade a bit ago. Really liking the deck, despite my general dislike of simic. Feels more like green stompy with crazy card draw. Cactus Preserve and Watchful Radstag are mvps.
sudden lava
new deck box Im getting
trail anvil
worth noting: you can reveal a non-creature card if you feel like BMing or just showing off your shiny card
atomic harness
pog
urban crane
assassin's creed, fallout and jurassic park just annoy me
i feel that way about the upcomming marvel one
glad peak
Elvish piper in command zone, huh
Card advantage added to it too, technically
Can’t activate at flash speed so that makes this more boring
glad peak
Green in general*
Scratch that, infect pump mindgames are a lot more interesting than other things
golden plover
Pauper Infect is a stupid fun deck
Although it's also infect in a format where no one expects ot
granite badge
Based
atomic harness
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOoo3Ot8OMY&ab_channel=Cardmarket-Magic
||Proud of him kidge||
fallow citrus
