Magic the Gathering

[modern minnow]

heard it both ways that yugioh content is better than magic content and vice versa
wondering what opinions people have as someone who mostly just dabbles in magic youtubers

[atomic harness]

I really like cardmarket, mengu and the guy who only plays legacy vintage modern in mtgo (harrymtg)

Cardmarket's yugi is kinda bad in comparison

[modern minnow]

yeah tbh the only good series is obliterate

also cardmarket magic has kinda gone crazy recently

[atomic harness]

Carl jamin thoralf

[rich bronze]

FoN FoW and Fierce guardianship

Oh and Pact too

[rich bronze]

In general yugi content is more entertaining

magic has a few great creators but everyone takes themselves way too seriously

[modern minnow]

tbh my problem is that 70% of mtg content feels like its a commander gameplay show

[rich bronze]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Qtt3Xct7o14

MagicAIDS is hilarious

He has this uh… persona

but he’s amazing at the game

[modern minnow]

i think mark and gavin are pretty cool and theres like no yugioh equivalent for them

[rich bronze]

I don’t think we have a yugioh equivalent of magicaids

[rigid scarab]

Magic the Noah used to have really fun deck techs

Until he found a video style that worked

[modern minnow]

i wouldn't count magic the noah as an mtg youtuber anymore ngl

kinda insane the people he gets on

[rigid scarab]

I need help cutting down the cost of a deck

[rich bronze]

How much is it

[rich bronze]

$ cost or mana cost

[rigid scarab]

Cost

It's for my brother who rn is having second thoughts about it

It's $136 USD

And an Elenda deck

[rich bronze]

I mean $136 sounds pretty budget

Any $20+ cards in it

[rigid scarab]

Most expensive card is Dreadhorde General

Can I show you the list

[rich bronze]

Sure

[rigid scarab]

https://www.moxfield.com/decks/tR-Zl6fKykqLsg46UxaIuA

I wanna separate between

Card that is vital

And

Card that is just really good

[lusty trench]

Remove Liliana put in harvester of souls

Same CMC, same effect you care about, and costs a shit ton less, easier to remove sure but like it keeps the price down

[rigid scarab]

Trying to hit below $100

[rich bronze]

seconded

What do I do with this

[rigid scarab]

Take it out of the sleeves and dunk it in water

[rich bronze]

Yeah but https://www.cardkingdom.com/mtg/dissension/blood-crypt-foil

[sleek ferry]

I think mtg has more possibilities in terms of what you can make content out of. Issue is 85% of channels just default to a version of commander

[rich bronze]

$679.99 shockland is funny

[sleek ferry]

Cardmarket is the only one that really seems to try to hit all formats/content types

Also, I can’t for the life of me watch any mtgo content

[rigid scarab]

The MTG youtuber is either commander or recent events rant

[granite badge]

Yugioh content is more varied but there's a lot more bigotry under the hood

A lot of the big names and even the ones with okay producation value like dgygo have said some stuff

[rigid scarab]

And brian kibler tweeted about supporting nfts

[sleek ferry]

I think we should just enjoy what cardmarket is giving us, because it’s only a matter of time till that specific group goes it’s separate ways

The best standard deck of all time tournament was fun

[copper pecan]

it bothers me so much that nobody is making anything like history of yugioh or the progression series but for mtg

[fallow citrus]

mtg has like

pro player stream vods

commander channels

cardmarket

[rigid scarab]

I've been thinking about this for a while

I'd love to do a thing where like

You draft every single set in progression

[copper pecan]

i feel like you would need to skip a lot of the earlier sets since they have awful limited formats

[rigid scarab]

Nah

It would be funny

If Prog can dedicate an episode to Duelist Packs

MTG can dedicate an episode to Homelands

[sleek ferry]

I tried to make new Tazri in hbrawl

holy shit she's terrible

[golden plover]

A big issue with this, unless they do it on something like tabletop sim or forge, is that you're either gonna have to proxy entire sets, or it's just not doable

A box of Beta is gonna set you back... Oh just $200k

[sleek ferry]

idt prog works in mtg either tbh

[golden plover]

I mean, you could do it

But it's definitely not doable with the actual physical cards

Like if you proxy up the reserved list packs, maybe

But also, yeah a lot of the old packs are bad and boring

No one is gonna be excited for the episode where everyone drafts The Dark

[sleek ferry]

also, like if we want just fun drafting experiences

mystery booster boxes are just that

and you will never get the same draft

I actually need to get around to buying a box

[golden plover]

Mystery Booster was by far the best draft experience in recent times honestly

[sleek ferry]

its between that and CL1 for me tbh

[golden plover]

Lots of cheap affordable reprints, powerful cards, weird cards, and the playtest ones

Yeah CL1 was really good too

[sleek ferry]

Aren't you in northern VA now saint?

[golden plover]

I'm in the Hampton Roads area

So not Northern, but not Southern either

About to be working with an investment company so my contract will have me here for 2 years

[last glen]

One of the understated differences between the YGO and MTG communities
is that MTG has no good unofficial simulators, auto or manual

[golden plover]

There's forge, but most people don't know about it

And then you can do tabletop sim, but that's also a bit harder to use

[sleek ferry]

what does forge look like

[meager isle]

My friends play digimon tcg on tabletop sim lol

[trail anvil]

they just snuck that shit in there

surprised they didn't try to rebalance it instead

also I don't think you get new wildcards if you already got it for the standard bans

also crucias got nerfed to 3/1, which feels like a kinda weird place to hit it but ig now it dies to cut down and heathook?

oh and bowmaster, that's kinda important

next up are ring and bowmasters themselves ig?

[sleek ferry]

Ring yes

Bowmasters no please

I love watching midrange kill themselves

[sudden lava]

new cards?

[trail anvil]

no, new ban and nerf

this deck is hilarious

verdant rejuvenation cascaded into alrund's epiphany

[golden plover]

Lmao they banned a card in the "we don't ban cards, just adjust them" format

Actually isn't this the second time they did that?

[sleek ferry]

this isn't the first alchemy ban idt

[golden plover]

[[Grinning Ignus]] had to pay for some other card's sins

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/stx/104/grinning-ignus

Grinning Ignus <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manar:292901508796645397>

Creature — Elemental
, Return Grinning Ignus to its owner's hand: Add . Activate only as a sorcery.
On rare occasions, a Prismari student will summon an elemental that shows such promise that it's permitted to stay and enroll.
2/2

[trail anvil]

yeah ignus

fun stuff

[golden plover]

Should've just nerfed the card that caused the issue and not ignus tbh

[sleek ferry]

anywas, it will be REALLY funny when they try to nerf the one ring

because there's no clear way to nerf it without completely changing the way it works mechanically

[golden plover]

Wouldn't taking the ring's protection away do a big chunk

[sleek ferry]

taking away indestructible from it?

[golden plover]

Yeah

And your 1 turn protection

[sleek ferry]

yeah that works ig, but then it stops being thematically correct

which is the issue with these UB cards

[golden plover]

Since a lot of the issue with the ring is that you can be in a losing situation, progenitus yourself for a turn, then fix it

And if you can't, play a new ring into it

That's the other thing. The ring should give YOU the counters, not put them on itself

[sleek ferry]

wild guess here, but I'm like 90% sure the reason we're getting the new Alchemy cards in September is due to the one ring just being the most broken thing in that format

and the format not being high powered enough to deal with it

I wouldn't be surprised if we get a bunch of stuff with "exile" in its text come the new alchemy cards

format is terrible rn though

and i liked it before lotr

the format just wasn't equipped to take a power leap like this

[clever sun]

This is super confusing. It's rotating in about a month and a half

[trail anvil]

I think it's a t3f style ban where they're just effectively doing an early rotation

[zinc shard]

So Alchemy's not following the new Standard Rotation scheme

[sleek ferry]

this was confirmed already

[twilit canyon]

yea alchemy will rotate like normal

[rigid scarab]

Tell em

[golden plover]

Still super weird they're banning the card instead of nerfing it

[rigid scarab]

Oh

We got enemy battlebonds in CMM

[twilit canyon]

yall talkin about fable ban like it matters

when they fucking nerfed crucias

yall goofy

[sleek ferry]

we said this

[twilit canyon]

nuh uh

[hidden ermine]

Oh did we get arena balance changes?

[sleek ferry]

yuh huh

[rigid scarab]

fym nuh uh

[hidden ermine]

Anything relevant to Ninjas?

[rigid scarab]

Also

[golden plover]

What'd I fucking say

[rigid scarab]

Planeswalker precon reveals

Reveals onstream, will get high quality pictures for more cards soon

[golden plover]

Even before other land cycles were crunched I went "it's gonna be battlebond lands lmao"

[fallow citrus]

oh these are loyalty counters on other cards

[golden plover]

Wait is that Lukka's cat?

[fallow citrus]

kind of cool you can just store loyalty on a card basically

[golden plover]

Oh gruff rewrites history is boring

Wait why does Lukka's cat have a name

[meager isle]

Isn’t lukkas cat a tiger?

[lusty trench]

Guff rewrites history revealing until you hit a non land is borrrrring

[golden plover]

Lukka never named it and immediately got it killed

[meager isle]

Yeah I don’t think that’s his cat

[lusty trench]

LMAO TEYOS ASS IS NEVER SEEING A MAINSET AGAIN

[golden plover]

Ayy my boi Teyo finally gets a second card

[fallow citrus]

lmfao

pramikon lite mf

[rigid scarab]

Chandra

[lusty trench]

They just can't figure out what tf to do with them

[golden plover]

Who the fuck is Vronos

[rigid scarab]

Killed by Garruk I think

Yeah

[golden plover]

Yeah

[lusty trench]

Yeah he's a walker that exists just so garruk can kill him

Lmao

[golden plover]

Weird, he's got a cool design

[rigid scarab]

I wonder

Where in the timeline is Legacy of Fire

[golden plover]

Also the Garruk serial killer stuff was the first recent wasted story arc

Would have been so cool to have a walker that travels planes hunting and killing walkers

https://preview.redd.it/pmh5detibrcb1.png?auto=webp&s=7c19ef71c1ce05ef812702fee3c04ac54b8c652c

Oh cool

It's WAR Sarkhan in blue

[rigid scarab]

Oh fuck

These reprints are fucked up

[golden plover]

https://preview.redd.it/19d30z7ecrcb1.png?auto=webp&s=3b1a557a4c63285ccc0dbdf018ea875fd3e5fe27

[rigid scarab]

Looking for value?

[golden plover]

Oh so they were TOTALLY 100% gonna kill off Nissa and Ajani

[rigid scarab]

Wait Nissa

[golden plover]

This looks like it was supposed to be art used from a version of MOM where they did actually kill off Nissa and Ajani

And then they went "actually they're totally fine"

[clever sun]

https://magic.wizards.com/en/news/mtg-arena/alchemy-rebalancing-for-july-18-2023

Yeah okay logic makes sense

Expose Crucias to cheap removal, early rotate Fable without hurting it in Historic and Historic Brawl

[rigid scarab]

Wait

A deck got revealed

@lusty trench

[lusty trench]

Thank you

[golden plover]

https://preview.redd.it/brniu4t6drcb1.png?auto=webp&s=32c858ee68604cc91355be66b96371ba444cca75

Full list in one image

Chain Veil reprint is actually really nice

[lusty trench]

Chainveil reprint is pog

[fallow citrus]

what does nahiri even have to bring out that is worth it in that list

[hidden ermine]

Who tf is Vronos

[lusty trench]

This list is fucking awful though lmao

[lusty trench]

Guy who died to garruk

In like the M15 trailer

That's all they did

[golden plover]

Oh yeah this list is kinda shit too

[sleek ferry]

[[the chain veil]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/m15/215/the-chain-veil

The Chain Veil <:mana4:292901508712890379>

Legendary Artifact
At the beginning of your end step, if you didn't activate a loyalty ability of a planeswalker this turn, you lose 2 life.
, : For each planeswalker you control, you may activate one of its loyalty abilities once this turn as though none of its loyalty abilities have been activated this turn.

[golden plover]

It's playable out the box I guess

[lusty trench]

No it's really not

[golden plover]

And it's worth it value wise because a lot of Planeswalkers have a single printing and are $10-$20

[lusty trench]

It's a planeswalker deck

[golden plover]

But it's not necessarily good or anything

[lusty trench]

It's a planes walker deck that has like

0 protection

[golden plover]

The creature selection is confusing as hell

[lusty trench]

The wanderer reprint is pretty good too

[golden plover]

That's the Nahiri that just loots and stuff

[[Nahiri, the Harbinger]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/c20/223/nahiri-the-harbinger

Nahiri, the Harbinger <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manar:292901508796645397><:manaw:1007102126813610074>

Legendary Planeswalker — Nahiri
+2: You may discard a card. If you do, draw a card.
−2: Exile target enchantment, tapped artifact, or tapped creature.
−8: Search your library for an artifact or creature card, put it onto the battlefield, then shuffle. It gains haste. Return it to your hand at the beginning of the next end step.
Loyalty: 4

[sleek ferry]

they should have reprinted the red creature card that puts a planeswalker on the field

[golden plover]

That's [[The Wanderer]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/war/37/the-wanderer

The Wanderer <:mana3:292901508771610624><:manaw:1007102126813610074>

Legendary Planeswalker
Prevent all noncombat damage that would be dealt to you and other permanents you control.
−2: Exile target creature with power 4 or greater.
Loyalty: 5

[golden plover]

Not the Wandering Emperor

[lusty trench]

OH WAIT ITS THE SHIT ONE NVM

[meager isle]

They’re not that nice

[golden plover]

Yeah she's $40

That can't be a slot in your $80 precon

We already gave you 4 $10 cards and a $20 card. Get over it

[fallow citrus]

yeah I know what nahiri it is, which is why I wonder if there's anything to -8 it for

[meager isle]

Wait is this the first precon to have swords and path?

[golden plover]

Chain Veil

[fallow citrus]

eh

[golden plover]

Nah, it happens every once in a while

[fallow citrus]

hardly emrakul

[golden plover]

Warhammer had both

[meager isle]

Oh right

[lusty trench]

I'm like pretty sure the only card of much value here is chainveil

[golden plover]

Honestly the creature selection is super fucking confusing

Yeah chain Veil, a couple walkers, and some lands

[lusty trench]

they reprinted three narsets except the one worth money (excluding aftermath)

[rigid scarab]

Honestly

[lusty trench]

This shit writes itself

[rigid scarab]

I can't remember the last non-UB commander deck that was like

[golden plover]

So we're 0/2 on precons not sucking

[rigid scarab]

Great

We've had good ones

Not very many great ones

And the MOM precons just sucked straight up

[golden plover]

Also I still can't get over the Chandra art implying that they totally planned to kill off Nissa and Ajani and then went "eh nah"

[lusty trench]

Hey respect knights and the stuff it brought to the table

Made the archetype cheap AF to build

[golden plover]

I wanna see what the original plan was for MOM because they CLEARLY rewrote the story last minute

[clever sun]

It wasn't written last minute

It has last minute plot point rewrites sure

[golden plover]

Literally a ton of the card and promo art contradicts the story we got

[clever sun]

But it was not a last-minute story

[golden plover]

They changed everything SUPER late into the story

[rigid scarab]

It was a shit story

But I wouldn't call it last minute

[lusty trench]

Says a lot when I think this is the best new card we got

If that 1 was a 2

[golden plover]

I'd assume the original was supposed to be way more devastating to the heroes

[clever sun]

Maybe? It already was. Even if they didn't they ended up desparked

[lusty trench]

How many new cards are there supposed to be per deck?

Oh right 10 including the face card

[clever sun]

What we can assume right now is that jusr Chandra, Quintorius, and Ajani are planeswalkers. Everyone else is tough luck.

[lusty trench]

Nvm thought I missed one

[lusty trench]

I'm assuming Elspeth is keeping hers unless I missed something

[rigid scarab]

I think planeswalkers losing sparks is the exception, not the norm

[golden plover]

I guess we'll have to see

[lusty trench]

Ob nixilus being stuck on new capenna is hilarious to me

[golden plover]

It's funny but it also literally doesn't fit his story

[lusty trench]

We aren't seeing him again for a long time

[golden plover]

He planeswalked away saying some villain shit at the end of the new Capenna story

[lusty trench]

Wasn't his literally only important thing he did was like

Fight nissa or something

And he lost like

Really badly

[golden plover]

Yeah

He was technically "The Adversary" in New Capenna

But nothing came from that

[sleek ferry]

@trail anvil why is winota so shit in hbrawl

i was like wtf

why am i getting only 1 trigger

off 6 attackers

[twilit canyon]

they nerfed winota in historic

ngl the nerf could be undone

it could have been undone ages ago

[sleek ferry]

nerf seems excessive, but idk the context of the initial nerf

[twilit canyon]

it was done during the mirror mirror event like 2 years ago

they let u play with at the time banned historic cards but readjusted to properly balance them at the time

[trail anvil]

honestly it probably could be unnerfed now yeah

in hbrawl there are a ton of must answer commanders that are have better outcomes

[sudden lava]

https://www.magicspoiler.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/Leori-Sparktouched-Hunter-400x559.jpg

Kitty

ooh Guff rewrites history is funny

[lusty trench]

Wait both of these precons have a single card worth around $30 as their main reprint

[twilit canyon]

real

[lusty trench]

So my bet is it's gonna be sylvan library or argothian enchantress for enchantment decks (big cope here I'm just not aware of any other big money enchantment) and emrakul eldritch moon for the eldrazi

[golden plover]

My money is on [[Chromatic Orrey]] for the eldrazi precon

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/m21/228/chromatic-orrery

Chromatic Orrery <:mana7:292901508540792835>

Legendary Artifact
You may spend mana as though it were mana of any color.
: Add .
, : Draw a card for each color among permanents you control.
Visitors marvel at its design, unaware of the other world that inspired it.

[golden plover]

Like $25, not too important, but cute enough

Oh wait nah

Maybe Darksteel Forge?

[dense berry]

there is no yugioh content anywhere close to the quality of MagicAids

oh nice i see some other folks linked him already

i keep getting time warped in this channel because its a thread

but yeah MagicAids is pro level, funny as hell, has great editing, makes amazing decklists

you cannot beat his quality

[twilit canyon]

yea hes fantastic

he invented modern 5c humans and a few other archetypes

[dense berry]

also the godfather of GW infect

and solemnity combo

and dimir 8 crab

and his decklists were responsible for the first wave of pioneer bans in the format

he should be in the hall of fame

[twilit canyon]

i wouldnt go that far lol but yes he is a consistent meta brewer

[dense berry]

i cant take mtggoldfish seriously ever since i found aids

[glad peak]

Wasn’t solemnity combo and 8 crab well known?

I’d credit him for really putting creativity on the map

[twilit canyon]

creativity yes

iirc during that time ppl disregarded 8 crabs since "it makes your opponents removal spells live"

[dense berry]

yeah after he made them

[glad peak]

No I mean I remember solemnity combo being discussed when it was spoiler season for their core cards and 8 crab being discussed during zendikar rising or whenever the second crab was printed

[twilit canyon]

it was rising

and yea i do remember it was discussed and some tried it but others disparaged it bc "removal"

[dense berry]

he made the video going either 5-0 or 10-0 in paid leagues with the crabs

i forget if it was consecutive undefeated leagues its been a while

[sudden lava]

[dense berry]

my queen

[copper pecan]

vronos
holy shit they actually gave him a card?

i thought this was never gonna happen

it's kinda good too

[golden plover]

His art is sick as hell

Too bad he'll never get another because he's dead

[lusty trench]

You know what this guy should've been the planes walker hunter

Tracking down and killing planes walkers for meddling in the affairs of other planes (back story could be something about how a planes walkers involvement ruined his life or whatever)

[golden plover]

He's cool as hell and it feels like such a waste to have him die for the basically nonexistent Garruk serial killer arc

Honestly? Yeah

He should have killed Garruk and then started hunting down other walkers that were interfering in shit

[lusty trench]

His spark ability could be being able to see the residual energy left behind from a planeswalk

[golden plover]

Yeah Vronos deserved better

It's not even like they did anything with the "Garruk is a serial killer" storyline

[lusty trench]

I love that mask he has on

[golden plover]

He killed Vronos, then vanished, and then was magical better

Honestly Garruk should have been around in WAR just picking off guys

[lusty trench]

I would've like the idea of a set that has its own thing going on

then suddenly garruk

He should be like a storm coming through

A reoccurring threat that's more challenging as the chain veils curse seeps in

[golden plover]

Honestly it'd be cool as hell

Like imagine you're on Capenna and then all of a sudden they find the body of some walker

And then Boom! Garruk is back

[lusty trench]

Just a black figure in a rainy alley lit up with purple eyes as they check the body

[golden plover]

See that'd be cool as hell

[lusty trench]

Hell you could make Vivian useful by having her track down the planes walker killer

And as their powers are similar to one another it'd make for an interesting fight

[golden plover]

Just give her SOMETHING to do, please

[sleek ferry]

@atomic harness https://youtu.be/olkQd1Der34

Carl is in charge of creative content for everything

[dense berry]

they wont let my friend cancel his preorder for commander masters

i guess a lot of people were trying to cancel

[lusty trench]

Hey that's probably illegal

dude should call his bank

[dense berry]

probably

i think we're just gonna madlad crack the packs

and hope to pull three jeweled lotuses

hopefully dodge these upshifts

[golden plover]

You've gotta pull 4, no?

Lotus is $75

You'd want at least 4 to hit $300

[dense berry]

maybe 3 + whatever the rest of the packs are worth will add up to a few bucks

[lusty trench]

I just realised Gideon isn't in the flames on the new planeswalker Chandra

My boy did not die to be disrespected like this

[golden plover]

Like I said, I'm p sure it's slush art from MOM

P sure it was from a version where Ajani and Nissa did die that didn't happen

[copper pecan]

according to maro it wasn't supposed to imply that any of the characters died

i really doubt it's slush art

[golden plover]

I dunno, it definitely gives off the "these are all my dead friends I'm fighting for" vibe in the art and name

Also, the art is just kinda bad?

Chris Rahn is a really good artist

https://preview.redd.it/19d30z7ecrcb1.png?auto=webp&s=3b1a557a4c63285ccc0dbdf018ea875fd3e5fe27

But Chandra looks kinda bad here

He's even drawn Chandra a lot better prior

But there's really no reason for it to be those 3 in specific if it wasn't supposed to be MOM slush art

Since her best friends were supposed to be Gideon, Nissa, and Jace

And Ajani and Jaya as mentors

Maro is obviously not gonna say "oh we fucked up" and he's been wrong prior

So I still think it's a weird piece of slush art

[copper pecan]

you say that about all the art you don't like though

[golden plover]

Sometimes it is just "this is kinda bad" but this is actively implying story beats that 100% didn't happen

Like if it's gonna be about the "legacy" and her fallen friends, it should have been Jaya and Gideon

Since Gideon is the reason Chandra became the main character she is now

OH WAIT WTF HER HAIR IS CLONE STAMPED

What the fuck why

Was it just so it'd stretch to the text box?

Look at the texture. It's 100% clone stamped

What

Okay yeah Chris posted the full one

They 100% clone stamped her hair

@lusty trench I feel like you'd appreciate this

[atomic harness]

Carl is the best kid

[twilit canyon]

this format is fucking insanely fun

v cliqued someone off muxus twice in a row

[twilit canyon]

this is actually the coolest format

just

hands down

[dense berry]

damn that is the worst chandra art ive seen

i normally love rahn

[zinc shard]

Ah yes my favorite card, "Chandra, Legacy Ire"

[atomic harness]

Loot dont look at into the fire chandra

[dense berry]

huh cant find that one

[twilit canyon]

real

bbe -> nactl hold up leyline binding

with crucias and scions as back up

this format is actually so good

like actually so cool

[dense berry]

that is quite the shovel face

the wrenn face looks ok

this is probably my favorite chandra

[twilit canyon]

maybe shelly + ring is good enough to see play in this but

i like how tuned and focused this list is as-is

[dense berry]

triome looks not worth it when your only white symbols in main are a 2x samwise

[twilit canyon]

its a late-game cycling land or a t1 fixer. it helps with the mana pips in case i do need to cast sam in an honest way

its def the weakest but by the numbers in terms of symbols + mana costs its "free"

[dense berry]

id recommend more clearings

maybe + 1 clearing +1 peatland

tap lands are the enemy of tempo

which just seems like the opposite of what you want for a rock deck like this

[twilit canyon]

its a combo deck

did i post the wrong screen?

no its def the sam cat combo list

after testing it a bit, the mana base is fine as mentioned. its free but the issue is actually my card choices. 2 sams is fine. woe strider is ok. cat combo is fine with sam. but i still likely want bowmasters

[rich bronze]

@rigid scarab so your bro wants a vampire deck right

I’m thinking of making one just to play this

Probably the rarest card I own… in total I think there’s maybe 100-150 out there tops ( russian foil ayami showcase sorin )

[lusty trench]

Ew

[rigid scarab]

Dunk that in water too

[glad peak]

Dunk it in milk

[lusty trench]

https://www.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/153578o/wotc_now_claiming_the_new_precons_arent_premium/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=13&utm_content=2

Uh ohhhhh

[glad peak]

Uh huh

[sleek ferry]

yeah, that's a shit show, and more than likely something the hosts weren't supposed to say?

[atomic harness]

[rigid scarab]

Could be just a slip in words?

Like

[sudden lava]

today is enchantments

[rigid scarab]

What do you think would happen to the PR guy if he's truthful in his answer

[sudden lava]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/448940916833648640/1130927442106798110/image.png

https://www.magicspoiler.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/Anikthea-Hand-of-Erebos-Commander-Masters-Spoiler.png

[rigid scarab]

Wait enchantments

@lusty trench

@lusty trench

[lusty trench]

YEEEEEEAHHHH I CANT WAIT TO SEE HOW THEY FUCK IT UP

[sudden lava]

legendary 6/6 nightmare god with menace and deathtouch and the new impetus coming

for sure today

[rigid scarab]

Where's it being spoiled

[sudden lava]

CommandZone

[rigid scarab]

In other news

The LOTR Game Knights already has more views than the MOM Game Knights

Maybe just maybe

Better games equals better rewatchability

[sudden lava]

https://youtu.be/4E8jxhn5ZEo?t=40

commander masters reveal season almost over, been a good reveal season

[rigid scarab]

Has it really

I feel like the more players start to proxy during reveal season

The worst your reveal season is

And a good 40% of my magic feed during reveal season was about how cool and awesome and based proxying is

[sudden lava]

and reveals for this will be soon

[rigid scarab]

I can't wait for the UB precons to be inconspicuously much better than CMM precons

[sudden lava]

Just saw episode 6 last night, and absolutely loving Rose Tyler. Sure I missed out the classic era but maybe I'll watch it some other time.

I like how all of them include blue, it just fits

[zinc shard]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2i98OjsXcg

[rigid scarab]

PleasantKenobi Don't Make a Commander Masters Video Challenge

[sleek ferry]

PleasantKenobi don't tweet about Commander Masters Challenge

I don't even follow the dweeb and I keep seeing him pop up on my timeline

[sudden lava]

oh 9:08, time for reveals

[sleek ferry]

what channel is revealing the enchantments list?

[sudden lava]

command zone

not up yet, 😦

https://www.youtube.com/@commandcast/videos

[rich bronze]

They should include each of FoW, FoN and Fierce Guardianship in each of them

[golden plover]

Hey he said a couple nice things about LOTR

Not much, but some

But yeah, it's kinda his bit now to just hate everything

[sleek ferry]

He's going down the Professor path

of just getting views/social media interaction off negativity

[golden plover]

The professor actually does like various wotc things

He just doesn't get to talk about them as much because there's way more shit he dislikes

[sleek ferry]

I will say he's toned it down a bit recently

but before he started up shuffle up and play

it was consistent

[meager isle]

Loved his product reviews but when he started opinion pieces eh

[sudden lava]

what is FoW and FoN again?

[rich bronze]

Force of will force of negation

[sudden lava]

oh right

they should

[golden plover]

God I hope the enchantment deck reprints [[Greater Auramancy]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/shm/7/greater-auramancy

Greater Auramancy <:mana1:292901508373282827><:manaw:1007102126813610074>

Enchantment
Other enchantments you control have shroud. (A permanent with shroud can't be the target of spells or abilities.)
Enchanted creatures you control have shroud.
A delicate veil of glamers can prove as sturdy as iron.

[golden plover]

But I know for a fact they won't because $40

[rigid scarab]

He did literally just make a video on his favourite mechanics

[sleek ferry]

isn't this just an example of an expensive card solely due to it not being reprinted in years

also it's 26 on tcgplayer for an LP copy

[golden plover]

Yeah pretty much

It's not particularly crazy or anything

But it has exactly 1 reprint, a judge promo, and those historically don't help with prices

The judge promo is weird as hell too

It's Emeria, but on Theros???

[sleek ferry]

i could see it get reprinted tbh

they reprinted that one $400 card in commander masters

and it's not even good

and the price already crashed

[golden plover]

Not sure what connection Emrakul has to Theros to be in the art?

But it's 100% Emeria

[twilit canyon]

theros may be a world emrakul has visited

[golden plover]

Could be, but there's really nothing else about Emrakul seeing Theros. Just the one art

[fallow citrus]

I don't see the similarity past wings+hood

[golden plover]

The tentacle ribbons

There's a big part of the Emeria design

Also Theros is an Archon plane and not an angel one

[lusty trench]

This is emrakul just showing up to theros, going "not impressed, I can do that too" and leaving

[golden plover]

Lmao true

[dense berry]

the reason the negativity is cranked up is because the corporate greed has been increasing gradually for years

[golden plover]

Yeah the professor does genuinely say he really does love magic

It's just been harder for him to enjoy it lately

[dense berry]

you can see in his videos he does try to be positive about what he can

the prof and kenobi

[sleek ferry]

prof found negativity in MH2 lol that ain;t genuine

kenobi is just a bum

[golden plover]

MH2 had a lot to be negative about tbh

He used to love modern and he didn't enjoy what it did to the format

[sleek ferry]

set wise? That's just untrue.

MH2 made the format better

[dense berry]

modern horizons literally added a rotation to modern

[golden plover]

It was also the start of "premium products being almost double the price"

[dense berry]

why wouldnt somebody be upset

[golden plover]

It might have made the format more diverse in decks, but it made it way less diverse in sets

[dense berry]

its a completely different format

if you enjoyed modern before get fucked

regardless of if you enjoy modern now

[rigid scarab]

Kenobi's titles and thumbnails tell a completely different story

Call it necessary clickbait but

[golden plover]

Out of the top 10 creatures, all but 2 are MH cards

Out of the top 10 cards

50% are MH cards

[lusty trench]

I will shit on MH2 a lot

[golden plover]

It's not a secret that the MH sets forced a rotation in modern

It's an entirely different format

[lusty trench]

Subjective

[golden plover]

MH2 admittedly has a lot of good card designs and is a blast to draft

[sleek ferry]

the evoke elementals aren't even a huge issue. Shit like Orcish Bowmasters is way more problematic than the Evoke elementals

[golden plover]

But it did DAMAGE to the modern the Proff played

I think a cycle of literally free versions of iconic spells is kinda bad design

[lusty trench]

Me when I make a better bolt 0 mana

(it also has double strike too cause why tf not)

[dense berry]

bowmaster is newer than mh2 its printed for the post rotation modern format

[golden plover]

Yeah Bowmasters was designed for the rotated modern of now

Doesn't mean card might not be an issue

But the MH sets were literally designed to rotate modern

And that pissed off a lot of people when the format was billed as a non-rotating one

[sleek ferry]

what I will say is that bowmasters gets to come in and be a real big fuck you to midrange/tempo decks which is a welcomed addition

I actually don't mind bowmasters anywhere near as much as say the one ring

[golden plover]

Proff also played janky t2 modern decks

He was playing merfolk

Which could top every once in a while, but was tier 2

And now tier 2 means "decks from before MH with MH cards" so pet decks are tier 3-4

[rigid scarab]

Can't wait for the Pioneer-specific set

[sleek ferry]

Hammer Time plays 2 MH2 cards

and is one of the best decks in the format

yawgmoth plays 3?

[lusty trench]

https://tenor.com/view/spiderman-three-gif-19489818

[sudden lava]

enchantment reveals out yet?

[lusty trench]

Kaldra compleat, esper sentinel and sanc en vac

[golden plover]

Yawgmoth himself is an MH card

[sleek ferry]

rhinos plays 3

talking mh2 cards

[golden plover]

His existence literally enables the whole archetype

MH2 wasn't the rotation point

MH1 was

The thing is MH2 was much more consistent about rotation

But MH1 had crazier highs

More MH2 than 1 cards see play, but both sets rotated the format

[lusty trench]

It's Yu-Gi-Oh style power creep within a format where no major changes were expected

[golden plover]

Hell, the summer of [[Hogaak]] happened

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/mh1/202/hogaak-arisen-necropolis

Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis <:mana5:292901508796645386><:manabg:292901508863754241><:manabg:292901508863754241>

Legendary Creature — Avatar
You can't spend mana to cast this spell.
Convoke, delve (Each creature you tap while casting this spell pays for or one mana of that creature's color. Each card you exile from your graveyard pays for .)
You may cast Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis from your graveyard.
Trample
8/8

[sleek ferry]

also, this is less rotation, and moreso power creep on a 2-3 year time period (which is still 4-6 times longer than yugioh btw)

[golden plover]

It's sort of both

Consider it something like DUEA

Where a single set was so strong it completely changed the top decks

We know Konami does that on purpose and we can assume WoTC did the same

[sleek ferry]

Well that's the point though, MH2 might have changed the top decks, but it didn't leave you at a "play these 2-3 decks or be shit out of luck"

that's why the ocmparison to yugioh isn't really accurate

[golden plover]

It honestly kinda did

[sleek ferry]

modern is spoiled with choice

[golden plover]

But lesso "play these decks" and moreso "play using cards from these two sets"

Modern has more deck variety, but MH1-2 killed a decent chunk of set variety

And also, modern was a format that was known to be safe to buy into, because you only had to change a few cards in your deck every few months

[lusty trench]

Wotc is in their print staples arc

Soon it will be their print archetype arc

[golden plover]

And now it's "it's safe until the next MH set comes out and you've gotta start from scratch"

[sleek ferry]

this is kinda irrelevant tbh. If you didn't kill set variety to an extent, the entry point for players into modern would be much more expensive than it already is

[golden plover]

Boomer jund is a meme because you could have picked up the deck 15 years ago and played it until mh1

[sleek ferry]

and if nothing else, the MH sets do usually reprint cards that are actually usable in modern

[golden plover]

Only every once in a while adding a few new standard cards

It was safe to invest $2k in the deck because it was always fine to play

[lusty trench]

It's cause wotc sees none of that $2k

So they went 😠

[sudden lava]

Im curious what creature type they are gonna give The Doctor cards. Alien? Timelord?

[golden plover]

Exactly

[sleek ferry]

Doctor

[sudden lava]

err creature type, not race 😅

[golden plover]

I would hope for easily reprint able type lines for if they need to make UB prints

But Warhammer told me they wouldn't do that

Why the fuck aren't the necrons just artifact skeletons

[sleek ferry]

well aren't the warhammer cards commander exclusive?

[lusty trench]

Timelord and then a subclass based on the version

[golden plover]

Why is [[Vexilus Praetor]] the only card in the game with the custodes type line

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/40k/19/vexilus-praetor

Vexilus Praetor <:mana3:292901508771610624><:manaw:1007102126813610074>

Creature — Custodes Warrior
Flash
Vigilance
Aegis of the Emperor — Commanders you control have protection from everything.
There is no greater bulwark than the Praetors of the Adeptus Custodes, the bodyguards of the Emperor of Mankind.
3/4

[lusty trench]

Like timelord artificer

[sudden lava]

But Doctor is the title, and we've seen alien as a creature type

[sleek ferry]

if not Doctor than Avatar

Human Avatar

or Avatar X

[sudden lava]

The doctor isnt human ^

[sleek ferry]

Avatar makes the most sense then

[golden plover]

Yes, but if one of them ends up as an EDH/legacy staple, they can't just reprint it in a masters set

They'd have to go through licensing

[lusty trench]

Imma dip for a bit some of y'all ping bomb me when the list drops

[fallow citrus]

"if" one of them ends up as a staple

not me looking at the miracles deck

[[triumph of saint katherine]] moment

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/40k/17/triumph-of-saint-katherine

Triumph of Saint Katherine <:mana4:292901508712890379><:manaw:1007102126813610074>

Creature — Human Warrior
Lifelink
Praesidium Protectiva — When Triumph of Saint Katherine dies, exile it and the top six cards of your library in a face-down pile. If you do, shuffle that pile and put it back on top of your library.
Miracle (You may cast this card for its miracle cost when you draw it if it's the first card you drew this turn.)
5/5

[golden plover]

With a UW variant with a more common type line, they easily can

[sleek ferry]

btw, if you want to complain about a format, complain about legacy

[golden plover]

So it's really weird they made the type lines super specific

[sudden lava]

The companions are obvious, like Rose Tyler is human. But my guess is either a new creature type or alien

for the doctors

[rigid scarab]

Thugs

[sudden lava]

Maybe add artificer in to, cuz that makes sense

[rigid scarab]

Competitive Magic's strongest soldier

[fallow citrus]

I'd complain about legacy but my only exposure is watching thrabenU vods

or boshnroll sometimes

[sleek ferry]

?

[rigid scarab]

This

[sleek ferry]

oh

That's misty

[rigid scarab]

I think throughout the entire last convo

[sleek ferry]

but yeah, I prefer my take on the fact that the lotr set fucked over 2 formats and they're both arena exclusive formats

[rigid scarab]

You could have just told us you like modern

[fallow citrus]

I too love being reductive

[sleek ferry]

I try to view everything through a nonbias way (though sometimes bias does get the best of me), but I really think modern is the peak of what a tcg format should be

in terms of longevity/choice/power level

[fallow citrus]

modern right now is great honestly

I think modern being peak is a good take because like, you have so many different decks that are playable without just trolling, and sideboard options feel much better than in ygo for example

but also just my opinion

[sleek ferry]

I do think the power creep in other formats has been kinda much, even in standard

like Standard during this rotation

[sudden lava]

copy paste fail

[rigid scarab]

My personal peak is pioneer

[sleek ferry]

has been really strong

[sudden lava]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WARcYHfIbeg&ab_channel=TheCommandZone

REVEAL TIME

[golden plover]

Yeah pioneer is great

[rigid scarab]

@lusty trench

@lusty trench

[dense berry]

i think we digressed the original point wasnt that modern is bad now its that MH2 completely changed the format and there are good reasons to be negative about that even if you do like post MH2 modern format

[lusty trench]

sickle I dub thee my strongest soldier

[golden plover]

@lusty trench @lusty trench

Dammit

[lusty trench]

Pope you are second in command

[fallow citrus]

if I enjoyed rakdos I'd play pioneer more

[dense berry]

that is a pretty card

[sleek ferry]

oh narci is neat

[rigid scarab]

Oh wow a non-rachel video

[golden plover]

Yooo

That's a cool card

[golden plover]

Not good, but cool

[zinc shard]

👏 Avacyn 👏 Token 👏

[fallow citrus]

yeah that's very valid. I never played before mh2 so I don't have that view of modern but a set skewing a whole format isn't great design, but I think they've kind of learned from that by not immediately making mh3 and making lotr instead

[sleek ferry]

YO Composer of Spring is really good

[lusty trench]

AYO

[golden plover]

Composer is solid, yeah

[rigid scarab]

Reprints

Dryad of the Elysian Grove
Starfield of Nyx
Grasp of Fate
Setessan Champion
Mirari's Wake
Cunning Rhetoric
Culling Ritual

[fallow citrus]

oh dryad reprint is good

[sudden lava]

FAT BOI

[fallow citrus]

lmfao

[lusty trench]

Dryad is the obligatory $30 card reprint

[lusty trench]

Don't know how to feel about that

[golden plover]

Hey they actually stuck to the theme this time

[sudden lava]

deck stats

[rigid scarab]

You had me at "Behemoth"

[golden plover]

Spiritdancer should be like 2 mana less

[sleek ferry]

Demon of Fate's Design is probably another CEDH wincon

also yeah, spiritdancer is overcosted

[dense berry]

i want to pick up a playmat of this artwork this is so gorgeous

[fallow citrus]

reanimate fates design play omniscience ig?

[sudden lava]

and now to see what gets crossed off on the list

[dense berry]

absolutely one of the best modern style mtg artworks

[sleek ferry]

this works yeah

[dense berry]

kinda gives me some renewed faith in the art direction of the game

[golden plover]

I can't see the card being super good, but I guess

What huge enchantments are you looking for

[fallow citrus]

omniscience, one with the multiverse

[golden plover]

Yeah fair

[sleek ferry]

ah my favorite cedh removal got reprinted

[[culling ritual]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/stx/172/culling-ritual

Culling Ritual <:mana2:292901509060886528><:manab:292901508872273920><:manag:292901508654301185>

Sorcery
Destroy each nonland permanent with mana value 2 or less. Add or for each permanent destroyed this way.
"Your own frailty is your undoing. I am merely the one to expose it."

[golden plover]

It's been in every BG+ precon recently

Which is good

[lusty trench]

We are 0/3 in decks that are worth the money

[dense berry]

well yeah

this is like the worst ev product in recent time

obviously not of all time, fallen empires and homelands happened

[sudden lava]

(I have no clue when 5 will be crossed off)

[golden plover]

But remember "it's not a premium product"

Despite it being billed as one up until now

[rigid scarab]

Probably a Planeswalker card?

[dense berry]

its not a premium product they just wanna charge more

[golden plover]

They're charging LGSes $60 a deck

Which is usually the price LGSes sell them for

[sudden lava]

wait, there is only the eldrazzi commander deck left and adamant hasnt been crossed off yet

[golden plover]

So it's not premium, just more expensive

[fallow citrus]

adamant in a colourless list huh

[sudden lava]

Adamant "If you pay colorless mana"?

[fallow citrus]

what a boring way to implement a boring mechanic

[dense berry]

we should have known this year would be a shitshow when 30th anni edition happened

[rigid scarab]

I don't think I would hold that statement up to much water

It was a PR guy under stress on stream

And what he knew was that the community hates premium products

[sleek ferry]

That’s what I said

Guy that said it wasn’t supposed to say that

But he got tired of being flamed

[golden plover]

He could have just not answered it then

[rigid scarab]

When like

Three quarters of your chat is all about "Fuck Commander Masters"

Sometimes you crack under pressure

[sudden lava]

Narci fable singer straight to that one bard commander, forgot name

the LOTR one

[dense berry]

PR guys entire jobs is to not say the wrong shit under pressure

[lusty trench]

Bombadil

[sudden lava]

bombadil yeah

[lusty trench]

[[bombadil]]

[dense berry]

double bracket

[lost widget]

Multiple cards match “bombadil”, can you be more specific?

[lusty trench]

[[Tom bombadil]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/234/tom-bombadil

Tom Bombadil <:manaw:1007102126813610074><:manau:292901508754702338><:manab:292901508872273920><:manar:292901508796645397><:manag:292901508654301185>

Legendary Creature — God Bard
As long as there are four or more lore counters among Sagas you control, Tom Bombadil has hexproof and indestructible.
Whenever the final chapter ability of a Saga you control resolves, reveal cards from the top of your library until you reveal a Saga card. Put that card onto the battlefield and the rest on the bottom of your library in a random order. This ability triggers only once each turn.
4/4

[rigid scarab]

He could very well just not be good at his job that day

I probably would if I was tasked with advertising what's guaranteed to be one of the most infamous sets of this decade

[sudden lava]

a little bit of heal and burn each time your sagas end

and draw power

[dense berry]

this is the year of corporate greed after all

[lusty trench]

Destiny spinner reprint pretty big

Still need to get me one of those

[rigid scarab]

I will say that putting a reveal on your official twitch stream

Is very much not a good idea

Because everything you say is going to be under extreme scrutinisation

[sleek ferry]

and you know damn well half the people joined that stream to make sure to tell you how shit your product is

[rigid scarab]

Oh absolutely

If there's one thing the internet's good at it's making sure you know how much they hate something

[dense berry]

is it more of a stretch to think a guy whos entire job is to not crack under pressure on a live stream cracked under pressure on a live stream and said the wrong stuff

[sudden lava]

a quick meme about 12 mana tramplers

[dense berry]

or that he said exactly what wotc wanted him to say to gauge how negative the community can be towards a product and still make a profit

[sleek ferry]

I'm going by hearsay as I haven't seen the clip, but supposedly the guy was visibly flustered from the situation

[dense berry]

boycotts sell product after all

[rigid scarab]

Just because it's your job to do something doesn't mean you're going to do it at 100% proficiency

[sleek ferry]

the clip should tell us everything we need to know

someone pull it up

[rigid scarab]

And if he wanted to gauge community negativity he could have just busted the "Not for you" card

He could have said WAY worse shit

https://www.twitch.tv/magic/clip/FragileInspiringWalrusDerp-nrZTybyddHg6WcEQ

[sleek ferry]

I mean he said he didn't know if it was a premium product or not

[rigid scarab]

He definitely seemed flustered there

[sleek ferry]

it wasn't even a flat out "it's not a premium product"

[rigid scarab]

Not quite MOM Writers level flustered but

[sleek ferry]

it was "can somebody show me where we called it a premium product, i'm not sure if we labeled it as that or not"

[dense berry]

thats pr speak for its not a premium product

[lusty trench]

It's pr speak for "if we did we didn't mean to"

[dense berry]

"show us where we said that"

[golden plover]

It is PR speak to say "I don't wanna say it's not and have someone tell me I said the wrong thing" too

[dense berry]

honestly thats even worse

[golden plover]

It's a non-answer so he can't get in trouble for the wrong answer

[lusty trench]

https://m.twitch.tv/magic/clip/YawningFitSoybeanTBCheesePull-X7UgbhVEQ4aiug-4

Also relevant

[sleek ferry]

That was def PR speak

[golden plover]

Oh yeah 100% PR speak

[sleek ferry]

the first one looks like him genuinely not knowing the answer to the community/his own question

[lusty trench]

They also said they didn't put good mana base cards in because they wanted to focus the "coolness factor" of the decks into the non land cards, and that mana bases "having room to grow" is part of what makes precons good as you can improve them yourself

(replace coolness with money it's what they mean) (no one looks at fuckin dryad of the illsian grove and goes "wow what a coooool card")

[golden plover]

Oh yeah they say that one a lot

[fallow citrus]

prime time players think that card is cool

[golden plover]

"Players want to upgrade the mana base, it's fun for them"

[fallow citrus]

as well as scapeshift players

[golden plover]

Which... Is it really?

Like I don't have fun cutting a guild gate for a shock

[lusty trench]

But do enchantment deck players?

They'll go "eh this counts and is generically good"

[rigid scarab]

While optimal mana bases are obviously not gonna be in precons, battlebond lands for sure should at least be in

[fallow citrus]

well it's an enchantment creature and a good reprint

[lusty trench]

I'm not saying it's not

I'm just saying coolness factor is just corporate speak for how much it is

[golden plover]

Hell, honestly precons should have a shock and maybe a triome

It doesn't cost them more to put good lands in them

I get they're never gonna put duals and fetches

But like a shock wouldn't hurt

[rigid scarab]

Would duals and fetches hurt either?

[fallow citrus]

well in an ideal world nothing would hurt

[golden plover]

Duals can't get reprinted

[rigid scarab]

I think you can spin not putting duals and fetches into precons as "WOTC is greedy"

[golden plover]

But fetches would be technically fine

They'd just never do it because $25-$40 lands

[fallow citrus]

but like every tcg they can't just put everything good in a precon because nobody would buy boosters to pull them and you can't artificially increase purchases of sets by including fetches and shocks in future sets

[rigid scarab]

Because the whole idea of "We want players to upgrade their precons" does hold merit

Not even from a monetary perspective but gameplay too

[sleek ferry]

The only way you can expect a tcg company to reprint a lot of high value stuff is by constantly power creeping said stuff

ie, archetype powercreep in ygo

[lusty trench]

Imagine MTG having the same collectible market as Pokémon

(wotc would still make good cards a bitch to get because more money but it's nice to dream)

[rigid scarab]

tbf

[sleek ferry]

pokemon is also one of the richest companies in the entire world

and the richest franchise ever iirc

[rigid scarab]

The competitive Pokemon market is so cheap partly because a LOT less people care about competitive Pokemon

[golden plover]

WoTC is literally a billion dollar company too

[rigid scarab]

A lot more just care about having artwork of a Charizard

[golden plover]

It wouldn't hurt them to adopt the pokemon reprint policy

[lusty trench]

Wotc is carrying Hasbro through the profitability line

Like by far

[golden plover]

Yeah

[sleek ferry]

WOTC's worth is 72 million. The pokemon Company has a net worth of 95 BILLION

there's no comparison

[rigid scarab]

PTCG is one of the few TCGs where I can say the collector's market outweighs the competitive market

[golden plover]

Woops meant Hasbro not Wotc

But it still wouldn't hurt to adopt the pokemon reprint policy

[sleek ferry]

It's not as if Hasbro is putting all their money into wotc

[golden plover]

It almost literally is tho

[sleek ferry]

they;re busy putting in their money into their other failing products

[golden plover]

WoTC is singlehandedly keeping Hasbro afloat

[rigid scarab]

Yeah Hasbro is never letting go of WOTC

Which yeah

It sucks

Hasbro WOTC is how we're getting M30 and OGL

And hey

OGL is one of the very few Mob Mentality Ws

[sleek ferry]

iirc isn't the entirety of hasbro besides wotc working at a negative?

[golden plover]

Pretty much

[sleek ferry]

i mean, it's only a matter of time before they sell then

might not be for a couple of years

[rigid scarab]

Makes sense

[sleek ferry]

but it should happen

[rigid scarab]

Hasbro's speciality is currently giga dying

Board Games are doing fine but

Hasbro board games are getting less and less popular

[golden plover]

It's because they're really afraid to try out new designs for board games and stuff

[lusty trench]

Kids ain't interested in elefun anymore

[golden plover]

Like the 1000th monopoly variant isn't exciting

[rigid scarab]

The worst timeline

[sleek ferry]

board games have been stagnant for like 30 years

[golden plover]

Not really?

[rigid scarab]

Eh

[golden plover]

Board games are more popular than ever now

[rigid scarab]

There are LOTS of amazing board games out there

[sleek ferry]

in terms of mass appeal?

[golden plover]

Hasbro just had shitty board games

Yes, absolutely

[lusty trench]

It's kids board games that are dying

[rigid scarab]

Board game cafes are amazing as well

[lusty trench]

Why play a board game when you have flashy light box

[rigid scarab]

Big Potato Games makes some of the best in the biz imo

[golden plover]

There's all sorts of cool board games out there

But Hasbro just makes shitty ones

[lusty trench]

And if you get bored of that, add more subway surfers to it

[rigid scarab]

Because Covid taught us that strictly online communication is not what the public is fond of

[golden plover]

Yeah people still vastly prefer hanging out in person

[rigid scarab]

Hence why in a post Covid world

IRL TCG events and Board Games shot up in popularity

[golden plover]

Yup

[rigid scarab]

Well aside from MTG

Because kekw pro tour

[golden plover]

Again, it's really just that Hasbro makes shitty board games

[rigid scarab]

But even then MTG is overall doing completely fine

It's not gonna die anytime soon

[sleek ferry]

mtg's only real fuck up was those anniversary proxies

[golden plover]

Haha absolutely not

[sleek ferry]

that was horrendous

[rigid scarab]

M30 is the only one that shot out to mass media

But they've done several which shook waves in the TCG crowd

[golden plover]

There's been SO MANY fuckups this year. M30 was just the highest

[twilit canyon]

whats the 5th

[sleek ferry]

the peleton situation was overblown

[twilit canyon]

fury, endurance, fov, ragavan

?

[sleek ferry]

like me and misty said, if they hadn't sent the peletons, they would have sent somebody else (literally all corporations do this)

[golden plover]

Oh woops, I miscounted, but still 4

[rigid scarab]

Pinkertons was a bad image but yeah it was kinda overblown
Commander Masters looks real rough, but it's not gonna be the stock market tank that M30 was

[golden plover]

Honestly the Pinkerton thing got a little overblown but it still should have NEVER happened over leaks

[twilit canyon]

also i will never understand why ppl complained for ages about modern's interaction spells being dogshit and then when they add interaction spells they complain

like lol

lmao even

[rigid scarab]

But honestly

[sleek ferry]

Also tbh, I rather they send Peletons then hit me with a big ass lawsuit with no warning

[twilit canyon]

did we really enjoy modern when it was heliod ballista company vs izzet prowess 24/7?

[rigid scarab]

I can't think of anything even Yugioh did that got this much backlash

Genuinely the biggest thing I think this year was the July banlist

[twilit canyon]

modern players: we want more interaction for the must-kill threats

wotc: okay here u go

[sleek ferry]

the shadowverse exodus due to pote

[twilit canyon]

modern players: wait not like that

[rigid scarab]

Ok POTE-PHHY powercreep was bad yeah

[golden plover]

There's also just at least one little issue that happens pretty much every set lmao

The SL with stolen art, the SL with unfinished art, Double Feature

[twilit canyon]

secret lairs i dont really count as sets but sure

[sleek ferry]

well OCG has more power than the tcg in yugioh, because OCG is spoiled for choice when it comes to available TCG's

[golden plover]

They're not as big, but when there's something going wrong literally almost every set it adds up

[sleek ferry]

If you're not playing ygo, mtg or ptcg in the west

then you don't have much of a choice

[golden plover]

Honestly surprised nothing came from the SL with stolen art tbh

[twilit canyon]

what was wrong with double feature? idr anything besides it being kind of pointless

[rigid scarab]

Premium pricing

[golden plover]

It was literally them slapping a black and white filter on cards and selling it as a premium set

[twilit canyon]

yea but who cares

[sleek ferry]

I'm pretty sure wotc ended up losing money off that anyways

[twilit canyon]

it wasnt any new cards

[rigid scarab]

Neither is Commander Masters

[twilit canyon]

it reprinted the shit out of some pricey cards too

[sleek ferry]

double feature was 2 mid sets put together

[twilit canyon]

[[$the meathook massacre]]

[lost widget]

https://scryfall.com/card/mid/112/the-meathook-massacre

Prices for The Meathook Massacre

Magic Online Promos

15.49 TIX

Innistrad: Double Feature

$43.23 • €39.17 • 14.41 TIX

Innistrad: Midnight Hunt Promos

$35.36 • €27.54

Innistrad: Midnight Hunt Promos

$63.95 • €35.00

Innistrad: Midnight Hunt

$39.23 • €32.32 • 14.86 TIX

Innistrad: Midnight Hunt

$49.51 • €53.62

[twilit canyon]

could be way worse without double feature print

[sleek ferry]

it was an $80 card at one point iirc

[twilit canyon]

yep

[rigid scarab]

Just because you don't need to buy a set doesn't mean you can't talk about it

[fallow citrus]

no actually it was 1 MID set and one VOW set

[twilit canyon]

sure but why waste ur energy or time on pointless squabble

especially if ur not even buying it

[rigid scarab]

Something about enough backlash instigating change

[twilit canyon]

it wont

[sleek ferry]

yeah liek the double feature backlash was stupid because the 2 sets in there were already readily available anyways

[twilit canyon]

not like that

[rigid scarab]

I mean it worked for OGL so they're not exactly invincible

[sleek ferry]

so like if you didnt like double feature, just buy 1 of the 2 sets?

[twilit canyon]

u know whats worse for a company? when they see 0 reaction to news

[fallow citrus]

only issue I had with double feature was the grayscale looks bad

[sleek ferry]

also yeah

[twilit canyon]

engagement and brand recognition (good or bad) is good for em

[sleek ferry]

double feature grayscale art was pretty bad

[twilit canyon]

no recognition or acknowledgement is worse

[sleek ferry]

outside of the lands

the lands are beautiful

[twilit canyon]

agreed

i like a few of the black/white cards from blue cards

[sudden lava]

just looking at human tribal commanders, oof

[twilit canyon]

like malevolent hermit

?

[rigid scarab]

I think Double Feature wasn't nearly as bad because it was at least funny bad

Like so incredibly shit in so many ways

[twilit canyon]

what are we looking at? number of decks? price?

[sleek ferry]

malevolent hermit extended art only being $1 is crazy btw

pick your copies up