Got a group of friends who love drafting the recent sets but don’t want to pay that much every week
#Magic the Gathering
glad peak
sleek ferry
Oh is [[meria, scholar of]] finally usable?
lost widgetBOT
Legendary Creature — Elf Artificer
Tap an untapped nontoken artifact you control: Add 
.
Tap two untapped nontoken artifacts you control: Exile the top card of your library. You may play it this turn.
"Why fear artifice? Is it not also of this world?"
3/3
golden plover
Meria is insanely good in commander, yeah
glad peak
Meria’s color combination is horrid but luckily she breaks parity on stax super easily
Just not at well as urza, who can win without doing anything or Magda, who doesn’t need to cast anything after she’s on the field
sleek ferry
We have a lot of solid green cards that frankly don’t fit together
glad peak
I would’ve liked green to be more overtly anti artifact for draft
sleek ferry
I mean we got liberator, industry and silverback shaman in standard what more do you want
glad peak
Standard? 
I meant to make the draft environment more interesting, make green control a thing
fallow citrus
sleek ferry
Yeah but looking at what bro is giving us, it’s looking like artifact decks might run rampant post it. If you make green more anti artifact than it already is, than green is going to be a gatekeeper deck preventing Any artifact deck that can’t handle it from being in the meta
I love that 2 drop btw
fallow citrus
battery bearer turning thought monitor into a draw 3 pog
glad peak
Yeah but looking at what bro is giving us, it’s looking like artifact decks migh...
Good? That’s exactly what format should be, a threat and a way to beat that threat
lusty trench
Bruh the pioneer 2022 decks are such value
golden plover
They're all pretty okay
The Phoenix one sorta sucks on it's own, and dimir control is questionable
The other two are good tho
languid quest
Izzet one needs lot of upgrades to be playable
Orchov humans has least value but it's okay out of box
hidden ermine
That seems incredibly overcosted
copper pecan
it seems crazy for limited
two 4/4s for six mana is nothing to sneeze at
also keep in mind that unearth is an archetype in this format
glad peak
I’m actually surprised they called gruul stompy, it was a deck when the format first started, died horribly long before the product was announced, and now is actually playable
languid quest
happy accident
glad peak
Eh maybe
trail anvil
That seems incredibly overcosted
yeah for sorcery speed 6 mana seems way too much here
there's better cards that do each of these effects for way less besides maybe grabbing 2 really good lands? still doesn't sound amazing
glad peak
Oh hey it’s prime time but without the time
fallow citrus
yoo they printed [[stifle]] for standard
lost widgetBOT
trail anvil
oh wait titania's command puts 2 counters on each creature you control, that's at least better than I thought
golden plover
It's like fine... Gives mono-g/gruul a way to exile a graveyard in pioneer
But they had hearse access before
Or even Klothys
trail anvil
uh don't they have scavenging ooze for that
golden plover
Oh right, Scooze too
trail anvil
and klothys and hearse yeah
golden plover
Yeah, there's not a lack of grave hate in green
It's grave hate with other options tho, which makes it fine
trail anvil
I think you run this in bigger decks w/ green anyways cause the lifegain tells me you want this as a top end
vs certain decks you can recover like 20 life or some shit by the time you reach lategame
golden plover
Or if you're trying to go wide, yeah
Since it makes the whole board bigger in the process
6 mana is asking a lot tho
It's a MEGA BOMB in limited tho
Like resolving it should usually win you the game
trail anvil
imagine this with field of the dead
erratum in historic to change the tokens to decayed when tbh
golden plover
Oh yeah, you could do that in historic
That'd probably make field a bit less overbearing
Decayed can't block, right?
Oh wait this is only one more than [[Hour of Promise]]
golden plover
And Hour saw play in its standard
lusty trench
It's one more and doesn't make you play deserts, and is more versatile
golden plover
I mean worse case you get 2 4/4s for 6
Best case you shut down a graveyard deck and get some tempo
twilit canyon
Exile the top three cards of your library in a face-down pile, then exile the top three cards of your library in a face-down pile. Look at both piles, then turn one of them face-up. Your opponent chooses one of them. Put that pile into your hand, and the other into your graveyard. You lose 3 life.
instant
lusty trench
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/805846945947320320/1037832585990119475/un...
That feels good
sudden lava
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/931305913829195846/1037844264887005244/un...
very good boi
twilit canyon
dont ping me
lusty trench
Apologies if that was me
sudden lava
Soldiers are getting a LOT of support
lusty trench
Glad to see it tbh, they often get overshadowed by knights
trail anvil
do you just use this before a board wipe to save your own board or something?
trail anvil
Decayed can't block, right?
they also die after they attack too
trail anvil
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/805846945947320320/1037832585990119475/un...
oh hey atris but you get to play the mind game
lusty trench
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/805846945947320320/1037852187331661947/un...
doesnt have flash
Cringe
languid quest
lol have fun with your treasure tokens that you can't use without hurting yourself
lusty trench
"go ahead, sac the treasures, you can't un damage your life total"
sleek ferry
Doesn’t it not affect treasure tokens since it specifically says “when an artifact an opponent controls is put into a graveyard from the battlefield”
And tokens never hit the graveyard
twilit canyon
they are considered sent to the gy
sleek ferry
That’s some Yugioh ruling right there
waxen timber
Avenger seems pretty funny with Bloodvial Purveyor
hidden ermine
... wait is this a way to bypass Unearths trigger?
glad peak
Being a lord IS the upside 
Yep, unearth can be blinked through exile effects
Hence why I wish blink was in this draft environment
That + prototype
clever sun
Four mana lord is a bit insulting
golden plover
Just won a game with the self thoughtseize into Parhelion
They never see it coming
lusty trench
Just realized that the brain can be used to remove parhelion from my opponents deck
lusty trench
Issue is if it's turn 2 when you drop the brain and you're going second, and they drop the rat on their turn 3
trail anvil
4 mana lord tells me they don't really wanna push soldiers outside of limited
twilit canyon
soldiers actually already have standard playables
4 mana lord is just a bit insulting
the 3 mana flyer that makes a soldier on attack
and then taps 3 soldiers to draw
card is extremely nice
dennick and thalia are also soldiers
they got an untapped dual
so they have 3 untapped duals and secluded courtyard
tribe is got a lot of good pieces
golden plover
Issue is if it's turn 2 when you drop the brain and you're going second, and the...
That's true. But it's a 50/50 you can just end them
trail anvil
nvm ur right holy shit there's so many soldiers
at least [[valiant veteran]] is the lord soldiers truly want 
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Creature — Kor Soldier
Other Soldiers you control get +1/+1.
, Exile Valiant Veteran from your graveyard: Put a +1/+1 counter on each Soldier you control.
"Let them come. We will show them that Argivian steel is stronger than any Phyrexian metal."
2/2
fallow citrus
yeah uw soldiers isn't bad for standard
you got harbin too for big swings
all we need is a white CoCo for standard now
copper pecan
soldiers don't really need another lord in standard when veteran exists
fallow citrus
I guess [[kayla's reconstruction]] is the "we have coco at home" option
copper pecan
i'm still in awe at how stupid the first sentence of that flavor text is
fallow citrus
greasefang
golden plover
Nah it's definitely not
I saw the salvage and thought this was a mirror
They also have a [[Mire Triton]] out
fallow citrus
I mean I guess they just crammed mill and discard outlets in
it still has the spirit of the deck
golden plover
I haven't seen them play a vehicle yet
fallow citrus
unlucky mills and draws happen
golden plover
Just removal
trail anvil
it's just poorly built greasefang then
fallow citrus
I can see eliminate and the spirit as tech choices but the merfolk is pushing it
trail anvil
greasefang's literal only effect is about vehicles
fallow citrus
they probably just didnt have all the wildcards but wanted to play or something
golden plover
They also hit my greasefangs with 2 power word kills
This list is AWFUL if it's Greasefang
And a Mortify
This is 100% not greasefang
copper pecan
if it's not greasefang then why is it running greasefang
rigid scarab
I will never forget the moment
Where I got absolutely 5Headed in EDH
I make a truce with the guy to my left that I won't attack him, but I will attack everyone else
He then plays this
copper pecan
very unfortunate that they made a red white and blue legendary wall that makes you choose left or right
especially during the year this came out
glad peak
I make a truce with the guy to my left that I won't attack him, but I will attac...
That’s why you always say “given the current amount of information known”
rigid scarab
That’s why you always say “given the current amount of information known”
True but
I mean I gotta respect it
glad peak
You must always speak like a lawyer
fallow citrus
finally
trail anvil
omg literally tron
trail anvil
consider 2
zinc shard
[[Curate]]
lost widgetBOT
fallow citrus
I do want to see how izzet prowess can come to be in standard now
zinc shard
oh no Gaeas Cradle D:
zinc shard
I do want to see how izzet prowess can come to be in standard now
idk about Izzet but mono red will probably be a thing
twilit canyon
scatter ray is pretty solid
spectrum sentinel is surprisingly solid??
pretty on-rate, protection from relevant cards, and gains life
fallow citrus
I think in soldiers it could be a cool side card
even a main card as a 1 drop instead of something else if you're expecting a lot of multicoloured stuff
glad peak
This is a great cube set, we just have to swap out uw’s archetype
zinc shard
Launch Party Promo for Jumpstart 2022
lusty trench
What this card is so good
sleek ferry
[[silverback shaman]]
sleek ferry
[[silverback elder]]
copper pecan
silverback shaman is like
peak mono green limited common threat tbh
it's simple but still interesting
golden plover
Damn I'm glad Swiftspear is in BRO
I tried to play Pioneer RDW in Explorer and I'm really only missing the den of the bugbears and a Dressed to Kill (subbing in a ToD) and it's HARD without her
(Subbed the land base for snow lands and am running a set of faceless havens in place of the dens)
waxen timber
Izzet prowess in standard is going to be pretty good. Swiftspear, Electrostatic Infantry, Third Path Iconoclast to make a bunch of tokens and Balmor to boost the whole team
golden plover
You also get [[Founding of the Third Path]]
golden plover
Which is pretty solid
It's seeing play in some Izzet lists in pioneer rn
Card is good
sudden lava
https://www.magicspoiler.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Swiftgear-Drake-The-Brothers-War-Spoiler.png
DD crow
zinc shard
How ive always seen it is MTG has a higher ceiling, but yugioh has a higher floor
lusty trench
I'd say magic has a higher practical ceiling
But Yu-Gi-Oh rulings are in a different league
golden plover
Yugioh is harder to start off playing
Since there's not as much of a casual scene where you play limited mechanics
MTG is harder to learn optimally, yeah
twilit canyon
i have 0 experience with paper ygo communities really
but in magic i also realize how much experienced players love teaching newer ones
which bridges the learning gap a lot
golden plover
Yugioh really lacks casual formats
So if you show up playing a structure deck out of the box at an event, you'll do poorly
ashen tulip
what are casual formats?
golden plover
Magic has stuff like commander or kitchen table where the game isn't as focused like how the competitive scene is
ashen tulip
can you not just play kitchen table yugioh??
golden plover
You can, but there's a certain style that comes from kitchen table yugioh that's vastly different from the regular game
Most kitchen table players mean they wanna play with DM/GX cards
You'd be hard pressed to find a casual learning environment for yugioh where you can experiment with stuff
ashen tulip
Kitchen Table only requires a homey environment, a kitchen table, and an agreement not to bring your ultra mega deck of ultimate enemy destruction or else someone's going to go crying to their mom and you're gonna get kicked out.
golden plover
You sorta can on the master duel story modes, but it's not perfect there either
I'm sure there are groups for kitchen table yugioh that aren't just DM nostalgia, but it's not as common
With magic, you can usually go to any game store and find people to play with, even at a very casual level
ashen tulip
You'd be hard pressed to find a casual learning environment for yugioh where you...
I think this is more based on mindset than anything. out of all the requirements for Kitchen Table I mentioned, the only actually required one is just the mutual agreement that you're not going to play meta, and are just going to be exploring the game.
golden plover
That's MUCH harder to do with yugioh
ashen tulip
is it?
golden plover
Most stores usually only run yugioh on a specific night from my experience, and that's usually competitive decks
Well competitive-ish
ashen tulip
but where is the fun in that, you know??
golden plover
That's what most enfranchised yugioh players find fun, and Yugioh doesn't really keep a card shop afloat
ashen tulip
I guess my confusion most of the time, is where is the fun in playing a competitive deck? nothing ever changes, nothing comes of it, and all it is is luck and your ability to piece cards together.
but then when people put that mindset away, and explore cards and do wild and wacky strategies, you could have so much more fun, and things could constantly change and be dynamic
which doesn't happen with meta decks. in fact, it's actively discouraged. everytime new cards are released you instantly find a way to fix up the deck as an "update" only for half of those cards to be banlisted due to being too powerful.
where's the fun in that?
things only change once every few months, maybe. there's thousands of cards in yugioh and yet most of them are hardly ever used because this is apparently the most optimal way to play, which for some odd reason is "fun?" what's fun about being optimal? for me it only makes things drone on and makes things an absolute pain in the neck to get through out of the sheer boredom of it all. at least that's what I assume, because I can't stand listening to people talk about meta's for longer than a few minutes.
regardless, I'm not going to be playing meta too much if I do keep playing yugioh
anyways, didn't mean to make this not about other tcgs
in mtg I was super into the whole big fuck-off green monsters
because they were big
and I saw the destructive power of them
and I just couldn't resist trying to tame it, so I always went with green decks and basically rarely ever did anything else.
I had this giant four legged monster the size of cities that I loved to pull out once I somehow amassed enough mana
and I would laugh maniacally as I got a once-in-a-hundred chance to summon a HOARD of powerful big fuck-off green monsters
I actually would laugh maniacally, one time I scared the entire lunch hall at my highschool
everyone knew me that day
twilit canyon
competitive good decks are infinitely more fun than casual bad decks
when your deck actually has a gameplan and performs
it feels a lot better than maybe sometimes doing a funny thing
the fun in meta decks is entirely skill based
you pit your best gameplay against your opponents
and theres nothing like "oh i drew bad" or "oh my deck is weak" to hold either player back
its "you played better so you won"
golden plover
I mean, sometimes it does come down to "oh I drew bad" even in competitive decks, but it's usually mitigated to an extent
Greasefang has a big issue of "woops didn't see the rat"
twilit canyon
yea
but overall, you can mitigate that in magic at least, with a mulligan
knowing how to mull well
or how well your deck mulls
golden plover
But there's also fun in learning how to get around that too
twilit canyon
is a skill
ashen tulip
I guess I can see that
golden plover
Like there's a really fun play line I like doing in Greasefang where I thoughtseize myself to get the Parhelion setup
twilit canyon
yea the ole reanimator combo
ashen tulip
goes back to something I thought of a while ago, which is to see "meta decks" as "characters" that update and get buffs and nerfs overtime
twilit canyon
thoughtseize target yourself -> discard the fatty -> bring it back
golden plover
Bonus points is that it sometimes makes the opponent scoop because they see the whole combo in hand
It's also sometimes fun in any TCG to win situations where you're lacking your gameplan and you're not favored
twilit canyon
yea but that also comes down to proper deckbuilding too
golden plover
Usually in magic that means beating the opponent to death with dorks or doing wack combos
True. But sometimes they see all the answers
twilit canyon
yea sure it happens
golden plover
Had a game yesterday where they saw all the answers and graveyard trespasser and I actually won off an LoTV ult
Felt like it was 2015 making them choose 2 lands and anvil or 4 lands
glad peak
Yugioh and magic definitely test different skills
Also saying meta decks are both unchanging in what they do and luck based are complete opposite sentiments to the same concept 
glad peak
As always, most of the special arts are full of cards people don’t want
So probably, but I won’t expect a 50% drop on all accounts or anything that big
rigid scarab
We got AoD
Wurmcoil
Aetherflux
Howling Mine
Mox Amber
Chromatic Lantern
Just off the top of my head
glad peak
Yep, a couple of them are cheap already and there are 63 special cards
Prices will drop a bit, they won’t make the base cards rise like some special printings do
burnt relic
is there an edopro equivalent for this?
something where you have access to everything and it handles rules stuff automatically
zinc shard
there are mtg simulators, but i dont believe any of the ones that give you access to every card are automatic
there's mtg online but you gotta buy the cards
and arena is free to play but it doesnt have every card
copper pecan
there's forge but that doesn't have online play
and xmage but that is missing a ton of cards and is really buggy
the only fan sims i can think of that have every card and have online play are cockatrice and untap.in, but those aren't automatic
golden plover
This draft deck sure is something
polar lake
i found a way to be able to ash blossom my opponent in magic
granted, i can only use this in casual games
but get a ash blossom and return it to your hand
glad peak
Or just use force of will
sudden lava
but you can attack them with blue-eyes
glad peak
No idea
polar lake
i think the funniest thing about this is that i can just get any yugioh card and put it into mtg now
zinc shard
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMRPL4o_TT0
Pre-Prerelease is up
golden plover
This hardly feels fair
lusty trench
Oh, then what's the issue?
twilit canyon
i face a lot of plat players in mythic this early in the season
golden plover
Tbf he's bad
He's running that grave exile desert and tapped out for a bonecrusher on me putting Parhelion in the grave
twilit canyon
explorer is not super popular on arena rn probs the big reason u got downpaired
conversely this makes it easy to climb the explorer ladder
copper pecan
yeah isn't explorer the least played of the main formats on arena
i know it was a few months ago but idk if it still is
twilit canyon
ye it is
it spikes in play every time theres an open or qualifier that runs explorer
but otherwise has a lower player count
last glen
how populated are MTG's unofficial sims?
golden plover
Depends on the sim
last glen
thinking about building a full-power deck on a free sim to feel the game out
waxen timber
Full power for what format?
last glen
well, "full power" is probably the wrong term
I wanna build "money no object" dinosaurs
probably Gruul or Naya for Pioneer
glad peak
You’d have more success with regular gruul stompy than dinosaurs
It would give a better indication of how the game plays too
last glen
but dinosaurs look cool
twilit canyon
we are going back to ixalan next year iirc
so you will get a chance at more dino support then
golden plover
Dinosaurs as a tribal is probably best off in commander
They're too disjointed for any 60 formats
But they've got some solid options to play them in commander
[[Zacama Primal Calamity]] being the most likely commander
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Legendary Creature — Elder Dinosaur
Vigilance, reach, trample
When Zacama, Primal Calamity enters the battlefield, if you cast it, untap all lands you control.
: Zacama deals 3 damage to target creature.
: Destroy target artifact or enchantment.
: You gain 3 life.
9/9
golden plover
Or [[Gistath, Sun's Avatar]]
golden plover
Actually Gishath yeah. He's the 27th most played commander in general
last glen
Commander is 100 card Highlander with your Commander always available to play, right?
copper pecan
yes
last glen
that sounds wildly inconsistent
golden plover
You can make it work, but yeah, dinos are
last glen
peepeehands
golden plover
Unfortunately dinos are in 60 card formats too tho
twilit canyon
commander is the format with turn 1 kills
copper pecan
dinos main problem is that they don't really have much of a gameplan beyond "burn your own creatures to do a thing"
twilit canyon
and decks that can mull to t2-3 kills with a 75% consistency
but dinos are not privy to that power
golden plover
Dinos are split between "Big guys that do stuff when they attack", "Big guys that do stuff when they take damage,", and "little guys that do burn things"
So there's not a real 60 card deck that can fit all 3 in the same setup
The advantage for commander being it's usually more casual and has 4 players so you have more flexibility
last glen
hrm
twilit canyon
but hes not really "dino tribal"
golden plover
Kalamax is better, but you'd really wanna do Gishtath for tribal
He's got the most tribal synergy and can cheat out the big 12 mana guys
twilit canyon
the problem really is that theres not really any dinos worth cheating in
last glen
I will simply put in four copies of Fossil Dig into my deck and assault anyone who calls a judge
golden plover
Zacama is good if you're not paying 9 for him. Ghalta is cool. I like Etali a lot
twilit canyon
i think you could give mtg dinos a tutor and they wouldnt be good anyways
last glen
they have Commune
golden plover
Etali is actually really solid in commander
Not in more higher power stuff, but getting to play 4 cards for free is nice
golden plover
[[Polyraptor]] is good if you can combo off with it
lost widgetBOT
golden plover
Dinos is lacking the ability to actually do stuff in pioneer, yeah
Hell, [[Marauding Raptor]] is basically a band-aid for them as a tribe
lost widgetBOT
Creature — Dinosaur
Creature spells you cast cost 
less to cast.
Whenever another creature enters the battlefield under your control, Marauding Raptor deals 2 damage to it. If a Dinosaur is dealt damage this way, Marauding Raptor gets +2/+0 until end of turn.
"Stand still and try not to look like prey!" —Skerk Hobnett, wilderness guide
2/3
golden plover
And it's still not enough in pioneer
glad peak
Better luck next year
golden plover
They'll print them another bandaid rare
It'll just be another 1 drop that does enrage things
I'm actually not sure they even have a 1 drop
[[Raptor Hatchling]] is the smallest dino I can think of and he's a 2 drop
last glen
[[Snubhorn Sentry]]
last glen
not really a dinosaur tribal, though
golden plover
Oh huh. Forgot that guy existed
golden plover
Oh wait you're in Naya for commander. Wouldn't you be better of just doing [[Atla Palani, Nest Tender]]
lost widgetBOT
Legendary Creature — Human Shaman
, 
: Create a 0/1 green Egg creature token with defender.
Whenever an Egg you control dies, reveal cards from the top of your library until you reveal a creature card. Put that card onto the battlefield and the rest on the bottom of your library in a random order.
2/3
golden plover
She's not necessarily a dino, but she's really good for cheating them out
golden plover
And she's kinda thematic I guess
I mean usually, Atla cheats out Eldrazi or combo pieces
But she does the cheating better and quicker than Gishath since it's not tied to his attacks
twilit canyon
yea fair
golden plover
Iirc she's even on Ixalan
golden plover
I could see them making a signpost uncommon for her or something
Something like Gruul or Selsenya that cheats creatures into play whenever you do set mechanic
That or she's a wild mythic that does something crazy but is like 8 mana
Iirc it's a two color set since we know [[Quintorius]] is involved
golden plover
Unless they made him mono-white or something
clever sun
I can see Quintorius being mono-white
golden plover
Yeah especially if he's got an artifact focus
That would also let Huatli be Gruul and not overlap
I guess Huatli is primary white tho
zinc shard
copper pecan
i keep seeing people misplay [[reezug]]'s effect
lost widgetBOT
copper pecan
[[reezug, the bonecobler]]
lost widgetBOT
Legendary Creature — Spirit Artificer
: Target creature card in your graveyard perpetually becomes an artifact. You may cast that card this turn. (It loses all other card types.)
1/3
copper pecan
like, it literally says right there that they stop being creatures
zinc shard
doing a MTG progression series with a group of friends, this was one of my antiquities packs
lusty trench
WOW
copper pecan
FUCK
twilit canyon
tron
trail anvil
you know, as much as some people like to hate on digital-only cards, I feel like we need more cards like [[forsaken crossroads]] to lower the play/draw disparity
lost widgetBOT
Land
Forsaken Crossroads enters the battlefield tapped.
As Forsaken Crossroads enters the battlefield, choose a color.
When Forsaken Crossroads enters the battlefield, scry 1. If you weren't the starting player, you may untap Forsaken Crossroads instead.
: Add one mana of the chosen color.
twilit canyon
yea thats what a ton of alchemy cards have been doing
lowering play/draw disparity and helping ppl not mana screw or flood
copper pecan
a lot of the hate on digital only cards is just completely arbitrary
the vast majority of the designs are fine to good
the people who hate them just hate them because they're different
zinc shard
glad peak
The professor will lose in either case
zinc shard
My friends opening turn in EDH
languid quest
so much ramp
golden plover
One of my friends at locals had a Mizzix deck that usually goes something like that t1
He's casually played 7 cards multiple times
It becomes a tossup of topdecking from there
zinc shard
My friend wanted to play Power level 7-8 commanders
he then proceeds to bring Atraxa Superfriends
lusty trench
Issue is power level is too subjective a metric
Everyone says their deck is a 7
everyone
copper pecan
the power level thing means literally nothing and i don't understand why people keep using it
lusty trench
There is literally no way to gauge a commander decks power without stating what the deck does and, if you can't really explain it well, showing the deck list
fallow citrus
cursed
twilit canyon
ballista in historic maybe??
urza lands in historic maybe??
pro-tour card
jump 22 isnt comin to arena
rip but also lol
twilit canyon
Jace is for Pro-Tour participants
it is actually all the cards
jace is for the pro tour
the others are for magiccons
lusty trench
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/663818693750292482/1040400872598941896/Sc...
5 head move
clever sun
No this is genius huh
They are gonna capitalize on conventions this coming year heavily
lusty trench
"please come to our event we'll give you an 80 dollar card in cool art please"
clever sun
Given how successful Magic 30 was
lusty trench
Unironically smart move
clever sun
Also that Brainstorm will be extremely expensive
lusty trench
Oh yeah no I want that storm badly
golden plover
Had a fun game tonight where I had Purpohoros out and then used sunforger to grab my cloudstone curio. Love that "combo"
Also [[Angel's Grace]] is INSANE in edh
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golden plover
Fuck your Thoracle, you lose
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Legendary Creature — Cat Knight
First strike
Balan, Wandering Knight has double strike as long as two or more Equipment are attached to it.
: Attach all Equipment you control to Balan.
"What weapon will you bear against one who's mastered them all?"
3/3
copper pecan
[[spectral sailor]]
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Creature — Spirit Pirate
Flash (You may cast this spell any time you could cast an instant.)
Flying
: Draw a card.
"Any ship that sails on these mean seas for long is bound to pick up a ghost or two." —Admiral Beckett Brass
1/1
golden plover
This one fits moreso I guess
I could tell immediately from the ghost leg and background who it was
golden plover
Yup
lusty trench
Very anime flavour texts
First ones is "I'm in a good mood today, I'll let you pick which blade I cut you down with" and second is "do you mind if I haunt this ship captain?
hidden ermine
What are these supposed to be
fallow citrus
I think it's just art
lusty trench
Jumpstart 22 comes with alt arts in anime style
Before anyone says anything
Google the price of amano liliana
lusty trench
I mainly said that because the demand for anime styled art is definitely there, and it's not the first time they've done it, mainly cause I think this might ruffle some feathers
hidden ermine
I mean I wouldnt put moe art and Amanos art in the same category ngl
copper pecan
there definitely are people on reddit comparing the spectral sailor art to literal hentai just because she's showing like one inch of leg
which would be hilarious if it wasn't infuriatingly racist
golden plover
Yeah the art does feel really out of place
But I guess there's a lot of other art that does at this point too
hidden ermine
Balan on the other hand is using my least favourite female knight trope, the battle bikini (though in this case its only the lower half)
golden plover
I really don't like the Balan art, feels cowardly
hidden ermine
Or is that more of a Leotard
golden plover
Make her a full cat person
copper pecan
mtg is objectively improved by having a catgirl with swords
hidden ermine
I dont like that the armour is a leotard
lusty trench
I mean I wouldnt put moe art and Amanos art in the same category ngl
War had this type of art too
glad peak
Well I guess now I play jumpstart just for these arts
Also is it just me or does the Karn jumpstart sound extremely powerful for a sealed jumpstart pack
Karn notwithstanding, there’s ballista, 2/3 of each tron land (not too relevant but 2/3 is big), a token generating land, mana fixing, and land search
rich bronze
Thoughts on this list
I like running 4 boseiju
since it makes w6 a lot better later on
waxen timber
For prereleases, you can either get Urza or Mishra themed. Does anyone know which one would be better to get?
rich bronze
For prereleases, you can either get Urza or Mishra themed. Does anyone know whic...
Imagine attending prerelease
ResidentSleeper
also obviously Mishra
waxen timber
Pre releases are great value. Pay $20, get first place then end up with like $45 worth of product
golden plover
They're the same outside of packaging
twilit canyon
i dont like 4 boseiju in modern jund. 2 is fine but 2 boseiju and 4 saga is very awkward on your mana as is. 4/4 is even moreso
also swap basic mountain for swamp for b moon purposes
or drop that basic alltogether so its 1 basic except mountain and instead run another triome i think
or a nurturing peatland
also personal preference. i like just 3 targets off urza's saga which opens up to running a 3rd fable which is imo 1 of the biggest reasons to be in jund in modern
with the same reasoning i would also consider dropping unholy heat and playing the 4th fable
rich bronze
Yeah I’ve considered exactly this
twilit canyon
adjusting the side to have more of the hard removal
twilit canyon
4 fable is absurd
oh also for the side. with 4 saga and spellbomb + soul-guide, you can probs go down to just 1 hearse
rich bronze
mhm
twilit canyon
i am also unsure on if sheoldred or soul of windgrace are better in jund atm
sheoldred is better into rakdos scam builds for sure
rich bronze
Haven’t tried sheol
haven’t seen much experimentation with that either
is it a popular choice?
twilit canyon
she plays well with and against fable and seasoned pyro tho
rich bronze
I can see that
twilit canyon
so if u play a lot of rbx midrange mirrors she is probably a tech to run
rich bronze
Also thoughts on haywire mite in modern @twilit canyon
In general
Great saga target IMO
twilit canyon
from brothers war? insanely good side tech yea
rich bronze
Yep
golden plover
Huh does Jund not play Kroxa in modern?
rich bronze
Burn bros suffer again 😔
rich bronze
Huh does Jund not play Kroxa in modern?
yeah ikr
twilit canyon
kroxa is better in pure rakdos
golden plover
Gotcha. Kroxa is a no brainer in any Rakdos deck in pioneer, so I'm surprised
rich bronze
The last card burn got was roiling vortex right
twilit canyon
not an actual mana concern from jund until you realize saga is a card
yea roiling vortex
golden plover
Tbf tho, Roiling Vortex is really good
rich bronze
So does burn get price or pyro anytime soon
twilit canyon
pop would be too good
rich bronze
probably not yeah
golden plover
I think they also seem to wanna move away from burn in standard as a whole, so it looks like they print less new burn spells into formats outside of horizons
twilit canyon
technically burn got flame rift in mh2
golden plover
They usually print the generic shock and strike with set mechanic, but there hasn't been much in the way of face burn or anything similar since really Eldraine
twilit canyon
i also like reinforced ronin
rich bronze
golden plover
Like Torban felt like the last time they made a burn focused card for standard
golden plover
Well I guess roiling vortex was after
rich bronze
Chain lightning in standard
Wouldn’t be too insane
And modern burn would slot it in
twilit canyon
chain lightning would be my take yea
golden plover
I don't think they'd wanna introduce it to pioneer tho
rich bronze
Pioneer burn is too good as is
twilit canyon
pioneer is kinda effed anyways
golden plover
Remember they left the Urza lands out of BRO because of Pioneer
rich bronze
that’s boring
golden plover
The Urza lands wouldn't have done much in standard supposedly, but they intentionally avoided them
Tbf people already don't like current devotion
Devotion + Tron would be pretty gross in a format that doesn't have the answers
rich bronze
But yeah 1+1+1=7 in pioneer would be like what post was in modern on release
golden plover
Pioneer literally only has [[Alpine Moon]] and bad land destruction
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Enchantment
As Alpine Moon enters the battlefield, choose a nonbasic land card name.
Lands your opponents control with the chosen name lose all land types and abilities, and they gain ": Add one mana of any color."
"A rare and fascinating phenomenon." —Tamiyo
twilit canyon
yea cloudpost is infinitely more powerful than the urza lands are
golden plover
Cloudpost is much worse, yeah
Cloudpost had to eat a ban in pauper, where Tron is just fine
rich bronze
I wonder
have yall spent more on magic or yugioh
definitely the latter for me
despite my magic collection being worth a lot more now
fallow citrus
the latter for me because I got into ygo first
rich bronze
I got into magic first
but It was self-sustaining
bought cards from people, sold cards to people
l never had to use card stores
and never buy sealed product
so It was easier to not lose money
ygo not so much
fallow citrus
I never buy sealed product except going to prereleases
fallow citrus
I'd sell up ygo and move to mtg if I had the money to make an initial investment into the game
fallow citrus
yeah true
rich bronze
consider pauper if you have a local scene
I top 4d a huge pauper tournament recently
fallow citrus
need money for a deck and actually need to find a decent modern scene around
rich bronze
ah ask around its worth it
pauper is an amazing format
it's not just legacy for poor people
fallow citrus
yeah I do enjoy it
lusty trench
For prereleases, you can either get Urza or Mishra themed. Does anyone know whic...
Iirc they're the exact same
Got everything I need from brothers war
Feels good
lusty trench
Ended the day with gix, all 3 urzas and his stone, all 3 Mishra and his dragon engine, portal to phyrexia, arcane proxy, all the ashnod cards including altar, and hostile negotiations
fallow citrus
what prerelease packs do you get lmfao
I've never seen packs that are just that good
granite badge
I would play pauper but there's nowhere ik that advertises it
there's like 3 people in my local scene trying to get pauper going but haven't been making ground
EDH/Draft have literally gobbled up every semblence of a scene for any other event
modern died, standard died years ago here
fallow citrus
our locals is rly weird cause it just feels like it's only standard or edh
granite badge
and obvs no legacy/vintage or anything like that
lusty trench
what prerelease packs do you get lmfao
Opened a set box, made some trades
fallow citrus
oh sure you got a box
fallow citrus
think I'm going to have to give my prerelease a miss because of money which is sadge
lusty trench
Unfortunate, the artifact slot makes this prerelease a lot of fun
fallow citrus
yeah I want to play but oh well
lusty trench
Had my partner drop a wurmcoil engine on me
lusty trench
I'm pretty certain the new urzas and mishras and even gix aren't gonna make waves, but I like em a lot
rich bronze
modern died, standard died years ago here
modern died?
modern is the biggest thing in town here
huh
granite badge
Talking bout my own local scene
Our LGS got Commander running last year as a regular thing on Thursdays & its so popular(consistent double digit turnout where even Yugioh is struggling in that regard) that they're planning on starting Thursday & Friday EDH nights
Standard afaik has been nonexistent for years but I didn't start going there until 2019 and only had my school's MTG club to go off of(which was ONLY EDH)
glad peak
Welp someone played mirari’s wake
Then I played damping sphere which incidentally screws them over
golden plover
Mythic
lusty trench
Any reason in particular?
lusty trench
Fair enough
lusty trench
Right the urza and Mishra commander decks are made
I think mishras ended up being strong cause I'm a black player mainly
lusty trench
Any of you playing at fmn events, don't expect to be given the royal retainer promos
LGS' either didn't receive any or only received one
Nice celebration of 30 years wotc
golden plover
Yeah that's about standard
lusty trench
Of course it happens to like the £30 one
golden plover
Speaking of, no updates on the commander deck
We got "they'll ship soon" in late October
And nothing since
lusty trench
That whole situation is baffling
golden plover
Especially considering how many products have came out since then
I think people wouldn't care as much if there was anything but radio silence
But it's been nothing since the apology boosters to now
lusty trench
It'd take a lot to satisfy me if that was me, like two neon dynasty collectors wouldn't cut it
golden plover
Yeah my boosters were trash
I'm hoping they throw in something actually decent to make up for it in the shipped product
Bonus card Mana Crypt or something
Watch it come with a 30th anniversary pack
lusty trench
~~Watch it come with a 30th anniversary pack~~
I'd be fine with that tbh
Oh wait not the lair just a proxy pack? Ew
golden plover
Yeah the proxy pack
lusty trench
Ig you could sell it to some idiot for $200
golden plover
They gave them out during the Vegas event whenever they got in trouble for mismanagement
So it wouldn't be out of character to randomly throw one in the shipped product
golden plover
Ig you could sell it to some idiot for $200
That requires finding someone willing to buy it tho
The second those packs actually get out to people, they're gonna drop to negative value
Anyone who wanted one will have bought it and they're really not something you can resell
Maybe if you open a proxy lotus. But you can just as likely open a proxy [[Animate Wall]]
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lusty trench
I still can't believe wizards thought this was a good idea
golden plover
It's the most baffling product idea they've done, and they've done some weird ones
lusty trench
Like all this says to me is I can play proxies because wizards now endorses them
Question, is phyrexian dragon engine the same dragon robot that's on the art of Mishra, tamer of mak fawa
twilit canyon
[[mishra tamer of mak fawa]]
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Legendary Creature — Human Artificer
Permanents you control have "Ward—Sacrifice a permanent."
Each artifact card in your graveyard has unearth 
. (: Return the card from your graveyard to the battlefield. It gains haste. Exile it at the beginning of the next end step or if it would leave the battlefield. Unearth only as a sorcery.)
4/4
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Artifact Creature — Phyrexian Dragon
Double strike
When Phyrexian Dragon Engine enters the battlefield from your graveyard, you may discard your hand. If you do, draw three cards.
Unearth
(Melds with Mishra, Claimed by Gix.)
2/2
golden plover
Like all this says to me is I can play proxies because wizards now endorses them
Yeah my lgs is all in on proxies now
This was an official endorsement
lusty trench
Man the meld side of Mishra is nuts
last glen
the next logical step is WotC will endorse unofficial simulators
twilit canyon
that would be a step too far tbh
cus arena and modo are very widely profitable
paper magic has their whales
the peasants can proxy their product still sells
lusty trench
I think the meld side of urza is weaker tbh
Spending 7 mana to meld them makes the +2 shakey if it's usable, the draw and removal is nice but idk
fallow citrus
[[urza, planeswalker]]
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Legendary Planeswalker — Urza
Once during each of your turns, you may activate an additional loyalty ability of Urza, Planeswalker. (You may activate the same ability twice.)
+2: Artifact, instant, and sorcery spells you cast this turn cost less to cast. You gain 2 life.
+1: Draw two cards, then discard a card.
0: Create two 1/1 colorless Soldier artifact creature tokens.
−3: Exile target nonland permanent.
−10: Artifacts and planeswalkers you control gain indestructible until end of turn. Destroy all nonland permanents.
Loyalty: 7
fallow citrus
the turn you meld him the +2 isn't great, but that's also assuming you meld him perfectly on curve
golden plover
Urza is also really easy to interrupt
granite badge
Lowkey I wanna build a Urza EDH deck but Urza himself feels like a kill on sight commander
copper pecan
the front face is good enough to make up for the back face not being great imo
zinc shard
Standard rotated after Dominaria United rjght?
zinc shard
damn i dont usually buy cosmetics but these looks so good
polar lake
jump 22 isnt comin to arena
thank fucking god, no tron in historic or explorer
rich bronze
Ig you could sell it to some idiot for $200
more
boosters are averaging 350 euros
on cardmarket
for recent sales
sleek ferry
Pulled a foil gilded lotus and a prerelease diabolic intent
golden plover
Oh right I forgot Diabolic Intent is regular format legal now
That card is gonna be GOOD in piooner
sleek ferry
Guy offered me $25 for my diabolic intent I said nah
golden plover
You should have
They're preselling for like $8
Pre-release would probably be like $12
lusty trench
Nah holding onto it for the long run is a good idea
Pre release stamped stuff is worth more over time for staples iirc
golden plover
Fair enough then
It's gonna be a multi format staple, so yeah, it'll probably stay valuable
Well it's already a commander staple, and now it's pioneer too
I'm trying to think of what we cut in Greasefang to play a set
Lets us sac Stitcher's Supplier or an Esika Cat if we're behind to get the rat
Maybe it is time to go to the yorion build, but I haven't loved that version prior
sleek ferry
What are the best common uncommons a from this set?
I haven’t really taken a look at the set as a whole
lusty trench
golden plover
[[Dreams of Steel And Oil]] is nuts
sleek ferry
Why does the flip side look like this lmfao
Is this supposed to be flavor since it’s an avatar?
sleek ferry
Oh the other half is in another card copy
lusty trench
Yeah you need both titania and the land to make the meld
sleek ferry
Man this foil gilded lotus is probably the best looking card I’ve pulled in a loooooong time
last glen
brain check
what are the standard ramp options for green in pioneer
past eight elves
golden plover
[[Nykthos]] is the main one
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golden plover
[[Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx]]
fallow citrus
[[sylvan scrying]] exists
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Legendary Land
: Add 
.
, : Choose a color. Add an amount of mana of that color equal to your devotion to that color. (Your devotion to a color is the number of mana symbols of that color in the mana costs of permanents you control.)
fallow citrus
[[oath of nissa]] can grab you lands quicker too
golden plover
There's also stuff like [[Growth Spiral]] based on the color
golden plover
[[Old Growth Troll]] sees play too
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Creature — Troll Warrior
Trample
When Old-Growth Troll dies, if it was a creature, return it to the battlefield. It's an Aura enchantment with enchant Forest you control and "Enchanted Forest has ': Add ' and ', , Sacrifice this land: Create a tapped 4/4 green Troll Warrior creature token with trample.'"
4/4
golden plover
Yeah pretty much
That's what the ramp is used for in pioneer rn
I don't think there's really any other decks that ramp
Well there's fires that plays Omnath, but it's less ramp, more cheat out stuff with fires
fallow citrus
oh [[arboreal grazer]] too
golden plover
True, but he's not seeing much play rn
last glen
gotcha
golden plover
[[oath of nissa]] can grab you lands quicker too
Fun fact with Oath of Nissa. Devotion uses it to play [[Teferi Who Slows the Sunset]] now
golden plover
With the whole intent of using him to untap Nykthos
Sometimes going infinite with [[The Chain Veil]] from your wishboard
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Legendary Artifact
At the beginning of your end step, if you didn't activate a loyalty ability of a planeswalker this turn, you lose 2 life.
, : For each planeswalker you control, you may activate one of its loyalty abilities once this turn as though none of its loyalty abilities have been activated this turn.
fallow citrus
lmao nice
golden plover
It's a backup plan if you can't kill them the normal way, but Tef usually gets you a ton of mana no matter what
lusty trench
Tried the urza and Mishra decks against each other today
Actually well balanced
The Mishra deck aims to win early, urza aims to win late which is fitting
zinc shard
So we're getting all the Retro Frame cards minus Mishras Bauble on Arena?
sleek ferry
What format is bauble broken in
golden plover
Anything with Lurrus
sleek ferry
So every non standard format then lol
golden plover
Lurrus is banned everywhere but Historic and Vintage
Lurrus is the first card to be banned in Legacy for power level reasons in quite some time
fallow citrus
bauble's good in modern but idk if it's broken
golden plover
It's only broken with Lurrus
Tbh Lurrus is the problem card there
Bauble could have come to historic without lurrus
fallow citrus
bauble being a 0 drop helps any deck that uses delirium or benefits off of 0 drops/artifacts
emry decks kind of abuse it
golden plover
Yeah but it's not like Ornithopter is breaking the format with emry
Bauble is strong, but it's not an issue on it's own
fallow citrus
yeah but ornithopter doesn't draw potentially 2 cards every turn
golden plover
True
Bauble is a strong card, but it wouldn't have been the problem without Lurrus
clever sun
So every non standard format then lol
Lurrus is only legal in Historic, Commander, and Vintage
Out of the official formats
It doesn't make the cut in Vintage at six mana anymore and bauble certainly doesnt either and for commander with it being singleton, bauble doesn't matter
Historic would be the last format where bauble and lurrus would organically combo again
hidden ermine
Oh its not worth it anymore at 6 mana?
twilit canyon
nah
if you can black lotus -> lurrus recast lotus -> ??? its broken
if you need to go -> lotus add to hand pass hope you can cast lurrus -> lurrus -> lotus -> ??? its way too convoluted
golden plover
Why is scryfall Mono-Green devotion rn?
Usually they're themed around current events
This is the first time I've seen it be key cards to a deck
golden plover
Ah, that'd make sense
I was trying to figure out what holiday devotion was associated with
Also, looks like Hasbro stick got dropped really hard by Bank of America over current product stuff
They specifically cited too many products coming out too quickly and the $1000 packs
Went from $73 to $42 a share
copper pecan
the changes bofa suggested in that article would be super bad for the actual playerbase
hidden ermine
Bofa deez nuts
copper pecan
like, more reprints are a good thing
hidden ermine
Yeah they seem hilariously out of touch
My favourite was them suggesting that lowering value on the secondary market might push players to YGO
... the game famous for its aggressive reprint policy
copper pecan
it's so weird seeing people agree with what the bank is saying literally just because they want excuses to complain about hasbro
like, the bank doesn't care about the quality of the game, they care about maximizing profit above anything else
if these people were in charge they'd still be putting things on the reserve list
golden plover
I don't think it's reprints they're mentioning
copper pecan
they specifically mention reprints
languid quest
reserve list is lie
golden plover
This reads more like "too many products are coming out"
copper pecan
i don't know how you could possibly read "there's too much supply lowering secondary market prices" as being about anything other than reprints
golden plover
I guess that point specifically is reprints, yeab
But the rest of the stuff they mention is the sheer amount of releases
languid quest
but they don't reprint cards that they should and when they do it's in masters sets so that doesn't make sense
golden plover
Tbh it's weird. There's a lot more reprints now, but there's not as many needed reprints, yeah
copper pecan
but they don't reprint cards that they should and when they do it's in masters s...
okay but that still doesn't make it a bad thing to reprint cards
golden plover
Like Ragavan is getting one, but it's only accessible to people who already could get ragavans
I wonder if that's referring to lairs then, actually
Since lairs are the majority of reprints now
languid quest
okay but that still doesn't make it a bad thing to reprint cards
I wasn't saying reprinmting cards is bad things since I am for it just that complain in that article doesn't make sense
yeah and those are expensive whale focused products
hidden ermine
In general it seems out of touch because theyre acting like commander being the biggest format is new
Or that standard hasn't been the least popular of the big formats for many years by now
golden plover
I mean, the explosion is definitely recent
hidden ermine
Ehh
golden plover
Covid shifted the focus to commander a lot harder than prior
hidden ermine
I'd put it at 5 years ago, minimum
golden plover
But standard had been declining and commander had been going up since commander 2015
hidden ermine
Even back then commander was what most people I knew who went to LGS' played
Its Commander, Draft, Modern .... then standard
golden plover
It used to be more variety in the premier format at most lgses outside of standard tho
But now it's almost guaranteed the store is mostly commander with other formats based on playerbase
And no standard
hidden ermine
From my experience standard was always pretty unpopular
golden plover
Standard has been popular back when there was a proper competitive scene for it and there was a better standard (it also helped that standard decks were like $50)
But now there's not really a proper pro tour scene and standard decks are the same price as pioneer/some modern decks
So there's no point in spending $400 on a deck that rotates in a year when you can get one that stays in the format
languid quest
I think that what helped standard to stay relevant were big events and once those went away thanks to Covid people really had no reason to play it anymore
golden plover
Yup, there's really no scene for it
Why build a $400 grixis midrange deck when you can spend $50 more to build devotion in pioneer or $100 to build Tron in modern
You're not gonna be going to any standard events so the $400 seems like a really bad investment
lusty trench
Someone on twitter opened this
twilit canyon
tron boutta be like 15$ to build in paper lol
lusty trench
Their Mishra deck had nothing but Mishra and ashnods
golden plover
Damn I know those decks have production issues but that's crazy
copper pecan
plot twist: that guy from the bofa wrote that article to crash the secondary market, allowing them to buy out all the copies of mind goblin and then resell them later
hidden ermine
Joe mama
lusty trench
Just found out my urza deck has an infinite today
And it's one of the more well known ones
fallow citrus
which one
lusty trench
Sensei's reality chip
fallow citrus
oh sure
lusty trench
Can also infinitely cast nexus of fate provided i don't get force of will pact of negation or force of negation'd
golden plover
Throw in a [[Helm of Awakening]], make it easier
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Artifact
Spells cost less to cast.
"This little prize will cover your head, your spells, your bets, and your behind!" —Pashad ibn Asim, Suq'Ata trader
lusty trench
Ye I got one of those
golden plover
Love that card
lusty trench
But urza has that himself
golden plover
Oh right, he does
lusty trench
So I'm not too worried
golden plover
Sometimes when I'm trying to do it in Elsha and people don't know the combo I try and bluff that everyone gets benefitted by the helm, so they should leave it alone
lusty trench
"guys the symmetrical effect is truly symmetrical I promise"
I think I need an aetherflux for the deck
fallow citrus
well aetherflux gives you a good kill off of your chip + top
golden plover
I'd rather [[Brain Freeze]]
lusty trench
Right now my win con is to ult urza then go to combat infinite times
fallow citrus
I mean you can have more than one kill combo in your deck
lusty trench
Yee
fallow citrus
they also have their upsides and downsides
like yeah freeze you can draw at any point but it's way more interactable than an activated ability from an artifact
golden plover
Yeah having a few options is nice
Freeze is really solid tho, I'd definitely run it
lusty trench
My Mishra deck rn is struggling for a win con
It's mainly just either rush them with good token gen or get one of the big dumb artifact pay offs like portal to phyrexia
Any one got any other ideas?
fallow citrus
Uhhh remind me what mishra does again