I dunno, BotW came out 6 years ago
#Pokemon
vagrant steppe
foggy oxide
Yeah 100%
vagrant steppe
And this game really wants to be BoTW
placid junco
the point is that the switch has the power to run games that are drastically more intense on the system than SV should be
foggy oxide
Just came across a Scyther, Golduck and Tropius 
sand forge
Where's the Fossil Dreepy
foggy oxide
Fossil Dreepy?
last musk
Also the sun and moon situation proves gamefreak suck ass at optimization
Tbh they always have
Since gen 1 they had to get iwata in to compress it
long stone
"drastically more intense" well that's what seems so but looks can be deceiving
1.) we don't know what they did for these games to run super well. there is likely alot on the back going on. 2.just bc it looks intense does not mean it is. and GF never does things the smart way. look at how many character models sun and moon used.
foggy oxide
Oh shit, these Pokemon are like level 50
last musk
Both of these are game freaks fault moonrite
placid junco
game freak never doing things the smart way is not a good defense
sand forge
Fossil Dreepy?
Dreepy is the ghost of an ancient Pokemon
Which is why it's Dragon/Ghost
vagrant steppe
You're aware people can look at the code of a game, right?
sand forge
Meaning Dreepy when it was alive would be Dragon/Water
vagrant steppe
Like it's not a magical entity the average person can't read
foggy oxide
Ah
long stone
game freak never doing things the smart way is not a good defense
why do u guys try to make everything " defending something" or an "argument"
vagrant steppe
People can tell gamefreak didn't optimize shit or anything
frail chasm
i named a pokemon on failboats stream lol
placid junco
k
last musk
why do u guys try to make everything " defending something" or an "argument"
What I was trying to say was, it doesn't matter how powerful other things are, gamefreak were hired to ship a game for the switch that runs at a consistent 30fps minimum with little to no visual issues, and they have failed to deliver a product that meets that requirement
This is on them
And only them
long stone
i wish it was that easy
last musk
I'm a game dev student
If you can't meet your clients requirements
You turn down the project
vagrant steppe
No one else is at fault for the company failing to deliver the product they said they'd deliver
last musk
Optimization is like 50% of what I do
A lot of this games problems would've been fixed if they had just loaded the games into chunks, there are plenty of ways to do this in an open world game, and there are also plenty of ways to clear unused memory in open world games
For example sonic frontiers and botw use the blood moon system
You can force a blood moon in those games by having too much loaded into memory
long stone
i feel like all of this is the "Dunning–Kruger" effect where ppl act as if they know everything. but in this case we have no idea really. Just throwing words as if we can do better.
last musk
I respect giving gamefreak the benefit of the doubt
vagrant steppe
I dunno, most people can tell the game came out half assed and unfinished
We don't know all the specifics behind the scenes
last musk
And truth is these issues could've been fixed with more time
vagrant steppe
But people can see and play the game and know it's unfinished
long stone
calling it unfished is fine, cuz that's what it is. but acting as if "we" could have done better/know better is a reach.
vagrant steppe
I mean obviously the average person can't just sit down and fix the game
last musk
I don't think I personally could've done better or that I'd know what I'm doing, but what I do know is other people could of done better and have done previously
long stone
well ppl do act like they can make a better game
vagrant steppe
But they can tell what's wrong and if you got a team together with the tools, experience, and time game freak had you could maybe get a better game out of it
Ultimately the devs weren't given enough time tho
Also "if you don't like it, go make a better one yourself" is a really shitty excuse
Most people aren't the biggest media franchise in the world and can't just go sit down and make a AAA video game
sand forge
calling it unfished is fine, cuz that's what it is. but acting as if "we" could ...
We literally have multiple separate options they could've done for optimisation
long stone
pokemon will never be AAA game
sand forge
it's not Dunning-Kruger when it's absolutely obvious
vagrant steppe
Pokemon is literally a AAA franchise???
sand forge
You even admitted it yourself, with the S&M NPC optimisation
vagrant steppe
Like they're the fucking textbook definition?
sand forge
How is Pokemon not triple-A/
long stone
not when it comes to the final product
vagrant steppe
It's a video game franchise made by the biggest media company in the world. They're AAA
The finished games don't feel triple A, yeah
But by definition, they're triple A games
AAA literally just means a game with a really large budget
vagrant steppe
And there's literally not a company in the world with a larger budget
long stone
anyway the games likely don't have much priority in the grand scheme of Pokemon
mighty storm
POV she saw your twitter
long stone
And there's literally not a company in the world with a larger budget
does not mean that money is going to the games/dev team
sand forge
anyway the games likely don't have much priority in the grand scheme of Pokemon
which is unacceptable for a franchise founded on the games
vagrant steppe
does not mean that money is going to the games/dev team
Maybe not. Obviously we can't see the budget numbers ourselves
But by all accounts, Pokemon is AAA
Hell, look at shit like TemTem which is made on a third of the budget
I'm not saying TemTem is an insanely good game or anything
But it's a 3d monster catching game where they clearly tried and actually worked on their game
Or the digimon cyber sleuth games
Cyber Sleuth had a notably small budget
And the end result is much better than anything 3d pokemon
long stone
psure those took more than 3 years to come out
long stone
well that's deadlines for ya
sand forge
no, it's not
Gamefreak could provide more manpower to the dev teams
or extended deadlines so they weren't yearly releases
long stone
anyway unless they get a new dev team or nintendo takes shit into their own hands, i don't see any of this getting fixed
vagrant steppe
Literally could have made a DLC with like 20 new mons for Legends this year and drop SV next
long stone
well gen 9 had to kick in i guess
vagrant steppe
That's maybe true
But only for the CEOs who forced it out
But they could go to a longer gap between releases and make the games better easily
They won't tho because even the worst ones sells millions
long stone
Literally could have made a DLC with like 20 new mons for Legends this year and ...
Honestly distortion world DLC with mons native to the distortion world would have been cool
foggy oxide
My game just crashed :o
long stone
damn ... now i really want this theoretical DLC
kind vortex
one pin isn't really a functional pinning system
sand forge
I just want a Hisuian Magikarp
placid junco
feebas
long stone
I just want a Hisuian Magikarp
pure flying that turns to a flying dragon ?
sand forge
Magikarp in the Pokedex is described as once being stronger than it is in the modern day
gimme a beastie like this
long stone
had these a while ago
the krap is pure flying
it's like a bufferfish but also a sky mine, very vicious
They have an air bladder filled with hydrogen
sand forge
That's a cool set
long stone
had an idea of giving it an ability called deflate where self destruct moves only cut its hp
harsh path
Man next time I use a Gyarados in Showdown I might call it Ichiban
For certain references
sand forge
Give us a future Gyarados that has become Dragon/Water or Dragon/Flying or something
harsh path
Truly becoming like a dragon
long stone
future nah, give me past
sand forge
I'll take both
sand forge
Ya
Could have Psychic or Electric,
Past lends itself more to more typings tbh
But you could do some pollution-based poison mons
silver vigil
We could’ve had uhhhh
Nuclear waste Muk/Garbodor
or smth
Though they mention paradox mons being 1 billion years in the future so
It’d prob decay by then iirc
crimson moat
Last Gen we also had galar weezing for pollution mons
sand forge
I'd love a Tyrogue-mon for Grimer, Koffing, and Trubbish
crimson moat
Nuclear Muk would be cool if we didn’t already have Alolan Muk
sand forge
Or at least a common ancestor
crimson moat
Plastic Island mon when
sand forge
I still want a Dhelmise Gigantamax that turns into a whole shipwreck
long stone
Shellossal
crimson moat
Mess with lore and make Almighty Sinnoh a past mon
long stone
still salty that the player can't get an Eternamax Eternatus...
sand forge
But that'd be a good Poke for Pokémon Legends: Zefureram
Pelipper with one of those six pack rings
crimson moat
Megalodon past Sharpedo
sand forge
That'd be cool
sand forge
And future Porygon and it's a really hi-def duck
kind vortex
first impression about a couple hours in and just going around catching mons: flamigo being available this early is kinda unbalanced
silver vigil
Paradox is like the one time I wish Kanto got a bit more, a lot of the franchise’s early lore lends really well into something like it
long stone
Ancient Drapion "Vicious Needle"
sand forge
Doesn't Drapion share an ancestors with Centiscorch
Give us that Pokémon
Fire Poison?
long stone
I was thinking poison water cuz of sea scorpions
sand forge
Water Fire
sand forge
Give us the giant Magnetite Gestalt from that one anime episode
mighty storm
only 2 titans left
crimson moat
Future Sudowoodo that is a fake light post
Couldn’t use wood disguise due to deforestation
silver vigil
Bug/Water for kabutops
last musk
Got almost all of the legends, one to go
silver vigil
idk for omastar
sand forge
Future Kabutops is just Genesect
long stone
Pomplin
last musk
And that's all legends caught
Gotta say I'm not a huge fan of "we scattered these things around the map and you have to get all of them" type deals
Feels like padding
vagrant steppe
That way they can go "It's a 30 hour game"
tacit sphinx
So is Good As Gold the best ability in the series now
or is Wonder Guard still better
void herald
wonder guard would be better if it was on a pokemon that had actually good stats/typing
sleek sky
It's also probably never coming back because it's so good with Tera
crimson moat
(Tera gets removed Gen 10)
sleek sky
maybe "never" was hyperbolic
crimson moat
(The word never also gets removed Gen 10)
(Text speed is now permanently set)
(to medium.)
twin shard
(Gen 4 HP speed is now permanent)
placid junco
void herald
how do you kill it 
placid junco
sandstorm or hail
void herald
does that work through substitute?
placid junco
pretty sure it does
pseudo goblet
vagrant steppe
(Text speed is now permanently set)
This is gamefreak. The speed is set to slow
vagrant steppe
does that work through substitute?
Takes 2 turns, but yeah
golden lance
how do you kill it <:monkaGIGA:652734094664269835>
Irrc you can teoretically use a sound based move with a mold breaker mon
frail chasm
whats a good moveset for iron treads?
crimson moat
whats a good moveset for iron treads?
Offensive is usually doing EQ, Knock Off, Rapid Spin, and a fourth coverage move/ Stealth Rock
last musk
Using the trade codes
Scarlet is far and away the most common version
Don't blame people, koraidon do be cooler
sleek sky
is Koraidon really the selling point here
placid junco
cavewoman professor
vagrant steppe
Wait they cut Pokerus?
placid junco
a friend of mine recommended I get violet
but I really don't like the professor design
or purple
last musk
Wait they cut Pokerus?
vagrant steppe
There's no speedy way to ev train now at all then
last musk
Just by the vitamins tbh
vagrant steppe
Like Pokerus wasn't great for it, but it was better than nothing
Yeah, that's all you can do
last musk
(tho money grinding sucks ass in this game)
vagrant steppe
Weird to cut Pokerus tho
vagrant steppe
Remember kids, Nuzelocks are hacking
sleek sky
okay, to be fair
I think that was poor communication of a misunderstanding
a more accurate translation would be something like "randomizers are hacking"
which are commonly used in Nuzelocks
and do involve hacking the game
if I grasped the situation properly
void herald
you are correct, that was the misunderstanding
twin shard
Shhh you have to take mistranslations at face value so the narrative makes sense
tacit sphinx
Where the FUCK is Girafarig
I bought this game specifically for Farigiraf and I haven’t seen a single Girafarig
golden lance
does anyone know what shiny ceruledge looks like btw?
golden lance
huh
golden lance
void herald
pseudo goblet
Gotta say, Clodsire was the name right? The design are just too cute, i wholeheartedly love it 
mighty storm
POV widelens pop bomb
pseudo goblet
How many poison types we have?
I’m hoping there’s no competition when I’m choosing team members with Poison for Clodsire 
golden lance
pseudo goblet
Wait, that engine looking Pokémon is poison??? Poison steel? 
golden lance
yes
vagrant steppe
Run Glimmora
pseudo goblet
干
vagrant steppe
They're nuts
kind vortex
2 gyms and 2 titans in, having fun so far
performance issues are relatively minor, haven't run into anything major
most major thing was in an early wild battle where the ground vanished in the middle to show sea textures, but it fixed itself quickly
haven't done any team star yet, probably gonna do one of those next
vagrant steppe
kind vortex
my biggest issue with it, fi anything, is giving the player flamigo as one of the first available wild encounters
mon straight up neuters the earliest gyms, and potentially one of the early titans too
casual 115 atk 90 spd
would not recommend using flamigo early game if you're looking for a challenge
placid junco
bleak pine
Phew, I've been doing a whole lot of chronicling of my adventure in Scarlet
Been enjoying it so far! That being said, I can't help but feel somewhat frustrated at the ever-so-present evolution requirements of some mons. And I really can't figure out where I can find some tips on where to go looking.
kind vortex
some evo requirements are way out there relative to what you might be used to
golden lance
bulbapedia/serebii should have the info out by now
bleak pine
Mon spoilers:
||I actually checked the notes after I got a Primeape after I just realized that Mankey got Cross Chop at a ludicrously low level. Nearly fell out of my seat but I can't for the life of me figure out what it could be||
kind vortex
bulbapedia/serebii should have the info out by now
serebii def does, idk about bulbapedia but i'd assume they do too
bleak pine
||I didn't even know it could possibly evolve, let alone learn some new move that takes in damage dealt and dishes it back out||
kind vortex
do you want to be told?
bleak pine
Oh, yeah, I would but I'm gonna try to do it with the least bit of spoilery stuff. Hence why I'm looking for tips.
Yeah, tips instead of just being told would be nice. The more vague the better!
Sorry
kind vortex
for primeape, ||pay attention to what it gets by level up, then make a point to incorporate it||
bleak pine
||Got it!||
kind vortex
any others?
bleak pine
Nope, none so far.
kind vortex
aight
kind vortex
do you want to be told whether you're on the right track or not?
kind vortex
alrighty
||primeape isn't even remotely the worst one of the new bunch||
||they went really dumb with some of these||
sharp kernel
but I really don't like the professor design
or purple
Yes, we all hate the mods
bleak pine
||Y'know, I don't got much favorites from Red/Blue, but I do actually like Primeape a fair bit. Pretty neat to know the fella can evolve.||
||I think my Angy (And yes I evolved it) turned into like||
||Some hypothetical lovechild of Akuma and Asura||
||Holy shit it literally is just Akuma||
||Now I just gotta knock out Charcadet. Apparently there's a book that's like, a story about how Charcadet became I guess, Armarogue or Ceruledge, but I highly doubt the method of evolution would involve actually fighting a Gengar, already a losing proposition.||
kind vortex
||Now I just gotta knock out Charcadet. Apparently there's a book that's like, a...
||there is a story about charcadet yes, and it should be the first hint you need for it; just make sure you remember where to find that story||
bleak pine
Ahh, gotcha
||So guess are A: Get into a very close fight and score a victory with Charcadet
or B: Find this so-called "armor". Apparently the official website made mention on how Armarogue's armor came from a 'distinguished warrior' I think.||
||My money's on B so far||
bleak pine
Maaan, this Picnic stuff really makes me get in the mood for sandwiches
Finally made a proper BLT and now I'm thinking Arby's
Also fittingly had Ursaring at the front
He better not take my Pic-i-nic basket, eh, Boo boo?
young river
Am i doing this right? lol
sand forge
Psyduck pog
tacit sphinx
Is anyone else finding it a smidge hard to level up
kind vortex
candies still exist
kind vortex
Is anyone else finding it a smidge hard to level up
make ham sandwich, use a flamigo or something to go farm chanseys up north
takes a bit of setup but levels pretty easy
maiden flax
Chansey outbreaks are like the best exp farm
in a nutshell lmao
fading stratus
Probably Moist critical reference
pseudo goblet
warm sky
pseudo goblet
Any incredibly-bad shiny with the new pokemon in this gen? I wanna know whose the shiny Garchomp of this Gen 9
crimson moat
Maushold
Body stays white, the extremely light blue parts change to extremely light tan
pseudo goblet
Thanks 
crimson moat
Also for Paradox pokemon, Iron Hands got a really lame shiny
Most Future mons, the chrome shiny is very noticeable and different, but for Iron Hands it changes very little.
vagrant steppe
Yeah most of these shinies suck
warm sky
... change eye color
crimson moat
oh yeah those 2 suck too
warm sky
bro they could've made done a palette swap or made a mega man reference
vagrant steppe
It also doesn't help that apparently the PLA sparkle doesn't happen now?
warm sky
or something
silver vigil
I find it funny how most of the new mons I'm using were some of the few shown before release
vagrant steppe
So you can easily miss most overworld shinies
warm sky
It also doesn't help that apparently the PLA sparkle doesn't happen now?
yeah, the lack of anything also fucking sucks for colorblind people
vagrant steppe
Accessibility features in a Pokemon game? Never
Just for that we're cutting pokerus
Oh wait
vagrant steppe
Just for that we're cutting the run button
warm sky
Hey remember when you could make the trigger buttons function like an A button for accesibility?
crimson moat
warm sky
They cut that out
vagrant steppe
Wow that's awful
placid junco
That is literally the worst shiny I have ever seen
warm sky
Also didn't HGSS have a run toggle, so you could make your running speed the default
which they just
removed
placid junco
Ye
placid junco
As well as having 2 key item hotkey slots
vagrant steppe
Gen 6 had 4
placid junco
Oh right
vagrant steppe
You could assign one to each d pad button
crimson moat
So yeah running list of the really bad shinies in gen 9
Maushold line
Ceruledge and Armorouge
Baxcalibur line
Iron Hands
warm sky
Also on a more minor thing.
I really don't like Rotom Dex / Phone just being a thing
It feels
... weird
vagrant steppe
Yo quick question: is there an NPC AT ALL in this game that uses a hold item?
I'd assume the answer is no
Because no one has used one since Gen 6 lmao
warm sky
also god, I felt like a pokéboomer when I saw the pokédex was reduced to an app 💀
warm sky
Seriously though but
vagrant steppe
I'm honestly surprised that a core feature, hold items, hasn't been used in the main story at all for 3 generations now
crimson moat
At least they learned their lesson in gen 7 about really annoying NPCs for items
warm sky
Looking at the rotom phone shit from a real world perspective
makes it feel really fucking weird
Like, where the fuck are we getting millions of rotoms from
to make into phones
crimson moat
Don't you kids have Rotoms?
warm sky
Is there a mass breeding farm or something?
vagrant steppe
Huh
warm sky
At the least in 7 the rotom dex felt like a small gimmick and it was a character
Now it's just "your phone is posessed by a ghost who runs all your apps"
vagrant steppe
Yup
warm sky
Like it makes sense from a worldbuilding perspective
But idk, it doesn't sit right with me
pseudo goblet
Actually, now that I looked at it, it’s at least 2-3 out of 10
vagrant steppe
Especially considering rotom has human level intelligence
crimson moat
that's your opinion
vagrant steppe
Okay just checked and ||Nemona|| doesn't use a hold item at all
So I can assume no trainers do
warm sky
||Wait so the battle expert / obsessed girl doesn't?... man||
silver vigil
||she's not the final boss boss||
||the professors use 6 paradox mons + the box legend||
vagrant steppe
Oh they use exactly 1 hold item
They are the only trainer to use one in the entire game then
pseudo goblet
https://twitter.com/cyndaquilism/status/1593786138996637700?s=46&t=90gub7Pab_Jjk...
Guessing Rowlet is next, finish the hisui trio
crimson moat
Granted this isn't a blatantly broken interaction that anyone will run into, there are other legit problems with this thing that are easy to do
"Like what"
Summoning your ride pokemon when you are close to the object will phase you into the olive
It also phases through NPCs and can become immovable
pseudo goblet
https://twitter.com/simoeru/status/1594366754062766080
Oh cool, someone recreated the m&m thief glitch
The one I saw was a guy with Miraidon
foggy oxide
Yo I just found a wild Glaceon. That's crazy
pseudo goblet
golden lance
The belt kinda looks like shinobi's
bleak pine
Love it
pseudo goblet
The belt kinda looks like shinobi's
Ikr
Friendly reminder that Geats stole Shinobi’s spot as the main 2022 tv rider lol
maiden flax
Actually people found the game really good
But the problem is the entirely on the performance
vagrant steppe
Yeah the performance is the primary issue
There's a lot of smaller ones that aren't great either
But the performance is unacceptable
warm sky
I saw a tweet saying "sonic 06 released in the wrong generation" and
god yeah
seeing how people treat SV
young river
vagrant steppe
I saw a tweet saying "sonic 06 released in the wrong generation" and
See at least Sonic fans admitted that 06 was bad
vagrant steppe
More like wrong fanbase
When anyone else puts out a game like this, they get shat on
Pokemon goes "well it's still fun guys, you're just mean"
Sonic had a major glow up in frontiers too
So it's weird
sharp kernel
I mean like Metrona said, the main issue is just performance based, the game itself is fun and complete with what they intended to ship.
It’s not a Cyberpunk situation where they shipped both a game with single player performance issues and an incomplete game
vagrant steppe
I mean, there's a lot of other small things they cut
warm sky
Twitter
I do agree from what I see tho that SV seems like the most solid gameplay loop.
vagrant steppe
Like interiors to buildings, random features, cut QoL content, and other stuff
But I think overall the game is probably fine to good other than the bugs
You can definitely tell they cut corners tho
There's no victory road and the elite four and all gym leaders are fought in the same white room with no background
Well the gyms are fought outside, but all gyms are that white room
vagrant steppe
https://twitter.com/Lewchube/status/1594735632869384197?t=J4exUoyJ6wBSKCgr3AHIvQ...
Watch them only fix the music thing and not the rest
sharp kernel
That’s why I said what they intended to ship. Cutting off victory road seemed to be intended. Things like interiors and stuff like that are minor graphical complaints that you could say they cut corners on, but they don’t actually affect the game
sharp kernel
Most people in the Pokémon community seem to think if there was no performance issues this would be the best Pokémon game in at least the past 3 gens, which depending on where you stand on Gen 6-Gen 8 could not be saying much to you
vagrant steppe
Compare it to all the previous gen gyms
vagrant steppe
Every other gen has had gyms be unique locations for the leader
last musk
I have seens unreal asset flips that look better than scarlet and violet
sharp kernel
I’m also of the mindset that I didn’t buy a switch for its late ps2 early ps3 equivalent graphical capabilities
kind vortex
Yo quick question: is there an NPC AT ALL in this game that uses a hold item?
random trainer had a mon hold a berry, but since it was a random trainer, i don't remember which one it was
but i think they wer ea courier?
vagrant steppe
I wasn't even counting all the GameCube ass overworld graphics
vagrant steppe
I’m also of the mindset that I didn’t buy a switch for its late ps2 early ps3 eq...
Bro the switch can run Nier, the Witcher 3, and Doom Eternal
maiden flax
Ive seen somepeople say its better than gen 5
sharp kernel
Compare nier, the Witcher 3, and doom eternal switch graphics to their ps4 counterparts
Tell me the switch is a powerful machine
maiden flax
Yo quick question: is there an NPC AT ALL in this game that uses a hold item?
Quite a few actually
vagrant steppe
They're a bit worse than their PS4 versions, yeah
sharp kernel
It’s not a bit
vagrant steppe
But that doesn't excuse SV
sharp kernel
It’s considerably worse
sharp kernel
Nintendo hasn’t made a powerful console since the GameCube
maiden flax
Like this one guy who had a focus sash and then kod my mon .-.
sharp kernel
Botw and odyssey are good looking switch games
Now take botw and compare it to god of war 2018
And you would think botw was made in the 90s
maiden flax
BotW was also made in several more years and like
5 different delays :x
vagrant steppe
The point is that the switch isn't the issue
sharp kernel
It’s like me saying
vagrant steppe
Also BoTW looks and runs like a modern game
vagrant steppe
The difference is consoles tho
I'm exclusively using examples that are on the same console
And all of these came out years before this one
sharp kernel
But again, Look at the AAA titles being made for the switch right now. We’ve gone back to 2D with 3D rendered environments with pretty sparks
And people think those look amazing
Live a live was arguably the best game of the year for the switch this year
But it’s just a touched up 2D game
last musk
Skyrim released in 2011, it runs well on switch, is a bigger open world than scarlet and violet, and runs better on switch
It also looks better
vagrant steppe
Pokemon is a AAA title
last musk
And it was ported by Bethesda
sharp kernel
I’m just saying, doesn’t it get tiring focusing on the negatives everyday, when a lot of what the community asked for, we actually got in this game? For the first time since I’ve been a Pokémon fan, we actually got a lot of the stuff we wanted and the stuff that was being asked for
Performance sucks ass
sand forge
I’m just saying, doesn’t it get tiring focusing on the negatives everyday, when ...
Such as?
sharp kernel
Removal of accessibility features really sucks ass, and I’m sorry for my friends here that needed those
sharp kernel
Such as?
Massive balance overhauls
Removal of forced tutorial (it turned into classes which was a unique way to make it optional, while still rewarding you for doing it)
First actual open world-ish game (no just wild zone areas)
Pokémon size scaling
Breeding QoL
Comp QoL
Actual solid story
sand forge
All fair points, only issue I have with any of them is the breeding thing
(why did they give you a random egg)
sharp kernel
I understand the random egg part being annoying
maiden flax
Massive balance overhauls
Removal of forced tutorial (it turned into classes whi...
History class is the best class cause it gives lore
sharp kernel
But in terms of me being able to go into a picnic, and if I have to do something come back an hour or 2 later to multiple eggs, that imo saves a lot of time compared to breeding
maiden flax
I understand the random egg part being annoying
Small price to pay for afk breeding
sharp kernel
Yeah that’s better for me, but I could see people that were used to doing all their breeding and hatching in the span of 8-10 hours of playtime having an issue with it
(I was one of those people)
But the afk breeding can only give you time to do other things imo
vagrant steppe
I mean, there's plenty of positives but there's a ton of negatives too
I'd focus more on the positives if the negatives didn't outweigh them currently tho
Also, powercreep this gen is off the charts lmao
sharp kernel
Looks that way for early meta, but I would wait to see just what a full fleshed out meta ends up looking like
And as the Pokédex expands, certain things will fall out
sand forge
I just wish the designs were more interesting
maiden flax
I would say the positives of the gen outweigh the negative for me personally
sharp kernel
The past ones are better than the future ones imo
But I like iron hands
And iron tusk
maiden flax
I liked a lot of mons this gen...
Also apparently flamigo's neck is tied in a knot at the base of its body
warm sky
yeah because it's supposed to be a balloon animal
maiden flax
Ah
warm sky
... it's still like a gen 1 type design (derogatory)
warm sky
Oh for sure
crimson moat
Sandy Shocks is the biggest L for paradox mons
kind vortex
flamigo the worst designed good mon in the game, apparently
vagrant steppe
Flamigo is dumb as shit
sand forge
Sandy Shocks is the biggest L for paradox mons
I'm not sure what to make of the revelation that it wasn't an ancient variant, just a very old Magneton
I never wanted to imagine Magneton getting saggy magnets as it aged
maiden flax
Lol
kind vortex
came upon a potential bug where rapid spin doesn't increase speed if it knocks out a pokemon
idk if this is just due to the speciifcs of team star boss fights tho
will test some more in general use cases later
instance was cyclizar rapid spin knocking out mela's torkoal
using rapid spin on revavroom w/o killing it had it gain speed as normal
(killing it ends the fight so i'm not worried about it there)
kind vortex
i wasn't paying attention when i killed torkoal just now unfortunately
was more concerned with the rapid spin speed issue
car didn't give exp, as far as i can see
foggy oxide
The battling the team part doesn't either I'm p. sure
sharp kernel
They don’t
flat fractal
the team definitely doesn't
sharp kernel
Also mela wiped me
foggy oxide
I just did Mela, but I was overleveled lol
I think I wiped vs the first or second gym leader I did though
I didn't go with the grass guy as first one
kind vortex
i'm a bit overleveled for mela as well but i tried to use some of my lower level mons
sandile was 31, cyclizar 29
finished with a 35 espathra but it's nbd
sharp kernel
Sheesh I only hit 30 on my first mon after 2nd gym/Titan
sharp kernel
Btw I did electric gym 2nd and ||what a perfect tera Pokémon for them to wipe me with||
kind vortex
||mismagius is a run killer if you do that fight too early, yeah||
foggy oxide
Actually I think I wiped vs what would've been my 4th gym too
I actually haven't gone back and done it yet
The Snow dude
kind vortex
you took grusha fourth?
foggy oxide
Yeah lol
Bad move, but I got a ton of training done in the area at least
Mainly a bad move because his ||Frosmoth Bug Buzz-es my whole team to death||
And was ||7 levels higher than my strongest, at level 47||
I just did Electric Gym while talking here :p
kind vortex
alrighty, gonna run tests on rapid spin now
would be nice if i could find a trainer with more than one mon
bruh don't make me test this on a damn gym leader
does every regular trainer only have 1 mon or something
jesus christ
kind vortex
ok i had it work properly in a regular battle
so for w/e reason it didn't work specifically in a team star boss battle
maybe it's something to do with how the game handles the cars?
if i remember to, i'll test it out in a later fight, hopefully those'll have more than 2 mons
placid junco
lmao
apparently the elite 4 theme is bugged
and only looping the first 3 seconds for some people
swift jasper
https://twitter.com/Lewchube/status/1594735632869384197?t=J4exUoyJ6wBSKCgr3AHIvQ...
yeah they're aware
placid junco
ah
crimson moat
#1040055999156994058 message
Yup
Resetting the game fixes this if it happens, but you are playing this blind you might not even know to do that or if there was supposed to be a theme to begin with.
vagrant steppe
Another fangame thing we called that ended up being in the real game:
Gallade got Sharpness
Sharpness uses the same move list we used for "Swordsman" but Sharpness includes moves we didn't have because they didn't exist
kind vortex
cheesing a titan i'm underleveled for with baby doll eyes spam and endeavor
you'd figure they would have accounted for endeavor with the titans, but apparently nope
also apparently salt cure does a number on them too, if you're into that
anyway, my progress now is 3 gyms, 2 team star, 4 titans
with 2 of the titans coming in the last 20 mins
considering pushing my luck and killing the last titan now
crimson moat
also apparently salt cure does a number on them too, if you're into that
The commonly posted strategy to cheese is to abuse Salt Cure + Sturdy + Healing items
Basically toxic sturdy staling but you have no need to get a TM
bleak pine
Alright, so I realized I might be missing out on Bagon
Really wanting to have one, so I guess I'd be willing to throw out like, I guess either Deino or Gible for one
Any takers?
foggy oxide
I've got 6 badges 2 Team Star halls and 2 titans done, but I need another titan to get the high jump ability so I can do the second to last gym
I'll probably just do all the titans next
Then finish the gyms
mighty storm
I'll probably just do all the titans next
the titans are easy to cheese with a naclistack
crimson moat
Welp... more detail found out about breeding
For hatching, you can no longer get down the step count of multiple eggs at once when one is close to hatching and basically each additional egg will have a set of extra steps to run
They liked fucked around with the whole breeding process why
The AFK to get eggs makes getting them faster, and hatching them is faster due to your ride mon, but it gets offset by having to do everything near separately
crimson moat
Each hatch now has to be 1 egg cycle apart, which is like an extra minute to hatch each egg
crimson moat
It's so bizzare, they made getting an hatching one egg quicker, but mass hatching a chore
vagrant steppe
Yeah that's not "improved breeding"
crimson moat
I don't know whether to call all this improved, worse, or just different
vagrant steppe
I'd say one egg at a time for hatching is much worse
crimson moat
ok just to reiterate, because I read this wrong too
1 egg cycle apart is not the whole egg hatch
but it is still accumulating unneeded time per egg
crimson moat
agreed
vagrant steppe
What do they have against breeding
foggy oxide
The gyms and ||team star|| on the other hand
The gym road is really fun. Been a long time since I've had to do as much grinding in a Pokemon game as I have in this one
crimson moat
So, to recap:
It is faster in that:
Eggs get accumulated in AFK
Hatching eggs is now naturally quicker due to the speed of your ride pokemon and the egg hatching buff from restaurant
Egg Moves are easier to breed
It is slower in that:
Picnics accumulate up to 10 eggs tops before you have to reset it
You are not hatching your eggs at all while in picnic
For every additional egg you are hatching at once in a party, you are adding on about an extra minute of time.
It is good for hatching small numbers of eggs, but this is probably hell for shiny hunters
vagrant steppe
It's worse for shiny hunting and specific comp sets
It's maybe better for regular breeding, but it's debatable
placid junco
Let’s goooo
mighty storm
The titans aren’t even hard though
yeah but titans open up full exploraton
so one mon being able to wreck all 5 of them, opens up more raidon forms quickly
sharp kernel
Yeah but I’m not even stressing it
The exploration itself has been super rewarding
I can’t imagine actually rushing to do things
bleak pine
Let’s goooo
Nice!
If you need someone for some multiplayer stuff, I'm able to help, Copper!
golden lance
How long did it take for bdsp to get the bug fixing patches, again?
crimson moat
A little short of a month
First patch after 3 weeks
Second patch 3 weeks later
Third patch, which was largely the fixes to multiplayer, took 3 1/2 months after the game came out
golden lance
Aight i got time to finish pla then
bleak pine
||Ok, so I stuck with this pink... thing with a club and kept being patient with it.||
||And i have to show the screenshot cause MY WORD||
||Ok, I'm sorry, this has how much power!?||
||Also, yeah, friendship ended with Mawile, now Tinkaton is my new best friend||
||Funny thing is, this pink thing bats rocks at Corviknight. For fun.||
||...Oh, this will be sick coupled with Protect/Detect.||
kind vortex
||Ok, I'm sorry, *this has how much power!?*||
||it's balanced by built-in torment and tinkaton only having 75 base atk, but ye it's a nuke||
bleak pine
||BIG SMASHY||
||This was funny, since around the same time my Corvisquire finally evolved, and apparently Tinkaton is the whole reason there isn't a Flying Taxi service using Corviknight, judging from its entry||
bleak pine
Y'know, Baby-Doll eyes is super underrated
Reduces the attack of the opponent by 1 stage, but it's a priority move.
I actually like it a fair bit, assuming Charm isn't an option.
golden lance
Honestly
It ain't that bad of an option considering intimidate got nuked into oblivion
Debuffs are still kind of a niche unless it does something else on top of it unfortunately
bleak pine
Yeah, Mystic Fire is still pretty cool
||As is Chilling Water, that new move.||
I just wish Confide got the same deal
Introduced alongside Baby-Doll Eyes, and all it does is just
Reduce Sp. Atk by one stage, and nothing else.
Only real claim to fame was literally everything could learn it.
vagrant steppe
I'm really hoping that patch comes. I might pick up the game if it does
Watch the patch only fix the e4 theme
kind vortex
It ain't that bad of an option considering intimidate got nuked into oblivion
intimidate is unchanged tho
kind vortex
no nerf
last musk
It was protean that got the nerf no?
mighty storm
protean got nerfed
lucid moth
bleak pine
Alright, so what kind of dragon-type thing is a version exclusive? I've been meaning to trade off for a Bagon but I dunno what kind of small drago I got that would be a worthy trade for someone with Violet
Hoping it's Gible, cause I don't exactly care much for the landshark
fading stratus
Intimidate nerf is oblivious not getting affected by intimidate
tacit sphinx
Am I missing something with Rellor?
I have had it in the party for a while now but it seems kinda… not great
bleak pine
||Ooooh, that the Dung Beetle?||
fading stratus
Alright, so what kind of dragon-type thing is a version exclusive? I've been mea...
Tyranitar and salamence iirc
tacit sphinx
||Ooooh, that the Dung Beetle?||
Yeah
golden lance
Alright, so what kind of dragon-type thing is a version exclusive? I've been mea...
Dreepy is violet exclusive
bleak pine
||The entry says its ball is made of 'mud'. Yeah, right, whatever you say, Pokedex||
tacit sphinx
I don’t know what I’m doing wrong, he’s Level 37 and has these stats
bleak pine
Ah, right shame that is, but that's alright
I just like Salamence enough to do some trades for it
lusty tiger
Am I missing something with Rellor?
They have been allergic to making good Pokemon outside of a the select few later pokemon you obtain
tacit sphinx
Does it evolve?
bleak pine
I don’t know what I’m doing wrong, he’s Level 37 and has these stats
||I did notice it can evolve. But it might have some dumb requirement to do so||
lusty tiger
Does it evolve?
Yes
bleak pine
Yep
tacit sphinx
The fuck
lusty tiger
And it turns into something solid but apparently it requires a real stupid evo method
tacit sphinx
Is it a stone?
lusty tiger
No
bleak pine
There might be a dumb sort of requirement it needs to evolve though
lusty tiger
100 steps in the overworld feature
bleak pine
Basically, walk with it
lusty tiger
Yes
tacit sphinx
I’ve deadass never used that shit
bleak pine
Throw that ball and start hoofing it
lusty tiger
You need to go OUTSIDE
tacit sphinx
Except for the squad fights
bleak pine
A short walk across the desert will suffice!
fading stratus
I just like Salamence enough to do some trades for it
Alternatively just use Roaring Moon
tacit sphinx
Also I find a weird levelling spot
lusty tiger
That's it
bleak pine
Gonna name mine Korogashi
lusty tiger
Insanely mid stats outside of SpAtk and SpDef
lusty tiger
It's not really a main story type of Pokemon
maiden flax
I don’t know what I’m doing wrong, he’s Level 37 and has these stats
What mon is this?
lusty tiger
It feels built for competitive
bleak pine
So I guess I'll just put out my posted request here: Offering Larvitar for Bagon
maiden flax
Oh wait rellor
tacit sphinx
What mon is this?
Rellor
lusty tiger
The thing that evolves into the Bug/Psychic
bleak pine
It's a funny dung beetle
bleak pine
Nah, we explained it
maiden flax
Its 1000 steps btw
bleak pine
In any case, do ping me if you are cool with the trade offer!
golden lance
So I guess I'll just put out my posted request here: Offering Larvitar for Bagon
Wait did you pick scarlet of violet?
bleak pine
Scarlet Version for me
lusty tiger
Is it 1k?
golden lance
Ah
bleak pine
I did a coin flip and got Scarlet
maiden flax
You can do it in bursts, as ive tested
lusty tiger
Jesus
golden lance
I see
maiden flax
Its 1k
golden lance
I got violet but uhhh
bleak pine
No regrets on that matter, just, I liked Bagon is all
lusty tiger
I don't own the games
maiden flax
Fastest way is to spin around in a circle
lusty tiger
I am just looking at stats
last musk
Does anyone want me to post the link to the video that has the trade codes for people trading version exclusives?
bleak pine
Does anyone want me to post the link to the video that has the trade codes for p...
Not I personally, but the sort of trade hotline for Bagon/Larvitar or whatever else would be appreciated
Tryna avoid spoilers if I can help it!
maiden flax
My rabsca is -speed +spatk which i find hysterical
lusty tiger
If it had better HP I could see it or better speed. But it's just really frail
lusty tiger
My rabsca is -speed +spatk which i find hysterical
Optimal probably
last musk
Not I personally, but the sort of trade hotline for Bagon/Larvitar or whatever e...
0316 or 0276
golden lance
Ngl kinda funny how you can see what new mons gf wanted to push by looking at the speed stats
last musk
Those codes should eventually get you the right trade
lusty tiger
That is true
bleak pine
Wait, which is which?
lusty tiger
The fucking Misdreavus with 135
maiden flax
Optimal probably
It learns trick room and revival blessing so in comp play it will be used in trick room
lusty tiger
Comical levels of speed
last musk
Wait, which is which?
You can pick either
lusty tiger
It learns trick room and revival blessing so in comp play it will be used in tri...
Yeah yeah for sure
bleak pine
Ahhh, gotcha
lusty tiger
I think it was made with comp in mind more than anything
last musk
It's just the two mons dex numbers
bleak pine
I'll try it! Thanks!
lusty tiger
You know
last musk
The second number is to diversify the pool
lusty tiger
Those Pokemon that suck ass in the game's story and regular game loop
last musk
Don't want to run into the same people with the same version after all
lusty tiger
But are more meant to use when you are playing VGC or singles
maiden flax
Like revival blessing for trick room is great since you have like 3 keys mons you want alive and the rest are support/trick room setters
golden lance
Btw
lusty tiger
Yeah for sure. Leppa Berry it to have insurance
golden lance
How does revival blessing interact with nuzlock rules?
tacit sphinx
Also I got a dolphin
golden lance
You can't use the move at all?
lusty tiger
Probably spread 252 HP and half/half Def/SpDef
golden lance
Also I got a dolphin
||it can evolve, really stupid method too||
lusty tiger
How does revival blessing interact with nuzlock rules?
It's nuzlocke do what you want
tacit sphinx
I feel like the dolphin is gonna have some fucking bullshit like “play with a ball in the picnic fifty times” to evolve it
maiden flax
Probably unless they want to make a joke about rabsca resurrecting the dead
maiden flax
I feel like the dolphin is gonna have some fucking bullshit like “play with a ba...
No worse
golden lance
I feel like the dolphin is gonna have some fucking bullshit like “play with a ba...
It's worse than that
tacit sphinx
How
maiden flax
You have to have a friend watch it battle
golden lance
||Level it up while another player is watching||
lusty tiger
Shit dolphin evolves by battling or leveling up with a friend watching
lusty tiger
Minimum level is 38 I believe?
golden lance
We introduced cuckoldry to pokemon
last musk
Pokémon just evolve wacky this gen
sleek sky
I hope you have friends
lusty tiger
Anyways your Finizen evolves to look exactly the same except it has a heart on its chest
Congrats
golden lance
Pokémon just evolve *wacky* this gen
And no one topped malamar yet
last musk
Malamar isn't too bad
lusty tiger
If it wasn't for the Hero form existing I would hate Finizen and Palafin
last musk
At least you could trigger that one on accident
golden lance
In terms of uniqueness, i mean
maiden flax
Anyways your Finizen evolves to look *exactly* the same except it has a heart on...
I like it, the joke about being a superhero like superman where they hide their secret identity and they go into a phone booth (pokeball) to change
lusty tiger
To be fair, I am still in shock cus Hero Form looks insanely ugly
golden lance
Just flip the 3ds upside down lol
lusty tiger
I like it, the joke about being a superhero like superman where they hide their ...
Oh I know what they were going for
golden lance
To be fair, I am still in shock cus Hero Form looks insanely ugly
The fact that's it's not even pink makes me a bit sad tbh
lusty tiger
I still think it's dumb
bleak pine
Alright tried 0316
maiden flax
Like finizen is a pun on citizen which is funny
golden lance
Since it could be a reference to that
last musk
Yeah the codes sometimes get trolled
bleak pine
Ah
lusty tiger
I also find it gross that they basically make it so easy to get those stats with a buffed up Aqua Jet
last musk
It's not common in my experience
lusty tiger
None of that is okay
tacit sphinx
So which one of you is helping me get the dolphin
lusty tiger
Hero makes Kyogre look washed
And I think that is absurd for the pathetic set up needed
At the very least Kyogre is a Special Attacker which kinda carries the extra 10 missing power stat points
But genuinely
maiden flax
So which one of you is helping me get the dolphin
Want to add me on switch?
lusty tiger
This gen just really did not care about power creep
bleak pine
So which one of you is helping me get the dolphin
I'm for it!
I think I still got you on as a friend too, if you're up for it
tacit sphinx
This gen just really did not care about power creep
The last like 4 haven’t
What’s the issue
lusty tiger
They have for sure
bleak pine
Lemme know if you're good and ready!
maiden flax
I still hate the tapus of gen 7 meta
lusty tiger
The Tapus feel reasonable compared to stuff we got this gen
tacit sphinx
They have for sure
Zacian, Garmanitan, Dracovish, Toxapex, the Tapus, the entire Fairy type
maiden flax
What about the ubs?
lusty tiger
And we know after they took a slap on the wrist nerf, that they are fine
bleak pine
||Sledge NO||
lusty tiger
The UBs are also fine overall. Just Naga and Phero missed the power mark overall
golden lance
Since it could be a reference to *that*
Since no one will get that nor is really that interested i'll explain it anyway, ||so there's this tale from the brazilian folklore that is about a pink dolphin who turns into a really hot dude, gets ppl pregnant, and dips, it served as an easy way to explain to children why they grew up fatherless||
tacit sphinx
@bleak pine ready
lusty tiger
Zacian, Garmanitan, Dracovish, Toxapex, the Tapus, the entire Fairy type
None of these are nearly as crazy as some of the new things that have come out this gen
bleak pine
Alright, so let's see how this works again
bleak pine
Is this a trade you wanna do Raz?
lusty tiger
God
lusty tiger
That is easily my least favorite new design
flat fractal
also that fucking coin pokemon evo
maiden flax
<@456226577798135808> ready
4611-0261-1446
Can you add me in switch anyway 😄
bleak pine
I can watch you level up fish with enthusiasm
bleak pine
Righto!
flat fractal
it looks like the cinnemon guy from the fruit loops commericals
bleak pine
I'll join in a sec
golden lance
Or that it has one of the best abilities ever
lusty tiger
Right that too
The ultimate spin blocker
And defog blocker
With a very strong BST overall too
Very optimized for its typing and use
golden lance
And as a way to put pressure with nasty plot
maiden flax
None of Gholdengo tells me it's a Ghost or a Steel type
It being made of gold didnt make you think steel?
vagrant steppe
It's funny, Gholdengo isn't even in the top 5 most broken mons this gen
That's how crazy the powercreep this time was
lusty tiger
It being made of gold didnt make you think steel?
I didn't even recognize it was made of gold
lusty tiger
That's how crazy the powercreep this time was
Yeah which is insane to me
last musk
I've just noticed kinggambit can use suckerpunch
lusty tiger
If we had gotten Gholdengo in any prior gen it would probably have gone to Ubers immediately
golden lance
Yep
vagrant steppe
I've just noticed kinggambit can use suckerpunch <:monkaGIGA:652734094664269835>
Yup, been sweeping in showdown with it
lusty tiger
I've just noticed kinggambit can use suckerpunch <:monkaGIGA:652734094664269835>
Yeah why wouldn't it?
vagrant steppe
Tbh, Gambit only really feels... Fine.
lusty tiger
It evolves from Bisharp
vagrant steppe
Which is also saying something
lusty tiger
Kingambit is really mediocre yes
last musk
Yeah why wouldn't it?
Something honourable warrior something something
lusty tiger
It is just Bisharp+
tacit sphinx
@maiden flax sent
vagrant steppe
Because Bisharp has consistently been OU every gen since release
tacit sphinx
Once you confirm it let me know and I’ll do a room
maiden flax
Once you confirm it let me know and I’ll do a room
Done
vagrant steppe
Gambit feels good, yeah. But he's more of a last resort than anything I feel like
bleak pine
We can probs make some sandwiches after that's said and done
vagrant steppe
Like he's just better Bisharp
lusty tiger
The only reason Bisharp has been OU for ages is that Ghost type is actually the most powerful type and Bisharp has a winning match up against every Ghost type really
golden lance
Btw
bleak pine
Anyone for like, a BLT or whatever?
golden lance
Do the raidons get shed tail?
vagrant steppe
I mean there's an insane amount of good ghosts this game
vagrant steppe
Do the raidons get shed tail?
Nope. Thank god
lusty tiger
Well okay Ghost isn't the single best type
golden lance
Anyone for like, a BLT or whatever?
P I C K L E S
last musk
What's yalls top 5 most broken Mons this game, spoiler the late game stuff if you need to
lusty tiger
But it is top two
bleak pine
Please do spoiler tags, I have to keep looking at very specific spots
tacit sphinx
@maiden flax @bleak pine i apparently have to update the software
lusty tiger
What's yalls top 5 most broken Mons this game, spoiler the late game stuff if yo...
Flutter Mane takes slots 1-3 and then the Legendaries
bleak pine
Yow
bleak pine
Alright, that's fine
golden lance
What's yalls top 5 most broken Mons this game, spoiler the late game stuff if yo...
||flutter mane, roaring moon, iron bundle, cyclizar, palafin||
lusty tiger
Koraidon is mid as fuck
maiden flax
Kk
tacit sphinx
Where the fuck is Girafarig btw
golden lance
Not taking stuff like last respects and revival blessing into account
tacit sphinx
Checked the whole fucking region I swear
bleak pine
Going off the map?
bleak pine
Should be near
last musk
Koraidon is mid as fuck
Yeah that's... That's fair
maiden flax
Checked the whole fucking region I swear
Do you know the auction area next to the desert?
bleak pine
Porto Marinada
tacit sphinx
Yeah?
vagrant steppe
What's yalls top 5 most broken Mons this game, spoiler the late game stuff if yo...
- ||Flutter Mane||
- Anything that gets Last Respects
- Cyclizar
- Palafin and ||Roaring Moon||, tied
- ||Iron Bundle||
maiden flax
Theres some there
bleak pine
It's across that friggin' desert.
tacit sphinx
What, on auction
bleak pine
Thankfully the desert is easy to cross
vagrant steppe
I'm ignoring the legendaries because they're obviously stupidly designed
lusty tiger
1) ||Flutter Mane||
2) Anything that gets Last Respects
3) Cyclizar
4) Palafin a...
I disagree on Last Respects ranking two
golden lance
Shit i forgot about palafin somehow
bleak pine
Once you hit the road, Girafarig are very common
golden lance
I'd put it on 5th
lusty tiger
Also Cyclizar is really good but I think it is gonna be just fine
vagrant steppe
Last Respects actually probably goes below Cyclizar
lusty tiger
I'd put both below Palafin
golden lance
Cyclizar is just gen 8 slowbro on crack tbh
vagrant steppe
I dunno, I had a game on showdown earlier where I was able to shed tail two pivots off Cyclizar
lusty tiger
And neither Iron Bundle or Roaring Moon deserve a slot
vagrant steppe
That felt incredibly dirty to me
lusty tiger
They are actually bad
vagrant steppe
Roaring Moon is really bad, yeah
vagrant steppe
It's only good rn until the meta settles
golden lance
||flutter mane, roaring moon, iron bundle, cyclizar, palafin||
This imo
lusty tiger
It has the WRONG moves
vagrant steppe
I do think Bundle is actually nuts tho