League of Legends

[eternal palm]

No way eclipse gets buffed

[night marsh]

fiora and riven mains have been grabbing it since the last change

[eternal palm]

That item is perfectly in a good spot rn

[prisma ravine]

Err was

[night marsh]

good spot for who

[prisma ravine]

I think they just nerfed eclipse no?

[eternal palm]

Kha loves eclipse

[night marsh]

you are trolling

going elcipse over lethality items this season

lethality items have been crazy since the start of the season

[prisma ravine]

Its niche on Kha but its good when its niche comes up

[eternal palm]

I can’t tell when there’s 3 tanks in every game I queue up for

[prisma ravine]

Yeah I'd go eclipse into a team of tanks on kha

[eternal palm]

Lethality was insane in the beginning of the season before everybody and their mother started playing the tankiest mfs top lane

[night marsh]

I wish I played vs these tanks

[prisma ravine]

Also riven urgot and I believe heca use eclipse well

Not urgot

Aatrox

Why did I say urgot

[night marsh]

urgot isn't from eclipse

[eternal palm]

Urgot is in a shit spot right now

[night marsh]

oh you caught it

brother what

[prisma ravine]

Ye idk why i said urgot

[night marsh]

he's one of the best top laners in the game rn

[prisma ravine]

Urgot isn't an eclipse user

[night marsh]

because of how he functions with hullbreaker

[eternal palm]

I haven’t seen a single urgot in game

Oh kled builds eclipse too

[night marsh]

it's because urgot takes a pulse to play

why do all that when you can lock in darius/trundle/illaoi

[prisma ravine]

Oh and its good on xin

But not popular

So yeah Eclipse is doing well tbh

[eternal palm]

Xin has a lot of different items he can to into though

[prisma ravine]

Ye

[night marsh]

tbh most of the champs listed do outside riven

[prisma ravine]

Hence unpopular

But I think its underbought on xin

Oh also Kaisa lmao

[night marsh]

like I don't think most of the choices of champs that can buy eclipse actually have it as a core item currently

I think the item is like just ok rn but I am afraid they overbuff it

[prisma ravine]

She's probably cutting eclipse next patch tho

[eternal palm]

You want to talk about really good, kaisa is really good rn, and heavily under picked, not urgot

[prisma ravine]

Its pretty core on riven and aatrox

Heca core ish

Nah kaisa is struggling rn

[night marsh]

kaisa has the issue of having no good unified build rn

[eternal palm]

Heca runs it like 70% of the time

[prisma ravine]

But she might be too strong next patch

[night marsh]

it's not core on aatrox

sundered is better

sundered -> shojin*

[prisma ravine]

Kaisas big issue is that she doesn't have a great first item for her optimal build

Guinsoos sucks first, terminus sucks first

[night marsh]

I see she's finally going terminus

[eternal palm]

Idk about that. Sundered started off really hype and fell off on a lot of champions (mainly due to tanks becoming very prominent t)

[night marsh]

sundered is very good vs tanks

[prisma ravine]

Eclipse is good but eclipse isn't getting those two items

Next patch might be interesting to tinker with

[prisma ravine]

Yesnt

Its part of her optimal end build but the good build paths skip it usually

Next patch might change that tho

[night marsh]

also thugs I think we're playing different games

cause sundered is still core on a lot of champs lol

[prisma ravine]

Hard to say tho because kaisas builds are weird

Hypothetically nashors terminus guinsoo looks insanely strong

You get all 3 evos and crazy onhit dps

[night marsh]

terminus is getting changed next patch

so maybe it starts getting built more

[prisma ravine]

But getting to 3 items is rough and all 3 aren't great first item

Nashors is the best

But nashors has no AD

Maybe you go BF pickaxe into nashors into Terminus into guinsoos?

But then you delay your first finished item forever

[night marsh]

im not a kaisa player, my roommate is and I hear him bitch about it all the time lol

also semi related but im pretty sure despite getting a nerf next patch, fiora's winrate will increase

[prisma ravine]

Kaisas builds are fun but also frustrating

Actually

Maybe you just go statikk nashors guinsoos

And pick up a pickaxe before finishing nashors

[wheat notch]

we have finally neutralised ziggs winrate

only took a 6 game winstreak

[chilly ivy]

Keep going

Climb over the 50

[wheat notch]

thats the goal

[wheat notch]

back into negatives

[chilly ivy]

How do you lose as yone vs kata

Yone is fucking broken

And just eats you if ur in his range, which you are with kata

[wheat notch]

idk man

game was not playabl

[chilly ivy]

Did she got fed off senna or yone?

[wheat notch]

yoen

[chilly ivy]

Skill issue on yone's part

[wheat notch]

senna deaths were smthg like 1 rengar 2 hwei 3 trist

i thnk

[chilly ivy]

I was just searching for an alternative to just "skill issue"

Guess none was found

[wheat notch]

im gonna be sick

why does 1 smolder w do that much dmg

[prisma ravine]

Good news is its getting nerfed

[chilly ivy]

95 + 25ad + 100ap

Smile

[prisma ravine]

Oh its worse, its 25% total AD

So you can guess what the base damage at level 1 is

[chilly ivy]

Yeah

I'm too lazy to count

10 mins till I'm off work, and my only task needs a guy that finished work

So I'm just browsing on phone

I wish they just made him a straight up mage

I kinda wanna play him mid

But i think assassin matchups delete him

[wheat notch]

why is a hyperscaler this good of a lane bully

who the fuck approved this man

[prisma ravine]

Surprisingly no

His worst matchups are mages

[wheat notch]

well idk man

i kinda want to off myself rn

[prisma ravine]

And ADCs that go mid

(That was for Solar)

Again theyre nerfing Smolders lvl 1 W

So youre correct that its broken

[wheat notch]

this aint about his lv1

and im playing a mage

[chilly ivy]

Does he just get outpushed or smth?

[prisma ravine]

That would be my guess

That and they make it harder to stack up his passive since they play at range

Vs assassins you can at least pester

[wheat notch]

its really cool that lv3 smolder w + aoe q instakills casters and halves melees

thsi is playable

[chilly ivy]

W dealing extra damage to minions prob helps tho

[prisma ravine]

A bit but not enough if I had to guess

Realistically Smolder mid is fine but not ideal

But also people build him wrong so 🤷

Iirc Nemesis has had decent success

[chilly ivy]

I will make him a shit corki

Lul

[eternal palm]

He is a shit corki basically

But some of his abilities are ridiculous in terms of range

[wheat notch]

why does his w have like triple ziggs q hitbox

while doing better dmg

im gonna shit myself

[eternal palm]

First time getting destroyed by a smolder?

[wheat notch]

im more upset its a bad smolder

he rushed manamune

[chilly ivy]

Kiddo let me introduce you to cho q

[wheat notch]

cho q is dog shit

dont kid urself

[eternal palm]

Cho Q is crazy…

Especially if he’s in a bush

[chilly ivy]

It's 50 mana 6 cd 80-320 + 100ap

[wheat notch]

and unhittable

its easier to hit morg q

than cho q

anbd that says smthg

[chilly ivy]

Maybe you can't

[prisma ravine]

Not the worst item on him tbqh?

[wheat notch]

its no shojin or er

[prisma ravine]

True

Though ER isnt good on him either

[wheat notch]

beats manamune

im so behind

[prisma ravine]

Ok Manamune into ER is actually dogshit wtf is he doing

[wheat notch]

navori 3rd

[prisma ravine]

Genuinely awful build wtf is he doing

[wheat notch]

thats the normal build

just wack ass order

[prisma ravine]

Not with Manamune first

And the Navori build is common but bad

But its even worse if you delay your RFD to your fourth item

[wheat notch]

well

i got a chest

so i guess its al lfine

but man fuck smolder

imagine if this guy knew how to build

oh thats a good skin

[prisma ravine]

Sure is

Its not Project Pyke tho

[wheat notch]

meh

i probably prefer sandwraith

btu thats more bc i dislike project

[eternal palm]

Sigh, the no shojin truthers will learn soon

[dapper kite]

https://vxtwitter.com/TheZector/status/1757503323505107409?s=20

[wheat notch]

No Major this time either

[prisma ravine]

Good Swain skin tho

[wheat notch]

I already have Crystal Rose

and if I didn't, I'd have Tyrant, and I wouldn't buy any skin over those 2

[slim terrace]

crystal rose as a skinline goes hard

[prisma ravine]

Winterblessed>crystal rose

[slim terrace]

depends on the champ

[wheat notch]

Honestly I kinda regret getting CR Swain LOL

I was indecisive between it and Tyrant so I asked friends and they all said CR

Tyrant Q is just smthg else man

[prisma ravine]

Hextech is the correct answer btw

[wheat notch]

That one's mid

[prisma ravine]

Nah its a banger

Also my shop fucking sucks

Its mostly champs I already have better skins for

And also Psy Ops Zed lmao

[wheat notch]

why cant i react to yo u

[prisma ravine]

No idea

Bug?

[wheat notch]

almost thought you blocked me

had me double take

[prisma ravine]

Nah

[wheat notch]

ah restarted discord and its chiller

[prisma ravine]

I dont block people

[wheat notch]

proof?

[prisma ravine]

No

:)

Also only 3 skins with over 975 value RIP

[slim terrace]

okay riot, I'll buy la ilusion ziggs, sheesh

[wheat notch]

it's mid

wouldnt recommend

[prisma ravine]

Oh star guardian zoe is good

[slim terrace]

eh might consider it

I've been using her original skin this whole time

[slim terrace]

how are you gonna call this mid, this whole line is goated smh

[wheat notch]

It just feels like it lacks personality

compared to Battle Boss or even Arcanist

Ziggs skins kind of fell off after Battle Boss honestly.

Hextech is like the best one after BB and even then the particles are kinda eh

[slim terrace]

it has the highest quality animations but I still don't like that skin's animations that much

[wheat notch]

referring to which one

[slim terrace]

battle boss

[wheat notch]

yeah but the minefield is little bombs that peek up

🥺

his W is pretty shit on that skin though

[slim terrace]

for me I think arcanist or la ilusion will always be my favorite

[wheat notch]

idk i bought ilusion and it's just

idk

do not like

feel bad

p2w ult is funny though

[sullen crystal]

we got meowkai I'm happy

[slim terrace]

ayy best maokai skin

[prisma ravine]

Also a good Kha skin

Third-best Id say

[sullen crystal]

alas I already have death blossom

[eternal palm]

they trolled me

a day before my birthday too...

[dim kindle]

new shop ohh

everytime there is a new shop i get reminder that somehow viktor still has no good skins

[eternal palm]

wdym

death blossom is a good skin

[dim kindle]

🧢

[wheat notch]

That reminds me of the Halloween skins

God I remember wondering how those ever came out

Their vfx look so shit

[prisma ravine]

Creator? High Noon?

[prisma ravine]

Damn why did you get a decent selection >:[

[slim terrace]

for once I agree with uno

[wheat notch]

creator mideator

[prisma ravine]

That happens quite a bit yknow >:[

[slim terrace]

does it now

[prisma ravine]

Yes

[wheat notch]

xd

[wheat notch]

into this next lobby clogchamp

i bet it was the shyv that played last game the worst

[dim kindle]

those are okay to good skins ig

but viktor just has no wow skins

if u get what i mean

high noon is cool in theory but falls a bit flat

[wheat notch]

I love a 1/6 Zed killing me through Exhaust

Why do I even fucking bother <3

[prisma ravine]

I kinda dont agree

I think creator is really good as is high noon

[wheat notch]

Why can I double buy oblivion orb

lol

nice exhaust literally just doesnt do anything

cool game

never again i suppose

this lobby is cooked

the fact that i was the only one to dodge hwei top into aatrox is . wild

[eternal palm]

Sigh no hwei I would have dodged

[wheat notch]

yes u wouldve

the comp was so bad

[wheat notch]

i shouldve dodged x2

[night marsh]

Smoulder + nidalee in your team is an instant dodge

[wheat notch]

Smolder is op

and Nidalee is apparently #1 jg on lolalytics rn

I didn't notice rammus top though X D

[wheat notch]

bro went like 4/1 in lane i dont think he was the problem

though mao abandoning lane because he got his ego bruised didnt help

[night marsh]

Smoulders usually get like 3 kills early and then fail to convert that to anything

His w is really good early but then you reach mid game where that champ does jack all

[wheat notch]

i mean being forced to 2v1 kaisa blitz probably didnt help

idt he was at fault

like that specific player has good stats on smolder

[night marsh]

80 games played already holy fuck

[wheat notch]

gotta abuse him while you can before riot fucks him over

https://www.op.gg/summoners/euw/Huh Yunjin-3312

[formal quartz]

Aw fuck am I banning her again?

[wheat notch]

shrug

[dim kindle]

Nidalee is extremely good in higher elo with proficient players

high elo games end faster

nidalee is just like the worst piece of poop to have past 30 mins but games dont go that long

[wheat notch]

@chilly ivy good item

Liandry's has only done 2k so far (bought 3rd)

[prisma ravine]

Damn, Wintry gaming?

[wheat notch]

Apparently the pressure from streaming just makes me Play Better

Dogshit scores until I booted up a stream just now for a bit

[night marsh]

I lost track of wintry accounts, is this your Smurf

[wheat notch]

This is my main

I have 2 accounts (uri9158#51pct and uri9158#49pct)

49pct has like D4 mmr

I'll rename my main the day I get a new name change, don't worry

[wheat notch]

That is, on the 19th

Had to double check

reddit

[prisma ravine]

Reddit do be bad at the game

[slim terrace]

gave like 5 kills combined to their bot lane early game and still managed to pull it back thankfully

this felt like we had no coordination whatsoever in a lot of points though lol

[wheat notch]

smolder gaming

[slim terrace]

yeah but it was mostly our top/mid side doing the picks lol

[wheat notch]

i will never acknowledge fizz players

[prisma ravine]

I really hope they dont fuck up Smolder

Champ is actually kinda fun

Also one more quest and I have ... the orb

[prisma ravine]

Got the orb

Turns out Ziggs does stupid turret damage

Aaaand its a worthless skin 😔

[night marsh]

btw for anyone it applies to, this is the last month for amazon capsules

[prisma ravine]

... hell yeah

[night marsh]

so claim it while you can

[prisma ravine]

I rerolled three skins

Got Odyssey Kha

The only Kha skin I still wanted

[eternal palm]

wtf did we do to you

We’re also not in the greatest spot rn

Beginning of the season we were eating good

Lately? Shit has been unpickable ngl

Like even in the games where Fizz is a solid pick, I can’t justify it over Akali

[prisma ravine]

Did Fizz get nerfed, or is it just the items?

[night marsh]

fizz got nerfed+ nerfs to stormsurge

[eternal palm]

The nerfs are w.e, shit is just unpickable into a million and 1 tanks

The best mid picks are shit you can blind

Like Liss is my go to blind pick

[night marsh]

I'd like if midlaners didn't become untouchable freaks later

asol and hwei exist and I hate it

[wheat notch]

be an ap assassin

[eternal palm]

Ap assassins not named akali have been shit to mediocre for years

[wheat notch]

u can buy lich bane and hourglass or veil i cant tolerate u

also ur champ solokills me lv3 despite that being smthg that shouldnt happen bc his numbers are dumb

[wheat notch]

lol xd

[eternal palm]

Ngl the veil change is like the best thing they did to AP items

[night marsh]

what other ap assassins exist, I'm blanking on them

[wheat notch]

ekko

[night marsh]

there's fizz lb

[wheat notch]

kata

lb

[night marsh]

oh yeah fuck that

thugs is high

[wheat notch]

nidalee elise

[eternal palm]

Again, nobody is picking Kata blind

[night marsh]

also acting like kat has been shit for years is crazy

[wheat notch]

acting like ap assassins didn't make 14.1 unplayable xd

[night marsh]

ekko is one of the most elo boosted champs in the game

[eternal palm]

If you get kata blind picked into you, and you don’t make that kata’s life hell in lane, that’s on you

[wheat notch]

who's talking about blind pickability like at all

[eternal palm]

Me

[night marsh]

im contesting this btw

[eternal palm]

I literally mentioned this

When talking about fizz

[wheat notch]

why are u bringing up smthg irrelevant to what me and lamb are saying

[night marsh]

also why does an entire class need to be blind pickable int he first place

[eternal palm]

Idk ask tanks

Ornn was the best blind pick for 2+ years

[wheat notch]

that's an ornn/sion thing not a tank thing lol

I'm not blinding malphite

or rammus

[night marsh]

first pick malphite, poppy, zac, or ksante and tell me how that oes for you

you will be under tower for the enxt 20 mins

[eternal palm]

Poppy isn’t a bad blind pick either

[wheat notch]

is poppy even played like a tank rn i figured she'd build like a fighter

[night marsh]

you build 1 ad item then go full tank

[wheat notch]

sundered sky eclipse or w.e.

fair enough

[night marsh]

before you just went divine sunderer into full tank

now idk what you go because sunderer felt like the only reason that champ was playable

[wheat notch]

these 2 sound good in my head

pick 1 i guess

shojin maybe

[night marsh]

it's just full tank now accoridng to op.gg

[wheat notch]

wack

[night marsh]

sunfire->thornmail->rookern

[eternal palm]

If anything poppy blind is annoying as fuck because now you’re either forcing people that play mobile champs into poppy or forcing people into their 2nd/3rd choice

Probably one of the most annoying picks to see come out

[night marsh]

I also just want to point out, of the current best 10 champs in top lane, there is literally a single tank

everything else is a fighter/jugger

or the ranged aids pick

[wheat notch]

finishing sunfire is yike

[gray sandal]

juggernauts are basically tanks

[eternal palm]

Correct

[night marsh]

bruisers arent tanks

[gray sandal]

wyd tonight kid

[night marsh]

you're just trading the survivability for a shit ton of damage

it's like ksante with all out on 24/7

[eternal palm]

Darius being able to eat 4k worth of damage while healing 2k and dealing 4k back is annoying

[gray sandal]

1.5k of that is true btw

[night marsh]

that timing

[gray sandal]

have fun lol

[eternal palm]

Let me decide if I’m playing league or 2k for my birthday

[gray sandal]

happy b-day

[eternal palm]

Appreciate it Lukio-Chan

[wheat notch]

happy day

it's always league

[eternal palm]

Thank you wintryus

[night marsh]

what rank are you dario

[wheat notch]

I can't think of more tanks man I'm dying

my brain only knows sej

[night marsh]

ahm kench

tanks are kind of ass rn i'm ngl

[wheat notch]

mundo? he's weird

ok i dont think thats true

[slim terrace]

watching keria makes me wanna play tk

[night marsh]

I thinkt he tank items are good

[slim terrace]

that ult is so satisfying

[night marsh]

but the champs themselves are just not good

[eternal palm]

Probably silver, I played like 11-12 ranked games and then stopped because Tekken 8 came out, then we started having weekly inhouses (which you and Lukio should join btw)

[wheat notch]

the tank items are insane

[night marsh]

hence why bruisers are dominating the items right now

[wheat notch]

just lock in sion and get free lp

[night marsh]

sion is terrible

[wheat notch]

[gray sandal]

only good tank i can think of is k'sante

[night marsh]

48% wr champ and you're telling me to lock that shit in 😭

[wheat notch]

i mean idk how he is top i just know he's one of the best mids rn

[night marsh]

well yeah mid is just rush mr item => win

[wheat notch]

zac is always solid

[night marsh]

in top, he gets zoned from cs or is just a bag of gold

[wheat notch]

rip

[slim terrace]

why is tf so crazy rn

what's up with tf top

[night marsh]

tf is cancer

[wheat notch]

his numbers are way overtuned

[gray sandal]

is camille good or is new terrain still screwing her over

[night marsh]

imagine if vayne had an autoreset and inbuilt tp

cam sucks still

[wheat notch]

115% ap scaling on blue card

[eternal palm]

AD build makes a lot of his bad matchups not as bad also

[wheat notch]

and ad tf still better XD!

[night marsh]

it wasn't just the terrain that fucked her

[eternal palm]

Also he’s the best split pusher in the game rn

High key

[night marsh]

divine sunderer got removed and she doesn't synergize with sundered sky as well

[slim terrace]

crazy

[wheat notch]

https://twitter.com/Jebwuu/status/1758154608491311226?t=aaKu5ZD7TkVYzf3tMTb79Q&s=19

Jebsu (@Jebwuu) on X

AD TF guide 🃏

https://t.co/ZIYJBC1iMA

FAQ
Yes the link is safe ...
No I will not gain access to your furry folder .. maybe 🧐

Twitter · Feb 15, 2024, 3:41 PM

[night marsh]

just for reference, cam q can't crit

so half of SS isn't as vaulable on her

[eternal palm]

Anyways, I’m just annoyed that mid meta feels super stale right now (as does adc)

Top is a dick measuring contest that usually ends up not mattering in the grand scheme

[night marsh]

I once try to split vs tf and he 3 shot me

[gray sandal]

is state of top lane just whoever abuses sundered sky the best lol?

[night marsh]

no

[gray sandal]

item looks like it makes any trades worthless once you have it

[night marsh]

imo its whoever has the best first 5 levels

[gray sandal]

unless i'm misunderstanding

[night marsh]

cause that decides the rest of the game

illaoi is just uber broken rn

[gray sandal]

illaoi yikes

[night marsh]

her level 1 sucks unless you rng spawn a tentacle into your range early

but lv2+

[gray sandal]

i guess better than ranged tops being the best

[night marsh]

it's just so fucking infurating

[eternal palm]

Top lane is a war zone, like I said though, it doesn’t end up mattering when you look up and your bot lane is a combined 1/7 at 15 minutes

[night marsh]

well

[gray sandal]

but that champ has always been cancer

[night marsh]

vayne and tf are both really good rn

[eternal palm]

Vayne top or adc?

[gray sandal]

vayne top depends on how good your jungler is

[night marsh]

top

[gray sandal]

imo

[wheat notch]

both

tbh

[night marsh]

vayne top got buffed huge this season

[eternal palm]

Oh yeah that’s never been bad

[night marsh]

by botrk changes

[eternal palm]

Eh bot she can be abused

[night marsh]

you dont need to hit 3 times to proc the slow now

it just procs off the first auto for some reason

[eternal palm]

I think Draven is really good, thank fucking god there’s so little Draven players in solo q

[gray sandal]

does it still do the bonus damage

[eternal palm]

That champ is aids

[gray sandal]

when it procs

[night marsh]

no

[gray sandal]

not the % stuff

[night marsh]

but the slow is on a lowish cd

I think it's like 15 seconds

lethal tempo is getting nuked next patch so that may change her standing and hopefully delete yone from viability

but I could also just be overrating the nerf

[formal quartz]

Oh the patch is next week? Lame

[eternal palm]

Isn’t lethality varus getting nerfed also?

Btw idk how many of you guys watch pro, but I’ve been getting so tilted watching pros build lethality varus with 2+ tanks on the opposite side

And they always get clapped

[prisma ravine]

Varus is getting nerfed as a whole

Onhit as well because onhit Varus is strong too

[dim kindle]

i think fizz was a real champ for the first time in a really long while at the start of this season

but he ate a lot of nerfs that hes kinda crap again

but ngl i dont want fizz to be good

ever lol

[night marsh]

I kind of miss when sylas was top dog

[dim kindle]

sylas has his dumb momenta but overall he feels pretty fair

so agree

[prisma ravine]

Nah I want strong Fizz

Fuck it, make assassins strong again

[night marsh]

[wheat notch]

they were just strong

shut

[dim kindle]

also apparently i should be building cryptbloom way more instead of tunneling on void

[prisma ravine]

Yes but I dont want it for just 3 patches

[wheat notch]

sylas w and e make me want to rip out someone's vocal chords sry

[prisma ravine]

I want it for a season >:)

[eternal palm]

They promised us this in the preseason and took it all away in like 2 patches lol

[wheat notch]

i only buy crypt on cdr champs

[prisma ravine]

[dim kindle]

idk play a mage into evelynn + fizz one game and then yea

[prisma ravine]

I think Kha is doing alright at least

[wheat notch]

so play rengar

he's been broken for how many of those

[eternal palm]

Like listen, I’m an Ornn enjoyer, but I can only take so many consecutive years of tanks being so strong

[night marsh]

do you see the malding off just zed

[wheat notch]

champ is a constant problem lol

[night marsh]

and you want that for an entire class for an entire season?

[prisma ravine]

Rengar hasnt really been broken since the crit items were fixed

But also Rengar is lame

[night marsh]

bro I promise you tanks arent that good

[eternal palm]

I promise you they are

[night marsh]

also you bring up ornn when that champ is trash rn lmao

[wheat notch]

when was that

[eternal palm]

Ornn is fine, not the greatest rn

But def still pickable

[night marsh]

what's your definition of pickable

getting skullfucked by aatrox, illaoi, camille, and gwen?

[prisma ravine]

Like when they buffed Stormsurge

[dim kindle]

Tanks are good at punishing high magic damage comps this season

[prisma ravine]

... about half a year ago I wanna say?

[dim kindle]

but thats about it

[wheat notch]

so then ur just wrong or what

[eternal palm]

You can blind Ornn, and just farm under tower and be usually more useful in team fights than your opposing laner who won lane (as long as you didn’t just solo die to them)

[prisma ravine]

Oh when they were fixed

Like 3 patches after that

[dim kindle]

and of course there is ksante but he is like a topic itself

[night marsh]

tanks don;t have the damage to beat juggernauts, no split pushing power to beat fighters, the power to win 1v1s

[wheat notch]

they culled 15% of his q combo ratio just now for a reason

[night marsh]

it's literally just their items rn

if you want to play the stat game, we can play that too

[prisma ravine]

Thats more to do with the fact that they dont want Rengar to be viable

People hate playing against Rengar (for a good reason)

[wheat notch]

no it has to do with the fact that he's consistently one of the best d+ junglers all the time and the assassin items actually pushed him off the edge

[prisma ravine]

If he was that good he'd see pro play rn, pro wants champs that can just shut down ADCs rn

[eternal palm]

Well its a good thing that games are usually being decided at 3rd-4th dragon (assuming we’re trading grubs/herald for 1 dragon each time)

[night marsh]

also just a question for you, if tanks were so insane, why are they all terrible in the jg rn

[prisma ravine]

Vi is the #1 champ for pro jungle for a reason

[eternal palm]

Poppy is literally picked in the jg??

[night marsh]

top isn't the only lane tanks can go in rn

poppy jg is not good bro

[eternal palm]

Xin isn’t a tank but he mitigates like 60% of your team’s damage with his ult

[prisma ravine]

Isnt Rell jungle strong rn?

[eternal palm]

Rep jungle also

[night marsh]

look at all these tanks bro

[prisma ravine]

Might be unpopular in solo Q tho since its Rell

[night marsh]

also vi isn;t a tank btw

[eternal palm]

There’s like 3 real picks in that top 10

[prisma ravine]

Realistically tanks are strong but theyre really unpopular as usual

[eternal palm]

Ovven is correct

[prisma ravine]

So for solo Q theyre not usually a big issue

[night marsh]

I'm calling cap on that

whenever tanks are strong, they're played

[eternal palm]

People don’t like playing tanks as people don’t know how to gracefully lose lane

[wheat notch]

what man

[night marsh]

malph, voli, ksante, ornn all saw play

with high pickrates

when they were strong*

[prisma ravine]

Like rn in pro the best picks in top jungle and support are tanks

[eternal palm]

Also correct

[prisma ravine]

Its why Vi is top 3 jungle pick in pro rn

[wheat notch]

champ that thrives in uncoordinated environment and is practically unbalanceable for pro because of it will surely be playable

[prisma ravine]

And zac and K'sante are good

[dim kindle]

tanks are stronger at mitigating damage in teamfights but way weaker in side compared to last season

[night marsh]

vi isn;t a tank

[prisma ravine]

Vi isnt, ye

But Mao and Rell are

Well Vi is hard to quantify

[wheat notch]

you can't peel a vi off your carry when she presses her skill button

[prisma ravine]

Shes like an off-tank

[dim kindle]

zac is good because has damage output of a juggernaut

tbf

[wheat notch]

and rengar isn't gonna snowball with hubris in a pro game get real

[prisma ravine]

You cant peel Rengar either when he presses the kill button (unless you have a god thresh)

[dim kindle]

ksante is ksante

[prisma ravine]

Thats true

[night marsh]

also am I getting trolled rn

[prisma ravine]

But I dont think Hubris is that much better than his other items

[night marsh]

count the number of tanks per team lol

[wheat notch]

also aren't pro matches on 14.3 already

[dim kindle]

no

this weekend might be

[eternal palm]

We’re seeing seeing a trend of blue side prioritizing lanes with priority while red side picks more defensive scaling picks, what’s the issue?

[prisma ravine]

Uh. 2 or 3, 2, 1, not sure what rakan builds, 3, 2, 3, 4, 4, 2 or 3

Thats a decent number of tanks

Im guessing Mao was mostly banned too

[dim kindle]

is it fair to count mao support

[prisma ravine]

Id say so?

[eternal palm]

Yeah

[prisma ravine]

Im pretty sure mao support builds tank

[night marsh]

mao is a tank yeah

[eternal palm]

Mao support still builds tanky

[night marsh]

vi, xin , morde, olaf arent tanks

[dim kindle]

i feel like it has very little to do with him being a tank

rather than him just being crazy out of line

[wheat notch]

u just have ur support with exhaust locket chauffeur ur carry everywhere and its fine

[prisma ravine]

Ye didnt count those

[eternal palm]

Xin is hard to quantify as he’s usually soaking up/nullifying a lot of damage imo

[night marsh]

what is this cope lmao

[prisma ravine]

I counted K'Sante, Naut, Mao, Sej, Zac, Rell and wasnt sure on Udyrs builds in pro

[dim kindle]

gwen is a tank

cuz w

then

by that logic

[prisma ravine]

Ok checked Udyr is built tank in pro, so the 2 or 3 are 3 ig

I wouldnt say its tall tanks, but tanks are decently represented

Support is most of the time tanks, and top and jungle are like 50/50 on that

[eternal palm]

Also Ivern might not build tanky but he is relatively tanky

[night marsh]

support seems dominated by tanks, top looks like it's just ksante vs ksante counters

[eternal palm]

Red side support is dominated by tanks*

Blue side bot lanes go for prio

[wheat notch]

play kayn

[night marsh]

for what thugs to be saying is true then other tanks would show up

and we all know why ksante is played rn

[prisma ravine]

I think the enemy plays tanks when youre not up against K'sante

Doesnt K'sante usually counter tanks?

[eternal palm]

You usually get a free lane vs tanks yeah

[night marsh]

no

[prisma ravine]

Is Kayn back on blue Kayn?

[eternal palm]

Wet noodle fights favor ksante because he usually does more

[prisma ravine]

I wouldve thought youd lean red Kayn rn

[wheat notch]

he's been back on blue kayn for the entirety of s13

[night marsh]

ksante doesn't beat tanks

[eternal palm]

Red Kayn is the funner kayn

[prisma ravine]

(I cant tell because stat sites dont distinguish)

[night marsh]

ksante excels vs fighters and juggers

[wheat notch]

just look at what items are most bought

it shld be assassin slop

[night marsh]

red kayn has been unplayable since they nerfed rhaast's healing on passive

[wheat notch]

like red kayn wouldn't buy profane into hubris lol

[night marsh]

majority of kayns go blue form or red form with blue items

[wheat notch]

i dont remember the last time i saw red kayn in soloq

[eternal palm]

Yeah but they buffed the 2 best items on red kayn this season in trinity and titanic

[wheat notch]

last time i saw red kayn in general was a scrim and coord. play is diff

[night marsh]

trinity

ban this nigga

[wheat notch]

doesnt matter assassin items are XD

[eternal palm]

?

[wheat notch]

also why are you buying trinity

[eternal palm]

Trinity is broken

[night marsh]

are we talking about the same champ

[eternal palm]

The item is actually insane

[night marsh]

he builds neither titanic or trinity

[wheat notch]

trinity has less games played than cyclosword brother

it has less games played than fucking. a n a t h e m a s

[night marsh]

how many times do you autoattack on kayn lol

for you to buy titanic

and trinity

[wheat notch]

also titanic has a 43% winrate on kayn

[eternal palm]

Nvm I just confirmed with my boy, he said sundered sky + cleaver is the build

[prisma ravine]

Actually people have been buying assassin items on Red Kayn for a bit

Thats what makes it hard

[wheat notch]

ok but he's not gonna buy hubris

or eon

maybe eon it has health but def not hubris

[wheat notch]

I can't believe the items with over 10k games played each are better than 700 titanic 40 trinity

[eternal palm]

Tbf, red kayn did use to build trinity + titanic years ago, but I forgot cleaver is really good again

[prisma ravine]

EoN definitely, Hubris if youre ahead I can see

Kayns AD scalings are pretty good on red kayn

[slim terrace]

how am I playing at emerald elo and people don't know how to group up for basic shit, this is crazy

the no tp briar mid is split pushing top then dies top right before soul point

[eternal palm]

I’m still so sad serylda’s is so shit on the champs I used to like building it on

Other than kha

[prisma ravine]

Its good on assassins

Just not good on non-assassins

[wheat notch]

emerald encompasses a very wide skill level

[wheat notch]

yea but he could be buying eclipse or sunderedsky

[prisma ravine]

Sundered Sky doesnt feel great on Red Kayn and Eclipse is generally underestimated rn

But yeah I guess blue Kayn might be more popular, I cant say for sure

[wheat notch]

I can

he is without a doubt the better Kayn for 99/100 games

[night marsh]

it never gets better btw

[wheat notch]

nah it does

[night marsh]

we're american

[wheat notch]

I'm sure that there's enough neurons firing at Master+ over there

[night marsh]

personal ancedote but my games since reaching diamond have just been unplayable

[eternal palm]

Btw, what do yall think about Jayce rn? He feels high key unplayable compared to how strong he was last season

[night marsh]

he's getting buffed isnt he

[wheat notch]

haven't seen him in ages he's probably fine

actually his e got murdered or smthg

idk just go like shojin manamune eclipse and you'll probably be fine

maybe eclipse 1st idk

[eternal palm]

E prob had to get a nerf with grubs being a thing tbf

[slim terrace]

nice

[wheat notch]

i mean more it got a functional change

apparently

and redditors are not happy

[night marsh]

the hammer or the gate

[wheat notch]

hamer

works like lee kick

now

i think

[night marsh]

idk what that even means

like he knocks up people that got hit by his e knockback?

[wheat notch]

no like

if lee ults into flash behind

his ult goes backward

[formal quartz]

what

[eternal palm]

It always worked like this for Jayce E no?

Or was this to prevent the spaghetti code that would bring you back if you dashed mid E animation?

[wheat notch]

i have never tried to e flash someone on jayce

[formal quartz]

oh on jayce

[night marsh]

I don;t play jayce so I would never know it got changed

[slim terrace]

I usually do flash e cause I'm not good enough

what was the old functionality

[night marsh]

if I ever wanted to get carpel tunnel, I'd play 3 games of fiora

[formal quartz]

I never know which spell flash works with so I never do it lol

[formal quartz]

ah so you can buffer flash

[wheat notch]

Jayce E always kicked towards a specific spot from a specific angle once you pressed the button

[formal quartz]

I guess that's better

[wheat notch]

so if you landed E on a LeBlanc that distorts she gets fucked

[eternal palm]

You could just walk behind them after proccing phase rush. That was Jayce’s biggest thing, he doesn’t really have a good rune rn, you usually just go phase rush or I’ve seen comet/fleet/conquerors also

[formal quartz]

lethal tempo

[wheat notch]

but that doesn't happen anymore

[night marsh]

I'll be real, I'm too zoned out to understand what that means, guess I'll find out in a few days

[wheat notch]

just take first strike

[eternal palm]

You know how uh

[night marsh]

also since when did fizz have to make physical contact with the champ for q to connect

I swear a long time ago his q hit you even if you flashed it

[eternal palm]

Aatrox pull pulls you back to the center if you don’t get out of it?

[wheat notch]

https://youtu.be/dUmmF_nl8-I?feature=shared

[eternal palm]

Think of Jayce E like that

[wheat notch]

this won't happen anymore

[eternal palm]

Except if you dash/move mid animation

It brings you back

To where he casted E

[night marsh]

lmao

[eternal palm]

That was considered a skill you needed to have to play Jayce btw

It picked up some cheeky kills like once every 5 games or so

[formal quartz]

does anything even do that anymore

I assuem riot just wanted to remove all instances of that

[eternal palm]

Uh

Does Akali E still follow people who teleported from top to bottom?

[night marsh]

yes

[dim kindle]

jayce e change was more about normalizing it for tbe cc to work more consistently like a lee r but making sure the person doesnt move during it anymore

[night marsh]

briar does too

[dim kindle]

like if u dashed on jayce while he used e youd rubber in all sorts of weird ways

now it fixes u like lee r

[night marsh]

semi-related question, are they playing gragas in pro play

my entire champ pool loses to that champ

[eternal palm]

Sometimes

[night marsh]

I legitmately can't beat it

[eternal palm]

Probably not enough rn tbh

We’re starting to see more gnar in pro rn

[formal quartz]

my entire pool loses to zac

[night marsh]

aren't you a nocturne slave

[formal quartz]

yes

but he's been getting banned in half my games

is he broken again?

[wheat notch]

hexplate good item

it's time to learn poppy

[night marsh]

nocturne has been good for a good minute lol

[wheat notch]

or ban zac

[night marsh]

I think before preseaosn, jg was noc vs briar

[formal quartz]

nerfing my lethal tempo 😔

[night marsh]

since briar's release

[eternal palm]

High key idt briar is good

[night marsh]

the latest changes put her a bit more in line but she still feels crazy to me

[formal quartz]

briar lives or dies off hitting ult from my experience

like yes she's good without it

but when she whiffs the team fight just goes in the enemy way

[wheat notch]

briar is just unkillable if she buys bruiser items

[night marsh]

she;s my go to jg rn

[wheat notch]

it's ridiculous

[night marsh]

champ is really fun but something probably needs to be nerfed

[formal quartz]

well lethal got nerfed

idk we'll see

[night marsh]

she doesnt go lethal

[eternal palm]

Only jungle champ I found super busted this season

[formal quartz]

oh right conq

nvm

[eternal palm]

Is fucking lillia

Fuck that champ

[formal quartz]

yea I ban her

[night marsh]

hail of blades and conq

lilia is cancer yeah

try playing vs her in top

as a melee

[dim kindle]

lilia ate some really hard nerfs

dropped like 4% wr or sth

but she was really crazy

[formal quartz]

the a sol special

[night marsh]

hopefully he goes the same way

I'm all for mages being good every now and then

but champs like that just feel so insane to play vs

[prisma ravine]

Jayce rn is weak-ish but part of that is just items

[formal quartz]

my biggest gripe is the wave clear

[dim kindle]

asol is really cool but also really lame

idk

[prisma ravine]

Manamune might actually need to get lethality over ad

[night marsh]

asol feels like kayle but without the really shit laning phase

[eternal palm]

Yeah this is the bigger issue and he’s one of the ones affect by the seryldas changes the most

[night marsh]

granted I don't play mid so idk if that statement is fully true

[dim kindle]

like thematically he is cool but his good gameplay revolving around afk until you fly in to e r

is a bit lame

[night marsh]

but in teamfights it just feels like such a herculian task to walk up to him

[prisma ravine]

Kinda

He is less of a hypercarry than Kayle is

[dim kindle]

nah he gets giga dumpstered

by everything

i think they really need to flatten his curve a bit

[night marsh]

he beats other mages doesn't he

I know he's a tf counter

[dim kindle]

tf is his only playable lane

that i can think of

[formal quartz]

I don't play mid either but I always see his breath out trading anything the opponent can throw out

[dim kindle]

mages beat him too

[formal quartz]

then I guess his absurdly high win rate comes from stalling until late game with his wave clear

[dim kindle]

well his latest changes make him come online faster which caused the higher wr

but in higher elo his wr is significantly lower cuz he gets put 30 cs+ behind and dies twice in lane

[night marsh]

I skipped his list of changes because I didn't play it but after his winrate skyrocketed, I checked by on the patch post and his mains were saying these changes were overboard lol

[dim kindle]

cuz mid jgl coordinate better to take him out

[dim kindle]

changes were basically just more stacks from q ing ppl in the face

but they overtuned it so much that you needed just like one good river fight to get way ahead on the stack curve

[gray sandal]

they changed that a while back

around the time they changed stuff like darius pull hitting you even if you flashed

[night marsh]

ah

[prisma ravine]

I think that was changed later

But that stuff is inconsistent

Pantheons W used to work the same for a bit, rn if you flash his W it still hits

Oh its an undocumented change

[slim terrace]

did they change panth w?

[prisma ravine]

Ages ago yeah

Around the time of the rework

Oh lmao they hotfixed it faster than I thought

Basically when the rework launched you could flash his W, a couple weeks later you no longer could

[sullen crystal]

flash his w you still get stunned but he doesn't get the 3 autos when it's empowered >:(

[prisma ravine]

He should still get those

He just has to get in range

[sullen crystal]

yeah but if they flash out of range he doesn't and it makes me sad always

[prisma ravine]

Just queue up the attack and get lucky with the queue-up bug smh

(Yes you can actually osmetimes still get the attack despite being out of range because league is a very well coded game™️)

[eternal palm]

https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/1argx17/my_thesis_cryptobloom_is_better_than_void_staff/

[wheat notch]

yes i posted about this yesterday

bc i was clowning on someone that said 10% pen is negligible

and someone else highly overestimating how much 15 haste is regarding tankbusting

[formal quartz]

they both have pros and cons, honestly one of the few riot wins where they designed two choices you can make

[wheat notch]

I don't think that's real

[formal quartz]

although for ranged it's 100% void yea

I moreso meant for melee

[wheat notch]

It's literally just

if you're a hastespammer or veigar you buy crypt if you're anything else u buy void

bc mr items are too broken so u cant afford the pen cut

[formal quartz]

ah okay yea that makes sense

[wheat notch]

it'd be more contestable if the pen was equal

and if void had an on takedown eff to even it out

[wheat notch]

For reference, it only starts mattering for Ziggs Q 24 seconds in

and even then I don't think the bonus Q outdamages the pen loss

[formal quartz]

More pen on take down

[wheat notch]

that's what i was thinking

[formal quartz]

like hubris

[wheat notch]

or an ap steroid

for like the duration of combat

like lifeline

the moment ur out of combat for a few secs its gone

[eternal palm]

What about the fact that cryptbloom is cheaper and more gold efficient (in stats only without taking the heal into account)

[formal quartz]

I feel like that matters less late game

[wheat notch]

the gold efficiency is very scuffed bc haste is overpriced and %pen does not have a good baseline

any item with haste becomes insanely cost efficient

bc the wiki uses glowing mote as a baseline

[formal quartz]

is it because of that 250 gold haste item?

idk how it's calculated

[wheat notch]

which is 50gold for 1 hSte

glowing mote

[chilly ivy]

mages always have the issue where they want more damage on their end builds and not 5 gold efficient items that are good to get early

if crypt was a first item sure, i'd take that argument

[wheat notch]

150g isn't a lot but I will concede that Fiendish Codex is a significantly better component than Blasting Wand

[chilly ivy]

but i'm not buying 5 morelo's just cause it's effiecient ap wise

[wheat notch]

like if crypt costef 3k the same champs buying it rn would buy it then

[wheat notch]

what's funny is i remember checking kennen or rumble builds early season and there was some guy in high elo rushing morello for the shit load of stats

bc it costs nothing

[chilly ivy]

i mean yeah cause they don't need mana

meanwhile i throw 3 e's and i'm oom

[formal quartz]

I don't remember them nerfing morello why did they stop?

[wheat notch]

i don't know if they build it still

idr who did it

[eternal palm]

Yeah the build path matters also, void’s build path is so ass sometimes. But it’s really a matter of preference I would say. Crypt/void are competing for that 3rd item slot with like deathcap and idk what else

[formal quartz]

I guess zhonyas depending on situation

[wheat notch]

also Morello is a bad buy on most champs bc yes it's cheap but also it doesn't have a broken item passive like liandry sflame deathcap hourglass

so ur just sitting on Stats

[formal quartz]

wow grevious wound is broken

rude

[wheat notch]

i rly do not think void and crypt are competitors

crypt is a haste item and competes with like cosmic or horizon

but also hwei just gets horizon later if he needs early crypt into mr

[formal quartz]

I think it's competitive for crypt buyers, but anyone who likes void isn't buying crypt

[wheat notch]

void competes for like liandry 2nd or deathcap or sflame

but u just get the other item later

bc mage item pool is fucking Barren

ziggs is back to only having 4 good items

[formal quartz]

bring back athene's

[wheat notch]

anyways gonna become less responsive my pizza came in

this shit looks delectable

[formal quartz]

enjoy

[wheat notch]

I'll post a pic

[eternal palm]

Nothing like a nice Hawaiian pizza before league

[wheat notch]

oh I'm not playing I'm going home no pc there

[eternal palm]

Ah RIP

[wheat notch]

I'll be back on the grijd on sunday

im lying im scrimming then

[eternal palm]

I think I’m going to warm up with an ARAM and then commit some sins on Ziggs

(I’m going to build seraphs)

[wheat notch]

please don't

begging

[eternal palm]

Sorry kidge, I have to

[wheat notch]

it's not good !!

stack it with Luden's if ur gonna buy it

don't solo seraphs it's extremely neg

just get tear 1st recall then go Luden's -> Seraph's -> Liandry/Void/Deathcap

[gray sandal]

I think I'll rush seraph into horizon

[wheat notch]

it's like you want to make me cry

[eternal palm]

This was the plan, tear into Luden’s into void

[wheat notch]

only go void if they have 2 or more champs with Mr items

liandry 2nd is much better into no mr

[formal quartz]

Ludens into frozen heart

[wheat notch]

insert cringe self promo here https://twitter.com/laikatkariga/status/1753178010021196155?t=_RnRNHCeLKvd5Vs58a53bQ&s=19

Laikatkarīgā (@laikatkariga) على X

Here's how I'd build Ziggs for the current patch and 14.3

Build feels pretty solid but I am getting clapped by variance in SoloQ right now which isn't ideal.

Works for both mid and bot lanes.

Twitter · Feb 1, 2024, 10:06 PM

[night marsh]

Ok now do that AP math on a champion with a playerbase of more than 5 people

[wheat notch]

I'll only drop my obsession of Ziggs once I become the #1 Ziggs globally

And boy do I not see Challenger in my near future

[eternal palm]

holy hell, malignance's passive is ASS

[wheat notch]

or if they kill the champ lol

[eternal palm]

idk why kass mains said you should rush malignance

[wheat notch]

the nerfs after his stupid q buff were really close

[eternal palm]

this shit is just a stat stick

[wheat notch]

it's bc the pen makes every trade you do way better

as opposed to sitting on worse stat sticks like roa or archangels early

though i think malignance is a 3rd item after roa seraphs

[eternal palm]

well you still go archangels, kass mains started cutting off roa (which is crazy to me considering you want to hit 16 asap)

[eternal palm]

sigh it wasnt a good ziggs game, picked liss instead

[wheat notch]

fym it isnt a good ziggs game

he's a great blind every game

[eternal palm]

I'm vs Zed

[wheat notch]

unless ur against like exactly leblanc or smthg

zed is manageable.

[dim kindle]

based

[night marsh]

@timber patio get on league little bro

we need a 5th

[timber patio]

tonight

cant rn

im free in like 3 hours tho

ill play

[night marsh]

man said tonight when it's already 7

[timber patio]

its evening

keep up

[wheat notch]

https://youtube.com/shorts/-fnG9nDbkiU?si=Gg14UyVRuSGq5PSc

tryna cop a jayce wr like this

[eternal palm]

8% win rate with anything is crazy

[wheat notch]

and he was ace in 3 of those losses !

[eternal palm]

Wait lmao, I didn’t even notice that

[timber patio]

@night marsh u still need someone?

[night marsh]

Nope I sleep now

[timber patio]

H8 u

[wheat notch]

https://twitter.com/dunistrash/status/1758700767202922934?t=pJyK43PlJgZg9qxiA6DXyQ&s=19

Dun (@dunistrash) on X

tear > sorcs > lich > seraphs > liandrys prob favourite build atm think it actually makes viktor feel pretty strong. make sure to take double adaptative

Twitter · Feb 17, 2024, 3:51 AM

[formal quartz]

No pen (except boots) is interesting

But it works I guess

[dim kindle]

this is pretty standard ngl

tho like ive deviated more to ludens amd i suppose early boots finish is the relevant point

[eternal palm]

I’m still on ibg viktor

[prisma ravine]

Im surprised by Seraphs

[eternal palm]

Why? Seraphs is pretty insane if you don’t care about stunting your damage till 2 items

But then your two items is better than most non seraph builders

[prisma ravine]

Because he isnt going any other mana items

So by level 11 you get a total of 116 AP from Seraphs, which is alright but the rest of its stats are kind of eh

Id rather get something with magic pen at that point

[wheat notch]

prolly for the shield

but blech

[slim terrace]

what????

HE BUILT MURAMANA HORIZON FOCUS, NOT EVEN MOONSTONE

[wheat notch]

wtf lol

[formal quartz]

banshee nerf

just click on them

[chilly ivy]

funny

[wheat notch]

How the fuck does this even happen

only found out bc of a reddit post

she's still got it

[wheat notch]

Lost 0-2 scrims