That ... is a start
#League of Legends
prisma ravine
dim kindle
yeah 400g is pretty huge
ill try it on swain now thats the only champ in my pool id consider it on
dim kindle
same
prisma ravine
Yeah I doubt Swains gonna use it
dim kindle
too much gold in mana
prisma ravine
Liandrys is too big to give up
dim kindle
for the most part but there are comps its bad into and for those cases rod could be great
at this price point
eternal palm
At full stacks the item at 3200g is already more than gold efficient, with the extra level that’s an extra 550 gold worth of stats
That’s the most gold efficient item in the game pre buffs
prisma ravine
Gold efficiency is also less good at rating mythics since most of their power is typically in abilities that dont have gold efficiency equivalents
eternal palm
I mean in a world where most ap mythics are ass that doesn’t matter?
The top 5 ap items aren’t mythics
dim kindle
Uh we are clearly comparing mage mythics to mage mythics here
and i am telling you rod is absolute ass at 3200g
eternal palm
Yeah and I’m telling you this is better than night harvester, Luden’s and riftmaker in its current form
dim kindle
its barely performing similar on the ideal users and giga bad on everyone else
dim kindle
Yeah and I’m telling you this is better than night harvester, Luden’s and riftma...
its not
harvester, rift and proto users dont care about this item and its not better than ludens
eternal palm
“Harvester users” you mean nidalee? Because nobody else should be building the literal 2nd worst mythic in the game behind evenshroud
wheat notch
Liandrys is too big to give up
did the luden build already fall off wtf
or is it just a swain main niche
dim kindle
Luden was only really ever an attempt at making swains solo agency better
but its not really good
wheat notch
nah like it's been a recent thing i saw by high elo and swaincord users
dim kindle
yeah I know about it
wheat notch
it felt super nice
but i dont think i saw any changes to suddenly stop going it
guess im bad Alamanders entire ranked history is filled w liandry again 🥲
dim kindle
yeah it was mostly a brief stint by alamander, fishlord etc because high elo swains got fed up with the lack of ability to do anything outside of skirmishes but turns out just playing to your champs strengths and praying your team goes along is better
fishlord plays more bot than mid swain though tbf
wheat notch
i just grab the last build i see in swainmains and it's usually fucking sick
was a big mandate gamer until i was informed it fell off
then this dh luden build
dim kindle
its p much just gonna be liandrys unless liandrys is terrible (e.g. squishy/high range comp) hen rod might actually be good at the reducef 2800g
but 2800g rod is definitely tempting
honestly issue is they fucking nuked all of swains ap ratios so like the 100 ap isnt as high value
wheat notch
was a big mandate gamer until i was informed it fell off
it's super obvious with my clash matches lmao going mandate then next clash switching to Generic Swain Build (tm) bc you saw ppl dissing it and then notice the dh luden
wheat notch
honestly issue is they fucking nuked all of swains ap ratios so like the 100 ap ...
I saw Alamander try Heartsteel on opgg which was funny but their scores seemed miserable compared to Rod games (in Normals tbf)
just rod into embrace
dim kindle
yea i mean tank mythics always sound cool but it just turns you into a nonthreatening sponge
rod definitely has high potential at 2800g its really nice
wheat notch
tbf Heartsteel does big dmg (looking at its text at least lmao)
dim kindle
better on bot than mid swain though if i had to guess
dim kindle
sunderer swain unironically worked before the ranged damage nerf (thanks ezreal) so i get trying it out
i was just p sure it was bad from the get go
wheat notch
ic
swain is like my 4th choice so i never think about him until he comes up in clash
dim kindle
ive gone back to queuing bot primary so all my swain games will be there but sometimes i do get put mid so ill see
I just hate most mid MUs witj him
so when i get mid i tend to go other shit
wheat notch
I just pick him in Clash bc he's just really good to slot into a lot of comps imo
dim kindle
ye
wheat notch
unlike... a certain... class, of champion
I'm still so upset they scrapped Vex being an artillery man what the hell
dim kindle
swain becomes infinitely better with coordinated play
wheat notch
ye just like getting another front that can do dmg and cc is super nice
dim kindle
its why he still gets a few pro picks as pocket
prisma ravine
I'm still so upset they scrapped Vex being an artillery man what the hell
I hate that their excuse was "oh we don't have the tech for it"
wheat notch
unlike... a certain... *class*, of champion
Ziggs and Xerath are so comfortable to play but I legit feel so bad ever picking them into Clash bc I'm just thinking "ok but Ori/Sera/Swain would have way better team synergy" :((((
prisma ravine
Then they delayed Vex anyway for purely cosmetic tech to be developed
I am still mad about Vex
dim kindle
first time i hear about that what happend
prisma ravine
The one we got is fine, but man she is so boring
wheat notch
I hate that their excuse was "oh we don't have the tech for it"
That sounds like such cope
prisma ravine
And does not even really fit her fantasy
Yeah the idea was that she had a sort of gate that would extend the range of projectiles
wheat notch
just say artillerys are shit design from the get go 
prisma ravine
Sorta like Jayce, but for everyone
But they "couldnt get it to work" for ... reasons?
Mind you, they recoded most champs ultimates for Sylas
And a lot more for Viego
eternal palm
Vex was supposed to be an artillery mage but they pushed that to the new dragon champ we were supposed to get, then that dragon champ got scrapped
wheat notch
just say artillerys are shit design from the get go <:poyoyOhNo:9554077056847339...
My favorite is that the last artillery, Zoe, might as well not be an artillery xd
I play her and she doesn't feel like it at all
like I get it
prisma ravine
Zoe is a burst mage
dim kindle
zoe got classified as burst
prisma ravine
She isn't really artillery, she just flanks and bursts
prisma ravine
Whos the last artillery mage we got
wheat notch
velkoz before zoe
prisma ravine
... it cant be Xerath right?
dim kindle
wiki is wrong then
prisma ravine
I guess Vel'Koz counts
wheat notch
The list was, as I remember
dim kindle
they called her burst in the first ever post mentioning her
prisma ravine
Also hot take: I miss old Xerath
wheat notch
wiki is wrong then
darn.
prisma ravine
AP Kog'Maw is an artillery mage
dim kindle
true
wheat notch
I was so happy for Vex just bc I was like
prisma ravine
Tbh I dont get how Riot treats classes sometimes
eternal palm
Ap twitch is an artillery mage if you use the mafia skin
dim kindle
vex is wintry
prisma ravine
It feels like they only want battle and burst mages to be good mid
wheat notch
yo my fav class of champ is gonna get a modern do over i can play artillery and not feel super powercrept on ziggs or xerath!
and then it's gone
:(
dim kindle
eh artillery gets pretty toxic when they are good
eternal palm
Ziggs was just meta for a year +
wheat notch
bot was my secondary
eternal palm
Showmaker picked Xerath in an MSI final and stomped with it
dim kindle
like scaled xerath is a menace but still has very exploitable weaknesses compared to other asshole classes
prisma ravine
I think artillery mages being toxic is cope
They tend to have a lot of counterplay
dim kindle
xerath was an azir counterpick no?
prisma ravine
Then again people hated Zoe for some reason so
wheat notch
11.12 to 11.16?
i called uno slurs over this a bit ago but i forgor
eternal palm
I forgot the situation he picked it under
dim kindle
p sure it was an ok azir counter at some point
wheat notch
Then again people hated Zoe for some reason so
My least favorite part about Zoe is how the true damage persists for a bit after you leave sleep :D
eternal palm
But iirc he lost lane and it didn’t matter since xerath scales like a god
dim kindle
"counter"
prisma ravine
Oh thats usually because of tenacity
wheat notch
i did not have tenacity.
prisma ravine
Tenacity reduces sleep duration, but the true damage persists for max duration always
wheat notch
im ziggs bruh u aint gonna catch me on mercs or legend tena or unflinching
prisma ravine
You sure?
eternal palm
prisma ravine
That sounds like a bug then
dim kindle
you p much cant touch objectives or siege vs a fed xerath but itll never get to that spot because yone can oneshot and dip from 50 miles away for solo q
eternal palm
Xerath into ori in pro
wheat notch
it sounds like a qol
im pretty sure it was like
oh u do true dmg if you do 2nd q cast before bubble ends
or smthg
it's dumb tho i hate it
wheat notch
eh artillery gets pretty toxic when they are good
Like I get long range poke being degen if strong but like
cmon give me some crumbs
I've played Ziggs since s8 and he's felt progressively worse over the years
bc im too stubborn to main botlane
where he's a real boy
slim terrace
My favorite is that the last artillery, Zoe, might as well not be an artillery x...
I'd classify her as one tbh
wheat notch
yeah ok riot did too
wheat notch
zoe got classified as burst
slim terrace
she's kinda hybrid with mobility if she picks up certain shards, and she needs to get in range for q
wheat notch
well, phreak did
slim terrace
but with terrain your E goes far as hell and so does your Q
wheat notch
it just feels extremely unlike artillery for me with how you have to get close to hit ur q
like i want to stay away not blink in their face
slim terrace
to me it kinda reminds me of old xerath where you root yourself, like you do put yourself at risk but you do at least snap back no matter what
it's kinda weird
wheat notch
I've never played old Xerath but that still sounds more artillery like
I'm just stuck on the principle, yk
eternal palm
Zoe def has inherent risk
wheat notch
I want to be as far away as I can be !!!!
I don't wanna portal remotely close to the enemy team smfh
Yone W still infuriates me sm like yeah I'm playing artillery but I burn my single self peel tool with a big cd and he still gets to catch up what gives
they even buffed ziggs w to go further and he still too fast!!!!
wheat notch
Ziggs was just meta for a year +
Ziggs' peak was from June to August 2021 so literally a few months
I checked just for u
It's possible he got play in S10 after his satchel bounce got buffed or a bunch of patches later where they buffed his passive but I don't remember him being as big (that is to say, I don't remember any attention on him that wasn't people with a Ziggs flair (besides idiots thinking the satchel distance buff was pushing enemies away and not yourself)) as he was in S11 summer
sullen crystal
I've been forced to play adc like 3 times and I actually just cannot play this role
eternal palm
Just pick Seraphine
sullen crystal
I'd sooner just not play
eternal palm
Or pick Senna since solo q supports love picking lux, brand, swain, xerath
dim kindle
seraphine senna t1 bot
eternal palm
Back when Senna was busted and Panth was still really good, senna panth bot fucked
So did senna wukong
God I miss fucking shit up with senna
Manamune, kraken slayer senna was peak senna
sinful frost
dim kindle
these are all very reasonable changes
sullen crystal
why is shyv so insane right now
prisma ravine
The new tank item that gives you health is hilarious in ARAM
Had over 8k health at the end of the game
I ... also did the most damage as Ksante?
prisma ravine
Also man, ARAM really should just roll from every champ, not just the ones you own
I got a bunch of champs I could get, but I dont wanna since I'd lower my chances of getting the champs I want in ARAM
dim kindle
why is shyv so insane right now
she has like 3 super strong builds she can adapt to and clears jungle giga fast
- dragon is even more important now which she deletes
sullen crystal
sigh I feel like every time I go in bot I just int
had to supp this time and it's just as bad
night marsh
Yeah and I’m telling you this is better than night harvester, Luden’s and riftma...
no shot this is better than ludens or riftmaker
it's not even comparable to riftmaker if we're being honest
since the champs who build that value the stats on rift more than roa
prisma ravine
Is league down for anyone else?
eternal palm
since the champs who build that value the stats on rift more than roa
Rift is usable on exactly 3 champs. And on 1 of them it’s not even that champions best item most of the time
night marsh
yes but what does that have to do with roa
roa existing isn't going to force them off rift
because the stats and percs of roa do not match or cover what rift provides
eternal palm
As stated, RoA is just generally a good item, in a world where every AP mythic besides Liandry’s is niche as hell
night marsh
I think you're overrating how much a level gives you in modern league
especially for mid game casters/scalers
eternal palm
Yeah I actually undersold it before, since the durability patch a level is actually worth over 600 gold
dim kindle
@wheat notch fishlord at least still likes ludens
also mask into high magic dmg seems really strong
slim terrace
this is not okay man
this item needs a serious nerf on aram, this is in 10 fuckin minutes lmao
wheat notch
<@265960037552357376> fishlord at least still likes ludens
i rly liked it so I'm glad
sinful frost
Twitter
sullen crystal
I love when I start to win a fight against rengar and then he pops ult, runs around and then one shots me
sullen crystal
just played against kassa with roa and he literally 1v9'd lmao
wheat notch
I want to dismiss RoA as just a worse stat stick than Crown rn but I can't tell how much Eternity sustain has helped me
wowee 3k healing 2k mana restore
tells me very little
prisma ravine
How long was the game and how early did you buy RoA?
You can usually gauge it by that
Anyway, is the buff live?
wheat notch
It doesn't matter how early I buy it Crown costs the same and has better components tbh
and yes
The only benefit RoA can have over Crown for me is technically making Embrace a less shitty item
by turning it into 97 AP with Shadowflame
but 27k dmg in 37 min is xd
🥱
prisma ravine
I mean I wouldnt expect it to be good on Ziggs tbh
The old version wasnt good, and it was cheaper
wheat notch
stat sticks be stat sticking
except its worse a stat stick than crown
so yea
like all i need is to evaluate eternity
and embrace
I'd like to know who the fuck approved of K'Sante being allowed to run down a mage on lv5 and 100-0 them
it's so dumb lol
i dont feel like a tank should be allowed to match a mage specialised in early this well
wheat notch
I mean do you see me playing Swain there
prisma ravine
No, but maybe you should be
dapper kite
finally i can play this again
sullen crystal
is your name actually fish fear me lmao
prisma ravine
Karma Top, Varus mid, AP Volibear, what kind of a game was this lmao
dapper kite
ok i understand questioning karma top
and i think the volibear just gave up at the point he was 0/2 and couldnt even farm under his tower
but varus mid is p viable, no?
prisma ravine
Its a for fun meme build
Its not the worst of meme builds, but its not really a viable build
dapper kite
i disagree
prisma ravine
I think it has something like a ... oh wait, its even less picked than I thought
I think it has a ~0.3% pickrate
dim kindle
tank karma is pretty well established ye
they nerfed the w base heal a few years ago i think even
lol in season 3 okay well i didnt think it was that long ago
and then recently for the durability update of course
wheat notch
wow !
i farmed real good
and i won the game
that's crazy
fuck poking the enemy laner im legit just gonna spam the wave i guess
9.2 cs/m
night marsh
what in gods name is that fiora build
dapper kite
experimental
wheat notch
I've no idea
night marsh
that does not inspire hope
dim kindle
prowler claw tech to dodge aatrox q
i could kinda see it if flat pen wasnt such a shit stat on fiora
also ravenous is still insane on her soo
crazy strong champ rn but she is skillful at least tbf
to translate the lane win into a game win is hard
sullen crystal
is shojin good on her?
humble glacier
Does red buff differ between melee/ranged?
prisma ravine
Yes but only the slow
prisma ravine
Half I think
sullen crystal
holy shit fuck darius mannn
his e misses? nah actually it grabbed you now you die
he hits you 5 times? yeah he gets like 1000 AD and bleeds you for 10 minutes
night marsh
prowler claw tech to dodge aatrox q
It’s Fiora though, you can just use your Q and W to dodge 2 of the Q sweet spots, lethality on that champ is gigatroll because you’re throwing away your@mythic for an active
Is troll because your champ@does true damage*
dim kindle
Yes
sullen crystal
walk through mid on half hp
enemy zed has 1 level on me and dirk
the second I appear on screen he w qs me and I die
lol, lmao even
eternal palm
So novelAI did its interpretation of All league characters
I’ll post the ones that made me laugh or found cool
slim terrace
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zs5bw2s5xAI we have ascended past spaghetti code at this point
chilly ivy
ik they won't waste development time on this, but they really need to revamp the engine
surely they could have added a clause where you can only clone champions and not every object in the game
slim terrace
but solar that's gonna fuck up azir even more 
chilly ivy
prisma ravine
Thats just Syndras E specifically being a buggy mess
It still rubberbands like mad too
dim kindle
I am very certain they completetly rewrote syndra e for the mini update but somehow made it pretty bad again
that neeko exploit is definitely on the high end of the crazy shit ive seen scale lmao
very wild
The spheres are a mess too because they obviously arent supposed to be terrain but sometimes randomly become terrain when certain conditions are met (no idea what those are)
for example sth that happens decently often that after tping you litteraly get minion blocked by your spheres
thats what i think happend to nami here
nami touched it got somehow blocked ny it and then the game checked "wait hold on this is supposed to be a syndra boll with properties xyz from e" rechecked it and made it stun again lmao
eternal palm
No Zhonyas vs a pure dive comp?
You are a brave soul
Also wtf was bot lane building, their items are actually reportable
Karma legitly build shurelya’s so you could run into the dive comp faster lol
This is what I mean about item building in games being brainless
wheat notch
You are a brave soul
Zhonyas on Ziggs is terrible lol
You will literally never catch me buying it
eternal palm
So there’s this one item that you can get to blow a bunch of cd’s vs the specific enemy team comp
But if you don’t get it, they just dive you repeatedly or never let you even get into the fight
Idt there’s any reason this game for you not to get it
Not saying it’s on you that you guys lost either since your bot lane was high key trolling
But your comp should win that game 7 out of 10 times if all factors are equal
wheat notch
I'm a high range artillery if I'm at risk of using stasis we either already lost the fight or I was standing somewhere I shouldn't have (and would die anyways)
plus Ziggs is like the only artillery with good self peel? a mid stat stick that delays my damage output by a lot is not on my priority list
sullen crystal
it's just one of those games huh
can't even step into vision cause he q ults me and i die
dim kindle
Also wtf was bot lane building, their items are actually reportable
uh no
new hydra is so overstatted that its unironically good on everything that scales well with bonus ad which this type of varus build does
its prob not a 2nd item purchade but its decent
even shit like akali is buying it rn
because it aids her biggest weakness
prisma ravine
Most junglers dont have a burst rotation that has higher base damage and scalings than assassins tbh
dim kindle
pick any jgler that likes hydra
prisma ravine
Lee, for some reason, does
dim kindle
lee is pretty decent rn but far from the biggest jgl offender
Entire role just gets to snowball so wild its not funny
no hands required
dim kindle
its very satisfying
sullen crystal
man there's no way jungle is this good
2 games in a row their jungler snowballs into a huge lead
and carries the game
eternal palm
new hydra is so overstatted that its unironically good on everything that scales...
You’re building an AA item vs full engage
I don’t give 2 shits how busted an item is
He was wrong for building an AA centric build when he literally can pivot to 3 different builds on Varus
Again, understanding team comp dynamics would easily tell Varus he was dead wrong
dim kindle
Muramana ravenous is not an autoattack focused build
ap varus is off the table vs trynd samira braum
ad caster varus is a bit mediocore here as well but it would be very tough for him to ever be able to just auto attack enough in this lobby
shieldbow guinsoo wits end wouldve served him the best here id still say
Yeah I retract my statement that he cant aa with the wits wnd build hes solid here
i still think his items are fine though
prisma ravine
Not this year iirc
night marsh
Oh yeah, I forgot we’re still only in Nov
wheat notch
im gonna cry bruh
ziggs player taking comet into this comp
goes e 2nd
starts tear
focuses on poking me when hse losing the farm war
he tps to lane when thresh is holding the cnanon wave for him
sigh
im throwing my lead 
Luden Seraphs????
why does he have cloth armor 😭
WHY DOES BRO HAVE 2 COMPONENTS THAT DONT BUILD INTO THE SAME ITEM
I PLAYED THIS SO BADLY TOO IM SO ASHAMED
Anyway I got an S but didn't deserve it 🤙
humble bane
ziggs player taking comet into this comp
Taking Ziggs at all with the 9 other champions in the game seems hella troll
wheat notch
Be careful of who you say that to 
I only picked Ori because I had Ziggs taken away from me and I was last pick 🥱
eternal palm
That’s actually not a bad Ziggs spot at all
wheat notch
Objectively speaking I would not pick Ziggs in that comp
wheat notch
You would get railed by Sett and Kanye in fights and the only champion that sets up your ult is Thresh
It's not enough
Like I'd pick it because I'm a cringe onetrick or w/e but from an outsider's perspective I would pick like
the same Orianna
even
like give Zed the ball and he ults a low health target and you use Ori R
You also get bursted by Lucian Nami way too quick once they break down your . singular threatening frontline
eternal palm
Just position well they have to go through illaoi to get to you, as 4 short range champions. The biggest crime here is that blue side comp is shit and has no synergy
wheat notch
(who got fed tbf but that's not important)
ah yes 4 short range champions if only the frontliner had this ult that takes your frontline and puts them on top of you
and then you eat a shockwave
humble bane
Illaoi doesn't qualify as nearly as much protection as you would hope
Your backline has to not insta die to sett ori
wheat notch
Illaoi was only relevant because she did damage
humble bane
But if illaoi is away or back there is no one to protect
eternal palm
Also, the fact that sett is picked is already an advantage. Sett has been one of the worst champions in the game for the better part of the last year.
wheat notch
tbh if i had known it was ziggs mid i probably wouldve picked xerath i just saw zed ziggs assumed ziggs was bot zed mid and didnt feel like autolosing lane when Swain got banned
eternal palm
Damn a stat stick that got nerfed to shit and shouldn’t be picked into anything besides specific counter matchups
wheat notch
it doesnt matter how shit sett is when he can go 1/5 in lane and still matter bc of his ult and e
humble bane
That is really unfortunate then he got picked with a team he works perfectly fine with
eternal palm
You don’t need engage in your comp. You have zone control between you and nami. Ziggs was their only hope of just not having to blindly walk forward (or a miracle thresh hook into a priority target)
wheat notch
sigh my neighbours are blasting bass-y ass music again no more ranked for me i guess 😮💨
They could at least play something good over ... ishowspeed or some garbage trap beat over the nfl theme
eternal palm
Hmm brand supp would have def been interesting, but zed jungle is the biggest tragedy
humble bane
Maybe workable
eternal palm
You change zed jungle to@ltierally anything else and the comp becomes more playable for blue side
humble bane
Well, if he didn't build serylda 3rd lol
wheat notch
id take thresh over brand tbh
unsure about ziggs since i dont have that much knowledge over brand
humble bane
I only know one champion that builds serylda on a consistent basis
wheat notch
is it jayce
eternal palm
You do build serylda’s on Jayce yes
sullen crystal
ah yes.
humble bane
welp make that two champs then
sullen crystal
man varus is a bit good right now huh
eternal palm
He never stopped being good for the last what, 15 months?
Maybe 18? I got to look back at the patch notes
sullen crystal
I've not had to suffer actually being in botlane until recently
eternal palm
The beautiful part is he has multiple viable builds
prisma ravine
Actually he wasn't doing too hot for most of summer
eternal palm
His pick rate went down, but that’s only because other adc’s rose in pick priority
Had nothing to do with Varus as a champion
eternal palm
It’s like Ashe. Ashe hasn’t been a bad champion in a while, but she randomly appears every world championship
Even if she hasn’t been meta All year
prisma ravine
He got incidental buffs from other stuff being nerfed and items iirc
sullen crystal
also has something happened with kayn cause that character seems like he's way better for no reason
eternal palm
Red kayn started getting some popularity post durability patch
He’s in general also a solid solo q pick if you’re trying to 1v9
prisma ravine
Ngl, hotfix remove Heartsteel from ARAM
night marsh
Kayn has been good since the dawn of time
This last nerf is like the first time in forever he wasn’t a good pick
And that lasted til preseason
prisma ravine
Hes been pretty bad most of this year, other than briefly after the durability update iirc
night marsh
Nah even at the start of the season when goredrinker kayn got buffed, then we had the inverse purple@build
I think the first time he had a sub-50% win rate this season was 1-2 patches ago
prisma ravine
Wasnt that when assassins were building bruiser items because assassin items were that bad?
prisma ravine
Oh lmao
Also win rate is usually bad, but especially for easy champs like Kayn, at gauging power
night marsh
So they had to nerf red kayn’ AD ratios
That champ@has just always been really solid for too long so I welcome@ when he’s in a nerfed state
night marsh
Makes the most sense though?
Blue makes for some very uninteractive games
Red is just the usual drain tank
prisma ravine
Eh, I just like the shadowwalk thing, and flanking on Kayn is fun
The issue is just that youre choosing fighter/bruiser vs assassin
night marsh
Feel like red slots into more comps better, has better scalings, and is a prio target
prisma ravine
And youd have to be stupid to ever pick assassin over bruiser
night marsh
Exactly
night marsh
Also I think people@just now realizing that red kayn AD ratios were wild just shows how unexplored he was
prisma ravine
Remember when they took Eclipse, one of Assassins only 2 good mythics, and decided to give it to Fighters instead who have like 6+ good mythics already
dapper kite
Still oneshot our adc 
prisma ravine
Certified Rito™️ moment
night marsh
Yeah Kayn is nice, whenever I’m regulated to jungle, I just lock him in
Man’s is a true 1v9
prisma ravine
I pick Kha cuz he's my boy
dapper kite
I played red kayn today
night marsh
Death Dance buff was also crazy
dapper kite
Felt p good, as always
prisma ravine
Im more of a midlane Kha usually (or was, at least)
night marsh
And the cleaver changes last year
prisma ravine
But jungle Kha is fine
night marsh
I honestly forgot Kha was in the game
Champ@went from like this omnipresent champ to so fringe now
prisma ravine
He got nerfed when he was already just alright
IT was really funny because Kha had like 1 pick at worlds, got nerfed
night marsh
I guess not everyone can be Elise or Lee sin
dapper kite
Hes on my list to try toplane this preseason
prisma ravine
Lee is just super privileged ngl
Tbh I just play mages mid nowadays
Always good, enough variety to be fun, and solid itemisation
night marsh
Fighters in this game are too fun but juggernauts are just wild
prisma ravine
Like I aint going back to assassins
night marsh
Part of me wants to learn Riven but goddamn that champ requires so much finger movement
prisma ravine
Why sweat my ass off with shitty-ass items when I can just play Ori and go "ball goes wheeeeee"
Or Viktor and just be eternally good midlane for no reason
Assassin players are masochists
night marsh
Because Riven is hot
eternal palm
Ornn is hot too
Don’t you just want to grab his horns and ram him
(Talking about his ultimate)
night marsh
eternal palm
Speaking of which, can we buff sylas, we’ve spent too much time nerfing him
dapper kite
love me some lilia top
dim kindle
playing vs lilia top has been one of my most miserable experiences ever
shits nasty for a lot of champs
you have no chance at any stage of the game
dapper kite
but yeah, this just never felt like urgot had any chance even with jgl
dim kindle
i litteraly didnt have a chance at 6 items
still won the game
but wow it was miserable
dapper kite
i was never in danger of dying this game even when overextending under turret
and suprisingly , despite building tank mythic, i never lacked damage
Curious!
dim kindle
if late game jax cant do shit to you in side you know its strong
dapper kite
at some point i stopped killing urgot cause i been in his shoes before
felt bed for him cause he tried to escape bay dashing over the wall
night marsh
Yeah Lil is disgusting rn
Making her melee was just such a wtf choice
I still think liandries+demonic beats out jacksho though
sullen crystal
yawn camille players are so cringe
why can that character do half my hp with an empowered q
and travel the length of my lane
humble bane
Can't tell if heartsteel is actually good or not
Hella unfortunate though that tank waveclear is back to being armor locked
dim kindle
imo most tanks feel significantly weaker
ppl underestimated how strong sunfire was
for tank dueling power
but I do think the new tank items are neat
im just not sure how they are gonna balance them being better on bruisers than actuwl tanks
sullen crystal
I hate it
eternal palm
You can make your shit adc look halfway decent
You can make your good players better
sullen crystal
yeah but I don't enjoy being a living ward
maybe it's just that I don't like 2 person lanes
but it just feels like their jungler always lives in your lane and that if the other adc gets 1 kill you just get snowballed out of the game
but maybe that's just me being dogshit at the game
dim kindle
I dont want to call you that no
but bot is generally a little less snowbally
Support can be a very high impact role depending on the playstyle
humble bane
yeah but I don't enjoy being a living ward
supports roaming is the most tilting thing to actually play against lmao
jungler is one thing, but having a support show up toplane is so painful
sullen crystal
idk I just don't enjoy botlane
dim kindle
thats fine yeah
sullen crystal
adc just feels more enjoyable than support to me if I have to play botlane
sullen crystal
love kata coming out of a bush and one shotting me
this game is dogshit sometimes man
SHE HAS JAK'SHO WHAT
jaksho nashors is all she needs lmfao
sullen crystal
what a fucking joke of a character
prisma ravine
That ... is a really shitty build ngl
sullen crystal
doesnt really matter when she can just shunpo dagger ult you to death anyway
dapper kite
what a fucking joke of a character
shaco type build
prisma ravine
Thing is, she can barely do that with a good build, let alone one where her second item adds genuinely 0 damage lmao
dim kindle
theory behind jaksho on kat is okay
prisma ravine
Im assuming its the usual draink tank kata nonsense
dim kindle
hydra is okayish too
dim kindle
Im assuming its the usual draink tank kata nonsense
not rly
eternal palm
Hydra has been fine on her for a while
prisma ravine
Not sure Id ever pick it over IBG if Im going the tanky route though
dim kindle
she just genuinely has excess damage where she doesnt need to buy straight highest dmg items at all times
At the moment
But yea probably a better choice around than jaksho
prisma ravine
She really doesnt, unless youre only cleaning up, but also, there is a difference between "not the highest damage item" and "item that does literally no damage whatsoever"
At that point just go IBG
Its a non-mana item now anyway
dapper kite
jaksho does do damage
prisma ravine
After 8 seconds, Kat doesnt get to 8 seconds
dim kindle
She really doesnt, unless youre only cleaning up, but also, there is a differenc...
always feels like you are playing a different game
but yea jaksho is not the way
prisma ravine
always feels like you are playing a different game
If Kat had actually good solo damage that didnt rely on the opponent misplaying six ways to sunday, she wouldnt be an OTP-only champ that isn't even doing great for said OTPs lmao
dim kindle
She doesnt post lane but she doesnt really need it either
nashor pre 20 creates enough damage for her to do what she needs to
Imo protobelt is the item but ppl tend to deviate from it because it requires good usage to be worth the gold
prisma ravine
Protobelts issue is, as usual, that a lot of value is in its dash
And Kat doesnt get much from said dash
But the other options are worse so
🤷
dim kindle
i do think she does but its just hard to do correctly sometimes
prisma ravine
If only Night Harvester wasnt turbo-ass
dim kindle
and it distracts you from thinking about what you need to focus on
we arent robots after all
prisma ravine
Switch Night Harvester and Protobelts stats and mythic passive, and Im pretty sure it'd be better for anyone building either item lmao
dim kindle
like the same way everfrost in solo q has lower winrate on sylas/ahri even though those items are very good on those character because we arent all faker
eternal palm
I cringe anytime I see my solo q teammates build everfrost
Because I know they’re not going to be able to use it the way it’s supposed to be used
dim kindle
Personally I am self aware enough to know I dont use the item well
so I dont buy it generally
eternal palm
Same. I go belt on sylas 90% of the time, the other 10% is when everfrost has infinite value and the best decision is for me to build it
dim kindle
e.g. when I play ahri I play a little more selfishly for solo picks so ludens just works bettet
dim kindle
Same. I go belt on sylas 90% of the time, the other 10% is when everfrost has in...
I go liandry usually unless the item is very bad that game
eternal palm
Eh Liandry is ok, most of the time I’m playing the flank and the extra dash is usually good to dodge any peel from the support to get to priority targets
dim kindle
sylas just reaches his critical strength at a certain amount of haste with 2 items + boots
also no mana feels rough for side laning
wheat notch
seraphs more like
despite being in the highest order of angels ur still so fucking bad huh
wheat notch
It's not being afraid it's
they didn't like it
so they're looking at different ways to change it
instead of pushing smthg they're unhappy w
eternal palm
So while manamune was buffed from its first iteration, seraphs gets to be that niche item for us mage players
wheat notch
Anyways gonna go play some League of Legends with the worst Ziggs loadouts you'll ever see today
aery manaflow trans gs boots demat
luden lucids sflamr gaming
i would love cpot if it had the focus passive like dring 😭
What if I just started w Mana Gem Refill and got Chapter CPot on first recall
eternal palm
Sounds bad
wheat notch
im gonna cry
slim terrace
they didn't like it
y not
wheat notch
I don't know why I just know they weren't satisfied w the changes and were looking at a different approach
wheat notch
Anyways gonna go play some League of Legends with the worst Ziggs loadouts you'l...
It's time to ball
wheat notch
ok i changed my mind im building liandry lucids drive next game
because that sounds REALLY funny
spell demon ziggs
wheat notch
😮💨
wheat notch
spell demon ziggs
It wasn't that good
wheat notch
Tanks 😴
Love buying my 1,5 anti tank items, having my ADC but 3 anti tank items and still being unable to kill Mundo 😮💨
dapper kite
villain jungler
system muted
wheat notch
yeah he was an ass
humble bane
Tanks 😴
zero chance adc and you kills mundo at that build tbh, ult stoneplate and it's suddenly impossible to finish the kill
everyone that isn't mundo would have to die first
wheat notch
zero chance adc and you kills mundo at that build tbh, ult stoneplate and it's s...
It's so dumb though
itemising for 1 champ specifically
then he still beats you in 2v1
because heartsteel dealing over half my hp is pretty cool i guess
like i get it, mundo is designed to be anti mage and all that
but c'mon
night marsh
this is post his buffs though right
wheat notch
...which buffs?
night marsh
I think I remember reading a little bit ago on twitter that they gave him buffs for scaling
like taking the ad out of his ult to increase how much it heals
wheat notch
He's only been nerfed this season
night marsh
and giving his w damage
wheat notch
wheat notch
I wanna get into Karth mid but he doesn't sound great to pick up
since he's all base dmgs I think,,,
dunno how good he is against tanks
esp being immobile as fuck
night marsh
immobile mage with all skillshots
wheat notch
Yeah but he's super fun :(
I love how aggressive he can get
It's like lower range Ziggs but better
Someone else I've been eyeing is Vel'koz
seems like the best artillery to pick up
eternal palm
Besides Zoe, prob
Velkoz is just obnoxious
His best role is prob supp though just like brand
wheat notch
His best role is prob supp though just like brand
It actually isn't
his skill floor is why i havent bothered much though 
humble bane
I've played vel for quite a bit
real issue tbh is that miss E die is like half of your playtime on the champ
damage is so crazy if anything hits though since Riot decided to keep buffing his ratios since I lasted played him like s8
q angles is fake skillfloor, landing E is the real floor
wheat notch
Can't believe I won 3 back to back because my opposing laners were the worst players in existance
(Udyr ended 2/14/0, Akali ended 3/10/1 & Vi ended 15/10/2 but I made her miserable early)
humble bane
udyr mid lmao what
wheat notch
preseason moment I guess
dim kindle
lol I actually played against mid udyr 2-3 times towards the end of the season and it was so useless
no idea where that comes from
i think they were trying to clear waves and roam or sth but I just had 24/7 prio vs them and they couldn't play
wheat notch
It was only mildly scary bc his Q burst did like 230 damage in the first auto but he either died under my tower like an idiot or traded 141
wheat notch
🛌
wheat notch
6/22 botlane too
wheat notch
I'm not here to defend myself I went 0/2 in lane
(although I will argue that my first death was unfair bec. my game froze under Ryze's tower and I couldn't live through Flashing 🙃)
(and that my second death I got pincered by Poppy coming from top Rell from bot with 0 vision no pings )
I need to hurry up w. getting an upgrade to my graphics card because it's getting so bad now
slim terrace
I feel like technical problems with the league client have gotten worse as of late
a lot of my friends are crashing mid-game when playing league
wheat notch
oh maybe but my pc is also nto doing good
ive stacked like 3 objects on my card just so its stays alive 😀
slim terrace
oof
night marsh
> 1/14 aatrox with chempunk chainsword rush
You’re not hip to the new Aatrox hidden tech?
dim kindle
chainsword rush was okay a while ago when the item was like 2600g i think
cuz it was so efficient
not sure though
definitely not the play anymoar
wheat notch
Regrettably I have now recorded 2 League of Legends games because some chally guy was offering free coaching
They're both dreadful but, you know
preseason be preseasoning
(and also I'm bad)
night marsh
morde jg is insane rn
lil also probs getting gutted from the massive buff she got in preseaspn
buffing tahm is hella troll though
slim terrace
thank god heartsteel is getting a nerf on aram
dim kindle
its kinda wild how much damage sunfire mythic was doing that tanks are suffering without
anyway very good changelist imo
jgl income probably needs a bigger nerf
wheat notch
I'm losing to the worst Ziggs player ever holy fucking shit
dude is infinitely more triggerhappy and shittier at hitting shots than me but hey I counterpicked myself and their jungler is 9.1.3 at 16min
this shit makes me want to quit the game ong
lost to the most moronic player bc of the whole team around him being able to perform up to expectations
like ok yeah fine i counterpicked myself i lost my own lane myself but god damn
did this ziggs not deserve it
he threw so many Qs at me (that missed) that should've been aimed at the wave
jesus christ
eternal palm
I mean, he did the most damage, and had a based mejai’s buy. That was a lost game anyways as soon as Vayne didn’t go 2/0 in the first 15 minutes of the game
wheat notch
arent you someone who has played ziggs before
u should knwo that an artillery doing the most damage is standard, not something worthy of note
wow i did the most damage
wow i did the most damage despite building like DOG SHIT
ok im exaggerating that one a bit
(and akali did 2nd most despite me beating the shit out of her)
wheat notch
Mental health restored 
sullen crystal
why is shaco actually a league character
sullen crystal
same question but with vayne
love when I click on thresh lantern and it doesn't do anything
very bug free game
prisma ravine
Lmao I just did like 60% of my entire teams damage in ARAM
More than twice the amount of the next-closest guy in the whole match
sullen crystal
I actually have no idea why I'm playing league recently
had more games than not when I'm going 0/10 or something close to that
just feels like out of nowhere I've become like the worst player ever
sullen crystal
why does lux have no cds and early game she hits an e for like 200
i never thought i'd hate playing against this character
prisma ravine
Her cooldowns are actually pretty long outside her ult (by ult standards)
sullen crystal
cap
I have never had any issue playing against her as panth before and now I can't even get close to her and she does 1/4th of my health every time an e hits
and this is after I buy hexdrinker too
lol
lmao even
prisma ravine
Its 11 seconds on Q and 10-8 seconds on E
She is annoying, her E is virtually undodgable and the Q hitbox is bullshit ,especially on her p2w skins
But her cooldowns are decently long
sullen crystal
just love that
darius with only tri force
only has to auto me 5 times and then ult me
what a character
prisma ravine
Thats Juggernauts for ya
Easy to kite and make useless, but if they get ontop of you, its gonna hurt
prisma ravine
Hook is pretty short range, and the slow is melee
Ghost is good, but you can play around it
... err, depending on the champ
What were you playing?
sullen crystal
panth
prisma ravine
Yeah that might be difficult
You can stun him and try to run, but, eh, works so-so
Your E is probably your best tool, but its hard to time it to stop his ult
sullen crystal
I stunned him
and used empowered e to get bonus speed
and he still killed me easily
prisma ravine
Yeah you wanna save E to avoid damage rather than get speed
If he is ghosting, you can't get far enough with it unless youre already under tower
sullen crystal
there's no point using e to avoid damage if he's on top of me because once it ends he just keeps hitting me
prisma ravine
Well, if you block his ult thats like, a good third of his damage
sullen crystal
but then he can just q again
or e
and the bleed he does lasts for about 5 seconds anyway
I just don't see how I'm meant to fight darius in any meaningful way
prisma ravine
His E is ~24 seconds cooldown
eternal palm
Tbf you SHOULD be losing lane as panth if lux plays safe. Even then, panths damage is so sad now that lux’s shield could fuck you from lethal, and if lux survives your level 2/3 all in and you’re flashless, that lane is mega over
sullen crystal
tfw I'm out of the yone rectangle and I still get hit and die anyway
thank u rito
man ahri sucks too huh
sullen crystal
:)
prisma ravine
Animations are often misleading
Yone isnt the worst, thats champs like Lux, Morgana and Ahri especially when using a p2w skin but
Yeah, it sucks
sullen crystal
might be time for me to just stop playing the game if I can't get top
hate playing bot, apparently mid is just dogshit for me now
and jungle is just jungle
eternal palm
All you got to do is
Find 1 champion you can play in each role
You don’t have to be amazing at them, just know “okay if I’m on this champ I can contribute to winning”
night marsh
Youre not playing around a juggernaut with ghost btw
You just have to sacrifice some things until you either are strong enough to 1v1 or@for your jungled to dickride you
Overextend just a smidge (go@past half the lane xd) and you’re donzeo
slim terrace
Yeah that might be difficult
doesn't panth just get answered hard by darius anyways
panth doesn't want extended fights and darius does
prisma ravine
Matchup seems slightly favoured for Panth judging by the data, but sample size is iffy
dim kindle
panth can win it but darius sorta just needs to wait out levels
giga snowballs both ways
id say panth is actually strong rn the botrk rush does a million damage
eternal palm
No ways his E now has a 1.0 AP ratio
Haven’t they learned their lesson yet about random 1.0 ap ratios
night marsh
I like what they're trying to do
but im not a fan of the ratios
turning counterstrike to AP is a bit much
cause now you have 1 less ability that scales with your attack damage you're buying
also itemzing against this guy is going to be a bit harder now
prisma ravine
I dont get why they want his ap build to be burstier
night marsh
yeah it's weird
humble bane
uhhhh that is a lot of burst they just gave Jax
but also why is Jax being changed...?
wheat notch
they wanted to make his ult more satisfying
dim kindle
These changes seem really forced to me
effectively this shifts some side laner power into teamfights
eternal palm
Lmfao, I had a GP I vsed call me a bot because I wouldn’t fight him mid
Meanwhile I held him to 5 cs a min
prisma ravine
And now matchmaking uses only your mmr and ignores rank
Why dont we just go back to lp alltogether?
sinful frost
matching based on MMR is fine as long as your gains appropriate
before they tried to have it both ways and it just ends up being awkward on both fronts
wheat notch
<@265960037552357376>
?
wheat notch
I hadn't
I thought you were talking about the vod xd
They're neat I guess but I'm still gonna stay right where I am lmao
wheat notch
i mean sure
prisma ravine
As long as one of them is Viktorious
sinful frost
now I get two skins instead of zero
dim kindle
interested to see what the jax mini game looks like lol
think the ranked changes make a lot of sense
prisma ravine
Lame
dim kindle
ksante buff is reasonable ig but champ is already scary strong in capable hands
night marsh
Ksante went from shit to annoying as fuck
have to relive this nightmare all over again
eternal palm
Anybody want to do aram cup?
wheat notch
"horrible midlaner" coming from nasus xd
i love bugged post game screens so i cant report toxic players <3
slim terrace
can you not report them through match history?
and even if not there you could probably do so through riot support
wheat notch
can you not report them through match history?
no
wheat notch
and even if not there you could probably do so through riot support
ive done this before for other ppl it doesnt do anything
they just go "lol i dont have the authority for this L bozo"
dim kindle
this preseason is really testing me
the jungle show every game is a bit tiring
also well played bruisers are so strong rn
dim kindle
what
sinful frost
that's pretty wild
trying to make it sound like a top player was retiring so he wouldn't get hired
wheat notch
Doing surprisingly well this preseason
prisma ravine
Nilah nerfs?
night marsh
they should probably just ner jacksho lol
prisma ravine
That champ is already basically unplayed because she is kinda garbage
Why would you nerf her lmao
slim terrace
https://twitter.com/RiotPhroxzon/status/1602438542374080512
maybe the lux buff can help out mid 
prisma ravine
High banrate
People think Zed is broken
Is he? Ehhh, hard to tell, its preseason
eternal palm
Even if he is
Zed being good is a GOOD thing
Who’s the last assassin to actually see prominent play at the highest levels of play
Only one that pops to mind is Qiyana when she was released
And that’s been years
prisma ravine
Akali
Kha has had some success
Not since he was randomly nerfed over Lee despite Lee being pick/ban and the most broken champ at worlds, but he had some success before that nerf
eternal palm
Bruisers/mages/tanks get preferential treatment
Assassins have been dead as a class since the rework
wheat notch
if mages get preferential treatment can i get old horizon back x
prisma ravine
The community hates assassins 🤷
prisma ravine
Could be worse
You could be playing a class that has 1 mythic item and like 1.5 legendary items
Lmao
wheat notch
liandry sflame rabs morello void no diversity
eternal palm
If we go by what the community hates, there’s a bruiser complain thread everyday on the league subreddit
prisma ravine
Seriously assassin itemisation is so bad, its actually impressive
Eclipse was made into a fighter mythic (because apparently fighters with their 5 mythics needed help, not assassins with their 2)
Duskblade is memeblade
So youre down to Prowlers
And Ghostblade is the only generally good legendary
The spellshield one is alright
The others dont exist or are for other roles as well
Like how Collector is an ADC item (for ... some reason?) and glaive is a support item (for ... some reason?)
eternal palm
Also wint, it’s hard to say mages have ever been in a bad spot, Azir, Viktor, Ori and more have been staples of high level play for years
wheat notch
the reason is bc ad supports didn't have shit
u were a tank or enchanter or u didnt have anything
prisma ravine
I mean sure, but at that point it was literally just Pyke
Even now its literally just pyke and Senna
wheat notch
panth
prisma ravine
No other support wants lethality
prisma ravine
Yeah they kinda nerfed him out of playability
wheat notch
Also wint, it’s hard to say mages have ever been in a bad spot, Azir, Viktor, Or...
don't care i want my horizon focus revert
prisma ravine
But yeah like
I really keep hoping they remove the crit from collector completely
And turn it into a proper assassin item
eternal palm
Horizon focus has never been a good item, it got changed because not even its intended champions were building it at high elo wint
So you’re asking for a worse item
wheat notch
what
prisma ravine
Errr
wheat notch
velk bought it constantly xer did too ziggs did too
prisma ravine
No the previous Horizon Focus was better
wheat notch
those r the target audience
eternal palm
Yea, Ziggs was not buying that shit at high elo
eternal palm
When was the horizon focus change?
wheat notch
Last preseason
Velkoz still bought horizon post nerf but thats bc he has true damage and horizon is the only td amp
there were xerath players still buying it but i hold that the vision u got wasnt worth the lowrr power
i have literally bought horizon like once or twice on ziggs after preseason just to double check how bad the item is
lux idk about ive seen luxes buy horizon 2nd but sflame probs better
eternal palm
I’m trying to remember the timeline of 2021 meta, this was when cosmic drive was a broken stat stick yeah?