split rampart
A lot of people spam the same dungeon over and over again (looking at you ransack).
This change aims at increasing the variety while rewarding difficulty.
I think this would result in a more natural gameplay loop.
Regular Dungeon -> 1 Item
Capstone Dungeon -> 2 Items
Eternal Tiers:
Tier 1 (1-4) would give ilvl 255 loot.
Tier 2 -> 270
Tier 3 -> 285
glossy estuary
kindred idol
+ drops of materials... and maybe increase the costs of upgrading gear/gems/rero...
if you increase the cost, i will farm any 25 key for best rewards.. its now more demanding to get bis gear, but still boring enough to listen to a podcast in the meantime.. nothing changed for me, but for the people that want to reach 10k as their max, gearing is now way harder .. why would we do that? 😄
north gale
much rather they just add A LOT more rewwards to the dungeon rating UI and thats our main form of progresion instead of spamming the same dungeon over n over again
glossy estuary
if you increase the cost, i will farm any 25 key for best rewards.. its now more...
you might farm E25, but to get there you still would have to push and progress. So that farm is becoming more exclusive to the hardcore players only, not for casuals; incentivising pushing over farming. Casuals will likely play until maximum 10k anyway, but it shouldn't be gated by farming.
This way alt gearing will technically be faster, if you farm higher tiers with your main for more gold and materials (Just give us a bunch of supply boxes already on higher Eternals so we can start alts at 135 iL please 🫣)
split rampart
much rather they just add A LOT more rewwards to the dungeon rating UI and that...
there will always be a “best” dungeon. this just aims at increasing the variety by reducing the difference between regular and capstone dungeons.
kindred idol
Why do we care if people spam ransack 1?
Because to push to 30+ you have to farm (ransack 1) … I would love a world where pushing high is all I have to do to gear my char / but that’s just not the case 🙂
junior ermine
No you dont, just go climb the ladder
kindred idol
You do … you can’t even upgrade your weapon / or reroll your traits if all you have is your push loot … and the one 255 piece I get for progressing a 33 dungeon IF I succeed is not helping 😄
Also good luck making it to 30+ without your legendary / you might get it in your 33 dungeon - congrats to you if you time it without your good legendary because all you did was push ( and therefore have 62 chances to get it so far… )
Don’t get me wrong gearing is way faster than s1 - but telling people farm is not needed and just push is just wrong …
junior ermine
Youre ruining your own experience of the game by choosing the play this way
And if people want to do that then let them
Keeps them out of my groups
kindred idol
Im fine with it - I never said I don’t like it - I actually love how fast you can gear this season 🙂
Not ruining anything - chill with friends and farm some ransack 😄
but telling people it’s not needed and to just push is just a wrong statement. You can’t gear your character (gems / essence bonus / legendaries / weapon traits) by only pushing …
junior ermine
It is not needed to push, pushing means playing at the highest level you can, not necessarily doing 30s or 40s or 50s
split rampart
Youre ruining your own experience of the game by choosing the play this way
this is where you are wrong. people don’t choose to spam ransack - they choose to be efficient and that happens to be ransack this time around. it’s always wrong to blame the player as they have no influence over the game presented to them. best one can hope for is that what ever happens to be the most efficient is also fun and varied.
kindred idol
but the highest level i can push is in the 30s? and the only way any person can push in the 30s is to farm beforehand.. you cannot get there with only the loot you get from pushing..
like if you do a challange where you are aloud to only get the shards needed each tier and continue youll max out before 30s.. but it would be a fun challange though 😄
but there is a hardcap here.. because you are not aloud to backtrack to farm anything, so once you cant complete your 28 dungeon the challange is over..
junior ermine
this is where you are wrong. people don’t choose to spam ransack - they choose t...
Of course people choose to do so, the game doesnt block you from playing eternal as far as you can go without full 330
People choose to do it
If they want to then let them, who cares
kindred idol
as i pointed out there is a world where you have to farm to continue to push.. so your argument of choice is wrong.
if any person wants to push over like i dont know 28, you need to have proper gear.. and for that you need to farm
junior ermine
IF PEOPLE WANT TO FARM THEN LET THEM FARM
Jesus christ i've said it like 3 times already
kindred idol
we dont want to farm.
we NEED to farm to progress.
junior ermine
You will farm regardless of how they change the gearing system
north gale
there will always be a “best” dungeon. this just aims at increasing the variety ...
not if you tie dungeon score into progression as then you need to do every dungeon at higher lvls
kindred idol
no i will not, if they give me 5k per new tier i clear, i push thats all you need
junior ermine
Item level is fixed, dungeon level isnt
There will ALWAYS be a level of dungeon that is most optimal to run
glossy estuary
we dont want to farm.
we NEED to farm to progress.
if you need to farm to reach 10k and can't get enough gear from pushing, then the design is bad.
kindred idol
if you need to farm to reach 10k and can't get enough gear from pushing, then th...
for 10k you need 0 farm.
for higher stuff you need it 🙂
junior ermine
Also you gain gear by playing the game
The only difference is how fast
Maybe just be better then you wont need full330 and stacked gems
kindred idol
Also you gain gear by playing the game
you dont. because i spent whole evening not clearing a single dungeon because we wipe 17 times in high etenral keys, its called progression. 😄 i get 0 gear ahaha
kindred idol
Maybe just be better then you wont need full330 and stacked gems
lol.
junior ermine
Dare i say skill issue
If its not ransack 1 its tuzari 2 or sailors 10/20
People will farm regardless
north gale
not if
kindred idol
no i will not, if they give me 5k per new tier i clear, i push thats all you nee...
i think you dont read my responses 🙂
ill discontinue the conversation, because you are like a wall 🙂
kindred idol
maybe other people are willing to talk to you 😄
split rampart
not if you tie dungeon score into progression as then you need to do every dunge...
give me a concrete example of how that would work.
north gale
give me a concrete example of how that would work.
10k mount, 10200, 1k gold, 10500, 50 marks of fellowship, 10750, 15 gems, 11k 5k gold, 11.2k 75 marks of fellowship
split rampart
10k mount, 10200, 1k gold, 10500, 50 marks of fellowship, 10750, 15 gems, 11k 5k...
how do i get more once i’ve claimed all of those?
junior ermine
You farm
north gale
how do i get more once i’ve claimed all of those?
you play other characters but you also would be obtaining items at end of dungeons aswell
and if the rewards are appropiate enough it should give you everything
and if you cant break certain dungeon scores to get the rewards you can always just spam +1's for a bit to get that extra power if need be
but again only way this would work is if devs made the rewards actually good but for some reason they have 0 brain cells when it comes to reward structures
i.e the woodland gives you 3g per quest
and 2 supplies
and you get 400g for getting 9.7k which is 1 upgrade etc
junior ermine
Woodland is for beginners, not for eternal gamers
north gale
its for nobody, it teaches nothing and provides nothing
junior ermine
They need more rewards beyond 10k but nothing they give will stop farming
north gale
unless the player struggles to find the W key woodland is for nobody
junior ermine
They could make upgrades free and people would still farm
north gale
ontop of that the game is marketing itself towards people who have an understanding of what m+ is, they dont have to be good or bad players but they should atleast know what theyre getting invested in and imo targeting gamers who struggle to understand that W is forward and S is backwards is a very quick way to kill this game off
as those players are very unlikely to ever bother with eternal the main content of the game
im not saying they shouldnt have tutorials, but easy content and tutorials should be designed for people who know what theyre getting into not for disabled people that never touched a PC game before
thats just my take tho, cause whatever the hell they did for season 2 obviously was a complete flop between the woodlands, healers design, abandoning progression etc
chrome crow
Yeah I made a similar suggestion here: #1447451011278180494 message
It’s very odd that capstones always drop 270 x2 and regular adventures drop 255
Instead of just making capstones drop x2 gear pieces and making the ilvl scale with “tier”
If you got 330 gear from e30+, then the best groups would be farming e30 keys for gearing, which would be infinitely more enjoyable than speed farming e1 ransack
It would also make doing push keys feel signficiantly more rewarding because of increased gold (from scrapping higher level gear) and reducing the amt of upgrades u need to burn gold on
junior ermine
Would they?
You can run 2-3x ransack 1s in the time it takes to run a 30 key thats closer to a push key
And even if the gear is lower it scraps for gold
You need gold for other things besides gear upgrading
split rampart
it won’t stop people from queue dodging but you’d atleast get something out of doing the wrong shard.
raven patrol
You can run 2-3x ransack 1s in the time it takes to run a 30 key thats closer to...
doing a dungeon at eternal level N should be precisely 2^(n-1) as rewarding as a eternal 1 dungeon. then it's always worth pushing the highest key you can because it's literally double the reward of going just 1 step down
this would also have the amazing side effect of making the grind incredibly quick if you're able to clear even moderately higher keys!
Which is perfect because, lets face it, the only people who could ever enjoy clearing the same dungeon over and over on low difficulty, are surely the ones that are so unskilled they feel E1 is a challenge worth repeating.
So the hardstuck noobs get to enjoy their trivial grind slop, and everyone else gets to play the actual video game of pushing keys to 80+ 
steady plume
Would also make the low tier abhorrent to progress through with a new character if you’re solo.
split rampart
you'd have a more natural progression curve that motivates you to advance in difficulty for better rewards instead of farming the easiest dungeons.
the most efficient farm is usually a combination of difficulty x speed x rewards.
the current answer for this equation is eternal 1 (ransack in particular).
which is a problem in itself as it recreates the problems that quickplay had because you mix veterans with "new" players.
chrome crow
All it would do is make it take slightly longer to just mega outgear content
And would be more rewarding as you progress
hollow breach
You realize if you got more rewards as you get higher you wouldn’t farm a 30… you’d just farm a 12 because (dungeon completion time + dungeon loot) / hour will always have a breakpoint that is wayyyy lower then your push keys.
You also like alienate people who can’t get to that level.
Idk I’m not being super constructive in this conversation because I don’t have a good answer to solve this either, but higher scaling rewards ain’t it.
You’ll eventually be brain off with a podcast or anime on at some level that’s determined most efficient and it won’t be anywhere near challenging other wise your gold/hour would be effected.
split rampart
You realize if you got more rewards as you get higher you wouldn’t farm a 30… yo...
you are completly right - there would still be a most efficient dungeon and it won't be the highest one you can do but something in the middle where difficutly/ time is advantageous to you.
look at it from different angles.
-Variety: right now capstone dungeons are just too rewarding compared to regular dungeons. this change would move the rewards of regular and capstone dungeons closer to eachother and allow you to play a wider variety of dungeons instead of doing the same thing over and over again.
Learning: eternal 1 is pretty much what quickplay used to be. getting boosted is not fun. new mechanics are solved by veterans for you and learn nothing. increasing rewards with eternal tier would disentangle eternal 1 as everyone could play the difficulty they are most comfortable with.
Puhsing -> less farming: completing 30+ dungeons and only receiving 255 loot feels bad. dedicated farming would still yield you more gold/ materials but increasing the overall rewards as you go up in difficulty would reduce the need for farming.
I think those changes overall would result in a more organic way of playing the game.
spice plover
Farming is play time
The ultimate goal of any game is to keep people playing
Going back to farm up and try higher levels again is the classic tried and true gameplay loop for mmos.
But also, everyone that will ever play this game has the freedom of choice. If you want to push and push and use whatever you get from that you can.
There’s no one set way to play the game, even meta is just a suggestion
