Let us queue to highest tier available in group for eternal queue.

[tawdry mesa]

I tried the eternal queue for tiers 35+ and one common problem I experienced is that players just want to push their maximum tier, which is totally understandable.

Why lock the tier to the lowest rank in the group?

If the following players are in the group: 35,36,37,38

Just let us queue to eternal 38. This would completely eliminate the issue with players leaving because they want to push their tier. This will also remove some pointless grind, because there's no big difference in running eternal 35 or 38.

I've seen the issue is even worse at eternal 40+.

Players are usually bis or heavily geared at those levels, there's no reason to keep pushing tiers one by one. Just let people push the highest tier available for them, instead of forcing them to grind some tiers that they are going to beat anyway.

Some would say that this would encourage elo boost, but elo boost can already be done, but with extra steps. There's no point in punishing all the rest of the players.

[last otter]

Just punish leavers already. It Will drastically lower people leaving that are fishing for specific dungeons or groups. It wont fix the whole problem but i can bet money you’d notice a difference right away.

[tawdry mesa]

Why tho? I completely understand players who just want to push their eternal.

Some people don't want to run a dungeon with no expectations that the group will continue playing afterwards.

Some players don't even "need" more gold or materials, they just wanna push and test their skills.

In mid - high eternal players just want to push, what's even the point of forcing them to grind tiers one by one when top players are already at eternal 70+ or so?

For example there's no difference for me to do eternal 35 or eternal 50. If I don't have the skill needed I will fail and that's ok. But if I have it, what's the point of making me climb there instead of just letting me in? My gear will be the same at 35 or 50.

So if I get in the same team as someone who is at eternal 40, why can't the group just queue to that tier?

Maybe it can be implemented in a way that you can do that if the difference in ranks is not higher than 10 or 20, idk. But why lock the tier to the lowest in the group? That's just really bad design for a queue where players want to push their eternals.

[last otter]

Yes but you gotta always have in your head that you are in a que for a random dungeon with random people. You cant make up the mind for 3 other people and you cant destroy 3 other peoples que either so you just gotta suck it up when you dont get exactly what you want. Just like in real life. But for some reason people think its ok to be egoistic when playing games and that they can chose the outcome for 3 others all the time till they are satisfied.

[pale adder]

are you ok in the head? YOu want to punish the PLAYERS, that are using a garbage system that the devs made? There are players with higher keys unlocked, and they get forced into group with pisslows like you and you expect them to waste their time and play the dungeon?

Lets punish the people that bought the game, and not the devs that took 2 months to ship this horrible system into the game. Nice one

[last otter]

"Lets punish the people that bought the game" which is exactly what you're doing when you're hindering them from playing the game by leaving the que all the time its not their fault either... see how you can turn both arguments in the direction you want?

[pale adder]

But its not the player thats punishing you???? Youre getting punished by the devs that shipped the queue system like this?

[gloomy gazelle]

You are misplacing the blame at the players instead of the developers

[last otter]

is it really devs making you leave ques?

I never had that happend to me

[pale adder]

Yes?

If i have 52 unlocked

And i get placed in a 40

[tawdry mesa]

Or you can just let people queue to the highest tier available in the group. After all eternal is designed to be pushed, and players queue there to do exactly that.

[gloomy gazelle]

Saying that they should add punishment for leavers is not fixing the underlying issue

[last otter]

Yeah but now its not available so dont destroy the que for others in the meantime and just quit till you get what you want

[pale adder]

Why should i care about others, if im soloqueueing?

[wheat shoal]

Yes these “punish leavers” people don’t want the game to be fixed, they just want to get revenge for being inconvenienced.
They’re the problem in the game.

[pale adder]

Who are you to me?

Youre a person thats doing 15 keys less, and i have no confirmation that you will even be able to complete the key

[tawdry mesa]

I don't quit, I simply stopped playing because it became really hard to find groups in-game.

[pale adder]

So get off your victim mentality

[last otter]

A human being? isnt that enough? what kinda psycopath are you?

[pale adder]

My time > your time

[knotty island]

what a crazy take, imagine having to progress from 35 to 39 with inexperienced people just so they disband at 36/37 and you never are matched with ppl at the same dg level. Yea, nice way to make people leave the game.

[pale adder]

Is that not simple enough?

[gloomy gazelle]

Why are you asking other people to quit because it's an inconvenience to you, it's the same if they asked you to quit becasue you are an inconvenience to them? 😄

[last otter]

egoistic kids on the internet aint something new but you guys are taking it to new levels, didnt think people were this egoistic lol

[pale adder]

Youre projecting so hard hahahhaa, youre the one thats egoistic by wanting to get your way in punishing others for smething not in their fault

[gloomy gazelle]

are you actually this blind to the problem?

[pale adder]

Crazy

Why do you expect your time to be valued more than the person queueing solo?

After all, the person thats leaving, has a track record of being a better player than you anyway

[last otter]

yeah my time aint worth more then 3 others, i never belived that, but you guys seem to believe you are worth more then 3 other people

[pale adder]

Yes.

[knotty island]

eternal queue its suppose to be a competitive system buddy if you want to keep helping people for days its up to you, you can do that. But most just want to push queue up, they want a system that do that. Are you for real?

[pale adder]

Take it out on the devs buddy, they shipped this garbage

[last otter]

nah i aint that egoistic i just play with what I have, no need to ruin the game even more as a player

I respect people and value their time

[pale adder]

Lets put it this way, i have 55 unlocked, i have 1 hour to play after work today... I get matched with you in a 40

Am i supposed to do keys im 15+ above?

And not have fun?

Eternal is about pushing

For you : 40 = pushing
For me: 40 = waste of time at the moment

[gloomy gazelle]

you can't expect a person who wants to play 55 play out a 40 just because there's 3 people premades who want that, what do you mean?

and you also can't expect them to stop queuing for the next 10 minutes until you found a dps that wants 40

[last otter]

then get a premade group, when you que for a RANDOM dungeon you gon get a RANDOM dungeon

[gloomy gazelle]

I could say the same to you, get a premade last 4th person 🙂

[pale adder]

But the system should not put you in a random dungeon are you ill???? It should be atleast +- 2 levels

The ego on this guy

And he cant even see it

GET A PREMADE GROUp

[tawdry mesa]

It's not really terrible, but I think the devs mentality is not properly aligned with the community. For some reasons I feel like they want to make Fellowship some kind of game where you make friends along the way, but for most players this is just LoL but with dungeons (me included). I don't want the power of friendship, I want a competitive game.

[pale adder]

yeah ill just find 3 people on the same key in a low pop game

[pale adder]

Agreed completely, i dont wanna make friends, i already have them

[gloomy gazelle]

what are we even arguing about, the devs simply need to add the same system as there is in wow
Create a group(setup filters)
Find a group(filters)

[last otter]

hahaha but yeah no you rather keep dodging and maybe make even more people quit the game.. nah I get it that sounds so much better

[gloomy gazelle]

here come the "promote toxicity" people

[pale adder]

That would be ..... . tOoo tOxIccc±!!!!!

[tawdry mesa]

It's not as easy. The system they designed forces people to only play with players in their range... But there are 70+ tiers already. There's just too many tiers for such a low playerbase. Just let players queue to the highest tier available in group and everything is solved.

[pale adder]

They are afraid of the queue timers i think

[gloomy gazelle]

The curret queue times are longer if you count in leaving when you get matched in a completely wrong tier

actually not even longer, they're infinite

[pale adder]

Yeah

Best is to make a system like in wow legit

for eternal

[tawdry mesa]

Yesterday I waited half an hour for this reason until I quit the game

[gloomy gazelle]

yeah bro, it's useless, back to discord search

[pale adder]

just an LFG where you can create or find a group

[knotty island]

I don't think is garbage either, but they are not being completly honest. The reason why they sent only to 40+ is cause they don't really have a system for high keys. They know progressing from 50 to 53 can take days and they are hesitant to ship:
1 - A system that matches you to same key level, that can take multiple hours to find a tank/healer at the same key level, cause taking too much time can reflect even poorly for them.
2 - a LFG WoW style cause that system gets a lot of hate, since there's so much gate keeping related to meta.

This low pop/progress problem starts as early as 30/35 and they know it

[twin fern]

sounds about as effective as having a single system called "queue" and you get placed into anything ranging from quickplay to eternal. Just one mega pot so queue times are the "fastest." No choice at all.

[pale adder]

i dislike the argument for meta gate keeping,

If youre not a meta hero, create your own key

Its like that in wow, and in every game

Non meta always has a harder time climbing

[gloomy gazelle]

the LFG wow has its flaws but still better than whatever we have going on right now, for example when I was playing DH and it was the worst class instead of applying to keys I'd just make my own

[twin fern]

We need higher tier queues or we need a premade group finder. Using Discord as a substitute is just 1000x worse, and as you can see, people fish

[twin fern]

We have /had like 90% failure rate adept when WOW's design philosphy is anything queued has to have like a 95% success rate.

[tawdry mesa]

This is why I posted this suggestion. I noticed that at my tiers people are already geared, they are just pushing and nothing else. I don't see what's the point of forcing people to only queue the lowest tier in the group. There's no big difference in eternal 35 or 39, for example.

[wheat shoal]

“Punish leavers” mindset is very shortsighted and rooted in a vindictive mindset. These players are a plague on the game. They only want the game changed in a way that “punishes” players for doing something they think is wrong but can’t think deeper into why that thing is being done in the first place and have the inability to think of ways to fix that issue from occurring that isn’t adding extra layers of negative game design.
They ONLY want leavers to be punished to feel better about themselves. “Haha that leaver now has to wait for inconveniencing me.”
This is not a good thing either. These people should not be validated but instead the game system should be changed in a way we’re leaving isn’t even a thing anyone worries about, and if someone does leave, there’s a way to replace them with low inconvenience. This isn’t a PvP game and things can be implemented in a way where people can come and go if they want/need without wasting others time.

Being allowed to choose team mates and choose exactly what dungeon and difficult to play would DRASTICALLY lower leavers. This is already proven in game by when you find a group on discord and queue eternal and push for a while. Then there’s still someone that might leave but they should have that choice and freedom to leave without punishment if they want. No one should be forced to play a game for any reason just cuz some vindictive jerk thinks otherwise.

[knotty island]

now hear me up, IMAGINE if before you get matched with lower people, you get asked "Are you fine to join this group of 36 being a 39 since thats what is available? Now if you AGREED with that, I think would be fine to implement some kinda of punishment system

[twin fern]

So on punishing leavers bit cause WOW players make similar suggestion for m+, offered one where the poster claims they won't encounter leavers but they're unsatisfied because leavers don't get punished lol..

people obsessed with punishing leavers are just vindictive.

[wheat shoal]

They’re vindictive and authoritarian

Actual 0brain

[twin fern]

Any leaver penalty has to come as an opt in / opt out, if people want such rules to bind them, the game should allow that.

if four people all tick that box, put them in a group together. Now they can get banned or maybe 30 min lockout whatever.

people think it makes the game better, let them play with others that want to agree to those optional rules.

maybe community is split, maybe it's 90/10, maybe it's 10/90 in terms of queue preference whatever.

@wheat shoal what do you think of leaver penalties that are optional?

[wheat shoal]

It depends on the system

[twin fern]

I don't think it does. It just means four people can agree to these penalties if anyone of them leaves. (Of course, they're totally not going to leave.) It's always someone else.

[wheat shoal]

If they had a full matchmaker system where you can pick your team mates and dungeon and difficulty and affixes but then also had a fully auto matchmakers system like quickplay that just dumps you in a random queue

[twin fern]

I mean match people who want leaver penalties with others that do, and enforce them. (Those penalties can be anything as long as the player is aware of what they're agreeing to.)

[wheat shoal]

Then I could see there being a punishment system for the “matchmaker quickplay” autofill portion of the game where the “I pick who I play with and what dungeon to run” didn’t have anything like that.

But I still don’t think leaver penalties will fix anything

Literally won’t make a difference

[knotty island]

I'm all for LFG since I play tank and that would be easy for me. That said, in WoW you HAD something to offer, your KEY. Here is hard to believe anyone will join your key if you don't have something to offer, since everyone has every key and tanks/healers, the most desired roles, would probably just dominate creating their group and choosing the best DPS available always.

[twin fern]

it likely won't heh. Probably create a system that no one uses, just to prove that it is..... there.

cause if people can opt in or out of leaver penalties, how many of them would actually tick the box?

[gloomy gazelle]

most people don't want to bother creating groups and usually just apply for groups, so you provide them with a group that's almost ready to go and needs 1 more person, I don't think not having literal "keys" in your backpack means a difference

[wheat shoal]

I’ve explained before the progression of adding leave penalties will have on the game and it’ll continue to get worse.

1. People spam leave so add leaver penalties
2. Now people don’t leave but instead afk. Now afk gets penalties as well
3. Now people don’t leave or afk but instead THROW.m by pulling extra packs or intentionally playing bad. Now bad players get reported and banned
   Each one of those steps have real world situation that can occur where youre “innocent” but the game just bans you anyway.
   This isn’t a good thing.

Now if you fail a mechanic someone reports you for throwing and you get an automated ban etc

It’s terrible

[twin fern]

that's why leaver penalties have to be optional. And opted in at a matchmaker level.

[wheat shoal]

It’ll literally breed a more toxic game than if they just made leaving a non issue

[twin fern]

cause anyone who agrees there should be leaver penlaties, probably won't be leaving. Thus improving the game experience for them.

[wheat shoal]

Through good game design

The people that say they aren’t leavers only say that so they can take the moral high ground and feel better about themselves. Guarantee they’ll leave at some point and keep acting like they don’t.

[twin fern]

Aside from the competitive integrity issue, if people could opt out of League of legends leaver penalties, maybe half of the players would keep them. cause they think it makes it a better game.

Here idk,,, I think a high numver of players are fine with leaving whenever and a minority want other people to not leave.

[wheat shoal]

They should have a leaver fill system that rewards extra materials and marks of fellowship that you can opt into and if you do that, you join dungeons people left but if you leave them then you can’t opt into the system anymore

[twin fern]

that could be a solution if the goal was completion but this game is semi-competitive and turns that aspect into a joke.

[wheat shoal]

So people can still leave if/when they want and someone will autofill after that person left that is motivated to get the dungeon cleared for their extra loot

[twin fern]

then do you arbitrarily stop applying at some point? (cause that probably won't end well.)

and people failing or even planned carries to the highest is just.... wrong.

[wheat shoal]

Arbitrarily stop applying what

[twin fern]

the ability to fill.

[knotty island]

it's not a crazy concept, you should be first warned that:

You got queue with lower key people, you want to get paired with them or go back to search?

You have 10 sec to press yes or back to search and thats it. if you denied 35 now you have 36 only, then 37 so on... If you are 2 hours in the queue was your decision after all

This might help remove some friction, and yea you can even give some bonus for people accepting that.

[wheat shoal]

Idk. If 1 original player still exists in the group then the group can continue.
The fillers can get rewards just for joining and more for completion as well etc

[twin fern]

the issue is say eternal 60 whatever, four people clear to last boss, someone intentionally leaves. Now their friend gets a timed dungeon.

[wheat shoal]

The whole problem is not having a free and open matchmaker system.
That would cure 80% of the leave issue.

[twin fern]

motivates carries if there are no limits.

this game isn't strictly PVE, it also has a competitive aspect to it.

[wheat shoal]

If people gonna do that then let them.

Who cares

[twin fern]

yeaaaaaaaa no.

[wheat shoal]

The person who fills doesn’t get the timer but gets the loot and rewards

Cuz that’s what the system is for.

Filling an empty slot so the other players aren’t inconvenienced for bonus rewards

[twin fern]

If you remove the ability to get score, it's potentially okay. But this being a seasonal game, would make lower ranks so not fun.

[wheat shoal]

And that’s assuming there isn’t any limiters in eternal like “+10 over the level req” to fill

[twin fern]

the issue with autofill in lower end is that it makes the skill of the average player drop.

[wheat shoal]

The system wouldn’t be for pushing rating at all.
It would be for filling empty slots so players don’t feel bad if someone leaves and gaining those bonus marks/mats so you don’t have to farm quickplay

2 birds 1 stone.

[twin fern]

right it solves the rating issue. But creates another issue.

the issue of matchmade groups being worse on average.

people progress faster and into content which might be their skill ceiling

cause all those players repeatedly suffering leavers (in which they are the problem.) Are now progressing faster, and becoming more of a burden.