#Thoughts about Bel'Veth 64.8% ban rate at all ranks

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

dawn elm
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If she didn’t have that damage reduction she would be a lot easier to kill. Also it’s only 1.5 seconds the cooldown is pretty long until she puts lvls in.

But honestly anyone that has a clear common idea of what bel is going to do I’m a game should have no issue dealing with her.

dawn elm
# wanton fog So it’s just wierd why she has that

It’s so when she gains the void remora from baron or elder and side lanes from jungle cause she’s one of the few junglers who do that. Voidlings that kill cannons or herself kills cannon/siege minions she can scale while side laning

uneven dust
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Justified

snow cloak
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she's a scarier yi but with a more brainless damage reduction ability

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they gave yi mobility and gave him a better w on top of whatever the fuck her ult is

spice ibex
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She’s fucking fun that’s what’s she is

winged verge
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You're kidding right?

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Solo queue ranked can be a bit rough depending on the players you receive on your team

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A lot of wild animals, some crazy indeed.

spice ibex
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Not everyone has played her let alone know what she does and even less know how to counter her even if it isn’t all too hard to do

glacial crater
obsidian stirrup
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People overreact to this champ she is not that strong. Her winrate is mostly just her pushes after herald or baron. If you win fights over those objectives she is a more controllable yi

gray swan
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Bel'veth encourages a playstyle a lot of players don't like dealing with. her snowball with her little void fish is also insanely obnoxious because they also get the baron buff. it'd be the first thing i think should be removed from her kit that.

spice ibex
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void cummies

uneven dust
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Wait how do you activate her fishies

ember rampart
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Harder to freeze, less punishing to dive, matchups are better than top

spice ibex
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canon minions become bigger void critters of course

winged verge
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The problem I only have with Bel'veth is her massive 70% dmg reduction E. Maybe tune it down? Or change it?

steady sandal
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and winrate somewhat went higher

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I'm guessing because her early game is way stronger now, and the AA range...

wintry hinge
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she op

ember rampart
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Her solo lane got buffed

lost wolf
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This is just history repeating itself over and over again

uneven dust
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i have a problem with just the concept. Like infinite attack speed is cool and all but when u give her natural true damage and multiple abilities to engage and disengage u just have a monster.

ember rampart
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Riot tried other forms of damage

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But without the true damage

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Belveth just wouldn't do dmg

dawn elm
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i hope you realise the ability only lasts for 1.5 seconds and can be canceled cause its a channel.

dawn elm
forest moss
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belveths dmg reduction cant be cancelled, the dmg can, but not the reduction

ember rampart
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Or Garen mid?

dawn elm
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yes

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and yes

ember rampart
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Kog mid?

dawn elm
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yes

ember rampart
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But they have about the same number of games as belveth top

dawn elm
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is a Bel good into any champion early no?

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does bel counter anyone no

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so wtf would i play her solo lane

ember rampart
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Should an early game champ counter someone in lane?

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Does that mean Kayle is not a good solo laner?

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Because she doesn't "counter" someone in lane

dawn elm
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yes she does

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she counters all in's and burst champions

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and her scaling isnt based off of things shes killed

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If bel has a hard time farming in solo lane her scaling is going to be heavily delayed.

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which is the case cause shes is easily bullied

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People cry Bel Op when they see see a montage of her getting kills when shes stupid fed already

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she has one of the worst early games out of all the champions in the game

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and if she is too far behind shes completly useless or the game is unplayable for her cause she cant contest rift or baron

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Also 65% ban rate all ranks. This champion is ffing horrible in ranks when people actually use their heads. Cause any player with actual knowledge of how Bel functions early game will just invade her take her camps and potentially kill her setting her far behind

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she is not 65% ban rate in higher ranks above plat, and if that is the case then those players are ffing dog shit

ember rampart
ember rampart
ember rampart
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Her laning is solid
Because of W range, E lifesteal, and Q waveclear

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On top of that her jungle clear is too good so she can accelerate herself even more quickly

ember rampart
ember rampart
ember rampart
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Looking at your opgg, have you even played Belveth in the solo lane?

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Or played against it?

dawn elm
ember rampart
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How can you act like you know what Kayle and Belveth solo lane is like

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when you don't even have a single game on them?

ember rampart
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Because if you actually play Kayle

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You would realize that if you are forced to ult in lane

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that only means that their ult cd will be up faster

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so that they can repeat dive you

dawn elm
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If nemesis is saying that the champion he brought back into the mid lane. Isn’t a anti burst champion then wtf was he playing it for so long.

Force ult how often can assasins force ults unless they are all inning them?

Kayle isn’t really bullied in the mid lane cause champions their are hated by cooldowns. Meanwhile top lane that really isn’t the case.

As long as the Kayle isn’t brain dead she can hit 6 the same time as her lane opponent then she is not longer bullied and she becomes the bully.

Dude bel doesn’t gain 100% gold efficiency for any component she builds cause of her dmg and on hit restrictions. Kayle this isn’t the case. If you think bel scales harder and faster then Kayle your ffing delusional.

Bel requires the completion of items in order to actually function with them, if she just has the components then she’s losing gold value.

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As for her stacks

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She’s required to kill stuff, if bel can’t make a lead she has no way of coming back.

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Meanwhile Kayle even if she becomes behind, it if she’s allowed to farm lanes she will eventually come back and her utility for her team assures she is never useless

dawn elm
dawn elm
dawn elm
ember rampart
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I'm not going to argue with you since I already made my point

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You don't play Kayle

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You never played Belveth solo lane

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You think you know better than Nemesis

dawn elm
ember rampart
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I'm not going to waste my time

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with your low effort arguments

dawn elm
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You clearly didn’t as well

ember rampart
dawn elm
ember rampart
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Go check it yourself

ember rampart
dawn elm
ember rampart
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How many months ago

ember rampart
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Come back when you decide to make an effort with your arguments

dawn elm
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I love how you show me this and still nearly nobody is playing her solo lane

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It’s 95% in the jungle

ember rampart
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Some less

dawn elm
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Yeah and how much are you willing to bet it’s people trying there off meta Korean pick

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I am more convinced when I’m seeing this that players are too lazy to learn how to play against her, and are blindly picking random shit that she scales better into.

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If people were actually using their heads they would realize her counters already.

Literally play rammus amumu into this champion and she’s unplayable

ember rampart
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Again with your low effort factless opinion based argument

dawn elm
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Stfu

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If you pick rammus into this champion you will never lose a 1v1 against her unless you have no idea how to use your W.

As for amumu he will always out duels her

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Champions that can out duels her through sustaining all her dmg/cooldowns beat her, those that can sustain the dmg and chase down, and those that can insta burst her and disable the E at the same time. If the E is Canceled or on CD when you all in her she’s going to die no questions about that

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Another way of beating her is through invading and stealing all her camps or killing her. But killing her isn’t necessary cause taking her stacks and gold away is more punishing.

Her lvl 1-3 is one of the worst in the entire game.

Her 3:15 clear is not consistent and she cannot contest scuttle cause she always full clears. Her Q is a liability in the early game because she’s using it on camps and if the arrow is down when she happens to get in a 1v1 she is almost certainly going to die.

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If she can’t take rift herald or baron she’s even more behind because those objectives are crucial for her ending games and snow balling into oblivion

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Her team needs to play around focusing those objectives but if they can’t she’s becomes more and more useless

ember rampart
ember rampart
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in plat+

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I love how you fail to prove your previous points and jump onto the next thing that comes into your mind

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to only get proven wrong again

dawn elm
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Failing to prove to prove my points? By describing the champions that almost never lose a 1v1 to her. Rammus: bel literally kills herself fast then any other champion will.

Amumu: will just tank all the dmg

ember rampart
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Yep Belveth is not a champion anymore because 2 champs counter her

dawn elm
ember rampart
dawn elm
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If this is belveth I extremely doubt this is actually the case

ember rampart
dawn elm
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Why do people complain about belveth? Cause they don’t bother learning how to play against her

ember rampart
dawn elm
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And their to lazy about it

ember rampart
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Yep low effort argument

dawn elm
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Ok go look at my most game in rammus and you will see exactly what happens in that match up

ember rampart
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Nemesis? Isn't he that Hardstuck challenger Kayle main?

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Yeah I know more about Kayle then him

dawn elm
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You no more about Kayle then him?

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Please prove it

ember rampart
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👀

ember rampart
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aight

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im out now

dawn elm
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Send your ign

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Low effort lmfao. Claims he knows more about Kayle then ffing nemesis. The guy who literally brought her back into the mid lane

ember rampart
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If nemesis is saying that the champion he brought back into the mid lane. Isn’t a anti burst champion then wtf was he playing it for so long.

dawn elm
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Because she is a anti burst champion. Idk why he’s saying it isn’t when that’s literally the case.

There’s 2 reasons why you play Kayle mid.

1: Into assasins she can survive the all ins if played correctly.

2: she scales faster off of waves cause mid lane scales the fastest

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In lane into melee assasins Kayle isn’t really threatened by assasins as long she isn’t taking hits for free.

But if she does take a few hits her W can sustain her a bit.

Kayle can consistently poke with her E off cooldown and can farm with it she she feels threatened. Yeah it’s a high cooldown early but it gets the job done

ember rampart
dawn elm
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Are you Mr. Low effort cause it’s seems to be your response to everything that comes your way.

Low effort this, low effort that. Is everything low effort as you deny ffing everything when I’m explanations in paragraphs?

dawn elm
ember rampart
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If you were to guess

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Since you think you know better than Nemesis

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Surely you would have atleast a fraction of the games Nemesis has on kayle

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Right?

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For reference Nemesis has played 267 ranked Kayle games on the past two Korean accounts

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Please tell me how many games of Kayle you have played?

amber iron
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playing belveth for the first time
goes 0-3
kills herald
kills mid
gets tower mid
enemy ffs at 20

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riot gj

nocturne lark
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bel needs a base stat nerf

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I see no reason for her to start with 0.85 attack speed even if she doesnt get any per level

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it makes attack speed items on her super efficient

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she also spawns too many minions, that should also get hit

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also making her E a proper channel would be for the best, the fact she doesnt lose the damage reduction even if you cc her is kinda dumb and takes away skill expression

wanton fog
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It’s also kinda stupid how big her hit box is on her w, it literally has a bigger width and length of syndras stun by like 60 while also have a shorter cast time as well

nocturne lark
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yea, its similar to red kayn w in terms of hitbox, but a little faster

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she is supposed to be a squishy hypercarry similar to viego, yasuo & other melee crit users

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but they gave her a little too much

wanton fog
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Also has a mini aoe garen ult that can reset upon kill

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And 100-250 bonus ho plus 165% ad cuz y not

nocturne lark
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ive found that is honestly the best time to burst bel

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since she locks herself into animation for 2 seconds

wanton fog
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But she has so much tankiness in her kit

nocturne lark
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she just has bonus health, doing her ult gives her none of her tankiness

wanton fog
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Has way higher stats than the avg squishy hyper carry

nocturne lark
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also, she doesnt build too much AD

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so the bonus ad ends up being ~200 extra health

wanton fog
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And 70% total dmg reduc at lvl 1

nocturne lark
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so around 400 health from her ult

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the 70% is strong, but how would you nerf it?

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make its scale?

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she will just max it first

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and stay in jg

wanton fog
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Yup 400 hp, higher base tankiness stats than other squishy hyper carry, and 70% total dmg reduc

nocturne lark
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the 70% is what makes her leave the jg

wanton fog
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25-50% atk speed modifier

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In top of infinite atk speed scaling

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And her ult gives her 20% TOTAL ATK SPEED

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not addictively

nocturne lark
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her passive is total attack speed as well

wanton fog
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Yup

nocturne lark
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each stack is 0.28-1% total attack speed

wanton fog
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That mechanic was removed on other champs like aatrox and yi

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For being way too strong

nocturne lark
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on average I get about 140 stacks in a 35 min game, about 70 in a 20min game

wanton fog
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I saw a belveth with only one atk speed item

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And was her only time

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Item*

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Have 1.8 atk

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Ratio

nocturne lark
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yea, bel only needs 1 attack speed item & then she builds bruiser

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sorta like how yas only needs 2 crit items then builds bruiser

wanton fog
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This champion gets way too many free stacks it’s insane

nocturne lark
wanton fog
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Way too stat checky and feels so bad to play against

nocturne lark
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yas gets 2x crit chance, trynd gets 60% crit chance for free

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its just what riot does to make melee hypercarries fun

wanton fog
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Bel veth I feel gets disproportionately more

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Which means you Biff one stat on her

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Buff*

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And it could have a dominos affect

nocturne lark
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before her "nerfs" I struggled a lot more to get to that point

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since stuff like voli & kayn could actually put me behind by constant invades

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rn they cant, cuase I can just get stacks from cannons and get to that point

wanton fog
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Yea I thought that was why she was good in low elo, but worse in high elo

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Because you could get punished

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But now, we look at the strats in high elo

nocturne lark
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the stacks from cannons is what made her hyper consistent

wanton fog
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53%

nocturne lark
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and her stacks scaling faster meaning she hits her lvl 15 spike at lvl 13 now

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and getting more from them each level till then

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makes her dueling power stronger

wanton fog
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Yea, her passive more than makes up for her no atk speed per level

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And in some cases can actually outpace them

nocturne lark
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honestly, I feel like the nerfs to her should be to her base stats, a hit on her bonus health from ult & a hit to her minions. That should put her in a balanced state

wanton fog
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They should make her dmg red like irelia in a way

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More scaling or split to take more magic or physical damage

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Just not flat 70 damage reduction lvl 1

nocturne lark
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I dunno. I feel like she needs that to function

wanton fog
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Master yi is similar, but has more counterplay

nocturne lark
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without it she is forced to run from every fight, and thats not fun for either party

wanton fog
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His w is interruptible

nocturne lark
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so his W isnt his only tool

wanton fog
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Yea but the thing is that he gets xx

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Cc*

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And dies

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As is the weakness to squishy hypercarries

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What are you supposed to do

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Against belveth

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When her dmg red is that high without any way to stop it

nocturne lark
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wait it out? it lasts 1.5 seconds and she has no defensive tools after that

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she also has to choose whether to use it for red or for damage

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since its her highest dps tool

wanton fog
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She has dashes…

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That scale off atk speed

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She has a massive w

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Hit box

nocturne lark
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also back to irelia red, that cant be canceled at all, which is why it has a split

wanton fog
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That knock ups up in the entire hit box

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Yea and it also scales as well

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And even then the damage is split

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Between ad and magic

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And doesn’t account for true damage

nocturne lark
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because her red has relatively little of her power budget

wanton fog
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While belveth is literally ALL Dmage

nocturne lark
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bel veth has a lot more into her E

wanton fog
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That ability is too strong when you consider so much of what else she has in her kit

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And her class

nocturne lark
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I think thats why you should nerf the rest of her kit

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ok, her class is skirmisher and those are all busted

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please just nerf all skirmishers already

wanton fog
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Lol try ur

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True*

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I agree 100%

nocturne lark
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like jesus I quit top lane, because skirmishers took over

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im tired of fiora/irelia/riven/camille/yone

wanton fog
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Wdym took over

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They have always been

nocturne lark
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nah, during stridbreaker meta it was juggernauts

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but they cant have nice things

wanton fog
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Riven with the 6 season 52-54%

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Well tbf with strikebreaker

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Every class got a dash item

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And stride got a mini dash

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Also divine sunderer was a nice time 👍

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Item*

nocturne lark
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divine making skirmisher stronger then ever I hate jax

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now its trinity

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but same thing

wanton fog
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Very fair

nocturne lark
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I think keeping her E the same, but nerfing her early game & removing health from ult would make her E fine

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rn its a problem since it just lets her auto win a fight since she can out trade without it

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its a win more

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but if you emphasize needing to use its damage to win a trade, then it would be fine. since she wouldnt use it defensively

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or if she used it defensively then she needs to disengage

wanton fog
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Well if the compensate enough numbers to keep e at 70%, I could agree with that

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Rn she just functions as a stat check champion to heavily

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She w you with her really hard to dodge hit box

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And dashes in

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With damage from too many sources

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And has so much tankiness and dashes and atk speed

nocturne lark
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cause rn it applies at 1-1

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her E on the other hand applies at 6%-24$ depending on missing health

wanton fog
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Plus 100-250

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Wait nvm that ult

nocturne lark
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I really dont wanna touch her ult damage, it should be satisfying when landing that

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because its hard to land

wanton fog
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Yea but like that ult damage is aoe

nocturne lark
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the slow only becomes relevant near the end of the channel

wanton fog
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On reset

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That’s potentially 1500 true damage plus

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If there are tanks or what not

nocturne lark
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she needs to be in melee range in order to cast the ult in the first place

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you can literally walk out of the range if you arent in the center

wanton fog
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I mean

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Cc

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And dashes

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And teamfights

nocturne lark
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that applies both way, you can cc her before she gets there

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like honestly, most of the time its literally better to ignore the ult and just auto cause it does more damage

wanton fog
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The reward is too high for what’s she risking

nocturne lark
wanton fog
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With the current amount of tankiness and what not

nocturne lark
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its her most vulnerable point unlike viego who is strongest during his resets

nocturne lark
wanton fog
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100-250 true damage aoe plus 25% missing

nocturne lark
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maybe nerf the missing a little bit

wanton fog
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Just for reference

nocturne lark
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but should stay mostly the same

wanton fog
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Garen is 250-450 from 25% to 35%

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With similar melee range

nocturne lark
wanton fog
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Well belveth hit everyone in her range with her ult

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And that’s not the only thing in belveth ult

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She gets bonus hp, healing, atk speed

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Reset

nocturne lark
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on the other hand, she has no control over when she can use the ult

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and is quite squishy without it

wanton fog
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Well she is a hyper carry

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That should be a weakness

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That she shouldn’t be able to bypass

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When other squishy melee hypercarris have

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Plus she has other tools

nocturne lark
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but unlike other hyper carries, her steroid doesnt increase the power of her strengths

wanton fog
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Hard cc plus dmg red

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So it’s not as if she has nothing

nocturne lark
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yi with ult can 1v5, yone with ult can 1v5, vayne with ult can 1v5

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bel with ult just becomes tankier & gets some more utility in the attack range

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the attack speed is nice tho, but it becomes irrelevant later

wanton fog
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Um I mean 20 percent total atk speed is substantial

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On a scaling atk speed champ

nocturne lark
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its strong early and becomes less useful later. I would rather it be removed completely to keep the other parts of her ult in tact

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but alas 200years champ needs it

wanton fog
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Yea, if they remove some of the stats she gets and fine tunes what she does haves

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She would be a lot more playable to fight against

nocturne lark
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like rn she is just overtuned because of the recent "nerf"

wanton fog
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Lol

nocturne lark
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which I called from day 1 was a buff

wanton fog
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Higher so rate

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Winrate btw

nocturne lark
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yup, attack range into base kit made her clear much easier

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E damage didnt do much to hurt that

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and stacks on cannons made her consistent

wanton fog
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Great balance team

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The face that she scaling champion in the jg is what makes it worse

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Because it’s harder to impede her scaling than say veigar or nasus

nocturne lark
wanton fog
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Infinite scalers

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What I meant to say

nocturne lark
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thats fair

wanton fog
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At least with kindred you have options to impede her stacks

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And shyvana with drakes

nocturne lark
wanton fog
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Oh, oops

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Scratch her then

nocturne lark
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like you arent getting more then 1 elder per game

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if you already have soul

wanton fog
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Yea

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Pretty much ends the game after you get the buff

nocturne lark
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I think her concept is fine if they make her early game weak enough

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she should be blindpickable

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basically

wanton fog
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Yea

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Maybe they give her more atk speed per stack, but put a cap on her scaling

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Just some kind of change

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Just spitballing some ideas

nocturne lark
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I mean, what would you cap it?

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unless you build like full attack speed you dont get over 4.0 normally

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if you cap it anything below 10 she will just go lethal

wanton fog
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Well cap the amount of atk speed scaling she gets

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It wouldn’t let her get out of control later, with no way to stop her

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Cuz this champion

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Is the literal definition of a solo q champ

nocturne lark
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yea, from my experience on her so far

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the hardest matchups are one where I have to engage .-.

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like its not even dependent on the enemy team, just my team

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cause her late game is strong enough to 1v1 almost anything

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I just need to not get cc'd

wanton fog
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She can split push hard too

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With her minions

nocturne lark
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nerfing her minions is 100% needed

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its so dumb

wanton fog
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That get baron buff

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For some reason 😂

nocturne lark
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I neded a game at 13 min yesterday

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cause my top lane fiora stomped

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and I get her herald

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and pushed to nexus

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without anyone answering

wanton fog
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Lmao the thing with those stupid ass minions

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Is that THEY DONT DIE IN ONE HIT

nocturne lark
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^SO TRUE

wanton fog
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they die in two

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WTF

nocturne lark
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they also do quite a lot of damage

wanton fog
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even turret shot needs two

nocturne lark
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for minions

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the only thing about them is that they take full damage from aoe

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so waveclear champs can handle a swarm of them

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but if you dont have like sivir or stuff you just get overwhelmed

wanton fog
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Yikes

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I don’t understand the minions

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Like

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If you removed the minions from her kit

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It wouldn’t change anything about what she would still do

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I feel it was such a random thing to add to her

nocturne lark
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it was added for lore reasons but it is a bit much

wanton fog
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Yea she’s a jg tho

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Not a laner

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So it’s just wierd why she has that

ember rampart
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to be a splitpusher

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instead of a teamfighter

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so the minions help give her identity more clarity

snow cloak
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she counters hard burst with her r

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and she is innately a tank buster so tanks are her favorite

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kayle also spikes at 11

obsidian stirrup
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knee-jerk bans to be sure, she's not very special

snow cloak
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her 16 spike isn't really as big as her 11

obsidian stirrup
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she either hits a mid-game stride and wins via a herald or she gets lucky and gets a good baron push for end late game. at all other points she's pretty bad

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people wasting bans on her

winged verge
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Don’t want to have faith in my teammates ‘

obsidian stirrup
winged verge
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Just walk away kekW

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Yeah tell that to my teammates

obsidian stirrup
#

if your team can't handle that, there are higher priority bans

ember rampart
snow cloak
#

@ember rampartyou do realize her r stops all dmg for a time

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you can literally stop al lof zeds r dmg

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it's an easy matchup for kayle

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she wins very hard post 6

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if zed ever uses w kayle can jsut walk him down

ember rampart
snow cloak
#

dude just said kayle gets outscaled by zed

ember rampart
#

statted

snow cloak
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in what ways lmao

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kayle will statcheck him post 11

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and at 6 it's skill matchup kayle favored

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can go ask kayle and zed otps about the matchup and not a pro player who doesn't have too much experience on them lmao

ember rampart
snow cloak
#

so he'd realize kayles counters are mostly champs who outrange her

ember rampart
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He realizes that

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He also realizes that Zed matchup isn't a free lane

snow cloak
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depends the player into assassin lanes is something i should add

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zed wins then

ember rampart
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If Zed player is bad

snow cloak
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if both players are bad

ember rampart
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then kayle wins

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But if Zed player is good

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It's Zed favoured

snow cloak
#

at 6 is the only time that will matter

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at lvl 11 kayle will have already outscaled him greatly

ember rampart
#

depends on items

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and how far behind you are in lane

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level 11 by itself doesn't mean much

snow cloak
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if u struggle with the matchup and go for zhonya's then you should never lose

ember rampart
#

You build Zhon

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post level 11

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Nashor and Riftmaker too important

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Also

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You really don't need Zhon on kayles

snow cloak
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that's why u only build it if u struggle with burst matchups

ember rampart
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You shouldn't be struggling

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If you are dying in lane

snow cloak
#

im building my base on mc rn and i got floating vines lmao

ember rampart
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you shouldn't play Kayle

ember rampart
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I promise I won't troll ahriHeart

snow cloak
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it's a private server w irl friends

ember rampart
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</3

snow cloak
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some mf griefed spawn w a wither already

ember rampart
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I wish my friends played mc...

snow cloak
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i'd rrather my terraria but all my friends hate it

ember rampart
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Your friends based dogeKek

snow cloak
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i have like 2k hours in terraria

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never got to finish half of my playthroughs with friends bc we'd quit our calamity past p1 yharon or pre supreme

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im trynna do a master mode modded playthrough bc 1.4 just got put on tmod

ember rampart
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idk I just want to build giant stuff

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Building giant stuff is too fun

snow cloak
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that's the only thing im doing on mc lmao

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i have a 50x50x60 base atm and expanding

ember rampart
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stoppp you are making me jealous

snow cloak
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technically it's 49 and a circle base but imma expand the basement more

ember rampart
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This was my build on my past server

snow cloak
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only thing is i don't have too much space bc my brother decided to build dr doof's base as his main like 4 chunks away

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dude thats sick

ember rampart
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Then the server owner decided to delete the server so he could play with his girlfriend

ember rampart
snow cloak
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gotta relaunch the game to show my base rq

ember rampart
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The things to the left side of screen was stuff I made

snow cloak
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the house looks dope

ember rampart
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and this was a ss of someone from the server asking who built it

snow cloak
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how do i take ss on mc

ember rampart
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F11

snow cloak
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winkey shift s brings up my inv from when i tabbed in

ember rampart
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Or was it F2

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F4?

snow cloak
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i think it's f2 but idk how to post them

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ill do it in a bit

ember rampart
#

Send it to me if you don't know how

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And I'll post