Jungle is the easiest role in the game

[sharp sentinel]

they made a support champion where you can just afk sit on someone and win

[gray birch]

Agree to disagree as a sup main that mained jungle before that

Jungle is the hardest role to master, followed by support. The other 3 share 3rd place imho

Or at least idk enough about the other 3 roles to rank them amongst themselves.

[gray birch]

As a Yuumi main, no. If you just afk you wont end up with a decent WR. Her WR would be much higher on avg if ppl didnt do that😂🫢 so thx to the afk Yuumi mains, ur the reason she isnt getting nerfed

[sharp sentinel]

but you get the idea, i do not believe jungle is easier than support

[gray birch]

Ye it isnt. Its a low elo take

[sharp sentinel]

nah not even low elo would say smt like this, idk what this is

[gray birch]

The most braindead jngler would probably be ivern, and even playing him well needs at least some hands

[summer crow]

no... mostly

hardest... but most impact

just because has most impact doesnt make it the easiest
most amount of decisions for a player to have to make while playing jungle, therefore hardest role overall... especially to master and especially to start off on

only think low on the poll is you dont need as high mechanics and last hitting... but that is not enought to be even "easy" for a role

[left agate]

did you use chatgpt to type the inicial text

[summer crow]

lol I just saw how that makes sense

ill say tho

it says something when the best or one of the best sup mains T1 Keria doesnt really play much sup in soloQ... that says something about the role lmao

i swear he must queue either fill, jung/sup, or top/sup

yeah, but i already stated that mechanics are less prio for junglers, and not for nid/lee... but like i said a thresh has way less desicions to make then any jungler which makes the ROLE... not specifically the champ harder

nah lee has more decisions then a thresh in a fight... thresh is hook and then either go in or cc from afar... and the decision of lamps for aggro vs saving/ also covering on ad... lee has 1v1ing, assassination, cc champs into team (which is way more mechanical then thresh), also covering his own carries etc... just the fact that lee needs to do everything a thresh has to do + carry is enough of an explanation... thresh ccs and protects... lee does dmg output, cc's, protects, 1v1s, uses stuff like ward hopping for positioning etc...

im not saying its not im saying jungle simply has more decisions to choose from at any single point in time

[summer crow]

this minus cc works for nidalee.. with cc works for elise as well

im not saying sup is ez just not as hard as jung... def #2 with mid being prob 3rd... just that mid is the most mechanical role with top being very close

and most sups are not near as hard as thresh

and there are at least 3 jungs at above or close to thresh based on ur idea... no other sup is near thresh tbh... mayb bard or pyke in some thought processes but not really

[gray birch]

Bard is the only sup that maybe comes close to decision making of junglers

Simply bc if u play Bard like another sup ur not really playing him

I like to bring up the example of Keria bullying thr shit out of enemy jngler at lv1😂 peak Bard gameplay

Man skills E lv1 just to be annoying

[frank dust]

i mean, no not really? nid has an argument for being the hardest champion in the entire game

jg is easier than people think but its kinda objectively not true that its easier than supp,

[hard niche]

Try clearing camps with only Q and check your time when you're done

Jungle is not the "easiest role" you probably played against a jungler who did nothing but fuck off and let you scale for free

Takes good macro to be an efficient jg

[sharp sentinel]

[hard niche]

W rage bait

[hard niche]

Mid #3

Mid is the easiest lane

Bro put

Mid over jg

Post op.gg

[sharp sentinel]

i'd say adc 3rd, with top being 2nd

[hard niche]

Why do i have to, im checking the validity of your statement through your recent jungle matches

[sharp sentinel]

jg 1st, the mid 4th and sup last

cool

[hard niche]

Fair enough

Its probably just the better role for u then but objectively it is the hardest role as it requires a lot more macro and if u fall behind its ggs

I do better as adc but i play jungle anyway cuz its fun to me and im still decent at it

[hard niche]

Id switch them

Adc is kinda in the gutter rn top is hard mostly cuz of management and matchups but a bad adc is rough

A lot more micro too

[west kraken]

T1 made chally in all 5 roles and in his opinion, support was the easiest role to of them all, he considered top the worst (legit if the enemy jg and top collectively decide they don't want you to get to play the game, you don't get to play the game).

[sinful crane]

nice rage bait .. as someone who mains jungle and has support as fill position, playing support is brain dead in comparison.. poke lane, don’t die, follow adc ..

[stable grove]

So many people got baited damn

[summer crow]

if ur saying adc is hardest im dieing

[south mortar]

yes jungle is the easiest role in the game. But this is at the highest of highest levels, this does not mean an average support player in gold will be a better player than a jungler.

But the ceiling of support is way higher than the ceiling of jungling

[frank dust]

what? that isnt true either. support and jungle at the pro level both serve as team facilitators, not as carry roles by themselves. theyre both stuck on engage tanks and low income high impact champions. no matter your opinion on the roles difficulties, to say that support is 'way higher' in difficulty compared to jungling at the highest of levels is completely ridiculous. they play similarly at the pro level. there are so many transfers to the support role from other roles. the amount of adc players who role swap to support is significant; nobody role swaps to jungle.

even beyond that, from an objective metric, support as a role is universally considered to be the easy because from an objective standpoint it is. everything that support does, every other roles does on top of their own responsibilites.

protecting teammates: every frontliner does that. top and jungle are both responsible for this
sustaining the team: what does this mean? this isnt a role specific thing, this is a champ thing. ivern 'sustains the team' so does lulu top. this is more common in support but shielding and healing exist in other roles
providing vision: on top of the fact that this isnt a paticularly difficult mechanic, so does every other role. adc does it the least through blue trinket, but every other role is taking sweeper to help contest vision. its not a role specific thing, its a teamwide effort.

like these arent support specific things, every other role does this. what does support do that other roles dont? meanwhile, the core mechanic of the game, which is farming, is completely absent from the support role. jungle at least has to farm camps or they auto lose the game. support runs around the map with no regard to anything but if their adc can solo farm under the tower or not. thats a simplification yeah, but theres just nothing to the idea that support is one of the harder roles.

beyond this, just look at someone like t1 who has challenger experience in every role. while everyone finds roles different in difficulty, hes said multiple times that it isnt even close; support is the easiest role.

im not saying jungle is 'hard' but its no where close compared to support.

difficulty: adc > top > jg > mid >>> support
impact: jg > support > mid > adc > top

[south mortar]

whatever jungle has to do, support has to do even more, the difficulty level is: mid > top > adc > supp > jg

[frank dust]

people say 'its easiest to climb on jg'

yeah thats true. because if youre good at the game you will climb on jg no matter what. people mistake climbing easily for the role being easy, but in reality that just means that youre able to leverage your game knowledge and skill better.

[south mortar]

mid is by far the most competitive role

[frank dust]

? jg is responsible for ganking more and farms, something support doesnt even do.

what does support do more than jg? ward? thats not a support specific thing something people bring up as if that isnt an entirely team effort.

[south mortar]

supp has do everything that a jg is doing, with on top of laning, so they have to lane as well

jg is not constantly against an opponent and has the advantage of fog of war

[frank dust]

it isnt. its the most popular role, but its no where near the most difficult. from a laning standpoint, mid has the easiest laning phase by far.

[south mortar]

i mean, im not stating an opinion, its just how it is

[frank dust]

in low elo sure. higher elo everyone knows where the jg is, thats not a real thing.

[south mortar]

im a jungler, so i would have wanted to rate jungle higher, but unfortunately the game doesnt really care about my opinion

[frank dust]

post opgg

[south mortar]

https://www.op.gg/summoners/euw/klnG DeMoN-EUW?queue_type=SOLORANKED

[frank dust]

yi main, makes sense. i would think role is easy too if i just played malphite top all the time as well.

[south mortar]

you are not really very smart if you have to link what someone is saying to who they are, thats not really objectivity

just because someone is challenger, wouldnt mean that everything they say has to be correct

[frank dust]

no, but what you play informs your perspective on the game. its nothing against you or the champ you play, but you dont interact with a good portion of the game. thats not to say youre bad, but only that you play the role differently than most of the rest of the players.

[south mortar]

i can be the same elo with any champ, my preference is yi cuz he's fun, but the thing i know are the fundamentals of jungling

[frank dust]

a tank top or an enchanter support has a completely different perspective on the difficulty of their roles than a normal player just because how they play it.

[south mortar]

if u know fundamentals u can play whatever u want and be the same elo

the game is not dependent on what champ you are playing but instead on the decisions you make

[frank dust]

on a macro sense sure. but the correct macro plays are informed by the champ youre playing. youre telling me malz mains have the same difficulty with mid talon mains have?

malz completely nullifies the laning phase. they dont have to lane the same way other champs do, youre telling me malz mains are as good at laning as other players in their role?

[south mortar]

there are some differences, but the correct macro plays are not really dependent on the champ, how you execute the play is dependent on your champ

[south mortar]

from where are u getting this? i never said this

[frank dust]

that makes literally no sense. comps inform the correct macro plays because not all comps can do the same thing. if the correct macro plays arent dependent on the champ, all pro teams would do the same plays no matter their comp, but that doesnt make any sense and isnt true.

split comps have to play the game completely different from front to back teamfighting comps, thats a completely ridiculous idea

[south mortar]

team play is not the same as solo q, lets stick to solo q, the same concepts apply there but since you have coordination, communication becomes a fundamental in team game

[frank dust]

so a team with yorick has the same macro plays as the team with malphite?

[frank dust]

no offense, but this is the most ridiculous thing ive seen someone say in a long time.

[south mortar]

and thats fine, a challenger player would not think the same way as a gold or plat or em

if they did, they would be low elo as well

[frank dust]

what? no challenger player is ever going to say that yorick macro is the same as malphite macro. macro is knowing what to do, when and where to do it.

[south mortar]

i think you misunderstood what i said

[frank dust]

and that is dependent on what champ youre playing. this isnt, like, an opinion.

macro wins games, sure. but again. if youre a malz one trick you may have amazing macro, but that doesnt mean youre not just choosing actively to not interact with an entire facet of the game in laning phase. not all champs are the same difficulty. supports dont interact with the core mechanic of the game which is farming. jglers dont lane sure, but jg not only deals with pathing which is entirely unique to the role, but also has to, themselves, understand wave states and laning in a macro sense.

[south mortar]

and supports dont have to understand pathing, wave state and laning in a macro sense?

[frank dust]

what does support do?

they roam and gank. something jg does more and mid does frequently as well.
they set up vision. thats a team thing, not a support thing.
they lane, except so does every other role.
they peel the adc, something that everyone other than mid has to do.

support isnt doing something unique that other roles dont do. again, jg is not a hard role and it has a misconception as such, but support mains try again and again to try and make things up to imply that their roles isnt filled which 40 champs with absurd base damages and incredibly broken abilities that dont function off gold income, something they also dont have to worry about.

an alistar starts up the game and walks around with 4 of the most broken abilites in the game and has absurd impact without having to do anything but exist. every other role has to balance gold income with their responsibilites, support gets that for existing. every other role has the responsibilites of having vision and map awareness, support just doesnt have to do it while having to farm.

[frank dust]

ofc they do. this isnt the argument at all. its just not. support has to do these things, the argument is that every other role in the game also does these things. support isnt unique for having this. every other roles does this, but they have stuff to do on top of that. support just simply has less things they have to do than other roles, and thats just an objective truth.

[south mortar]

yes, every role has to do the things you have mentioned

every role has to understand pathing, laning, warding, wave states etc

but "the laning slot" is completely empty for a jungler

[frank dust]

you cant just list things support has to do and act like its unique to support. you have to list things unique to support and make the argument that these things unique to the role are more difficult than the things unique to other roles. except that support doesnt have these things, because they have less things to do than other roles while having an outsized impact with their absurd position in the game.

[south mortar]

so supp has to do whatever a jungler is doing but on top of laning

[sick sedge]

I think you're missing a bit of him saying a jungle player has to understand laning as well kInG DeMoN, which you do intuitively even if you dont realize it sometimes since it factors whats gankable and isnt, etc.

[stable grove]

A jungler that doesn’t understand laning is going to be horrible because his entire job revolves around understanding how their laners are approaching the game, how enemies are going to do the same and so on

[south mortar]

understanding laning and DOING laning are different things

[sick sedge]

is it, though?

[frank dust]

but thats not true? jg doesnt 'lane' in the traditional sense that they participate in sitting in a lane and interacting with the opponent. instead they sit in the jungle and interact with the enemy jg through pathing, something support doesnt have to do. by the metric that jg doesnt lane, you can say that support doesnt have to path jg.

[south mortar]

you are not actively trying to farm, sidestep abilities etc

[sick sedge]

Ask yourself that, is it really all that different. it's a core skill to the game

[south mortar]

in jg u are pve, all u gotta do is press f keys and watch the laners, and u get the necessary information

another aspect you might be missing is that im talking about the highest levels of the game, so in high challenger, playing jg is more easier than playing supp, same case in competitve, playing jg is easier than playing supp

im not talking about ur average gold, plat supp

[sick sedge]

we're not either.

[south mortar]

then you are just stating an opinion, its fine to have an opinion, but that doesnt make it the truth

[frank dust]

jg is just pve is such a reductive view of the role. jg is a time management role. jg has to do everything on the map, they have the most responsiblity of the entire team. just because they arent actively fighting camps that can kill them, does not imply that farming is an easy thing to do when you have 10x the amount of time management issues that support has

[south mortar]

did i say "just pve"?

[sick sedge]

it's funny how you can say so much without writing a lot, innit?

[south mortar]

but this might be a good place to stop, i've said what i needed to

[frank dust]

no, but the point is that youre implying that jg doesnt have a comparable difficulty to laning because they are pve instead of pvp, not understanding that camp clearing is a pvp idea on a macro sense.

like, the idea that its 'pve' is such an awful understanding of what jg is. not its not, no more than malz is playing pve perma shoving the wave on cd and doing nothing.

[south mortar]

it is pve

[frank dust]

malz is pve?

[south mortar]

when u are clearing ur camps, they are NOT contested, its not the same way for cs, every cs can be contested

[frank dust]

malz cs is contest?

[south mortar]

there are champs that just ignore the laning phase

and there are ways to ignore the laning phase, like what baussffs does

[frank dust]

but this also isnt true. invading and counter invading is like half the jg experience. there are matchups which dont participate in this, just like malz ignoring laning, but to say jg is pve is absurd

again this is why i say what champ u main affects your idea of the game. master yi is playing jg way, way different to more standard jglers.

[south mortar]

my idea of the game has no link to my champ, i've said this before

[frank dust]

you say this, then say that jg is pve like the enemy jg just doesnt exist in the game.

[sick sedge]

this is true you shouldnt discredit someone because of what they enjoy/play.

[south mortar]

"in jg u are pve, all u gotta do is press f keys and watch the laners, and u get the necessary information"

i never said "jg is a pve role"

[frank dust]

"playing support is all pve, all you gotta do is sit behind your adc and shield them"

these statements are absurd and not true.

[south mortar]

can you link your opgg?

[frank dust]

brother. i have it in my name.

ive never hid what rank i am and what i play.

[south mortar]

right

[frank dust]

inb4 lillia main, opinion disregarded

[south mortar]

i dont link what u are saying to what champs or rank u are

[frank dust]

except that its also valid to say that i understand the game differently bc of what champs i play.

[south mortar]

if you are speaking the truth, u can be bronze, but its the truth

[frank dust]

u should, bc they demonstrate different understandings of the game.

[sick sedge]

i think the interesting thing between you two is you both main two champions that arent known for being super aggro early on, lol.

[south mortar]

this is true for people that dont think enough, so their understanding is tied to what they've experienced

it should already be interesting to you that im a jg main and i still say that supp is more difficult at the highest level than jg xD

[frank dust]

like sure, you can say even iron players playing garen can be correct about the game.

[frank dust]

it should be interesting to you that its common among challenger players to say that support is the easiest role in the game xD

[south mortar]

yes exactly, if someone says something is true, it is what itis

[south mortar]

and thats because most challenger players dont know enough, the ones that do, dont say this

[frank dust]

you determine which challenger players know enough? and are those the ones that agree with your idea of support difficulty?

[south mortar]

if 2+2 = 4, even a person with PhD in maths cannot say 2+2=5

[frank dust]

you start from the position of 'support is harder than jg' then conform the players who 'know enough' to the ones that agree with your position.

[frank dust]

axioms are different from the conclusions that stem from them. support is more difficult than jg is not an axiom.

[south mortar]

yeah cuz its a fact, if someone isnt agreeing with a fact, that does means they dont know enough or maybe they know it but they just dont wanna believe its true

[frank dust]

but its not a fact. its the complete opposite of a fact.

[south mortar]

a supp has to do EVERYTHING a jg has to do with the added element of laning

[frank dust]

jg has to do EVERYTHING a sup has to do with the added element of jg pathing

see how that works?

[south mortar]

yes, jg has to lane too, agreed

[frank dust]

yes, supp has to jg path too, agreed

[south mortar]

the lane starts at krugs and goes all the way to gromp xD

well we should stop here, there isnt any point in going any further

[frank dust]

ill be sure to tell every challenger theyre completely misunderstanding the game for sure.

somehow that didnt come up while they were actively climbing in these roles

they somehow are wrong about the estimations about the difficulties of the roles, while simultatenously hitting the peak rank in said roles.

i too believe that sports medicine is harder than a math degree, while having a degree in neither and also disbelieving everyone who says math is harder.

[stable grove]

Aye, broken

[frank dust]

after all sports medicine does math too, and on top of math they also have to study biology!

lowkey i kinda cooked with this analogy

[stable grove]

Stop responding to the obvious baiter man, both him and the OP are probably laughing behind their screens right now

I responded to this since it’s the latest message btw

[frank dust]

post your main brother, not your alt.

[frank dust]

op is a baiter super obvious ik that. i cant tell is the other guy is a baiter or not.

bait and awful takes arent one in the same.

[stable grove]

It’s either a baiter or someone that is actually clueless and just repeating what he heard his favorite streamer say, no offense with this, I know quite some people who do this, literally 0 game knowledge just emulating what they hear on twitch

[south mortar]

yes i have 0 game knowledge, agreed

[stable grove]

I said I know some people who do this and they have 0 game knowledge, read it again

Clearly a baiter with this response ngl, I’ll lurk and enjoy the show with Skolver then

[hard niche]

Oh brother

A yi main

[west kraken]

Reference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rxr009zMp2k

[south mortar]

What he's saying is that "support is the easiest role to climb with". Not support is the easiest role. Stop hearing what you wanna hear

just because support is harder than jungle doesnt mean supp players will be better, in general most supp players suck and will be lower in skill than their same elo junglers

[west kraken]

easiest role, easiest role to climb with are one and the same, it means that for a given level of effort and skill you get better results out of support than other roles.

[quartz ruin]

here is the ranks for difficulty:

1.) ADC
2.)
3.)
4.)
5.)
6.) Support
7.) Top
8.) Mid
9.) JG

[minor laurel]

jungle aint easy if you plan to 1v9

[left agate]

you're so real for that

[summer crow]

idk if ur defining hardest meaning hardest to carry/win games then maybe... but id say with champs and roles the more different choices you have to decide on and do the harders something is... especially when many choices are fundamentally not benificial choices and only 1 or a few choices are good... id just argue jungle has more choices in general... and has more detrimental choices possible to choose from vs good choices, vs adc where its mainly choosing fights... rotating for cs correctly and which lane to go to at any givin time... their biggest thing is just micro only... idk i think im hard stuck that jungle is at least 1-2 hardest overall... just because jungle seems "easier" because they have more impact isnt enough of an argument for me... and i do think junglers underestimate the amount of things they have to think about compared to any laner... because of junglers getting used to doing a lot of stuff subconsiously... or junglers saying their role is the easiest simply because they arent laning...

[summer crow]

idk how the second half of this isnt enough to say sup isnt that hard

[summer crow]

adcs need little macro knowledge... if they learn only micro and how to outplay then they can win games so... know where and how to get cs, know which lane to be in, know how to group for teamfights/ go mid after laning phase

[minor laurel]

the hardest rule in the game is top

pretty much skill based role
you have to know what every champion does, the abilities and their cooldowns
and properly plan executions based on that

god forbid someday you take darius and you end up against vayne

you will have to prepare yourself for getting fucked in ass for 15 minutes straight

the key to winning that lane is not die from sodomization

unless if vayne is worse than a bot

mid is the easiet role in the game

all you do is spam abilities and shove the wave
I could play mid with my feet and still win

[minor laurel]

who the fuck is faker

yall dropping names that nobody knows

[fallen wind]

yay welcome to the jungle

Jungle is both the hardest and easiest IMO, and it's for the same reason funny enough lol

it has the potential to do the most impact but also fuck everything up. It's nice to have the game in the palm of your hands, and it's also why when people are losing their own lanes they blame you lol (sometimes they're right though)

[west kraken]

funny you say this because I think this matchup is actually winnable for Darius. The 2 things to cause issues for Vayne top are enemy's with wave clear and ranged harass and Darius has the former of these w/ Q.

[hard niche]

vayne shits on darius top if the person playing her knows what the word spacing means

Whenever i play top and enemy picks darius i curse them under my breath because i despise darius then pick vayne and just insta win

Roll the "zz ranged top shitter" chats yeah yeah u play darius

But anyway yeah its freelo for vayne

Top is not harder than jungle you win/lose top during champ select lol

Ban the worst matchup and either counterpick or play into a slightly less shit match up and thats top for you

• wave management

But jungle requires good planning macro and not make braindead decisions

Plus the mental block when your 0-7 kassadin keeps feeding the vex and then blames it on you

Or the enemy jungler getting slightly ahead and you fall behind suddenly they have control over the whole game

[west kraken]

its about a 51/52% vayne win rate in higher elos...

so slightly Vayne favored but hardly freelo. Sett is probably much worse for Darius at that MMR.

[gusty mural]

its braindead like pre mid masters

but like every other role is also braindead pre mid masters

[pseudo pecan]

this is such an incredibly wrong statement, while i dont have an opinion on who is harder, decisions will always be the most on thresh because every single one of his abilities is offensive aswell as defensive, which clearly doesnt apply to lee sin where only R and maybe W could be talked about in multiple contexts

[lavish pollen]

I Agree JG is the easiest role in the game and junglers have been gaslighting people into thinking its somehow the hardest role in the game LOL

XD bro fr but jg mains thinks that theyre 500 IQ

[lavish pollen]

sad but true

[west kraken]

It's a super easy role in iron and maybe bronze, it stops being easy by the time you're in Gold.

[lavish pollen]

this guy is a jg main disguised as a top main fr fr

[hard niche]

At least that top main understands man

[quartz ruin]

Jg is too easy

[gusty mural]

pretty sure like every multi role challenger player calls adc/supp the easiest role in the game

and jg as the hardest

but yk im sure its easy in bronze silver games guys

[hard niche]

Adc isnt easy either

Where JG is the hardest macro wise, ADC is the hardest mechanically

[west kraken]

If you click on my profile you'd see that I have all 5 roles selected....because I play all of them.

[left agate]

real

i play jg and i know. just know the toplane/botlane matchups and route towards them and gank level 3 (after 3 camps) if possible, also try to punish enemy jg by invading in case they reveal their position

thats all you have to do early

[minor laurel]

its not, end of discussion

[summer crow]

im wrong yet u dont have an opinion... 🤔 at last i have one/thought through one