Why do you think teams are bad at branding and merchandise?

[tulip lichen]

League of Legends. Esports. Sports. What is the livelihood, what is the reason people pump money into the things they love? Is it a semblance of camraderie with someone they see who looks like them, talks like them, plays like them or is it due to an allegiance with the badge, regardless of player? It's cus of branding.

All the teams are awful at it. fucking awful. it's like they put 0 effort into it even though you see IMT do a 10 episode series about their struggles but nobody watches it. What's the deal? Why can't everyone do what KCorp and KOI did? What the erl's are still doing? Why are teams so bad at branding?

It does not help esports players in general have less charisma than a rock that's left on a stone cold beach. But you can work around that! How hard is humour? within a landscape of brands rising from the dirt league of legends teams are always left behind. Why though

KT Rolster is the example I'mma use here. I wanna buy a pyosik shirt and tattoo it onto my skin so it won't come off. So I look online to buy one. Nothing available! like bruh.

[fierce notch]

https://tenor.com/view/ibai-explicando-rapido-720-eduardo-gif-18338196

[lament junco]

Preach brother

[minor hound]

Orgs nowadays have been butchered thanks to out of touch corporations that only gate about making money with no plans to get there. . I mean how do you expect Orgs like DWG LSB to create a brand when they sell their brand to the highest bidder

As for the players it's a harsh reality to to accept that not everyone wants to be super popular . Players just want to play the game and get paid. Everything else comes second. How you perform inside this industry doesn't reflect who you are on a personal level and that part people fail to realize when it comes to player brands . Just because a player is boring brand wise doesn't mean that's how they are personally. There's a reason why vtubers exist, to separate the person from the streamer. Pro players don't get that luxury

[tulip lichen]

Oh I'm just wondering why the orgs don't force them

Cus those are your cash cows

[minor hound]

Oh well I mean you can but that's a bit unethical you know

Maybe in lck it's sorta like the draconic days of eSports but not in the west

You can ask our friend Arnold from geng on his thoughts on how players should be forced to do content

Very interesting guy to say the least

[tulip lichen]

I mean at minimum you can force em to stream like 10 20 hours a week

[minor hound]

Do you know the average streamer makes pennies streaming on twitch primarily? You'd be making twitch more $$ off ad revenue than you make yourself. Even top end streamers left twitch tv for that same reason.. the compensation isn't worth it. I mean sure you have players who A. stream for fun/on their spare time B. Their main source of income. But if you're a player making average salary or above that, it's comes to a point where streaming isn't even a supplement to what you make

https://youtu.be/6m5P_n5njCQ?si=vkKjcOBEN8grUvh0

[tulip lichen]

Nah it's not about that. It's about building players brands. You make em stream, then make highlights for them. People watch highlights then tune in

[rich brook]

time to stretch my fingers a bit

https://tenor.com/view/goku-warm-up-stretch-db-gif-11448397

alrighty, so lets say you are the shittiest org on the planet and have no business sense and you have your players coming 6th to 4th every split cuz you know, management is probably bad with performance issues too, with no (and i mean NO) visibility and avenue for fans to itneract with the personalities they simp for, then you .....have no case to argue to potential sponsors

sponsors want visibility

they want to be on jerseys, streams, and if they can, they would LOVE to be tattoed on your favourite players ass with a dedicated onlyfans

what the actual fuck are you doing if you cant make money to support the players ...who need to practice and perform?

i always thought the no streaming take was garbage

and it still is

https://tenor.com/view/peace-out-peace-sign-peace-ice-age-eddie-gif-17088347

[fierce notch]

https://tenor.com/view/laughing-cat-catlaughing-laughingcat-point-gif-7577620470218150413

@rich brook

[tulip lichen]

This was by far the funniest response once could have made

[grim tangle]

Seems like 3 people started typing essays and I ain't reading all of that

So ima just say. Let's go GenG!

[minor hound]

Whether it's garbage or not it's the reality

Players want to be compensated for their time not being felt like their time is being wasted

The entire streaming industry being garbage and problematic is the root of the problem

Let's not add.more fire to the pit by forcing players to stream on a service that barely compensates them.for.their.time

[tulip lichen]

Bruv the players get paid by the company, they're playing soloq already might as well stream it. I'm not saying to only stream as your main source of income, use the stream to promote your org

And your players

Get the eyes on the brand

Build up your own personality

[limpid plinth]

Streaming should be a player choice, it's a taxing thing to do and not everyone is built for it

Most gamers are just socially inept people who just likes to play games, not everyone wants to build their brand and entertain a bunch of people

Should they build their brand? Of course they should considering most players are only going to last a year or two and then go back to college. To build a brand outside of being a pro player is a requirement to having a career in this space. But not everyone wants to do that and that's fine.

I do wish teams help players that do want to build their brand tho,

But I'm not part of any teams so no idea if they do or not.

[minor hound]

They don't get PAID by the company for streaming. That's a separate deal between players and orgs. Like with due respect there's just a disconnect from what's needed and what's actually happening.. growing a brand, representing your org is good and well but if it was that simple players would be doing that

Like actually listen to the people who are ACTUALLY working in the industry and what they're saying about streaming

[astral quail]

All Arnold does is to hire incompetent people and fuck lck over by getting de facto banned

In china

Until esports attracts more top tier quality talent good management and promo ain’t not happening

[tulip lichen]

So why do T1 players stream loads

[mystic galleon]

Several T1 members actually enjoy interacting with, and entertaining their fans. It helps when you produce W's and nobody's giving you flack for sucking constantly. Also, I'm not 100% sure but it might be tied to their contracts in Korea.

I think there's a missed opportunity for sure for branding, but streaming on twitch ain't it. It's a dying platform with an arguably slowly dying game. There's a reason the top streaming giants are either not streaming like they used to, or jumped to another platform. You'd need to make that your primary focus for it to pay out for the org or yourself, which isn't worth it for the pro, or the org.

[tulip lichen]

yeah but like tiktoks, youtube shorts, shit like that, brands are being made day by day and the League orgs aren't on the ball. My whole proposal really is making pros stream then post highlights on tiktok or something then bring more viewers etc

[rich brook]

https://tenor.com/view/goku-warm-up-dragon-ball-stretch-gif-12423732

alrighty

1 - if the stream industry is so trash caedrel wouldn't have quit casting to swim in cash

2 - teams pay their players, what are you on about? you are acting like they are on the poverty line

3- players show up maybe twice a week on camera, practice should be paid for and such but in this unfortunate era, not much is supporting pro league other than investment and sponsorship

4 - beggars cant be choosers, the pro scene isnt football. sponsors for football will be assured millions of ppl will see their ad, for league, what else can you use to assure them ppl will see their push?

[rich brook]

i do think teams should allow no cam streams to allow shy players to relax and just play the game, and to also lessen the workload of streams for regular players, but im still in the each player should stream cmap, they dont need to build personal brand, but they arent getting fed for free

[rich brook]

you just contradicted yourself in the first two sentences, even if it is a separate deal, they are still getting paid by the org, with that, wont read the rest of what you said...

[rich brook]

t1 get flak for losing, get flak consistently and streaming for t1 fans isnt as easy as you make it out to be. If anything its harder since ppl want you to always look inhumanly talented. Most korean orgs have the players stream too, so yes it probably is a korean thing, either way some digital branding should be done since it is a digital game. Whether it is streaming or youtube vids, content has to be done and a way to publicly interact with players should be done. NA fans are losing interest in playrs because NA orgs lost interest in connecting with the fans, i dont think its just performance based.

[rich brook]

i saw ms random bring up this thing about value. the thing is, even if you think the individual streams wont bring in that much income, it isnt about the money made from streams but the exposure, the connection with fans, and the value it brings to sponsors. sponsors pay for the salary of players

[tulip lichen]

Legit spot on

That's exactly why they should stream

I'm not saying they need to solely make money off the stream that's insane

It's to get your face out there

[limpid plinth]

Are you saying orgs should force no cam stream?

Playing professionally is already extremely stressful as if. Imagine if you are on a team is expected to win the split but your team is struggling in matches. Streaming in that kind of environment/fanbase is the most toxic thing you can ever do to yourself.

There's this idea in this thread that in order to develop a brand you must stream. But are we going to just ignore the fact that most of LEC doesn't stream or make videos either?

[rich brook]

this is false

just because you don't watch their content doesnt mean they don't make it

and almost every lec org has a player that streams, do all of he players stream? i would say no, maybe not,

[limpid plinth]

I also keep seeing this comparism between LCK and LCS and how korean teams have mandatory streaming in their contracts. But are we all really going to pretend that if you stream, suddenly you are going to be popular and your brand will become huge (or even moderately sized). Like how many of yall are invested into NS's Sylvie because of his stream?

[rich brook]

the ppl that speak korean

when sylvie learns english im sure he will get foreign fans

everything is relative, you retain fandoms by streaming not make fandoms

you make fandoms by having something interesting to reel ppl in

[limpid plinth]

Right cause insert popular korean player speaks so much English

[rich brook]

a star player, or a chmapionship

[limpid plinth]

Meanwhile Sylvie averaging 23 views on his stream

[rich brook]

every aspect of branding is a cog and they all fit together

[rich brook]

so did HLE grizzly

[limpid plinth]

Oh yes, the Koreans love Sylvie so much

[rich brook]

but ppl know who they are

[limpid plinth]

And do they know them because they stream?

Or is it because they are pro players

Don't get it mixed up lol

[rich brook]

i dont know half the pro players in NA so its not because they are pro players

[limpid plinth]

But somehow you know every Korean player because they stream

[rich brook]

but again, this is for the org, you are giving back to the org brand by streaming

[limpid plinth]

What branding is just mindless streaming getting you though?

Let's be truely honest here

[rich brook]

interaction

[limpid plinth]

Why would anyone watch some random 23 viewer NS jungler when you can watch Oner from T1

[rich brook]

because they are a NS fan

imagine you are one of those 23 viewers

[limpid plinth]

23 viewers is a lot of brand recongnition

[rich brook]

and you didnt get to see your sylvie

or anyone from ns

how would you feel the org is treating their fans?

[limpid plinth]

So suddenly the topic discussion is about "treating your fans"?

I thought we are talking about teams being bad at branding and merchandise

[rich brook]

...so treating your fans is what?

what is a brand to you?

when you see a brand you go omg that will be trash cuz its a brand

?

[limpid plinth]

Streaming is only beneficial to the top teams of the league

[rich brook]

no you go its going to be good

[limpid plinth]

If you are a nobody on a middle team, there is no branding to be made from streaming

[rich brook]

because of what?

[limpid plinth]

.

[rich brook]

its beneficial cuz they get to server thier large fanbase?

[limpid plinth]

Second, the idea that streaming is required to be popular is also a joke. Let's name a popular player who is popular because of their stream.

[rich brook]

idk what you are going on about to be fair, but i have never said in this thread that streaming is THE way to get brand recognition

for an org

im saying i think its needed to retain fandoms

and thats just a fact

[limpid plinth]

No it's not?

[rich brook]

if you dont have a fandom to begin with you can only retain what you had

thus if you are ugly you can only retain those looks by maintaining yourself its the same thing but growing a fanbase includes a multitude of different things

mostly...winning

tho i can point to a ton of orgs

who won

and did nothing to try to capitalize on that

i.e eg

mad lions

rogue

all ...did not have good streaming schedules or content

so everything goes hand in hand

you grow your fandoms, then you keep your fandoms

NS will get those 23 views for slyvie but its still better than the 7 NA players get when they turn on a stream

i will give you the best example that might hit home

LCS got viewership and was going well, and then they had a long ass pause that was out of their control (to be fair) lost about 10 to 20K viewers that didnt come back

if you apply that to branding, you got some fans by doing something cool, who knows what it is, a viral tiktok, a clip someone saw on youtube, a celebration after a match, an old school mate wants to be happy they know a pro, winning a difficult match, a cool sick play ..could be anything thus that = viewership in this example....say NS didnt stream nor show/do anything to keep the interest of fans, then they will lose the fandom i.e the pause

[limpid plinth]

And you would consider NS good at branding?

[rich brook]

no because they are incompetent

[limpid plinth]

But they stream

[rich brook]

streaming is a part of the system not the entire thing

[limpid plinth]

and when LCK goes down for a techincal pause then can all watch their streams right

[rich brook]

thats like someone is the greatest mid laner cuz they can play azir

[rich brook]

i was using the pause a rhetorical example

ppl lose interest when they dont get something to stimulate their interests

[limpid plinth]

So the LCK just ended and now everyone who still wants to watch LCK related content will now flood to NS's various stream/yt/tiktok content

[rich brook]

obviously not

thats very different

as for being the BEST brand it requires more than the base level

but everything has a base level or the basics

a lot of na orgs cant even get the basics down

if we are arguing if streaming is the pinnacle of branding then the answer is no

and i never insuinuated that

if we are guring tho that not streaming will hurt your brand, the answer is yes

[limpid plinth]

You claim that it's required tho

[rich brook]

and i am hardlining that

drinking water isnt the only thing to make you healthy

[limpid plinth]

You can make content and grow your brand without streaming

[rich brook]

but not drinking water at all is bad your your health

[limpid plinth]

Water =/= streaming

[rich brook]

sure, if you think that is possible show me examples

[limpid plinth]

They are completely irrelevant tf

[rich brook]

it is a rhetorical example

[limpid plinth]

Oh no you don't stream, now you are the equivalent of someone who doesn't drink water

[rich brook]

because you dont seem to understand that not doing something

is differnt to something being THE END ALL BE ALL if youd o it

[rich brook]

you are just being obtuse

you can use that energy to give examples

[limpid plinth]

Streaming is a supplement to growing your brand, we all agree on that. But there are many other alternatives that doesn't require the player to stress themselves over something that they probably don't even want to do.

[rich brook]

im waiting

ok so show me a successful esports league brand

that doesnt stream

[limpid plinth]

I mean most top tier teams of LEC and LCS dont even stream?

[rich brook]

which team

lets be specific

[limpid plinth]

like all of them?

[rich brook]

so i can fact check

ok lets say c9

[limpid plinth]

c9 has jojo

and no one else, no?

Also why are you checking

Shouldn't you know this because their brand is so big because of their streams

lmfao

[rich brook]

balber streamed 3 days ago

[rich brook]

i just went over this

[limpid plinth]

.

[rich brook]

maybe you need to read what i said

about retaining fandoms

ffs

and balaber streamed 3 days ago

fudge last streamed 6 months ago

15.k followers

[limpid plinth]

Clearly Fudge isn't streaming so let's ignore that

[rich brook]

berserker 6 months ago

[limpid plinth]

I'm not sure how Blaber's stream schedule will look like, but as far as I'm aware most pro players will stop streaming once season start or a bit into it

[rich brook]

vulcan 17 hours ago

[limpid plinth]

Check 100T

[rich brook]

and you dont think this might be a reason lcs viewrship is dying?

[limpid plinth]

Hardly

Correlation =/= Causation

[rich brook]

what do you think is killing lcs viewership

[limpid plinth]

It's a lot more complex then "oh no my players don't stream"

That's for fact

[rich brook]

i agree

but you dont think its a reason?

thus a part of the problem?

[limpid plinth]

There are work arounds to that issue without developing a toxic work culture like Korea

[tulip lichen]

Players not streaming means that people can't get into them as personalities. Look at the starting days of LCS, who did people follow, Imaqtpie, Shiphtur, cus they streamed as well as play.

[tulip lichen]

Do you want to be the best or not

These players grind anyway

Might as well showcase it and get fans

[limpid plinth]

True let's emplace toxic work culture that us koreans love

[rich brook]

like what?

[tulip lichen]

What toxic work culture though if they're already grinding the game?

Also they are professionals who eat breathe and shit this game

[rich brook]

we are here to be serious about the discussion for branding so just saying something is wrong and not supplying solutions is a bit flagrant

what can NA do to help their viewership and branding

that isnt streaming

[fierce notch]

Make more NA players play league

[limpid plinth]

Stop being on weekdays, trying harder at developing stories for the lcs, creating a more interesting story

brands making content in the first place

[tulip lichen]

They're not on weekdays

They're on weekends

[limpid plinth]

and that's why it's helping now

[tulip lichen]

How do you create more stories for players that the people don't know?

[limpid plinth]

a big issue viewership and care for lcs was because they were on weekdays

[rich brook]

stories? how would the production create a story? and isnt that laziness for lcs to work on player brands and not the orgs

[tulip lichen]

Why would I care about Mask Vs Insanity

[limpid plinth]

i think lcs also needs to work harder on tiktok and yt short content

[tulip lichen]

You dodging questions

[limpid plinth]

Because I'm still answering

like can you wait your turn isntead of spamming questions

both of you

[tulip lichen]

Ok go ahead

[limpid plinth]

how many questions did you even spam

What toxic work culture though if they're already grinding the game?
what can NA do to help their viewership and branding
How do you create more stories for players that the people don't know?
tories? how would the production create a story? and isnt that laziness for lcs to work on player brands and not the orgs
Why would I care about Mask Vs Insanity

[tulip lichen]

I just want this one answered

[limpid plinth]

jesus christ

you guys are helpless

if you expect me to answer all that

[tulip lichen]

Bruh

[limpid plinth]

Bruh is you spamming me with questions like this is an AMA

You want a discussion?

Start by acting like it

[tulip lichen]

I didn't take you to be this sensitive

[limpid plinth]

and answering my response to that original question instead of starting an entirely new conversation

[tulip lichen]

The response to the original question is further questions

[limpid plinth]

Sensitive is you being upset that I won't answer your 4 questions

[tulip lichen]

I tried that and you got pissy

[tulip lichen]

You haven't answered one

[limpid plinth]

Because I was having a discussion with someone else?

but you butted in

[tulip lichen]

Right ok

[limpid plinth]

and started inserting your questions

and then acting like I need to answer you

like contribute to the conversation we are having or wait

[tulip lichen]

This whole time I bet you coulda answered like 3 of them

Instead of telling off the guy who made the thread

[limpid plinth]

Public forum

public discussion

[tulip lichen]

Public forum and yet I "butted in"

[limpid plinth]

it's not that I'm required to talk to you

because you have the "op" next to your name

i have no idea why you feel so entitled

[tulip lichen]

You don't have any answers do you

You don't know what you're talkin about

Because you initially said LCS should go back to weekends

[limpid plinth]

And?

[tulip lichen]

And they already announced it ages ago

[limpid plinth]

We all know that

and your point being?

[tulip lichen]

Clearly you didnt

[limpid plinth]

?

[rich brook]

ok so why should lcs production do the work for orgs is my question

[limpid plinth]

The system itself was one of the reasons for why it's hard for teams to become more popular imo

[rich brook]

i think lcs production will suffer if the brand dies, but everyone is in it togther

[limpid plinth]

I'm not saying it's the only reason but if you want to have a successful brand, the workplace must be in a healthier position

[limpid plinth]

Agreed

I'm not saying the teams are not at fault because I also said

Oh wait I never got to say it because I got distracted by the op

my bad

[rich brook]

for production or orgs?

[limpid plinth]

But I was going to add on top of the LCS being on top of their product that the orgs needs to work harder at creating content

But my opinion with LCS was that the product itself wasn't interesting to casual fans

So trying to make the orgs more successful will only be minimal compared to the lcs

not saying it won't help because everyone should work harder at improving lcs

but the product was the issue

[rich brook]

what would instantly make the lcs product better?

[limpid plinth]

I also didn't realize how many pro players actually streamed tho

[rich brook]

in your opinion

[limpid plinth]

Well for starters the move the weekends was extremely good

I also like a lot of the changes LCS has made

I think to trying to improve on it when the product just shipped isn't the best idea tho

since currently we have several things already changed, so we can keep track of viewership of those changes

But let's say we changed a whole lot more things

then it's going to be harder to keep track of what is actually increasing viewership

or fan interest

Like as much as i think fan interest in LCS would incrase with fearless draft, I don't think it's the time or place

Something I do think LCS suffers from a lot is the lack of content for tiktok

and is something that could help the LCS greatly

obvious by LPL

But as far as I'm aware, no one on the lcs team is interested in making tiktok content and is the reason for why they aren't

But if they could that would greatly improve NA interest

I also think we should find out how CBLOL keeps fan interest high, cause last time I checked they had incredible viewership for their size

[fair raptor]

Fearless draft is a gimmick

It draws attention because of novelty more than anything else

[fair raptor]

Streamer orgs that are also top teams

LOUD is both 1 of the best teams in the region and has a lot of clout from their ownership

So it's both easy to get invested into the team and easy to be committed because they are winning (unlike KC)

It's the same reason why DSG brought a lot of eyes onto NACL

Streamer owners also tend to do a lot more work to publicize their teams and bring in their viewers as new fans to the leagues they play in

Like costreaming their team's games

[rich brook]

i mean cblol wont exactly be the best example for the non-stream narrative...

but they do their production very similar to NA, they just have a lot to work with in terms of player personalities

when you have nothing to work with, what are you supposed to do?

[fair raptor]

Honestly the content narrative is way overblown

People say this stuff a lot but I believe it less and less every year

It's 1 of those Reddit narratives

[rich brook]

i think tiktok is ok and maybe they should look into that

[fair raptor]

It doesn't really matter how much content is made because people don't actually care to watch most of these players

[rich brook]

this is the point i was going to make

so how do we get ppl interested in the org and players?

in your opinion

[fair raptor]

There's not really a real answer

Besides get new orgs in

[rich brook]

who will the new orgs hire? same old players, no?

[fair raptor]

Doesn't really matter

[rich brook]

y?

[fair raptor]

As long as the org itself has names attached that people care abuot

People will watch

[rich brook]

that is true

[fair raptor]

I don't think most people really cared about watching FakeGod, Meech, etc. before DSG picked them up for NACL

But them being on DSG brought a lot more attention onto them

Which was only amplified by them winning

But the fact that DSG inherently draws more eyes because they are associated with a popular personality already makes the initinal fan investment way easier

[rich brook]

so what na orgs should do is pick up a big streamer to costream games and make content?

[fair raptor]

Same with how KC managed to build a giant passionate fanbase despite being in LFL for most of its existence

[fair raptor]

The orgs themselves have to be deeply attached to the streamer, usually as owner

[rich brook]

well, its because they are french and enabled the parasocial behaviour with twitter pandering and management being accessible

[fair raptor]

That way there's a clear association between org and streamer

[rich brook]

so streamer ownership..?

[fair raptor]

KOI had the same effect

[fair raptor]

I mean basically

You can see it in Valorant

VCT Challengers NA highest viewership matches; top 5 viewership were DSG, DSG, MxM (Ludwig/Cr1tikal), DSG, MxM

DSG finished last place in that split

This was a split with orgs like G2 and MAD

and TSM

[rich brook]

well ... i mean that is a way to make viewership ballon

[fair raptor]

But viewership was dominated by DSG/MxM even though DSG literally didn't win a single game

[rich brook]

any others that current orgs can apply, like players becoming a personality? like caedrel for example... he was a boring ass pro

now we found out he has a personality in there

[fair raptor]

I mean it's really just converting a large existing fanbase into fans of your team, and by extension the league your team plays in

It's just easier to do that than add orgs that actually have to do a lot of legwork to build a fanbase from nothing

[rich brook]

fair

do you think allowing pros to swear on broadcast will make ppl more open to watching?

[tulip lichen]

wait sorry

[rich brook]

delete you clown

[tulip lichen]

dont wantt op noticing

[fair raptor]

Probably not

[tulip lichen]

szy swore on broadcast once and it was so cringe

[rich brook]

will bring some relatability back no?

[minor hound]

You're 100% right my bad

[rich brook]

how so

[tulip lichen]

well when you look at swearing, it's a multiplier not an additive. if you are saying "fuck you reddit" on stream then that is cringe, that is 0, you can multiply anything by 0 and it's still 0. Then again if you're charismatic enough you don't need to swear for clicks

[fair raptor]

The problem is that, again, making pros more likeable really just targets and affects existing fans

[tulip lichen]

like if anything, have a little press conference where the pros have to trash talkeach other

[fair raptor]

When the real goal is getting new fans into the league

[minor hound]

? Contradiction where.

[rich brook]

not for clicks but for human relatability, streamers are followed mostly due to them being relatable

[fair raptor]

You can't increase fans by making content that only really appeals to people who already watch your stuff to begin with

[rich brook]

the org pays the players whether it is a separate contract or not

[rich brook]

fair

[tulip lichen]

yeah true and ig swearing would be ok but it's how you use it imo, and in terms of relatability the way i see it is a stream is your space, vs a broadcast which is a shared space that you should hold yourself to a higher standard to

[fair raptor]

That's why orgs attached to content creators are so powerful; fans of that streamer aren't necessarily existing fans of the league

[rich brook]

back in the day ppl related to a struggling guy trying to make it big playing video games

[fair raptor]

You see this in real sports too

[tulip lichen]

so a streamer can be monke as much as he wants

[fair raptor]

With Taylor Swift and the NFL

New viewers are just inherently more valuable than existing ones

[rich brook]

nowadays what about a pampered guy making 200k is relatable? thats y streamers try hard not to show their riches on stream or disclose their income

they sit in a boring ass room

with the same chair and go..i may be rich but ims till one of you guys at heart

[limpid plinth]

@fair raptor Interesting I agree with most of the takes especially about how teams and team owners will attract attention

[rich brook]

didnt rito try to bring on new personalities on broadcast like qt and she got trashed?

[limpid plinth]

sadly...

[rich brook]

fair

[limpid plinth]

imo I like to think of brand loyalty being a funnel to becoming a fan for the product

But I do agree that most will probably be loyal to a team

Anyone know what happened to the biggest TSM fans active on this server and if they are inactive compared to before

[rich brook]

@unsaken

huh they are inactive

[limpid plinth]

RIP

good bye to the real ones

[fair raptor]

Unsaken was banned

Pretty sure

[limpid plinth]

As expected of a tsm fan /j

[tulip lichen]

yeah he got banned

[fierce notch]

Why what did he do

[tulip lichen]

pretended to dox someone

then ban evaded

[fierce notch]

@real urchin

Sozin is here

Can he type

[rich brook]

oh fuck unsaken was indeed banned

[real urchin]

wot

oh im not getting in this

y'all crazy af

fr

fr

[fierce notch]

sozin is alive

[mystic galleon]

I don't think the talent is there in NA for the 'content' that keeps getting espoused here that would go on TikTok or YouTube. You need to be storied or a complete attention whore like DLift to get anybody to care, and idk what changes that.

I've heard people say a lot of talent is left un-tapped in challenger/academy circuits, but teams go with players that may not perform well enough for a trophy but are solid and have been around a while.

[tulip lichen]

Well if you stream, then in 4 hours 3 good plays or funny moments happen, get your orgs editor to cut it up and put it on tiktok and if 1 of those goes viral boom, you'll have some fans roll in

You don't even have to be good for soloq

Or just make tiktoks of your own teams llays

Plays

[limpid plinth]

Man I wish it was that easy lol

[tulip lichen]

Why isn't it?

[limpid plinth]

Trying to get to step 1 of making something blow up is really hard already

But then retaining your audience is even harder

If you just spam out outplays onto your tiktok, I think you are seriously underestimating what it takes to go viral on tiktok

[tulip lichen]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsR-acBaSw8 ok so this is a champs queue game edited by Damwon and it already has 200k viewers

i'd love shit like this for NA

[limpid plinth]

A well established org that has won worlds and one of LCK's most popular and hilarious mid laner went viral.

Like same, I would love for NA players to also have viral clips like Showmaker. But to achieve this kind of virality without being as established and long time streamer as Showmaker isnt easy at all, if not possible.

Should pro players try to emulate this? Of course they should, but they won't be popular for years if at all even with the huge requirement of effort.

[real urchin]

You know what phreak said: you guys are like masters of identifying problems but are also terrible at finding solutions

Like a lot of the "solutions"(if we can even call it that" are tone deaf at worst and out of touch with reality at best

In an ideal would everyone could be streaming, making content and whatever but it's not that simple

It's never that simple

If you want actual answers to your questions stop looking at it from a comsumer perspective and educate yourself on the issue because there's high end content creators who talked about the trashcan streaming industry

[limpid plinth]

Real

[rich brook]

yes, educate yourself on the esports industry

the only people here trying to simplify things here are the ones hyper focusing on streaming like it is the end all be all, it is part of the system and i have yet to see a solution that goes around this SUPER problematic industry that ppl make billions off of. I'm well aware that the streaming idustry has problems and is not for everyone. it is not a get rich quick scheme and takes a lot of effort and time to build a fanbase. Im well aware like any industry you cant just wake up one day and succeed..... but this is about esports and growing the brand not about becoming streamer as your main job

this level of illiteracy and reading comprehension is what makes the people in the industry not take the redit community too seriously

and its a shame because I think there are ppl who do put forward very decent alternatives and well thought out processes only to get overlooked because someone wrote a click bait passive aggressive post that resonates with the other over emotional under educated individuals

like taking the high road and using credible names to try to pull down others while not putting forward anything of reasonable worth via an actual contribution to the topic or to the community at large is the epitome of this community

make a contribution by putting forward your ideas or workarounds instead of coming here JUST to complain about a take, because from how I see it you are doing the very same thing phreak said, you identified a problem and are just wasting your time moving fingers for validation or a random upvote

put forward something that can be an alternative strategy to streaming or just stfu about random things phreak said

what you said provided no real value to the discussion other than herddur you are under educated about streaming, but the funny thing is... I know more about streaming than most ppl here....considering it was a job of mines

so please, please...can one of you provide some level of coherent strategy about esport org branding that can be an alternative for streaming....nothing is wrong with shitting ona take, but dont take the high road if you have nothing to contribute

[rich brook]

i will put money where my mouth is and help argue your side, lets say....streaming takes up time and is bad for the practice environment due to mental health etc. most lec, lck and lpl teams do fan meetups and lpl do this thing where they let fans meet the teams and give them a gift on stage, maybe at the end of the game one of the lucky fans in the crowd can submit their questions that will get vetted for their players they like and if that palyer gets chosen for an interview the interviewer will choose that question and allow the fan to meet them on stage

[tulip lichen]

They should do talks and events at schools about life as a pro gamer

That would be super cute

[limpid plinth]

I like this idea a lot

[grizzled helm]

being a pro gamer is more cut throat than football and nba

[limpid plinth]

What are the careers like for non top players in football and nba?

[grizzled helm]

bench warmers

anyway i think riot needs to help the most for the teams instead of sitting and hosting

they should do big trailers on their main socials for each team for respective regions

and have like the ads on home page of league

[limpid plinth]

They do tho, no?

[grizzled helm]

and more esport content like day in life of pro gamer or something cute

no they dont

[limpid plinth]

Like on their respective esport's page

[grizzled helm]

teams have to do it themselves

on their OWN channel

riot reaches way more than teams ever could themselevs

so it will help them be more aware

offical educational videos will also be nice on why pros do things

for strategy

doing fan interviews could be coool too

or i mean

the fans can ask players questions

so many cool things they can do and riot helping exposure wouldbe the biggest

[limpid plinth]

these past 9 days has been amazing for lcs content

a new video every day

[grizzled helm]

idk what their content is

i only watch lck

lck got the right strat so far with t1 leading them

[limpid plinth]

Oh so you were talking about LCK then?

About riot needing to help lck with branding

and not the entire esports scene, right?

[grizzled helm]

no

i was talking about every region

even the minor ones maybe

[limpid plinth]

But if you dont watch their content then why are you so sure about other regions?

[grizzled helm]

because i got bored of lcs

im not wrong at all

lcs lec are just memes

and we talking about team branding not comedy videos

im too tired to argue with a person like you

[limpid plinth]

it's funny since lcs only made 1 comedy video since the MarkZ address