Khalshazar logcheck

[dense atlas]

ok

log says 19s first symbols

[blissful sonnet]

ur doing nothing

for the first 5 seconds

and you delay your symbols to 19s as you say

you are not lining up your cooldowns

theres a lot of things wrong here, give me a few mins

[dense atlas]

ok ty, appreciate it

trying to switch to sub from assassin and it just feels much different

[vestal ridge]

maybe reading the guide and understanding stuff first will help out as well

[blissful sonnet]

Like whats the point of this symbols usage

You have shadow dance available

[main stirrup]

you are playing venthyr finality

[blissful sonnet]

Sub is all about syncing cooldowns, you keep using them separate from eachother and you are barely using abilities when in dance.

The build is irrelevant atm

you can do way more dps with obedience finality

than this

[dense atlas]

So what is the interaction supposed to be between symbols and shadow dance?

wait for both and then hit them together?

[blissful sonnet]

I think you need to read a guide

[dense atlas]

ok

[blissful sonnet]

These are sub basics, I really don't want to go through every single basic rule about the sub gameplay

but yes you want to sync cds and you want to optimize ur flag usage, which you arent doing atm

[main stirrup]

venthyr is more dependant on how you line your cds than kyrian

cause you also look yo maximize dmg and to stack flag as much as you can

[blissful sonnet]

Both want to line cds

You just dance more frequently as kyrian

[main stirrup]

yeah pretty much

[dense atlas]

I think this was the main line from the guide I had read that I remembered:

Cast Shadow Blades Icon Shadow Blades, Symbols of Death Icon Symbols of Death and Vanish Icon Vanish on cooldown.

[blissful sonnet]

yes but theres more to it

and i think its explained in the guide

[dense atlas]

this accurate?

[blissful sonnet]

It's accurate, if you read the line next to symbols it says "in combination with shadow dance"

[dense atlas]

yep

[blissful sonnet]

But its a bit barebones

[dense atlas]

so you think in general it's CD alignment is the main problem?

[blissful sonnet]

It's one of the issues

But probably the most pressing issue

[main stirrup]

Yeah that 10 second rule is quite important for venthyr

[dense atlas]

I noticed I'm so panicky about the rotation etc right now that the mob gets pulled out of melee range and I don't notice for a couple sec

so I'm hoping with practice that will resolve too

[blissful sonnet]

this was ur breakdown for that fight. Whenever backstab is higher than shadowstrike

sirens and alarms goes off

[main stirrup]

i suspect you might be dancing with very little energy and that might cause your low casts on shadowstrike

[blissful sonnet]

yea it just requires practice. But you need to practice the correct thing

[dense atlas]

yeah I did a key last week with another rogue and I noticed his dmg breakdown was way diff from mine

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/BnMmFGAd7jbtYaqy#fight=1&type=damage-done&source=1

that was the good rogue

[vestal ridge]

your talent choice for that key

[dense atlas]

but not even thinking about keys right now

I know...

supposed to be tornado

[main stirrup]

@dense atlas if you are on eu we can head to orgrimmar or sinfall once push is done logchecking you

[blissful sonnet]

Vigor is a dead talent for sub

[dense atlas]

US/alliance

[blissful sonnet]

in case you didnt know

[dense atlas]

yeah I think that key was my only try with vigor

[blissful sonnet]

There are a few talents you never pick as sub

[dense atlas]

the other rog said it's deeper forever

[blissful sonnet]

Gloomblade, subterfuge, vigor, mfd, alacrity, sec tech

[dense atlas]

I think going into that key I had 4.9% haste and it felt bad so I wanted to try it

[blissful sonnet]

just never pick these talents

[dense atlas]

lol ok

[blissful sonnet]

They are actually trash, like 0 remedy

its not "oh might be bad"

they are terrible

but just as a baseline shadow dance usage, you want to:
Shadow dance with Symbols
Shadowstrike until you are at 5 combo points and then Eviscerate

rinse repeat, its very simple. I am not including rupture or snd here, because you mainly want to refresh them when you are not in dance. BUT if snd drops you refreshes it in dance no matter what. The plan is to avoid that though

[dense atlas]

ok

so what's opener look like for something like halondrus?

or is that in the guide

[blissful sonnet]

i have a lil checklist in my guide for things you can look for in your own logs, if you check these boxes you're mostly playing it correctly and can start min/max uptime etc.

[dense atlas]

oh which guide is yours?

is that on wowhead?

[blissful sonnet]

method one

[dense atlas]

oh shit are you famous

[blissful sonnet]

no im not

lmao

i just write a guide

cus i play the spec a lot

[dense atlas]

nice

cheat sheet for a real moron like me

[blissful sonnet]

Once you have figured out how to use your cds

i would suggest looking into kyrian

for pure ST fights

[dense atlas]

ok

what % better is Kyrian in general?

[gentle glade]

quite a bit on st

[dense atlas]

hmm

[blissful sonnet]

Its like 4-5% on ST

2-3% on 2t cleave

Venthyr is better on AoE and in M+

[dense atlas]

not related to this log but when do you use shuriken/blackpowder?

only in 3+?

[blissful sonnet]

Do you have tier set?

[dense atlas]

na

actually I got 1 item from vault

[blissful sonnet]

So without the tier set you want to shuriken on 3t and either BP or evis (if prio target)

On 3t you also spread ruptures

[dense atlas]

ok

[blissful sonnet]

You never backstab outside of dance unless its ST

[dense atlas]

so e.g. on echelon in HOA, when the adds spawn, Shuriken for CPs and evisc the boss?

[blissful sonnet]

So you're storming on 2t (NOT IN DANCE) as well, but you dont BP

[blissful sonnet]

yes

or BP, depends if the adds will die or not

[dense atlas]

yeah ok

[blissful sonnet]

cus you still want to kill those adds before the petrify goes off

but backstab is only ever used on 2t if you are playing Perforated Veins

But this might be a lot to take in atm. As i said, just slam some dummies or something and try get used to shadow dance, symbols and flag usage first.

[dense atlas]

yeah maybe I'll hit LFR

thanks all for the tips

will print out the cheat sheet

I just wanna get consistently into 40%+ parses for ilvl

I had some shit last night that was 4%

actually green here because I ignored the add... https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/7gcA8T6j9kNawqW4#fight=15&type=damage-done

any thanks again

[vestal ridge]

I would kinda ignore ilvl parses

[blissful sonnet]

Also, just play Shadow Focus

for now

don't bother with Nightstalker until you are more comfortable with the spec