subtlety

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[wicked badger]

how can I go about getting some logs looked at?

[deep river]

Are we running cloud cover still for m+?

[lethal thorn]

are we back on top after May 5 change or outlaw still better ?

[lilac stag]

Outlaw dead

They had their 2 weeks of fame

[lilac stag]

Use !log

[wicked badger]

!log

[lethal thorn]

https://tenor.com/view/pepe-pepe-the-frog-dance-rainbow-celebrate-gif-16678420801263072500

[grim wasp]

Good news no need 1h wep now

https://tenor.com/view/the-solution-is-simple-it's-a-no-brainer-im-jeong-dae-squid-game-season-3-player-100-song-young-chang-gif-10042109574270080784

[dusky yacht]

2h sword sub rogue when

And cheap shot animation turns into us bonking them on the head

[grim wasp]

a range spec using shurikens only

just didnt have the macro bound when in stealth had normal blackpowsder

[hazy breach]

For Singletarget yeah after the hotfixes its gonna be about the same as trickster

But you want ~1.1k haste for it to instead of ~700

So its not that easy

[fossil forge]

Time to swap back …

[subtle aspen]

its sub > assa for keys now?

i mean on high ones

[astral axle]

id say doubtful but otoh people are doing high keys on sub still so follow your dreams

[real panther]

what is this talking about 2H? did I miss something? XD

[grim wasp]

works perfectly king thanks

https://giphy.com/gifs/vevo-vevo-JwjBy94VzDd6

[astral axle]

sub now wants 2h agi axe for bis weapon after tuesday

[[ you do not ]]

[somber sun]

hell nah bro

id quit the game

[woeful wren]

imagine the deathstrikes

[dusky yacht]

Oh look who it is

Back so soon?

[fossil forge]

it was nice to do damage nocap

[dusky yacht]

0 cap detected

[grim wasp]

i am copying all the macros maybe i dont get this right but is the backstab shadowstrike macro not useless?

it would use backstab instead of ss if i have only 40 energy and im pressing buttons right?

i can have just backstab when out of stealth and ss when in stealth on same key? what am i missing

[velvet jay]

I really love the fact that you pick your vault items so that you are more focussed to crit, and then they nerf the talent so that mastery is better again.

love that

[hallow mortar]

fun fact is that crit is about even with mastery after you get good amount of it

[empty cargo]

Really glad I didn’t change any of my stats honestly & stuck with premed 🥷

[shrewd lantern]

Crit isnt suddenly bad

change your neck or ring

thats it

[velvet jay]

I haev 848 mastery and 783 crit

[hallow mortar]

thats seems good enough

[velvet jay]

I have 7 sockets so I can change alot xD

[shrewd lantern]

6 because one is primary

[charred sandal]

why you need so much haste on DS

[hallow mortar]

you can sim yourself you will find crit and mastery flask is pretty even when you have like 800 mastery

i was running crit flask before change

[shrewd lantern]

yeah this doesnt change much

besides go back to mastery flask

are we being fr rn

[hallow mortar]

its basically free pad 😄

[velvet jay]

if crit and master is about the same in single target, shouldn't you always go mastery for any fight where you do black powder?

[shrewd lantern]

one boss?

dragons

[velvet jay]

first boss has adds :p

[shrewd lantern]

if you swapped all crit>mastery gems to mastery>crit

[velvet jay]

king has little balls

[shrewd lantern]

you’d gain 72 mastery

end of the world

ok who tf pads on nk balls

off to jail with you

[velvet jay]

got some juicy logs cause of that xD

[shrewd lantern]

[hallow mortar]

i have two myth crist haste neck, but its not like there is better option beside last bosses ones, which are kinda hard to get as rogue

[shrewd lantern]

we really care about nk logs

oml

[shrewd lantern]

lura neck or cosmos

both hard to get

lmfao

[velvet jay]

I have this

[shrewd lantern]

idk if if beats mythic

but ye its good

[velvet jay]

and

[shrewd lantern]

extra socket goodge

oh im using npx rings

i have both on myth

bless bonus rolls

[velvet jay]

big

got platinum star band om mythic

[shrewd lantern]

i mean i’d rather more burst so dislike the revert back to scruples

though the crit variance was annoying at times

[hallow mortar]

bursting P1 on alleria is fun

hope we kill her this week

[still basalt]

hi guys can i only use one bonus roll per boss?

[hallow mortar]

yes

[still basalt]

bad, thanks

[hazy breach]

Its missing the 10% cdr on sectech that trickster has

So to have it line up well you need more haste, which lines up fairly well with the next breakpoint for shadow dance duration

[charred sandal]

ah, makes sense

[real panther]

le me about to swap my crit mastery gems again next patch

[dusky yacht]

Me recrafting my stuff for the third time this season

[swift tinsel]

@lilac stag I might be jumping to woyer too lol

[trail bison]

look at this crit during amp

[grim wasp]

with macros only 3 buttons to press mostly now was complicating stuffs for no reason

https://tenor.com/view/the-solution-is-simple-it's-a-no-brainer-im-jeong-dae-squid-game-season-3-player-100-song-young-chang-gif-10042109574270080784

[shrewd lantern]

imagine having more than 2 items

people really going to care if they have 40 more crit than mastery

[upbeat cradle]

My crafts were crit/mast anyways

Was fun using new talents for a week tho

[shrewd lantern]

yeah it really barely changes shit

i was low on crit so crit haste crafts were still better than haste mast

[twin quartz]

I didn’t change anything but a few gems and my flask

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/ultimate-warrior-gif-6761287664057495473

[shrewd lantern]

yeah literally it

i guess all the no premed complainer

can shut up now

[hallow mortar]

no premed was kinda weird

[lilac stag]

yeah getting extra heals and doing more dps was absolute shit

[hallow mortar]

but did not mind it that much

[lilac stag]

That whole extra 3 seconds in the opener just ruined everything

[shrewd lantern]

all the tourist rerollers

are annoying

[hallow mortar]

but having choice of picking better step or heals was super nice

[lusty root]

Its just less fun tbh

[hallow mortar]

and cloud giving DR

[lilac stag]

If 3 seconds to an opener ruins your vibe, idk you’ve not played sub with any consistency. That shit was tame compared to past versions.

[swift tinsel]

I liked blades feeling like a cd again

[lilac stag]

bunch of complainers

You all got what you wanted

A shitty “bugged” version of premed back

[spice island]

If I'm a fair bit higher on mastery right now, should I still go with the double crit effectiveness ring enchants?

[swift tinsel]

You run those all the time

[spice island]

Gotcha

[tidal solstice]

i finally got used to the krankled ass opener and then they gut cloud cover two weeks later

[shrewd lantern]

sub opener has changed so many times

anyone complaining hasnt played sub

for more than a few weeks

[tidal solstice]

i mean if blizz would make a season worth playing longer than that

[shrewd lantern]

i mean thats your choice

the raid lasts longer than a few weeks

for most people

[tidal solstice]

i was being facetious 😛

[shrewd lantern]

if you raid in like ID where alot of their roster only plays the first month

to clear the raid then afk

[real panther]

!apex

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  If all of the above are true, use cast a Shadowstrike / Shuriken Storm (even if on full cp).

[tidal solstice]

will shadow dance be up when you Evisc after Shadowstrike? ☑️

otherwise im sending the evisc

[lilac stag]

this channel needs a purge after the last 24 hours

[rain swift]

whys that

[lilac stag]

if you don’t know don’t worry about it

[rain swift]

nah now I need to know

[shrewd lantern]

anytime a tuning pass happens

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/figure-it-out-glaring-watching-you-staring-mad-gif-15425518

[peak ice]

Aren’t you the one saying you’re rerolling warrior?

[shrewd lantern]

”what rogue spec is best? under 5% difference matters”

[lilac stag]

No I’m the one who has multi classed rogue and warrior for the past two expansions. Guess what’s not exactly needed.

[tepid trellis]

dps warrior

checkmate

[lilac stag]

Well we don’t have a prot warrior

[shrewd lantern]

sometimes i get asked to play warrior since

for some reason finding non crayon eating warriors

[lilac stag]

and our dps warrior is dead half the encounter.

[shrewd lantern]

is difficult

[tepid trellis]

he should spec prot then and live longer

so he does more dps

[shrewd lantern]

where the meme max clip where he says playing warrior makes you dumber

[rain swift]

finding people who arent crayon eaters in wow is generally hard kekw

[lilac stag]

He was our tank. He hated it. Just as much as he apparently hates doing mechanics like avoiding shit. Hahah

[shrewd lantern]

i dont m+ more than i need to

[grizzled gust]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Light's Potential
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[shrewd lantern]

so i avoid 90% of them

[lilac stag]

Love him but he be meat balling it from tank just soak it pov

[rain swift]

same i just get my 8/8 for vault dont need any items from m+ anymore

[tepid trellis]

well people that tank tend to forget that as dps you actually have to dodge the shit on the floor

and not just stand in it

[lilac stag]

yep

[tepid trellis]

so watching tanks swap to dps

is always a joy the first few keys / raids

[shrewd lantern]

watching ranged swap to dps

[lilac stag]

I’m worried he’s gonna crash out so just getting it ready

[shrewd lantern]

then die to frontals

[swift tinsel]

any time our tank onetrick gives any perspective I immediately tune out

[shrewd lantern]

anytime i see someone complain about dodging swirlies

its 90% a ranged main

[rain swift]

imagine not having ranged DPS that refuses to move from glaives in lura because they wanna finish their cast and die

[keen yew]

except dps dks for some reason, they do stand in shit

[shrewd lantern]

yk what would be crazy

[tepid trellis]

then they show up on lura

[lilac stag]

Assa sucks. Outlaw sucks in raid. Sub is fine. the knee jerk to is frustrating.

[shrewd lantern]

positioning out of tue glaive box

[tepid trellis]

and get 1 banged by glaives

[shrewd lantern]

pre cast

[rain swift]

too good to be true

[shrewd lantern]

I think i’ve gotten hit more by the glaives spinning around the room

than the ones ejecting

[rain swift]

tank a glaive, let the healers do their job mentality

[shrewd lantern]

those glaives dont 1 tap though

the ones that float around

[tepid trellis]

only issue is

they can do like 4 ticks

in 0.2 sec

[rain swift]

they do if u tank one the whole way through it and dont move right

[tepid trellis]

and kill you

[shrewd lantern]

Yeah

[shrewd lantern]

ok if you tank it that much

you’re….

[tidal solstice]

yeh fotm rerollers need to be purged or somethin

[jade oasis]

i learned

i cant play without one hour

tricks

[shrewd lantern]

achieves are acc wide

though

[lilac stag]

@tepid trellis the warrior was a suicide bomber on dragons soaks. I had first soak of first group. I lost track of the number of times I got gibbed during prog getting the soak.

[rain swift]

does cloak make u immune to them? havent dared to try it yet as I usually save it for the intermission because people move their damn beams into you

[tidal solstice]

oof

[shrewd lantern]

idk

[keen yew]

yes

[shrewd lantern]

also i apparently took salhadaar beam damage

through cloak

despite its shadow

????

[grizzled gust]

So outside of Cloud cover back to No Scruples, what other talent changes will we make?

[rain swift]

tbf would just do that mechanic and save cloak in case u break both orbs too fast

[warm marlin]

our dk ate 3 ticks

[chrome palm]

half the things in the m+ r otation man

[warm marlin]

he walked it off

[grizzled gust]

Premeditation?

[chrome palm]

quick question when should you use cloak on lura in seat?

[tepid trellis]

exact same talents as before the patch

[shrewd lantern]

i watched our dk on court talk about tanking 5 melee swings from the big bug

as if thats nothing

[grizzled gust]

gotcha

[lilac stag]

Soon it’ll be you

[tepid trellis]

our tank died end of p3 on lura

[warm marlin]

salhadaar beam, searing radiance on paladins, soak on paladins, alleria obelisk dot

[tepid trellis]

our unholy took 14 melee swings from lura before he died

[shrewd lantern]

yeah dks talking about tanking a boss

casually

lmfao

as a dps

[grizzled gust]

The talent builds in the pin use Numbing Poision, are they supposed to? I thought Atrophic Poison was better

[rain swift]

depends on fight usually

[shrewd lantern]

it doesnt for raid

minigame players like numbing more

[grizzled gust]

so in M+ its Numbing?

[chrome palm]

didnt realize that last one wtf

[grizzled gust]

raid its W/E?

[chrome palm]

this class is a joke

[warm marlin]

yes

[chrome palm]

so when my rl was calling "defensive if you get obelisk" i just have to eat it no dr thank you blizzard

amazin

zero dr class icant

[warm marlin]

yep

[shrewd lantern]

”one heal”

[pulsar hemlock]

So glad I procrastinated making my outlaw weapon, now I get to save my crests

[warm marlin]

i link my raid the clip of me slowly rotting out to searing radiance on paladins

"oh but you have cloak up"

🙂

[chrome palm]

[warm marlin]

goodbye my cheat death

so long

[keen yew]

run elusiveness like

this is massive

[dusty totem]

Sub st is looking pretty insane now no?

[shrewd lantern]

if egg burn is 40

do we delay the 3rd dance now

hmm

[woven ruin]

can we sim new changes yet or nah

[tepid trellis]

compared to what?

[shrewd lantern]

2.5% to a bin spec

[hazy breach]

You can just select no scruples and its pretty much on point

[shrewd lantern]

=insane apparently

[dusty totem]

Compared to all the other specs

[tepid trellis]

no lol

[hazy breach]

Missing aura buff and 2% on no scruples, but it doesnt change talents/stats

[tepid trellis]

we are like middle of the pack

[split garden]

I have 800 haste and puzzle box, is there a reason that sometimes the second sectech comes up with 3-4 seconds remaning on SB and sometimes its so tight im not even sure im getting 2 sectechs in SB

[chrome palm]

LOL

cheat on alleria is hard locked man

[keen yew]

wth

[hazy breach]

Sectech cdr scales with haste

[chrome palm]

no thank you on elusiveness there

[shrewd lantern]

not playing cheat in raid

lol

[chrome palm]

cheat death is your main defensive on alleria

low key

[keen yew]

you get targeted so much by obelisk throughout the raid you have no reason whatsoever to run cheat death

[split garden]

yea but other than lust idk what haste effcts I would have

[dusty totem]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[chrome palm]

idk maybe its not scary anymore but i was proccing cheat p3 every time in prog

[warm marlin]

its ok we got crimson vial

[hazy breach]

Hunt from your weapon sometimes

[split garden]

hmm ok

[tepid trellis]

healers should just do 1 heal

ong

[shrewd lantern]

[tepid trellis]

its their job

[keen yew]

id muich prefer a 20% dr on each spell that comes every 10s than a one time cheat death in p3 for one of the grasps

[shrewd lantern]

i get more big heals from our ret

[warm marlin]

you just arent going to die to obelisk normally though

[shrewd lantern]

than healers

[warm marlin]

cheat is way better on that fight

[chrome palm]

rogue dying on 40% of alleria logs with a CHEAT DEATH is absolutely demonic

[tepid trellis]

i was perfectly fine with obilisks

[keen yew]

i litteraly never died running elusiveness

[shrewd lantern]

why is ww so high

lmao

[keen yew]

i did with cheat death

that was the math for me

[chrome palm]

thats great but when i progged it in p3 i would proc cheat every time, maybe its not the case anymore

[warm marlin]

i died once in p1 to a shotgun that killed me through cheat, never died once in later phases with cheat

[keen yew]

i don't know about now tbf

[tepid trellis]

i only procced mine in p3 when people decided to pop two grasps at the same time

or if they yoinked it same time as explosions went off

even though they were told to not

do that

[warm marlin]

its annoying that cloak doesnt save you from obelisk but you are protected from all the other rot ongoing

so you are unlikely to die during it anyway

[chrome palm]

also removes absorb iirc

[shrewd lantern]

i’ve gotten more saves from that

from ret lay on hands

than healers

i think blud is aware this class is potato to rot

[chrome palm]

give your ret a lil kith

for a loh

[spice escarp]

is there a quick n easy way to see if people did the aa extra stab thingy in logs?

[peak ice]

Theres like a timeline cast so you could probably check that

[spice escarp]

ye, kinda wanna overlay that with buffs somehow

[wind flicker]

Is stacking mastery still prio after hitting the haste breakpoint? I've heard a few people say theyre starting to stacking crit after this last patch.

[mint bobcat]

Mastery for aoe crit for ST

Are the sub rogue changes coming next Tuesday a nerf or buff literallt can't tell lol

[wind flicker]

Im talking strictly m+

[mint bobcat]

Then mostly mastery

[wind flicker]

Wonder why those people are stacking crit for m+ now 🤔

[mint bobcat]

Dont take my word as 100% correct and try simming yourself on like patchwork 6 targets for a min or less and mess around with it, I could be wrong

[wind flicker]

No worries and will do

[peak ice]

might be playing around the 150% crit from cloud cover thing

[mint bobcat]

That would be my guess and it is getting nerfed this tuesday so 🤷‍♂️

[peak ice]

Yea

[half loom]

Do we want 700 haste if we're only doing m+? Or it's not as important

[peak ice]

Yea

[mint bobcat]

Still need 700-800 haste yea

[half loom]

Feel so short on haste using what SIM tells me or looking what other people running keeps sitting at 600ish

[peak ice]

I wonder if its worth dropping an eyes of the eagle to put me just above 700

[half loom]

And looking at all the top rogue's on murlok and archon not many of them are over 700 most around 600ish

[chrome palm]

700 number is kinda fake you can get away with a decent amount less, 660-680 or so which is like having 2 gems for free

[worldly root]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[mint bobcat]

Wpuld that show if they were haste potting to hit those thresholds?

[peak ice]

"Around 700"

[chrome palm]

If they are haste flasking their haste would begin with a 5

[half loom]

Oh nah it wouldn't so yeah might make sense actually forgot haste pots a thing always run mastery

[mint bobcat]

True

[half loom]

I mean top m+ guy had like 300 but maybe he was just testing tbh

[chrome palm]

Sub is bad in m+ so the top guy might be some Chinese fella doing weird pad build

[frank drift]

What's the current wisdom on the use of the "uber macro" on WH, vs. the "don't macro your haste trinks/pots due to delay in recognizing deepening shadows" on IV?

[chrome palm]

Instead of a genuinely good build

[mint bobcat]

Anti funnel class do be feeling bad

[chrome palm]

People have been cooking high mastery low haste / pbox this season and it’s good in aoe very bad st

[shrewd lantern]

hasnt had funnel since bfa

8 years ago

[chrome palm]

Had a lil in sl 🙈

[shrewd lantern]

[chrome palm]

Flagellation shards of halkias

[shrewd lantern]

stretch kinda

but ehh

[frank drift]

Like is this a good "opener" macro, and if not, why not?

#showtooltip
/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use Light's Potential
/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Where 13 is some instant cast haste trink

[shrewd lantern]

well deepning shadows

requires trinket to be seperate

[frank drift]

So two macros, split after the pot?

[shrewd lantern]

i mean i dont macro pot

i just hit it manual

not that hard to hit a pot bind then sb macro

+times you dont pot on pull

[drifting ether]

Put 13 seperate and you’ll be good

Ye or have a seperate macro for with pot and without pot

[cerulean mirage]

do we coup de grace in aoe cause of Nimble Flurry?

[peak ice]

ye

[cerulean mirage]

ty

[peak ice]

thres a macro to auto use it wwhen using black powder

[pearl swan]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[dreamy escarp]

Bad in what capacity? Not doing 21s? Sure, 19s? No problem

[tribal blade]

i mean sub is objectively not great

did a random 18 AA as sin (and playing sin for the first time in that dungeon) as a sub main

did 20-30k more overall than sub

[chrome palm]

everything is relative

[dreamy escarp]

Imagine using AA as a proxy for good lol

[chrome palm]

anything can time a 19

[tribal blade]

i mean yeah

it's one of the hardest keys of the season

[chrome palm]

but there still exist bad specs in the game

[dreamy escarp]

I love wow discords so funny

[short radish]

okay what should be used as the proxy for "good" then?

[chrome palm]

you can play sub if you want in keys man

[tribal blade]

i'm not shitting on sub, i love sub

but it's just not amazing

[short radish]

you can shit on things you love

wait....

[tribal blade]

HAHA

i could find an image for that

but i would get banned

and btw the diff between a 19 and 21

[void ocean]

ok WTF

[tribal blade]

is astronomical

not even in the same ballpark

[somber sun]

nah bro

[tribal blade]

cutoff right now in NA is all 19s

and from my exp you can use any spec to make title cutoff

it's the meta specs that are gonna be able to go far above cutoff

[jade oasis]

#harassyourhealers

[mint bobcat]

The time investment required to actually get into groups as off meta is the real barrier not dps

[sharp bolt]

Any word on if the bug between Premeditation and Ancient Arts is being fixed? Has Blizzard even acknowledged it?

[tribal blade]

this is very true

[hazy breach]

Its not a bug

You are not expending any shadow technique stacks when you have premed up since you just get full cp

[somber sun]

yes fk evokers

[hazy breach]

Thus you wont proc any shadow clones, as those only spawn when you expend shadow technique stacks

[sharp bolt]

Right, but it is an obvious oversight. I only care if its being addressed.

[hazy breach]

Should they redesign premed so its not like this? Yes, will it happen in a random hotfix? 0% chance

At best it migth get changed in .1

[random mason]

They could accidentally fix it tho

[short radish]

yeah we didn't expect the fix to cloud cover so quickly

who knows

maybe they are watching

[hazy breach]

"cloud cover fix"

Is one way to phrase it

[limber folio]

https://tenor.com/view/hachiware-chiikawa-happy-stimpy-flapping-arms-gif-82452333563293721

[shut jay]

fix rogue, give us 3% crit raid buff

[short radish]

fix rogue, delete this class so we are set free from this prison

[hazy breach]

Either way my point is you are absolutely not going to see premeditation getting reworked in a random hotfix/weekly tuning note

[random mason]

They did "fix" spatter <> singular focus back in tww as well

[somber sun]

letting go is better than holding on ahh

[tribal blade]

goddamnit he's right for once

[shut jay]

i actually could see them doing something incredibly stupid like giving us honor among thieves that somehow stacks a raid buff. then after a week of more than one rogue being in raid they completely nuke the buff and the class as a whole and we remain dead till the next expansion

[tribal blade]

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/liquids-max-talks-rogue-raid-buff-situation/2296187/41 like, subscribe, hit the notification bell

[limber folio]

i literally did nothing to my gear

[hazy breach]

Same

[limber folio]

i just swapped out the MT ring

for the Vorasius one

[somber sun]

why does he always finish with 🏄‍♂️ 🏄‍♀️

[tribal blade]

me too haha

[limber folio]

and i simmed like 2k better

[shut jay]

same

[limber folio]

when shit like

talent changes come

[tribal blade]

but he's correct about it not being a nerf

[limber folio]

and its not like core hero

i dont see it lasting long

[tribal blade]

people are dooming thinking sub is getting nerfed

[shut jay]

how can you nerf what is literally, as the kids say, mid

[tribal blade]

what happened to outlaw could have very well happened to us

[limber folio]

but this is unironically kind of

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/766349238941777931/1131266466289819779/caption.gif

moment

[shut jay]

they're going to see this gigabuff to warriors go live and then after a week of being op they'll murder warriors again

[tribal blade]

lol so true

[tribal blade]

yeah this yoyoing of fucking tuning for classes like warr and hunter

is getting interesting

btw hunters were down bad with 2 spes for 5 seconds

and immediately get tuned

[shut jay]

its kind of amazing that we see weekly/biweekly tuning though

[tribal blade]

EVEN while having a spec doing top ranking dmg

[shut jay]

remember when we weren't touched for like all of undermine

[tribal blade]

yeah this was blizz's philosophy coming into midnight

more frequent tuning

[shut jay]

they didn't have to tune us 3+ times if they just did the right thing and gave us a 22% aura buff off the hop

its fine though, my guild's udk is in shambles

[tribal blade]

at least we're slowly climbing

we basically got hit with the nerf bat early on then gradually over time been getting better

[shut jay]

imagine if they gave us banshee's blight too

[tribal blade]

maybe they can take this as a lesson to not nerf based on M0s lol

[tribal blade]

YES

[shut jay]

gods we were strong then

[random mason]

They give us a week of em just to make decisions based on that wdym

[shut jay]

blame outlaw, it's all outlaw's fault

[tribal blade]

the best part is if they had not nerfed our aoe and cleave

we would be in a decent spot in keys

[shut jay]

imagine if they didn't change nimble flurry, we'd be impactful in the current raid

[tribal blade]

yeah we would actually be possibly one of the better specs in raid

on overall WCL statistics

[short radish]

we had our fun in tww s3

its okay

not every class can be meta every season

[shut jay]

'class'

[tribal blade]

TRUE

[jade oasis]

yeah but

we had to press

flag

and that sucked

[short radish]

there's also a bit of tongue in cheek reference to dk/mage

[tribal blade]

hahaaaa

well at least mage is finally not meta

i'm sure blizz will fix that soon though

[short radish]

yeah on the last boss

[peak ice]

Is frost not still pretty solid

[tribal blade]

it is

but mage isn't like

mega OP meta atm

[peak ice]

Ah right

[short radish]

yeah you only want to bring a single mage to last boss

class is literally so jover

[tribal blade]

also mages aren't really doing rank 1 keys

[peak ice]

What’s the meta for midnight?

Just all warlocks?

[tribal blade]

brew, udk, dev, aug, rdruid/rsham

[warm marlin]

dont forgor demo

[tribal blade]

locks are also doing rank 1 keys yeah

[peak ice]

No nerf though

[tribal blade]

i think lock is one of the highest dps currently

in keys

[peak ice]

They’re fine just leave it

[tribal blade]

if not highest

[peak ice]

Yea they are silly

Feel like you can 1 button rotation and out dps

[tribal blade]

and then you randomly have zac in there haha

[peak ice]

On outlaw?

[tribal blade]

yeah

he was already on the frontpage before .5

so i don't think the outlaw nerf is gonna hit him too hard

[peak ice]

Crazy

[tribal blade]

law will still be stronger than before the .5 patch

like ~5-6% stronger iirc

[peak ice]

Think im too invested in the assa/sub style to try grind some swords to try outlaw atm

[tribal blade]

no need, outlaw isn't gonna be mega strong in keys anymore

actually not sure what it'll shake out to be, but it won't be gapping quite as hard as right now

[spice island]

I wish there was a combo of Wang and Sensei

[dusky yacht]

Can you just write ‘sub is going to be amazing blaster goats fr’ for me

[crystal comet]

sub is gonna be amazing blaster goats fr fr ong

[sullen hare]

Cap detected

[dusky yacht]

Critically Amazing Perfect rogues?

[tribal blade]

sub is going to be perfectly adequate ok dps fr

[dusky yacht]

Prophet.

https://tenor.com/view/cat-head-pat-poke-annoying-boop-gif-6808277743442463226

[unborn egret]

Is sub expected to be better than assa in keys?

After changes

[outer orchid]

depends on your key level

[dusky yacht]

Sub is going to be amazing blaster goats fr

[outer orchid]

unless you're doing 17-18+ your spec doesnt matter more than just playing correctly

[livid frigate]

Higher the key just make sure kicks and mechanics are done and don’t fuck up

[vagrant sinew]

sub was timing 19s like week3 before two buffs so I think you can up that standard now

[outer orchid]

only time assassination is better is when your group needs prio damage

[unborn egret]

Assa prio damage is pretty bonkers

[vagrant sinew]

and in 2 weeks you get the ilvl bump so even in 20s should be whatever

[unborn egret]

20s the new 12

[outer orchid]

i'd say sub will always be playable unless you're in the top .1% and even then you're probably good enough to make it work

[livid frigate]

Is assa raid damage better then sub rogue?

[tribal blade]

highly unlikely

[frank drift]

Hey, sorry if this is a dumb question, but I notice that my Eviscerate button turns to Coup de Grace when I get 4 stacks of Unseen Blade, even in single target. What am I meant to do with that? I don't see it in the ST rotation.

[livid frigate]

Use it

[frank drift]

And then Eviscerate right after?

[tribal blade]

it's not in the rotation because you just press it when you proc it

and then go back to regular priority

[livid frigate]

Use it as an eviserate

[outer orchid]

off the top of anyone's head is it worth trying to apex coup during dance or should it just be sent as you get it

didnt mean to reply

oops

[tribal blade]

maybe for more prio in aoe, but other than that you only apex SC

[outer orchid]

i figured that was the case

[peak ice]

What’s SC

[outer orchid]

supercharged cp

[tribal blade]

supercharger

[peak ice]

I can’t keep up with the abbreviations

OK sweet

[sullen hare]

./cancelaura atrophic poison

[sullen hare]

Don't even try to look at the outlaw guide then lmao

[unborn egret]

True. This character just an alt but i keep swapping between assa and sub and cant decide what i like best 🤣. The Boss dmg in keys for sub is very good, so i might just go with that

[outer orchid]

if you're just playing an alt then just play what's more fun

if you're not shooting for top 1% or 0.1% then just play for fun spec

people in group finder dont know the difference between the specs usually

[unborn egret]

Im just getting 3.4k n chillin. P casual

[livid frigate]

I’m sub and I got over 3k in but I’m pushing for 3.4 k
Last night our guild got aotc and I’m keeping up with some of the top dps we have

[sullen hare]

If they pester you to play anything else just go into discord, say "garf" and then leave and offer no explanation

[livid frigate]

Hahha nah they can’t believe my burst in my opener hahha and if I can stay on target I’m good the downtime sucks when you are waiting for ad and stuff

[hollow spear]

Don't worry, they'll believe your dps during the opener again soon enough

[livid frigate]

Also in keys it depends on how the tank pulls mobs if it’s slow and only a couple at a time my dps isn’t as good as big pulls

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Essential:

• ArcUI / BetterCDM - Enhanced Cooldown Manager.
• WangBar / SensaiBar - Resource bar (when using blizzard CDM)
• MSUF / UUF - Unit frame mods.
• Platynator - Nameplate Addon.
  Quality of Life:
• Buff Reminders - Food/Flask/Poison Reminder.
• WilduTools - QOL enhancements.
• Mute Cold Blood sound
• The first dance tracker

[lilac stag]

@tribal blade I'M READY FOR DS

[ancient leaf]

premed still bugged?

[tribal blade]

HUGE

heroic paladins

i'm gonna just play sub on paladins on reclear

[lilac stag]

It's not bugged. it's the shit design of the talent

[ancient leaf]

so still not playable yes?

[alpine wraith]

we will play premed

gameplay just came back to previous things

[lilac stag]

!premed

[wicked jolt]

• The first Ancient Arts clone cannot proc while Premeditation is up, as you are not expending any Shadow Technique stacks. Which is why it is a DPS loss to talent into it as the Shadowstrike clones with rotten up can crit insanely hard.
• There is also a bug that makes it so while Premeditation is active you cannot get a refund nor spawn the clone from Ancient Arts 3. (This does not matter much numerically, but feels weird)

[peak ice]

Do all balance druids struggle on this fight, my guild ones always got similar logs

[lilac stag]

I’m tempted if I’m in to just play sub with PP

[sullen hare]

PP?

[plush roost]

PokePower

Yknow

[sullen hare]

Ah yeah makes sense

[plush roost]

5/5 Sheer Cold PP

40/40 Growl

Type shi

[sullen hare]

I'm sitting in a hotel bed RN so I'll just look it up later or just forget about it

My brain just can't seem to get over PV which is perf veins

[outer orchid]

i'm glad we get to go back to the old build but my monkey brain wants to see the big(ger) burst still

[sullen hare]

Same but why so many bugs still 🙁

[short radish]

balance druids just struggle in general

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1118575330899263623/1120760865751314532/b3abc67591162ff5.gif

https://media.giphy.com/media/FfM4ClWXUl2pENCGl4/giphy.gif

[peak ice]

Feel like I say that and then the guild gaslights me into saying they pump

[short radish]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/783130420413202442/1430546217762426930/ezgif-2d18c8f8c1e57a.gif

if you need more balance druid slander gifs lmk

[peak ice]

Thank you I do

[short radish]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/353472085625929728/1419752002296090645/ezgif-377ba90578a958.gif

https://imgur.com/mftGPmI

hope this helps

[peak ice]

The guild name is perfect

[shrewd lantern]

why is it always the ones who dont use glyph of stars

[short radish]

idk but balance druids aren't real people

[shrewd lantern]

neither are healers

[short radish]

true

dabbling back into healing again because hpal has been buffed for the 3rd time (to compete with bottom of the meters now instead of dead last)

and its acutally just so chill healing

you just vibe

you dont crash out over doing 10k less dps

you just see hp bar go down

and press heal

then hp bar go back up

[somber sun]

xddd nice arsenal

[short radish]

i do what i can for the cause

[somber sun]

You also need some where mages blink to random places

[short radish]

https://imgur.com/aQmzFRo

[short radish]

best i can do is a DDH

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/759564659714949213/1419765116685123706/cymbaly.gif

not a blink off but a bit criminal

[somber sun]

Nah that's crazy

Hats off

[somber sun]

xddddddddddddddd

Nah I can't dude

Ty made my day

[short radish]

no wukkas

[tribal blade]

are we slandering boomies

good

[iron obsidian]

wait, is that was PP stands for? Ive always figured it was power points

[peak ice]

lmao wtf

[jade oasis]

resto sham is so fun rn

guys my myth parse average is also 90+ now i’m so happy

started out with green parses

[summer mason]

in Skyreach on the last boss , is there any way for us to skip the add mechanic? I tried using Shadowstep while falling, but it doesn’t seem to work. Can anyone confirm?

[foggy estuary]

Shadowstep works you have to time it

You can stun the bird yourself btw, just target bird, sstorm and kidney. Or try the sstep tech but u have to wait for the bird to drop you then shadowstep to boss

[short radish]

any tier rshamn is fun/meta is a good tier

[shrewd lantern]

false, df s2

[plush roost]

Absolutely no idea ngl

[jade oasis]

and every tier that priest healer is good

is a terrible tier

[alpine wraith]

it is potent powder

[west tide]

back to the sub mines on lura

[alpine wraith]

now with 3% more dmg

[ornate lake]

Just kidney/cheap it and you can cleave it

[haughty geyser]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[foggy estuary]

I would expect vanish to work with that mechanic on skyreach tbh

Like you get selected, vanish, someone else is selected. Because you vanish🤷‍♂️

In nexus point for example when u get the debuff on the engineers pack you can vanish it(or cloak ok). Same with chains on seat, and a boat load of others

[alpine wraith]

you can vanish the red fire fixate and that is better

the bird you just kidney and it is free cleave

[foggy estuary]

Yeah 100%

But im arguing for consistency sake. Guess we wouldnt want rogues now cheesing mechanics and getting invited more in m+ right?

https://tenor.com/view/we-dont-do-that-here-black-panther-tchalla-bruce-gif-16558003

[dusky yacht]

We already got rogue cheesing mechanics, even when you're targeted yourself you can target the bird, cheap or kidney it and ping it for your party

7 seconds stun if you get full cp kidney on it

[lapis ridge]

Any tips for paladins? Im struggling to find the secret sauce

[tribal blade]

use inky black potion

it's a cheat code for taht fight

because the hardest part is dodging the shields and hammers

[thorny ridge]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[foggy estuary]

Its 8 seconds and doesnt consume extra, its up to 5 afaik.

[shrewd lantern]

spending on kidney is diabolical

at least cheap you trigger umbral edge

[timid pulsar]

Evasion works for birds

[sullen hare]

Pretty sure they're talking about the kidnapping mechanic not the mark for death

Using evasion on the mark for death is a total Chad move though 💪

[timid pulsar]

Yea kidnap mechanic

I got selected, pressed evasion and bird missed me with that shit

[frank wolf]

Me after :

[shrewd lantern]

This meme would work if it didnt completely disregard mastery

[frank wolf]

Wait what

Im regarding mastery im calling it my new best friend

[keen dome]

It was always your best friend, though. You just forsook it for a week, smh.

[frank wolf]

But there is justice - my transgressions will cost me in recraft gold. Dearly.

[keen dome]

[dusky yacht]

I'm sure the 40k evis would've been so much better in that situation

[keen dome]

what if you could kidney shot allies

[sullen hare]

It would be perma CD outside of cooldowns

[frank wolf]

I used to beat the BRAKES off of my teammates when we’d get sent down to the arena in that one Theatre of Pain boss

[keen dome]

hell yeah

[rocky cave]

!stats

[wicked jolt]

The following is a general recommendation, but you will always get more accurate results through simming your gear through Top Gear.
Single Target / Mythic+: Critical Strike > Haste(roughly 700) >= Mastery > Versatility
Mythic+: Mastery >Haste(roughly 700) >= Critical Strike > Versatility

[open coyote]

just asking yall do know we can avoid the big lense flare in skyreach with a well timed vanish right?

[celest spruce]

deathstalker angle on beloren? anyone done any match on tricker/deathstalker on that fight

[short radish]

when cast is on you but before the channel starts

[open coyote]

i have been testing it and i've managed to consistently get it to cancel if i vanish around 0.1-0.4 seconds before the cast goes off

he shoots his hands in the air and then nothing happens

makes the last boss pretty easy

[astral axle]

ooc what are people running in keys in lieu of tfd, veiltouched?

[astral axle]

looks like veiltouched

[open coyote]

but that's still super worth no?

sectech has huge shadow damage

with the clones no?

[astral axle]

im not saying it isnt worth?

[open coyote]

then i misunderstood what you were asking

[vale pine]

good morning lovely people

[thorny kestrel]

hmm, can't seem to find a sub rogue streamer or youtuber. (For most recent patches). I've exhausted my usual because they're all playing outlaw or sin. Anybody know of any that is posting recent content. (mainly for mythic plus)

[alpine wraith]

yea use vanish when you get the red arrow

before the cast begins

[vale pine]

Think casualaddict plays subtlety quite a bit (streams).
I sadly don't follow youtube much, so unsure.

[robust dust]

do i need to recraft crit to mastery on wednesday reset for sub in raid? or is crit still viable if you also play assa in raid? 😄

[vale pine]

yes

[thorny kestrel]

thanks, yeah i usually check him out but he's been only playing outlaw and sin... and recently uhdk getting 360k overall so don't think he'll be playing rogue 🙁

[vale pine]

or well

[vale pine]

I am fairly certain he will test subtlety after the buffs

basicsally

we revert mostly back to what we used before cloud cover

talents, opener, gear

!sheet has updated simulations for single tatget

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[vale pine]

*target

[thorny kestrel]

yup yup, saw that. was the reason why I wanted to see if there was anybody playing it before buffs if it's even going to make that much of a difference

[vale pine]

the buff makes the sustained damage higher

[upbeat cradle]

I liked having a big burst back tho

[vale pine]

but reduces burst

which is probably a slighly benefit in m+

tho i think it will heavily depend on tuning

subtlety lost too much of its niches in Midnight to not depend on very good tuning to be played over others who didn't get the same treatment

e.g. a very good example is the removal of cleave and prio damage for no reason at all

which also went against the self set stated goal

same with dynamic in gameplay decision making

but, not much you can do. I don't blame individuals but see this as a consequence of the higher pacing they want with midnight.
It leads to more changes in lower time, which can come at the cost of quality.

[open coyote]

how does potent powder actually work, is it 20% of the mastery % so like if i spend 5cp on bp it will do 20% of 70% ie. 14% increased damage?

[plush roost]

Just looking at some logs i think sub will be very happy next week

[alpine wraith]

i mean in a real company you can blame people and those have to take responsability

but we know game companies are a team

also tbh the bugs that happen are not omegagamebreaking by their index i guess

i still cant believe the warband purge happened

[plush roost]

Damage profile sucks but you just need good prio classes like arms and ret or mm maybe?

[copper sail]

So how bad are the upcoming changes?

[plush roost]

Good

[alpine wraith]

they are not bad

we got buffed just less bursty once again

[lucid jackal]

Burst matters on 1 singular fight this tier

[alpine wraith]

but it is fine

yea and that fight got clowned

+10 secs on egg

is like

freee

[plush roost]

And that fight youre crtting zero strikes during burn anywau

Unlucjy

[copper sail]

It's like they can't decide what to do with rogue.

[vale pine]

its a net buff overall, we happy

[alpine wraith]

i wonder if DS might be more reliable than trickster

but i cba making a haste gearset

[woeful wren]

How fucked would it be to drop danse for potent and just play ds in m+

[copper sail]

good, I can't stop playing my rogue this xpac

[vale pine]

correct the buff to 2.5-4%

[alpine wraith]

ds is still very behind in aoe/cleave

[plush roost]

[vale pine]

DS is an alternative in raid on st fights, if you rly want to

it is close enough in value to not play it

[plush roost]

Ds still unda simming i find

[alpine wraith]

it might be the play on some fights like vorasius nexus king and others

where you can get reliable DN resets

and just tunnel boss

but tbh

[woeful wren]

Idk I just genuinely feel bored as sub in m+ ds at least gives something to monitor

[alpine wraith]

i cba for those jokes of a fight

now laura

idk tbh

you can only really snipe in p1

and losing the cleave is dicey

[vale pine]

possible, maybe there are some apl changes to make it better

[plush roost]

I was simming 100k on ds and did 106k on voracious with a horrible kill timer

Earlier in season

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[alpine wraith]

ds is by design less swingy than tricskter

but also the energy pooling etc does help

also the DN 1 mark snap into dance

and those are in sims

iirc

[vale pine]

DS has less damage in cooldowns, so could be that

but still seems like a noticable diffrence

[plush roost]

How come hunt then down doesnt show up in the sim breakdown

[alpine wraith]

might be joined with autos

[plush roost]

Ah clsssified under melee

[vale pine]

wdym?

[plush roost]

Ye i found it later mb

[tribal blade]

cooking DS again?

dude if we keep this trend going

sub is gonna be doing really well soon

[lucid jackal]

Sub gets an unintentional buff: flirting
Outlaw gets an unintentional buff: sexual harassment

[tribal blade]

lol that's fair

[halcyon fractal]

I presume Sub is ahead of Outlaw now or is it neck and neck?

[tribal blade]

i've said it several times, if i was outlaw i would be fuming right now

[tribal blade]

looks like gonna be somewhat equal in raid statistics maybe

but this raid's statistics are pretty fake

doesn't really tell the full story

[tribal blade]

the thing is we take these acorns of blizz not fucking us

for the cold winter months when they decide to

[maiden oar]

im fuming and im devourer

its not right

[hollow spear]

It's not like we're top of the pops anyway

We're probably middle of the pack

And I'm okay with that

[tight fjord]

I feel like none of this would have been necessary if they never nerfed black powder

The past 3 rogue rebalances

[chilly dagger]

With all the change that been coming, are we still wanting 700 haste with guidon?
But we go back to mastery heavy?
Overall, did we profit in Keys? Or are we still wanting to play Assa for the Prio?

[tight fjord]

It's all addressed on the pin

Yes, yes, yes, sin unclear

Sin is strong for that but depends on your team comp if you need prio

Subt can always just St rotation if you think it's going to end the pull faster or let you chain pull sooner

I say sacrifice the parse for key speed

Or atleast during dance use shadowstrike on the prio mob even though storm is more overall

But idk that's my take on it

[hollow spear]

I don't agree

Our single target would have been quite atrocious without the changes

[tribal blade]

more specifically you can do the prio strat of apexing every BP instead of spamming evis so you don't lose so much overall

where you force apex by striking the prio mob at full CP before BP

iirc roughly -5% but gain more prio

[tribal blade]

this is actually a very good point

[hollow spear]

Still not sure I understand that one. Is it strike-strike-bp-strike-strike-bp?

[tribal blade]

nah in aoe it would be storm>strike>BP

only if you don't proc apex

[hollow spear]

Yeah ofc implying that you didn't get apex

[tribal blade]

yeah yeah

[hollow spear]

Hm

[tribal blade]

iirc it's roughly 5% overall loss doing that

[hollow spear]

Storm-strike, interesting

[peak ice]

Sorry whys is it shadow strike and not just another storm?

[hazy breach]

Yes

[open coyote]

ty

[chilly dagger]

Apex was the thing that lets us double finisher?

[brisk onyx]

I don't think sub make bad "priority" damage that people think (of course, if you insist on comparing it to sin, then it is indeed bad, but sin is almost t0 priority damage maker in this game). This is my damage against raven/construct in 19 Skyreach

Many people speak based on their impressions

[chilly dagger]

And how do you do dmg in those pulls?

Striking the prio mob then bp?

[tribal blade]

yeah

[brisk onyx]

Yes, that's all, or you could use evis to priority attack, speed things up when the pull is almost over

[tribal blade]

yeah sub has not bad prio

[brisk onyx]

In fact, tech/coup/lashe/ub all have high priority damage (or evis/ss, if you want)

[chilly dagger]

So basically i just shadow strike in dance before bp, if i dont have the double finisher (black bars) up?

[tribal blade]

doesn't need to be in blades, but yes

[chilly dagger]

Wanted to say dance*

[tribal blade]

most likely you don't need to do this

[peak ice]

Can u not storm instead of strike?

[chilly dagger]

And outside its just storm bp

[tribal blade]

the whole point of this is to do more prio dmg

so using strike gives you more prio

[chilly dagger]

Because well have it up naturally most of the time

[tribal blade]

because strike hits pretty hard

[peak ice]

Oh righto, not just to proc ancient arts

got it

[chilly dagger]

Thanks for the info! 🙂

[tribal blade]

yeah that and it's more of a thing for higher keys

[chilly dagger]

Im just dipping the toes into 16s

[abstract cosmos]

strike gonna be so sad next weds

[tribal blade]

strike will still hit hard 😉

our dmg is gonna be a lot more stable now too

so i think it's a win tbh

we could have easily ended up in the same boat as outlaw

[abstract cosmos]

aoe wise i think we gonna pump alot more

played ptr

was fun

[tribal blade]

they fixed cloud for outlaw and they're getting ~5% nerf

they fixed cloud for sub and we're getting ~2.5% buff

[abstract cosmos]

so we still playing cloud or nah

[tribal blade]

no

[brisk onyx]

ptr lives ?

[tribal blade]

scruples now

[abstract cosmos]

was for me might be down now

havent checked at work

[abstract cosmos]

but mythic+ i think subs gonna be better

[tribal blade]

we'll see

[brisk onyx]

Hopefully, we can defeat m lura this week to avoid any unpredictable dps changes next week due to class tuning

[tribal blade]

i thought frequent tuning would be only a good thing, but i'm starting to see now that yeah it does create this weird situation

[azure thicket]

aren't a bunch of meta classes getting nerfed

[tribal blade]

they are

[azure thicket]

6 rating off 3500

wew

[drifting ether]

Got it on my alt 🥲

[tribal blade]

nice

[open coyote]

they are but they're still ahead

[tribal blade]

SV is low key gonna become the top raid spec

or close to it

[small sleet]

timed my first 20s tonight we eating good

[brisk onyx]

my hunter guildmates ask me can they call some daggers

[small sleet]

i got carried but we take those

[tribal blade]

LOL i know that feeling

[hollow spear]

How hard is devo dh getting hit?

[tribal blade]

hahaha

if they're anything like my guild's hunters

their brain cells won't be able to comprehend playing in melee

[tribal blade]

i think roughly 5% iirc

[brisk onyx]

maybe 5%

from ddh dc

[tribal blade]

which is fine

they'll still be a top performer

[small sleet]

devo and unh will still be meta in m+ even after these changes

[tribal blade]

we shall see

this might open the gates for more specs to take dev's spot tbh

[hazy breach]

Fwiw that's usually blizzards goal

[small sleet]

oh yeah i think it'd be cringe to swap the meta mid season

[tribal blade]

yeah blizz always states they don't want to shake up the meta too much

right now all dev brings is dh buff and dmg i think

[hollow spear]

Dk meta the third patch in a row

[tribal blade]

so other specs might be able to sneak in

nobody can take udk's spot though

except frost dk

[hollow spear]

Maybe I should level one, that usually means that it won't be meta the next time around

[tribal blade]

haha true

it feels unlikely they'll be tuned this well next season

[brisk onyx]

You can do that, and then a smile will appear on your face

[jaunty umbra]

its gonna be a fire mage aug meta next season

[tribal blade]

we already had that in DF /cry

not again pls

[brisk onyx]

When I easily obtained a 0.1 title using fdk in tww s2, I realized that blizzard was now focused on building a meta experience and wouldn't easily break it

[tribal blade]

waiting for rogue to finally get a dmg raid buff

then we can finally be a meta spec

[tribal blade]

wait was S2 TWW fdk or udk meta

i forget

and i got title that season too

oh yeah it was udk meta, fdk was S3

i remember there was 1 guy pushing as fdk that season haha

[brisk onyx]

Haha, so that's S3. anyway, the whole process was so easy, it felt absurd to me

[tribal blade]

i've actually never pushed as anything but rogue so i have no idea

[brisk onyx]

I only put in less than 1/10 of the effort I put into studying rogue

[tribal blade]

i was playing sub during S2 SL the first title season, but i found a group and literally never pugged

and that was when sub was meta

[tribal blade]

makes sense yeah

i'm told the upside is you get more invites, but then downside is there's a billion people playing that same spec trying to get into that same spot

but it's still better than playing off meta

[brisk onyx]

miss eon

[tribal blade]

ME TOO

i would love that to be a reaction in this channel

iirc VT or DD was a conduit then and the amp affected EoN too

i think DD

that was a really cool interaction

i would love for them to bake funnel into sub with banshee's blight

[dusky yacht]

https://tenor.com/view/slowpoke-pokemon-king-crown-gif-11621808

[shy scarab]

https://tenor.com/view/beru-solo-leveling-beru-solo-leveling-arise-solo-leveling-arise-gif-6959347451528492547

Bottom top top 13!

[stiff stirrup]

Even after buffs sub won’t be able to catch assa or outlaw in highest keys right

[lilac stag]

Are you running 22’s?

no? Then it won’t matter
yes? You know the answer and rerolled off rogue.

if you’re trying to push .1% on rogue you’ll likely be assa

for everything else play what spec makes you happy

[small sleet]

sub is fine for title level keys even now, and will be even better on tuesday

you really can play any of the rogue specs in m+ right now and do totally fine

[lilac stag]

the harder part is “perception of LFG” for title keys. The cope copying of “top” groups be a thing.

assa and its “prio” fills a niche

[small sleet]

yeah ive just found the groups that will take a rogue will take a rogue of any kind

[lilac stag]

for the most part yes (if they take a rogue)

[small sleet]

haha yeah thats the hard part

[lilac stag]

Melee comp looking arms+sv+x. The outlaw destruction makes x a harder spot to take

[small sleet]

i mean yeah motw alone makes most phys comps want feral over rogue

[lilac stag]

can’t wait to see what actually ends up live on reset

for everyone trying to knock out 3400. play what’s fun to you.

[hazy breach]

Its great when they post notes where its not clear whats gonna happen

[lilac stag]

well first we complain about not getting blue posts… so clearly we are at fault on this one.

[hazy breach]

Does surprising still work? Is 7% more damage damage +7 or x1.07? (aka does our aura go from 1.13 to 1.20 or 1.21?)

[lilac stag]

did auto attacks get included?

[hazy breach]

Is the 2 stacks of fazed for outlaw only? (presumably yes, but who knows)

[lilac stag]

it’s comical

[hazy breach]

And it really doesnt matter as it doesnt have any impact before it goes live anyway