subtlety

[stoic anchor]

agree but if maybe danse macabre or lash macabre would be buffed by like 25-30%(at least) maybe it would be interesting to use another ability in shadowdance sometimes

[vale pine]

i also liked the old danse macabre

the new version is just tuned high enough to be relevant, but boring

[plush roost]

Idk i still really want them to try either a goremaws where ur next 3 evis full cleave, or a goremaws where its a short 8 sec cd blade dance type spell

Sub has 2 key spells, surely a third is not the end of the world

When dh has 3, 4 if ur aldratchi. Druid has 3-4 etc

[fossil forge]

just give bladeflurry brah

[vale pine]

so you say, they shouldn't have removed blades?

[fossil forge]

[vale pine]

*flag

[shrewd lantern]

didnt dh get their aldrachi tier

as a hero talent

[abstract cosmos]

quick question about sub rogue im new to it and with secret tech and shadow dance why does it sometimes goes the same cd as each other and then sometimes when i press it doesnt i feel like im being stupid

[lean geyser]

Secret tech scales with haste

[abstract cosmos]

@lean geyser so the more haste u have the more low cds u get from it

[swift tinsel]

yes

a little nerfed but same idea

[bright briar]

yeah thats why i was always told to rock ab 18-21% haste

so you can fit an extra secret tech in rotation

[fair phoenix]

i will go for 200 hast build

lets check

[olive canyon]

one more button would be nice, but it does seem like just another flag replacement - goremaws changing to say "next 3 finishers dont consume combo points and increase crit effectiveness or crit by X" would add some interesting flavour to their design direction

[swift tinsel]

as long as that button isn't rupture or some clone of it

[abstract cosmos]

sitting on 19% rn

[swift tinsel]

I wouldn't mind an additional rotational button since it its very much bs/strike->evisc or storm->bp

[abstract cosmos]

in aoe sub is just bm

[swift tinsel]

outside of the 1 sectech every 18-20 sec

[rancid sierra]

@warm marlin Hey - you helped me earlier and something else came up. I was simming myself and it said to use PSB instead of my haste/crit ring. Both 276.

When I lose the haste from that ring it puts my haste at 612 with haste flask/weapon oils as you can see. Is that right it can be saying to drop to 612 haste when fully buffed?

Thanks for help, it was big earlier, in advance

I just find it so odd its telling me that it is almost +1400 dps to drop to 612 haste

[olive canyon]

its because the sim plays perfectly

[warm marlin]

612 too low, sometimes it wants too low haste

[olive canyon]

we as humans need some leeway, so thats why you go for 700 haste

[rancid sierra]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/waWjCoJcmcyyg2wSsMytMi

Well +1219 now to drop to 612 haste

So ignore it?

[warm marlin]

yeah dont go 612

[bright briar]

700-820

[abstract cosmos]

so im actually behind in haste

[bright briar]

yes if your human i would do 700 yk

[abstract cosmos]

im a nightelf

[bright briar]

shit you still get buffed so it should be same if im not wrong

[rancid sierra]

thanks

[abstract cosmos]

ill send single dps 2 secs

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/h87N9FDUFey6VavJN719ua

feel like my dps is still low for ilvl

[rancid sierra]

Look at mien above

we both 273

[abstract cosmos]

ye ik and u do nearly 5k more dps then me crazy

[rancid sierra]

well you dont have guidon trinket, thats like prob 2.8kdps~

[abstract cosmos]

ye true

[rancid sierra]

you'd have to sim it exactly

[abstract cosmos]

let me check with it on

[rancid sierra]

I can also see an upgrade you could get easy

[abstract cosmos]

whats that

[rancid sierra]

This is probably for sure an upgrade for you from your neck I'd imagine

you can go get it from pvp quest

[abstract cosmos]

sim it and its not

[rancid sierra]

really?

wow

[abstract cosmos]

let me check again

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/5o7RqnZKGutBAWFBKnzEwU

am i siming wrong

or is guidon awful for me

hello?

[cunning iron]

according to pinned message, I have to use the academy box trinket before my major CD's, so before the ShadowDance that lead into shadow blade & secret technique right ?

[abstract cosmos]

u always pre pop box

[rancid sierra]

How come you have a crit flask? @abstract cosmos How much haste do you have

[bright briar]

yeah prep trinkets before you fully send some trinkets hs passives

[abstract cosmos]

idk i was playing rogue outlaw for abit

forgot to change flasks

[bright briar]

have*

[rancid sierra]

How much haste does your rogue have

[abstract cosmos]

616

[rancid sierra]

unbuffed?

no oil or flask

[abstract cosmos]

yep

[rancid sierra]

try resim with a haste flask

i wanna see

[abstract cosmos]

ight

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/1CMEe1VcpSRkyg1nv15anZ

idk i feel like im missing something

[rancid sierra]

sec

[abstract cosmos]

i shouldnt be at 90k single target

with my sims

apprently if i craft legs or ring my dps goes to 91.500

[minor trout]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[abstract cosmos]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/mNLpAbq2jg9QCgDshQju8s @rancid sierra i swapped rings out

and this is my new dps

[rancid sierra]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/v8bFJR7yhmX4frsYspGY6n

i can do better

sec

[abstract cosmos]

hes cooking for me

keep going

[rancid sierra]

I dont know the cause of what you were simming with guidon, but it is def like 3k+~ dps like my sim i did

[raven maple]

Is anyone able to check 1 specific thing on my logs.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/pj2Qcm8wYxWTvhfg?fight=33&type=damage-done&source=6

Can anyone tell me why this guys is doing so much more damage with his ST than mines?
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/jd24bCZhTVByNzDM?fight=84&type=damage-done&source=1254

[abstract cosmos]

so its better with heart then box

thats weird

[rancid sierra]

I mean I added 2 trinkets and you're almost 96k for fun.

https://www.https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/v8bFJR7yhmX4frsYspGY6nraidbots.com/simbot/report/sdDHEseLeEbzqiYdQwH8UU

with haste flask

[abstract cosmos]

cant see

sim

[rancid sierra]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/sdDHEseLeEbzqiYdQwH8UU

all it is is trinket swaps, same iLvl

almost 6k dps

[abstract cosmos]

mental

so my gear is fine

its just my trinkets'

and pot ig

[rancid sierra]

sec

[abstract cosmos]

ye check my gear

for me too

im awful at crafting

[rancid sierra]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/pSKtTmFCiQF163xV17tqT3

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/tGk5ibdY18HR9EZTJEMoZg

+1050 dps if you make crit/mast pants

[abstract cosmos]

shame i dont have crafting sparks

[rancid sierra]

+900 for haste/mastery

[abstract cosmos]

can u double check

the dung

drops

aswell

and the novice neck

just wanna double check my gear is fine from mythic+

also tyvm for helping

[rancid sierra]

np sec

[steel zinc]

gj with the theorycrafting

[rancid sierra]

I think you have to run double sims for m+, one with haste flask and one with mastery flask becasue can change slot from haste breakpoint

[abstract cosmos]

i see

[rancid sierra]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/qkBMPpE2AHLSUgkVWR6bRg

NPX ring is 1100 dps

[abstract cosmos]

is that with haste pot ?

i have that ring

btw

i have both

[rancid sierra]

thats with haste flask, mastery flask is simmiung now

crit is good and is even better on tuesday

[abstract cosmos]

lmk what the other sim says

[rancid sierra]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2ad2zDXeNJDEW63YuVHFhA

thats with mastery flask

[abstract cosmos]

so i should run double nexus rings with haste flask

?

[rancid sierra]

but if you have how much haste? 612? you have to use haste flask for 700+

those sims are with 276 items.

so you need hero crests to upgrade ring

[abstract cosmos]

i mean

[rancid sierra]

your ring is 266, I simmed 276

[abstract cosmos]

im missing 250 hero crests

lol

[rancid sierra]

watch this

[abstract cosmos]

okok

[steel zinc]

Think about this goremaws is a capstone talent and never ever been played in any season for any amount of time and hard griefing taking it

[rancid sierra]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/6xLXHNzUbbLp1uWDBgEZEi

I gave you 250 hero crests and upgraded your shit optimally with them

with guidon trinket

[swift tinsel]

goremaws been so bad for so long it would upset the balance of the universe if they made it good

[rancid sierra]

you need to go farm crests and upgrade your shit

[abstract cosmos]

@rancid sierra FR +6 spam incoming

[fossil forge]

after an entire day of using draught of rampant abandon ive got to say its much better than lights potential

• its cheaper

[rancid sierra]

+2800 dps just from upgrading

[fossil forge]

+little minigame

[rancid sierra]

no trinket added

[abstract cosmos]

also for the rings question do i wear them rn or when there upgraded

[steel zinc]

@hazy breach why first dance is "bad" with the new talent?

Is one finality point not better then tfd?

[rancid sierra]

Ill tell you rn

[abstract cosmos]

and using mastery flask looks better

[rancid sierra]

with mastery flask its +817 right now at 266

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/fN8k7D1HmA3y2GTJiQnpta

it did some gem swaps though

but that can be dependant on flask

[abstract cosmos]

but it seems to sim better

should i change gems then ?

[rancid sierra]

what I would do if you're just going to farm crests

is just chill on the gems

and get your 250 hero crests

upgrade everythng like the sim says

THEN run a gem sim and then swap stuff if its a big diff

but swapping gems and shit now when your stats are going to chnage is not worth

[abstract cosmos]

ill just use the sim u did and run it again

[rancid sierra]

you'd have to ask other opinions\

but hero crest farm might be easier in delves

then +6's

im not %100 sure

[abstract cosmos]

how many do u get from delves

?

[honest dome]

any possibility to already sim for next weeks changes?

[rancid sierra]

I think you can get like 20-30 on t11 delves @abstract cosmos

[timid rose]

I was soloing tier 11 delves at 235 last week when I got my rogue to 90, it's a good source of hero crests and myth starters if you can do those

[rancid sierra]

more if you get the trovehunter bounty

[timid rose]

Plus you don't need to play group finder simulator

[abstract cosmos]

u get 20 from tier 11s ?

[rancid sierra]

you get 10 from nemesis box and 10 from bountiful chest i believe

if you get all 4 nemesis packs

30 if you have map

[hazy breach]

Doesnt really have much to do with the changes, i just dont think tfd is worth it unless you specifically play around it or feel like you get good value out of it

The alternatives are way better than last season

[stoic anchor]

what was the addon called that if u mouseover you see how much stat is being lost again ? true stat value or smtg

[hazy breach]

Completely irrelevant addon

Sim already includes it

[timid rose]

I got the addon that alerts with tfd and with how my tank pulls it very rarely seems to be longer than 3-4 seconds between packs

[steel zinc]

True but if I can track and play around it what would you drop starting next week for it?

[hazy breach]

Veiltouched

Again, its not anything different compared to now

[coarse raven]

hi, is it possible to sim my gear with the change of next week ? or i need to wait ?

[timid rose]

https://mimiron.raidbots.com/simbot/topgear

I think that's the beta link for sims

[hazy breach]

you can put ptr=1 in the advanced mode section instead if you want

[vale pine]

expert mode*

[karmic harbor]

With sub buffs is it's st as strong as assa?

[lilac stag]

Subs was already stronger. We just didn’t play it.

[coarse raven]

outlaw benefit more from the buff no ?

[leaden prairie]

@hazy breach last boss seat, lura, damage amp is 200% so 3x damage, is it worth it do you think to hold supercharger for it, as in dance at max cp and not finish, no sec tech either

[lilac stag]

have fun playing trickster outlaw

[leaden prairie]

after like say the first dance after the damage amp

and just hold for 2min basically

[lilac stag]

not pushing your key level, but my overall on that boss was higher just spending dances and not finishing for the amp

[leaden prairie]

key level doesnt matter

you get the same damage amp as me :D

you tried both options?

[lilac stag]

I just went in with full sc and slamming apex

[hazy breach]

Im pretty sure it wasnt worth it, but not entire sure after cloud cover

[grim wasp]

I have a crafted mh dagger myth and a hero 6/6 oh

Also have a hero crafted dagger in bag. Should i just make it myth?

[leaden prairie]

no ye im asking for rn

doing 21 seat and im unsure

i tried 19 just before while holding dance

or uh holding supercharger

[warm marlin]

how long is the amp?

[leaden prairie]

idk, didnt feel that insane

[hazy breach]

20

[leaden prairie]

long enough

idk

i can spend it all

inside

[hazy breach]

Im pretty sure its 20 atleast

[warm marlin]

presc puzzle with lust is really really strong on 20s

[ripe flame]

It is

[warm marlin]

can chain dances and get both sectec supercharged

[leaden prairie]

ye maybe i hold for the first one with lust and pot

tru

[grim wasp]

Was thinking of void forged since i got one crafted at heroic in bag already?

[karmic harbor]

Looking at logs, assa is top on boss dmg for vorasius and chim

But ig it's very close

[lucid jackal]

Theres a lot of sampling bias going on with bosses like vorasius and chimerus

[fallow nimbus]

Why do you have a crafted myth and hc dagger?

[grim wasp]

Came back after a long time had crafted hc one then instead of just spending crests i prefered to craft a myth one

[fallow nimbus]

Every craft needs crests so you atleast lost 80 hc crests

[karmic harbor]

What ilvl is hc crafted dagger?

[fallow nimbus]

272

I think

259 is crestless craft

[red flame]

They also lost sparks for no reason

[rancid sierra]

How do you guys think the buffs put sub in the melee tier? Maybe more than 1 rogue now?

[glacial locust]

we would have to get to 1 rogue to start with

[red flame]

I really hope not

[grim wasp]

I know i lost crests and sparks should i just make it myth? At worst i will spend 20 more crest on a myth weapon right?

[red flame]

The day we want more than 1 rogue is my 13th reason

[rancid sierra]

The burst and ST makes me think they are prob going to be quite good for L'ura

add burst

[grim wasp]

https://tenor.com/view/buzz-no-signs-of-intelligent-life-gif-13481205

[glacial locust]

you cant do it often enough to do every set

[red flame]

https://tenor.com/view/batman-real-true-fact-checked-fact-gif-6343207587503842551

[fair phoenix]

pls uncap crests

[shrewd lantern]

its been a month chill

not even

[alpine wraith]

yea after first screams you can dance once and just spam strike

[lucid jackal]

Melee is still really shit on last 2

[alpine wraith]

to get superchargetrs

[lucid jackal]

But it was already good on beloren and Lura

So its a lot better now

[alpine wraith]

just remember to sec tech before dance

[rancid sierra]

yeah

[alpine wraith]

so it does not use a charger but still goes on cd + you get the unseens

[graceful rock]

Do I get to play fart cloud on egg?

[alpine wraith]

next week yes

[graceful rock]

Let’s go

[alpine wraith]

we play cloud cover everywhere

[graceful rock]

Yeah I just hope it’s better than assa at egg damage

20-25% more burst makes it sound so

[raw frost]

IS PRIMARY STAT POTION better or the mastery one

[red flame]

light

[graceful rock]

You can sim it, but I think it’s primary

[lucid jackal]

It already was if you werent a noob

But it will be a lot better now ofr sure

[graceful rock]

Oh I just filtered logs

[lucid jackal]

I'm not trolling every public log is a noob

[graceful rock]

Saw some gamers on assa

[lucid jackal]

Like its unreal how noob every sub rogue parse is

[graceful rock]

Except for my public sub rogue logs

Those aren’t noob

[lucid jackal]

Nobody is use pbox? barely any attempt to prestack SC charges going into phases

Just makes no sense

[red flame]

true & real, i feel like theres a prob if im able to get a couple purple parses

i dont think im that good

[lucid jackal]

U can make sub do way more damage if u just, actually play it properly

[graceful rock]

Puzzle box sub better for burst?

[abstract cosmos]

jesus being behind on crests is so aids

[graceful rock]

Ig during lust

[lucid jackal]

Well the fight on mythic is a 2 minute fight

So why would u use a 1:30 trinket, on a 2min fight

[graceful rock]

Well you don’t get the 2nd sec tech in phase 2

[lucid jackal]

Ik @warm marlin was doing double on use nonsense as well, which makes u even stronger on egg phase

[graceful rock]

I’ll probably do some 30s sims on Tuesday to see

[warm marlin]

yeah the public logs are trolling (for egg damage)

mega

mythic gaze is better than second on use

but my passive is a renown trinket

[graceful rock]

Mythic gaze is good and all but can I offer you 2 agi staves every week?

[warm marlin]

we already have 9

our mw who has never specced brew has 2 of them

[graceful rock]

I think we’ve gotten 2 gazes period from the boss

But we’ve gotten like 8 vaelgors

[leaden prairie]

true

didnt think about that

[warm marlin]

you also only need 5 SC

can send one sectec in dance

[hallow mortar]

just like that?

[coarse raven]

hi, is it possible to get my log reviewed ? i think i do low dmg in M+ and i dont know what i can improve
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/KBm6VwbknAGCx29t?fight=29&type=damage-done&source=786

[woven quail]

has anyone noticed our Akaari's soul counting as an extra dps on logs?

I main assa but did a hc pug on sub and noticed Akaaris soul did 5k on its own in the log on chimearas

[hazy breach]

Yeah if you are in the in other realm as the person logging

Or more than 100 yards away

That will happen

[hallow mortar]

yeah i start running my own logs becasuse of that 😄

not like im public puhsing them but i just started recording mythic raids

[dense coyote]

Are we gonna be better than assa after 12.0.5

[fair phoenix]

where i can turn on e xpert mode

[river igloo]

Hiya
Quick question
I simmed my character in AoE (5Target) and noticed that sometimes the sim will show that it uses Shadowstrike even in AoE. Why is that?

[vale pine]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[vale pine]

^ thats why

[fair phoenix]

i need to open the tab on downstairs, thats why i dindt find

[river igloo]

Ahhh, thank you!

[fair phoenix]

tyty

[forest moss]

!stats

[wicked jolt]

The following is a general recommendation, but you will always get more accurate results through simming your gear through Top Gear.
Single Target / Mythic+: Mastery >= `Haste(~18%, roughly 650-700)` > `Critical Strike` > Versatility

[graceful osprey]

Another week of raid and first boss of voidspire dropped double shield…again

[river igloo]

How big of a gain is it to do this in AoE? Do you do it for Trickster as well?

[lilac stag]

because that’s literally the only thing assa can do. Run DS on both those bosses and you’re doing more dmg.

[exotic steeple]

can i read somewhere about the 12.05 rotation?

opener etc.?

i did i dont see the rotation there

[hazy breach]

Theres nothing different

[exotic steeple]

just the backstab to 7 cp?

[hazy breach]

Besides the opener

Which is mentioned

[rancid sierra]

I JUST LEARNED, acuity of the ren'dorei wep enchant can be on both weps?

i thought it didnt work like that

[hallow mortar]

i run some sims to look at this new stuff we getting, was suprised how close is bp talent to wm on 3T

[fair phoenix]

at case for backstab until 7 cp, we can shuriken storm until 7 cp for aoe?

[alpine wraith]

yea

also in m+ ending at high cp in a pull you dont snd randomly like before

you just keep the cps

[honest basin]

I still do it every now and then bc of stupid muscle memory

I miss my cdr

[red flame]

is this 12.0.5 or current as well

[alpine wraith]

12.0.5

[tribal blade]

no downside to doing it right now, only next reset it'll kinda matter

[alpine wraith]

now it is whatever

because first strike fills cps

[tribal blade]

but it realisitically only adds 1 more gcd before going into dance

so it's not a big deal

[alpine wraith]

it can be way more depending on target count and current cp

or if it is a boss

[tribal blade]

they seriously need to make premed give sht

[ivory leaf]

if we're simming for m+ kinda stuff do we like dungeon slice or patchwerk 5 targets?

[alpine wraith]

slice

we never do 5 target sims anymore kinda

[ivory leaf]

roger, thank you

[tribal blade]

wtf did the tank do wrong if in the 1st pull of AA he's gathering and i open up with tricks and get aggro

after casting strike

i should say i didn't get the snap aggro problem of strike

it was after that

[summer lynx]

Question, for my opener. In my second dance Secret tech comes off CD after I used my two supercharged CPs are used. Should I hold Secret for my third dance or just use un supercharged in my second?

[tribal blade]

send it

[plush roost]

Theres something weird with those mobs

I get aggro all the time

Ive just started pressing evasion on pull

[tribal blade]

mmm ok, it never happens to me so thought it must be tank issue

[tribal blade]

good idea

[plush roost]

Pretty sure

I has to do with them tagging big mob

And moving

And the smallies aggro table resetting randomly

[steel zinc]

Why are we not taking premed instead of healing talent???

That makes 0 sense to me

[steel zinc]

lol so in opener we just basically need to ramp with bs and then into cds? 😄

ty btw haptics

[plush roost]

Yea

Is what it is

[mental saffron]

Does weapon enchants on mainhand have more proc uptime than OH?

[spiral needle]

I imagine you can vanish/SS to help it a little bit...unless vanish is saved for something important?

[hallow mortar]

back to ramping like with flag 😄

[vernal drum]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Light's Potential
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[shrewd lantern]

flag ramping was, pressing 1 gcd before the rupture

[hallow mortar]

yeah but than you had to spend gcd on flag rupture

so basically the same before you actually get to do dmg

[shrewd lantern]

well that was because rupture existed

[hallow mortar]

and flag existed

[arctic heart]

629 + guidon hc, need to find more haste?

[shrewd lantern]

you want 700 before guidon

[arctic heart]

holy fuck

[shrewd lantern]

or 684

whatever the chart says

[hallow mortar]

but i can see that some bosses this will fuck up lining up

[arctic heart]

wheeeeeeere

someone can send me a character with 700 haste

to compare

if possible ofc

[shrewd lantern]

its a bot command

[hallow mortar]

how many backstabs are we going to press in raid ? 2?

[shrewd lantern]

so in theory yes you can play 587 if you're confident you have 0 lag/delay

[swift tinsel]

and don't cast coup

[timid rose]

Is guidon really more just a st trinket? My sims keep putting it below my current trinkets for dslice

[shrewd lantern]

ideally you probably want to vanish strike between your 2 dances in sb

to get another strike with 3 fazed stacks

and hope it crits

[spiral needle]

yea that hit me after i posted it

Does SS work properly with 1 faze and just not 3? Weird bug

[shrewd lantern]

wdym

[spiral needle]

Eleem's pin says faze isn't buffing its damage

I assume it works on 1 atleast, because that'd be a pretty major bug to go unnoticed this long?

[honest basin]

fazed increases finisher dmg

not generator dmg

if thats what you mean

[shrewd lantern]

yeah strike damage buffed by the other talent

probably some weird nelf tech to meld strike

in raid now

[spiral needle]

Oh, the ingame tool tip is just wrong?

Just says more damage, lame

[shrewd lantern]

idk i never read the fazed tooltip

I listen to what the tcs pin and dont read

[spiral needle]

Yea, it just says more damage

Fix ur tooltips or make it work on SS so sub can be stronger just imo

[shrewd lantern]

i didnt even know PV changed this expac until last week

[short radish]

i just copy the top chinese rogues build and do whatever they do

[honest basin]

based tbh

[spiral needle]

cant go wrong with that

[shrewd lantern]

also i didnt realize weaponmaster got reworkd

until first week of this raid

[spiral needle]

they always finding something

[shrewd lantern]

this is how much i read talents

[shrewd lantern]

arent those guys full sending mastery

with 0 haste

[honest basin]

i read talents enough to see they misspelled "shuriken" in the shuriken tornado talent

but ig they fixed it now, dont see it anymore

oh wait

its dark shadow

ggs multibillion dollar company has no spellcheck

[lilac stag]

He’s from the future. It’s fine.

[final gulch]

full sending mastery is pretty broken for keys though ngl

[honest basin]

if you dont take the haste talents you dont need haste

[shrewd lantern]

i mean thats loosely what the pvpers do

or well, they often only go for 1 extra gcd

[honest basin]

dont need extra gcds if your sectech instakills

[spiral needle]

secret to beating tanks on vanguard: 0 haste

[honest basin]

pvp unironically fun this tier, ive had to find smth else to do while ive been out for every boss in voidspire

[short radish]

yes

[shrewd lantern]

my fun part about shuffle is people saying to "just" kill a mage

who has 2 blink charges

that break stuns

[dire ravine]

For the new raid build- are we still going to drop WM for PP in AOE fights?

[honest void]

backstab to 7 pts makes me wanna commit crimes in the Tri-State area

[tribal blade]

probably

[dire ravine]

You’re thinking too local. Think contiguous US.

[shrewd lantern]

My condolences you live there.

[tribal blade]

could see the situation where WM hits of strike hit so hard you want to keep it talented

[somber sun]

close your eyes while you do it

I also mute the game

go back to default at 7

[arctic heart]

there no way to maintain premed?

[red flame]

this is wild af lmaooooo

[slate matrix]

would someone be willing to check out my thread and give me advice for sub plz? Its been a few weeks since i posted it and no one has checked yet 🙁

[hazy lichen]

do we still take premed

[alpine wraith]

after patch not really

[cloud barn]

is cloud cover visible to everyone or just us?

[upbeat sorrel]

12.0.5 buff looks juicy will we get invited to keys over dk's now

[short radish]

lol no

[lucid jackal]

its visable to everybody

[cloud barn]

Lollll

This is gonna be a blast

[short radish]

i cant wait to tell everyone "get in teh smoke bomb"

and gaslamp them into thinking its a DR

[cloud barn]

“I can’t see the abilities”

Ok but do you see my dps

[frail kindle]

praise be to cloud cover

[upbeat sorrel]

didnt smoke bomb used to be

a pve DR

once upon a time

[haughty geyser]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lucid jackal]

It used to be like pvp smoke bomb and a DR

where it'd break LOS

but in legion, they made it a PVP talent, without the DR, and gave darkness to DH

[raw frost]

So basicLlyb

Basically for the full duration of shadow blades you have the cloud buff

Right ?

[lucid jackal]

Yep

[raw frost]

Really good

Even in ST thats a good chunk. Of dmg

[lucid jackal]

its 20% more damage in CDs

very good

[raw frost]

I mean its more dmg from the cloud buff itself and benefiting more from shadow blades

Its like in the 20 sec burst window you need to throw everything

To be optimal

Pump as much as you can to benefit on maximum

[wintry heart]

Think I can get away with 690 haste in m+? Would like to run Mastery flask again, but dont want my ST to tank

[lucid jackal]

Yeah

[raw frost]

Btw you wont use premediation , but if there is trash before the boss at least the first try , you can stack shadow tech and when you stealth shadow strike , its like you have it anyway xd

[lucid jackal]

The actual cutoff for haste is 684

[wintry heart]

https://tenor.com/view/john-john-crypto-john-the-coin-memecoin-red-candle-gif-3746997840446702790

Mastery stonks

[raw frost]

And the apex talent will benefit

I have a question , can you start bosses with 2 supercharched points before hand

[lilac stag]

Yes

[raw frost]

How long they stay

[lilac stag]

Any more than two are removed

Same in keys

[raw frost]

When i go in combat and use shadow dance i had 4

Thats good for initial burst xd

[lilac stag]

You have the two you saved + two for using dance

[raw frost]

Yes perfect

[wintry heart]

Finally

[lament ravine]

I currently have 633 haste, and all sims are telling me to put crit enchants or gems in my gear instead of hitting that 650 haste in the wowhead guide (ST Trickster sims)

Would someone be able to explain why? Or should I ignore sims and go for that 650-700 breakpoint

[lilac stag]

subtlety do low damage (“精妙”专精的伤害较低) get 700 haste from stats (通过属性面板获取 700 点急速) perecent does not matter (百分比数值并不重要) robot needs less haste than dad with 3 kids (机器人所需的急速比那位带着三个孩子的“老爸”要少)
enjoy bench (“老爸”要少)

[tribal blade]

@short radish hit me with the buff copy pasta again

[short radish]

PLEASE GIVE THE GREEN STONE OF HEALTH 健康の緑の石をお願いします Piedra verde de la salud por favor 请健康的绿色石头 placet dabo in viridi lapis in salutem

PLEASE DROP THE CLOSET OF SUMMONING 请放下召唤的壁橱 Por favor dejar el armario de convocatoria 召喚のクローゼットを落としてくださいSodes stillo conlocatio

PLEASE PLACE THE PURPLE STONE OF RESURRECTION 请放置紫色复活石 Por favor, coloque la piedra púrpura de la resurrección 紫の復活石を置いてください Quaeso pone lapidem purpureum resurrectionis

PLEASE DROP THE GATE OF TRANSPORTATION 请放下交通之门 Por favor suelte la puerta de transporte 輸送のゲートを降ろしてください Commodo vehicula porta dui

PLEASE DROP THE TABLE OF MAGE FOOD 请放下魔法食物的桌子 Por favor dejen la mesa de comida de mago メイジフードのテーブルをドロップしてください Iacta mensa magi victus

PLEASE ENABLE THE ROAR OF BATTLE 请启用战斗的咆哮 Habilita el rugido de la batalla 咆哮を有効にしてください Quaeso, ut sonitus pugnae

PLEASE GIVE THE TOKEN OF WILDERNESS 请赐予荒野信物 Por favor, da la senal del desierto 荒野のトークンをください Da mihi signum in deserto

PLEASE GIVE THE BOON OF FORTITUDE 请赐予坚毅之恩 Por favor, da la bendición de la fortaleza 不屈の恵みをください Da munus fortitudinis

PLEASE GIVE THE FORTITUDE OF STRONG WORD 请赐予强词夺理的刚毅 Por favor da la fortaleza de las palabras fuertes 強い言葉の不屈の精神をください Da verba fortitudinis fortitudinis

PLEASE CAST THE BRONZE BLESSING 请施放青铜祝福 Por favor lanza la Bendición de Bronce ブロンズブレッシングを唱えてください Placet mittere benedictionem aeneam

Glory to the CHINESE COMMUNIST PARTY干得好 we are declare war for indonesian 你被中共开除出党 are gold bots 中华business thievs中华. 公开处决 DO NOT buying glod from indonsia. you have been warninged 中华人民共和国

PLEASE CAST THE FURY OF THE SKY 請釋放天空的怒火 Por favor, desata la furia del cielo 空の怒りを投げかける Quaeso, iram caeli effunde.

just made the skyfury one as well

[haughty heart]

No first dance? in m+? cause of chain pulls or what

[dusky yacht]

I fking did it boss

Anybody know how I can drop 3 haste rating /s

[leaden prairie]

why no french ..

[dusky yacht]

Pourquoi pas francais monsieur

[leaden prairie]

oui oui

baguette du fromage

[dusky yacht]

https://giphy.com/gifs/29N7io9xsCMaA

[leaden prairie]

je parlé francais

[dusky yacht]

Tres bien

[tribal blade]

wee wee

je swee le tab le

[dusky yacht]

Quelle bordelle

[short radish]

fr*nch is banned

[tribal blade]

no se

que?

upsidedownquestionmark

[dusky yacht]

Lo siento senorita no hablo espanol

[tribal blade]

oh si si

[leaden prairie]

yayayaya

[dusky yacht]

ajajajaj

[leaden prairie]

oh fuck is it the wrong one

i dont speak spanish very well

[dusky yacht]

You're so washed bro

It's over

[leaden prairie]

my bad lil cuh

[dusky yacht]

How will you ever recover

[plush roost]

Alt code 0191 buddy

¿

[tribal blade]

oh good looking out

[alpine wraith]

?¿

[buoyant shale]

Assuming you have a myth guidon which should you voidforge(or whatever the ilvl upgrade is called) first. Guidon or weapon?

[jagged hamlet]

weapon is almost certainly going to be the play

[dusky yacht]

Upgrade weapon (升级武器) Damage big (伤害大) Strike foe from shadow (从阴影中袭击敌人) Daily !vibe in offtopic (每日！闲聊氛围)

[naive creek]

!guidon

[wicked jolt]

Trickster Shadow Blades Optimization:
During Shadow Blades, line up your second Shadow Dance with the last 8 seconds of Shadow Blades instead of using them back-to-back. This allows you to fit another Secret Technique into Shadow Blades+Shadow Dance. It will not be supercharged but thats ok in this scenario.

[civic lava]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[tribal blade]

well we're being sat on crown boys

after having literally this on heroic crown today

[dry flame]

what about P3 dmg punk?

(im joking, sucks that you are sat for it)

[cloud barn]

Did you tell them cloud is coming

[tribal blade]

ATROPHIC SUCH AN AMAZING RAID BUFF

[tribal blade]

i highly doubt that would change anything

the reason i'm being sat is definitely not performance or throughput

[cloud barn]

Low vis high dps inc

[dry flame]

if it makes you feel better, i got backstabbed by my own fellow rogue (i won't tag him) this week, after I pumped Chim crazy style

[tribal blade]

damn /cry

[dry flame]

at least trinket went to one of us, but i was salty for sure

[dusky yacht]

I don't think anybody can blame you for that

Prolly took it better than most would lmao

[dry flame]

i did pug imperator yesterday and got myth helm, so that's my first ilvl bump in 3 weeks

[tribal blade]

i'm actually so over this raid tier

this might be one of the worst raid tiers i've ever done

[dry flame]

well, at least you're with a guild, im full pug

[short radish]

should have padded on p1 adds harder bucko

[tribal blade]

solely for the fact that i'm watching turbo horrible players be in for bosses just because their specs are insanely OP

[short radish]

but yeah fuck this tier

donkey ass tier

donkey ass bosses

donkey ass design

[tribal blade]

yeah this is just awful

[dry flame]

this is as far as i have pushed my character through pugging (currently with crit flask and oils, cuz im M+ as assa)

[lucid jackal]

The raid is p fun

Its just rogue bad on last 2

gg

[tribal blade]

not bad!

[tribal blade]

there's no way sub is bad on belo after reset right?

[dry flame]

I imagine we're crit-flasking for ST after reset?

[tribal blade]

i already recrafted a piece to prepare for it

[dry flame]

i got kinda lucky in that regard - i wanted my crafted pieces to be usable for all 3 specs, so my boots and neck are crit/haste

[short radish]

i've already recraft everything to crit/haste for sin anyway

[dry flame]

only my dagger is haste/mastery

[tribal blade]

that's exactly what i just did haha

[tribal blade]

i have over gold cap so i can recraft as much as i want 😉

[dry flame]

Damn, i was never good at making gold

i did make a little bit since the start of expansion, but nothing crazy

[tribal blade]

it just mostly takes time

if you want an easy vibe way to make gold

fly around zul'aman and loot treasures

[dry flame]

BoEs?

[tribal blade]

yeah

i made an insane amount of gold off them

[lucid jackal]

Its not even bad rn

[tribal blade]

before raid dropped

[lucid jackal]

THere too much larp about rogue

rogue is bad on last 2

thats it

last 2 of voidspire

Theres too much larp about rogue on march

[tribal blade]

OH right

[lucid jackal]

Rogue is good in march

[tribal blade]

i thought you meant march haha

mb mb

[dry flame]

How's Assa doing in March? or CDs not great?

[raw wadi]

Beloren strong on egg...

[dry flame]

regardless, im waiting for the big Belo Myth nerfs so i can try pugging it ;d

[short radish]

you might be waiting a while

[dry flame]

I did try it on HC yesterday (the 1 egg cheese), but not sure how 203k compares, will have to run it as Sub next week to check

[tribal blade]

sub is about to absolutely crank the egg phase

[dry flame]

haha yeah, idk if it would even be a fair comparison after reset

[short radish]

i am a bit excited for reset

[tribal blade]

ME TOO

[short radish]

crown dies tonight

if raid locks in

some minor prog to see start of fight on birb

then next week

we get a mythic guidon

surely

and i go into birb

AND NOT HAVE TO CHANNEL PBOX

[dry flame]

Are the changes gonna help us in M+?

[tribal blade]

does cloud cover make guidon better than puzzle

i assume it does

[dry flame]

we'll be more durable, that's for sure

atm i feel very much like paper on Assa in 16/17s

if sub pulls well after reset, might be nice to be tankier

[lucid jackal]

The spec does more damage

[tribal blade]

it's hard to say if people will swap back to sub because sin's dmg profile is just so good

[lucid jackal]

therefore itll be better

[cloud barn]

Mast stocks out crit stocks in?

[lucid jackal]

Its not rocket science

[tribal blade]

but sub is about to be nuking stuff in keys

[tribal blade]

what's the consensus on outlaw?

[lucid jackal]

It will also be better

[tribal blade]

i saw some people dooming about playing trickster

and all the shenanigans that goes along with it

[lucid jackal]

That channel is negative about literally every change that happens to the spec

Literally no matter what happens

[tribal blade]

LOL fair enough

[lucid jackal]

However, trickster does have to play with "less passive resources" cuz FB comes with a few

You have to play with Killing spree, which is devicive

[tribal blade]

yeah FB feels amazing to play on OL and sin

[lucid jackal]

and then the finisher rules are adjusted which some ppl act as if the world is going to end based on that fact

[tribal blade]

i really hate DS

KS

[lucid jackal]

U can technically not play KS, lose 2% st

and still be like, 11% better than fb if u wanted

[tribal blade]

oh shit

what do you lose mostly, fazed uptime?

[dry flame]

It's still comforting to hear

[tribal blade]

oh less coup casts too if you do that

[dry flame]

I am doing my best to be positive this tier

[tribal blade]

this tier is really testing my ability to be positive lol

[short radish]

you and guy. the only 2 positive rogues in existance

im still a negative nancy

damage buffs are nice

fundamental problems of rogue still there

community perceptions of rogue still there

[tribal blade]

i'm very happy about cloud cover

but yeah core problems still remain

and will always remain if blizz doesn't do anything

[short radish]

https://tenor.com/view/explain-gif-21856831

me trying to explain to the party leader next week how i now do really good burst damage

and will still be declined for a dk/aug

[tribal blade]

LOL and it's true

[short radish]

damn you do burst damage? so does devourer DH

[lucid jackal]

Yeah just fazed uptime

Probs bigger loss in aoe cuz the ao application

[tribal blade]

that's true yeah

they could have just used blade rush instead as the cd

and adjusted BR's cd

[dry flame]

We can only become the change we wanna see in the world

https://tenor.com/view/predator-arnold-schwarzenegger-hand-shake-arms-gif-3468629

[lucid jackal]

The core problems of

checks notes

Being undertuned

[dry flame]

Undertuned, but I am really enjoying that i can play all 3 specs this season (at least in M+)

[tribal blade]

i'm a little confused by the entire

"blizz doesn't care about M+ tuning, only raid"

but then when it comes to rogue

suddenly they care about key tuning

[dusky yacht]

Gz bro

[dry flame]

Nah, real GZ is to you, who doesn't need to do more Nexus runs XD

[dry flame]

I find it funny at this point

well us and Guardian druids

[tribal blade]

it's just kinda hilarious that tier after tier of rogue specs being piss poor in keys and then getting the "blizz only cares about raid tuning" in response

HOW THE TURN TABLES

[dry flame]

I think ever since BFA, they're too scared for Rogue to be dominant in M+

[tribal blade]

well rogue has been very good in keys recently to be fair

the major issue though is no real raid buff

[dry flame]

even though i don't get it, because other classes have been super dominant in multiple MDI tournaments

[tribal blade]

yeah blizz is clearly more willing to let favorite child classes be OP

[dry flame]

peperige farm remembers

[tribal blade]

i don't even remember this

and i've played wow since 2005

[dry flame]

it was WoD 😄

Multistrike

[tribal blade]

yeah i loved multistrike

[dry flame]

caused too many problems for them haha

and made ele sham mastery obsolete

[tribal blade]

rupture multistrikes was so much fun

[dry flame]

HFC Sub was one of my favourite iterations of the spec

there were a lot of shenanigans then though, where we needed TBC and MoP 2-sets for prepull to get max SnD

and i had cloth gear for "prepull set" for max mastery

to juice the SnD to the max

[short radish]

holy shit even i forgot about this

though i dont think i played wod

all i remember was HAT

[tribal blade]

i remember hat for sure

[dry flame]

im drawing a blank, hat?

[short radish]

yeah no cap

[tribal blade]

honor amongst thieves

[dry flame]

oooooh

[tribal blade]

old sht basically

[dry flame]

that was different

forgot the name

where we could store up to 10 cp

it was a talent

[tribal blade]

anticipation

i think

[dry flame]

think so yeah

[tribal blade]

i miss that too

[dusky yacht]

I still look at the ring every time I log on bro

[tribal blade]

although sht is basically anticipation now

[dry flame]

Oh i found this classic:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lKbXmhCPtU

[vagrant fossil]

With the recent changes it might not be worth running the nexus point set though since you could have a lot more crit

[tribal blade]

you still need haste

and mast will still be a good stat

[vagrant fossil]

Yea, but swap the haste mast one for POS ring with crit haste. And then there's possibly an argument for POS neck over alleria neck if you have that I guess

[tribal blade]

i dunno how much crit we'll be going

[lucid jackal]

I feel like ppl underindexed how much crit u wanted even right now on live

and are overindexing how much more value crit is now

[tribal blade]

but i don't think we'll be full blasting crit only

[vagrant fossil]

All my sims are currently saying swap haste/mast ring and alleria neck, even though alleria neck is not completely simmable

[tribal blade]

sims will do that when you're over haste breakpoint

[vagrant fossil]

Yea, but changing those 2 keeps me at the 700 haste mark

It's basically just moving stats off mastery and into crit

[tribal blade]

yeah makes sense, that happens to most people's sims

especially when people go too hard into mast

[vagrant fossil]

Well, it's only happened because of how buffed crit damage gets with cloud cover

[tribal blade]

oh i thought you meant for current sims

how much crit is it trying to get you to

like the rough %

[lucid jackal]

My sims always have told me to keep like

equal crit to mastery more or less

[tribal blade]

i basically do that too yeah

[lucid jackal]

Idk what ppl are simming where they are like, mega mastery stacking with no crit or w.e

I also dont even know what gear would even allow u to flex so much stats

[tribal blade]

i just got to 800 buffed crit

[lucid jackal]

U need the 700 haste, u have tier, and then its just like, crit or vers

and crit is better than vers

[tribal blade]

yeah crit about to be WAY better than vers

[keen dome]

Recrafted stuff, maybe? That's been my guess on some of the weirder sim situations.

[vagrant fossil]

About 38-39%

[tribal blade]

took this from vault one week which was pretty feels bad

[keen dome]

imagine if we could reforge....

[tribal blade]

TRUE

it's w/e though, i just hear whispyr's voice in my head

STATS DON'T MATTER

[keen dome]

Yeah

And he's right

[vagrant fossil]

I mean, I don't see how vers is worth anything really

[tribal blade]

it gives dmg

haha

[vagrant fossil]

Mastery increases damage on finishers and scales faster than vers

[keen dome]

And DR. but it's also w/e.

[tribal blade]

it's not a completely dead stat

[keen dome]

It has value but it's value is immensely smaller than what you'd gain from crit / mastery.

[tribal blade]

but yeah not great

[keen dome]

I have 25% crit atm, which is a nice figure

[vagrant fossil]

It was just from what Foreverguy said

[tribal blade]

i'm at 29% unbuffed atm

[keen dome]

Damn

How much mastery?

[tribal blade]

685 unbuffed

[vagrant fossil]

This is mine unbuffed

[tribal blade]

with mast flask it's roughly 800 or so

[keen dome]

okay that's the dispairty then

Yeah

715 unbuffed mastery atm

[vagrant fossil]

687, 721, 757 / Crit, haste, mast

[keen dome]

I'll probblay recraft stuff to crit/mast as I gain more haste from taking stuff to 6/6 myth

[tribal blade]

i suspect on reset if i need crit i can literally just slap on a crit flask and be good

[keen dome]

Yeah same probably

[vagrant fossil]

I am ready for it to be like "ye, you can swap over to crit items and then go crit flask as well"

[keen dome]

if I get Gaze then that's a solid 100+ extra mastery

[dry flame]

And 100% concentrated power of will

[keen dome]

I'll probably swap my gems to crit / mastery too

Once I can drop the haste on them

[leaden prairie]

how come sometimes my sim will not send 2 dances in cd

is that real

[dry flame]

Gemming optimization is hard, since I don't wanna swap gems every time I swap specs

[vagrant fossil]

It shouldn't be

[leaden prairie]

but is there something im missing

where you would do that

or is it just sim weirdness

[vagrant fossil]

Sim weirdness atm

[dry flame]

You have Guidon ye, Zac?

[leaden prairie]

ok stop sandbagging sims

[leaden prairie]

nah

or well i do but

im not playing it for what im simming rn

[dry flame]

Maybe it only sends 2 dances during lust then

[leaden prairie]

no lust

[dry flame]

Hmm

[keen dome]

Maybe the sim is cheating

[leaden prairie]

i wanted to sim last boss seat

to see if it was worth doing weird things

before amp

[dry flame]

It's what? Like a minute into pull, the amp

[leaden prairie]

but i encountered things where it doesnt send 2 dances in cd and prefer to hold it for after to sync with sec tech

[leaden prairie]

we delay

so 1min40

and then 2 min after

we arent not entirely sure if its worth it to delay yet but

trying stuffs out

i just mostly want to figure out for myself if i should be inting my damage out of damage amp for damage amp

and if so how much

[dry flame]

Guess it could be nice for 2x DB yeah

If no delay, just play , send KB on pull and full blast Amp

[leaden prairie]

eh

[dry flame]

Assa actually pretty strong for seat

Every pull is bug prio

[leaden prairie]

sub is better for these damage amps especially next week

[dry flame]

2nd boss

[leaden prairie]

i swap off

before last boss

im not doing an entire key as sub

im outlaw

[dry flame]

Ah I see

[leaden prairie]

me outlaw guns

[tribal blade]

everything leading up to last boss is pretty miserable as sub tbh

[leaden prairie]

not great as outlaw either dw

[dry flame]

How do you exit fast to respec after 3rd boss?

[vagrant fossil]

I was wondering. I legit thought you were simming for raid or something because officers had said you were benched if not on sub or something lmao

[leaden prairie]

tp out

you legit comes in before the rp is finished

thats how long that cringe rp is

[tribal blade]

how much RP time is there

[keen dome]

I find the entire dungeon miserable

[tribal blade]

also where do you zone in

[leaden prairie]

infinite

in front of the door from the last boss room

like outside

[tribal blade]

ah ok

[leaden prairie]

the room

[tribal blade]

so that's chill then

[leaden prairie]

in front of corridor

ye

[keen dome]

that's a nice swap

[leaden prairie]

and you comes back in before the rp is even finished so

kidna cringe honestly

how long that rp is

[tribal blade]

imagine if you had to run the entire length of the dungeon lol

[keen dome]

Yeah..

[vagrant fossil]

It's crazy they haven't changed that part

[leaden prairie]

well there is a respawn point on every boss kill now

[tribal blade]

true yeah

[dry flame]

It's crazy people keep voting for AA

I'm tired boss

[keen dome]

I wonder if there's an issue with how older dungeons are setup and it's like. There's just one version and they can't easily change it without changing it for all the vrsions

[leaden prairie]

academy feels kinda boring nowadays

idk

[tribal blade]

that RP is not nearly as cringe as others in the past

[leaden prairie]

there is nothing interesting about the dungeon anymore

people just like doing first pull

[keen dome]

first pull is funny

Also I like how the dragon says "...Birds.."

[tribal blade]

i've watched a bunch of tanks flop over in 1st pull

[dry flame]

They are changing them, but not always for the better yeah

[vagrant fossil]

My tanks tend to make it past the first pull, all the way to last boss

Stay in an area with 8 orb spawns and then die

[keen dome]

I did a few AA weeklies and people do not know how to play the final boss in pugs

[vagrant fossil]

I gave up

[keen dome]

Entire room randomly full of pools and orbs

[vagrant fossil]

It's staying a 12 until I end up playing the key with my guildmates for push

[dry flame]

Academy is so aids with pugging. Half the time tanks either don't kite first pull well or their routing and tank position is crazy bad - like the big slammers at the end, they pull 3 at once and don't tank on a corner to los

[keen dome]

First pull AA chaos is nature healing

[tribal blade]

i'm not currently title pushing so i'm with you there

[alpine wraith]

enough to get 2 dance worth of superchargers almost

[tribal blade]

i was trying to get that timed on 15 today

[keen dome]

I believe

[tribal blade]

let me tell you about players in 15s

[alpine wraith]

so you begin with 6 or 7 chargets

[tribal blade]

that's actually pretty hot

[dry flame]

I'm purely pug lord, currently at 3333 io, and no matter how much I optimize and blast, none of it matters, when I lose 20+ k overall from just bad pulls

[alpine wraith]

just depends on how you ended boss

[tribal blade]

yeah tanks hold your dps in the palm of their hands

[alpine wraith]

if you only have 1 charge and second is like 12 secs after

dont send the second

[keen dome]

The best thing I did was make friends with a few pure tank players who play at a high level and pug.

I highly recommend trying to find a few yourself

[dry flame]

So many times on Assa I ask for funnels and either they don't bring any or others full CD aoe nuke everything

[keen dome]

They will always try to get you to run keys with them

[vagrant fossil]

Playing with a good tank is like playing a different game

[tribal blade]

honestly kind of a low key problem haha

[dry flame]

Like even AA tree - BM top dmg, but then actual boss dmg I did 6M more

[keen dome]

ethical damage

[tribal blade]

i just spam BP on tree boss

[dry flame]

16s, best I can pug atm

[tribal blade]

don't hold anything for add sets really

and can top doing that

[keen dome]

that's real good imo

[tribal blade]

you find a lot of those issues go away the higher in key level you go

[dry flame]

How high boss, I need to get over that barrier (or find friends to push with)

[tribal blade]

if you want to do very streamlined keys you want to be playing around title cutoff area

it's a big difference

[charred pawn]

What trinkets are you guys running in m+? Torn between puzzle box and guidon

[dry flame]

Sub I run Guidon regardless

Assa puzzle

Outlaw, aleria trinket

[keen dome]

Yeah, Guidon in M+ and Raid here.

Puzzle in bin

[charred pawn]

Thanks. Was thinking of running guidon, cause holding blades for 30 sec to align with puzzle feels horrible

[small sleet]

If you run puzzle box you just use it every other blades

That being said

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1035163024480276640/1495101632759730388/puzzle_box_1.gif

[dry flame]

You don't hold blades with puzzle

You use it as 3 min CD with every other Blades

[charred pawn]

Haven't thought of that. Do you reckon sub overthrows assa after patch in m+?

[dry flame]

[tribal blade]

also holding blades becomes even worse after reset

unless you hold for a big event

[dry flame]

Probably not in high keys, just because Prio dmg is invaluable

but anything under 15 should be even better after reset

[tribal blade]

i suspect with this change sub will become what it was during S3 of TWW

nuclear burst spec with high overall dmg

but "paddy" overall

i'm guessing like high A tier

[dry flame]

aren't we already big padawans ? 😄

[tribal blade]

or mid A tier

[tribal blade]

lol yeah

i put paddy in quotes because i feel like it's sub rogue stigma

other specs can be paddy overall with not much prio but it's fine

[short radish]

rogue does any damage to adds? must be pad damage

[tribal blade]

ever since sub had funnel

and lost it

now everything we do is considered pad

for some reason

[tribal blade]

EXACTLY

i'm looking at boomies

fucking starfalling everything

and that's ethical aoe

sub presses BP

padding

[short radish]

im too lazy to put spec icons on there

[tribal blade]

omg amaze

oh @short radish i might make a new forum post

saying i'm happy with cloud cover

but it doesn't fix core issues

[short radish]

👍

i have made my document too big

🤡

[tribal blade]

LOL

[short radish]

i havent really added much to it

[tribal blade]

btw there's a lot of similar posts popping up

[short radish]

but ive definitely over done it

oh okay