subtlety

[hollow spear]

Vessel is just very good if you pickup like a robot

[swift tinsel]

you can still get cucked though and sit at 2 bc of rng

[hollow spear]

I always account for me being bad

[swift tinsel]

its kind of a silly trinket all around

[south moss]

yeah for sure, but 3.5k is such a big diff that even if you arent a robot it seems you would be in the positive

[swift tinsel]

even with the sound alert addon

[south moss]

but in terms of the original q, we do think raidbots is simming crucible properly?

[swift tinsel]

I do not plan to use it personally

[tribal vortex]

with the sound is playable tbh

[south moss]

i know some of hte uptimes were higher than expected

[tribal vortex]

you just strafe a bit

and you hope you got it

[swift tinsel]

except when it spawns behind or in front of you lol

in the spell effect bonanza pile

just don't mistake a magus of the dead spawn for the same location

[stuck tulip]

vessel in raid is impossible to see

[swift tinsel]

(I hate vessel)

[tribal vortex]

it kinda spawned diagonally in front of me every time

[swift tinsel]

its a neat idea ig but quite impractical

[south moss]

at least the orbs are green and not purple

[tribal vortex]

i couldn't see it i was searching for it

[warm marlin]

yes it is

[hollow spear]

Good that you spell it out, I wasn't sure

[tribal vortex]

on dragons it was ok i picked it up

[warm marlin]

thing has infinite uptime in raid

[tribal vortex]

but in paladins i didn't even try

[warm marlin]

like 80%

[swift tinsel]

I've had it spawn in any direction relative to me when testing on dummy

[south moss]

ok thank you then i guess vessel just sims crazy high

[swift tinsel]

360 degree possibility

[hollow spear]

Jump three times
Orb

[swift tinsel]

collect or stand in circle

[warm marlin]

you did click all the bonuses to crucible in options right

idk the exact numbers but 3.5k sounds high

it's about equal to same ilvl gaze for me (crucible that is)

[hollow spear]

I think think he meant vessel

[south moss]

yes but good call out

[hollow spear]

Which also sims like 2.7k extra for me

[warm marlin]

damn ok ig that thing is just crazy

if you are a soul pickup master

[south moss]

at least we are a 2 button rotation now so i have more mental bandwidth to look for green orbs

lets see how it goes

[hollow spear]

Need to watch some alpha male videos on how to pick up

[swift tinsel]

they can spawn so streaky too

can go like 30sec without getting one then get 3x rapid fire

[keen dome]

Just run around in a circle the entire fight

[hollow spear]

My pick up game kinda bad ever since I've been in a relationship ig

[swift tinsel]

love that for an ironfur-type agi buff

[wet jacinth]

!logs

[south moss]

ima rizz tf out of those orbs

[hollow spear]

It would certainly entertain my fellow raiders

[hollow dune]

which boss is that?

[keen dome]

Running around in a panic or running around to pick up buffs? Why not both

[hollow spear]

Confuse the raiders for the gains

[south moss]

also sorry last q but what is this "sound" you speak of? This is an add on that makes a sound when an orb spawns im assuming?

[swift tinsel]

Our melee do that anyways

Watching the big white arrows freak out on cosmos

Cinema

[wet jacinth]

would be sick if anyone could look at these logs and help me out a bit. i think im approaching cleave fundamentally wrong

[hollow dune]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[open depot]

Alleria HC

[hollow dune]

gz!

[open depot]

Thanks

[fair wedge]

tyyyy have u got a pov of ur kill?

[rapid barn]

is there any subetly pov for all raids boss?

[uneven shard]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[pastel arrow]

could be great, i'm kinda lost at what to do, i was thinking i was doing good, but at the end of the day i'm still bad

[sick jackal]

i am afraid not i can send you the logs tho

[pastel arrow]

what offset piece should i craft with spark ? still wrist ? i got one with socket proc, but still champion gear, or ring, neck ?

[lilac kestrel]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[spare turtle]

I dont get it, im doing 20 on parses at 245ilvl playing everything as it should be casting ST with Shadow dance, always fitting 2 inside Shadow blades and so on, is there another angle to this?

[shell willow]

For the TCs and other top rogues. Has anyone looked at using ancient arts on every finisher while in dance?

[fleet acorn]

idk how u do it but u cant fit 2 inside ST if u do - its wrong at the moment

[spare turtle]

I meant 2 shadow dances

[fleet acorn]

u dont even have 4 set

[warm marlin]

bad

that was the initial rule we had and it got refined first to the lust only variant and then the supercharge version we have now

[shell willow]

My logs aren't bad when doing that my dps on eviscerate is higher than others.

[faint quail]

can we send hero crests on hero gear or better to wait? 1/6

[shell willow]

Oh okay I guess I never iterated and made that change.

[warm marlin]

it's not much worse to be clear

[karmic harbor]

my tanks are just falling over on crown hc, is that normal?

[weary tree]

Crown hc does hurt

[karmic harbor]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[woven sonnet]

Do we only shadowstrike in this window when we randomly have =>5 shadow technique or do we auto attack before SD so provoke this state 100% of the time?

[swift tinsel]

you don't do any kind of farming during dance

you look at your situation before you cast your finisher

and if it meets the criteria, you strike

[weary tree]

You stop finishers 10 sec before blades though

[swift tinsel]

its purely reactionary, no trying to force the conditions

otherwise you're losing globals in dance and torpedoing your damage

which you dont wanna do lol

[spare turtle]

Dont you use supercharger on secret technique most of the time? So this only goes for the second dance during the blades

[swift tinsel]

as trickster you supercharge it every time

[weary tree]

You have 2 supercharger stacks though

[swift tinsel]

as your first finisher as you press dance since you macro sectech with dance

^

[shell willow]

Yeah okay. I was filling suboptimal globals in dance hitting strike for ancient arts proc instead of eviscerate.

[spare turtle]

Oh

[swift tinsel]

ah yeah don't do that lol

[fleet acorn]

thats how far we got today

[swift tinsel]

I vibe-force apex on coup in aoe but that's a me-thing for more prio

at least that's what I tell myself

[weary tree]

Problem is only P3 dmg matters

[open depot]

Big, love that for you

Learned any tech?

[fleet acorn]

not rly should there be any rogue specific ? i only know i can step p2 the plattforms

[warm marlin]

p2 is like by far the hardest phase

[swift tinsel]

whats diff about heroic p2?

[warm marlin]

assuming your p3 damage is fine

[shell willow]

Lol would have parsed better if I did this correctly. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/82Mm4hKDyVF1gTnz?fight=47&type=damage-done

[weary tree]

P3 healing can be spicy

[dreamy jewel]

sub really wasnt the choice for the first boss on heroic, did so bad got benched

[fleet acorn]

did u call out what to use on p2 explosions?

[open depot]

benched on hc?

[fair wedge]

that wld be nice thank uuuu

[swift tinsel]

sub kinda owns first boss

[warm marlin]

i barely remember normal

[swift tinsel]

favorable timers

[weary tree]

Also add dmg on that boss is just useless

[warm marlin]

you have to arrow the adds to kill them and kicks have to be tight

good baits etc

[swift tinsel]

I was on simulacrum but it was basically just the add puts up a shield

ranged handled the other adds and dropped shit everywhere

[sick jackal]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/nLQ9YAxHG2NC7JDd?fight=18&type=damage-done&source=13

[swift tinsel]

(our guild is mechanically interesting)

[warm marlin]

yeah you all stack together on H and hit the guy who happens to be in melee

[fleet acorn]

does anyone knows if theres a addon for show that u have supercharge or not before u pull?

[warm marlin]

they jump back and forth a lot

[fleet acorn]

or can i add outline in bcdm?

[swift tinsel]

ah, ye we split ranged and melee between alleria and the simulacrum

[fair wedge]

cld u send thru ur logs on all bosses u have?

[warm marlin]

idk im a rogue i press feint

[weary tree]

True that

[warm marlin]

dont have to think about those things

[weary tree]

Don't take dmg from it anyways as rogue

[shell willow]

I actually use blizz default combo point.

[sick jackal]

they are public you can check them on my character page

[swift tinsel]

a lot of cp addons will have either colored background or cp border for supercharged combo points

idk about literal text reminder for it though

[fleet acorn]

i have bcdm and its only colored when i have combo points

[gentle temple]

at least hc crown is one of the worst encounters for sub rogue in the last expansions

it feels so bad

[plush roost]

?

[warm marlin]

[plush roost]

Yeah sub hates getting sblades back during downtime and free superchargers

[open depot]

Oh no! My adds who take 120 - 200% increased damage to send my Shadow Dance + Sec Tech on

[plush roost]

Only part of alleria thats meh for sub is u only get 2 cd sets in p3

[warm marlin]

assa

[plush roost]

But maybe u just send extra on p2 and it dont matta

[plush roost]

We're splitting hc tmrw and im bringing assa to both

W

[warm marlin]

how many splits has consq done at this point

i swear ive seen 3 already

[lucid jackal]

It's a sin tier

Apply the poisons li'l bro

[zinc kayak]

!log

[warm marlin]

assa pot execute 2nd cd set in p3 gonna go crazy huh

[plush roost]

Ye were doin 3, 2 alleria tho some split alts wont make the dps check

[open depot]

Don't let the bozos hear you say that

[plush roost]

Virgin every other class vs chad assa

[warm marlin]

I will find a little puzzleboxington maybe

???

[plush roost]

I dont wanna talk about it

[warm marlin]

this guy went afk!

[plush roost]

That was sleepless DS no crafted dagger didnt have time to review the fight raw dogging it

Aka peak gameplay

[warm marlin]

you should've ripped the p1 30 min nap like me

[plush roost]

True

[warm marlin]

really helped rejuvenate

[last scarab]

Sub still going to be number 1 or will Outlaw creep in?

[plush roost]

It was our very last pull of splits after being in splits for 3 days and with no sleep

[warm marlin]

i was mega low ilvl i will ascend next week

think sub can do good damage there

[plush roost]

I think sub will be fine ye, i do think assaexecute is king tho

Maybe mythic makes a beeg diffy

[warm marlin]

the lust not being in execute sounds a bit tragic but you have pot ig

[plush roost]

I think lusting at start is bait u should 100% lust at 2mins in

[chilly dagger]

I currently have 3 Spark of Radiance.. on my char it tells me 2/3 Season Maximum.. can it be that I missed one? I only reached 90 about 2 weeks ago, so might have missed first reset in case that is a source.. Is there an overview so I can cross check? Dont want to miss it if I potentially can get one

[warm marlin]

sounds like assa propaganda

[plush roost]

Just have 1:30s hold

Its a 3min phase

U only get 2 casts anyway

And then you have pot as well

Seems no brainer

[warm marlin]

wont everyone have cds and pot at the 6min mark anyway it's just execute ur helping

[gilded thistle]

does weaponmaster give combo points or is it basically just increased shadowstrike/backstab damage

[plush roost]

Well idk seems good to help your execute classes. Depends ig how fast u get into execute can be better

[gilded thistle]

it doesn't count the one from the midnight world tour

so yes you're missing one still

we can have 4 total rn

[warm marlin]

the wm combo points were bugged forever in the past not sure if it got fixed

should be shadowstrike damage

[gilded thistle]

but it is intended?

[warm marlin]

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[warm marlin]

ok they dont generate sht

idk its like all shadowstrike/backstab damage

its a decent st talent

[gilded thistle]

would you take it over veiltouched for a cleave build?

I know potent powder is the most important thing but that other point kinda floats around for me

[warm marlin]

depends on the target count but finality -> pp and wm -> pp are both similar swaps

finality scales more with target count, wm better at low target cleave

veiltouched is good

[gilded thistle]

ah fuck it's finality

I couldnt fucking tell where that point was coming from

that was frustrating me thank you

[woven sonnet]

!macros

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[gilded thistle]

so in m+ first dance kinda loses a lot of value if your tank is chain pulling

what's a more consistent alternative?

[open depot]

Outlaw

[gilded thistle]

so real

[hazy breach]

Youll get it after the bosses

Itll be worth it anyway

Longer dance is very very very powerful

[gilded thistle]

that's because it lets you get a second sectec right?

(still learning here)

or is it just the extra time with 10% damage

[hazy breach]

Its way more than 10% damage

But yes

[gilded thistle]

o

way more because of energy and shadowstrike?

or is there another buff talent in there

[hazy breach]

Also just more buff talents

[gilded thistle]

ah ok

[hazy breach]

If you search for shadow dance in the tree youll see a bunch

[woven sonnet]

I dont get the coup powder macro. I dont trigger both abilities anyways and evis becomes coup so what do I gain?

[gilded thistle]

pressing 1 button

instead of 2

[hazy breach]

If you cant be bothered to track it and just want to press one button

Its fine to do in dummy scenarios

[woven sonnet]

ic ic thx

[fleet blaze]

Is it okay to run a higher ilvl sword in my off-hand instead of a dagger?

[alpine wraith]

no

basically attack speed is so important

[short radish]

!oh

[wicked jolt]

Shadow Techniques is not normalized and this makes a slow weapon (axe/sword/mace/fist) in offhand significantly weaker and almost never worth equiping.

[alpine wraith]

that you want a dagger in offhand always too

[fleet blaze]

OK. thank you

[short radish]

lvl 1 grey dagger > 260 ilvl sword

(probably)

[fleet blaze]

god

[last marten]

Was running around with a sword cuz of 9 ilvl, that shit was horrendous lol

[young reef]

how do you get sockets in pve?

like to put on pve gear

and not pvp

[gilded thistle]

i dont think there's a consumable for that this season

all rings and necks just come with 1

[shrewd lantern]

weekly vault

[gilded thistle]

other than that one I guess

[shrewd lantern]

a bit weird that the crit bonus gem isnt that good anymore

since it competes with the more primary one

[kindred coral]

can someone send me m+ atlents

talents

[young reef]

cant you put two sockets on rings and necklass tho?

and is weekly vault only way to get socket?

[hazy breach]

Not anymore no

[young reef]

well, there is a necklass that comes with two osckets in it in raid

[hazy breach]

And yes for helm/belt/wrists you can only get the sockets from vault

[young reef]

march of del quals or w.e

[hazy breach]

Or you get lucky with it dropping with it

[shrewd lantern]

how much is a socket worth anyway

[hazy breach]

Yeah because its from the last boss so its allowed to cheat

[shrewd lantern]

got a socket belt in my map box

[young reef]

so only vault

and u have to chose between a peice of loot from vault box

?

[shrewd lantern]

but i mean this is also why pvp bracers kind of good early on

yeah

[hazy breach]

Well the socket is the consolation price

For when you dont get anything else you want from the vault

[young reef]

gotcha

ty

im savin up 80 myths to craft wep

[shrewd lantern]

idk if pvp rings can still get 2

or they just reduced the amount required

since pvp jewelry comes with default 1 now each

[hazy breach]

Dont think they can get more than 1 either

And the gem adding things are just for wrists/helm/belt

[shrewd lantern]

seems that way

it was super annoying needing to buy 6 pvp items for sockets in pvp

every season

just for rings and neck

[hazy lichen]

yo what should i wishlist from raids

whats biggest prio items

[hazy breach]

and maybe alleria neck

[hazy lichen]

goat

[heady talon]

Good evening, at midnight I wanted to try out the sub rogue... I looked at quite a few sites for rotations, at the beginning I had a good opener but I ran out of steam due to lack of energy. Do I lack haste or am I doing something wrong?

[short radish]

no. running out of energy is normal

[wheat edge]

If you arent in dance you are lucky if you have energy to press feint

[fallow glade]

you can type !log to open a thread, and hope someone looks at it

[dense fossil]

!log

[swift tiger]

Trying to wrap my head around the apex talents, when doing the opener or burst window, if i get a proc of ancient arts, do i send two eviscerates or do i go back to try and proc another ancient arts before sending another evis?
I'm looking at my logs from the raid and i'm ashamed of my performance

[hazy lichen]

rn isnt our biggest upgrade tier set so should i just put that in my note

[hazy breach]

Yeah if you dont have that you can put that too

[random mason]

3 leather tier tokens dropped today from first 3 voidspire + dreamrift

Guess how many i got

[fallow glade]

3 🔥

[random mason]

https://tenor.com/view/no-score-judging-zero-gif-17004233967473592920

But i got the hc guidon after already getting normal guidon on wednesday

[fleet acorn]

Does anyone knows can i get a mrt reminder on rdy checks?

make my own one ? like Supercharged done?

[naive zodiac]

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[fleet acorn]

i always forget to use supercharge need a reminder for that

[hazy lichen]

do we use lights potenital or recklessness

[frosty sinew]

lights potential

[swift tinsel]

Your raid will hate you if you use the silencing one

[fleet acorn]

!addons

how can i check i think there was a addon list whats recommended

like some raid buff addon

[oak sorrel]

i see trickster recommended for crown but i swear deathstalker feels better

[left ledge]

just play whatever fits your raid more

i played DS, i hate DS and preferred trickster

but we wanted more alleria damage

[tribal vortex]

I mean it's the same damage no?

[left ledge]

almost

DS is more prio and ST

[tribal vortex]

like 2%?

Also in alleria fight mark can be fucked up no?

with adds and P2 etc

[tribal blade]

if it makes a diff this is the breakdown on heroic crown

[astral axle]

[sweet moss]

guys i want an alt that feels similar to play to rogue

what do i play

[agile kernel]

2% ain't worth having to deal with deathstalker mark

[fleet acorn]

how do i put wangbar into my bcdm ?

wanna replace my bcdm bar

[copper horizon]

Need some help, even after getting 18% (20,8%), still simming towards even more haste and not crit/mast, its that ok /?

[tribal blade]

you might not be hitting the exact breakpoint

at 18%

[muted kindle]

so just so just to help my smooth brain we do send 2 dances in sb windows right?

[torn tide]

is that a good number btw?

like jokes aside lmfao

[tribal blade]

lol nah

well it's a good number if you're a satanist

[swift tinsel]

The sweet spot is what, 685?

[tribal blade]

684 yeah

[torn tide]

mines only 3 off from u lmfaoo im at 669

[swift tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/get-smart-maxwell-agent-86-gif-12923944

cries in 500something

[torn tide]

no way

[tribal blade]

so close

[swift tinsel]

I get so many crit/mastery drops

[torn tide]

also how much crit should we be getting lol cuz i realised i barely care about crit

[prime pier]

anyone up to look at logs and explain me why I parse grey?

[torn tide]

its at 418 LOL

[swift tinsel]

As much as you have on your gear when you hit the haste breakpoint

[undone mesa]

hey guys! should i line up sblades with puzzle box? or use 1 with 1 without?

[torn tide]

damn im only at 652 haste i suck

crazy part is that i already got all the bis from mythics that i can

[soft garnet]

simbait trinket?

[tribal vortex]

there is no bis at this moment with champ gear. Stats are too low, you need items with more haste

[frosty sinew]

use it as a 3 minute trinket so every second shadow blades

[torn tide]

ahh

[shrewd ermine]

Does he need more critical strike chance?

[prime beacon]

for my opener, I use both charges of shadow dance thru shadow blades, and just SS -> Eviscerate for the entire second SD, since I dont have ST up?

[short radish]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/449080055893590017/1280746470815043646/456.gif

1 more week and we'll be at the numbers for this

[shrewd lantern]

acquire haste point

rest dont matter

[shrewd ermine]

More Haste?

[shrewd lantern]

idk how confident are you in hitting a 0.1s global in dance?

[torn tide]

260 ilvl would be nice

[fading saffron]

how we lookin stat wise bois

unbuffed

[short radish]

[torn tide]

this might be the first time im seeing 0 vers

[short radish]

not seeing vers upsets me

[livid cape]

Oh boy when was cheap shot made a 12 sec cd lol. Take about removing the skill

[fading saffron]

[shrewd lantern]

@swift tinsel This is what i meant how many different glowing purple sets dh has

[oak sorrel]

i seem to be completely incapable of lining up sectec with ancient arts in trickster

[shrewd lantern]

its still very strong in pvp

[short radish]

if i sent crests into helm instead of boots i think i'd be 260

[valid yoke]

for blades do I want to hold sb so I get two during blades?

It feels like a very long time of doing no damage

[swift tinsel]

the glowy feet from dimmy are my favs lol necessity on any dh mog

[valid yoke]

and missing a sec-tec use

[shrewd lantern]

real

i dont have the green ones for any class though

also you can just take shot in the dark which gives you a freebie cheap per dance

[lilac stag]

I can’t love you any more than I do right now.

[fading saffron]

upsert as in "Im jealous" or upset as in "you should have some vers"

[short radish]

upset as in "sub has had vers as its best/2nd best stat for the last several expansions, and not seeing it anymore makes me sad"

[shrewd lantern]

like it was barely a pvp nerf

[fading saffron]

[short radish]

youre fine not having vers

[shrewd lantern]

and who tf is pressing cheap in pve

[short radish]

i will deal with my grief in my own way

[fading saffron]

[chrome palm]

@warm marlin alleria 30 man done now we go to next 30 man this time no rogue 💀

about to find out how good rogue buff is

[warm marlin]

extremely strong ive heard!

sources dispute this claim

[short radish]

mandatory raid buff

like paladin devo aura

[kind plank]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[rugged condor]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[leaden prairie]

@hazy breach

is your whole

haste thing fake

can i say its fake

[hazy breach]

?

[leaden prairie]

my sim dont want me hitting the haste treshold

while i have the rings to do it for free

why !

[hazy breach]

#subtlety-faq message

World lag adds a little bit extra delay compared to sims

[leaden prairie]

it stops way lower

[tall girder]

Myth giving you loot

[leaden prairie]

i dont like this idea that i cant trust the sim and i have to feelycraft a number

what is this !

[oak sorrel]

is there something with 4 set that makes sub an op PI target?

[hazy breach]

No sub is an awful PI target

[oak sorrel]

or wihtout it?

cause mallet sims have it as complete garbage but ive seen multiple people in different groups claim it's one of the best

[random mason]

Time your own input delay and put that into the sim

[hazy breach]

Idk PI does literally nothing

[leaden prairie]

sims have input delay already

[hazy breach]

Yes

5 ms

[random mason]

Zac has <5ms input delay

He's playing on the backend

[warm marlin]

he means like 550 btw not 630

[hazy breach]

Ye idk

[leaden prairie]

150 ms

in sims

per the wiki

[hazy breach]

Its 5 ms per global roughly in sims

[leaden prairie]

idk thats not what is said in the wiki but

maybe wiki is out of date

[hazy breach]

But you can try playing with like 530 or something its insanely hard to consistently hit all the gcds (without coup ofc)

[leaden prairie]

you are right tho

idk why the wiki says that

supposedly

there is 2 things

[leaden prairie]

yeye i know

i checked

[frail bone]

Where or how do we change the the numbers to match our avg server lag

[hazy breach]

You dont really, thats the thing

I think the stance delay thing is happening when dance fades too right

[frail bone]

Does anyone know what 65ms in time

[hazy breach]

ms stands for milliseconds, but your MS is irrelevant

[frail bone]

I thought thats what our lag increment was

[fleet acorn]

Yo Zac quick question on your combo bar what Color Code is the white and what Color you use for supercharged?

I use something similiar Color wise and cant find a good Spot what fits

[leaden prairie]

color code for white is white wydm

like 0 0 0 0 0

its pure white

very white white

[short radish]

[leaden prairie]

is that the question

im unsure

:D

[fleet acorn]

thats black

[leaden prairie]

wtf !

[short radish]

white is FFFFFF

[leaden prairie]

haha

it kinda depends

[hazy breach]

But yeah im not entirely sure how the stance delay thing works at the end of dance, i just went on the beta and after doing the math on the breakpoints added a little bit more haste until i could consistently hit all the globals. Then i added a little bit extra in the guides for some more leeway

[fleet acorn]

yea that works

[leaden prairie]

1 1 1 1 can be white

[hazy breach]

And since the sim was around 50 lower than that consistently it seemed to make sense

[leaden prairie]

and for supercharger i use red

very red red !

1 0 0

;D

good luck wiuth that one

[hazy breach]

But tbf i mostly did sims with the bis profiles, so things probably change without tier for example

[leaden prairie]

im fully juiced up bro

[tall girder]

Blue for supercharged on top

[short radish]

i use
blue for supercharger
white for default cp
green for when im max-1cp
red for when im max

[leaden prairie]

4set gaming

[short radish]

only from crown

oh and a adagger

[hazy breach]

guidon?

[leaden prairie]

ye but im not gonna play that dogshit

[tall girder]

Fim ur copying me for combo point colours wth

[leaden prairie]

some random sub player dmed me about it

some cringe optimisations

[hazy breach]

[short radish]

nuh uh, i did that first

[leaden prairie]

im going with puzzle box instead

fuck you and your guidon

keep your shit bro

[short radish]

zac rate my puzzlebox opener on crown

[tall girder]

I can’t beat the nuh uh

[leaden prairie]

massive skill issue

[sudden quarry]

haha nice one

[leaden prairie]

• you potted after aswell

you sleeping cuh

[tall girder]

Based department calling

[short radish]

i always pot after box 🙂

[leaden prairie]

ye well

try boxing before cds

friendly advice

lil tip

[short radish]

cheers mate

i'll note that down for next time

[fleet acorn]

what are these 100 colorcodes lol

[leaden prairie]

i give out free sub advices in dms if you guys need some

[leaden prairie]

bro no way you are trolling me like that

[random mason]

Turn the brightness up buddy

[fleet acorn]

FF0000

[leaden prairie]

i told you i use red

first off

[tall girder]

Fim u should box after the first dance if ur still waiting for 2nd sec tech cd

[leaden prairie]

you should have color picker plus installed

so you dont get cancer changing colors

look at mine

so much better than yours

owned

[short radish]

im using alleria trinket because its only 0.2% dps less

and i cbf channeling shit

[tall girder]

My puzzle box bro

[leaden prairie]

i got this one tho eleem

[fleet acorn]

bro literally photoshoping in wow

[hazy breach]

Without guidon sectech alignment feels kinda ass unfortunately

[short radish]

after all that effort into leather stacking AA as well

[tall girder]

I go back into heroic tonight

[hazy breach]

Blizzard didnt quite succed with making our cds line up well naturally

[fleet acorn]

but thx for help zac appreciate it

[short radish]

im just waiting for the 13.1.7 patch where they add a charge to sectech

[leaden prairie]

@warm marlin apparently it sims neutral to just get the little bit more haste

how strange !

[warm marlin]

your robot has outlaw brain

[fleet acorn]

is everyone now using funkis clickable raid buffs tracker or some other good addons to take a look?

[leaden prairie]

im goated i managed to trick my sim into 669 haste

robot doesnt even know btw

he got owned

[steel horizon]

how does leveling valeera make the nullaeus fight easier? does level effect just her survivability? or is it everything like dps and healing throughput as well?

[leaden prairie]

yes everything

• you gain levels on the items aswell

[steel horizon]

damn ok. im done trying this with lvl 22 valeera lol

[leaden prairie]

her spells things

[steel horizon]

time to grind delves 😫

[leaden prairie]

im gonna have so much fun as sub on alerria tomrrow !

banger spec

[tulip light]

guys i set my particle density to the lowest setting possible to declutter raid animations a bit (not boss abilities) is thre a script / command to further reduce?

[blissful gale]

2 button spec

[restive dome]

is it worth taking Dark Brew and give up a point somewhere if i have the alleria necklece for the shadow dmg synergy? raidbots says it can't really sim the necklece passive right now. but im guessing not?

[hazy breach]

Dark brew does not increase the damage of that

Generally spells/talents that increase damage only work on class specific effects

And exceptions to that rule are considered bugs.

Find weakness works on physical damage (so ~17% more damage for those effects) and Lingering Darkness in Deathstalker also work on non-rogue items (such as that neck)

But nothing else for Sub

[oak sorrel]

remember that one trinket that was super op on brewmasters specifically because it did fire damage

i might be making some shit up but that's in my memory somewhere

[hazy breach]

Yes and instead of having trinkets with interesting synergy with some classes theyve decided to try to make every trinket playable for every class by removing all the fun synergy elements

Back in the days almost everything worked on everything

[icy mulch]

the good old days

[hazy breach]

Recklessness for warriors for example gave 100% crit so it would make damage trinkets really strong

[plush crescent]

draught of souls warrior/vanish rogue was sick

[hazy breach]

Ye ofc shoulders too

[restive dome]

Awesome, thanks Eleem! I figured as much, it would've been a fun neck if it synergized more lol

[stuck vale]

Has anyone noticed the sim still preferring haste over mastery in the 730-750 range?

[restive dome]

ya i remember back in legion on my warrior - reck + draught was just stupid dmg

[fast flax]

hello guys do we still play

fishing for the apex talent in st in raid all the fight or just lust

[hazy breach]

!aa

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[hazy breach]

Neither

[sacred gull]

what's the % of dmg on cleave of sec tech plz ?

[fast flax]

so we only doing for supercharg points

[hazy breach]

50%

[sacred gull]

ty

[hazy breach]

In practice it should happen automatically most of the time

[fast flax]

like the whole fight only for supercharges and if my next gen is about to proc it

[hazy breach]

Since you should ideally not finish a couple of seconds before you dance

But if you get unlucky and dont have 5 on your first strike you will surely have it on your second one

[runic sinew]

how strong is that trinket?

[hazy breach]

It good

[shrewd lantern]

where is the lfr version of this even from

[hazy breach]

Warbound from normal

[shrewd lantern]

oh right

[valid yoke]

guys, ngl im stuck af. I'm struggling to see where I'm going wrong. is anybody able to check a log for me and give me any pointers?

[rustic raven]

is there an optimization with 4pc where we hold second dance during blades to fit 2 sectecs into the blades window?

or do we not worry abt that

[robust light]

same boat

[odd jacinth]

these dagger are so sick, loving the broken sword aesthetic

[warm marlin]

yes

[supple barn]

my sims keeps telling me to use sappling

do i just listen to raidbots

[valid yoke]

!log

[glass jackal]

My sims keep telling me to use sapling too and it’s so confusing lol

[tight dove]

owned

[grave cove]

I'm just switched to sub but 250 outlaw spec also wanted sapling over most non s tier trinkets

[craggy quest]

Great fight sneaked a rank 6 on it

[naive zodiac]

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[humble oracle]

Do we have a spreadsheet that matches haste breakpoints for SD and ST cooldown duration?

[humble oracle]

Like how to know how much cdr I'm getting from lust or a PI

[raw wadi]

Nothing

[fallen depot]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[hazy breach]

I mean the cooldown are 20% and 30% shorter respectively

Or well cd/1.2 or /1.3

[humble oracle]

So it's flat, no dr ?

[hazy breach]

Regardless PI is horrendous

Theyre actually worse than they were in midnight

Because literally all it does is the sectech cdr, you already cap out shadow technique stacks anyway

[frosty sinew]

only time any rogue spec should be getting pi is if your group wants to invalidate your parse

[humble oracle]

I said PI for the example, ofc I won't get any.
I was just curious to know the CD of sectec during lust, the guidon trinket and both at the same time.

[gilded ferry]

So, in this kind of scenario, if I do not hold, I wont have 2 dances in blades. Should I hold for 20s?

[warm marlin]

personally im ripping the sectec raw there

[modest lily]

On Fuu's sheet it mentions sub changes, I'm assuming reference the 3% aura buff or is Fuu refering to the 0.5 changes coming?

[flint parrot]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[warm marlin]

it was a reference to the prior specific spell tuning

sub has a lot of random spellids from stuff like eviscerate clones

[modest lily]

Makes sense then, thanks.

[warm marlin]

they did it all correct, so the numbers are accurate, next week is just 3% aura which should be simple to implement

[modest lily]

Simple...famous last words. lol

[gilded thistle]

how we feeling about that btw? Is it gonna make us matter again?

or am i just gona get benched for a 4th frost mage

[warm marlin]

youll play one rogue for atrophic regardless

idk im happy to get buffed but all melee are still kind of ass

it's just a ranged tier

[torn tide]

ive seen raids take 2 rogues sometimes idk why

[warm marlin]

lots of splits going on maybe they think rogue is fun

[gilded thistle]

I'm the token rogue at least

[torn tide]

it was a funny one, in heroic chimaerus it was me and another sub rogue but the other dude did 18k dps so he got the boot

[warm marlin]

sub might end up being thanos on last bosses anyway

[modest lily]

I'm the only rogue on my mythic team so I'm not too worried but it does worry me a bit, I'm hoping the 4pc is a 11-12% gain so that could help us and maybe why they don't want to give us too much. Probably copium on my part.

[gilded ferry]

interesting

[torn tide]

but after he got kicked he ninja aggroed the boss then dipped just to piss the party off

[gilded ferry]

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[warm marlin]

the sim can be a bit schizo if you aren't playing exactly 4p + guidin + 700 haste so its hard to give concrete answers for these things

[plush roost]

Yeah bud youre puttin on 4 poisons

[warm marlin]

i did practice assa today for alleria

[gilded ferry]

another thing i noticed: apex does not proc properly when using sectec in trickster

but in DS does

is that intended?

[warm marlin]

!premed

[wicked jolt]

There is a bug that makes it so while Premeditation is active you cannot get a refund nor spawn the clone from Ancient Arts. This is not something you need to play around, as using Ancient Arts of Secret Technique is about the same value as using it on a regular Eviscerate.

[plush roost]

Whats there to practice XD?

[warm marlin]

thats why it only took 5 minutes

[gilded ferry]

oh makes sens

ty

[modest lily]

I got lucky and got a heroic guidon this week, went ahead and upgraded it.

[lucid jackal]

Bro thinks he wont play the execute spec

Joy emoji

Also like, something I like, realized last night is yk

[warm marlin]

i think 90% itll be assa on alleria yes

[lucid jackal]

Ppl are coping like, omfg sub is gaining 14% DPS next week compared to logs

[warm marlin]

sub last boss of mqd tho

[hazy breach]

Yeah weve tried to fix most setups but its hard when theres so many differing haste levels that could randomly brick sectech timings

[lucid jackal]

Bro I looked at the top like

5-10 on every boss

ALl of them have tier already

[warm marlin]

ya but like all the top logs are cooked bro

i saw some guy with 4p + a 276 weapon

what u gonna do

[lucid jackal]

I just mean like, idk if sub is actually gonna gain that much on logs by next week

[shrewd lantern]

bro really sent his hero crests

[lucid jackal]

And sin feels really fuckin good imo

[shrewd lantern]

for the week 1 parse

[warm marlin]

you know you have my sympathy it just makes it hard to give people accurate advice for their situations

[red flame]

Jfc that’s nuts

[lucid jackal]

Played it on alleria

Actual god in p3

[warm marlin]

yeah the second dm with pot is gonna go insane

[lucid jackal]

r u suppose to pot the execute or the lust

[gilded ferry]

it feels bad when you do nexus everyday and still has blue daggers though, i can relate to that

[plush roost]

I mean the number 1 guild on stormrage Meta Done ™ is definitely not a chinese sale guild with 4pcs and 276 weapons

[warm marlin]

yeah that was a funny log to read

264 frost mage

[plush roost]

Week 1 logs i cba lmao

[shrewd lantern]

....what

just make a 259 farstrider's

[lucid jackal]

My tier is already over dw

[warm marlin]

dw your vaults will save you right

[gilded ferry]

24

[plush roost]

Lookin like me bro

[warm marlin]

those are super good!

[hazy breach]

Yeah im just coping that surely blizzard will remove hasted cdr from sectech in .1

[warm marlin]

(3 vers rings)

[runic sinew]

!log

[gilded thistle]

will m0 vault give hero or champ?

[warm marlin]

I will tell people what I would do and assume my instinct is just correct

robot has abandoned us in our time of need (except in full bis)

[lucid jackal]

dont even start bro

[plush roost]

People who ask me for coaching i just tell them that it is a bit pointless to teach them anything till 4pc

[blazing night]

Why isn't Crusader's Keepsake in the trinket tier list? Is it that bad?

[gilded ferry]

anyone has that sheet that has all gains for pieces?

[warm marlin]

are you ready to explain deepening poll rates?

[oak sorrel]

bro what in gods name am i doing wrong on crown for this to happen

[warm marlin]

I need to find an addon that actually does the 1 second clock thing so I can stream and just explain the pure unfiltered degeneracy

its all for the bit

[shrewd lantern]

probably a mix of pad on adds more

[gilded thistle]

if 70k is a 14 im cooked

its over

[shrewd lantern]

not having tier

[young heart]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[hazy breach]

2 button spec

[plush roost]

Yeah easily bro, "yeah so basically you have a constant 1 second refresh rate on our shadow dance duration that is near impossible to track without a specific addon that ticks a 1 second timer the moment you log in or else you have an inefficient global in your gcds so dont worry about it unless you really wanna maximize" "for now, lets work on hitting 7 gcds and not 5 during dance"

[warm marlin]

nah the end line is so real though

[oak sorrel]

is sub tier really that insane? jesus

[plush roost]

Last tier i had to explain to someone that mashing storm in aoe is in fact, not good.

[warm marlin]

no way

[smoky estuary]

which bosses in voidspire are you guys going ST or aoe talents

[shrewd lantern]

9% for 2p

so quite large

[warm marlin]

my friends old gm played sub once in a low key with them

[oak sorrel]

i can hit 70-90% on every other boss but a 14 on crown is painful

[prime pier]

Do we min/max the apex talent in ST, cleave and aoe?

[warm marlin]

he just spamme storm the whole time

[plush roost]

Hahaha based

[smoky estuary]

the FAQ for sub says yes

[plush roost]

Storm powder dream came true

[warm marlin]

"why would I spend my combo points" - real question asked by a like 5x title tank

my goat

[plush roost]

Why would i wog myself when i can sotr

[shrewd lantern]

healing me is the healer's job

[prime pier]

So we min/max the apex talent only for the supercharged combo point? After that it’s build-spend?

[warm marlin]

i can't say ive had it quite like this personally, might have something to do with my character name not explicitly being my discord name

gotta dig a very slight amount, usually the dms i get are people who have done some research

[gilded ferry]

ryldd did you do pvp for catalyst?

[smoky estuary]

#subtlety-faq message

[warm marlin]

yes

i was 2 points off in 7 games of bg blitz and then i had an ancient curse put on me to suffer through another 20 games without getting it so I swapped to 2s with a homie and got it fast

[smoky estuary]

what I usually do and what others have told me is spam shadow strike during dance to proc apex then use finisher on ST, on aoe just ignore the apex talent and just black powder at 6 combo points

[plush roost]

I think its cause i was top rated m+ last tier and really high s2, play with forrest who is the savior of NA lfg and im pretty active in disco

And i dont ignore any dms XD

I yap too hard gg

[warm marlin]

ah ye its prob the m+ thing

way more m+ gamers than raiders

[plush roost]

Yerrr

[frosty sinew]

is there actually an addon that does this lol

[warm marlin]

it's not what you think it is

[oak sorrel]

real talk if anyone can look at this log between me and the other rogue and tell me if im doing something wrong or what he's doing so different that would be sick

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/BbqdXPyfpj3AzWG2?fight=last&type=damage-done

[frosty sinew]

i will just keep using my trinket 1 second early

[warm marlin]

there are some very cursed underlying interactions with haste

[frosty sinew]

and be sad

[warm marlin]

ye 1s is safe

[frosty sinew]

not like im parsing well with 0 tier on alleria tomorrow night

who caressss

but all my plate guildies have 5 set so it's fine im happy

https://tenor.com/view/kermit-gif-19730757

[hazy lichen]

yo

once u get 4p how does getting catalyst drops work

[steel horizon]

only took like 7 hours but im free. fuck this boss

[iron plover]

is the void stalker contract's contract from seat good for like aoe?

[warm marlin]

you do endgame content like arenas and m+ (maybe m0) and raid and get charges to just appear in your currency

[hazy lichen]

so its infinite if u grind?

[warm marlin]

you can only store up to 8 but yes infinite otherwise

i have 3 extra already

[frosty sinew]

wonder if i should do pvp to insta get 4 piece if tier shows up in vault

how bad was it ryldd

[warm marlin]

bg blitz was the ninth circle of hell

[frosty sinew]

solo queues are disgusting long

[warm marlin]

2s and 3s were so fun we kept queueing after getting it

[frosty sinew]

would need to play with randos idk if worth

[warm marlin]

shuffle might be better if you already have an honor set and previous pvp experience

[frosty sinew]

16 min queue for solo shuffle 😭

also dont have honor

would probably just send 2s if i did go for it

[warm marlin]

you will get hard focused without honor gear in shuffle

bg blitz queues were like 5 mins at most usually

plus if you're undergeared you're only 1/10 members and a rogue

just go backcap and be annoying

[frosty sinew]

it says like 18 mins when i queue

[shrewd lantern]

shuffle queues arent too bad

[warm marlin]

and then have a mental explosion when your team throws an 800-0 lead

[frosty sinew]

but maybe it would actually fill faster

[shrewd lantern]

just do something else during

sometimes you get a 1min pop

idk im almost done in only 5 games

[warm marlin]

again i was 1598 rating after 7 games and i didn't get it after I stopped at like 25 total

[upbeat sorrel]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1484624630764273745/drops.png

[shrewd lantern]

F

i've gotten mostly 4- 2 lobbies

or 5-1

[oak sorrel]

im guessing we have to wait for march to get the aotc tier token?

[warm marlin]

yes

[shrewd lantern]

i also pvp for cosmetics every season tbf

and just abusing sub before it eats a nerf

[oak sorrel]

is the aotc token shared with the 2k one?

[frosty sinew]

yes

all 3 are shared

[oak sorrel]

figured

[frosty sinew]

can only get it from 1 source

[strange chasm]

@lucid jackal how is windrunner LMAO

[warm marlin]

yeah sub is pretty good

well very good

pretty sure ww is better tho

[lucid jackal]

Fine

Cool fight

[shrewd lantern]

maybe in shufff

[warm marlin]

idk when we hit 1800 in 2s it was straight wws for 15 games in a row

seems suspicious

[shrewd lantern]

oh yeah if you're doing 2s

and not q'ing something like rogue mage

if you wanted some royal comedy q sub mm

you pop most non immunity teams in the first minute

[frosty sinew]

what ifi just queue double sub must be op

[shrewd lantern]

rogue mage is generally better

[frosty sinew]

how dare you

even try to tell me to play with that class

🙁

[shrewd lantern]

i mean its the best comp since

forever

[frosty sinew]

ill change the meta

[shrewd lantern]

and rn with disc damage

[warm marlin]

we were playing disc sub

[shrewd lantern]

my disc in shuffle

outdpsed me

[warm marlin]

disc is absolutely

disgusting

[shrewd lantern]

2/3 games

[warm marlin]

btw

[warm marlin]

we had a mirror match when we were still playing holy where enemy disc did both sub's damage combined

and every time we kill someone there are 18 hits from expiation and inescapable torment for 20k each within 0.2s

disc is just a second dps

[shrewd lantern]

yeah i mean

i dont play sub healer 2s

[frosty sinew]

i have come to the conclusion i will just do m+ for the 2k since i will get more than enough charges anyways and wont have to torment myself in pvp lfg

[shrewd lantern]

q shuffle

[frosty sinew]

ill queue 1 game

i dont have honor gear though ill prob just get ran down

[shrewd lantern]

oh yeah should have farmed that

in preseason

[frosty sinew]

i have like 1 trinket i think

nb

[shrewd lantern]

you kind of need your cc break trinket

[frosty sinew]

think thats the 1 i bought

[heavy steppe]

Quick question - sorry for interrupting! Do you guys prefer the SD-SB macro for raids and M+?

[shrewd lantern]

you get a freebie 263 one from the bg quest last week

[warm marlin]

yes

need trinket on a separate bind if it has haste though

[shrewd lantern]

technicaly any trinket

cuz puzzlebox

[heavy steppe]

Is it more efficient for lining up abilities? I feel like whenever I use it, I’ve been failing to line up my cds together.

Might have to go back to the dummy to figure it out again

[warm marlin]

you just don't want to waste time in your cds not gcd-locked, so removing manual human delay from pressing a blades key, then a dance key, then a sectec key is good

[brazen stone]

has any1 here done Nullaeus on lvl 2? is valeria supposed to be on tank or something? i just tried it and died in 2 melee hits basically lol

[heavy steppe]

Makes sense. Maybe it’s just me. I might need to hit the dummy a little more. Do we have a range chart too? For like auto attacks?

[brazen stone]

is there a trick to this that i dont know about

[lucid jackal]

Use numbing poison

Maintain healing orb stacks

Use consumables

[warm marlin]

range chart?

everything is melee (3m?) except storm and bp that are 8

[brazen stone]

how do these talents for it look

[oak sorrel]

forever

is there a trick to pumping alleria

[lucid jackal]

on sub or sin?

[oak sorrel]

sub

[lucid jackal]

dont use ur 2nd CD set in P1

Play the spec properly

Not even flame but its not rocket science really

[steel horizon]

probably want to change cheat death to feint DR

[plush roost]

Whats the trick to playing outlaw ? :^)

[oak sorrel]

i posted a log above doing 70k vs another guy's 80 and other than having 2set he barely had more gear, and i think i had better trinkets

[warm marlin]

it comes up like 20s in

[lucid jackal]

be sad

=[

[sand fox]

I havea braindead sub question:

how often do we save both charges of dance in M+ and raid? Do we ever rip on cd after opener?

[plush roost]

Okay so im just naturally gifted outlaw main then thats my specialty

[soft garnet]

what are people running on first boss voidspire

the st buiild or no

[torn tide]

i thought the answer was to sail the 7 seas and live the pirate life first

[shrewd lantern]

we have an aoe build?

its one talent

[soft garnet]

oh

well

idk

im just asking lmao

[shrewd lantern]

make a call depending how much your guild has covered for aoe

[oak sorrel]

!apex

[wicked jolt]

Apex talent optimization:

• Is shadow dance up? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have 5 or more stacks of shadow techniques? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Do you have Darkest Night up OR A supercharged combo point? - :ballot_box_with_check: Yes
• Is ancient arts up? - :x: No
  Use Shadowstrike (even if on full cp).

[oak sorrel]

what do you do outside of dance for trickster in regards to hitting sectec with arts?

[open swan]

Is the wow head rotation wrong? The apex talent optimization isn't listed on there

I keep spamming evis at 67 cp but have dog parses

[brazen stone]

ohhh you can use tricks on your valeera

im dumb

ok this things a joke

[warm marlin]

you dont care about having apex for sectec

[lucid jackal]

Late!!!

[warm marlin]

prefer to macro it with dance, with !premed bug you cant apex it doing that

[shrewd lantern]

@warm marlin 6 pts off

this season is so deflated holy

[warm marlin]

hopefully you do not suffer another 20 games like me

[shrewd lantern]

its shuff unless i int giga hard

doubt

[warm marlin]

ah ye

[shrewd lantern]

4-2 lobby only is +37 lmao

[warm marlin]

saved!

[shrewd lantern]

the melee lobbies are always kind of someone dies in the first 1min 30

meanwhile locks got like 3 healthbars

[gilded thistle]

fuck i didnt realize i had to collect souls from the vessel

i thought that shit just proc'd a buff

[arctic heart]

noob question, which skill applies DS in sub?

shadowstrike?

[oak sorrel]

!premed

[wicked jolt]

There is a bug that makes it so while Premeditation is active you cannot get a refund nor spawn the clone from Ancient Arts. This is not something you need to play around, as using Ancient Arts of Secret Technique is about the same value as using it on a regular Eviscerate.

[chrome palm]

@long sun shindig i see you trying not to laugh bruh

[arctic heart]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[ornate heron]

any tips for "??" on sub?

[hard trellis]

reroll

[oak sorrel]

so trickster doesn't do any specific playing around ancient arts?

[warm marlin]

fun fact btw, supercharged points don't reset on arena match start

like at all, even to 2 like on key start/raid boss pull

i watched some of the typical sub guys and none of them are prestacking it

you can have 6 SC points prestacked for every arena game

[long sun]

LOL

cmon man

[chrome palm]

that fight on 30 man is farming everyone

[long sun]

fr

but lowk crashout kinda justified

we did int

altho

yup

[gleaming plank]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[chrome palm]

i was using puzzle box on my assa rogue

that shit is demonic for that fight

im not doing that anymore

[warm marlin]

press feint lil gup

[long sun]

i thought i was suppsoied to use cds twice in p1

apparently u only use once as sub

[warm marlin]

idk depends on ur push timings i think

i sent twice and it was fine

lined up perfect rest of fight

[oak sorrel]

imagine trying to crown

with old gcd feint

[gilded thistle]

never understood why they did that

wtf was the point of having it on gcd

nerfing us by making our defensive clunky

genius

[oak sorrel]

well it has to be a gcd ability

cause it's a whole ass spin

[gilded thistle]

u do a 360 and face away from the boss

[oak sorrel]

makes acool sound at least

do we get our 2nd cata charge next week or week after?

[gilded thistle]

i would expect week after

but idk anymore, they just be doin shit

[oak sorrel]

next week is the start of the 4th week since launch ye?

idk lol

[lucid jackal]

Just press it wdgm

[oak sorrel]

i'll get 2k pretty quick or just insta pug march aotc, so between that + vault + the piece i have now i might be ok

ngl if i knew 2p was a 10% diff i might've made it before throwing myself at h crown for like 6 hrs

[chrome palm]

in p1 its annoying because while youre pressing it puddles are spawning on you

in p2 its annoying because taunt swap happens while you cast it

i just hate that shit

[lucid jackal]

U can take 1 puddle it ain that srs

And in p2 just step

Step is broken mang

[chrome palm]

step is insane on that fight

[lucid jackal]

It legit felt like a non issue

Pbox

[chrome palm]

its a little baby alt rogue so it feels pretty squishy on that fight

also i am getting giga 30 man debuff

[lucid jackal]

Fair

[chrome palm]

on that fight

[warm marlin]

i like to limit test swirls on heroic

[plush roost]

You must adopt the feint -> puzzlebox true combo

[warm marlin]

i will get mechanic and press feint to plant in a swirl

most of them on that fight dont do dmg btw

[lucid jackal]

Sin legit has infinite energy glitch

Just press feint true

[plush roost]

Ye once u have a bit of haste sin is pretty chill on wnergy