subtlety

[shadow lance]

https://tenor.com/view/hey-cat-waving-wave-paw-gif-11249423921160715390

[plush roost]

Sec tec does work

U press sec tec and get 4sht from apex 2 now

[haughty mural]

so no apex cancel

[plush roost]

The shadow clones dont clone themselves for damage but u still get your sht and all other benefits afaik

Currently a gain to not cancel aura it in big aoe

Since the phys part will spawn a clone

So u get 6sht with apex sec tec

Good deal

If premed bug wasnt in itd be way better

[haughty mural]

I see

Thanks for clarifying. I missed that

or my brain is getting dull over there

[clever delta]

huge buffs

[tribal blade]

getting all these bug fixes is kinda mind blowing

maybe they're actually going in a new direction dev wise

[keen dome]

I believed.

They're tuning up the purple.

[sinful zephyr]

its great going forward

easier to add new things with less bugs

[keen dome]

Ye, that's been my positive outlook on the whole situation. I overall like the changes, but the real core is that it should be easier to build up and improve versus the spaghetti before.

Hopefully.

[cursive island]

Is 2 sectech in blades supposed to be consistent on beta ?

[torn cedar]

how does the dance/Sb function with CdG? does all attacks get the buff if sent 0.1 s before they fade? or does it have to be up for the full attack?

[finite crow]

huh?

[warm marlin]

Up for full attack

[north schooner]

alacrity

[finite crow]

aa i see

[tribal blade]

it feels like sub is missing a button atm to me

but i agree with you i think this is a strong base to work on

[keen dome]

Ye, I agree.

[tribal blade]

it just means now they can add more to sub and it won't be in danger of being convoluted

[keen dome]

I think it needs one more button to do something like a "Every dance you get 1 stack and can consume it to get x stacks" or like, a Symbols or something

I have zero idea what would really work and am just speculating.

But I do think it could use additional button or mechanic.

[tribal blade]

yeah there's a billion different directions you can take it

last one i heard was something to do outside dance that makes you lead up to a stronger dance

[keen dome]

My favourite dumb idea is a Netherprism button. Every Sectec or Dance or something is +1 stack that gives Mainstat. It goes to say, 8. And you can consume it anytime via a button.

[tribal blade]

i would be down for it if it didn't reset on death

[keen dome]

So you can build up to it, or pop it early if needed. Giving Sub it's on demand explosion

[keen dome]

I feel like it would have too, but at the same time it'd be independant of trinkets, etc.

But just something to play around.

[tribal blade]

the only thing i didn't like about prism was losing all the stacks

felt way too punishing at times

[keen dome]

Yeah.

I don't think it'd hurt as much if it wasn't a trinket. Since it'd be in addition to everything else.

[tribal blade]

yeah true

i had the idea of nightblade coming back as a ST dot only applicable to 1 target

but then it would created the DS issue

unless the dot didn't require you to attack that target

another was bringing back flag or something like it except it only deals lash dmg

[fallow nimbus]

Don't bring anything back, rework goremaw for it

Like every goremaw use adds 1 stack of the sylv dagger effect

[tribal blade]

thing is goremaw wouldn't add a button baseline

but yeah they definitely need to do something about goremaw

[keen dome]

Yeah

[tribal blade]

we kinda don't need energy anymore

[keen dome]

Banshes Bane should be a thing, the sylv dagger proc

[fallow nimbus]

We never really did

[keen dome]

It's so sub

But put it on Danse imo

[tribal blade]

way back in the day the energy nodes were high value

but yeah nowadays not anymore

[vale pine]

think th problemw ith sylvanas effect was the combo point integration

[keen dome]

Nod probably

[vale pine]

blizz moves away from complicated things

at least to some degree

sht/shadowcraft/apex is a big mess if you consider that

and can be designed easier, but there was no attempt to do so

[keen dome]

It's not sub rogue if SHT / Shadowcraft / Shadowed Finishers isn't broken or weird or janky in some way

[tribal blade]

yeah the entire apex is very confusing to figure out

[keen dome]

I like it's Clones. I like them going hard into shadow clones

That's what we've said for ages. It's a really good pick to focus on. It's cool and thematic and ties it closer to our queen

[wintry elm]

im new on the spec eny advice for energy management¿

[keen dome]

you don't need to think about it, really. outside of cooldowns you do minimal damage and don't need enrgy anyway.

And in cooldowns you've got plenty.

[tribal blade]

you can play sub without an energy bar currently

[wintry elm]

the problem is i come form fury and i press to many bottons

i think

[tribal blade]

if you find a way to starve yourself you're doing something very wrong

[tribal blade]

there'll be moments where you can't press a gcd

which is perfectly normal

so long as you're doing the rotation correctly your energy will play itself

[wintry elm]

then i need to chill and dont spam to much

[tribal blade]

you can spam

you'll just not be able to fill every gcd

outside dance that is, inside dance you should be able to fill every gcd

[wintry elm]

yeah on cd's i dont have problems

is out of cd's

[tribal blade]

yeah that's normal dw

the funny thing is this is the best we've been able to press gcds outside dance in a LONG time

last time must have been DF with vigor and tea talented

[wintry elm]

then is a good time to start play this

btw thanks for your answers

[keen dome]

Never be afraid to ask! We're here to help

Hell yeah more sub rogues

[tribal blade]

i need to set up sin some time soon

my goal is to have all 3 specs fully set up going into midnight

outlaw took quite a bit of tinkering to get everything right, sin should be much easier

[keen dome]

Yeah, same

[slender kraken]

questions out side of sd / inside of sd - on two targets am i always use bp feels kinda bad

[haughty mural]

if they continue with that pace, i have a feeling that midnight will be a really great subtlety expansion

[open depot]

Big doubt we ever gonna play Outlaw. Big dagger time

I miss combat 🤧

[alpine wraith]

they made things simpler but also they can add things now

maybe we get more clone things

[haughty mural]

yuh

my thoughts

[keen dome]

Strip it down to 1 then build it back to 10

[tribal blade]

holy shit sin feels BRUTALLY slow

my god

(without apex)

[vale pine]

can i get an ai clone to play keys for me if i don't feel motivated?

[steel zinc]

yes only those two

[vale pine]

thanks

[steel zinc]

and for outlaw nothing 0

for sin only deathmark

not KB

basically any major cd

[tribal blade]

wait a second

holy fucking shit

i was testing sin without poisons on

holy

mother

of

god

[vale pine]

i had that happen quite a bit

[tribal blade]

NO WONDER

[vale pine]

its easy to forget poisons

[tribal blade]

i was like "nah there's no way sin is this slow now"

"this shit is unbearable"

[tribal blade]

i did that so many times while pushing during S2 of TWW haha

as sin

till i got a huge WA to remind me

ok this is way better

sin feels pretty fucking good on aoe, the CT change is banger

[alpine wraith]

tbh would not even be mad if reflection came back

[upper narwhal]

Are you pressing envenom or just spamming CT until everything has dots first? Cuz one of those is way more fun than the other imo

[scarlet heath]

they keep talking about just spamming CT, even if all are dotted

ang ignoring CPs

(in high target count)

but it probably gonna get patched

[upper narwhal]

Gameplay ✨

[keen dome]

POSION TOGGLE

my demand is vindicated once again

[tribal blade]

yeah no kidding

this shit is bananas at this point

[tribal blade]

i was just testing on 5 target dummies so spreading till all has bleeds

only 2 CT casts for that

[keen dome]

Leveling is so fun. Gotta reapply the dumb posions every hour!

😠

[tribal blade]

but after pushing as sin for the entire of S2 this feels pretty chill to me

half the brain power required for sin in aoe now

but more required than sub i think

[tribal blade]

yeah it's annoying at this point

there should also be a warning when you don't have poisons on

actually i dunno, there are points at which specs like sin actually take off crippling to not fuck gathering in keys

[mighty citrus]

ai made the dream work 😄

[tribal blade]

oh shit nice

[mighty citrus]

would need to adjust the prompts for assasination, but iam sure its feasable

[torn tide]

every hour isnt so bad

[north schooner]

bring back poison charges!

[torn tide]

of it was anything below 30mins then id be annoyed

[tribal blade]

i think if sin is tuned high enough

this spec is gonna be the meta rogue spec

at least in keys

seems like prio is very good

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/annoyed-face-gif-25409193

[haughty mural]

me thinks someone does not want to hear that word so often

[lilac stag]

Especially not when someone is testing assa checks notes WITHOUT POISONS

Old man is washed up like the rest of us

[haughty mural]

[alpine wraith]

you know what would make sub prio good?

singular focus working with sec tech kek

[tribal blade]

hey hey hey normally when i swap to sin i get a big ass WA in my face yelling at me to put them on 😉

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/simpsons-abe-simpson-milhouse-old-man-is-talking-gif-16954497

Imagine needing WAs to play wow. SMH my head.

[tribal blade]

despite some inconveniences i'm so happy they're gone

[swift tinsel]

The cpu load reduction factor is the only upside I’m experiencing

Really wish they wouldn’t have destroyed the ui aspect of WA

[tribal blade]

that one made a big difference for me

[swift tinsel]

Idk I’m very frustrated with both blizzard and WA for the rug-pull

And with available addons I can only get my ui into Uncanny Valley territory of my old setup

Where it’s close-ish but far enough away to be annoying or permanently look off

[tribal blade]

i get the frustration yeah

they did all this very very suddenly

[swift tinsel]

I’m of the mind where if they’d have gone with a staggered approach vs scorched earth secret value and slow walk back WA would have been less inclined to just drop the project entirely

Esp since Blizz said they were going to use a staggered approach

[hazy breach]

Idk seems like the point was to have WA drop their project

[lilac stag]

^ this

WA could just do way too much

Even if you just used it for a UI.

[steel zinc]

Whole point was blizzard controlling buffs/debuffs in combat.

[steel zinc]

Just use enhanced quality of life or any other addon that tracks this sorta stuff

[mighty citrus]

but for me its fun to play around so. sure somebody will have done it better already, but i just like doing those small things for myself

[floral geyser]

how does it change rotation

[vale pine]

I think its performance

a lot of the new stuff controlls how addons implement things, making it more difficult to waste a lot of cpu cycles

even some of the worse offenders like elvui are now fairly harmless in terms of fps impact

its like 1/3 of what it was before if even

[hazy breach]

Probably still gonna have fps issues in raid

[tribal blade]

main thing is it reintroduces the refund system back to sub

gives you something to react to

[vale pine]

probably, the engine rly needs some work

many implementations are far from ideal

[hazy breach]

And some janky shit like strike at full cp to trigger it

And canceling it in aoe for deathstalker

[tribal blade]

i have yet to try doing that on the beta

it feels dirty

[tribal blade]

oh lol that's right

[vale pine]

just wait till they remove the ability to cancleaura the buff

[hazy breach]

Probably will

And then you are gonna feel great using your 7 sht stacks on eviscerate in a 10 mob pull

Instead of on BP

[tribal blade]

well wait till expac after midnight for DS fixes

at this rate DS will be playable in 2030

[vale pine]

*till they remove ds

fixed it

[tribal blade]

at this point i want DS gone

the whole thing just bums me out

[floral stump]

! sheet

[runic sinew]

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[runic sinew]

remove space

[soft summit]

Hey, did AI create this WA??

[torn tide]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[mighty citrus]

addon, but yes

[graceful osprey]

I hope they fix things. Having to cancelaura doesn’t feel good

[hazy breach]

You dont have to cancelaura anything

[north schooner]

trickster gang

[topaz crow]

hello, just curious about patches for midnight, was the latest update the last for midnight or will there be more in time?

[hazy breach]

There will be one ever week or every other week

For like 2-3 months

[topaz crow]

ah ok tysm

[nimble cradle]

yall think sub still going to be meta raid spec?

[exotic steeple]

i mean for sure 1 of the 3 specs has to be

i pray

dont want to not get taken into hc raids because people think we not meta and we cant clear bcs of that

[lilac stag]

You’re not getting into heroic raids due to ilvl more than anything else

[fathom adder]

iirc 1:30 cd fits good for a few bosses, but aside from that

lets see

[lilac stag]

You’re taking a rogue unless tuning is absolute dog shit across the board.

nothing to see

[hollow spear]

I used to bind backstab/shadowstrike to 1 and evis to 3. Since I would like to start a heated exchange about keybinds that will end up with someone posting jpc's binds:

What's your take on binding stab to Q and evis to E?

[shadow lance]

Q is my strafe left and E my strafe right

So idk

[north schooner]

well Jetpack Cat needs her binds closer because her paws are tiny

[plush roost]

Asd strafe forward strafe, q backstab w rupture (rip) e sec tec r evis

W is such a core rotation spot i dont even know what to put there anymore

[hollow spear]

Oh wow, you're a W binder

[plush roost]

Maybe goremaw if its ever good...

[hollow spear]

I think my brain wouldn't be able to process W not being forward

[plush roost]

I redid my binds in cata so i could play pvp (i was 8 and didnt understand ctrl or shift binds)

So i wanted qwerty to be binds for rotation

[onyx flame]

I have shuriken/powder on Q E

[plush roost]

XD

[torn tide]

mine is shuriken/powder on R T

[fathom adder]

kick on q, rest on the 12 mousebuttons

[swift tinsel]

Q blades E kick

[plush roost]

Shift w storm, ctrl w powder xd

[torn tide]

that sounds like pain

[onyx flame]

I couldn‘t play on those 4kg MMOs mice 😄

[plush roost]

Nah its super chill because my brain says aoe button w, and that lets me not have to move fingers outside of my pinky

Ct is ctrl w and fok shift w as well

[hollow spear]

Kick has to be F

[plush roost]

Shift w blade rush, ctrl w blade flurry

[fathom adder]

yeah find it always cool to see the preferences

so many

[plush roost]

My kick is t, shift t focus kick

[hollow spear]

My hands are not meant for ctrl or alt as modifiers

[onyx flame]

tendonitis incoming 😄

[swift tinsel]

I only use ctrl or alt for binds I don't really use rotationally

[plush roost]

Idk i played piano as a kid im used to moving my fingers weird

[hollow spear]

I'm unironically thinking of a pedal modifier

[plush roost]

Very flexible

[swift tinsel]

like I use alt+E for health pot

[plush roost]

Okay thats demonic bro

[hollow spear]

You must die a lot

[swift tinsel]

nope

Im left-handed so its very easy for me to hit combos

[hollow spear]

Kinda criminal

Right hand discrimination

[plush roost]

Alt is such a weird place for me, i dont like moving my thumb off spacebar haha

[swift tinsel]

I don't really jump much lol

and my thumb rests close to the left edge of my spacebar when I'm gaming

[plush roost]

I jump a lot when im backstabbing just to feel some apm

[onyx flame]

Yeah still unhealthy to spread them this much for an ability you press that often.
Mine where like this too for almost 20years, but i recently changed them for more ergonomic binds and after i got used to it my hand feels way less tired

[swift tinsel]

so I kinda just curl it a tiny bit and its on alt

ctrl is the weird one for me

[hollow spear]

I discovered mouse wheel as keybind

My life has drastically improved

[swift tinsel]

I have alt and ctrl mwu and mwd for stuff but its usually like...buffs or some shit

[hollow spear]

I have feint on mwu

[swift tinsel]

but I zoom in and out for things and shift I use for action bar paging for professions

I have feint on shift+mb4

[plush roost]

Since my hand rests on asd and not qwe idk if im even stretching my fingers out. Its essentially already resting my pinky on shift and i just shift my entire hand to the upperright to move my pink down rather than shifting the finger so idm

But maybe im young and dont feel.anything yet

If it ever starts hurting then id know im in trouble haha

[hollow spear]

Has anyone of you played elementalist in gw2?

That's a real keybind hog

[onyx flame]

I am totally convinced that this would be enough to play midnight subrogue

[steel zinc]

can you send me your talents for m+ beta and trinkets your running?

[hollow spear]

Stop derailing mapko

[steel zinc]

testing now some stuff would be much appriciated Charrend

[steel zinc]

sorry how could it

XD

[plush roost]

Aoe

To go st its crazy but u swap potent for wm and thats it

Coldblood forced induct deeper obv

[hollow spear]

You now have to give us your three spiciest keybinds now Mapko

[plush roost]

Class tree is mosy utility

[hollow spear]

Or they'll prune sub even more

[steel zinc]

shadwo focus better then tornado?

[plush roost]

Gaze of the alnseeker + puzzlebox/feather/critflask/passive

[steel zinc]

your running vigor?

[plush roost]

Shadowfocus is very good

No vigor

We have so much energy

[onyx flame]

Mostly this i guess

[steel zinc]

and playing as 2min spec or jsut sending?

since we play 2min trinket

[plush roost]

U play as a 2min with pbox

[keen dome]

I have suffered an Event. A pantomime in a library. Nothing in WoW can touch that experience of chaos.

[steel zinc]

k

[plush roost]

But idk if pbox is worth it anymore

Just something i was fiddling with

Most importantly you want 200ish haste, 578 or 687 haste

This number matters

Not the %

Its ur dance breakpoints

Also youll feel like shit without windfury on lowhaste but it be what it be

[steel zinc]

ya noticed that without shaman

[plush roost]

Also improved ambush is good for weaponmaster talents

Thats about it tho

[steel zinc]

[Light Company Guidon] not good?

90 sec haste trinket

[plush roost]

The flag? Eh

[steel zinc]

ya

its 677 haste on use

looks good

[plush roost]

We really just want the haste breakpoint anything after is excessive

Were so sht and energy saturated from our apex talent

[steel zinc]

[Freightrunner's Flask] 90 sec on use crit also good

Just thinking if 2min trinket is worth you know

[hazy breach]

In theory ye

[plush roost]

That if it werent for dance length we probably wouldnt play any haste at all

[hazy breach]

But not the numbers on it

Puzzlebox is almost twice the stat the flask gives

[plush roost]

Ye crit flask will be good when its not 467 crit

[steel zinc]

true true

[plush roost]

And is instead 800+

Like.it should be

[steel zinc]

yeah not used to the numbers yet your right

[hazy breach]

I mean its not gonna be 800 like puzzlebox

But like 600-700 like flag

[plush roost]

Ye w.e the math works to

I always forget 1.5 are understatted a bit since cd ans blah blah

Any betters on a 1.5 mastery trinket in the 12.0.7 raid btw?

I feel it in my bones

[alpine wraith]

i think there will be 1 or 2 trinket pass tuning

[steel zinc]

But tbf I expect lots of trinket tuning to be done

[alpine wraith]

some of the numbers dont make sense

[steel zinc]

haha

we think alike 😄

[alpine wraith]

big geniuses in town

[steel zinc]

you saw the new filter hachadino?

[alpine wraith]

what filter?

i saw there were some cool updates to the addon but havent really checked

[steel zinc]

#1447768196362014823 message

I know its german but you get the idea

[alpine wraith]

POG

im more than 0% german maybe

[steel zinc]

you can use now important filter to track with player auras for sub these two buffs and get rid of idk cataclym event buff

yeah but the arrow explains well

you have player auras with important filter on and you just see these two buffs and get rid of all the bullshit

like idk its event xyz buff

[alpine wraith]

time to track wep enchants again

to do some silly things

[graceful osprey]

I’m actually about to play trickster again because I don’t want to manage cancelaura for DS lol

[vale pine]

trickster is good now, and probably the better choice on 90

so perfectly fine choice

[alpine wraith]

trickster is quite ahead in aoe in midnight

even after all the fixes for DS krangles iirc

for st they were sameish i think?

[vale pine]

trickster is ahead in st currently

but we will see

[alpine wraith]

yea lots of tuning to be done

my hope is they buff some trinks that we may use

[minor sorrel]

Deathstalker should only pull ahead on large count ae

[alpine wraith]

unlikely flawless is quite strong

it is a perma 20% or so mastery steroid+fazed

at lvl 90 sec tech applies it again

[vale pine]

deathstalker has in theory stronger prio

but idk how much that matters

[alpine wraith]

and coup flurries are very strong

[minor sorrel]

And funnle

[alpine wraith]

vs DN rip

nah funnel is fake

[vale pine]

you won't use evis in aoe, so would not call it funnel

[alpine wraith]

until singular works with sec tech

if they fix that one we may talk

[minor sorrel]

Meh...

[hazy breach]

It doesn't though

The more targets you add the worse it gets

[minor sorrel]

Whelp fazed is just much too strong still lol

At least i like the trickster sound design.

[graceful osprey]

Bring back double coup

[alpine wraith]

just proc hard enough

ez

[graceful osprey]

Sometimes I wish things weren’t so proc reliant

[alpine wraith]

i will never forgive blizz by killing icd things

[hazy breach]

Sub is very non proc based though

Very little in the rotation is actually random

And sht, which is a bit random, still uses a system that makes it not have much outliers

[shrewd lantern]

deathstalker assa better at that

[alpine wraith]

sht in dance now is clown fiesta of strong yea

you get so many

[shrewd lantern]

well probably not as much now without spatter as strong as it used to be

[shrewd lantern]

sub doesnt really have procs

unless you want to reach and say crits are

[lilac stag]

well we’ve moved on from 2 buttons to funnel an prio dmg.

gm chat

[glad bough]

I am trying to find an energy bar/combo point set up i can use and be able to move around freely and position where i want but i do not want my health bar attached to it like the blizz default one. anyone have any suggestions for an add on or something that has it?

all addons i was looking at seemed to be only the combo points

[alpine wraith]

sensei has a cool simple one but there are many ui addon things

you can try and choose

[glad bough]

ty ill take a look at that one

[shrewd lantern]

guarantee you 95% of people who say prio damage

[hollow spear]

how many dance macros do you guys have atp?

[shrewd lantern]

dont know what they're talking of

[swift tinsel]

just 2 for now

[shrewd lantern]

and just say it because some streamer did

[swift tinsel]

but 1 is storm+dance so effectively 1

[lilac stag]

But max said it and I sub to his twitch

[shrewd lantern]

yeah you only need 2 max

dance storm dance sectech

what else is there even

[grand wyvern]

2 buttons = 2 macros

[swift tinsel]

don't think I'm making a swifty macro for dance+sectech+blades since I can hit them all pretty easy

[shrewd lantern]

idk honestly i can still hit dance strike within 0.2

[swift tinsel]

probs gonna macro trinket to blades with potion or keep natty pot bind

[shrewd lantern]

and the delay makes dance strike macro not doable

so meh

just have fast hands

[hollow spear]

yeah, but you're kinda capped on how fast you can hit dance strike

so even with fast hands, you have to get extra haste to account for it

[swift tinsel]

I'm dancing with full cp so dance strike is kinda w/e

[lilac stag]

Get that juicy Sectech coup supercharged combo

[shrewd lantern]

0.2 secs yeah

[alpine wraith]

sadly you cant sec tech coup because premed cucks

but one day

[lilac stag]

You’re going to make me look at logs. Pretty sure I had setech into coup a few dances on Tuesday.

[warm marlin]

dance/sectec/coup not workie because of premed bug

this is true

[alpine wraith]

you can sec tech coup if you used premed first

but entering dance with apex or back when shadowcraft it didnt work

[shrewd lantern]

im already missing the big boom of sectech double coup

[alpine wraith]

it will take years to recover like when going from wod->legion

or bfa->shadowlands

[steel zinc]

what about strike?

to get some EB proccs

[swift tinsel]

storm gives EB tho

[vale pine]

^

we don't need to anymore

[swift tinsel]

and its been fixed to no longer random target

[red pewter]

Can still just dance/bs macro if you’re at low cp for the macabre. Not the worst thing on earth. Other than that just dance at full cp

[vale pine]

there is no reason to use backstab anymore

[red pewter]

Still procs a macabre event no?

[vale pine]

yes, but backstab is also weaker

so the trade off is not worth the effort

[red pewter]

So you’d just manually dance strike at low and sac a finisher at the end of your dance because you’re too slow and call that a dps gain over just dance stabbing

Low cp, or you’d bs to full cp then dance first

[swift tinsel]

realistically you'd prep your dance to avoid that

[red pewter]

Yeh, I’m just saying. Sims don’t always equal what’s actually doable on a 95% + replicable basis

[swift tinsel]

and I'm also saying that scenario is entirely avoidable

shouldn't ever really happen on opener, and you're prepping each dance after that

so its not really a question of simming

[red pewter]

They could also just fix the bug and let you macro dance coup and strike

[swift tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/gino-d'acampo-gino-dacampo-this-morning-grandmother-wheels-gif-1270420353161197650

[tepid trellis]

i was about to type that

no shot

[swift tinsel]

hehehe

[red pewter]

☠️

[swift tinsel]

it's always in the chamber whenever I get the chance, its such a funny video

[tepid trellis]

its a top 10 for sure

[swift tinsel]

just the coldest no fucks given

[tardy solar]

one of the best gino quotes ever said

[tepid trellis]

fwiw it is one of the things we try and make doable, to make them as real world playtime accurate, which is why sometimes alot of small optimizations arent added cuz they arent realistic to pull off alot of the times

[red pewter]

Fair

[tepid trellis]

which is why we even added the Shadow dance + strike delay into sims

[red pewter]

So what’s optimal now for when you proc a coup directly before dance window. Two separate macros? A dance coup macro and dance strike macro?

[alpine wraith]

dance sec tech

then you have to strike

then coup

because of premed bug

[red pewter]

Yeah imma just play assa

[shrewd lantern]

its not a bug its a feature

[alpine wraith]

kek

if you are big brain you pool some sht

and cancelaura premed as you enter dance

so you can sec tech coup

and still proc apex on next strike

but that is forbidden magic

as you only super overcap sht with blades up

or bl

[shrewd lantern]

cant wait for a million stat questions

when season starts

[red pewter]

I dunno, this is some diff between a 95 and 99 parse stuff.

Both will get the job done unless you’re literally in liquid or echo

[keen dome]

how much speed should i have

[alpine wraith]

dont worry your coups didnt crit and your unseens didnt double

[shrewd lantern]

idk enchant speed

avoidance is a healer issue

[keen dome]

I need a NUMBER!!!

[alpine wraith]

tbh after all the fixes to apex and shadowcraft

[north schooner]

depends on how much it costs around your parts

[alpine wraith]

we may just natty gear low haste

and just become dinos of mastery

or just change 1 jewelry between st and m+

[red pewter]

I haven’t checked in on it in a bit, can you use apex on sec tech or is that still forbidden

[keen dome]

Yeah

[shrewd lantern]

im just gonna put it into raidbots

and equip what robot says

[alpine wraith]

apex on sec tech is almost neutral

[shrewd lantern]

no thiughts

[keen dome]

Petition to rename Raidbots to Raidboys

Way better name

[alpine wraith]

because now we have more sht

[keen dome]

"I've gotta ask the boys a question"

[alpine wraith]

so the waste is whatever

and it is still some extra dmg

[keen dome]

"The boys told me this is best"

[shrewd lantern]

ttv.m***brah

for bis gearing questions

[red pewter]

If you get that ring with giga haste on it

[alpine wraith]

yea my idea was engi helmet or wrist with haste on it

then just change between raid and m+

or that ring

[shrewd lantern]

I do like how much people use stats to scapegoat

[red pewter]

What’s the single haste stat ring drop off of?

[shrewd lantern]

not playing well in this game

[alpine wraith]

last boss

kekw

[red pewter]

Niceu

[tepid trellis]

most of it is practically irrelevant

[alpine wraith]

yea optimizations sometimes are just kinda on the lower end but we are rabid finders of bigger number

[shrewd lantern]

95 and 99 is realistically bigger diff made by how fast your guild kills

and crit rng

[keen dome]

Need to invent a fake stat called "Skill" or something

[red pewter]

The majority of people aren’t going to be able to use the extra .2 sec on dance to fit in a finisher, so yeah pretty moot

For those people being mastery Andy’s would be more beneficial

[tepid trellis]

or add tiny bit more haste

and now you can suddenly fit it in

[alpine wraith]

well it is the other way around sometimes majority of people would lose that gcd

so gear a bit more haste

yep

[red pewter]

But but but, ain’t gon have dat much haste friend

[shrewd lantern]

you can dance strike natty in 0.2 secs

[alpine wraith]

tbh i will try and make a video about how to limit test your dance usage with haste brain

[shrewd lantern]

0.1 seems a stretch

idk if possible

[alpine wraith]

i can usually do it on 0.1

[warm marlin]

they do not let you do this unlucky

[alpine wraith]

but also even if you send it faster

[red pewter]

Brother have you raided with a non HoF guild? Some of these people mean well, but goodness gracious.

[warm marlin]

if you don't want premed you need to untalent it

[alpine wraith]

sometimes it does not register after some ms after

[alpine wraith]

rip

[warm marlin]

and fwiw 0.2s is barely enough for most to fit all their dance gcds in assuming their first gcd is perfect

[shrewd lantern]

yeah i would need to check but i’ve had instances where my strike still went off

[warm marlin]

I reviewed a lot of logs in tww2/3 and ppl be dropping micro gcds all the time

[shrewd lantern]

despite my dance buff expired

[alpine wraith]

maybe it had some ms left

[warm marlin]

you definitely dont want to lose 0.2s with your strike

[alpine wraith]

it has some leeway

[warm marlin]

for example, second sectec in tfd (including both clone hits) was possible essentially every single pull in raid if you dropped less than 0.1 gcds over the whole dance and had predisorient/presupercharge, no lust required

but i never saw anyone say

[alpine wraith]

i would always err on the side of caution tho

[warm marlin]

i went over a raid night once and hit it on dimmy 21 times in a row or something

[red pewter]

Just join a parsing guild my friend

[alpine wraith]

well double sec tech was a bit of a cheat because you could always dance after and only lose the macabre %

[red pewter]

This week it’s your turn for 3 PI’s and we reset if you’re not on pace for a benji

[haughty geyser]

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet

[warm marlin]

which is a big chunk of damage on that hit at least

but mostly an example of how most are dropping micro gcds, it happens a lot more than i think people realize

[alpine wraith]

trickster never helped too

[warm marlin]

i would recommend more than 0.2s leeway for most prob

[alpine wraith]

i would always recommedn the extra 0.2 yea

like from 0.4

[warm marlin]

im not counting the coup one

[alpine wraith]

it is also not a lot of haste more

[warm marlin]

so like more than 0.4s leeway counting coup

maybe not so bad now that macro is gonna be standardized but i saw a lot of poor guys dropping gcds in dance

[dire ravine]

can you explain this to me, but slower

[ebon nest]

Is it better for a mid player like myself to focus on Haste or Mastery for general use with a mixture of raid and m+ content? Been confused on stats for a bit

[alpine wraith]

does not work ryldd explained why

[alpine wraith]

we will see how much haste you want for st and aoe/m+

[warm marlin]

I do wish we could cancel premed!

[alpine wraith]

then just change 1 or 2 items depending

[warm marlin]

that would be interesting

[alpine wraith]

as it stands around 700 haste for st

and like 200 for m+ seem to be the numbers

but anything can change

from bug fixes to buffs

to nerfs?¿!

[ebon nest]

I see atm its just kinda swapping gear around to fit the content

[alpine wraith]

yea we got lots of bug fixes that helped sht generation

so now we only really care about the dance duration and to an extend

[hollow spear]

Sht is certainly an abbreviation of all times

[alpine wraith]

yea sub has a funny time

so much

s

[hollow spear]

Sod is gone

[keen dome]

Combies is better than combo points, imo

[alpine wraith]

good riddance

[hollow spear]

Sod off I say

[alpine wraith]

rest in piss

[fossil forge]

https://tenor.com/view/rip-bozo-gif-22294771

[onyx flame]

Hey i have a question about tricks of the trade. The tooltip says it transfers all my threat to the tank/targetet player.
But when i firsthit a Boss in an M+, i still receive the first hit from him?

[fallow nimbus]

First use gives you a 30sec buff then your next hit triggers the threat redirection

[vale pine]

bosses often hit the closest target when engaged

[onyx flame]

no, it was already running

[onyx flame]

ah yes, makes sense

[vale pine]

also the first treat redirection can sometimes be slow

if you want to be sure to not get hit, you can use storm as opening as it allows you to stand outside melee range

[fallow nimbus]

Yeah, wait until the boss moves

[inner pulsar]

The amount of times I've prematurely Shadowstriked a boss and been insta-gibbed thinking Tricks would save me....

[vale pine]

i mean idk if people remember the previouse raids

[warm marlin]

just cheat death lil gup

dont need that anyway just dont die

[vale pine]

but i had a lot of discussions with our tanks to stand in melee

[inner pulsar]

you just changed my life

[vale pine]

on certain fights the boss 100% attacks the closest target first when engaged

[warm marlin]

np got you

[vale pine]

turns out

[sullen hare]

that's what cheat death was made for

[vale pine]

people rather flame you and say skill issue while playing tanks

and stand the furthest away from the boss when engaging

[warm marlin]

cheat saved me from pulling on both fractillus and oab

[sullen hare]

oh ryldd already said that

[vale pine]

🤣 tank players are special people

[warm marlin]

they don't got hands like that

[vale pine]

i mostly use it for limit testing

[inner pulsar]

It's the CTE

[vale pine]

i was mostly joking

but its true that i had to fight with the tanks tanks to actually move to melee in my raid team

which they then did ~33-50% of the time

[swift tinsel]

glad to hear its not just me that feels like pulling teeth to get tanks to move intuitively

[vale pine]

oh no, its a longstanding struggle

but i think thats a perspective problem

[swift tinsel]

its interesting they're melee but don't understand how to accommodate melee

[vale pine]

as a melee, you depend on tank movement a lot

so inherently, you will complain if the positioning or movemet is bad

[swift tinsel]

we have 2x pwar and when they hear movement their choice is to then heroic leap as far as humanly possible away

[uneven scarab]

Play with a wheelchair bdk and you’ll be fine :3

[vale pine]

but some boss fights need a lot of good positioning and planing

because bosses have casts too or are not movable at certain parts

[swift tinsel]

for a lot of bosses its whatever bc movespeed but some like Rik are literal speed demons

[vale pine]

tanks are usually reactive

their role i mean

so they are used to "this happens -> i need to spot/use defensive"

[swift tinsel]

their job is normally pretty boring so I'd think they'd jump at the chance for something to do lol

[vale pine]

the game just does a very poor job to explain or highlight the impact on others

[swift tinsel]

for sure

[vale pine]

and don't rly gives rewards for ahead of time planing

[swift tinsel]

I've had more success with tanks that are very m+ active

[vale pine]

and certain specs can attack off target for a bit

[swift tinsel]

bc they seem to understand positioning and movement a lot more

[vale pine]

which means, not all melee dps are impacted equally

[bronze turret]

The bottom line is still that if ur a melee player and can’t sit on the boss ur just bad

It’s part of the skill kit of being a good melee player

Optimizing uptime to every ms

[vale pine]

yes

ill give you one example of what i talk about

even tho that was agreed on after a short depate

[swift tinsel]

ye that's why I lean on step often when they decide to get erratic

[bronze turret]

So it doesn’t matter if ur ”good at downtime” cus if the fight has downtime you can’t control ur just benching most melee regardless

[vale pine]

amirdrassil lerodar

there is this phase pulsing aoe comes in, you need to stand in an cycle, the position is controlled by the tank

so the tank did not move the boss close to this zone

melee dps can't do damage

[bronze turret]

You talk to the tank

[vale pine]

skill issue on the melees

i guess

[bronze turret]

You talk to the raid leader

You fix it

[vale pine]

thats my point

[sullen hare]

one of the reasons I absolutely hated larodar

[swift tinsel]

ye the convo started talking about tanks being obstinate about movement

[bronze turret]

Ye well why does it matter if x spec does 10% more dmg from range then?

Cus that’s just not how you should play the fight and is a raid leader/strat issue

[vale pine]

its an tanking issue

and thats what i highlighted

[bronze turret]

Tanks are slaves to the strat sometimes

It’s on the melee to speak up if something is shit tho, ive had amazing tanks and they could still have a blind spot in some melee situations

Just gotta communicate

[vale pine]

exactly

[swift tinsel]

that's what we're saying lol

[vale pine]

you just repeated the gist of the discussion ^^

[tepid trellis]

me and you constantly asking if we can move the boss another way

[bronze turret]

I just hate this opinion

[sullen hare]

I quit for the tier when my guild turned our smolderon strat from the standard to a more ranged-friendly approach while completely sacrificing melee uptime 300 pulls into prog

[bronze turret]

Triggers me

[vale pine]

oh, did not intend to hit a nerve ^^

[bronze turret]

Not a single melee is happy shooting offbrand lightning bolts in range group

[bronze turret]

Ye gotta optimize every second

[swift tinsel]

did we lost long arms with DF rework or was that tww

idr

[bronze turret]

Tww

We had long arms when i last played

Which was mid df

[swift tinsel]

ah yeah that's right

couldn't remember if that survived the rework or not

[bronze turret]

They slashed it from everyone tho

No?

[swift tinsel]

umm I think so

[bronze turret]

Like every spec in the game

[swift tinsel]

ret has like..vestiges of it

[bronze turret]

So nothing lost relatively

[warm marlin]

depends on your definition, but yes every melee lost the 3yds on "melee" spells

some like ret and udk can just cast most of their repertoire from 30yds anyway

[bronze turret]

Ret

Give them a moment to shine pls

[swift tinsel]

I think uhdk lost theirs with the clawing shadows change

[bronze turret]

Poor bastards

[swift tinsel]

for midnight

[warm marlin]

i thought someone told me they had exactly 1 button that was true melee left

i could be cooked

[swift tinsel]

oh nvm they baked the 30 yard range into base scourge strike

[bronze turret]

I don’t think any melee should be able to do good dmg from distance, like ranged dps levels. Kinda defeats the purpose

[warm marlin]

ye

[swift tinsel]

so now its just festering strike that's melee

bc putrefy and dc obv are range

[warm marlin]

crazy btw

[swift tinsel]

oh I guess soul reaper

so 2 lol

[bronze turret]

Hopefully tuned thereafter

[warm marlin]

[swift tinsel]

thematically I kinda get it bc they're effectively a necromancer

which is often a caster vibe

[bronze turret]

I like being in the middle of chaos

[swift tinsel]

same, ranged is lowkey boring

[bronze turret]

Having to move perfectly, it’s satisfying

[swift tinsel]

played mage for one tier and it was the least exciting tier I've raided

[bronze turret]

So many fights in the first tier of df were melee movement fights and it was fun

[tepid trellis]

watching orby die on sennath

gold

content

[bronze turret]

Love it

[swift tinsel]

god I hated that fight

[bronze turret]

It was kinda annoying but also funny

[swift tinsel]

watching people get yoinked off a ramp and fly off was pretty choice lol

[bronze turret]

Few bosses that made me hate ranged dps more than on sennarth

[swift tinsel]

I just hate the skating interia movement bit

[uneven scarab]

melee wasnt even that fun on sennarth either tbf

aids fight

[bronze turret]

You also had the wind fight

[uneven scarab]

dathria

[bronze turret]

Even the shaman totem shit had movement

And ofc last boss with the waves and what not

[bronze turret]

Kurog

Lowkey best intro tier ever

Most of them are dull and shit

[uneven scarab]

Kurog was great

Love that one

agreed tho

[tepid trellis]

first 2 sub rogues to kill it baby

[bronze turret]

Hah ye

Fuck outlaw

Aint falling for that trap

Kinda nostalgic for me too cus it was the last tier I actually enjoyed the game and cared enough to plan and strat. Miss that part the most

[vale pine]

must be nice when your tanks are receptive to feedback

[lucid jackal]

IT was a sub tier

• Sub Copers

[vale pine]

every tier is a sub tier

[bronze turret]

In colour every tier was a sub tier

At least as long as I played

Stealthi was quick to turn to the darkness (ass rogue) after I left

[vale pine]

weakness

and all of this even tho he knows the tier list

[bronze turret]

It was genuinely better for prog I think. So no blameo, but i would have played sub at least

[flat sun]

single dps is low or not ?

[tepid trellis]

i played Assa until it was nerfed in amirdrassil

then i played sub

was waaay too overtuned at the start to not play it

[vale pine]

unpopular opinion^^

[bronze turret]

[alpine wraith]

smolderon said overtuned this nuts

then the great chicken appeared

[tepid trellis]

it did a lil too much dmg

[shy ermine]

Perfect prog kill timer

My PI died so I didn’t get in execute and still got prog r1

[bronze turret]

PI hoarder

[alpine wraith]

i remember igira week 1 was so sillt

i could snipe all the spears perfectly

and still get gapped

[tepid trellis]

i only had 2 out of 3 iirc

jahrl had the lust one on pull

[warm marlin]

5 ilvls up on most of your raid

[vestal escarp]

Yeah bro kush and company heliumbagged sin so hard that tier they went medieval on its ass

[warm marlin]

heliumbagged

[shy ermine]

the glory days

[tepid trellis]

im a no lifer on launch

had gotten pretty much all pieces i needed from m+ before our first mythic raid

[warm marlin]

ah i assumed this was mythic prog

[vestal escarp]

Given the gap id say it was a gnarlroot kill

[warm marlin]

slacking raid smh

[alpine wraith]

think igira was more op as assa than gnarl

everyone kinda had dmg on that boss

but in igira you stole everyones

or maybe it is gnarl hmm

[tepid trellis]

igira

[tepid trellis]

igira mythic

[native zodiac]

remove the amp cap on kinsgbane

bring back amirdrassil kinsgbane

[keen dome]

Huh, possible changes to crests on beta? 20 per level or something.

[swift tinsel]

I only saw the 50% cost for alts thing

[keen dome]

A buddy mentioned it might've been hotfixed just now.

20 per step, 80 for a weapon craft or somehting

I don't have beta installed to check, though

[alpine wraith]

i knew i was a genius

[plush roost]

How does one know

[alpine wraith]

i worked with other people

[astral axle]

holy no more incrementally higher cost for crest upgrades?

pog???

[crisp marlin]

hi, can anyone help me with a question regarding secret technique, are there any circumstances there i would want to use it outside of shadow dance?
since if there arent i could use the same keybind for both abilities since shadow dance would switch me into my stealth keybinds

[keen dome]

Crafted pieces now require 80 Crests (was 60)```

Yeee

Crests now cost 20 per upgrade (was 15)
Crafted gear now costs 80 crests (was 60)
Each gear track now only accepts a singular type of Crest (Champion Gear accepts Champion Crests the entire time)
Each track has been standarized with 6 total tiers```

[vale pine]

always during dance

[vale pine]

interessting, think this makes a lot more sense for turbo boost too

[keen dome]

Yeah.

20 per step is pretty comfy, 100 per week so a full upgrade a week. Crafted more in line, too.

No huge final step

[tribal vortex]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
Here is a macro to make it easier to fit all of your globals into your Shadow Dances:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique

Deathstalker likes to use this macro instead:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Shuriken Storm

This can be combines with trinkes and other cooldown use.

/cast Shadow Blades
/use 13
/use 14
/use Tempered Potion
/cast Ancestral Call

Trickster Rogues can combine Coup de Grace and Black Powder in one button:

/cast Coup de Grace
/cast Black Powder

You can find more macros and details in Guides like WoWhead or Icy Veins.

[alpine wraith]

i knew this shit was not gonna last

[vale pine]

you never know

there are so many parts in wow, some might not change

[keen dome]

like poisons..

[alpine wraith]

you use it sometimes without dance on like third rotation of cds

to have 2 dances for blades

[astral axle]

amen

[vale pine]

poisons are the betrayal

they removed them in legion

just to be "surprise, we add them back" later

[tidal blade]

content

[alpine wraith]

i never recovered from not having fall damage

[crisp marlin]

aight checked out the macro:
/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Secret Technique
but one thing i dont really understand is that this macro would immediately use secret technique regardless of how many combo point i currently have wouldnt it be better to delay it by one global cool down to be able to fit in a shadowstrike for max combo points?

[alpine wraith]

you can enter dance with full combo points

[tidal blade]

can and should

[crisp marlin]

so i should optimally delay using shadow dance until i have full combo points?

[plush roost]

No you should have full cp before ur dance is ready

[hazy breach]

• Generally Trickster wants to enter at full cp and deathstalker with low cp.
  Per #subtlety-faq and the guides

[vagrant fulcrum]

@vale pine did rules for some hero trees going into dance with low points get invalidated?

Xd

[steel zinc]

Fuu what do you do in aoe btw? Still strike for UB and BP?

Or just storm BP?

midnight^^

[hazy breach]

Storm

[steel zinc]

So we do not care at all for ub in aoe?

even at two targets?

[hazy breach]

Storm procs it

[steel zinc]

ohhh

yeah did not keep up that much then nvm

Ty

[tidal blade]

Don’t we shadow strike in dance at 2-3t? Or no

[hazy breach]

Slight gain to use it in 2 targets yes

But not the end of the world if you cba

[tidal blade]

ok ty wanted to check myself there

[vale pine]

its more strict in midnight because of apex

its less so in pre patch

apex give more power to dance

[full bobcat]

why is that?

[hazy breach]

Because it allows you to spender sht faster, instead of it just piling up and getting more combo points after dance

[hollow python]

So as of this moment trickster is the only move¿

[fallow nimbus]

Always has been

Prepatch was enough DS

[lilac stag]

Stop trying to make DS a thing.

[astral axle]

https://tenor.com/view/fetch-regina-george-mean-girls-santa-hat-mean-gif-5497996

[vagrant fulcrum]

Careful, they might hear you and illegally buff bp so DS is the only choice

[lilac stag]

This isn’t Max’s stream. No devs to be found here.

[vagrant fulcrum]

I can’t tell if that’s good or bad ngl

Xd

[lilac stag]

Otherwise goremaws would have been fixed

[vagrant fulcrum]

I feel like they just forgot

[hollow python]

I read it was good for single target and committed to getting set up and comfy with it, ill just say it was a passing hobby

[vagrant fulcrum]

About goremaws / all the HO shit for outlaw

[lilac stag]

Tbf I’m happy with them fixing so much ahead of launch

[vagrant fulcrum]

Or did they think giving sub infinite energy wouldn’t impact a button that mainly generates energy xd

What are we settling for here, come on they can’t just have multiple specs with absolutely unpickable capstone level talents

[lilac stag]

sub is way ahead of typical new expansion completion. We’re eating good

Rogue hero talents is a class issue

Which are still directionless

[vagrant fulcrum]

Bro it’s a two button spec 😭

They reskinned fury

[lilac stag]

Everything is 2 buttons

Have you even looked at anything on beta?

[vagrant fulcrum]

Nah, atleast other specs have something to track or react to

[lilac stag]

Your tracking Sectech

[vagrant fulcrum]

😭😭😭😭

[lilac stag]

Enjoy

Assa is what two more buttons and even more braindead

[vagrant fulcrum]

Bro it’s 1 macro every 20s cmon surely spriest having like a low cd nuke etc

Ngl im coping

It’s all brain dead

[lilac stag]

Is there depth? Not really. Nothing has it. Pacing is good. Vibe is good. I like big dam every 25 seconds

I’ll enjoy people coming in here and completely fucking up the 2 button spec.

[plush roost]

Its actually quite a conundrum for blozzard because bp is 40% of tricksters overall

They cant just buff bp anymore

[lilac stag]

Sure they can

Just nerf trickster cleave at the same time

Coup now has a 1.6 second gcd

[vagrant fulcrum]

Spell is just super strong bc of that potent powders talent, if they do keep buffing it I’m fairly sure ds abuses that more, they have more bp amps bc no cleave like nimble

[hazy breach]

I mean they can adjust other things if they want to

But idk if they dont fix the mark does it even matter?

[plush roost]

Its just that they would have to buff bp so much for that threshhold to be met with ds > trickster that the class would be batshit op

Since ds is just that behind

Hence, they cant just buff bp to "solve" this "issue"

[hazy breach]

DS has less BP buffs than trickster does now anyway

[chrome palm]

When buff eviscerate

Why are they allergic to buffing evis

They’re gonna hit us with like 20% more backstab damage or something

And more melee damage prob

[bleak night]

[plush roost]

Cant theyd buff aoe

[sullen hare]

Oh nooo, what would I ever do if they buffed bp another 12%...

[north schooner]

they should buff bp enough to be better than evis on st

[bleak night]

the dream

[sullen hare]

Make goremaws increase black powder damage only

[north schooner]

your next 3 BP deal 50% more damage and reduce goremaw's cd by 1s per cp spent

[hazy breach]

I think it should have some effect on sectech, either by allowing an extra sectech without triggering the cd or somehow empowering the next sectech

[north schooner]

6 akaari clones

or Army of the Goats. You summon 3 akaari clones and she copies your next 5 finishers with all 3 clones

[sullen hare]

or you summon akaari's evil extremely mal-adjusted goat herd

kinda like this

[north schooner]

10 trees died for this

[sullen hare]

probably.

[tribal blade]

DON'T PUT THAT OUT IN THE UNIVERSE

[tall urchin]

sorry but do any of you know of an addon that can make icons popp up when a spell is offcd or say i can show just numbers of stacks i have of something (buff) as a huge ass number on my screen? something like poweraura

[hazy breach]

Afaik you can't do that

That's precisely the type of functionality that was intended to be removed

[tall urchin]

what, to have a big icon show (instead of the spells own icon) or stripping away the icon and only show the number?

[sacred yarrow]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Bubbling wax:

• Can be pickpocketed from kobolds in e.g. The Ringing Deeps. (needs The Final Candle questline completed.)
• Only use it on one weapon. (does not stack)

[hazy breach]

Both I think

[tall urchin]

sounds to me like the thing they want to still allow since it has no underlying smart logic

[hazy breach]

Addons can't see spell cd

Or spell stacks

[tall urchin]

hm that might be ye, meh

[hazy breach]

Yeah but removing the smart logic stuff unfortunately collaterals into removing a bunch of qol and customization

It is what it is

[tall urchin]

so ur saying addons cant see if a spell is avail or not?

ehh, on/off cd

dont need no countdown

[hazy breach]

Might be able to, but you def can't see how long left the cd has

[tall urchin]

yeah im just having a hard time looking at ingame icons, need big-ass icons that i can distinguish by their shape for when key things are usable and hidden when not 🙁

[hazy breach]

Welcome to midnight

[tall urchin]

nah someones gonna make

[alpine wraith]

hmm

trickster even more ahead now on aoe

[kind edge]

Yea, good news.

They posted it at 2 mins ago

[swift tinsel]

Must have seen us puzzling about why they don’t list fixes and threw one in lol

[hazy breach]

I will have to check how that works tomorrow, but that should be a noticeable buff

Curious as to why they didn't touch sectech clones too, but

[swift tinsel]

A buff for trickster is a win for the good guys

[hazy breach]

Maybe they did

Idk

I'm in bed

[swift tinsel]

They’re allowed to list one fix per six month period

The rest stay in the shadows

[hazy breach]

Either they made coup its own clone from apex or regular eviscerate clones now also cleave

[alpine wraith]

step by step who knows

[kind edge]

Its true that the thing about the cancel stuff with the sectech and apex talents was shadow fixed?

[alpine wraith]

we dont really cancel ancient arts anymore

for sec tech

[brisk onyx]

Is there a link? I couldn't find this post.

[swift tinsel]

Ye just for DN in aoe

[kind edge]

https://www.wowhead.com/blue-tracker/topic/eu/world-of-warcraft-hotfixes-20-february-606453

[swift tinsel]

Inb4 they make Apex uncancelaura-able

[hazy breach]

It wasn't fixed, just turns out it wasn't worthwhile anymore

[maiden oar]

wahoo

[hazy breach]

It's +-0

[maiden oar]

good bug fix now give eviscerate 20% buff

[swift tinsel]

Shrimply not possible

[maiden oar]

ur right give it 25%