subtlety

[plush roost]

Great pad, but boss dps does go down abit

but idk

like

maybe im onto something

[charred kestrel]

I think kush ran a DB build In something but not gonna auto copy that untill it’s been verified by a big brain in here.

[alpine wraith]

db is fine it can do more overall

in the end it depends on what you want

[plush roost]

anyway this is the cook if u wanna play around

[charred kestrel]

Big numbers

[plush roost]

only 2 symbols is very weirdge

[charred kestrel]

I’ll check it out. Still in DH jail for awhile tho.

[haughty rose]

can anyone check this log and tell me how the fuck theres so much dps difference between me and the other two? i don't see where this massive gap comes from since i don't feel like i played any bad. +13 Arakara

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/NJd6jApmTMhPFa4L?fight=last

[shrewd lantern]

i mean you drop deeper dags for it too

[lilac stag]

why are you not rupturing mobs on the way to the first miniboss?

[haughty rose]

good question

[lilac stag]

youre casting storm in dance on the first pull

[haughty rose]

that was for rotten most likely

[lilac stag]

if youre running rotten you storm after sod outside of dance

run finality. rotten is shiet (they're both fine, but rotten likely isnt needed).

you're pressing evis a lot

so yeah you're missing some of the basics

!aoe

[wicked jolt]

General Gist of the Aoe rotation

• At ALL target counts cast Coup de Grace when it is ready.
• At ALL target counts cast Shadowstrike during Shadow Dance, not Shuriken Storm. (unless coup is ready, !coup)
• Cast Black powder instead of regular Eviscerate at 4 or more targets (there is no other secret rule).

[lilac stag]

@haughty rose multiple storms so not fw

maybe out of dance, timeline and cast arent aligning exactly

That dance shows a cast time of 3:45

And if it’s out of dance you’re missing globals in dance

[haughty rose]

ok thanks

but would this explain a gap of almost 3B? After all i have some decent MFO HC logs so i can't be that bad

[lilac stag]

keys and raid are different

[haughty rose]

i mean sure. but not once have i had such a massive gap this season

i'm rarely last

[lilac stag]

you were in there 25 minutes. which means max you'd have is 16 flag casts. you had 13

likely could have at least got one more set in

you asked for feedback, i'm giving it. do what you want with it mate

[alpine wraith]

yea it might not seem much but delaying things adds up

[shrewd lantern]

Literally all of sub's damage is in cds

so missing cds is gonna fuck you

[alpine wraith]

like sometimes it seems a waste to pop cds on a pull but it takes a bit of knowledge how to make that effort

other times it is better to send it

[lilac stag]

meanwhile on fury, do I have bladestorm up for pull.

[haughty rose]

yeah no i'm not disagreeing at all sorry if i made it seem so that wasn't my intention

[lilac stag]

“Yes, but” kinda frames it that way.

It’s all good

[haughty rose]

yeah this might explains it. that tank was constantly chain pulling which i'm not used to and sometimes the CD's came back up when the pack was at half health so it felt wasted

(not blaming the tank btw)

[lilac stag]

use vanish for TFD

Half health is still send a dance

[lucid jackal]

ts like 1 fan outlaw

Just fake news

[haughty rose]

yeah i learned this today and did it one or two times

[burnt abyss]

anyone have or know of a plater profile that supports Phased targets etc?

[plush roost]

wdym fake news?

ecodome 18 db build

guys im cooking

I am for real

cooking

siren siren emoji

[shrewd lantern]

where goremaw pv build

[plush roost]

Drop Death perception and go goremaw HOLY

(JOKING)

[spice escarp]

how come i gain a shadowcraft proc sometimes when only using symbols by itself?

[plush roost]

If u start at 7 without premed and sod u proc your shadowcraft

[spice escarp]

i see

am i missing something, or is that not supposed to happen?

[warm marlin]

its a bug

[spice escarp]

typical

trying to find a simpler way to track the cp refunds for the shotgun, i guess technically it is a full shadowcraft refund

[olive remnant]

!log

[olive remnant]

could some1 maybe look at my dawn log? I thought i did fine but its only 37%.. Startet sub this season so im kinda new

[dusk stone]

no idea first 4 minutes looks fine

!mistakes

[wicked jolt]

Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:

• Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
• Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
• Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
• If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.

[lucid jackal]

Just like

Ugly to play

even if its decent

No inev 1 depth perception

[lilac stag]

🚨 🚨

[plush roost]

Yeah it actually felt like season 3 df with sod downtime

[lilac stag]

sir we do not joke about

[mental shore]

when use thustle tea build and ice cold one

[frank narwhal]

Anyone know what this debuff is? I can't seem to find it in details, and I've set plater to only show my debuffs

[hazy breach]

Bombardment from scalecommander evokers

[frank narwhal]

Oh okay, thank you

[hazy breach]

Im fairly sure atleast its that

[frank narwhal]

It was yeah

[hazy breach]

Because its a buff they apply on nearby allies

So it counts as "yours"

[frank narwhal]

Ah right. There's also one from paladin's that I've seen but haven't yet got rid of heh

[clever delta]

i take it

finally its down

[misty mason]

Hey all, in raid fights if we are talented into shiv when are we dropping it in the rotation ?

[willow bobcat]

Shiv is utility

[versed swift]

https://tenor.com/view/thats-the-neat-part-you-dont-invincible-gif-27194608

[paper siren]

why is my 710 Antenna still simming better than the 710 Ritual forge

[ionic tinsel]

Funny story, even if I turn on hekili, goremaw is never recommended as a button press

[clever delta]

on dimmensius we are not sectech later living mass?

i check like 4 logs and nobody do

[maiden slate]

Hello.
I made my video guide for a subtlety lens. Where can I post it for you to watch?
Remember, I speak Spanish and use a translator.

[alpine wraith]

you danger killing it too early

and making you wipe because it revives

[clever delta]

ok

and the openers are kinda crazy

ss into flag sectech 😄

[maiden slate]

Hola.
hice mi vídeo guía para un objetivo del sutileza, donde lo puedo dejar para que lo vean?
Recuerden que hablo español y uso traductor. : )

Hello.
I made my video guide for a subtlety lens. Where can I post it for you to watch?
Remember, I speak Spanish and use a translator. : )

[native zodiac]

you should

if you want to do more overall

if you sectech boss it wont hit the mass

[clever delta]

yeah i get that

i can like sectech add and than ignore it as im dropping poop in back anyway

[maiden slate]

Can you pass the link here?

[tepid trellis]

nope

[maiden slate]

And where can you go to share it among the Subtleties?

[tepid trellis]

point 3

[regal rose]

for the delve waist what ability are we suppose to use on it ?

is it still worth using ? doesnt sim higher for me but maybe cause i wasnt using the right abilty on iy

it*

[clever delta]

damn i sended my P3 cds withnout second dance ready:D i did tank dmg in p3

insane

still logged

[old scroll]

how do u stack netherprism before dung start? :p

[clever delta]

you hit the dummy

[old scroll]

but like it resets

doesnt it

[alpine wraith]

no

you wait for the key holder to put the key

then you go out

then go in when the golden bubble timed out

best done if you dont have a crappy HDD and loading screens take 30 secs

so beware

[deft silo]

they may have hotfixed it now, stacks of netherprism dissappear when entering a dungeon, even before keys in

[alpine wraith]

rip

[lethal yew]

I tried it last night. Maybe my timing was off but it reset my prism stacks

[old scroll]

@alpine wraith ty!

[alpine wraith]

you need to enter after bubble is down but if what kevin said is truye

just unluck

[dusty totem]

We are cooked

Never even got around to doing it in any key that matters

Was kinda obnoxious to stack for 3 min before key tho

[magic dove]

Yeah thats cringe

[frosty thistle]

!aoe

[wicked jolt]

General Gist of the Aoe rotation

• At ALL target counts cast Coup de Grace when it is ready.
• At ALL target counts cast Shadowstrike during Shadow Dance, not Shuriken Storm. (unless coup is ready, !coup)
• Cast Black powder instead of regular Eviscerate at 4 or more targets (there is no other secret rule).

[frosty thistle]

o/ everyone. outside cd's in aoe scenario do we usually spamming shuriken strorm & bp or backstab & bp for gaining coup?

[ashen sable]

Anyone can help me? What am i doing wrong here? https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/gTfhJPnMw1k2XZpH?type=damage-done&cutoff=2&fight=46

[shrewd lantern]

build with storm outside dance if 2+ targets

dont build with it in dance even in aoe

[sullen yarrow]

fast question

where do i send teas in m+

[karmic harbor]

nobody in the top 50 flags on pull: https://lorrgs.io/spec_ranking/rogue-subtlety/forgeweaver-araz, you've got cold blood macrod to secret technique which is a dps loss, you want a seperate cb + st macro, and st just by itself. you flagged at 2s and used shadowblades at 35s with potion for some reason. You didnt use dance back to back on your second flag/blades. you sent symbols used 2 finishers then used sectec so it wasn't supercharged (outside of dance) and then used dance 2 gcds later.

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[sour sun]

macro to dance, forget about it

[karmic harbor]

rly just the wowhead guide is enough to know how to play sub

[sullen yarrow]

!macros

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.

[karmic harbor]

!bs

[wicked jolt]

Backstab/Shadow Dance/Tea Macro:yaml #Showtooltip Shadow Dance /cast [bonusbar:1] Backstab; Shadow Dance /castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, nullThis will cast Shadow Dance and Tea(if talented) on first key press and Backstab on second key press.

[magic dove]

What build you using that has tea in it?

[sour sun]

M+ build on wowhead has tea by default, you can run cb aswell, its preference

[ashen sable]

i will check it for sure, i used pot cuz i used shadow blades on adds, it's not nexusking it's araz

[karmic harbor]

yes on araz nobody flags on pull sorry, just had the nexus king up cause i was looking at it: https://lorrgs.io/spec_ranking/rogue-subtlety/forgeweaver-araz

[ashen sable]

I need to figure out how to use this site tho

[karmic harbor]

you just click the icons and it tells you where people with the top 50 ranks use them

can toggle them off or on

[ashen sable]

oh now my life is over

good thing i got to go to work tomorrow so i can study wowhead and this stuff

Would it be worth to macro flagellation with shadowblades?

[tepid trellis]

No

[vale vault]

how much st do you lose with db build? + -

[coarse halo]

How do you properly like up cds in m+, and what do you do when you dont have cds? Feels like I am doing no damage outside of cds

Or when I want to save them for next pack

[signal moth]

in a pug just rip them on cd if the pack isn't about to insta die

you do no damage outside of cds

thats kind of subtlety's thing

[shrewd lantern]

You can send a dance with sod and sectech

as long as flag and sb arent back soon

it's still ok damage especially if you land the double coup cast inside

[signal moth]

anyone reckon sub or anyone will get buffs soon? Feels like 0 tuning is being done lol

another mage/dk+x meta is fucking boring

[coarse halo]

how many shadowdances do you fit between each flag/shadowblades?

3/4?

[lucid jackal]

2

between? like 2

depends tho on ur cdr

[coarse halo]

2 plus the 2 inside that window yeah?

[lucid jackal]

Just stop pressing CDs at 30 seconds left on flag

only thing I'd pay attention to

I legit dont know how many I get in between

[coarse halo]

ok

[short radish]

!dr

!atro

[wicked jolt]

Atrophic /Feint in Raid: > Click to Open <

[torn shell]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WAs's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker
• :skull: Find Weakness target tracker
• Stealthi's Coup de Grace bar

[vapid lodge]

Whats the best way to send double on use trinkets? Playing prism/lily atm.

Do I just send lily all the time with big cds and prism only with a lot of stacks?

[left ledge]

!prism

[wicked jolt]

Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:

• If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
• If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
• If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.

[vapid lodge]

Legend. Tyty

[fierce lantern]

is there any 1h sword/mace/axe/fist worth offhanding for any reason this season?

[lucid jackal]

Nop

[karmic harbor]

no

[lucid jackal]

never has never will '

[fierce lantern]

i just want to mog a 1h offhand

🙁

[lucid jackal]

Next expac (probably maybe)

[vapid lodge]

Off topic. Is there a place to see all ! commands? Would love to go through it instead of asking questions if possible

[wispy crystal]

DK being top single target and AOE is ridiculous right now.

even if they are undergeared they do so much damage

[plush roost]

I was topping st or competitive with DH

But im also starting with 18 stack prism

[heady shell]

is it still working, I tried today and couldn't get it to work

[plush roost]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/7LT4y3Nzv2frGHjg?fight=6&type=damage-done

Here is a log of one of my db runs if youd like

Lil scuffed cause i got invisible swirld at the start of the key

[solid panther]

Why might a Cold Blood have a 35-41% use in M+?

[plush roost]

Better boss dps, holdover from last season. Some people dont like tea

Key dependant as well

[solid panther]

I'm not a fan of Tea for Sub

[smoky tide]

!relog

[empty plume]

I think the tea auto-proc just feels bad

and so people prefer the option that they consistently control

auto tea should just be a setting option, or automatically on if you are using the single-button rotational assist (but I think they added auto tea before single-button)

[dusk stone]

Tea is great

You only occasionally feel not having energy while with cb you can actually run out in cds

[short radish]

nobody except the mouthbreathers on wow forums like it probably

i dont think even reddit likes it

[austere summit]

Hey everyone! I'm new to Rogue and I'd love to share my armory with you. Feel free to let me know if there's anything I could optimize, if I'm making any mistakes, or if I'm missing any items, embellishments, or anything else. I'd really appreciate any advice!

https://worldofwarcraft.blizzard.com/es-mx/character/us/quelthalas/balen

[lilac stag]

@keen dome 2/8m on woyer. monday night pug life!

[woven ruin]

how many globals is it we should have in our cd's ... 10?

[swift tinsel]

Typically 8 for a regular dance but depends on how many coups bc it’s 1.2sec

[brisk thunder]

!coup

[wicked jolt]

Coup de Grace Optimizations:

• **Number 1: ** You can hold coup up to ~20 secounds and stop using finishers ~10 seconds before your Flagellation comes up on Single Target. The later is used to build up Shadow Techniques for your cooldowns.
• Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades or with 4+ targets, if you have the 4 set buff active and need to build combo points you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
• Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.

[mint summit]

Is there anyway to see if unseen blade is available or not? I am getting confused in the AOE rotation. Procing unseen blade with Eviscerate is a higher priority than casting black powder. I know unseen blade has a cooldown of 20s but Thousand cuts can reset the cooldown. So is there anyway of seeing that Unseen blade is ready or no?

[hazy breach]

Evsicerate does not proc unseen blade

Coup de Grace, the proc you get when youve done 4 unseen blades is what has higher prio than black powder

[mint summit]

sorry i meant backstab

[hazy breach]

If you are confused and not feeling confident at all i would just recommend to do the singletarget rotation on aoe, except swap backstabs outside of dance for shuriken storm

Until you get more comfortable with the spec

[mint summit]

ty also is putting rupture on multiple targets really better than black powerder in AOE? i am assuming that once you have enough targets in the AOE blackpoweder gets higher value right?

[hazy breach]

If you have replicating shadows specced (which most aoe setups do) theres no target count where you wouldnt rupture outside cds

You might not rupture because the targets are dying too soon or they dont matter (think small murlocs in gambit)

[mint summit]

TY TY that makes sense

[sullen yarrow]

a

[dry anchor]

which cds can i macro together without trolling my damage out of shadow dance/symbols/shadow blade/tea?

along with 13/pot

trying to consolidate keybinds

[warm marlin]

cb sectec in the damage amp without autumn

ty for the help squad tried skipping the second last ring and died and just locked in the regular way

[dry anchor]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.

[ripe flame]

I'm ready to perfect this for like 200 more pulls only to fail on the kill

[pure pollen]

i wanna say 90% of sub rogues I've looked at, pop dance then sob. I have a muscle memory of doing it the other way around, is that a lose or pmuch neutral?

[sullen yarrow]

hey why im doing 0 dps

with tea

and im blasting with cold blood

[plush roost]

Did u winner?

[warm marlin]

20%

[sharp gull]

So I'm using a macro to cast cold blood/secret technique but in certain areas and dungeons it just stops working. like karesh or the dungeons here

I'd appreciate help if anyone knows the work around

[shrewd lantern]

!cbbug

[wicked jolt]

Cold Blood bug:
A common issue when switching between Assassination Fatebound and Subtlety is that Cold Blood stops working, this problem is solvable with the following step:

• Relogging.
  You can use ths weakaura to get a reminder: >Open on Wago.io <

[sharp gull]

oh...so sorry. I tried google and didnt get answers. I will try that. Ty

[warm marlin]

sod -> dance is probably better since youre going to waste less time in dance physically pressing the sod button

[pure pollen]

thats what I've been thinking. guess i could just swap the buttons around and act like nothing changed lmao

muscle memory gets to stay the same

[jade oasis]

!macros

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.

[chrome fern]

i just bind SoD 9/10 im using it with sectec anyway

I have 3 sectec bind
symbols + sectec + blades
symbols + sectec + blades + prism
symbols + cold blood + sectec

i can use the first bind as just a symbols bind if im not holding cds

[limpid sage]

There are lots of times where you’d want sectec on the second supercharged finisher though

[chrome fern]

i know, but that almost relies on coup

all i will say is this, sure you can teach people to be optimal, but also being suboptimal still can get orange parses on heroic

and it lifts a shit tonne of cognitive load

[limpid sage]

Ofc

[chrome fern]

like i get it, if someone is planning to main sub and is preparing to stick with it, learn the ins and outs, lazy macros will be a hinderance in the end. but if it's fotm or a reroll for a tier or 2? i think it's fine

suboptimally binding symbols won't be why your parses are blue, lets just say that

[rocky ocean]

[mint violet]

Why sectec before blades?

[chrome fern]

just the order i thought of it

it's correct in my macro

[mint violet]

Oh kk

[chrome fern]

i assume you are talking about pulling sectecs cd? or for coup. i jsut settle with holding coup till after sectec, and as long as im not holding blades windows i can effectively use the top macro as a standalone symbols to pull

[chrome fern]

only thing is, this doesn't work out for me on forgeweaver or soul hunters, big sad

lol

[short radish]

eh idk even then its just

[short radish]

still press buttons

maybe do a bit of lining up

[chrome fern]

i innevitably favor pressing buttons over waiting for the 3 dh's to be stacked, bozo move

[short radish]

like forgeweaver, the only real important one that they line up is 1min50ish

then the obvious send on amp

soul hunters is basically on cd

[chrome fern]

but also those 2 fights dont really matter

[limpid sage]

I feel like soul hunters always split just as you start sending cds

[limpid sage]

Yeah exactly. Lots of times you need to send supercharged coup at 15 sec left on sectec to get the cb sectec in the first dance

[short radish]

yeah but lorgs is saying everyone is basically sending flag on cd

so even if theyre jumping away

just sit on the one that has another dude next to it

[limpid sage]

Ye I do it as well

[short radish]

[limpid sage]

That’s something I’ll never get actually

So many blue parsers will know tiny optimizations for their spec

[chrome fern]

too much focus on doing the optimisation that their gcd is longer than the 1 button

[weak hamlet]

Any1 know if there is a bug for resi 16? Timed all 16s but my key is still resi 15

[limpid sage]

You have to get it up to 16 first

It doesn’t gain a key level

[weak hamlet]

My key is 16

But it says resilient 15

I got 2 friends in the same situation

[limpid sage]

Oh

[chrome fern]

did you guys maybe not actually time one?

[limpid sage]

Ye it doesn’t get increased resil straight away

[weak hamlet]

What do u mean

[limpid sage]

You have to change the key

[upbeat sorrel]

is frost dk hard to play

asking for a friend

[limpid sage]

https://tenor.com/view/watching-you-observe-seeing-i-saw-you-gif-5740825

[chrome fern]

umm

this is the sub rogue channel

XD

i'd try the DK discord

[little fractal]

with double on-use trinkets (prism + lily) should i only unleash prism when fully stacked? (also kinda same question if i run only prism + proc trinket, is it better to hold it for fully charged or just send it with every shadowblades?

[cosmic dust]

One button class

!prism

[wicked jolt]

Unyielding Netherprism
Use the trinket at the same time as Shadow Blades. What stacks you should use it on depends on your trinket combination:

• If its your only on-use trinket: Using it on 9 or 18 stacks is the same on a target dummy but in practice thing like big pulls, damage amps or timings often end up favoring the big 18 stack.
• If youre using Prism+Forge: Rotate between them each Shadow Blades regardless of stacks (so forge on pull, prism on 1:30, forge on 3:00)
• If youre using Prism+Lily: Use Lily with Blades until you have 16+ stacks of Prism, then use prism and hold Lily for next Blades.

[cosmic dust]

@little fractal

[upbeat sorrel]

compared to EC druid is it harder or easier

[cosmic dust]

I dont have any clue about druids

[upbeat sorrel]

EC druid is one button aside from dots and spenders

[keen dome]

Hell yeah, puglordin' it up

[tall girder]

!cbbug

[wicked jolt]

Cold Blood bug:
A common issue when switching between Assassination Fatebound and Subtlety is that Cold Blood stops working, this problem is solvable with the following step:

• Relogging.
  You can use ths weakaura to get a reminder: >Open on Wago.io <

[queen plinth]

if im struggling with sub am i better to play assa in 16s?

sometimes my tanks just pull everything away the moment i press buttons or mechanics make me struggle to get my burst in

[ornate lake]

First aug key of the season

zero black powder key

[weak hamlet]

Ewww

Aug and ethical gameplay?

[ornate lake]

never knew anyone even played aug tbh

Thought he was a devo when i joined

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/rAq5tHqcsagGfpymchxKZv

rotten is simming 0.8% ahead of finality for Dslice

🤔

[scenic plover]

Was it a smol pull dungeon? Or whats the reason for no bp

[wicked urchin]

first time hitting 10m overall in a key

neat

[ornate lake]

ecodome

big guy dies fast

[astral compass]

Do we know by now what the requirements will be to purchase the raid trinkets in the new patch?

[wicked urchin]

boss kill necessary afaik

[ornate lake]

Me putting my 1 year old on adoption so i can afford a mythic fractilus kill

https://tenor.com/view/gloop-gif-25555044

[fossil forge]

Best thing you can do is make a dk

[queen plinth]

i want to play rogue man

[fossil forge]

same

[queen plinth]

but yxea i barely get nvites

got 15s done not getting invited in 16s

[fossil forge]

Rogue has nothing besides damage

[noble shale]

am i meant to be using the rotten in M+?

guides are saying not to but all the good subs are using it

[queen plinth]

so how to get invites? make a dk yea?

[fossil forge]

I gave up on pugging on rog

Waiting for 3 hours just for 1 pull

[queen plinth]

same problem right here

im never the problenm

[fossil forge]

u should be able to play any class until 15

[queen plinth]

so if i want to push play dk or bm yea

[fossil forge]

Dk dh or mage

Mage is meta always

[queen plinth]

i dont want to push on my main

as u can tell by my profile pic

[fossil forge]

why wouldnt you want to push on the class you are most comfortable with

[queen plinth]

cause im bored to play mage

[fossil forge]

🕵️

[queen plinth]

thats why im playing rogue cuz its fun

[fossil forge]

Assa gets invited more than

[queen plinth]

but i forgot wow community plays fully around meta in highkeys

[fossil forge]

But its very sleeper to play

[queen plinth]

is assa better than sub tho in highkeys

i know st sucks hard cock

[fossil forge]

Theres like 500 sub rogues and 490 of them dont even play m+

If u get my point

Idk i barely played assa

[queen plinth]

i have 3350 io currently and i am rank 8 on my realm so

so yea sub barely has competition

[molten cedar]

Neither does Assa tbf

[fossil forge]

If you open top rogues most of them are playing assa probs

or outlaw

you either play your key or you dont play

[queen plinth]

i play my own kmey and its depleted in 2 seconds

so yea buying hc boost for my low ass dk then

[fossil forge]

u need like 1,5 working braincells to play dk

very much

[queen plinth]

i know that frost is hard braindead

[fossil forge]

Chillplay

• ur unkillable

@queen plinth find a premade phys comp and go push If u want to play sub in higher keys

[limpid sage]

tanks this season are beyond boosted

and you can't be picky either because there are so few of them/all the good ones are already doing higher keys

[fossil forge]

thank god i have a premade tank

🙏

[limpid sage]

sending hate from denmark

[fossil forge]

(And he is actually a human)

[hollow flume]

Hello, I am playing sub trickster, and I am always fumbling the rotation in AOE - but, why is it 4 ore more targets for black powder since eviscerate cleaves up to 7 targets?

[fossil forge]

Im always res 17 and i still have floodgate and priory on 15

Those 2 keys dont exist

[limpid sage]

deals more dmg

[fossil forge]

Bp got buffed hard

Big number make monkaey Brain go boom

[hollow flume]

and if I have a coup de grace proc, should I keep it to use it with shadow dance/symbols even if those are going to take a while to come back up?

i don't have 4 set yet

not sure if it makes a difference

[coarse halo]

Black powder is just artificially inflating your overall, not actually making the key faster tbh

[fossil forge]

Im not sure hows the Command

[coarse halo]

If you’re not playing with a havoc and arcane you probably should evisc the high hp targets instead of padding

[fossil forge]

But i think its sectech>coup>bp(above 4target)>evis

[coarse halo]

That is purely overall and not what is actually good to do in m+ tho

Like i said bp will do more damage since youre padding

[tepid trellis]

the prio diff between pressing BP or evis is very little

[fossil forge]

yea

[tepid trellis]

most of your prio comes from shadowstrike/unseen blade procs and Coup

and ofc sectech

[fossil forge]

buff evis !!!

[karmic harbor]

Make sub funnel again

[fossil forge]

Fax

make sub great again

[spice escarp]

bring back shuriken combo

[vale pine]

shuriken combo with coup de grace would go hard

i think it should make a comeback

becaseu it seems like it isn't creating the problem blizz assumed it would

we would have seen it removed on assassiantion by now else

[hollow flume]

arcane buffs black powder?

[limpid sage]

weird - prio rotation seems to sim relatively worse on 4 targets than 8 targets
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/b3ZGYzn8R55VSLQyGgJRmg
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/dzCiDoops98ipkyawwm6xi

[feral knot]

meaning its better to bp at 4 and evis at 8?

[limpid sage]

no it's still more dmg to bp at 8

[feral knot]

hehe

[fossil forge]

ATP just unbind evis

[wet echo]

what's the dps loss to just BP in ST unless coup is up?

[tepid trellis]

well it does about 20-25% less than an evis

[fossil forge]

Thats straight up int

[wet echo]

if evi is ~15% of your total dmg

[fossil forge]

i get flamed a Lot for oneshotting funnel though

[wet echo]

that's a 3-4% loss

acceptable for the memes

[spice escarp]

i miss dfa, such a fun ability

[wet echo]

you could time it to be immune to stun while flying to her as well

best ability ever added to the game but they had to remove it cuz they hate us

[spice escarp]

ayre it had a lot of fun interactions, and it felt good to use

[fossil forge]

Reset tmrw and i have 2 keys done on my main and 0 on alts

how cooked am i chat

[karmic harbor]

the maiden tech was crazy

[karmic harbor]

at the time a lot of ppl complained about it iirc, but i loved it

[limpid sage]

It bugged out a lot iirc

At least in wod

Oneshotting people on assa with dfa was peak though

[wet echo]

it was sub 1-shotting in wod

[tulip gorge]

we finally get some news about midnight

can't wait to get nothing for rogue

[limpid sage]

assa could as well with nightstalker

vanish into dfa would delete

[storm field]

does it really matter if you use everforged weapons or gene splicers? Always see everyone use atleast one splicer... Whats the reason for this? Only due to the 3 extra item level at mythic?

[limpid sage]

yes

main hand is the biggest upgrade per ilvl for rogue

was like 1.1% upgrade for me

[storm field]

whats the difference between everforged stabber and myth gene splicer

its barely anything no?

[limpid sage]

.

[storm field]

ah

[limpid sage]

how big of an increase it is for you I can't say

that'd be up for you to sim

[autumn condor]

It was nowhere near that much for me, but it's still always going to be better than not and unless you are the 16th rogue in your guild you're gonna get one very quickly in mythic.

Hence everyone has it

[storm field]

well started the game a little over a week ago havent really gotten into mythic raids yet

[limpid sage]

I mean I also went from 720 everforged + 710 gene splicer to 723 gene splicer + 720 everforged

so there's also some stats on offhand involved

[storm field]

im using a 720 stabber and 704 gene splicer

[limpid sage]

what's your char name

[storm field]

Kjellkåre

[limpid sage]

what server

[storm field]

Draenor

[autumn condor]

Yeee you'll get it when you get it, its NBD off hand upgrade is small comparatively

[storm field]

I probably have to think about joining a guild before even attempting mythic raids

and Im missing the reshii wraps boot proc thingy aswell, havent dropped yet from raids. Probably will increase my damage a bit

[limpid sage]

@storm field https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/n9KCZaBisYQTAX2LBJcCc2

2.1% upgrade for you

[storm field]

dang

[limpid sage]

you should prob look into putting an embellishment on your weapon as well ;D

your wrist embellishment does nothing currently

[storm field]

someone told me embellishment on weapons were crap or something

[limpid sage]

I mean embellishments in general aren't that big

but there's no reason not to put it on

[storm field]

true ig

[limpid sage]

you have an embellishment on your wrist that makes nerubian embellishments twice as good

but no nerubian embellishment

[storm field]

XD

wait dobble he effect

dobbel the stats from the ring?

[limpid sage]

nono embellishments are the things you put in crafted items, granting them extra effects

[storm field]

ahhh

[limpid sage]

there are 2 embellishments you would choose from with those wrists: symbiosis or ascension

they're pretty much equal

[storm field]

I can just put it on right?

I dont need to recraft anything

[limpid sage]

[storm field]

i dont know much bout crafting lmao

[limpid sage]

sadly not, you have to recraft

[storm field]

bruh

[limpid sage]

ye

doesn't consume anything else but materials though

[storm field]

I have a spark of starlight thingy tho

idk what to use it on

[limpid sage]

you don't have to use another spark on it

[storm field]

is there anything to use it on

[limpid sage]

ye ring or neck would prob be a good craft for you

[keen dome]

Sparks are the base requirement for making a crafted item.

[storm field]

I have use two sparks and I have one more, but no clue waht to use it on

[keen dome]

So if you want a new item, you need a spark. Or if you want to take an old item to the new seasonal iLevel. Think of them as the seasonal identifier for crafted stuff.

[keen dome]

Sim and see, you can sim all crafted items.

[limpid sage]

this is where I'd try and get familiar with raidbots

[storm field]

👍 ill do some testing

[limpid sage]

gl!

[storm field]

probably wont switch this one out tho

[limpid sage]

no I would def not recommend that xd

[storm field]

thanks for help 🙂

[keen dome]

That's a real good ring, yeah. Probably gonna last you the whole season into Midnight.

[autumn condor]

fwiw this sim also has fiber upgrade

Which is something else you should upgrade, just need to get one crafted

[limpid sage]

ah true

[final granite]

!coup

[wicked jolt]

Coup de Grace Optimizations:

• **Number 1: ** You can hold coup up to ~20 secounds and stop using finishers ~10 seconds before your Flagellation comes up on Single Target. The later is used to build up Shadow Techniques for your cooldowns.
• Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades or with 4+ targets, if you have the 4 set buff active and need to build combo points you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
• Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.

[storm field]

actually got a higher increase with switching the neck out than ring

+28k vs +20k

[fossil forge]

i have hc bloodstained memento and i crafted ring

It was like 38k+

[storm field]

im using mega medallion

[clever delta]

What you guys cloaking on p1 dimensius

[storm field]

I have both tho

but crit strike + vers is worse than mastery verse no?

[north schooner]

no it depends on your stats

[storm field]

at what point should I think about crit strike then

[north schooner]

when the sim tells you so

[short radish]

when we gate at like 1:45

dont trust healers

[clever delta]

Really

[short radish]

yeah whenever we made it there

i felt in danger

now i just cloak

its like

the bit leading up to the gate

because people arent used to movement

so i figure healers aren thealing as much

[clever delta]

Im playing poop there too

[short radish]

once you plant

its kinda okay

aka after gate

but before gate is danger

[clever delta]

I will be doing gravity there and than placing poop

[wild hornet]

Aren't they supposed to like gate first/last

[short radish]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[ashen sable]

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[tribal blade]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4EtnhT88IVg

despite a few obvious issues, really enjoyable video

[lilac stag]

You lost me at tettles

[tribal blade]

HAHA

i don't mind him or dratnos

[lilac stag]

[tribal blade]

and my entire guild hates dratnos for some reason

[vale pine]

i don't mind any of the content creators

[tribal blade]

me neither!

[keen dome]

I like both of them, they're fun and self-aware enough

[tribal blade]

actually preach

i can't stand preach

[keen dome]

Tettle's pugging to 3k video was a lot of fun to watch as a puglord

[vale pine]

but i watched a lot of the podcast which includes tettles, and it always felt a bit out of touch

[tribal blade]

youuuu

[vale pine]

sooo many topics just get good arguments once

to then not get discussed

[void ocean]

is this considered rare? 😄

[vale pine]

like it lacked critical discussion

[tribal blade]

i think a lot of the super high end players are kind of out of touch with the people below them you right

[keen dome]

Nah, but his video was fun

It's cool to see people doing it

[vale pine]

like

give me one example

[void ocean]

aye

[keen dome]

Esp like, big content creators who typically don't pug to 3k

[lilac stag]

I’m at 2996.3 should I make a vid?

[keen dome]

yes

Invite the worst people possible to your group though

[void ocean]

cause i got 3k by pugging 2nd season in a row, this one even went smoother

barely wiped any

[keen dome]

gonna do a series where I pug to 3k and invite the worst possible choices to every key

[keen dome]

ye same, it's not a big deal. Pugging to 3k is extremely easy and chill

[void ocean]

tho i did some early keys with my guild

[lilac stag]

Carried an assa rogue in a 12 priory.

[tribal blade]

i'm staying strong with sub

[void ocean]

but usually when i get to 10+ range i go stag

[keen dome]

But it's cool to see a very high end player and content creator who typically only plays with their community or non-pug people actually experincing that side of the game

[tribal blade]

(whoops that other screenshot sucks)

[vale pine]

the argument was "the seasonal affix is too punishing" -- following the massive drop in popularity with the new affix system
Then the discussion moved quickly into arguments which would discuss the problem.
But just as a good argument formed, the entire podcast went back to "NAH, skill issue, blizz does perfect"

[tribal blade]

nice

[lilac stag]

It is a very different world.

[keen dome]

It really is

[tribal blade]

a lot of those players have ties to blizz so they'll take their side more than other people would

[keen dome]

Yeah

[vale pine]

which for me killed the entire concept of a podcast, because the main thing i would listen is to have diffrent opinions and positions discussed.

[keen dome]

It's why I really want them to experience more of the side of the game I play.

[lilac stag]

We did a 12 priory last season (fairly early) with someone from Liquid on a druid alt. The pulls were insane. We had 24 deaths I think and still timed it by 2 minutes.

[keen dome]

yeah

[steel zinc]

Imo a good Podcast should have multiple povs

[tribal blade]

the interesting thing to me was listening to the rank 1 key pushers would are completely out of touch with how people who barely make title are playing the game

[keen dome]

I'm lucky I get to play with some very very good players who for some reason put up with me, but i'm also a puglord.

[karmic harbor]

the only time ive played with rwf players was in legion and they depleted my darkheart thicket key

[steel zinc]

They are aware though that they are the minority

[lilac stag]

If you make too many friends you’re no longer a puglord.

[keen dome]

true

[tribal blade]

my favorite was ellesmere going on about how he only pays attention to cc and kicks when he's looking for a good player to push with, and dps doesn't matter

[steel zinc]

Once you raid high enough or do m+ high enough you reach that quite fast

[lilac stag]

But that should be the goal

[tribal blade]

but then i realized the rank 1 key pushers all do rank 1 damage

[keen dome]

I'm def less of one this season as I did 3k with my tank buddy who plays at a top100 level so that's def cheating

[tribal blade]

so it's not the same

[karmic harbor]

im stuck pugging 16s it's hell

[keen dome]

But we mostly pugged the other 3 players

[karmic harbor]

maybe 1h to get into a group x)

[keen dome]

And then despaired as we kept getting healers who refused to push DPS buttons EVER

[vale pine]

I think we in a sense see this discussions in theis channel too

e.g. sometimes between me and guy

[tribal blade]

it definitely does happen yeah

[lilac stag]

Sub is easy

[vale pine]

not that

but more like what balance is

[keen dome]

I'm glad I can have a voice about it in here too as an almost exclusively raid pugger / low Mythic player.

'Cos it's a very different game

[lilac stag]

Both tbf

[vale pine]

where i tend to look at it as a general concept across contents and for an entire season

[lilac stag]

We’re good for HoF. Spec is perfect.

[vale pine]

guy is more towards last (two) bosses of a raid fight for the first ~month of a tier

[keen dome]

We're also extremely valuable in a pug setting which is interesting to me.

[vale pine]

both are valid positions

[keen dome]

Because being able to adjust stuff as needed to support group weaknesses is a pretty unique niche.

[vale pine]

i found it problematic

[lilac stag]

a side note, is there a way to get rid of the red ground effect from dev vokers? Played my first keys with one last night and that shit hides everything in melee

[vale pine]

e.g. playing with a DH in the group

many of the stuns i can use are just on massive dr or immune already

which elminitaes a big part of the ability to fix mistakes

[tribal blade]

i agree with your end here

how a spec performs matters across the entire season when you bring M+ into the mix

it makes a massive difference how a spec performs beyond the first month

[wispy crystal]

we should always try to save coup proc for shadow dance window so it does 30% more damage right?

[tribal blade]

M+ is actually the other end of the spectrum where how a spec is performing at the END of the season is more important than the beginning

[vale pine]

only if you also have flagallation for it

[lilac stag]

The argument “it doesn’t matter” cracks me up since it still matters for us getting CE or whatever 2-3 months in

[wispy crystal]

oh if blades + flag is on CD.

Shadowdance is maybe about 10 seconds away. Can we hold a coup proc just for a naked Dance?

[vale pine]

m+ was the content we saw very large power swings

[lilac stag]

All of the sudden I do no ST dmg and the adds aren’t important and now are pad

[vale pine]

dance is not impactful enough on its own

basically think of it like this

your blades/flagellation have the most damage

which is why holding coup for it makes sense

[tribal blade]

sub being really good in keys right now means absolutely nothing if they tune everything else higher and don't touch sub and let it fall behind

[vale pine]

but every time you hold coup outside of that

you also lose cdr for your cooldowns

[lilac stag]

Are your 2x or 1x on use

[tribal blade]

i don't have forge yet so i'm prism+antenna

[vale pine]

so you rather trade off a bit of damage during dance, for having more dances or better cooldown alignment during 90 sec ones

[tribal blade]

my guild rolls off gear so i'm at the mercy of rng

[lilac stag]

I’m legit torn on it. I know it’s legit impossible to maximize full use of both (quantity of cast wise), but it really feels like it leans into what sub should be doing in keys.

[fossil forge]

This is much better than the i give loot to my friends that been with the guild for 6 years

[vale pine]

loot distribution is a big discussion topic always

[tribal blade]

honestly i need to play with it to know for sure haha

but eleem had an interesting point about how you're sitting on stuff way too long playing double on use in keys

[lilac stag]

We do LC and it works well enough. Loot generally isn’t our issues for prog.

[tribal blade]

i simmed it and antenna needed to have something like 85% miss rate for it to be worse than forge

in dslice

[vale pine]

one thing people forget is also that antenna gives a lot of agi

[fossil forge]

Our gm gives out loot based of upgrade % on wowaudit

[lilac stag]

I think at the keys you’re doing, you’re likely not. It does get sketch in 12-13s

[tribal blade]

true, i don't sit on cds too much yeah

[vale pine]

tho i think what makes forge + prism so good is boss fights

because you can forge -> antenna

[limpid sage]

I think having actual human tanks also makes prism/forge better

[tribal blade]

it does, and a LOT of crit

[vale pine]

*forge - prism

[tribal blade]

for sure

[lilac stag]

On most pugs I find forge lining up better than prism with flag, and I’m usually sitting on prism.

[vale pine]

and bosses are many times a problem

so they might give you a bigger time safe

overall

[tribal blade]

i think forge+prism plays more into what makes sub already so strong in keys, which is mega burst

[limpid sage]

is there any boss currently where it doesn't make sense to macro both prism and forge into shadow blades?

[lilac stag]

I laugh that both specs I’m enjoying are boss dmg focused in keys

[vale pine]

last 2

[fossil forge]

sacrifacing agility from antenna is worth having a stacked on use every cds though no?

the base agility is a Lot actually though so idk

[wispy crystal]

oh yes you are right, i totally forgot about the CDR!

Is there any situation we send a naked sTec.

e.g. just symbols + sTec with no dance?

[lilac stag]

I ran pacemaker and prism on forge and didn’t notice an overall difference.

[tribal blade]

it's not just base agi, it's a lot of crit too

[fossil forge]

Yea

[limpid sage]

when holding dance+symbols for next cd window and you have +30 seconds till flag

[fossil forge]

Im overcapped on crit with 2 orbs

[tribal blade]

so you're getting higher crit during cds, which is not negligible

[limpid sage]

not with symbols though

[vale pine]

you technically can send naked secrets, but its very risky to do so we will usually avoid that

[fossil forge]

but If you play double on use you dont have to chase the orbs

I have transmitter ptsd

[wispy crystal]

sure got it

[tribal blade]

yes, 1 main benefit is not chasing orbs yeah

[wispy crystal]

i understand this. ill try to avoid doing this

[tribal blade]

another thing is deaths are probably more punishing depending when you die when playing forge+prism

[vale pine]

you can also tactically delay the pickup

^^

[fossil forge]

Yea

[wispy crystal]

guys our BIS trinket is

1. prism + forge
2. prism + antenna
3. prism + pace maker

assuming all are the same item level e.g. heroic 710

which option would you prefer?

[limpid sage]

I'd take forge

[fossil forge]

Probs bis for m+ prism antenna

[limpid sage]

but that's because I haven't tried playing forge yet

[tribal blade]

just started progging salarbar so i REALLY REALLY want forge

[fossil forge]

ive played around with both combinations

[lilac stag]

4. forge + pacemaker on short fights

[vale pine]

1 is the most common plyed
2 or 3 is somewhat more comforatbale on any fight you don't want to hold cooldowns

[limpid sage]

and I miss having actual huge opener

[vale pine]

tue

i don't have forge too

[wispy crystal]

got it... with forge having that big pump opener must feel real good..

i dont have forge either lol!

[fossil forge]

We are 100pulls in on saladbar and our best % is 70

[lilac stag]

Poggers

[wispy crystal]

rolled a 78 the other day on heroic forge. but our warlock won it with a 87 roll

[lilac stag]

I hope we down soul hunters this week

[fossil forge]

Not really i find it very frustrating how people cant dodge the beams

[vale pine]

70% of the salad bar left

[wispy crystal]

i swear hunters are rolling on netherprism. is that even good for them?

[lilac stag]

Got to intermission with 1 hour of prog

[fossil forge]

Especially as ranged

[upper narwhal]

It’s giga on dark ranger BM

[fossil forge]

Only 30% of jail time done

[lilac stag]

Better for them than us (debatable)

After tuning especially

[fossil forge]

Cant wait for next saladbar nerfs

[velvet grove]

!coup

[wicked jolt]

Coup de Grace Optimizations:

• **Number 1: ** You can hold coup up to ~20 secounds and stop using finishers ~10 seconds before your Flagellation comes up on Single Target. The later is used to build up Shadow Techniques for your cooldowns.
• Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades or with 4+ targets, if you have the 4 set buff active and need to build combo points you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
• Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.

[wispy crystal]

ok fair enough. hunters have been rolling on rogue gear since TBC.

e.g. Madness of the Betrayer, Dragonspine Trophy

[vale pine]

think sub is the one spec with the most obviouse benefits from netherprism

[wispy crystal]

the rage I get from them winning the roll for those trinkets still exist today

[fossil forge]

Just make a monk and roll on everything

sell everything

https://tenor.com/view/business-man-leon-short-gif-21636355

[lilac stag]

We do vault prayer circle in 3 hours

[fossil forge]

Always prepot before Opening vault

[lilac stag]

Ngl if forge and prism showed up in same vault idk which Id take

[fossil forge]

10% extra luck

prism by far

Forge is filler

[lilac stag]

not with kill times dropping.

[upper narwhal]

I don’t have forge or antenna yet it’s so cursed

[shut ridge]

prism 100p

[lilac stag]

I don’t think it’s that obvious, but I’d be fine having that problem with my vault. Hahah

[limpid sage]

bis for both mm and bm

[wispy crystal]

i actually have champion prism, and after simming heroic prism.

its only a 0.6% dps increase on ST.

of course if i get a mythic one thats a different story. But i doubt so, since we have not killed Mythic Fractillus yet

btw, can we get Mythic Fractillus loot if we never killed him before?
e.g. we killed Mythic Plexus + Soulbinder

[haughty rose]

thanks for the tips i ran arakara again right now, tried to follow all of your tips and did 0,57M dps more

to add onto the rotten discussion, i just simed talents again and rotten sims 2,1% better which is quite drastic. is there a possibility rotten or finality are simed wrong?

Current is just some random build btw

[lilac stag]

how are you simming?

[tight monolith]

only if you killed king nexus or dimensius mythic

[haughty rose]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/5mqVCtkcXUCVBKkTPJ3B7j

dungeon slice 5 minutes no raid buffs

[wispy crystal]

damn mythic Dimensius

[lilac stag]

I can look later. You should sim the crit meta gem and force 4 colors. Should be an increase.

[tight monolith]

I mean its how it is if you kill one boss you unlock the previous ones, it was an answer to your question. with what you killed you unlocked plexus, soulbinder and loom table in vault

[wispy crystal]

if i killed Plexus + Soulbinder, Loom loot table is unlocked in vault?

[tight monolith]

yes

[wispy crystal]

wow!

didnt know it works this way now

im only 2/8 mythic

[lilac stag]

If you kill frac, soul hunters is in vault.

[tight monolith]

loomithar counts as 2nd boss

[haughty rose]

ok yeah i look into gems later thanks

[wispy crystal]

damn that's good to hear that!
Loom drops a mythic dagger if i recall

[tight monolith]

and antenna

[lilac stag]

You may have to “remove gems” from gear for it to work correctly.

[haughty rose]

slightly less dps increase for rotten build with flask, pot and meta comp (war, sham, DH) raid buff

[haughty rose]

will do

[cursive island]

!logs

Whats the command to see what to analyse in logs already pls ?

[north schooner]

!mistakes

[wicked jolt]

Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:

• Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
• Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
• Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
• If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.

[north schooner]

this?

[cursive island]

Thanks

[steel zinc]

For whoever thinks rogue is meta:

Doing weeklys keys

[cursive island]

Oh wow

[tulip gorge]

Who thinks rogue is meta lol

[cursive island]

Its def not bad in M+

[tulip gorge]

Yeah but not meta

[cursive island]

True

3k5 getting declined in 10 is cringe af

[haughty rose]

when siming gems, do i have to choose the "only max colors" option? i just simed it without it and the result was crit+vers gem on every socket except 1 for diamond

[tulip gorge]

Eh +10s are the most popular keys

They probably pick whoever signed up first

[fleet wharf]

the trick is to not bother simming gems

[errant steeple]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.

[north schooner]

you are not the only dps applying, if they have 20 applicants what's meta barely matters for a +10

[haughty rose]

would save me from some headache for sure but my inner nerd needs to be fed

[tulip gorge]

Surprisingly I have no issues getting into groups this season

[fleet wharf]

I think only max color forces you to have 4 diff gems to satisfy meta reqs

[haughty rose]

so choosing every gem that would make slightly sense, and choose "replace existing colors" is enough right? i'm just surprised that crit+vers on everything sims the best

[fossil forge]

Actually simming my gems and making blasphemite do something gave me 40k+ dps for free

[fleet wharf]

I mean that's part of why it's not really worth simming gems. the point i guess is to see which would come out on top, but it's pretty minimal difference

40k sounds bigger than .1% gain

[fossil forge]

Current gem setup

[lilac stag]

This.

well whatever the gems cost was

[fossil forge]

The settings

Cost more

Than the gems

[fleet wharf]

who the fuck bought out all of the blasphemites btw

[fossil forge]

The same person

[lilac stag]

Goblins

[fossil forge]

Buying out all stuff

B4 turbo boost

[lilac stag]

With way too much gold

[fleet wharf]

i mean they're all made from blasphemites, but whoever it was fucking played the market real good ig

[fossil forge]

i cant say but i made a Lot from flipping gems

[lilac stag]

You also need it for neck and rings if I recall correctly

[fossil forge]

just buy out everything and set your own price for reset day

People dont care they will Pay

[fleet wharf]

all of them do, and it's kind of a pain to manually make them even as an alch

[fossil forge]

I also leaked sauce before

Flipping hc boe rings

Is insane rn

[fleet wharf]

still?

hm

[fossil forge]

Yeah

[lilac stag]

Yep

The mythic are too expensive

[fossil forge]

i legit bought

Midnight doing this

[lilac stag]

And people are def going for heroic rings

[fossil forge]

plus a few extra boosts ofc

but mostly flipping the auctionhouse

[fleet wharf]

I wish I had bought 1000 blasphemite last season and not the palty 15 I bought for personal use

[fossil forge]

I wish i bought like 100000 settings when they cost 1k

[fleet wharf]

yea I thought they wre too expensive at that price too. how wrong I was

[fossil forge]

this is by far the most expensive xpac

goldwise

[hazy breach]

Is it

[lilac stag]

Right now there’s only 7000 avail. Even at 1700g a sm cartel could buy everything

[hazy breach]

Pretty sure its very cheap

Relative to some other ones

You dont need to spend a couple of hundred thousands for legendaries for example

[upper narwhal]

Shadowlands legendary costs still keep me up at night

[fossil forge]

yea but u get to keep the legendary

[fleet wharf]

but I get to keep my enchants too bro

[hazy breach]

Until next tier ye

[fleet wharf]

btw, has BIS enchants always shifted like it has this expansion?

[fossil forge]

Lets say i only meant enchants etc

Gems

Settings

[hazy breach]

Yeah even then

I dont agree

[upper narwhal]

At least enchants don’t get tuned every other patch forcing you to rebuy them

[fossil forge]

I cant rly say cuz ive only been playing for 2 years

My friend that has played His entire life said its hella expensive this szn

[fleet wharf]

I think I have a bit better of an idea on how to make money for midnight though

[hazy breach]

Might be a bit expensive for a last patch, but early patches in the expac are SIGNIFICANTLY more expensive than it is currently

[fossil forge]

yea i meant the prices rn

People want to make gold

[fleet wharf]

weren't weap enchants going for like 10k or some shit?

[hazy breach]

Like r3 weapon enchants were costing like 150k the first few weeks

[fossil forge]

At the start its always been like that

[fleet wharf]

ah forgot a 0

kinda weird though, this season def more expensive than last season

like all of the enchanting mat prices have gone up and aren't coming down

[fossil forge]

anyways

Fuck mages

[lilac stag]

last season you had vendor exploits for mats for enchanting

[graceful osprey]

Ladies and Gentlemen, may the RNG gods bless your vault today

[lilac stag]

Those are gone

[fossil forge]

is anyone running

[lilac stag]

I’d also guess delves aren’t being run as much

[fossil forge]

Cursed crit

[lilac stag]

nah. Not worth

We tried to and couldn’t

[fossil forge]

Robot said its worth

For me at least

Very low crit

[lilac stag]

It was .02 for typical gear

yeah maybe if you’re starved for it

[fossil forge]

Yea i was running mastery on my rings for 0

But cursed crit simmed more

[lilac stag]

ST sim, but I'm still

[fossil forge]

Watfek brou not even 5

(Im stuck on 4,8)

[summer peak]

hey guys, looking for some soulñhunter guidance. Do ye hold Dance if you know the DUSKBLADE dash is coming ina second and we all run to or do yOU send anyway ? it seems i have dance up as duskblade dashes and of coruse we all follow and moving out of ST?

[vale vault]

ty my man

[fossil forge]

https://lorrgs.io

[steel zinc]

you clearly didnt look at the screenshot

[fossil forge]

https://youtu.be/SEek-Tye7K4?si=WMrjG4b_OmdSKxpV

[steel zinc]

like having full mythic clear nearly and 3.5k but +10 nah decline. I cant handle

pugging is insane

[fossil forge]

This video put me in perspective

This french dude is a beast

[summer peak]

ya forgot he had a video, wastched him alot hes sick on Assa last tier aswell

[lilac stag]

At 10s I’m assuming you’re a troll.

you get hurt sooooo many times by high io Andy’s at that level

zero patience

or wtf is an affix

[fossil forge]

Im never queueing a 10 again

I refuse to play affix with randoms

12 only for weekly

Crestmaxxing

[north schooner]

why? that you are overqualified for a 10 doesn't guarantee an invite

[haughty rose]

i think i'm siming wrong. it only shows the same gem on every piece/in every row and not different gems like in your sim

[lilac stag]

I’m running slice now. Hold please.

[fossil forge]

You need to check max colors if ur simming gems

[steel zinc]

yeah but just doing weeklys. Idk its insane

[lilac stag]

They’re not necessarily weekly for the people you’re trying to run with

I pugged first 2 of mythic last night. That was wild.

We had a 6/8 crash out after 2 pulls. lol

[steel zinc]

Yeah true. I didnt pug much this season apart from some higher keys.

lol

[lilac stag]

Replaced with a 7/8 mage that was on vacation for their dim kill. He was blastin

At the 10 level the 26-2800 io groups are usually chill

Over that and it’s either try hard or mechanic ignorers

12s are kinda hit and miss but no affix is nice

I’ll legit run my 3 delves on reset for crests. It’s often faster than sitting in LFG and running the dungeons

[fossil forge]

ATP if you have hands and do damage you can solo a 10

[lilac stag]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/qes9TPqxFjgqa39uRSPCH6

enjoy your dps gains

[fossil forge]

why is rotten simming more man i cba playing it

[lilac stag]

that'll be $5

[graceful osprey]

Do you all sit and wait bit for invites for M+ as well? When I don’t run with my guild, I sometimes find myself waiting at least 30 minutes for someone decides they don’t mind a rogue for M+

[lilac stag]

tfb i dont think the unpdated apl is in, they're extremly close and it doesnt matter

[fossil forge]

depends on key lvl

if ur pushing playing rog is a queue simulator

if u cba waiting for invites just make red class

[tidal marsh]

red class

[lilac stag]

what's fun is you can see the setup they had at 7.7, my gear change to 8.4 then the talents to 8.5

[tidal marsh]

the new melee light blue class

[limpid sage]

rotten is bis

stop hating

[fossil forge]

Finality propaganda !!!

[limpid sage]

🤓 👆🏼

[lilac stag]

rotten just likes the hard opener, change my mind

[fossil forge]

wym hard opener

[limpid sage]

I do not know what this means

[lilac stag]

forcing sod + rotten out of dance

[limpid sage]

ah

[lilac stag]

isn't pratical always in keys with SoD being the actual fuel tank for cds

[graceful osprey]

Yeah trying for anything 10+ has me waiting long unless I’m running with the guild

[shadow lance]

Sod storm dance bs sectech

[fossil forge]

To spread fw?

[shadow lance]

Yep

[fossil forge]

Oh

[hazy breach]

Idk

[fossil forge]

Cba extra steps finality on top

[hazy breach]

Just have coup up and nado

[lilac stag]

you can just storm with finality and spread FW

[graceful osprey]

I would not mind smoke bomb again for pve

[fossil forge]

The finality and rotten fight needs to end we need to fight the nado players

[limpid sage]

📠

[lilac stag]

sorry, now a storm enjoyer. bladestorm goes brrrr

will put down the rotten enjoers and their pack o lies

tldr, it dont matter

finality better tho

[native zodiac]

Dark brew

[lilac stag]

[fleet wharf]

Is there a viable dark brew build?

[lofty lance]

Did they fix the sec tech prepull for Disorienting?

my coups are not proccing now wtf

[native zodiac]

Still worked for me yesterday

[lofty lance]

ye same

but not today

[rocky ocean]

💦

[lofty lance]

did they also fix the prism stacks staying after re-entering dungeon?

[limpid sage]

if they did that's awesome

[lofty lance]

maybe it didnt work cuz I sec tech a dummy outside a dungeon

[vestal escarp]

!atro