I didn't realize it would be so strong on last boss
#subtlety
warm marlin
we still have only seen 1 on normal in entire splits
short radish
i passed on them because i just read "its dps neutral"
leaden prairie
But at this point I had a vault mythic antenna so
short radish
oh wait
warm marlin
and i was given first mythic antenna
short radish
servers are up but vault isnt up
leaden prairie
i passed on them because i just read "its dps neutral"
Ye no way
short radish
nvm i spread misinformation again
warm marlin
servers are up but vault isnt up
it dont come up for 10 mins
until normal reset time
leaden prairie
On this type of fight I think it's nuclear
umbral fulcrum
vault doesnt reset until 11
warm marlin
On this type of fight I think it's nuclear
its really good for downtime
short radish
NOW EVERY FUCKING CLASS HAS REALISED THEY WANT PRISM AS WELL
leaden prairie
I'm ngl
short radish
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
leaden prairie
Didn't educate me well enough
I will know for next tier
I'm still a sub amateur
warm marlin
Didn't educate me well enough
well i would say its only really super better on dimmy
hard to predict that
leaden prairie
No it's not
umbral fulcrum
if zac is an amateur im a coughing baby
leaden prairie
If the apl was made day one, and we knew how it change the damage profile to be more around cds
tender frost
forge on nk platform into full stack prism for burn goes insane
leaden prairie
And then you look at world first players on dimmy
And how much downtime and afk there is
It's simple
Should have been like
Obvious
warm marlin
And then you look at world first players on dimmy
ye by then it should be known
but even with the apl prism passive is still very good
leaden prairie
I blame sub channel and sub specialist on this one im ngl
warm marlin
and antenna was nerfed twice
leaden prairie
forge on nk platform into full stack prism for burn goes insane
Me when I send a 6 stack prism on damage amp
tender frost
Me when I send a 6 stack prism on damage amp
warm marlin
Me when I send a 6 stack prism on damage amp
noob not pressing shuriken toss to proc stacks
from range
scarlet oyster
hi, I sometimes waste unseen blade procs due to thousand cuts, does anyone has a WA to track unseen blade stack that works with thousand cuts ?
I got LE's tracking but it doesn't work on that specific proc
leaden prairie
On what
narrow night
imagine not playing sub flawlessly
leaden prairie
But thats the same as a forge
Nah bhtb
narrow night
everyone who cant play sub flawlessly should get burned on a stake
sweet raven
is actually sub even competitive without prism atm?
hazy breach
if you count the passive agi gained from your passive trinket, otherwise it needs to be like 8 stacks
warm marlin
Ye but then I'm naked on the platforms
still better than a lot of other dps but ye
austere bison
is there a rotation and priority list i can find here?
slate marlin
is there a rotation and priority list i can find here?
!guides
fringe palm
hey @leaden prairie why does your descriptions say outlaw rogue when youre not outlaw 
leaden prairie
immune boss as you walk away i think
What imune boss
leaden prairie
hey <@352916297262301194> why does your descriptions say outlaw rogue when youre...
Fuck you
I'm outlaw one trick
slate marlin
I use wowhead
fleet wharf
flip some coins
slate marlin
bc its written by the goat
warm marlin
What imune boss
you throw the spike at dragon as you walk to platform and when you come back to get the prism icd immediately
tender frost
^
vale pine
which one is best
all of them are good
tender frost
fuu so humble
leaden prairie
you throw the spike at dragon as you walk to platform and when you come back to ...
What dragon
I'm playing dimmy cuh
upbeat escarp
Isnt lily+prism okay if you dont have forge?
nova cairn
Is the key build for sub on low keys vs high keys the same?
lilac stag
which one is best
They all convey the same info in different manners. See which one resonates best with you.
austere bison
all of them are good
whats the difference between thisle tea and coldblood talents like i mean objectively speaking i understand what they do
slate marlin
Have you thought about stacking it harder zac?
lilac stag
whats the difference between thisle tea and coldblood talents like i mean object...
Vigor is more enjoyable for most people. CB does a bit better in ST and low target pulls
vale pine
Cold blood is slightly better on single target and cleave
Tea is slightly better on aoe
the diffrence in gameplay is, tea can be macroed to dance
slate marlin
Stop stacking my balls
Never, i want them full
leaden prairie
warm marlin
okay vault time
fleet wharf
is it too much to ask for cold blood to only affect finishers?
warm marlin
prisms for all of us
slate marlin
Cmon zac you served that joke in a silver plate
vale pine
is more comfortable to play, because of the higher energy income and vigor (more baseline energy and regeneration)
nova cairn
!tea
wicked joltBOT
Thistle tea use:
It is recommended to macro Thistle Tea with Shadow Dance like this:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
slate marlin
Yoy get myth shoulders and all the haste rings
swift tinsel
stackin that avoidance
austere bison
<@166073317193678848> get fked noob
US servers already have vault?
warm marlin
yes
austere bison
crazy
astral axle
i like when zac posts in subtlety 😌
short radish
<@166073317193678848> get fked noob
gzgzgz
warm marlin
ty
slow gorge
is more comfortable to play, because of the higher energy income and vigor (more...
Do we need to pool our tea or we use or on cd?
warm marlin
hopefully urs is as good
short radish
im opening my alts first
short radish
gotta cook
twilit phoenix
<@166073317193678848> get fked noob
surely you take araz?
slate marlin
<:ks:1407878495715070153>
Goated icon
vale pine
Do we need to pool our tea or we use or on cd?
we use it with shadow dance, no pooling required
leaden prairie
astral axle
Won't do it again
slate marlin
Not goated ability
twilit phoenix
leaden prairie
True
leaden prairie
surely you take araz?
What you doing in here traitor
warm marlin
alpha good wdym
karmic harbor
alpha good wdym
already got it
short radish
okay garbage on the druid this is good
swift tinsel
got alpha and both necks lol
twilit phoenix
What you doing in here traitor
traitor??????????????
warm marlin
o yeah then time to end it
slate marlin
msybe myth dagger?
twilit phoenix
been sub for a hot minute
strange chasm
dog water again
leaden prairie
Tf
slow gorge
???
lucid jackal
LOL
leaden prairie
Guy did you kill dimmy yet
short radish
how have you taken this many sockets
lilac stag
youre so fucking cursed
On the flip side, maybe blessed for getting so much loot from raid. 
short radish
wait true
i bet guys rolling with forge and prism already
OKAY
PLEASE GAME
BLESS ME
leaden prairie
Me when I cant get upgrades from vault week 3 cause I'm already full bis 
lucid jackal
i actually dont get it
slate marlin
Gz
karmic harbor
gyat damn
warm marlin
wait this guys vault was even better than mine
slate marlin
now get the fuck out of here
short radish
i hope you have neither of those trinkets mythic
i have a heroic prism
so surely its a forge angle
or i hodl for mythic clear tonight
prime raft
got my myth track prism what is the WA to track it
short radish
and see what drops
nova cairn
Look at my vaults this tier man
Outlaw neck gg
short radish
prime raft
!WA
wicked joltBOT
short owl
The illusive antenna
slate marlin
hold for mythic clear 100%
leaden prairie
Look at my vaults this tier man
Goat
karmic harbor
mm hunter got myth prism over me 
lilac stag
prime raft
dude had a HAvoc DH get the prism over me kast week lol
karmic harbor
and our other rogue is rerolling sub so he'll probably get next drop
twilit phoenix
surely ring long for the long term
prime raft
and our other rogue is rerolling sub so he'll probably get next drop
tell him to go OL
twilit phoenix
you'll be able to just buy trinkets with turbo boost
karmic harbor
tell him to go OL
he's rerolling from OL
prime raft
ASSA then
karmic harbor
i wouldnt wish my worst enemy to play assa
lilac stag
surely ring long for the long term
i dont have a desire to chase balls lol
so thinking ring
twilit phoenix
i dont have a desire to chase balls lol
excrutiatingly based
rancid crow
damn... do I take one of the mythic pieces for higher ilvl later on? Or do I replace my veteran set gloves with the heroic set gloves? when do I get another void splinter 😭
prime raft
where can i find the prism tracker
rancid crow
how is this even a question
This is my first season doing anything but casual shit :/
remote rapids
!fuu
wicked joltBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
lilac stag
people just dont understand ilvl
twilit phoenix
This is my first season doing anything but casual shit :/
myth track for sure king
lucid jackal
U cant farm mythic track items, u can farm hero track items
twilit phoenix
you can just hero gloves from keys
rancid crow
myth track for sure king
ty
lucid jackal
No reason to ever take hero track from vault
sweet raven
is dungeon slice still relevant for rogue btw?
lilac stag
is dungeon slice still relevant for rogue btw?
its good for gearing
twilit phoenix
is dungeon slice still relevant for rogue btw?
yeah dslice is p good for rogue
short radish
is dungeon slice still relevant for rogue btw?
earnest canyon
i got mythic logic gate in my vault. subcreation and wowhead guides said its bis. is there a specific reason? the stats doesnt look too good
short radish
beans beans beans
sweet raven
bri ish
steel sierra
I guess belt then, neck/boots suck
strange chasm
Look at my vaults this tier man
Hey I've taken sockets 2/4 weeks so far 😄
sweet raven
my droptimizer is edging me
twilit phoenix
holy shit
icy mulch
+29k without spending a single crest on it
only thing better could have been nexus king dagger or forge
tender frost
this game will not give me M netherprism bro
short radish
i feel like they roll leech so often
i was running 3k passive leech without a single leech enchant at one point this tier
umbral fulcrum
i mean its not like you've had that many chances yet
short radish
secondary stats are on everything
umbral fulcrum
dooming about drops this soon is tough
hazy breach
i was running 3k passive leech without a single leech enchant at one point this ...
I literally had 0 last tier
No avoidance or leech on anything
(i purposefully was looking for it for hkp)
alpine wraith
im so sad they have nerfed tertiares twice already
plush roost
Look at my vaults this tier man
Sick outlaw chest tho 8)
stoic token
yey just got my netherprism.... this toon is just for m+ should i run double on use with lily or soleahs/nether?
alpine wraith
used to be so much fun running tons of leech and avo
try to get a better passive both lilly and so lea are kinda not the best
like pacemaker
hazy breach
Vengeful Oath has a new animation attached to it to (hopefully) make it easier to see.
short radish
I literally had 0 last tier
this is with full leech enchants
steel sierra
Did the DISC belt nerf come through? This belt is the only thing I could take and it's a 600 dps loss over my 701 belt at 723il fully upgraded
alpine wraith
disc nerf is in 1 month or so
hazy breach
Did the DISC belt nerf come through? This belt is the only thing I could take an...
Theyre coming in the .5 patch
alpine wraith
with new patch
steel sierra
ugh
hazy breach
So not until a month or so
plush roost
` Vengeful Oath has a new animation attached to it to (hopefully) make it easier...
Source? I made it the fuck up?
steel sierra
tokens maybe then
alpine wraith
although likely that belt upgraded is better
hazy breach
alpine wraith
anyway
hazy breach
@plush roost
warm marlin
` Vengeful Oath has a new animation attached to it to (hopefully) make it easier...
nice
plush roost
Sheee
warm marlin
well dimmy maybe gutted
stoic token
try to get a better passive both lilly and so lea are kinda not the best
if i can get vers/crit it sims well for me, granted this toon is 6 days old and not fully optimized
warm marlin
p1 nexus still a bloodbath no
alpine wraith
wont be free but guilds close to finishing just got a sprint to the kills
rancid crow
people just dont understand ilvl
I know higher ilvl is better, but I also know that not having 4set can be a big dps loss
alpine wraith
these 2 days will be blood for ranks
lilac stag
I know higher ilvl is better, but I also know that not having 4set can be a big ...
you have like 50 charges at this point just farm pieces
lucid jackal
p1 nexus still a bloodbath no
I mean the hard parts of the fight are what, living in p1, and having enough damage for platforms
Both just got deleted lol
rancid crow
you have like 50 charges at this point just farm pieces
I don't know what that means bruh 😭
lilac stag
catalyst charges. you can sit in delves all day and get items to convert to tier
rancid crow
the ethereal voidsplinteR?
void ocean
I don't know what that means bruh 😭
legal charges, u r going away for a long time bruv
warm marlin
I mean the hard parts of the fight are what, living in p1, and having enough dam...
depends on much easier they made spirits ig
i dont think we had anyone die to banishment in the last week
or the invoke the oath cast
lucid jackal
Sure but that cuts out a lot of dumb early deaths
prime raft
i feel like they roll leech so often
my myth track rolled speed
lucid jackal
Like early prog
short radish
Sure but that cuts out a lot of dumb early deaths
CAN CONFIRM OUR RAID IS STUPID AND DIES TO IT
can also confirm that im stupid
and have died to it
rancid crow
legal charges, u r going away for a long time bruv
I swear I didn't steal it 😭
tender frost
these add hp nerfs are going to scuff our nk cds aren't they
elder isle
!up
wicked joltBOT
lilac stag
these add hp nerfs are going to scuff our nk cds aren't they
Assa now BiS! 
(kidding)
short radish
damn... do I take one of the mythic pieces for higher ilvl later on? Or do I rep...
take myth track helm and cata that. we got another charge this week
its like same same ilvl difference but helm is perma, gloves is temp
helm or chest
take chest it's more stats
warm marlin
Sure but that cuts out a lot of dumb early deaths
im just hoping it isnt gutted
let me dream
strange chasm
I mean the hard parts of the fight are what, living in p1, and having enough dam...
Really? You think both fights are 100x easier now?
lucid jackal
Ya
runic kraken
Myth Pacemaker should still be a win I hope.
short radish
Really? You think both fights are 100x easier now?
reminder that guy raids in a top 20ish hof guild and his views are not to be taken as a general representation of the average raiding andy
runic kraken
Hold Prism for the 3 min line-up with Pacemaker angle.
limpid sage
is there ever a time when you'd send cold blooded sectec without shadow dance?
fleet wharf
is there ever a time when you'd send cold blooded sectec without shadow dance?
not worth the risk imo
lucid jackal
Like so on dimensius in total
You aren't going to wipe to p1 damage as much
You aren't going to wipe to cleaving gravities, or not having enough damage for adds/walls
And you aren't going to wipe to p3 gravities either, or general damage output. With this much gear as well, p3 really isn't a damage check
limpid sage
not worth the risk imo
no idk if I should either
fleet wharf
just use it as 1.5 min cd
rain stream
Hello friends. New rogue enjoyer here. I got my char to 80 yesterday and managed to sneak a 10. I do not expect to ever get mythic Soul hunter shoes on her, so should i take these? I could also take my missing tierset (on veteran tho)
short radish
is there ever a time when you'd send cold blooded sectec without shadow dance?
just dont
alpine wraith
guy was right that we are blasting tho the first three weeks were wild for us
strange chasm
reminder that guy raids in a top 20ish hof guild and his views are not to be tak...
I mean I'm progging Nexus rn and about to kill so I value his insight.
alpine wraith
we blast the platforms so making it easier will help lots of people
we may not win overall but will win in the hearts of the people that can hold things
short radish
I mean I'm progging Nexus rn and about to kill so I value his insight.
are you progging as a hall of fame guild or hall of shame guild though
alpine wraith
saladbar is still hof if you kill this week or next likely
limpid sage
couldn't you use it ahead of having energy for naked sectec tho
short radish
and nerfs are nice but it's still not going to fix people being stupid dying to 1shot mechanics
lucid jackal
I mean I'm progging Nexus rn and about to kill so I value his insight.
I think we're at like 250 dimensius wipes, I think these nerfs would legit remove like, 50 wipes
short radish
and no thats not me saying they should nerf the 1shot mechanics
lucid jackal
Straight up
short radish
thats just saying the above average andy is still only above average
lucid jackal
Small nerfs matter a lot
alpine wraith
the platform nerfs are going to be very noticeable
short radish
yeah but when you say it's free, there are still different levels of free
aka jailer free
lucid jackal
I mean sure you are going to still wipe to ghosts as a first time prog to the fight but like
short radish
but that's also just me being pedantic
lucid jackal
If Ur getting to p3 at all, it should be free
Less damage, less defensive play, more gear, more damage, less risks
Less wasting health pot in p1 etc
short radish
nerfs are definitely good though
dont need to fear for my life as much with the dot on
alpine wraith
2 stacks of banish on you!
bright meteor
how is the sub rotation? ive only ever played sin and outlaw
short radish
how is the sub rotation? ive only ever played sin and outlaw
!design
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety is designed to be a spec with highs and lows. During your cooldowns you do immense burst and have plenty of buttons to spam but conversely outside of symbols and dance you do not do any damage whatsoever. This means that having some periods of "afk" downtime where you do not press a button because you're out of energy is the intended way the spec plays. As long as its not happening inside your cooldowns (flag/blades/dance/symbols) its not a problem at all, and especially nothing that having more haste would "fix".
glossy mist
hey guys i saw a video for the opener and he said i do a backstab to consume something but how can i use backstab in shadow dance?
tepid trellis
by binding it
short radish
sub rotation is rather easy and people overstate how hard it is, but it's largely a muscle memory sequence
wicked joltBOT
Backstab/Shadow Dance/Tea Macro:yaml #Showtooltip Shadow Dance /cast [bonusbar:1] Backstab; Shadow Dance /castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, nullThis will cast Shadow Dance and Tea(if talented) on first key press and Backstab on second key press.
prime raft
need a tank that plays around CDS
bright meteor
sub rotation is rather easy and people overstate how hard it is, but it's largel...
whats the apm like compared to law?
lower?
tepid trellis
yes
feral bluff
in AOE what determines weather you press shuriken storm or shadowstrike?
short radish
in AOE what determines weather you press shuriken storm or shadowstrike?
if you are in dance or not
bright meteor
ah so quite a bit lower
karmic harbor
!aoe
wicked joltBOT
General Gist of the Aoe rotation
- At ALL target counts cast Coup de Grace when it is ready.
- At ALL target counts cast Shadowstrike during Shadow Dance, not Shuriken Storm. (unless coup is ready, !coup)
- Cast Black powder instead of regular Eviscerate at 4 or more targets (there is no other secret rule).
short radish
if you are in dance press ss if you not in dance press ss
thats shadowstrike in dance
glossy mist
and what do i consume in the opener?
short radish
and shuriken storm on 4(?) mobs out of dance
feral bluff
if you are in dance or not
im looking at casualaddicts log and hes hitting shuriken storm a lotnon SD
short radish
im looking at casualaddicts log and hes hitting shuriken storm a lotnon SD
he's running rotten
tepid trellis
he feelycrafts it
tepid trellis
cuz it feels good to guarantee FW on everything
feral bluff
well he feelycrafty a lot of damage
tepid trellis
its not actually "good" to do
short radish
who cares in m+
feral bluff
and im trying to see why
strange chasm
are you progging as a hall of fame guild or hall of shame guild though
HoF
strange chasm
as 2 day
tepid trellis
sub is essentially just a spec filled with a ton of 0.5-1% minmaxes
short radish
okay then yeah nvm. it's probably super free for you guys now
burnt ridge
!gear
wicked joltBOT
short radish
glhf
tepid trellis
but if you wanna play 100% right
feral bluff
he's running rotten
every aoe build runs this
strange chasm
Yeah people pre upset because boss was killable for us.
tepid trellis
only time you press Storm in dance is between coup1 and coup2
feral bluff
nah but my black powder does 0 damage and i have no idea why
warm marlin
Yeah people pre upset because boss was killable for us.
such is the life
feral bluff
evicerate in aoe is doing way more in my cds
hazy breach
Afaik casual doesnt do the rotten storm in dance, he does it before, so symbols>storm>dance
tepid trellis
most of your casts in dance ends up beign sectech and Coup anyway
hazy breach
And the way the sim is setup thats really really annoying to test reliably, but thats probably fine if youre just heading into a new pack
floral arch
!coup
wicked joltBOT
Coup de Grace Optimizations:
- **Number 1: **You can stop using finishers ~10 seconds before your Flagellation comes up on Single Target. This is to build up Shadow Techniques for your cooldowns.
- Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades or with 4+ targets, if you have the 4 set buff active and need to build combo points you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
- Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.
rain stream
Hello friends. New rogue enjoyer here. I got my char to 80 yesterday and manage...
Help pls
lucid jackal
I don't get the point of nerfs this big when gear is so insane this tier
wicked urchin
warm marlin
I don't get the point of nerfs this big when gear is so insane this tier
cmon its not like turbo boost is dropping in a month
warm depot
tepid trellis
I don't get the point of nerfs this big when gear is so insane this tier
generally speaking i dont get nerfs pre HoF
lucid jackal
cmon its not like turbo boost is dropping in a month
I mean even the forge and fractilus nerfs were insane to me
tepid trellis
unless the bosses are borderline undoable
glossy mist
!guides
hazy breach
Forge nerfs were insane.
alpine wraith
maybe they are just more happy to nerf early now
hazy breach
30% hp
karmic harbor
generally speaking i dont get nerfs pre HoF
really depends when non hof guilds are getting there ig
alpine wraith
the ms on the adds was more big
tepid trellis
i dont agree
alpine wraith
they were montoya
lucid jackal
There is 0 world the 2nd last boss on the raid needs nerfs this big lol
alpine wraith
now they are me onn a good day
hazy breach
Ye the movespeed was a reasonable nerf
karmic harbor
do we really want weeks of world 200-500 guilds on forgeweaver
tepid trellis
but i play the game for 1 reason only
leaden prairie
I don't get the point of nerfs this big when gear is so insane this tier
The 2 last bosses are extremely comp reliant I think
Idk if gear overcame that much
tepid trellis
and thats to do very hard bosses
leaden prairie
Nerfs on the other hand
karmic harbor
and thats to do very hard bosses
sign up for fatsharkyes
tepid trellis
so whenever they take those hard bosses and make em not hard, i get annoyed
lucid jackal
U just need any cooldown class for the platforms
U can use sub, you can use arcane. Mm
tepid trellis
just nerf them after HoF is through it
stoic token
lets go god vault
feral bluff
So many shuriken storm presses for what
leaden prairie
U can use sub, you can use arcane. Mm
Did you kill yet
lucid jackal
Nop
short radish
do we really want weeks of world 200-500 guilds on forgeweaver
When average Andy guilds are already on soul hunters? Yes
lucid jackal
Trolled Sunday
burnt panther
Jajajaja I want to cry
lucid jackal
Had a few good pulls yesterday
leaden prairie
lucid jackal
Our guild is so undergeared it's disgusting
leaden prairie
I'm gonna be so mad if we don't kill before reset nerfs tho
alpine wraith
yea we are on soul hunters
lucid jackal
I mean uve seen my vaults
feral bluff
Like look at this
lucid jackal
So annoying
alpine wraith
almost killing it and are like wr 5xx
leaden prairie
Ye
short radish
Fract being a free boss doesn't help
tidal wigeon
are y'all using a netherprism wa and what one? and what ability are you binding netherprism on use to?
short radish
Araz was the only real blocker boss
short radish
With the amount of coordination it required
alpine wraith
even if you killed araz
feral bluff
!aoe
wicked joltBOT
General Gist of the Aoe rotation
- At ALL target counts cast Coup de Grace when it is ready.
- At ALL target counts cast Shadowstrike during Shadow Dance, not Shuriken Storm. (unless coup is ready, !coup)
- Cast Black powder instead of regular Eviscerate at 4 or more targets (there is no other secret rule).
tepid trellis
Araz was the only real blocker boss
and it kinda was not, after they smacked the RWF nerfs on it
short radish
But then you can outgear and stand behind
tepid trellis
think it took us 16 pulls
karmic harbor
hey took my guild 56
prime raft
was belt nerf today?
karmic harbor
no
short radish
was belt nerf today?
Belt nerf is the turbo boost patch
Sometime in October (dont quote me on this)
karmic harbor
56 pulls for first kill, and another 38 on reclear 
oblique burrow
hi, i'm having problem from my rotation
dusk stone
rip vault, i got destroyed
oblique burrow
my cold blood isnt sending itself with secret technique with my macro
karmic harbor
!cbbug
wicked joltBOT
Cold Blood bug:
A common issue when switching between Assassination Fatebound and Subtlety is that Cold Blood stops working, this problem is solvable with the following step:
- Relogging.
You can use ths weakaura to get a reminder: >Open on Wago.io <
dusk stone
socket it is
karmic harbor
my cold blood isnt sending itself with secret technique with my macro
stop playing assa and itll fix itself
oblique burrow
Thx !
tepid trellis
Took us 55 <:garf:1320173032743899157>
short radish
Built diff or something
tepid trellis
think thats wr 46th we killed it
slim seal
Sword in OH, is it totally unplayable? I accidently opened vault as Outlaw..
wicked joltBOT
Shadow Techniques is not normalized and this makes a slow weapon (axe/sword/mace/fist) in offhand significantly weaker and almost never worth equiping.
warm marlin
I mean even the forge and fractilus nerfs were insane to me
yeah was sad to see that happen to frac
especially since hes wa boss
slim seal
So yeah. ”Accident”
short radish
To really drive the point. A 723 sword is worse than a 650 dagger in oh or something
slim seal
Ayeaye..
lucid jackal
I don't say this lightly but I think frac is the worst boss made in years
short radish
Back to outlaw you go
short radish
I don't say this lightly but I think frac is the worst boss made in years
Most patchwork boss since patchwork?
leaden prairie
I mean
Blizzard just fumbled hard
Or it was their intention to make this boss to show how bad weak auras have to be deleted idk
tepid trellis
dimensius not so much
leaden prairie
Actually my favorite boss this expac maybe
frail kindle
eh nexus king p3 really disappointing
leaden prairie
Fuck dimensius
short radish
Tbh if it was like the first or 2nd boss itd be okay
leaden prairie
eh nexus king p3 really disappointing
P1 is cool tho
short radish
Fix dimensius hands and hit box please
lucid jackal
This raid is good overall though. Nexus and dimensius are great bosses
leaden prairie
Well the boss is still a fuck you to anything that isn't mega burst cd I think it's a bit much
And flying kekw
tepid trellis
p3 nexus king just needed more health and his abilities to hit harder
leaden prairie
I don't wanna be flying anymore
little sierra
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
leaden prairie
frail kindle
eh i think it needed another mechanic or something
leaden prairie
Send me straight to the platforms please
frail kindle
if youre not assigned to the starkillers you dont really do anything
leaden prairie
I guess
serene notch
I think cinematically this raid has been by far my favorite last 3 expac
serene notch
Space is rad
frail kindle
yeah visually boss is goated
prime raft
why would we macro prism into shadowblades if u wanna have decent stacks for it
frail kindle
fix dimmy hands and hitbox tho
prime raft
how many stacks can be built before SB CD is off
inland galleon
how reliable are the sims when it comes to double on use trinkets?
serene notch
Power scaling in the game is funny, fight a roided out spider, a fat goblin in a robot suite…..a planet destroying void monster that throws asteroids at you.
inland galleon
i have a myth lily, lookin at this hero araz in vault and wondering if the myth lily is really better..i notice my sims are constantly pushing me away from mastery in favor of crit/vers
cinder axle
when u enter the dance window do u guys do Backstab - sec tech - shuriken storm - BP or Evis - Shadowstrike ?
or is it worth to skip the shuriken storm and go into the shadowstrike?
talkin about Aoe
proven plover
when u enter the dance window do u guys do Backstab - sec tech - shuriken storm ...
With rotten u want to shuriken storm there to spread find weakness but if youre playing without rotten, its not needed at all and you would just strike
serene notch
I only hit SS inside dance after symbols in aoe if TR is speced to spread FW
lucid jackal
if youre not assigned to the starkillers you dont really do anything
U still have to dodge the lines
I think adding MORE stuff to P3 would have made it a shitshow
Because it is very, visually busy
stoic token
other than fractilus/council the fights are bangers
lucid jackal
With the lines, especially on the later end of the fight
I like the council fight idk
Only boss I hate is frac
stoic token
its just mech spew, not a fan
i tend to not like council fights in general maybe biased. The last council i liked was Vault
cinder axle
With rotten u want to shuriken storm there to spread find weakness but if youre ...
makes sense, i thougt i get one more stack on Danse Macabre that way and if that would be the reason why its worth
vale osprey
i tend to not like council fights in general maybe biased. The last council i li...
You LIKED vault?????
proven plover
makes sense, i thougt i get one more stack on Danse Macabre that way and if that...
Danse is a small bonus, fw on all targets is more Important. You wouldnt storm just for the macabre stack
tidal wigeon
should i never be using secret technique
cinder axle
Danse is a small bonus, fw on all targets is more Important. You wouldnt storm j...
but do I still do the backstab first?
or do i just SS first and then go for tech
stoic token
but do I still do the backstab first?
yes but that is more to take advantage of premed+dance stack
tidal wigeon
ok thats probably why im getting smashed in dps by undergeared outlaw rogues
proven plover
Yea and also if playing with rotten you would dance > backstab > symbols > sectec > storm
hazy breach
when u enter the dance window do u guys do Backstab - sec tech - shuriken storm ...
No
!aoe
wicked joltBOT
General Gist of the Aoe rotation
- At ALL target counts cast Coup de Grace when it is ready.
- At ALL target counts cast Shadowstrike during Shadow Dance, not Shuriken Storm. (unless coup is ready, !coup)
- Cast Black powder instead of regular Eviscerate at 4 or more targets (there is no other secret rule).
fleet wharf
Just got antennae from vault, any tips on maximizing the trinket?
tidal wigeon
and is shiv for pvp only? e: nvm i see it dispells enrage now
cinder axle
now I am confused xD
stoic token
Just got antennae from vault, any tips on maximizing the trinket?
dont miss orbs, they come to you but if you move from your original spot they sometimes stop right next to you. Make sure to grab them
for the most part there is no minmaxing
hazy breach
You dont want to storm in dance
Besides the coup thing
Because tier makes unseen blade and coup too valueable
languid kindle
!coup
wicked joltBOT
Coup de Grace Optimizations:
- **Number 1: **You can stop using finishers ~10 seconds before your Flagellation comes up on Single Target. This is to build up Shadow Techniques for your cooldowns.
- Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades or with 4+ targets, if you have the 4 set buff active and need to build combo points you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
- Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.
cinder axle
ok so the global with unseen blade is more value then the rotten with SS
proven plover
Ic i thought u still do it since there are many ppl running rotten atm
chrome palm
does renown buff wax?
lucid jackal
apparently it buffs DK runes?
tropic nimbus
Another 5% buff for frost
turbid edge
goodbye delve belt
clever delta
so we are playing mana oil from next week
or what
i dont understand that next week buff 😄
bronze dagger
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
winter harbor
you guys think taking a mythic pacemaker is worth dropping double on use for big pulls in keys? Currently using hero prism / lily. shows 93k but feels a bit bait. Doesnt pre rupturing on the way to pull like kill a lot of the value by the time you go into cds?
lucid jackal
Double on use is overrated
winter harbor
My damage definitely went up when i dropped cyrstal for lily with forge. Especially on big first pulls with lust like halls and eco. But honestly most first pulls are pgood.
oh and flood is another giga
cinder axle
the call was to only use double on use with prism and forge
lily is too weak for that
limpid gull
do i just macro forge into shadowblades?
lucid jackal
Think of it this way, with on use + passive, your on use will be bigger on average than double on use
winter harbor
lily is too weak for that
simmed higher on st for me than crystal / prism did at the time
ionic thorn
people look at logs and see others running double on use in raid and just automatically run it 
hazy breach
I mean its good
winter harbor
uhh yeah I guess if it procs during cds and not on the 3 pack we are pulling into boss or something
cinder axle
y ST is a different kind of story i guess - I talk about M+^^
stiff stirrup
prism + pacemaker sounds giga chill
hazy breach
Its just not 10% better than anything else like some people are making it out to be
stiff stirrup
def better than lily
winter harbor
y ST is a different kind of story i guess - I talk about M+^^
It was higher on keys as well but I just thought that was a given.
lucid jackal
Its really only nexus king where 2x on use is nutty insano
cinder axle
It was higher on keys as well but I just thought that was a given.
The thing is lily gives u like 9k mastery - forge is over 30k agi and a 18stack Prism is nearly 60k
the cd on lily 1:30 so u cant always use it with cds because u want to use prism
ionic thorn
prism+antenna goated
cinder axle
with forge it makes sense cause its a 2 min cds
ionic thorn
would never want to use double on use personally unless it's broken
cinder axle
I play Prism and pacemaker cause i dont have Antenna or Forge
feral barn
Hey guys do you also have the issue, when changing spe from Assa to Sub, i don't have my cold blood even tho it's skilled
cinder axle
otherwise i would swap
ionic thorn
Hey guys do you also have the issue, when changing spe from Assa to Sub, i don't...
known bug
anytime you were playing sin and spec'd into CB and then swap to sub you need to relog to fix it
!bug
wicked joltBOT
Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet | Github Tracker
winter harbor
the cd on lily 1:30 so u cant always use it with cds because u want to use prism
I just use prism every other at 18, not really any different than forge
i understand that a 2 min trinket can have more value built in than a 1.5 though but the use cadence is the same
ionic thorn
wouldn't using prism every 1.5m be better than holding for every other 1.5?
cinder axle
I just use prism every other at 18, not really any different than forge
yeah I know but the effect of Forge is stronger cause its a 2 min cd and that works better with Prism cause u use one of them every 1:30 mins. Lily is designed to be a 1:30 trinket so it just sits one entire duration while it is up.
tidal wigeon
should i be using secret technique ever or can i remove it from my bars
winter harbor
it sims similarly at 9 or 18 stacks but if you have pulls lined up for 18 it goes stupid
lucid jackal
should i be using secret technique ever or can i remove it from my bars
Bro what
tropic nimbus
should i be using secret technique ever or can i remove it from my bars
That’s a secret
cinder axle
thats ragebait 😄
ionic thorn
it sims similarly at 9 or 18 stacks but if you have pulls lined up for 18 it goe...
it might sim similarly but what I'm saying is that you're buffing every CD window instead of every other, although in fairness probably doesn't matter because 3m is full stack and lines up with CD window anyways
winter harbor
i know thats my exact reasoning for lily
so when the biggest pulls in the entire keys happen i have a trinket for them
ionic thorn
i know thats my exact reasoning for lily
but you don't need lily with prism
cinder axle
I just use prism every other at 18, not really any different than forge
and you can just check the top subs on IO - no one is running lily and prism so I wouldn´t recommend it
winter harbor
not running double on use means you pull 20 mobs with lust + pots into the first pull and you dont have a trinket for it. It's completely dead weight until second cd set
cinder axle
so when the biggest pulls in the entire keys happen i have a trinket for them
y I feel you but over the entire duration of the key you would get more valu from Pacemaker then the lily gives u in that first pull - with forge it would be fine cause the effect ist stronger
spice lichen
another week of only trinkets and rings
cinder axle
9k mastery in One pull dont make u dead weight 😄
winter harbor
it makes the trinket dead weight. Never said I, or sub, would be.
ionic thorn
and you can just check the top subs on IO - no one is running lily and prism so ...
I mean tbf #2 is
winter harbor
^
cinder axle
it makes the trinket dead weight. Never said I, or sub, would be.
y I know but its just one pull^^
winter harbor
one pull? Half the dungeons the its the biggest pull with lust and pots, it may be one but when its like 10% of your entire overall it kind of matters.
ionic thorn
but if you're going to run double on use, forge and prism are the common ones
clever delta
bro i sold all my waxes not a long ago
winter harbor
yeah i'd love to have a forge but it went to a ret paladin
ionic thorn
hero forge still good no?
cinder axle
the thing is the first pull in a dungeon dosent decide if u time the key or not cause u dont have 9k mastery in that pull
the rest if the dungeon its better to have the passiv trinket
tropic nimbus
Hoa shards say hello
cinder axle
and it sims good because the sim is using the cds perfectly. In every run u do there will be a time u Sit on lily for 10 secs because u are waiting to use ur big cds again and all other kind of shit that isnt considered in the sim
cinder axle
but tbh just play what feels good to you
it was just a tip how i decide which trinkets i use^^
vale pine
bro i sold all my waxes not a long ago
it takes like 5 minutes to collect 20 wax
clever delta
it takes like 5 minutes to collect 20 wax
and what happened to mana oil
haste maxing
vale pine
it wasn't bad before
wax + mana oil was initially the best budget option
stats now make it not a bad option
graceful osprey
I find it amusing that I am occasionally throwing hot wax into a boss and they take damage
wheat sentinel
i assume I should just automatically take prism here if raid doesn't drop it
winter harbor
and it sims good because the sim is using the cds perfectly. In every run u do t...
Yeah makes sense but there are also times where you proc passive autoattacking the last couple mobs on the way to the next pull before you even start putting bleeds up.
with double on use, when damage needs to happen now I can do it.
tiny mauve
would macroing shadow dance and symbols together cause any issues with the opener?
winter harbor
ya there are times you need to delay symbols a bit on your second dance ot line up with your secret tech cast
ST has to be one of the first 2 finishers cast after pressing it
cinder axle
with double on use, when damage needs to happen now I can do it.
y I feel you - I mean i got Lily in my bag and havent tried the double on use cause the Message was its only worth it with forge. If it feels better for you just keep using it and maybe i give it a try too
wheat sentinel
If the prism drops from raid I probably want that crystal yeah? lol
winter harbor
like its def not as good as forge but I dont have one yet unfortunately
brave ocean
for ritual forge, do i hold it for shadow blades or send it on cd?
grim pewter
for ritual forge, do i hold it for shadow blades or send it on cd?
treat it as a 3min cd and always send with flag.
cinder axle
for ritual forge, do i hold it for shadow blades or send it on cd?
if its ur only on use u hold
even if u have 2 on use u hold 😄
brave ocean
wait send it with flag or shadow blades?
cinder axle
blades
grim pewter
i forgot the two abils are pressed with about a 1 sec delay between them. I just meant "send it with cds" type vibes. blades is correct sry for confusion.
brave ocean
got it ty
crisp lion
bro i sold all my waxes not a long ago
this over whetstone?
high eagle
I haven't even considered other weapon consumable. I just use whetstone. Are the others better? 😂
proper latch
little sierra
i am just trying to read everything
hazy breach
Theres nothing to play around, no need to track it
little sierra
oh i see what you mean
hazy breach
Remove it from your bars and forget it exists 
little sierra
it's not on bar, it's a passive lol
i just thought that there were some more tips on finality
little sierra
i see
vale pine
https://youtube.com/shorts/z-L7EtDTAk4
subtlety has some rly good burst, so might be valuable
obtuse phoenix
!fuu
wicked joltBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
fair anchor
1 sectec cast, 38 hits, 162M damage lmao I love this season
vale pine
short owl
Weak mental
steel jolt
Are they just suiciding
short stratus
Im checking some logs on nexus king, is there a reason why some rogues are getting one blessing of autumn at 47-50 sec into the fight, i dont understand why
latent finch
its just makes your cds come up a few seconds early which gives you some sec to spare to have the cds where you want them
limpid gull
how does the forge/prism interaction work?
tepid trellis
lines up cds better for platform/burn
limpid gull
does one put the other on cd
tepid trellis
works just like any other 2x on-use setup
short stratus
lines up cds better for platform/burn
well you would get them like at the start of platform than 10 sec later so its nothing that i should look into
tepid trellis
al it does is make your cds ready earlier on the platform and for the start of the dmg amp
2nd part being the "real" reason why its "good"
short stratus
noted, ty for reply time to msg my paladin
fierce finch
!guides
dense mountain
link the sim?
coarse hound
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
deft star
Are we wax users?
long flower
!sod
wicked joltBOT
Macro to prevent accidental uses of extra charges: #showtooltip Symbols of Death /castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null /cqs
scenic plover
where can i best farm the wax?
dense mountain
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/8bGFh4uf4MfSWas3bmHDKQ
lily kinda sucks lowkey, but i am a bit surprised. Are you deep into mastery DR?
lucid jackal
where can i best farm the wax?
little sierra
yo guys how do you get invited to 15+ keys after you get all the 14's down
mint violet
Do your own
little sierra
they usually deplete mine
warm osprey
Bro i dont get invited to 12s with timed 14s lol
steel zinc
That looks good in sim but in practice last two you play double on use
warm osprey
Im bad though, so they are making the right decision
grim pewter
and it snapshots
hold up, i heard snapshotting mentioned. finality snapshots? o.o
inland galleon
!wa
wicked joltBOT
inland galleon
i cant for the life of me get using blackpowder on 4 targets while in dance to ever equate to using evis
patent lichen
How is a 2m trinket out simming 1.5, ilvl or not
I wonder if tweaking fight duration flips it
steel zinc
i cant for the life of me get using blackpowder on 4 targets while in dance to e...
If u have a prio target that is fine
lucid jackal
i cant for the life of me get using blackpowder on 4 targets while in dance to e...
BP does a lot of damage
grim pewter
yes
so like you could snapshot some ruptures while at high finality? not to say this is worth it but, it can be done?
inland galleon
BP does a lot of damage
not for my rogue 🙁 maybe im not pressing it hard enough
urban field
why cant i maccro Symbol of death and shadow dance?
weak jungle
No one is stopping you from doing that. But you may find delaying symbols for a second or two to line up with secret techniques to be preferable.
tidal wigeon
i macro'd my netherprism to my shadow dance, is this a bad idea
lavish rose
it happened
warm osprey
Yes
tropic nimbus
Great idea
vernal leaf
Hey guys, got this from my vault, I currently have hero Pacemaker and normal Netherprism. Would it be better for the long run, and the playstyle of subtety, to take the Heroic Netherprism, and farm a Lily, or take the Mythic Pacemaker and just use my normal Netherprism.
This is all assuming I more than likely wont get a heroic Netherprism from raid since I pug (dont raid with a consistent group)
sullen yarrow
hi guys
how do i know when im about to get a full combo point in my rotation
in m+
jagged rover
i macro'd my netherprism to my shadow dance, is this a bad idea
yes, macro to shadow blades
sullen yarrow
anyone?
lucid jackal
shadowcraft
jagged rover
how do i know when im about to get a full combo point in my rotation
track shadow techniques, when its at 7+ and your in symbols it'll refund
warm osprey
Are people actually macroing Prisim? Arent you sending on low stacks?
wintry heart
!wa
wicked joltBOT
tropic nimbus
Are people actually macroing Prisim? Arent you sending on low stacks?
Low stacks=8 or 9 which cds are back up for
jagged rover
Are people actually macroing Prisim? Arent you sending on low stacks?
not counting specific situations where you need more damage or burn phases, it comes out to roughly the same sending 9~ stacks every 90s or 18 every 3 mins
devout jackal
Hey guys, got this from my vault, I currently have hero Pacemaker and normal Net...
Personally I'd take seafoam mythic and farm a hero track lily
shrewd lantern
myth priory ring
clever delta
getting autumns on salamander now, poggers
shrewd lantern
i guess W
rancid crow
Is the Mind-Fracturing Odium trinket any good? It’s got a really cool effect that works well with my mog
sweet raven
Ok guys do I go in mythic pug for 2/8M on my rogue alt ? I feel like it will fuck my prism / araz trinket chance in vault
stoic token
what good drops off the first two bosses?
hazy breach
Killing soulbinder unlocks loom
stoic token
you can still get loom loot though
shrewd lantern
so its a decent pool tbh
can also get dagger
ring is also one of the better ones without praying for vault
sullen loom
!macro
wicked joltBOT
Subtlety Macros:
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together because most of them result in performance losses compared to using them manually.
The following macros are an exception:
/cast Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=5 Thistle Tea, null```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key as well.
sullen loom
someone use thistle tea macro ?
unkempt drum
I've been reading through the guides, and while the burst explanations and conditions make sense to me, I'm struggling a bit with when/how to stop using stuff to prep for a flag window (basically when it's ok to SD between flags), am I missing part of the reading or just misunderstanding something? I'm hitting like...60% of sim on a dummy
cinder axle
with double on use, when damage needs to happen now I can do it.
so I just tryed the Prism and Lily in a +15 Eco Dome and it wasnt the cleanest run but timed. In some cases i have Cds up + lily and my Prism sits at 14 Stacks cause maybe somone died and we need time to kill 3 mobs that survived and stuff. then in the next pull i Send my CDs with 14 stacks prism and after the pull i havent used my Lily for like 4 mins and that kinda feels ass. With a passiv trinket i would get more valu. I think double on use is cool and works in a clean run but if its scuffed u lose more then a passiv trinket. In like 17 or 18 keys the run is bricked anyway when it gets scuffed but in the 15s I think the passiv trinket gets a little bit more valu^^
limber relic
Why you flagging after rupture?!
meager coyote
__Subtlety Macros:__
We do not recommend macroing your cooldowns together becaus...
guys why is lily last here
tidal marsh
Why you Shadow Bladesing before SD and SoD
vale pine
guys why is lily last here
it does not matter, all of them are off gcd
also if you use double on use, please don't use trinket macros but use them with seperate binds
limber relic
Honestly the macro works pretty well for forge/prism...uses forge first then prism when forge is on CD
But i can see lily fucking it up
meager coyote
where do I slam it with double on use, is it just after pressing flag?
stray oyster
has any one seen where you have cb, but when you make it a macro it says "spell not leanred yet" but i can use out of macro?
hazy breach
!cbbug
wicked joltBOT
Cold Blood bug:
A common issue when switching between Assassination Fatebound and Subtlety is that Cold Blood stops working, this problem is solvable with the following step:
- Relogging.
You can use ths weakaura to get a reminder: >Open on Wago.io <
stray oyster
ty, good game blizzard glad they are on top of their program
stoic token
I've been reading through the guides, and while the burst explanations and condi...
20-25 sec before flagg comes back up
if you dance there, you most likely wont have x2 dance/symbols for big burn
frank harness
Don’t worry I had a warlock tell me their bugs are worse than rogues 
hazy breach
Hard to measure what a "worse bug" is
tidal wigeon
does crippling poison work on the adds in the last phase of forgemaster
unkempt drum
20-25 sec before flagg comes back up
Ok -- so if I have shadow dance up and flagg is 30+ seconds away, it's okay to send that and SoD. Inside of that time, hold and just BS/finish to make sure there's 2x dance for flag and blades. Also want to make sure there's secret teq up for the first dance, right? And never use secret teq outside of dance, if I'm reading this correctly
Also, sub seems to be the consensus in keys over like...15. I'm guessing it's because there's somewhat less reliance on stealth and the boss damage/single target is stronger, is that generally right?
unkempt drum
This is exactly what I was looking for, thank you!
vale pine
there is no "hidden tech" to the first dance
lethal lark
20-25 sec before flagg comes back up
Should you have 1 dance banked at 25 seconds before Flag is up?
vale pine
if you don't get it, thats fine
if your tank pulls and you would get it in like 1-2 sec
you can wait before starting to engage
but thats all to know about the first dance
astral axle
Also, sub seems to be the consensus in keys over like...15. I'm guessing it's be...
i dont know if people are thinking about it all that much at this point tbh. Sin sub and outlaw are all doing pretty good
unkempt drum
Sin pure single target is absolutely miserable, in AoE it blasts
stoic token
outlaw is used a lot in phys comps and sub everywhere else
astral axle
easily remedied by having people bring in funnel, which there are so many funnel comps it is prolly gonna be standard to bring funnel in to bosses where possible
stoic token
yea every boss in floodgate brings prio adds
unkempt drum
easily remedied by having people bring in funnel, which there are so many funnel...
True but lots of pug tanks just won't do it, and some bosses like Geezle in FG or Rash'anan in DB you're just stuck fighting for fourth DPS with the tank
placid crown
Why you Shadow Bladesing before SD and SoD
it's a macro anyway, same timing
placid crown
Why you flagging after rupture?!
???
oh shit
my muscle memory was good but not my memory
you right xD
sand monolith
Are we spending our super charged combopoints on double coup de grace procs or secret techniques
astral axle
True but lots of pug tanks just won't do it, and some bosses like Geezle in FG o...
id be pretty surprised if pugs in title range keys will just pull single boss w/o adds when given the option this season. feral, arcane, havoc, sin -- all do great funnel and are performing pretty well rn
unkempt drum
id be pretty surprised if pugs in title range keys will just pull single boss w/...
15s aren't exactly title range, but pug tanks there are frequently pulling funnel-available bosses solo, like the first one in Streets or Eco Dome and it drives me crazy
astral axle
hah well they are 15s in that case, you'll time even if your boss damage is low
there there
unkempt drum
I had a tank shit talk me in Streets a while back because I was 1m behind the other DPS on the first boss even though I was 5m ahead of them on the prior pull (and 2m overall), it super pissed me off
This was also an 11, it's not that deep at that level
unkempt drum
What is title range right now, 18s?
vale pine
@tidal wigeon macro prism to blades, not dance
west ridge
is it better to macro araz to blades and netherprism as single button or the opposite ?
willow pawn
Don’t macro double trinkets to anything
vale pine
if you use double on use
west ridge
Don’t macro double trinkets to anything
no wouldnt do that just which one should i macro into blades is the question
vale pine
if you use two on use trinkets
its best to not macro them
but if you just use prism and a passive
stoic token
since araz is 2min why cant you macro it in and have it as the 1st trinket option. Why would that not work?
vale pine
its 90% of the time perfectly fine to macro
if you use forge and prism
you forge -> prism -> forge -> prism
etc
you get the gist
its like that with most combinations of on use
little sierra
@vale pine does it matter if you cast shadow blade before secret technique? i have seen some logs where it's really dandom
random*
west ridge
i mean i macrod araz cause its 2min so it isnt up at 2nd blades then that was my way of thinking
vale pine
so either is good
little sierra
ok thank you, but you would use prism before secret technique right?
west ridge
but thank u fuu i will consider it to put on a own button 
vale pine
ok thank you, but you would use prism before secret technique right?
the shadow clone attacks is where most power is
it is also why using it after is okay as long as its before the clones strike
there is no snapshotting on clones, so just need thigs up before they hit
stone patrol
vale pine
stacks reset on instance start or boss fight start
so yes and no
if you do like hard mode
you can stack yourself up
18 stacks of prism, 7 charges of supercharger, disoriented strikes
but for m+, all you can rly do is use symbols once when the key starts
or between packs if there is very long downtime
same in raid
disoriented can be gamed sometimes
signal moth
vale pine
but not reliable, you won't have the oppotunity to use secret before every whipe on progress
west tide
another week no trinket,,,
stoic token
this has been the luckiest alt i have ever had, 6 days old and has pretty much everything. More geared than my mage
cinder axle
tell me about it, my shami went into one raid and got hero antenna + Forge
my main ist just standing there naked xD
stoic token
if i can just get the neck from PSF to drop, have run it at least 20 times
cinder axle
never saw forge drop
vale pine
!loot
wicked joltBOT
void ocean
!wa
wicked joltBOT
magic dove
Does wound poison work on Nexus King?
sullen yarrow
**__Subtlety WAs's:__**
Class packs:
> ### <:fuu:1184251947352608768> [Fuu's](<h...
yes
but how do i do it
crystal bone
looks like ima double on-use gamer now
sullen yarrow
like to check the thing
graceful terrace
do I hold my symbols/dance at 17 secs of flag?
seems to be the point that i hit every time just before CDs is 17 secs
lucid jackal
You stop at 30 seconds
graceful terrace
so i dont symbols or dance with 30 secs left on CD?
what do I do for 30 secs
lmao
just dot and BS?
tropic nimbus
Afk
honest saddle
on a fight like fract where there is no amp or adds, how much worse is it to run prism at 9 stacks every flag window instead of every other at 18 (assuming you send all stacks at the end)?
Is it the exact same?
seems like it would be identical
seems like sending every time would be better since you don't waste any stacks that way
real panther
any weapon enchants good enough or is there one making a big % diff?
jagged halo
okay i have a new sub guy question: do you ever send tea without SD?
real panther
no
jagged halo
okay i didn't think so, thank you
crystal bone
on a fight like fract where there is no amp or adds, how much worse is it to run...
the sim sends on cd at 9 stacks
real panther
excuse me. precise answer is sod i think
crystal bone
for patchwerk
pure pollen
my sims keep pushing me more towards vers > mastery is this normal?
tepid trellis
stats are always a balancing act
half yew
hi guys i am new to sub rogue, i tried to watch casualaddict and other streamers and i still dont understand when to use eviscerate and when black power to aoe ? he seems to use both in aoe
tepid trellis
!aoe
wicked joltBOT
General Gist of the Aoe rotation
- At ALL target counts cast Coup de Grace when it is ready.
- At ALL target counts cast Shadowstrike during Shadow Dance, not Shuriken Storm. (unless coup is ready, !coup)
- Cast Black powder instead of regular Eviscerate at 4 or more targets (there is no other secret rule).
half yew
thank you
pure pollen
stats are always a balancing act
can you elaborate a little on what you mean by that, just different situation to situation?
tepid trellis
value of stats change every time you do a slight change in stats
half yew
are there other commands that explain rotation ?
real panther
hi guys i am new to sub rogue, i tried to watch casualaddict and other streamers...
when eviscerate become coup de grace, you go that, otherwil you go bp for +4 targets (3+ if find the weakness on all)