subtlety

[west tide]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[ornate heron]

would this macro work to backstab first in dance?

#Showtooltip Shadow Dance
/cast [bonusbar:1] Backstab; Shadow Dance
/castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null
/cast Thistle Tea
/cqs

[chrome fern]

/castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null 
/cqs```

[clever holly]

That makes it I can't sod when one is active?

[vale pine]

no

[chrome fern]

makes it so you can't sod within 2 seconds of pressing that macro

[vale pine]

this just prevents you from using it 2 times

[clever holly]

Ahh tyvm

[chrome fern]

(and 2 seconds from pressing that macro within the 2 seconds)

don't ask me how i know...

[acoustic matrix]

You mean sending backstab on high cp right ? Or is energy a thing to consider too ?

[vale pine]

no

i posted the one picture

you did storm - backstab

flagellation

dance

backstab

if we break this down

you would in general get 3-5 cp from storm

then probably 2 from backstab due to sht

so you end up on ~5-6 cp before flagellation

so you used flag

and then dance-backstab

with only 1-2 cp of room left, this wastes all the combo points you already have on hand

in this case, it would be better to either

flagellation-dance-secret

or flagellation-rupture/evis-dance-backstab

[acoustic matrix]

Aight, you guys help a ton, thanks!

[round latch]

thats fuu u are talking so its only natural

[vale pine]

^^

[acoustic matrix]

Yeah I gained like 1M on several 2minutes, incredible advice

[clever holly]

It's not natural

On other discords u ask stuff and they go like "get good" or "Sim Ur dumb question" 😂

[tribal blade]

get good idiot

[round latch]

Well thats why i specifically said its fuu so its natural

and we arent other discords

[tribal blade]

(jk <3)

[clever holly]

I know -.-

[round latch]

Ravenholdt>>>>everything else

[tribal blade]

someone was in here the other day saying ravenholdt is terrible

[round latch]

yeah was a DH main

was pretty rich

[tribal blade]

because he couldn't figure out what the icons were on the wowhead guide

[round latch]

what a legend

[stiff remnant]

guys does trinket tuning hotfix changes anything? is antenna still the hot?

[tribal blade]

never seen someone have an issue like that using a guide

[tribal blade]

it's a very small nerf

[cloud rover]

Ravenholdt worst place on the internet frfr

no cap

[tribal blade]

iirc it's liek -180 crit or something really small

3% reduction in crit for the trink is nothing

[tribal blade]

TRUEEE

[acoustic matrix]

This. There are helpful people in other discords but also a lot of those

This is the friendliest class discord i've seen so far

[vale pine]

everyone has diffrent expectations ^^

so ye

[tribal blade]

I DEMAND YOUR FULL ATTENTION

[wheat edge]

what is the correct play when cooldowns are in this situation, do I send a symbols charge at some point but just leave the dance charge?

[clever holly]

Dumb question (that can't be sim'd)

Do I collect the antenna stuff or do I get it naturally

[cursive vapor]

'watch guides and stfu'

[tribal blade]

you can play around it

[clever holly]

Got that comin

[tribal blade]

like kiting the orbs till you go into dances

[cloud rover]

You can play around me

[tribal blade]

eleem was saying he could get a bunch of stacks during dances with kiting

[cursive vapor]

[tribal blade]

ok 😉

[tawdry karma]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
It is not recommended to macro most cooldowns, including Cold Blood+Secret Techniques and Dance+Symbols.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key.

[tribal blade]

i need to tighten up my sub rotation, i'm still making so many mistakes

[vale pine]

haha^^

[tribal blade]

and still #1 NA sub rogue

i could do more

[clever holly]

I hate those trinkets

What was the m+ one with the 3 orbs

[vale pine]

it depends on the boss

dimensius is not good for antenna

[runic trail]

Possibly a symbols + sectech and hold til flag

[vale pine]

also antenna will get nerfed with reset

[tribal blade]

yeah some of the bosses you can't kite

[vale pine]

even tho only by a little

https://www.wowhead.com/news/astral-antenna-nerfed-on-the-weekly-reset-upcoming-trinket-tuning-incoming-378330?utm_source=discord-webhook

[shadow snow]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[tribal blade]

interesting they nerfed it by such a small amount

[runic trail]

I really need to play around with the 4 set more to get a better feel for it. I'm just not confident enough on sub to use it for prog

[cloud rover]

Best thign for sub is double on use right? Like Lily and Prism?

[tribal blade]

nah not lily because it lines up with every cd set

forge + prism for double on use

because forge gives monster stats

use it on 1st cd set, then prism on 2nd

then rotate

[cloud rover]

Well if they overnerfed it, they would have fucked some vault picks

which isnt a nice thing to do

[upbeat sorrel]

does sub still use ionclaw Whetstone for weapons

ass is using oils now

[tribal blade]

that's very true

[cloud rover]

Okok good, i dont ahve forge

So i stay 1 on use as of now

[cursive vapor]

ironclaw alloy

[cloud rover]

Weirdly enough, my sim tells me to go with Wax + Mana oil on Sub and Assa

[tribal blade]

actually i'm not sure how lily and prism plays together, but i think it's not great

[lone linden]

any hit of coup de grace can refund CP via shadowcraft right?
its hits 3 times every 0.4 seconds after you press it? is that correct

[tribal blade]

but i would warrant a guess lily becomes pretty bad using it as a 3 min trink

[tall hatch]

Can some1 recommend me a Sub guide/video? wanna catch up a bit

[cloud rover]

I mean Prism needs time to stack right? would prolly use prism as 3 Min

[tribal blade]

forge is worth doing that kind of stuff with because of how highly it's tuned, i know WWs hold cds for a long time just to line it up with forge

[tribal blade]

yeah for sure

[cloud rover]

I mean Prism has more Main stat

(if fully stacked)

[shadow lance]

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[clever holly]

I don't know my chances to get forge for m+ use after I already got prism

Let's just hope loot officer is low on gold

[shadow lance]

Above

[tall hatch]

Thanks

[tribal blade]

thing is i don't think prism is actually bis for a whole lot of specs

[shadow lance]

MM hunters and sub rogue

[tribal blade]

fdk maybe too?

[shadow lance]

The only one needing in my raid

[tribal blade]

but yeah i had no competition for it

[shadow lance]

No fdk wanting it

In my roster

[clever holly]

Forge tho

[tribal blade]

yeah forge will be harder to get

it's bis for more people

[vale pine]

i think more classes/specs will try to look at it

[clever holly]

That's the one I need

[vale pine]

[tribal blade]

maybe yeah

they might want it for dmg amps

some other class discords might cook up some dmg amp stuff for raid

[clever holly]

When will prism get bad like spymaster did?

Boss fights under x minutes?

[vale pine]

probably yes

because you just use forge

and eba

*cba

[cloud rover]

Prolly fights under 3 Minutes?

[vale pine]

figths under 1 min 30

[clever holly]

Forge still on blade?

[vale pine]

or well 1 min 50

because you want to actually utialize your cooldowns

yes

you need some time to build prism stacks

so you would forge first

then prism 2nd set of cooldowns

which is 1 min 30 in the fight

[serene blaze]

Mag'har orc or dwarf for M+? how much dps inc is mag"har racial into blades?

[clever holly]

In Raid also 2 on use or just in that short fights?

[tall hatch]

Also any video I could watch or just to hear it while at work?

[vale pine]

tiramil did forget that the first set of cooldowns is at the start of the fight, and hence mentioned 3 mins

[vale pine]

basically its like this

[shadow lance]

In English, idk

[vale pine]

double on use is in general not that strong, so if we talk about it

we mean prism + forge

[cloud rover]

true

[vale pine]

and for this combo, its about on par with prism + antenna

[tall hatch]

Which other language then

[vale pine]

well after antenna nerfs

probably slightly ahead

neverless

prism + forge have the advantage of control over your burst and especially at the start of fight a higher damage

while prism + passive have the advantage of having on average higher damage during your burst

both have applications

[shadow lance]

Got a french one

[clever holly]

Yay let me just pull another key bind out of my

[runic trail]

Shindigg has one for 11.1 which is good, there weren't a bunch of changes for 11.2

[vale pine]

for m+, the fine control of forge + prism is important

for raid

[tall hatch]

I’ll check it thank you

[vale pine]

you would use it on dimensius mainly because antenna gets worse value

due to the fight design

[tribal blade]

playing with prism is honestly making me try to treat every key like it's hardmode tezavesh

because dying with prism stacks is big depression

[clever holly]

This 😂

[serene blaze]

u stacking vers 😄 just dont die ez

[cloud rover]

You should try to have above 0 HP for that, you are welcome

[clever holly]

16 Stacks death = abandon vote started

[tribal blade]

yeah i have 20k vers fully buffed atm

[clever holly]

Wich flask do you guys use

[proven plover]

alchemical

[cursive vapor]

vodka melon and jim beam

[serene blaze]

vers

[topaz egret]

I'd recommend double on use on most movement fights, u lose quite a few of your antennas, think on dimensius/NK it was about 25-30% orb miss

[tribal blade]

i really don't like trinket mechanics that make you pick up orbs, so i would rather play forge+prism yeah

[dreamy badger]

Is lily good enough?

[clever holly]

Very good I use those on pure St fights

[tribal blade]

you double the cd on lily to do that so nah

[dreamy badger]

Thought so

[tribal blade]

forge works so well as double on use with sub because of how much main stat it gives

[cloud rover]

Its btw really funny

that a 704 Lila

gives as much Mastery on Use, as a hosue of cards

on 684

[tribal blade]

does it actually? that's crazy

[cloud rover]

Lily 704 give liek 8,6K mastery

[tribal blade]

that's not much yeah

[cloud rover]

and thats basically how much HoC gave

[vale pine]

just don't die (i am joking)

[tribal blade]

i try so hard!

[proven plover]

704 lily is close to 9k and upgraded mm hoc is 9.4k fully stacked

[clever holly]

Yeah die (in-game)

[vale pine]

i am very good at that

[tribal blade]

i had a good day of not dying today, i don't think i died a single time in any push key i did today

[cloud rover]

Its so weird, that they sometimes under budgeting trinkets so hard

[tribal blade]

except when there were full wipes

[frigid prawn]

@tribal blade use that for hard mode

[proven plover]

raid vs m+ trinket ig, they really like to make raid trinkets stronger

[tribal blade]

well you see i can't control the 4 other people in hardmode 🙁

we lost hardmode today because one of my guildies made a call that got our warr killed

on the portal boss

[cloud rover]

Maybe unpopular Opinion

[tribal blade]

boss was almost dead and full panic happened

[cloud rover]

But Hardmode Taszavesh giving a myth track item

Is very tocix

and shouldnt come back

[tribal blade]

yeah it's not a good idea

tbh

[cloud rover]

Especially if its only once per week chance

if you could repeat it, wouldnt be as bad

[proven plover]

true it is very toxic

our guild is chill about it but I've heard some stories of people getting hard blamed for dying

[vale pine]

our rl did tell us to not get hit by orbs on soulbinder.
So, i positioned myself perfectly and avoided all the orbs of people who did run out late or positioned themselves poorly.
Just to realize that i stand with the back to the void, in the second the knockback hit.
I was not very pleased to get jumped off the platform due to poor orb management and me trying to optimize damage income

[tribal blade]

noooo tragic 🙁

[vale pine]

haha

it was a whipe

so not too bad

[keen dome]

Damn, haha

[tribal blade]

oh nice nice

[keen dome]

Gravity. Our greatest foe

[tribal blade]

that moment when you die and you start praying it's a wipe

[vale pine]

this raid def.

[cloud rover]

Reminds me of a clip i mad for my guild fuu

[vale pine]

haha

the classic

[keen dome]

hahaha

[vale pine]

"wait where do i go"

probably followed by your rl saying

"bro, you did this on normal/heroic already"

[proven plover]

that boss is such a joke though

[vale pine]

it is

[clever holly]

I'm already happy the first boss is no gimmick

[vale pine]

but its funny

[clever holly]

But a very tiny wall

[proven plover]

first boss is really nice

[vale pine]

if you die to some unforchunate things

[proven plover]

reminds me a bit of the first boss of aberrus

difficulty wise

[vale pine]

i wonder how difficulty will be

in the next xpac

6-1-2

sounds weird with staggered releases

(raid boss releases)

[proven plover]

wait what, I havent watched the panels

[keen dome]

big same. I'm glad other people feel that way about Plexus

[vale pine]

you did not miss much

[keen dome]

Have they confirmed it's staggered though?

[vale pine]

they spend like 1 min talking about raids

[proven plover]

wdym staggered

[vale pine]

in the 25? minutes pannel

[bleak night]

the 2 boss raid is staggered

[vale pine]

[bleak night]

i dont think the one boss is

[keen dome]

Basically like MoP then, I guess.

[bleak night]

but i could be misremembering

[vale pine]

its basically, 6 boss raid

[keen dome]

So we have 6 -> 1 -> wait -> 2

[vale pine]

then a 1 boss

then a 2 boss

[bleak night]

like the one boss is supposed to be about as difficult as a mid tier boss in the 6 boss raid

[vale pine]

so its staggered

[proven plover]

in the same raid or what

[bleak night]

and the 2 bosses are harder than the 6 boss

[keen dome]

Three instances.

[vale pine]

its one raid

just uses diffrence raid instances

[keen dome]

It's still the same tier, though. It's like the first tier of MoP

Mogu'shan -> Heart of Fear -> Terrace. Still tier 1 of MoP

[vale pine]

its unclear to me weather they just want to re-use old zones for raid fights

[proven plover]

ah so like releasing different wings over the course of a season?

or is that longer than a season

[vale pine]

or if we will have 3 compeltely new/unique zones

[keen dome]

The first seven seem to be out immediately, with the final two coming a bit later but who knwos

We won't know until closer to launch / they confirm for certain.

[proven plover]

so they just dont have enough time to finish it xdd

[keen dome]

I wouldn't be too shock if it's like

The first seven are for heroic week -> final two with Mythic

[vale pine]

hmm

[proven plover]

seems weird but ok lol

[summer peak]

hey guys, I have a macro for Symobls, Dance and Backstab for my opener CDS. it seems that its pressing Symbols twice when i looked at logss.....

Do we know does the secquence that stopes you pressing SOD ina row work in nthat style of macro

[bleak night]

time gated raids pog

[keen dome]

Maybe, who knows.

We legitimately do not know

[bleak night]

well we definitely do know about the 2 boss being later

and i even think it was by several weeks

[keen dome]

Yeah, but we don't know how much later, do we?

[bleak night]

i'd have to go back and check though

so maybe im making shit up

i do enjoy spreading a bit of misinformation

[keen dome]

I'll bet you 1 gold it'll be a Heroic -> Mythic week thing if they do a Heroic week

Where it's 6 + 1 for Heroic then 6 + 1 + 2 for Mythic

[vale pine]

difficulty curve will be important

[keen dome]

Yeah

[vale pine]

because if like

firts 6 are not hard

[keen dome]

The middle lairboss should hopefully be the bridge between the 6 and the 2.

[bleak night]

they described it as 3-1-3-2

[vale pine]

would feel weird to have 6 fights to just wait for the hard ones

[keen dome]

It's cool to see them trying something else though. I want them to expriment with tiers

[bleak night]

but idk how far apart the 2 will be from the rest

crucible of storms time

[vale pine]

and while i see why they split it

[keen dome]

Yeah

[bleak night]

[vale pine]

some sort of "goose chase"

[keen dome]

man, fucking cruicble

[vale pine]

story

[keen dome]

Ye

[vale pine]

i don't know

its too early for me

[keen dome]

Because of the RWF, I can't really picture them going "oh yeah the final part of this tier is out in six weeks bye" even though the race is unofficial.

[bleak night]

more importantly which ones drop housing items

[keen dome]

Which is why I believe it'll be a Heroic week thing

[night sparrow]

Trinkets nerf noooo ???! Oh idc prism and forge no nerf 🥸 🥸

[vale pine]

heroic week also returns

so its like

[keen dome]

Yeah

[vale pine]

are they doing a month of wfr?

or no wfr?

[keen dome]

Nah

[vale pine]

or only first 6?

[keen dome]

I think it'll be heroic week having 7 bosses then the final two in Mythic week onwards

So once Mythic is out, you've got the full 9 boss tier

This also lets people do the story in heroic week and the 'chase' since a week later the final two unlock

Absolute speculation on my part but I think it makes sense

[vale pine]

hmm

i think it will be weird

because you kill 6

then need to port to a new raid

then kill 1

then port to a new raid

then kill 2

[keen dome]

Ye

Speaking as a puglord, it's gonna be a huge pain in the ass lmao

[bleak night]

ye and some asshole will ask for a summon despite there being a portal probably 5 feet from them

[summer peak]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
It is not recommended to macro most cooldowns, including Cold Blood+Secret Techniques and Dance+Symbols.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key.

[bleak night]

and we'll sit there waiting for everyone to accept

[vale pine]

i am not sure there will be

[keen dome]

If I see someone standing in Shadow Point and asking for a summon, I kick them.

[bleak night]

then someone will hearth back because they forgot to buy potions

and forget that people have ah mounts

and you've gotta put the portal back up

and summon them again

[keen dome]

lmao

god, stop, you are hurting my soul

Pugging also has a pretty strict mentality around "You should only be doing the next boss from what you've killed"

So if like. Boss '7' i.e., the lairboss is easier than boss 6. it'll be weird.

[bleak night]

yeah

get halfway through the first raid then try to get everyone to go to another one entirely

[keen dome]

I don't really think it'll be much of a problem, but I can see it being funny.

[bleak night]

then come back to the first one

[keen dome]

Yeah

[mental flume]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[keen dome]

I think if that's the case you'd just do the lairboss first.

A door boss situation where if the group can kill the lairboss then they're clearing the rest.

[bleak night]

honestly might be the way to go anyway

yeah exactly

[keen dome]

It's why Mythic pugging this season is so good

If the group can kill PlexusM then they're gonna kill Soulbinder.

[vale pine]

i still think raid restrictions should go

so you are not locked

if you pug first mythic boss

and your healer decides to just leave after

[keen dome]

Oh, absolutely

[bleak night]

yeah pugging mythic is absolutely way too restrictive

[keen dome]

I'm a very vocal and firm supporter of deleting the lockout system

[dusk stone]

that makes no sense to me why they did that

[keen dome]

I do think Scath and others have a pretty valid point of doing it after the HoF fills

[bleak night]

if we want more people to get into mythic raiding it has to be accessible outside of finding a guild with a spot in their 20 man group for you

[keen dome]

Ye

[dusk stone]

like whats the point of it actually?

[vale pine]

just don't allow pug groups to be part of hof

[bleak night]

i can see waiting until after hof yeah

[vale pine]

make hof guild groups only

[bleak night]

so people arent hiring mercenaries and shit

[vale pine]

problem solved

[bleak night]

make them get hopeful to pilot their account like ethical people instead

[dusk stone]

is that not what alts are for?

[keen dome]

Yeah, it's pretty much what Bel said.

A pug group is never killing the end boss before hoF is filled

Like, it's just not happening.

[dusk stone]

yo how much to have casual get me a 100 on dawnbreaker

[vale pine]

hof can take long to fill tho

some times very long

[bleak night]

yeah restricting it entirely until hof is filled is probably too long

[keen dome]

It can. It's not an ideal solution and ideally you'd just have it work like heroic lockout from the get-go. But I understand their perspective and I think it's a fair middleground.

[dusk stone]

cant you just evade the system by using an alt?

like the lockout isn't accountwide right

[vale pine]

thats why i propose the limit to guild groups

[bleak night]

wdym evade the system

[keen dome]

Ye, I think that's a good idea.

[bleak night]

yeah you can go pug on an alt but that doesnt help the average person

they dont have multiple mythic raid level characters

[vale pine]

if like 18/20 people are from your guild

you can't rly "buy" it

[dusk stone]

no what i mean is, whatever problem the lockout system is there to solve it doesn't solve because alts exist

[vale pine]

2 echo players won't make you kill dimensius

your entire raid needs to play well to kill it

[keen dome]

Ultimately, pugging is good for the game and making Mythic more pug-accessible without reducing difficulty or impacting guilds is good.

[dusk stone]

so what ends up happening is people just get screwed and noone is saved from anything

[vale pine]

^

would just reduce fustration

you don't lose your lockout if you pug

and things go south

also one thing can return a guild did i had in Wotlk

where you can swap in/out people dynamically for a longer time

[dusk stone]

we didnt have this bs in swtor smaller game mind you

[bleak night]

oh that part is also cursed

[vale pine]

and see what works best, currently you are too limited by restrictions

[dusk stone]

nightmare pugging was a very common thing and the content was not easy

[bleak night]

like you might only be in for one or two bosses that week for prog but get locked for the whole raid

[keen dome]

You are at the whim of the worst player in a Mythic pug past the first boss.

[bleak night]

thats annoying as fuck too

[keen dome]

I have had multiple weeks ruined on 1/xM because someone left or we couldn't clear due to a shitter.

It's not worth the effort.

[bleak night]

yeah you wipe once at 5% and some dude immediately leaves

[keen dome]

Yep

And you aren't filling.

[bleak night]

or doesnt win the loot they want and just dips

[dusk stone]

yeah you don't dare mythic pug if you don't alt a lot and you are in a mythic prog guild

thats just awful

[keen dome]

Or like, legitimately has to go. Less common but still

It's happened to me

[bleak night]

yeah also true

[dusk stone]

i legit play 1 toon

[keen dome]

I tried to do Cauldron a few times but never managed it 'cos the groups would always collapse.

Which is why most groups started doing Cauldron -> Vexie

[summer peak]

Guys, are we still using STech before we use shadow blades?

[bleak night]

dude it was so funny when my guild discovered we could just

[summer peak]

Or does it matter

[bleak night]

walk out the back door

and skip vexie

lmfao

[dusk stone]

you use sectec with shadow blades

[keen dome]

yeah it's really funny

[vale pine]

can do before or after, does not matter

[dusk stone]

is heroic easier this tier?

[keen dome]

Yes

[dusk stone]

i just 1 shot a fractillus pug

[vale pine]

just use it before clones hit

[keen dome]

Fraciltus is a legitimate joke on Heroic. It does nothing.

Araz and Nexus-King are the only hard bosses on Heroic. Even Dimensius is whatever.

[summer peak]

Ok brilliant m! Thanks Fuu!

[keen dome]

and Saladbar is only hard due to P3 instant-wipe mechanics.

[dusk stone]

i have yet to kill dimensius on heroic, waiting to clear our roster up a bit before we do, had legit 680 ilvl people still

[keen dome]

I think the balance this season for Heroic is really good but their HP is just a bit too low.

And Soul Hunters / Fract are vastly easier than they should be at Heroic level because of it, due to the immense DPS gain we have from tier, etc.

[dusk stone]

fracc doesnt feel like oab heroic i will say that

[keen dome]

But it's a very good tier. Extremely fun to pug through. Nexus-King P3 is the big pug pain point because, for some reason, pugs have latched onto the worst possible way to do that mechanic

And if you do it the proper way, it's extremely easy

[dusk stone]

oh saladaar isnt legitimately a bad boss compared to mug'zee

i hated that thing with a passion

[keen dome]

Yeah he owns

Dimensius isn't easy, btw. He's just really well designed that you learn each phase properly and nothing is a "haha gotcha" mechanic.

It's just getting your reps in and he dies.

[runic trail]

Dimensius hc is a fun fight, we did kill him with 7 people alive though

[dusk stone]

well that sounds good

[keen dome]

Hell yeah

[runic trail]

Things went wrong

[keen dome]

I think he took me about 23 pulls in a pug? 25? Let me check

[runic trail]

But I lived so fuck the rest of the team

[keen dome]

19 pulls

[dusk stone]

no prism on fracc 🙁

[bleak night]

bro you mightve killed it in a pug faster than my guild did

[keen dome]

• 2 in a pug before this one

Oh wait, no, this log includes those lmao

It's just 17 pulls then

[bleak night]

ye it took us 22 pulls

[dusk stone]

i never actually killed gally in a pug

[runic trail]

We still had people dying on the flying bit, every time

Like, pls

[keen dome]

Gally was extremely fun to pug prog early on 'cos it was a SUPER intense heal check and DPS had to pay attention

I think I did him in 8 pulls haha

[runic trail]

Dimensius is a fun spectacle fight

[dusk stone]

yeah thats where we always got stuck, right at the start

[keen dome]

Extremely funny to compare to Ansurek which was easily 150+ pulls

And then I didn't even kill her in a pug

[runic trail]

I am not looking forward to guiding the drunk Friday social raid through it though

Gonna be chaos but by the time we get there we should outgear it

[bleak night]

im kinda sad i just didnt play s1

pugging ansurek wouldve been hilarious

[dusk stone]

hopefully we start mythic in next week or 2

i want to pull araz

[keen dome]

95% of wipes are in P1, in the first 30 seconds

[bleak night]

instead i didnt get aotc until the week before season ended because i joined my new guild and they ran it lmfao

[keen dome]

And then people release.

And you want to cry

[dusk stone]

well at least ansurek respected your time

idk thats actually better boss design if one of the walls of the fight is right at the start

especcially in mythic

[keen dome]

it didn't!

[runic trail]

95℅ of wipes are people touching the pops when they shouldn't be

[keen dome]

Yeah

[bleak night]

touching the nipple too early

unlucky

[keen dome]

Or in week 1 being hit by anything in P1 'cos it one-shot you more or less

[dusk stone]

also

[keen dome]

the waves did INSANE damage haha

[dusk stone]

parsing heroic this tier is for some reason giga easy

i got a 90 from that 1 pull and it was nothing special

could not get a single parse last tier to save my life

[bleak night]

i missed the amp phase on dimensius entirely and parsed 90

you sub gamers need to step it up

[dusk stone]

i dont get it

last tier was way worse, it was hard to get like a 60 or 70

dont think ive improved that dramatically, but the renown bug may just have ruined that as well

[keen dome]

I parsed 45 lmao

[dusk stone]

i think the meta strat is just to 18 stack on burn phase

[keen dome]

I need multiple kills to do good damage

[dusk stone]

i got a 99.7 on plexus

[keen dome]

And also not be raid leading

[bleak night]

yeah raid leading pugs is giga debuff to any type of dps

[keen dome]

I also just fixate on mechanics to the detriment of my DPS

Which is very helpful for killing stuff in a pug early on but not for damage

Compared to my rekills on normal

[dusk stone]

yo the hell, my plexus sentinel got deleted?

i was 4th on the table and its gone

[bleak night]

unethical pi gaming perhaps

[haughty mural]

[keen dome]

We had this Hunter throwing a wobbler about a Shammie DPS on my SaladbarH kill. How he was low iLevel, doing bad damage. Hunter, naturally, was the reason we'd wiped. And the Shaman was there for all 4 pulls, played mechanics properly and boss died

People fixate so much on DPS in pugs and have zero awareness of why you wipe lmao

[haughty mural]

Ego is a problem in all of online gaming nowadays

Wow is no difference

[bleak night]

i intentionally do things to fuck over other dps so i look better on meters

[bleak night]

like stand on casters with mechanics so they have to move

[dusk stone]

why are all of my logs gone?

[bleak night]

[keen dome]

My hero

[dusk stone]

i hate WCL, i go to personal logs and i can't find any of my stuff, but i found my plexus

[cursive vapor]

whats the optimal remaining cd from flag/blades to stop using dance/symbols?

[dusk stone]

depends on the environment

in keys you have more CDR

[tulip gorge]

after using flag/blades you basically have 2 dance windows to use

[cursive vapor]

~ 20 sec maybe? in m+

[tulip gorge]

then you have to hold

[dusk stone]

for raid i stop at like 30, in keys its as low as 20

[cursive vapor]

ye

thought so

[dusk stone]

i dont like 20 though, and i swear raid was more like 40 last tier

[pastel tapir]

im looking at a season2 sub guide, has anything changed going into season 3 about st or multitarget rotation?

[dusk stone]

yes, 4p

we get an additional coup that can be used within 5 seconds of the first coup, and inside of shadow blades or 7+ targets you use storm once to not waste escalating blade

the wowhead guide should be up to date

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[alpine raft]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[dusk stone]

rip, no 13's at this hour, big sadge

[rapid forum]

you're raid leading as sub rog? 💀

[keen dome]

Yes

Sub is extremely good for it

[rapid forum]

except you only see boss butt

[bleak night]

only need to focus for like 15 seconds every 90s

ez

[keen dome]

If you only see the boss butt you should probably zoom your camera out

[rapid forum]

na why

im not raidleading

[half dragon]

anyone happen to know how to sim the antenna nerf?

[short radish]

Astral Antenna crit nerfed by 3%

override.spell_data=effect.1229154.coefficient=1.46636

Screams of a forgotten sky On-death damage buffed by 15%

override.spell_data=effect.1230276.coefficient=150.742

Perfidious Projector buffed by 10%

override.spell_data=effect.1231013.coefficient=1216

Naazindhri’s Mystic Lash buffed by 15%

override.spell_data=effect.1230671.coefficient=28.265

Gigazap’s Zap-Cap buffed by 15%.

override.spell_data=effect.1204552.coefficient=4.6985

Gigazap's Zap-Cap ICD reduced to 0.5s (was 0.75s)

override.spell_data=spell.1219103.internal_cooldown=500

hmm

yeah that works

[turbid edge]

Is sub the go-to rogue spec now for higher m+ keys like 14+?

I'd like to just hard swap and recraft my gear

[upbeat sorrel]

fortunately dont have to recraft much

the embellish only gives like 5-6k over the ass ones

[short radish]

just replace anything with haste

to be not haste

and your egood

[turbid edge]

Sweet. Is anyone following the higher rogue m+ pushers? Is that the trend where they're swapping from sin to sub, or is it just swapping to sub for streets and dawn?

[half dragon]

where would i enter that, havent used overrides before

[short radish]

advanced options below or something

[calm lion]

Is there ever a scenario where we send symbols and ST without SD? I've been holding to sync all 3 up, but I feel like my DPS is lacking

Because "when possible" suggests it can be OK to not wait for dance

[vagrant thorn]

btw for questions like this you can run a patchwerk sim and just look at what the bot presses and then ask yourself why

🙂

[lusty epoch]

If you ever get 3 stacks up of SoD, then yes. It kinda depends from fight to fight.

Holding sod or sd is never a dps loss unless it's capped

[haughty rose]

so no matter the amount of mobs i always use 2x coup when it proccs instead of BP with 4 set right?

[tepid trellis]

yes

always consume coups

[calm lion]

My bad, figured this was the other trusted sources to ask!

[haughty rose]

ok ty.

another quick question: in m+ do i use netherprism with every blades or am i supposed to safe it?

[calm lion]

Okay, thanks! Maybe I just gotta get used to holding a bit more between CDs, cuz my initial DPS is great, but I fall of hard(er than I think is reasonable). It's a learning curve

[acoustic matrix]

Is it a big deal if I change target mid burst ?

[lusty epoch]

I often find myself doing like

Flag
2 dance+sod
1 sod+tec (if fight allows)
Flag
1 dance+sod
1 sod+tec

Play around with it! Dummies are your friends! 😉

[calm lion]

I am playing as hard as I can, coach Thanks for the feedback!

[keen dome]

Reemmeber to hit the buttons harder to do more dps

very important

[lusty epoch]

I guess the only downside would be that your target does not have find weakness? So if you swap and use shadowstrike as your first attack it would be no difference

[acoustic matrix]

Aight, just wanted to make sure ty !

Freak me the moment I start enjoying sub I get signet

Playing with a 2 minutes on use feels so bad

[random comet]

Go grab the pvp 1min trinket, pretty easy

Join a warcrate group and get your 700 conq in like an hour maybe

[mint swift]

Can confirm this is true

[random comet]

Still not ideal but probably better that priory

[mint swift]

The more broken keycaps the better

Also curious is sub still sometimes sending danceless symbols

[hidden jasper]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[vale pine]

Oh yes, and press jump when you got nothing else to do

[keen dome]

100%

It's important to stay limber for movement

[mint swift]

Nono

[summer peak]

hey guys, does anyone know why this doesnt work. i sometimes press it twice and uses SOD twice. (i only use for opener / 3 mins CDS

/cast [stance:0] Shadow Dance
/USE Tempered Potion
/castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null /cqs
/cast [known:The First Dance] Backstab

[mint swift]

You also need to mash movement keys in stealth pre pull

Mainly A and D

Idk why but I do this on rogue much more than hunter

Although when my meds have worn off and I’m playing BM, I’m running around like I’m full on caffeine every pull

[keen dome]

just rogue things

[mint swift]

Yea
Maybe it’s the S+ tier female goblin sneak anim

The most cartoonish one possible

[keen dome]

Goblin sneak animation is the best in wow

[small crag]

How does the 1 min pvp trinket compare to lily? pvp one better?

[keen dome]

PvP is 17k agility, whereas Lily is static agi and 8k mastery buff

You can sim to compare.

It's probably going to depend on your specific gear more than an either / or "yes better"

[vale widget]

If you check logs and how the sim goes, you will see its common to do at least 1 ST between cds, and that 2/3 of times with SD and SoD
Sometimes, only with SoD, sometimes with any cds
The thing is always not overcap SoD/SD charges, not hold too much ST, and if theres 30 secs or less for Flag+SB, then hold it because you will always want to do the double opener sequence on that window

After understand that tonight, things went better

[small crag]

gotcha. Just coming over to dabble from assassination, so already have the lily.

Let me see if I can try to test a trinket I dn't have in my sims

[keen dome]

You can add it via top gear

[small crag]

Do you guys have the name of it?

[small crag]

thanks!

[summer peak]

hey guys, can anyone answer this? really stuck 🙁

[calm lion]

Yeah, I definitely think I am holding ST too much, and then I overcorrect and start getting my CDs misaligned. It's 99% a skill issue 😄 Thanks!

[small crag]

ugh i suck at this - it's not letting me upgrade it

[random comet]

I’d expect Lilly to be better yeah, plus the PvP one caps out at 704 (8/8 champ)

[summer peak]

upgrade the ilvl at the top when chooseing the item.

[small crag]

ahh ok thanks

[summer peak]

there is a dropdown with ILVL and stats

you might see like Crit/master

then next to that

[small crag]

Sweet, running now. Thanks guys

[summer peak]

your welcome mate

[random comet]

Also the conq gear has a bunch of vers/x gear, can be a good gap filler for sub if you’re still gearing

[torn dove]

haven't touched sub in a long time. can you still play sword offhand?

[astral axle]

no

[sacred magnet]

Is there a way to macro in the same macro both tempered potion from guild cauldron and the personal ones?

[small crag]

yeah so might as well just chill with the lily

[random comet]

That sounds about right

[bleak night]

Pretty sure if you just put the fleeting potion first it'll prio using that

Then use the normal tempered if you don't have any fleeting

[runic trail]

If you have a /use fleeting tempered potion then after that a /use tempered potion you'll be fine

[round latch]

bis trinket fr fr

[sacred magnet]

Oh thanks! Ill try it tonight 🙂

[acoustic matrix]

It sims higher than my Pacemake

[shadow snow]

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[fierce kite]

Hello team, can you tell me from which point there are diminishing returns on mastery and versatility? And at what point should we start focusing on critical strike instead? Should we completely switch to crit once the caps are reached

[mighty citrus]

dont overcomplicate it

use the robot to tell you what gear is good

[runic trail]

The answer is to sim really

[mighty citrus]

it makes it quite simple

[runic trail]

Feed data to robot, look at what gives you the bigger number, equip that.

[keen dome]

Sim and don't worry about it.

[runic trail]

Life is simpler this way

[fierce kite]

OK no problem. And for mythic + i sim with dungeon slice? its good? Or we do patchwerk with multitarget?

[runic trail]

Dungeonslice

[keen dome]

Dungeon Slice, yeah.

It's very good for rogue. Patchwerk multitarget is a terrible sim choice in general because there's no fight like that.

[fierce kite]

Ok thank you 🙂

[deep ferry]

what do you think guys, will we be fucked soonish?

cant wait to see the classchanges

any mods ready to close the discord channel

[keen dome]

We're good and will remain good

[mighty citrus]

ST i dont consider us really good, nor target switching like on loomi 😄

but i mean its fine overall right

you cant be best in everything

[clever holly]

I just showed our raid lead my dmg outside cds now I don't have to do anything

[half dragon]

how much better is double on use for this raid as sub compared to antenna and prism?

[tribal blade]

simmed difference isn't substantially different

but i suppose in practice fight dependent can be better or worse

[half dragon]

well the sims arent really relevant since the bosses have amp phases

[tribal blade]

double on use allows you to fully stack prism without having cd sets with no on use trinket

if you play passive+prism if you want to fully stack prism for an amp you have to do a cd set with nothing

[half dragon]

well obviously

[tribal blade]

and i guess you have all the answers already

[tepid bluff]

!mistakes

[wicked jolt]

Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:

• Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
• Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
• Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
• If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/i've-never-been-here-before-marshall-lawson-territory-it's-my-first-time-here-sam-corlett-gif-1587921523140068275

[random star]

wow, sub is very behind sin in single target

it seems to be doing fine in m+

[lilac stag]

It’s almost like the spec isn’t tuned around ST damage.

[random star]

sin seems to be tuned for everything though

[lilac stag]

It’s not

It has 2 functioning hero trees

[weary crystal]

!sod

[wicked jolt]

Macro to prevent accidental uses of extra charges: #showtooltip Symbols of Death /castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null /cqs

[weary crystal]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
It is not recommended to macro most cooldowns, including Cold Blood+Secret Techniques and Dance+Symbols.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key.

[lilac stag]

so where we used to be good ST dmg in 90 second CDs, they has been taken over by a fixed fetebound assa tree

[keen dome]

How's the dog training travelling going for you, Scath? I hope it's all good.

[lilac stag]

Off to Ohio this weekend.

[keen dome]

Hell yeah, I hope it's a smooth trip

[lilac stag]

me too. Slammed all my keys yesterday.

[haughty mural]

If I wanna travel to the us I would like to visit cinci in ohio

[keen dome]

Blasting

[lilac stag]

Ohio sucks.

Just an fyi.

[haughty mural]

While traveling ?

[limpid sage]

antenna people

how often do you miss the orb

[lilac stag]

Traveling, Human Rights, boredom. Armpit of America

[haughty mural]

Id love to tell you but Im pretty certain I’ll get prism and forge before I will ever get an antenna in raid

Everyone and their pets rolling on it

[haughty mural]

I see

[native zodiac]

Realy depends on the fight, ive seen up to 40% on some fun fights on logs

[lilac stag]

It was a 14 hour drive from where I’m at near Chicago to the eastern part of Pennsylvania.

Indiana and Ohio are absolutely brutal to drive through. Zero elevation changes. Nothing but farm fields, cops and construction. PA is a nice, but expensive drive through mountains.

[swift tinsel]

Indiana is the literal worst

[bleak night]

there are worse

[swift tinsel]

Esp if you have to go through Gary

[bleak night]

trust me

[haughty mural]

Damn that sounds rough.
Did you drive alone ?

[bleak night]

gary

[lilac stag]

Me and the doggo

[haughty mural]

Adorable

[swift tinsel]

Gary Indiana is a post-apocalyptic wasteland

[keen dome]

😻

[haughty mural]

[swift tinsel]

Wisco isn’t much better but the Driftless Area is nice

[limpid sage]

40% missing the orb?

[lilac stag]

and if you’re near Chicago the traffic is bumper to bumper nearly all day it seems in both Indiana and Chicago.

[limpid sage]

Or 40% uptime on the buff

[swift tinsel]

Yeah I avoid Chicago if I can whenever I drive south

[lilac stag]

You can at least get cheese

[swift tinsel]

Yeah fresh curds are top tier so it’s a silver lining if living here

Same with some of the breweries lol

[lilac stag]

The cheese ain’t that good

[swift tinsel]

Plus Culver’s

[frail island]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lilac stag]

the event in PA I was at had Wounded Warriors serving meals. On god it was the best grilled cheese I’ve ever eaten in my life.

idk if it was the love put into it for her lost son or the cheese but it was insane.

[tribal blade]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/3wmrOdqIfZk

[native zodiac]

Yeah, that was an extreme example though, the norm is prob 10% just going off frac logs

Realy depends on the fight, something like soul hunters will make you lose a lot more orbs

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/vinni-lock-stock-and-two-smoking-barrels-smash-door-smashing-gif-17640946

[tribal blade]

another classic one

do you know the story behind that scene

it's pretty legendary

[lilac stag]

Two very good movies

outside of the movie context, or?

https://tenor.com/view/snatch-turkish-five-minutes-5-minutes-two-minutes-gif-14210052574209496469

[tribal blade]

hold up trying to find it

hrm i can't find it that's weird

[hasty oasis]

Hey guys, I have this maccro, but my BP does want to fire, its okay for the Coup de Grace but not BP, can you help me ?

[slate lantern]

Black power

[hasty oasis]

#showtooltip
/use [known:Coup de Grace]Coup de Grace;Black Powder

My maccro was like this

[tribal blade]

a long time ago i read that vinnie jones had just been released from prison the day before they filmed that scene, and he went straight to the set and did the scene with so much real anger and rage that the entire production staff shit their pants @lilac stag

[dreamy olive]

is dungeon slice good choice for sim sub?

[lilac stag]

yeah I had heard that one. he really blurred the lines of real and acting anger

[limpid sage]

oh damn - the orb is really that slow?

[vale pine]

!loot

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/475024539693219850/1406266615619784765/suble.webp

[tribal blade]

makes sense with who he is 😉

[weak flame]

do we have a weak aura showing the "cast time" of coup de grace

[bleak night]

the orb is reasonably fast but it just goes to near where you were when it spawned, it wont follow you at all if you move away

[short aurora]

can i somehow sim a netherprism with fullstacks?

so essentialy a stacked netherprism cd?

[bleak night]

so on fights with movement you can just run away from it and never pick it up if you arent specifically looking for it

[hazy breach]

Thats what it is doing by default

[bleak night]

and if you are specifically looking for it you can go to pick it up and die like firedup did a few times

[hazy breach]

Unless you mean starting with maxxed out

[short aurora]

ye

thats what i meant

so i can compare a cd with netherprism and forge

[lilac stag]

I’ve got a 24x36 poster print of this framed in one of the room.

[short aurora]

and so on

[lilac stag]

Did it switch from every 90? I hadn’t noticed.

[tribal blade]

oh i meant to check can you vanish the interrogation on 1st boss of streets or will it recast on someone else

been too scared to test it

[hazy breach]

Its barely any different, just makes lining up other on-uses easier

In the sim that is

[hazy breach]

Recast

But cloak works

[tribal blade]

yeah cloak def works

would be sick if combat drops did too

[keen dome]

Yeah, it'll recast. I may have killed a friend by vanishing on it.

[lilac stag]

@tribal blade rio by spec check

[keen dome]

our hero

sub stronk strong

[tribal blade]

i am getting the feeling sin might be better in some keys though

but i'm going full send with sub atm

but the bugs on sin atm are absolutely gross, sub level type bugs going on

[keen dome]

It's their turn to be buggy

[tribal blade]

some of the bugs are really bad lol

like criminally bad

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/fight-it-resist-stay-strong-taken-a-hold-of-you-mr-frodo-gif-26956441

[bleak night]

ive actually been playing sub mainly in keys this season instead of assa just because its more fun

what a time to be alive

[tribal blade]

trueee

[bleak night]

[tribal blade]

yeah it's nice being able to do dmg when it's just a solo boss

[fallen crescent]

U know what would be crazy

That sub overperforms then blizz nerfs them and assa was never bbad gets bug fixed plus another aura buff and becomes even more meta.

[bleak night]

good thing sub isnt overperforming

so our victim fantasy doesnt have to play out

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/fantasy-island-gif-13861761976175647738

[fallen crescent]

Welome nice

[bleak night]

welome

[keen dome]

It's a real good season for Sub

[tribal blade]

it could be sub early season scaling things

[fallen crescent]

Mhm

[tribal blade]

and then we even out as the season progresses

[keen dome]

Nah, sub season

purple until midnight

then midnight? sub expansion

sadly it then take sa turn for the worst and it's outlaw for last titan

[fallen crescent]

They should make sub void themed

[lilac stag]

DH expansion. remember they got kyveza

[bleak night]

oh ye

[tribal blade]

imagine if they give us combo back

[keen dome]

We're getting our tank spec in midnight

[bleak night]

when did they change shadowblades from vague purple fart clouds around our hands to sparkly void fart clouds around our hands

[keen dome]

The only way we're getting combo back is if one of us ends up at blizzard

[bleak night]

i can never see my character in combat so i didnt notice it until recently

[lilac stag]

dont wish that voodoo on anyone in here

[fallen crescent]

What is combo? I’ve seen it mentioned but i do not know

[bleak night]

shuriken combo

[keen dome]

I'd do it if I could do it from the UK.

[bleak night]

just made evis do more damage after you used shuriken storm

[bleak night]

was subs funnel back in the zul days

[tribal blade]

% used to be higher iirc

[keen dome]

They changed it because we broke a boss

[tribal blade]

like 10%

[keen dome]

And then they had to nerf the boss a few days later

[plucky parrot]

shuriken combo with nimble

[lilac stag]

was also subs demise

[plucky parrot]

[tribal blade]

yeah combo would pair with nimble very well

[plucky parrot]

watch as I kill my own funnel

[tribal blade]

combo with coup

jesus

[plucky parrot]

[fallen crescent]

First mythic tier i did and was assa rogue and got asked to play sub in zul XD

[keen dome]

coupbo

[plucky parrot]

let's be real, it probably wouldn't interact with coup for atleast a patch

[tribal blade]

lol true that is our trademark

[lilac stag]

it would interact, but only the shadow dmg part of coup

[plucky parrot]

inb4 it's optimal to cancelaura escalating blades (idet you can) for better funnel

very nice

[tribal blade]

nah it would still be better to press coup over evis even if it didn't nimble

sorry didn't benefit from combo

[plucky parrot]

yeah yeah I'm just memeing

just mentally preparing myself for a nice set of goremaw apex talents

[tribal blade]

don't will it into reality

[lilac stag]

bring back legion gorwmaw and weaponmaster and lets go

[tribal blade]

suppress it in a deep and dark place

WM interacting with storm would be awesome

[plucky parrot]

if they can make goremaws go crazy style with 4 talent points

I'm down

[lilac stag]

the shit we have now are not even the same talents

travestly what theyve done

[plucky parrot]

tbh it'll probably be sec tech blades or dance, but I'd like for them to try and spice things up a bit

as much as I enjoy current sub

[tribal blade]

the best one to me is the arc backstab has had since 2004

it went from being a nuclear button

to doing literally nothing

it's really quite impressive to take rogue's most iconic spell and turning it into something everyone universally hates

[lilac stag]

blizzard rogue dev doing blizzard rogue dev things

[keen dome]

Gloomblade baseline, Posion toggle, combo back, ky'veza animations

Vote for me

[lilac stag]

I miss you sephuz

[swift tinsel]

Prism talent

Cannot forget

[keen dome]

Oh yeah, Prism talent

Coup talent

[swift tinsel]

Also remove armor from pve

[keen dome]

Delete FW and put DB where it is

[tribal blade]

true they should lean more into shadow dmg

[swift tinsel]

Or gloomblade tbh

So it’s effectively baseline

[lilac stag]

all dmg during dance is shadowdmg

[swift tinsel]

Been begging for that

[plucky parrot]

surely they bake double coup into the new hero talent column they're adding

[lilac stag]

but theyd fuck up all the coding

[plucky parrot]

sec > coup > coup just feels so right

[tribal blade]

oh interesting, my idea was all dmg during blades would be shadow dmg

[runic trail]

What is your stance on the invasion of rogue territory by the demon hunters?

I need to know your policies

[lilac stag]

turn flag into prism

make dance matter mor

[runic trail]

Are you a tyrant we can trust?

[keen dome]

I'm allowing it but if you use that spec, it makes sure your transmog is incoherent and ugly

It has to be accurate to Adarus

[runic trail]

Hmm.

[keen dome]

It'll be one of the spec passives

"Too edgy to dress self"

[runic trail]

I'll allow it

[swift tinsel]

Lol every time you log in it dresses you in a random appearance in each slot

[keen dome]

That said I do think it looks pretty inventive and it IS a ranged spec, more or less

So they didn't just do purple havoc

[bleak night]

well except for the meta

[keen dome]

It's filling a niche the spec doesn't have. It's as expected

[bleak night]

the meta is just purple havoc

[keen dome]

lmao yeah

[bleak night]

[swift tinsel]

And purple eye beam

[bleak night]

and purple hunt

[plucky parrot]

and spirit bomb

[bleak night]

but we love purple so its ok

[keen dome]

Spirit bomb is cool

[plucky parrot]

can't forget spirit bomb

[keen dome]

https://tenor.com/view/genki-dama-spirit-bomb-goku-gif-12526925

[bleak night]

i hope its more like hunter than a caster

[plucky parrot]

I hope it hits like a freight train

[keen dome]

Goku's ultimate attack of "The really slow moving giant orb"

[bleak night]

but im afraid its just a mage that happens to have a melee combo

[plucky parrot]

same

[bleak night]

stupid fucking wizards

[keen dome]

Yeah, same

[swift tinsel]

Red mage from ffxiv

[bleak night]

yeah thats what i was hoping for

[keen dome]

Red Mage is what I'm expecting them to emulate

[plucky parrot]

yeah rdm is my hope for the spec

[keen dome]

Since there's nothing in woW quite like it

[bleak night]

doesnt seem to be that based on what they said

but god would i love it

[frank crescent]

What is the "(20 seconds)" about with SoD? Surely it doesn't mean to use it 20 second before pull as the buff only lasts 10 seconds?

[keen dome]

Alpha is in a few weeks

[plucky parrot]

I feel like that's everyone's sentiment who even know what rdm is haha

[keen dome]

Maybe I get invited again

[swift tinsel]

Yeah which I think is a cool concept for a damage dealer

[proven plover]

u do

[plucky parrot]

like I'm ok to cast

[proven plover]

its because u keep the supercharger cps

[plucky parrot]

but I'd like options for instant casts

[bleak night]

i would actually swap instantly if its even remotely similar to red mage gameplay

[plucky parrot]

and if I need to plant to launch a spirit bomb

that's fine once in a while

[frank crescent]

Okay, thanks!

[lilac stag]

they could make a choice node. edge of night or combo

[hazy breach]

You dont need to do it 20s before pull

[plucky parrot]

but if meta isn't as much of a focus for the melee hybrid build

[hazy breach]

you can do it 10 minutes before pull

They dont have a duration

[plucky parrot]

I wonder where the damage is mainly going to come from

[swift tinsel]

I’d assume that big finisher spell they said was gonna get the crit modifier

Idr what it’s called

[bleak night]

spirit bomb

(collapsing star)

[swift tinsel]

Bc they’re forced to iterate on our hero/spec trees I’m curious what/how the apex sub talents will be by launch

[bleak night]

wait isnt spirit bomb literally a vengeance spell

this joke doesnt work

[swift tinsel]

Yeah

And AR doesn’t even use it

[plucky parrot]

yeah for the caster build it makes sense, because it's supposed to do more damage the longer you stay in meta and the more times you cast it

but if meta uptime isn't the focus of the hybrid build

I'm guessing it'll be a smaller portion of your damage

[swift tinsel]

They make it sound like void form

[plucky parrot]

ye

[swift tinsel]

With souls instead of void bolts

[bleak night]

or breath

[swift tinsel]

Ye

[bleak night]

its just old breath where you perma kept it up with runic power

[swift tinsel]

New breath goated tho I’m a fan

[bleak night]

which im not a fan of that type of gameplay

[keen dome]

I hope they give us Velf DHs in lemix

[bleak night]

and they keep removing/changing it every time they add it

so idk

surely this time it works though

[swift tinsel]

I liked the empower iteration personally

[graceful osprey]

Sub rogue apex ability will be a bigger black powder called, void powder. Deals omega massive damage and causes a dot on all targets hit. When the dot expires, it casts a black powder.