subtlety

[young mural]

ive never seen a large queue when i used to have premium

max was like 20 idk

[warm marlin]

the traffic right on reset is like 100x any other time of the week

[vale pine]

^

reset and especially content release

like next tuesday

or wed

[young mural]

lol im fucked

gotta get my sub back up before next week

[keen dome]

The first vault opening after the first week of the season is always funny

[vale pine]

tho i don't think we reach a high this xpac

just simply because wow is in a dying state to word it more severe than it is

xpac releases just have he highest amount of players total

and it falls off for in between patches

[keen dome]

Seasonal decline

[vale pine]

yes

season 2, 3 and 4 is always less players

[young mural]

fuu, is it normal for shuriken tornado to sim 5% extra compared to replicating shadows on dslice? does dslice have bigger pulls?

[vale pine]

it is why blizz wants to move to a 1 year xpac release cycle

[vale pine]

yes

i mean 5% not

[young mural]

yes to both? lol

[vale pine]

but 2% i think was the diffrence when i did a sim

[young mural]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/kCiGpX9qDqG8yJcWSWj4hq

[keen dome]

While true, I think TWW will show higher retention than prior ones. Def not seen, personally, the gulfs of nobody around this expansion

[vale pine]

tornado just fits better with the fight style

[young mural]

i have old and new builds

with and without tornado

[young mural]

ah gotcha

thats what i was wondering

[vale pine]

but you can switch between replicating/tornado depending on dungeon

more aoe heavy -> tornado

cleave -> replicating

[young mural]

ah gotcha

ill do that

[vale pine]

i did switch wowhead/pin talent to replicating because a lot of pulls will be small first weeks

[wild vine]

I wouldnt call it funny

[young mural]

makes sense

ill play around with it

[vale pine]

There is a good reason DF and TWW have higher player retention

[young mural]

im interested in some rotational change, cant stand doing it all the exact same way for 2 patches

[vale pine]

Blizz basically learned from mobile games, and implemented retention mechanism in the game

[wild vine]

Id be interested to see how the early access to housing (unless I heard that wrong) might impact that towards the end of the season

[keen dome]

ALL. CLOAKS

[keen dome]

I imagine it's coming in the pre-patch. It's, to me, the same as early access to evoker, etc.

[vale pine]

I don't know tbh. Housing is a thing many will be very loud about, but i feel like a big majority won't care about

e.g. i know a few people who play ffo

and none of them is talking about housing

[wild vine]

For me its always all wrists

[keen dome]

I'm waiting to get the haste/versa floodgate dagger from my first M+10 vault. agani.

[wild vine]

Idk it sounded like it might be earlier, since its with pre order

[young mural]

theyre for sure gonna drop me a tier piece or trinket

[keen dome]

It just states "early acces" though

[young mural]

btw, any new delve trinkets this season? didnt see anyone talking about that

[wild vine]

That could also be true, but it has that "new" factor, so it might atleast draw quite some people in on release

[keen dome]

Housing is gonna be huge

[young mural]

oh damn no more delve trinkets?

nvm

im going insane

[wild vine]

Both makes sense, I feel like prepatch would be rather late, but it would require some way to access a new zone ig

[bleak night]

access will probably just be from org/stormwind

[keen dome]

Elwynn / Durotar, yeah

My guess is.. Legion Remix in December. Pre-patch late January. late March expansion

[bleak night]

everyone has said very good things about housing so im expecting it to be terrible

[young mural]

all i want is to live in goldshire..

but thats not going to happen

[keen dome]

I can't have a house in tazavesh so it's terrible

[vale pine]

basically its like this:

• What was previously one content release is now split out or time gated(e.g. weekly caps), so there is longer time you need to stay with the game to get the same benefits.
• Content releases are spaced out so you always have a reason to stay subscribed, couple it with bonus rewards if you buy for multiple months in advanced.
• The trading post is basically a "battle pass" light, you need to log in and play at least a few hours each month to complete
• They removed 1 month game time option, so you need to buy 2 months --- which is roughly the time between content releases.
  Blizz on top off that inreased the baseline game price which is now 90$ per xpac instead of 60$ by adding perks like early access and they iirc try to bring xpac cycles down to 12-16 months instead of 2 years.

[vale pine]

possible

[wild vine]

Thats kinda early for prepatch tbf

[young mural]

oh wow, I hadnt ever thought about trading post as a battle pass

thats literally it

thats where they got the idea from

[keen dome]

Ye, my gut feeling is a longer pre-patch due to housing but I dunno.

[keen dome]

Yes, it's a better application of the typical battle pass.

Because it's a 'perk' fo your subscription. It's a retention method, but a good way of designing one.

[young mural]

yhea agreed

[keen dome]

Because it's something you naturally complete, and is given as part of your natural subscription to the title instead of extra.

[young mural]

they need to do more positive incentives to keep a sub going, like the trading post and not timegate the fuck out of content

if thats their main goal

[wild vine]

I actually very much liked the garrison setting. Having the option to just place it in a zone you like would be pretty cool

[haughty mural]

@keen dome btw more and more animations are added to the toy model - we are getting the race soon

[wild vine]

(limited to the current relevant zones)

[young mural]

😭

[keen dome]

Yeah, I really liked the OG Garrison design idea even if it simply couldn't work. Tazavesh would make a cool house location.

[haughty mural]

Esp for the new race

[young mural]

whats coming sooner, playable etherals or void DH

[keen dome]

But I think they're going to be careful and keep it to locations they'll never narratively impact. I.e., before TWW I'd have said: Dalaran would've been a great housing place.

[keen dome]

I pushed Adarus into space, he's dead

[young mural]

Hm....

[bleak night]

the fate that will befall anyone with as bad a transmog as him

[haughty mural]

void DH won’t come.. we are getting that shit

[keen dome]

Etheals are most likely than a void DH spec

[young mural]

LMAO

[wild vine]

Just have every new zone come with like 5 spots to place your house, get asked where you want to place it after the mainstory and make it so you can place your hearthstone there

[keen dome]

Hell yeah

[young mural]

i need retroactive support

i need to live in goldshire

[keen dome]

You can go do that anyway

Nobody will stop you

[young mural]

dude

i dont play in moonguard

[sour forum]

i mainly raid log and do my weekly m+, what do they expect me to do with housing 😢

[keen dome]

Cross-realm groups are a thing. House share!

[keen dome]

nice place to queue idle

[sour forum]

how about some more bosses or dungeons

[young mural]

lol

[vale pine]

It depends on the perspective you use

[sour forum]

would be just a square cba with furniture and stuff

this tier i dont know if i cba to farm rep for infinite aug rune

[wild vine]

Thats alright because not every type of content needs to be for everyone

[hardy egret]

!coup

[wicked jolt]

Coup de Grace Optimizations:

• **Number 1: **You can stop using (non maintenance) finishers ~10 seconds before your 90 sec cooldowns come up.
• Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades, if you get the 4 set buff, you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
• Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.

[sour forum]

yea but "my type of content" got slashed the past 2 expansions

less bosses

[vale pine]

think it makes sense

[sour forum]

less tiers per expac (but lets say they release sooner...-ish)

[vale pine]

if they want to shorten release cycles

like e.g. lets say they aim for 14 months cycles

they likely miss because thats a drastic reduction

but we possibly still see 16-18 months

instead of up to 24

[wild vine]

Idk, felt better than before tbf, even if I didnt like some themes

[vale pine]

There is a limit of the amount of content blizz can produce and it showed every time they tried to increase it and failed

[sour forum]

my bet is, this tier last 6 months like the others, so we'll be done in february, then queue the fated season for another 3-4 months, release midnight early summer

[vale pine]

so there needs to be some cuts

but shortening a xpac, means more money

because you get the 90$/60$ more frequently

even tho the content amount is the same

[sour forum]

i dont mind at this point in my life if they ask for more money from me, its ok as long as i get the stuff i want

but i feel like im getting less stuff (that i care about)

[bleak night]

ngl ive still never gotten the hatred of fated seasons

like i get if you just dont like the gimmick

but we arent losing a tier to fated, the time fated has taken up would always just have been literally nothing

[sour forum]

dungeons are now 3 bosses most of the time, raids are 8 bosses, its true they made 2 new dungeons but the mega dungeons got scraped for this expansion

[keen dome]

I bet you 5 gold we don't get a fated season, becaus Legion Remix will carry it over.

[vale pine]

well the problem with fated is, you essentially have no content for a certain period

[bleak night]

people seem to think that we get fated instead of a season 4

[wild vine]

Imo its just a cheap way to make an expac last longer, because its just recycled content

[bleak night]

we always have no content for a certain period

[vale pine]

the argument of "its better than nothing" would hold up if the baseline assumption is no content

[wild vine]

There should imo be no fated at all

[bleak night]

end of expansion lulls happen every single time

the fact is no content

[vale pine]

yes

but the baseline

is 4 raids

not 3

so reducing content amount

[bleak night]

but it would legit just be 4 raid tiers and then fated

[vale pine]

and then replacing it with fated

[sour forum]

my main issue is 8 bosses per raid

[bleak night]

4 tiers wasnt replaced by fated, it was replaced by blizzard shortening expansion cycles

[vale pine]

but it wasn't

[bleak night]

(and shadowlands/covid bullshit)

[bleak night]

im saying

[keen dome]

Last time we got 4 tiers was BfA.

[warm marlin]

sotfo

[vale pine]

both xpacs with fated ended up with 3 tiers

[bleak night]

the decision to stop getting 4 tiers

[keen dome]

3 tiers has been the norm for three expansions now

[wild vine]

Fated is still a relatively new thing in the grand scheme. They just replaced a tier

[bleak night]

was because of shortening the time between expansion launches

[sour forum]

3 tiers is here to stay, but how about 10 bosses per raid, even if they are filler

[bleak night]

this is a seperate issue to fated

[bleak night]

10 bosses would go hard

[sour forum]

or do something like 8-9-10

[keen dome]

Fated was an experiment to try and fill the dead time when the majority of people are working on a new expansion, and there's not enough time for a fresh season. I think Remix and TURBO BOOST will be their new go-to

I would like different boss amounts.

[lyric cargo]

Hey guy I might have gotten skiped as there was wall of new comments I have a question again how should I use Shuriken Tornado ? I dont quite get it as I am new to sub 😄 do we use it with SoD or when we low on CB as filler in aoe ? Thanks again

[bleak night]

i mean even if they kept going with this "optional" (but not actually optional) boss scheme

give us a couple extra optional bosses

if they want 8 to stay as the normal raid

[keen dome]

I think using it out of cooldowns as a way to spread rupture and farm cdr is one?

[bleak night]

but 10 boss raids would definitely be nice

[sour forum]

i think ppl like 8, because prog is shorter and a lot more guilds can get CE so in a sense "every1 is happy"

[vale pine]

idk

[keen dome]

I think it's relative, honestly. 8 is probably the easy formula they've found to design consistent bosses with.

[vale pine]

i think the biggest problem of raiding is raid size

[wild vine]

Hopefully. They atleast dont require deeper commitment to recycled content

[keen dome]

Yeah. Remix is an extremely powerful tool because most people will love it.

[vale pine]

having to find 20 resonable players is not easy

[bleak night]

i mean im gonna be honest i dont really think we're getting a fated season this time

[keen dome]

Even if it's old content, it's old enough to be fun, and also a power trip.

[sour forum]

nah, honestly its what makes wow unique, if they went to 10 they'd ruin it imo (speaking of raid size)

[bleak night]

obviously i could be wrong

but i think they just hard force midnight out instead

[wild vine]

Same

[keen dome]

We'll know later this month.

[bleak night]

but then that goes back to fated not being the reason we dont get 4 tiers

but release schedule

[keen dome]

We're gonan get a launch window for Midnight (March 2026 quote meeee)

[vale pine]

mop had 10, and it was one of the best recived xpacs

[keen dome]

MoP had 25, and it was one of the best received expansions

So I agree: Bring back 25-man raiding

[wild vine]

Ye its also just something you can do for fun instead of it forcing you to keep up so your guild doesnt break apart

[keen dome]

[vale pine]

well it had both options

[keen dome]

100%

[sour forum]

i did try FF raiding and it felt kinda bland, maybe its because its a different game altogether, but i think 10 man restricts boss mechanics in a way

like how would u do silken court dispels on top of boss with 10 people?

make just 2 dispels?

[vale pine]

higher amount of players

[bleak night]

i think its hard to compare raid sizes when theres so much else thats fundamentally different with ffxiv and wow raiding

[keen dome]

Ye, agreed.

[bleak night]

i think 10m coming back could work fine in wow

im not particularly invested one way or another in it

[sour forum]

ff raiding is weird anyway. its a game of 1 shots, be where u are supposed to be or die

[keen dome]

It's a very chorographed dance

[sour forum]

well yea

[vale pine]

means 2 things:

1. You can assign more players to do certain things as they are a relative small part of the total
2. You can not design things tightly as the group size and encounter space is limited

also final fantasy class design is a lot less interessting

which is the biggest diffrence

[keen dome]

It's incredibly bland, haha

[sour forum]

ill tell u what it is

boring

[keen dome]

It's really interesting how 14's design is just stagnating to an extreme

[bleak night]

i think the class design is fine fundamentally, they just made the decision to hard shoehorn every single class into a 2m burst window

and its severely limiting what they can do

[keen dome]

Yep

[bleak night]

but they refuse to fix it

[sour forum]

i only played it cuz some friends did aswell, after spending god knows how long in that shit MSQ land (even if u rush and skip everything getting to "current content" nowadays takes like 100 hours)

[keen dome]

Also the quite comical button bloat for bloats sake.

[wild vine]

Imo 16 player for example could work, even if it turns out more difficult than 20, it would atleast let you try at all, but 20 definitely needs to be the most advantageous size

Since thats the intended group size

It atleast means you dont need to cancel a raid if some are missing or smth

[keen dome]

Ye. I mean, I'm also of the mind they need to delete Myth raid lockout and make it work like heroic but this is probably more of a divisive topic than raid size itself.

I think it'd help solve that issue too

[sour forum]

the issue with 20 players is that is restrictive and u gotta follow a schedule, making it unaccesible

[vale pine]

flex would be best

10+ players

and give out a unqiue achivement if you do it with 20

[sour forum]

idk why when that gets brought up every1 counter argues with boosting will be rampant, well it already is

[wild vine]

Flex 16+ wouldve basically been my idea

[vale pine]

hof also only 20

[keen dome]

Yeah.

[wild vine]

It would definitely make mythic way cheaper

[vale pine]

benefit everyone tbh

[leaden prairie]

Imagine 10 with current raid buffs tho

[keen dome]

I could finally assume my final form and be the mythic pug guy

[vale pine]

if people want to buy boosts,

[bleak night]

i mean it could make boosting twice as prevalent and it would still be good for the overall health of the game

[sour forum]

what discord is this again?

[vale pine]

ye.. get rid of raid buffs or allow multiple classes to apply the same one

[sour forum]

im all in for removing lockout

[bleak night]

making the first bosses more accessable to everyone=more people can actually experience the content and potentially get interested in it

[leaden prairie]

I guess it's just m+

Same issues

[bleak night]

10m with raid buffs would be very funny actually

[keen dome]

Ye. We saw an increase in DF in all areas 'cos content was a LOT more accessible (in part due to gearing, etc). And this was good for the game.

[vale pine]

what if i tell you

https://tenor.com/view/the-matrix-morpheus-red-pill-blue-pill-truth-gif-15865648232657580077

[wild vine]

I honestly still dont know why they didnt go with the consumable road completely. Would be just fine if all the actual buffs were scrolls

[vale pine]

that this problem has a solution already

[sour forum]

im actually fine with raid buffs

[vale pine]

and it was in the game

in the form of scrolls/drums

[sour forum]

we had a few shit tiers as rogue where we wouldnt get in

and i yoinked a spot cuz i give the funny dmg reduction

[keen dome]

Yeah. Scrolls / Drums were great.

[wild vine]

You could still have class utility

[sour forum]

i think having 1 of each class in raid is fine

[wild vine]

But atleast not buff based

[sour forum]

there are still like 6-8 flex spots

[vale pine]

raid buffs are a solution to class stacking

[bleak night]

i think its fine in 20m, it just causes issues in m+

or this hypothetical 10m

[vale pine]

its just that some raid buffs are a lot better than others

[sour forum]

yea but 10 man will be the same

if they add scrolls to 10 man, class stacking gallore

[bleak night]

i mean currently you couldnt even fit every class into 10m

[sour forum]

if they keep raid buffs, a few classes have guaranteed spot

[leaden prairie]

I'm still torn on raid buffs

On one hand it's bad

[sour forum]

or all of em

[leaden prairie]

On the other it allows for 2 comps to coexist in m+ kinda?

[sour forum]

allows classes to not be benched if they have a crappy tuned patch let the OTPs play 😂

[vale pine]

you can make it m+ only

[leaden prairie]

Very much kinda tho

[vale pine]

a lot of things don't work in certain content types

[sour forum]

yea thats a good point, m+ should just have scrolls

[vale pine]

or dissable raid buffs outside of raid

which would also be fine

[keen dome]

Add Barry the Buff next to every keystone. When the keystone is in, he goes "It's buffin' time!" and gives you every raid buff for the duration of that M+

he's a kul tiran

[vale pine]

XD

[keen dome]

i've solved it

[sour forum]

u did

now go apply to a blizz job to actually implement it

[keen dome]

They couldn't afford my genius

Or stupidity

[sour forum]

there was a story about a dude, that applied to a game studio, got the job, fixed a bug that annoyed him for years then quit (idk if its confirmed real, but i'd like to think it is)

[tribal blade]

maybe just have every key passively give you 50% effect of every raid buff while it's active

and if you have someone who brings that buff you can overide that one to 100%

[keen dome]

Sorry it has to include a kul tiran in a kilt doing /flex called Barry the Buff otherwise it won't work

[bleak night]

just make keys 20m then you have room for everyone

[tribal blade]

fair enough 😉

[maiden pilot]

Could it be possible that sacbrood isnt simming correct? or can it be that 691 sacbrood is worse than Zee's Thug Hotline 684

[keen dome]

He's integral to the system

[tribal blade]

sacbrood has passive haste

i would assume that's why

[bleak night]

the goon squad is stronk

[sour forum]

fuu never makes mistakes

[tribal blade]

sub REALLY hates haste

[sour forum]

time to regear from assa to sub again

then assa gets buffed 4 weeks in

then i have to regear again

fun times

[keen dome]

Just play Sub

[short radish]

more traumatic than anything

[keen dome]

I crafted a dagger and that's my loot for the week. oh, and some nice boots I guess.

Lily eluded me 🙁

[short radish]

honestly some of these names are so fitting

[upper cosmos]

I've fallen for this so many times

I'm just staying sin this time

[shy scarab]

Just save rings and neck for both specc ez pz

[sour forum]

Its happened 3 times in a row, ammirdrasil (but assa to sub), nerubar and undermine

[bleak night]

just play fatebound and pretend its sub

[sour forum]

Idk man

[bleak night]

damn this goes hard

[keen dome]

it's true

[bleak night]

just edit his face over bernies

[short radish]

oh shit yeah i should do that

[sour forum]

I got a 691 vers/mastery neck from m0s, i simmed on assa vs my current 681 mast/haste or something

Lost 50k dps

[short radish]

need to find his most deranged look

[short radish]

as sub or as assi?

[sour forum]

Will be good on sub tho

[short radish]

wait nvm i can read

yeah

assi doesnt care about stats

[sour forum]

Well it does apparently

50k was the same difference as normal mythic ring vs gallywix ring

[bleak night]

the only reason i can think of for that big of a jump is either your neck has embellishment or you have signet trinket and the new neck fucked up stat prio

[short radish]

yeah 681 sounds like embelishment

[sour forum]

It was crafted but no rmbelish on it

Simmed with house of cards

[wild vine]

Most certainly the Ring or trinket getting scuffed ye

[short radish]

link sim

[wild vine]

No other way

[drifting fable]

!coup

[wicked jolt]

Coup de Grace Optimizations:

• **Number 1: **You can stop using (non maintenance) finishers ~10 seconds before your 90 sec cooldowns come up.
• Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades, if you get the 4 set buff, you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
• Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.

[bleak night]

idk i wont say its impossible it just sounds weird to me

[sour forum]

I will when i get home

[tribal blade]

that or that's the only piece of gear with haste on it

[bleak night]

ye he might have literally no other haste

which if he like sub is possible

[tribal blade]

drop enough haste from sin ST and the sim will start wanting it bad

[sour forum]

Iirc my stats are something like 12k crit, 19-20k mastery, 10k haste, 2-3k vers atm on assa

With no flasks and stuff

yea i cant do it on work PC, doesnt pull my armory and i dont think u can change talents builds either :/

oh wait i have it in history

it was with signet true, but still mastery heavy build

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/1U68JvZUDKJqzAETX2PHur

[bleak night]

well right away

thats not helping

[short radish]

why is that popping up

it was popping up for me when i was trying to run transmitter

[sour forum]

ill take the 1.5k margin

[sour forum]

maybe this

[bleak night]

idk you have plenty of haste in other places

im still wondering why its in low precision mode

[sour forum]

idk i didnt click anything different

i do have the simc input tho, i could try run it again

[bleak night]

that neck has speed btw gimme

olh

one sec

[keen dome]

speed speed speed

[sour forum]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/8kQ9PETF47Cm5jXkG7zgDM same thing, but dps went down by 0.001 somehow tho

[knotty depot]

sacbrood is kinda poop for sub

I got the vers/mastery neck, a vers/mastery ring and the pacemaker, guess it's a pretty good first week

missed the lily but not a bad one.

[bleak night]

i got distracted

idk haste giga i guess

though kind of points to how easy it is to just craft a neck and a ring and swap between sub and assa

[vale pine]

haste can be good if you have none

so its not super terrible

we just don't actively look for it on any piece of gear

agility is still important, so item level always a factor

[sour forum]

now that fuu is here.... do we swap 2p 2p?

[clever delta]

Need tier set sims first

[carmine portal]

For anyone that needs an easy wep upgrade: The Horrific Vision 5-mask vendor has 668 ilvl stuff

[short radish]

yes

[bleak night]

you arent fuu

[short radish]

you dont need to remind me

[sour forum]

what if its fuu's alt account

[alpine wraith]

to add to this if you are a rogue crafting thje 691 this week is fine if gold is not an issue

you can recraft to 720 later

[clever delta]

Already did

[haughty mural]

I hope you didn’t use all of your loot luck in the first week

Be like me - drop nothing worthy 🙂

[slender zodiac]

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[short radish]

entire fucking carasol is full and i cant get on

[native zodiac]

You dont have to get on

Just stand on the carousel

[short radish]

wait what

since when

[alpine wraith]

XD

[slender zodiac]

hi, when should you change your old 4p? is it worth to play 2p+2p?

[bleak night]

[short radish]

[knotty depot]

I probably did...

But since a friend dropped Lily, didn't need it and couldn't trade I think I'm safe

[steel zinc]

Sim it

[void ocean]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WAs's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker
• :skull: Find Weakness target tracker

[void ocean]

ehm i assume we put mastery socket in the cloak?

[clever delta]

Or haste one if you feel fancy today

It cost 100g

[dense forge]

how is sub looking in the new patch

[clever delta]

Very good

[warm marlin]

laugh at this user not using the fancy tailoring ones

[clever delta]

Tailoring one ?

[dense forge]

can it compete against sin for high keys or nah ?

[wheat edge]

workorder fibers from tailors for 600 extra stat

[clever delta]

It's the same one as from vendor right

[hazy breach]

Yes

[wheat edge]

the ones u buy from vendor are worse

[clever delta]

Really

[wheat edge]

good ones

[clever delta]

Alright thanks

[nova cairn]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WAs's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker
• :skull: Find Weakness target tracker

[remote shuttle]

100% agree

[rare shell]

How do we get 8/8 vault this week ?

[short radish]

you can repeat a dungeon

just dont get loot

[rare shell]

do i have to fuck some else loot ?

[short radish]

since its personal loot, no

either they get loot

or they dont get loot

[rare shell]

ok cool thanks

[short radish]

like maybe the boss wont drop loot

which means that you would have gotten it

but you were always going to get it anyway

[carmine portal]

To any of the stat ppl out there, what is it that makes Cursed Stone Idol bad?

[alpine wraith]

it is not bad per se

just overtaken by other trinkets

[carmine portal]

It's just super low down on the list, I'm gna run a few 0's with it and see how I feel I think

[alpine wraith]

same reason forge or lilly are not super bad just worse than prism

it is a bit worse than the pvp trink

[hazy breach]

Well forge is because its 2 min

Lily and cursed just dont give as much stats for their ilvl

Just numbers being low

[dry plank]

Feelcraft in action )

[carmine portal]

I moreso mean compared to what I have VS what is simmed as BIS

[hazy breach]

Its a channel, so its a bit annoying

Cant macro it to blades like the others

[carmine portal]

My thoughts so far: forgot to equip it.

[cursive island]

Is there any way to fit shuriken tornado in our opener ?

I mean as a AOE combo point builder for 4+ targets

[carmine portal]

Atm for 0's I'm kinda just using it on medium/larger pulls where I dont have CDs to farm BPs - Tornado that is

[cursive island]

because im' kinda confused with this line

ST should be use in Symbols but during big CDS ? otherwise as a filler in less that 4 target ? that is how i should understand it ?

[remote shuttle]

Did they change anything about Tornado not interacting in a good way with Shadowcraft?

[hazy breach]

No

[remote shuttle]

Ouch bud

[alpine wraith]

you dont really use tornado on the opener

you use it later to get cdr

[remote shuttle]

Ye as before so

[alpine wraith]

and in between the dungeon to get ruptures up etc too

[remote shuttle]

It still mess stacks for refounds... I see

[remote shuttle]

Ye old DF way

Ty buds

[vale pine]

You use it as a filler but its still strong to use it during symbols on higher target counts

[zealous hedge]

Lowkey love Shuriken tornado glad we use it

[vale pine]

you can use it or skip it

both is fine and replicating migth be better early on when tanks pull small

[zealous hedge]

Haven't done any crazy content yet but in the dungeons I did yesterday it was fun so im enjoying it.

[void ocean]

gotta enjoy the S tier

[vale pine]

subtlety is always S tier

[void ocean]

!tier

this command should return S

!cheese

[wicked jolt]

Pre Pull Cheeses:
Recommended - Supercharge - Using Symbols of Death before pull gives you 2 supercharger charges, this is easy to perform and can be done without any loss given the infinite timer on supercharger.

• Explanation: Only the first 2 stacks of Supercharger don't reset on a boss pull, and you can easily press symbols early enough to have full charges on pull.
  NOT Recommended - Disoriented Strikes - Using Secret Technique gives you disoriented strikes, you can start bosses with the benefits when using Secret before a wipe or on Trash carefully.
• Explanation: Disoriented does not reset on boss pull, but this trick requires a lot of attention and can't be done consistently, so is not recommended.
  Damage Impact: Both Cheeses lead to a bit more than 1% damage gain in a 5 minute Patchwerk simulation.

[tacit maple]

what Brann do you guys use in delves? Just keep it on healer even with 1hour tricks?

[limpid sage]

healer brann is tankier than tank brann for some reason

so ye

[void ocean]

I use Bronzenbeard

[tacit maple]

eww, what a metacuck

[keen dome]

Magni is better

[void ocean]

i think for melee tank Brann is hell

i used it for range tho, when i did delves with mage

but on rogue always heal

[vale pine]

i use healer bran

[carmine portal]

Always dmg brann with the new healing-shield curio

Never dies

[tacit maple]

this is my first tier trying Rogue, going all in on Sub...I was told it was the most difficult and I'm no bitch

[carmine portal]

"Difficult" is not the right word

[tacit maple]

but I am really confused

[carmine portal]

It's all about CD management. Making sure you don't overuse Shadowdance or Symbols outside of your big CDs (Shadow Blades and Flagellation)

You've come to the right place if you're confused 🙂

We're all confused

[keen dome]

It's the best spec becuse it's purple

[vale pine]

thats a good starting point 👍

[keen dome]

I also agree: it's not difficult. It's just got a learning curve and has some complexities. Ask questions, don't be afraid to be confused.

[dire pulsar]

i m on the same board ! Feel like doing a lot of math and learning before being able to pop off 🙂

[bright briar]

that's the fucking attitude i wanna see

[tacit maple]

the most annoying thing for me so far has been tracking Flawless Form and Fazed, I've kinda just been assuming they're always up

[bright briar]

get you a WA and plater to track stuff

[knotty depot]

THIS

[keen dome]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WAs's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker
• :skull: Find Weakness target tracker

[knotty depot]

I'm trying to get used to the cases where we BP now

ANd my head hurts everytime haha

[keen dome]

All of these are fantastic choices to use, or grab stuff from. Incredibly work on them all

[slate lantern]

Also zacs is pretty gud too (dirty outlaw player)

[tacit maple]

Ya I gotta pick a better WA suite, I've tried Quazii, Naowh and Luxthos...but they dont track it super well

I need something to scream at me haha

[knotty depot]

oh the Find Weakness tracker WA looks perfect actually

[slate lantern]

Yeah never use general wa pack makers, they don't know what you need to track

[keen dome]

Using one made by Rogues for Rogues is good 'cos it helps cover the wierd quirks of our spec

[knotty depot]

I do like Luxthos but I make some changes on it usually

[carmine portal]

Luxthos' weakauras are very good to vulture from. I use his resource bars/rune/combopoint bars for every spec

[bright briar]

well gentlemen whats the best WA and plater for rogue then to help this man track

[knotty depot]

I really like his CP and shadow techniques tracker

[tacit maple]

surely its Fuus right? hes the like, THE guy

[keen dome]

Fuu's is very good

The best thing is they're all excellent so you can use the one that appeals to you the most, imo.

[slate lantern]

LE has a banger pack too

Just try out all of the ones in the WA command above and see which you like most

[remote shuttle]

@leaden prairie i'm still using Ur sub Wa pack, Is It up also for s3?

[tacit maple]

oh LE's looks good, it only has all the rotational stuff. I like that, since I track defensives/utility on a sidebar next to party frames

[hazy breach]

I would recommend to not really track those either. Only really tracking when theyre not up

[lilac stag]

She also has everything modular on her Wago page

[hazy breach]

And for fazed specifically only if you have coup ready and fazed isnt up

Since thats the only time it matters if you have fazed or not

[glacial hinge]

Used to use luxthos, now for Sub on a fond of LE,s just works nice

[keen dome]

LE's is excellent and her WA work is absolutely incredible.

If I am ever confused on how to do something, I check how she's done it 'cos it's very clear.

[glacial hinge]

Amen to that, never felt so confortable on a pack

[hazy breach]

A lot of general WA packs track a bunch of unnecessary shit for sub that makes the spec seem way harder to play ye

[knotty depot]

Also I need to bitch once again on thistle tea

Why can't we have a choice node to not have it automatically be used

[hazy breach]

Macro it to dance and forget it exists

[knotty depot]

Yeah on sub it's... okay-ish but I tend to pop it by accident in between CDs

and it feels so bad

On Sin I find it even worse.

[dire pulsar]

i got fragUI, and the rogue ones seems pretty good 🙂

[tribal blade]

at least on sin you will never pop it by accident in aoe

plus playing sin you're not really spamming buttons in ST anyways

[dire pulsar]

Do we have a spreadsheet with all % bonus for 2p and 4p, i see some talking about before but cant find precise info

[leaden prairie]

I haven't played sub but nothing changed for me so idk

Maybe I'm unaware of something tho

[hazy breach]

Its like 10% for 2p, 30% for 2+4p

[leaden prairie]

I updated the ub weak aura

[hazy breach]

For sub

[crystal bone]

30% is nutty

[void ocean]

its perfect, shush

[crystal bone]

[quasi wedge]

guys i can't stealth wth
like not even clicking from spellbook or typing /cast stealth working
if I change to assa or outlaw i can

tried dying and loging out

[cursive island]

yo guy's i got a last concern about rotation, we never use SS during SD eaven with 8+ targets??

[vale pine]

yes

always strike

[crystal bone]

storm only once for FW i believe

[cursive island]

is there a reason or just not worth dps wise

[vale pine]

strike does more damage ^^

and it procs unseen blades

[cursive island]

okay thanks

[lilac stag]

Do you think a bot commmand for what’s actually important WA wise would be useful?

maybe make things less daunting for new to spec

[keen dome]

That would be pretty helpful

"What is worth tracking and why"

[wild vine]

On sin it doesnt even matter

[hazy breach]

Think spriest is still 40%

[knotty depot]

I forget to pool in ST and pop it by accident 😦

[hazy breach]

Blizzard ran out of time to balance some of em

[knotty depot]

It's me being poop

[hazy breach]

Ye but it literally doesnt matter

[knotty depot]

Okay

Wrong emote

[crystal bone]

40%

[hazy breach]

Its always gonna be up for kb/dm anyway because the cd lines up

Sub is every other cd which is a bit unfortunate but it is what it is

If sectech wasnt soft capped at 5 we would play cb everywhere anyway

[alpine wraith]

sec tech is so silly

[haughty mural]

I hope they won’t nerf our tier set

[alpine wraith]

wait until they see our 3 min limit break

to top 5 dps

[mighty delta]

anyone here use a macro for pick pocket? im wondering which ability to put it on - is it typically Sap?

[dapper gyro]

I pick pocket on cd with ambush or wtv is called on sub

I'll get rich

[mighty delta]

ok perf tyty

[tulip gorge]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[trail bane]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
It is not recommended to macro most cooldowns, including Cold Blood+Secret Techniques and Dance+Symbols.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use Unyielding Netherprism
/use Araz's Ritual Forge
/use Lily of the Eternal Weave

When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key.

[vale pine]

don't think so

[trail bane]

with that macro,

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea

can i unbind thistle tea and just forget about it?

[lime obsidian]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WAs's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker
• :skull: Find Weakness target tracker

[mental saffron]

What is the dmg loss of CB over Tea for M+

[hazy breach]

Like 1% diff

Slightly less

[mental saffron]

CB does feel a lot better to use, especially if you run the Ritual Forge trinket

[tepid trellis]

i hear it feels the exact same if you just crit your sectech

[hazy breach]

Idk why the forge trinket would have any impact, but sure

[alpine wraith]

with more crit CB is less valued

so just crit dog

it will hit 20% harder with tea too

[lilac stag]

juiced always feels better

[mental saffron]

Cause it gives 40k Agi when you pop it decaying over time

[hazy breach]

Yes

But its already decayed past what prism would give you when youre using cb

As its like 9-10s into blades

[lilac stag]

are we really going to let maths get in the way of feels this early into the tier

[mental saffron]

I would just slap it on the first stech and call it a day and enjoy the crit

[lilac stag]

and youre supposed to slap it on the second sectech

youre weakining your feels and losing out on the bigger feels

[short aurora]

But is it fun

[lilac stag]

if you're gonna pump, fucking pump my man

[mental saffron]

^

[haughty mural]

You are not having forge atm

[tepid trellis]

you ready for the annual double on-use propaganda?

[short aurora]

Oh no

[hazy breach]

So fucking ready man

[leaden prairie]

what if you play double on use tho since prism is 3min now

[lilac stag]

it'll disappear after assa takes meta role week 2

[hazy breach]

Why have prism+passive give you 42k agi when you can have forge giving you decaying 40k

[tepid trellis]

it sims the same if you just use it every 1min30

[leaden prairie]

no!

[mental saffron]

Cause you get it every dance

[tepid trellis]

YES!

[mental saffron]

More good feels

[tepid trellis]

huh?

[mental saffron]

ah nvm, its 2 min

Plans ruined

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/hangar-hangar-of-roam-roamer-balloon-metal-gif-26138414

[tepid trellis]

ive got a gif ready to spam

[warm marlin]

[tepid trellis]

https://tenor.com/view/dogs-cute-animals-gif-10310968

this when they refuse to listen

[short aurora]

Shulkn is good at shooting stuff not at mathing

[crystal bone]

[tepid trellis]

https://tenor.com/view/song-hye-kyo-now-we-are-breaking-up-hye-kyo-aniyo-disagree-gif-24401756

[haughty mural]

We just have to live with lesser burst and call it a day

[tepid trellis]

this when they ask if its better

[hazy breach]

Idk cant really imagine any sub rogue getting forge any time soon anyway

[tepid trellis]

prolly not

[leaden prairie]

whats wrong with htat guy head

[hazy breach]

Since 90% of other specs want it

[tepid trellis]

prism tho

INSTA mine

[lilac stag]

pay for it 😄

[hazy breach]

Nobody wants prism it seems

So ig theyll buff prism

Indirect sub buff 📈

[leaden prairie]

I hope they just buff the damage part of it

Outlaw trinket fr fr

[hazy breach]

Very possible

[tepid trellis]

i would love to read today/tmrw that sub gets a 5% buff before raid opens

that would go hard

[lilac stag]

mmhm

[leaden prairie]

It's funny tho

[hazy breach]

Eviscerate buffs

[leaden prairie]

Prism is another sub trinket

That I will use all season on outlaw in keys

So cool

Thank you sub people

[lilac stag]

you would need to DM realz and ask if he remembers its a spec

[hazy breach]

Very cool

[leaden prairie]

Gearing my m+ spec

[hazy breach]

Its a cooldown for outlaw atleast

[lilac stag]

do they need to cancle this one too?

[hazy breach]

And double down on the fact that youre completely out of the game if you happen to die once

[haughty mural]

It has a dmg proc and gives you agility
What’s to hate about it as outlaw ?

[hazy breach]

Losing ar and all of your prism stacks

Might aswell go next

[warm marlin]

Killing spree gone

[lilac stag]

just try to wipe the raid at that point

[warm marlin]

How u gonna die now

[hazy breach]

Fair enough

[leaden prairie]

[tepid trellis]

boredom

[leaden prairie]

ok buddy

[lilac stag]

i'm sure there will plenty of twitch clips to show up the way

[leaden prairie]

nah bro

im a bitch if i die once this season

not dying ever

mark my words

[short aurora]

[tepid trellis]

ill open your stream on reset

just to clip you

die

[hazy breach]

Tbf if you die as sub right after popping cds youre alt4ing as well

[warm marlin]

immortal god spec with stamina 18 passive dr sources 30% vers 2 20 cd or less on use drs

[alpine wraith]

pop flag then die

AAAAAAAaaAaAa

[leaden prairie]

i will hav e 50% vers buddy

i aint dying to anything

[mental saffron]

Is macroing sprint to every hotkey as Outlaw a overcook? @leaden prairie

[hazy breach]

Sub only at 30%

[shadow snow]

At least are tanky with all this vers

[leaden prairie]

idk just press it so you dont end up not having it when you need it

thougths ?

[tepid trellis]

sub has good vibes tho, outlaw does not @hazy breach

[swift tinsel]

lol kyveza tombstones you when you die

[shadow snow]

Both have good vibes i think

[tepid trellis]

wrong

[lilac stag]

wrong

[leaden prairie]

sub has 0 aura

[short aurora]

Aswell as playerbase

[tepid trellis]

coming from the flatline spec

[lilac stag]

outlaw has wish we could cancel this aura, literally in KS

[tepid trellis]

thats quite comical

[shadow snow]

Tbh i like outlaw more cause it feels like spamming my keyboard like a maniac with all this haste meanwhile sub is more chill

[leaden prairie]

hm

[shadow snow]

Also sound wise outlaw feels like we are really shooting people

[leaden prairie]

i wanna say something about haste but i cba rn

[tepid trellis]

atleast sub doesent do tank dmg on single target

[leaden prairie]

and aoe

[tepid trellis]

BUT YOU DO IT ALL THE TIME!

[swift tinsel]

at least not all the time

[short aurora]

Sub is lootspec to Equip outlaw

[leaden prairie]

holy shmoke so op !

steatlhi

i realized

im doing s2 damage

i checked

[hazy breach]

[leaden prairie]

my damage isnt higher really

[chrome palm]

Sub auramaxxed so hard in legion they had to cripple us for an entire expac after

[lilac stag]

tbf he did less than tank when dead

[leaden prairie]

i have anecdotal proof !

ok well

i dont think i need to be dead to do less than tank

[tepid trellis]

careful, u finna upset people

[shadow snow]

Can i have that again?

[leaden prairie]

https://www.twitch.tv/porsea1/clip/LovelyTolerantGazelleYee-_w30-ECvI57nOgQc?filter=clips&range=7d&sort=time

[hazy breach]

Surely blizzard buffs

[leaden prairie]

peep this one

[leaden prairie]

I expect more nerfs than buffs tbh

Outlaw is going to look crazy on the cleave bosses in raid

[tepid trellis]

u seen the single target brew can do?

[leaden prairie]

Like fr

[leaden prairie]

Ye

I have seen it

[tepid trellis]

its finna beat your ass

[leaden prairie]

Hehe

[tepid trellis]

on bosses

[leaden prairie]

I know lol

[hazy breach]

Ye i saw one do 25m on first pull floodgate too

Brew big bonkermen

[leaden prairie]

none of the monks i was watching on ptr were doing nearly as much as monksea tho

you guys aint ready

[crystal bone]

put me in coach

[leaden prairie]

if they dont nerf brew i think outlaw is under tank on like half the packs and bosses

[short aurora]

Looks like mop balancing

[alpine wraith]

mop was funny for monks

[leaden prairie]

I have seen people say that this ptr looked balanced

[alpine wraith]

super op then nerfed into the nether

[leaden prairie]

But idk

I don't think it is

[leaden prairie]

I hope they don't nerf brew tbh

They deserve

[tepid trellis]

are those people blind?

[leaden prairie]

Ye

[short aurora]

Fdk players

For sure

[leaden prairie]

And people don't know about assa yet

They ain't ready

[mental saffron]

Assa is going to rip the charts

[tepid trellis]

its like the worst ptr cycle we have had

[near rivet]

Hey, idk if this has been talked about, but this funny dagger from hallowfall assault have cantrip, thats not even included in sims, or i cant read the html report kek. Anyway sim says its an +1% due to raw ilvl, and cantrip feels to be like 0.3 - 0.5% of dmg

[leaden prairie]

I think the funniest thing to me is how dks played frost the whole ptr

And then the last week

A few played unholy

And oh surprise

[hazy breach]

Somebody on here that you know told me bleed has worse funnel than frost dk

[leaden prairie]

Unnohly is even more broken

Kekw

[tepid trellis]

just as broken

yeah xD

[leaden prairie]

Just as broken?

Bro

[warm marlin]

Dks kind of melee warlocks ngl

[hazy breach]

The cantrip does almost nothing last i checked, but ofc for this week when its at a fine ilvl its okay

[leaden prairie]

https://www.twitch.tv/zac__________________/clip/OptimisticPeppyOryxTriHard-fxXYGQgm_k8Q5u1z @tepid trellis

[near rivet]

does around 50% of instant poison dmg kek

[fiery cobalt]

The nightfall gear has been upgraded to season3?

[leaden prairie]

this is the overall, on a good key without death he does 15mil

[near rivet]

if you do the event you get the 4/8 and 1/8 veteran track gear

[fiery cobalt]

Good to know

[tepid trellis]

yeah like their uncapped AoE now that they are back to bursting

[hazy breach]

I find the people saying "you must have arcane the funnel is too good" on the ptr to be quite funny when assa gaps them in a lot of situations

[tepid trellis]

is quite something

[leaden prairie]

dude

assa does arcane funnel in cd

while out of cd

im not even capping

in cds it deos 4 times arcane funnel

[lilac stag]

Assa funnel kinda hitting zul levels

[leaden prairie]

Ok can we talk about something btw

How come funnel is free now

Like

[lilac stag]

no combo for sub though.

[leaden prairie]

What happened to sacrificing AOE

To do funnel

[hazy breach]

Idk everybody cleaves for free too

[leaden prairie]

Why do all these specs just AOE pad

And get funnel out of it

[hazy breach]

Every spec has bladeflurry

[leaden prairie]

I feel like outlaw got robbed of its niche I'm ngl

We used to be able to do st while aoing and it was unique

[hazy breach]

Yep

[leaden prairie]

Now every body just funnel while doing full AOE

[lilac stag]

well when you give assa everything and priorities the funnel shocker it’s good

[alpine wraith]

welcome to uncreative work

where everyone does everything but if you are too good you get maced

[hazy breach]

Cant balance niches so we give everybody everything

[lilac stag]

turn on one button and every spec is the same

Xbox here we come

[shadow snow]

But how come we have nothing

[lilac stag]

the devs don’t care about outlaw or sub

Er sub

[hazy breach]

We do have blade flurry wdym

[leaden prairie]

Assa is crazy I'm ngl

They managed to slowly give it everything

[swift tinsel]

and dreadblades

[shadow snow]

And aoe blind don't forget that too

[lilac stag]

it wasn’t slow. It was quick by ignoring the other two specs during the rework

[swift tinsel]

speaking of things stolen

[tepid trellis]

dont sya that to them, they get mad

[leaden prairie]

Like they got bf, then they got uncapped aoez then their cds finally did AOE, then they got more AOE and auto bleeds and finally they added some funnel on top of it

Outlaw got

Let me check

[alpine wraith]

they made sure deep cuts was not a thing

[wary cloak]

!coup

[wicked jolt]

Coup de Grace Optimizations:

• **Number 1: **You can stop using (non maintenance) finishers ~10 seconds before your 90 sec cooldowns come up.
• Number 2: ONLY with the 4 set of the new tier! -- During Shadow Blades, if you get the 4 set buff, you can use Shuriken Storm to not proc Unseen Blade before using your 2nd Coup.
• Explanation: The Tier Set buff does not allow new applications of the Unseen Blades stacks, so any Unseen Blades procs between the 2 Coup casts would be wasted, this small adjustment prevents that from happening.

[leaden prairie]

Ye the uptime meme got worse

And hm

Ye that's it

[alpine wraith]

dont forget nerfing it every time it was about to be good in its niche

[leaden prairie]

They gave us pc ye

[lilac stag]

“SUB IS ALWAYS META IN RAID” -

[leaden prairie]

The low target cleave talent

And everytime pc is good

[alpine wraith]

and nerfed it every time

[leaden prairie]

They nerf it or they nerf our AOE

Like they prenerfed our AOE this tier again

[shadow snow]

Who said that

[leaden prairie]

So result is we do 0 AOE in keys

But pc is still pc so it will blast the cleave in raid

[lilac stag]

Nearly everyone in that channel and one or two in here.

[leaden prairie]

Wouldn't be surprised if we get nerfed again cause of pc I'm ngl

[tepid trellis]

victim complex, yep yep

always meta

why mad

[lilac stag]

though I think he’s asleep

[leaden prairie]

Tbf sub is always meta in prog

[lilac stag]

Start the summoning circle

[leaden prairie]

[alpine wraith]

dont worry we have the best burst in the game

sub is good if you are top 20 progger

only need to worry about 2 weeks

good life

[lilac stag]

sub is pain once you get to normal ce prog

[tepid trellis]

funnel-yoink
1min30-yoink

[leaden prairie]

haha

[alpine wraith]

dont forget making sure DS does not work with sub

[lilac stag]

big burst with 1:30-yoink

[leaden prairie]

i forgot about that one @tepid trellis

[lilac stag]

Execute… oh wait

[alpine wraith]

singular and DN being bugged

[tepid trellis]

DS working well with sub-NOT ON MY WATCH yoink

[leaden prairie]

they should give assa dust

so it trully has everyhing

[patent crystal]

Maybe another buff

[alpine wraith]

they made sure their dots spread to 3 targets with good coverage

[leaden prairie]

I mean you meme but

Assa is getting buffed lol

[alpine wraith]

and ours to 2 targets in 5y

[lilac stag]

negative bugs getting fixed? Oh wait. Assa exclusive.

[alpine wraith]

and spatter goes from the player and also the mob

casual double the area

[lilac stag]

Splatter goes through walls.

[leaden prairie]

I'm actually willing to bet quite a lot on something like 5% aura for SIN *and an AOE nerf for outlaw in the first 2/3 weeks

Sub probably nothing tho as usual

[alpine wraith]

sub will just crater after 1 month

[keen dome]

I could see outlaw getting something simply 'cos of the council fight haha

[alpine wraith]

but people will enjoy being top 5 for a bit on amp bosses

[tepid trellis]

you need 6 seconds out of combat to activate TFD- sub (suprised picachu face)
just press stealth lmao- Assa TANK WONT LET ME STEALTH

[hazy breach]

Nobody plays sub anyway until its proven 100% to be op

[lilac stag]

ok. Taking dogs out. Let me know when we get our BP buff and assa gets another 4% aura buff

[chrome palm]

Sec tech also hit through walls 😛

[keen dome]

🫡

[leaden prairie]

nah bro

you havent seen

the cleave bosses

[keen dome]

oh no

[leaden prairie]

dude

on ptr outlaw was demolishing the adds

[keen dome]

Is outlaw gonna be the pad kings

[hazy breach]

Sub getting aura buff or even better an eviscerate buff would go so hard

[leaden prairie]

its litteraly the perfect outlaw fight on these 2 fights

you were 10/20% ahead of second guy

[keen dome]

lmao, hell yeah

[leaden prairie]

and since then outlaw got about 20% buffs

[keen dome]

lmfao

[lilac stag]

not gonna happen unfortunately.

We have too much burst

[keen dome]

Which two fights is this, i need to make a note to invite like sixteen outlaw rogues

[leaden prairie]

One fight is like

Uh

[shadow snow]

Evis buff would actually help with st dmg

[leaden prairie]

You break things to spawn adds

And the adds are damage amped

[lilac stag]

waits for heroic parses to nerf evicerate dmg

[leaden prairie]

100%

So it's Perma 3 targets

Damaged amped

[keen dome]

Wild

[patent crystal]

Give funnel back

[chrome palm]

Soulbinder?

Didn’t know adds were amped

[leaden prairie]

And the other fight is the one where you drop adds behind an AOE and they slowly walk toward boss

[keen dome]

Bring back Shuriken Comboooo

[leaden prairie]

That fight is Perma 4 targets cleave

[chrome palm]

That’s five fights with amp 👀

[lilac stag]

assa eating good

[leaden prairie]

well these amps aint for you

idk why they are dmaage amped im ngl

[chrome palm]

Surely one spawn lines up with 1:30s

[leaden prairie]

But it's litteraly shitter adds that do nothing but get cleaned by outlaw

Every like 30/40s

Idk

[hazy breach]

Last season when we were at the top of the old raid chart we got nerfed, so surely being on the bottom this time means we get buffed right?

[chrome palm]

You just timed 2nd sec tech to add spawn

Like gally

And yoink the amp

[vocal bear]

It's bosses 3/8 and 4/8

[leaden prairie]

Nice

They come early enough

For the week 2 nerf

Holy shomke !

[lilac stag]

“Out of sight, out of mind.” ~Realz… likely…

[vocal bear]

What about the triple DH ? Not good for outlaw ?

[leaden prairie]

nah its fine

but i dont think its gonna be insane

its more like a admi council type beat

[nocturne ruin]

!sheet

[leaden prairie]

you want boomies

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[tepid trellis]

cant wait for next expansion when assa can also do spread cleave

gonna go so hard

[leaden prairie]

Rupture spread to targets within 100 yards

Spatter range increase by 400%

[keen dome]

they'll make gloomblade baselien for sub and it'll be fun

[tepid trellis]

they will add a new finisher

[patent crystal]

They get s3 df tierset as a passive

[tepid trellis]

that for the first 6 months

wont work with shadowed finishers

and leave it at that

[keen dome]

just the first?

[tepid trellis]

yeh after that it will work with shadowed

but then they will add a tierset

where it wont work all season

cuz reasons

[keen dome]

Ah, of course

[swift tinsel]

If they don't remove FW going into Midnight imma drive to Irvine and shit in front of Blizz HQ every day until they do

Eat nothing but Chipotle

[keen dome]

Nah, just drive up and make them play Sub and ask them if FW is a fun mechanic.

Ion, play Sub for a tier.

[chrome palm]

Caustic spatter in front of blizz campus goes hard

[swift tinsel]

still love that Borderlands 3 made a rocket launcher just to troll him

the Ion Cannon, flavor text: Fun Detected

[lilac stag]

It’ll still be THE PROG SPEC

[tepid trellis]

yeh for 50 guilds

dunno why they act like it matters for them

[lilac stag]

[rocky ocean]

press buttons purple spec life is good

[haughty mural]

You guys are trying to summon him ?

[keen dome]

Sub's the best spec because it's purple and glows

[lilac stag]

yes cause I’m leaving for the day.

[leaden prairie]

are you guys talking about the 3 times

[keen dome]

i've made sure there will never be a void DH spec so we are safe

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/showtime-beetlejuice-gif-24573561

[keen dome]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1170654455973294110/1402975554088472638/image.png?ex=6895de4e&is=68948cce&hm=9b27e9134ee593db9ad483c0aef7c39b37ba425e27945048e6999f23cee64073&

He's not going to be able to concentrate now.