subtlety

[vale pine]

to be fair the diffrence between tfd and wm is low

[sullen hare]

as long as I can only lose less than 10% damage in m+ I'll still skip out on nado

[vale pine]

so you can play either

[sullen hare]

boy I sure love that I hit tornado into several black powders instead of eviscerate which synergizes with my herot alents

[keen dome]

Finally my choice to not take tornado off my bars is justified

[sullen hare]

https://tenor.com/view/a-christmas-story-soap-gif-10600941

[keen dome]

Laziness wins again

[slate marlin]

isnt this the build that weirdly sims higher but isnt played?

[chrome palm]

wonder if we take tornado for aoe fights in the raid

[sullen hare]

see you for the s3 guide where fuu says "it's shit. it's all shit, but I've been painted into a corner" in so many words because that's all that gets clicks these days

[slate marlin]

from the fuu doc

[chrome palm]

sinec its just that vs veil touched then

[lilac stag]

You already could depending on fights. One of the highest gally logs for a good while used nado.

[lilac stag]

See above. Miss-replied. Haha

[sullen hare]

no I think that one was correct

[lilac stag]

it’s too early. 💤

[keen dome]

it is

[lilac stag]

someone shooting what sound like a shotgun at 2am woke up everyone.

[sullen hare]

really? working on a project car at 2am?

I guess it is a saturday

[lilac stag]

no it was was gunshots.

not a backfire. Hahah

[keen dome]

I just couldn't sleep 'cos it was slightly too warm 😦

[sullen hare]

I tried to sleep but I'm just feeling restless tonight

[plush roost]

somethings not right here

and i dont know what it is

[alpine wraith]

did you hit a critter

tht seems crazy

[plush roost]

thats what i was thinking but i dont think theres any critters in valdrakken

[chrome palm]

outlaw, purple

[nova cairn]

There are

[plush roost]

ah okoki

[alpine wraith]

oh valdrakken can get cursed because there is also the emerald thingies

sometimes

[nova cairn]

Around the fountain

[distant bison]

what trinkets u guys use on ptr?

[plush roost]

netherprism + pacemaker

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[spark crystal]

any keybind tips for sub ? i use cold blood and secret tech macro and when stealthed i got shadowstrike instead of backstab. just looking to optimise my binds any tips are welcome

[lilac stag]

we don’t macro much of anything

Very little is “directly stacked” ability wise

You do want a separate Sectech bind besides the macro

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
It is not recommended to macro most cooldowns, including Cold Blood+Secret Techniques and Dance+Symbols.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use House of Cards```
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key.

[sullen hare]

(we currently don't take tea)

[steel zinc]

prism and void touch

void touch if it stays this way is early on bis

in aoe its bis

@vale pine why sub again under 5mill? 😭 What happend we lost again like 85k

maybe because we didnt pick finality?

[slate marlin]

bc of finality bug i think

idk what it is but he said that in assa channel

[hollow spear]

Finality is definitely oversimming, no clue by how much tho

[hazy breach]

It is not anymore

[brisk onyx]

this one?

[hollow spear]

So the coup problem has been taken into consideration in the sim?

[steel zinc]

that bug is on live too right?

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet | Github Tracker

[brisk onyx]

ye i think so

[steel zinc]

What about m+? We just dont take Planned Execution and instead Replicating?

[lilac stag]

Tornado Time!

[steel zinc]

idk might be worth

the dungeon slice sim can not be right

not taking first dance is actually troll no m+

[sullen hare]

Rather just play ww again for the tier thanks

[lilac stag]

Tbf if you’re off rogue idk why you’d knowingly come back

[steel zinc]

bro according to ds sim it is best to run tornado and not tfd

[lilac stag]

TFD isn’t exactly easy to sim

[sullen hare]

It's home and it's cozy but goddamn if I'd ever be seen using nado again

[hollow spear]

Yeah I think it performs better in actual dungeons than in sims

[steel zinc]

it is omega bis with the ptr fixes

this isnt implemented well

[hollow spear]

Just play it then

[lilac stag]

How do you want to implement forced combat drops? Figure that out and you can make it sim better.

[steel zinc]

https://mimiron.raidbots.com/simbot/report/h37MidDFgv1UiuJTzMLDsq (fuu)
https://mimiron.raidbots.com/simbot/report/sa21UGcwsqVm7GwDrdzRjq (other talents)

[slate marlin]

can also swap tornado for vt for the ease of use

[steel zinc]

with other talents I mean standard m+ talents

[lilac stag]

What standard talents?

It’s a new tier

[slate marlin]

u have all raid buffs

[steel zinc]

nvm ok

let me fix it

[lilac stag]

[hollow spear]

I mean what's the point anyways

We know that tfd undersims

[lilac stag]

There are no standard talents. Season hasn’t even started yet.

[lilac stag]

Rage for rage sake?

[hollow spear]

Ig

[lilac stag]

like getting upset at assa sims because of sudden demise

or whatever else they got upset about

[hollow spear]

The world won't be a better place just because our ds sim is now 100k higher

[lilac stag]

clearly that will show Yoda we’re meta and to make a new video

[hollow spear]

It will be after another buff to bp

Trust

[lilac stag]

21% or bust

[slate marlin]

We are going to be playing roughly the same build anyway

[lilac stag]

🤝

[hollow spear]

I'll just build something cursed

[lilac stag]

Tornado will be a big change for many

[slate marlin]

taking finality into pe is whatever. 0 impact

[hollow spear]

And not care because I only play 10s

[sullen hare]

Hell I'd even take 20.5% buff to BP and literally no other changes if anyone is listening

Since sarcasm is dead

[lilac stag]

21 or no deal

[slate marlin]

tornado was also on the s2 sim btw, we still played vt

[hazy breach]

Idk if youre not playing nado now you wouldnt play it next season

It already sims better

[hollow spear]

I'll rename myself to Damage Amp Andy in details and call it a day

[slate marlin]

i think a couple months ago we had this discusion with fuu where the m+ top simming build is weird

it sims highest but is not the play

[hollow spear]

It's groundhog day

[steel zinc]

so its already better then replicating?

[lilac stag]

I’m more curious where the tier changes with extra CDR and vigor/tea making nado/bp outside of dance a thing.

[hollow spear]

I might actually play tea

[lilac stag]

there’s one good log on gally with it now so who knows.

[sullen hare]

I would've paid to not read that

[lilac stag]

not that I like tornado, but I don’t think it’s immediately a no

[hollow spear]

You will press tornado and you will like it!

[sullen hare]

If by tornado you mean delete character

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/windy-storm-twister-flying-cow-stormy-weather-gif-24931764

[hollow spear]

Sounds like a complicated macro

[slate marlin]

i think he meant press n-> assa spec

[vale pine]

finallity bug was implemented

[hollow spear]

This recently?

Dang

Seems to have accounted for quite a bit

[vale pine]

yes

finality isn't the best talent in st anymore as a consequence

[steel zinc]

but tfd isnt impleted correctly or lets say cant be

[hollow spear]

Realz, emergency buffs are in order

[steel zinc]

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet | Github Tracker

[vale pine]

tfd is implemented correctly for single target

it just does not get resets in dungeons

tfd and wm is very close so both is fine

[steel zinc]

yeah because that thing is goated in dungeons

like dawnbreaker where you have forced downtime

[slate marlin]

anywhere really, cool af talent

and its even better in ptr

[hollow spear]

Yep, I've played it this season already

[hollow spear]

I hope that was sarcasm in reply to my sarcasm

[sullen hare]

It is

[hollow spear]

Good

[steel zinc]

Do we bind tea to dance now?

[sullen hare]

I wouldn't defame bender Rodriguez with any sort of seriousness

[hollow spear]

Don't know anymore with this channel

[sullen hare]

[hollow spear]

We always did

Or at least this expansion

[steel zinc]

yeah but idk m+ seems rather weird not using it more strategic

[sullen hare]

Pretty sure us macroing it just for the mastery buff was why it got the automatic use bullshit strapped to it

[lilac stag]

just blame assa

[hollow spear]

strategic use has left the chat

[steel zinc]

nah

you still want to use it not fully on cd

[lilac stag]

forces friction between spamming mutilate and saving tea for shiv

[steel zinc]

aoe m+ I mean

[hollow spear]

Do whatever you want

[lilac stag]

[slate marlin]

ye tea is for mastery

[hollow spear]

But binding it to dance is how you play it

[steel zinc]

in st ya

aoe no

[hollow spear]

Strategic use for another two backstabs

[slate marlin]

that is news to mean, care to explain?

[hollow spear]

[lilac stag]

you don’t give a shit about energy or mastery outside of dance

[slate marlin]

ye thats my understanding

[steel zinc]

ofc not

[slate marlin]

bc u hit like a wet noodle

u still want cdr out of dances tho

[lilac stag]

Which is why you use it with dance and not run the risk of losing casts over 25 minutes.

[hollow spear]

Mapko will time the second he runs out of energy during dance

[steel zinc]

you bind it when you actually hit in dance your finisher

[hollow spear]

And definitely not lose it to auto casts

[steel zinc]

like it doesnt buff in dance you strike or w/e

so you use it in dance yes ofc but on the finishers

so you want to press it before your first finisher in dance

and not direct in dance

[lilac stag]

That 1 second going to be huge.

[hollow spear]

That's probably not even 0.03% dps

Who the heck cares

[vale pine]

tea is fairly easy to use

[slate marlin]

fuu typing everyone hold their beers

[vale pine]

just macro it to dance

easy as that

[proven plover]

U just drink it with some lemon and sugar

[lilac stag]

but what about my finisher mix max?

[hollow spear]

In single target, fuu

[steel zinc]

if you just macro it on aoe you will lose out imo

[hollow spear]

Not in aoe

[steel zinc]

in st yes

[slate marlin]

daddy fuu has spoken

[steel zinc]

you bind it in st

[hollow spear]

[slate marlin]

ill resume my beer drinking

[hollow spear]

I have to hit the gym

[lilac stag]

let rogues make things even more excessively complicated than they need to be.

[vale pine]

just use cb in st

[hollow spear]

I'm kidding fuu

You haven't read the last messages ig

[lilac stag]

he has.

[steel zinc]

binding it in aoe is imo just a bad call in m+ since you want to have alteast one tea or 2 tea charges during your cds

[lilac stag]

He’s ignoring he .03% min max .

[steel zinc]

nah just logically thinking

you are a cds class you want to stack cds

[lilac stag]

You don’t want to lose cd casts

You start saving tea. You will lose them

[hollow spear]

Yeah, but my comment he replied to was irony

[slate marlin]

i mean u will proc it forcefuly out out of dances

[steel zinc]

wasnt that assa?

[lilac stag]

Lost on Austrians. Germans struggle with sarcasim.

[slate marlin]

huh? its autoproc for every spec

[hollow spear]

Yup

[steel zinc]

30 energy

[slate marlin]

theres no way u arent going low in energy out of dances

[steel zinc]

you can game that

yeah then your right if it does procc I lose chages

[slate marlin]

yep

[steel zinc]

that autoprocc killed my thought process your right

[hollow spear]

You can make playing outside of cds even more shit by doing that yes

[steel zinc]

I forgot about that

my bad

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/im-game-ava-germaine-the-expanding-universe-of-ashley-garcia-im-down-im-up-for-it-gif-19242106

[steel zinc]

I am still in df when we played it as sin

[slate marlin]

no worries sub hasnt played it in a while

[steel zinc]

ok your right just bind it also in aoe

I was just thinking we still had full control as sub

[slate marlin]

auto proc is a big nothing burguer that still feels bad for some reason

[hollow spear]

Yeah but even on sin it was like 0.1% of a difference between min maxing autoproc and just sending

[steel zinc]

yeah on sin its w/e when I played during prog sin

[slate marlin]

yep, nothingburguer at its max

[steel zinc]

just I was thinking if we had control lets use it fully in our cds always like stack everything with trinket more mastery etc

but since we cant control anything

screw it

[lilac stag]

we’re a muticd spec that doesn’t get to stack CDs directly, because friction.

[vestal escarp]

Frictiontly

Subction

[lilac stag]

That word is getting worse than “pivot”

[hollow spear]

Imma start a fight with my gf later, need some more friction in my life

[lilac stag]

makeup friction later

[slate marlin]

you just want the reconciliation later on

[hollow spear]

So much prejudice.

[sullen hare]

Just put the toilet paper on wrong that'll do it

[lilac stag]

Leave the seat up

[slate marlin]

do anything

[sullen hare]

No need to thank me until you're done yelling at each other

[lilac stag]

And the bidet on

[sullen hare]

Ok Satan

[slate marlin]

you want him to go back to his parents?

[lilac stag]

the test of true love. How much can you fuck with each other.

[plush roost]

I played the tea setup with finality on the ptr

And fellas i got bad news

[sullen hare]

How'd it go

[plush roost]

Its actually pretty good

[sullen hare]

Oh no

[plush roost]

Sample size Halls 14 and Streets 14

[sullen hare]

I'm hoping that's just copium

[plush roost]

St is worse

Actual pack dps higher

Especially during your down periods

Wasnt being optimal either, with tornado and all the energy i sent sec tec and dances dry without symbols often

No details meter, at work. But st boss dps was about 3.3-3.5m which is subpar. Went into third boss of halls without cds and that was a nasty 2.8m

[hollow spear]

What kind of a st difference do you get simming it on st?

[plush roost]

Just skyfury

[hollow spear]

Like standard build vs this one

[tribal blade]

HELL yeah

[plush roost]

I didnt sim just yolo

[tribal blade]

i actually enjoy playing sub with tea and vigor

feels like old sub

without bricked storm energy

[plush roost]

Big issue i found, and this may just be ptr having 18% crit baseline

But i wasnt pressing bp lots

[tribal blade]

oh that's probably way too low for not running CB

[plush roost]

Since fw uptime was real bad no rotten

[tribal blade]

when i simmed tea during DF crit starts gaining a lot of value

[plush roost]

Hmm maybe i recraft tmrw and go agane

[slate marlin]

lets pray for 30 energy storm

[plush roost]

I played pacemaker as my crit source

[hazy breach]

Dont think your crit matters much

[tribal blade]

i tested sims when kush was experimenting during DF S3

[plush roost]

Yeah its just i was frequently at 4-5 fw in a 13 target pack

[lilac stag]

crit was already gaining vaule end of this tier with sectech.

[hollow spear]

Critting is 50/50 anyways

[plush roost]

Not sure if that was a bp angle or not ngl

[tribal blade]

5 is yeah

[hollow spear]

Well

[plush roost]

Interesting maybe i press bp more then

[hollow spear]

At 13 targets you'd bp anyway

No matter the fw

[plush roost]

Not used to aoe rules on trickster

[tribal blade]

it's very convoluted

[plush roost]

Since i was sin pmuch all season

[hollow spear]

I think it's 7+ target if you ignore the fw rule

[tribal blade]

oh dave made this btw

maybe you can import it over to ptr

maybe

[plush roost]

Mm useful

[slate marlin]

5 fw up, or 3 during blades=bp

does it make sense with nimble being 7? no

[plush roost]

I shall continue to ezperimwnt tommorow

[steel zinc]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WAs's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker
• :skull: Find Weakness target tracker

[plush roost]

I do think tho, that steets is very much a normal build angle

With tfd and rotten

[spiral sierra]

is that with dark brew? or same spec just moving stuff over to tea?

[plush roost]

Not many big target counts

[tribal blade]

streets having a lot of downtime between packs yeah

[hazy breach]

It doesnt really matter tbh

[tribal blade]

nah sort of same build

it's PE+x2 finality build

oh @hazy breach do we play around rupture finality in ST with x2 finality talented again

[hazy breach]

No

[tribal blade]

sick

[spiral sierra]

what PE? sorry >.<

[slate marlin]

precise execution

[spiral sierra]

ohhhhh

[tribal blade]

planned execution

[hollow spear]

We don't talent finality in st at all

[slate marlin]

its planned? wtf

my bad

[spiral sierra]

yeah its planned, i knew what you meant tho

[hollow spear]

Yeah, since planning is important on sub

[slate marlin]

ill use beer as an excuse

[hazy breach]

Fairly sure you always run TFD no matter what

But here is a spicy build for ya that sims the highest when you have skyfury on

[tribal blade]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[hazy breach]

CUQAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAM2mBAAAAAALjxy0YGMzMYmZmxMzMMmtZxYGbzMDmZMGzsMbDAAAgZGAwY2MMwAziWoFbwA

(with tea)

[steel zinc]

can you share the string pls?

[hollow spear]

Are you working at an Indian restaurant Eleem

[tribal blade]

gonna be real, i would be down to run this build again

[steel zinc]

I am blind today

[tribal blade]

it's DB build, similar to the one we ran during DF S3

[hollow spear]

The trick is to not join pugs without a shaman

[steel zinc]

these talents all require the new tierset or?

[lilac stag]

So I’m not totally crazy.

[tribal blade]

think so yeah

[slate marlin]

no shadowcraft build?

[lilac stag]

It’s not as important in keys, just feels less good especially on bosses.

[tribal blade]

oh shit i didn't notice no shadowcraft

[hazy breach]

"Requires" is probably pushing it

[sullen hare]

I assume that goes without saying

[hazy breach]

Its like -0.8% instead of +0.8% with old set

[sullen hare]

Oof

[hollow spear]

Justice can't wait to try it

It has tornado

[tribal blade]

run DB build and then rupture spreading becomes massive value

[sullen hare]

It has everything I like (tornado)

[tribal blade]

it actually kinda works because nado is less troll without shadowcraft talented

[slate marlin]

maybe

but shadowcraft is fun

[tribal blade]

it would just feel like you were playing early DF sub again

[sullen hare]

I didn't run tornado then either :)

[steel zinc]

S1 yeah

[hollow spear]

How cursed is this in single target

[tribal blade]

probably wouldn't feel great compared to what we run now

[sullen hare]

No shadow craft refills so probably feels like you're cut off at the ankles

[tribal blade]

but that build i think has higher aoe sustain

[hazy breach]

Without shadowcraft refunds you have more opportunity to use your hard hitting builders!

[sullen hare]

Oh boy!

[hazy breach]

(no meme strike that procs double unseen blade actually does comparable damage)

[tribal blade]

because we learnt the other night that sub is NOT the finisher spec

[north schooner]

PV value

[hollow spear]

Stop it

[sullen hare]

As I have always said, "I sure love pressing shadow strike twice per eviscerate"

[hazy breach]

Nah buddy

[slate marlin]

sad 😦

[sullen hare]

Because I grew up listening to we are the champions and that's the rhythm. Stomp stomp clap

[hazy breach]

On AoE pv aint even the 0.1% it is on ST

[north schooner]

exactly, that's like as impactful as fatal intent

[spiral sierra]

how would a raid build look like w/ tea?

same as now?

just curious

[hazy breach]

Yeah but CB is better for ST

[short radish]

sub is a DoT spec

[hollow spear]

It would have a lot of assassination talents

[hazy breach]

Sectech does less of your damage in aoe than in ST

Thats why CB is less valueable in aoe

Because for some reason sectech is softcapped at 5 targets

When BP is at 8

[tribal blade]

you know what, i think the devs literally mixed up CT and sectec soft caps

because sectec softcapped at 5

and CT says softcapped at 5 but actually 8

[limber dirge]

New to sub, is the cd usage loop something like this

Full cds > x2 Shadow Dance+Symbols in between > Full cds > x1 Shadow Dance+Symbols in between and then repeat the loop?

[sullen hare]

That's kind of a really compressed way of looking at it but yeah I guess

[north schooner]

they like mixing the soft caps for some specs but I have no idea what they achieve with that (if intentional)

[hazy breach]

Roughly yes

[steel zinc]

gonna try this now on ptr

with shaman

[tribal blade]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfVJKzgqtSQ

omfg watching pikaboo flag carry with burst of speed on mop classic is bringing back so many memories

now i'm sad

[compact violet]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[pale spoke]

is there a bug where shadowstrike is usable outside of stealth/dance now?

[tribal blade]

it might very rarely happen

some people report having it happen to them

not sure about ptr though

[pale spoke]

yeah it's happening to me on live now

[tribal blade]

might be a dumb question, but are you talented into subterfuge

[pale spoke]

nope

[wheat edge]

I noticed something funny while running transmog content on sub, if shadowstrike kills your target you stay in stealth and can kinda teleport around between a few mobs

[tribal blade]

probably just restart game and it'll fix it

[tribal blade]

yeah that's a weird one

it's also funny how if your target dies the millisecond you port with strike you stay in stealth too

[steel zinc]

@hazy breach that build with no shaodwcraft actually really works very well. You have way more sustained aoe and some peaks when in full cds.

its really good just st is a bit worse

[spiral sierra]

i think i really hate tea for single target, but for AoE its nice.

[steel zinc]

is it worth to use no shadowcraft on st raid? (nah because not much cp or)

[tribal blade]

do you have rough numbers on how much worse the st is

[steel zinc]

I recorded an eco dome I can send u the link later

[tribal blade]

i think losing some st is honestly fine in keys

[steel zinc]

I had a shaman and monk buff and a dk who just chain pulled and I resetted sometimes tfd with vanish

and you were not tanking dps you could hold sustained damage which has always been subs issue since the rework

[spiral sierra]

wrong channel

[random star]

oh shit sry

[spiral sierra]

all good 😄

[random star]

mb

[tribal blade]

yeah that's a lot closer to sin's dmg profile

[steel zinc]

yeah like its just based on that one dungeon I argue you lose something like 10%

[tribal blade]

mmm ok

[steel zinc]

like you dont tank like sin your dps but you really do less st

[lilac stag]

Add raid bosses could be interesting

[tribal blade]

i think that would be fine for most keys

[lilac stag]

depending on timings and needs

[tribal blade]

haha until there's M+ bosses taking 6-7 mins

[lilac stag]

talking raid

[tribal blade]

ah gotcha

oh right

[steel zinc]

maybe raid if you have shaman buff which you have you dont play shadowcraft

idk

like you hit way harder sustained

[tribal blade]

were you being aggressive with rupture spreading

[steel zinc]

yeah

[tribal blade]

noice

[lilac stag]

also not munching cps unintentionally

[steel zinc]

I just screwed up sometimes tornado since I had to remember the keybind

[tribal blade]

mm and then playing nado without shadowcraft it's nado>dance+symbols

[steel zinc]

ill share later unlisted video of the run

yeah I did nado symbols dance bs and then tried to get all nado ticks

since nado takes like 1 gcd to get rolling you can bs in that gcd maybe

idk maybe overcapping the cp

[tribal blade]

ohh i see

it sounds like you would global lock yourself from your first nado tick

maybe i'm wrong

[clever delta]

you casting finisher next gcd after nado pres

[tribal blade]

yeah exactly

[clever delta]

nado is kinda shit show as trickster isnt

[steel zinc]

its ok

like what I did I used it also to spread omega fast ruptures

like when mobs are stacked and you pressed flag into nado into all ruptures

and then into cds

but I aint good enough to always pull that off

[clever delta]

feel kinda waste losing that much of flag uptime on rupture spreading but w/e not really nado enjoyer, make much more sense for DS

[tribal blade]

mm i didn't think about losing strike casts using nado in dance

which is basically losing coups

[tribal blade]

boy isn't sub just the most well designed spec in the game

[clever delta]

its flawless

[tribal blade]

imagine if they put unseen on storm

[clever delta]

that BP buff was the last pieace we needed to make it perfection

[hollow spear]

I feel like they have one more bp buff in the tank

[tribal blade]

we joke about it

but it could happen

it's the only real toggle blizz has to tune sub's aoe

whenever they touch sectec that affects ST too

[clever delta]

they could buff nimble more

[tribal blade]

true they could buff nimble

[clever delta]

that i would actually dont mind 😄

[north schooner]

not if they touch the soft cap

[tribal blade]

yeah actually using nimble on 7 targets regardless of FW would be hot

[clever delta]

ye

and would make more sense aswell

[tribal blade]

would def make sub more intuitive

[steel zinc]

I still use it mostly on 7 targets regardless of fw. Since most of the time you only have fw on like 8 targets on like 3 or so up

[glossy turtle]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[hazy breach]

Nimble fixes would be great, especially because tierlist andies would read it in the notes and be like "ah yes a small bugfix" when in reality its quite a large buff

[tribal blade]

how big would the nimble fix be exactly

!bugs

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Bug tracker: Spreadsheet | Github Tracker

[steel zinc]

Wasnt it like 8%

[hazy breach]

Depends on which one youre referring to

[steel zinc]

all bugs

[tribal blade]

jesus

[hazy breach]

But all of them was like 7-8% when i napkin mathed it out

[steel zinc]

thats like insane imo

[tribal blade]

yeah that's a lot

[clever delta]

the nimble buff was them saying they are not fixing it

[steel zinc]

thats like a whole patchnote of boomkin 8 aura buff XD

[hazy breach]

Probably ye

But

[steel zinc]

I argue yes

5% nimble buff is what overall in a dungeon?

3 or 4%? overall

[clever delta]

realz opened the nimble code during his lunch break (aka dediceted rogue dev time) and was like "nope"

[steel zinc]

I wish he would answer here again

like actually say ok we are fixing them at some point we have seen they are bugs

bro these bugs will be here until they remove hero talents

same like nighstalker talent that was never fixed

[tribal blade]

most likely they don't get fixed yeah

given the speed at which they fix em lol

[clever delta]

its not that major

and propably req lot of dev time

[steel zinc]

what nimble?

[clever delta]

yeah

its not major for them

[steel zinc]

ya but most classes have bugs like this just rogue imo has the most

[clever delta]

and you can balance it with buffing the nimble itself

[tribal blade]

when i think of major bugs on other classes i think of vdh

and how half their spells don't (or didn't) generate threat

which was always a funny part of pushing this season watching people open up too early and get insta 1 shot from threat

[hazy breach]

I mean for most of the season it wasnt even "open up too early"

[tribal blade]

yeah even half way through pulls lol

[hazy breach]

Sometimes they just lose aggro 15-20s into the pull

[clever delta]

thats where nigh elf kick in

[north schooner]

isn't it even stranger than that in that they generate threat conditionally? I don't remember if it was only after pulling or when they are used to pull

[hazy breach]

Especially for specs like arcane, enhancement and assa that do big ST damage

[tribal blade]

i actually really enjoy being nelf

[tribal blade]

happened to me on the pull after 1st boss of workshop

i just spread ruptures while the tank was gathering during tricks

press DM and instantly get 1 shot by the drill

[hazy breach]

Ive gotten knocked back on the first pull of priory and i was like "wtf knocked me back bro"

[tribal blade]

hahaaaa

[hazy breach]

And then i was like ah, its the tanksmash

[tribal blade]

suleyman boy

[lilac stag]

haha

[clever delta]

how do you deal with that knock as paladin tank?

[tribal blade]

stand against the stairs

usually

[hazy breach]

Its tanked against a wall

[clever delta]

i actually start tanking on my pala tank this week and had no idea

[hazy breach]

Or well, with your back against a wall/stairs so you dont fly far

[tribal blade]

you just run up to the left stair well asap

[clever delta]

it pushed me side way when i tanked against wall

but maybe im just bad

[tribal blade]

nah i think it is hard to deal with

i've seen even vdhs have issues staying in 1 spot

[lilac stag]

I somehow pulled stix on Thursday. I’m sitting out of melee range with should up. Fucker just turned around on 4 seconds left with pull time and triggered cheat.

[tribal blade]

haha that's happened to me before

[lilac stag]

what in the hell is this shit

DK goes horsing in

[tribal blade]

what's even worse is my guild's tanks having boomer reflexes and not pulling on 0

and i proc cheat from aggro

[lilac stag]

Warlock crossed because openers

[clever delta]

i always wait for boss to move

[lilac stag]

I was out of melee range.

Just happened to be closest toon I guess

[tribal blade]

as sub it's sus sometimes because you don't insta generate tricks threat from strike port

i've 1 shot myself many times being aggressive with pulls in keys

[lilac stag]

Was scratching the doggos head, so I know nothing was even pressed accidentally.

[runic trail]

Happened on cauldron once, chilling in shroud, boss gets pulled and I get mauled.

[hard inlet]

any hype for sub going in to season 3?

[hazy breach]

Plays pretty much identically to how it plays right now, but numbers seems slightly higher so people are liking it

It should be really solid in raid as fights seem quite good for us

In keys it seems ok once they nerf the ultra-broken specs

[vale pine]

we would love a bit of an aoe buff tho

[vestal escarp]

11% ?

[hard inlet]

is there a delve trinket thats bugged on ptr that we are using?

[left ledge]

Holy agreed

Let’s get some bp buffs in there

[hazy breach]

Dont think theres any bugged trinkets

[hard inlet]

oh ok heard somthing about that

[hazy breach]

Atleast thats available to rogues

[hard inlet]

if im not misstaken it was yoda who said somthing about it

or just broken trinket

oh well

[hazy breach]

I have no idea what youre referring to im afraid

[upper narwhal]

The only issue I have with Sub is BP and Nimble competing in AoE, they should compliment each other (BP at 8+) but instead they create cringe gameplay where you are supposed to guess how many debuffs are active

[left ledge]

They could just buff bp

To where you press it even in ST

[upper narwhal]

Another 11% for BP

[left ledge]

A few more of those and sub is saved

[vestal escarp]

[upper narwhal]

One step closer to SL gameplay

[vestal escarp]

Kino powder should hit for like 7x times sectech

[left ledge]

Then make nado work with blades again

[vestal escarp]

Then im satisfied

[hazy breach]

Lets just make nimble 80% instead of fixing any of the bugs

[left ledge]

“I’m popping cds” into nado bp spam in ST

How cinema would that be

Holy

[upper narwhal]

+5% to nimble every patch and it will finally outcompete BP in The Last Titan

[hazy breach]

Just buff eviscerate so we are better in raid too

[left ledge]

Got it, Eviscerate damage decreased by 5%

[vestal escarp]

Nah nible should just go beyond 100%

Like outlaw

[upper narwhal]

Reverse prio

[north schooner]

precise void cuts

[left ledge]

Guys fr though dooming aside

They’ll fix the bugs

Just not this expansion

The next expansion when we get 20 new bugs

[hazy breach]

Or theyre gonna remove nimble

So theyre like "cba fixing the bugs"

[north schooner]

likely not the next one either

[upper narwhal]

Once they release the new DH spec and spend 8 months fixing it they will get round to rogue

[left ledge]

No no they will fix this expansions bugs next expansion

It’s the trend

[vestal escarp]

Ok so they're never gonna fix last titan bugs?

Good.

[hazy breach]

Surely atleast one of the new mechanics/talents/legendaries/whatever theyre adding works with shadowed finishers and sectech on the first implementation right

ONE of them atleast, right

[left ledge]

[vestal escarp]

Pffff

[upper narwhal]

My tinfoil hat theory is that dev time is being spent on a new DH spec and that’s why we aren’t getting changes, and I swear it’s real

[vestal escarp]

[left ledge]

Shadowed what

Never heard of him

And we’re moving the phys part of sectec to pets too

[vestal escarp]

Woof

[north schooner]

make all of sub's shadow damage pet damage

[left ledge]

WOWZA

Insanely good idea

[hazy breach]

Remove FW and shadowed finishers+rework blades to no longer add shadow damage, but instead make our spells do shadow damage while its up

[upper narwhal]

Orc bis

[vale pine]

combine blades and flag into one cooldown

[vestal escarp]

Still wont work with nimble

[hazy breach]

Can just toss flag

[vale pine]

would be one idea

[hazy breach]

Just removing flag and replacing it with something that buffs blades

[vale pine]

just make it one cooldown

instead of 2

makes the rotation easier too

[hazy breach]

But alas, no such luck

[vale pine]

also cold blood could be "your next 2 finisher after symbols"

or sth

[hazy breach]

We would go under our minimal allowance of jank

[vale pine]

haha

[upper narwhal]

What if we make blades a 2 min cd and keep flag a 1:30 cd and leave it like that?

Maybe we could have some way of allowing them to sync together

🏄‍♂️ 🏄‍♀️

[left ledge]

Dude I forgot cold blood was a button

I just press a diff sectec button

[north schooner]

and make symbols 35s recharge and last 9s, and dance 57s with 0,5666s reduction per combo point spent and last 7,3s

and make backstab great again: only useable from behind, +12% damage, 60 energy

[vestal escarp]

Yess, no flag and giga blades instant would be too good to be true

[graceful osprey]

Any undead rogue enjoyers?

[vale pine]

female undead has rly good animations

[graceful osprey]

I think it would be cool to add a little more animations. To each race

[lofty path]

I am a big sub noob, but I want to learn it for next patch, how hard is it these days?

[hazy breach]

Easier than people say that it is, but not very intuitive and quite punishing if you fuck up

[lofty path]

is it still b/c of CDR stuff? where if you mess up your timings you can get desynced

[hazy breach]

It plays quite differently than most other specs, because you have cooldowns to press most of the time, you just actively hold onto them for later

[lilac stag]

!mistakes

[wicked jolt]

Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:

• Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
• Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
• Make sure you always get 8 globals off during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
• If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.

[hazy breach]

But yes if you use too many dances or symbols and dont have enough for your big burst cd the damage meter is gonna look sad

[lofty path]

so the last time I tried playing sub was on good old smolderon, where you had to line up your CDs perfectly (it also helped that the fight was practically made for sub), is it still like that generally?

[hazy breach]

Yes

[lofty path]

where you have to line up your CDs for when mechanics are or aren't happening

gotcha

[hazy breach]

Roughly 70% of all of your damage you do happens during your 16 seconds of blades

(in ST)

[lofty path]

ye I have a buddy in my raid team who is a sub aficionado, and when I saw his logs for a ST fight, it was really funny to see how little damage was outside of CDs

[plush roost]

Backstab soup

[hazy breach]

If you look for outside of dance especially its real low

Looking at the top log from sprocket, he is doing 450k dps over 10 seconds here, but around 100k of that is gushing wounds and his weapon enchants

[lofty path]

wait this image rules

[short radish]

thanks, just refried it fresh out of the pan

[runic trail]

Just gotta add a little backstab to the left hand side, like dumping ketchup over the top of it.

[hazy breach]

Just pulled out my backstab soup out of the oven

[lofty path]

wait but if you put it in the oven you lose the texture of the ice

[vestal escarp]

Sorry to hear that

[runic trail]

And also a shuriken storm, in honour of next season. We're adding ranch to it as well.

[hazy breach]

Ye i saw it as a lifehack on tiktok

[short radish]

have you seen the bbq ice they do in china?

[plush roost]

Why are we adding ranch to our soup?

Of all things

[short radish]

it's all a fucking mess anyway so why not

[lofty path]

so I haven't been keeping up with how sub is effected by 11.2 tier, does it change much in the rotation? or can I safely assume that not much is changing outside of getting a free 2nd coup in I assume dance windows

[plush roost]

Cant wait for gloomblade to return, so we can have Mr. Noodles Spicy edition

[runic trail]

We shuriken storm between coups or something like that.

[plush roost]

Very similar to live, you storm between coups for cp without proccing escalating during blades

[hazy breach]

Only gameplay implication is that you want to storm inbetween coups during blades

To avoid wasting a stack of unseen blade

[lofty path]

what the fuck

sure

why not

[hazy breach]

Since for some reason you cant stack towards your next coup while the 4p is active

[runic trail]

Surely it gets fixed

Surely

[lofty path]

yeah I knew about that as I am an outlaw enjoyer

which is definitely a choice

[hazy breach]

Ye just like the shadow part of undermine tierset is gonna work on sectech

Anyday now theyll fix that

[runic trail]

THERE'S STILL TIME ELEEM

[lofty path]

best rogue can get is getting ignored in patch notes

[runic trail]

I still love that of all the bugs they could have fixed, one of them was the parry one

[slate marlin]

Lmao ye

[runic trail]

(Though apparently they also fixed the rotten bug and something with tfd so at least its something)

[slate marlin]

another bugfix not in patch notes

[lofty path]

no nimble flurry bug fix tho

🙂

that would make sub too good

can't have that

[plush roost]

Watch them fix undermine tier set next patch "as compensation for this fix, Secret technique damage reduced by 9%"

[brisk onyx]

how much difference do we make this rotation?

[hazy breach]

My favourite was them posting that "fazed should now work with nimble flurry"

And it just didnt

[plush roost]

Lmao

[lofty path]

[plush roost]

Should doing some heavy liftin g here

[hazy breach]

Only fixed for outlaw

[north schooner]

that one was a good one

[hazy breach]

I dont think they said should

I think it just said it now works

Cba digging up the post

[runic trail]

You missed the small print where it said 'for outlaw' at the end

Like size 1 font the same colour as the background

[lofty path]

it's fine outlaw needs all it can gets

[plush roost]

They just colored the text the same as the background

[lofty path]

literally eating the paper thin slices of bread from the mickey gif

https://tenor.com/view/poor-mickey-mouse-hungry-stingy-bread-gif-9574980

although tbh that's just rogue in general

[north schooner]

they clearly didn't want sub's nimble flurry to be too overwhelming

that 5% would've been too much

[brittle plinth]

I think they're worried that if it adds shadow dmg or anything common sense, its just more work to balance.

[runic trail]

I try not to be too negative but, please, the hero talents remaining the same for this long despite the same criticisms being levelled at it since they were announced makes it hard not to engage in at least a little bit of doom.

[brittle plinth]

Sub just stuff piled on top of stuff, one buff probably has too many interactions for them to map

not like the player base is there to support the type of fear

[hazy breach]

Not to mention the fact that deathstalker actually had a somewhat decent ST gameplay loop at the start of the expac, where you could fit 2 DNs inside every dance

[runic trail]

I still don't understand fully how trickster works

[hazy breach]

But then the "you cant reduce the mark while DN is up" bug got added like 2 weeks into S1

[lofty path]

I don't think the devs do either

[hazy breach]

And it got ruined

[brittle plinth]

me neither

[runic trail]

Also deathstalker on sub without that bug sounds much better than it does on sin, at least moving the mark around isn't a nightmare.

[brittle plinth]

"hey anyone got a UI where I can track all these buffs/procs"
me: so if I do the rotation, almost all the time eveything works and I dont need to track em?

[hazy breach]

Technically you can do the 2 DNs in dance now as well with the new tier

Since for some reason the tier removes a stack even with DN up

But its cringe because you have to have DN up > dance > strike > symbols > use DN

[brittle plinth]

wait wait

why we talking about DN?!

[hazy breach]

So you have to delay symbols

[brittle plinth]

did I miss something

Im so afraid

[hazy breach]

No deathstalker sucks

[brittle plinth]

phew

[runic trail]

It sucks we're just on about the wasted potential of it

[brittle plinth]

thank you for explaining

you can appreciate my momentary panic

[runic trail]

Yeah for sure.

[hazy breach]

Theyre probably gonna buff the tier for them but not enough to make it good for sub

[runic trail]

I learnt sub just to escape the mark because the mark on sin in some fights hurts.

Silken court is still burnt into my memory

[brittle plinth]

sin feels like they took a ranged class design and made it melee

[lofty path]

yep

[brittle plinth]

just doesnt feel fun

[hazy breach]

But who knows, seems like theyre a couple of weeks behind schedule for the new patch so maybe they just dont have the time

[lofty path]

I'll never forget the pain of trying to juggle the mark on silken

[hazy breach]

And just aura buffs assa instead

[lofty path]

absolute aids

[hazy breach]

Well youre in luck, theres lots of that this raid!

[lofty path]

🙂

[runic trail]

Accidentally send a DN envenom 15 seconds before the boss jumps away, gg

[lofty path]

killing myself in game

[runic trail]

At least VV seems to be the play so... vanish is free for mark nonsense

[hazy breach]

For one ye

[runic trail]

Better than none!

[lofty path]

tbh if I have to play another tier as sin I might just quit

it's so

boring

all the time

[runic trail]

I may end up stuck with sin on prog because my sub gameplay isn't at a level where I'm happy with it right now

I'm trying to escape the shackles of being a pure one spec one trick pony but its hard

[lofty path]

I'm gonna do what I always do

play outlaw until it's unplayable

then swap to sin or sub if I'm comfortable enough on it

[runic trail]

So... you're never playing outlaw

[lofty path]

wait wait wait

[runic trail]

(Its a joke Zac please don't murder me)

[lofty path]

it will be playable

on like the first 4 bosses

probably

maybe

who knows

also this gif is an accurate representation of me playing outlaw

https://tenor.com/view/deltarune-gif-23627897

[slate marlin]

Ill play sub or assa depending on boss, can play assa with whatever stats so its fine

[graceful osprey]

Sub stats work okay for assassination? I thought assassination was crit mastery

[lofty path]

assassination doesn't care about secondaries

like secondary stat weights generally are equal across the board

[graceful osprey]

Interesting, I was unaware

Still going to play sub

[wheat edge]

this is my highest simming food buff

(the good version of this obviously)

[lofty path]

yeah that tracks

[slate marlin]

Yeah its extremely easy to swap from sub to assa

barely any gear change needed

[steel zinc]

buff nimble 10% or fix the bugs

[vale pine]

one way to do it

[leaden plover]

just give us more BP buffs 🙂

[carmine portal]

Just a thought but a cool way to make Nimble Flurry more fitting for Sub is to make us have those shadowy tendrils from the Darkflame trinket striking nearby enemies

Visually ofc

[hazy breach]

Assa doesnt care about secondaries at all and Sub doesnt care as long as its not haste

So yeah its really easy to swap between them

[spiral sierra]

so i can rock full mastery/crit and be fine?

[hazy breach]

Ye

[spiral sierra]

hmmmmm shweet, big crits incoming

[marble elm]

Hey, I wanted to know if fatebound is still playable in MM ?
Or it is only for raiding ?

[hazy breach]

Wrong channel, but i dont think so

[marble elm]

Oh sorry!

[carmine portal]

I just hate the non-fitting hero talents

[lucid jackal]

I think trickster is fitting

[carmine portal]

Nimble Flurry just has no Shadow flare

[lucid jackal]

Well because its combined with outlaw

And outlaw has literally 0 bases in "Shadow"

Outlaws entire thing is blade flurry

So it gives blade flurry to sub

[hazy breach]

I too think trickster is fitting, just wish it had a bit more "trickster flare". Not sure what that would be

But the infinite tricks of the trade is my favourite talent by far for theme

[lucid jackal]

I like a lot of the rogue hero talent visuals, despite them being fairly low key

But unseen blade could be a bit... more seen

The visual is a bit too low key for me

I like it

[hazy breach]

Deathstalker could have some more flashy visual and it would still be on brand, but ye trickster being lowkey is alrigth with me

[lucid jackal]

I dont want to dream bigger

I like it how it is

I don't want to have a final fantasy giant animation

I like that a lot of rogue animations are subtle

Theres a handful of spells that I would like to be a little flashier, but coup isn't one of them

for me across rogue its like what

Unseen Blade, Fatebound in general, sectec,

but even sectec only a lil bit

I really don't want to be a FF character lol

Yeah but thats like, their thing

[north schooner]

sectec really needs to be more than a shadow fart

[carmine portal]

Meh, to me nothing about Trickster matches what I consider a Sub rogue to be but I am a "sub should be entirely shadow dmg" type player

[lucid jackal]

Okay so its a hero talent, its meant to combine 2 specs together

Why would trickster be a "Shadow damage" themed hero talent

[hazy breach]

But idk sub could be all shadow damage and still have trickster

Like both can be true at the same time

[lucid jackal]

its combined with outlaw, a spec that is ENTIERLY physical damage

[hazy breach]

But the trickster tree isnt gonna make everything shadow

[lucid jackal]

that's like, a lot

You have almost 100% uptime of nimble flurry

So it'd just be perma clones

Idk

Too corny for me

having that happen 100% of the time is a bit much for me

Its the same as warrior, I like a lot of warriors animations even if almost every single one of them is just "Swing sword"

its like

the 15 different sword swings

roar, and bladestorm

and thats it

[leaden plover]

more purple, rogue good

[shell willow]

😆

[lucid jackal]

Cold blood has a good sound

Evis has a good sound

[leaden plover]

I love the sound of Secret tech

[keen dome]

I like Coup's animation now it works. SecTec is probably the only one I want to see an improvement too (Ky'veza trinket animation, but purple ghosts. It'd be great)

[slate marlin]

i dont think ub or coup should be flashier

but secret technique should

by a lot

[lucid jackal]

I think UB could be more defined, not flashier

But that might be being a bitt oo pednatic

[slate marlin]

no i get what you mean

[keen dome]

Ye, I agree with you there.

[slate marlin]

Sub, for me, is a shadow ninja

would like more shadow visuals

[keen dome]

Shadow Blades could do with somehting more, too

Like, coat your weapons with shadows.

This is all it does right now:

Shadowy clouds around your hands.

[north schooner]

what are you bbqing in your gloves

[keen dome]

jump three times

[swift tinsel]

sashay left

[runic trail]

Waiting for the next trinket to make us do the full cha cha slide

[plush roost]

Collect and stand in circle

[north schooner]

I'm waiting for the inevitable captcha

[steel zinc]

I still have ptsd from the trinket and wa

[random mason]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lilac stag]

Nice DH Keveza Mog. Just need glaives.

[keen dome]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1170654455973294110/1399066996259160196/image.png?ex=6887a62d&is=688654ad&hm=f9f436d07796ea721b4cbd80c4177dff1c2d433f081fa5d4a5da3307662f9912&

[sullen hare]

goo kitty ❤️

[steel zinc]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[lilac stag]

I miss Kevin.

[plucky parrot]

!FUU

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[slate marlin]

inow i want a trinket that forces yiu to dance the macarena irl

[hollow spear]

I'd need a couple of pre-raid drinks and I'd absolutely slay

Taking the whole pre-whatever thing to the next level

[stuck linden]

Did something change with the sub sim? I thought it was simming above outlaw ST.

[reef elm]

i think someone found a higher outlaw sim

[median nacelle]

atleast mounts arent hiding from me like the sub rogue patch notes https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/318002396171206656/1399071083478520010/image.png?ex=6887a9fb&is=6886587b&hm=49739ad428e81f96f5518c34d4cef9032880c74392d655db467446acf117296c&

last char i had to do it on for the week too, sheesh

[plush roost]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WAs's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker
• :skull: Find Weakness target tracker

[slate marlin]

gz!!

[spark crystal]

which trinkets sub uses in 11.2?

[hazy breach]

Netherprism + passive

[spark crystal]

peacemaker or other passive?

[hazy breach]

Pacemaker is fine

[spark crystal]

thank you

we use prism together with blades?

[hazy breach]

Yes

[spark crystal]

tyy

[spice matrix]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[plush roost]

15 ecodome

with the tornado build

not baaaaaad

[shell willow]

Sheesh that looks nice

[hazy breach]

Beating tettles

[plush roost]

Thats humanity hehe

[swift tinsel]

Hey he remembered a healer this time

They grow up so quickly

[shell willow]

Storm build you are sending with ever other blades and outside of that are you sending with sectech? Or with 3rd symbols? @plush roost

[plush roost]

Im ngl

I used storm to spread ruptures

LOL

tornado*

[lucid jackal]

He just pressing it off vibes 💯

[plush roost]

1000000000

[shell willow]

Lol word

[plush roost]

i never used it during cds

cause

unseen procs way more important

it was kindof a filler/recharge cdr button

[shell willow]

Okay its not really a damage ability per say

[plush roost]

maybe optimal to use it without SoD during a dance

thats an angle i can see

[slate marlin]

seing boomies that low makes me happy

[hazy breach]

Using nado to spread rupture is what robot likes the most too

[plush roost]

It feels right

spread rupture during gather, nado to finish rupture spread, go into cds

I wonder if flag into nado into 4x rupture dance

is worht it

for 2 turbo jucied sec tecs

[hazy breach]

Sim didnt think it mattered, either way seemed to be the same

[plush roost]

hmm so just kinda situational i see i see

[shell willow]

Would you mind quickly breaking down using nado to spread rupture? @hazy breach

[hazy breach]

Im not sure what you mean

You press tornado

[left ledge]

Press tornado

[hazy breach]

Then you press rupture

[left ledge]

Press rupture

Holy fuck

[plush roost]

haha

[left ledge]

He’s faster than ChatGPT

[hazy breach]

Not like the tornado automically spreads rupture

Just using the cp you generate from it to cast ruptures

[left ledge]

Can you break it down for me though Eleem

[shell willow]

Okay I thought i was missing something else there.

[left ledge]

Nah dw tornado interacts with nothing

Not even with your main cooldowns

[north schooner]

can you break this down?

[left ledge]

https://tenor.com/view/breakdance-chineese-gif-26375280

[north schooner]

wicked

[shell willow]

Yeah i had to review the talent just free storms basically

Haha sorry I was being dense.

[left ledge]

Nah lol dw dude

Just memeing

[swift tinsel]

It’s okay I mentally block out tornado too

[steel zinc]

its really fun build ngl

just getting a hang of tornado is a bit weird

[hazy breach]

Is the tornado build the no shadowcraft one

[steel zinc]

Idk the exact sequence

[hazy breach]

Because technically every build should have nado if you go by sims

[steel zinc]

get dark brew

[hazy breach]

Ait ait ait

[steel zinc]

so no shadowcraft

this is 15 eco dom but some wipes but in time

[hazy breach]

No tfd

[plush roost]

no shadowcraft sounds cursed to me idk

the extra sht in cds is kinda insaneo

[steel zinc]

eleems build is this

you need a shaman in the group

[plush roost]

ill give that a whirl later

[steel zinc]

its fun ngl if you play df s1 its kinda like that

just with supercharger

[steel zinc]

how do we play tornado actually in cds? I do not remember exactly

like whats the sequence

feels like playing piano

[hollow spear]

wait Char

[hazy breach]

Sim wants to use it to spread ruptures

[hollow spear]

you played without tfd?

[steel zinc]

yeah thought so like when the pull is kinda gathering you spread rupture with the help of tornado or?