subtlety

[fleet wharf]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/741275386188529734/1372656620034592869/3882ade1b2e0cab5893c24ec180af244.gif?ex=685e47d8&is=685cf658&hm=d4f4114fc0d017ffb9c4399ac04631bbe053a486a04af3221a57046a74e1d6bb&

[tribal blade]

basically use that momentum and HELP US

[vocal wolf]

This is the way

[tribal blade]

optimal gameplay

[vernal hull]

That's gold.

[void hound]

skill issue, just step back 😄

this is some "you area already dead" type of shit

[vestal escarp]

I came a little

[void ocean]

3 rogues?

[runic trail]

The entire rogue player base in one gif

We all pulled up that night

[void ocean]

u atroed the shit out of Lock

imagine all those stacks

[warm marlin]

Now they will only super die instead of super super die when they fail to hit the warlock gate

[fleet wharf]

did you guys also use the warlock gate weak aura that tells you when to press your shard?

[void hound]

no but maybe we should have

[warm marlin]

nah I just watched the cast and mashed my gate hotkey as it finished

[void hound]

"after the cast" and "later than you think" was a bit too ambiguous

[fleet wharf]

yup. and actually, mashing made things worse

you want to press it just once and be touching the gateway as the knockback goes off. not that anyone needs it but i felt like sharing soon to be useless piece of knowledge

[warm marlin]

well it kinda depends on where your gate is

Some of our guild stood right on boss to get knocked onto the gate while mashing

[fleet wharf]

i saw UH dk perspective once and it made me want to be a DK for the first time

[short radish]

yeah but you have a good full half second to click the thing

[coarse hound]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker

[void hound]

yeah the timer is very generous

you can fly well past the gate and it still works

[short radish]

yeah

i didnt understand how so many of our raiders fucked up with it

[void hound]

yeh xd

[fleet wharf]

ping fucks with you pretty hard ig

[short radish]

eh you can play around ping

as long as its not more than like

300

[fleet wharf]

I feel with like 170ms mashing becomes a lot less viable

[void hound]

as long as ping is consistent you can find a good timing

[tribal blade]

you could legit just stand in range of the gate

and it would let you gate even if you got knocked out of ranged

so long as you didn't get knocked TOO far away

once i figured that out i never missed the gate ever again

[fleet wharf]

yea that's what I mean. you want to be closer to the boss than the gate, and the WA basically makes it so that if you are within range of pressing the shard when the timer goes off, you can take it even if it looks like you're already in narnia

[tribal blade]

ahh i see

i just waited till the knock happened, then hit my bind, worked every time 😉

and i play with ~200 ms

[fleet wharf]

yea, the thing that made the biggest difference for me was to stop mashing it and my consistency went way up

[tribal blade]

yeah most of people dying was panic

[fleet wharf]

just be DK and walk like normal

[tribal blade]

"I NEED TO PRESS GATE" and then fumbling pressing early

[warm marlin]

yeah a majority of our deaths on prog were to early gates and not late gates

[fleet wharf]

it's so fucking troll that you get knocked back after taking the gate if you press it too early

[void ocean]

why cant we reflex shadowstep it

[tribal blade]

no big think

small think

[runic trail]

My raid leader if I shadowstepped on prog he'd beat me

He knows where I live

[tribal blade]

i think i reflex shadowstepped once on the fight when someone knocked me

[void ocean]

thats mobbing

[tribal blade]

but i didn't kill anyone

thankfully

[warm marlin]

ye same

[runic trail]

I unbound it for safety

[warm marlin]

I stepped boss like 4 times on prog I think

never killed anyone

living on the edge

[fleet wharf]

bold

[tribal blade]

haha ninja

[runic trail]

I also had to rebind jump on that fight due to weird hand placements and accidentally hitting spacebar

Had to bind jump to 7 for safety purposes

[void ocean]

https://tenor.com/view/monica-friends-seven-geller-gif-7303089

[fleet wharf]

but how would you show off your oab ring and flip everywhere

[runic trail]

I don't have the ring and I play a troll

[fleet wharf]

skill issue. I'm never selling that ring

[warm marlin]

I don’t think we’ve had a single roulette wheel ever go to a raider and not a buyer

[runic trail]

But yeah, right hand on wasd plus repeatedly tapping a or d on a conveyor belt led to a few accidental jumps

[warm marlin]

They just don’t drop without buyers

[vocal wolf]

You gotta step to him directly really send the message

[void ocean]

stop taapin ur d then

[runic trail]

You can't make me

[tribal blade]

i have to hear about that ring every time we do bandit

and how much everyone is pissed at how it drops

[void ocean]

I'll ask ur raid leader where u live

[fleet wharf]

would any other spec want a big vers small mastery?

[vocal wolf]

Kinda wished you could dinars it xd

[tribal blade]

don't think so no

[tribal blade]

i think they'd have to put every possible stat combination on the vendor

but why not

[void ocean]

i wish e had m+ weapons for dinars ffs

[fleet wharf]

truee

[void ocean]

my fdk would have a 684 in that case

[runic trail]

[tribal blade]

at least for sub right now so long as your daggers don't have haste you're chilling

[vocal wolf]

Yeah but It'd be funny cuz you know people would buy the wrong ring constantly

[warm marlin]

Iirc for the mdi or whatever you could just spam refresh the vendor and it had random stats every time

[runic trail]

But... My daggers have haste, and I want to chill

[tribal blade]

oh interesting

[warm marlin]

a bit sad they didn’t implement that for dinars

[runic trail]

Wait, no, Vers mastery, WE'RE CHILLING BOYS

[tribal blade]

is it too out of this world for the dinar vendors to give any piece from raid or M+ of the season?

just throw the entire loot table in there

[fleet wharf]

are dinars even coming back next season onwards?

[tribal blade]

most likely yes

this was kind of a test run

[runic trail]

I kind of hope so just as bad luck protection

[tribal blade]

it's a good system

[fleet wharf]

I wish they make it so even if you buy hero weapon you can upgrade it to myth track if you kill boss or get high enough on keys

[runic trail]

Cos we haven't had a single mythic house of cards drop and the vault has not been forthcoming

[tribal blade]

my raid team had massive loot drama this tier

which was made better by the dinars coming out

[fleet wharf]

one thing I like about rogues is that no one else wants stinking daggers and they're mine

[tribal blade]

lol yeah i get every dagger from raid

i had to chat with my RL about daggers going to my loot score

because i felt like my loot score exploding from getting every single dagger from raid was kinda bs

[fleet wharf]

did it work?

[tribal blade]

i think so, i'm not 100% sure

he did say it was a good argument, but i never asked if it got implemented tbh

i'm less of loot whore than i used to be haha

[short radish]

yeah but it also means its harder to share drops in m+

[warm marlin]

… loot score?

[runic trail]

That sounds like a dumb system

[fleet wharf]

by the way has it always been the case that daggers drop from one of the earlier raid bosses or were there tiers where this wasn't the case?

[tribal blade]

yeah we use loot score 🙂

[short radish]

dkp v2 electric bogaloo

[tribal blade]

that's usually the case

[fleet wharf]

sharing.. what does that word mean?

[runic trail]

All sensible guilds use loot dictatorship

[runic trail]

Just appoint one benevolent dictator and go from there

Nothing can go wrong

[tribal blade]

i think most weapons in raid work that way

[short radish]

worked for singapore

[runic trail]

Exactly. Flawless system don't question it

[tribal blade]

godDAMN that's a lot of vers

[runic trail]

You don't even get the flips from it

[tribal blade]

someone's not dying

[warm marlin]

Beautiful

[short radish]

bro i just walk through fire

idgaf anymore

[tribal blade]

my man enchanted it with vers and vers heavy gems

just leaning more into unkillable

[runic trail]

same but without the vers

[warm marlin]

Vers goated

[short radish]

means i can then enchant for SPEED

[tribal blade]

yeah i swapped stats around on my sin set to get more vers

[fleet wharf]

It is nice, but i dunno man I don't think I like the idea of vers as a scaling stat all that much

[tribal blade]

it's a negligible dps loss for sin in M+

[tribal blade]

TRUE

[short radish]

that is the one good thing about sin

stats dont matter for it

[warm marlin]

Vers is criminally underrated in keys in general

[tribal blade]

i always go out of my way to get more vers

[short radish]

vers is just underrated in general

my paladin feels so squishy

i'll get hit by something and i acutally notice it

going hmmm maybe i need to dodge

[warm marlin]

Even on specs that scale well you can go like full 20% vers for like a 1-2% damage loss often

Super worth if you’re pushing in a live season

[tribal blade]

it does make a huge difference

i remember back during S3 of DF

the 1 shot season

people were having to use not even close to make sure they weren't dying

[warm marlin]

Ye I full recrafted vers then (was on havoc)

[tribal blade]

and getting more vers was a big part of it

[short radish]

if i equip my bone band i can get 15% DR from vers without flask

[warm marlin]

It was worth like 1-2 key levels alone

[short radish]

with flask

[tribal blade]

i remember havocs fucking up bladedance and getting 1 shot lol

[warm marlin]

not the best class for one shots for sure

[tribal blade]

that was a stressful season

[fleet wharf]

By the way, is there a chance our scaling prio changes for S3? prolly not right?

[tribal blade]

yeah that season had so many turbo horrible bosses looking back at it

[warm marlin]

The yazma incident

[short radish]

unlikely we wont want to stop stacking vers

[fleet wharf]

is verse ahead of mastery for us btw?

[tribal blade]

that boss was a terrorist lol

[short radish]

depends on what your stat weights are

vers for me is usually ahead of mast though

or equal

and i also rather drop mastery for crit

[tribal blade]

love how blizz made that boss even harder than it needed to be with a rework

[short radish]

than vers for crit

[fleet wharf]

what does that mean? I know it boils down to sim it but wanted some rough guidelines

[short radish]

ignore it, i'm being stupid

stat weights are a joke

and shouldnt be relied on

[warm marlin]

i still loved df s3

[short radish]

https://support.raidbots.com/article/66-beware-of-stat-weights

[warm marlin]

absolute banger season

[tribal blade]

i honestly didn't play very well that season

but i still made title

[warm marlin]

we timed a 29 fall with 25 deaths

love bolstering

[tribal blade]

one of the few sub rogues doing it

[tribal blade]

LOL crazy

squishvegan blessed me with a 29 rise run

he didn't go over route, just threw the key in and we timed it

[tribal blade]

let me guess, half the deaths were on the trash before 2nd boss

[warm marlin]

i think like 90% of them were yes

[tribal blade]

haha sounds about right

[warm marlin]

bolstering the dot guy

[tribal blade]

it was so common for people to die there

even on the top teams

[warm marlin]

bolstering the tank buster guy and just nuking tank from orbit

[tribal blade]

iirc there was the tech to jump off the platform

for the explody thing

[warm marlin]

ye i did it on dh

[tribal blade]

nice

i think aug did it too

that was back when i was a stubborn sub rogue

one of the few non outlaws that season

[warm marlin]

df s3 outlaw

[tribal blade]

outlaw was nutty that season

i remember a super common comp for throne was x2 outlaws a 1 fury warr

...and then you had the x3 mage waycrest manors

[runic trail]

I miss waycrest, great dungeon. (Though the hag boss + deathstalker would be hell)

[tribal blade]

the tree boss was super cursed

(hence the mages)

[remote shuttle]

Guys i see in pins best for dps (belt) Is crit effect... Still i think i'll stay with static (versa) for both m+ and raid... Is anyone doing same? Or Just crit everywhere

[lilac stag]

Waycrest sucks

[short radish]

do what you want, its farm now anyway

and difference is probably rounded up to nothing

[vocal wolf]

GiVe Me ThE IrIs SiStEr

[runic trail]

I like the vibe.

[vocal wolf]

Vibes were great just not a fun key

[hollow spear]

My 92 parse ages like fine wine, already up to 94. Unfortunately the lock it in, so my overview doesn't improve 😄

[short radish]

just crit all your eviscerates instead

[warm marlin]

any very generous gamers want to log into ptr to give me shaman buff

[plush roost]

it'd be as bad as bricking 20 floodgate to bubbles skip 🙂

[tribal blade]

nooooooo

[short radish]

fuck it, i'm going afk to watch TV so i can

[tribal blade]

isn't this season just amazing

[short radish]

leme just copy a shaman

[warm marlin]

[runic trail]

I need to find an EU live server shaman buff bot

[warm marlin]

need a proper test to see if double dance between each flag is possible

[runic trail]

Try sub in raid for the first time last night, and we have no fucking shaman

[warm marlin]

def not without skyfury

[plush roost]

his name is blue now...

Hes truely a sub

[short radish]

one of us

one of us

[plush roost]

no longer a Dom

[hollow spear]

The only thing I am critting is vacation

Our guild stopped raiding for this tier

[warm marlin]

listen im keeping my outlaw kir

its still what i play in keys

[short radish]

/inv Fimbulvatr

or form a group

[warm marlin]

cannot find player

add bingusguppy perhaps?

[short radish]

do servers exist on ptr

[warm marlin]

oh right

lmao

[hollow spear]

Going from 4 ele shamans to 0 shamans should be illegal

[warm marlin]

well it shouldnt matter actually right

[alpine wraith]

rip

[hollow spear]

isn't PTR just one big server?

[short radish]

under custom

[plush roost]

it'd be /inv binguspuppy-Razageth

or whatever youre on

[hollow spear]

it's proof

they don't want us to achieve full power

[tribal blade]

i thought ptr had a few servers

[runic trail]

Idk where they all went

[swift tinsel]

Asked a shaman for skyfury last night and he looked at me and logged off

[warm marlin]

it does but there are people from other ones just running around me at the dummies

[runic trail]

But we now have 3 dks, 3 demo locks and 2 rogues

[warm marlin]

i dont think it matters

[runic trail]

So

It's fine

[short radish]

oh

[tribal blade]

ah gotcha

[short radish]

but when i was at the dummies i saw ppl from razagath

[plush roost]

ptr many servers

[warm marlin]

i am on raszageth

[hollow spear]

hmmm

[short radish]

game is too hard

leme log in again

[warm marlin]

gg

[short radish]

maybe we'll somehow hit the same instance

[plush roost]

smhmyhead

[short radish]

wait

[warm marlin]

okok i relog

[hollow spear]

Fimbul in shambles

[short radish]

lmao

[tribal blade]

have you guys tried turning it off and on again

[hollow spear]

(shadowbanned)

did you already get the leaver flag?

maybe that's why

[short radish]

yeah we bricked a 12 on pull

so left

[alpine wraith]

leave flagged

[tribal blade]

damn dude steps foot on the server and get insta leaver tag

[alpine wraith]

unluck

[runic trail]

[fleet wharf]

bro that leaver flag is going to be like so much worse than just a shadowban

[swift tinsel]

Lol I can copy my shaman to that server in a sec

[tribal blade]

haha i'm not really worried, i generally never am the first to leave a key

[swift tinsel]

Does it matter if na or eu

[tribal blade]

but you're gonna have people being terrorists

holding groups hostage

[swift tinsel]

Thought it was all the same

[hollow spear]

I kinda shared Dratnos' opinion

[warm marlin]

should all be NA

i dont think theres eu ptr

[runic trail]

That's gonna be me, I don't like giving up

[hollow spear]

The system will probably be too soft rather than too punishing

[plush roost]

Every high key player under the sun is going to have a red flag

[swift tinsel]

Kk I can copy in a sec

[plush roost]

ngl

[swift tinsel]

If you still need the fury

[tribal blade]

LOL true

[plush roost]

aint no way anyone is waiting to abandon group

[warm marlin]

idk i might be bricked if charrend can see it but i cant

[plush roost]

everyone knows a key is donezo when its donezo

[hollow spear]

yeah so what's the problem then

[tribal blade]

yeah in high keys everyone bails as soon as you know it's over

[warm marlin]

[hollow spear]

I think high keys won't be the proiblem then

[fleet wharf]

yea everyone clicks vote abandon, group disbands, no prob

[hollow spear]

I think the actual toxicity is in lower keys tbh

[tribal blade]

it's gonna make it kinda awkward

usually you just get people leaving mid key without saying anything

[fleet wharf]

but it is actually annoying sometimes seeing ppl with high io come in, do random dumb shit they'd never do with their own keys and leave if it goes sideways

[runic trail]

I just do vault keys, giving up is not an option. I don't care if this weekly no leaver takes 4 hours I'm getting it done or so help me god.

[short radish]

lmao is it just bricked? i cant even see you online

[tribal blade]

soldier on

[hollow spear]

I feel like there's a bit too much dooming around it

Usually with these kinds of systems you kinda have to be a dick to get flagged

[runic trail]

It's made worse because my group invite policy is, 'first ones who sign up'

My guild banned me from being the group leader

[swift tinsel]

lmao crit error as soon as I try to log on my shaman on ptr

[tribal blade]

oh no wonder you're in keys for 4 hours

[warm marlin]

i think we got it

[hollow spear]

I never believe people when they come to discords or reddit and are like "I told a player to shut up and they chat restricted me for 14 days"

[runic trail]

They clearly have good reaction times so they gotta be good

Insta sign = insta react to mechanics, surely

[tribal blade]

i'm the opposite, i look up rio and logs

i take my time

but this is for high keys

[hollow spear]

different expectations yeah

[runic trail]

Yeah, I ain't a m+ enjoyer, I just do the minimum for what I need for raid

I only got a resi key this season for dinar options. (I never ended up buying a m+ trinket)

[tribal blade]

last season when i was doing weekly keys i would just take a shammy no matter how bad they were

and give them a free carry

just press skyfury for me, pls and thankyou

[hollow spear]

same, I only apply to groups with a shaman haha

[tribal blade]

this season is kinda awkward for sub players

you gotta make your own groups to ensure getting a shammy usually

[warm marlin]

[tribal blade]

last season it was easier because you could almost guarantee every single key had a blue man

[tribal blade]

click it off, no balls

[short radish]

the amount of hoops we had to go through just to get that buff

holy shit lmao

[warm marlin]

i am definitely not clicking it off lmao

[hollow spear]

did you have to involve John Blizzard?

[short radish]

bro we had to go to rookery

[warm marlin]

apparently you can't raid buff opposite faction members

in open world

[tribal blade]

LOL

[warm marlin]

[hollow spear]

lmao

[tribal blade]

this is the same bullshit as when i see people i want to whisper in lfg

but they're on the opposing faction

so annoying

[hollow spear]

kinda cringe that that's still a thing

[tribal blade]

it's annoying because sometimes i want to whisper someone i know but don't have btaged

why i'm not inviting them

[hollow spear]

"lol u suck"

dang it, cant whisper them

@warm marlin When can we expect your 30 page thesis on the current state of PTR sub?

[tribal blade]

he wrote it already

[hollow spear]

and now he does it again with Skyfury in mind?

[tribal blade]

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/feedback-the-war-within-season-3-class-sets/2119870/114

[hollow spear]

would be kinda hilarious if skyfury pushed us over the edge of 2 dances between flag

already upvoted the post

[tribal blade]

i could see it happening

[keen dome]

Damn, that's a really well written post

[tribal blade]

i read the whole thing, it's good

[alpine wraith]

even if it pushed us to 2 dances still have to account for the triple dance that we may want in flag

getting to 30 flawless stacks may be a thing

[keen dome]

It's really good. Extremely well written, formulated and argued case with good suggestions

[tribal blade]

crazy

[keen dome]

If I was a dev I'd pay attention to it 'cos it's so well presented

[lilac stag]

They’re only going to read goremaws

[tribal blade]

don't say it

[alpine wraith]

rip goremaw

it cleaved with flurry for 2 weeks

[lilac stag]

Attention spam of 30 seconds or less.

No one reading that whole thing

[sacred yarrow]

no because objectiveness means youre doing your job wrong so the post is an offense rather than criticism. so nothing will come of it ( /s I hope)

[hollow spear]

Goremaw tier inc

Was reading through the finality conversation yesterday. The way I understood it is that the sim says it works in our favour with coup while logs say it doesn't?

[warm marlin]

well i dont think 2 dance between is possible

at least not without changing the unseen blade munching thing

even turbo aggressively sending coup the second it procs and not pooling a single resource ever

the 3min flag is super tight to have dances for

[tribal blade]

damn

[warm marlin]

and then the 430 one is cooked

[tribal blade]

so we just need deepening tuning

[warm marlin]

but im actually munching infinite escalating blade stacks

[hollow spear]

So you basically confirm Haptics findings?

[keen dome]

Lillian Voss has an ability called Shadow Shiv

when do we get that

[hollow spear]

In "High Noon", the expansion after "Midnight"

[keen dome]

hah

[hollow spear]

Where subtlety becomes a shadow space cowboy

I'd dig that

[keen dome]

I've been leveling Fury and it's fun hitting buttons a lot.

[short radish]

that sounds like outlaw talk

[keen dome]

Maybe I should try Outlaw again in 11.2......

Although it is hurting my hand, hahaha

[warm marlin]

it actually might be possible

didnt full send aggressive enough

maybe a bit rng

but like it once lined up to press coup with 8s left on flag cd

i had to do it for dance cdr

that just feels wrong

[keen dome]

Which finding is this, out of interest?

[warm marlin]

2 dances between each flag

now with skyfury buff to test

[keen dome]

Ooh

That'd be rad

[brittle plinth]

I'm thinking of creating a new macro for my rogue that I can press if I mismanaged or desycn shadow blades/flag or dance/symbols like a dumdum

"Hello my temporary friends, you may or may not be aware on the absolute reliance of cooldowns, and their specific pairing, as part of sub rogues damage profile. I am saddened to inform you that I have mismanaged my cooldowns and will be utterly trash for a pull or two until they aforementioned cooldowns are synced up once again allowing me to perform appropriately. Thank you for your understanding. This is an automated message, no response is required."

[keen dome]

hah

[alpine wraith]

you can shorten it

to ehehe

whooops

[short radish]

ehehhee i made a fucky wucky oopsie doopsie

[hollow spear]

I was talking more about the "we lose approx 2 (+2) coups over 5 minutes" finding

But I'm also interested in the two dances theory

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/space-cowboy-spike-spiegel-gif-14035397957492859370

[hollow spear]

Even though I'm almost convinced that optimising your flag windows is better than an extra dance every 3 minutes

[keen dome]

"I regret to inform you all that I've done a whoopsie and now I will log off in shame"

[hollow spear]

Just make a macro that alt f4s if it recognises that you went into flag with more than 35 seconds of shadow dance cooldown left

[tribal blade]

does lust make a difference

[brittle plinth]

Lol

[warm marlin]

probably helps

[runic trail]

Out of curiosity, how much of a damage boost is just windfury on its own? (Don't have my simc to hand or I'd check)

[short radish]

@me when you want lust

[keen dome]

Haha

[hollow spear]

It's in fuus sheet

[runic trail]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[runic trail]

Thanks!

[hollow spear]

How many ebs are you wasting rn in five minutes?

[warm marlin]

i started pressing storm when i knew i had disorienting just to try to max cdr even more

and still wasted 13/96 over a 7min period

[tribal blade]

oh NO

truly the most cursed timeline

[hollow spear]

He's not ready yet

[warm marlin]

I think i brainlagged and didnt send dance between one of those flags

but you can see its close to possible

all but one had 2 dances between

[hollow spear]

Ig you're throwing away all flag maxxing for that tho?

[warm marlin]

yeah you need to churn cdr as much as possible

[hollow spear]

Hmm

Since flag windows are so important

Maybe the additional holding it affords us is more beneficial

[warm marlin]

i dont think you want to play this way even if you can

like you need 100% uptime

[alpine wraith]

yea i can see more important doing triple dance on flag with good coups

than the noodle dances

in betweem

[warm marlin]

you're ripping sectec hard on cd

dance or not

[alpine wraith]

i can see using sec tech on cd tho

the potential resets are big

[warm marlin]

if you get boned a bit by 2p resets you need to delay flag a little bit

[hollow spear]

Not the worst thing

[warm marlin]

maybe but in a raid scenario you probably want to hold dance on fights for adds sets or whatever

[hollow spear]

If you have an idea of how long a fight will last you usually know if you can hold a little

[warm marlin]

pure st maybe you can do it

[hollow spear]

I think triple dances might also be a tad much to ask for after opener

[alpine wraith]

we can only check

just the power lvl might be there

with how flag works

but also maybe you do 2 dances in a row in between

[plush roost]

If only sblades was still 20 seconds and not 16 😦

[alpine wraith]

mostly because if you get like 20+ flawless

it is same mastery lvl as flag

and you can do that with the 4 coups that you get kinda

• the unseens

[plush roost]

Back to back dances out of cds could be interesting

[hollow spear]

Yeah but as ryldd says

[plush roost]

If you're able to farm back cdr for flag

[hollow spear]

We usually have add spawns that are bigger than optimal st

[alpine wraith]

so no triple dance but get 1 charge and 20 secs do two then just send sec techs with no dance until cds

[plush roost]

That seems like it could be very good in m+, a true 45/1.5 spec

[hollow spear]

Most fights this tier have dance timings on an encounter basis

We'll see what next tier brings

[plush roost]

Man its gonna be weird to play this tier in m+, how often we backstab will go way up

I wonder if we end up doing like, backstab every 4-5 globals and storm the rest out of cds to spam sec tec

Gonna have to fiddle more on ptr i was just playing normally on my little stint

[alpine wraith]

if you can fill cps with storm

you may stab when you have some sht

even in aoe

kinda silly to think

now imagine if unseens had charges and you could see them

and they stacked

[hollow spear]

Unthinkable

[plush roost]

So any deathstalker sub enjoyers? Smile

[alpine wraith]

deathstalker is close to just not using evis but to pop DN on st

someone somewhere may enjoy that

[plush roost]

Tying the tier set to symbols is just so... Meh

I dont really wanna press symbols again till pandemic yknow

But pressing symbols at 3 dsm is so cursed which sometimes happens

I wanna supercharge sec tec and dn yknow

[north schooner]

supercharging dn

[void hound]

the solution is simple
you dont play sub in m+

[vale pine]

ye, the tier set design def. feels a bit off

we rarely backstab

[warm marlin]

@short radish rebuff pls

[short radish]

k

[sacred yarrow]

theyre already envisioning the 11.2 rework (believe)

[warm marlin]

2 dances per flag

the lust is fake

you really start to lose juice after the 430 flag though. had only delayed flag about 6s total until the 430 flag, which I had to hold for 10 seconds. then had to hold the 6min flag for 16 seconds

[fleet wharf]

thanks for doing the tests. that's pretty sick. I guess now it's to figure out if doing that is better than juicing your flag windows right?

[warm marlin]

have to wait for things to be on raidbots but ya

[fleet wharf]

I'm kind of torn, it's cool we can squeeze in one more dance, but I kind of like the flexibility that we had on when and where to send the cds

[warm marlin]

it really doesn't seem very good

the timings are so tight

and you need 100% uptime

even if they change the escalating blade thing to prevent overcap I wasn't really wasting many that test by using shuriken storm

only wasted 7/96

[swift tinsel]

4:30 seemed to be when things started falling apart for me too when I was trying to force things

[warm marlin]

just from comparing logs I was also doing a significant amount more damage with the pooling playstyle

[tribal blade]

i went from being very hyped about the trickster tier set to slightly bummed

[fleet wharf]

So I guess the wishlist would be to either let EB munching prob go away, or go all the way with the 2 dance between flag window by giving us more cdr

[warm marlin]

astronomically cursed dance of dance/symbols -> coup -> shuriken storm -> sectec -> shuriken storm -> coup

[fleet wharf]

god that sounds awful lmao

[tribal blade]

we can only hope they do sub tuning

[warm marlin]

i think the pooling style is very fun actually

[tribal blade]

and buff deepening

[swift tinsel]

I toyed with this idea but just reading it makes me not want to lol

I agree, the pooling makes you feel like you're building up an even bigger burst window and its tangible

[tribal blade]

i haven't play sub in a hot minute, i wanna try this out next reclear

[fleet wharf]

yea, that feels better than feeling like a hamster on a wheel that's going a bit too fast for it

[swift tinsel]

how far out on flag have you been sitting on coups?

[warm marlin]

20-25s

[swift tinsel]

ah same

[fleet wharf]

oof

[warm marlin]

if you're doing the cold blood thing you often proc it shortly after that dance ends

[swift tinsel]

I still backstab and eat an EB to get flawless rolling

[warm marlin]

which is around the 1:05 mark

also in that test above, i procced coup with a thousand cuts reset

went to 1cp

and then 2p 30% chance procced it 4 times in a row

while backstabbing to 6cp

[swift tinsel]

Coup shadowcraft has become my new nemesis

[warm marlin]

and wasted all 4 escalating blades

[swift tinsel]

or the janky resets that are like the old RS

[alpine wraith]

likely we shall sit on not spending until you can sht from 1 to 6 or so

[tribal blade]

i just threw up in my mouth a little

[alpine wraith]

to avoid reset krangle

but still those unseens did do dmg and create a flawless soidk

game is cooked

[swift tinsel]

been a humble sht farmer in testing and the payoff is there but it just kinda feels bad to sit on so many things

[tribal blade]

don't worry guys, we have a whole other hero tree we can play

[swift tinsel]

that set is depression

as cringe as some of the trickster stuff is on ptr

deathstalker talents plus tier is just

depression

and not the quirky kind, the Trent Reznor Downward Spiral kind

[alpine wraith]

30% stronger singular focus pog

also if fatal intent pops while on SoD

instead of doing 0.002% dmg

[swift tinsel]

it may show up on details

[alpine wraith]

it might do 0.004%

[fleet wharf]

I'm not super happy with the deathstalker design either since we don't gain much benefit from what it buffs, but isn't it tankier than trickster?

[swift tinsel]

trickster gets flat dr from fazed targets

5% iirc

[fleet wharf]

but changing evasion to a DR node is also pretty nice, no?

not that we need much help with survivability, but more is still better

[swift tinsel]

I could see cases where the 20% magic dr would be nice

but I think the 5% flat damage reduction wins out in the end if your healers are paying attention

or are alive in general

[warm marlin]

fazed dr in raid, evasion dr in keys

[swift tinsel]

and we'll have even more fazed uptime

[fleet wharf]

what';s giving us more fazed uptime?

[swift tinsel]

more unseen blade procs from 2pc

[tribal blade]

not really no

[fleet wharf]

is it basically what ryldd said?

[tribal blade]

pretty much yeah

i think both work well

[swift tinsel]

the evasion dr would come from having to play deathstalker though

which causes more damage irl

[tribal blade]

the 5% flat dr from trickster doesn't sound very sexy, but if you add it on top of all the other DRs we have it's nice

the DS bait and switch is situationally strong

[fleet wharf]

it is absurd what sub rogues can get away with lmao

[tribal blade]

yeah being passively tanky as sub is awesome

[warm marlin]

active defensives are just generally much stronger in keys, you can mostly get away with not really using them in raid outside of high wr

and raid damage tends to be a lot more rot style

[tribal blade]

yeah that's very true

1st pull of cinderbrew with 3 muscles makes me really like DS bait and switch lol

people always said only the evasion part of bait and switch was useful, but with how many trash packs have a mix of physical and magic dmg this season you get good value from the phys part of cloak

[fleet wharf]

On that topic, do we still get extra strong magic resistance/immunity when we press it or is that interaction gone now?

[swift tinsel]

plus you can get even tankier if you run elusiveness on top of bait and switch for a super juiced evasion

if you don't want cheat insurance

cloak super immunity still exists afaik

[hollow spear]

I just don't have the balls to not run cheat death

[short radish]

@warm marlin i dc'd am i good to stay offline

[warm marlin]

ye

[tribal blade]

in raid you should be running cheat pretty much always

[swift tinsel]

oh yeah

[tribal blade]

unless it's a kyveza type fight

[swift tinsel]

I mean more so for m+

[tribal blade]

yeah elusiveness becomes so mandatory in high keys /cry

[swift tinsel]

I use it for death soaks

cheat, that is

[hollow spear]

I'm not got enough yet to actively use cheat death as a resource

[swift tinsel]

it has value but some abilities are fucky

and the game is seemingly picky about which ones can be Cheated and which just outright kill

[hollow spear]

But I'm feeling so confident in my rotation and stuff that I'll try to push my encounter prep to the next level in s3

[swift tinsel]

I usually start with 'can I live with feint

then add cloak/evasion

[tribal blade]

it's usually based on a % over your max hp i think

[swift tinsel]

yeah

so some meteors are fine

but the bigger group soaks will straight up dumpster you

[tribal blade]

yeah some hits that wipe the raid we can cheat

[hazy breach]

If its more than 2x your max HP in overkill you die

[swift tinsel]

ah yeah that sound sright

ty ty

[hollow spear]

That + evasion is a godsend for pre disorienting

[hazy breach]

So If you have exactly 10m health you would die from anything that does more than 30m

[hollow spear]

Juicy

[swift tinsel]

Battlemasters inc

[hollow spear]

If they gave rogue taunt the game would be over

[warm marlin]

unfortunately the double dance dream seems omega dead

unless im missing something big

its just not worth the sacrifice at all

[hollow spear]

That's what I thought

[warm marlin]

although

[hollow spear]

It's getting more and more clear that flag maxxing is giga value

[warm marlin]

I will note that I did get 2 dances after both the 3rd and 4th flag

[swift tinsel]

pooling for omega flags is super fun too

[warm marlin]

so there is some wiggle room to squeeze an extra one in

[hollow spear]

It is

[warm marlin]

you just can't do every single one

[hollow spear]

I also just like the extra flexibility

To move stuff around for specific encounters

Without inting your flag window

Sometimes you had to really squeeze uptime to get flag off in time

Rik for example

[swift tinsel]

iirc you're also getting a couple more naked sectechs off too

not a ton, maybe 2-3?

in 5mins

[warm marlin]

yea i just wasnt sending them since i prefer the cold blood playstyle

[hollow spear]

If you delayed your 2nd flag too much, you'd lose your 2nd sectec

[hollow spear]

The in between?

[steel zinc]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[warm marlin]

ya

[swift tinsel]

ah yeah I never send between

[hollow spear]

Could also become better now

[swift tinsel]

I don't wanna mess with that tight of a timer

[hollow spear]

If you can double coup pre sectec

[warm marlin]

its already kind of a difficult thing to pull off on live without delaying flag

[hollow spear]

To get high flawless

[warm marlin]

getting the 2 coups off first seems quite hard

[swift tinsel]

yeah you're kind of at the mercy of sht

[hollow spear]

I'll play around with that

You can usually afford to hold flag a tad

If you can calculate around fight duration

[warm marlin]

for sure

[hollow spear]

Anything sub 4:30 and above 3:30 and then onwards gives you lots of leeway

[warm marlin]

for no raid buffs except shaman these peaks are kinda high too

very burst

[hollow spear]

For sure

[swift tinsel]

dang, peaky

[hollow spear]

Are you playing with consumables?

[swift tinsel]

I think the highest I was getting was 11ish mil

[warm marlin]

now, yes

[runic trail]

I need to figure out my Rik timings, tried it last night, delayed first flag until after his drop-down thing and then sent the second too close to his intermission

[warm marlin]

only flask/weapon things

[swift tinsel]

but that was with gaming spymaster for a big 3min flag

[runic trail]

That fight went... Badly

[hollow spear]

13 mill peak

[swift tinsel]

it may not be popular but I think I'm gonna play into double on use

I quite like the minigame

[warm marlin]

fixing the coup finality thing would probably be a rather decent dps increase as well

[fleet wharf]

Which would you use for that? spymasters and then what?

[swift tinsel]

Lily from new dungeon

[hollow spear]

You usually send before, at least that's how we played it a couple of weeks ago

[warm marlin]

comparing some logs to sims on live it's probably like 4% gain with new tier

3-4

[swift tinsel]

Finality + Coup has been really annoying to figure out

[hollow spear]

So it doesn't work as in sims?

[swift tinsel]

I saw yall were talking more about it yesterday but wasn't able to follow bc work

[runic trail]

Yeah, I was concerned about the drop-down interrupting mid cooldowns so I figured delay and it'd like up with adds a bit

[swift tinsel]

The finality buff was acting strangely for me on ptr Tuesday night

[runic trail]

And yeah it went wrong

The intentions were good, the execution was not

[swift tinsel]

I had one cast where I had the buff going into the first hit of coup which was consumed, and then no other finality buffs were generated until the next natty evisc cast later

[warm marlin]

why can't you use your discord app

[hollow spear]

If they don't fix that

I know who'll benefit

[warm marlin]

#goremawbeliever

if only we had avoided being banned

[swift tinsel]

#GoremawsIsNOTaTalent

[hollow spear]

Please don't ban me for my goremaw activism

[swift tinsel]

Have you heard about our Lord and Savior, Not Goremaw's Bite?

Solving problems we do not have

[hollow spear]

Can't say I've heard of them

[swift tinsel]

I'd make a Goremaws casket gif but it was never alive to begin with

DoA

[hollow spear]

Yeah it's lame for sure

But so is a 2nd point in finality if it doesn't work with our now strongest spell (not per cast, but overall)

Not pushing for the two dances will also make the 2 stacks of sod feel less clunky I suppose

[swift tinsel]

Its not the worst but like Ryldd said yesterday if you get good sht resets in tfd your dances come back really quick so you're stuck holding for a sec or two so if you're okay with that

not with 2 charges

you have less

[lilac stag]

rogue solo content is dumb kekw

[swift tinsel]

this is ptr things are different than live

[hollow spear]

Without current tier set I think I'm fine with that

[swift tinsel]

yeah I'm personally not against 1/2 death perception 2/2 finality if it works with coup

[keen dome]

oh I should do that this weekend and finish it off

[swift tinsel]

yeah I gotta do that and the underpin king

[lilac stag]

i just wanted this

[keen dome]

Decided to level a warrior 'cos I want to go fully self sufficient on crafting next season

[swift tinsel]

ah nice! def worth the investment imo

[keen dome]

And I want the purple 1.8k set

[swift tinsel]

which one is that?

[keen dome]

I'm sure playing pvp as a warrior with no experience won't go wrong

[swift tinsel]

1.8k pvp rating?

huh?

[lilac stag]

stop being cringe Dave

[swift tinsel]

I can't

[keen dome]

The off chance Blizz, someday, add multiclassing and I don't have that armour unlock? can't risk it.

[hollow spear]

Did you even clear hc mate?

[lilac stag]

no we're stuck on Gally

[hollow spear]

Cringe

[keen dome]

There is a hole to fall down on Gally

it's siren song calls to thee

[short radish]

??????

still

werent you on gally 2 weeks ago

[lilac stag]

Heroic? we've been stuck since the 500 pull Mugzee marathon

[short radish]

[keen dome]

500 pull Mug'zee

[lilac stag]

granted we're trying to 5 man it

[hollow spear]

Maybe you're one of the 10% who has no good knowledge

Or maybe I didn't understand that sentence, also very likely

[swift tinsel]

I am too cringe to understand it

[lilac stag]

36% mythic. so maybe tonight?

[swift tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/viewtiful-joe-just-go-for-it-gif-14716751230568411191

[runic trail]

Wait, what?

[swift tinsel]

Motivational Viewtiful Joe

[keen dome]

Hell yeah, Scath

[lilac stag]

me trying to get my raid rep fixed

[runic trail]

Good chance of it tonight, phase 2 is chill

[keen dome]

It's not ChatGPT, it's just a template with some bits they have to add. Just keep sending it and EVENTUALLY it'll get sent to someone who can actually do something.

Them gutting their GM service is so fucking stupid

[runic trail]

Gutting their GMs and QA team surely won't negatively impact the game

Surely

[runic trail]

[lilac stag]

can't wait for the automated resonse from the 18th different gm bot

[keen dome]

A buddy had it bug and reset entirely, then only fill to about 3 ranks.

It took him 25 or something tickets before they fixed it

[swift tinsel]

all development time is going towards void dh spec

[keen dome]

[lilac stag]

kyveza dh

[keen dome]

personally designing it to upset me, specifcally

[lilac stag]

BAMF

[swift tinsel]

they're actually calling it Anti-iGestalt

not Entropy

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/nightcrawler-xmen-x-men-xmen-97-xmen-'97-gif-18308365078408454052

[keen dome]

OG X-men hell yeah

[swift tinsel]

nightcrawler poofting around is what i dream shadowclones to be

[lilac stag]

two swords, clearly DH

[keen dome]

Have you seen some daggers in WoW

those could be daggers

[swift tinsel]

esp if it had that whipcrack sound

[hollow spear]

that new DH spec will be so god damn purple

[keen dome]

what about the teleport farts

[swift tinsel]

they're iconic

[lilac stag]

igestalt rerolling DH

[swift tinsel]

necessary

[hollow spear]

iGestalt hugging his Dave bodypillow

[keen dome]

impossible

[hollow spear]

weeping

[keen dome]

Although, I do have the Raid bosses name reserved on my realm

So I'll probably just make him

[lilac stag]

that looks like kyveza with DH tattered wings and a blindfold

[hollow spear]

True

You can run, you can hide...

[keen dome]

Although I'd wanna make him a night elf, not a dumb blood elf..

[keen dome]

lmao

[swift tinsel]

snip tool omegascuffed

even it doesn't want void dh

[keen dome]

There's no off-spec rogue tier helm from S1 right

[swift tinsel]

to be possible

[keen dome]

I can't copy his transmog 1:1..

[swift tinsel]

I dont think so

it was DH iirc

[keen dome]

Yeah, I believe so

[swift tinsel]

something betrayer's visage?

[hollow spear]

betrayal is a good keyword

[keen dome]

But I'm ready

[swift tinsel]

beyond's dark visage

[hollow spear]

Awalrus

[swift tinsel]

oh man the arc begins

[keen dome]

https://www.wowhead.com/ptr-2/npc=246325/adarus-duskblaze

I'll be a raid boss

[swift tinsel]

ahahahahahaa

this is so great

[keen dome]

A lot of my alts are just npc names

You may wonder why and the answer will astound and amaze: I'm incredibly uncreative.

[swift tinsel]

most of mine have Hap in them somewhere

[keen dome]

Hell yeah

If blizz let me just do FF14-esque classing on one guy, I'd have precisely 0 alts haha

[hollow spear]

Hapless

[swift tinsel]

I played suuuuper casually from cata until nathria when I joined a raid guild again so I floated between alts

a lot lol

[hollow spear]

Haphazardly

[keen dome]

I've got a lot of respect fo rpeople who have a cool naming convention for all their characters

[swift tinsel]

and alt names usually had a theme based on the main I played at the time

[keen dome]

Gestalt doesn't really lend it to much variation haha

[swift tinsel]

lol its still iconic

[hollow spear]

I started naming myself after the instruments my gf played at that time haha

[keen dome]

That rules

If I could go back in time I'd make one of every class just called their name

This is my Rogue. He's called Rogue

[hollow spear]

Because my noise cancellation sucked and my raid heard her play in the background when I unmuted to make a call 😄

[swift tinsel]

my first ever toon was a troll shaman named Dirtydubes bc that was a nickname when I was a teenager lmao

[brittle plinth]

your name is Dirtydubes rl?

Oh ol Dirtydubes Johnson, ya he's in accounting.

[swift tinsel]

maybe that's why I work in a basement

would explain a few things

[delicate wind]

I just use Dan in my chars. Like on d2 my assassin is dansindan bc I like to dance and my barb was barbaradan

[cyan ember]

Can someone explain how atrophic poison interacts with raid bosses thanks gamers

[delicate wind]

But my rogue is currently buttercups and I tried to make a gnome female look like a powerpuff girl

[keen dome]

Hell yeah

[hexed sluice]

If only

[lucid jackal]

Boss gets debuff

Debuff causes boss to deal less dmg

[cyan ember]

Does it apply to mechanics like fire circles on stix

[lucid jackal]

No idea on what it does and doesn't work on

It works on most things tho

[jade urchin]

it doesnt apply to environmental damage, but i dont know the specifics

there were some puddles in other raids where it didnt work

[brittle plinth]

My first MMO min length for name was 4 letters when I started, so I picked Y or X and then hit 3 random keys after. Here I am 25 years later.

[vale pine]

!atro

[wicked jolt]

Atrophic poison/feint in Raid: > Click to open Sheet <

[vale pine]

^

[warm marlin]

I cannot believe im saying this but goremaw's bite actually feels good

it smooths out both the escalating stack waste and the energy problem

[lucid jackal]

[warm marlin]

and obviously there's a lot of variance but I did about the same damage even without skyfury swapping a finality point to it

if the coup finality thing was fixed though

definitely a finality angle

[tepid trellis]

coup is bugged in a good way with finality

so

[alpine wraith]

yea it works with finality or procs it then works said eleem

kinda weirdly ok

[warm marlin]

the logs we were looking at recently showed otherwise

[alpine wraith]

they might have broken more things

also goremaw might help on some things

but idk if worth that point it is very competitive

maybe it does let you double dance in between cds more reliably

and delay blades too

if we want to ever triple dance

[warm marlin]

if you don't have finality up, it generates and consumes it on 1/3 of the coup, if you have finality up already, it consumes it on 1/3 the coup and does not generate it

the second image is cut off a bit but there is no finality present after the coup ends

[warm marlin]

its specifically being used as a generator between coups, to not have to backstab and waste escalating blade stacks or to shuriken storm and have no energy

or at least thats how i was testing it

[haughty mural]

Thank god goremaws in my bar since legion

[placid crown]

checking logs on mugzee mm

this guy

and me : (wipe at 14%, was alive 99.6% time) :

how even the instant poison and incontinental sauce can have such a diff dps

[warm marlin]

he has twice as much melee dps as you

are you out of melee for long periods of time

[placid crown]

look number of casts

[warm marlin]

ya he has 200 more auto attacks

[placid crown]

ye

idk how

our fight was even longer

like 15sec longer

but we wiped at 14%

[swift tinsel]

this tracks with what I've seen too

[alpine wraith]

yea seems good

[placid crown]

bro is 99.82% active, i'm at 99.65%

[hollow spear]

That doesn't mean anything

[warm marlin]

im pretty sure rupture damage will count you as active even if you're not actively hitting the boss

[hollow spear]

You having way less auto attacks means that you were out of range a lot

Which means less sht stacks

Which means less combo points and therefore cdr

[warm marlin]

less instant poison procs

[placid crown]

ye actually i didnt chek details of the fight, maybe he was never chosen by boss abilities whereas i was a bit

[hollow spear]

Just don't get chosen

Easy

[swift tinsel]

I come back from a meeting to Goremaw's viability what is this timeline

[hollow spear]

That's how you parse

[hollow spear]

The golden time line

[placid crown]

i mean even after 1min of fight he has 1M more dps

[hollow spear]

Golden maw, so to speak

[swift tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/peepo-peepoleave-gif-20075315

[hollow spear]

You can't outrun this

[swift tinsel]

the worst part is I can see it too

[hollow spear]

Ryldd didn't want to

[swift tinsel]

I don't either lmao

[hollow spear]

But something inside of him awoke

[warm marlin]

huge goremaw dps wowie

[hollow spear]

The maw

[swift tinsel]

Oh my Gorsh

I believe

how could I have been so foolish to deny is

[hollow spear]

I mean it's almost as much damage as shadowstrike

And it barely crit

We need to riot to get the coup finality interaction fixed

[swift tinsel]

I doubt they get to it this cycle

[hollow spear]

Just has to happen before go live

It's a purely numerical issue

[warm marlin]

you guys think goremaw's works with surprising strikes

surely right

[sly shore]

uh it also gives energy sweaty

[hollow spear]

Even though I can see why goremaw also feels a bit better

Ryldd, are you using it in conjunction with your cb windows or are you using it as 90s cd?

[warm marlin]

uhh its a little weird

i was pressing it only between coups when I would otherwise be forced to use backstab/ss

so not really strictly on cooldown

[hollow spear]

Yeah kinda hard to get it to align with coup being rng

[warm marlin]

its kind of funny because it is actually extremely good at solving the no energy no cp coup issue

[alpine wraith]

yea it does give solutions

[warm marlin]

generates 3cp, usually 1-2 sht stacks after coup as well

coup goremaw coup

[hollow spear]

I smelled it

[warm marlin]

coup goremaw coup strike cb sectec

[alpine wraith]

we knew all along

[warm marlin]

theres just no chance its actually good though

[alpine wraith]

who knows

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/trust-me-true-believer-stan-lee-marvel-mallrats-brodie-gif-13709575

[alpine wraith]

maybe save sht and have coup ready get to full cp dance sec tech goremaw coup coup or maybe storm then goremaw in between

what a world

[warm marlin]

hang on i need to go rottenmax my goremaw

[alpine wraith]

you cant have rotten and goremaw

unless you do the PV thing

and that is less dps for sure

[vernal hull]

What the fuck am I looking at chief

[warm marlin]

listen eleem cooked this don't look at me

he cooked it, then i inted him by putting the finality points into goremaw and rotten

[haughty mural]

PE instead of RS again?

Crit stonks

[alpine wraith]

kek

i mean crit does get a bit of value

[hollow spear]

I mean

We all wanted talent choice right?

[alpine wraith]

yea goremaw does hit decently hard

[haughty mural]

[alpine wraith]

tbh a funny text to add to goremaw would be this ability benefits from mastery

so it becomes a nuclear nuke

[haughty mural]

[warm marlin]

you need to consider the PV goremaw synergy

[runic trail]

!log

[warm marlin]

of the big maw

[alpine wraith]

i used to use PV for ER but now that one is gone

it did so much dmg although was close in st but not crazy

it died with dust too

[haughty mural]

I also flurried

[alpine wraith]

yea ER did flurry

goremaw did in alpha but not on beta onwards

was too strong!

[haughty mural]

Good thing tooltip also suggested ER would flurry

[hollow spear]

Actually weird that it doesn't flurry why wouldn't it

[haughty mural]

If I had to guess - bug?
They cba to fix because it’s not played

[alpine wraith]

i try to report it every time

but i think im on some list

[haughty mural]

Or they strictly excluded it

Because goremaws is op

[alpine wraith]

i mean ER already hit for 5m on S1