subtlety

[hazy breach]

But stacking up to 14 takes too long outside of symbols

[warm marlin]

this was happening fairly often on ptr for my testing

[swift tinsel]

I've been holding onto coups going into 2nd/3rd flags and that's been a good play

to bank the sht

does outlaw have issues with the EB portion or do they not really care about it either

[north schooner]

yeah it sucks for outlaw too

[warm marlin]

outlaw kind of has the opposite issue

you don't actually need to press sinister strike that often

[swift tinsel]

ah true

[warm marlin]

so ignoring the trickster tree there would be long periods where you would not press it

[lucid jackal]

Any goremaws cooking

[warm marlin]

get in there and test it guy

i believe in you

[shrewd lantern]

remember when goremaw was good (aka never)

In legion it was a last ditch energy resource

[swift tinsel]

maybe one day we see it get the sepsis treatment

[north schooner]

they keep unchanged goremaw around in case it accidentally becomes non-garbage after the spec is reworked twice

it's like when you hoard old cables/chargers in case they are needed in the future

[swift tinsel]

trust me bro I'm going to use that coax cable

[pliant topaz]

why though

[lucid jackal]

@warm marlin was talking about it. Finality kinda low impact, helps not waste Eb procs in between Cd windows

[warm marlin]

woah woah

this is a misrepresentation

[lucid jackal]

Is it

[swift tinsel]

thats a bold accusation

Ryldd Goremaws Enjoyer confirmed

[lusty epoch]

guys do you have any tips for bandit mythic? Like general mindset with CDs etc.

I blow everything at pull but then flag comes off cooldown like 20 seconds until next assistant spawns, is it worth holding on for 20 seconds? Feels like flag always ends up in between assistants.

I experimented a little and i did more dps when just blowing cds into boss with no adds, ofc i wasn't playing perfectly but man i'm doing gray parsing... not really had this problem on earlier bosses

[lucid jackal]

I didn't mean like, he was making an apl or whatever, just spit balling an idea

Was wondering if that discussion amounted to anything

[warm marlin]

I briefly memed about it allowing you to avoid wasting unseen blade procs between coups and providing energy to make it play cleaner, but i definitely think finality is way better

[pliant topaz]

i can see the vision, i can try different ideas with it once tiers implemented in sims

but i kinda dont think so

shit does too little damage, resources are completly useless

so youre losing finality for it, to gain a dm stack + some damage + save 1 eb proc

[north schooner]

ryldd was blessed by the spirit of ryukagge himself

[swift tinsel]

just throw out a storm instead of having to see goremaws on your bars

[pliant topaz]

nah

storm does way too little damage

[warm marlin]

it was mostly for coups outside of symbols/dance at all

[pliant topaz]

i doubts its difference with strike is enough to make it worth

[swift tinsel]

yeah unfortunately, we're likely in an EB waste timeline

[warm marlin]

you dont have the energy to build to 6 before your 2nd coup

[pliant topaz]

depends on 2 pc imo

its a 45 sec cd

[warm marlin]

ye maybe if it was shorter cd

[pliant topaz]

with 2 pc, your coup cadence outside of dance is gonna be around 12-18 sec imo

so youre cooked regardless

[warm marlin]

finality just seems hard to drop with how hard coup is hitting

seems like a high damage talent

[pliant topaz]

what

coup barely works with it

[warm marlin]

I know its bugged

[swift tinsel]

yeah that's why I was toying with 2/2 finality 1/2 death perception

[pliant topaz]

i think finality is gonna be even less value

[north schooner]

does finality see coup as an eviscerate or a coup?

[pliant topaz]

cuz youre gonna get more coups

vs evis

ratio wise

[swift tinsel]

idk if its bugged or just how they want the buff to be

[pliant topaz]

and finality is worse for coup

[warm marlin]

how many strikes does it buff

[swift tinsel]

every other iirc

[warm marlin]

because it does generate and consume finality itself from what i can tell

[swift tinsel]

but idr if its split between phys and shadow

it was fucky

[swift tinsel]

coup is just 3 eviscerates

or is treated as such usually

by the game

so its buffed by stuff like shadowed finishers

[plush roost]

What kinda dungeon overall are y'all doing in ptr rn anyway? I was playing with a somewhat scuffed group/route and got to about 6.5m overall which is low

[north schooner]

yeah but because it overrides the spell I wasn't sure whether finality considers it a different spell or not

[pliant topaz]

you can look at logs on warcraftlogs or lorrgs to find what higher parse rogues are using timing wise. find a kill timer similar to your guilds kill timer and adjut to that

[swift tinsel]

ah yeah its still considered an evisc

[plush roost]

But I did burst packs for about 20 mil if I'm banked on shadow techniques going in

I also found that the second boss of ecodome does his intermission every 1.5min so if you can time flag to be up as that occurs you're cleaving during flag blades on boss

Kinda mega

[swift tinsel]

haven't popped into there yet, might try it tomorrow

[warm marlin]

it consumes/generates it in a wacky manner

[swift tinsel]

some guildies were talking about doing some testing with me but we'll see if they do

[plush roost]

I need to see what its like

[warm marlin]

if it is 3 eviscerates in a top hat it's probably generating with the first one, consuming with 2nd, not generating with 3rd

[plush roost]

To have skyfury on ptr

Probably insane didf

[warm marlin]

idk for sure though

[lucid jackal]

It's time boys

It time for goremaws

[swift tinsel]

unless the first hit of the coup that's cut off is the one that consumed the prev buff, 2nd generated, and 3rd consumed

[chrome palm]

goremaw truthers stay winning

[warm marlin]

its not cut off all 6 hits are in the picture

[pliant topaz]

from what i remember the third one never interacted with finality but idk

havent looked at it for a long time

[plush roost]

Warning signs enjoyers stay hungry 😦

[swift tinsel]

what I mean is that first one consumed a prev Finality buff

[chrome palm]

next season brother our time is nearing

[warm marlin]

oh ya no it didnt

[swift tinsel]

and generated one for the 2nd

ah

[plush roost]

Yeah when they release void dh and rework sub into kyveza

[chrome palm]

the soul hunters trinket has better visuals than all of rogue lmfao

[pliant topaz]

#tww-subtlety message I wonder how many people ever used it. since its basically ALWAYS worse

than its choice node

[warm marlin]

https://tenor.com/view/discord-cat-cry-no-access-gif-4843402027541887132

[plush roost]

Nobody xddd

[swift tinsel]

two eviscs and no finality to show for it

[north schooner]

would the universe collapse if the goremaw build included PV and Lingering Shadow?

[swift tinsel]

[chrome palm]

gloomblade build bring it back

[north schooner]

forgot Warning Signs

[swift tinsel]

I have my pc set to explode if that talent combo is input unironically

[pliant topaz]

xd

get rekt

[plush roost]

Gloomblade warning pv and goremaw

Exodia

[swift tinsel]

truly forbidden tech

[chrome palm]

deathstalkers final form

[pliant topaz]

its basically this :

I can see the vision tbh

but it just never panned out

and also the energy/ haste stuff just was super off base

[swift tinsel]

like the rest of 10.1.5 rework

[pliant topaz]

since energy as a concept kinda got removed from sub

[swift tinsel]

yeah

[north schooner]

how would that work exactly

[pliant topaz]

it doesnt

[chrome palm]

when haste doesnt let you do more casts it isnt as good crazy thought

[plush roost]

Should just make subs energy pool 200 and costs higher but harder, make pooling great again

[north schooner]

that's what I thought

[pliant topaz]

its always worse and the extra haste will NEVER be felt

[swift tinsel]

no more casts, no hasted cooldowns

[pliant topaz]

unless you have like 60%

[chrome palm]

all the builders cost like 40 energy

i think storm is like 45

half your energy for one move

[north schooner]

it's 6% extra haste, it won't multiply shit

[pliant topaz]

nah i dont think so

i think just too much power has been put into a few talents

things like goremaw coulda been cool

if energy actually was meaningful

no need for 200, it doesnt really solve your problem

u just spam 2 extra backstabs and youre out again

[north schooner]

does it have to be energy though? It could empower 3 finishers in a different way, no?

[pliant topaz]

you need systems, gameplay loops that reward that playstyle

[swift tinsel]

could see if finishers worked like ferocious bite where extra energy consumption added damage

[pliant topaz]

if thats something u want

[swift tinsel]

with the finisher energy redux component

[pliant topaz]

we're talking about energy so i said energy. the idea of it buffing finishers is fine, but we have so many amps its just getting dull

ah yes shadowed finishers to buff

then finality to buff

[swift tinsel]

could do 'as if x extra cp spent' but that's kinda just more supercharger

[pliant topaz]

then dance to buff

dance macabre to buff

sod to buff

sod charges to buff

dark shadows to buff

like okayt i get it

[plush roost]

If you make things cost more to a point where SoD doesn't essentially refill your energy perma then pooling could be meaningful. Idk i think pooling should be fundamental to sub but bht thats just me

[north schooner]

yeah no need for "we have SC at home"

[warm marlin]

drop cold blood for vigor

[pliant topaz]

its mostly shadowcraft not sods energy that saturates your energy

you go strike -> finish strike

refund from finioshing covers the cost of finishers

strike cant cost more either

[north schooner]

it could however convert 3 finishers to full shadow damage or something dunno

[plush roost]

Well yknow what i meant, SoD perpetuates shadowcraft since its 2 sht procs in 1

[pliant topaz]

sure, but again, it just depends on what u want from the spec

if you have any vision / idea for it

[warm marlin]

what if shadow focus was energy cost outside dance

[pliant topaz]

which i doubt they do

[alpine wraith]

i want devs to put all the builder talents

[warm marlin]

and not terrible

[alpine wraith]

and just delete them dont mind if they just leave a blank

[pliant topaz]

again, its all what u want from the spec

[alpine wraith]

you can put this picture there

🦖

[pliant topaz]

do u want it to spam outside dance? spam in dance? starve outside? starve inside?

[alpine wraith]

like we had for NS for like 1 year

[pliant topaz]

as long as u have a vision u can make it happen

i personally think this version of sub is fine

im not that attached to energy

[plush roost]

They should make a button thats identical to backstab but it requires you to alternate with backstab out of cds so i have some varitey

Ong

[pliant topaz]

but if its like this, i wonder if theres better ways because energy being like this outside kinda feels suffocating at times (atleast did for me)

backstab could just hit really hard but have a x second cd

and no need for energy

u could get the exact same pattern of button presses

but less suffocating feeling of being dry

idk

it all depends on what u want

[plush roost]

Wait let this man cook, an out of dance builder on a cd sounds kinda nice

[hazy breach]

Goremaw is like putting ketchup on an italian carbonara

[north schooner]

I mean, they clearly don't envision sub builders to do much. So why are half the talents (lie) about builders? What is their expectation of those talents?

[hazy breach]

Just not it

[pliant topaz]

https://tenor.com/view/mario-mamma-mia-gif-12730074586093078200

[warm marlin]

@hazy breach how much does finality actually affect coup

since we were discussing it

[alpine wraith]

it works but not greatly

finality might get a bit more power

[lilac stag]

Bring back old Goremaw complete with the weapon master interaction.

[hazy breach]

Idk seems to have changed since i checked in early s2

[alpine wraith]

old goremaw was almost 900% ap

[pliant topaz]

run a sim with finality and without finality (use a talent that doesnt affect damage some utility shit instead) compare differences ez

[alpine wraith]

this one is 300%

wonder what would happen if goremaw did triple dmg

[lilac stag]

half backed neutered talents is what we get instead

[warm marlin]

wish i could do it on ptr but i suppose i will try it on live

[alpine wraith]

im still so sad we have krangled WM

instead of real wm

[warm marlin]

but finality SHOULD be good since evis/coup are such a massive part of your damage profile on ptr

[north schooner]

900% ap is like ~5 shadowstrikes

[hazy breach]

'So if finality is up > it buffs all 3 hits
If finality is not up it doesnt buff the first hit, but then it activates finality which seems to buff the second and third hit anyway'
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1033875562797735977/1349014289515810836/image.png?ex=685d4df6&is=685bfc76&hm=cfa52429ce96f9d70e5051b06f638e92e5471aa42f967656559141cb48ce4dab&

This is from march

[pliant topaz]

oh they changed the behaviour

big buff to coup then

[hazy breach]

But evidently your screenshots are different

[warm marlin]

yeah from my logs this month it was not working that way

[hazy breach]

So idk

[warm marlin]

[pliant topaz]

xD

[warm marlin]

wait

is it because you're only showing phys part of coup

[swift tinsel]

The screenshot I post was from ptr last night

[hazy breach]

No

I only showed phys because it was easier to see

[lilac stag]

[lucid jackal]

Sub has had a weird history with generators, it's not just a now thing

Stuff like the rotten, gloom blade, and such have always been a part of the spec, despite it being "the big burst" spec

Even look at sl with the er big boom builds

They were PvP mainly but the idea and pieces have always been there

[pliant topaz]

some people wanted to spam builders like season 1/2 dragonflight they liked that, then some older sub enjoyers were like no its a finisher spam, then devs got confused and threw their hands up and said cant decide, heres a shit show pot of both that make no sense, go figure it out

[north schooner]

rotten somewhat makes sense with SS and FW for instance. The damage boost is like getting a piece of candy as a treat

[warm marlin]

somehow coup is gaining MORE from finality than evis is (7% vs. 13%)

[pliant topaz]

depends on implementation could be

[hazy breach]

Well ye because it works like I described in sims

[pliant topaz]

if its how eleem says (which he says it is) then itll be more

[warm marlin]

[pliant topaz]

but is sims the same as how it works on live?

not even allah can answer that one chief

[hazy breach]

Idk havent checked since i made that post in march

Probably some silly version control oupsie got it reverted

[pliant topaz]

would be funny if they had 2 scripts and everytime you called coup, it would randomly execute one of those scripts

just to mess with you

[hybrid prism]

@hazy breach What helm enchant do you recommend?

[pliant topaz]

dont tell him, hes only the 2nd coolest connor. imposter

[plush roost]

They do run seperate scripts for different characters.

Its why when I roll the bones it takes 11 attempts for a 5 buff and zac rolls them on command :/

(this is a shitpost)

[warm marlin]

thats brazy

[pliant topaz]

okay but i wouldnt be surprised if something like this was real btw.

im armin what

[plush roost]

Bro i swear that man just gets better rtb

[pliant topaz]

from what I know they did tie in the past random events to UIDs based on player accounts

[warm marlin]

oh i just read his name

lmao

[pliant topaz]

like i saw a post from shadowlands (before i played so idk) that some raid events were only going on specific players

and it was because that player had like idk lower values on something related to their accounts

or w/e

but idk

[plush roost]

Oh the UID stuff yeah. Being the lowest means you got every mechanic hahah

Its not like that since DF afaik

[pliant topaz]

usually if they use something like your account ID as a seed itll be fine but idk they could always fuck it up

[swift tinsel]

The GUID curse

[raven maple]

Heard all rouge specs are looking bad. Chat was I misinformed?

[hybrid prism]

He's corporate, Big Connor is lying to you. I am clearly the coolest. Tell me the helm enchant.

[north schooner]

GUID-based targeting

[swift tinsel]

Rogue will be the strongest most handsomest class in the game

[hazy breach]

The duel in top for sure works this way

[hybrid prism]

ELEEM HELP ME

[hazy breach]

With the boys i push with ive never been in there with my dk

[swift tinsel]

Search your feelings

[hazy breach]

Its always shaman+x

[hazy breach]

With what

[raven maple]

Handsomest class without a doubt

[hybrid prism]

what helm enchant do i use

[hazy breach]

Gushing or void ritual, like the pin says

[hybrid prism]

i have been using twilight dev since echoing void was bugged but idk what to use

oh its pinned

that would require me to have a brain my b

is one better for both raid and m+?

nvm thats in the pin

thx for the help!

[swift tinsel]

Hehehe

[north schooner]

then why do the duelists change between duel phases sometimes? unless bait

[swift tinsel]

All of them lowrolled

[hazy breach]

Idk

All im saying is our shaman is down there literally 100% of the time

Not almost always

Literally always

[swift tinsel]

That happens with one of our hunters in raid

They get every single ranged mechanic known to man

[hybrid prism]

how much worse is gushing wound in m+? I like that effect more than void ritual

[north schooner]

what I have seen with abilities which use GUID for targeting in the past, is that they tend to heavily favour specific people but still target 1-2 other people occasionally. So it might be that it always favours 2 people in the duels

[swift tinsel]

We have another guy who has to have high rolled his because he never gets shit but his rolls are immaculate and he’s gotten tons of the old mount drops in the game on just a couple of attempts

Gmod, mimirons head, alar, invincible

[hybrid prism]

how do i change my icon to trickster?

[swift tinsel]

Channels and Roles

[haughty mural]

Feel the trickster

Be the trickster

[hybrid prism]

there we go

thanks friends

haha

soon though deathstalker will be better and ill swap back and be so happy

[swift tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/one-of-us-wolf-of-wall-street-wolf-of-wall-street-gif-pelf-pelfort-gif-2709546633117027040

[haughty mural]

[swift tinsel]

You say that but I urge you to try it on ptr lol

Because you will not think that for long

Whatever frustrations there are with trickster tier are objectively worse for deathstalker

Unless they stealth fixed mark bug

[hybrid prism]

I do like the trickster play style marginally more but i like the theme of ds better. Plus the mark is a cool concept

makes me feel hella shadowy and roguey

[swift tinsel]

It could be cool if not for the bug

[hybrid prism]

ye

so would yall choose void ritual to just set and forget for all content?

[runic trail]

Thats what I'm doing

[swift tinsel]

Spoiler I don’t even have a helm enchant or belt on my rogue atm

[hybrid prism]

traitor

[swift tinsel]

I just resubbed a few days ago lol

[jade urchin]

is it just me or does every tset on ptr stink super hard for all 3 specs

[swift tinsel]

I kinda like the fatebound one from the bit I played it on outlaw

Sub one is potentially nice depending on what they do with 2pc

[jade urchin]

depending on if we get energy for second coup u mean

[swift tinsel]

That doesn’t come into play too terribly often

[jade urchin]

idk i felt like it happened all the time

[swift tinsel]

And it’s more often building the cp vs having energy to finish

Farming a lil bit of sht stacks before the first coup helps tho

And depending on how close you are to flag you just don’t send anyways

So you can go into it with sht stacks farmed and 2x coup ready to rip

[jade urchin]

fair fair

but thats mad annoying

[swift tinsel]

I need to toy around with double on use a bit more

[hybrid prism]

yall like static charge or critical chain?

[swift tinsel]

Though I’m probably just gonna go with execute sigil and spymaster

Gonna try and get better logs if ptr doesn’t kick me out every couple minutes like last night

[jade urchin]

im just gonna cope that release will feel better to me

[swift tinsel]

People were dooming hard about s2 set and it ended up being pretty whatever

Plus it’s still early and things can change

[alpine wraith]

s2 set was good in spec identity

but what we got was fine too

[hybrid prism]

I enjoyed this tier

[alpine wraith]

a bit of an overnerf but what can you do

[jade urchin]

they removed the 30 seconds of rupture last minute tho

[alpine wraith]

we were mid to bad now only mid

[hybrid prism]

I'm just a pugger these days though and usually only clear about half the raid in mythic and go for 3k

I'm cool with being mid

that means we hopefully wont get nerfed

[swift tinsel]

That comes a week before it hits live

Kekw

[hybrid prism]

I'm just sick of all the people on reddit that have rogue ALTS and complain because they can't handle the specs advocating for complete reworks. It's really annoying. The playstyle of sub is so fun rn

[swift tinsel]

Yeah forums are like that too

That plus Xaeth and Mafic arguing

[jade urchin]

i think the only thing about rogue thats unfuin to me rn is killing spree

the live version that is

[hybrid prism]

it pisses me off so much. like just because you cant handle the sub cooldown window doesnt mean we have to completely rework the spec so you can have an easier time on your freaking alt! The actual rogue mains are pretty content with what we have right now. They can kick rocks

[alpine wraith]

sub cd window is argubly the hardest it has been kinda these last years

you have to do dmg for almost 30 secs

global by global

before you had some setup and timing

but it was 5 secs

or 8 secs

[jade urchin]

and thats fine because we have other specs in the game that are the opposite

diversity is fun

[hybrid prism]

Yeah, its awesome and so fun

i would be super pissed if it changed

if you do it right, you freaking pump. If you do it wrong, you are cooked and a chump

so are the sims also wrong on echoing void? it is simming half a % better for me

[runic trail]

Still bugged

[hybrid prism]

oh i see. The sims are bugged at showing higher than it actually does in game. TY.

y'all taking static charge or critical chain?

[jade urchin]

autopilot crit chain

no think

[hybrid prism]

So i've got a 671 jastor diamond, ritual bone band, and a 681 crafted ring. The sims are saying to use the bone band with the crafted ring and not jastor with it. Does that sound like the call?

[haughty mural]

If robot tells so

[jade urchin]

we trust robot

[hybrid prism]

beep boop

[haughty mural]

I sit on double crafted ring atm because robot told me to

[hybrid prism]

you can use double crafted?

[jade urchin]

ye

[haughty mural]

Yuh

[hybrid prism]

like 2 ring of earthen craftsmanship

?

[jade urchin]

yes

[hybrid prism]

what the hell

[haughty mural]

Yup

[hybrid prism]

i have no clue

[haughty mural]

[brittle plinth]

That doesn't mean anything. If you ask reddit; every spec in the game requires a full rework.

[haughty mural]

One crit/vers and one vers/mastery

[hybrid prism]

yeah but i dont want blizzard to change shit because of that

[hybrid prism]

can you do double vers / mast

[jade urchin]

if it tells u to not wear jastors u prolly have enough mastery

but sim if i unsure

[brittle plinth]

They ain't gonna change much cause of reddit. They would look at low player count and think something might be needed but it won't be cause of reddit.

[haughty mural]

I believe so yes

[brittle plinth]

Heroic jastor isn't all that good based on my sims

[fallow nimbus]

Does our new set work on the ptr?

[jade urchin]

even myth jastor barely won over crafted ring for me

[hollow spear]

Myth jastor is 9k better than a crafted ring for me

[brittle plinth]

9k is worth it for the ilvl increase

[graceful crown]

i tried sub for 1 month and had fun, but i was so used to the rotation of outlaw, that having 30s of doing just ruptures in pulls waiting for cds to comeback to do real damage... is ugh

[brittle plinth]

That 0.01 ilvl

[graceful crown]

still an honorable spec tbh

skilled

[brittle plinth]

Outlaw is funny

It feels like im driving on ice

It really is a fun spec that is poorly designed in all the right ways

[graceful crown]

yeah haha

i had a fun season with outlaw

sad i had to stop at 17s i didnt have more patience waiting for keys in pugs

[brittle plinth]

I'm waiting to finish my 3k up before diving in deep outlaw

50 points off

[graceful crown]

fight! :)

[brittle plinth]

Have my dbl tfury xmog ready to go on my weapons in my bag

[river hedge]

How strong is Ratfang Toxin for Sub? Bloodmallet is saying's it's not great and the guides also say the same thing, but sim are saying not to replace it with any other trinket of the same ilvl.

[brittle plinth]

What's your other trinkets

There's a lot of missing info

[river hedge]

I have house and junkmasetro's mage magnet.
Running 8/8 hero, upgrade all equipped gear to the same level, patch 5 min.

If it's ok I can throw the sims into chat

[hazy breach]

I mean magnet isnt fantastic either

[river hedge]

Like I know eye does get value after 6 mins, but shouldn't be the only trinket out of say hotline, seaforium and stuff

[hazy breach]

Most trinkets are fairly well balanced as your second trinket

Would generally just recommend pacemaker for most things just because it requires no extra thinking

[river hedge]

I know most classes do enjoy pacemaker, but the sims are putting it as a 6,5k dps lost or .3% over cards and ratfang combo so just was a bit confused on that

[fallow nimbus]

For me it a tiny bit worse than the goon squad but not having the lust effect is like a 5k downgrade

[hazy breach]

Ratfang isnt available at myth track and most recommendations are based on the highest ilvl available

Especially now that dinars allow you to buy a guaranteed myth pacemaker once youve done all 12s

[river hedge]

True on that. This toon still needs to work up to 12s so working mostly on heroic upgrades into mythic stuff. I'm sure the sims would be difference siming for a mythic trinkets.

But I'm also seeing the small upgrade from the hotline only giving me like 200 extra dps. So maybe the sims are right?

[brittle plinth]

I'd avoid multiple on-use. The 3 you're looking at all are on-use which may be the primary issue with getting something ahead.

Ratfang isn't objectively bad but the on use would be hoc which is better. Do you have any passive ones?

I guess objective is the wrong word, it's not great but two on-use makes it worse.

[hybrid prism]

how much mastery is too much?

[river hedge]

No sadly some what just started gearing this rogue up. Why I was doing drop sims to see what I would want to hunt for. If I was going off bloodmallet and the guides I wouldn't mind the thug hotline just to not have so many clicky trinkets.

[brittle plinth]

BM won't distinguish between active and passive is where I got stuck too.

Can you target floodgate 7+?

[river hedge]

That's a hard maybe. At worst I can kidnap people to run me through 12 floodgate XD

[brittle plinth]

That may be helpful too, since I believe anyone can roll on it?

[river hedge]

As long they are dps and not a caster I think so

[brittle plinth]

If you got 12m friends who can also roll on it, you don't even need to time it

[west tide]

i feel like we gonna be good

[river hedge]

Time to cash all those healer favors I've been stacking XD

[polar vessel]

hello, I have a problem everytime I do a +7 target rotation with storm and powder I deal a lot less damage than just basic backstab eviscerate rotation

maybe my stats could be the problem since I'm only 661 but I feel like I already have a solid stat distribution with 19k mastery and 16k vers

do you guys have any idea why

[chrome palm]

Do you have logs of your rotation? You should only use storm once in dance to spread find weakness via the rotten, and coup de grace has a higher priority than black powder at all target counts

[polar vessel]

no sorry I don't have any logs I've only done 10s and 12s for gear, I'll log some keys where packs don't die instantly

alright I've pretty much spammed storm instead of backstab so I'll fix this next time ty

but yeah it's not even close when I press powder instead of evis

[chrome palm]

You still use storm to build outside of dance

instead of backstab

[polar vessel]

yup I got this

[graceful crown]

man, there's always something new to learn with sub LOL

i always learn new things

[chrome palm]

but in dance with symbols you want to consume the first stack of the rotten with backstab or shadowstrike and then the next builder in 7+ should be storm to spread find weakness

find weakness makes your black powder do 30% extra damage as shadow (shadowed finishers)

assuming that youre running the standard m+ build

[polar vessel]

ya for premeditation also right

I think I am

but still that wouldn't explain the difference between evis and powder rotation

I'll just come back with logs 😄

[graceful crown]

what's the difference between the normal build and the dark brew one?

like dps wise

[chrome palm]

dark brew build sims higher but only because TFD's value is not reflected in dungeon slice

[hazy breach]

My guess is that youre storming too much instead of striking, thus never proccing coups or any of the trickster stuff

[fleet wharf]

I was messing around a bit on the PTR, but shouldn't deathstalker's mark work a bit differently for sub if they want us to ever take it? llike both backstab and shadowstrike is so shitty for us. Like wouldn't this be a lot more exciting if it buffed our next finisher instead?

[lucid jackal]

Deathstalker was good in s1

[fleet wharf]

Wasn't it only usable on pure ST only? like it was barely better than trickster iirc?

[chrome palm]

It was 3% ahead in pure st

[fleet wharf]

oh, that's not insignificant

[chrome palm]

So still better on fights like bloodhound horror very late in the tier on reclear

[fleet wharf]

why not also on kyveza?

[chrome palm]

Also on kyveza

[fleet wharf]

i guess there was a fair number of ST fights last tier, Sikran too

[lucid jackal]

This is a near 0 ST tier so

We just play trickster on everything

It's not like its 30% behind or smthing

Its probs like, 5% at most, if anything

[fleet wharf]

but isnt deathstalker also way behind even on ST fights?

[lucid jackal]

It might be better on pure st, legit duno rn

[fleet wharf]

oh, no one tested it huh

[random hare]

i did

trickster is very good numerically from when i tested on st, gameplay is quite shit, but its eearly so we cant know

sub is always good early on

st is super super high in m+

[fleet wharf]

until they buff us with 3 weeks left in the tier

[random hare]

actually i lied

[fleet wharf]

then we're gaming

[random hare]

sub isnt super super high

mage does 1m more dps

but mage is mage idk

they're doing 4.5m st

their tier set is crazy

its nice to fit double sectechs in 1 dance

legit a coup pump simulator

feels rly bad that coup costs energy

that should be changed

because sometimes u cant even cast the 2nd coup due to low energy

but thats only in st and when u cant send a symbols

happens quite often in m+

it'll be fine in raid tho

[tepid trellis]

time to pool energy for double coups

the real energy mingame we have all been lookin for

[random hare]

btw stealthi

theres a trinket better than the one we had in s1

[hybrid prism]

my 671 energy drink is simming higher than my 671 kezan and pacemaker. guess were going with that for my second trinket until i get a 684 pacemaker

[random hare]

the orb one

forgot what its called

[hybrid prism]

which i think will be better but who knows

[random hare]

we got a spymaster trinket

[chrome palm]

Oh prism

[random hare]

when i checked the amount of agi is very similar

i think the new one is better

[chrome palm]

The damage effect on that is also higher than any other trinket too

[random hare]

by a good amount

[chrome palm]

That is gonna get nerfed for sure

[random hare]

also

the new trinket is undersimming

[fleet wharf]

i think it's even m ore than what the transmitter gave if you'd scale it at 1.5 min

[random hare]

no not rly

its like spymaster

so

it wont be nerfed

[chrome palm]

I mean the damage effect might get nerfed

[random hare]

idk about that

[chrome palm]

It did more damage than the soul hunter trinket for me

[fleet wharf]

i thought it was mostly a stat stick

[random hare]

maybe

[random hare]

well the dmg compensates for the agility loss

u need to be aware of that

so

it is definitely op i know, but i dont think it will get a nerf, low chance imo

because its like

trying to be a normal trinket

but in real gameplay, mechanics and downtime etc buffs the trinket alot

and makes it op

cuz it ramps

[chrome palm]

I’m not sure how good it will be since you don’t have the on use for opener

[warm marlin]

When I was hitting dummy today it was only like 2%

[chrome palm]

And you don’t get stacks outside of combat in m+

[random hare]

ye maybe

[warm marlin]

Which is still very good for that kind of trinket to be clear

[random hare]

we'll see how sims

im sure it'll be great tbh

but ye might be shit since it starts at 0 idk

[chrome palm]

Atleast we get 2 trinkets we can use this tier

[random hare]

honestly u know what

i think sub might play double on use

[chrome palm]

Maybe we use that and the forge master trinket

[random hare]

ngl

the 45k agi and the 55k agi trinket

use 45k on opener, 55k on 2nd window

45k on 3rd cd

55k on 4th cd

could be very good

ngl

@tepid trellis thoughts?

[warm marlin]

Definitely an option

[tepid trellis]

Doubt

[random hare]

why

[chrome palm]

Also the spymaster type trinket lasting for 20s

[random hare]

u sure i think it lasted more

or?

[chrome palm]

I thought the stat on use was for 20s

[random hare]

idk i dint check

[tepid trellis]

Passive trinket available would have to be actual garbage

[warm marlin]

Running a second on use griefs your spymaster window

[chrome palm]

But that would let you maybe fit 3rd sec tech in?

Idk

[random hare]

all passive ones are garbage

[chrome palm]

Probably not

[warm marlin]

they did look kinda ass ngl

[tepid trellis]

They Will Tune Them

[warm marlin]

The execute one has potential

[random hare]

HOWEVER CHAT

listen for this one

[tepid trellis]

Its early ptr

[random hare]

there's an op delve trinket that gives 30k mastery, be ready to wait for that to be at 15 stacks so u can send ur cds

and u all know what 30k mastery means

double ur dps

passive btw

[chrome palm]

Is that the overlapping one

[fleet wharf]

is that a new trinket?

[random hare]

new delve trinket

idk what du mean by overlaping

[fleet wharf]

surely I'll get it week 1 and not 13

[random hare]

it just stacks ramps to 15 stacks then 10 seconds of 30k mastery

[chrome palm]

One of the passives has a stat proc that can overlap

[random hare]

so sub rogues will play around that im sure of it

its also agi main stat

so its great

[chrome palm]

Pray that it procs before adds spawn

[random hare]

30k mastery, 20% uptime in m+ btw

super great in m+

cuz it gives stack per kill on any mob

ngl

i think the 55k 45k agi trinkets will be good together too

might be rly good ngl

because the 55k agi ramps to 3 mins

so its legit perfect

[chrome palm]

I wonder if the forge master one is better if you hold for 2nd dance in blades

Since you lose primary with every ability

[fleet wharf]

it's kind of weird, because spymaster was only good if you were able to juice it up all the way. on shorter fights not having a trinket on opener really sucked

[random hare]

dopuble coup is very fast btw

u send double sectechs in first dance window

its super op

[chrome palm]

Without tfd?

[random hare]

tfd is about to sim very wild

[random hare]

idk i didnt play enough

if u pre ramp i assume u can

[fleet wharf]

btw can we get better weapons in PTR or what? I haven't used PTR much in the past

[random hare]

pvp vendors

they scale with ilvl in m+ and raid

so np

[chrome palm]

That’s why you’ll see super low ilvl trinkets from ptr vendors

Cuz they just get scaled

[random hare]

cant wait for raid tests

to use my dmg abuse gear

and do 10m pure st

i love ptr

i have a trinket that sims 10% dps gain over the bis sin trinket rn

one of the op old trinkets

[chrome palm]

They’re gonna nerf us pre season again 😭

[random hare]

nah dw its guild raid we dont log

[mystic minnow]

Is there a reason people are using TFD in raid? I thought the reset macro didn't work on bosses?

[brisk onyx]

[fleet wharf]

if the fight's below 5 min it's better than weapon master from what I understand

[random hare]

tfd is very strong thats why its worth even in long ish fights

[brisk onyx]

Any cocked @random hare

[tepid trellis]

Sims equal or better on shorter fights

[random hare]

weaponmaster is essentially useless

[mystic minnow]

heard, ty

[random hare]

or what stealthi said

[random hare]

cocked

or u mean cooks

[brisk onyx]

Oh ye

[chrome palm]

Any cocks @random hare

[brisk onyx]

typo

[random hare]

autocorrect

[brisk onyx]

[random hare]

wtf bro

whats ur search history

send now

[random hare]

for which spec

i have a big cook but im sure ppl will find out instantly anyway

[brisk onyx]

sub

[random hare]

i wanna keep it hidden so that ppl dont fix it

blizzard*

[chrome palm]

Goremaws I fucking knew it

[random hare]

can send in dm's tho

[brisk onyx]

👍

[random hare]

if u wanna know but ye w.e

just dont want it fixed pre season

cuz its kinda cool

[pearl swan]

Send thru the build king

[warm marlin]

Good luck proccing it in spymaster

I despise variance and avoid these proc trinkets whenever possible

Idc if it’s slight dps loss on average

[swift tinsel]

Caps at hero track too

[random hare]

nah i wouldnt say that man

the stats it offers is way too high in comparison to any other passive trinket in the game

its incredibly overtuned

[swift tinsel]

Have you seen the execute one

[random hare]

30k mastery is alot, idk login and check ur mastery and you'll know what i mean

[swift tinsel]

Yeah but getting it to proc when you benefit most is tricky

Bc you have like no control

[random hare]

u can know when it procs bro

[warm marlin]

yeah it’s turbo amount of stats but even with the extra uptime in m+ from mobs dying it’s still only 20%?

[random hare]

no u literally see

when it procs

[swift tinsel]

Yeah but the stacking isn’t like spymaster

Assuming you’re talking about void stone

[random hare]

u literaly see the stacks idk its easy bro

ye

[warm marlin]

but you can’t sit there and hold blades for when it procs

[swift tinsel]

I tried getting it to line up and it was annoying

[random hare]

sims will find out

[swift tinsel]

Bc you literally have to babysit it

[warm marlin]

It procs off auto attacks too

[random hare]

do u see what i mean?

thats literally

another flag window

on top of a flag

[warm marlin]

You can’t hold it for cds

[random hare]

so

ur sending double flag's

at once

xd

thats r1 sub gear full bis

19k mastery btw only

imagine 30k

thats like

100% mastery

xdd

im sure sims will do sketchy stuff

its way too broken op atm

[warm marlin]

You can hold dance for it for sure

[random hare]

i did 10m pure st no raid buffs on sin rogue with it btw

[swift tinsel]

It was proccing at like 2:45 for me

[random hare]

imagine for sub

[swift tinsel]

When I was testing it

[warm marlin]

But then how are you also holding coup

[random hare]

idk maybe u stop dps

and let it sync up for 3 min

u have so much cdr with coup anyway

so why not

u just snd snd snd

idk

we'll see

im sure the most fuccked up logs will have it on

im also sure it'll get nerfed but who knows

[warm marlin]

yea it will giga highroll sometimes

I hope it’s nerfed personally

[random hare]

30k mastery is way too stupid ngl

like

its fun af

i like it cuz

for M+ its strong

i love m+

[warm marlin]

I wish pacemaker didn’t scale like dog

4k crit at 723 ilvl

💀

[random hare]

💀

anyways

for those who think its bad idk rethink how good tfd is

because

i think this is just as good

cuz if it lines up once entire fight its already huge dps gain imo

but idk we'll see

i didnt raid with it obviously so im not sure of it at all

[swift tinsel]

Idk I’ve been liking double on use

Send 1.5min on opener, spymaster at 0:30, 1.5 at 1:30 then have a 55k mastery buff for 3min flag

Plus all the cosmic damage procs in the meantime

I’ll try out voidstone when I get home and see if I can get it to work

[warm marlin]

When I was trying it it seemed very difficult to work with

You have to full stop auto attacking and I’m somewhat sure even rupture can proc it

Didn’t seem possible to hard hold it for cds

[swift tinsel]

Rupture and poisons/autos did for me before

So it might be literal 180 away from boss lol

It’s too azerokk to me imo

[tribal blade]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aEcDU6_O1E

are we actually a few steps away from a phys comp season

[bleak night]

[tribal blade]

once again i'm baited by content creator thumbnails

just need gingi's thumbnail face

[bleak night]

me when the other mage gets pi

[tribal blade]

me when i get pulled out of stealth and have to vanish to apply mark

[bleak night]

and then the mark falls off again]

[swift tinsel]

“I can’t believe half my guild went to Method”

[tribal blade]

TRUE

[bleak night]

[tribal blade]

lol

[pliant topaz]

https://imgur.com/1nUZrGo

this moment u knew it was gg

[serene notch]

Historically doesn’t prot war start every season as a front runner but always gets gapped as people gear up?

[wicked urchin]

one of these weeks ill get a good gally log

[swift tinsel]

Idk if it’s every season but every expansion they’re usually fairly dominant

For the first part of the first season

[short radish]

who knew being able to just ignore physical damage would be really fucking strong

[swift tinsel]

Alright we got wine it’s time to hit a dummy for two or three hours

[tribal blade]

every time you can see what he's saying in his head as he's rolling his eyes

[lean arrow]

Sub really that hard to play?

[swift tinsel]

nah not really

it has a reputation for being way more complicated than it really is

[twilit phoenix]

Not really. It’s all about nailing the 1.5 min burst windows and playing around fight timings

[lean arrow]

Prob watch a guide video or somethin

to learn a bit more

cuz im noob lol

[twilit phoenix]

The wowhead guide is really good imo

And the people in this disc are usually really good about log reviews

[sullen hare]

There's a lot of good resources but once you get the understanding of how our cooldowns interact with each other you're good.

[twilit phoenix]

You’ll get it with practice king

I believe in you

[swift tinsel]

be brave, be strong

[twilit phoenix]

[sullen hare]

As zombies (autocorrected from somnius, it's your new name now) said, the guides are good

Can't be a good sub rogue without being a bad one

[random hare]

True af

[weary crescent]

Do you guys know when SecTech calcs its damage? Is it as soon as you press the button? or is it after the 1.5 sec time delay? Only ask cause sometimes I send my second SecTech in my burst window with about 1-2 sec left in Shadow blades and it seems a bit lack luster.

[lean arrow]

Ok cool ty

[warm marlin]

blizzard has asked for feedback on tier sets

i provide absolutely devious yap session

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/feedback-the-war-within-season-3-class-sets/2119870/115

[tribal blade]

nice

upvoted

[warm marlin]

they prob never read it or do any suggested changes but oh well

fun thought exercise

[swift tinsel]

it updates dynamically

so if the first hit lands in dance and the clones don't, they don't inherit the damage bonuses

[weary crescent]

oh ok thanks! So i need a solid 3 seconds left of shadow blades for it to get all the damage amp from it

[swift tinsel]

same with blades

the clones hit 1 and 1.3 seconds after the phys so as long as you have 1.5 sec left you're good

[short radish]

at least you can say "i told you so"

[weary crescent]

ok thanks haptics

[short radish]

it's funny that the solution of "allow stacks to go past max consumption" just makes life so much easier

aka add charges

[swift tinsel]

@warm marlin how high are you able to burst on ptr atm

[warm marlin]

ye it really solves most of the issues

[short radish]

adding more symbol charges

adding secret technique charges

we even had that with combo points

could go up to 10 but consume 5

[warm marlin]

idk was like 10m ish in opener at best I think

[short radish]

good times

[warm marlin]

im playing with no flask no buffs and full new ptr gear so stats are wonky

was like 30% vers

[swift tinsel]

ah yeah same lol

80% mastery, 28% vers

[warm marlin]

legit just escalating max stacks to 8 and coup not requiring fazed and its goated tier set imo

[short radish]

Not exactly a tier set specific issue, but having Disorienting Strikes active before combat (e.g., from trash or a prior pack) drastically impacts your opener.

no don't tell them that

now theyre going to fix it (like they didnt already know)

[warm marlin]

well

[short radish]

honestly surprised they hadnt patched that yet tbh

[swift tinsel]

are you popping any trinkets or anything in the opener

[warm marlin]

i explicitly didnt mention doing cringe stuff

[warm marlin]

macro prism to blades

[swift tinsel]

ah

[warm marlin]

just like "oh oopsie had disorienting from trash hehe haha"

[swift tinsel]

I'm holding it to max it for 3min blades

[short radish]

raid leader still wont give me 53 second pull timers

its so jover

[swift tinsel]

but I'm gonna try just macroing it to blades

[warm marlin]

someone asked for a 2min break on gally this week and like 4 of us hearthed out to get the stupid flower buff and i took the chance to also get my disorienting

we then insta wiped

[short radish]

flower buff?

ugh

i hated insta gally buffs

[warm marlin]

the midsummer event

you get 3% crit for 2 hours (lose on death)

[short radish]

wtf

no wonder my parses suck

[warm marlin]

we ofc 2 pulled sprocket gally mugzee this week

so i lost it every time

[short radish]

i think im just forever doomed to not get a sprocket parse

[warm marlin]

i posted a picture briefly

our sprocket buyer this week refused to jump off

he just ran around with the polarity

he knocked our tank around

he blocked us out of melee

he killed people

[short radish]

yeah

thats acutally wild

how did you resolve that

or just power through

[warm marlin]

thankfully he ate a beam on the second pull after forcing half our melee to drop 8 globals straight in lust

so we killed like 30s slower

[tribal blade]

nice and indepth, maybe if we were mages they would listen

2 changes i would want to see if letting escalating blades stack beyond 4 and put UB procs on storm too

those 2 things

[warm marlin]

you're not a #goremawbeliever?

[swift tinsel]

#GoremawisNOTaTalent

now watch, they ignore everything from your forum post except for the goremaw bits

[warm marlin]

[tribal blade]

nah screw that talent 😉

[hexed sluice]

Thats a

"I didnt buy my kills, see I was alive and fighting in these kills" type of guy if ive ever seen one

[tribal blade]

insane behavior

[hybrid prism]

The last 12 key i need is priory and once i finish it i can replace my 671 energy drink with the 684 pacemaker and that makes the rogue cloak from catalyst better than my 684 trashmaster mantle. So i can finally get rid of that piece of shit when i can time this 12

[short radish]

you can do it 👍

[vernal hull]

Mantle Sims higher when you have more bis items. I made the mistake of catalyzing mine and need it back for outlaw and sub. Mantle, mugzee glove, and vers mast ring from bandit only uppies left.

Single target anyhow, maybe the mastery is better for aoe

[hybrid prism]

I am never going to get mythic mugzee gloves or the stuff from after stix on mythic pretty much

[tribal blade]

@plush roost bricking 19 workshop to the skip before last boss makes me want to uninstall this game

[keen dome]

[hybrid prism]

https://tenor.com/view/smile-gif-22700131

[cloud rover]

Now imagine doing this, but in DoS at the Endboss

[tribal blade]

if they bring DoS back that's gonna be a painful season

[cloud rover]

44 Minutes into the bin

They would need to rework DoS entirely

[tribal blade]

i think SL had the king of toxic dungeons

[cloud rover]

It wouldnt work in this era

Most Dungeons are now at the 30 Minute mark

[tribal blade]

yeah that place was just WAY too long

so much going on

[cloud rover]

I mean you prolly would save 5 Minute, if your out of combat speed is doubled

[tribal blade]

it would be funny if they fixed that place by removing an entire wing

remove the hakkar wing

[cloud rover]

Ye

[steel zinc]

You can craft in that spot should he equal to them

[lilac stag]

tier gloves weak

[brittle plinth]

Sent one greedy shadow dance last night, felt behind on them the rest of the run.

[vocal wolf]

My favorite is ur tank leaping up and melds, then just dies to air

[tribal blade]

bro i can't stand the skips this season

we do the key pretty much flawlessly and wipe because of 1 skip at the end

[vocal wolf]

Aye we've bricked a few keys from skip borks it's tilting fs

[tulip gorge]

you know what would be nice, if they stopped making every fucking pack have true sight

so you can just skip with shroud or invis potion

like a proper human being

[glacial orbit]

just remove skips from the game

[short radish]

sorry best we can do is a potion of mindsooth

[tribal blade]

i legit can't believe they put meld into a pot

but it makes sense, they want to "fix" the problem while doing the least amount of work possible i suppose

[fleet wharf]

they can also put maghar orc in a potion too! oh wait...

[tulip gorge]

I want dwarf in a potion

[vocal wolf]

https://tenor.com/view/mopszes-be-like-blender-smoothie-gif-15312916

[tulip gorge]

what if they just made shroud stronger than true sight

[tribal blade]

yeah i like this idea

[short radish]

what if they just deleted true sight from mobs

[tribal blade]

make it so shroud ignores true sight

[tulip gorge]

so shroud is stronger than mind soothe

[short radish]

b-b-b-b-b-but then you'd need to have a rogue for every key

how will mages find a group now

or druids

[vocal wolf]

That'd be traaaagic

[tribal blade]

oh you mean like you need a boomy or vdh in every key right now 🙂

[short radish]

[tulip gorge]

not like they gave mages shroud for whatever reason

[tribal blade]

you mean you can't do half of the pulls right now without vdh and boomy soloing the cc??

this has become a rogue staple btw

"it's too powerful on rogue"

and then they give better versions to other classes

[short radish]

rogue having an aoe stun is too powerful

no other class has aoe stun

[tribal blade]

off the top of my head

sub loses combo

then a bunch of other specs get massive funnel

they put truesight on half the mobs because shroud is too powerful

then give priests no cd mind soothe

[tulip gorge]

remember when mind soothe ignored true sight

[tribal blade]

funnily enough priests kind of can get around true sight

with fade

i still remember priests soloing every single cage in brackenhide

[vocal wolf]

Good ol Brackshots

[short radish]

rogues are the true demon hunters. we've sacrificed everything

[tribal blade]

oh they took away aoe kidney because it was "too strong"

now look at vdh cc

or boomy

[tulip gorge]

wasn't aoe kidney an aoe 7 seconds stun tho

[tribal blade]

yeah but very easily tuned

by cutting the aoe portion down

easy

[fleet wharf]

yea, or make it be half as long or something that could prolly work too

[keen dome]

they blew up our sewer

[short radish]

its almost like theres a talent that makes blind aoe, but reduces its duration by half

[keen dome]

i mean it's the same shit multiple times. shurken combo, lmao

[tribal blade]

stop it you're blowing my mind right now

[short radish]

did any other class hall get lost?

[keen dome]

None of any value

[tribal blade]

yeah it keeps happening lol

i'm FRUSTRATED

[keen dome]

Rogues lost the most when Dalaran exploded

Nobody else suffered as much.

[short radish]

well

khadgar lost his legs

[fleet wharf]

yup, even more than the residents of dalaran

[runic trail]

And then the mages got a big 'oh woe is me' questline, BUT WHAT ABOUT US, HUH?

[short radish]

but yeah other than that

[short radish]

fuck mages

honestly

[tulip gorge]

not like there are people that play rogue anyway

[runic trail]

Real

[keen dome]

None. Of. Any. Value

[runic trail]

I barely class as a people so it checks out

[keen dome]

I love timewalking

[fleet wharf]

actually, the reason we're getting no attention is that we're just too good at going invis. they just can't find us so no attnetion is given

[short radish]

yet mages have better invis

[vocal wolf]

That and the rogue devs /cast vanish long ago

[tulip gorge]

come on they reworked killing spree after months of constant complaints

that counts

[tribal blade]

this happened to me the other day while queueing for keys

[runic trail]

[keen dome]

lmao

[short radish]

and cheap shot!

[void hound]

same

[tribal blade]

cheaplul

[vocal wolf]

"need beam" xd

[fleet wharf]

that's kind of a good point though. what happened to all of the rogue controls

[runic trail]

Same. DH murdered me last night on conveyors

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1304795065964564551/1387517059319074968/image.png?ex=685e4a35&is=685cf8b5&hm=be6832912288f09fc47ace3eca2b48ba59455ffa9d6602f59f7e35dc0a6e4178&

Pls

Leave me on my side

[vocal wolf]

step back to them return the favor

[fleet wharf]

just shadowstep back on him

[void hound]

thats rough

[runic trail]

It happened instantly they fucking dashed

[fleet wharf]

reaction time issue

[runic trail]

True

[vocal wolf]

Roll trickster outlaw next pull

[fleet wharf]

yea, it's going away in 6 weeks

get your chance for luls now

[runic trail]

Just go outlaw for one pull to hit killing spree

[tribal blade]

they need to take that good fix for outlaw energy into sub

[runic trail]

Show them what true fear looks like

[tulip gorge]

what fix

[tribal blade]

the KS fix

[tulip gorge]

you want sub to have adrenaline rush?

[tribal blade]

energy as in momentum haha