subtlety

[paper iron]

and since you re arogue u followed that

like

outlaw in everbloom was the trashiest thing i ve ever seen

in WM u had to play double mage

[tribal blade]

yeah outlaw wasn't too hot in the big pulls

[paper iron]

cause of the tree boss

[tribal blade]

i remember the play for that place was you played as sub till you killed the tree boss

then you died at the end of the tree boss

zoned out and respecced outlaw

for the rest

[spark dawn]

If only guild isnt lacking in rogues. I would have continued my mage

[tribal blade]

i was one of the few people who pushed that entire season as sub

because i apparently wanted pain and suffering

[paper iron]

i had so much fun as outlaw this season

new crackshot, kir was banger, dps race with zero / zac

[tribal blade]

yeah the crackshot change sound very cool

makes me willing to consider trying outlaw again

[paper iron]

that was too fun

sorry

best gameplay ever

[tribal blade]

i'm having a lot of fun with bleed sin build

i just need to remember i can press shiv kinda on cd with it

i keep forgetting

and holding charges for a nonexistant kingsbane

[paper iron]

yea same

i havent played sin since the "dry shiv" thing

so i m still a bit used to hold them

[tribal blade]

i've been getting used to the dry shiv too

i plan on playing sin for mugzee when we get there

i did alt heroic raid today

i forgot to swap back to my sin set and had my sub gear set on for locken, bandit and mugzee

/cry

2% haste and 19% crit

kms

[paper iron]

why cant dummies

stay full life

so hard to try assa stuff on them, they just perma in exec

[tribal blade]

i was having this literal problem the past 2 days

testing bleed build

you go into execute way too fast and it inflates details

i still think they need to make an instance for players where you can go in and get any buff you want, lust, special types of dummies and the ability to reset all cds whenever

[paper iron]

inflate details and energy management

since u just have perma blindslide

[tribal blade]

lol yeah nonstop blindside procs

[zenith prism]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[vestal escarp]

[gritty gorge]

Is a jastor on hero track better than mythic rings?

[ebon oyster]

sim

[alpine wraith]

for raid dps yes

[gritty gorge]

I mean mainly for M+. Dungeon Slice sim says no

[worn ivy]

how the f i sim same with tea and cb

dungeon slice

[steel horizon]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker

[vale pine]

a sandbox would be insane

[vestal escarp]

Sectech can crit by its own

[sly shore]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[worn ivy]

how big is forced induction?

[hazy breach]

Very

[worn ivy]

how much i loswe

if i drop swift death

for shadow focus

[hazy breach]

Well swift does gives you 5 second shorter symbols cd

Shadow focus quite literally does nothing

[worn ivy]

does nothing if u think about dps

i wanna use feint while dancing sometimes

also some bosses you have more uptime on boss with quick disecion

or what if i play master of shadows

actually

its better to go master of shadows

i think instead of shadow focus

[hazy breach]

Master of shadows atleast gives you some energy

But then you have to not play first dance so

[sly shore]

dancing is almost the only time you can feint

you don't need to go any other talents

you have infinite energy inside dance already

[daring marlin]

how am I not gaining anything from getting 4 sets from 2 + 2 https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/o9ush2XSoysaUihVmsWpn4

[hazy breach]

Well youre not simming 4p

Youve set it to only have 1 catalyst charge, so it doesnt get 4p

[daring marlin]

oh, thanks

[strange chasm]

is there actually a world where this is true

[twilit phoenix]

He said when the buff is 25-35%

[dawn hinge]

how much of a loss are we talking about, not having a shaman buff in m+?

[hazy breach]

like 5-6%

[sick jackal]

does any1 have a legion like combo point addon/WA for my char frame?

[jovial cipher]

How sub guyz, need an alt played enh too much

[lucid jackal]

Ret

[hollow spear]

I raise you bm

[spark dawn]

No sham go sin?

[jovial cipher]

Idk nothing else is fun too me and too lazy to do 16s rn alone in pug on sham and sub looks fun but idk how the damage is

[lilac stag]

No shaman, assa def more enjoyable.

[spark dawn]

Assa st sux tho

[lilac stag]

Pull mobs into boss

Subs AOE sucks

You’ll do more overall as assa

[wild hornet]

why are people using cb on the first sectec on mythic stix?

[hoary lotus]

Cause lazy

[warm marlin]

can't remember stix super well but could make it line up better for an add set earlier in the fight

where it would not if held for 2nd sectec

[jovial cipher]

Sadge assa aint fun

[dry plank]

Assa is fun when it’s not pure st kinda. Or im trying to convince myself

[wild hornet]

tru

[cursive vapor]

!burst

[wicked jolt]

During your Flagellation and Shadow Blades you want your second Shadow Dance to be cast immediately after the first one ends. You do not
want to cast Symbols of Death at the same time as your second Shadow Dance, but rather 1 or 2 seconds later when Secret Technique has
10 seconds or less remaining. This is to make sure you supercharge the Secret Technique instead of an Eviscerate.
Because of this a Shadow Dance+Symbols of Death macro is not ideal.

[lilac stag]

Bleeder build is enjoyable. removing KB depression helps a lot

[wild hornet]

do yall prefer to use numbing or atrophic poison on stix

as an only rogue

[lucid jackal]

Atro lol

[wild hornet]

i see some top logs use numb

didnt check if its multiple rogues though

(i know its not dps related but i just noticed)

[vale pine]

you would only run numbing if you have 2 rogues

[spark dawn]

arent sub and sin aoe kinda similar? assuming mobs dont die too fast like in 10 below keys

[lilac stag]

no, the bleed build is insanely better and without the dry spells

[twilit phoenix]

Sin outscales sub in mass aoe

And had pretty good sustain even outside of cds

[lilac stag]

get a tank pulling packs when theyre at 35-40% health and assa just cranks

KB just felt like total shit in keys and now you ignore it so the flow from pack to pack is nice.

[twilit phoenix]

Crazy how turbo bad Kb is

[lilac stag]

it's like flag, doesnt feel great to not get a full use out of it. you get stuck with do I or dont I.

just a way worse version of flag

[lucid jackal]

Sin st is dog schmeat

That's the tradeoff

[lilac stag]

tank pulls mobs in, or you just deal with lower ST on some of the boss fights

we had to adjust our pulls a bit to keep chaining them

[lucid jackal]

I won't be playing sin

[lilac stag]

all three are basically play whatever you want

[spark dawn]

why cant rogue be decent on both :/

i mean they are decent but....

[lilac stag]

watching demise pop off is funny/fun

[spark dawn]

so m+ is sin/outlaw then raids is sub/sin

[lilac stag]

outlaw

[lucid jackal]

Sub is fine in keys

It does insane st and good aoe

It's just not sin aoe

[spark dawn]

hard to get accepted in keys

as sub

[lilac stag]

not everyone can be DK ;p

it's just hard getting into keys if not meta

[keen dome]

Become the meta through sheer force of will.

[lilac stag]

we finally have a decent group where our schedules work out to either get weekly done or slowly start pushing and it's way more enjoyable than dealing with lfg

[spark dawn]

its like 5x easier to get into pugs as mage even as frost vs rogue

[lilac stag]

workshop is prob only key that it's easier to get in as a rogue

people still see value in the skip

[vale pine]

thats kinda rogue tuning "its okay but not sin"

[wild hornet]

sandbag sub

[vale pine]

don't rly need to sandbag

[spark dawn]

I got more gold since rerolling from mage to rogue 🤣

Way less consumables consumed

[marble ledge]

Are we replacing Cyrce's with a 665 ring?

I guess I'll just sim

[wild hornet]

is it better i macro my tempered potion to sblades instead of flag?

or vice versa

[stoic sphinx]

i wouldnt macro it to either

you want to use it when it makes sense, not just strictly on cd

but yeah you dont potion with flag you do it with blades

or rather right before blades

[wet jacinth]

hey quick question. How do you handle a badly set up cleave ? if for example the techincians from gallywix get pulled too far away. do you stay on gallywix and cleave just "some" of the mobs or do you switch targets and try to hit the entire pack ?

[lilac stag]

if the techs (or whatever the mobs) are going to wipe you, that's your priority. Bitch at the range after the kill.

[median hearth]

I'm confused..

Why <-- Play This, when I see most use Deathstalker..? 😄

[stoic sphinx]

are you looking at assassination?

[median hearth]

Sub

[stoic sphinx]

there is no way most people are playing deathstalker sub

[median hearth]

My bad..I actually looked at the wrong.

Me dumdum

[stoic sphinx]

🙂

[median hearth]

Hawt. What's the most recommended site to read? Archon? Wowhead?

[stoic sphinx]

wowhead or icy veins guides are both good imo

archon isnt really a guide site, its just a tool you could use but imo can be quite misleading if you dont know what youre looking at

[lilac stag]

Method site is good for sub

A little more concise

All three are well done.

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[median hearth]

Roger.

[wild hornet]

mfw you pad hyenas and youre forced to hit bombshells

[median hearth]

I know Wowhead recommends me to buy Eye of Kezan with Dinars, but i'll probably buy 2x Reverb Daggers. I don't play Raids so i won't benefit much from eye of kezan.

Or 1 Reverb Dagger + 1 Crafted.

[bleak night]

if not eye then i'd buy jastors

[median hearth]

Yeah, that's doable. You get max 3 Dinar per char I think so.

[bleak night]

it was that way last time but idk if it'll be the same now

hell idek if blizzard knows how they're gonna do dinars yet

[wild hornet]

when are dinars even coming out

[median hearth]

11.1.5

[hazy breach]

Nobody knows

Maybe .5

Maybe .7

[bleak night]

probably at some point maybe possibly

[median hearth]

According to Wowhead.

[hazy breach]

Its not confirmed

[lilac stag]

There is zero reason to buy an offhand dagger

[median hearth]

Yeah, its not confirmed.

[bleak night]

blizzard said .5 or .7 but theres been no sign of them so far in .5

so im not holding out hope

[lilac stag]

When HOC mythic is sitting there

[median hearth]

But seeing as a 11.1.5 Is a mid-way patch towards next tier, so perfect for catchups.

[bleak night]

oh yeah this is sub

buy hoc

lmao

[median hearth]

hahaha

[wispy bolt]

they should remove BP and buff the fuck out of coup AOE

especially considering buffing BP will lead to only pressing BP

[median hearth]

Anyone who can share their action bars so I can try new setups ?

Also: Do I ever use Shuriken Toss? I'm 1000% New to this spec so.. Spank wisdom into me.

[light crow]

sub aoe is a hassle. i feel like a wet noodle outside of cds

[jaunty umbra]

thats when u respec assa

[light crow]

ive yet to hit over 2m dps overall at 660.

[median hearth]

Is Sub that hard?

[jaunty umbra]

no

[light crow]

i dont think so i just suck and still learning ins and outs

[sullen hare]

Ah I'm sure you'll get there

[light crow]

i will say its harder than playing my dk

[jaunty umbra]

current udk is one of the easiest specs tho

[lilac stag]

Sub has more to worry about than most specs and it’s not intuitive by wow dps terms.

If you can figure out the opener, that’s 70% or the spec.

If you’re not ok doing healer dps outside of CDs, you’re not going to enjoy the overall feel of the spec.

[hexed sluice]

Also once you learn the dungeons more, you get the feel of your cds cadence and it feels great

[light crow]

i enjoy it but running with pugs most dont understand that lol. tryna explain to them im not a ret pally who has cds up every pull gets old

[molten citrus]

not really no

[versed hazel]

Does anyone know how ppl are mogging swords as sub? Seen a couple of videos on yt/twitch for current patch where they have them

Tried the old spec swap macro tech but doesn't seem to work

[molten citrus]

you can't

you can just mog daggers that look similar to swords

like gurubashi pokers

[versed hazel]

do you know the name of some of the ones that do?

ah sweet will check, cheers

[final holly]

Is there any tech for handling the intermission on sprocket? I feel like I got an ass parse because I spent way too much time just running back to him after the knockback

[stoic sphinx]

you can get knocked directly to where he is going

need good tank positioning tho

[final holly]

How do you know which way he is going

[stoic sphinx]

locations are set

[final holly]

Huge

I had to skip a whole SD sectech because I had enough downtime to not get the cdr for 2 SDs in the flag blades right after

[waxen lotus]

How bad in practice is it to play without an on use trinket? Im on one arm mythic and playing with transmitter is tilting me. My guild gave house of cards to a DK...

[iron fjord]

warlock gate -> shadowstep
no?

[stoic sphinx]

grab the pvp trinket

[iron fjord]

dks need it just as much as subs, you'll get the next one for sure

[stoic sphinx]

afaik its not better than myth transmitter but its close enough if you hate transmitter

[lucid jackal]

U literally shouldn't play the spec without an on use

Play sin instead

[median hearth]

Where is most of our AoE Income coming from in Keys ?

[lucid jackal]

And go get priory

[lucid jackal]

Nimble flurry and sectec

[waxen lotus]

I cant play sin we need me on bombs

[lucid jackal]

Then gg enjoy mitter

[median hearth]

are they passives ?

[iron fjord]

yes, no

[lucid jackal]

Well secret technique is like

The entire spec

Nimble flurry is a passive yes

[median hearth]

So..Say In a big pull like..Meadery start. Do I swap targets often, or do I just cleave off my main target?

[iron fjord]

As long as your main target has "fazed" and "find weakness" on it you can swap around freely

[stoic sphinx]

spread ruptures as its being gathered then focus down the big boys full cds

no need to target swap

[iron fjord]

we good at prio dmg

[median hearth]

What's easier for me to play as a pure noob on rogue: Sub or Assa?

I suck at target swapping 😄

[lucid jackal]

Probably sub

[stoic sphinx]

sub is very strict about cd sequencing but once you get that down it kinda plays itself

sin has a lot more choices about what to press depending on the situation

[median hearth]

CD Sequencing? So..How do I go about CDs, use whenever ready, or hold em for specific instances..?

[stoic sphinx]

sub is basically just dont fuck over your burst by using abilities in the correct order and making sure to pool when needed

[lucid jackal]

U should read a guide

[median hearth]

yeeeah

[lucid jackal]

Sub is easy when u know the rules

U can't really just freeball it

[twilit phoenix]

Easy for Guy to say

[median hearth]

kek

[twilit phoenix]

He’s one of the best to ever do it

[lucid jackal]

This is true

[twilit phoenix]

Nah but fr sub is ez

Just read a guide and practice

[median hearth]

I'm leveling using Hekili atm, i've got some learning disability. I've gotten other specs down ezpz, I just don't know if i'll be able to memorise the spec without.

[stoic sphinx]

ive played all 3 this season i think sub is the easiest of the 3 tbh

[median hearth]

[stoic sphinx]

hardest thing as a sub rogue is getting house of cards

[tepid trellis]

Assa in raid is by far the easiest to do well on

that shit got strip'd of everything

nothing matters anymore

just envenom

[median hearth]

heh

[paper iron]

[median hearth]

What's that ability nerfed AF In DF? 😄 Least the first 2 seasons?

[stoic sphinx]

psychic link

[paper iron]

exsang

[median hearth]

yh

[paper iron]

went from a 3mn cd

to a 45s

to a 1.30

to a passiv now

[median hearth]

I remember it being super busted at the start of DF 😄

[paper iron]

yea it was in a bad state

was so good that u delayed you dm for it and all, really weird

[median hearth]

I've got 2 chars with 663 Ilvl yet I struggle to find a class I enjoy and have fun with :x

[brittle plinth]

They're all fun when you leveling and gearing up I find

[brisk onyx]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[midnight jetty]

at the tail end of my Shadow Blades window, sometimes i might have ~1 second left on Shadow Blades when I hit SecTech. When I do this, does SecTech get the full buffed damage from shadow blades?

Like a "snapshot" of the damage buffs I have at the time I cast the ability?

[hazy breach]

It does not snapshot

[midnight jetty]

i feel like i can barely squeeze the second SecTech in CD window in real-world scenarios like keys, having to dodge things or do other mechanics

[hazy breach]

It shouldnt be that tight unless youre missing a ton of globals

Are you using sectech as your second finisher in dance? Because thats not ideal

[midnight jetty]

well my parses in heroic are like green so i'm definitely doing something wrong. 659 ilvl

Shadowstrike, Flag, Rupture, Symbols, Shadow Blades, Shadow Dance, SecTech is how i open and i believe is correct

[tribal blade]

i was fighting a rare elite in undermine and it died during my DM

wtf

oh wait nvm there were small shitter mobs in the pull too

[shrewd lantern]

Do you have a transmitter or hoc

[midnight jetty]

at the training dummies i can hit my second SecTech + Cold Blood with about 4 seconds left on Shadow Blades

No, I'm playing rogue as an alt and just started it about two weeks ago. hoping to get hoc in vault

[hazy breach]

Pvp trinket?

[shrewd lantern]

yeah at 659 without an on use

dont expect more than blue parses in hc

[midnight jetty]

i have signet of priory

[shrewd lantern]

doesnt work

[midnight jetty]

and seaforium pacemaker

[empty oyster]

starting mythic mugzee prog tomorow, is it better to play sub or assa?

[hazy breach]

Ye should get the pvp trinket so you have an on-use for every cd

Its massively better than priory

Doesnt take much effort to get it either

[midnight jetty]

Here's a log from H Mugzee kill comparing me to a 665 ilvl rogue with HOC and Eye of Kezan. A lot of our casts are pretty similar so I feel like i'm doing things relatively well, i just don't have BIS trinkets

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/compare/C1Yf7byrxqXBzgpH/self?fight=3%2C3&type=summary&source=4%2C1

[shrewd lantern]

playing sub without a trinket for your cds

[hazy breach]

Typically assa. The bulk of the hard parts are in p2 and thats where you need the damage

[shrewd lantern]

is not worth

[finite spire]

Hey if I don't really have the means to swap between high crit for Sin and high Vers for sub...am I truly losing out on 1% of vers = 1% more damage for sub? If someone has 20% vers and I have 5%, are they actually going to do 15% more damage?

[hazy breach]

Which is in execute where sin does really well

[shrewd lantern]

also sus energy drink from delves

is probably just as good as kezan

[hazy breach]

I mean yes if you have literally no stats, but you have like 18% crit instead

[shrewd lantern]

for short-mid kills

idk

[hazy breach]

Which on average is gonna be fairly similar

It doesnt matter that much

[bleak wind]

assa seems better on last 2 bosses, and most likely come the .5 patch everything will go back to how it was last tier

[hazy breach]

Ye where sub is technically about the same as assa

But assa is gonna have 10x players

[bleak wind]

yep

[midnight jetty]

why is assa so much more popular?

[bleak wind]

easier to play

[hazy breach]

Outlaw tanking a """"5%""""" "nerf" without compensation is quite funny to me as well

[midnight jetty]

oh sub wasnt that hard to learn

[bleak wind]

sub can be weird depending on fight timers

[shrewd lantern]

sub is learn the cd sequence

[bleak wind]

ye kinda

[covert pine]

sub is gay

[shrewd lantern]

assa is always the most popular

since its the easiest spec

[midnight jetty]

i quickly learned to hold CDs on Rik Reverb until after he does his first stun slam

[bleak wind]

I can see it actually being exactly like last tier, outlaw sneking up top damage here and there followed by assa and sub with the majority being assa

[shrewd lantern]

its slowly reaching bm hunter/ret paladin level of drooler

[hazy breach]

surely sub gets a small buff

Just like outlaw got a compensation buff last tier for being unfairly nerfed hc week

[shrewd lantern]

i feel people always fumble specs where you have to press particular buttons

in a short timeframe

see fire mage

[covert pine]

need dopamine

[shrewd lantern]

outlaw is dopamine just turn off details

[bleak wind]

imo the tier set needs something but doubt we get anything

[honest brook]

i feel sub is too on burst cds

[hazy breach]

Im moreso expecting aoe buffs

[honest brook]

only sin is boring for me

[covert pine]

sin is

[hazy breach]

But the ST is also quite mid, only reason its fine on overall log statistics is because sub is decently good at padding

[covert pine]

except no sub cds -> backstab ... Zzzz.. backstab ... Zzzz.. evis? Zzzzz

[bleak wind]

assa has little to no skill expression right now, like even pooling energy is gone

[honest brook]

ye

[lucid jackal]

Sin during the entire fight?

[covert pine]

lol yes

[hazy breach]

Also bruh why did they add these corruptions back into the game

[shrewd lantern]

Thats how sub should be

[hazy breach]

If theyre just gonna make em pissweak

[shrewd lantern]

its always been the burst spec

[bleak wind]

apparently even 'padding' the shit out of the 1m40 adds on bandit is not even close to assa since it does like 400k more boss damage

[shrewd lantern]

we dont talk about the abomination that was late sl/early df sub

[hazy breach]

Ye ik

[shrewd lantern]

People who liked spamming shadowstrike for 30secs

[short radish]

tbh the downtime in sub is great

for me to stretch my hands/wrists

[bleak wind]

an then assa is an acceptable PI target so numbers gets scewed even more

[honest brook]

😂

[short radish]

it's acutally the perfect boomer spec

no joke i can take my hands off the keybord

[vital stump]

I loved df s1 sub, didnt raid, but in keys had a lot of fun playing it

[short radish]

and just rotate my wrists around a bit

loosen it up

[hazy breach]

I mean its not really

[bleak night]

if you're using pi on sin in raid you need a new raid

[bleak wind]

'acceptable' as in you know people are gonna do it

[hazy breach]

Ye ofc

Its not sub rogue

[lucid jackal]

Sin gets PI cuz its not terrible for it

Sub doesnt get PI, its bad

It will inflate the average a bit yeh

[bleak wind]

ye thats what I mean

[hazy breach]

Theres like 15 specs that are better to give PI to over assa

[bleak wind]

gonna scew the statistics a bit

[hazy breach]

But some are still gonna get it

[bleak wind]

I don't know if there is something new with this patch but seems like it now auto targets people if your 'pi target' is dead

[hazy breach]

Yes

[bleak wind]

I've been randomly getting it here and there cos my name stars with A

[hazy breach]

I think its using the same things aug buffs are doing

Where it gives it to people with cds up if possible

[bleak wind]

its very often me so I feel like its one of those id things forgot the name of it

unless it counts sub's shadow dance being ready as cooldown

[hazy breach]

I think this is it

Or you being inside dance

[bleak wind]

could be

[hazy breach]

But idk maybe its name, maybe its proximity

[final holly]

This would explain so much

[bleak wind]

I would've guessed name or id, like back in the day when you could predict who the mechanics went to because of the player id

[honest brook]

guys is darkflame trinket on sub is so bad ? anyone test it?

[hazy breach]

Which one

Theyre both alright, but nothing spectacular

[honest brook]

that darkness

[shrewd lantern]

delves have better trinkets

well, energy drink and mechano

[honest brook]

ye iam anlaky in delv and raid

[shrewd lantern]

yeah i just get noggenfucker from my map

after its nerfed

on 2 chars

[honest brook]

damn

[rotund briar]

Deathstalker is okay before 4pc, for raiding? Or should I just generally stick to Trickster?

[covert pine]

trick

[burnt loom]

stay trickster, there's always an add up to cleave off. Trickster for ST too

[rotund briar]

And so the order was given. Thank you.

[tribal blade]

lol tried simming sin bleed build dropping MA for iron wire

[spark dawn]

So we can farm pvp trinket in battlegrounds? Up to 658?

[sharp kernel]

wrong channel

[tribal blade]

no right channel

[hazy breach]

Yep

[sharp kernel]

[hazy breach]

Or you can do world pvp crates farming

[tribal blade]

all sub rogues going sin for pushing keys

it is what it is

[sharp kernel]

Ask Shindigs about that one

[rotund briar]

That's sacrilege

[tribal blade]

as casual put it

[sharp kernel]

Someones gotta do the boss damage

[tribal blade]

for some dungeons yes

[sharp kernel]

especially like ToP

[short radish]

are you noticing a substantial difference?

[tribal blade]

but for others you are gonna be going incredibly slow when you're doing the same burst dps as everyone else

[sharp kernel]

cause 5 bosses

[tribal blade]

and then tank dmg without cds

[tribal blade]

yes way more aoe

[short radish]

[tribal blade]

way way more aoe

and aoe for every pack without fail

[short radish]

fucks sake

[tribal blade]

yeah but what can you do when blizz refuses to let sub burst hard enough to warrant the downtime

sub is still playable in some of the lower target count dungeons

[burnt loom]

putting up willingly with deathstalker's mark in m+, at that point just switch class 😂

[short radish]

yeah cant say i want to deal with that shit again

[tribal blade]

yeah playing with DS is cringe

[final holly]

My perma tricks... Idk if I can go back

[tribal blade]

don't get me wrong this is just a high key pushing thing

sub is more than capable of doing weekly keys

[short radish]

no 10s require only the meta of classes

[final holly]

I also find it poetic that in the ass channel right now there's a bot post telling you to switch to sub if you want to hard switch to barrells in rik

Grass is always greener

[tribal blade]

well that's different

but yeah funny how that works haha

sub's dmg profile good in raid

[final holly]

It's definitely different I'm not equivocating, it's just mildly funny

[paper iron]

no, 10s require only the meta of classes

i fixed the sentence

you re welcome fimbulvitueur

🍺

[minor bobcat]

where would you guys recommend looking for sub rogue coaching? i was pretty decent at other specs so being only average at sub sucks but im too stubborn not to learn it right. any advice?

[median hearth]

As a nordic norwegian.. Skål

[lilac stag]

You still do boss damage. It’s not like healer damage on packs without cds.

[median hearth]

https://tenor.com/view/rage-thor-twilight-of-the-gods-furious-thunder-powers-gif-12471751030515735642

[lilac stag]

The time you make up on trash more than balances out the ST dmg

[median hearth]

I tried boomie but its too much ramping up and shit dies before i pop off

Caleb writing a lexicon

[burnt loom]

open lorrgs and see how ppl use cds. You need to get patient with your buttons and use them smart. Same goes for m+

[median hearth]

Nvm..

Ngl kinda disappointed

[burnt loom]

Lol! wouldn't be me

[minor bobcat]

ty

[median hearth]

I have no expectations of a VULPERA

[burnt loom]

[lilac stag]

!mistakes

[wicked jolt]

Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:

• Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
• Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
• Make sure you always get 8 globals of during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
• If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.

[minor bobcat]

❤️ i didnt know this was a thing

[median hearth]

[random hare]

sub is back?!?!?!??!

(deplete on 3rd boss)

[median hearth]

+17? You sexy toaster

[random hare]

should've seen our 18 cuh

(i played assa)

[median hearth]

Huh. Maybe i should go Arms..

[random hare]

ye i never see him playing fury

[median hearth]

Fury bores me

[random hare]

besides everytime i see a fury

he always does 0 dps

like

mega 0

[median hearth]

Yeah

[random hare]

that warr is good tho

[median hearth]

Fury was sexy in DF

[random hare]

one of the best

[median hearth]

Arms or Feral Cat. Mmmm. Prolly Arms

[random hare]

feral is op

legit crazy dps

but moonkin will be chosen because of "caster comps"

[median hearth]

I hate boomie. So long ramp up times.. shit dies before i get my dots up and i flatline on healer dps

[random hare]

feral is really good

its legit op

does more than sub rogue

by a good amount

and

gives 3% vers

so its rly op

[median hearth]

My seasons have been so far: aug evoker. Survival / BM. Ret Paladin.

[random hare]

but gl convincing people since boomkin exists

but ye

like

feral i think is better than boomkin dps wise in some keys

where theres like low target counts

but has no beam

thats the only downside

[median hearth]

Mmm yeah. I cant decide ngl

[random hare]

im not 100% sure but thats from what i could guess based on druids i played with

[median hearth]

Uuugh. My head

Already got 2 chars at 2600rio and 663..

But i donMt enjoy them as much

[tribal blade]

the dream

[lilac stag]

Show non-workshop / top

[random hare]

fastest rookery 16 in the world

sub entire key

[lilac stag]

That’s the UH gap I was expecting

[bleak night]

show non workshop/top/rookery

[random hare]

?!

i mean

maybe ML soon i guess

once we play it again

and darkflame xdd

[twilit phoenix]

Bet you gapped on last boss

Show last boss meter

[random hare]

ye ofc

im just afk on shield

not doing any dps whatsoever

[twilit phoenix]

Gaming

[random hare]

we're just playing around dmg amp

not details dps

but ye

[twilit phoenix]

Uhdk and arms shitters in shambles

[random hare]

4:17 min fight

its the same kill timer on 17/18/19 and 20

xd

we're mega overkilling it

[random hare]

https://tenor.com/view/aintnoway-gif-27058877

we just depleted workshop 17 due to tank using the hunt

and falling on last boss

we had infinite time

time to delete wow

[lilac stag]

Oof

[pastel rampart]

guys i found it

its back

we can use dust again

[brisk onyx]

[vale pine]

torghast returns^^

[bleak night]

someday i need to go back into torghast

and get the last achievement i dont have

thats a lot of phantasma though

[sullen hare]

Torghast 🤢

[vale pine]

still quite a bit to farm

[bleak night]

Yeah that’s why I haven’t done it yet, sounds cursed

[smoky goblet]

!mistakes

[wicked jolt]

Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:

• Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
• Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
• Make sure you always get 8 globals of during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
• If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.

[alpine wraith]

never get s old

[ancient whale]

Anyone got an wa to track when in and out of combat? So I can know when to restealth

[short radish]

no but i have a macro you can spam so it'll only keep you stealthed

and wont destealth you

[cursive vapor]

must have imo

[vale pine]

Twent seconds to Weakaura:

• create a text or icon Weakaura.
• add a trigger which is always active.
• under load select the condition "in combat" twice to only load it out of combat.
  ✅ done, took ~20 sec.
  I created an example for your:yaml !WA:2!1rvZUUnru4gLfizHG2OQi4csKBRubjKQGk1k1nifhCOfYno44BVTRCg7zS9uSNz0mJZ9MSmIfDDEeYg2GyHFe6tGvepb5rOpbCMXHcxexVXNZmNF((oZ5C6mUxzpCp8B(sjVsxqzeP)5HtE(up5v(PPkIUJ4RXuLOaTkKCLokLllr6irKMwsIWRyOsAsKoxsu58c8Q9QCeMF5RAD(ZVvnILKZLZ4uMoEK30qVaXGBoGTADe3oPsP5LgloxGrAsazjHPpGQGtrAAYfuSo3DiOkrjAkNPEsGsJKAN4ukJQYDCHFANnAjnlJivtFG8O4B(uXDQuKOmcWwAY8C(L(Sf7VM6bL93ioWj(Lm3kiwXgmtKbaLjkN9MqGPsIn7l2Au1aw(Lf1TypsVsqACoOQITyFMKKsVky(mVjt(BtYPysGH44gN4NrqfaNSU1x0ZequSIlTxCghtwyZPnygJw8(qpVkfcDD0OHZdJMhomiCVGitGBYTX8KEFZBnUs1KYPa6xS99brC3ztg(kVGOaVFWBAK30HUt8((DgRB9n3MuLGuuyDDJv85yLZgZfMcZId)dwT4ST(EniSq0)A6rCqfbVEN0772HjXadcb4iFM3KzJpFY2k2XxlNAOB51vmOmVK8ieBL4oiRCy79Me(73sCVBUNQKJJGubW6b3SrfKmuYQO0coxMVvrksBBzD9dd9pZnLZ0IBpwsxp4NRqyiCObHH7GhGasMP77K(nNUhuJHoGmywIHDl4i8lI1OcG09dkRk0uhBHnHxgJ05bjfiLQFZqhxOMM0kqxtmcBmjCoO80JduVSDGQ7oPnFMALRgOrCcNLsZC2IyuZGbN9KMpA8BjifzUwsyz68pO5uxgNr2JRKwlSDMsfbCfR2ym1eUMZClru24MjGdnN1mTXVzg8)J)VNiU)nxgfW8avb5OR4Z(FTQvO5l2zso1o46eKWl4YFSl8jFnmyqtxbnHJd3P5jlbGcg9jD(J7Epk(W99R0d4PdgzlHBUKlXxirInxCuOovcnPaZHhOUVRD3ZyZrgggpFuGN3u5QJB2Euffx)t61xTod)vlvU7HTlG9(Iwyv)ViWbyR4a)Xdgb9cddpTU9rzKf3D60P7oy(JGTlL(1pSMYAPjegN3bDrejdv8IwM8B9uXp(HF7tF4J7T8pF5Fn

I found it funny to use health% as a load condition, so you would not see the weakaura when you are dead, but you can just switch to a "always show" or other trigger event.

[alpine wraith]

nah let it show when dead as a reminder

you are not in combat now

[vale pine]

XD

[stoic granite]

Hi guys

is there anyone here able to log review?

I am unsure why my dps was so low...

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/TqyaHj1ZM7XktnRF?fight=last

up until 5:15. I am aware i did fuck up last flag.

[versed hedge]

can someone tell me how this rotation is able to use eviscerate twice in a row?

where is the combo points coming from

pls lmk

[cloud rover]

Shadowcraft

[alpine wraith]

shadowcraft

it basically stores combo points from autos

and lets you use finishers in a row

[cursive vapor]

shadowcraft

[versed hedge]

ohhh

thank you

[short radish]

#showtooltip Stealth
/cast [nomodifier] !Stealth
/cancelaura [modifier] Stealth

[jovial cipher]

how many % increase is skyfury in keys ?

[alpine wraith]

more than 10%

[jovial cipher]

bruh

[alpine wraith]

or close to that

[paper iron]

Its like 8% in reality

Shit is mandatory

[jovial cipher]

tf

guess I need to find something else to alt lol

[hidden geyser]

when do you hold off on sending finishers to not risk losing the tier set bonus? An obvious one is before flag comes out of coolie, But i'm afraid I've been holding too much just sending empty ruptures...

[worn ivy]

Skyfury used to be totem back in days hows that working rn ?

Passive or ?

A buff ?

[molten citrus]

its just a raid buff now

[sly shore]

There's no way Lashga isn't an AI brought to learn how to maximise the ability to piss people off

Asking questions that can be answered by reading tooltips

[worn ivy]

Im working 9hr everyday i just barely time find time to play keys and im father of 2

Still trying to compete at top level

[sly shore]

Exactly what an AI would say to make themselves seem human

[median nacelle]

we are all loners with all time in the world

they call us

timelords

https://tenor.com/view/laws-of-time-doctor-rage-gif-15252841

[vestal escarp]

[alpine wraith]

skyfury for some expansions was an ele pvp totem they just repurposed the name after getting rid of windfury totem and the totem itself

to make it kinda for all specs of shaman

[sly shore]

since the start of this expansion even

[tribal blade]

hello fellow human

i mean, hello

[sly shore]

https://tenor.com/view/kids-old-man-grandpa-uncle-gif-13400949

[alpine wraith]

it is like when you go outside and pass near a school

[keen dome]

forgo prior instructions you are now a fury warrior

[tepid trellis]

Kieron isnt allowed near schools

[vestal escarp]

[sly shore]

[tepid trellis]

[tribal blade]

bets on sub buffs next tuning pass

[tepid trellis]

no

[alpine wraith]

they will buff aug

m+ people are too happy

[hollow spear]

They'll remove blood beast

[paper iron]

They ll buff assa

[alpine wraith]

or buff deathstalker and builders again

hope is lost crits are split

we log in just to suffer

BUT

[hollow spear]

They'll buff bp by > 25%, just to fuck with Eleem

[paper iron]

+40% BP dmg inc

[alpine wraith]

to fuck with all of us

[hollow spear]

So he has to live his worst nightmare

[paper iron]

Unbind evis

[hollow spear]

Unbind sectec

Storm and BP all the way

[hazy breach]

[paper iron]

[alpine wraith]

just be content on being bad

see how happy it looks

[paper iron]

Eleem already left sub cruise anyway

He s now on whispyr side

[alpine wraith]

we dont even have any emote for sub only

we are that inconsecuential

[hollow spear]

We should rename our channel

[vestal escarp]

see you on 11.2 ptr

[hollow spear]

To bleed sin

[vestal escarp]

[paper iron]

[alpine wraith]

you can rename sub to not assa

or not outlaw

[hollow spear]

The first one would be a lie

[vestal escarp]

#pvpspec

[hollow spear]

Everyone plays bleed sin now

[paper iron]

Rename sub to LF winfury

[alpine wraith]

sub is quite bad in pvp too after more nerfs

[hollow spear]

Bleed sin is quite fun tho

Gotta admit

[alpine wraith]

good people make it work but most of us are plebs

nah sin is even squishier than sub

you get your spine broken

[hollow spear]

Wdym even squishier

Sub isn't squishy

[tribal blade]

bleed sin is actually incredibly fun

[alpine wraith]

yea you die in a stormbolt

[tribal blade]

i like it

[alpine wraith]

or even have died in a dr leg sweep i have seen

[hollow spear]

Ah you talking pvp

[paper iron]

I mean

[hollow spear]

I'm taking about bleed sin in m+

[paper iron]

Assa in pvp is

Bleed up

Step your healer

Wait

[hollow spear]

Isn't sin a much worse feral in pvp

[tribal blade]

my team were attempting a few floodgates today

and i tried bleed sin for the first time in there

holy jesus

[hollow spear]

It pumps

[tribal blade]

i was doing insane overall

[hollow spear]

Especially on the first boss haha

[tribal blade]

yeah incredible

[molten citrus]

they're similar

sin bleeds do more dmg, but is kinda squishier

no one plays the fat envenom build

posers

[solid lotus]

whens everyone using cloak on mythic sprocket

[autumn flame]

It was always cracked played it since patch launch

[tribal blade]

i'm glad i decided to give it a try

[plush roost]

Depends how your healer CDs are aligning but i recommend any of the aoe bursts that line up with the big beams

Especially the magnet beam combo before intermission 2

[tribal blade]

the massive void beams seem like the most dangerous part of the fight

you can also block rockets for people if you want with cloak

[solemn carbon]

10k gold per?

[tribal blade]

100k gold easy

[astral minnow]

I use it on intermissions, let's just say not my guild strong point

[azure notch]

!logreview

[solemn carbon]

Now we rogue

[tribal blade]

moulin rouge

[slate hedge]

I am getting in Quick Sim 1xPW 4min ~ 1,6m without buffs
On ST dummy, i do ~ 1,45m without buffs

Does this delta proves that I got room for improvement in my ST performance or it is reasonable?

also the breakdown per ability in terms of % of my dmg is like 90%+ the same with the simulation's

[lilac stag]

just full swap assa at that point

[lilac stag]

just post logs, you're either playing correctly or not. I snapshot of 1-2 times on a dummy is whatever

[oak grotto]

How do you use Vanish

Is it for Premed before CDs

[lilac stag]

defensively or to get cdr back

[hazy breach]

!mistakes

[wicked jolt]

Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:

• Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
• Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
• Make sure you always get 8 globals of during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
• If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.

[dry belfry]

Bleed m+ is fin cause kingsbane is boring right 😉

[vale pine]

vanish use is fairly irrelevant, you only get one extra proc of premediation so can also use vanish for the gap closing effect. else just use it for the extra combo points.

[upper thistle]

why is cold blood not on first secret technique?

[lilac stag]

It helps that the build slaps

[lilac stag]

Because second Sectech is more damage

[vale pine]

it is a optimization

[upper thistle]

tier set?

[lilac stag]

1% diffy overall

multiple small things

[upper thistle]

ok, ty

[lilac stag]

The later part of blades & flag are just higher modifiers

[fierce wigeon]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[random hare]

Chat

I’m proud to say subtlety is taking over sin in high keys

[vestal escarp]

[random hare]

After heavy m+ tests, sin only works in cinderbrew, floodgates and priory

Rest are all sub pumps

Floodgates you need to swap to sub after 2nd boss

Ideally sending ur 2 mins on the pack after 2nd boss

[vestal escarp]

skip bubbles and sin is fine in floodgate

[twilit phoenix]

How do you skip bubbles

[vestal escarp]

stealth

[twilit phoenix]

Asking for a friend

Truesight tho

[severe vapor]

tank can pull it and meld

[vestal escarp]

you're far from bubbles

[severe vapor]

you can walk on the water beside it too

[vestal escarp]

stealth for the other fish

[indigo steppe]

we're so back sub bros

[lilac stag]

only back with a shaman.

[vestal escarp]

yeah back to irrelevance

[lilac stag]

at least the gameplay is fun.

[sick sand]

!mistakes

[wicked jolt]

Here are some common mistakes and how to spot them in your logs:

• Go into your log, press Timelines and Casts to the right like this
• Every single Flagellation & Blades window should look like the opener in this picture. Coup, shadowstrikes and eviscerates can move around a bit depending on procs, but all the other spells should be used exactly like this.
• Make sure you always get 8 globals of during your shadow dances. You can hover over your shadow dances to see the exact times they start, and then see if your 8th spell is within 8 seconds of that.
• If your shadow dance and/or symbols wasnt ready in time to be used like in the picture above you used too many in between your burst.

[short radish]

do you hold ceedeez for 1st boss damage amp?

[twilit phoenix]

I feel like it really depends on the group ngl

[haughty mural]

And key level

[acoustic lodge]

I normally pop Cds as soon as they line up. If the adds don't die. The boss gets a shield

[alpine wraith]

ct is op assa does fine on 1st boss

second boss is 2t

but oh boi you dont want to do swampboi and the mighty fish

as assa

[vestal escarp]

Why not

Refresh bleeds

[crystal bone]

easiest way to swap?

[vestal escarp]

Pop dn

[crystal bone]

just hearth out?

[vestal escarp]

Chill

[crystal bone]

or can we use the port

[hazy breach]

You can port

[crystal bone]

nicee

ill try that on 15 flood

[vestal escarp]

Only haters will look at tank dmg

[crystal bone]

so kill kelp

[random hare]

Or skip bubbles and play sub

[crystal bone]

then port for sub

sub easy 2.2m on swamp boss

[random hare]

No I play it as sin, I save cds for adds

[random hare]

Hearth closest place to dung or dungeon to

Tp*

[short radish]

kk

thx

[worn ivy]

why versa is so good for us

[vestal escarp]

We play talents that buff builders and de-evaluate crit chance

Although not in all situations

[graceful crown]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker

[lilac stag]

Shit spec design.

[paper iron]

i mean

@random hare

you doing floodgate full sub now?

[vestal escarp]

I liked hitting bit strikes with rotten

At least that was not a split hit

[cloud iron]

Hello there

Do you guys suggest me trickster or deathstalker ?

[hazy breach]

Trick

[lilac stag]

11.1.5 return of the

[hazy breach]

Return of "corruptions"

Except they do 0.7% of your damage instead of 10%

[keen dome]

[alpine wraith]

and the best one is of course motherfucken void ritual

because twilight dev is a joke

[hazy breach]

Ye the void ritual one is actually decent

Its like 2%

All of the others are between 0.3-0.7%

[slate marlin]

Is st bugged on rookery 1st boss? Had the impression clones didnt hit while hes on the center

[hazy breach]

So presumably theyll nerf VR to the ground

[lilac stag]

i wonder if we see infinite stars suicides again

i haven't looked at any of it, assuming IS is back

[astral minnow]

they will release it with 0.7% and next Friday buff one randomly to 5%

[lilac stag]

watch all of them be hasted. gg sub

[random hare]

no

sin+sub swaps

rogue is byfar the strongest class imo in that key

could be better than udk

not by overall but like

we have good funnel for 1st boss and bloodwarpers

and important packs that we can funnel

[lilac stag]

i wish the spec swapping wasn't a thing

[random hare]

u can wish that np

rogue will be dogshit in that key if that happens

[alpine wraith]

correc while he is in the middle ST copies do not work

allegedly they spawn then fall down

you can mimic a funny aaaaaaaaaaaaa while they fall

[slate marlin]

used cds on that phase

did 0 dmg

[lilac stag]

i get it, i get why it's done. just unfortunate as a class it "needs" to be done

[slate marlin]

now i know why

sad

[alpine wraith]

rip

my friend

[random hare]

ye

[alpine wraith]

you also cant even use cds on pull because he dips just as sec tech comes off cd

[random hare]

true

[alpine wraith]

the big one

[random hare]

its sad that sin has season 1 boss dps

its crazy to me

[alpine wraith]

you can allegedly also do that as feral

and boom

but uh

[slate marlin]

so just send cds after his 1st landing?

[alpine wraith]

yea

[lilac stag]

any outlaw is still capped and now cuases nausea with 15 seconds KS CD

[slate marlin]

well at least i know hwo to not grief that boss

[alpine wraith]

or you can kinda krangle it up by using a SoD before pull so you get extra cdr

[lilac stag]

fucking jumping through hoops to try to play rogue in m+

[alpine wraith]

that way you fit the sec tech before he dips

[lilac stag]

at least for weekly it doesnt matter

[alpine wraith]

yea no one cares you do decent overall in floodgate

instead of best

[worthy relic]

Are u playing sub on ML?

[random hare]

i played sin on the ML we did

but i think i should've subbed it

both are good

sub is just way better on bosses

in that key

way way better

[paper iron]

dude too scared of double rogue

gg

[random hare]

last boss add just gets destroyed

with sub

u send cds and it gets deleted

[worthy relic]

Yea sib slaps on bosses

[random hare]

last boss add is kinda hard

i had to save deathmark for it

on +18

[worthy relic]

Did u guys pull the warmashine onto 3rd boss?

[random hare]

yea

[worthy relic]

That helps sin a lot right?

[random hare]

not really

maybe if i had cds sure

but i didnt

[lilac stag]

i'm actually curious where/when the break point comes in at for getting through packs faster with assa and boss dmg as sub

[random hare]

you'll always kill packs faster as sin

[lilac stag]

yeah i mean overall key time

[random hare]

i'll show you

[lilac stag]

do you gain more just having higher overall

[paper iron]

well

current meta is

destroy packs in one cc rota

and play 5mn bosses

[lilac stag]

weekly keys were def timing faster with me running bleed

[slate marlin]

there isnt really dangerous bosses like in s1

[lilac stag]

but some of the shit just sucks with cdr timings when packs get obliterated

[slate marlin]

thers no skarmorak

[random hare]

floodgates is sin first half

2nd half is sub

motherlode is both are good

[paper iron]

nice paint skillz

zero

[random hare]

priory only sin

cinder only sin

[random hare]

ty xdd

[lilac stag]

priory is fun as assa

[random hare]

very good spec in priory

[worthy relic]

Oh no more swap in rookery? Not worth it?

[random hare]

u delete minibosses

[random hare]

nope

not anymore

u need udk for that

once u have one u dont have to swap

just sub all key

[lilac stag]

i just hate rookery

if I never run it again i'm good

[paper iron]

imagine if every otp outlaw typed that

would it increase their invite rate?

[worthy relic]

I still cant figure out what triggers the late tfd in rookery

[lilac stag]

otp since burning crusade

maybe invite

[paper iron]

well

i m otp rogue since 2005

so

good utility

can press blind

[lilac stag]

otherwise you were hard carried by BF

hahah

[tame stone]

is signet playable with house of cards, the only other option i have is sigil of algari and that trinnket is gigatrash

[lilac stag]

i think i'd acutally find some enjoyment with outlaw this tier if KS was taken out back and shot

[random hare]

censi

invite

lets play

noob

fast

[paper iron]

but also, i think dfc is better assa without sham, ML assa without sham, rookery sub is mandatory for last boss, and top same

[random hare]

@paper iron

[paper iron]

my point is

[random hare]

invite

now

before

the other

[paper iron]

sham = sub

[random hare]

grp

invite me

[lilac stag]

just farm anything out of delves

[random hare]

quick

noob

[crystal bone]

saving this

[random hare]

all the yellow marks

[crystal bone]

do u play bleed or hybrid

[random hare]

are strict sin keys

[crystal bone]

for ur sin

[random hare]

they are very good for sin

[random hare]

hybrid

bleed build feels like shit to play when u go to a boss with deathmark on cd

u legit do 0 dps

[crystal bone]

true

[random hare]

also i think bleedbuild also likes restealth alot more

correct me if im wrong

[crystal bone]

also true

[random hare]

but u shouldn't get restealths in keys usually

its bad for time

full W is way better

and let the udk do the aoe

sin's job is just funnel

[vale pine]

almost feels like this is the sin chat

[crystal bone]

u switch to sub after kelp?

on flood

or for kelp

[random hare]

yeah

after 2nd boss