subtlety

[placid crown]

now my trickster sims 3% better than my deathstalker in single target

will not even talk about the multitarget

and finally realized trickster gameplay is actually easier than deathstalker

and more comfortable with cds

I don't know, maybe be able to apply the deathstalker mark to several targets at same time will be enough to balance the 2 hero talents

[random hare]

https://tenor.com/view/aintnoway-gif-27058877

[void ocean]

i think the worst feeling in the world is when between cds u sit on 6 cp with no energy and have darkest night proc 😄

[alpine wraith]

you actually pool before popping the mark

so you can stab once and sht fills cps

then you evis and get the mark back

[placid crown]

Also, applying the mark with an evis with 7cp is cool, be able to apply the mark with 6cp would be really cool too, very frustrating to cast an other builder just to go from 6 to 7 cp to then apply mark

[alpine wraith]

on lowtime on dance you just take the L

[void ocean]

never rly got into serious DS gaming, when season began, wise ppl said trickster and I obeyed 😄

[young trench]

deathstalker should heavily impact vanish with juicy cdr on it etc to make swapping marks around not such a pain in the ass

[hazy breach]

The mark swapping is not a big issue for sub

[young trench]

i only played it last tier on sin so idk

still hate the hero talent

[hazy breach]

Ye its terrible because it doesnt really do anything coherent for sub

For assa its a bit iffy, but atleast doing the nature/plaugue damage on the target cleaves, which then circles back to the main target through singular focus

[young trench]

for assa you have one tree buffing envenom and the other buffing envenom xdd

[hazy breach]

For sub its just +plague damage on a bunch of spells and bugged interactions thats supposed to be buffing BP and eviscerate by a lot more than they do

[hollow spear]

needs "Has Shaman"

[vale pine]

all hero talents feel like they ended up designed with a specific spec in mind

could just make it one per spec and it would be better

[mint swift]

Then you have the assassin tree itself

Which….

Buffs envenom

[young trench]

i heckin love envenom

[placid crown]

I am taking advantage of this message to ask if there is an addon that can do this kind of things ?

[brisk raptor]

Is sub performing better than assa on any fight other than rik reverb?

[hazy breach]

Mythic bandit

Theres a set of cc immune adds that spawn around 1:50 that needs to die asap, so you need either monks or sub rogues to burst them down

[placid crown]

Where are the statistics leading to say this haha

[brisk raptor]

I see I see!

[placid crown]

just kidding on the fact that very few (not enough?) guilds ended this fight

[short aurora]

do i store the 2 unseen blade stacks after a secret technique when i already have coup up?

[brisk raptor]

I feel like on some fights as sub, such as rik reverb for example, I’m lacking major nimble flurry damage compared to other parses. Is that just tank positioning? It doesn’t seem like other logs are swapping to the adds but they are cleaving them heavily, about 250k more dps with nimble flurry than what I’m doing

[stone robin]

should i delay CDS a bit for the barrels on rik?

[young trench]

10ish seconds

[upbeat escarp]

whats the finality st build? put 1 point from rotten into finality?

[hazy breach]

Yes

[dim stream]

!trick

[proven plover]

does anyone have a prepull SoD reminder WA?

[dusky hatch]

Hello gents. I currently play assas in m+ and I dont mind it. Is it worth trying to pick up sub? I mean is it that more efficient / better ?

[random hare]

queue, take lead and kick 1 dps and invite 1 shaman

[upbeat escarp]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[keen dome]

That's a good, proactive pug solution. I approve.

[grave shore]

!sod

[wicked jolt]

Macro to prevent accidental uses of extra charges: #showtooltip Symbols of Death /castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null /cqs

[wild hornet]

@hazy breach wtf am i looking at

[tepid trellis]

it lines up with every clash if you do that

[wild hornet]

even if its a top 26 log it still seems a bit suboptimal

[iron whale]

ok guys, hear me out... now, keep in mind im probably the worse rogue in the game... my main has been subtlety rogue for several expansions now... my alt (who was my main during legion) is a DH.

so, I was playing with my DH and I did this Undermine quest where I had to kill 100% the mob gauge to complete it.
As Havoc, I pull 30-40 mobs (I'm not even kidding): chaos nova > meta > laser eyes and I finished the whole thing in 6 seconds top.

Then I was like: ok let's try the same quest with my main now.
I go in as sub rogue, let dagger in the dark stack on 2 isolated mobs, enter combat, a third mob gets pulled, pop my cds, crimson vial and then I had to vanish when the 4th mobs got pulled and I almost died.

4 mobs btw

and my dh and my rogue are the same ilvl btw

[spice matrix]

[haughty mural]

[iron whale]

[swift tinsel]

and at the end everyone stood up and clapped

[bleak night]

[iron whale]

hope you appreciated my anecdote, you're a brilliant and outstanding audience

[iron whale]

yes

[shrewd shadow]

[iron whale]

I forgot to say that I vanished away and didn't kill anyone in the end

and then I just logged off.

[vocal crypt]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker

[slate hedge]

Guys, which guide is the "best" to follow? Since IV-Method-WowHead are kind of different slightly in terms of BiS gear-crafts-talents

The differences are so minor that makes them all relevant?

[lean torrent]

what is the best talent to trade for gloomblade on specific fight where you cant get behind your target?

[lucid jackal]

None

You dont do that

[knotty venture]

anyone know the range of Nimble Flurry?

[bleak night]

8 yards around you

[knotty venture]

around me or my target?

[knotty venture]

Thanks mate

[hazy breach]

Unless theyve hotfixed it since the start of the patch gloomblade still requires you to be behind to apply find weakness

So theres no point to spec it

[quaint nimbus]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker

[foggy sentinel]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
It is not recommended to macro most cooldowns, including Cold Blood+Secret Techniques and Dance+Symbols.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use House of Cards```
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key.

[viscid ocean]

why is crafted cloak considered bis when catalyst cloak also give vers mastery?

[hazy breach]

it doesnt matter

Bis lists are fake and made up

[nocturne rose]

Anyone knows if Geargrinder's spare keys are acutally good? Or do they just sim well for us

[hazy breach]

Theres dozens of combinations that sim exactly the same as the top one, with stat differences that is

[small juniper]

😲

[vale pine]

crafted gear in general is very close, so you can pmuch use any combination of low impact slots for it

back, neck, bracers, boots, belt, rings and offhand weapon all are good

[cloud kestrel]

I feel like this is a luck thing. Sometimes I get like 3 adds drop near the boss and coom, other times it's like 2 but they are on either side of the boss 10 yards off and I ctrl alt del my parse for that attempt

[glass jasper]

3.2m and lowest damage in the key 😦

[west tide]

is it a dps loss to delay the first symbols 1 gcd in opener after the backstab?

[shadow lance]

Why would you do that?

I mean, why no sod your first sectec?

[glass jasper]

That would be a very minor dpsloss, your first backstab gets no sod

[vale pine]

delaying symbols like this is actually fine

[hazy breach]

its fine, but why would you

[steel zinc]

it isnt really

since bs is w/e

[west tide]

feels more natty for me and my keybinds atm..

[glass jasper]

hence the "very minor"

wouldn't sweat about it

doesn't really matter

[fallen crescent]

are we still running rotten over finality in st?

idk maybe i got confused somewhere

[small juniper]

sim urself angle

typically like 0.1% dmg dif

[raven maple]

Are my eyes tweaking or is assa performing generally better than Sub right now?

[vale pine]

• Both performed statistically the same

Assassination: gets a 5%+ buff
Statistics don't include much of the buffed logs now tho

so if you want to see full effects of the buffs is to lower the log timeframe to 1 day

so you will see assassination increase on the statistic over time when the pre buff logs start to face out

[raven maple]

Ahh I appreciate it, I'll check the logs again later on

[rotund sedge]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[vale pine]

bottom line is just, assassination is now statistically better, subtlety is still good

[blissful shore]

do i have to much mastery or why is house of cards simming lower than last season transmitter?

[small juniper]

aint no way a 678 hoc is worse for u

heroic possibly

[blissful shore]

hc is worse

[small juniper]

ye thats normal

u do have a lot of mastery tho

[blissful shore]

damn

cuz our other sub rogue gets 17k from hc house of cards

and i get -2k

i dont want to have transmitter

so annoying

should i try to lose some mastery?

[hoary lotus]

What flask are you using

113 is not reachable without flask I don't think

[blissful shore]

alchemical chaos

[hoary lotus]

Should use vers flask

[blissful shore]

alr

[hoary lotus]

Also look to get vers heavy ring from top

[hazy breach]

Nah its fine to use whatever flask you want

Alchemical sims higher typically

[blissful shore]

i got 22k mastery w/o mastery on alchemical chaos as main, and 25 with

[timid pulsar]

Can we cloak the knockback effect on sprocketmonger?

or does it only negate the damage

[blissful shore]

nope

[small juniper]

mby sim urself

alchemical is a bit not the best for sub atm

at least for me

[swift tinsel]

they're pretty interchangeable

[small juniper]

gotta min max everything

else not a real gamer

[blissful shore]

tru tru

how much dps do you guys sim?

[swift tinsel]

they sim within .001 of each other for me

so it really doesn't matter lol

[hollow spear]

you might cause disagreement with this statement

[gilded garden]

Does playing Finality change the Rotation up?

[vale pine]

[swift tinsel]

the audacity

'Statistics' being the specific filter on WCL?

bc then fuu's statement is just objectively correct

[vale pine]

think colophonius just refers to the disagreement between me and guy earlier today

[swift tinsel]

ah

must have misssed that convo

[vale pine]

and thats fine, i am happy to be wrong

[hollow spear]

I am just trying to fan the flames 😉

[graceful crown]

what build do you guys use for cleave bosses like the first on mythic...? should i just go st since trickster does it's magic

[swift tinsel]

sectech/nimble cleave

[graceful crown]

i meant like, do i take finality

[hazy breach]

Yes

[graceful crown]

siick

[rain hazel]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[delicate wind]

kind of a bummer not many great options for off pieces from dungeons other than snagging a ring

[jolly pasture]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[old kayak]

!log

[blissful shore]

i fucking hate transmitter on sprocket

shit trinket

[fathom adder]

i fucking hate transmitter was enough

true

[blissful shore]

its fine

on normal bosses

but when i use cds second time

magnets come

and if i get jump thing

im dead

shit trinket

[hazy breach]

Then dont

Play pvp trinket instead

[blissful shore]

oof

i wish i was good at pvp

dont feel like playing a 606 trinket or whatever it is

[twilit phoenix]

don't need to be

[blissful shore]

whaaat

[twilit phoenix]

it's 658 trinket

just join a war crate farm group for like 2 hours

and you'll have the conq

[blissful shore]

i feel like thats the play

but hopefully sprocket is dead today

believe

[karmic harbor]

i finally got it

im free from transmitter jail

[blissful shore]

gz

im not...

[vale pine]

still worth it

just to get rid of the minigame

[plush roost]

The dps u lose doing the minigame is not in the sim xd

Transmitter freedom is 10000% worth it

[vale pine]

we did a small experiment sim with stealthi a while ago

and found around 1% dps loss in slight missuse

but a well played cards is still extremely good

[placid shadow]

Is there a bug with Faulty Zap on Rik Reverb that removes poisons? I've had to reapply both twice tonight immediately after breaking a shield on an amplifier with it

[jaunty heath]

RIKA RIK REVERB

Such a nice boss

[twilit phoenix]

This is like less than 0.1%

and you’re not playing optimally all the time

Guaranteed

[vale pine]

nicu

[wraith solstice]

I am to stupid for sub. idk

[vale pine]

!cds

[wicked jolt]

Cooldown Use:
Every 90 seconds you want to cast Flagellation and subsequently Shadow Blades. When these two are up you always want cast 2 Symbols of Death, 2 Shadow Dances and 2 Secret Techniques.
To ensure you have enough cooldown reduction on your Shadow Dance to attain that you need atleast 1 charge and roughly 40 seconds left on your second charge before casting Flagellation.

[vale pine]

go from there

[upbeat escarp]

how do you use the mega magnet trinket? wait for 30 stacks?

[wraith solstice]

I do that (most of the time) but i am still omegalow damage

no clue what is wrong

[manic oar]

So what's up with sub gear sims? I got some wild swings while simming upgrades, more than three times the margin of error:
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/aFEdZY2tBfJhcnPBWgaKVK -1700
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/4Df1YhVKc5uC1s77LshTph +1700
different round, look for the same gloves:
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/auADpzEjSS26HCg3WqvDGN -5400
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/pvGucKHcnQKsm93LXZSjev +550

[verbal turret]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[wraith solstice]

Any experienced sub players up to look at a log and try to figure out why i suck?

[vale pine]

you can create a log analysis thread by typing !log

[spark plover]

Quick question for enchant on weapon , is it ok to play with 1 depth / 1 radiant ; or it is mandatory to play 2 depth on ST ?

[wraith solstice]

!log

[west tide]

some sims are including a trinket swap others arent

[manic oar]

Sure, but the sims also include the result for just swapping the gloves, which confused me - one of them has it at -5400 dps, another at +500 without changing any other piece of gear. That's why I resimmed it a bunch of times with just the gloves and still got a difference of about ~3400 dps, which is 3x the margin of error of ~1092 dps

Almost 6k diffence in sim dps is pretty big when picking out upgrades and weird if it's the difference in simming the same item a bunch of times

[random hare]

bombardiro crocadilo

[manic oar]

Which btw has absolutey marginal differences to my already equipped gloves - same stats, just sligthly different spread

[iron obsidian]

how bad is it to macro Dance with Symbols?

[random hare]

tralalero tralala

[shrewd wren]

like super illegal

haha its not recommended

[iron obsidian]

aight

[blissful shore]

and how do you know

ive been sub main for 3-4 weeks

can play it in and out

[thick temple]

wait how you parse on rik reverb during the phase where u gotta ansurek jump the poles

am i bad

[iron obsidian]

so my guild hasnt even been lucky enough to see a HoC drop from OAB, where do I wanna send Transmitter?

so I can get the buff before I go into my burst

[thick temple]

u wanna finish minigame before sectec cast

[warm marlin]

He’s immune after casting sound cloud

So it doesn’t matter

[iron obsidian]

okay so should i just maybe rip it after press rupture?

[thick temple]

the longest one is the stand on platform so sometimes if you're unlucky you have to evis then sectec to make sure you get agi buff bfeore sectec

[plush roost]

People macro it to flag

[iron obsidian]

and we never wanna use CB with the first cast of sectec right

[thick temple]

typically i do flag -> trinket -> rupture -> and then finish minigame -> SD/SoD/sectec

[twilit phoenix]

if the orange/green names in here are in consensus about that, I seriously doubt you're some exception

[thick temple]

I've been messing with waiting for second sectec to combo CB with. It wasn't mentioned in s1 but I think we're supposed wait for second sectec now

[thick temple]

on raw raid opener its ss->flag trinket rupture-> and then you can vanish/ss/evisc to give yourself time to finish minigame THEN sectec

[thick temple]

im DUM

[lucid jackal]

ur trinketing way too early

oh u mean mitter

Yeah fuck mitter tho

Get house of cards

[iron obsidian]

Guy

OAB

[thick temple]

yeah for hoc its probably just right before sectec

[iron obsidian]

hasnt dropped 1 yet

[lucid jackal]

Same

[iron obsidian]

and i havent seen it in vault

my alt sham did tho

so its either i use transmitter

or i use myth signet

[thick temple]

I only pugged OAB once and pugging raid is ass i need a guild

[twilit phoenix]

b-but my transmitter sims 0.1% better! I'm literally gonna shit my pants if I play another trinket!!!!!!!!!

[iron obsidian]

and a 2min trinket on a 1.5min spec sounds ass

[warm marlin]

Pvp trinket

[runic mountain]

Hi. In my sim, it shows Signet doing well, with using my Seaforium. This is over using Eye. Is that because if I use Seaforium + Eye, I won't have an onuse?

[iron obsidian]

I should have First Dance, right?

[wraith solstice]

I just suck with every trinket, so i do not care

[left ledge]

Holy fkin atrophic

Actual DR bot

[thick temple]

tfd is for m+ i believe. i forget what you trade it for in raid spec

[iron obsidian]

ahh yeah i see where fuu put the bit for first dance

[thick temple]

thats the one where ur dance is like 10 seconds yea

[iron obsidian]

switch weaponmaster

yeah

your very first dance of the fight is like 10 seconds or soemthing

[jaunty heath]

GUYS

THIS BOSS IS DEAD

I BLASTED EVERYTHING PAID OFF

YEHAWWW

[keen dome]

Hell yeah

[thick temple]

insane parse

[west kite]

i dont need to be spending combo points on my flag target correct? I can swap?

[hazy breach]

You can swap indeed

[waxen matrix]

Is there a passive trinket replacement for Eye of Kezan in M+?

[haughty rose]

any idea why i get rejected for 90% of the m+ groups i apply? i have 649 ilv and get back to back rejections for priority even tho i cleared it on +4

is it really just the spec?

[rustic mortar]

They should add a line to the 4-Set: "Shadowdance instantly gives you 8 Stacks of Jackpot"

[thick temple]

like to use instead of eye or until you get an eye?

[shrewd wren]

you have to take into account many other people are signing up alongside you. be persistent and its truly a timing thing. unless your io/ilvl is insane

[waxen matrix]

i have an eye of kezan. but it doesnt stack up in M+ due to downtime

still worth using eye?

[thick temple]

maybe last season, I think keys pushed so fast this season so lots of overgeared people are applying to lower keys still to farm crests/drops. You are probably competing with people that are 655+ or even 660

[haughty rose]

true that. i switched from pvp main to m+ because que times are incredibly annoying but m+ ain't better tbf. but good to hear it's not just them rejecting only the spec.

[shrewd wren]

nah sub is a perfectly good spec to take. keep signing up and hope for that timing. people with higher ilvl/io experience the same thing

[silent umbra]

can you precloak rookery corruption

like dk ams

[tropic river]

I'm using trinket from priory and pacemaker, im not able to get the house of cards. What's my second best for m+ that's not house of cards

[shrewd wren]

pvp trink

easy to get too

[thick temple]

rogue in general has util use this season too. shroud useful in ML, mechagon, ToP

[tropic river]

really?! well i suck ass in pvp. What's the trinket called

[shrewd wren]

just flag warmode and find a group looking for crates

its like 60 conq a pop or somethin

couple hours and youll have it

probs shorter honestly

[tropic river]

ah cool, what's the trinket do / what stats does it have

[violet shuttle]

Do we use Symbols only with shadow dance? Or is it fine to send Symbols just for Secret Technique?

[shrewd wren]

static crit, 1min on use fat agi

its badge ferocity something or other

[tropic river]

Ah roger ill check what the item is called and run a sim

[thick temple]

Eye still sims higher than me in dungeon slice. dunno how reliable dungeon slice sims are since theres downtime n stuff.

[waxen matrix]

hmm

[thick temple]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/7zJBnkFo34wmM4eLYb6cb7

[tropic river]

Simming now

Should i sim dungeon slice or patchwork with multiple bosses?

[shrewd wren]

for m+? just do dslice

[waxen matrix]

where can i see how much uptime Dslice has?

[median nacelle]

the pvp trinket, do u need 700 conq and more to upgrade it after?

might have to farm it

[shrewd wren]

normal upgrade mats, valorstones/crests

conq is to buy

[median nacelle]

kk

ty sir

[shrewd wren]

np

[shrewd wren]

it very well may not be your 2nd best option in the pool of current trinkets. but its solid and easy to get

lots of agi for your flag/sb dump

[tropic river]

Yeah i hate not having the transmitter, because i'm kinda fucked with second trinket now i feel like. I saw on wowhead that theres a delve trinket thats pretty decent but im not too sure about running 2 passives trinkets in m+

[median nacelle]

i use 2 passive trinkets rn cause i had a meltdown with the puzzle trinket and no luck with HoC yet

[shrewd wren]

a great option is this pvp trinket cause fuck the mitter

[median nacelle]

preach

[shrewd wren]

amen and bless it

[tropic river]

For real brother,

[median nacelle]

in m+ its true hell at times

[thick temple]

aint that bad lmao only when you get platform ig

you can do a quick 90degree turn to make sure its not somewhere lethal

[median nacelle]

its good but horrible same time

[tropic river]

even the house of cards, sims WAAY better on veteran, then my priory trinket thats hero tracked.

[shrewd wren]

the signet is kinda w/e cause its a 2min cd

not bad but can get better

[hazy breach]

If you dont have house of cards or transmitter you 100% should get the pvp trinket

Its very easy to get

[still jacinth]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[median nacelle]

is arenas 2s good for conq farm?

[hazy breach]

If you win

Weeklies or crate farming probably faster

if youre not good at pvp

[median nacelle]

havent arena since 9 sec kidney redbuff in wod

[shrewd wren]

crate farming is pretty quick. people have weakauras telling you where to go lmao

[tropic river]

holy share?!

[shrewd wren]

get in a group and have them send it to you haha i dont use it

[median nacelle]

getting it tomorrow and picking up the house of cards on next vault

[thick temple]

wait im thinking of farming for vet HoC now lmao I am on heroic transmitter

[tropic river]

So i just turn on war mode and fly around opening chests?

[shrewd wren]

yerp

[median nacelle]

is that lfr or?

[thick temple]

normal

i meant champ

myb

[shrewd wren]

i had heroic mitter coming into this season and a heroic track hoc fully capped simmed higher

[median nacelle]

o, ya u should try iguess

ppl try to sell it for 200-400k xD

[thick temple]

yeah but im already dreading pugging keys i hate pugging H raid

[median nacelle]

i mean i have 5m but fck that

[shrewd wren]

fair enough

[thick temple]

unless i host

[median nacelle]

heroic first week pug on bandit was something else

still is but not as bad cuz ppl have gear

[thick temple]

i miss my guild

[tropic river]

Dude thanks for the help, sim just finnished and the results are looking great!!! will farm that one right now 🙂

[shrewd wren]

sure thing! enjoy!

[median nacelle]

maybe next season we get a dungeon onuse trinket that is bis for sub 🤡

[hazy breach]

idk the pvp trinket is reasonably close

Since all trinkets suck ass

[summer owl]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[cobalt monolith]

Hello, I have these two trinkets. How much DPS do you think I will gain in a single raid with the house of cards, please?

[blissful shore]

use raidbot

[shrewd wren]

about tree fiddyyyy

[cobalt monolith]

already do

but not precise for trinket

[random hare]

?

are a casual player or what

[hexed sluice]

You will gain at least 47,821 damage

I assume you are trying to convince raid to give it to you over others, in that case just gaslight the shit out of them since you want it so bad

[cobalt monolith]

Concretely I can burst once in 2 with a trinket impossible that I win only 48k

[hazy breach]

You could just get the pvp trinket

but you wouldnt hold your burst for your trinket even with signet

You'd hold your trinket for your burst

[honest saddle]

working on weakaura and looking for a way to track scrapmasters that do not have a certain buff via trigger

having a hard time telling it to look for all scrapmasters and apply IF xyz buff is missing

[warm marlin]

iirc there is a bug with pacemaker

try swapping the slots or putting some other good passive option in top gear and then put house of cards in

48k sounds wrong if your on use is signet

[hazy breach]

Nah its fixed (assuming you sim on latest/nightly, possibly its on weekly now too)

[atomic steeple]

!sheet

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[cobalt monolith]

???

[swift tinsel]

Have you tried using Aura -> Nameplate -> Buff and enter the unitID under Affected Unit Filters and Info?

[hoary lotus]

Can't do that with a wa. Just make a plater script that changes nameplate color if buff is applied

[swift tinsel]

Yeah that'd def be easier

since there's a million mods that do that

[neat gate]

Hello rogue gamers, I'm pretty new to rogue and started playing it 2 days ago since I need to reroll it for myth prog for my guild. I'm kinda getting the hang of the opener now, but I still have two questions I cannot really seem to find an solution for:

During your burst window, you're using backstab after Dance + Symbols to prepare your ST, does it matter or change anything if I just use a shadowstrike instead?

Second thing I can't seem to get the hang off: When do I use Dance so I can (for example) Strike -> Evis --> Chargeback of CP --> Evis again? Sometiems I can, sometimes I can't so I guess that there has to bee a timing of when you should pop it, is that correct? Would like some advice

[hoary lotus]

First lose small amount of damage

[swift tinsel]

shadowcraft is what gives you CP resets during Symbols

[hoary lotus]

Second procs are procs. Sometimes refund sometimes no refund

[final holly]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker

[neat gate]

does it rlly matter in the end tho?

[swift tinsel]

not really

[final holly]

The refund trigger sound helps a lot imo

[shy scarab]

1. dps loss is 0.5 for not using backstab

2. depends if ur max cp when you enter dance, but premeditation is for builder i think? so dance-evis- stab-evis-shadow strike i guess

!bs

[wicked jolt]

Backstab/Shadow Dance Macro:yaml #Showtooltip Shadow Dance /cast [bonusbar:1] Backstab; Shadow DanceThis will cast Shadow Dance on first key press and Backstab on second key press.

[shy scarab]

Can use this macro makes it abit easier

[neat gate]

That one will always make it so when I cast Dance it will use backstab first and then strike, i guess, yeah?

[final holly]

The other thing you can do is track how many stacks of shadow techniques you have. >= 7 means the next spender will fully refund

[neat gate]

I‘m tracking that, I just couldn‘t figure it out in the end

[shy scarab]

No only backstab, you need shadow strike on another button

I have this on Q and 1 is my backstab/shadowstrike macro

For example

[final holly]

Speaking of the macro, has anyone run into an issue where your first SD in blades is ending right at the end of a gcd and mashing the macro just queues up a backstab instead of going back into SD?

Or is this just a skill issue on my end

[robust igloo]

Is there talent for sprinting on the water? Cuz i know that they put it back but did they took it again?

[west tide]

how come in top gear my pacemaker outsims vexie mythic but in droptimizer its like +18k 🤔

both latest

nvm guys

hehe

[swift tinsel]

pretty sure you can't spellqueue dance so it won't let you

[pulsar lintel]

Sorry if this is listed somewhere on here, but, how many shadow dances are we using between bursts?

[fallow nimbus]

Yes, you need to wait a tiny bit with full cp

[gritty knot]

How on earth do u have 20% Vers and 113% mastery? Was this pic taken with flask or buffs?

[slate lantern]

2-1-2-1 kinda vibes

[blissful shore]

normally i have 22,5k mastery but with alchemical chaos and mastery as main (+3k) i get 25,9k

[young mural]

took me quite a while to discover this on my own

but the combo points happen when symbols of death is active and you have 7+ stacks of shadow techniques

but you should definitely use the sound weakaura that was linked earlier, helps alot with those procs

[plush roost]

Unironically recraft neck to crit/verse

Check it in a simmer

[young mural]

or maybe just fuck around with flasks

idk

[prisma sparrow]

anyone know what is cap of mastery?

[molten citrus]

there's no real 'caps' for stats per se

you just sim your gear on raidbots

[grave delta]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[short radish]

no cap frfr

[prisma sparrow]

kk ty!

[blissful shore]

i rerolled assa today

hate sub at sprocket

ggwp sub rogue

[short radish]

whats wrong with sub on sprocket?

[plush roost]

its better than sin on sprocket imo

[brisk onyx]

until your kb be parried

[strange chasm]

Eleem tips for OAB?

[short radish]

all comps should always field sub rogue to stop bosses being able to parry

[strange chasm]

other than vanish the ad set so you can nuke the bomba guys

[lucid jackal]

Dont just spam symbols/dance on boss

Probs just save for reel asistants

I'm not eleem but

Just shift every set back for an add rather than just the boss

and CD on CD

flag/blades cd on cd

[strange chasm]

bless

we destroy the first ad set eh?

[lucid jackal]

Yeh

I think if u play sub itll just be intuitive but

[strange chasm]

yeah was just curious if there was anything advanced or lowkey

[tepid trellis]

nah all you do really is delay your 1:30 to 1:40

after that its just on cd

[paper helm]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[willow fulcrum]

I see so many different macros for shadowdance. Shadowdance + tea, Shadowdance + backstab, Shadowdance + Symbols+potion....like do we need that many different ones?

[shy scarab]

Wait a sec, sub doesnt get parried?!

[short radish]

no

dont use macros

[alpine wraith]

trickster disables parry

[short radish]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
It is not recommended to macro most cooldowns, including Cold Blood+Secret Techniques and Dance+Symbols.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use House of Cards```
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key.

[alpine wraith]

if target is fazed

[short radish]

except the bottom one (and only with house of cards)

we dont take tea

[short radish]

does it disable for everyone or just you

[short radish]

i swear tooltip says just you

but i keep hearing it applies to raid

[paper iron]

if that s the case

[alpine wraith]

everyone yes

[paper iron]

then rogue is the best raid buff in the game

[short radish]

thanks blizzard, way to make tooltips not vague

[paper iron]

oh no wait, we play 4 mage 3 sp 3 lock nvm

[shy scarab]

Holyyy fuck!!! Hahaha played assa in raid today, no wonder i suddenly got tons of parry warnings😂😂😂

[short radish]

back to sub you go

[shy scarab]

Yepp, we got tanks from temu, if u stay behind or side of the boss you stand in flames so gg

[marble ledge]

Does anyone have a WA that could help M+ groups see when my First Dance buff is up?

[wooden nacelle]

!logs

[molten citrus]

seems kinda unnecessary lol

[shy scarab]

Why would the group care about ur first dance tho?😅

[lucid jackal]

your tfd is your problem

ppl already dont restealth for sin/otl

Imagine having a weakaura announce to your group "I NEED 6 SECONDS OF OUT OF COMBAT TIME"

[runic sluice]

!macros

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
It is not recommended to macro most cooldowns, including Cold Blood+Secret Techniques and Dance+Symbols.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use House of Cards```
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key.

[runic sluice]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[tribal blade]

someone invited me to their key then removed me without saying anything and this happened

brother

1. i never decline people in lfg, i prob just delisted the group

2. "i deserve to get into every group in lfg because i'm a special snowflake"

[sullen hare]

Damn that is some world class fragility

[alpine wraith]

he is rping being an activist

[short radish]

[tribal blade]

if i ignored every person who didn't take me to their key group in lfg i would literally have 0 people to push with

[hazy breach]

Professional bridge burner

[vocal crypt]

worth to put backstab in a macro with dance for the extra danse stack ? Forget it to often to click 😄

[tribal blade]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
It is not recommended to macro most cooldowns, including Cold Blood+Secret Techniques and Dance+Symbols.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use House of Cards```
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key.

[tribal blade]

hrm

!backstab

i forget the command for the backstab macro with dance, but we have one

[alpine wraith]

!bs

[wicked jolt]

Backstab/Shadow Dance Macro:yaml #Showtooltip Shadow Dance /cast [bonusbar:1] Backstab; Shadow DanceThis will cast Shadow Dance on first key press and Backstab on second key press.

[strange chasm]

oab kinda not fun

when you dont have 10 sp

[alpine wraith]

yea there was a wowhead article

[twilit phoenix]

why don't you have 10 SPs?

[hazy breach]

Ye bandit is alright

Big burst at 1.50

[strange chasm]

Yeah but the ads

are so tanky the reels

the burst is fun though

[steep hemlock]

should i only be doing 2 dances with my cds or do 3 to take advantage of tierset stacks

[alpine wraith]

yea problem is reels are 3x so often

at least we are good on big adds

and also smalls becasue we can always vanish the fixate

so we dont ever need to run away

so not using vanish on pull is big possible value

[gleaming locust]

!macro

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety Macros:
It is not recommended to macro most cooldowns, including Cold Blood+Secret Techniques and Dance+Symbols.
The following macros are an exception:

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Thistle Tea```
```yaml
/cast Shadow Blades
/cast Blood Fury
/cast Ancestral Call
/use House of Cards```
When using diffrent macros, make sure to keep the cooldowns on a seperate key.

[bleak wind]

so is the bike trinket from first boss not actually splitting the damage or is there some 'do more damage up to 5 targets' thing

[hazy breach]

I think they all have the "do more damage up to 5 targets"

But its still kind of a meme

It used to be 20% extra per target so it would be 80% more at 5, i vaguely remember them buffing this to 40% per but cant find a source

[bleak wind]

I always thought it was 100% extra at 5 targets

[full wyvern]

grey parsed rik because I was on solo bomb duty 🙂

[hazy breach]

Ye maybe

Idk its usually worse than stats in aoe anyway

Split damage cringe

[final holly]

Makes sense, do I want my trinket to do 100% more damage or 5x60% more damage?

[bleak wind]

ye, but a mythic one sims a bit more than a hc thug line so using that one for the moment

[hazy breach]

Fairly sure it does the split and increase thing ye

[bleak wind]

ye looks like it

just thought that it didn't split but its actually the 5 target thing

[hazy breach]

Im playing pvp trinket because i cant be bothered with transmitter

[bleak wind]

I am very close to doing that as well

I had jump one time on sprocket, pressed W while jumping went into the other group

[hazy breach]

Yeeee

Actually cursed

[plush roost]

pausechamp

[hazy breach]

Its a bit annoying with the chip baits on bandit too

So i just said fuckit and went pvp

[bleak wind]

ye I notice it more on pull

started pressing it pre pull

[hazy breach]

On pull and at the 1:50 burst

Its still playable, but i just cba

[bleak wind]

I know what you mean

[hazy breach]

Would recommend holding vanish for the 1:50 adds if youre not doing that already btw, its nice to not be focused

[bleak wind]

yea I am trying but I see it off cooldown and just press it, need to fight the urge

[hazy breach]

Fair enough

[bleak wind]

do you have to vanish after they start walking or as soon as they spawn is ok

[lucid jackal]

old

[hazy breach]

As soon as they cast their fixate thing

Or like, you can wait longer, but since they refixate, you risk baiting some other melee if you wait

[plush roost]

ik its just i finally sim higher on finality wild

[rancid axle]

where do we get spark this week?

[bleak wind]

ye so its fine then, nobody will even notice

[jaunty heath]

World soul pick a weekly

Theres one for seasonal dungeons

So nothing you have to do really

[rancid axle]

oh, from that one, perfect tyvm

[iron obsidian]

so i have 23% crit rn and 16% vers, how much of that crit am i gonna want to convert to vers?

[final holly]

All of it and become unkillable

[bright elk]

https://lorrgs.io/spec_ranking/rogue-subtlety/rik-reverb
Why are all the top logs on Rik delaying CDS on pull? when I wait till after the first amp goes down the 2nd CDs seem to overlap the intermission and I cant always get the 2nd SecTec off before he goes immune

[iron obsidian]

probably for the first set of barrels

[bright elk]

they dont seem to line up well either way

unless im messing up

[iron obsidian]

i always had a dance + symbols + sectec for barrels

[hazy breach]

You can get the entire blades out, youre probably delaying it a few globals

[bright elk]

anytime I get targeted with that blue circle and have to break open an amp i lose enough uptime to ruin that 2nd set of cds

[hazy breach]

Yes if you get that its fucked

[bright elk]

or bad barrel spawns

are you guys swapping off the boss for barrels or just cleaving off boss?

[hazy breach]

If the boss is close hit boss, if its far swap

Technically you get haste for main targetting the barrels, so you could do that but its kinda whatever for sub

[jaunty heath]

I targeted an add for secret tech in case of clone weirdness

Also im in that list for the first time lesgooo

[hazy breach]

I did the non-sub thing this week and only went for boss dps pretty much

[jaunty heath]

If you look at my log you know why I absolutely cannot do that

I don’t even know how they do it we only used 1 br on that fight

It’s prog n shit i get it

But holy

Theres a bit of a gap

[hazy breach]

Ye you need some padders for that

[jaunty heath]

Idk we have to have ALL our ranged on a far add literally ST or it doesn’t die

Boomkin is a private friend of mine he was fuming

He got to starfall 3 times on kill

Because solo adds wouldn’t die

[empty cargo]

Just parsed a 92 on one armed bandit. Thanks for the help boys 🫡🗡️

[jaunty heath]

Huge!

This class discord does wonders compared to others

[empty cargo]

I agree. I was in the 30-50 range a couple of weeks ago. A lot of good stuff in here

[warped ferry]

Can i get a rundown on when you used your windows?

Guessing you held one for every coin phase?

[jaunty heath]

Lorrgs.io is your friend

[empty cargo]

Pretty much

[warped ferry]

Okay figured

[bright elk]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/ZPh3dz62yNtKBLVH?fight=last&type=damage-done&source=1161
I was trying out cds on pull here, other than that can anyone give some feedback? I thought I pumped and then saw it was a 74 lol

[jaunty heath]

Well a lot of your damage is supposed to be on adds

So getting the adds in your cb secret tech does a lot of work

[bright elk]

true

[jaunty heath]

It’s not hard to not cd on pull I thought it’s annoying for like 5 pulls

But you get used to it

Make yourself a personal note on MRT

Copy lores

Lorgs*

[bright elk]

even when I delayed the cds it didnt seem like it lined up well

[jaunty heath]

And let Kaze shout at you

It does

You even have them up a bit earlier than needed

[bright elk]

most of prog I was delaying till right after the area denial amp drop thing

maybe I was just sending the dances too early

[jaunty heath]

I stayed in it and before he dropped is kinda when I flag

[bright elk]

doesnt it stun you? or can you cloak it

[jaunty heath]

Evasion

[bright elk]

dang wish i knew that lol

[jaunty heath]

Doesn’t make a huge diff tho you can flag after too

Like right after

[bright elk]

thats what I was doing, I guess ill try it again next week

[jaunty heath]

Personal MRT note makes life easy if you struggle with when to dance

But most of the fight is

Cds-dance after and next dance on adds

Cds again

You have 1 dance between cds and next add spawn

And then the adds after you have cds again

I found one add spawn that fit for sod + secret tech where I couldn’t dance

That’s it

[bright elk]

ok yeah that 2nd dance between cds I think I just kept doing too early, I wanted to make sure i had dances/sectec up for the next big cds

[jaunty heath]

Don’t have to worry about that

Generally speaking

Cds - 2 dances - CDs - 1 dance

Repeat

Makes sure you always have 2 dances for CDs

[bright elk]

well now I wish I could try that agian lol its Stix time now

[terse knoll]

/m

[jaunty heath]

Good luck I geared a shadow priest for that boss prog gonna get sub kill on reclear

Cba to prog that as melee

Also making sure my pirate friend stays in the raid

[hazy breach]

You can evasion his smash down move

And continue dpsing instead of running out and pressing bp

[iron obsidian]

for the 1hr tricks

do i need to press it every 30 seconds still

or does it not matter

[jaunty heath]

Well if it’s 1hr you don’t have to press it every 30 seconds

[iron obsidian]

well idk how it works

first time playing trickster

[jaunty heath]

Just generate threat once

And ur good

[iron obsidian]

k thank you

[bright elk]

if you die you have to redo the tricks i believe

my guild's got too many melee, these spread circles fuck

[lethal yew]

Can you swap off a target with Flag and still get the mastery buff?

[bright elk]

yep

[tidal salmon]

dude i was pulling around 3m overall on a 10 rookery as sub, and i was happy with 'i'm doing good boss dmg at least'

fuck sub, assa does 5m

:/

[cloud kestrel]

5m overall? Bleed build?

[iron obsidian]

sounds like it

[hazy breach]

People really do be exaggerating

[tidal salmon]

weird part is nope lol, hybrid

boomkin on the party was mindlost, doing healer dmg which affected it tho

• monk and war in the comp

but still, i guess i'm never going back on sub unless top or workshop

arguably only top actually

[lucid jackal]

SIn literally does 8m overall

(1mst)

[hazy breach]

If youre doing 5M as assa and 3M as sub theres more to it than simply the spec difference

[iron obsidian]

fr

man im fucking ass at sub

but was forced into sub prison because my guild doesnt know how sin works

even when i try to tell them

[small juniper]

anyone else get mythic hoc today

[tidal salmon]

this shit was the reason i wasnt playing sin, alongside with that shittard dm

but its not doing that bad single

not as bad as boomkin at least

[hazy breach]

Monday for me for sure

Surely it drops

(and we kill it, which is not 100% either)

[indigo steppe]

I keep seeing on guides that race doesn't matter but is that for decent ones? I'm playing vulpera and I feel like I'm kinda trolling with how dogshit the racial is

Kinda hard telling how much it would actually increase DPS over a key since sims are usually just like 5m

I don't think there's a single other vulpera rogue over 3k

[still quartz]

it doesnt really matter dps wise

probably 1% dps or maybe close to 1.5%

[indigo steppe]

I don't see how it's not higher though isn't orc/morc racial basically like free skardyns

[hazy breach]

Ye so like 1-1.5%

Them being 2 minutes is kinda cringe since it doesnt line up

But you just macro it to blades and pretend its 3 min

[indigo steppe]

I think that's assuming I actually press bag of tricks though xD

[warm marlin]

btw did you consider flagging at 3min on sprocket rather than 3:20, just so that racial comes back up for the 5min burn

i was doing it early prog and it was kinda wild trying not to drop globals running over on that timer

[lucid jackal]

U cant

Cuz doesnt the boss move across the arena

Like u dont really have the ability to

[warm marlin]

with sprint and cloak it was kinda possible

obv ur saccing defensives

[bleak night]

what is the range of sectec

for the cleave i mean

[hazy breach]

Not sure, probably like 8 yards

If i had to guess

[bleak night]

ok i kinda just gotta get a feel for it i guess

playing sub on riccardo

and im doing like tank damage to the boss because im never sure if i can reach barrels with sectec

so i always just send into barrels

[lucid jackal]

I mean Ik u can

Just a li'l crazy lol

[hazy breach]

Thats so close to the reds

[warm marlin]

too much speed

[bleak night]

calculated

[edgy zenith]

bro get me OFF this boss

actually such a bad fight

[swift tinsel]

Is there a rhyme or reason to how the bombs drop in gally p1 hc? Some of them seem to drop in random places

One of them looks like the bomb box drops near people but the other will drop in no man’s land sometimes

[edgy zenith]

think they drop on pets

images, etc

but should be random target as far as I know

[swift tinsel]

We’re stacking on specific spots in the quadrant and they appear way off to the side sometime tho

So the big circles still kinda overlap each other

It’s very inconsistent

[edgy zenith]

yeah, idk how it works but someone always says "ranged bait" before the bombs come out

so

think it's baitable

[swift tinsel]

Yeah we tried that

[edgy zenith]

not a huge deal either way

[swift tinsel]

So they bait at alternating north and south but they’ll drop east and west

Idk our guild was getting torched by them

[edgy zenith]

really?

that's the onlym echanic happening lmao

just walk out

[swift tinsel]

Yeahhhh

They spent half the night trying to game the drops instead of just moving

[edgy zenith]

i kinda respect it honestly

[swift tinsel]

I think the idea was making the diffusing easier for the tanks but idk

I wasn’t paying that much attention to that part lol

Also our war tank was taking 100% of the trick shots when they swapped but our bear took zero damage from it

[sturdy moat]

How is sub feeling compared to other two specs ? Now that sin is buffed in keys and outlaw does crazy damage in raid i dont see what niche sub has

[sand monolith]

It's fun

[jaunty heath]

Blowing up adds

Which neither of them do

But there’s also not a lot of relevant fights for it

[hazy breach]

For most fights youll find atleast 2, but usually 3 of the rogue specs in the top 10 of rogue damage

[jaunty heath]

Not at OAB yet but I guess sub is the better prog choice there?

[hazy breach]

Its not like sub is getting gapped by the other specs, or the other way around

[jaunty heath]

Yuh it really doesn’t matter atm

Rogue solid

Nothing special nothing terrible

But solid

[bleak night]

i mean its niche is quite useful on rik

[edgy zenith]

arguably it's getting gapped by Outlaw

[bleak night]

probably oab too if you dont have turbo comp

[hazy breach]

Its literally not

[edgy zenith]

but Outlaw turbo cringe

[lucid jackal]

U need 2 specs to kill bombs

[jaunty heath]

I did say relevant bosses but yeah Rik would be the prime example of sub nieche

[lucid jackal]

WW, Ret, Sub are like, the sort of designated bomb killers

[jaunty heath]

I guessed so

[lucid jackal]

If u dont have 2 ppl killing they live for a really long time

[bleak night]

well i guess in good guilds rik isnt relevant yeah

but uh

down here its kicking my ass

[jaunty heath]

I killed today dw im one of you

[edgy zenith]

@hazy breach

[jaunty heath]

But in reality it’s not a relevant boss

[lucid jackal]

Do you understand that WCL isn't the game

[bleak night]

yeah in the grand scheme of things

[lucid jackal]

more specifically, the WCL statistics page

[hazy breach]

Bro theres like 2 people playing outlaw

The stats are skewed as hell

And not usable

[edgy zenith]

yeah there are a lot of sub players

[hazy breach]

If you look at the top logs

[jaunty heath]

What’s the sample size of sprocket even in general

[hazy breach]

Theres literally 1 of each spec on pretty much every boss

[edgy zenith]

and they're gapping even the max sub log

Outlaw crank

Sub is still probably better for prog

[hazy breach]

They literally dont though

Did you read what i wrote

[lucid jackal]

Here lets look at an individual fight

[bleak night]

the only one of those 4 fights its getting gapped on in top logs is cauldron

and thats the second boss lmao

[jaunty heath]

That boss sucks btw

Fuck cauldron

[hazy breach]

Ye and thats because if the person logging is on the other side sub loses 200k dps

[lucid jackal]

So keep in mind

Sub on average is going to log worse, because its a coin toss if you just dont deal damage

lets look at actual carnage logs

I wouldnt call this "gapping"

[jaunty heath]

Fuck me crosswise I should’ve thought about that

[edgy zenith]

WCL isn't the game bro

[lucid jackal]

Are you fucking stupid

[edgy zenith]

cmon bro

[jaunty heath]

Im literally in the wrong group fuck me

[lucid jackal]

or are you stupid on purpose

Like were you born this way or do you just do this online to troll

[edgy zenith]

why we're really angry

[bleak night]

new meta ask to be in group with logger so akaari doesnt get you

[hazy breach]

You can also log yourself, but ye

[bleak night]

idk i gotta open the app

and click live log

[lucid jackal]

Because you are making stupid comments and it annoys me

[bleak night]

thats a lot of work

or upload later

idk man

[hazy breach]

Im also like 99% sure holding cds for clash is better

So you get to cleave all of your uses

[jaunty heath]

🎻

[bleak night]

i saw that you were doing that

if i was playing sub on that boss i'd try it

probably pretty good

[bleak night]

thwack jack is so good

[jaunty heath]

Fuck Noggen beating my soul btw

[warm marlin]

seemed hard to actually cleave with all the swirls and fire between the bosses

[jaunty heath]

What a trinket that was on outlaw

[warm marlin]

or the cleave range is much larger than it seemed

[hazy breach]

The bosses hitboxes are big, but yes you need to stand in the warzone

[edgy zenith]

you mean on opener? just legit hold? or second flag hold for second clash?

[hazy breach]

Only thing is sectech wont ever cleave

[jaunty heath]

I thought about cauldron the other day too, I tried cding the clash for a few pulls while also actively being in the warzone

It didn’t seem to matter

Kinda same

Probably also heavily killtime dependent if it’s worth or no

[edgy zenith]

yeah, surely an extra flag is better than a cleaved one, no?

[celest mulch]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker

[edgy zenith]

do you not lose a cast holding with standrad kill times?

[hazy breach]

3 cleaving vs 4 non cleaving

[edgy zenith]

hmm

[jaunty heath]

I mean if secret tech isn’t cleaving

I doubt it’s worth

[edgy zenith]

yeah, I don't know how much extra dam you'd get. has to be like 33% more to be equal

seems kinda hard without sectechs cleaving

nimble is what, 50%?

60?

[jaunty heath]

Especially if you only do 3 you don’t get a flag In pot right

[bleak night]

yeah thats rough

if you have a longer kill time its probably better to use in clash for sure, but if you have a longer kill time you arent parsing

[jaunty heath]

Tell me with my 08:30 kill timer

[bleak night]

well i say that but second highest parse is 7m

[jaunty heath]

Was amazing

[bleak night]

uh

lemme check what ours was

im sure it was not good

actually it was 6:40 nvm

[short radish]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[short radish]

@waxen matrix

[upbeat nymph]

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Eleem

[upbeat nymph]

!rotation

[warm depot]

!symbols

!symbol

!sod

[wicked jolt]

Macro to prevent accidental uses of extra charges: #showtooltip Symbols of Death /castsequence reset=2 Symbols of Death,null /cqs

[rocky ocean]

Season of discovery

[boreal finch]

is dungeon slice for sub good to run?

[tribal blade]

hrm

i've heard a lot of chatter about this trinket, is it good

nvm it sims real bad

[zenith magnet]

It was broken for outlaw - but nerfed allready

[hazy trellis]

hi guys : D iam new to rogue. and i think Dathstalker plays more smooth. is it very far behind Trickster? Thx for your help ❤️

[alpine wraith]

it is a bit behind trickster on st

but i find interesting that it plays smoother for you

[hazy trellis]

it feels so wroing for me to use backstab in starting dance window u know what i mean? XD

[wraith sphinx]

u dont really have to do that on trickster tbf if thats whats keeping you from playing it

it's such a minimal increase in dps

[hazy trellis]

ok

i really didnt get

why people do this

xD

[wraith sphinx]

its just for the extra Danse Macabre stack, but it wont ruin your gameplay if you dont do it

[hazy trellis]

well. without this backstab i just can pop everything

and BAM

thats amazing ^^. i think i will first play like this and bind my backstab. thx m8

maybe i will learn it xD

[tribal blade]

the backstab in dance doesn't really change the flow of the spec at all

you're just pressing backstab instead of strike

trickster is much smoother for sub because you have far more cdr on secret technique

which makes the cd windows much better

[hazy trellis]

yeah. my problem is that i have the same keybinding for it. >.<

its on my transform bar. just need to find a good key for me i think

[tribal blade]

it would be worth having a seperate keybind for backstab

[cloud rover]

Prophet

Im finally free of Transmitter

[hazy trellis]

@tribal blade thx u prophet 🙂 ive got a lot of work to do. but i will try to improve ❤️

[tribal blade]

keept at it!

[tribal blade]

HUUUUUUGE

doesn't it feel amazing to do cds without transmitter

it's actually a whole new world

[cloud rover]

Well yeah especially, when i just switched spec and play with Signet now

GOTTEM

[tribal blade]

LOL

i got baited

[cloud rover]

But soon

when i get my HoC

im back prolly

Itll be next week right ?

[alpine wraith]

surely

[cloud rover]

Surely

[rotund trail]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's guy's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border
• Targets in range tracker

[robust dust]

Hey. When playing with First Dance sometimes it finishes 6 sec Timer and then Starts a new 6sec Timer. Any idea?

[alpine wraith]

yea if you enter combat it can reset

why?

because fuck you

[dry plank]

And it did not start immediately after you leave combat

Great example in workshop before spider spawn after 3 robots you sometimes can wait till it resets and sometimes it start countdown few seconds after you in stealth

[glass jasper]

That's why I'm considering just running weaponmaster for m+ instead of TFD

Becaus TFD is just buggy and annoying

Sure, might be theoretically better. But its making me go mad

[jaunty heath]

Not sure, it probably needs to work once or twice only to beat weaponmaster

[glass jasper]

Thats true actually

Might be enough for it to work on opener

To be good

[dry plank]

Just ignore that

[glass jasper]

opener 1st pull*

[jaunty heath]

Better than weaponmaster at least

God we do have some deadge stuff in our tree

[glass jasper]

Anyone in EU wanna T11 delve with my hunter?

[alpine wraith]

it is a lot better not theorically tho

[dry plank]

Some? xD

[alpine wraith]

just remember it takes like 10 mins for wm to beat tfd if there is almost any aoe

and even more in mass aoe

so even getting 2 or 3 USES across a whole key

is better than the wang that is wm

[glass jasper]

Alright I'm sold

I will keep it but i won't be happy about it

[jaunty heath]

Just ignore it exists

Be happy when you have long dance

Ignore if you don’t

[alpine wraith]

you can save vanishes to use it before a pull with cds

the diff between a tfd double dance and one that does not in cds in very noticeable

[jaunty heath]

Also one question for tfd while we are at it

Loads of times it ends right when tech cb would be

Wait nvm my question

Initial hit secret tech ain’t doing shit anyways

Doesn’t matter

[alpine wraith]

yea you just sec tech on the second dance

[median nacelle]

happy friday fellow yellows

[glass jasper]

Yea been trying but i feel like there is always som shit

That pulls me back into combat anyway

[alpine wraith]

as long as you dont get hit the timer continues

you entering combat just resets it but not more than once

so on some pulls before cds you can vanish and just go forward or backward

[tribal blade]

@alpine wraith

this is what was going on

[alpine wraith]

yea basically a routing issue