subtlety

[swift tinsel]

and then they drop right after

[spark tusk]

It's still wild to me that it can drop from bleed ticks

[swift tinsel]

Their set is so conceptually cooked

Oh definitely, there's way too many damage instances lol

[raven frost]

Is sub any fun after dust removal

Havent touched in tww

[kind bluff]

Nope we just play it because we hate ourselves

😉

[tribal blade]

there's no shot, that's crazy

although doesn't that mean more chances to proc the 4pc

or is that not enough to balance it out

[swift tinsel]

Yeah, apparently it procs like crazy in aoe

[tribal blade]

so basically the 2pc doesn't exist

it's just the 4pc for sin

[swift tinsel]

it's really weird

[tribal blade]

yeah that's pretty bad

[swift tinsel]

bc it stacks, but also gets consumed but also not

it's absolutely all over the place atm

[tribal blade]

i wonder if they rework winning streak

or they gonna double down

[swift tinsel]

it's just a weird thing

not very popular

[tribal blade]

no melee is happy with it

[swift tinsel]

It's just a ham-fisted approach

[tribal blade]

mega rng is never fun

[swift tinsel]

nah not at all

even if it works as intended

its just hard to plan around or it encourages really degenerate gameplay

neither of which are fun imo

esp since you can generate winning streak max stack in either 9 seconds or almost a full minute

for sub*

[tribal blade]

needing to just spam rupture as sub outside dance

is degen to the max

[swift tinsel]

I have a feeling it'll only be worth it to do that ~20 seconds before flag or in the middle of cooldowns when you have that 2-finisher spot before sectech is ready again

which, still not ideal

Average 0.16ish stacks per second outside Dance so you'll hit 3 stacks most of the time in that window

Super interested to dig into the reset behavior once it’s working

Bc the stacking atm is actually pretty good, I’d be pretty fine with that portion going live as-is

[graceful dust]

Stacking is fine when it doesn't reset at 4 every time or reset the global before cd window

[swift tinsel]

Which is why you’d likely not evisc in the last 15-20 seconds of flag’s cooldown

And in that time you’d get stacks from auto attacks, backstab, rupture ticks, etc so it’s not so bad

But again, will come down to reset behavior and some tc work

[spark tusk]

While that is "interesting"

I don't really like suppressing our main ST finisher in favor of...what rupture spam? BP spam again?

in st?

oh wait does bp proc it too?

[random hare]

[spark tusk]

Rupture's the one that doesn't

Or slice

[random hare]

physicist Lisonna

Explaining quantum sub mechanics

[spark tusk]

quantum quantum quantum

Imma take the eigenvalue of dance's CDR

I don't know quantum was over a decade ago

[random hare]

[swift tinsel]

Yeah it’ll be rupture/SnD which is degen either way lol

[spark tusk]

I suppose we have kidney shot!

[swift tinsel]

Just send autos, take a bio break then rupture or slice depending on pandemic as your flag finisher

Omg new kidney meta

In a surprise twist we get Recuperate back as a finisher

I can’t wait to see if BP/nimble evisc insta-drop it bc it’s 15% per hit between phys and shadowed finisher and not per cast

Cinema

[spark tusk]

Just like bleeds for assa

lmao

15% chance per damage instance

Except watch it only proc from shadowed finishers

[swift tinsel]

Omg

[spark tusk]

because shadowed finishers can never be bug free

[swift tinsel]

Don’t manifest that

😂

Coup gets stacking reset chance per hit

[spark tusk]

all the more reason to not evis

[swift tinsel]

So it’s got like 90% reset chance

Didn’t SF make bp do weird shit with our DF s3 set

I’m also not so secretly hoping that trickster’s increased dance uptime nudges ds out of the picture bc it definitely has a notable impact on stack generation

Maybe my brain is just cooked from five hours of trickster openers and them feeling great compared to ds lol

[viral girder]

See I dont like the effects of the tier sets in season 2

BUt at the same time.

I never pay attention to tier sets and just.. get them to get them

They arent like Elder Scrolls Online where set bonuses drastically change how you play

Its always just "keep playing the same way you normally do but have this boost every now and then"

[swift tinsel]

They sometimes do alter gameplay though

This next set might also

Too early to say until things are more functional

Could be mostly passive, could change how we approach finishers entirely outside of shadow dance

A question for the robot

[tribal blade]

pray they rework winning streak

[round latch]

aint happening

(well not when we want it)

😅

my daily yappin' about to end with how much i hate coup

and its so much

[spark tusk]

i just wish rupture would be themed as shadow and not a bleed

[rocky ocean]

sub is still a physical spec, which I was surprised about when specced into it

[spark tusk]

: 2pc: Rupturing a target with rupture on it outside of dance applies a stack of Shadowed Blood per combo point spent. Casting Eviscerate or SecTec inside of Dance Ignites the target's blood causing X damage per stack. Shadowed Blood stacks removed when leaving shadow dance.
: 4pc: Casting Symbols of Death causes your Shadowed Blood stacks to explode for their normal damage per stack to all enemies around the target. While Shadow Blades is active, Shadowed Blood stacks do not reset when leaving shadow dance.

Idn just something that came to mind

Which would alter gameplay

[round latch]

this is some cooking

the shadowed blood thing

me like

Im obsessing with the avatar of shadow idea

months now

coz sub needs an avatar button,or passive

[lilac stag]

as soon as you name it “shadow…” it stops doing dmg

[void hound]

https://tenor.com/view/tear-sad-sonic-adventure-shadow-crying-gif-1566461694267213405

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/lebowski-the-big-dude-bowling-am-i-wrong-angry-gif-16078957

[sly shore]

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/mark-it-zero-angry-gun-aim-gif-14130527

(Devs and Shadow Dmg tags)

[lilac stag]

https://tenor.com/view/the-big-lebowski-jeff-bridges-the-dude-dance-dancing-gif-5172317

[tribal blade]

i didn't forget about your warr btw, i'll hit you up later for key 😉

[lilac stag]

I should be back home around 13:30. it’s 5:30 currently.

I maybe can get on before leaving for teaching in 3 hours

[tribal blade]

i'll be on the game at.. around 8pm est

8-9 most likely

[lilac stag]

That should work

Just trying to figure out the time zones hahah

Woyer up to 624. Got the rare neck on Sat. Now it’s crest farming and vault prayers.

I somehow have the bis trinkets as well. lol

[tribal blade]

nice! big

[tribal blade]

lol tell me about it, i'm constantly having to do it since i don't live in the US

[lilac stag]

Most people in the US can’t figure out the 4 time zones we have within the country.

[tribal blade]

i'm also having to deal with daylight savings while not having it where i live

(kill me)

[vale pine]

[atomic dune]

Hello!
I'm doing this opener on a dummy

Why is it sometimes after using Eviscerate I suddenly get a full bar of combo points that I need to react to and avoid pressing Gloomblade / Shadowstrike?

[vale pine]

shadowcraft

[tribal blade]

my raid time's gonna change in a bit over a month back to being an hour earlier 😦

[vale pine]

you essentially get combo points refunds if you have high enough shadow techniques stacks during symbols

[atomic dune]

Ah yea I see now

[vale pine]

it is why the sequence can be slightly diffrent depending on how much you proc

but should on average look like the above

[tribal blade]

i look forward to you coming in here later on asking why you aren't getting refunds when you should be

[atomic dune]

And obviously we want to extend Symbols of Death (and Shadow Dance too?) buff during Shadow Blades? using pandemic

[atomic dune]

I just couldn't find what spell/talent gives that interaction

[tribal blade]

it's a silly joke, sub has a lot of bugs with the combo point refunds

[tribal blade]

you mainly want to use your symbols around when you're using secret technique

because you want to always buff sectec with supercharger

so the main timer that dictates when you press stuff is the cd of sectec

[atomic dune]

I see, and generally we always want to press SD+SoD together?
In other words does it ever happen that we press one without another?

[tribal blade]

in the opener you can chain dances back to back with flag and blades up

but then sectec won't be off cd quick enough

so you symbols midway through the 2nd dance when you can supercharge sectec

[lilac stag]

Why are my combo points delayed refunded?

[atomic dune]

Thank you!

[tribal blade]

i actually noticed it immediately after the rework when i got a WA to track sht

but i assumed my brain was playing tricks or the WA was buggy or laggy or something

NOPE

[vale pine]

the bug is over a year old by now ^^

[tribal blade]

horrendous

[atomic dune]

Ah you mean when I press Evis and it takes some time for the bar to fill with Shadow Technques?

[tribal blade]

yes, and you can't really play around it

because the delay varies

[atomic dune]

Yeah I noticed that too

[tribal blade]

so if you try to play around it you can end up losing several gcds trying

but usually you can delay your stuff very slightly and sometimes catch those stray delayed procs

[atomic dune]

And is it intended that the following macro doesn't work?

/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Symbols of Death
/cast Shadowstrike

It doesn't cast Shadowstrike , as if the spell bar isn't updated and switched instantly to "spell bar while stealthed"?

[tribal blade]

they broke that macro going into TWW

doesn't work anymore as intended

[tepid trellis]

need to double press it

[tribal blade]

it's not really worth using anymore, it's very cumbersome

[tepid trellis]

correct

[tribal blade]

i used to use it, and now i just manually dance then strike

[tepid trellis]

i stopped using it at the start of DF

[atomic dune]

I'll take it as a feature to promote playing this spec as a pianist

But does this spec have many more bugs or not?

[tepid trellis]

[atomic dune]

Cuz it feels really depressing to learn a buggy and forgotten by blizzard spec

[tepid trellis]

welcome to the red headed step child of blizzard

[atomic dune]

Even though I was really excited to learn rogue

[tepid trellis]

sub has it pretty bad bug wise

[tribal blade]

sorry to be the bearer of bad news

[lilac stag]

It’ll still be here in 12.0 if cp refunds aren’t changed by then.

[tribal blade]

gonna be completely real, the track record of devs working on sub in particular has been getting worse and worse over the years

[lilac stag]

It’s easier to ask what isn’t bugged.

[tribal blade]

so unless you absolutely love this spec it's a bit of a headache

[lilac stag]

I’d say after a month on it most give up

[tribal blade]

plus you're trying to parse against the sweatiest of sweatlords in raid considering the only people who play sub are the ones who love the shit out of it

[lilac stag]

Those are the smart ones

[tribal blade]

i think the upside honestly is that there's so few of us we get to have very fun convos in here between the few of us haha

[tepid trellis]

damn thats why my logs are shit

time to reroll

fcking sweats

[tribal blade]

hey racoon, you're one of them

how's lost ark btw

[tepid trellis]

I BEG TO DIFFER MFER

(im not really playing)

[hazy breach]

https://tenor.com/view/spider-man-we-one-gif-18212100

[tribal blade]

3 purples, he's washed up

[tepid trellis]

worst part is

2 of those are still top 50 logs

so

dead spec

[tribal blade]

yeah parsing as sub right now is hell on earth

i play out of my mind on bosses and don't parse very well

[tepid trellis]

sikran we kill to fast to play sub on it

[tribal blade]

feels bad

[tepid trellis]

so its just awfull

until we shave off like 20 more sec

[tribal blade]

dude the last 3-4 times i've recleared sikran i get the first charge

and then i just give up from there

no recovery from that

[tepid trellis]

and im playing assa on thursday

cuz im bored

[tribal blade]

nice nice

my guild is in queen prison, we got her to 7% today

[atomic dune]

Is sub the only spec that has a bonus damage if you're attacking from behind? And how does it work on bosses like Rasha'nan?

[tribal blade]

backstab does so little damage it doesn't matter much

[tepid trellis]

backstab dmg mod

is sooooo finy

tiny*

[tribal blade]

like backstab is a fucking horrendous button

[tepid trellis]

• on those type of bosses they delete the parry system

[atomic dune]

But shadowstrike has it too

[tepid trellis]

no

[tribal blade]

i think you're confusing the bonus dmg from striking from stealth

[atomic dune]

Yes I am actually

[tepid trellis]

and before you get the chance to ask

[tribal blade]

that's just bonus dmg from real stealth btw, so dance doesn't work

[tepid trellis]

that dmg amp does not work on dance

xD

[tribal blade]

same brain

[atomic dune]

In my case I immediately had a thought "hmm that's weird since SS is always pressed from Stealth"

[tepid trellis]

you'd think so yeah

but unfortunately dance =/= stealth

[tribal blade]

that's part of what makes sub such a clusterfuck for devs to work on

i honestly think the best bug we have is you take virtually no aggro in dance

it's kinda crazy

[tepid trellis]

thats not a bug

xD

[tribal blade]

not sure if you would call that a bug or unintended side effect

[tepid trellis]

its intended

[tribal blade]

oh it is??

damn

[tepid trellis]

no clue why its there

but it is

just -1mil threat

in dance

like fade for priests

[tribal blade]

it seems unintended because there's nothing in the tooltip about it

[keen dome]

The "Oh my god Brann I hate you" button in delves.

[tribal blade]

bro it's awful in delves

[keen dome]

Watching Brann run out the door of a boss room

[tribal blade]

i hope they keep it in, i like it

[tepid trellis]

ive killed people on purpose with it

[tribal blade]

the best part is you know when you tank dies on a pull in keys you won't be the first person to take a melee swing if you're in dance

[tepid trellis]

i tank the mobs with evasion

[tribal blade]

so you can keep attacking and then dip out right before dance ends

[tepid trellis]

just say "wanna see something funny"

[tribal blade]

haha

[tepid trellis]

and my DH friendly instantly knows whats about to happen to him

i press dance

he gets clapped

[tribal blade]

btw is there any play around your tank dying, he resses instantly and gets aggro back from tricks

[tepid trellis]

tricks wont do shit for that

[tribal blade]

i try to click off tricks quick but never works

[tepid trellis]

like yes it will redirect "some" threat

but its really not alot

[tribal blade]

it's just a weird issue with perma tricks

[tepid trellis]

like sure if no other dps is doing anything

[tribal blade]

you send mobs running clear across the dungeon for the tank

[tepid trellis]

then yeah

it would slowly get directed to him

[atomic dune]

I get an impression that this place is some hobby/sport club with a bunch of regulars who've been coming here for a long time
And then there are many newcomers who come here for their first free session because they're really excited to join the club and have this hobby in their lives
And then they never show up after their first session

[tepid trellis]

very accurate

[tribal blade]

damn that's actually really accurate yeah haha

pretty much everyone who talks in here regularly knows each other by now

[atomic dune]

[keen dome]

All six sub rogues

[swift tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/one-of-us-wolf-of-wall-street-wolf-of-wall-street-gif-pelf-pelfort-gif-2709546633117027040

[tribal blade]

now maybe 7 if we don't scare away the new guy

[plush roost]

Scarily accurate

[lilac stag]

Just take the non-tricks talent.

[tribal blade]

nahh too much work 😉

[lilac stag]

The only thing you’re missing is investing a whole bunch of money on professional end equipment.

At one point on Ovi I had to swap since my burst was getting so high in the opener the second DK tank couldn’t get aggro back. The joys of slightly undergeared DKs for one fight.

[rocky ocean]

I like it when tanks can’t handle my dps load too

[old venture]

@tepid trellis

[tepid trellis]

[hardy snow]

so we're going to use gloom during SB?

if tier works?

[tepid trellis]

[vestal escarp]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-stupid-slobber-the-bluetooth-device-is-ready-to-pair-gif-17323072743601828847

[old venture]

same

[keen dome]

powerful orange

[twilit phoenix]

Me watching palmbee’s stream (i’m down bad)

[tepid trellis]

[twilit phoenix]

Thanks for posting your sub vods

They literally changed my life

[sly shore]

This was my thoughts last night

[lilac stag]

Does your warrior post kills or stream?

[tepid trellis]

which one?

xD

but i dont think so

[lilac stag]

hah

Crit covers usually everything but always curious with what you guys do.

[dire geyser]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[hollow spear]

Great analogy

[tepid trellis]

ive now asked

[hollow spear]

How fun is warrior?

Is it as degenerate as I think it is?

[lilac stag]

Ronkley is my shadow rogue warrior go to

[twilit phoenix]

Arms is cool

Fury is zzz

[lilac stag]

Fun is subjective

[keen dome]

Arms arms arms

[lilac stag]

I could feast off the visuals alone.

[tepid trellis]

ive always enjoyed arms

but ive always hated fury

[lilac stag]

The hero talents don’t change anything

[tepid trellis]

demolish is fun

[hollow spear]

I'll feel at home then

[lilac stag]

I prefer arms play

[tepid trellis]

that button hurts

[hollow spear]

Not like we have much choice in our talents

[lilac stag]

but fury doesn’t give me arthritis like outlaw.

[hollow spear]

Or that changing the changeable ones does matter

How arthritis inducing is arms?

[keen dome]

My theory of "Sub rogue -> Arms warrior" correlation continues.

[swift tinsel]

Been toying around with colossus arms and it's quite fun

[hollow spear]

What's that theory? Ppl quit subtlety rogue to play arms warrior?

[swift tinsel]

Slayer gameplay just doesn't do it for me

[keen dome]

Yeah, pretty much. Or that sub rogues also enjoy arms warrior

Because it does seem to be a pretty funny theme.

[swift tinsel]

Yeah I'd never quit sub for arms unless its truly dire but def as a fun alt

and mw if I wanna heal bc they're amazingly fun atm

[void hound]

youre so real for this

[hollow spear]

I have a dk alt

But I just cannot get into that gameplay

[sly shore]

[lilac stag]

Depends how good you are with keybinds. Small hands. Good luck.

[void hound]

this emote is unfortunately cursed 😭

[swift tinsel]

I've got everything at 600-610 but arms and mw/ww stick out as the most fun non-rogues

though San'layn UH is a good time

cleaving the big dot consume feels gnarly when you set up well

[hollow spear]

WW are pretty doom about their spec, but that's probably because everybody is doom about their spec

[lilac stag]

Arms biggest issue is dmg rot surviving

[keen dome]

I am always shocked by how little survivability warriors have

[swift tinsel]

glass cannons

if its not parryable for arms they're kinda cooked

or spell reflectable

[keen dome]

Survivability is probably the wrong word but like, they lack a lot of options.

[swift tinsel]

fury at least gets a dr

[lilac stag]

It’s like pugging a warrior in BGs. Have a pocket healer and wreck fools

[keen dome]

Yeah

[hollow spear]

Sub is surprisingly tanky

[swift tinsel]

that's why you see guys like Bajheera with at least two healers on him at all times lol

[keen dome]

Always adored how utterly unkillable Sub is

[hollow spear]

Survivability wise it's miles ahead of sin

[keen dome]

Esp in TWW with our verse stacking on top of the baked in DR and shit. It owns.

[lilac stag]

20% vers and a ton of while in X gain defensive it is not surprising at all

[swift tinsel]

Oh yeah I basically feel immortal outside of when I fuck up

[kind bluff]

Enhance for me. Been playing it since vanilla.

[swift tinsel]

which is why I get assigned shit all the time

[keen dome]

Sub is one of the best classes for soloing older or challenging content before it's nerfed (DF raids, etc)

[hollow spear]

Yeah, I'm not talking about the figures. More about class fantasy.

[swift tinsel]

Does recuperator work yet?

[hollow spear]

For me a rogue has never been the picture of just shrugging off hits like it's nothing

Besides evasion/dodge

[vale pine]

sin has lifesteal and makes enemies do less damage, which is diffrent in design.
Sub can deal with burst damage better.
But the biggest diffrence is still the higher amount of versatility you run on sub.

[swift tinsel]

also makes passive damage trinkets more viable

[lilac stag]

GL with class fantasy. Purple is immortal. Blizzard class fantasy.

[hollow spear]

Yeah, the 10% dr during dance is also big

[lilac stag]

and yer a cc bot in pvp

[swift tinsel]

I'm annoyed target dummies are immune to ratfang toxin stacking so I can test how much damage it does over 5mins

[lilac stag]

That’s as deep as subs class fantasy goes

[hollow spear]

Not like we're playing around that from a defensive perspective, but sometimes it aligns quite well

Just submit to the purple mate

Next season it's all we'll get

[swift tinsel]

I'll submit to the purp when we're 90% kyveza

[lilac stag]

I would encourage sub on my enemy

[swift tinsel]

I wanna become a purple ethereal when I dance

[vestal escarp]

Currently 21% kyveza

[swift tinsel]

Results may vary

consult your doctor

[void hound]

rogue defensives are a mess, i wish they were more streamlined

[hollow spear]

YOU WILL DO A LOT OF DAMAGE WITH YOUR AUTO ATTACKS AND YOU WILL LIKE IT

[swift tinsel]

I AM A DENIER I WILL NOT

[lilac stag]

How much more streamlines is do nothing, press fient or press cloak/evasion?

[hollow spear]

Wdym? Is that related to the dance dr comment?

[swift tinsel]

Sometimes cloak/evasion don't work on the things you think they should

but that's a blizz thing not a rogue thing imo

[lilac stag]

that’s not a streamline issue

[swift tinsel]

well, encounter team thing

[void hound]

well in the sense to make it more predictable and easier to understand what each button does

feint's description and when it works is sometimes quite random

cloak having a 1 sec "hard immune" part is also weird and cringe

[lilac stag]

of all the things wrong with sub/rogue, defensives ain’t it

[hollow spear]

I think that's more on how mechanics are programmed than what the skills do, no?

[lilac stag]

You should be the last one standing every wipe

[void hound]

well im not saying its a huge issue

but it could be better

[lilac stag]

[void hound]

my point wasnt about power level

but rather

how intuitive it is

[hollow spear]

Yeah I agree with that

[void hound]

thats probably part of the problem yeh

[hollow spear]

Every patch is "let me die to this mechanic real quick to see if my defensive works or not"

[void hound]

exactly

[tepid trellis]

thats what ptr is for

"will this kill me through feint"

[lilac stag]

Almost like you need to play the game to master your spec

[void hound]

what

[hollow spear]

I'm not really playing ptr/am not raiding on there, but I guess

[lilac stag]

test shit out

[swift tinsel]

that's what I use Normal clears for lol

farming cheese

[hollow spear]

I feel like that statement is a bit disingenuous, Dave

[void hound]

hey this thing could be better
"well have you tried gitting gud?"
ok my bad

[hollow spear]

That's what innovation means

If a mechanic doesn't count as what it says it is in the dungeon journal

[lilac stag]

I feel like you’re looking for issues that are non existent. Press fient once. It worked? Great. Cloak didn’t work? Good to know.

[hollow spear]

How is that "not being a master of your spec"

[lilac stag]

good talk.

[void hound]

so you think its cool that feint works on fyrak blazes but not on regicide, when its almost the same shit in blue?

[lilac stag]

I don’t care if it works or not as long as I know it does or doesn’t after I test it

And it’s consistent

[hollow spear]

I know we have bigger problems than that. Doesn't make it not a problem though.

[lilac stag]

For that encounter

Learning and using defensives often separates good from great players.

[hollow spear]

You're arguing against your own strawman

But sure

[void hound]

where is the skill expression in trial and error

when it shouldnt be in the first place

[lilac stag]

Ah straw man shit.

Guess you’re just one shotting everything on prog?

kekw

[hollow spear]

Nevermind dude

No point discussing this lmao

[void hound]

the class fantasy of digging through logs to see if my defensive works

[tepid trellis]

or just stand in it and press it?

[lilac stag]

are you not doing that with offensive abilities?

Or are you just relying on 4 people in here to do that for you?

[tepid trellis]

nah im gonna gaslight people next tier

cant trust me anymore

[swift tinsel]

Idk I like the reward of figuring it out

[tepid trellis]

"it works source trust me"

[swift tinsel]

or like when you can shadowstep cheese stuff

[lilac stag]

“It works, source blizzard tool tip”

[tepid trellis]

me and push used to just chat all the time during ptr

to test defensives

[void hound]

no i do exactly as you laid it out, im just sayings its bad design

[swift tinsel]

The day I trust a blizzard tooltip is the day I hard switch to deathstalker

[void hound]

but for some reason we are running hardcore defense for unintuitive design

[hollow spear]

You're really making it easy for yourself here 😛

[swift tinsel]

If there are zero deathstalker haters left, I am dead

[lilac stag]

Watching unnerfed princess defensive brainstorming was fun

[tepid trellis]

that was simple tho

for rogue

that is

cloak / feint the charge with elusiv

evasion regicides

and feint when that runs out

if you arent cloaking charges time your cloak so it lasts the last two regicides in intermission

[sly shore]

I think that blizzard has issues with the current energy CP classes as a whole

WW/Feral/Rogue all have issues in design

Idk how they fix it cos energy is either a resource or doesn't matter

[tepid trellis]

imo

energy should be a thing that limits your out of cds output

which is why outlaw should be deleted

[sly shore]

But Outlaw is always in CD's

[tepid trellis]

lets be real

they dont have cds

so just delete them

[swift tinsel]

ADR is their SnD

[tepid trellis]

i remember when AR did something

[leaden prairie]

Why you guys always hating wtf

[tepid trellis]

bring back combat

frfr

[swift tinsel]

Bandit's Guile rise up

[tepid trellis]

Turn sub into Empress arcana from lost ark @empty hornet thoughts?

just less rng please

no cull, judge pull rng

[sly shore]

cos it's so easy

to hate, that is

[old venture]

I think you were 11 the last time that was true

[tepid trellis]

OKAY BUD

im not "that" young

im almost 27

[empty hornet]

fuck yes

god yes

[leaden prairie]

why tho

on the topic of energy

sub energy

[tepid trellis]

have you seen what they can do in tier 4

[leaden prairie]

is even less interesting

than outlaw one

[empty hornet]

nah

[tepid trellis]

their new T skill hits for like 5bil with cull

[empty hornet]

havent followed recent loa updates

[sly shore]

It's not a competiton, they are both shit

[empty hornet]

[sly shore]

[tepid trellis]

and their reset cd card

works on it

[empty hornet]

neat

[tepid trellis]

that + their finish spam

[empty hornet]

but ye empress arcana gameplay reminded me a lot of old sub rogue

[tepid trellis]

they can pump out like 15bil dmg in 4 sec

[empty hornet]

its prolly why i loved it so much

[tepid trellis]

https://youtu.be/F3_wHzcj_38?t=369

[swift tinsel]

Best version of sub rogue?

aaand go

[empty hornet]

judgment+cull

[tepid trellis]

https://youtu.be/F3_wHzcj_38?t=179 earlier in the pull

back to back T skill

[empty hornet]

man

i miss arcana so much

[tepid trellis]

they are turbo busted atm

both specs are

[empty hornet]

like it should be

consdering both specs have pretty high skill cap

[lilac stag]

@empty hornet hi.

[tepid trellis]

so does reaper?????

but it does z

-.-

[empty hornet]

ye

but thats bad

[tepid trellis]

had to swap away from lunar to hunger

im not happy

[empty hornet]

the one thing that was true for arcana for most of its life was that it had one of the highest skillcaps in the game, but also did insane damage if you played it right

meanwhile ignite sorc

[tepid trellis]

drool on keyboard

still insane dps

[empty hornet]

ye

[tepid trellis]

rat class

[empty hornet]

but the combo point/doomcard system together with the temp buffs from the identity cards

is just too peak

[tepid trellis]

but yeah i think the most broken classes atm is SE, Arcana and RE deathblade

[empty hornet]

RE blade

[tepid trellis]

RE IS NOT OKAY

[empty hornet]

ngl

[tepid trellis]

they made them hitmaster

bro

[empty hornet]

surge blade was also very sub-rogue esque early on

[tepid trellis]

their surge is omni

[empty hornet]

i know @bronze turret really loved it

[tepid trellis]

and is nowa dash

[empty hornet]

[tepid trellis]

surge hard blows now

they back loaded their dmg even more now

[bronze turret]

ye me and DK (rip) played it

[empty hornet]

happy belated bday cutie :3

[tepid trellis]

whats he even doing now

havent talked to him in a long time

dont think he responded to my last dm

[empty hornet]

is he still alive?

[pliant topaz]

Last I heard he’s a surv hunter rogue hater now

[bronze turret]

idk

last time he posted was in july

didnt respond to my dm

and hasnt been online anywhere for months

[empty hornet]

i kinda respect it

[tepid trellis]

he hides offline on disc but i aint got him anywhere else

[pliant topaz]

I think 11.0 tilted him enough to reroll, then he didn’t enjoy being something other than a rogue and quit? Idk

[bronze turret]

thank you mister, age catching up to us huh

[empty hornet]

ye every fucking year

[tepid trellis]

im close to 27 now

its not good

[bronze turret]

i have 1 foot in the grave

[tepid trellis]

kids taking a toll?

[old venture]

if you think 27 is going to be bad

buddy do I have news for you

[empty hornet]

ye

it aint getting any better

[tepid trellis]

u graying yet?

[bronze turret]

yeppers

[tepid trellis]

my body is older than yours it barely works

[bronze turret]

not a single gray hair yet

[old venture]

I've been graying since 17

[tepid trellis]

can imagine having 3 kids running around can get quite alot

[old venture]

I've officially had gray hairs more than half my life

[bronze turret]

at least 2 of them is just on 50%

[tepid trellis]

i dye my hair so i dont even know if i have grey hairs

[old venture]

you should be used to it with wow raiding

[bronze turret]

ye i'm numb to stupidity

[tepid trellis]

those 50% weekeends tho

[old venture]

[tepid trellis]

i think its tough just when my sister visits with her kid for 1 weekend

but i also dont do well with kids

[bronze turret]

its just one of those things, you learn to shut it out

[worn ivy]

In theory which spec you guys think we play in s2 m+ ?

[tepid trellis]

in low keys?

or do you mean season

ah

prolly assa/sub

depends on key scaling tbh

atleast early season

if shit dies too fast assa aint that great

[worn ivy]

There is no good 1:30 trinket

[bronze turret]

i mean, even if outlaw would be the de facto best spec, theres no way ur touching that dogshit

[tepid trellis]

well i wouldnt yeah

[bronze turret]

might as well quit wow if thats the case

[tepid trellis]

facts

[rocky ocean]

Outlaw because sub has no trinket and assa has no tier

[tepid trellis]

havent played it since i played with a broken arm

outlaw is never the answer

just reroll class

[bronze turret]

possibly the worst spec to play with a broken arm

[old venture]

how is stealthi physically older than all of us old men?

[worn ivy]

Too much apm needed

[tepid trellis]

cuz im dumb?

[bronze turret]

i have thicc bones

[tepid trellis]

ive got a thicc ass

[worn ivy]

Too much apm for this damage is crazy

[tepid trellis]

gotcha

[bronze turret]

played football for 18 years and never broke anything

[old venture]

I mean same, but I've never broken a bone

[alpine wraith]

dont worry im more fucked up it just comes

[old venture]

I'm literally knocking on all the wood I can see

[alpine wraith]

you get used to it

[old venture]

I think being run over helped you a WEE bit with that

[alpine wraith]

im actually glad you never had to suffer it

[bronze turret]

i think this is where being short comes in handy, shorter bones, less likely to break em

[alpine wraith]

well i've been ran over stabbed shot

[tepid trellis]

well you probably have the voice in your head going " hey adam thats not very smart what you are about to do, you might get hurt"

i dotn

[bronze turret]

built like a tank

[alpine wraith]

you name it

[old venture]

that's only when I'm on a tall balcony

and the "I wonder how much it hurts to free fall 14 stories"

thought pops into my head

[alpine wraith]

think of the people that will have to clean it

then intrusive thoughs disappear

[tepid trellis]

"hey stealthi you dont have the balls to rail slide down this 20 stair"

[old venture]

what are they gonna do

[tepid trellis]

proceeds to t ry

[old venture]

bill my corpse?

[tepid trellis]

and break my tailbone

[old venture]

ah see that's your mistake

you have energy to do things

if you're just clinically depressed all the time

you have no energy

[tepid trellis]

i think since i got hurt doing so much dumb shit as a kid

[dry plank]

Stealthi true raccoon and have tail

[tepid trellis]

ive just got rid of the "fear" of getting hurt

[old venture]

brother

[tepid trellis]

and im also just perma unlucky

so i do get hurt alot

[old venture]

I hurt my back shoveling snow

and I've been wincing in pain for 3 days

laying down hurts

[tepid trellis]

i helped my dad with some wires few days ago

and my whole hand started bleeding

not sure i did it right

xD

[old venture]

I electrocuted myself a few weeks ago

that was pretty neat

[tepid trellis]

but hey our washing machine works now

[keen dome]

Was it the wiring or the blood sacrifice that fixed it, though?

[old venture]

yes

[tepid trellis]

we will never find out

[tepid trellis]

but i learned to not try and straighten out copper wires with my bare hands

[old venture]

another thing

[tepid trellis]

they sharp

[old venture]

for the future

[tepid trellis]

very pointy

[old venture]

don't try to straight out copper wires with bare hands while the electricity is still on

you're welcome

[tepid trellis]

dont think ill try that

[old venture]

I had a shooting pain in my left hand

for literally 2 weeks

[tepid trellis]

wet raccoon + electricity

doesent sound fun

(i was out in the snow before that)

[old venture]

I think you europeans have stronger voltage from your outlets too

you might die

[tepid trellis]

okay youve convinved me to try

[old venture]

Europe's electrical system is different from ours in two ways: the voltage of the current and the shape of the plug. American appliances run on 110 volts, while European appliances are 220 volts.

have fun!

[tepid trellis]

"a light tickle"

is what im reading there

i mean im dumb as shit

[old venture]

well I can tell you with certainty, unless you have heart issues, 110v won't kill you

[tepid trellis]

i used to touch voltage fences

for fun

[old venture]

but it fucking hurts

p sure voltage fences are way lower than 220v

or am I wrong

[tepid trellis]

yeah they are

way way lower

[old venture]

between 15 and 500 milliamps

[tepid trellis]

they are just scare cows / horses to not touch em again after doing it once

so they dont just try and jump em

[old venture]

15-20amp for US outlets

smol dif

[tepid trellis]

i used to terrorize people

id grab their hands and touch the fence

[old venture]

@empty hornet I'll take things I can't type online for $1000

[tepid trellis]

LOL

[plain jay]

I can learn all types of things on this server, how to play rogue, don't touch copper wires with or without electricity with my bare hands

Euro appliance are different than us appliances with voltage

[tepid trellis]

np

[empty hornet]

[restive cloak]

yo, just came back, is totd animation permanent above my fuckin head?

[swift tinsel]

If you have So Tricky, yeah

[restive cloak]

ahh man, not a huge fan

[swift tinsel]

yeah it's not great, looks like a perma-LoL emote

[lilac stag]

Why are people all of the sudden coming back?

[twilit phoenix]

prolly plunderstorm

might as well check out retail if you're back for that

[swift tinsel]

New raid/season on the horizon

[keen dome]

I am excited to Plunder tomorrow.

[lilac stag]

Island first for ring.

[swift tinsel]

Legit keep forgetting ring weekly is a thing

[haughty mural]

Is there catch up with the Ring ?

[swift tinsel]

The previous weekly ilvl upgrade quests become available right after doing the first one so you can catch up pretty quick

so like you start the one from the first week, finish it and then can start the next

they aren't very long at all, I think tomorrow will be the 4th upgrade for NA

[mighty citrus]

iam testing some stuff on a dummy. when i do opener, sometimes my vanish breaks, anyone knows why?

[worn ivy]

any news on ptr? no thank you see you later

[alpine wraith]

you can go on a car brrrrrrrrrrr

[short radish]

probably you spamming buttons and you do an auto attack inbetween gcd

[leaden prairie]

You can't vanish directly after a finisher as sub

It's bugged

Cause of the finisher refound shit probably idk no idea

Just wait half a second before vanish and make sure you vanish SS directly

[mighty citrus]

Ty guys

[woeful egret]

I find that in mists I constantly get unstealthed during the maze portion, known bug or blizz hates me?

[hazy breach]

Thats just how it is

[woeful egret]

how exciting!

[woeful egret]

i've had stop attacking for like 7 lines macro'd to vanish, this might help too

[leaden prairie]

When you aren't talented into subterfuge, you need to wait outside the room till the mob did the spawn animation

If you are using subterfuge like on otl or ass it won't take you out anyway

[short radish]

it's a known feature 🙂

i love that its a thing

especially with the talent TFD

it's really really fun

[tribal blade]

alright guys rogue notes tomorrow

who's ready

[lilac stag]

Not me. Just got home. Flipping ice all over

[swift tinsel]

“In fixing the tier set’s shadow damage amp we accidentally removed all shadow damage from the spec. Because we don’t actually care we’re just gonna leave that, laters 👋 “

[last bear]

I’m so confused by these leveling guides

I’m just trying to figure out the talents for leveling

[lilac stag]

Use a character boost. Don’t actually level a rogue unless you really hate your life and want pain.

If you insist on leveling, Wowhead is shit on mobile. Open on desktop. There’s a talent color key.

[dusky yew]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[rocky ocean]

Gameplay until 30 is actually backstabbing and eviscerating
Without shadow craft
Without premeditation
Without energy refund on finishers

The apm is very close to assa st in M+

[kind bluff]

Do we want both daggers 639 or one crafted?

[fallow nimbus]

Yes

Dagger craft was/is the best possible craft because it's high itemlvl from the start and also embellishment slot

If you can easily get 2nd boss daggers then it might not be worth it

But you also would have 2 good weapons if 1 drops and you craft one

[kind bluff]

I just got double wep drops from second boss lol

And have crafted dagger

[fallow nimbus]

Sparks should drop a good amount and crest/flightstones are farmable, so just do it

[haughty mural]

@swift tinsel thx mate

[steel zinc]

Embellishments are w/e rn. Just have a crafted dagger in offhand. Also no dagger current has versa mastery

I think next season 1 dagger has it

[lilac stag]

It’s just prepping you for sub gameplay outside of CDs

[rocky ocean]

btw if embelishments don't scale with ilvl, doesn't it force us to play new ones?
or if the new ones are on par with the previous then in s3 they are going to be like 0.00001% increase?

[lilac stag]

Some do scale, it’s just not a crazy amount.

[vale pine]

The effects just become less relevant, but embellishment choice is already fairly irrelevant this season.

[tribal blade]

the game feels healthier with embels not being that good

considering how gated we are with crafting stuff

[void hound]

i like the ideas of embels but i hate pseudo choices

[haughty mural]

qol embelishments are great

like flavor pocket

[keen dome]

They're more fun than damage, but I like what they did to make flavour packet stuff more accessible with hearty food

[void hound]

agreed

[keen dome]

They should add some more flavourful or useful embelishments. Maybe one that massively boosts move speed in old content, or something. But I quite like they're all a bit shit this season (expansion?, who knows) and you can just use whatever.

[vale pine]

pmuch, the diffrence is so low it usually is irrelevant

[keen dome]

Yeah

[alpine wraith]

the best one is duskthread and it is still like half the power of last expansion ones kekw

[vestal escarp]

Gm, dev notes?

[hazy breach]

Ye the 525 embellishments from df are stronger than current ones

[void hound]

https://tenor.com/view/mcmahon-crying-he-was-special-wwe-vince-mcmahon-gif-13313547165599993551

[tribal blade]

i was actually thinking the other night about how BSL was stronger than our current embels

[hazy breach]

Yep

And not only percentage wise

[hazy breach]

Just raw numbers wise it would be better to have the dragonflight 525 embellishment than the tww ones

[tribal blade]

in some ways i'm happy to have embels that aren't super impactful because it makes gearing less of a headache

but at the same time it's kind of like why do they even exist then

i think i'm over embellishments, i don't like em anymore

would like a new system

[keen dome]

Ye, they could remove them and it's whatever.

[tulip gorge]

They should rework embellishments to just have fun effects

[keen dome]

Agreed

Like i said earlier: legacy movespeed boots

bam

[tulip gorge]

Like increased movement speed, or being able to double jump

[keen dome]

Haha yeah

[hexed sluice]

I like gimmicky embellishments, so them being shit is nice for me cause now I can run stuff like the bumble bee buff allies one with out completely inting me

[tribal blade]

that could be cool, but they couldn't be too insane because then it would become this system where you only ever crafted 1 OP one

or you would craft the wrong one and then you couldn't do a boss fight the same as everyone else

[keen dome]

The idea of having a way to make a crafted item potentially have a cantrip on par with something non-crafted is cool. But the balance of it, nah.

[tulip gorge]

You can always recraft gear

[keen dome]

I think they should just become QoL / utility stuff.

[tribal blade]

true, but that's a HUGE headache

[keen dome]

Flavour packet-esque, movement speed. Sew an augment rune into your gear, etc

Nothing that applies to Dam% or Survivability, etc. But just stuff that makes stuff easier or more convenient

[tribal blade]

like imagine you get to a boss and everyone has to zone out of the raid and recraft their gear to deal with a certain mechanic

[keen dome]

The potion tinker should be:

1. Be an embellishment
2. Not have the insanely stupid malus

[hexed sluice]

I am missing all the world content ones from DF that didn't really count as an embellishments, just a small bonus like the parachute, bandage amp etc

[tulip gorge]

I liked the embellishment that allowed your food buff to stay after death

[keen dome]

Yeah, flavour packet

[tulip gorge]

Just add stuff like that

[keen dome]

But they did the smart thing and bake that into cooking itself, which is the right call imho.

[tribal blade]

small stuff like that would be cool, but it would very quickly become a "who cares" system haha

[keen dome]

I think that's fine.

[tribal blade]

the novelty would wear off very quickly

[hexed sluice]

Killed myself too many times in time walking cause it doesn't scale down

[tribal blade]

man i just want artifact weapons back

[keen dome]

One of the biggest requests from old content runners is movespeed. Which is why I think a movespeed in legacy content would be huge. Or letting you mount in instances below max, etc

[tribal blade]

i'm a big movespeed bandwagoner

i got a lot of flack during SL for gemming full move speed gems

like the pvpers did

[keen dome]

Also, you could take the bonus of different professions and make them an embellishment. I..e, you know how Alchemy has double potion duration? Make it an embellihsment so non-alchemists can make a choice there.

[tribal blade]

i got a lot of "why are you gemming speed, just get more damage"

and my thought process was i'm moving like 8-10% faster than you

[keen dome]

Yeah, movespeed owns

[tribal blade]

at all times

i like it

[keen dome]

It's always a shock going away from Sub to another class

And just being so slow

[tribal blade]

yeah people think move speed is overrated till you play something like a priest haha

[tulip gorge]

Rogue’s 1 second gcd is too addictive

[tribal blade]

1 sec gcd is a blessing and curse

[keen dome]

Movespeed means getting to, and away from, stuff quicker

Which is more uptime

[tribal blade]

i play with high ms anyways so more speed really helps

since you can't barely dodge things with higher ms

half my deaths and cheat procs from blades on queen are because of my ms

i'll barely dodge a blade and be safe on my screen, but the game says NOPE

[kind bluff]

What causes the delay on cps refunding, sometimes I hit a builder cause it refunds to 4 then right before it goes off it refunds to 7

[hazy breach]

It never refunds to 4, it always refunds to max

[vestal escarp]

!delay

[hazy breach]

But having replicating shadows specced makes it so the refunds can proc even when you didnt do a finisher right before

(if you get to 7 sht stacks that is)

[tawdry meadow]

How’s sub looking on the PTR,

[hazy breach]

No changes

So same as now

[tribal blade]

back to back sub classics

refund delays and no rogue dev notes

[vestal escarp]

Any day now the ritualposting will work

[keen dome]

This time next week we'll have big notes. I can feel it. In my replicating shadows.

[upper narwhal]

big notes = bugfixes please

[keen dome]

They'll take it literally. Size 500 notes. It's one word. "Nothing."

[plush roost]

(x) doubt

[swift tinsel]

You never know, they might change the wording on a pvp talent

Cinema

[lilac stag]

Are you raiding on full NA guild or?

I was surprised when my MS was normal with you yesterday.

[candid mural]

I see we're all ready for another round of #nochanges

[swift tinsel]

Damn right

[keen dome]

Hell yeah Dave profile picture.

[swift tinsel]

At best maybe a fix to the tier set

I need to make that an emote

[keen dome]

The Subtley rogue eagerly awaiting patch notes emoji

[swift tinsel]

patch notes when

The devastation one might be my favorite

[bronze turret]

Did realz fully tap out from the disc?

[swift tinsel]

He hasn't said anything in here since Oct iirc

here being Ravenholdt in general

[keen dome]

Same, after I eat too much cheese.

[dry plank]

People in this channel every reset wait for notes not vault 🙂 while everyone else wait for vault usually xD

[swift tinsel]

I don't think I even have a vault this week lol

I'm in vacation mode this late in the season

[keen dome]

I'm chasing two drops from vault, and it's just so fruitless haha

[sacred yarrow]

more sub talk in chat would be welcome, when sub was fotm s2 df there were so many new folks, was fun to read

[sly shore]

that's a very good pic

what's it from

[swift tinsel]

Someone drew all of the spec icons

[sly shore]

the WW one

is nuts

[swift tinsel]

lmao right

[keen dome]

I love the affliction one

Very

[swift tinsel]

looks like its giving sideeye

[sly shore]

the arcane gigachad

[swift tinsel]

Demo is just Handsome Squidward

[keen dome]

this is very good too.

[swift tinsel]

had to make a true Dave emoji

[sly shore]

Bare in mind these were made in Legion

[keen dome]

They're good

Also: ring upgrade quest live in EU early again. Prizes without having to do the dumb fill a bar quest tomorrow.

[vale pine]

na and eu get the ring upgrade at the same time, was always like this

[keen dome]

Yeah, I know it's been consistently like this but it could suddenly change, for some reason

[worn ivy]

Any changes on PTR?

[swift tinsel]

Too early

PTR is usually evening iirc

[minor aurora]

been playing a lot of rogue (sub, obv) on the free trial, how is overall levelling with the spec in the full game? I haven't tried the others purely cause i really enjoy the quick burst sub offers

[swift tinsel]

evening NA*

[keen dome]

It's fine. Rogue in general is awkward to level as a lot of our power is quite late. But leveling is very quick. Sub is pretty comfy to level as, though. Nice burst, quick movement, etc.

But the majority of the game is in the end-game, so leveling is a relatively short experience these days.

[minor aurora]

sounds good, thanks

thinking of getting a membership for a month, sinking some more time into rogue after my mock exams - and sinking time into WoW in general

[vale pine]

ptr update does not even need to be today

[swift tinsel]

Yeah I expect a lot of resources will be towards making sure plunderstorm is ready to go

maybe ptr update thurs

[vale pine]

is plunderstorm next week?

[swift tinsel]

today

[hazy breach]

Should be today

[swift tinsel]

6 hour maintenance

[vale pine]

ohh

for eu also today or tomorrow

[keen dome]

It's meant to go live at 1AM going by the calender.

[sacred yarrow]

PlunderFarm begins again 🫡

[keen dome]

Hell yeah

[swift tinsel]

they just started ~30mins ago in NA

[keen dome]

Gonna get everything, again.

[swift tinsel]

I think I played maybe two rounds the first time it was live lol

[keen dome]

I just did nothing but for a few days until I had the track finished and all achievements, etc

[swift tinsel]

battle royales just aren't really my jam

I don't have the pvp edge anymore

[vale pine]

i guess i know what i do today/tomorrow ^^

[keen dome]

I'm pretty excited for it. I liked it enough the first time that i've often thought it'd be fun to just dive in

[vale pine]

okay chat, what is the highest simming plunderstorm build, i need to know

[keen dome]

Triple parrots and a slice of pineapple

[sacred yarrow]

I farmed rep through the quest/blunder method, avoided players like a plague

wonder if I can do that again

[keen dome]

Yeah, I suspect so

[vale pine]

i remember trying this and it felt horrible so i just went to try to play for first/second

[keen dome]

I'd land at the troll area or the hidden dock area, grind up, etc.

[leaden prairie]

that red axe

with like all movmeent abiltieis

a banger no cap

best simming

i done the math

[swift tinsel]

based

[sacred yarrow]

I landed mostly near horde settlement, farm the mine and rares around, die near the wall

[vale pine]

https://tenor.com/view/asterix-fish-fisch-nicht-frisch-obelix-gif-27253874

[keen dome]

They've made some changes, too. Curious how it'll feel.

[sacred yarrow]

have funn out there everyone 🫡

[vale pine]

fish was quite good, so the one holding the fish is onto a winning build

[keen dome]

Hell eyah

maybe we'll run into each other and have a fish duel

[swift tinsel]

The new reward system looks pretty nice, might need to play a few rounds since there's no hard-locked reward track this time

[vale pine]

Plunderstorm Countdown: <t:1736888400:R> (assuming no further delays)

assuming it goes live global after the servers are online in na

[swift tinsel]

that'd be what, 8pm CET?

[vale pine]

10pm

[swift tinsel]

oh duh its 1pm PST not my timezone

[void ocean]

how important is to actually finish the campaign on alt, do u guys know

i finished on main and did skip on alt but still offers me quests

and im not sure i got weekly

[worn ivy]

not getting inv even the keys ive done

interesting

[hazy breach]

Well its because youre playing an ultra offspecc unplayable class

(despite it being on the frontpage on rio)

[bronze turret]

Didnt ion talk about this recently

Are they doing anything about it

[hazy breach]

Yes and no

[bronze turret]

Its a shame 33% of the pve content is deleted because you play the wrong spec

[hazy breach]

Its not like swapping to assa really helps anyway

[leaden prairie]

Yesterday I was getting declined in 16s

As assa

[hazy breach]

Ye same

[leaden prairie]

( I timed everything in 18)

People legit fiend for Aug

Over anything else

It's kinda wild to me

Aug/enh

Basically applying to a group missing either of those you aren't getting in ever

Even if I'm giga out rioing the key

Idk it's weird

[hazy breach]

And even groups where those are in

Theyre 99% of the time gonna take a boomie or dk

[hazy breach]

Such is life when youre playing such an obscure offmeta spec

[leaden prairie]

Assa isn't even that off meta tho

[hazy breach]

Ye thats my point

[leaden prairie]

Like I understand when this happens when I'm applying as outlaw

As outlaw I can't even enter 14s

But as ass