Seems legit
#subtlety
pliant topaz
No I think it was the one from the James Bond one
wind canopy
pliant topaz
https://tenor.com/view/eosjk-gif-23854718
Yep that one my gos
pliant topaz
i honestly live close enough to china to buy fake stuff
Buy me a fake Rolex while you’re at it
I tried buying a real one, and it was so much work I don’t think I’m gonna get one anymore
swift tinsel
pliant topaz
That’s good I guess. I have some ideas now how to optimize it. I was worried rppm would be lower
tribal blade
I tried buying a real one, and it was so much work I don’t think I’m gonna get o...
SHEEESH baller
pliant topaz
Nah clearly not baller enough
went in and asked for the one I wanted they said they’re out even though I’m sure they weren’t
tribal blade
went in and asked for the one I wanted they said they’re out even though I’m sur...
discrimination
hybrid prism
went in and asked for the one I wanted they said they’re out even though I’m sur...
they were. You have to be on a wait list to buy any rolex
from a retailer new
pliant topaz
yeah maybe
strange chasm
!fuu
wicked joltBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
pliant topaz
Ill look into it more again later maybe, ill probably get one by the end of this year
spark tusk
Ill look into it more again later maybe, ill probably get one by the end of this...
"end of this year" doing a lot of work here said on January fourth
hybrid prism
lmao
alpine wraith
we actually have 4 rolex and mostly it is because they make numbered batches of x model
so sometimes they dont have some
but you can backorder
round latch
https://tenor.com/view/eosjk-gif-23854718
thats a nice piece
vale pine
true gansters go for aldidas ^^
rough rivet
@vale pine remember removing eleems tc writeup link off your pin? its still in the sub faq. just letting you know in case you want to remove it there as well
hollow spear
<@639956635300790285> fuck Rolex go for the Jacob & Co Casino Tourbillon
Fits the new patch
tribal blade
true gansters go for aldidas ^^
niiiiiiice
just found out apparently sin is completely busted in pvp atm
molten citrus
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-seVoAGudc
it's funny because it isn't 
tribal blade
it's funny because it isn't <:XD:357861468080832524>
oh it's not? damn i've been had haha
molten citrus
venruki especially is always spreading libel towards rogues
been nerfed time after time yet he'll continue to say rogue is broken in pvp
molten citrus
sin is good, but outlaw is considered better in 3s in most cases
tribal blade
mmm interesting
is it because outlaw doesn't sacrifice cleave for ST
or just outlaw tankier and more dam
tribal blade
like outlaw prob has 100% uptime on feint
molten citrus
sin does the most dmg out of the rogue specs, but it's nothing 'broken' or unhealable by a regular good healer
tribal blade
gotcha
bro i feel like they gotta do something about feint on outlaw
100% uptime is ridiculous
having 20% dr rolling 24/7 kinda batty
molten citrus
we're also getting a new pvp talent that buffs feint's DR during stuns
but they're removing veil of midnight and shadowy duel
vale pine
<@194804407706189824> remember removing eleems tc writeup link off your pin? its...
oh thanks, moment, done
tribal blade
we're also getting a new pvp talent that buffs feint's DR *during stuns*
so outlaw basically becomes immortal after that
keen dome
but they're removing veil of midnight and shadowy duel
This is a crime.
How dare they take the best pvp talent away from me
tribal blade
shadowy duel is a huge loss for sub in pvp
molten citrus
i can understand it from a gameplay health standpoint
tribal blade
i think it was inevitable, people have been up in arms about sub's cc capabilities for a LONG time
molten citrus
i'm just very tired of them removing things and not compensating rogue whatsoever
keen dome
i think it was inevitable, people have been up in arms about sub's cc capabiliti...
Yeah, I guess. I'd argue that it's balanced by just how.. absurd the knowledge gap is for playing Sub in pvp but I'm a baby who can't even hit 1.8k, so.
molten citrus
sub is in a bad state rn even WITH duel
tribal blade
Yeah, I guess. I'd argue that it's balanced by just how.. absurd the knowledge g...
maybe they'll lift some of the burst nerfs sub has
in pvp
keen dome
haha
molten citrus
it's not BAD, but it's not good either
keen dome
Also depressing to hear. I still need to try and push to 1.8k for the set
But I got super lazy at bothering.
molten citrus
1.8k is insanely ez
tribal blade
i imagine sub lost a decent chunk with the removal of dust too
keen dome
I'm sure it is but I am really bad at pvp.
molten citrus
if you know how to press stuns and do your dmg rotation
all you need to do is press the queue button fr
keen dome
I'm hoping my medicore skillset and general knowledge will carry me, yeah
tribal blade
you can actually get pretty far in arena by just using the bum rush strat
keen dome
I just hope the inflation helps.
keen dome
you can actually get pretty far in arena by just using the bum rush strat
I love it when a DH bum rushes me in solo shuffle
molten citrus
I just hope the inflation helps.
ye that's why it's so ez rn
keen dome
DH zooming over and behind the pillar because he say me in stealth: HE DEAD NOW.
blam blam
molten citrus
as sub i like to open with just a subterfuge window
to see if it baits anything
then use flag/blades/kidney etc
keen dome
Oh that's smart
tribal blade
nothing worse feeling than popping everything straight into an immunity
keen dome
Letting subtefuge fall off to see if they think it's a dance or something?
molten citrus
sometimes at low rating people just waste stuff the moment you open
like stunning you or using a defensive
molten citrus
getting cc'd during flag/blades sucks
tribal blade
are you playing DS or trickster as sub in pvp
keen dome
Nothing will top the shuffle I had where a warrior flamed me when he was on my team, and then the next round he was against me. Then I killed him in 6 seconds and he ragequit the lobby.
molten citrus
are you playing DS or trickster as sub in pvp
DS
tribal blade
makes sense
tribal blade
DS gives you a lot of passive damage too
molten citrus
you can press rupture as your first finisher before flag
to line up finality with darkest night
for max evis
keen dome
Makes sense, that's really helpful
tribal blade
omg playing around finality and DN
keen dome
At least it makes sense in pvp where the BIG HIT is gonna be monsterous
tribal blade
glad to hear symbolic victory is seeing some use
molten citrus
against good players can't really get a kill without duel though, at least in the opener
even then some classes can deal with duel
like pally or dh
keen dome
I just want the 1.8k set so I have all the etheral colours..
molten citrus
If they compensate with some damage buffs it’ll be fine I think
It needs sustain dmg bad
keen dome
I loved Shadowy Duel in RBG's, though. So much fun hitting it when a healer is about to drop their biggest buttton.
And then blam, it's in the shadow realm
lilac stag
That and old vendetta base defending.
tribal blade
dealing with sub rogues can be kinda simple from what it sounds like, you literally just cc/defensive during dances
and you're fine
i saw some pvpers running WAs that scream whenever dance is popped
keen dome
Damn
tribal blade
sub's damage outside cds is hilarious
lilac stag
yeah pvp’s finally realized WAs are useful
keen dome
Haha
tribal blade
yeah pvp’s finally realized WAs are useful
dude the video i just linked
absterge is running SO MANY was
all over his screen
keen dome
I wish Batleground Blitz wasn't so infurating because I really enjoy Rogue in RBG's. RBG's just feel way more fun to play
molten citrus
yeah pvp’s finally realized WAs are useful
Once they were actually allowed in tourneys people started using them
lilac stag
I loved solo defending calling for backups. You could do so much carnage to one of two people trying to sort out where you were and then stealth hitting vendetta preventing any cap
tribal blade
i agree rogue was so much fun running solo missions in rbgs
keen dome
Yeah, it's was a lot of fun when I played earlier this season. Sitting the cap point on the gilneas map and just wasting so much time when the enemy came over to try and cap
At one point having 3 peoplet rying to cap and just being an absolute menance
tribal blade
i feel like the full scope of the rogue concept is realized in pvp
in pve not really
it's halfway there
lilac stag
Once they were actually allowed in tourneys people started using them
I figured something like this changed.
keen dome
The ultimate annoying gremlin class.
tribal blade
the entire rogue toolkit is incredible in pvp
keen dome
Yeah
tribal blade
and all equally useful
in pve we have a bunch of stuff that becomes borderline useless to straight up useless
molten citrus
you pop a cd and instantly get cc'd
Well cc is also used offensively, so yes but not always
tribal blade
Well cc is also used offensively, so yes but not always
mmm you right
lilac stag
the entire rogue toolkit is incredible in pvp
The realization when you understand no one likes rogue in pve because it’s a pvp class
tribal blade
The realization when you understand no one likes rogue in pve because it’s a pvp...
this is actually a really good point lol
keen dome
haha
tribal blade
yeah there is a big disconnect between rogues in pvp and pve
molten citrus
The entire player base hates rogue because they are bad at the game
keen dome
Oh man. Shadowy Duel as a PvE burst button. You lock enemies with the mob. Enter a shadowy arena and in eight seconds it dies. Like a turbo massive dance window
molten citrus
lilac stag
The entire player base hates rogue because they are bad at the game
Assa is braindead AF in pve
Like maybe one more braincell needed than ret
molten citrus
Is it though
tribal blade
bring back smokebomb for pve, maybe not create los, but something similar
keen dome
oh yeah, smokebomb
molten citrus
Compared to a warrior or ret idk
tribal blade
i miss having smokebomb
keen dome
Smokebomb would be really nice in M+, in my opinon. Just making mobs run into melee with the group
Esp with the kick change
tribal blade
they won't put it back in the game as los i don't think
keen dome
Nah
tribal blade
it created too many problems
keen dome
I mean it could work as a defensive for the group like Darkness too
lilac stag
Warrior has survival issues in pve, well where most struggle.
keen dome
Just make it reduce cast damage
tribal blade
something like that yeah
or even you make the spell hit chance of everything in the smoke bomb reduced by a number
lilac stag
Ret is light up. Assa is remember one condition, hit buttons close to in order.
tribal blade
imagine popping smokebomb and the hit chance of everything in it got reduced by 50% or something
keen dome
or even you make the spell hit chance of everything in the smoke bomb reduced by...
Just thinking about some of the DB pulls where ther's all those obnoxious beam guys
And without a Paladin it can be awkward to group them up for melee.
tribal blade
rogue just needs a bit more utility in pve
lilac stag
Just shroud 4head
keen dome
ye, heroism button and a rez
tribal blade
i'd love for rogue to get a paladin level rework
NOW we're talking
keen dome
Disarm would be another fun button in pve
tribal blade
but rogues getting dev time not a thing
keen dome
But I dunno what it'd do
keen dome
but rogues getting dev time not a thing
No notes yet because they're cooking a big lot of cool changes like poison toggle.
molten citrus
turn sub into an actual shadow magic something or other
keen dome
All about them clones
molten citrus
base rogue specs are so bland after 20 years
tribal blade
agreed, they should go all in to sub being shadow damage
keen dome
Steal the Ninjitsu system from FF14 and give it to Sub
tribal blade
just model sub after kyveza
molten citrus
i'm leveling Ninja rn
keen dome
I love the NIN cast system because of how flexible it is
molten citrus
just started poking around ff again a week or so ago
keen dome
And being able to just adapt to any pull or situation or movement
molten citrus
level 40 so far
keen dome
However: doton is dumb
molten citrus
heard of it, haven't gotten to it yet
keen dome
What if Death and Decay but on a rogue
lilac stag
i'd love for rogue to get a paladin level rework
We did. It’s called Assa
lilac stag
Assa can do everything
molten citrus
i'm more worried about like
lilac stag
and use talents to make choices
molten citrus
the actual thematics, animations, etc
lilac stag
That is pali rework
molten citrus
as opposed to performance
molten citrus
SAYS WHO
lilac stag
And I hate it
keen dome
Kyveza animations when
keen dome
Can you do animation replacement mods in WoW like you can in 14.
Can I just do it myself
I assume not
molten citrus
yes
lilac stag
they haven’t done shit with rogue animations for YEARS and when they do you you don’t even know is there because you actively avoid the ability from trying to kill you.
molten citrus
technically you can yes
but no one has authored any sick animation packs i'm pretty positive
because it's technically ToS
keen dome
Yeah, I imagine so
molten citrus
people have used mods like jmorph, tmorph, imorph in wow for a looong time
you can choose any existing model in the game files and change your character into it
lilac stag
The last good animation rogue got was machine gun on outlaw.
And that’s a low fucking bar
lilac stag
You’re sneaky. Can’t be flashy. 
…. ~bliz
molten citrus
strike->evis->strike->evis->strike->OMG SEC TECH?? so cool......
keen dome
Wasn't one of their points about the removal of +range nodes for Melee an animation argument? That it looked silly we were so far from the mob doing melee stuff
Which is just. What a silly point
lilac stag
when you macro purple fireworks to Sectech so you have some visuals it’s clear what blizzard actually thinks of this class
keen dome
We glow purple when we dance. That's visual
molten citrus
they actually get to feel like the main characters
void hound
i'd love for rogue to get a paladin level rework
bold of you to ask for all this dev work for the 100 people who play this class
molten citrus
if they did some work to the class
keen dome
A hundred people with the posting power of thousands.
molten citrus
more people would play it
lilac stag
i feel like everything on Ret has nice gold/hammer animations
They could just copy lost ark if they wanted to phone it in
void hound
(im being tongue in cheek)
lilac stag
We have poisons, shadows and pirates. Our biggest visual dopamine hit is fucking poison bomb.
molten citrus
paladins get loads of changes and updates -> they have a lot of representation
keen dome
I've convinced two people to play this spec this expansion. I'm doing my part.
Both quit the game but that's neither here nor there.
lilac stag
I've convinced two people to play this spec this expansion. I'm doing my part.
Do you hate them?
void hound
its a chicken and egg problem that plagues modern day gaming
dev time devoted to proven formulas
vs
dev time devoted to unknown outcomes
molten citrus
yeh it just sucks for the few die hards that love the class
void hound
paladins get loads of changes and updates -> they have a lot of representation
right, but they had lots of representation before
even before the rework paladin was way more popular
molten citrus
ofc
lilac stag
Rogue in pve is only popular when it’s busted
molten citrus
easier specs will always be more popular as well
void hound
blizzard development resources are already stretched incredibly thin
void hound
Rogue in pve is only popular when it’s busted
not even then
in 10.2 rogue was incredibly strong and it didnt really impact player numbers
we still got mogged by hunters and paladins
lilac stag
It wasn’t
void hound
huh???
lilac stag
That’s not busted
keen dome
Rogue in pve is only popular when it’s busted
And from what I saw in DF, at that point you get a lot of "I've got to play Sub for prog"
lilac stag
10.2 it was strong
void hound
sub was like the best dps spec for 2 out of 3 of the relevent bosses last year
lilac stag
Best being strong and best being busted are two very different things
lilac stag
Bombs for everyone
molten citrus
every raid jumped from 0 to 4 surv hunters
void hound
we can quibble about what is busted and what is strong, the point stands
rogue power didnt meaningfully impact the number of people who played rogue
lilac stag
Because the power was not do far ahead that it matters
keen dome
every raid jumped from 0 to 4 surv hunters
When Paladin got their rework, we went from 1 Ret to having something like 7 at one point.
void hound
so youre saying if rogue was another 10 or 20% better all those ret mains would have rolled sub?
keen dome
Yeah, I agree.
It's like we saw with all those terrible Shadow Priest rerollers in S4.
void hound
rerolling and and meta chasing is a thing, but you are overestimating the willingness to reroll for the average playerbase
ret was popular even when it was bad
lilac stag
When did you start playing?
void hound
dragonflight, so my history is lacking
lilac stag
100
molten citrus
i feel like the meta chasing has only gotten 10x worse no?
in the past couple expansions
keen dome
rerolling and and meta chasing is a thing, but you are overestimating the willin...
I suppose you'd need to look at it as two categories, right? The 'average' player and the player who engages in higher endgame content.
void hound
yes, but that has more to do with a bleeding playerbase
so you are only left with the sweaty tryhards who havent touched another game in 15 years
molten citrus
like for raid you need at least 1 of a lot of classes for buffs etc
but m+ meta chasing has gotten a little insane
void hound
I suppose you'd need to look at it as two categories, right? The 'average' playe...
definitely
lilac stag
So follow along. Rogue isn’t a popular class. Paladin is.
The only time rogue gets considerably more play is when it’s actually broken and needs a nerf. You can look at outlaw numbers when people were running 2-3 in keys.
void hound
dave is not incorrect in saying that meta chasing is prelevant
keen dome
Yeah
Most people (I.e., the average player which is, I'd argue, 95% of the playerbase) is going to pick a class for esoteric and cosmetic reasons. But a lot of the endgame playerbase will metachase which massively skews population of a class.
lilac stag
We only track numbers for mythic parses and keys
That’s all that matters for higher end
keen dome
Yeah, I think that's why the conversation needs to focus on the latter part, not the former. And why I completely agree with you, Scath.
void hound
*Most* people (I.e., the average player which is, I'd argue, 95% of the playerba...
for sure
keen dome
'Cos I know an absolute ton of people who play rogue... for roleplay and don't touch end-game at all.
keen dome
Rogue is an extremely popular class for roleplayers on Argent Dawn, it's fascinating.
But I'd say an absolute minority of them touch end-game content.
lilac stag
And that’s fine. It doesn’t change the fact this is a dead class in high end pve and it’s been like that forever.
keen dome
Yeah, absolutely.
It's just to reinforce the point of focusing on the end-game population who do that content, which means ignoring the collective whole of the playerbase, 'cos otherwise it's just.. skewed weirdly.
lilac stag
Zul was probably last time sub was giga busted
lilac stag
Teaching 3-4 raiders how to main a rogue for one fight
because a AH blue geared rogue did more dps than mythic geared locks and mages.
keen dome
It was so frustrating how they just slammed that change with no testing or thought.
And then had to nerf the fight later.
Well, "no thought" is absolutely unfair, but it felt that way at the time.
lilac stag
Only time rogue really wasn’t worth bringing At least one to in mythic was what, nathria when all three were undercooked
maybe missing a raid
keen dome
Nathria was really painful and I went outlaw for it. And then quit.
lilac stag
Assa got fixed and was good , but took time
molten citrus
i started playing again not long before sin got buffed so i just swapped
lilac stag
sub had one small niche fight use for shield break
molten citrus
i had started heroic/m+ as outlaw
rogue was nice in SoD
also decent in jailer raid, except a couple fights
molten citrus
yer
keen dome
Went through the entire of Nathria without ever getting a Heroic weapon. not one drop, not one vault. Nothing, nada. Multiple people who could get the token from council and it never ever dropped. Raided every single week.
molten citrus
yeah i don't think i ever got a helm either
i still have to go back and farm the mythic helm
keen dome
The absolute worst the game has ever been imo. And then I quit with Sanctm and came back in DF.
lilac stag
to get back to where we started. I’d kill for actual animations
keen dome
Sameeee
molten citrus
yeah
keen dome
There's honestly so many good rogue-esque animations in the game they could just adapt. Kyveza is the obvious one.
lilac stag
I started gearing arms warrior. Forgot how satisfying it is to play just based on visuals
keen dome
But what about Lillian in whats it called.
molten citrus
i feel like if the class' thematics and animations were modernized, it would bring a lot of players to it
keen dome
I agree.
lilac stag
We had amazing audio effects and those are all gone
keen dome
Most people pick a class based on three things: Vibes, visuals, and versatility
molten citrus
look at reaper or darknight in FF14
molten citrus
adapt that into rogue animations
keen dome
Two swords that become a glavie
keen dome
Let us connect our daggers during dance
lilac stag
Nah
keen dome
I'm firmly of the belief that we're never getting another class.
I think at most it's going to be new specs.
keen dome
Tinker could just be a hunter spec I dunno
lilac stag
Nope
keen dome
I will bet you 5 gold we don't.
keen dome
New class: Interior Decorator
molten citrus
we'll see in a year and a half 
keen dome
I would, personally, prefer more variety of specs (No more mono DPS classes) than a new class.
Shaman tank, Warlock tank, Mage Healer, Hunter... tank. Rog.. Rogue tank.
lilac stag
Mid range rogue spec would be fire
hollow spear
Rogue heal
keen dome
DH Ranged spec
lilac stag
Delete sub for this and I’m ok
keen dome
Evoker tank
hollow spear
Stealing bandages from actual healers and using them on other players
keen dome
Red Mage imo
But with finnese.
Basically a ranged spec that does it's big finishers in melee.
lilac stag
I think outlaw hits the sword slinger
molten citrus
that just sounds so bad for wow mechanics
hollow spear
What is mid range?
molten citrus
What is mid range?
ret
lilac stag
Ret is range
lilac stag
Evoker is mid
hollow spear
I thought that was long range 😅
hollow spear
Isn't ret also 30?
molten citrus
they also have to auto attack n shit tho ya?
lilac stag
At some point sure
keen dome
Haha
But like - I think a single (or three or so) new specs would be easier to build up than an entire new class 'cos you can adjust and adapt stuff from existing areas. Warlock tank that pilots a huge voidwalker mech
lilac stag
I’d be more excited for adding fleshed out specs to some of the lesser played classes than a new class
keen dome
Yeah, agreed too.
As with anything in WoW: More work towards a strong foundation than building on top of it.
lilac stag
I think it’s a better use of dev resources as well
keen dome
Yeah, it doesn't really sell the expansion
lilac stag
why?
molten citrus
Because it’s wow
keen dome
Although I think Housing will probably make Midnight one of their biggest selling expansions ever.
lilac stag
You do house and add specs
keen dome
yeah
lilac stag
Then you add a class
molten citrus
A new class is a selling point
lilac stag
And maybe a new race
keen dome
We're getting Hannar this expansion for sure
lilac stag
You don’t need a selling point until after houses
keen dome
I'm betting Etherals in Midnight
lilac stag
People are going to buy that up faster than the AH mount
keen dome
Yeah
lilac stag
assuming it’s no total trash
molten citrus
That stupid leak
keen dome
Housing is one of the single most requested additions to WoW, imo.
molten citrus
Has me convinced
keen dome
Which leak?
lilac stag
the DE emails?
keen dome
Shaman tank leak?
molten citrus
The survey emails ye
molten citrus
Evoker got leaked, no one believed, guess what we got
keen dome
Yeah
But like. Thematically. Tinker in midnight
Although, like Scath says.. Next expansion. A titan-tech based class in Last titan
molten citrus
It doesn’t have to be tinker
lilac stag
I think people just need to not assume new class when some of those clearly have no depth past one when others do. Bard has 3 specs. Support healer dps (we just got that). Tinker (mech user) can do any. Everything else was more singular.
lilac stag
A gunslinger ain’t tanking or healing
molten citrus
Ye I mean even if the surveys had any substance you’d think if we were getting a new class in Midnight it’s already be in the pipeline as well
So maybe it’d be the following expac
But I just get the feeling we’ll def get another class before it’s all said and done
lilac stag
New classes need a lot more after the fact with tier and shit
keen dome
Another tier set every patch.
lilac stag
They can’t maintain the current classes correctly
so when it actually happens, that will be the only expansion feature im guessing
I would also kinda laugh a bit if instead of adding specs, they just replaced underplayed/developed specs
keen dome
The survival treatment
lilac stag
Dagger/Swords/Midrange all rogue themed.
Lock loses a spec for tanking.
Shaman get the Druid treatment and gets a 4th spec.
DH no changes. 
Etc
keen dome
dry plank
Dh and rogues seems like most forgotten classes
jaunty umbra
same dev 
vestal escarp
Dh is getting snacky next patch tho
Movement gameplay got partly addressed and they got a bit of sustained back
round latch
@hazy breach yo man,what keys would u suggest i sub instead of sin(thinking of pushing until 15s,currently 11-12 territory)
vestal escarp
Coming from a tier where they basically played 10.2 sub darkbrew
dry plank
<@212854714197344256> yo man,what keys would u suggest i sub instead of sin(thin...
Sv gb as sin everything else sub is fine
But I think that 15 could be timed as sub in any dung
round latch
But I think that 15 could be timed as sub in any dung
my overalls prolly would cover any key until like 13-14-ish range,sub or sin,i just wanna know what spec out of those two would be more impactful,like sub on mists that blows up 1st,2nd and the shield on the last boss,or idk sin dmg overall in GB,stuff like that
Im pretty much certain Sub does more ST in keys,like i dont even wanna ask that
just wanna know what spec overall looks more optimal in certain keys/areas thats all
lilac stag
Assa prob makes LFG easier if that’s a factor
round latch
Idk man,the pug experience stops around 13 range,above that u get to add ppl and send them keys
discord for stops and all
hazy breach
But I think that 15 could be timed as sub in any dung
Yep pretty much, the russian guy has timed most 17s too
round latch
Yep pretty much, the russian guy has timed most 17s too
wanted ur personal opinion more tbh but guess u go after that line right?
hazy breach
City is probably the best sub key
Dawn could be good but you usually pull around an enhance
worn ivy
my overalls prolly would cover any key until like 13-14-ish range,sub or sin,i j...
Your overall as sub is fine till +17
round latch
Your overall as sub is fine till +17
dont intent to go that high,wont go back to bfa tryharding my man but i rly have faith in this spec
idc what newfies say
gritty knot
Idk man,the pug experience stops around 13 range,above that u get to add ppl and...
In that range you can play all keys as sub while doing decent dmg. CoT like Eleem said is by far the best sub key tbh. I recently timed boralus+16 as sub too. You just won't get invited at all to keys as sub, you have to know that 😂 either play ur own keys or with a group. But be prepared to que as assa to get atleast an invite every 2-3 hours. As sub none will invite u for sure 😂
round latch
In that range you can play all keys as sub while doing decent dmg. CoT like Elee...
i always que my keys 😉
cba with ppl that dont know what sub rogue is
even as sin,i just que my own keys,vast majority of them newfies just leave but what can u do,it is what it is
gritty knot
Ye, I mean u can def que ur own keys until 13, some 14s. But then its starting to get horrible with pugging and just frustrating. Had +16 Ara Last week and within Not 2 hours it went down to a +12. I just shutoff my computer in silence, went to bed and watched some anime to calm down. Otherwise I was on the Edge of smashing my computer
round latch
thats how it is,its degen content
fathom adder
will be nice to no longer deplete keys from 12+ on with 11.1 after getting the acm
lilac stag
It’s a pug helper, not a pusher helper.
round latch
i dont even need gilded crests at this point,can craft myself a neck and be done
638ilvl is enough
my rogue jumped from being a rat to 638 in no time,even higher ilvl than my mage now
strange chasm
!fuu
wicked joltBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
lilac stag
Idk what’s even a good ilvl any longer with the ring fluff
round latch
might be able to go 640-ish
round latch
idk,ive taken the myth track sacbrood to ascend gilded
now i only need a neck,using the hero track from raid
and im 638
random mason
now i only need a neck,using the hero track from raid
Craft one for achievement if u havent already
round latch
Craft one for achievement if u havent already
yup im just waiting this reset,ive got the crests
hollow spear
I'm still being delusional about eventually getting the island trinket on sth else than veteran track
random mason
They drop champion track items there but it's rare
Idk if I'd put myself through that farm
random mason
At least you can grab all the transmogs there whole you're at it
The 380k flame iron or however much it was
hollow spear
I'm still convinced that even the veteran version is bis on silken
warm marlin
I'm still being delusional about eventually getting the island trinket on sth el...
this trinket you mean? 
hollow spear
Go away
I looted it on my garbanzo dk alt
Depression
I really need to learn how to do more elaborate sims. I'd be curious how it interacts with the damage amp phases.
spark tusk
I looted it on my garbanzo dk alt
garbanzo best banzo
severe prism
Maybe that sounds stupid but, i play DS and i was wondering should i press BP or Evis on necromancer packs in NW. Considering we're ethical of course and want to kill the necromancer asap.
Because singular focus deals more damage to my marked target i thought maybe BP was actually more ST damage
hazy breach
It is
BP does almost the same damage as eviscerate by itself anyway as deathstalker
(it does like 85% of eviscerates damage on pure ST)
severe prism
Cool thanks 😄
strange chasm
!fuu
wicked joltBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
severe prism
at what target count BP is more ST then ?
hazy breach
Like 3 or 4
severe prism
That's a lot lower than i thought it was 😮
hazy breach
Effectively you never eviscerate when theres more than 2 targets
Without darkest night up
hazy breach
That's a lot lower than i thought it was 😮
Ye because its dumb
Thats what happens when you just buff BP by like 65%
Just like if you read nimble flurry you'd assume that its worth to eviscerate up to 8 targets, but nah at 5 targets its time to BP
Because it just does more
alpine wraith
yea bp got the Deathstalker hero talents treatment
just this time instead of doubling or trippling they just went 20 20 30
SURELY NOW THEY USE IT
yes boss we use it
severe prism
I didn't really like flurry because i felt like it took away the choice of funnel or big aoe sub usually have, but ds is the exact same issue but in the opposite way then lol
hazy breach
Trickster still has that
But idk its not a very fun choice anyway
Its a choice between two options that both feel bad most of the time
severe prism
I like it that's one of the reason i play sub but it's just an alt i can understand it's frustrating as a main
When i strated to gear my rogue as trickster it felt like i was just doing st rotation basically almost everytime (was before bp buff), it was weird
hazy breach
Yep but the current play pattern feels so fiddly.
Since BP is only good if you have find weakness up
But you dont want to storm to apply find weakness since nimble makes your strikes do a lot of damage
So you want to use rotten for a single storm to guaranteed apply it
But if you do it as your first rotten gcd its bugged and consumes both stacks
So pretty much every dance has to be exactly symbols+dance> strike > sectech > storm > bp
When theres 4+ targets
Mostly due to find weakness being rather pointless nowadays since its just always up (and really annoying when it isnt up)
cloud perch
can anyone tell me whats wrong with my macro
#showtooltip
/cancelaura [nocombat] Shadow Dance
/cast !Stealth
hollow spear
Mostly due to find weakness being rather pointless nowadays since its just alway...
FW should just be guaranteed on backstab/gloom/shadowstrike
silent ruin
But if you do it as your first rotten gcd its bugged and consumes both stacks
wait what? storm is bugged in that it consumes two stacks of rotten ??
hollow spear
Aye
hazy breach
FW should just be guaranteed on backstab/gloom/shadowstrike
Fw should just be deleted or reworked to be more relevant
cloud perch
so about the macro
vale pine
wait what? storm is bugged in that it consumes two stacks of rotten ??
old bug ^^
hollow spear
Fw should just be deleted or reworked to be more relevant
Or that. It never feels great and sometimes feels bad. So all in all bad 😄
lilac stag
It’s pointless
vale pine
find wekaness was specifically introduced to add crunchiness to the system
so i don't think they want to remove it
lilac stag
Yeah def need more pointless shit to everything else you’re managing. /s
cloud perch
why is macro not working but typing it works
lilac stag
Do you have it on your stealth bar?
hollow spear
find wekaness was specifically introduced to add crunchiness to the system
Wdym? "crunchiness"?
cloud perch
Do you have it on your stealth bar?
i am so dumb XD and for years i thought my client is just bugged
vale pine
Wdym? "crunchiness"?
basically, making a system more complicated if it could be simple
hexed sluice
Son of a bitch.
vale pine
for find weakness
before the change you just did more damage
but now you do the exact same damage than before
but ONLY if find weakness is applied
so blizz added a system by splitting out damage and adding additional constraints
changing something from being simple to complicated
in rollplaying you usually say crunchy to systems designed like this
hollow spear
I mean, they are half way there by making it auto apply while being behind the target 😄
vale pine
and some people like design thats not simple and adds a lot of extra work for no reason
hollow spear
now we need the other half of the target
cloud perch
that is funny enough
idk that macro was on my stealth bar all the years but the other XD
vale pine
it kind of is also part of any game system
you want to keep it simple but not so simple that you remove all thought
wow isn't that good in following this direction
but the game is also 20 years old
hollow spear
They are pretty bad at that, based on what I see in the sub tree at least
vale pine
i am not judging their design, their team seems extremely small and wow is still the most popular at least traditional mmorpg
hollow spear
It basically just makes me want to set up more weakauras to bandaid
I just hope that our tree sees some love soon-ish and that some of the long standing bugs get ironed out. Probably coping, but hope always dies last.
vale pine
most of the new systems are designed in a way to add additional things to keep in mind
hero talents are kind of a mistake if you want to keep things simple
hollow spear
I don't have an issue with juggling things, but imo they should be a little more 0/1
I wouldn't mind keeping up FW by using a backstab here and there
But sometimes you just cannot reliably get behind the target and it feels bad to hope for crits
sick jackal
so blizz added a system by splitting out damage and adding additional constraint...
isnt this the case for everything sub rogue has
vale pine
but again, the game exists for 20 years and sticks to a simialr deisgn philosophy. It works for them so i am not here to critisize it.
hollow spear
Yes, but that doesn't (and shouldn't) stop you from constructively criticizing their talents/approach, when necessary.
vale pine
isnt this the case for everything sub rogue has
I am fairly certain it is one of their design ideas. Many systems have simpler alternatives which seemingly had no appeal.
But all just comes down to how much dev time a spec gets, you see specs who get more typically have more choice in talents for example.
round latch
!guide
vale pine
also just because things are complicated does not mean you can't make them fun
round latch
also just because things are complicated does not mean you can't make them fun
how is arakara trinket good for sub 
im feeling weird
ive got it on myth track and all but how does the stupid trinket functions for sub
vale pine
its just stats
patent crystal
transmitter has haste
lilac stag
Sacbrood DN
sick jackal
also just because things are complicated does not mean you can't make them fun
its not the complicated part that makesthe spec unfun its the identity part
sub rogue felt goos cuz when you pressed dance your stelth abilities did big damage
right now 16 dmg amps do the damage not stealth abilities
being able to spam ss felt like cheating for a while
rn its just you dont do dmg outside dance
uneven scarab
Ya i kinda agree with that bigtime
sick jackal
and the combo point system is just dead rn as we dont even think about it most of the time
just pressing gen into spender is bis for most of the time
lilac stag
If sub was that good (design wise) more people would play it. Hot take but aging wow player base don’t want to be bothered with all that and want good visuals / topping meters without a crazy skill cap.
sick jackal
tbh looking from a design wise sub needs a overhaul rework
hoary coyote
i mean immune the stun
hoary coyote
y
hoary coyote
No its physical
and ofc evasion doesnt work too?
hazy breach
It does not
hoary coyote
ty ty
lilac stag
tbh looking from a design wise sub needs a overhaul rework
Was discussed way earlier in the day. Rogue’s toolkit is great for PvP. It doesn’t transfer to PvE and we basically force it trying to work in pve.
Tricker is fun, but it’s not well designed overall.
and ofc fun is subjective
vale pine
rogue is not great for solo content by design
vale pine
survivability is good with cooldowns
damage is good
utility depends, its not terrible anymore
sick jackal
Was discussed way earlier in the day. Rogue’s toolkit is great for PvP. It doesn...
Pvp is pve nowadays so kit isnt good for pvp either
Survivability wise sub might be the most tank spec in the game
İmo atleast
Never needed healing even on 14s
hazy breach
Nah sub is paper compared to DKs
But ye sub is incredibly tanky compared to all the other specs
DKs are losing 4% DR and 8% stamina come next patch and theyre still gonna be the tankiest 
jaunty umbra
so long they have AMS 
hazy breach
Not even AMS, they just passively have so much damage reduction and extra stamina
jaunty umbra
yea I mean even if they nerfed all the passives, they still have good active defensives
and Deathstrike
that thing is also disgusting
hazy breach
My friend does some pushing on a DK and whenever the tank dies he just casually tanks the mobs for like 5 seconds when the tank dies
Theres so many clips of it
uneven scarab
Isnt warr getting a 10% stam node too
Or buff
needed tho
Arms is fucking paper
hazy breach
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/38?metric=deaths&dataset=90
This isnt an exact ranking of a specs tankiness, but its decently close to the truth
Holy priest is a bit weird with their spirit form thing
vestal escarp
My friend does some pushing on a DK and whenever the tank dies he just casually ...
hey i can do that too for 10s
uneven scarab
Oh yeah a good dk
jaunty umbra
warriors suck big time in defensive department
uneven scarab
Can easily off tank
jaunty umbra
at least how i felt
uneven scarab
it’s disgusting
Yeah they do
They just have mega outdated defensives and have literally 0 passive tankiness
vestal escarp
warriors suck big time in defensive department
depends on the damage patterns of each raid/season
but overall they're mid in defensives yeah
hazy breach
I do find it silly how tanky sub is compared to assa
I checked notevenclose
As sub i wouldnt need to feint on third boss siege17
As assa i need to feint on 15s 
uneven scarab
Ita crazy how much i use feint on assa compared to sub
Rarely have to press it as sub
Just eat damage
jaunty umbra
Rot damage as a warrior <:gollUMM:1111287435670851624>
def stance and cry 
uneven scarab
No fr thats like ur only option
lilac stag
yea warrior is rough
lilac stag
bin
worn ivy
bubbling wax sims higher aoe for me no?
jaunty umbra
idk why i farmed so much wax at the beginning
i can use them for another season
vale pine
main hand or offhand
highest item level, so typically mainhand
hollow spear
What was the "trick" to control transmitter a little better?
wicked joltBOT
The orb and circle from Treacherous Transmitter always spawn in the same spot. Relative to how your character is facing it spawns northeast/1:30 o'clock/frontright, this means you can know where it will spawn and react accordingly.
https://i.imgur.com/cTPN4Tz.png
vale pine
^ it always spawns at the same point
sick jackal
As sub i wouldnt need to feint on third boss siege17
I think i need a better healer friend i need to feint in 13s
hazy breach
I mean its just one hit of damage every 30s or so
sick jackal
How much vers do you play with?
hazy breach
Idk
uneven scarab
last i checked i had like 18% vers
sick jackal
I kinda play with more mastery i need to feed the hopium
uneven scarab
maybe a bit less around there
lilac stag
20
worn ivy
yo bois do u have the WA for Tremor totem
i wanna see it when sham drops it
there is no wa like this in wago
molten citrus
there is no wa like this in wago
there is, but i believe they will require your totem plates to be turned on
plater may have a setting for it, not sure
swift tinsel
Can probably use omnicd too
wind canopy
You can probably create a WA that tracks the combat log for when it gets cast
molten citrus
gz
fallow nimbus
What's that?
pliant topaz
masters in league
fallow nimbus
In which league?
pliant topaz
Legends one
hazy breach
gzz
pliant topaz
:3
spiral marsh
how much does it matter that sectec is one of the first 2 finishers used for supercharger during dance? I see some logs where rogues use sectec as the 3rd finisher but it doesn't really benefit from supercharger
pliant topaz
alot
sectech being first 2 is more than just supercharger btw
its very important for the cadence of trickster
and its also important for fitting both sectechs in transmitter window / flag window
spiral marsh
its very important for the cadence of trickster
Why trickster in particular and not as much deathstalker?
pliant topaz
because trickster has coup de grace, which a major activator for it is sectech
also it has 10% sectech cdr which deathstalker doesnt. which is also one of the reasons u also sectech asap as deathstalker during flag windows. so the 2nd one is back up in time
tribal blade
what is this, is it impressive
pliant topaz
I think this is the distribution
tribal blade
SHEEEESH
pliant topaz
i hit master+
tribal blade
that's big
pliant topaz
nah the real challenge is hitting challenger
gonna take me a year probably to get there ngl
tribal blade
that is a crazy low %
how many people hit that in actual numbers
sounds like it would be below 1000
pliant topaz
well masters is pure climb, u win games u climb.
but after that its # of people
so like challenger is litearlly only 500 people i think??
and a lot of challengers have multiple challenger accoutns
so really its like 100-200 people
pliant topaz
if wow continues being this boring probably yea
new split starts in 4 dayus i guess, but im probably gonna try to push for grandmaster next
tribal blade
hell yeah
pliant topaz
my goal was just to learn and improve. theres a lot of games u lose and theres almost nothing u coulda done to win it
but im trying to find every thing i can improve
tribal blade
my goal was just to learn and improve. theres a lot of games u lose and theres a...
yeah i've heard horror stories about those kinds of games
bleak pasture
! Huge what role?
pliant topaz
just one tricked zed
pliant topaz
yeah i've heard horror stories about those kinds of games
yeah they happen, but like im realizing its just part of the climb. some times pepople have awful games. going from diamond 1 to masters was so so bad.
i yoyo'd between 99lp and 0 lp d1 like for 3 weeks...
warm marlin
I think this is the distribution
this was like omega long ago right
they are mentioning d5
and masters used to be a set # of players too
pliant topaz
but if you sit at master 0 LP
we won firt game in masters
enemy viego kept forcing grubs i kept killing him with nidallee mashallah
spiral marsh
Do we hold coup de grace usage if we have <25 secs left on shadowblades? or can we just hold for regular dance if its coming up soon?
Or is it just safe to burn coup outside of dance altogether?
rocky ocean
it's definitely safe, as nothing depends on it
latent oracle
About to ask some stupid questions
For context I am a returning player who left shortly after MoP, so a lot has changed so it appears. Even then, I didn't really play rogue.
I want to PvP but don't seem to be doing much at the lower levels (I'm 24 right now, undead) what rotations should I be using at this level?
molten citrus
About to ask some stupid questions
For context I am a returning player who left ...
pvp is pretty much max level only content these days
if you're talking about retail
latent oracle
Right but I'm still finding battlegrounds as soon as you can play em, or do you mean a rogue isn't effective at pvp until end game?
molten citrus
no class is really useful in pvp until end game
i think battlegrounds have level scaling, but it's likely incredibly wonky
most people you're going to run into are probably twinks which you won't stand a chance against
latent oracle
Twinks doesn't mean the thing I'm thinking of rn does it
molten citrus
twinks in wow are people who exp lock their characters
for example at level 20
then they get BiS level 20 gear
and do wild damage because level scaling is wonky
latent oracle
Might just have to go back to cata classic where I'm at least somewhat comfortable in what I'm doing lmao
molten citrus
Might just have to go back to cata classic where I'm at least somewhat comfortab...
Just finish leveling
Pretty much everything in retail is end game content now
Doesn’t take long to level at all either
pliant topaz
Do we hold coup de grace usage if we have <25 secs left on shadowblades? or can ...
no need to holdsend on cd
pliant topaz
it's definitely safe, as nothing depends on it
not really true. holding it is a non trivial dps loss, specially if you hold for that long
rocky ocean
the question was is it safe to send coup righ away, and I answered accordingly
lilac stag
Two questions were asked, you didn’t reply to one over or the other and gave a non contextual answer
pliant topaz
mb then
molten citrus
the command bot is down atm
spiral marsh
Thank you for the help 🙂
round latch
Habibi Armin confirmed
round latch
Amen 
stray plank
how do we deal with dance drying out? send one symbols with sectech and no dance after second blades?
celest mulch
teal prawn
wind canopy
how do we deal with dance drying out? send one symbols with sectech and no dance...
Yes
There's times where you might have no dance and/or symbols to go with your sectec.
spark tusk
Amen <:Prayge:846862909846061067>
sapzilla blue name sapzilla blue name
round latch
sapzilla blue name sapzilla blue name
i was blue before this discord even existed as an idea 
plus im having fun as sub
no downside
tepid trellis
@pliant topaz noob
pliant topaz
<@639956635300790285> noob
racoons a bully...
tepid trellis
im currently digging up dirt in lost ark, had to put my anger somewhere
round latch
thats one weird raccoon
tepid trellis
need to do it craft these
tepid trellis
just an item used to upgrade gear
round latch
cool cool
pliant topaz
idk how you actually grind lost ark
I tried like 4 times to get into it but man the grind is something...
tepid trellis
have people to play it with
pliant topaz
I guess. non of my friends wanted to try it out
theyre all playing ffxiv instead
or league
tepid trellis
i raid in lost ark with Ryler
pliant topaz
and soon Scana right?
tepid trellis
dont think scana kept playing
tepid trellis
league is also just way easier to get into
round latch
i think its more fun but idk,its been a while since ive last played dota 2
ok u need to take a break
pliant topaz
SoonTM tho then ive got full 8s
dude youre sooooo close!!
tepid trellis
cant spend the gold on it atm tho
need to hone ilvls for the new raid that soon comes out
pliant topaz
whens the new raid coming
pliant topaz
can you make it?
molten citrus
theyre all playing ffxiv instead
needs ff friendos
pliant topaz
*needs ff friendos*
u do?
molten citrus
yeah all my homies are still playing wow or osrs
tepid trellis
and then once that is done then some of these 1660s needs to hit 1670, so they can do normal mode of the new raid
tepid trellis
can you make it?
yeah it will hit 1690 next week ish
pliant topaz
yeah all my homies are still playing wow or osrs
im slowly going through the story right now. my friends and I wanna make a static when we are done with the msq. im down to play if youre down!
pliant topaz
yeah it will hit 1690 next week ish
oh nice, you got it then! hopefully its a fun raid
tepid trellis
its supposedly a good bit harder than the last one
pliant topaz
oh thatd be dope then
molten citrus
im slowly going through the story right now. my friends and I wanna make a stati...
yeah that'd be dope, i'm also slowly working through the msq atm
i think i'm over halfway through ARR
pliant topaz
oh sick! im a little ahead of you then! gonna be a while before we finnish but im down to play after
molten citrus
oh sick! im a little ahead of you then! gonna be a while before we finnish but i...
same same. what job are you playing?
pliant topaz
yeah they seem pretty fun too! I might give em a try too ocne im done with msq
its actually kinda a fun game ngl
tepid trellis
yeah they seem pretty fun too! I might give em a try too ocne im done with msq
now we done diggin
molten citrus
Yeah I tried it a couple years ago and was turned off by how slow the combat was at first
pliant topaz
now we done diggin
mashallah, bro lived the grind. youre stronger than me
molten citrus
But I actually gave it a chance this time and it’s pretty dope when you start getting more abilities ngl
pliant topaz
yea it gets a lot better once u get some more abilities!
I was watching my friends prog some fights too
and it seemed kinda dope
molten citrus
Yeah the ultimates look sick
I’ve thought about boosting a job to rush into raid and come back to the msq on other jobs, but I’m gonna hold off
pliant topaz
my friends told me to do that too, but i kinda wanna experience the game first im not in a rush to finish it
molten citrus
Will probably help learning the different mechanics over time
They look a lot different from wow’s
pliant topaz
oh yeah! theres a bunch of different ones you learn along the way
i knida really dont like the ones where youre supposed to look away from the boss though
theyre kinda annoying
molten citrus
I don’t think I’ve seen any of those yet but yeah sounds annoying
One big thing I like so far is that back pedal actually turns you around to run with the right settings
pliant topaz
yeah that ones pretty good!
theres a setting to make it like wow i guess but the way it is feels great
molten citrus
the one setting i can't find - not sure if it exists or not
i'd like to be able to move my camera with left click while moving without turning my character, like it is in wow
pliant topaz
oh yeah i havent found that one either, ill ask my friends if they know and let you know if I hear somethign
its pretty annoying how it turns the camer a
keen dome
Same. I like a lot of 14's stuff, but the minute-to-minute combat is so dire compared to WoW. WoW's movement, the fludity of combat, the snappiness, the camera, etc.
vale pine
one thing i hoped would be an option to change was camera with shadowstep
it is quite a bit confusing if you use step and have your camera reset to a certain angle/position
the same problem with killing spree but probably more annoying
keen dome
haha, yeah
I streamed a key to a buddy who only plays 14, because I wanted to show him the typical WoW endgame content. And he was getting so disorientated whenever I'd step something.
vale pine
it is def. not intuitive
round latch
I streamed a key to a buddy who only plays 14, because I wanted to show him the ...
my nephew used to cry when he watched me play arena 10+ years ago,now he's a killing machine
😂
void hound
one thing i hoped would be an option to change was camera with shadowstep
agreed
rocky ocean
shadowstep camera option would be so fucking huge
stone robin
hello :) im trying to learn sub, coming from assa. Do i use symbols of death only with secret technique?
rocky ocean
hello :) im trying to learn sub, coming from assa. Do i use symbols of death onl...
yes
stone robin
and shadow dance with symbols of death, or hold both for flaggelation?
sick jackal
and shadow dance with symbols of death, or hold both for flaggelation?
youll get to send a dance or 2 between flag+blades windows
fathom adder
when would you "cleave" with your st rotation in trickster build and when using storm? i do not understand that right now
sick jackal
in a dance window you always want to generate combop points with strike and if you have less than 5 enemies youll want to evis
stone robin
okay so i dont hold anything?
sick jackal
okay so i dont hold anything?
depends
basicly you press shadowdance everysingle time when you can send a secret technique as the first combopoint spender
and when you have send 2 dances you check how long is left until your blades/flag and cook up some dances
stone robin
and when can i send secret technique as the first combopoint spender? i thought i have to use it second always
sick jackal
and when can i send secret technique as the first combopoint spender? i thought ...
that was former seasons
stone robin
oooooh
sick jackal
with our new tierset we send tech as the first spender
stone robin
i see
so if my technique and symbols are up i press shadow dance, symbols and then technique?
sick jackal
yes
if you can you want to dance without combopoints into a strike then tech for best opener
stone robin
aaaah okay i see
sick jackal
and thats becouse of dancemacabre
stone robin
and when flag and blades come up i want to send 2 dances in that window best case?
sick jackal
yes you always want to send 2 dances
stone robin
okay okay , its pretty overwhelming ngl haha
stone robin
i will do that, thank you so much for helping me <3
sick jackal
nws if you have anyother questions happy to help
stone robin
thanks!!
stone robin
are there some good weakauras you could recommend ?
molten citrus
are there some good weakauras you could recommend ?
!wa
