subtlety

[warm aspen]

if u get garbage in vault u craft a spark piece for 90 and u still get upgrade

[spark tusk]

I ignore bis gear and just take items that sim better

[warm aspen]

i tend to use the green names in here for any info i want

these guys are the fking goats

not just for our class but kinda the game in general lol

[unkempt trench]

k well imma ask that green name guy above

@spark tusk is it still mastery > vers >>> crit >>>>>>>> haste atm?

[warm aspen]

hearing about other class APL writers fucking their sims on purpose to get buffs, meanwhile green names in here and an anime profile guy Fuu legit just run a full college course on rogues

absolute goats

[wind canopy]

I wouldn't suggest pinging people like that to ask questions like that.

!stats

[wicked jolt]

The following is a general recommendation, but you will always get more accurate results through simming your gear through Top Gear.
Mastery >= Versatility > Critical Strike > Haste

[spark tusk]

Well at the very least I was already here

[warm aspen]

oh mb for kinda baiting him into that

[spark tusk]

but yeah, use sims

[warm aspen]

i meant to talk to green name senpais when they show up lol

[unkempt trench]

imma newbie to sim, i only sim my character, if i want to change the weapons and ilvl i need SimC?

[warm aspen]

jsut in top gear

click everything clickable tbh

that's how we all learn i think

[spark tusk]

!simguide

[wicked jolt]

Guide to Simming yourself: https://www.wowhead.com/how-to-use-raidbots-sims-stat-weights

For more accurate results you should always sim yourself using Top Gear for gear you already have in your bags
or Droptimizer to see which content drops the biggest upgrade for you. Do not use Stat Weights sims to evaluate gear.

[warm aspen]

oh but also, yeah i SWEAR stat weight is so depressing now

[spark tusk]

The raidbots website has options to test all of that

[warm aspen]

it used to be that u can sim stuff and balance ur gems/gears for ur own perfect stats

now im at 1% haste and it's still half the value of every other stat.

kinda crazy how bad it is

[spark tusk]

Don't use stat weights

[warm aspen]

yeh just sim normally at this point

but even then gears with haste on them still dont win lol

fake stat

oh actually tho

i wonder if we'll still get ritual knife next tier lol

[unkempt trench]

So my raidbot looks like this atm, do I have to install that SimulationCraft?

[warm aspen]

oh yeah

the addon will give u like

a whole postgraduate disseration to copy/paste ingame

u copy that over and start simming

[unkempt trench]

kk going to try that out

[silent condor]

Is simming Dslice maintained and safe to use ?

[wind canopy]

For rogues, yes

[wispy bolt]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/304343434137960449/1283842520308256858/image.png

[sinful sluice]

in obinax do we just spam evis on boss?

or do we black powder when adds are up

[alpine wraith]

evis on boss

[sinful sluice]

oki

[honest scarab]

!tricks

[wicked jolt]

Smart tricks WA on tank, this require the following macro:

/click SmartMisdirect LeftButton 1
/click SmartMisdirect LeftButton 0

[tribal blade]

there are other specs that are better suited to deal with the add damage, the great thing about rogue is we can do quite a bit of boss dam

and once you have enough add damage you want as much boss dam as possible

basically warriors and dks just solo the adds

[alpine wraith]

i find funny how dks are unholy n ow instead of frost to blast the adds

[real pike]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[keen dome]

Negative: Failing to time a +8 because nobody has their monitor on.
Positive: Getting the Dawnbreaker trinket as a karmic reward.

[sinful sluice]

I was thinking of taking shuriken tornado on obinax as well

[tribal blade]

i just realized why i'm having such a hard time clicking stuff in delves

they made the clickable area to target brann stupidly big

and he'll stand on top of you as you try to click stuff

and everything won't be clickable because the game assumes you're trying to target brann

[keen dome]

He's like a real boy

[tribal blade]

this is so stupid

this is legit driving me insane

[keen dome]

Leaves on the first death. Constantly gives useless advice. Stands in the worst spot. Shouts about AoE while standing in AoE. Blocks picking up items. Does no damage.

Blizzard should be commended for the most lifelike NPC in gaming but also yes it's very annoying.

You know what'd be cool? If he picked up tiems / used objectives for you

[tribal blade]

yeah he is actually the most annoying npc in the game ever

also why can't he stand and tank like a man instead of kiting everything in random direcions when i tricks him

WHY BRANN

[keen dome]

Oh, also: his egg.

His fucking dinosaur egg.

[tribal blade]

everything

[keen dome]

Constantly putting the stupid egg down and trapping you in combat.

[tribal blade]

BRANN JUST PULLED AN ELITE I WAS WALKING AROUND

THANKS BRANN

[vale pine]

brann is such a buddy

making sure you don't get bored

[keen dome]

My favourite is when he uses his derage on a random mob I've not pulled.

[tribal blade]

i'm about to put a gun to my head

[keen dome]

And it causes him to then aoe it for some reason

I dunno why they didn't make him have a tank spec. He'd actually be really useful for us.

[tribal blade]

yeah he should have a tank spec

but i suppose it would just be too easy

[tribal blade]

he's like the one friend nobody likes, but he's your friend so he's your asshole

[keen dome]

Haha

Expecting the S2 companion be like, Tank and Heal or something

[tribal blade]

https://youtu.be/_EWvPLWIE-o?si=bCzQajFBgdS4PTbT this is how i feel about brann

[alpine wraith]

best one is he escaping and resetting mobs

[keen dome]

Yeah.

One of the Delves in the 4th zone. Boss does the burrow spikes things. I vanished to do something and the boss aggro'd onto Brann who ran out of the room with it chasing him.

Frustrating but also funny

[tribal blade]

what a guy

[vale pine]

i am actually curios what they do with delves

we will likely see massive changes to them in 11.1

at least thats how game development typically works

the system is so new that it should get a lot of attention and change

[keen dome]

yeah

[tribal blade]

it's funny you say that, my guildie posted this to me earlier

[keen dome]

Right now we've got like. A load of them but they're all built around the S1 stuff / Brann. What happens in S2? We know we're getting a new season and companion. Assumably a new zone with probably 4 - 5 new delves. What happens to the prior lot? Do they get a refresh with new stories or..? It's going to be interesting.

[bitter silo]

what's the best opener to use for the most damage on subtlety

[keen dome]

I'm very interested to see how they evolve through TWW and into Midnight 'cos I think they're a good system at their core.

[tribal blade]

i think delves are fine in general

it's good solo content

[keen dome]

There's some rotational and opener information on WoWhead + in the TCInfo thread under the Subtley channel.

[vale pine]

good question, delves are for me a highly under developed system

the reward structure is flawed

[keen dome]

It is. I really hope we see them add Myth vualt to D11. I think it'd be a good aspirational content

[vale pine]

and they essentially just act as a "fill your vault" style content

[keen dome]

And also make some reall good trinkets fully viable long-term

[vale pine]

thast just good enough to not be completely ignored

[keen dome]

Yeah

I think having them be another major pillar of WoW content is good. So D11 = Myth vault and GIlded crests. But also less grindy ideally. They're fine enough but they also suck a lot.

Balance wise I think they're okay now after the nonsense that happened.

But ideally you don't want them to become mandatory content for players to feel they NEED to do. But at the same time, they should be accessible loot content for eveyrone while rewarding the full spectrum.

You know how PvP gives you free weapons at 2500 conq? Something like that for Delves would be interesting. Esp as Weapons are often the most fiddly slot to gurantee.

But I suppose then it veers too heavily into "content you gotta do" territory

[tribal blade]

i think having the max level delves give you myth track pieces in the vault would make a lot of my guildies happy

the ones who absolutely hate M+

[keen dome]

Ye. It's another avenue and it opens up those trinkets whihc I think is important.

[carmine portal]

I main brewmaster and man, I'd fkn LOVE a myth track crit candle lol

[tribal blade]

you would basically be swapping out content that requires 5 players and can be very toxic to potentially solo content you can do whenever you want in your own time

[keen dome]

Yep. And it doesn't really change the loot cadence 'cos... lmao

16 weeks with ideal vault drops to just get Myth quality gear.

[tribal blade]

oh wait but it would be myth track delve items

[keen dome]

• tier

[tribal blade]

issue is a lot of M+ gear is bis

[keen dome]

I think it'd be fine in 90% of circumstances.

Myth has trinkets, tier, weapons.

Sorry, Delves have.

[tribal blade]

then it would become the thing of having to do raid AND m+ AND delves

for max vault

[keen dome]

It would regardless for some people and I don't think you can avoid that.

But the positives, imo, outweigh the negatives. You don't have to do it, but some people will feel compelled.

That said the ultimate solution is just fixing the vault to not be a goddamn pain in the ass. Detemrinism!!!

[tribal blade]

yeah i feel like my RL would allow people to do delves for vault if that was the case

[carmine portal]

Biggest issue in WoW players rn. "Feeling compelled" vs "Having to do"

[keen dome]

Yeah, I think it's a pretty interesting and important discussion area.

[carmine portal]

Blizz could add the best system in the game and players will STILL complain about "I HAVE to do this wtf"

[tribal blade]

the way i see it this game has always had "mandatory content" you ahve to do if you want to be optimal

[keen dome]

Yep

[tribal blade]

when you take away that requirement the game becomes boring imo

[keen dome]

It's a balance.

[carmine portal]

Yes but If you want to be optimal you are agreeing to yourself that you will do whatever there is, that's on you saying "I WANT to be optimal" not "I HAVE to be optimal"

[keen dome]

Ideally you have multiple avenues to be optimal and I think Myth Delve track would really help that.

It also goes hand-in-hand with the gear mobility issue that TWW has created, imo

[tribal blade]

blizz has created an interesting situation where myth track items are way better than hero track

[keen dome]

Yep

Something that I think desperately needs resolving because it's creating an awkward bottleneck and resulting in Normal / Heroic groups struggling a lot more than they should be.

Which makes friction and isn't healthy for the game.

[tribal blade]

yeah you're kinda fucked with gear if you don't mythic raid

i see that issue in keys

[keen dome]

And then less people engaging with harder content which means less good groups and so on.

Simply adjusting Hero track to go to 626 on the Hero currency would solve it, imo.

[bitter silo]

thank you btw.

[carmine portal]

The main thing I've found with all my chars is getting to this weird 617 ish ilvl position where it feels like climbing a mountain to get upgrades

[keen dome]

Normal and Heroic would cease being identical in power. Myth would revert to 4/4 instead of 6/6, which'd fix the gilded grind a bit and you can return Myth crafted to 60 instead of 90 crests, etc.

[keen dome]

Absolutely, yeah.

[carmine portal]

Then I see some folk (who mythic raid_ at 630+ and it's like

That 13 ilvl jump

Is just

Insane

I've gone from 580 to nearly 610 in a day or two on my rogue and then it takes WEEKS to get to 620

[keen dome]

617 - 619 is super accessible, yeah. Then you hit a gigantic wall. Which becomes either pure RNG or just mind-numbing grind.

[tribal blade]

yeah i mythic raid so i'm at 631 ilvl atm

it's a big difference

[keen dome]

I'm 625 atm and don't. Probably 629 if I get off my ass and grind 400 gilded crests.

But it's not fun.

[tribal blade]

your gearing and crest spending is super scuffed as well if you don't have myth track pieces to upgrade

[keen dome]

Yeah

[tribal blade]

you end up sending upgrades on hero track

so in the long run you are taking WAY longer to uprade everything

[keen dome]

YEP

Absolutely sucks.

I've also had trash RNG on Myth gear.

Identical trinkets, identical shoulders.

[tribal blade]

it's a luxury to be able to only ever use gilded crests on myth track pieces

[tribal blade]

yeah that's the worst part about the vault

[keen dome]

It's also just so time consuming to do 8 10's

[tribal blade]

it is a lot of time investment

[keen dome]

I just cba. It's not worth the energy. I'll do 1.

[tribal blade]

they should probably change the numbers

to like 1-3-6

[keen dome]

yeah

[tribal blade]

or even 1-2-5

[keen dome]

Match it to the raid, honestly.

[carmine portal]

It's just a weird step, YES mythic gear should be hard(er) to get but progression should always be a slope of some kind

This feels like one step, two steps then like

[keen dome]

2-4-6

[carmine portal]

10 steps

[keen dome]

Yeah.

[tribal blade]

so one good thing is the first half of the raid is relatively easy to pug

[keen dome]

I really need to start doing that weekly.

[tribal blade]

i've seen casual players in my guild getting mythic sikran killed

the real difficulty of the raid doesn't start until ovinax

[keen dome]

I really want them to remove the Mythic ID system. It's absolutely dire for pugging.

[tribal blade]

the difficulty jump once you hit ovinax is kinda crazy

[tribal blade]

that could be nice too

[keen dome]

I have to imagine it goes away sometime in TWW.

It's a dumb relic.

It also creates a toxic pug enviroment where you typically find groups only invite people with experience, because if you kill B1 but then struggle to kill B2, it's fubar for the week.

And then you run into situations where one or two bad players or players who don't care enough to make an effort, or even disconnects can completely ruin your vault and waste your time.

Let the content be hard and challenging, not the accessing it, imo.

[tribal blade]

iirc it has something to do with blizz not wanting people to do boosts for other guilds

[keen dome]

Which happen anyway as I understand it

[gritty knot]

I have a question because idk either I am too stupid to read the dwarf racial properly or not. But I realized in so many Dungeons that when I got a bleed debuff or sometimes disease too when I Press the racial nothing Happens. Nothing gets removed. Is that a Well known Bug? Is the tooltip wrong? Or whats going on there?

[fallow nimbus]

Would be so nice to clear like first 4 while progressing endboss

Also pugs could reinvite new ones instead of wasting the id of 19 people if like a tank leaves after 2nd boss

[keen dome]

Yeah, precisely.

I feel it's something that's coming in some form, although with the incredibly strange decision over cross-faction LFG queueing.. Who knows.

[fallow nimbus]

Mythic guilds are slowly getting fewer and fewer

Or let's say endboss killing guilds

[keen dome]

Yeah, CE guilds.

I'm not on a major raiding server, but it is one of the most populated. And we have quite a few Mythic guilds who do 3 - 5 bosses. I tihnk we have.. two who do CE? three?

[fallow nimbus]

With the faster content releases it will be even less

[keen dome]

We had more, but recruitment has apperently been impossible since cross-realm guidls became a thing. Anybody who wants to raid at that level joins better guilds elsewhere. And there's far less people incoming. but, I don't have practical experience at that level of recruitment so I can only go on what people've told me.

[alpine wraith]

i mean you just need to see how it is

we are like on court now

but that one already only has like 5xx to 6xx guilds on it

even less as they disband

[keen dome]

Yeah

[alpine wraith]

in the whoooole world

in s1

where the population is at its peak

and after some heavy nerfs to ovi nax and ky veza

and 2 stacks of the buff

[keen dome]

It's why I think the focus on Mythic raiding is entirely misplaced. By focus, I mean the gearing structure in TWW.

It's not good for the game, imo.

[fallow nimbus]

The 6/6 mythic was a mistake

[keen dome]

Very strong agree.

[alpine wraith]

i think it could be fine if the crafting one was 60 instead of 90

so people could craft better if they dont mythic raid but can still do +8

right now as a mythic raider i will have 2 sparks

not used because im still upgrading M gear

[keen dome]

Easily solved if you make 626 take hero crests, move Myth back to 4/4, etc.

It's smooth the whole incline out from a sheer cliff to a comfortable hill.

[alpine wraith]

yea that would be fine

i still have like 3 or 4 pieces at 619

to not waste gilded

[fallow nimbus]

That champion is 619 max and hc is also effective 619 without gilded crests is wierd

[keen dome]

Yeah

Normal and Heroic cap at the same point. Myth being 20 iLevels on top of it.

[supple verge]

anyone got a good shadowcraft tracker?

[alpine wraith]

i use the LE one

but there is also one in the

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border

[supple verge]

ty

[surreal siren]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/304343434137960449/1283842520308256858/image.png

[sick sand]

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Oxi

[proper latch]

Do I really need to hold SB in the opener? Feels so wrong.

[vale pine]

you want to yes

we hold it to not waste premeditation

[twilit phoenix]

Did sub used to just send it together?

[vale pine]

yes

but we didn't play premediation

now we do

[twilit phoenix]

i missed the boat!@

now I gotta learn with these separate cd situations

trial by fire bro

[alpine wraith]

it is not that diff you get used to it

then it just syncs well

[vale pine]

premed feels rly nice to play

[alpine wraith]

yea what does not feel good is when you forget dmg takes you out of vanish instantly

[twilit phoenix]

premed works with dance?

[alpine wraith]

so you vanish and then are like WAIT

and cant strike

[idle aurora]

So we mostly always just play trickster?

[alpine wraith]

yea

[idle aurora]

And from the all the YouTube guides the opening rotation has changed?

[alpine wraith]

apart from the opener only some logic has changed

but it makes more sense than with dust imo

[vale pine]

you can play trickster everywhere

[twilit phoenix]

hachadino

you said vods this weekend

i'm waiting bro

[alpine wraith]

hmm i already did 2 bosses watching world finals on league rn

[twilit phoenix]

oh shit pog gonna watch them

thanks king

[alpine wraith]

np

[twilit phoenix]

bro has a sheet of wonders

incredible

[vale pine]

!up

[wicked jolt]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/304343434137960449/1283842520308256858/image.png

[warm aspen]

...what

he is my...anus?

[alpine wraith]

i did find a funny thing

if you play first dance mastery is a liitle bit better than usual

but for some reason depths is still better than radiance

i guess i will see after crafting engi helmet next week

[warm aspen]

and this is pure raid fights right

not m+?

[alpine wraith]

uh yea radiant is better for m+

stats are better for more than 1 t

guess the problem about radiance in st is that it can proc a lot outside dances

and it loses lots of value

[warm aspen]

true

man being a flat damage spec is so op

they use use full value of radiance

[paper mortar]

anyone have some good macros for cds?

[warm aspen]

literally the only macro we use is sectech + CB

[paper mortar]

cool thanks

i need to like post the rotation on a note and paste it on my screen for reference. learning is hard

[vale pine]

you can

potential macros:
secret techniques + cold blood (with a minor loss if you play trickster for macroing)
Shadow dance + Symbols of Death (you still need symbols on a 2nd key bind tho)
Can macro Shadow Blades to Secret techniques (you technically want to use it after the gcd, but people want to reudce button count)
Can macro Shadow dance + Tea (nothing bad about it)

[turbid saddle]

theres no spam protection on symbols right? can u get around this somehow?

prolly not

[upper narwhal]

Anyone else notice the bloodmallet sims are borked for Sub trinkets? Transmitter is one of the lowest lol

[alpine wraith]

yes someone makes us notice every day

bloodmallet does not have talents somehow

[molten citrus]

/castsequence reset=1 Symbols of Death,null 
/cqs```

you might want to change it to reset=2 or whatever you prefer

sometimes i double symbols in 1 dance in pvp so i set it low

[turbid saddle]

OK SAVED actually

yeah 1 is enough

[lunar bluff]

do you do blades + sec tec?

[turbid saddle]

ty king

[steel spindle]

do we go deathstalker again for ST yet

[molten citrus]

np

[lunar bluff]

could you also do like, vanish + trinket?

[steel spindle]

or just stay trickster

[vale pine]

i don't

oh one more

you can do flagellation + transmitter

i use that one

too lazy to have a extra bind for the trinket

[grizzled jungle]

anyone had a bug where on last boss in nw while playing sub the add walks to the wall ,evades and teleports?

[steel spindle]

How do people get 1.6mil in dungeons with the same gear as me? I can't get past 1.25mil most the time, I'm using my cooldowns pretty good I think so I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong.

[grizzled jungle]

without using vanish evasion dance or w/e only backstabk evis

[steel spindle]

I save SoD 30sec before blades and try to have 2 charges of each

and try to save before boss by a pull or two

[alpine wraith]

that is the punishment for playing the tricks talent

best thing you can have is good teammates

same dungeon i can go from 1.4m to 2.1m

[grizzled jungle]

ah so its i have tricks up?

i can just cancel it then

[alpine wraith]

yea the 60m tricks bugs adds out

just cancel it

[grizzled jungle]

ah ty!

finally xd

[steel spindle]

like in your video where you ran Dawnbreaker. I tried to do that same thing and I end up with like 1.2mil average dps.

[alpine wraith]

ahaha yea teammates can make things hard

in dawnbreaker i think i usually do 1.6m or so

[steel spindle]

how do you even get 1.6mil average. How am I not using my SoD + SD right?

[alpine wraith]

unless they troll me

[steel spindle]

It just confuses me a lot.

[alpine wraith]

no idea tbh maybe sometimes you used cds and mobs died too soon

[steel spindle]

I make sure not to do that though. I think i do pretty good with that as much as average people.

[lucid jackal]

There is no way to give you an answer with the information given

[vale pine]

if you perform well relative to others in your key, you likely doing things correct

[alpine wraith]

yea best mists i had with like 2.1 mil i got gapped by enha and dh

[lucid jackal]

Mists weekly

[alpine wraith]

they did 2.7 and 3m

ingra died in 9 secs

i did 1 sec tech into him before he vaporizedf

also damn guy that is almost dream comp

all the good buffs

[keen dome]

Damn, blasting.

[steel spindle]

idk how :0

[alpine wraith]

guy big blaster

[steel spindle]

like do I have to record myself

[alpine wraith]

also that comp is so good for sub party buffs

[fierce cedar]

how do you use shuriken tornado effectively lol

[alpine wraith]

you use it outside of cds to get some cdr

or before cds to get ruptures up

now that flag lasts 24 secs and even with first dance you only have 20 secs of dance

you can just flag tornado rupture rupture rupture dance SoD sec tech etc

[fierce cedar]

ah ok

[alpine wraith]

but most of us just dont play tornado

annoying ass button kek

[fierce cedar]

yeah i hate it

[steel spindle]

i refuse to play it lol.

[fierce cedar]

fair

[lunar bluff]

teach me sub guy

[lucid jackal]

This spec isnt about shd and sod anymore

its a spec about sod and sectec

💯

[vale pine]

you could say its about secret

[lunar bluff]

what this mean

let me go int a weekly key and see if u right

[vestal escarp]

they called you the juicebox when you was a kid

[vale pine]

basically what he is trying to say is

you align your cooldowns around secret technique or major cooldowns

so in essence

want to have 2x symbols, 2x secret, 2x dance every flag/blades

and outside of this optimize for secret technique

so you use symbols always if you can use secret techniques as a finisher for one of the supercharger stacks

and line dance up to it

[lunar bluff]

and you still only want to sectec in dance ye?

i dont know why you wouldnt

[vale pine]

but it can happen that you do a blank symbols with secret

[lunar bluff]

interesting

[vale pine]

this does not happen much

but

it is possible closer to flag/blades comming up again

[lunar bluff]

what are the conditons for that to happen? like sectec/symobls up and dance how much time left on cd?

[vale pine]

because you want to get this

[vale pine]

^

https://discord.com/channels/124169701881282560/1271971289396936735 has specific rules to it

[lunar bluff]

must learn the sub ways again

CP resets seem SO laggy

[vale pine]

it can be but there is a bug to it

https://github.com/SimCMinMax/WoW-BugTracker/issues/1167

[lunar bluff]

does m+ prefer more mastery, while ST is more vers?

[warm aspen]

dawg we just slam versa mastery on every piece of gear lmao

[lunar bluff]

ya boy got too much crit

[warm aspen]

i pretty much only have crit and haste from tier, and the sims are still telling me to make everything versa mast

the single crit neck that i have? it apparent has to go

[vale pine]

yes

[lucid jackal]

Any weakaura wizards

How would I make it so FTD only shows out of combat, in dungeons

or raid ofc

I was testing in hallows end

and its not working

[alpine wraith]

first dance has 2 buffs

[alpine wraith]

one where it is charging and the other when it is up

have to do it for both

[lucid jackal]

No it doesnt

Oh U mean the actual buff that ticks up

well I mean it works for example look

I have my weakaura package only show in combat for example

This is with all the load conditions turned off that I just sent

[warm aspen]

how tf is bro 6.3 million hp lmao, raid buff?

[lunar bluff]

whats ftd

[alpine wraith]

the first dance

[vale pine]

the first dance spelled incorrect

[lucid jackal]

LOL

[lunar bluff]

hm that WA shouldnt be too hard to make, you want it to show when out of combat, basically in encounters/dungeons

[lucid jackal]

Well yeah but for example, hallows end didn't work with these checked

[warm aspen]

daaaaang lol meanwhile i been hardstuck like 627~628 for like 3 weeks now

[alpine wraith]

yea you need mythic gear

[warm aspen]

[alpine wraith]

it climbs up fast

[warm aspen]

im stuck at 75 crests rn with boe shoulder and a spare spark

and no catalyst charge

i want to end it all

[alpine wraith]

just buy ring too

it is very good

[keen dome]

Incredibly dumb suggestion but I wonder if it's being weird about classification, and it's under legacy looking for raid?

[warm aspen]

LOL i got crafted ring already

[alpine wraith]

get the boe one too

[warm aspen]

yeah and then 11.0.7's ring comes out in what

a month?

[lucid jackal]

Yeah probably

[keen dome]

It should just be a dungeon, but it wouldn't be the first time it's classified really strangely for a one-time event thing.

[lucid jackal]

Belt came with a socket too

[keen dome]

Damn, nice.

[lucid jackal]

Big thing I'm missing is just transmitter and contract/mandate

Technically queen ring too on mythic but I have heroic and soon we will be replacing it with annulet

[warm aspen]

lmao yeah i ain't getting mythic raid gear

doomed

i swear m+ is so sadge now

[spark tusk]

It's possible hallows end is just a special case of a holiday zone not having the appropriate flags on it

I don't know if that's the case, but I've seen so many buggy things in this patch

that it wouldn't surprise me at all

[keen dome]

Ye, same.

[spark tusk]

You can specifically exclude zones by ID as well if there's an outlier

I just have my TFD always showing even in town, but IIRC your pack is set to completely hide out of combat

[lucid jackal]

It is, but I have a few things that track out of combat

Like poisons, like TFD, like darkest night

[spark tusk]

What is hallows end? Is it actually a zone or is it the instance when queuing for headless horseman? I'm not familiar

[fierce minnow]

nimble flurry still bugged to deal less dmg?

[vale pine]

no

but you shouldn't test it in the new zone

best is to use og/sw target dummies

[tight bison]

Yo, what thinking about starting a new main.. i am going between Survival and Subletly.. anyone here that plays both that got some ups and downs for both speccs? ❤️

[spark tusk]

@lilac stag has been known to dabble in both

[vale pine]

You want to know the downsides or the upsides of subtlety?

[tight bison]

Both 🙂

[vale pine]

Upside:

• Satisfying Burst damage
• A lot of dynamic in the rotation
• Good mobility
• Fun to play
  Downside:
• Steep learning curve
• Punishing for mistakes
• Playball to tuning
• Has a lot of bugs (tho thats probably most classes in tww)

[tight bison]

I really like the playstyle, only problem I have is the downtime.. I don’t really fancy downtime speccs.. tho when u have energy, sub is AMAZING to play. Is the energy starve a gear issue? Or just how the spec is atm? Cos in Shadowlands it felt quicker than now

[vale pine]

!design

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety is designed to be a spec with highs and lows. During your cooldowns you do immense burst and have plenty of buttons to spam but conversely outside of symbols and dance you do not do any damage whatsoever. This means that having some periods of "afk" downtime where you do not press a button because you're out of energy is the intended way the spec plays. As long as its not happening inside your cooldowns (flag/blades/dance/symbols) its not a problem at all, and especially nothing that having more haste would "fix".

[vale pine]

the spec is designed for low lows and high highs

if you don't like lows, you won't be happy on the spec

[tight bison]

Aye aye! 🙂

[vale pine]

shadowlands especially season 3/4

had one of the most boring gameplay iterations of the spec

[tight bison]

And I really enjoy playing Off Meta speccs, and usually sub and Surv are off meta compared to the other class speccs

[vale pine]

you spammed all cooldowns most of the time

[tight bison]

True. How is sub in keys then? Is it viable? It on the low side

[vale pine]

it was rly bad before 11.0.5

its now good, but its not one of the OP specs

some specs this patch deal absurd damage in aoe, subtlety can't compete with that

if thats what you look for tho

[tight bison]

Do we shine on st or Aoe?

[vale pine]

assassaination is currently one of the op aoe specs

single target and burst damage are the 2 things we do rly good

cleave damage is also good

[tight bison]

I am looking for a specc that

1. Has a high skill ceiling
2. Bursty
3. Off Meta usually
4. Few players

[vale pine]

thats subtlety

all of it

literally least played dps spec in game

[tight bison]

is it usuallu the least played specc?

[vale pine]

don't think you can't be more "non meta"

[vale pine]

it was for all of bfa

it is now for 3 seasons

[tight bison]

hmm, tempting

xD

[vale pine]

but it depends on tuning

[tight bison]

ye i played it on Mythic Nymue prog

[lilac stag]

Play SV if you don’t want down time.

[tight bison]

and it was INSANE

[vale pine]

what is good on rogue always depends on the other 2 specs

[tight bison]

@lilac stag U played both i heard. What do you have most fun with in keys and raid? 😄

[vale pine]

and if e.g. assassiantion gets heavy nerfed

like in DF

subtlety can become the rogue meta pick

[tight bison]

ye thats the thing with Hunters.. Usually people dont choose Surv, even if its the strongest specc

[lilac stag]

Sub is good right now play wise. Still too many bugs and who the fuck knows where we are with new tier set and not knowing if there will be a 90 second agil trinket.

SV tree is better build and designed.

You just need to deal with why not range bruh?

[vale pine]

it is the problem of melee/ranged

[tight bison]

ye

[jolly salmon]

I keep swapping between all the rogue specs right now; everything feels fun and I can't choose 😂

[warm aspen]

sub upside: sexy as fuck
sub downside: if mages are Dudley to Blizzard's Vernon, then we're fking Harry Potter

i'm still a bit miffed that blades don't work with sectech lol

those are like, 2 of the biggest things in our kit

and then RS, yeah...

[vale pine]

we have a lot of small annoying things

but i think thats every spec in TWW

hero talents are a breeding space for bugs, so each class has plenty

[warm aspen]

k

hero talents = the viego of WoW

got it

[vale pine]

they introduced a lot of problems

for a system thats so small

[warm aspen]

see now i wonder how blizzard feels about 1 hour tricks kinda saving trash pull wipes lmao

like, is it intended that tricks persists thru tank's death but not mine?

[mighty delta]

i love 1 hr tricks

[fresh field]

anyone know if dawnthread lining scales with itemlevel?

[mighty delta]

it wasnt like last month unless they changed it

[fresh field]

looking at upgrading my non embellished piece so trying to see if i need to move it

from what i can tell it doesnt

[steel horizon]

you wont love it on NW last boss lol. remember to click it off before then

[pliant topaz]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/759067482505609266/1302338247677968434/faker-league-of-legend.gif

T1 FIGHTING

T1 FIGHTING

T1 FIGHTING

[warm aspen]

YOOOOOO

I DIDN'T EVEN HAVE THE BALLS TO WATCH

FAKER MY GOAT

[pliant topaz]

faker

found

his god damn

dimentia pills

and found his buttons

goodbye shaker

hello faker

[warm aspen]

ayyy a guy like knight will never truly beat faker

the goat for 11 years

sucks for gigabin tho

if anyone deserves to break the lpl curse it's that guy

[molten citrus]

did they win already

[pliant topaz]

YES

[molten citrus]

[pliant topaz]

THEY PLAYED OUT OF THEIR MINDS GAME 4 AND 5

LITEARLLY UNWINNABLE DRAFT

AND THEY FUCKING WON

IDK HOW THEY OWN AGAINDST SMOLDER ZIGGS 33 MINUTES IN THE GAME WITH LITEARLLY 0 ENGAGE

BUT FUCK IT

[molten citrus]

i didn't watch at all

idfk what's going on when i watch league

[warm aspen]

they did it cuz they're t1 man

i swear that zofgk

embodies everything good with esports

staying together for years thru the highs and lows

[vale pine]

last 2 games ended up soo good, gg for both teams

[warm aspen]

never drama, always working hard

[pliant topaz]

they litearlly did the impossible

last game they played a comp where they basically had 1 job. to protect the adc

somehow the adc fucking died

and they ended up winning anyways

how the fuck

god damn gragas

[warm aspen]

wait

i just realized tho

no t1 yone skin this year huh

[vale pine]

they also gave the mid laner

his best champion in game 5

[pliant topaz]

they gave bin jax

canyon nidalle

they dont give a fuck

max disrespect

[vale pine]

i would say, the wanted to show that they are the best

and so they did

[pliant topaz]

imagine going from almost not making it to world

[warm aspen]

ngl tho, i'd be in fking shambles if knight of all ppl beat 11 years without drama GOAT faker

[pliant topaz]

to winning worlds

remember that faker clip of him bashinghis head on the wall and people holding him back?

[warm aspen]

man thank fuck

[pliant topaz]

now he won world

holy fuck

this worlds

was pure

cinem

aa

[vale pine]

agree, was incredible

[warm aspen]

absolute cinema indeed

4th seed win

legit the drx run

[pliant topaz]

zeus alive

LOL

[warm aspen]

chinese fans legit mindbroken rn tho

it's the galio again?

[pliant topaz]

guma said it last year

t1 doesnt lose to lpl

we are so back

[warm aspen]

nah like remember s7?

5 games of galio

[pliant topaz]

OL

yea

[warm aspen]

it legit broke something in rng/uzi

the hope of china lost to fking g2

next year

xD

meanwhile the "5 chinese can't win" memes will continue i guess

[pliant topaz]

this is too funnty https://x.com/Caedrel/status/1852784708121227544

Caedrel (@Caedrel) on X

never change my goat

never change

Twitter · Nov 2, 2024, 6:47 PM

[vale pine]

#1113807388408029204 tho

[pliant topaz]

new emote dropped

okay

[spark tusk]

Fuu casting Armin off to the shadowrealm 🫡

[vale pine]

na, i am happy if people are so excited about a game

[pliant topaz]

ITS JOEVER

[winged crest]

so i can just take SnD off my bars now ?

[still trellis]

also how do i cope with the fact that i lost hc transmitter to a holy priest because we tied and he won it

[vale pine]

nope

[still trellis]

wait sub still presses snd?

[crystal blaze]

is this spec as cooked as ive heard

[cedar rock]

the first finisher in wowhead opener after SD is sectech right away

do we not play around danse macabre anymore?

[alpine wraith]

we play danse

just sec tech first is better

[cedar rock]

ok cool ty

[vale pine]

oh i missread

snd you can

sod you can't

[still trellis]

aight, i thought for a sec that sub has some snd cook

[spark tusk]

omg yeah

I was scared for a sec

[cedar rock]

so only inside of SD do you still spam shadowstrike for aoe situations but outside of it you use shrikun storm for combo build up?

[charred sandal]

i mean u could still press it to extend it if u got CP left after a pack no?

[spark tusk]

Like it is the only thing you can do with combo points when you don't have a mob to attack and still gain benefit

I still instinctively push my snd bind after combat with CP left over when I know there's a long travel time or just idling to clear my combo points

even though the bind does nothing now

It was just a habitual way for me to clear my combo points in the past

[still trellis]

i usually just open my spell book at that point

[spark tusk]

My bind is still free for it so I should probably just return it, I put tornado there but I don't like tornado and don't think I'll even use it in keys

so no harm to leave it there, as long as I don't have to add my SnD WA back into my pack when I'm not thinking of doing

[charred sandal]

is there a way to go around putting trick on brann and boss just resets after shadowstrikin

[lunar bluff]

first sub key. many misplays feels STRONG tho

[vale pine]

nicu

[strange chasm]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[iron hare]

worth picking replicating shadows in m+ right now?

with all the bugs

[alpine wraith]

yea sure

[still trellis]

did arcane get a nerf? had an arcane in 11 dawn and he also did shit dmg like that in your group

or are people just typical bad fotm players

[sinful sluice]

can anyone share their mythic ovinax run as sub?

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/DzNvHKngmFqZJQcG#fight=22&type=casts&source=17&view=timeline

was just looking at this log and noticed he barely uses shuriken storm

[alpine wraith]

yea you barely use storm

but that is because most mobs die fast

not because it is not good

[sinful sluice]

I guess our raid party lacks dmg...

[crystal spear]

Do we still use symbols on cooldown?

[alpine wraith]

nope it is a bit different now

[crystal spear]

!guide

[wicked jolt]

Guides:

• WoWhead - by fuu
• Method - by Stealthi
• Icy Veins - by Oxi

[barren tree]

!wa

[wicked jolt]

Subtlety WA's:
Class packs:

Fuu's Luxthos's LE's

Kieron's Devlin's

Utilities:

• Shadowcraft refund sound trigger
• Deathstalker mark nameplate border

[shell lance]

i don't remember for sub is haste mastery or versa mastery?

[spark tusk]

!stats

[wicked jolt]

The following is a general recommendation, but you will always get more accurate results through simming your gear through Top Gear.
Mastery >= Versatility > Critical Strike > Haste

[wet echo]

haste bad

[shell lance]

ok thanks

[wind canopy]

It’s not great, but not horrible.

[shell lance]

how much versa i must have?

[pliant topaz]

theres no stat requirements

just use top gear and see whichever items bes for your character

[wind canopy]

Yeah, stat requirements are an outdated concept

[tepid trellis]

can u kill silken our?

or*

i need content

you should stream raids, so i can hate watch

need my post tier watching

people suffer

as i did

[wind canopy]

I mean we love seeing you in pain

Wait, did I say that out loud?

[pliant topaz]

oh trust me

i am suffering

bro spikes half the raid

10 seconds

after a spike went out

banger

thanks blizz

[tepid trellis]

good thing that it also happens on Ansurek

sicne you love it so much

[pliant topaz]

oh perfect! every day im more and more excited to raid! definately really looking forward to raid days. definately i dont wake up praying electricity goes out on raid days

[tribal blade]

hey @pliant topaz how exactly do you use cds on 1st boss of mists as sub

[pliant topaz]

but also

surely queen cant be worse than silken

thats just not possible

[tribal blade]

for 14

[pliant topaz]

if i have to go to allah cuz my dh fel rushed me on burn

i might find the nearest bridge ngl

[pliant topaz]

depends on how u do it tbh. on the 14 i did, i had cds on pull. so we sent cds on pull on main guy then milked tree for 1.5 min. sent cds again and uh, boss was at like 40M hp after that so we killed i

but basically the 2nd fear which is where you would die comes at 1:30 of each phase

so u acn just milk it

[alpine wraith]

yea hit ingra with cds

[tribal blade]

awesome sounds good

[alpine wraith]

then when he puts shield tree guy

playing mandate is good too but if they make it go to 1:30 it is also fine

usually enh + sub + whatever is enough to almost 1 phase it

[pliant topaz]

it legit doesnt matter ngl

sub enhance we burned the tree so fucking fast

i mean the main guy

[tribal blade]

everyone hits the main guy on pull right?

till he's immune

[pliant topaz]

we had aug but like after burn i think i was at 3.7M enhance was at 4.7M

yeah boss takes full damage first 30 seconds of each phase

[tribal blade]

cool

[solar thicket]

Why is a cele/mas wrist simming higer than a crt/mast wrist? lol

[wind canopy]

You mean haste/mastery?

[warm aspen]

you're starting to sound like sylvanas

[solar thicket]

yep

Idk why haste would sim higger than crt

Also the second item gives more mastery than the first

[wet echo]

link sim rather than screenshot 😄

could be ilvl diff or a socket or just you having 0 haste on other gear

[solar thicket]

yeah sorry, there it is https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/vf5ryMK5VBWKBPFHoxiUp9

[robust light]

goat btw

[pliant topaz]

https://tenor.com/view/teldrasil-world-of-warcraft-fiery-sky-gif-15360159

me watching the enhancement sending that thing to god

[warm aspen]

LUL u sure it ain't you?

would like to see some dmg charts for just that one fight

[wind canopy]

I mean, haste isn’t a dead stat.

[pliant topaz]

i have another 14 mist in my bags might do it tmrw

right now im rewatching worlds

[warm aspen]

nah just rewatch game 4 and 5

[solar thicket]

[pliant topaz]

based. gmae 1/2/3 were weird af

although game 2

keria my king

and also xin paid actor kicking dumbass fakers sylas tping half hp over the wall

smh

[warm aspen]

be careful tho

fuu might shoo us to the league channel again xD

[wind canopy]

Like if you have zero of a stat and tons of others, it’s gonna start being more of a gain for that stat you have none of.

[wind canopy]

#1113807388408029204

[warm aspen]

nuuuu i am being bonked again :((

[wind canopy]

#1113807388408029204

[warm aspen]

[wind canopy]

I also don’t want to hear about Faker

[warm aspen]

but that's my waifu

[wind canopy]

[warm aspen]

i'll marry him one day i swear, he just doesn't know it yet

but MAN

i fking wish we have usable m+ trinkets next tier

i feel like M+ only players are so gimped in the mythic track

and in trinkets

[pliant topaz]

:3

[wind canopy]

#1080572530554835072

[pliant topaz]

gl finding a #:xla

[wind canopy]

@vale pine can we have a #xla thread to banish armin there from time to time?

[tepid trellis]

i can just banana him

[tribal blade]

ok boys we have a 15 ara

do i play sin or sub for it

[alpine wraith]

arakara is not that good for sub iirc

[tribal blade]

yeah sounds like it

[wind canopy]

!banana armin

[warm aspen]

bro

why am i running out of symbols

by the 3rd blades in a fight

god raid fights are so cringe

[jolly salmon]

I can't commit to a spec right now, I like them all, and I am bad at sub but hot damn the sheer amount of damage it does when you hit the bursty cooldowns is so satisfying 😅

[sly shore]

Because you're playing wrong

[warm aspen]

i feel like i can't actually afford to send that naked symbols before the 2nd flag lol

everytime i do it ends in disaster

m+ just feel so much better man

the little bit of downtime with each pack

[lethal thorn]

!fuu

[wicked jolt]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version

[supple verge]

how much black powder should i be using

[spark tusk]

are you playing trickster?

[supple verge]

or is the aoe all sec techs and flurry

ye

[spark tusk]

Black powder is your aoe fillter when you don't have flurry up

which is very rare

[supple verge]

ok yea thought so

[hazy breach]

Or on extremly large pulls

Like nw first pull

at 12+ mobs

[supple verge]

i was thinking about it in some double pulls at the end of mists

after staghorn dies

ya

[hazy breach]

@pliant topaz Oh no

Some keen eyed enhancement in my group sniffed out my swappero

[pliant topaz]

theyre getting so sneaky lately... we must use a new strategy

id like to call it, gaslighting

where we tell them subs better for x,y,z and bring up some random nonsense

[hazy breach]

The guys i usually play with have seen the light, but pugs are not so easily convinced

[spark tusk]

No no

tell them details is bugged

there's a new post from details out that they're working on

but it shows assa as sub

[hazy breach]

Once the key has started theyre stuck, then its fine

[wind canopy]

Start the key, be like "I'm in raid talents, shit" then swap

60% of the time works every time

[hazy breach]

I especially enjoy not being a complete ⚓ on bosses

After playing some sub keys whenever i play assa bosses are just pure despair

[pliant topaz]

its really hard to convince them ngl.

[supple verge]

that look reasonable in terms of damage breakdown proportions?

just started learning sub, full m+ run

[strange chasm]

Legit if they could merge sub boss dam with ass aoe

We'd be eating so good

[livid minnow]

Seems about right. I'd expect a bit more from flurry but other than that it's about the right order of things

[supple verge]

thx

[livid minnow]

Maybe apply Rupture a bit more in AOE packs that last a bit long (meaning your group doesn't have much CDs up)

[supple verge]

right on, i didnt play RS because i heard it was bugged so i didnt have a ton of rupture dmg

[livid minnow]

yeah that's fair, its situational anyway

[supple verge]

maybe i should just play it and tornado anyway

[hazy breach]

RS is absolutely worth playing anyway

[hazy breach]

We'd be nerfed

[livid minnow]

Pretty easy to do with mouseover macros too during a big lengthy pack

[vagrant fulcrum]

@hazy breach it's deffo competitive from the mists 10 I just did, still feels like if you ever have any downtime it suffers a ton

[hazy breach]

Wdym by downtime

[vagrant fulcrum]

my dmg breakdown is suspect tho

[tribal blade]

attempted 15 DB and this was the damage before 2 wipes before 2nd boss

[vagrant fulcrum]

shit like tredova if people are terrorists and you have to go off the boss to get to a safe spot to melee it from

[pliant topaz]

i really like that tank btw. did quite a few keys with him earlier this season

[vagrant fulcrum]

was 1.15 on it, was expecting like 1.3 if the positioning wasn;'t dogshit

[tribal blade]

yeah we were excited to get him

[vagrant fulcrum]

i think flurry aught to be a lot higher for me

[pliant topaz]

hes a good player

yea

[vagrant fulcrum]

this was 1.8 overall in a mists 10

still a bit lower than what I pull as sin but its probably skill issue

[tribal blade]

we wanted go get him in disc but he said language barrier

and there was some confusion about where we were going after mini boss

and our shammy accidently body pulled something

[tribal blade]

sectec will be higher in mists

because you do giga sectecs on first boss

inflates sectec damage

[livid minnow]

and other than last boss gauntlet, packs in Mist are annoyingly small

if you don't have a tank that can pull through walls in labyrinth

[tribal blade]

@pliant topaz sub feels way better once you hit 14/15

you can actually spread ruptures

and it's full value

[pliant topaz]

yeah exactly

[hazy breach]

Idk sub doesnt really need big pulls anymore

[pliant topaz]

even on 13s it kinda feels weird

[tribal blade]

yeah 13s stuff dies too fast

[pliant topaz]

okay i did try sub DS on a 14 SV

[tribal blade]

very true

[hazy breach]

How did it go

[pliant topaz]

i padded so fucking hard i think i saw god

[tribal blade]

no iron wire in SV, straight to jail

[tribal blade]

HAHA

[pliant topaz]

its not that bad tbh

theres like 1 fear

just kick that guy

[tribal blade]

yeah so long as everyone is on top of kicks it's good

[pliant topaz]

and then after first boss its like a few silences

bt just ick too

[tribal blade]

OR your prot pal kicks everything for you

[pliant topaz]

shrimply bring a shaman and assign the fear to him

ranged kick ez

[hazy breach]

Assa does a lot of "padd" too

[pliant topaz]

but I will say

[pliant topaz]

okay lets put it this way. first pull I may or may not have reached 14M pad

[tribal blade]

true rsham kicks are so good

[hazy breach]

I dont think sub is better than assa, but if assa gets nerfed again it probably will be

[livid minnow]

Haven't really tried 14s yet, still on farming all 13s first. But it is way more fun to play Sub in these than sub 12s key that's for sure

[hazy breach]

Nice thing about playing sub is that youre immortal compared to assa

[pliant topaz]

yeah i really really like vanish and the shield

and vers stack

[livid minnow]

freaking enh sham and frost dk destroying all backs too fast in 11s, no point

[hazy breach]

+5% dr from fazed, 10% hp shield a lot of the time and then roughly 50% uptime on 10% dr or big vanish shield

As well as more vers

[pliant topaz]

i also really like the boss damage aspect

it feels really good to burn bosses

i swear if sub somehow had good prio damage it would be perfect

but it has like such little "funnel/prio"

[wind canopy]

Buff evis

[hazy breach]

I mean it doesnt really

Its just that assa has really insane funnel/prio

[pliant topaz]

trickster?

isnt it like 10%

at best

[wind canopy]

Nerf scent

[hazy breach]

Well ye its not much funnel, but its just pure ST so its still fine prio

[pliant topaz]

yeah, but I meant its fine to do less aoe if youre doing really good prio

or get alot of prio from having the extra mobs

[vagrant fulcrum]

is tornado worth in GB? if not what do we take instead

[strange chasm]

Is DS sub in dungeons more aoe or no

[hazy breach]

Nah fuck nado

[hazy breach]

On very big pulls yes

[livid minnow]

Basically build closer to what the ST Raid build looks like, and let the other broken class do the funnel, take care of the Prio instead

[hazy breach]

Also its deeper+flag, despite it being hard to see in that pic

[strange chasm]

So like NW DS sub probs goes hard

[pliant topaz]

thats why i tried it in SV. every pull is really large except litearlly the 2nd pull of the dungeon.

if singular focus wasnt as bugged as it is, the prio would be insane too

[vagrant fulcrum]

what magic damage are we doing without shadowed / db anyway? just sectec clones / flag / blades?

[strange chasm]

It's the same as play style as trickster right just instead of casting evis and shadow strike you are storm bp

[hazy breach]

Shadow evis

[vagrant fulcrum]

IDK why my brain kept telling me

that finality is shadowed finishers

xd

[hazy breach]

You could use nado instead of VT if you want

But im not a nado enjoyer

[vagrant fulcrum]

yeah im not a massive nado fan either

kinda clashes with rotten imo

[strange chasm]

Nado not working with blades makes the talent unplayable for me

[vagrant fulcrum]

how many mobs do we powder on in trirckster

[strange chasm]

Like 12+?

[hazy breach]

Like 12+, but thats only like first pull NW

[vagrant fulcrum]

1st pull nw is poweder then

[hazy breach]

And maybe some SV pull

[strange chasm]

Maybe GB pulls too

We pull a lot in our group on GB

[hazy breach]

GB has too much prio

For it to be worth even if overall might be higher

[strange chasm]

Prio < pad

Like we pull the big dragon with all the trash before the dragons you fly on

And just lust delete them

Inside the boomie silence

[livid minnow]

in 12 + ??

that's cray

[strange chasm]

Ye

On 13

Coordinated groups > pugs

[livid minnow]

Well yeah, but double Oversear buffs is kinda rough anyway

[strange chasm]

Shiv and boomie de enrage

[livid minnow]

in Assa with Silence I'd understand

but in Sub, idk if Boomy silence is enough

[vagrant fulcrum]

bloodmallet is omegacooked

the sims submitted to it are entirrely non functional

[hazy breach]

Because bloodmallet is simming without any talents

For sub

[vagrant fulcrum]

as good as mandate is, its not going to do 70% of urr dps unless you're actually not using spells

[hazy breach]

I have updated the profile so whenever bloodmallet runs its sims again it should be correct

Yes transmitter+anything really

Contract, knife, mandate, crystal are all fine

Sacbrood aint great

[vagrant fulcrum]

@hazy breach after a bunch of thinking I think I figured out why i feel my st on dungeon bosses sucks on rogue

compared to sv

sub included

I don't hold cds

so ill pull stuff like 3rd boss siege with like 80s cd on blades / flag

[left ledge]

Yeah that will probably do it

[hazy breach]

Sometimes its better to not hold, just depends how long it takes

[vagrant fulcrum]

i've been conditioned to not hold if the cd is litterally not useless (deathmark on a dead mob)

[left ledge]

I mean that’s fine, only hold if you want to allocate damage somewhere specific

[hazy breach]

The thing about sub rn though is that you want to make sure you have 2x dances and 2x symbols for cds

So theres sometimes where you do pretty much nothing but farming cdr since you wont have enough dances come flag

[vagrant fulcrum]

also it feels like if ANYTHING goes wrong during cds

it can be catastrophic

idk how but tank managed to pull boss onto pillar 3rd boss siege and he avoided coup + sectec in blades

i was like where the fuck is my 10m dmg in 2 globals

[hazy breach]

Ye thats burst specs for ya

[vagrant fulcrum]

also using transmitter in keys is peak cringe

whoever designed this trinket doesn't have love for us (the players)

[hazy breach]

Idk ive gotten used to it

[vagrant fulcrum]

its fine like

9/10 times

then out of the remaining time

[hazy breach]

I didnt have skardyn for assa for a while so i still start jumping after pressing deathmark

Even though im not even using it

[vagrant fulcrum]

.5 is you take an extra global or 2 to find it

and .5 it gets stuck in water or the wall or death zone so you cant get it ever

im so envious of specs like enh that historically have just ran 2x passive

[hazy breach]

Enhance is bursty now though

[short radish]

Ptsd do be like that

[hazy breach]

It does play into the feeling of "setting up" though'

Despite it being kinda cringe

[vagrant fulcrum]

yeah, its why I said historically

[hazy breach]

yeye

[vagrant fulcrum]

I think I might actually prefer flatter dps profiles for keys

which is strange since im fairly sure burst is almost always better

[hazy breach]

Generally theyre better ye

for keys

[tribal blade]

it's fucking over