assassination

[marble hemlock]

no raid for us

[gusty mirage]

You would be well versed in agriculture wouldn’t you?

[violet jackal]

I'll take your spot 🙂

[gusty mirage]

So I’ve heard

[bleak sky]

you could even say I'm agri cultured

[marble hemlock]

youd make good fertilizer

[gusty mirage]

Yo I fried some plantains on the trip and you never showed up

[hollow river]

yooo

[bleak sky]

were they bussin bussin or disgusting

[marble hemlock]

feel free to interpret that any way youd like

theres multiple

[hollow river]

thats some good shit hombre

[gusty mirage]

Ngl cooking on a propane tank they were kinda gross

[bleak sky]

F

[gusty mirage]

F indeed

[hollow river]

you like platenutres @bleak sky?

[balmy condor]

https://tenor.com/view/propane-accessories-hank-hill-gif-13079833

[hollow river]

maybe called something diff where you are

[marble hemlock]

no raid until august tho

[bleak sky]

banana chips are good ye

[hollow river]

yeee

[bleak sky]

[void wharf]

didn't realize you could cloak off azerite debuff, cost me rank 1 jailer parse had a druid simping me and everything, so sad

[hollow river]

big pog

hard to get here sometimes

[gusty mirage]

You had a Druid playing kyrian in 9.2?

[hollow river]

[balmy condor]

[gusty mirage]

Like were they okay with being completely useless?

[void wharf]

yeah he got tilted about our tanks positioning

so he said fuck this and just simped me

[gusty mirage]

He was playing kyrian before being tilted too?

[void wharf]

nah

[balmy condor]

druids in shambles without an OP build that clearly does 50% more damage than everyone else in the raid

brain turning into pudding

[void wharf]

first night venthyr

second night nf

3rd kyrian lol

[gusty mirage]

Jokes on them, brain was always pudding

[void wharf]

thank god we didnt get the 4th night necro

looks a bit disgusting on the leaderboards though 15 buffs and i'm not even top 10

[gusty mirage]

What a team player

[void wharf]

guess i'm just a trash can

[gusty mirage]

Purposefully throwing cuz he’s angy he can’t cast his wraths

[bleak sky]

my brother in christ

[void wharf]

lol

[gusty mirage]

No you just got the wrong externals homie

Kindred more dead than a boomkin’s will to live this tier

[marble hemlock]

honestly

[gusty mirage]

Ain’t that right @wild lantern

[balmy condor]

@abstract leaf this is why I parse bad I promise it's not me

I just don't get enough externals

[marble hemlock]

getting a boomy to play kyrian and wanting to kill themselves after is way more useful than getting the actual rank1. ruining any boomkins will to live is aces

[gusty mirage]

PI the rogue tbh

[void wharf]

i felt like kyrian buff didn't do that much

i was similar dps with just pi

[balmy condor]

that's cause it doesn't

[gusty mirage]

Yeah they nerfed it

Lmao

[void wharf]

i wish i knew cloak removed the debuff though

should have just pressed feint

[gusty mirage]

That man just tainted your log for nothing

[balmy condor]

I mean

200 dps

people be unspeccing feint to try and get 200 dps on the dragonflight talent trees my guy

[bleak sky]

i wanna reclear jailer so bad

[hollow river]

feints garbage

dps or die anyway

[marble hemlock]

ill get easy #1 in DF cause no one is used to playing without cheat

[balmy condor]

true

[balmy condor]

but we get cheat because we take dance

[void wharf]

don't press feint and flame healers for not topping is definitely the play

[marble hemlock]

ssshhh

[meager granite]

he's got his builder build don't worry

[bleak sky]

big mutilate build is great

[balmy condor]

dude I already can't handle the "why did X top log play this one thing that's -0.2% dps"

[bleak sky]

don't hate on it

[balmy condor]

can you imagine

[gusty mirage]

Also pretty sure feint doesn’t work on the azerite soak

So there’s that

[balmy condor]

the fucking talent trees

on logs

[bleak sky]

yepcock

[balmy condor]

I'm gonna lose my shit next expansion

[meager granite]

hahaha the log compare will be so much fun

[void wharf]

it was for the add spawns because nobody stood in the right place so no safe spot in the middle

[balmy condor]

"he took the 60 second sprint reduction instead of -5 energy on vial, is the sprint reduction really that good?"

[marble hemlock]

it does with elusiveness. you didnt play elusiveness? weirdo.

[zinc frost]

Pls no, make it stop

[meager granite]

imagine being the only assa in raid, having to get the DR poison and the RL asking why you dont do same damage as the top logs, who don't take this talent

yummy

[gusty mirage]

Great question, I rarely die and feint on CD

[bleak sky]

ah, yes, the 100 dps diff

truly insane

[strange python]

What could you take instead of feint for damage in first 3 rows

[balmy condor]

after they move the line? not much

[marble hemlock]

is the sub tree really bad or why is DK hanging out here? not that im complaining, im happy about a godgamer being active in assa more

[strange python]

No its good

I just wanted to get opinion on my mock assa tree

[balmy condor]

could do this

[gusty mirage]

Sub tree is good, just needs some stuff moved around to be peachy keen

[meager granite]

he saw Shadow dance, so he came in

[marble hemlock]

guess its SL 2, subtastic bigaloo with a bunch of 3heads joining and ruining any decent discussion or?

[strange python]

I mean sub tree could launch today i’d probably be okay with it

But if it was changed a bit could be even more sweet

[marble hemlock]

is it still gloombuild or?

[strange python]

Yea thats one of the builds you can go

[balmy condor]

I think sub tree needs the most looking at

tbh

[void wharf]

would you be okay with outlaw and assas being way better because of raid utility though

[strange python]

Theres like 3 or 4 potential builds you can go

[marble hemlock]

we got shadowstrike at home. shadowstrike at home:

[strange python]

Just depends on tuning of spells

[gusty mirage]

I want mfd reworked to work like surrender. We have a minute to kill the target or else Ion comes into your room and RKOs you

[strange python]

The outlaw thing isn’t as big of an offender as the atrophic poison lol

[void wharf]

being forced into mfd for sub looks kinda of shit as well no?

[strange python]

Not really

Its just 5 extra cp for free outside of dance

Like

[balmy condor]

I actually like mfd on sub

[strange python]

Its literally just free cp gen

[balmy condor]

but it always competed with deeper

[meager granite]

You just like to watch to world burn don't you?

[strange python]

Ye

[balmy condor]

and that's obviously a dead winner

[gusty mirage]

I do

[strange python]

You get it now quite literally for free cuz its on the way to dance lol

So thats fine

[gusty mirage]

Wait I just realized, mfd -> snd. Ez

[strange python]

Oh true i didnt even think of that

Using it on pull for snd

Actually gonna make the opener not feel clunky

[gusty mirage]

No need to use mfd for flag might make it feel less shitty for sin

[strange python]

Oh it’ll be nice for sub too if we play flagellation

Never had mfd for flag

[gusty mirage]

You also didn’t struggle to generate more than 30cp an hour

[void wharf]

never had problems getting 30 stacks without it though guess you can just get there quicker

[gusty mirage]

I’m going to talk to Ion and get you alpha access @balmy condor

I’ll use the secret lawyer backchannels dw

[hollow river]

yep time for all of us to call our uncles at blizzard

[balmy condor]

I mean

we get put on a list

for wowhead

it's not insta-alpha

but should be early

[strange python]

maybe they do a bigger first wave

[gusty mirage]

Can I still try to contact Ion through my secret lawyer back channels?

[balmy condor]

Yeah go for it

[strange python]

what do you think is bad

[balmy condor]

Coherency and mobility

[balmy condor]

The paths feel very scatter brained

And once you go down a path you’re stuck

[strange python]

mobility is a bit restricted ye

lot of people have been saying that

[balmy condor]

The left side confuses me

You just go symbols inevitability and then all of a sudden you’re like invigorating shadowdust, PV, rotten

And you’re like what the fuck

These all do completely different things

What is this

[strange python]

i think he wanted to give sub vanish synergy but didnt know where to put it

[balmy condor]

Yeah it makes sense

Idk

It just feels very “throw darts at a board and see what sticks”

[strange python]

yea i can see that

ig thats probably the reason theres a few potential builds you can go for

looking at it now its a bit weird that assa's aoe nodes like katar flying daggers and ct are completely off to the side

opt in

other 2 specs dont really have that element to them

[balmy condor]

Yeah idk bout that either

But left side needs those points or else it would just do nothing in m+

[void wharf]

weird that fok isn't baseline

[balmy condor]

Not that weird

Outlaw doesn’t have fok, sub doesn’t have storm

Each spec needs a point to get aoe

[strange python]

ye

its not that weird

[void wharf]

but would there be a situation where you opt out of taking it because you're always going to want to go down the left side

[strange python]

well left side has stuff like imp shiv and elaborate planning

[balmy condor]

If you don’t take fok you literally can’t spend all your points

[strange python]

so no youre prob always gonna have fok

that too lmao

[void wharf]

is there a situation where sub doesn't go down the storm side

[silent tinsel]

What does dance give assa

[void wharf]

the same as sub

use of all stealth abilities, combat benefits of stealth and increase damage

[silent tinsel]

Thistleeee teeeee

[strange python]

no

you need to get storm to get relentless strikes

and if you try to play sub without relentless strikes you're probably in for a bad time

[void wharf]

true

i can't wait for the nerds in here to tell me what to play thank god i don't have to use my brain :p

[balmy condor]

A fuck ton of damage

Dance is old vendetta

[bleak sky]

what is old vendetta

[meager granite]

in better

with 1 min cd

current vendetta, whispyr is already playing DF

[sand sigil]

@balmy condor do i have permission to play dragonflight alpha with some fucked up builds and tell everyone these are best for dps and if they have any questions to send them here and ask u why ur tree is different from mine?

[bleak sky]

[sand sigil]

[void wharf]

make sure it ends up on wow highlights

[strange python]

How good does Dragon-Tempered Blades look?

[marble hemlock]

very

[meager granite]

TTB looks fabulous aswell, cant wait to do 5k damage on a 24 sec cd....

[silent tinsel]

The name makes me thing you get a tiny shiv

[strange python]

Yeah I would pick both up even tho sin’s final row seems hella expensive

[meager granite]

I was being sarcastic. In the current iteration, and depending on tuning of spells, there are better option than TTB

[strange python]

Well yeah ofc it’ll depend on tuning

[balmy condor]

It’s gonna happen anyways, I’ve already had 3 arguments about why I take gouge instead of 1 point into nightstalker

[kind talon]

Self aware jpc

[marble hemlock]

why did you take gouge?

isnt nightstalker better?

[bleak sky]

why did you not take shadow dance

it works with everything smile

[silent tinsel]

cant gouge a raid boss

harrumph

[deft flicker]

Can gouge trash between bosses

[balmy condor]

I’m gonna make a Google doc with multiple possible builds

And then hopefully everyone will leave me the fuck alone and I won’t get off the plane with 25 thousand pings about what if we take 1 more point out of alacrity or whatever dumb shit you dent brains cook up

[bleak sky]

[obtuse robin]

[cursive summit]

[balmy condor]

I love you

Im not mad, just disappointed

There there champ

[thin trout]

Aren’t we in alpha phase

[obtuse robin]

friends and family alpha yeah

[balmy condor]

Idk if it’s even friends and family

Still seems like internal alpha

[thin trout]

Isn’t it likely things will change

[balmy condor]

Well yes, we’re not in alpha

So things will change

[obtuse robin]

damn they might skip f&f then

[thin trout]

Also do I taks one or two points in Alacrity @balmy condor

[balmy condor]

Probably a bigger alpha to start yeh

[thin trout]

https://tenor.com/view/tickle-feet-gif-21372591

[balmy condor]

4, just keep hitting the button until the calculator breaks and said 5318008

[hollow river]

[obtuse robin]

3 points cuz u need deeper for mega juicer cold blood amp envenoms

[balmy condor]

[hollow river]

[balmy condor]

Deeper doesn’t even buff finishers anymore

[hollow river]

an extra point is still more damage no?

[balmy condor]

Might as well be anticipation

[hollow river]

just no actual dmg amp

[balmy condor]

Yeah but it’s all linear

[hollow river]

% based

yeah

sadge

also locking 7cp sub behind alacrity

[balmy condor]

Deeper strat is just overcap prevention nowadays

[hollow river]

pretty cringo

the biggest positive points i see in the new trees

are that we get multiple legendaries as talents

[obtuse robin]

sub looks like a snooze fest tbh

[hollow river]

and that vendetta is deadge

[obtuse robin]

having all ur leggos and cov abiltiies is cool i guess

[balmy condor]

(It’s called shadow dance now)

[thin trout]

Isn’t the vendetta replacement suffering from the same problem? If stuff died too fast its wasted?

Like the lihivum add for example

[balmy condor]

I mean that wasn’t really a problem

But sure

Yeah

[obtuse robin]

replace sespis with duskwalker

[thin trout]

Was poop and i never wanted to use cd on the adds

[obtuse robin]

[hollow river]

(:

[balmy condor]

[hollow river]

i just want TTB and thistle tea gone

[balmy condor]

And exsang

[hollow river]

[thin trout]

Yes plz

[hollow river]

buff exsang

[obtuse robin]

man said ttb and tea but left out exsang

[balmy condor]

Ttb thistle and exsang

[obtuse robin]

fake rogue

[thin trout]

Whole left side

[hollow river]

i really like the idea of exsang damn it

[balmy condor]

No Just ttb thistle and exsang

Just those 3

[hollow river]

just make exsang aoe

for aoe build at least

[obtuse robin]

the idea of tea seems cool but we r in 2022

[hollow river]

[thin trout]

Was the 3 yard extra range outlaw only or accesable to all specs now?

[balmy condor]

Acro is on the class tree

Outlaw gets another 3 on top

If they take that talent

[hollow river]

for BF only

[balmy condor]

(They won’t)

[balmy condor]

For all melee

But okay

[hollow river]

have to for aoe build don't you?

[balmy condor]

I don’t think so

But I’m not too familiar

I just know they get another +3

[deft flicker]

(They will because linear af trees)

[obtuse robin]

we wont but the idea of pressing bf in st and attking from across the map is fun

[thin trout]

Oh lol 11 yard goblin attacks

[obtuse robin]

in pvp u will tho

[hollow river]

its only while BF is active sir

[balmy condor]

Explain where

[hollow river]

they have to take it to get to dancing steel

[hollow river]

must be updated tooltip

[balmy condor]

Maybe I just can’t read English anymore

Please help me

[hollow river]

mine says while BF is active

wait

thats survival talent whispyr

[balmy condor]

What

[obtuse robin]

lmao

[hollow river]

[balmy condor]

Cringe

They all look the same

[hollow river]

you shit posting mad man

[balmy condor]

That’s me

[hollow river]

Long Arm of the Outlaw

[balmy condor]

I was also looking at survival

For a guildie

[hollow river]

[obtuse robin]

hunter gets done so dirty 3 points for 3 yards and 3 points for 6% movespeed

like hello

[hollow river]

yeah they got screwed bad

like at least make it haste or crit multipliers if you're out of ideas shit

[deft flicker]

4% vers for 2 points are a blessing compared to that

[obtuse robin]

the classes that have had robust kits are gonna do well with these trees

thats why survival seems like shit

i have a feeling mage is gonna be insanre

[hollow river]

yeah too much spreading, not enough made baseline

so specs with low amounts of stuff will be sadge unless they add new/recycled ideas

[obtuse robin]

i cant imagine what dh is gona look like

[bleak sky]

hopefully good

[hollow river]

they'll prob get cov abilities

and a couple leggos

[bleak sky]

the hunt HAS to be there

[obtuse robin]

all covs and all leggos

u get all the thins

[bleak sky]

no, sinful brand can fuck off

[hollow river]

i'm really surprised hunter didn't get cov abilities

[obtuse robin]

def speccing into their kick

[hollow river]

kinda sadge tbh

[deft flicker]

The hunters took the hunt icon already

[bleak sky]

ok and

[deft flicker]

Also rogues got sepsis for some weird reason

[hollow river]

rogues got everything except SBS

[obtuse robin]

the reason is not wierd it makes sense

just

like no

they clearly want us to play around stealth

alot

just sepsis is boring

[deft flicker]

So they give us an ability that doesn’t even let us enter stealth and surround it by stuff that buffs in stealth

[obtuse robin]

it works for a bunch of stuff

it also works beter for pvp

u gotta give pvpers stuff to

be happy its at the end of tress were u dont have to take it

[deft flicker]

Don’t pvpers still get their own talents??

[obtuse robin]

they get 3 talents

just like now

just like there r pvp only talents now

like master poisoner

it cant be only pve

[thin trout]

we haven't seen any other class get the 3% damage reduction 'raid (de)buff' right?

[solid mica]

Actually cringe sepsis can fk off

[autumn gate]

pala have it with devotion aura

[thin trout]

doens't stack with Atrophic poison right?

[bleak sky]

it should because they're different things

pala doesn't have the same thing with devo aura

[thin trout]

ah okay

[bleak sky]

they have a similar effect

[cursive summit]

Replace it with the superior kingsbane

Or make it a choice node lul

[toxic locust]

things i'd still hope to see are SS and kingsbane in sin tree and flag in class tree (maybe choice node for ER and flag?)

[brave gyro]

honestly Shrouded Suffocation was great - even without the dmg bonus, the extra CP were just really nice and smoothed out the rotation

[hollow river]

No u

[cursive summit]

I think kingsbane is my #1 on a wishlist

[spice spire]

[blazing totem]

[burnt latch]

I hope you kings have a wonderful day/night depending on your location! @ebon notch @limber lion @bleak sky @spice spire @gusty mirage @oak sky @subtle tundra

[spice spire]

No you mister Warcieft

[bleak sky]

@burnt latch you too my man, you too

blessge

[burnt latch]

[subtle tundra]

Thaamks amigo

[burnt latch]

no worries varas @subtle tundra

[subtle tundra]

Varas @Folyr

[viscid spear]

[burnt latch]

sorry king

[viscid spear]

[ebon notch]

Korruptio has made you such a polite man

[burnt latch]

always been a polite gent

[ebon notch]

Agreon was completely smashed yesterday so will take time for him to respond

[digital gyro]

Any WA for Garrote/Rupture with pandemic?

not for nameplates pls

I have this one https://wago.io/2l0LTrY7n/1 but I guess it is outdated it spews endless amount of errors

[gusty mirage]

What a wonderful message to wake up to

[subtle tundra]

Cap

[bleak sky]

https://wago.io/rk2kEs76d

[digital gyro]

its nice but its not accurate

it shows last 3 seconds

not based on duration :(

thanks tho <3

[bleak sky]

what do you mean exactly

this wa should be working just fine for vendetta and non vendetta pandemic timers

[digital gyro]

it starts to glow long after my old wa

[burnt latch]

mby ur old weak aura is inaccurate

[bleak sky]

walk me through the problem

what do you expect to happen and what is actually happening?

when are things going wrong?

[digital gyro]

this is my old WA

[bleak sky]

ok

[digital gyro]

and thats during vendetta

new WA starts to glow a second later

[bleak sky]

Pandemic timers during vendetta are different

[digital gyro]

prolly not updated on every frame?

thats why?

[bleak sky]

Pandemic timers during Vendetta:
Garrote, 2.7
Rupture, 3.6

so it makes sense that it would not start glowing at 5

[burnt latch]

warcieft was right again

[bleak sky]

Pandemic timers outside of Vendetta:
Garrote, 5.4
Rupture, 7.2

So either your current weakaura is using wrong pandemic timers and starting at 5 OR it is ignoring vendetta timers OR both

[digital gyro]

guess old one was broken then

thanks a ton <3

[limber lion]

That's because your old weakaura is incorrect. The timers change with the tier set during Vendetta.

[bleak sky]

np xi

[ebon notch]

is it wrong that i dont know pandemic timers

[bleak sky]

nah you're a gamer

[subtle tundra]

you dont need to know them

the wa needs to

[ebon notch]

[limber lion]

You should know them

If you want to be good at the game

[subtle tundra]

cry about it

[limber lion]

But I guess Daps has given up on that

[ebon notch]

wtf

[subtle tundra]

70 hours/week raider

[burnt latch]

unlucky

[subtle tundra]

job

oops

[limber lion]

Ty, you too! :)

[burnt latch]

[ebon notch]

that was toxic 😦

[burnt latch]

unluck

[gusty mirage]

Facts

[digital gyro]

Oh now it makes sense! thanks a lot ♥️

[limber lion]

Your dps is going to skyrocket with the new weakaura :)

[digital gyro]

I do pvp only XD

but thanks a lot

[limber lion]

Even then

[digital gyro]

its actually very useful in pvp so thanks a ton

[limber lion]

No worries

[digital gyro]

helps with making the right decision, finisher wise

[subtle tundra]

im pretty sure a couple of years ago i saw a video in legion about using the trinket from karazhan, the eye of command, with mouse over bleeds in m+, anyone know how bad it is to play

[limber lion]

Very bad and not recommended at all

[subtle tundra]

😭 so its not some hidden tech to make assa meta in m+

[thorn fjord]

copium

[subtle tundra]

yes

i am FULL of copium.

i want to blast m+ as assa

[thorn fjord]

I got benched on Lords prog

[limber lion]

Nope, it's bad and super aids to play on top

[bleak sky]

we will have the new aoe rupture + garrote

trust brother we will rise

[sand sigil]

[thorn fjord]

[subtle tundra]

we will have my no seal fate build

y'all shall see

[bleak sky]

you're omega trolling wtf

[limber lion]

If Shadow Dance actually works with improved garrote and master assassin, it might be stupid strong

[subtle tundra]

do we know if cb works with bleeds?

i guess it doesnt

cb=cockblock=cold blood

[bleak sky]

@limber lion do bleeds crit?

not on the initial hit, but after

[limber lion]

Yes

[bleak sky]

then maybe varas

[subtle tundra]

cause, uh, cb + aoe empowered garrote

[bleak sky]

now that's interesting

[violet jackal]

No seal fate, full mastery, crimson tempest and sepsis in single target, just wait

[gusty mirage]

Lost me at sepsis

[thorn fjord]

lost me at CT

[subtle tundra]

but also like ER + aoe 7cp rupture

[thorn fjord]

That would be fun lol @subtle tundra

[bleak sky]

so you want to run something like this for m+

?

wait I didn't take atrophic 💀

[gusty mirage]

Saved you a point, take it out of that pvp talent

Pretend it doesn’t exist

[bleak sky]

vicious venoms or what

[subtle tundra]

i havent played with the simulator

so idk which one is what

[limber lion]

I highly doubt you get 100% crit for the entire bleed with CB but feel free to go try it out on Sub

[bleak sky]

https://www.wowhead.com/dragonflight-talent-calc/AACTAAACKNVYIURUVgQBQ8UA

[subtle tundra]

this part looks weak imo

for m+ atleast

[gusty mirage]

Dragon tempered blades is too strong

[bleak sky]

it's to get to the extra poisons, should still be worth for m+

ya

[subtle tundra]

oh yea baby

[bleak sky]

dragon tempered + lethal dose kinda nutty

[subtle tundra]

cant wait to press 4 poisons all the time

(YAY!!!!!!!!!!)

[gusty mirage]

Think of the IMMERSION

Wait what’s the 2nd lethal poison anyway

[subtle tundra]

its in that tree

[gusty mirage]

Yeah that’s pretty good

[viscid spear]

I'ma immerse myself into the ocean 🦈

[bleak sky]

like this poison seems weak to me

[subtle tundra]

same

[bleak sky]

BUT you have to path through it

[subtle tundra]

for m+ atleast

[gusty mirage]

I mean it’s a passive damage amp

[subtle tundra]

and EP is not taken which is big

[gusty mirage]

And on the path to a giga strong talent

[subtle tundra]

for aoe atleast

it has 100% uptime

[bleak sky]

you're right

but then you can't really get to dragon talent

[gusty mirage]

Just remove the fok buff talents

[subtle tundra]

cttc is 1 sec or 2 sec currently?

[gusty mirage]

Poisoned katar and flying who gives a fuck what it’s name actually is

[bleak sky]

fok does some damage tbh oxi

[gusty mirage]

3s

[subtle tundra]

oh damn

shit would suck with 1 sec

[bleak sky]

like 30% extra fok aint bad

[gusty mirage]

But you’re giving up dragon and EP for them

[subtle tundra]

flying daggers isnt that amazing

[bleak sky]

unless you give up atrophic

[subtle tundra]

i wish the zoldyck tree wasnt that bad holy shit

you have to get venom rush LMAO

[bleak sky]

venom rush is good

just sucks in m+

[subtle tundra]

exactly

zoldyck is stronk in m+

venom rush is 0 dps in aoe

[gusty mirage]

We’ll see where things end up after they move VW

[bleak sky]

I want some tree mobility around this area

[gusty mirage]

It’s almost 0 in ST too dw

[subtle tundra]

poison bomb should go into zoldyck

[gusty mirage]

[bleak sky]

then you have to move other talents

you can't get zoldyck AND dashing AND dragon in the same line

[cursive summit]

What does venom rush do again

[bleak sky]

seems too strong

[gusty mirage]

Bring back the good venom rush that buffed venomous wounds

[bleak sky]

-8 cost of mutilate

[cursive summit]

Ahh yeah

[gusty mirage]

Yeah you didn’t remember because it sucks

+3 energy to VW venom rush

Pls and ty

[bleak sky]

vw is getting buffed by itself ]

at least dev thinks so

[main blaze]

Yeah I felt like that part of the tree was too linear compared to other trees.

[bleak sky]

moving vw up + buffing energy gain

[gusty mirage]

Okay then delete venom rush

[bleak sky]

why do you hate me?

[gusty mirage]

Replace it with double dose

[bleak sky]

I want my big mutilate build

[gusty mirage]

Okay?

Double Dose > venom rush

[subtle tundra]

idk the assassination tree is ok, but now that im looking at the rogue general tree, thats cringe AF

[spice spire]

.

Double dose into Doomblade

[gusty mirage]

ER being in the general tree is confusing

[bleak sky]

(what is double dose?)

[spice spire]

Ain’t no way

[thorn fjord]

Maybe they just meant to put SBS there instead of ER and one of the devs screwed up

🤌

[bleak sky]

aight

replace it

i'm ok with it

[gusty mirage]

Venom rush feels like a leveling talent at this point

And a bad one at that

[subtle tundra]

but like, there's so much shit thats currently existing for assa, that gets put so far away and it makes you have to take useless shit to get to and you dont get enough points to get important things

[main blaze]

Oh man would double dose double dip with 2 lethals?

[subtle tundra]

i really dislike the rogue tree

[gusty mirage]

Yeah I agree. The general tree is kinda yikes

But if dance works with all the stealth effects, not like we’d have much choice than to gothat way

[subtle tundra]

like seal fate being where it is makes it MANDATORY to go there

like 0 option

locks you in CB

i think thats not really good design

it should be the other way

you go seal fate and then you get the option of cb

[gusty mirage]

Agreed. Luckily though, for a first draft it does look good

A lot of potential

[main blaze]

Yeah I'd like to see Vigor and Seal Fate swapped spots

or maybe with deeper strat

[bleak sky]

don't like that

[main blaze]

Have it be part of the two path area

[gusty mirage]

I think seal fate should be in the sin tree

Considering how long it’s been part of assassination’s toolkit

[bleak sky]

taking 3 points of alacrity seems like overkill

[subtle tundra]

and alacrity is so strong it also makes it mandatory

so you have to go and take it

[gusty mirage]

Yeah right now we seem pigeon holed into certain parts of the tree

[subtle tundra]

and i dont like that some utility is mandatory to take, why do i always need to take sap?

maybe thats just how talent trees are supposed to be

[main blaze]

Or yeah maybe replace sepsis with seal fate, since sepsis is already in other trees too.

[shadow tulip]

1 of the 2 only true CCs.

[subtle tundra]

ok and? in many many dungeons i dont need it

and in raids never

why is it an "option" if its mandatory to take it

just feel wrong for me

[shadow tulip]

Then you won't take it. EZ

[gusty mirage]

I mean

[bleak sky]

freezing trap, poly, hex, paralysis are not true ccs?

[shadow tulip]

Remember, you'll have layouts to save and switch between

[subtle tundra]

nah

[gusty mirage]

You’re giving up cloak of shadows by not taking sap

Lol

[bleak sky]

you can't NOT take sap

because cloak

[main blaze]

glass cannon rogue build

[subtle tundra]

0 defensives build???????

[main blaze]

LOL

[subtle tundra]

PPPPPOG

[bleak sky]

what makes a CC be true cc

legit question

[shadow tulip]

Only Sap and DH imprison are true CCs. You can go next to the CCd mob and will not cause combat. Others do

[subtle tundra]

you dont get in combat

[bleak sky]

OH that

[gusty mirage]

Other specs have to take garrote for evasion

[bleak sky]

yayayaya got it

ty

[gusty mirage]

[subtle tundra]

imagine if sub gets garrote

and its strong enough to use in ST

and it just becomes assa...

[gusty mirage]

Well we’re all becoming sub rogues

[shadow tulip]

https://tenor.com/view/memes-risitas-laughing-lmao-lol-gif-11500030

[gusty mirage]

Thanks to dance potentially being so strong

[bleak sky]

I want dragonflight now

[gusty mirage]

I don’t. I want to see more iterations of this talent tree first

[bleak sky]

no I want to toy with it now

[subtle tundra]

also, wtf is this talent

??????

2 min sprint by default

[gusty mirage]

They took rank 2 sprint and turned it into a talent

[subtle tundra]

like.......

[regal cloud]

It reduce the cool down of sprint

[main blaze]

..

[regal cloud]

[shadow tulip]

Alpha access is good for that too

[gusty mirage]

We don’t want minalba being our tester

No ty

[subtle tundra]

and guess what, if you want something as simple as 1 min sprint youre forced into gouge

[bleak sky]

bro?

what did I do to you oxi

[gusty mirage]

You didn’t come with me on my trip

And now I’m sad

[bleak sky]

next one I promise

[gusty mirage]

Okay fine I’ll email Ion and put you on the list

[bleak sky]

[shadow tulip]

Email?

Just call him on the phone

[gusty mirage]

Secret fellow lawyer access

No I hate talking on the phone

I only talk on the phone when I can charge people for it

[subtle tundra]

i think mostly what the tree needs is more connections

so there are actual choices

[shadow tulip]

Aye

[spice spire]

I think we need a connection @subtle tundra

[hasty siren]

Can someone share their NF sim? Just want to compare on what i am seeing.

[lucid birch]

[spice spire]

[gusty mirage]

[burnt latch]

[wanton comet]

Hi just got back from holiday and seen Rogue talents have been added to look at. Can you correct me if I am wrong but "Lethal Dose - 2% increased damage to targets for each poison and bleed effects on them" So that's Deadly Poison, Numb Poison, Sepsis, Rupture, Garrote, Doomblade 12% increased damage. Then when you pop Deathmark which then duplicates all bleeds & poisons on the target, and adds a bleed itself so will that mean we do 26% more damage to the target.

[cursive summit]

Yes, it ain't staying that way though

[wanton comet]

Going to say that is insane xD

[royal lantern]

yes

lethal dose is broken

[strange python]

Don't forget dragon tempered blades

[rose narwhal]

Deathmark only replicates garrotte rupture + lethal poisons so in your list it would go to 20%

[strange python]

I doubt sepsis will be picked

[wanton comet]

Ah fair. Just been catching up on the pins.

[royal lantern]

dragon tempered would be enough to make lethal dose broken

no need to pick stepsis

[strange python]

Crimson tempest though

But yes, it'll probably be nerfed

[shadow tulip]

Stepsis, heh? ARA ARA

[shy axle]

hey guys, does anyone know how the legendaries will work with season 4? is there just another upgrade you need to buy and craft?

[thorny pond]

Stepbro why are you stabbing me?

[grim tangle]

leggos are staying at 291 max ilvl

[limber lion]

Deadly, Amp, Instant and Wound.

So probs Deadly + Instant in M+

[gusty mirage]

instant seems kind of redundant doesn't it

[limber lion]

Sure does

I thought Deadly replaced it but guess not

[gusty mirage]

me waiting for more stuff

and thinking you're cute cev

at the same time

[thorny pond]

uwu alert

[limber lion]

u2 babes

[thorny pond]

who wants to give me a dagger so I can play sin again? sitting here with double eons like an idiot

[shadow tulip]

Check AH? My guildie just linked a 2h BOE from ZM

True, it would only be 246 (-ish?), but more than nothing

[limber lion]

That wouldn't help much considering he's got double eon's :P

[lucid birch]

2h boe

[slow marsh]

so like how excited (or not) are people about talent reveal?

[lucid birch]

The one that happened already or the results

[slow marsh]

idk

i just peaked at the wowhead talent calc so idk the backstory stuff

[lucid birch]

It seems like the rogue trees definitely had the thought put into them and dev was kind enough to stop by here and accept feedback

So over all good interactions and directions so far, much better than what could have been

[slow marsh]

Yeah I was somewhat impressed by what i saw in terms of what it seems the direction is going in

[gusty mirage]

seems pretty pog, some things are in odd places but the dev working on it has played a rogue before so that's a good start

[slow marsh]

but idk i am noob so wanted to see what the real gamers thought

[gusty mirage]

also mentioned moving stuff around

[gusty mirage]

oh shit mb

@bleak sky iceblades needs thoughts of a real gamer

[slow marsh]

Dance being in class tree seems broken idk

[gusty mirage]

apparently it's supposed to trigger all stealth effects too

so yeah pretty broken lmao

[lucid birch]

Seems like there’s a couple odd things but I feel like (non rogue player) the unintentional interactions in the trees either need to be made intentional or the pathing could just be better

[slow marsh]

I was like, oh cool thistle tea, that'll be really cool, oh wait that's dance

My takeaway was like ok this seems cool but I have nothing to compare it to so i'm gonna chill

I like the idea of having different viable builds though, hopefully they can make that happen with like the more passive consistent dmg vs the bursty looking stuff

[lucid birch]

Have you seen the utility yet that’s usually the eye opener

[slow marsh]

Kind of yeah

[lucid birch]

Atrophic poison and restless crew

[toxic locust]

dance builds for sin/outlaw look awesome

[slow marsh]

Is restless crew in outlaw?

[toxic locust]

ye

sin gets atrophic, outlaw gets crew

[slow marsh]

I haven't looked at the other specs tbh. I haven't even looked all the way through sin

[toxic locust]

there's some great stuff in there

[slow marsh]

oh wow restless crew seems interesting

[lucid birch]

Indeed

[violet jackal]

sublety gets stealth stampeding roar

[lucid birch]

Atrophic poison is also very op in its current state

[toxic locust]

we were wondering how it'll work with shiv

[lucid birch]

Depends on the encounter and environmental effects but

7% dr super frequently is insane

[slow marsh]

yeah

i mean its pretty much perma on sin rogue right as long as you're on boss with high uptime

[lucid birch]

Two bosses ? Two rogues even

[storm onyx]

May end up exempt of shiv and be a flat 3%
Would we prefer it to be toned down and included in shiv or excluded; if we will spread it aoe, I would prefer it be flat 3% I guess

[lucid birch]

I highly doubt they keep it near 7% I would say they just exclude it in the end

[storm onyx]

That’s before counting in master poisoner btw

[uneven hamlet]

raid leaders setting shiv as a defensive cd soon

[cursive summit]

Yeah there's no way Sin gets a high uptime 7.2% dr

[main blaze]

"alright, 3 2 1 shiv"

[storm onyx]

I am ok with we have that utility; as long as bosses go down. Just the TB/Shiv trade off is still meh

But it has a logical nature to it. We act for surviving the situation; then dmg becomes lower priority.

[slow marsh]

I mean if that's the case you just dont go past shiv on that branch right?

oh i just saw zold is a talent uwu

[uncut dragon]

Do they have shadow step in both the assassination tree and the general rogue tree? How's that going to work? 2 charges or wasted point?

[violet jackal]

2 charges

[slow marsh]

ye it specifically says add a charge so seems to be intended

[uncut dragon]

so, wasted point.

[lucid birch]

Zold is bait rn from what I understand

[spice spire]

?

[slow marsh]

ye i see that

their placement of certain talents seems kinda troll to me but

i am noob what do i know

[violet jackal]

Every boss in dragon land is going to have a vigilant guardian sized arena and 8/10 bosses will be heavy movement sims :imagine:

[spice spire]

Placement is being looked at on a few

Heavy movement sims

[lucid birch]

Inc dragon flying aerial fight

[slow marsh]

I figure placement is gonna move around a lot so that's why i'm not putting too much stock into this right now

dunno if i'm even gonna play it still

[spice spire]

Most sane WoW player

[uncut dragon]

Do you think the shiv dr is going to be enough to keep all group content from being outlaw with the cooldown reduction?

[spice spire]

Never thought I’d see the day

[lucid birch]

Just bring both kekw

[slow marsh]

I would say this gives 10 points just for some of the ideas that i'm seeing, only 80-90 more to go wow devs xD

wait lmao they actually made un-obedience'd flag one of the last 3 talents for sub after moving dance to the class tree

no wonder i've been seeing all the sub players chatting in here the last couple days

[spice spire]

Sub looks like the weakest atm but again, tuning could ruin this line of thought

Also no more vendetta

[slow marsh]

ye ofc tuning

but like one of their key abilities is in the class tree right. and i dont see really anything that replaces it for sub

their aoe still seems like it'll be much better witth nado though so i'm sure it's fine.

i'm just typing my intiial thoughts cuz this the first time i've actually looked at the trees while not being in a league game inting my ass off

[lucid birch]

You can look at messages from @ realz

[burnt latch]

they just need some raid utility or its going to be hard to justify bringing one into raid

[lucid birch]

To get a better understanding of what the dev is thinking

[spice spire]

PTSD looking mf

[burnt latch]

m+ they can be decent maybe

[spice spire]

Yeah the roar is definitely not enough

[burnt latch]

depending on tuning

it breaks on damage aswell

actually horrible

[lucid birch]

I made sure that space was there

[spice spire]

Ik, he said he doesn’t mind being pinged; obviously you’re just being courteous tho

[lucid birch]

Yee

[uncut dragon]

Vendetta kind of sucked, to be fair. Locking into single target.

[spice spire]

Tl;dr I’m clownin

[lucid birch]

[spice spire]

I got bad news for our new CD

[icy agate]

locking into aoe?

[lucid birch]

[burnt latch]

[icy agate]

but its nice getting to choose between deathmark and carnage

[spice spire]

Porque no los dos

[icy agate]

can't imagine deathmark without exsanguinate though to fit the second duplicate garrote in right?

[spice spire]

You definitely can take dm without exsanguinate

[burnt latch]

Exsanquinate forbidden tech

[icy agate]

i guess you could just refresh it early, see how it pandemic

[lucid birch]

[slow marsh]

truuuuuu lmao. good times, good times

I mean exsang is still worded the exact same

[bleak sky]

something about insane damage amp from shadow dance makes exsang good maybe

[slow marsh]

yeah I saw that interaction too

idk though

cuz it's either super stupid broken damage

or not enough damage

to justify

[lucid birch]

Don’t mention the ns Exsang dm forbidden tech pls

The German will awaken

[spice spire]

Mister dsnow, pls

Forbidden tech

[lucid birch]

I’m just bored I don’t even play this class

I don’t know how I ended up with like 4 rogue maining friends

[bleak sky]

you're going to play it 100%

[spice spire]

Because you joined this server Smdh

[lucid birch]

No

[spice spire]

(And whispyr)

[bleak sky]

monk tree is gonna be disappointing and you'll swap melee characters

[slow marsh]

This server would legit be the only reason i'd resub tbh

[bleak sky]

it's bound to happen snow

[lucid birch]

Do NOT manifest this

[spice spire]

Awww babe. Check your mail this week

[bleak sky]

i have spoken into the universe

it's done

[spice spire]

2 late

It’s manifested

[lucid birch]

https://tenor.com/view/fade-away-oooooooooooo-aga-emoji-crumble-gif-20008708

[bleak sky]

https://tenor.com/view/william-knight-tik-tok-guy-tik-tok-grand-rising-app-there-is-no-such-thing-as-a-coincidence-gif-22190856

[lucid birch]

Omni called me a ww mw flex

Yeah flex dn

[grizzled jay]

Monk will never have a good tree

[slow marsh]

monk

[spice spire]

Bless up

[lucid birch]

Yeah I have abandoned priest

[grizzled jay]

Except Brew

It will have the best designed tree in the game

[bleak sky]

doubt

[spice spire]

Holy based

[grizzled jay]

Blizz loves Brew

[bleak sky]

brew boring ass tank

[spice spire]

Can’t argue PI if there’s no PI to give

[spice spire]

Slow your roll dh main

[lucid birch]

Went from least movement least defensives to most movement most defensives

[bleak sky]

[lucid birch]

Can’t possibly troll prog now

[bleak sky]

true now you have cumcoon

insane cd

[lucid birch]

BRO I play WW

[bleak sky]

ok healer

[winter hill]

does cold blood affect the whole duration of an ability? like if we were to use it on rupture would every tick crit?

[lucid birch]

[bleak sky]

unsure

[spice spire]

If it’s anything like current iterations (think MA) no

But won’t know for sure until we get in

[winter hill]

Would be amazing

[grizzled jay]

It shouldn't as that would make no sense thematically and also feel horrible to play

[spice spire]

I mean dance is supposed to be affected with stuff so who knows

[toxic locust]

??

[slow marsh]

The only thing that I kinda wish was a bit better for these trees

was if you could cross sooner

[toxic locust]

more paths would be great ye

[bleak sky]

absolutely

[toxic locust]

plus some choice nodes in places like sepsis/exsang

[slow marsh]

like it seems like you're locked in to a path pretty early on

[bleak sky]

but first iteration of the tree, maybe we get a little more freedom

[slow marsh]

and some are opposite sides probably intentionally but i dont think its necessary

[winter hill]

i mean if it doesn't affect the entire dot duration then i guess we only use envenom after cold blood

[lucid birch]

I don’t enjoy the right side of the rogue tree

[grizzled jay]

Sepsis/ER should be a choice node and then the upgrade below it changes based on choice

[spice spire]

You and everyone else

[lucid birch]

[toxic locust]

i love the right side of the rogue tree

[bleak sky]

yeah but that's the big ass damage amp

unfortunate

[slow marsh]

Yeah

[lucid birch]

700 points to get to dance

[spice spire]

Outlaw colors 🤨

[slow marsh]

The good stuff is in left/middle but dance is right

[grizzled jay]

If they move Imp. Ambush over it'll feel nice

[spice spire]

No but really, why do you like that side compared to middle and left?

(Not here to troll, would like perspective)

[toxic locust]

dance builds sound fun

honestly that's about it

[grizzled jay]

Cold Blood and Seal Fate boring

[toxic locust]

it's kinda shit without dance

[grizzled jay]

Subsin fun

[lucid birch]

It does but isn’t there like 5 or 6 just travel nodes it doesn’t feel good

[ebon notch]

no monk on first boss

[lucid birch]

Travel nodes god I have poe brain still

[cursive summit]

if cold blood affected bleeds you'd just macro it into rupture or garrote no?

[slow marsh]

I mean night stalker, mfd, dance , deeper are all on right side

which are pretty great together

[spice spire]

Cursed

[toxic locust]

yea, right side has a clear "build" it's going for

[grizzled jay]

No because you'd want to pandemic refresh CB rupture so you'd have to hold it

[lucid birch]

Mfd and deeper (1 of 2)

[slow marsh]

also as cool as thistle would be, i'm sure we'll still struggle with overcapping energy by the looks of it

[bleak sky]

dev said this regarding energy:

Early conversations help of course, but internal playtesting is already revealing how energy-starved Assa is without late-expansion haste and engines like VW... underestimated the economy, likely to adjust position (and probably back to either 7 or 8 energy like it has been at times in the past)

so either that was a vw-less test or ...?

[lucid birch]

Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t mfd just one global a minute if you generate cp in two abilties regularly

[bleak sky]

but we shouldn't really get starved with a buffed vw

[toxic locust]

VW will be more easily accessible and buffed

[slow marsh]

without VW???

why would you ever play without vw tho

[bleak sky]

30 seconds for sin

[grizzled jay]

Think they also didn't playtest VW + Deathmark lol

[lucid birch]

Ah

[spice spire]

Because it was deep on a bad side of the tree

[toxic locust]

^

[spice spire]

And limited your build path

But again, it looks like they’re looking at its position pretty hard

[slow marsh]

well good then they can kinda understand the struggle

[grizzled jay]

Baseline 1m for all 3 in current trees

[bleak sky]

[slow marsh]

playing sin without vw would be nightmarish tbh

[lucid birch]

[bleak sky]

that's unfort tmb

[spice spire]

Bro think of it this way

MA FOK into your aoe cd rupture garrote

[grizzled jay]

Same thing for Dance. 30s for sub now, 1m in new trees.

[thorn fjord]

They arent resetting stats and DMG output again for DF are they?

[toxic locust]

why wouldn't they

[spice spire]

And then go read a book for 30s while you recover 50 energy

[storm onyx]

Was that clarified? Couse i thought it migt be an issue where the mock trees were put togather...

[bleak sky]

what do you mean by that

[icy agate]

they aren't resetting ilvl no

[slow marsh]

BUt the aoe cd is under VW now

[thorn fjord]

meant squish @bleak sky

[lucid birch]

@bleak sky is tight spender good

[bleak sky]

don't think so

[spice spire]

Ignoring your truth, bestie

[slow marsh]

kek

[bleak sky]

I don't remember them saying anything about squishing

[grizzled jay]

Clarified no but because they are in Generalist tree nothing should change spec-specific

[thorn fjord]

Yeah me neither

[bleak sky]

for sin at least*

[storm onyx]

Good point

:/

[bleak sky]

for the other 2 specs might be ok

[slow marsh]

Tight spender being only finishers means its just meh for sin yeah

[bleak sky]

we finish every 4 globals

mfs finish every other global

[slow marsh]

and you only save like 5 energy at that

[grizzled jay]

Also the one that increases crit of generators is also meh for us

[slow marsh]

uhhhh

why

[grizzled jay]

Only affects Mut Ambush

Not Garrote

[slow marsh]

and?

[bleak sky]

this?