assassination

[limber lion]

Not like you have much choice now either because the alternatives are so bad

Always stuck with alacrity

[fallen arch]

Think she was meaning she has to remember to keep hitting stuff to keep stacks

[plain onyx]

is there a specific pattern for placing shards in sockets? or it doesnt matter where do i place them as long as i gain the bonus set ?

[viscid spear]

Yeah, just throw 'em in

[plain onyx]

thanks a lot ❤️

[brazen zodiac]

More like im too fixated on hitting balls and not moving like a pack

So fucking up with swirls and shit

Or just losing track of spikes

[viscid spear]

I have brain farts a lot in the last phase with both sets of spikes happening

[static rock]

okay dumb question but do people ever really pool in m+ as sin?

[viscid spear]

I always get a trap on me so I have to go Big Brain Time to avoid everything in order to drop it correctly

[static rock]

i’m always refreshing crimson, garrote or rupture

i might get an envenom off

but i don’t feel like ever get pool in m+ on bosses

[bleak sky]

you can pool on bosses, it's just like fighting a raid boss

[bitter apex]

wtb frostrime fix

[gusty mirage]

Same

[limber lion]

Frostrime is not dps

Thus it'a useless

[bitter apex]

spoken like a true dps haha

I just really enjoyed being rather high is healing meters

[fallen arch]

Negligable

U can pool a bit on bosses, otherwise no

[static rock]

yeah on bosses i’m having trouble because it’s like there is always a dot coming up that i need to refresh

[fallen arch]

Which is fine, pooling is not gonna male the difference timing a key or not

[echo geyser]

anyone tested shard of tel this week?

prob aint fixed

[small basin]

is dreadblades only really played with deeper strat?

[echo geyser]

wrong channel to ask

[gusty mirage]

still broken

[spice spire]

Just like our love

[echo geyser]

[gusty mirage]

sorry man too busy getting bent like you told me to yesterday

[spice spire]

Understandable have a nice day

[gusty mirage]

better grind today

[spice spire]

Got a 20 top plus some other shenanigans tonight

[gusty mirage]

ye knocking out a 21 sanguine and 21 dos today

you're just going to continue getting gaped my friend

[spice spire]

Bro?

[gusty mirage]

bro?

[spice spire]

You forget a letter there king?

[gusty mirage]

nope

[spice spire]

O

[fallow estuary]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[bleak sky]

get a room you two sheesh

[spice spire]

Already have king

You should see it in the dms here is tame

[severe sparrow]

how come all the vaguely high parsing rogues have elaborate planning/vigor, but blindside/deeper sim higher for me by ~100? is this just sims vs real life, or are my stats just weird enough that these others are higher?

[viscid spear]

Wonder if there's going to be something to dump all your Soul Ash and Cinders into before 9.2.
Especially with everyone doing the "grind Layer 9" for Renown strat.

[spice spire]

It’s because deeper/blindside is purely st and there’s very few purely st fights. EP Vigor is more flexible and just easier overall

[severe sparrow]

ah, makes sense. thanks

[slow marsh]

Na now that you can grind it freely they don't have a reason to reward you for it

Has to be time gated for rewards

[gusty mirage]

just like I time gate my affection toward you

[slow marsh]

It's because for most higher profiles ep/MfD (new vigor build) is only 50 behind BS/DS and is super ahead the second any 2nd target comes into the mix

[slow marsh]

True

[gusty mirage]

this is so good

lmfaoooo

[slow marsh]

[ember mural]

https://tenor.com/view/simp-simping-yelling-meryl-streep-shouting-gif-17852144

[limber lion]

EP/MfD and EP/Vigor also pull ahead when you introduce movement

And SoD is filled with adds and movement

[slow marsh]

Yeah vigor is better with movement than MfD too right

[limber lion]

Ye

But I would probably just play EP/MFD on every single fight tbh

[slow marsh]

I will gladly simp for oxi any day

[ember mural]

me too bro

[slow marsh]

Yeah I thought about playing vigor for KT because of the movement but I get so many resets it would be stupid to play vig

[gusty mirage]

yea literally everything gives you resets

including your dead teammates

[slow marsh]

I haven't figured out if it's better to do opener normal or delay 2 seconds for first tank adds. I think delay right

[gusty mirage]

dunno haven't had a second go around on KT

unless you mean heroic, and then it doesn't even matter tbh

[limber lion]

Definitely worth to delay Vend/Shiv/Vanish/Flag

But

it's kinda aids so I don't do it

But you should if you want maximum deeps

but if your team mates blast the frostbound devoted adds then it doesn't matter either way

because that's the big money

[gusty mirage]

ye I remember them melting in mythic

in heroic you breath on them and they disappear

esp if you have a monk in the group

[spice spire]

Yoinking this, thanks

[gusty mirage]

@slow marsh lemme know if you'd like to sue him for stealing your content

I'll do it free

[slow marsh]

Lmao I'll keep it in mind for the next time he slanders me for kemeing night fae so we can double charge him

[spice spire]

Fuck you buddy

@gusty mirage

@slow marsh wombo combo kyrian sin gamer

[hexed frost]

Played on my hunter after two weeks and already feel like i'm inting keys by dying to stupid mechanics

And now i realise the reason i enjoy my rogue so much is because i can be pepega and still doing damage.

Soaked swirlies in mordretha and tredova, aped the balls in mistcaller and even ate a frontal from the skeletal marauders

[gusty mirage]

man you really hate your healers

[magic basin]

how much haste do you need as assa?

for raid

[hexed frost]

shadow step to marauders
tank turns around
proc cheat death
carry on with rotation

bro rogue is soo easy i swear man just press buttons like an ape

[gusty mirage]

however much topgear tells you to equip

don't chase secondaries

just go to raidbots, import your character via armory or simc input, and just topgear your best gear

[subtle tundra]

chillin on marauders
shamn uses earth ele
cheat death proc

[magic basin]

i mean my assa is doing much less dmg then my sub thats why im asking and sims dont tell me anything

just to get mastery

which is not what top players do

[gusty mirage]

link the sim

[hexed frost]

i was playing a 2v2 and this healer popped LoH, sac and WoG on me when i was in heirmir soulbind form

I was howling so loud lmao

[gusty mirage]

any treant cheat deathers in chat?

[frail fossil]

https://tenor.com/view/skillissue-skill-issue-gif-22125481

[keen mantle]

Does assassination plays theotar in raid because of naja bug?

[gusty mirage]

yes, but also for some people theo simmed higher than nadjia anyway

[fading wigeon]

What's the NadiJa bug?

[gusty mirage]

fatal flaw comparing crit % vs vers rating

so it's always giving vers

[fading wigeon]

Damn

[spice spire]

Toxic

[frail fossil]

🤏

[spice spire]

Yeah really unfortunate for our frost gamers

[keen mantle]

also is flageration better now for assassination than dashing? it sims higher for me

[spice spire]

Yeah, the mfd optimization have it a bump

At a certain gear level plus daggers

[keen mantle]

im 254.5 . Obedience felt stronger tbh but if you make a mistake

it punishes a lot dmg wise

thats what i feel like

[spice spire]

Yeah it takes a bit more thought, but it is stronger around there

[hollow river]

Depending on your fight timers obedience can be better as well

If you can get an extra flag cast off

[static rock]

bs ds is the play of guardian right?

[slow marsh]

The general consensus is that obed can be better than dashing for a lot of the fights but dashing doesn't require any change in play so it generally wins just off of ease of use

[gusty mirage]

yeppers

you can play ep/vigor (if non-venthyr) or ep/mfd if venthyr too if you don't feel like switching

but bs/ds will be the play 9/10 times

[static rock]

ep mfd is better with obedience right?

[gusty mirage]

ye and for a lot of people it's better with dashing as well

so I'd sim the two and see

[hollow river]

Remnant orbs reset mfd now?

Iirc

[gusty mirage]

they do

[hollow river]

Bet

[gusty mirage]

refund energy too from ruptures

[hollow river]

Sick

[gusty mirage]

actually one sec

lemme double check that

[slow marsh]

They do

Cuz they die now

[hollow river]

ye they changed it

[slow marsh]

Only thing that's questionable is sbs but that's more cuz it's buggy af and never works when it should

[hollow river]

the example was "that warlocks something or other resets" on their death now

[shell ivy]

do we keep crit or haste for tea now? or was it vers

[gusty mirage]

crit ideally

but haste or vers are fine too

[gusty mirage]

you die now

[slow marsh]

Vers is bad wym

[gusty mirage]

I mean its better than agi

so

how is it bad

lol

[slow marsh]

It's better than agi but still worse than the balanced average

[shell ivy]

i'd guess crit > haste > vers >> agi

[gusty mirage]

am I typing in russian?

hello?

[slow marsh]

If you can't reroll crit or haste then you just have the same luck as me with daggers

[shell ivy]

i think i'd only reroll if i have vers or agi

[gusty mirage]

yeppers

[slow marsh]

Yeah I wouldn't reroll haste ever

Unless you're the type to hit on 18

[gusty mirage]

I rerolled haste on sylv and got crit

gotta chase the odds

[slow marsh]

I'm sure that extra 15 dps still didn't get you into top 5 for the rest of the night too

[spice spire]

Implying big fragger oxi isn’t top dam

[gusty mirage]

ye bro

you right

[slow marsh]

If he actually tried

[spice spire]

Nice

[slow marsh]

69 parse you win

[gusty mirage]

if p1 and p2 damage matter sure you'd be right

I won't touch top 5

[spice spire]

P1 mattering

[gusty mirage]

but I'll take my boss dam all the way home

🙂

[slow marsh]

As it should be

Gamer

[gusty mirage]

just glad people figured out their CD usage

used to be 12%

was kinda yikes

[hollow river]

think im gonna roll theotar for the boost run tn

[gusty mirage]

you should roll theo anyway

because you're a gamer

[hollow river]

i know

just hate rolling tea man

[gusty mirage]

well its either that or 20% vers

so

[hollow river]

vers isn't so bad

[slow marsh]

Yes it is

Just accept the tea party

Embrace it

[hollow river]

thinking about running obe for some fights

fight timers are gonna be so short

fate-kt-sylv run dashing

[gusty mirage]

I forgot I had obe on for the first 3 or 4 of my sale

didn't even notice I didn't have dashing on

lol

[hollow river]

_>

[spice spire]

Wdym short

Just had a 7 minute eye kill

[hollow river]

3-3:30

[spice spire]

Only long timers

[hollow river]

idk i looked at some boost run logs

[spice spire]

Oh heroic?

Yeah that shit is speedy

[hollow river]

saw 1-7 getting downed in less than 4min

[spice spire]

Yeah

Even we did that

[hollow river]

ye

its like ~3:30 for every fight

besides fate-kt-sylv

[spice spire]

Our Druid ramped on the eye p1 didn’t even get to the end of ravenous by the time he phased

And he didn’t get a second one off

[hollow river]

idk if that's how it'll go tn

[spice spire]

[hollow river]

but was thinking about running obe for those

[spice spire]

Try it

No harm for boost runs

[hollow river]

should squeeze an extra cast

[spice spire]

If it’s GIGA bad

You’ll know quick

[gusty mirage]

it will

from my boost:

and it was probably the slowest boost I've been in so far

[slow marsh]

I should get in these boost runs to get gold for next tier

But

[gusty mirage]

payout is nice

310k

[slow marsh]

Idk how to get in

[gusty mirage]

I'll DM you

[slow marsh]

Never done anything like that

[hollow river]

my tea rolled haste

[slow marsh]

K sick

[hollow river]

now i log out til raid

weirdge

[quasi grotto]

at what point does obe become a dps increase?

[slow marsh]

You get used to it

[slow marsh]

If you get an extra cast

[quasi grotto]

isnt it simming higher for people in general too though

[gusty mirage]

sims behind dashing for me

[slow marsh]

Some

[gusty mirage]

but its a small amount

[quasi grotto]

yeah its always a very small amount

like 5-10

[slow marsh]

Obed is better in the later fights if you are using it well

If you're not then stick with dashing

[hollow river]

How so

[winter vapor]

so Threat plates sometimes lags when applying CP . althogu I swear the game just lags/loses them very very occasionally, is plater more reliable in that sense or?

[hollow river]

For combo points?

[winter vapor]

yeah

[hollow river]

Idk but probably

You don’t use a WA pack?

[winter vapor]

i find myself watching the health bar more than the weak aura

[hollow river]

Shows CP below your character

Hmm

Try plater I suppose

Show resources

Etc

[winter vapor]

thanks 🙂

[gusty mirage]

also feel free to check out our very own @limber lion's plater profile, it's pretty great:
https://wago.io/gf0Dg_Ujr

[winter vapor]

tbh, thats the one i was going to use 😄 ty @gusty mirage xi

[gusty mirage]

[hollow river]

Oh I didn’t realize his plates tracked CP

I’ve never used em

[hollow river]

I’m assuming boost runs soak tank adds on fate

[gusty mirage]

depends on the raid lead

most of the time they just tell you to kill the add

[hollow river]

Oh

[gusty mirage]

I don't play CT though

not worth

the adds just melt anyway

[hollow river]

Yeah I was just curious

CT for KT tho ye

And bs/ds for guardmanGe

[gusty mirage]

I just run ep/mfd for everything except guardian

cuz they just send the rogues downstairs anyway

[hollow river]

CT still decent if you go down

Idk how fast everyone’s killing the small stuff though

Probably a lot of padders

[slow marsh]

For heroic you're prolly better off for poison bomb proc on the adds than using ct

For KT

[bleak sky]

don't bother swapping to CT in sales

[gusty mirage]

everyone lookin to giga parse

so like you'll get zero pad

[bleak sky]

shit gets deleted instantly

[gusty mirage]

ye

[slow marsh]

Or just play outlaw

[gusty mirage]

ye those 2 flurry hits HUGE pad

[slow marsh]

KS

I did try a couple pulls as outlaw on KT last night and found out sin is just better

Uncapped CT on zombies is kinda huge

[balmy condor]

zombie damage

padding on prog

[slow marsh]

Not even padding though

[balmy condor]

of course it is

zombie damage is whatever

[slow marsh]

Still top boss dam by a mile

[balmy condor]

?

what does that have to do with zombies

[bleak sky]

just let the pad classes deal with zombies

skellies

[slow marsh]

I'm dropping CT and a couple rupts then funneling back into KT. Not really padding

[bleak sky]

wait

[stray mural]

The timewalking ring was changed to flat damage per swing with no stat budget change, right

[bleak sky]

can you guys not cc the skellies while kt is alive?

[balmy condor]

A COUPLE RUPTS

[slow marsh]

For energy regens I swear

[balmy condor]

that implies more than 1 rupture

[timid cloud]

RUPTURES INTO WHAT????

[slow marsh]

Literally a garrote and two ruptures so I have 5 bleeds to funnel into KT

[bleak sky]

I know I'm never fixing kt parses

[slow marsh]

With shiv

[timid cloud]

I have to hold otherwise we wipe.

[balmy condor]

no shot those zombies live long enough for you to funnel with 5 bleeds

[timid cloud]

So same.

[slow marsh]

They do

[timid cloud]

Pardon???

[slow marsh]

You underestimate how bad my guild is

[balmy condor]

then your ranged dps are actual bonobo monkeys

[bleak sky]

do you guys not run ele sham/havoc dh/ww/anything better than a rogue to kill skellies?

[slow marsh]

They are

Actually

[timid cloud]

No Hunters? No Chickens?

[stray mural]

So many red names

[bleak sky]

welcome yellow

[balmy condor]

I had to ask them to kill it SLOWER so I could funnel dude

[bleak sky]

dirty sub player smh

[spice spire]

“Those adds are mine I’ve planted my flag”

Give me the funnel

[bleak sky]

just mfd the little guys

and snipe off resets

[slow marsh]

I mean I get to stay upstairs while sub rogue goes down so

[bleak sky]

mfd ice spikes, mfd tank adds, mfd skellies

[slow marsh]

If you want to call me unethical then go ahead

[gusty mirage]

[slow marsh]

I didn't even ask

[spice spire]

In what world

???

[timid cloud]

What????

Now THAT is wild.

[stray mural]

They send the funnel guy downstairs over the single target guy

That’s hilarious

[spice spire]

Give me ur gms info

Finna flame

[bleak sky]

but THE BURST

[timid cloud]

We must have words.

[balmy condor]

I've seen some shit

[bleak sky]

something something sub holding dances + shb to go down

[spice spire]

I remember your heroic prog Whispyr

Holding CDs very fun gameplay

Very cool!

[timid cloud]

Sheeesh.

[gusty mirage]

ye blades FAT damn

[spice spire]

Nah he held them all

It was painful

[stray mural]

Yeah but we have damage too I don’t get it

[timid cloud]

I DONT WANT TO STOP DAMAGE, I WANT TO DEAL DAMAGE -Pilav 2021

[balmy condor]

that was early mythic prog

[bleak sky]

iceblades are you an alliance gamer?

[slow marsh]

My guild strats are beyond saving that's why I'm leaving

Yes

[timid cloud]

Oh. Figures.

[bleak sky]

no raiderio info on the kt pulls sadge

[slow marsh]

Vitamin gg on wcl

[bleak sky]

pog

[slow marsh]

No shame in my game

[bleak sky]

sir this is not assassin

[gusty mirage]

I mean you do what youre told to do

but your RL kinda sus

[timid cloud]

TRAITOR

[stray mural]

Part of me wishes I actually tried this tier so I could experience the jokes happening

[timid cloud]

[bleak sky]

can the shamans not play ele, ice?

[slow marsh]

I told you I played outlaw for a few pulls

Then went back

[timid cloud]

Lol

[slow marsh]

No they dont

[bleak sky]

f

[slow marsh]

Poxxon plays some ele but he's no good

[spice spire]

Upon further review this has been deemed a lie

[slow marsh]

I have nothing to be ashamed of sir

[spice spire]

Outlaw on prog

[timid cloud]

[spice spire]

[slow marsh]

Sometimes you just have to find out something is bad before realizing it's bad

[bleak sky]

is mass root the only way to cc the skellies?

[slow marsh]

Ring

[bleak sky]

no

permanent

"permanent"

[spice spire]

Oh uh

[timid cloud]

Ring of ice?

[spice spire]

Probably ring yeah

[timid cloud]

Uhhh

[spice spire]

Nine seconds

[timid cloud]

Binding I think.

[slow marsh]

I mean mass and binding would be long enough right

[timid cloud]

That’s all I can think of. Maybe grips.

Yeah for most.

[bleak sky]

idk you gotta phase the boss while they're ccd

[spice spire]

Oh grabby hands

[timid cloud]

But if they are living THAT long.

[spice spire]

Are good if they’re not targeted

[timid cloud]

Grabby hands is bad because they’ll insta explode on you unless you don’t get targeted.

We had that issue.

We kept having to get a leg sweepy for them.

[gusty mirage]

okay first off

stop bullying iceblades

that's my job

[timid cloud]

Idk if those lil boys should live for that long, no cap.

[gusty mirage]

second, run away as far as you can from that guild and never look back @slow marsh

[timid cloud]

LOL

[slow marsh]

I'm trying

[bleak sky]

some of his guildies are trolling it seems

[timid cloud]

Love yourself.

[gusty mirage]

SOME?

HIS RL SENT THE SUB ROGUE DOWNSTAIRS AND KEPT THE SIN ROGUE UPSTAIRS

SOME?

[timid cloud]

That’s the biggest understantement of the year.

[bleak sky]

oxi im tryna be polite here ok

[gusty mirage]

his RL is an actual baboon

[timid cloud]

[gusty mirage]

[bleak sky]

kekkw

[hollow river]

so let the sin rogue pArSEE

[gusty mirage]

on WHAT

[bleak sky]

the DH playing venthyr on prog and doing shit boss damage doesn't help either

[gusty mirage]

your negative dps in aoe?

[slow marsh]

RL is tank btw and first tier raid leading

[hollow river]

or is it prog?

[slow marsh]

It's prog

[hollow river]

o

THATS BAD

[timid cloud]

Hey, CT can give you fat shards into KT.

[gusty mirage]

just switch horde and take my spot

[timid cloud]

Okay????

[slow marsh]

The leadership just doesn't listen to anyone who has a different opinion

[bleak sky]

that's bad

[gusty mirage]

I'll give you a vouch

[hollow river]

oh that opening you spoke of

[timid cloud]

[hollow river]

sadge

[gusty mirage]

nah havoc dh bouncing

[timid cloud]

That is CRINGE

[gusty mirage]

can make it two spots

[bleak sky]

take my place on my guild, I'm get bullied because of my sylv dps

[hollow river]

[timid cloud]

[slow marsh]

We just had two people leave, if I leave there is actually 0% chance they kill sylv. Down from 30%

[gusty mirage]

I just want a rogue friend

[slow marsh]

If you stay I'll come

[spice spire]

????

[gusty mirage]

don't even

start

[bleak sky]

playing 2 rogues on the same raid feels pretty good

[slow marsh]

I want a rogue friend too

[gusty mirage]

quake absolutely hates me

he just pretends to like me

[bleak sky]

gives you that "I GOTTA BEAT THAT FUCKER" feeling

[spice spire]

Nah oxi openly flaming me rn

[slow marsh]

Yeah that's how I felt at the start of the tier with our rogue

[bleak sky]

deserved tho

[spice spire]

??????

[gusty mirage]

how did I flame you

[bleak sky]

¿¿¿¿¿¿

[gusty mirage]

you've ran 2 whole keys with me

and one was on your janky DH

with the worst 17 necrotic wake I've ever ran

[spice spire]

Chopped liver

[gusty mirage]

and I've ran with some actual potatoes

like the people behind the keyboard were literal potatoes

russet too

not even red skin or golden yukon

[timid cloud]

Master Poisoner Oxi.

Toxic

[gusty mirage]

nah nah @spice spire can attest

that wake was a troll

[spice spire]

100%

[hollow river]

[gusty mirage]

I don't think I've failed a fortified wake since season 1

[spice spire]

One of the worst keys I’ve ever done

[gusty mirage]

but sure enough

the route made less sense than uncapping ww monk

[bleak sky]

bricking a nw feels BAD

[timid cloud]

How do you even do that...

[spice spire]

No kyrian

[gusty mirage]

idk why does the tank take 20s to pull every pack

healer sitting at 100% mana

[spice spire]

Route was overthought and janky

[gusty mirage]

me and quake crying to each other in whispers

[timid cloud]

Cringe & weird...

[gusty mirage]

just sitting there

afk

[spice spire]

Nah he was learning tanking again

[gusty mirage]

yeah you run in and taunt

[spice spire]

It was really trying to be too cute

[gusty mirage]

super difficult

[spice spire]

Because no Kyrian

Just do normal pulls but slightly smaller

[timid cloud]

[spice spire]

And it’s free

[bleak sky]

nw with no kyrian is kinda cringe ngl

[gusty mirage]

utilized orb on double marauder & necromancer pack

then used 2nd orb on 2nd boss

fortified week btw

spear + orb on 2nd boss

in a 17

[timid cloud]

What in the fuck...

Anyways, we digress.

What’s going on in this KT @slow marsh ?

[slow marsh]

You tell me

[timid cloud]

It’s a lot of information to unpack.

[slow marsh]

Ikr

Tldr I'm looking for a new guild

[hollow river]

[plucky briar]

Is the shield from the frost shard or bonus set bugged?

[bleak sky]

Yep

Frost rime, the shield from crit frost shard, simply does not work.

[plucky briar]

Which one. Sorry i dont know which is which

[balmy condor]

shield on crit

[golden basalt]

doesn’t deal damage

doesn’t matter

[fathom lynx]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[glad siren]

i just wanted to come in and admit that i was wrong about mfd .... tyvm for that tip it's great 🙂

[hollow river]

it's the shield from the shard, but it's only bugged when using the set it seems.

[arctic hare]

Finally, got the gear needed to have Tarnished Insignia to sim better

[plucky briar]

yea I just wanted to know if I should even put that shard of kyr on in m+

[hollow river]

It should be fine in m+ I think because your set bonus isn’t active

Try it in a dungeon and check for frostrime on your healing done

[charred wraith]

nah, it still doesnt work i think if you have 3 frost shards equipped

ramfam reported it 1,5 weeks ago or something

[spark scaffold]

Hey guys, is a 246 sylv dagger still worth playing on mythic sylvanas over a 246 with stats from m+ ?

Or is there any way to sim that?

[spice spire]

Yeah you just add the other dagger to sims

[charred wraith]

there is, tho this sim wont tell you exactly the solution, bc p1 dmg while being needed, becomes pretty irrelevant couple hours into prog

[spice spire]

Ohhh I see the question

[charred wraith]

so technically you get the highest uptime at 2 stacks of the debuff, when the dmg matters

[spark scaffold]

Yeah, hence my question

Is 2 stacks enough to warrant dropping the stats from another 246 / 252 dagger

[spice spire]

As assassination, the experience has been the 252 dagger has been better. Across all content; that would be flushed out with her only reaching 2 stacks

[charred wraith]

enemy_death_pct=50
or
enemy_death_pct=45
to be exactly precise

[spice spire]

I would THINK the normal 246 would be better given that parameter as well

But change it to 45

[charred wraith]

idk tho how to set the 80% starter health

[gusty mirage]

enemy_initial_health_percentage=80

[charred wraith]

thanks!

[gusty mirage]

[spark scaffold]

And where would you put that?

enemy_initial_health_percentage=80

[gusty mirage]

top of the sim in advanced sim

@balmy condor can I confirm this?

[balmy condor]

Yeh that works

Expert mode works too

[balmy condor]

This doesn’t work btw

But the evaluation of sylv daggers is essentially equal to a normal patchwerk fight

If it’s really really close, then don’t use it

But it’s safe to assume the same results within about 0.3-0.4%

[spark scaffold]

How is that possible considering you're missing out on the part that works best for the daggers?

[charred wraith]

?

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gQ4w5ZmrxBTd3KApSDJYFD
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wdUJ2KwvQb2tt5Trw1F9wK

[balmy condor]

Because the daggers aren’t 10% dps Upgrades and the execute on them isn’t some magically 50x dps increase

0.4% is pretty big for just one offhand

[balmy condor]

I’m on mobile what are these sims

[charred wraith]

one with enemy_death_pct=50

[gusty mirage]

5min patchwerk, one with 50% death and one normal

[charred wraith]

one without

why doesnt it work?

there is a clear difference in banshees blight dmg % from overall

[balmy condor]

Cause it legit stops casting between the eyes halfway through

[charred wraith]

and why it does that

[balmy condor]

Because enemy_death_pct=50 has janky interactions with various APLs that include time to die lines

And that’s a problem in simc core

[charred wraith]

oh, didnt know, sorry for misinformation then

[spark scaffold]

So its hard to actually sim which dagger is better

That being said would you recommend still using a 246 sylv dagger or just going for normal ones?

[balmy condor]

Sylv

[balmy condor]

It’s impossible without editing the APL actually

The alternative would be to do a fixed health thing

Which I tried to do as well

But fixed health also has its own bugs and issues

Like bek being active the whole time, and other threshold type effects not functioning properly

[spark scaffold]

I see, thank you for the insight

[balmy condor]

Np

[spark scaffold]

Out of curiosity what shard do you use instead of bek on the sylv fight? 😄

[balmy condor]

You still use bek

You can make an argument for zed but it doesn’t seem to be much different

On heroic where it actually doesn’t provide any benefit, you’d probably run zed

But zed is such a small dps increase

[spark scaffold]

I use oth but its just personal preference at that point isn't it?

[balmy condor]

That it’s functionally just a utility slot

Well zed does SOME damage

It’s just very little

Really the options would be jas, oth, zed, bek

The last 2 do some damage, but not a ton

Bek at least works on adds

Which can help in p2

[keen mantle]

why all top assassination rogue logs are with dashing while obidience is better for bis gear ?

[slow marsh]

cuz top logs don't mean a whole lot

[clever kindle]

I don't think that's accurate to say, that's real data

Sims don't mean a lot when they don't translate to real world

[slow marsh]

look at how many externals the top logs have

[clever kindle]

Or more realistically the sim scenario you're trying isn't exactly accurate to the fight, or the application might be slightly different then the sim works

When you're saying top logs, no one looking at actual data is looking at logs with 10 PI's

[slow marsh]

but the long answer is that obedience is better when you can get at least 1 extra cast off. most top logs are short kill times so dashing wins out in shorter fight

the difference is pretty minimal and my general rule of thumb is that if you have to ask then probs just stick with dashing for ease of use

[kind talon]

The best players just aren’t using obedience

It might be better, it’s just not being used

[slow marsh]

i mean why would you when its a small gain at a moderate risk

[kind talon]

Yeah exactly

It’s not consistent

[slow marsh]

im glad we have logs and sims but sometimes i dislike the nuance that is having to interpret what they actually mean

cuz to me it's super easy but for newer people to specs and such it can be misleading sometimes

[clever kindle]

Just use what feels best and fits the role you are playing in your raid

[kind talon]

There is no feels best

Just use leggo that do damage kill boss

[slow marsh]

Like I said, if you have to ask just use dashing cuz you can't mess it up

[clever kindle]

You can min max dashing but its minor

at best

just becomes another bar to watch

[slow marsh]

the only minmaxing on dashing is maintaining envenom uptime which you should already try for so its not really minmaxing for dashing specifically

[oak sky]

@toxic quail o/

[toxic quail]

YO

its me!

[hollow river]

[balmy condor]

The only one

[oak sky]

@toxic quail rats that dont have cutscene

😔

[toxic quail]

Cutscene BIS dude.

[oak sky]

fr

[strange python]

is there a reason why my sin sims much lower than my sub

like at least 800 dps

but i heard sin better for prog

[oak sky]

could be gear stats

could be sylv daggers being stronger for sub

[strange python]

probably

[oak sky]

but sin generally has a little bit of a lower cap than sub rn

[strange python]

yeah io got double heroic slyv daggers

i also have r5 everything

[plain onyx]

Guys, during raid i usually smash buttons continuously to keep up the rotation, but sometimes I feel there's a **gap **between spells. Checked out the forums and heard about something called "SpellQueue Window" or "Lag Tolerance". It says that it should be set around your latency. Didn't change it yet, just wondering if anyone has tried it before ?

[vestal wren]

any source that states to set it around your latency is not trustworthy

all spell queue does is to allow you to queue a spell up in advanced so that you can cast spells back to back

people often like to turn it down to somewhere around 200 esp. if they have a low gcd like on outlaw during ar or on other classes that have their gcd scaled with haste

if you have those gaps, its possible that you or a addon did set it to a low value

[plain onyx]

So i should be leaving it as the default "400" ?

[vestal wren]

/console SpellQueueWindow X - replace the x with the value you want

something around 200+ is best

[plain onyx]

👍 thanks a lot, I'll try what suits me the best

[vestal wren]

default was 250 iirc in earlier xpacs and then changed to 400

setting a lower value just means you can't queue up spells further in advanced

400 means 0.4 sec in advanced

there is still some lag from hardware imput, syncronisation, network latency, ....
this is why f.ex. #outlaw players can have the problem of double casts during ar

what basically happens is people sending spell inputs longer than anticipated and end up adding a spell to the queue
(with the default setting you have 50% of your global cooldown covered by the spell queue window during adrenalin rush)

[plain onyx]

kinda confusing, i will try setting it around 200+ and try. Thanks a lot for the help

[vestal wren]

people overthink it

[hollow river]

Are you sure that’s not just being energy starved? As assa there should be a little downtime in your rotation, and energy pooling etc before envenoms.

[sonic schooner]

I though spellQ was a thing only for minimax pvp :d

[hollow river]

Nah some people change it for PvE as well. Just not something that’s usually going to be necessary on assa rogue

[small basin]

do you still finish at 4-5 in aoe with FoK? or just 5

[normal mist]

Isn't it a waste to FoK if you already at 4?

We probably better to just finish at 4 than wasting potentially 3/4 cps (with crits)

[small basin]

yeah true

[spice spire]

You absolutely finish at 4 with fok. Obviously assuming you’re not running deeper

[golden basalt]

id think even if you are running DS in this cenario that throwing out a 4cp rupture is better than wasting the potential CP

[strange python]

Is the Nadja bugg already fixed?

[limber lion]

We'll update pins whenever stuff gets fixed

[strange python]

Thank you a lot @limber lion

[elfin chasm]

can i get some 10k dps sims if u guys have

is sth wrong with my rotation, i'm supposed to get like 7-8k dps :3

[wary ice]

A log would help a lot more than a screenshot wrt identifying rotational issues

[clever kindle]

Your dps also isn't going to be accurate there because your shards aren't active

So that's about 15-20% of your damage

[lavish lichen]

And a sim is THOUSANDS of iterations anyway

You’re also missing enchants on your btw

[elfin chasm]

yea, trying to simm with all rings

am a sub player, tryin to transition slowly into sin

[lavish lichen]

Get a guardian log or something

Will be much easier to give advice based on that

[elfin chasm]

ah ok

[lavish lichen]

And check out the #assassination-faq if you haven’t already there are tips in there you might find useful

[elfin chasm]

ty, erm, so i cant find my log, but i have a good sin player log

what should i look out for in that log

[normal mist]

I guess uptime of garotte/rupture(ideal is 100%), if you missed any casts of vendetta/flag (if venthyr), shiv usage

I believe that's the general idea

Wasted cps aswell

Those from seal of fate are kinda hard to control, but mutilates/garrotes overcapping ain't that good

[elfin chasm]

What i do is i mutilate, if 3/4cp, i do a fan of knives and envenom, pool for shivs, garrote/rupture 100% uptime

only use envenom at 5 cp

is it wrong to pool for envenom?

or just spam mutilate

[ocean drum]

you wouldn't use a builder for 5 cp when at 4, would you? o.O

except for garrote tho?

[grand ridge]

I think you want to envenom and rupture at 4

[normal mist]

4/5

[grand ridge]

Only fok with 3 ttargets

[normal mist]

No FoK never in single target

[elfin chasm]

so u'll mutilate at 3cp ? @_@

[normal mist]

Yes

[grand ridge]

Mutilate is a big part of your damage too. If you are at 3 and you go over on cp that is better than wasting energy on fok on one target

[normal mist]

Exactly

[elfin chasm]

so ur at 20% flag, and ur at 3cp, flag is about to end in 1 sec, do u envenom at 3 cp or go full envenom 😄

last question tho

and what is normal flag for sin

[normal mist]

I usually get 20 to 25 if lucky stacks

But usually 20

And I have high CRIT %

I should pool more for flag :(

[elfin chasm]

😦

my shards are still at desolate, so, i cant sin yet i guess

raid dps only like 7-8k

everyone at 10k constant

[normal mist]

Don't compare yourself at other DPSs dude, just focus on learning. Keep upgrading those blue shards and your DPS will skyrocket

[small basin]

isn't it 4?

[elfin chasm]

does the crits of, phial ... banshees flight... serrated bone spike, flag count for dashing frost explosion

is it sth like, if phial crits for 500 , it gets absorbed for the explosion? or sth like envenom does 10000 dmg, 13% = sth around like 1000 gets absorbed for explosion

[quasi ledge]

There's a max amount stored from each crit, it's a couple hundred I think

[subtle gyro]

750 at r5?

[quasi ledge]

Can't remember, never really looked. Pretty sure it's not over 1k though

[clever kindle]

With the frost set active it's like 2500

or something like that

[gusty mirage]

Slight correction, fok 4+. You only fok at 3 to reapply poisons if necessary

[grand ridge]

Oh okay. Does that change with poison katar

I thought there was some situation where you did fok at 3

[gusty mirage]

That’s a good question, I’m not entirely sure tbh. I know PK isn’t super game changing but maybe a 252 empowered one could even it out

@marble hemlock do you know if a high ilvl empowered katar would make it worth using fok on 3+ instead of 4+?

[marble hemlock]

no idea

[gusty mirage]

Looks like I found a good distraction from work

[gusty mirage]

Whispyr just confirmed that the conduit won’t change the rule on fok 4+

[marble hemlock]

i fok at 3+ when i already have CP

i.e. 3target, first mut gave 3cp

then i fok

cuz you usually still starve energy on 3t

[gusty mirage]

Ye I do too

Have you played around with mfd at all seli?

[marble hemlock]

no

fuck mfd

[gusty mirage]

I’ve tried both and tbh besides getting a free rupture in the opener it’s kind of meh

[marble hemlock]

literally saves 1gcd

each pull

and sniping low hp targets is int

[gusty mirage]

Useful if you can get a ton of resets but besides that

[small basin]

isn't it better with obediance in keys?

[grand ridge]

Thanks for the tip

[bleak sky]

no

[gusty mirage]

But even with resets it feels meh

Tbh

[marble hemlock]

you get full stacks on aoe anyway

[small basin]

idk mfd feels super smooth on assa

[gusty mirage]

Yea

[small basin]

i like it

[grand ridge]

Kinda reminds me of cold blood

[small basin]

but im so used to playing it from arena so its probs that

[marble hemlock]

basically its a crutch you should never need in m+

and sniping low hp targets is the worst thing you can do

on trash

[small basin]

idk how it's a crutch lol

[grand ridge]

There's a lot of stuff going on and assa aoe is a lot of juggling already I agree

Basically

[small basin]

think vigor is easier to play

[grand ridge]

I'm too dumb for mfd in m+

Is what I'm saying

[marble hemlock]

its a crutch in the sense that its a "free" finisher to set up your sustain better. but its not needed

[grand ridge]

Look at all these festive Santa hat pfps

This is great

[small basin]

only thing i dont like about mfd is you dont have the energy for 4 garotte in a row

when opening

[marble hemlock]

and thats why vigor is good

its not the regen

[gusty mirage]

Yeah in aoe the extra envenom/rupture/ct you get out of it doesn’t really do much

[marble hemlock]

its the max energy increase

[small basin]

yea

[gusty mirage]

Like it’s nice to go in and get the regen jump started but imo it feels kinda unnecessary

[grand ridge]

Oh that's a good point

[gusty mirage]

As seli said the extra gcd is whatever

[grand ridge]

Extra energy good for getting all those garrotes off too

[marble hemlock]

in terms of dps efficiency you still wanna triple garrote into CT as your first 4 GCDs

so youd mfd+rup as 5th

instead of fok

which might not even be good

as thta delays poison application even more

[small basin]

ah ok, you dont 4 garotte then?

[marble hemlock]

no

[small basin]

just the 3 empowered

[grand ridge]

I think you 3

Ye

[gusty mirage]

Yeah the first few seconds of a pull with mfd are miserable

[marble hemlock]

you could triple garrote ct mfd rup and still have only 1-2 poisons up

with lowered max energy

and then youd suddenly starve energy for 2-3 gcds before you get it all up

[balmy condor]

3cp ct

[marble hemlock]

you hold cp

from previous pull

mr sub rogue

[bleak sky]

dirty sub rogue

[balmy condor]

Just garrote 4x

[bleak sky]

smh

[marble hemlock]

[small basin]

but if you dont have slice, you slice first right

so 3 garrotte slice

[balmy condor]

Or 3x gar fok

[grand ridge]

I'd 3cp the rupture over the ct

[balmy condor]

Yeh

[marble hemlock]

i dont snd until after ct is up

[grand ridge]

Or that

[small basin]

still dunno if i prefer venthyr obe or necro with zoldyck for keys

[bleak sky]

venthyr obe feels pretty damn good

[marble hemlock]

from the little i played venthyr rn

id say

venthyr obe on tyra

if youre playing with meta classes like mage/warr/monk

that melt entire packs in 20seconds

forti id say venthyr or necro zoldyck

depends a bit on key

probably venthyr in high downtime keys like spires

and necro in low targetcount dungeons like top

or whatever you need for dungeonbuffs

but venth zoldyck didnt feel good at all this week

obe is also smoother to play in terms of cd management on tyra keys where you generally want 2 vendettas on boss and line it up with flag, which is incredibly awkward to do with 90sec flag cd

add zoldyck to that and you kinda delay CDs so much that youre losing out on uses overall

and end bossfights with both vend+flag being on high CD still, so you wont have it for next pack either. its just all around awkward to play around the CDs on tyra with zoldyck

less of an issue with necro, but i dont think necro is the play on tyra unless its pf/top

[small basin]

yeah i liked venthyr obe for tyran

[viscid spear]

Is Opulence soloable in LFR yet? I really want the black crown.

[viscid spear]

Where y'all at

[balmy condor]

Up your butthole

[hexed frost]

It's been 3 days since I've returned to office and I've done only 5 keys this reset. I want some motivation juice badly

I'm just tired after coming home and will just do korthia and sleep

[viscid spear]

Thought it felt itchy

[bleak sky]

join key
2 out of 3 times this happens

why are we discriminated against fellas

[small basin]

what key level

[bleak sky]

23, not that high

[subtle tundra]

only happened twice for me

[small basin]

no one ever commented on assa if iplay it

personally

[potent raft]

what was the simc command (raidbots) where the target is always at full health?
(and no target dummy disables raid buffs)

[viscid spear]

"No, I'm Assassination."

[bleak sky]

but you're big number gamer

[balmy condor]

enemy_fixed_health_percentage=100

What are we testing

[potent raft]

sylvanas

thanks 🙂

[balmy condor]

That doesn’t sound ideal

[potent raft]

i want to take out the execute component of Blindside when simming talents

[balmy condor]

Oh

You definitely don’t play blindside on sylv

[potent raft]

wouldnt i? if it sims best on ST full-health

[balmy condor]

Last I saw it doesn’t, and you still wouldn’t, no

[gusty adder]

Do I reroll agi theotar food for crit/haste?

[bleak sky]

probably

but sim it

What Party Favors Tea to use?
Versatility is usually your best choice but all of them are very close.
You can sim it for yourself by putting your /simc in advanced sim and paste the following below it:
profileset."primary"+="shadowlands.party_favor_type=primary"
profileset."versatility"+="shadowlands.party_favor_type=versatility"
profileset."crit"+="shadowlands.party_favor_type=crit"
profileset."haste"+="shadowlands.party_favor_type=haste"
Note: Keep in mind that you lose the buffs if you switch to a different soulbind.

from the sub faq

[gusty adder]

oh ty

[keen mantle]

do we know whats the highest assassination rogue sim?

[oak sky]

sub is different than sin

crit is our best tea haste is 2nd

can sim to check

[slow marsh]

In faq. 12.1ish

[keen mantle]

yes but i cant see the gear equipped

its out of date or sth

[slow marsh]

I mean it's 2 months old but it's not any different now

[steel sage]

I have a very odd question and it doesnt have to be answered it's just been bugging me. My 2 buddies play Sin and one's winds of winter was doing like alot more dps than the other. They both had correct soulbinds/conduits both geared similarly and supposedly the sets were the same gem lvls. They even looked at their boss uptime and it was about the same. Only diff was the lower one was veny and the upper was necro. Any ideas why winds was so much lower for the veny?

[clever kindle]

Because Necro has more damage sources to feed into Winds

Serrated bone spike dot tick

One of the other things I think will affect it is going to be your pot/oil choices. Maybe this part is more feelcraft but using shadowcore oil and the according potion adds additional damage sources for Winds to pull crit damage from

[steel sage]

i think they both used the oil so prob just the necro ability then! thank you so much!

[clever kindle]

I noticed that when our other sin rogue was running venthyr that my winds damage was a lot higher so had wondered the same thing, when I broke it down that was our primary differences, no problem

[bleak sky]

yea mb forgot to remove the "vers is our best stat" part of the copypaste

[limber lion]

That's incorrect. Shadowcore Oil is whitelisted on Winds

Agi pot is the superior choice

Venthyr should be doing more damage with winds, except maybe in aoe encounters.

[balmy condor]

oil crits counts for winds

at least that's what I thought it did

let me double check

[potent raft]

it doesn't look like i can override raidbots' setting for target.
running this in the advanced sim
https://paste.gg/p/anonymous/8780ea3168274e18854529fd74aefcfc
gets the same results as top gear /w patchwerk as target

[balmy condor]

doesn't look like you made an enemy

[potent raft]

correct

[balmy condor]

😛 well that makes it difficult doesn't it

[potent raft]

indeed. i'll try to get a true input from raidbots including the target.

[balmy condor]

it does

[potent raft]

the question then is, do you go double oil

[balmy condor]

definitely the fuck not

oils aren't worth

[glass tulip]

so shadowcore + sharpening stone?

strange

[balmy condor]

double stone

[viscid spear]

Need a pair of stones to do big damage; it's simple.

[kind talon]

true

bigly damage

[slow marsh]

Yeet skeet

Double stone agi pot gang

[alpine latch]

Ugh ...

I might have to tank next tier

Kill me now @slow marsh

[kind talon]

what would u play @alpine latch

[alpine latch]

IDK .. Maybe Pally? They are solid in keys. I always like having a pally tank as a rogue because I can just dump damage off the pull and I fuck up they cover my mistakes

If Rogue had a tank spec like in Rift I'd play the shit out of it

[slow marsh]

rip palmer rogue

[alpine latch]

I'll still have my rogue

But our tank situation in the guild is dire

We either lose me, the top DPS

Or we deal with a sub-par tank that has shown zero growth in weeks

[slow marsh]

move on to new guild not an option?

[alpine latch]

If I left them I'd just quit the game altogether

[slow marsh]

i see

[alpine latch]

My two best friends are here. If I leave I'd just play something else

[slow marsh]

That makes sense

If it were me i'd just tell them that I could tank temporarily as long as they looked for a new tank to take over

[alpine latch]

Our MT just stepped down after being our MT since Wrath

As Alliance, it's not been easy finding someone competent to take their place

[slow marsh]

Understandable

I never truely understood the ally struggle until this tier

[alpine latch]

It's pretty fucking awful

Especially if you're not on Stormrage/Sargeras/Proudmoore

[slow marsh]

I'm on proudmoore and it's still pretty bad

[regal cape]

Stormrage recruitment is also kinda yikes right now

[alpine latch]

I assume it's awful on all accounts

I log into my Horde rogue and there's like 400 keys up

There are nights on my Alliance there's 3 15s up

[hollow river]

wow

that sounds pretty rough

and i thought Horde recruitment was rough

[alpine latch]

When we were trying to get our Shaman her Changling there was a night where there wasn't a single Mists up of any level for like 20 minutes.

Not sure how it is now. We have our push team mostly locked in at this point

[regal cape]

I assume all recruitment is rough just cause of patch fatigue. But horde is always wayyyy more active in pug m+

[alpine latch]

The funny thing is the raid has only been out like 4 months

And it's been shit for recruitment for more than 2

[regal cape]

We have like 100 pulls on mythic sylv as 19 man

And we've canceled like 5-6 nights in total since starting her cause of recruitment/attendance

[alpine latch]

We have had a CE guild that has been running with us on heroics to dick around on alts, and they just asked if I'd be willing to be a backup on Mythic for them.

I'm beyond excited

[regal cape]

We are getting to 3rd platform in p3 now that we have a 20th

[alpine latch]

I gave up CE to come back to Alliance and play with my friends

[regal cape]

So hopefully it dies before Thanksgiving :)

[alpine latch]

Hell yeah, good luck!

[hollow river]

in the same boat rn

[spark scaffold]

Must be doing smth wrong I always get 25-27 depending on crit RNG

28 is perfect RNG 25 bad RNG usually

[obsidian aurora]

Any sims on double leggo?

[dense hamlet]

no point theres going to be tier sets and new soulbinds

[hollow river]

No new soulbinds

[dense hamlet]

i mean no updates yet

or is there no new ones

oh i meant like

the extended tree

or whatever u call it

[hollow river]

No new ones, confirmed

[dense hamlet]

well

[hollow river]

Yep

Leaves the crowd favorite, Night Fae, in a rough spot

[dense hamlet]

idk abt the first part

[normal mist]

MFD?

[spark scaffold]

Nope

[normal mist]

then i have no idea on how u do it lol

im 46% crit, always 5cp before flag

and yet i usually get 20-23?

imma pull sylv rn and watch carefully how many i get with BL and all

[spark scaffold]

Do you do vendetta after flag

And do you do vanish mt envenom mut

[normal mist]

i did 28

on pull

[spark scaffold]

Some logs would be nice if you want some help

[normal mist]

and 23 first burn phase

unlucky crits

on p2

i usually do: