i mean with all the talk happening right now surely they will tune cov leggos or release new options
#assassination
slow marsh
umbral rapids
hopefully
small basin
i mean with all the talk happening right now surely they will tune cov leggos or...
haha
slow marsh
wtb ptr obedience
small basin
this is blizz
fleet anchor
Rogues losing daggers and frost set though so tuning will be totally random
Opening up leggo combos throws an insane monkey wrench in tuning
Plus set bonuses
gloomy knoll
tier sets also will decide a fuck ton
fleet anchor
We have no idea
fleet whale
blizz wants to bring back legion
fleet whale
but with tier sets, double leggos, covenants, soulbinds etc
umbral rapids
yes 
fleet whale
i am nervous we may get another legion to bfa situation
bleak sky
obe + zoldycks in keys 
hexed frost
Vendetta will be made a flat out damage buff instead of a single target debuff.
Screenshot this
hexed frost
never gonna happen
No
slow marsh
I heard Rogues were getting utility. 🤔
smoke screen is on rng poison bomb proc
2 p tier set
inland hull
What would a rogue utility even be? A raid buff increasing nature damage? Seems like with lack of utility should come personal throughput.
fleet whale
if we get utility for tier bonuses then that woudl be lame
rogues had decent utility pre legion
gloomy knoll
What would a rogue utility even be? A raid buff increasing nature damage? Seems ...
smoke bomb
a raid dr
limber lion
crit chance for everyone :)
slow marsh
darkness 2.0
spice spire
crit chance for everyone :)
Wasn’t that in cata?
gloomy knoll
5%
slow marsh
5 is too much like it was in bc with hutners
frosty bridge
Trying to convince the guild to give you PI like
limber lion
Wasn’t that in cata?
5% crit for Sub rogues yeah, among many other things
limber lion
How do i sim with PI?
You just add the power infusion line in the footer in Expert Mode when simming Top Gear
Or by simming in advanced
slow marsh
it would probs be a bit lower
limber lion
external_buffs.power_infusion=3/123/243 are generally decent timers for Assa
slow marsh
since obed cdr works past 30
limber lion
But you can change them for your needs
gloomy knoll
45 second sin dream 
bleak sun
Wasnt feral druid back in wod that gave 5% crit with aspect of pack ?
limber lion
Yes
slow marsh
45 second sin dream <:copium:854628182104080414>
pin it
inland hull
Pickpocket boss for a raid buff increasing crit chance
dawn ivy
@slow marsh genuinely curious how you think sin is going to get that much cdr off flag
slow marsh
scaling duh
fleet whale
just press your buttons faster
dawn ivy
i feel like sin is pretty hard locked into get 22-29 stacks in 99% of ST situations
fleet whale
that's all you need to do
dawn ivy
think ive gotten 30 stacks one time on guardian with blindside/DS and it was a god pull
drifting cloud
fleet whale
just have all your mutilates crit during flag
fleet whale
yeah like RNG is gonna screw you up sometimes
getting 30 stacks all the time means luck is on your side
dawn ivy
not to say dust/obedience doesnt sound interesting
doubt it would be worth, but would be a funy damage profile
fleet whale
it's gonna end up being doomblade/obedience i bet
dawn ivy
would fuck with our shiv timings a lil
humble ginkgo
external_buffs.power_infusion=3/123/243 are generally decent timers for Assa
Kk ty
humble ginkgo
external_buffs.power_infusion=3/123/243 are generally decent timers for Assa
Is this just vend cd?
limber lion
Power Infusion cd
limber lion
Not necessarily
humble ginkgo
Hmm ok
limber lion
the apl might sync flag + vend
You would have to customize the apl much more to get to sync the external buffs with your cooldowns
dawn ivy
im going to dance around the word because i promise im not feelcrafting, but is there a rough linear line of how much energy we end up spending every tier
or maybe a better question is how our apm goes up every tier
dawn ivy
yeh :S
dawn ivy
84% haste dream
slow marsh
you can just sim dustwalker right now and see what the timings are
it will sync with flag and then cast another
fleet whale
but i'll say it will hover around 55 ish apm for 9.2
fleet whale
in a ST situation
slow marsh
which i assume changes next
dawn ivy
yeah it will roughly be 1 minute if you go dusk/obed for sure
slow marsh
we can sync to 1min guaranteed
dawn ivy
just wondering how it will realistically line up
spice spire
There’s so many ifs there though. Seems wasteful 
dawn ivy
obedience wont be 100% a 1 minute
dawn ivy
probably more realistically 1:05-10
slow marsh
not at all
it's realistically 1:05-1:10 right now with current gear
stacking crit over haste into drs
dawn ivy
well the chances we're going to be getting that many secondaries to be reliably getting an entire finisher on top of what we have right now is unlikely i think
but we need to see our set bonus ofc
maybe we get some cheesy vendetta energy rush
slow marsh
yeah cuz tier set isn't known it's not really worth arguing
all in all being "forced" to use obed is a really nice thing
frosty bridge
Nothing personal trait from BFA + Duskwalker
slow marsh
that woudl be crazy
viscid spear
Shrouded Suffocation, thoughts?
spice spire
Miss shrouded
Toned down would be a very fun talent
Triple shrouded just created weird gameplay
If it was like 2 stacked into a talent that would be fun
dawn ivy
it created versatile gameplay imo
crazy single target that allowed unique talent build and carried the spec into being good at m+
spice spire
Not really, at least in the 8.3 iteration
In raid
Was very rigid
But that was a lot of factors not just shrouded
viscid spear
By 8.3 it was GOTTA GO FAST stacking Expedient, wasn't?
spice spire
Yeah
clever kindle
Recycled bonuses 
slow marsh
everything is recycled wym
and we are likely to get more recycled stuff since none of the devs play rogue
clever kindle
Would be a more applicable statement if we weren't gigablasting meters at the moment
oak sky
bonuses themselves will be similar to the ones in the past, featuring fun and unique benefits for a certain playstyle, with the bonuses swapping if you decide to change. We tried to explore a little, to get rotations become more fresh and unique.
slow marsh
we are blasting meters cuz vanilla bp
slow marsh
bonuses themselves will be similar to the ones in the past, featuring fun and un...
SIMILAR
viscid spear
Rehash those sets, bruh
viral locust
Cov leggo + leggo of your choosing
viral locust
Sucks if you’re one of those weirdos who isn’t venthyr lol
slow marsh
fae might be good
marble bear
Obediance is Pretty fun though
viral locust
Just get to run Zoldyck as second leggo and turn your brain off.
viral locust
oak sky
if i can go the whole expac not nf rogue ill be happy
slow marsh
if iit worked with envenom then yeah
slow marsh
hwo would it work with envenom
thorny pond
reduce the Envenom CD lel
marble bear
liker literrally any interaction would be good lol
so probably do obediance and doomblade
or something
idk
bleak sky
reduce cd even further on flag
viral locust
Imagine some nightmare scenario where kyarian is good.
bleak sky
I wanted them to give us something fun like double covenants
but I guess that'd be stupid to balance
sinful citrus
Lol venthyr and necrolord? Would be pretty dope to have flag and spike
bleak sky
kyrian venthyr for the animacharged flag
sinful citrus
Lol
clever kindle
Imagine some nightmare scenario where kyarian is good.
Kyrian is good right now
surprise
tribal mauve
she's dead lets goooooo
modest glen
do you swap out blood dps gem for healing recieved one for mythic sylvanas? doesn't the dps one help even if its just the last 5% on boss? and adds
Bek vs Jas
weary marten
guys when you are at 5cp and shiv comes back, do you shiv before envenoming ?
or shiv after ?
limber lion
Shiv before Envenom
You pretty much always Shiv on cd
Only exception is holding for maximum of 12s for Vendetta.
glad siren
Just hit 51% crit... I assume this new tier set is gonna take away these gem sets?
placid pagoda
Hold shiv if your going to overcap cp or send it?
placid dawn
send it
limber lion
Hold shiv if your going to overcap cp or send it?
literally just answered the question less than 2 messages above you
placid pagoda
literally just answered the question less than 2 messages above you
Yup on cd was clarifying if that was considering overcapping cp
limber lion
Yup on cd was clarifying if that was considering overcapping cp
literally
read 3 more messages above that
that was literally the question
lol.
it's okay
it happens
limber lion
That's not true
placid pagoda
I just got on the discord didnt even see above
viscid spear
All this new information has him on edge
limber lion
I've always been snappy whenever someone asks the same question that I literally answered less than 5 messages ago
You might want to read a line or two before asking something then :p
placid pagoda
My mistake for not reading the guys question in depth
viscid spear
cev, wen i hol teh wepin teh owie part hurts my hand
im saposed to hold sharp part, rite?
limber lion
same dude, same
viscid spear
Plus I see a red symbol thing that looks like a set of armor on my screen
Someone told me something about "derabillitee" but they must not know I play rouge
hollow river
Do u even shiv bro
oak sky
Lmao
humble ginkgo
Definitely might just play it
humble ginkgo
I asked our RDRUID
and its not happeninmg
apparently im not worth simping on
how do you sim KA?
limber lion
I don't see why he wouldn't swap when swapping covenants is free now
Same way as you would with PI
humble ginkgo
Is it kyrian affiinity or kindred
limber lion
kindred affinity
And the cooldown is different to PI
buuuuuuuuut
It's a pretty depressing sight
humble ginkgo
ye what CD is it?
if pi is 3 123 and 243
im guessing they give you it at the same time as pi
humble ginkgo
3 instead of 1 is to give you time to mut gar flag rupture right
limber lion
Yeh, you can move it a bit actually
Because KA lasts for 10s iirc
You can do something like 7s
spice spire
With the conduit it drops to like 45s iirc
humble ginkgo
Oh yea
I forgot to add it in
unlucky
prolly pushes it to 13.4
Actually so unfair
I am now working into convincing my druid to go kyrian
timid cloud
What'd you do in that sim?
humble ginkgo
PI + kyrian druid leggo
thorny pond
Convince your feral
humble ginkgo
Nah its resto
spice spire
Even easier
jaunty kayak
necro dead in 9.2 prediction? cuz 2x leggos but death spike kinda meh..:((
limber lion
Yes, definitely
visual hemlock
why do people don't line up flagellation with vanish and vendetta on mythic sylvanas p2 and p3? You use it more often yes, but it wont do as much damage in total if you hold it for vanish and vendetta
limber lion
why do people don't line up flagellation with vanish and vendetta on mythic sylv...
Losing casts is generally a bigger dps loss than syncing abilities.
You can definitely sync in p1 and p2, but I wouldn't in P3.
I would sync some casts, but definitely not all of them.
Ey I got 13.1k without PI
limber lion
oh it was with kyrian affinity
visual hemlock
i was holding my flagellation for vanish and vendetta in p3 and in total it did more damage that way then in logs of other rogues that pressed flagellation as it comes off cd, so i was curious why 😄
limber lion
i was holding my flagellation for vanish and vendetta in p3 and in total it did ...
It's probably not because of that
there's literally millions of other factors in the game
Rng, procs, mechanics, comp etc.
visual hemlock
So its better to not wait for vendetta and vanish and just press it as you have it?
limber lion
You should line them up when you can, as long as you don't lose casts
I line them up twice in p3, but press Flag twice without syncing
3 Vendettas and 4 flag casts
2 sync'd casts
one with lust
visual hemlock
where do you bl, third platform or last platform?
limber lion
we used to bl last platform, I however haven't played the game in 3 months so who knows
gloomy knoll
for most guilds you'll prob bl last platform
valid spoke
@limber lion wanna look at my p3 sylv real quick? :)
fleet anchor
I'll log in to see how much I can pull off, looks fun
Kindred Affinity without distinct buffed/unbuffed brackets is the most degen thing lol
Should be flagged as an exploit 🤣
Actually ridiculous for parsing though, no clue why WCL is still being stubborn about not having an unbuffed bracket
Difference is getting absurd at this point
I think the worst part for me is how many of the buffed parses are actually just like... really bad parses?
When I look at some of them I'm like "dude without externals this was like a blue parse at best" 🤣
bleak sky
they probably still have to play decently well to get a good parse right
limber lion
they probably still have to play decently well to get a good parse right
This is the r1 opener on hc Guardian
fleet anchor
Like every so often you get a blaster who ALSO is getting externals
limber lion
That should speak for itself
fleet anchor
And is like 1k+ higher than everyone else as you'd expect
But then you have a sea of basically "about the same as the top unbuffed parses despite getting 10+ externals" folks
who basically would be putting up like a 58% parse without help
which is sadge
bleak sky
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/758203941053530122/908119670723342376/unk...
what the fuck
limber lion
Actually ridiculous for parsing though, no clue why WCL is still being stubborn ...
Ye, I agree. We could just have the default view be the one with externals but have a togglable bracket for the non-cheaty boys
fleet anchor
Yeah I'm ok with the default/full view still being whatever
But it just sucks since I'm not really planning on getting externals this tier (we hardly have any in our comp anyway)
Really demotivates me for trying to parse
limber lion
Glad I got my parses in 9.1 before people even thought about using Kyrian Affinity
fleet anchor
Like I was looking at Balance Druids for example on Sylv
The difference between just 0 buff and 5 buff for them on that fight is absurd
If you're getting 0 buff why even bother? lol
Basically you can put up a 95-98% unbuffed number and still get a sub-80% parse
Kindred for Assassination is probably the most extreme case now though
limber lion
Yeh it feels awful
fleet anchor
Since one buff is worth like 11%
limber lion
You feel like you did very well and played like a god
and you look at a purple parse.
KA for assa is just ridiculous
It's around 1.4k dps for my profile
On 5min patchwork that is
humble ginkgo
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/758203941053530122/908119670723342376/unk...
Wait this is wrong right?
Bc thats not how I do it
timid cloud
Yeah, that's a bad opener.
humble ginkgo
Ok i was gonna say
ive been doing it wrong my whole life
Does sin do deathly prepull?
!deathly
timid cloud
Negatory, Word of Glory.
limber lion
Only works for Sub
timid cloud
We also need that as a big CD for MA
fleet anchor
I mean I don’t usually like to opener shame but that opener there was wrong in like 8 different ways
limber lion
Muti - SnD - Muti - Garrote - Flag - Rupture - Vend - Shiv - Vanish - Muti - Env - Muti
humble ginkgo
Ok ye thats what I do
limber lion
Wait this is wrong right?
But yeah, that's the point
limber lion
nutty.
fleet anchor
I think it’s less that it’s a big deal and more a reflection that whoever was playing is kinda just mashing buttons and being carried by externals
timid cloud
slow marsh
Externals shouldn't be that strong
limber lion
But it's still extremely amusing to me
slow marsh
I feel so terrible if I mess anything up on opener
Thankfully only ever really happens on sub
limber lion
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/758203941053530122/908119670723342376/unk...
- Not applying SnD ASAP
- Not maximizing MA value by mutilating twice during the window
- Using Garrote/Flag during MA
- Using Vendetta before applying both bleeds
- Using trinket before Flag
- Applying Rupture way late
- Applying SnD way too late
- Not pressing Shiv early enough
- Not pressing potion early enough
slow marsh
Not that it justifies anything cuz it'd still be wrong but you have to garrote flag in ma window if you prepull mfd
limber lion
Not that it justifies anything cuz it'd still be wrong but you have to garrote f...
Why would you
slow marsh
Snd already up
limber lion
That's why we don't garrote as our first gcd
even though 1 cp is enough to maintain SnD
because we want to maximize the MA value with mutilates
shut garnet
i wonder if its worth vendettaing pre flag with mfd for a bigger winds proc
slow marsh
But garrote yes I see is a big nono
shut garnet
rather than doing flag rupt vend shiv vanish
slow marsh
Prob not
bleak sky
It's around 1.4k dps for my profile
I think I'm dumb dumb
Is kindred buff not being applied to me? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bFXHumnVpp4Y5c9fZMPzaj
slow marsh
I would be interested to see it though since vendetta has an extra 2-3 secs after everything falls off
shut garnet
ye but ur first winds proc is at 20s in the fight right
shut garnet
so getting an extra envenom in vendetta is cool and all but is it actually more damage than a ton of extra lashes being added into the mix + the crits of ur poison ticks doing extra dmg for a couple ticks
havent tested it nearly enough and im too pea brain to try n sim the diff but it defo feels burstier
limber lion
I think I'm dumb dumb
Is kindred buff not being applied to me? https://www.raid...
you might want to look at the footer again
you pasted it twice
limber lion
i wonder if its worth vendettaing pre flag with mfd for a bigger winds proc
I mean you can bring it up to Whispyr or sim it yourself and see if it's worth it
I think they've done excessive sims about it and it's been neutral or a loss.
bleak sky
you pasted it twice
feels good to pepega
shut garnet
@balmy condor hi 
slow marsh
so getting an extra envenom in vendetta is cool and all but is it actually more ...
Yeah I'd be interested to see it in sim if vendetta envenom is bigger than vendetta flag+lashing
slow marsh
I don't think its a big deal either way
limber lion
Rupture is kind of a dead gcd though
So that's likely why using Vend before it not so poggers
balmy condor
it is not worth using vendetta until rupture it out
shut garnet
well, its 5lashes right?
slow marsh
Probs fine if you are prepull mfd
shut garnet
but true ig
slow marsh
Since rup already up
shut garnet
prepull mfd? 
limber lion
Definitely
limber lion
Then you'd do Muti - Rup - Muti - Gar - Vend - Shiv - Flag - Env - Vanish - Muti - Env - Muti - Env - MfD - Env
But you know
shut garnet
wait is there any reason ppl arent doing that
limber lion
it's not as giga as you'd think yeah
moving one or two gcd's around in your opener won't change much over the course of an entire fight
slow marsh
just the 20s pulltimer inconvenience?
Just MfD during ready check and don't hit ready until 20s
shut garnet
slow marsh
Works like 95% of the time
Worst case scenario you just do regular opener because MFD will be back up
static rock
Then you'd do Muti - Rup - Muti - Gar - Vend - Shiv - Flag - Env - Vanish - Muti...
how can you do that? my energy is so starved
slow marsh
you wait 2 seconds
hollow river
or use torrent
limber lion
I mean just because I type it out in one line does not mean that you have to press them immediately
you just chill
static rock
when i mut-snd-mut- i cant instantly garrote after
slow marsh
just wait a second
static rock
okay i was thinking maybe it was a haste problem or something
hollow river
nope
slow marsh
just a patience problem
static rock
yeah just figured i needed to hit every gcd but its good to know it doesnt matter
hollow river
well you should be pooling energy before envenoms, outside shiv/flag/vendetta
we skip GCD's on purpose sometimes
static rock
do we want to shiv at higher cps? or can I cast it at 1 cp?
static rock
okay thanks!
hoary night
Hyped we will get obedience with dusk in the next patch
This is the combination I was wondering ever since they announce the covenant leg
slow marsh
welcome to the brotherhood
hoary night
Indeed
hollow river
also will dashing still be best when we drop our shards
no real way of knowing
dashing was barely behind Doomblade in the first place though
it was like ~1% behind iirc
hoary night
Dashing scales better with increasing secondary stats imo
Hope they give us jack of the jack on tier set bonus lol
hollow river
so will prolly be a choice between the two again
no telling
alpine nebula
so I'm trying to increase AOE damage on assassination, 5+ targets
I ran a sim on 8 target boss fight over 3 mins to simulate a psudo-M+ environment
What I don't get is that we basically have TOO much energy yet the sim is still casting garrote and shiv, maintaining rupture on 5+ targets
whereas I'd expect a minimum number of ruptures for energy return and then the rotation should essentially flatline to FoK -> Crimson Tempest repeat
ignoring envenoms on priority targets and such
is the sim just wrong here?
strange python
we need an aoe finisher like ret palas have
untold nest
maybe next expansion
odd heath
whereas I'd expect a minimum number of ruptures for energy return and then the r...
we crimson tempest to refresh the dots, not worth to spam it
initial dmg is too low to be worth
u maintain envenom buff, CT dot, and spread ruptures / garrotes
gusty mirage
whereas I'd expect a minimum number of ruptures for energy return and then the r...
why would you expect a minimum number of ruptures
bleak sky
you just press CT earlier than usual when you have lots of targets
alpine nebula
so this rotation is based on the numbers off wowhead:
FOK is 24.6% AP on 8 targets = roughly 200% AP per use
Garrote is 108% of AP (ignoring stealth bonus)
CT initial dmg is 4.68% AP per CP * 6 * 8 = 187%-224% per use
Rupture is 25% of AP * 6 = 125%-150% per use
Envenom is 64-80% AP per use, plus some dmg from poisons in the next 6s
alpine nebula
TLDR on the above is it looks like FOK outperforms garrote handily on 5+ targets
bonus on FOK is it returns more CPs too
and I expect CT to outperform rupture on 6+ targets
maybe there's a mechanic I'm glossing over there that changes the math
my theorycrafting skills are rudimentary 😄
balmy condor
oak sky
i was just gonna @ you
bleak sky
man is raiding and you summoned him
balmy condor
I felt a disturbance in the force
so here's a question
have you considered mastery and haste at all
alpine nebula
I have not, haste seems like it shouldn't impact the above but mastery definitely would
brb with mastery calculations 😄
how do I find out if mastery applies to the initial damage of CT?
gusty mirage
I have not, haste seems like it shouldn't impact the above but mastery definitel...
haste affects the tick rate of our bleeds and poisons
it should absolutely impact everything you put
alpine nebula
ok time to burn down some rainforest with 20 target sims 😄
balmy condor
bleak sky
just do dslice
balmy condor
but why
balmy condor
what's the point of simming 20 targets
alpine nebula
to see if rupture drops off
bleak sky
he's simming the entire first floor of halls
balmy condor
what situation are you emulating
alpine nebula
after the target cap
alpine nebula
fundamentally I want to answer the question of optimality on a large pull, say 8ish targets between the following rotations (ignoring triple garrote opener)
garrote on CD to keep energy, rupture 1-2 targets and FOK/CT spam
FOK/CT spam and garrote on min targets to keep energy, dropping rupture*
gusty mirage
there is no minimum number of bleeds to keep up
alpine nebula
FOK and CT to maintain dot, extra CPs to rupture > envenom
minimum number of bleeds as in, the minimum required to maintain energy and not be waiting on regen
gusty mirage
yeah but that's irrelevant
marble hemlock
all of these have either already been done, or are purely theoretical exercises with no real-world (i.e. ingame) relevance
gusty mirage
whispyr spent like a hundred hours earlier this year
optimizing assa dslice
to minimize energy waste without it costing dps
marble hemlock
turns out many bleed = bueno
alpine nebula
pulling 20 targets in ardenweald is a trivial example of when this comes up
in the grand scheme of things maybe not THAT impactful, it's one moment in one dungeon
but there's some optimal rotation here that (I think?) might exclude garrote and minimize rupture
maybe that target number is like 15+ and we can basically forget about it
bleak sky
so you're doing this pull right
oak sky
you realize before the sim priority list was written someone had to do this math
bleak sky
where some stuff just gets insta deleted
gusty mirage
oh shit we reinventing the wheel again
ye the real 9.1.5 content doesn't release until december
this is the result
bleak sky
dslice is good, just trust it idk
echo geyser
did they announce AoE exsang in 9.2? 
oak sky
i wish
bleak sky
yes
oak sky
Smoge
gusty mirage
did they announce AoE exsang in 9.2? <:exsangery:830021268207304735> <:ct:716010...
no
bleak sky
tier set is exsang
gusty mirage
you play venom rush instead
hollow escarp
malefic rupture 
gusty mirage
because venom rush is more damage
marble hemlock
ram in assa so much
quasi venture
did they announce AoE exsang in 9.2? <:exsangery:830021268207304735> <:ct:716010...
Monkafuck ram 
marble hemlock
think hes sick of playing sub
glad siren
51% crit feels nutty with winds of winter
marble hemlock
id rather just have a button that applies my bleeds all at once
the assa ramp feels fucking slow as fuck
balmy condor
maybe that target number is like 15+ and we can basically forget about it
the issue is that something that might be a gain in 15 target on 3 minutes, it's a gain on 12 targets on 40 seconds, or a gain on 18 targets for 1:30
oak sky
ram you gotta join us buddy
echo geyser
AoE rupture when?
bleak sky
wtb 9.2 build today pls gimme blizzard
echo geyser
or rather
hollow escarp
51% crit feels nutty with winds of winter
that's what I got, still have pulls with 20% winds crit 
echo geyser
CT = gives energy regen from the bleeds
balmy condor
there's way too many situations
marble hemlock
no
echo geyser
balmy condor
where you could optimize
marble hemlock
thats not even a gain :<
balmy condor
for one specific thing
bleak sky
AoE rupture when?
o
marble hemlock
just gimme aoe rupture
balmy condor
and it's just not viable
glad siren
i still have 239 pieces though so.. lol u know.. yikes.
echo geyser
the new finisher will be called shuriken rupture
gusty mirage
the new finisher will be called shuriken rupture
oak sky
swipe
echo geyser
bleak sky
what if instead of black powder sin got red powder
oak sky
red ink
echo geyser
gusty mirage
what if
gusty mirage
our utility soothe isn't tied to an important dps cd
quasi venture
The Ravenholdts crackshop has been going wild today.
bleak sky
it's smoke bomb
oak sky
or maybe we never find out
glad siren
is zand troll still best? i'm orc atm
balmy condor
the difference is non-existent
bleak sky
it's ugly so not best
glad siren
lol prob right
oak sky
🐏
stray mural
The 9.2 news just says “lmao play obe and whatever else” right
stray mural
Deathspike popped into my head for keys too.
bleak sky
Deathspike popped into my head for keys too.
obedience + zoldycks tho
stray mural
True
oak sky
deathspike is for overall
stray mural
Linking Details overall is the only way I feel like I did anything
Between fire mages and balance druids I feel like doodoo until the end
I hope we have enough crit going forward to keep dashing around. It’s been very fun using it
jaunty steeple
io = pp size
bleak sky
pp smol 
jaunty steeple
stray mural
I stopped caring after I timed all my 20’s as Assa. I just wanted to see if I could do it
bleak sky
can't get to 2500 sadge
stray mural
2400 is good enough for me. It’s gonna mean nothing in 2036 when 9.2 drops
bleak sky
9.2 dropping today for sure
i've been refreshing wowtools since blizz released the video
my copium is running low
glad siren
for soulrender am i supposed to stick to the boss? i thought i was supposed to switch to aoe
balmy condor
9.2 Update Pin
If I'm missing anything let me know 
-
Double legendary (1 cov, 1 regular):
We will craft a new belt, which has the covenant legendary. THIS LEGO WILL SWAP WITH YOUR COVENANT SO ONLY ONE CRAFT + a regular legendary in a normal slot. Current idea is Duskwalkers with Venthyr. This combo is super strong because of a ton of added energy -
No soulbind updates:
Unless there's some tuning, that means we're locked into venthyr. Fae suffers from bad soulbind traits in the last couple rows, and because tuning traits means tuning for multiple classes/specs, this is very touchy. -
Tier set:
2 set: Shiv's debuff causes your Bleeds to gain 25% Critical Strike for 9 seconds.
4 pieces: Vendetta causes Poisons and Bleeds on your target to expire 100% faster.
The 2 set here isn't very impressive, but the 4 set looks like good burst, built in exsang. Exsang will not come back, but we might see subterfuge/nightstalker come back in. Venthyr is the clear move here. After testing, the 4 piece adds a ton of energy when paired with duskwalkers, which turned out to be a lot of damage. Seems okay balance wise, but the 2 set is still underwhelming
Summary
Covenant - Venthyr, probably not kyrian, fae too weak, definitely not necro (deathspike is really bad single target)
Stats - Probably a mix of everything, as usual, crit and mastery look good, haste is good, versatility not great
Legendaries - Obedience and Duskwalker
arctic hare
I can't wait to figure out what the effect's gonna be
Also, I thought dashing scoundrel was only good due to the frost set, which we won't have in 9.2 afaik
stray mural
I hope there’s a unique effect for every spec and not some one effect fits all
stray mural
“You gain an AoE finisher that isn’t CT”
slow marsh
Also, I thought dashing scoundrel was only good due to the frost set, which we w...
dashing was already really close to doom in 9.0.5 and arguably pulled ahead with poison bomb procs. but seeing as that's a poop talent and is super rng it nefver really caught on
slow marsh
true to an extent yes
stray mural
As fun as speculation is we won’t really know for a couple months and that irritates me
I need to know now
slow marsh
Yeah
We won't know until we see tier set bonuses, which will probs be fairly minor but will still determine what we play
oak sky
i mean
stray mural
I swear if it’s all passive
oak sky
we might start hearing stuff in the next 3 weeks
arctic hare
dashing was already really close to doom in 9.0.5 and arguably pulled ahead with...
Oh, hmm
oak sky
especially if ptr is next week
stray mural
They’ll probably roll out the sets in waves
slow marsh
they have a chance to make it kinda hype but idk if they have the marketing team to do that
odd heath
Without dom, we may see haste coming as best stat again over crit
making dashing lose a lot of value
balmy condor
Stat scaling solves that I thought
I mean kinda not really though
slow marsh
haste is good for dashing too maybe even more so. more haste is more ticks which is even more energy gen
slow marsh
yeah after a certain point
all i'm saying is that our current options are really close even without dom sets and we just have to see what tier sets are
until then
thorny pond
Mastery Rogue is back ™️
bleak sky
for soulrender am i supposed to stick to the boss? i thought i was supposed to s...
things are dying too fast, slam boss
glad siren
ty sir
sinful citrus
Is there a way to Sim from a certain %hp I'm trying to figure out if it will be worthwhile to use Zoldyck for more execute damage on fate
sinful citrus
Solves that lol we had 3 different 3% wipes
marble hemlock
anyone got any ideas what cov might be best in 9.2 with double legendary?
marble hemlock
🧢
slow marsh
unless the tier set mega buffs sbs, deathspike is jsut so bad for ST
kind talon
Tier set buffing covenant ability
odd heath
necro, huge aoe, deathspike + zoldyck stonks synergy
slow marsh
and venth already has the better soulbind anyways
kind talon
🧐
slow marsh
necro will be pogger in m+ though for sure
marble hemlock
were already struggling to get our shit out asap
marble hemlock
yes, im aware
odd heath
jokes aside, venth looks to be the pick
marble hemlock
just saying, not a big fan of deathspike in general, both because it doesnt have smart targeting, as well as the GCD real estate already being quite busy
slow marsh
yeah
but who knows maybe some of the harder bosses in raid require a lot of add management and necro stonks go to the moon
balmy condor
anyone got any ideas what cov might be best in 9.2 with double legendary?
hi, thanks for joining ravenholdt, I hope you find the info you're looking for. To answer your question, please refer to the pinned messages, by hitting the pushpin icon at the top of your discord. Thank's again and enjoy your time!
slow marsh
i'm trying to throw you a bone here seli
marble hemlock
pressing sbs feels bad
gimme smth to apply my bleeds to all targets
the ramp just feels horrendous
before things start rolling
and sbs doesnt help
slow marsh
just blade flurry and it'll feel better
marble hemlock
maybe if they fixed all its bugs
marble hemlock
obedience+zoldyck will actually be a slick m+ combo
odd heath
it will
marble hemlock
doubt itll compare well to what other classes can get tho
spice spire
think about the prio damage 
slow marsh
rogue is in a really nice spot with the double leggos actually
marble hemlock
nah
slow marsh
compared so some other specs
marble hemlock
itll blow
compared to other good specs
and its mostly pointless to speculate rn anyway without set bonuses
spice spire
no shot
slow marsh
wym
you are the only responsible one in here anymore
cev retired
whisp abandoned us
oak sky
seli is never here 
slow marsh
Vel likes to make our lives harder by forcing us to play mfd
exactly
we're constantly with substitute teachers
spice spire
I'm responsible, just y'know, I'm not what the paragon of responsibility should be
slow marsh
you think we're responsible
odd heath
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/xe8gkkKt8PKAubQMjDoakf
18 dps difference for me between doomblade and dashing, just simmed
so little difference lol
copper sundial
no frost shards 
slow marsh
yeah it'll literally just come down to set bonuses and a smidge of raid fight layouts
marble hemlock
whats the best way to upgrade conduits? this 158 lashing doesnt feel nice
copper sundial
xD
marble hemlock
already killed rares for the korthia shit
slow marsh
kek
spice spire
wtf
slow marsh
you can get it from weekly jailer quest
marble hemlock
i blame @marble ruin
marble hemlock
oh eah
slow marsh
and the 226 conduit upgrade thingy isn't capped anymore
oak sky
echo geyser
i thought the day would never come
kind talon
echo geyser
when seli swaps off necro
signal badger
Anything I can do to squeeze out more dps or is it just a crit unlucky thing? We held dps on P1 for about 10 seconds
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/w1PjmFCfMrpvKxGa/#type=damage-done&fight=last
marble hemlock
hmye
idk, tyra is just a frustrating necro week imo
not even because of the st but just cause
having a 15sec setup for decent aoe
and by the time you get there, mobs are either dead or already low hp
echo geyser
sin on tyrannical trash
kind talon
echo geyser
what sim
hollow escarp
13k 
echo geyser
lmao thats my base sim as sub
echo geyser
my sin is like 15k
humble ginkgo
im leaving the discord
humble ginkgo
echo geyser
let see what u added
humble ginkgo
ah ok
humble ginkgo
u got bis gera bro
steel ridge
humble ginkgo
give me some time
humble ginkgo
Right
echo geyser
kind talon
Bis gera
humble ginkgo
show ur sub sim
kind talon
kind talon
Fuck sub
humble ginkgo
so true
kind talon
📠
steel ridge
What in the actual fuck
kind talon
Outlaw tier incoming on god (sin can be good too)
kind talon
Boutta run resounding clarity bro 📈
stray mural
I ditched Outlaw for Assa because I was tired of underperforming
The APM boss caught up to me
steel ridge
Whisp asleep or how did skip and decaf capture this channel
kind talon
Whisp asleep or how did skip and decaf capture this channel
We are everywhere
stray mural
Also just like listened to advice from my guild who said I am a much better Assa player than Outlaw. I felt like I got told to play BM Hunter but just over time admitted they were right 
steel ridge
@stray mural ouch
stray mural
It’s not like I was doing “poorly” as Outlaw. I was doing something wrong in keys and couldn’t figure it out. That’s what the catalyst was.
steel ridge
Tell your guild to stick it and keep on rolling
hollow escarp
what is this outlaw propaganda 
stray mural
what is this outlaw propaganda <:Hmm:865126050156773386>
Anti propaganda
steel ridge
This channel has been pirated
stray mural
I haven’t played Outlaw once since 9.1 dropped and I’m now scared to pick it up again.
kind talon
I haven’t played Outlaw once since 9.1 dropped and I’m now scared to pick it up ...
Well I was very bad at outlaw in 9.1 and now I’m not
steel ridge
And the bike is on fire
kind talon
And I took a long break playing assa and tbc too
Between CN and now
I main swapped to assa then quit for tbc
And played outlaw again this tier
So u can do it
stray mural
I’ve also wanted to play Sub and have been talked out of it repeatedly
kind talon
Idk why ppl would talk you out of trying something
Just do what you want??? It’s a video game
stray mural
When you’re one of the top consistent performers it’s hard
You can’t have fun in prog 
kind talon
Bro You don’t have to play it in prog to “try it out”
steel ridge
Damn straight you can
kind talon
There’s a difference between prog and other parts of the game
stray mural
It’s also just dedicating time to earning the currency, gold, and renown to play
I was small brain in CN and was NF outlaw
Switched to Doomblade/Necro
steel ridge
Imagine not having 20 legendaries yet
stray mural
I’m sure it takes absolutely no time now
steel ridge
NF Outlaw 
stray mural
I could probably farm all of my covenant renown in two weeks
steel gyro
itsw faster than you think doing level 9 torghast
steel ridge
Its so fast now
steel gyro
- you only need like 57 for conduit trees
stray mural
Yeah but the enhanced conduits and Stam tho
steel ridge
Meh
steel gyro
enhanced isnt that big imo
esp if youre not convinced youll like it
getting to 57, you'll only miss 2% stam too
steel gyro
gotcha
theres ways to farm research now too
which is incredibly fast with a group of 5
steel gyro
i was waiting for them to nerf
but hasnt come yet :P
so hopefully it stays
I got all my conduits to 252 in a couple hours of farming.
heroic level is fine too
only 1 level off max
upbeat needle
Raid Leader said I need to change from frost to unholy on fatescribe bc Winds too much damage and pushing the boss over 😦
upbeat needle
your raid lead is insane
do u think so?
we holding at 75%
man I just wanna kill this shit
hollow escarp
what are you holding at 75% ?
hollow escarp
you sure you're not talking about fatescribe?
upbeat needle
oh wait
i'm dumbass
yes
fatescribe
lmaoo, my bad a mf stressed over this boss bro
yes fatescribe
hollow escarp
well, you do want to push below 72% but after you deal with the ads, you should just phase the boss
the winds might be a lot of damage if it happens during that time but it won't be the only thing pushing
I'd rather check active damage rather than passives
drifting cloud
ah yes winds crit that does less that 0.2% pushes the boss over 
upbeat needle
me and other rogue swapped
:/
blood link sub
shit ass
gonna bring that up to him tho
balmy condor
actually trolling swapping to unholy
cunning needle
just get one less person to not pot on pull
balmy condor
thorn fjord
Where are we using Mfd now?
sharp zodiac
gonna bring that up to him tho
Or just get your tanks to pull the boss out at 72.5
let dots tick
Have a WA just like Sylv Watch HP for Fatescribe if youre interested
upbeat needle
we got all that
shadow bison
Hello!
I'm lf for someone that take a look on my Raid Log. If this is allowed to ask here 
Started raiding now with my Assa Rogue and have embarrassing Grey Logs 
not sure why except better Ressource management.
marble hemlock
Youre more than welcome to post a log here and people will take a look at it 🙂
gusty mirage
hollow river
<a:Kidwave:775073712490807316>
gusty mirage
<:feelscryman:585734081304592385>
whats wrong my friend
shadow bison
Youre more than welcome to post a log here and people will take a look at it 🙂
Thanks! Horrible to see the logs. Was pretty shocked. I'm new in raiding with Assa (not random) and ofc I need Exp but it would bet better if I play in the right way from the start
Mythic Ner'zhul
I know I haven't the best gear atm because of a Reroll. But even with ~243 it's pretty bad.
Frost set is Rank 4
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/vYyGKZjmQc6JN3PR#fight=29&type=damage-done&source=17
hollow river
no new PB tn
drifting cloud
oxi can you help me with my log https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/b2PFkXD1CLzKpQyf#fight=14&type=damage-done
😳
gusty mirage
I'll fly to the moon for you Ryler ❤️
drifting cloud
wasnt even necro!
marble hemlock
doubt necro is better on soulrender
drifting cloud
not my fault we dont have hunter or wws
marble hemlock
unless adds live like 20+secs
drifting cloud
but yeah KA pretty good 
didnt expect boss to die so fast so didnt get full value of last flag even
carmine dawn
oxi can you help me with my log https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/b2PFkXD1CLz...
fucking blasting
drifting cloud
did everyone know you can only rotate rune once on fatescribe (if everyone is alive) or am I the only one who found that out today
spice spire
oxi can you help me with my log https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/b2PFkXD1CLz...
Howdy ryler I know that you asked oxi, but I’ve a great bit of info here. I see that you only received kindred affinity buff on 66% of the fight. If you have that up to 100% you’ll frag even harder. Sincerely yours, oxi#2
carmine dawn
did everyone know you can only rotate rune once on fatescribe (if everyone is al...
wym
like assignments?
drifting cloud
like you wont get the debuff twice
carmine dawn
gusty mirage
did everyone know you can only rotate rune once on fatescribe (if everyone is al...
wat
how the fuck did I get all 3
carmine dawn
LOL
gusty mirage
in our mythic kill
carmine dawn
drifting cloud
did you have a guy dead or 5 heals?
