Yeah pretty close for me
#assassination
zinc frost
wintry mica
yea just thought I would ask, ive just been staying as theotar since it seems better outside of ST
do we lose a lot for any reason by having double on-use? feels like it doesn't make sense that my 233 phial is outsimming my 239 fusion amp
zinc frost
How much is it outsimming it by? They are pretty close at that ilvl
wintry mica
yea i guess its pretty close
like 20-30 dps lol
I guess I shouldnt complain cause I don't want to do double on-use unless its actually better
zinc frost
Yeah I personally wouldn’t unless it was a decent gain. Hate double on-use haha
junior rampart
Hello, could someone let me know if its haste/crit for dashing scoundrel?
wintry mica
you can sim it, but im pretty sure itll basically always say crit haste
junior rampart
thank you
placid pagoda
Thanks for this cev that just changed my opener for the nine by a lot
lethal zodiac
it took me 39 runs and i only got it in run 39 because i boguht it of a random healer for 200k gold.
zinc frost
I’m still salty he charged you that much..
hollow river
Yeah that’s fucked up
lethal zodiac
i just couldnt do another 39 runs
hollow river
For something they won’t even use and have 2 hrs to trade
Bro
U would’ve gotten it on the 40th run
Swear
zinc frost
Haha, or the 90th 😝
lethal zodiac
U would’ve gotten it on the 40th run
maybe, maybe not idk but i feel like i get a 252 tmrw in the vault
and i will pick it
thorny pond
Like tier pieces or just random gear from badges?
Because the answer is yes they have
thorny pond
Meh
I remember targeting certain pieces and it was cool to get it
Few times they were bis
hollow river
But didn’t feel as nice to get it or something?
thorny pond
Nice is subjective
thorny pond
sex is still better
hollow river
Or u see some good 252 in vault
thorny pond
I mean sure
hollow river
Idk
viscid spear
All 3 of my UH shards are Foreboding, and I finally got Heroic shoulders, should I start upgrading my Frost shards and use the UH set until they're caught up?
I don't have Dashing made
hollow river
I don’t like rng
thorny pond
But there aren’t many pieces now where it’s like omg 8% increase
hollow river
All 3 of my UH shards are Foreboding, and I finally got Heroic shoulders, should...
Simsimsim
thorny pond
It’s usually a slow burn
hollow river
True
thorny pond
So the upgrades are incremental
Or s big piece on an alt I guess
But it’s an alt
So wtfc
hollow river
My issue atm is
zinc frost
sex is still better
Depends how bad it is
thorny pond
People who ripped Sylvanas daggers maybe from a 220
hollow river
I’m readying enhance sham for mythic
And making rogue my “alt”
But I need 2 vein rippers phial and fusion amp for enhance
limber lion
All 3 of my UH shards are Foreboding, and I finally got Heroic shoulders, should...
I would, yes.
hollow river
And vein ripper sylv dagger phial fusion amp for rogue
viscid spear
I would, yes.
Should I craft Dashing then or is Obedience still good enough?
zinc frost
All 3 of my UH shards are Foreboding, and I finally got Heroic shoulders, should...
That’s where I’m at. Rank 4 unholy and just upgrading frost atm. Sims way more for me. Gonna be juicy
limber lion
Should I craft Dashing then or is Obedience still good enough?
You should be making dashing for the frost set.
My 262 doomblade outsims a 235 dashing. It only pulls ahead at 249 or more personally.
viscid spear
Ugh 
hollow river
Can’t wait to craft dashing
I’m upgrading my frost to rank 4 tonight after I check some sims for outlaw/sub just to see
Gonna blast raid 
zinc frost
Big dam inc
hollow talon
gotta stop the jailer and then do some normal/heroic
to get the perfect amount of embers
lusty surge
Managed to pug aotc last night, pray for my h dagger
lusty surge
Womp
I got a belt off her and already had a 252
So I have some bad luck protection built
lone wren
All 3 of my UH shards are Foreboding, and I finally got Heroic shoulders, should...
sim yourself to be sure, but in a lot of people's case, lvl 4 frost is when the frost set starts to get ahead of their lvl 4 unholy. At lvl 5 frost, frost is simming a good margin higher for most sims i have seen in single target. If you want an opinion, if you have your unholy at rank 4 currently, start saving your embers, once you are able to have a rank 4 frost set make the switch. Because while rank 3 frost sims slightly higher than rank 4unholy for most, that's only the case in single target fights therefore not worth the switch for a raid setting until you can have rank 4 frost. (this opinion is based on my character profile sims, sim yourself to be 100% sure)
cold rampart
miam mangle or wps?
balmy condor
miam mangle or wps?
what lego you playing
cold rampart
doomblade
balmy condor
probably wps first, then mangle close second
slow oriole
Well every soulbind has at least two potency slots after renown 43, so everyone is probably running WPS and Maim, Mangle/Lethal Poisons, whichever of the latter sims better
tardy sluice
frost set sims better for me with doomblade is this normal?
woven ruin
@slow oriole. So sudden fractures aint very good anymore?
zinc frost
frost set sims better for me with doomblade is this normal?
Yeah it’s normal. Dashing takes over for me at rank 4 and 249 ilvl
Even at 235 dashing is only like 30 dps behind
thorny pond
Well every soulbind has at least two potency slots after renown 43, so everyone ...
Lashing?
bleak sun
Ye lashing is busted
burnt star
My 262 doomblade outsims a 235 dashing. It only pulls ahead at 249 or more perso...
Damn
My dashing 235 pulls ahead of my 262 doomblade by 51 right now
Also. A r4 frost beats r5 uh
For me*
I know it differs for everyone
radiant dirge
What conduits are we suppose to run with dashing?
radiant dirge
Gotcha
radiant dirge
With that gear you hit 40% crit?
burnt star
Hmm i was at 36.8% but that was without crit enchant/crit socket. And 236 crit dagger instead of 239 from raid
So 100 crit over 36.9%
cold rampart
!oil
prisma monolithBOT
Using consumables will increase your damage, however the difference between oil/stone/potion combinations are very minor (within 0.5% of each other). You can sim the difference for yourself by pasting this pastebin underneath your /simc input, in the "advanced sim" section of raidbots: https://pastebin.com/Lbxc7afJ
radiant dirge
Crazy how your sim is way higher than mine wonder what I’m doing wrong 😂
radiant dirge
Yeah I’m only at 9.3k
hollow river
wicked knoll
Those be fightin words
limber lion
Damn
My dashing 235 pulls ahead of my 262 doomblade by 51 right now
Ah yeh, it sims better for me as well when using BS/DS but loses a bit when using Ep/Vig
wicked knoll
He'll lose bc of worse gear...but still
hollow river
Shards weapons and profile set up everything makes a big difference
burnt star
Oh ya. Ep/vig put db ahead :)
celest ruin
is there any fights even worth going bs/ds? feel like its only guardian and its kinda annoying just to use a tome just for that specific fight
limber lion
is there any fights even worth going bs/ds? feel like its only guardian and its ...
Just Guardian yeah
quaint sequoia
god pugging as a dps is so fucking aids. Spent 2 hours getting decline after decline now -.-
viral locust
DS makes the rotation feel soooooo slow.
balmy condor
DS makes the rotation feel soooooo slow.
bs/deeper is actually considerably faster than ep/vig
viral locust
whhhhaaa? it always feels miserably slow, unless you get a lot of BS procs I guess?
iron orchid
So with frost set and dashing do we not switch to ds/bs?
you do actually
iron orchid
in many scenarios it can be a gain, but it always depend on your own gear
and on fight's design
viscid spear
the Harvester's Court Attire is pretty bland for reaching Renown 60
iron orchid
Damn
My dashing 235 pulls ahead of my 262 doomblade by 51 right now
same here too
burnt star
Actually gonna need to redo all my sim.to see if i get r5 uh or r4 frost
Didnt think that i dont really use ds/bs on raid
limber lion
BS/DS remains the dominant choice in single target, regardless of shard set and/or legendary.
wide ridge
starting next reset, we'll get "soulbind's first row of conduits is enhanced"
do we have info on that what does?
on what that does*
wicked knoll
bs/ds?
zinc frost
Blindside/deeper stratagem
amber mountain
starting next reset, we'll get "soulbind's first row of conduits is enhanced"
It boosts the base % bonuses of that row
radiant dirge
Just feel so empty when I don’t run vigor
wicked knoll
was there a change? most things I see say vigor for raiding
daring minnow
so i keep seeing that bs/ds is better but the logs show that the highest sin rogues in lots of fights are running ep vigor
is that because everybody doesn't have the highest shard sets yet and maxed dashing?
amber mountain
It comes down to comfort and what you do
wide ridge
It boosts the base % bonuses of that row
oh, ty
fluid glade
comfort out dps' everything
zinc frost
BS/DS is really better suited to pure ST fights with no adds and minimal movement.
limber lion
is that because everybody doesn't have the highest shard sets yet and maxed dash...
EP/Vig is just better for most fights.
BS/DS is only good for Guardian.
daring minnow
Ah i see. So guardian and training dummies
thanks
oddly enough, highest sin rogue ran vigor ep on guardian
fallen arch
Tarragrue?
daring minnow
Oh don't usually look at tarr because anima powers and such kinda skew results
fluid glade
yeah bs RNG will determine the diff between those top end parses and ofc buff funneling
zinc frost
I reckon I might run bs/ds on tarra this week to see how it feels
balmy condor
whhhhaaa? it always feels miserably slow, unless you get a lot of BS procs I gue...
Ep vig is like 44 apm and bs deeper is like 48
Bs makes it basically a full 10% faster
viral locust
weird.
balmy condor
People just can’t stand the opener with deeper
Cause wah my garrote takes so long
WAH my rupture
viral locust
sweats nervously in also hating the opener
thorny pond
MY PURSE
balmy condor
Idk sin community is giga fucking weird
There’s so much flip flopping
Like people loved legion sin
balmy condor
Legion sin was much slower than this
viral locust
I personally loved Mastery stacking MP rogue
thorny pond
legion sin was the tits, AP/MP zinnnnggggg
balmy condor
But then like people complain that sin now is slow
zinc frost
Maybe they got used to stacked expedient corruptions in BFA :p
balmy condor
At the start of the expansion people were saying “man this is really slow I wish we had like sin from EP”
Sin in EP was slower than the start of the expansion
viral locust
shudders in Font
viscid spear
Maybe they got used to stacked expedient corruptions in BFA :p
stacking Expedient on everything possible
balmy condor
Like I get people enjoying expedient
cobalt pelican
like.. eternal palace?
balmy condor
That’s cool
balmy condor
like.. eternal palace?
Yes
balmy condor
Blindside + alacrity going into shadowlands made up for it
unkempt pilot
i just got a nice bug, and want to know if anybody got it before
cobalt pelican
vop was the best major for single target in 8.3
unkempt pilot
ToP, NEcro covenant, first boss die but keep getting hit by my dot
cobalt pelican
which was kinda memes
unkempt pilot
So stay in boss fight, can't eat, can't release, can't do nothing
cobalt pelican
you could play triple vend dmg trait vop
viscid spear
ToP, NEcro covenant, first boss die but keep getting hit by my dot
I get something like that in open world.
I'll kill something and move on but see the popping DoT text from the corner of my screen.
viral locust
Yeah like
BfA was kinda dog, but I really miss how much damage 3 stacked Az Armor bonuses could do
Shrouded Suffication in keys felt so nice
viscid spear
Always hard getting used to losing the major system of an expansion when you move to the next.
Losing Artifact weapons before BfA, losing Azerite Armor and Corruption before Shadowlands, etc
Swift kick in the pants
viral locust
Yeah just all the damage SS could do on your opening per pac with Subturfuge, Garrote hit so fucking hard lol
viral locust
Yeah it's kind of crazy that BfA private servers are the most popping off rn.
But of course it's 8.3 with corruption vendor available so I guess it makes sense lol
zinc frost
Really? I always hear people memeing about bfa private servers but didn’t know they were that popular
zinc frost
That’s crazy. Was just fun to have different builds like burst aoe for sin, actual usage from exsanguinate with high haste or high crit ST toxic blade build.
viral locust
Yeah I liked BfA's systems, just the rest of the game was kinda dogshit, but boosted rates on those servers usually go a long way.
ptsd flashbacks from spamming islands for AP
zinc frost
Die in a vision, well can’t do that again till next lmao. Corruptions in pvp.. yeah definitely had it’s issues
next hedge
is 30% crit the max that we should go or should we go higher?
fallen arch
alpine latch
is 30% crit the max that we should go or should we go higher?
Not sure that there is a max for Crit. Crit is life.
next hedge
AMR is telling me to lose crit for haste
wintry mica
I could see haste still having higher value if you are still simming with unholy set
but 30% crit is def too low to start stacking haste if you are running frost
next hedge
ive been hearing frost set is slightly better, granted i dont have the shoulders yet or the gems to complete a full set
wintry mica
at higher gear and shard ranks frost is winning ST right now
once you have the sockets/gems raidbots will let you sim the set bonuses against each other
next hedge
gotcha, right now im at 32% crit and 13% haste
wintry mica
you need more crit and haste lol
amber mountain
I likely won't hit teh gear levels this patch to make the switch to Frost worthwhile
wintry mica
yea frost won as soon as it hit rank 3 for me
it really isnt that crazy of gear thats needed
sharp zodiac
He doesn’t need more anything. He needs to sim his top gear and use whatever is BiS
amber mountain
He doesn’t need more anything. He needs to sim his top gear and use whatever is ...
that's too easy. It's more important to add complicated layers to everything 🙂
sharp zodiac
@limber lion put me to school on this last week
limber lion
wintry mica
yea if you scroll up like 5 inches I said to just listen to the sim
arctic hare
I have done something amazing, my mastery value is literally 36
simmed myself, its still my worst stat LOL
arctic hare
Haha, having 15.35% mastery is the lowest I've ever had it
limber lion
Sylv chest gives mastery :(
arctic hare
The one piece thats giving me said mastery? oh, just my friggin Domination socket shoulders LOL
alpine latch
So ... What are you guys running for m+? 3 DPS gems and which defensive?
wintry mica
I like the frost stacking shield
limber lion
No, 4 dps gems and the absorb shield
alpine latch
4 DPS gems?
limber lion
Yes
wintry mica
what do you consider the 4th dps gem?
limber lion
Unholy has 2 dps gems
wintry mica
unholy aura?
alpine latch
The one that drains health? Unholy aura or whatever?
limber lion
Yes
alpine latch
Ah yeah, okay
wintry mica
makes sense, the defensives from any of the others isnt really worth more than that
limber lion
(Honestly I don't care enough to change my gems at all)
I just stick to my normal raid setup
hollow river
There’s a good add on Cev
zinc frost
Yeah it doesn’t make a huge difference I don’t change gems at all haha. Too lazy
limber lion
Sure
hollow river
For shard sets instant change
alpine latch
I only have 3 Dom Sockets anyway... I'm tired of farming normal but it's gotta happen
arctic hare
hey, how high can a piece be upgraded to?
arctic hare
like, a mythic key
hollow river
I’d die without .02%
alpine latch
It's not like I need that
Woah woah woah, let's calm down here bud. We're not all you. lol
wintry mica
yea we still powerclear normal to fill out pieces sets
hollow river
Would nuke my key
arctic hare
At 1200 IO I can upgrade pieces to 236, can you upgrade stuff to 252?
zinc frost
246 isn’t it?
hollow river
you can upgrade m+ gear to 249 max
246
high phoenix
how far behind is necro vs venthyr on frost shard build?
limber lion
Woah woah woah, let's calm down here bud. We're not all you. lol
I doubt you'd need the 0.2% either :P
limber lion
how far behind is necro vs venthyr on frost shard build?
Quite a lot.
harsh lantern
https://gyazo.com/c61e14ad8aae5c5c73a45fbebc1f2d07 just simmed this trinket is good?
didnt think it would be
limber lion
https://gyazo.com/c61e14ad8aae5c5c73a45fbebc1f2d07 just simmed this trinket is g...
Yes, really good.
alpine latch
https://gyazo.com/c61e14ad8aae5c5c73a45fbebc1f2d07 just simmed this trinket is g...
SGT is our top 2 m+ trinket, and it's pretty decent in ST as well
alpine latch
I think it's like top 5 ST and since you got it at 252, it's pretty damn strong.
balmy condor
Phial should be the other slot
alpine latch
^
harsh lantern
i got bottle and ooze 233
arctic hare
So is SFA that good?
harsh lantern
howling 225
limber lion
Yes.
harsh lantern
226*
limber lion
SFA + Phial is #goals
balmy condor
The fuck is sfa
limber lion
Amplifier Whispyr
alpine latch
So is SFA that good?
SFA is our best ST trinket in the game at Mythic. On Heroic it's still better than almost everything.
arctic hare
Salvaged Fusion Amplifier
balmy condor
Oh
limber lion
Guardian trinket
alpine latch
Salvaged Fusion Amp
alpine latch
Gosh Whispyr, get in touch with the kids these days
balmy condor
Phial + fusion is the play
amber mountain
https://gyazo.com/c61e14ad8aae5c5c73a45fbebc1f2d07 just simmed this trinket is g...
Make a macro to use it with Vendetta, they line up perfectly and synergize well
limber lion
Would recommend.
arctic hare
Just gotta ask Rng jesus lol
alpine latch
I'm debating if I want to buy the Mythic BoE pants and call that slot a day or not.
fallen arch
Dude you are funny
alpine latch
?
fallen arch
You said paying for phial wasn’t worth because it would be like 4 months of game time gold
But now this?
alpine latch
I don't think I said that.
fallen arch
Or it was paying for aotc w/e
alpine latch
I said that the Longboi wasn't worth it
alpine latch
Longboi at the time cost as much as 2 years of game time, the $80 expansion, and 2 years of Blizzcon
limber lion
fallen arch
These pants are outdated in 6 months
limber lion
How long are you planning on playing WoW for?
fallen arch
Or 5-10
alpine latch
I have a second account and a portable mailbox. Having longboi isn't that much of a timesaver for me, just for people around me
arctic hare
Also the mount will allow you to play the auction for whenever you want lol
limber lion
You think you'll be playing WoW in 40 years?
balmy condor
Yep
fallen arch
Ye but he can buy 100 longbois wihout making a dent in his wallet
balmy condor
zinc frost
71 year old me playing wow, sounds good to me
arctic hare
Ye but he can buy 100 longbois wihout making a dent in his wallet
God that'd be great
Haha, yes
balmy condor
Gonna tell my grandchildren about garrosh
arctic hare
Imagine, in a 100 years
alpine latch
You think you'll be playing WoW in 40 years?
I'm paying multiple subscriptions in gold for friends... So for me, 5m gold allowed me to play with 3 of my friends for over a year (plus buying them Shadowlands). I have the gold to burn, which is why I don't care about throwing down 300k on pants.
arctic hare
we'll just make our own private servers of wow, and let our grandchildren play it, or even great grandchildren
limber lion
I'm paying multiple subscriptions in gold for friends... So for me, 5m gold allo...
Sounds worth it to me.
zinc frost
There’s a grandma that I found the other night streaming heroic raid. She played boomkin. She was pretty chill
arctic hare
Tell them stories of our glory days
alpine latch
300k on Pants is nothing - shit my r6 cloak cost me 250k when I bought it.
alpine latch
And it's already not BiS because @arctic hare went and found out about Dashing
cursive silo
lol
fallen arch
There’s a grandma that I found the other night streaming heroic raid. She played...
I actually raided with a 58 year old lady 2 weeks back, that was interesting
arctic hare
And it's already not BiS because <@!259523182355152896> went and found out about...
heh, and the sepsis
alpine latch
lol
fallen arch
She was really nice, not great at the game tho
alpine latch
But yeah, I don't mind locking in an item slot for 200-500k if it means it's BiS the entire patch.
zinc frost
I hope she smashed you in meters :p
deft obsidian
how can i sim different legos?
arctic hare
Yeah, honestly, that sounds like the move there
balmy condor
how can i sim different legos?
Top gear has a thing at the top
plain thistle
anyone know how many stygian embers you can get per week? doing a full clear heroic and 5-6 mythic bosses?
alpine latch
Aw damn. Someone flipped them and jacked the price.Might not being buying pants, then
zinc frost
Treat yo self to those pants, you earned it 😉
balmy condor
Ozsassin-Silvermoon EU ty
Boutta log check you into the next dimension
balmy condor
Nah
main wharf
roleplayer detected
balmy condor
You pump
fallen arch
Not all
I try to
Just wished we could kill Sylvanas hc some day
So we can get our wipes in on mythic
alpine latch
I think my guild is 2 weeks away... so I'm pugging it until then
We should have Fatescribe and KT this week, so that gives us time next week for Sylv
fallen arch
Boutta log check you into the next dimension
Lets hope that Sylvanas is lit up next week too
grim tangle
don't kill sylvana it will lower your average
zinc frost
What a legend
thorny pond
Yea, Clown taught you on to play kek
amber mountain
I just need to climb out of grey
balmy condor
People teach themselves how to play
fallen arch
Ok maybe, but this discord helped me a lot to optimize
tulip dagger
I learned that using shiv on CD means to actually use it on CD!
amber mountain
hold up, i'm in yellow, so.. improvement 😛
zinc frost
I learned that using shiv on CD means to actually use it on CD!
Slammmm it
alpine latch
Yeah, you smash me. I'm a mostly blue some purple raider.
My average is around 56 right now
amber mountain
I'm an old gamer, i average 18 😛
in normal...
but I'm also raid leading at the time with a group that desperately needs to be micro-managed
thorny pond
At least you're playing sin and not some arcane non-sense
zinc frost
Just keep coming here, logging kills and you’ll be averaging 90s in no time
amber mountain
ha
spice spire
At least you're playing sin and not some arcane non-sense
We don’t shame mages here
Only boomkin 
amber mountain
I'm also top DPS in my guild, while raid leading (though there's a DH that's slowly out-gearing me)
spice spire
Shame me papi
thorny pond
I shame my feral druids constantly
thorny pond
Oxi makes mages quit
sterile sinew
whats the lore on ds with the frost/scoundrel setup
gusty mirage
Where <@!192059095279337473> at
sup qt
spice spire
That mage should have been shamed
thorny pond
Was telling these people we are toxic to everyone
spice spire
And has been eternalized in RH
balmy condor
whats the lore on ds with the frost/scoundrel setup
You said it, frost and dashing
spice spire
whats the lore on ds with the frost/scoundrel setup
@slow marsh RP’d his heart out to make it work. Then it got buffed
Always lucky rubber ducky
sterile sinew
so if you're running the frost setup and scoundrel deeper strat is the move?
thorny pond
More damage events per/20 means bigger frosty winds
spice spire
Yessir
balmy condor
Deeper strat is always the move
balmy condor
People just play EP/vig cause there’s cleave
sterile sinew
aight i'll try it i got like 1100 crit now and it sims like 200 higher than ep/vigor
arctic hare
People just play EP/vig cause there’s cleave
What if we play it so we have more energy....
spice spire
It’s a bad use then
thorny pond
That's not wrong but it's not optimized
balmy condor
What if we play it so we have more energy....
What exactly does that do
spice spire
I’m just lazy and don’t wanna split ngl
arctic hare
Uhhh, make it feel better to play?
thorny pond
oh you know, ripping keys, out dpsing ele shaman
Had someone compliment me today on pumping in a 19 and I felt so good
limber lion
Be a gangster and play EP/MFD
spice spire
With sbs
thorny pond
Sex without a condom feels better too
balmy condor
Uhhh, make it feel better to play?
I mean it’s a game and if that’s fun to you go for it
spice spire
True homies only
spice spire
Sex without a condom feels better too
Sir this is an assassination spec channel
sterile sinew
arctic hare
I remember getting the anima power on tarragrue that reduced your energy consumption by 30%, ended up using Deeper on that
real bay
both should be baseline for true ASSa experience but thats just too much to ask
pine grove
Any special trinkets to look out for if I'm wanting to go Frost/Dash?
thorny pond
true mut experience is waiting for the other rogue to put up expose
balmy condor
I remember getting the anima power on tarragrue that reduced your energy consump...
I almost wish that it was a good anima power sometimes
balmy condor
Any special trinkets to look out for if I'm wanting to go Frost/Dash?
Phial/fusion amp
pine grove
Ah. same as normal then. Good to know!
arctic hare
Heh, I just take what I get and deal with em for the most part
sterile sinew
if only decanter was good man
arctic hare
don't think i've changed any anima power once
balmy condor
I had to reroll twice now
spice spire
Why
balmy condor
Once cause I got garbage
balmy condor
The other time cause we needed everbeating
spice spire
I’ve done it once for everbeating lmao
thorny pond
I jokingly said loot council is based on tarragrue parses for the week and now it's a law
spice spire
I pugged the grue on mythic
fallen arch
Mad man
spice spire
Beach making the laws 
thorny pond
No. I troll and sometimes I say stupid crap
unkempt pilot
Frost / dashing with Necro still work ? or better to reswap venthyr if going that way ?
spice spire
That’s me every day beach 
thorny pond
but then again my tarragrue parse is top 100 for both specs because I'm a lucky fucca
amber mountain
No. I troll and sometimes I say stupid crap
if the stupid crap/trolling you say becomes law, then you do in fact make laws 😛
spice spire
Nah - grue joke of a boss kinda deadass
fallen arch
Ye
fallen arch
But people in pugs be stuuuupid
balmy condor
Frost / dashing with Necro still work ? or better to reswap venthyr if going tha...
Still fine
arctic hare
Since I got better gear now I guess I'll resim myself to see if vigor/EP is still better
spice spire
They can be just gotta pump more 
balmy condor
Since I got better gear now I guess I'll resim myself to see if vigor/EP is stil...
Ep/vig should never sim better
arctic hare
ohp, its not anymore, epic
arctic hare
Ep/vig should never sim better
It used to when I had like, 206-210 gear
thorny pond
If you ain't first you're last. That's why I sort by boss damage done
balmy condor
Oh well yeah
amber mountain
Yeah, it's more about how you play to make the choice between ep/vig and bs/ds
balmy condor
If you’re undergeared you go vig
arctic hare
Yeah, now I'm 227
balmy condor
But there is not a single sin rogue that’s like 230+ that sims higher with ep/vig on single target
slow marsh
EP/Vig isn't bad but it's like just giving away 100 dps for feelycraft
arctic hare
Right lol
arctic hare
I guess I'll have to figure out how to manage my energy way better
thorny pond
EP/Vig isn't *bad* but it's like just giving away 100 dps for feelycraft
Keep it fair for all the non-fotm specs
arctic hare
Wait, are ep and vigor better in mythic+, hmmmm
alpine latch
If they can show me evidence otherwise
BRB re-simming my rogue
spice spire
45 DPS diff 
strange python
is dashing scoundrel sim bait?
arctic hare
Too bad there isn't a conduit that decreases the energy cost of mut
balmy condor
is dashing scoundrel sim bait?
No
thorny pond
is dashing scoundrel sim bait?
Yea you put in on your fishing line and catch big dps
dusk mason
what too use for bait ?
balmy condor
Sim bait is such a trigger word for me fucking hell
slow marsh
It’s bait if you don’t have poisons on i guess
wounding poison or what
The new SCALING
thorny pond
The only bait dashing will get you is whispyr's hands
nimble tinsel
Sim bait is such a trigger word for me fucking hell
I heard pressing buttons in my rotation is sim bait, confirm/deny?
thorny pond
wowslayer gonna get a perma ban
sterile sinew
deeper strat kinda 📈
nimble tinsel
lmao
lost mist
deeper strat kinda 📈
DS sim bait?
arctic hare
Nah, I just never simmed myself
thorny pond
Can't bait yourself if you never sim yourself
sterile sinew
ye but people actually played it last tier
thorny pond
arctic hare
Hmm, interesting, DS is still better in AOE, oh, I suppose that makes sense
slow marsh
imagine that
thorny pond
I am imagining exsang pumping
arctic hare
Wasn't Exsang like, stupidly powerful back in legion or BFA?
real bay
time to go exsang HB
zinc frost
balmy condor
Wasn't Exsang like, stupidly powerful back in legion or BFA?
It was powerful in legion because of some borrowed power and because it was like 400% rather than the 100% we have now
arctic hare
Heh, amazing
balmy condor
It was powerful in bfa because garrote was a third of our damage
arctic hare
Does it just make the timer go faster?
thorny pond
Does it just make the timer go faster?
That's alter time
arctic hare
Like, Say you have 30 seconds on a bleed, you use it, would it turn into like, 15 seconds but double dmg?
balmy condor
Exsang at its core is one of the most mangled janky abilities in the game
thorny pond
nope
arctic hare
Oh, hmm
balmy condor
But the easy explanation is that it takes a bleed
And reapplies it’s
With double the tick rate
And half the duration
thorny pond
it is
arctic hare
Heh, 400%, thats nuts
balmy condor
It’s clunky because it snapshots haste
But also doesn’t actually take the bleed you have applied currently
It removes the bleeds
And then reapplies them all
arctic hare
oh, that sucks
balmy condor
It’s just
arctic hare
interesting mechanic, but kinda crappy
balmy condor
Really messy
arctic hare
Makes sense why we don't use it now
thorny pond
It's because at one point it was bugged and affected ALL bleeds
which obviously blizz didn't want
and they aren't smart enough to fix
so we got this shit
balmy condor
Exsang is only good if you have a way to create a huge burst window
That’s really it
If you can’t artificially make a burst window happen
Exsang is dog shit like it is now
slow marsh
Let's pray it never comes back tbh
thorny pond
It was making SBS recursive on beta kek
nimble tinsel
Why can't we just exsang our infinite bleed 
slow marsh
Why can't we just exsang our infinite bleed <:monkascheme:585734083590750219>
Cuz it was patched in beta or something when someone found that out
balmy condor
Cuz it was patched in beta or something when someone found that out
Yeah something about ptr servers crashing would do that
slow marsh
Yeah weird
balmy condor
It was raid utility though
Could walk into raid and Exsang sbs on a boss
Until your entire raid dc’d
Kinda huge
slow marsh
Putting rogue on the map let's goooo
cursive silo
maybe if you dc the boss it dies
spice spire
Until your entire raid dc’d
Honestly would save the raid hours of pain tbh
balmy condor
It’s true
balmy condor
Just break the instance server so hard you can’t raid
And then log into Minecraft with the boys
balmy condor
So it tried to reapply the infinite bleed that apparently SBS is
Yeah it did exactly as advertised, removed sbs, and then reapplied it with double the tick rate and half the duration
arctic hare
Hahahaha
balmy condor
The duration is infinite
balmy condor
So you could repeat the process
arctic hare
thats hilarious LOL
and therefore get like, 12 times the tick rate and lag people out, dude, thats friggin hilarious
balmy condor
So you’d get 100% faster, then 100% on that 100% for 200%, then 400% then 800%
After about 3 exsangs you started to lag
Then the fourth caused everyone else to lag
arctic hare
heh
balmy condor
Then the fifth crashed everyone in like a 1000 yard radius
balmy condor
It kinda wasn’t honestly
arctic hare
So like, exactly how fast was the tick rate, less than half a second?
balmy condor
Was like 23k
arctic hare
per tick?
balmy condor
So like, exactly how fast was the tick rate, less than half a second?
Some people got it down to like 0.02 seconds
arctic hare
Jeez
balmy condor
Before the servers shit out
arctic hare
23k per tick at 0.02 seconds is, kinda op
probably enough to kill a raid boss on its own
balmy condor
No like 23k dps
balmy condor
It had to ramp for almost 6 minutes to get to that point
So the early shit dps wasn’t great
But then you exsang’d like 4-5 times
arctic hare
Ahh okay
balmy condor
And it was doing like 40k
arctic hare
But the lag
balmy condor
So it was broken
But like
Not even that crazy
Couldn’t walk into a raid boss and one shot it or anything
Most kill times at the moment wouldn’t even let you stack it hard enough
arctic hare
heh, imagine if you could though
winged kindle
What would cause the DPS gap between EP/Vig and BS/DS to increase?
arctic hare
Uh, the execute phase?
fallen arch
Then the fourth caused everyone else to lag
Hilarious design
balmy condor
What would cause the DPS gap between EP/Vig and BS/DS to increase?
obedience
things that value CP
sylv daggers
winged kindle
Ok yeah that makes sense
And more crit in turn gives higher CP generation with each builder
arctic hare
Why is it that Duskwalker's patch isn't as good? I mean, wouldn't it increase uptime on Vendetta pretty dramatically?
fleet anchor
Because it would have to increase DPS by 7-8% to be competitive
arctic hare
Hmm, good point
vestal wren
its maybe good in pvp
soft shale
tbh exsang does not seem super bad with frost set
finally something that actually makes the talent do something
wintry mica
hey it was good back at like the start of legion
arctic hare
Oh my god, I only now just realized why I was arguing for get 4 combo points before using shiv and vanishing
soft shale
it lasted 3 days
arctic hare
cause I had enough energy to manage that lol
wintry mica
yea perma 10% haste too good
arctic hare
oh wait, I just realized, I'm not too sure when to use fusion amplifier in the opener
balmy condor
tbh exsang does not seem super bad with frost set
soft shale
seem is not reality
alpine latch
oh wait, I just realized, I'm not too sure when to use fusion amplifier in the o...
Bind it to Shiv like a baddie and you’re golden.
alpine latch
Using it incorrectly is better than not using it at all, IMO.
arctic hare
True!
arctic hare
Well I have two on use trinkets now
hollow river
Me too
fading harness
question, if i'm at 4/5 cp, do i still mutilate on boss or do i cast envenom
hollow river
question, if i'm at 4/5 cp, do i still mutilate on boss or do i cast envenom
Envenom
fading harness
ty
dusk void
How bad is explosive affix for assassin?
balmy anvil
could anyone take a look at my logs and tell me what i'm missing? it feels like no matter how good i feel during the fight my damage is subpar. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/darkspear/kittiechan
dusk void
Do you actually switch DPS to orb, or let other DPS deal with it?
balmy anvil
not on the first one, but after that yes, i was also running orbs on our kill
balmy anvil
before the dh left i had some blue parses, but no kill so doesnt count lol
dusk void
No, i was talking to you Trickz lol
balmy anvil
for explosive you just click and your autoattack destroys the orb
hollow river
Yes u right click the explosive affix
Or click the name plate to target it but u need to be close to it
Only get the close ones tbh
Unless no one is attacking one
wooden perch
how come dashing scoundrel sims lower than my obedience. 40% crit rank 3 frost
hollow river
U want them gone before they explode
hollow river
how come dashing scoundrel sims lower than my obedience. 40% crit rank 3 frost
Weird it’s not even close for me and I have less crit
hollow river
how come dashing scoundrel sims lower than my obedience. 40% crit rank 3 frost
What’s your ilvl?
balmy condor
Frost needs some ilvl and rank 3 is like borderline tbh
It doesn’t really happen until like 240-245 and rank 4-5
That’s when it’s really stonks
hollow river
I’m 233 ilvl
balmy condor
Yeah
hollow river
And dashing frost rank 1 is ahead
wooden perch
like around 243 with the gear im simming
hollow river
Ye
wooden perch
im talking dashing scoundrel vs obedience
hollow river
U sure everything in sim is correct?
wooden perch
not frost vs unholy
wooden perch
hmm ill send the sim 1 sec
dark token
could anyone take a look at my logs and tell me what i'm missing? it feels like ...
this is terrague so you should aim for 99% uptime on dots
weak bane
obedience is simming like 200 higher for me as well compared to dashing
pale plank
How much crit do u have? Dashing doesn’t sim higher until u start getting lots of crit
weak bane
38%
balmy anvil
yea i struggle with energy capping when we lust on pull and i pop vendetta on top of that, i'm not sure what I should be doing to fix that?
dark token
could anyone take a look at my logs and tell me what i'm missing? it feels like ...
with dashing and DS you can cap pretty easily actually
balmy condor
Energy capping during that is fine
Wowanalyzer is dogshit
Is what it is
The uptime stuff and cp stuff is fine tho
wooden perch
can you check the sim if im missing something?
balmy condor
can you check the sim if im missing something?
Yeah just got home give me a sec
dark token
but idk like here is an eye of the jailer log where im 2 ilvls lower and dont have a set bonus at all https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/gJZtandkxqRTpWXM#fight=1&type=damage-done&source=1
balmy anvil
so its really jsut managing my bleeds and making sure i finish at max-1?
balmy condor
Ye
dark token
and its like 1.5k dps higher
balmy condor
Just based on that
balmy anvil
i feel like im missing something else
slim pebble
Guild added another raid day to schedule and I can’t make it so I guess I’m back to a m+ Andy. What’s the best way to sim as sin rogue to see upgrades in vault
dark token
its hard to get 100% on that boss
balmy condor
Guild added another raid day to schedule and I can’t make it so I guess I’m back...
For m+ we use dungeonslice
slim pebble
Okay, does the target amount matter?
balmy condor
Dungeonslice doesn’t allow you to change target count
dark token
@balmy anvil try playing with EP/vigor its a bit easier to play and doesnt overcap energy, and barely any lower sim than BS/DS
balmy anvil
is that uptime on just the eye?
dark token
thats overall rupture uptime during encounter
balmy anvil
so if theres an add up during phase 2 and it's not on my side that would lower uptime?
balmy condor
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/xoA1Ag7w2CakXo33MdSYt3
you simmed a 235 dashing homie
balmy anvil
or jsut any rupture on any target?
dark token
any target
balmy anvil
ok thank you
dark token
heres your energy wasted, roughly 2x mine
not saying im a sin god or whatever im just comparing between my logs and yours
balmy anvil
is that eye still?
wooden perch
@balmy condor shouldnt that already be better?
whats the point of getting 262 dashing for like 30dps
lmao
balmy condor
dark token
so i would say try playing with EP/Vigor and maintaining dots a bit better, you can overrite garrote at 5.6 seconds and rupture at 7.4 seconds
if you can get a log on like guardian of the first ones normal would be a bit easier to analyze too
balmy anvil
yea i have alerts for when they are falling off of my current target, its tabbing around for adds where i will let it drop off i think
oh i have a few, hang on
balmy condor
whats the point of getting 262 dashing for like 30dps
oh wow
dashing better
what a surprise
I guess there's no point crafting legendaries at a high item level though, have fun with your obedience
wooden perch
ye no point wasting all those soul cinders for that low of a dps incresae
raven locust
What else would you spend your soul cinders on
balmy condor
What else would you spend your soul cinders on
maw rattle
wooden perch
maybe upping celerity to 262 tbh
raven locust
lmao
wooden perch
outlaw is poomping rn
raven locust
Yea if RNG is on your side
dark token
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/darkspear/kittiechan#difficulty=3&boss...
yeah definitely overcapping energy
balmy condor
or just envenom
envenom
runic reef
I need some help with Shards and Set Bonus - I have all 3 Frost Shards upgraded to Desolate level and have Shoulders w/ Domination socket - BUT only other Domination pieces are helm and chest. Can I get Set bonus using these three pieces?
balmy condor
I need some help with Shards and Set Bonus - I have all 3 Frost Shards upgraded ...
if you have shoulders you can get the frost set
balmy anvil
at least one of those was me getting caught on the stun, and another was me having the bomb, should i just be throwing poisoned knife when im at range?
slow forge
I need some help with Shards and Set Bonus - I have all 3 Frost Shards upgraded ...
as long as u have 3 frost shards and the shoulders it doesnt matter what your other pieces are
they can be feet hands
feet hands shoulders will still give u the set
dark token
at least one of those was me getting caught on the stun, and another was me havi...
if you will cap energy yes
balmy condor
yeh
it's just shoulders for the set
and then 3 gems in whatever slots you want
don't need to have a frost gem in your shoulders either
runic reef
awesome! ty - Is Frost still looking best for raiding Sin
balmy condor
yes
balmy anvil
ok, ty again
balmy condor
frost with dashing
I guess unless you refuse to craft dashing
then dashing isn't good
or something
runic reef
ughh crafted Obedience on back slot as I'm Venthyr? :/
dark token
that still good, especially on aoe, and you can play sub so
slow forge
do i craft dashing? im currently using DB r4
dark token
dsashing is only like 1-2% dps gain, most of the dps gain came from frost set
its worth if you have embers
¯_(ツ)_/¯
i personally crafted 235 doomblade -> 235 obedience -> 262 dashing, now im crafting 262 celerity and 262 obedience
slow forge
i went necro today so im playing zoldycks + and DB raid + PF
pale plank
i just started gearing my rogue llilke 2 weeks ago, so i straight went to dashing
slow marsh
i went necro today so im playing zoldycks + and DB raid + PF
Rip your dps
pale plank
since there is almost no difference at the beginning, i was like i might aswell start early
slow forge
Rip your dps
?
idle star
That feeling of falling further behind cos vault offers no upgrades
slow marsh
Zold in raid
slow marsh
Exactly
kind talon
slow marsh
Also dashing is still better than DB as Necro as long as you have frost same rank as UH
slow oriole
Read the sentence again, he said he plays Zoldyck (in) + and DB (in) Raid + PF
slow marsh
If you refuse to play dashing then obedience is better than DB
slow marsh
Also dashing is still better than DB as Necro as long as you have frost same ran...
This
Then
slow forge
I dont raid on this rogue often its a rat alt i do rat keys with
slow marsh
I see. Well then do whatever I guess lol.
echo cargo
Anyone know if Sylv heroic dagger typically sims higher than a mythic dagger?
jovial goblet
!legendary
obtuse robin
sim it
wintry mica
when you sim with theotar what buff does it use?
hollow river
Guild added another raid day to schedule and I can’t make it so I guess I’m back...
Droptimizer and set it to the ilvl of what your vault will give.
hollow river
Haven’t even seen it on Normal
wintry mica
same
hollow river
wintry mica
finally got remnant dagger out of vault but thats the only one ive seen all tier
raven locust
I've watched 4 legendary bows drop, zero daggies
drowsy parcel
is kevin infinite if i can reset sbs enough?
wintry mica
we only got 1 bow so far
fading adder
with out Doomblade lego do i still open with mutilate or do i open with ambush
balmy condor
if you can reset sbs enough, yeah, sure
sbs adds duration
if you can sbs to refresh that duration
it'll be infinite
untold nest
still think the marrowstone will be better from Heirmir esp with frost gear
drowsy parcel
marileth is barely 100 dps behind for me on single target
with rank 4 frost
so not for me
vocal barn
is it a cape that you want to put obedience on?
winged basin
So I simmed it, but with 13% haste, 35% crit Dashing/Frost, should I run BS/DS
or stick with EP/Vig?
raven locust
Whichever the sims says is best, EP/Vig is good on fights with cleave though
winged basin
BS/DS sims 167 dps higher but dont know if my dashing makes up for my complete lack of haste
raven locust
if the sims says it does more then its better for ST
granite fjord
Does anyone have the trinket called "Decanter of Endless Howling"? Just curious as to if there is a "cap" to how many times it procs or not. It is appealing as hell, but there is almost nothing on icy veins/wowhead on it.
slow marsh
it'll be infinite
I guess the question is would that be better than dumping sbs in a gemstone window 
granite fjord
That makes me so sad. It is so appealing in what is written.
slow marsh
Every minute
balmy condor
I guess the question is would that be better than dumping sbs in a gemstone wind...
yes
slow marsh
Does anyone have the trinket called "Decanter of Endless Howling"? Just curious ...
Uptime is about 40%
raven locust
if you get one should keep it though, Blizz could always randomly buff it
slow marsh
yes
Are sims updated with that usage already ? I want to see cuz I only sim against heirmer and am kinda on the borderline of swapping with big fixes
balmy condor
wdym are sims updated with that usage
slow marsh
Does anyone have the trinket called "Decanter of Endless Howling"? Just curious ...
The issue with the trink is that it gives a secondary stat with mainstat proc, and there's too many good mainstat trinks with damage procs
But I'm currently using heroic version with fusion amp until I get phial to drop or mythic eye trink
pale plank
do you guys use pots?
slow marsh
Twice a fight if able
balmy condor
three times on sylvanas
slow marsh
You're trolling not to unless you're pugging norm/heroic and don't care
balmy condor
whenever possible with cooldowns
pale plank
unless i am blind
granite fjord
The issue with the trink is that it gives a secondary stat with mainstat proc, a...
With my guild being 9/10 on normal, not having any SoD daggers, would the dagger off Soulrender be a better choice for vault?
balmy condor
if you're popping vendetta, pop a potion with it
pale plank
ok, thanks
slow marsh
With my guild being 9/10 on normal, not having any SoD daggers, would the dagger...
Vs what
balmy condor
sim it
slow marsh
Yep
granite fjord
I was afraid you were going to say that, lol
timid talon
Usually the answer for everything
balmy condor
I was afraid you were going to say that, lol
why afraid?
granite fjord
I am not good at simming anything.
balmy condor
!simguide
prisma monolithBOT
Guide to Simming yourself: https://www.wowhead.com/how-to-use-raidbots-sims-stat-weights
For more accurate results you should always sim yourself using Top Gear for gear you already have in your bags
or Droptimizer to see which content drops the biggest upgrade for you. Do not use Stat Weights sims to evaluate gear.
balmy condor
practice makes perfect
granite fjord
I seem to screw something up, haha
granite fjord
Quite true 🙂
balmy condor
I find knowing how to sim yourself and read your own logs
are like
the 2 best things to learn and improve
granite fjord
Which I am trying to do! Took me a long time to get the courage to ask for help, so I am a work in progress
hybrid cosmos
can anyone help me with the bonus id of Dashing Scoundrel?
Grim-Veiled Cape (262)
back=,id=173242,bonus_id=7451/1559
this is obedience
would like to change the line to dashing
hybrid cosmos
i know
balmy condor
hybrid cosmos
its for another
balmy condor
what are you trying to do
hybrid cosmos
ah wait you mean to find the id?
balmy condor
I mean I know the ID off the top of my head
I just want to know what you're trying to do
and see if there's an easier way
usually editing bonus ids is like
the last way to do things
short token
guys on mythic remnant, what specifically are you doing to shadowstep back to the ledge? like in detail
hybrid cosmos
ok, well i "have to" droptimizer my gear with dashing equiped for a new rekill setup roster planungslist
slim wagon
sit on the edge look on the side, shadowstep
hybrid cosmos
and since im from eu and dont really want to build rank 5
drowsy parcel
Dashing Scoundrel
back=",id=173242,bonus_id=6716/7115/6647/6649/1559"
slim wagon
a weakaura to track mass dispel cast might help you
hybrid cosmos
i dont have dashing
balmy condor
ok, well i "have to" droptimizer my gear with dashing equiped for a new rekill s...
aight so here's what you do
fossil kiln
guys on mythic remnant, what specifically are you doing to shadowstep back to th...
are u usin g the double dispel strat?