assassination

[tribal marlin]

I played sub and detroyed the boss

[shy dust]

I think assa is better

But I don’t think the difference is meaningful

[tribal marlin]

But I saw Assa doing very good job as well

[shy dust]

Like basically the same or a bit worse for sub

We get an enhance shaman starting next week though

📈📈📈

[tribal marlin]

Assa if you go Doomblade is straight forward

Like this guy is a very good rogue I respect

https://i.imgur.com/E4RYlcV.png

he doesn't even try to do shenanigan

he just sync everything, damage went when they need to come and he ends up doing top damage

[plucky quail]

I have a nuance question. When you're about to use shiv should you refresh rupture even if it's before the pandemic window and then shiv or just pop it on CD and re-apply rupture a second or two after it falls off and your shiv window is over?

[lost mist]

If it's not in pandemic, then u should be able to pop shiv and use it, and renew rupture later.

Bc pandemic of rupture is like 7ish seconds, so u can still use those secs on shiv. Its better than reapply rupture with 8+ sec or delaying shiv

[plucky quail]

That's how I started tonight but then somehow I got it in my head that I should have it rolling all the time so I would re-apply early. Wasn't sure which was the way to go so thank you

[quick creek]

what % do I want my haste/crit around as sin?

[dim temple]

Uhmm more and more Top neco lords in M+ using the new neco leggo .

[lost mist]

Try simming yourself, there are no softcaps or something, u should play what sims more and feels u comfortable (like not starving energy or getting 2cp every mut lol) , but above 25% crit and above 15% haste sounds good

[quick creek]

with my current gear thats exactly what I am at but outlaw still simming higher for me

I can buy some 230 gear off AH to get better stats but idk if its worth

[lost mist]

What ilvl are your MH for sin and outlaw?

[quick creek]

226mh 220oh sin 226 both ol

[dim temple]

@balmy condor U may look into it at FaQ about neco reown legendary it seems more and more top 10 in the world are using it.. just a note 🙂

[balmy condor]

deathspike?

where are they using deathspike

[slow marsh]

About how much is one singular dps gem worth? I don't have an open slot to sim it but wondering if there's a rough number for say, bek by itself

[marble hemlock]

Zoldyck is just straight up better

[balmy condor]

yeah I agree

[marble hemlock]

Deathspike has more up front damage

But zoldyck is better st and overall

[balmy condor]

I can't find anyone using deathspike can you point me to someone?

[marble hemlock]

Maybe HOA or dos can be deathspike ones

But even then, lots of 3-pulls in dos

[quick creek]

#2 outlaw rogue is using it

[slow marsh]

where the master assassin in keys gang at?

is it just me ?

[marble hemlock]

Hopefully :p

[quick creek]

Tsukima

[marble hemlock]

Ma in keys = no bueno

[slow marsh]

MA is pog

[slim jay]

when im in single target outside of shiv and cds should i be pooling my energy before envenoming or just spam spam spam

[marble hemlock]

You should always pool

[fallen arch]

The leggo or talent?

[slim jay]

like after I use a finisher I use my mutilates in EP window

[slow marsh]

leggo ofc

[slim jay]

then pool to like 2/3s energy

[fallen arch]

Phew

[slow marsh]

that would be tragic

[fallen arch]

Never tried it, but should be fairly equal to zoldyck

[marble hemlock]

It's not

[slow marsh]

it is

actually

[fallen arch]

Getting popcorn

[slow marsh]

if you play it right

[marble hemlock]

There's nothing to play "right" with it

[slow marsh]

which isn't hard

[marble hemlock]

It's not like it takes an advanced degree to use the gcds efficiently

[balmy condor]

the lego is not great

zold is simply better

[balmy condor]

kinda cringe tbh

but even then

[quick creek]

I was just pointing it out, since someone mentioned it

[balmy condor]

this isn't outlaw

[marble hemlock]

assa is not about up-front damage. we dont have abiltiies that facilitate that kind of playstyle. zoldyck on the other hand works perfectly with a ramp spec that has all bleeds and everything running by the time a pull goes into the 30% hp range

in order to make MA somewhat work, youd have to run CT/NS and even then its just such a minor part of your overall damage that you would tailor an entire talent and legendary build around trying to get high upfront damage at the start of a pull, and it just straightup doesnt work with the core-design of the spec

ive tried playing ds/ns/ct with MA to see if its worth running on high targetcount pulls. its not. and even then, its super clunky to play and the early energy regen is just a pain in the ass to get right without starving

[slim jay]

also on pull should I be popping vendetta right away or do I wait until bleeds are up and pop it only when starting my shiv > vanish rotation

[balmy condor]

(also gear is increasing and that directly de-values stat based legendaries like MA)

[fallen arch]

Might be fine overgeared in low keys?

[balmy condor]

(because ya know, crit)

[marble hemlock]

lowkeys would be even better for zoldyck

as lowkey = small pulls = mobs hit execute while subterfuge garrotes are still ticking

[slow marsh]

this is true. i will concede that point. kind of awkward to have crit trinket with MA

[halcyon zealot]

wait if you select "domination shard set bonuses" checkmark on a sim will it always prefer a bonus?

[limber lion]

I honestly don't think so

[balmy condor]

no, that simply enables the bonuses

but the bonuses are very strong and will probably be preferred

[limber lion]

The less hp the mobs have, the higher % of the pull the mobs are affected by the snapshotted NS CT

[fallen arch]

Yes that’s what I thought

[halcyon zealot]

because i have all 9 shards, no unholy set piece; 1 frost and 1 blood set piece and simmed them all and it came out with 3x blood shards being like a 400 dps increase, which i found strange, since i assumed it would have me wear the dps one from each type while i dont have correct bonus

[fallen arch]

But who cares about low keys really

[limber lion]

Which is surely more damage than subt garrotes with Zoldy.

[marble hemlock]

sure, but you cant realistically ramp up properly when running ns/ct

[slow marsh]

snap shotting NS CT into vanish NS CT is massive

You dont need to ramp

[limber lion]

But yeah, I dislike the playstyle of NS/CT quite a bit

[balmy condor]

probably simmed it wrong

or your blood shards are way higher level than your unholy's

[limber lion]

It requires for the tank to pull everything together before you can do amything

And if you get hit by something or the mobs attack you, you lose the stealth effect.

It's a very cheesy and fragile playstyle.

[slow marsh]

See i'm the exact opposite lol. I prefer the MA playstyle better because of how my groups usually play out keys. and zold only sims like 1% or less better so

[marble hemlock]

when a pull lasts 10sec-15sec, youre barely able to get more abilities off than the initial ns/ct., and youd have to snipe low-hp targets for energy with rupture to not starve going into the next pull. which directly goes against the idea of holding 5 CP to start off the next pull with CT

[limber lion]

Yep, each to their own :p

[slim jay]

should I vendetta on pull for my initial bleeds or wait to pop it right before doing the shiv>vanish>envenom

[marble hemlock]

meanwhile a regular build with zoldyck will, even in a 10sec pull, get 3x garrotes+ct+2-3ruptures out

[timid talon]

Another week without daggers

[limber lion]

Use Vendetta after applying bleeds.

[slim jay]

ty

[marble hemlock]

the only environment where i see ns/ct carry strength, is when the pull is so short that you can actually get massive benefit out of carvers eye on the CT

at which point we're talking about 5-10second pulls, and you dont generally have pulls that are that short

[slow marsh]

Yeah idk numbers speak for themselves and I see greater success with MA leggo at a lower ilevel (225) than I do with zold or obedience right now. Also I have more fun with it in general so ye. At the end of the day it doesn't matter anyways cuz if you are being that serious about keys you should just play sub or outlaw so its a moot point

[marble hemlock]

(and thats not even taking into consideration the benefit of having a triple silence opener with iron wire from a utility/tank mitigation PoV)

the numbers would point towards zoldyck though, not MA. (if were talking about sims) unless youre talking about your individual experience ofc. if you see better succes with MA then you can obviously play it, but that doesnt change the fact that zoldyck is simply the superior choice for m+ :/

[halcyon zealot]

that i did.. jfc lol

[marble hemlock]

and assa can more than hold its own in m+, especially on high keys

[silver fog]

Do you think if my progress group struggles with some fights on hc (at painsmith atm) would it make sense to use zoldyck to maximize last phase if we actually get to it?

[marble hemlock]

theres a few dungeons where i can see sub getting some play, but for the most part its just not strong enough on 2-3t pulls to be worth playing in a lot of dungeons due to its mediocre low-target cleave damage.

[slow marsh]

well obviously it can hold its own 😛 yeah i'm rerunning sim to see exact numbers now but last i simmed zold only beat MA by like 80 dps overall and that was using mfd, which you usually dont run with zold anyways. So with it being very close I just rock the build I perform better on (consistent 7-8.5k overall)

[marble hemlock]

i actually lowkey think that assa will be one of the strongest m+ specs this season

[slow marsh]

also, yes if you're pulling 2-3t all dungeon then yes ma is going to be shit

[twilit python]

sub 2-3t is bad but outside of a few dungeons there honestly arent too many terrible pulls

and even then you can generally hold your own even in 2-3ts

[marble hemlock]

the main issue with sub, is that compared to outlaw and assa it has even less utility in keys

the triple silence has massive value, esp with vanish not being that big of a dps CD on aoe so you can hold and use it pretty regularly for the triple silence benefit, outlaw still has gouge although its not as needed anymore now that some of the most dangerous mobs we used to gouge have all gotten nerfed pretty hard, and sub just doesnt have anything unless you start CSing during dance, but thats just a bit too much of a dps loss

[twilit python]

sub prob does have the least amount of utility but idk if its thats far off

[marble hemlock]

with pride gone and most st-burst-heavy classes reigned in a lot, im expecing a lot of highkey bossfights even on fortified to last 2+min, which would give us another vendetta on st in zoldyck range, which is pretty significant as well

[placid dawn]

How is the ST for sin on m+?

[marble hemlock]

its great

[twilit python]

inspiring last week was cancer but cs and very easy kidneys can come in handy

and permanent 30% slow is decent

having to kidney a mob as assa feels so bad

[placid dawn]

I wenn outlaw for m+last season, might look into sin now. I also find it weird that sin has a lower dslice Sim than ST

[marble hemlock]

8-10k st is pretty doable when adding necrotic anima power to the mix

been pushing 10-11k overall in most dungeons, more when you get PI

and thats just doing 15s, things get better on higher keys when stuff lives longer

[slow marsh]

I mean yeah but even then I think it's more just exposing how bursty other classes are vs how consistent our damage is

[marble hemlock]

in 15s i rarely even get full carvers eye value cause the mobs dip sub90% before i get the triple garrote out

[twilit python]

ive only played sin in like one top key this patch so far

[slow marsh]

Yeah idk I am venthyr so I don't have those struggles

[twilit python]

not having prides to always vendetta sounds like it sucks

[slow marsh]

My biggest issues are tank pulling mob into another pack while i'm trying to chill in umbrella shade

[marble hemlock]

well, you mostly skipped prides in highkeys anyway, so now you actually have 4 more targets to vendetta compared to before

[dim yacht]

is the unholy shard set really that good? on sylvanas i only got 15 stacks 5 times i think

[placid dawn]

Just go necro and you don't need to stand on umbrella

[slow marsh]

you just cd the general dudes

even better

because they are spread out from bosses

[twilit python]

some of them are placed kinda aids

[slow marsh]

and almost always have cds back up for boss

[marble hemlock]

thats fine though

even when you have general+boss

it just means you get vendetta back during execute on the boss

[slow marsh]

you still get to use cds on both yeah

our value for ST prio is high for sure

[marble hemlock]

even on massive aoe pulls we're not actually that terrible

you can still sustain like 15-20k on larger pulls over endless amounts of time

[stiff tapir]

Question for bosses that have adds spawn would you go CT? Or stick with poison bomb.

[marble hemlock]

CT, seeing how its already worth using on st anyway

[stiff tapir]

Let’s say like. Dormasain or however you spell it

Ah it is

[slow marsh]

no for raid go pb

[marble hemlock]

low priority, but when you dont have to refresh anything else, you ct on st outside of shiv

[slow marsh]

only ct fight i think is fatescribe

[limber lion]

Eh

[fallen arch]

No

[marble hemlock]

psure at certain haste levels you go CT even for pure st :p

[limber lion]

Soulrender is a CT fight

Nine could br a CT fight

Painsmith can be a CT fight on mythic

[marble hemlock]

nerzhul is pretty solid for CT as well

[limber lion]

They're so close already that just getting multiple targets to smack for just like 10% of the fight puts CT ahead

[stiff tapir]

Probably throw eye of the jailer in there too?

[limber lion]

PB is kinda trash

[marble hemlock]

since you wanna kill orbs before the next set of dispels, so getting extra cleave on it is worth

[slow marsh]

Are we entering whipsyr's nightmares where we take CT on everything

[velvet haven]

generally speaking as assassin you dont need to touch orbs on nerzhuel

[limber lion]

Not yet.

[velvet haven]

that shit gets insta'd

[marble hemlock]

depends entirely on the raid

[slow marsh]

seems like soon tho

[limber lion]

Not true

[twilit python]

nah

they dont

[limber lion]

Not on mythic at least

[twilit python]

you definitely gain plenty of value with ct on nerzhul

[marble hemlock]

even with triple destrolock we often only got 2/3 orbs down before dispels

[velvet haven]

on mythic you would I agree

[limber lion]

Gotta put up dots on those boys.

[velvet haven]

thought he was asking heroic/norm like most ppl

[quaint carbon]

At how much target do you start using fok instead of mutilate to build up in m+ ?

[marble hemlock]

4+

[stiff tapir]

So like when soukrender adds spawn

[marble hemlock]

think at decently high crit that can shift to 3+, or atleast go mut and then fill with fok instead of muti if the first mut gave 3cp already

[stiff tapir]

Might try sin next week but I got 226 weps so iono

[marble hemlock]

you dont really do much on soulrender

you just apply ct and then keep pumping the boss

[quaint carbon]

Ok ty. I sometimes find myself overloaded with many target and multi tab-targeting

[marble hemlock]

other classes just are much better at cleaving the adds, so you dont wanna commit to them

[rocky pecan]

Or just play sub

[marble hemlock]

add damage isnt really a priority unless they are still alive during the dance

[placid dawn]

Wouldn't a rupture on an add be good for energy?

On soulrender

CT fok rupture add and pump boss

[limber lion]

I was at the top of add damage for our kill

Like top 3 every pull

[marble hemlock]

did your monk DC?

[limber lion]

Didn't have a monk dps :'(

[marble hemlock]

or hunters

[velvet haven]

if u wanna look at my soulrender fight log, I have a 97 on it if you need ideas @placid dawn

I used poison bomb on it

[placid dawn]

Mythic?

[marble hemlock]

like, hunters/mage/monk are just so much better at dealing with the adds while still being able to get good damage onto the boss, compared to assa

[velvet haven]

N, heroic, if mythic i'd CT

[limber lion]

I just gar - sbs - rup - sbs - rup - sbs - ct - gar and pump boss

[placid dawn]

I have a 95 on heroic with PB aswell

[velvet haven]

nicu

[limber lion]

Energy starvation for pumpin boss

[marble hemlock]

not even sure if rupturing the small adds on mythic is worth, since its not really a gain for prio on the boss anyway. maybe garrote here or there, rupture the big adds, but besides that id just full tunnel the boss

[timid talon]

ive got pinks on all fights on heroic using pb /shrug

what matters more in heroic is speed

but mythic im sure if it lasts longer that ct would pull ahead

[limber lion]

It's definitely a gain on boss damage.

But yeh, depends on how fast you kill them

We generally just focus boss and cleave adds down.

[placid dawn]

With my guild probably pretty fast. Full of padbois

[velvet haven]

my group runs 2 grippy hands for that fight, so honestly poison bomb might still be better for me on Soulrender particularly

without that i'd still prob go CT

[marble hemlock]

@balmy condor whens the last time we did priodmg sims for 2t to check rupture/garrote on the off-target value?

[balmy condor]

sometime during council

[marble hemlock]

cause im still under the impression that rupture barely benefits, if at all, and garrote was worth doing

[limber lion]

Koji did sims for prio

[marble hemlock]

but thats like

[limber lion]

And both were worth

[marble hemlock]

what it was on jaina, so its been a while

[balmy condor]

we changed the apl in the process

[limber lion]

Even on council where you don't do any damage qith em

[balmy condor]

to account for "energy saturation"

[slow marsh]

energy regen for ST prio makes it worth

[balmy condor]

which is a fancy term for just having enough energy for every gcd

[limber lion]

Soulrender damage is not even "useless" damage either like it was on council

I mean, add damage

[balmy condor]

ends up being somewhere between 4 and 5 bleeds total

usually 5

so like 3 garrotes 2 ruptures, or 3 ruptures 2 garrotes

that kind of thing

any more than that and it's a loss on prio

[marble hemlock]

im assuming that was full duration ruptures

[balmy condor]

correct

[marble hemlock]

any idea how adds dying preemptively changes those results?

[balmy condor]

I went through and optimized the rupture "sniping" if you want to call it

which is what you're asking

[marble hemlock]

cause id assume adds dying before the full duration would skew it a bit

[balmy condor]

like hectic add cleave sims

gained about 2%

[limber lion]

It's great.

[idle star]

why crimson tempest on mythic?

[marble hemlock]

well, it depends on the situation youre in, init

[balmy condor]

target.time_to_die-remains>(4+(runeforge.dashing_scoundrel*5)+(runeforge.doomblade*5)+(variable.regen_saturated*6))```

is the logic

[marble hemlock]

if youre already sustaining high energy due to some haste procs or for others reasons, i.e. vendetta usage, using sbs which is low energy cost builder etc.

[velvet haven]

ads gonna last longer

[balmy condor]

so like with zold

[marble hemlock]

then the multi-rupture would no longer be that big of a gain

[velvet haven]

get actual CT value

[idle star]

are you guys stacking haste up above 30% normally or going all out crit? i know sim yo self but i wanna know

[balmy condor]

it would be rupture snipe on 5 seconds + 0 + 0 + 6 only if you're saturated already

[velvet haven]

i think im

33% crit 18% haste rn

[marble hemlock]

whats the threshold for it to be "saturated"

90+energy?

[velvet haven]

and my haste to crit is like H1.52 to C1.50

[slow marsh]

with the currently available raid gear you can get both

[limber lion]

Mobs dying preemptively whilst still ruptured is not a massive giga thing

You still get benefit from VW

[marble hemlock]

cause im psure the benefit of having high energy/second goes out the window when youre already sustaining high energy with a lower amount of bleeds

[slow marsh]

more energy gen means more boss damage and more envenoms during shiv

[limber lion]

I see no reason not to sbs - rup 3 adds before pumping full on boss

[cobalt hemlock]

can you still ignore the knockback mechanic with shadowstep even on mythic? (remnants of nerzhul)

[limber lion]

Energy starving yourself on a situation with one massive prio target and 5 lesser targets

Is inting

[marble hemlock]

yes bluwe

oh yeah for sure

[balmy condor]

variable,name=regen_saturated,value=energy.regen_combined>35

[limber lion]

And it's not like the mobs die in 3 seconds

At least didn't for us

[balmy condor]

combined being passive regen + bleed tick regen, per second

[marble hemlock]

yeah makes sense

im just wondering if being close to cap already and then going into a low-cost rotation like cev said, i.e. sbs>rup>sbs>rup>fok>ct>st prio would be an overall loss due to being likely to cap energy (or rather, forcing you to funnel boss earlier already, to the point where the multi-rupture would no longer be of benefit due to capping from the VW-death energy surge)

[slow marsh]

about how much time is there in KT from when phylactery spawns and adds spawn?

[marble hemlock]

*overall prio loss

[balmy condor]

I think the loss would depend on how long those adds are alive for

if you're sbs rupturing like p1 sire ghosts

then that would be the way to do it

[marble hemlock]

mhye

btw whens the last time you ran a duskwalker sim?

[balmy condor]

uh like a couple days before the patch

[marble hemlock]

remember what the cdr went up to with 9.1 gear profile?

cause im lowkey considering running duskwalker on soulrender if i can push the cdr to a certain amount

but dunno if 1:10min vendettas are realistic at all

[balmy condor]

I can double check

[marble hemlock]

but yeah, been kinda wondering if dashing or dusk might be a better play on soulrender

[slow marsh]

if anything wouldn't you just run obedience?

[marble hemlock]

im not venthyr

[slow marsh]

oh yeah

[balmy condor]

seli is a diehard necro

[slow marsh]

rip you

[marble hemlock]

not my fault you havent seen the light yet

[slow marsh]

na i was actually all in on necro stonks because i still believe their soulbinds are better

I feel like it'll end up being one of those in practice > sim potential kind of things

But we'll see

[marble hemlock]

not atm

because token of appreciation is busted

making theotar quite a bit better in mythic progression than any other soulbind

but yeah, people just focus on max-renown sims a bit too much atm

and dont consider that the ~2% gap is easily made up for due to most fights having multi-target situations. the main issue with necro in SoD is that half the bosses dont refund spikes when adds die

[slow marsh]

i think when people start leveling out gear for prog and aren't undergeared as much then the dam from necro will outweigh the token

[marble hemlock]

absorbs are never bad

its why disc is still a thing despite the countless number of nerfs

and token of appreciation is just way too much healing

[balmy condor]

@marble hemlock t27 profile with dusk gets it down to almost 60

64.3 according to the sim

1:10 seems pretty reasonable

[marble hemlock]

hmmm

might actually try it then

cause im wondering if the benefit of getting 3 extra vendettas on boss might outweigh the doomblade bonus at that point

With killtimers being somewhere around ~7:20min

[slow marsh]

well if you try it

make sure it's before friday

[balmy condor]

can try that

[limber lion]

7:20 is pushing it

At least not a single public log with a 7:20 kill, not sure how fast the big boys have done it

[marble hemlock]

should be fine with this resets worth of gear

[limber lion]

That's true

[silver fog]

Do you think if my progress group struggles with some fights on hc (at painsmith atm) would it make sense to use zoldyck to maximize last phase if we actually get to it?

[limber lion]

This reset is probably giga

[marble hemlock]

as it allows you to ignore the last add wave

[limber lion]

A lot of people getting full sets

Yeh

[balmy condor]

no

[marble hemlock]

so you just cc the small adds, ignore big add, and once he reaches garrosh he just makes the small adds immune to cc, at which point you just interrupt them but overall you gain like ~1minute of pure boss nuke instead of having to deal with adds again

[echo island]

What do i take 😂

Already got good rings

[stiff thicket]

Sim it 😄 !

[echo island]

😄

[lean sinew]

Damn, a heartbreaking vault. I want both so bad xD

[slow marsh]

tragic

[muted linden]

amazing bro

[obsidian socket]

edge of fuckin night wtf???

[muted linden]

is raidbots simming the Sylv dagger procc correctly ?

cuz when i Sim the dagger its only a 50 DPS increase

got also one in the vault thats why im asking

[obsidian socket]

Enchant it?

[plucky sluice]

sadly again no sylv dagger or 252 dagger or trinket. but ring is rly rly nice and both helmets for my unholy shards - i think i will wait for hc raid if head dropps or not

[vestal wren]

i am not sure if i would take edge over phial

[plucky sluice]

woow how lucky xD

[lean sinew]

of course now I will not see the trinket in the vault for the next 6 months 😄

[obsidian socket]

Well weapon damage rules priority though

[slow marsh]

i mean you can farm a 246 phial right

[vestal wren]

i am just not sure what is more common to get

[vestal wren]

true

[kind veldt]

Sitting here at runecarver debating on making obe or doomblade 262

x_x

[stiff thicket]

i'd rather have a 246 edge of the night over the phial and farm phial to 246

IMO

Sim both just to be sure

[wild beacon]

aren't you going to need another edge eventually anyway?

[slow marsh]

statistically edge of night is the pick just because it's not farmable like phial is

[wild beacon]

i'd take the first

[tidal gorge]

Man... 3 unholy set is freakin busted. Just completed it tonight

[regal river]

Got an Edge of Night 246 as well but can also choose unholy head which gives me the bonus cus i have the 3 shards. On top of that a IQD 252 😂

[wild beacon]

i've got the slots but can't get the fucking shards

[regal river]

Surely edge of night above unholy head is more worth it no? Since u can farm 4 bosses for head

[stiff thicket]

i've got 2 shitty shards in 2 weeks

[lean sinew]

I am simming it, but will probably take the dagger either case, 246 phial will be good enough if I never see one 252 in the vault

[timid talon]

my thought is take the phial, you'll never replace it

[timid talon]

probably the trinket, do you plan on raiding mythic?

[echo island]

yeps

That salvaged infusion trinket is actually simming pretty good

[marble hemlock]

fuck this torghast week

im not getting any SBS refunds

[balmy condor]

I heard a lot of top 10 world players are using deathspike maybe try that?

[gentle gyro]

that's the wrong dagger, blizz

[marble hemlock]

i mean i like my cov ability

getting broken on half the fights

[keen swallow]

how strong is the salvaged fusion amp?

[marble hemlock]

and being useless this week in torgh with this torment

[balmy condor]

Very

But that’s 226

And we don’t like that

[keen swallow]

I got a 239 in vault

[balmy condor]

That we like

[gentle gyro]

i didn't get to raid with my rogue all that mcuh this week

[tidal gorge]

I would take a 226 over the skulker I still have. Tired of getting yeeted across the room on stuff like eye

[keen swallow]

i already got a belt from last week kekW

[gentle gyro]

guess I'm takin the dagger

[keen swallow]

is the tormented rack fragment pepega?

[limber lion]

This game really wants me to play sub

Just got the ritual ring with a socket

[stiff thicket]

😮

[limber lion]

Phial next week for sure.

[timber abyss]

@balmy condor haste + crit is the best secondary stats when crafting legendary?

[balmy condor]

Das what the #assassination-faq says yuh brother

[gentle gyro]

for sure

[timber abyss]

@balmy condor i checked there but didnt saw information about that, that`s why i ask

[balmy condor]

Wait did I forget that part

I thought I wrote it

[keen swallow]

opinions on titanic ocular gland?

[timber abyss]

no

[gentle gyro]

just put a giant everywhere

[zinc frost]

It’s in there

[balmy condor]

Oh

Pfew

[limber lion]

It is there

[balmy condor]

Got it

[limber lion]

Yeh

[balmy condor]

Is aight

Not great

But is aight

[timber abyss]

@balmy condor sorry

[limber lion]

Better uptime than what most people seem to think.

[keen swallow]

Probably worth using if u can get high uptime on it, right?

Yeah, using it in dungeons i get around 97% uptime

[limber lion]

I mean it's around 95% uptime in raids as well

[ebon thorn]

honestly think im shadowbanned from weapons

[limber lion]

If it sims high, use it

[keen swallow]

also using hc decant of endless howling, raidbots wants me to replace the decanter with fusion :S

[limber lion]

[ebon thorn]

fr

got weapons on my dh and my druid

but my main? nah

[limber lion]

That was my life in 9.0.5

[ebon thorn]

it is what it is

[limber lion]

Just get em

[ebon thorn]

yes

just spam another 20 plaguefalls 20 mists

few SD's here and there

might get 1

[deft obsidian]

Took me 29 instances /w daggers last week but we got em 😂

[lethal copper]

yo guys do you think edge of night 233 would be better option than any of the 252 armor pieces ? my main hand rn is 229 and off hand 207

[gentle gyro]

if your offhand is 207

definitely Edge

you want a domination socket for chest eventually anyways

[balmy condor]

All good, I had to double check as well :P it’s still very new

[lethal copper]

oh yea thats true forgot about that, ty

[strange python]

PV STONKS!? ZOMG!

[mossy crown]

hooray 252 Tanglewood Thorn.

[marble hemlock]

i swear SBS is really trying to give sef a run for its money as the most bugged ability in the game

[limpid plinth]

Hah did my first vault december 20th and still never seen weapon in vault

[fleet anchor]

Haha

[ebon thorn]

like its fine not getting weapon but

[marble hemlock]

im just not getting refunds at all

[fleet anchor]

My head might explode trying to keep track of all the things that refund vs don’t refund

[marble hemlock]

in torghast atm

[ebon thorn]

when my alts gets them every week

u start to wonder

[marble hemlock]

idk if its due to torments

ill learn now

[fleet anchor]

But not had any issues in Torghast

[limpid plinth]

Yep did literally couple of vaults on my monk and he got 226 wep and phial instant

[strange python]

better than my vault, my LARGEST upgrade was a 13 dps upgrade solely for dungeon slice sub

[fleet anchor]

It’s not weak

Boring? Maybe I suppose. No different than any other on use damage trinket.

[strange python]

I mean skulkers wasn't boring

it would throw you directly into the path of incoming damage all the time

[marble hemlock]

like

[fleet anchor]

When it worked right it was boring

[marble hemlock]

they broke smth

super hard

a few days ago

i think recasting sbs on the asme target might remove the trigger for it having a spike active or smth

[fleet anchor]

Certainly possible although not seen much myself

I may test more later

[marble hemlock]

ill have to test it in a solo run

im doing it with a pally atm

and i either get refunds

~3-5sec after mobs die

[fleet anchor]

Only massive bugs I saw were with Deathspike

[marble hemlock]

or not at all

[fleet anchor]

And lots of stuff not refunding since it technically doesn’t die

Remnant orbs

Tank adds on KT

Few others

[limber lion]

Yeh I love sbs

And hate it at the same time

[fleet anchor]

Mostly it’s good though

[limber lion]

Most things in SoD don't reset it and it's so frustrating

[fleet anchor]

Positive side

[limber lion]

P2 mobs on Sylv, balls on Painsmith (EVEN THOUGH IT REFUNDS RUPTURE ENERGY)

Like

[fleet anchor]

It refreshes Dyz forever 😛

[limber lion]

What

[marble hemlock]

like

5 mobs

[fleet anchor]

Painsmith has a lot of stuff disabled

[marble hemlock]

5 deathspikes

they all die

i get 2 refunds

how

[fleet anchor]

Though

[limber lion]

Yeh

It's just weird how VW works

[fleet anchor]

Pain balls have like both kill and high hp procs disabled

[limber lion]

But sbs reset doesn't

[alpine garden]

Got myself a normal sylv dagger from vault

[limber lion]

Both have the same variable in simple form

[marble hemlock]

but

[fleet anchor]

Don’t get Carvers Eye either for example

[marble hemlock]

you can reset sbs

on pain balls

[limber lion]

If mob is dead

[limber lion]

Nope

[fleet anchor]

Don’t think First Strike works on them either

[stiff thicket]

What ? balls on Painsmith reset my sbs

[limber lion]

Not on mythic

:D

[fleet anchor]

So I think they basically disabled most procs on the balls

[marble hemlock]

psure im even getting resets when the balls just reach the end 😄

[limber lion]

[marble hemlock]

not always tho

[stiff thicket]

Oh 😄 i'm not there yet

[limber lion]

Yeh pretty sure I did as well on hc

But on mythic

Never

[stiff thicket]

just because

[fleet anchor]

Are you using Deathspike leggo?

[stiff thicket]

we don't know why xD

[fleet anchor]

Deathspike cleaves definitely fuck with refunds

That was broken right before the patch went live at some point

[sand heath]

is IQD still simbait as it was, I am necro I know it interacts well with Venthyr, but wasnt sure if it still over weighted in sims due to how it works?

[marble hemlock]

ye

but it wasnt an aissue

last week at all

and i ran like

[marble hemlock]

15 torghasts with deahtspike

[thin imp]

Hi all, I am a bit of confused here, I am always told that you should take the weapon in the vault except if you have a bis trinket or something like that, according to simulation shadowgrasp totem ilvl252 makes a better improvement over voracious gorger spine ilvl 249, should I listen to the simulation or just take the dagger?

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wAPMkEtTtCBmRfUP6TCG6V

[limber lion]

3min painsmith with 3 ball waves

And spikes on each of the first balls we kill on each wave

:/

[misty holly]

Shadowgrasp sims very well. If you want to use that trinket take it.

[marble hemlock]

the saddest part is

that WLs do get refunds

on the orbs for example

but sbs doesnt

even though its virtually the same mechanic

[fleet anchor]

But yeah Deathspike cleaves seem broken for refunds and probably the Torghast trait that is the same thing with the cleave

Not sure when it was broke

[misty holly]

It looks like shadowgrasp might be bad for fights with too much movement though

Since it requires 15 seconds and Im not sure what the range for it is.

[marble hemlock]

im sure its jhust smth removing the "sbs active" trigger

thats why sometimes it seems to give 1cp now

or why refunds dont work on targets

[limber lion]

Yeh I've noticed that sometimes I get 1cp even though I have a spike on a different target already

[marble hemlock]

i mean

i got

triple 1CP sbs

when hitting sylvanas

when she had the dot up already

[limber lion]

It's so annoying

[stiff thicket]

I noticed that too

[marble hemlock]

triple SBS, 3 CP

🙂

[fleet anchor]

The range is like 60 yards. It’s a non issue

[dim temple]

is worth to crap neco lego for m+ ?

craft

[marble hemlock]

no

[dim temple]

ty ❤️

[limber lion]

Depends

If you like having fun but doing less dps

Go for it

[marble hemlock]

ye

its fun to play

and very smooth

[dim yacht]

is anyone else just randomly getting unstealthed in torghast?

like straight up, i stealth and instantly i get broken out, nothing is hitting me

[dim temple]

I dont get it, my vault i can take a chest 246 chest with crit and haste my old one have same stats but are 226. but simc wants me to take 239 hands with Dom socket and my glovers are 226 with haste and crit but the vault glovers are Vest and mastery

[rancid warren]

SBS fkin bugged rn, keep getting 1CP SBS on dotted target Moreover, SBS dot on training dummies expire like in 3 sec wtf

[misty holly]

I didn't notice anything weird with SBS in raid tonight

[idle hornet]

how important is the edge of night weapon?? a 239 tanglewood thorn sims better than a 233 edge of night. Is banshee blight not that good?

[shut garnet]

u wot?

[balmy condor]

Yeah idk

I saw it earlier from a guy as well

But I don’t know why it happens

This is Assassination, but no, that’s not right

Check the pins in sub

[marble hemlock]

i think

[rotund torrent]

sorry ill delete the message

[marble hemlock]

i figured out what bugs it in torghast

@fleet anchor

youre not gonna believe this

it seems they fucked it

so now the main spikje target

doesnt refund

but secondary ones do

but not like super consistently

omg

what is this game

it also seems that mawsworn enemies just dont refund sbs at all

probably smth to do

with the fix on mawsown enemies on sylvanas

wouldnt be surprised if the sylvanas on-deaht effect fix fucked smth up in a major way

[placid pagoda]

Done an insane amount of M+ per week (10 slots + more) and 6/10 HC clear per week and still no daggers from that or vault god save me@

[soft shale]

pvp has your back

[placid pagoda]

Think im going to need to now

[gusty adder]

did we have a trinket overview somewhere?

[heavy forge]

Hey guys ! I've the guardian trinket, do you use it on cd or is it better to line it up with Vendetta ? don't really know how to sim that

[keen dome]

just run a quick sim with the trinket and check when the trinket is used in the Sample Ability Log

[tulip nacelle]

trinkets don't interact with vendetta, just use on cd

[marble hemlock]

@limber lion welp

seems that

casting SBS on a target more than once

will make it not refund

the charge anymore

🙂

[strange python]

is this very pog

or little pog

[thin trout]

man i got a 252 head/shoulders/gloves from M+ so bad i cant use any of it because of dominiation sockest

andall my heroic loot also crap

[gusty adder]

how is 252 IDQ really ?

And is it worth taking over 226 headpiece with dom-socket, considering I have all three unholy shards

Im thinking short vs. long term gains here

[slow marsh]

Are you venthyr

[edgy whale]

guys, how come most of the top logs show assa rogues with doomblade, even tho obediance sims higher in ST and DS for assa? why do most player play with doomblade?

[strange python]

its easier to manage i guess

[gusty adder]

no - im necro atm - considering going vent after Ive grinded out 2s in PvP

[tropic ocean]

probably because they dont want to waste gold to craft it on r3 and will craft it on r6 directly but also difference is minor

[slow marsh]

I'll be crafting doomblade rank 6 because of the plug and play is worth more than the possible 40 dps gain or whatever it is. Also keep in mind sims are full bis with full shard ranks

[idle star]

Yeh can reliably get 233 daggers atm from pvp

[gusty adder]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/2MYJ1APA4iRbywqmRTAYF5

[soft shale]

wrong quote my friend

[gusty adder]

Atm 252 IDQ sims 400 higher, while the 226 dom socket (with rank 3 unholy) sims 1k

[slow marsh]

I guess the question is #1 are you gonna go venthyr and if yes, how can you guarantee you get a helm this week from 2-4 boss kills

[gusty adder]

Im probably not going venthyr within the next 2-4 weeks (considering necros position in pvp). But why is IDQ better for vent than necro?

[limber lion]

Honestly, what the hell

How is that even possible

🍝

[marble hemlock]

my best guess is they tried to fix some sbs bug with deathspike or smth

[strange python]

Big fucking sadge. 98% on nine but no Dom set

[marble hemlock]

or fix it not working on most adds

[slow marsh]

Bc they values crit more than Necro so iqd landing on crit is just better vs what it does for necro

[marble hemlock]

and instead they just fucking broke everything

[gusty adder]

Aha - I havnt been using IDQ as assas before, but would have thought that I was lining it up with vendetta

[slow marsh]

I mean it doesn't really matter either way. You pop it and you get big crit numbers for more cp. More cp good

[plucky sluice]

Just wanted to ask here if sbs is bugged...at fatescribe mostly (bot always) getting only 1 CP. Even with dot on adds and boss.

Most annoying is opening pull with sbs not giving any CP or dot on boss but costs 1/3 of abs ;(

[strange python]

How to get 99 parse without Dom set :(

hi

[slow marsh]

Necro has gemstones which is a mild but more consistent iqd. Venthyr doesn't so they want it more for flag windows

[strange python]

is assa nice nowadays in keys?

[bleak notch]

hey !
have question about stat weight sims - does https://www.wowhead.com/item=180116/overcharged-anima-battery?bonus=7606:7359:40:1560:6646&ilvl=246 use effect participates in stat weight sims?

[strange python]

Sin is fine in keys. Sub and outlaw are better though

[slow marsh]

Play what you want in keys. Doesn't matter until you get to higher keys anyways (18-20)

[quaint carbon]

is Zoldyck the best overall lego? my casual ass need to craft R6 but i dont wanna craft obe incase i ever switch back to necro

[slow marsh]

Doomblade then

Just don't do keys with it tho

[quaint carbon]

yeahh thats why i said zoldyck i wanna do keys too

[strange python]

so zold better than obed?

[tropic ocean]

pump?

[slow marsh]

Then do keys with a lower ilvl until you can craft big zold. Unless you care more about keys than raid but at that point learn sub or outlaw

[quaint carbon]

yeahh seems smarter

ill craft big doomblade and do with R4 zoldyck for now

[slow marsh]

Sounds like a good idea to me

[marble hemlock]

there seems to be a new bug with SBS, yes

where it simply doesnt generate extra CP anymore based on however many bleeds are active, including sometimes generating 1CP only on st

[dim temple]

So if Ventyr. Craft Doomblade to rank 6 or Obedience , it seems most ventyr stil using Doomblade on logs. and i simc best with doom so just craft Obedience to 235 for aoe? is this the best way to go?

[digital zodiac]

similar situaiton with me @dim temple .. currently obedience actually sims best on ST and AOE... but i guess sims take into consideration 100% uptime?

[dim temple]

I think so.. but I really like to know for most ventyr rogues on the logs are still using doom

[slow marsh]

Cuz doom is plug n play and sims higher right now for current gear

[dim temple]

ahh ok so later on and with the repwn level it going to best

[slow marsh]

In full bis gear sure obed is better because of consistency of flag stacks + vers affecting bis trinkets and set bonus...dagger procs, that stuff

They are close enough to where it doesn't really matter

[dim temple]

ok so for now just doom as for rank 6? and save up for obedience later

[slow marsh]

Sure, or if you are ever thinking about messing with Sub obed would be the play. Either way it isn't going to make that big a difference for most people

[dim temple]

Ever going to play sub

[iron orchid]

if you wanna play obed in M+ it can also affect your choice

[slow marsh]

Yes that too

[dim temple]

Raider is main m+ just more ok noting eles to do and make my weeky

[digital zodiac]

so if this is the case, and obed is simming best for me even now, then its prob a safe bet?

[slow marsh]

Yes

[modest jasper]

Helmet in Vault and 3rd unholy from Sylvanas

Casual 800 dps increased from set bonus. What a joke

[gusty adder]

so how do we use IDQ considering its 3min CD and Vendetta's on a two?

[digital zodiac]

only about 5-10% of top 100 players on each boss use obedience tho

[slow marsh]

Then don't use it

[odd hazel]

if it sims higher for you

use it

if not

dont

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[jagged osprey]

if you need to ask whether obedience is good for you

pro tip: its probably not

[manic pebble]

Obed is bad on my sim

Doomblade ftw

[odd hazel]

doom only wins on Pure ST

obedience pretty much wins in dungeon slice

[manic pebble]

My zoldy is somehow sim better in dslice

kek

[odd hazel]

triple theo?

[manic pebble]

Yes

[odd hazel]

odd, but thats what sims are for ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[manic pebble]

This was the sim https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ig2ADaGqZtGf4ZYjnvVht7

[radiant fossil]

Got a 252 dagger last week

[manic pebble]

Pog

[radiant fossil]

But this dagger isnt that pog tbh. its like 0.7% upgrade dps. Im disappointed

[void igloo]

how much better is sylv dagger? i have the option between 239 dagger and sylv normal (233)

[opaque mauve]

Probably better, sim would say

[slow marsh]

That's it, im gonna craft dashing

[fossil raptor]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/3SvEHDQuS9KNqJGSAQ7A9J get boots or trinket ? fkin vault ;O

[odd hazel]

TRINKET

boy

unless you have unholy gems

then i might take the boots

[strange python]

really unsure what i should take here... boots and chest are domination socket pieces (chest sims highest with +97 dps increase)

was thinking maybe i should take the 239 legs or the pvp dagger and try to get rival for 240 - what do you guys say?

[fossil raptor]

have only 1 uh gem but shit

i wanted to get trinket

boots will drop somehow in raid

[river kelp]

Wich soulbind would you reccomend besides Heirmir for assa raid. I dont have enough conduit energy to permanently switch them so i need to use another one of them 3 >.>

When im looking in the pins i guess its Marileth

[sterile chasm]

Is this sylvanas dagger op or not?

[soft shale]

its really good ye

can be beaten on main hand but for off hand even normal beats most mythic weapons

[sterile chasm]

We want 2 of them or 1?

[soft shale]

two hc beat everything until mythic sylv

[lavish stag]

is shadowgrasp totem really this good or am i getting jebaited here

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bdStN8UCAeDwjnZhbJesVg

[odd hazel]

its really that good

oof on that codex

[ember forum]

with MA, should i be trying to have an envenom as i come out of stealth?

[lavish stag]

got jebaited hard last week

[celest marlin]

Quick help plz. 2nd Silvanas dagger from normal dif or Domination socket head hc version ?

[odd hazel]

do you have unholy gems?

[celest marlin]

2 frost 1 unholy in bags atm

[odd hazel]

i'd personally take the dagger then but, before i say that

what are your two daggers?

[charred wraith]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/jtngavMyneCn6iLDrY2ewK
isnt 3 piece blood gem set blood link supposed to win?

[odd hazel]

our go to is the unholy set

and the damage blood and the damage frost

[charred wraith]

i dont have head

i know our go to is unholy

[dark swift]

frost is fairly close to unholy tho

[celest marlin]

239 mh random dagger 233 silvanas in offhand atm

[odd hazel]

take the helmet then tbh.

[plain zealot]

Hey guys! im kind of confused about the legy stuff.. i can craft the Doomblade or the Flag Legy today. at pins its rlly close for ST and in DungeonSlice Flag is far ahead.. but when i sim myself Doomblade is beetter in any situation. how can this happen?^^

[lavish summit]

Does sylvanas daggers stack? It's worth to have 2 daggers?

[odd hazel]

doom shouldnt ever be ahead in Dslice

[odd hazel]

yes it does stack, but i believe a 252 MH and sylvanas OH is the go

Sim for best results

[twin prism]

Do you guys recon that realistically doomblade still would perform better?

In bosses with some downtime, or nah?

[frosty cedar]

252 weapon last week, 252 totem this week blessed

[twin prism]

fuck you

[frosty cedar]

still 220 phial tho

16 plaguefalls still no drop loot karma

[plain zealot]

thats why im so confused.. i would prefer the flag legy cause i can use it for both and for st its not that far away from doom.. but after my simds its just weird. dont wanna craft the wrong one^^

[odd hazel]

link the sims?

[plain zealot]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wSGgc73wY9SnUGJc8BHUzw

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/7gHnRwFsxPMnkTfP2GHACo

[odd hazel]

oh

you're still in ST set up for the Dslice

[plain zealot]

ah.. lawl

ure right -.- xD

[odd hazel]

also

fuck you

252 phial

get out

yall are some lucky people lmao

[plain zealot]

im sry. just got it today. whole season 1 i never got this damn trinket

[odd hazel]

i did get a 252 weap this week and 242 last week so i cant complain

[odd hazel]

Glad you got it! it took me FOREVER just to get a 220 lmao

[jagged osprey]

meanwhile im here with 252 gear on all my dom socket slots

[odd hazel]

prob will take all season to get another one

[jagged osprey]

and no dom socket slots nor dps shards to go in

[odd hazel]

im not worried about dom sockets until i actually get the shards for them.

[jagged osprey]

such a bullshit system 😦

[odd hazel]

its a fine system just

sucks you cant farm a certain boss

for a certain gem

or that M+ doesnt drop them

[jagged osprey]

its fucked

[odd hazel]

RNGesus be with you

[jagged osprey]

someone can be a few ilvls behind me

but just because they got lucky on 3 shard drops

be several hundred or even 1k+ dps ahead of me

just cause rng

[odd hazel]

i mean, they could of done that last season too

if you have shit trinkets but a person has both BiS trinkets at max then rip

[teal bloom]

Not to the same extent

[jagged osprey]

thats not the same

at all

lol

[odd hazel]

its the same idea though

just not as powerful

[jagged osprey]

might be slightly comparable to old tier set bonuses

except shards of dom are objectively worse than tier sets

[odd hazel]

atleast its not azerite power

[jagged osprey]

trueeee

[ebon thorn]

damn

from 0 dom shards to 3x Unholy rank 3's i get 900 dps

st

🤔

[jagged osprey]

lmao

[teal bloom]

FeelsBadMan when your best upgrade from vault is a 249 decanter trinket when you already have a 246 one

[jagged osprey]

case in point

[ebon thorn]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/a6YaBYejFCoiRRtbq6dRRB

[odd hazel]

never said yo uwere wrong, just the problem has always been there

[strong elk]

Hi guys do you know if i better put sylvanas dagger main hand with lower ilv for a better proc rate?

[winged rock]

Which missives for obedience guys?

[eager river]

crit/haste

crit/vers can also be good if you plan to use for multiple specs

[olive peak]

Hey bois, what bonus set are we after ? And what slot is it on

[vestal wren]

you want the unholy 3 set

[sonic schooner]

i want friends and energy regen, not a set bonus

but yea, unholy set from the headpiece

[olive peak]

K cool

I don't have a single unholy gem

Hahah

[balmy crane]

i have 2 dom socket items from raid... that are both gloves, and the leather purchasable item is also gloves.

fml

[sonic schooner]

the purchasable gloves are shit anyway, still good if you need your 3rd gem spot, but otherwise ewwww stats

[mint kindle]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[queen herald]

Any idea on how good is the new tazavesh trinket ?

[solid venture]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/7qSLxMWSvBqfGcNGWWhi7L unholy set too good

[lavish summit]

Lmao, u were on my sylvanas party 5 min ago xD

[solid venture]

oh rly

hi there xD

[limber lion]

237 and only 8.7, unlucky

:'(

[limber lion]

The 233 sack? Really good

It gets outshined by max level m+ trinkets and mythic raid trinkets, but it's really good for how accessible it is

[queen herald]

Yeah i was wondering since a few of my guildmates run it

[solid venture]

give me ur weps ceverion

[limber lion]

:')) no

[solid venture]

yes pls

i beg

[queen herald]

But i own a 239 one from guardian and a phial so i don’t really know

[ebon notch]

i finally got my unholy set bonus

but i lose 500 dps from sub to assa

is that expected

[queen herald]

Sub sim higher but i doesnt really apply tbh

I do sim 700ish higher and still perform better as assa, could be on my end tho

But doubt i could fuck it up that bas

Bad*

[ebon notch]

thats what i was thinking

cause yesterday i did a boss as sub

and lost 1k dps

i asked here and there were small mistakes but idk

[queen herald]

I guess there is a reason most « top guild » run sub instead of assa

[odd hazel]

Burst dps

[queen herald]

But it is more linked to damage profile

Than actual overall dps

You def can pad better as assa

And there is so little public logs regarding sub rn

[ebon notch]

idk shuriken tornado and shit

[queen herald]

True but the rais is either, pure single or single with cleave or burst aoe

Assa is way better at cleaving and on par with singlz imo

Burst aoe is already done by hunters or random classes

[odd hazel]

you dont really bring rogues for cleave

we are really good at st/2t/3t

but add cleave is already handled 90% of the time

[ebon notch]

are you guys running subterfuge on the nine?

[odd hazel]

nope

[ebon notch]

yh thats what i thought

[oak canopy]

I've been trying to figure out the best way to open on the 9

[ebon notch]

i mean if ur using MA

you can just wait and set up ur dots

then go full ham with normal ST rotation

its a long term fight right they arent just gonna melt

at least on mythic

[oak canopy]

Do you hold your vendetta until your set up?

On both targets

[ebon notch]

the way i would do it

would be to set up rupture on both

garrote on main burst target

then shiv to get 5 cp

flag vendetta vanish envenom

and go from there

[lavish stag]

[quaint carbon]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz

[quaint carbon]

!dfef

!def

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Defensives usability: http://tiny.cc/q602uz

[misty holly]

Anyone know how much dps the blood or frost set do? I have the chest and the shoulders but no helm, so unholy set isn't possible right now.

[limber lion]

I mean

sim it?

[soft shale]

you can run rank 2 blood for a while

its only 15 cinders

frost set is heavily undertuned

the off gems of frost are lit tho

chances are you run both of them in m+

[dark swift]

bloodmallet's showing frost set as bis

how is that undertuned

[soft shale]

nani

[sick aspen]

saw that too, was unholy earlier today or last night.

[modest jasper]

I mean.

Having had both frost and unholy.

I can about 98% say that Frost is not BiS

😛

[azure flare]

Wasnt frost set even bugged lol

[bleak phoenix]

if your rupture has fallen down during shiv window do you refresh it? or do you envenom and refresh it after the shiv window

[azure flare]

You should probably make sure that doesnt happen to begin with

[hexed karma]

guys our new best slot for doomblade is back right ? I'm going to buy the piece now and i dont want to make a mistake...

[azure flare]

Yes cagu

[bleak phoenix]

i mean thats a given. but it doesnt answer my question

[hexed karma]

thank you

[keen dome]

You refresh rupture during shiv

[bleak phoenix]

thanks

[azure flare]

You eat the loss

And ye rupture

If u find that happening often try to pool more energy prior to shiv

[next dune]

Yeah I typically throw a quick small combo point rupture on the target to keep it rolling. Usually can still catch an envenom before shiv falls off. It rarely happens to me anymore, but we've all been there man lol

[safe rover]

what leggo is best for tyran weeks? obedience or zoldyk?

[next dune]

I ran obedience in mists yesterday, was very pleased with the results

[swift lance]

do you guys use oil or sharpening stone in raid? ST. and also do youse phantomfire still or agi pots?

[worn geyser]

Is Sylvanas dagger still pretty strong for us? In sims the normal version i got only simmed 100 dps above my current, despite my current being 213 ilvl

[strange python]

as necro we still going with Heirmir even though the other 2 got more stuff unlocked with 51 renown now?

[modest jasper]

You really don't want to do that.
Just put up a proper min-1 rupture and eat the loss.

[scenic root]

!oil

[prisma monolith]

Using consumables will increase your damage, however the difference between oil/stone/potion combinations are very minor (within 0.5% of each other). You can sim the difference for yourself by pasting this pastebin underneath your /simc input, in the "advanced sim" section of raidbots: https://pastebin.com/Lbxc7afJ

[flat mica]

Hey guys, I'm new to Ass rogue, do we pool energy before Envenom for any reason?

[modest jasper]

Always pool if:
Dots are running
No Shiv window
No Flag window

[flat mica]

@modest jasper Okay thanks. I thought we would, but didn't see it mentioned anywhere explicitly

[modest jasper]

It's mentioned in FAQ but kinda the other way around

Aka "you don't want to pool during shiv/flag/vendetta"

Which implies "always pool otherwise"

😄

[next dune]

It helps damage in your Elaborate Planning window. Also helps keep your envenom buff running

[flat mica]

😄 Hhaha, must have missed that 😮

[next dune]

Which speaking of Elaborate Planning, does that not benefit from Pandemic? I don't think it does, which... Is kinda bs imo

[wild birch]

Is there sims for dom shard sets?

[teal bloom]

elaborate planning doesn't pandemic sadly 😦

[next dune]

Elaborate Planning is a 4 second buff. So 30 percent should give you 5.2 seconds and it doesnt. I feel like this is an oversight

[real bay]

it's a buff not a dot , do any buffs pandemic?

[next dune]

Envonom and slice and dice both benifit from Pandemic. So yes

[real bay]

ah yea brainfart

but any other classes buffs?

[pseudo hamlet]

What do you guys think?
(got phial 236 already that I will be upgrading and the second one is slime/ooze 226)
Don't know if these trinkets may be the "sim baits" or something, or the shoulders won't be useful because they lack the domination socket

[harsh anchor]

I mean both are affected by the amount of CP used to get those buffs

[pine grove]

Nadjia gang - are you guys picking up Sinful Preservation and just dealing with the third Finesse socket or going with the worse power (Nimble Steps) and getting a second Endurance?

[harsh anchor]

Actually my statement is null. Garrote is affected. IMO EP usually has pretty decent up time already

[real bay]

close to 80% is easy

[pseudo hamlet]

personally going with sinful preservation and third finesse

[pine grove]

Yeah. I really don't like the finesse options, but Sinful is too hard to pass up even if we don't have a warlock in our raid.

[wild birch]

Does this mean that frost set is actually bis?

[golden prairie]

on NP I hate these always "IMMUNE" on bosses

[wild birch]

Colored line is the set bonus, orange is shard

[pseudo hamlet]

yeah, my fault

[fallen ginkgo]

Bracers are Haste+Vers (but Tarragrue drops Bracers) - Legs are High Crit + Mastery (same as BoE im gonna buy).
Im lacking Domination Gear hard, should i just pick after tonights HC raid?
Never played the Trinket, not sure if i like it. Already got Phial and would rather use Fusion Amplifier

[pine grove]

Good question. I assumed it would be Unholy, but I've never actually looked into it.

[gusty mirage]

I’d wait to pick until after raid, that way you won’t be big sad if said dom pieces drop

[spice spire]

Agree

[bright elk]

How does MA affect bleeds and poisons like garrote and rupture? 4 seconds of crit tics?

[spice spire]

Yes

No snapping here brother

Completely off topic, but is your name related to the chemical that creates “heat” in peppers and other foods? Lmao

[pseudo hamlet]

The trinket is... somewhat good(simming +140 DPS in ST and +120 DPS in M+), but the shoulders(Crit+Vers) seems stronger in M+(+200 in M+ and +110 in ST).
There's a catch though... I'd like to get the shoulders with the dom socket for raiding. And I don't know how powerful for real is that trinket(Bottled Flayedwing Toxin)? Bloodmallet and Herodamage are showing that it's not that good though

[fallen ginkgo]

thanks, that was my thought ye!

[pine grove]

Hmm. EP is simming 27 DPS higher than Blindside. Anyone who has run both - do you feel the rotation becoming clunkier without those free Ambush procs or is it actually liberating not having those procs when you're running close to energy cap?

[fallen ginkgo]

Anyone else got info and feedback on the Shadowgrasp Totem? Never had it. Only info i have is bloodmallet and Herodamage - numbers are high but ...

[spice spire]

Shadowgrasp feels good

And it is good

Vouch

[spice spire]

Ep/vigor feels nice. The fact that it’s a gain for you is surprising over bs/ds

[pseudo hamlet]

And the bottled flayedwing toxin? Seems low on these sites though

[sand dirge]

u press it on cooldown and it does great damage. nothing else

[pine grove]

Currently using BS/Vigor. Not simmed DS yet.

[spice spire]

Aggressively mediocre

[spice spire]

Try BS/DS, generally those two run better together than BS/vigor 😛

[pine grove]

How hard do you feel the reduced energy cap? I've grown very accustomed to it.

[pseudo hamlet]

considering that my other reward are shoulders(but I want dom socket for raiding) and I already got haste wrists which are really good I''ll be running with that untill I pug some DOSes

[spice spire]

BS/DS feels worse but in reality is better. The difference was negligible for me on ST, and with more than one target EP/vigor gains value. So I just EP/Vigor full time

[next dune]

I don't think Sims take in account execute procs for Blindside. Please correct me if I'm wrong though. I've always been a Blindside/DS fan, but I've swapped to EP/Vig this tier and really don't notice a loss

[spice spire]

I ran into a pretty similar issue yesterday, picked up 252 shoulders myself; however, I think with a comparable trinket it may be fine with picking that. HOWEVER I will also say that set bonuses only work in raid? So the shoulders won’t be completely out of inventory once you get bonus

Shards do work outside of raid afaik tho, just not bonus

[spice spire]

They do take them into account iirc

[pine grove]

Weird. DS/BS seems to be the highest sim. Seems odd. Going to run it again.

[sand dirge]

it is in the sims but bs/ds vs. ep/vigor are like ~50 dps difference (with my current gear)

[spice spire]

That’s pretty normal actually. Especially if you’re venthyr

[pine grove]

Ah. I am indeed Venth. That seems like quite an uncomfortable talent set, though, given that you have the procs from BS but not the energy cap from Vigor to help fit them in.

[pseudo hamlet]

My second trinket is phial 236(that will be upgraded asap)... and it seems that I will be mostly doing M+ this patch. So... a tough nut to crack for me.

[alpine latch]

How are you guys actually surviving Torghast? I got a 1* and a 2* last week on 11s ... It's fucking impossible.

At least as a necrolord I had a good power.

[spice spire]

It’s slow af, but you get used to it

[pine grove]

Bonuses are king.

[alpine latch]

I died like 11 times 😦

[spice spire]

Rough 😦
Shoulders could be fine the.

[alpine latch]

I was having to eat every other pull

[spice spire]

You run leeching poison?

That helps me solo it tremendously

[alpine latch]

Nope, Cheat Death

Should I?

Interesting

[pine grove]

Hmm. Could end up being slightly more than the sim damage increase, as there's a bit of waste with Vig/BS.

[spice spire]

Yep, that’s the issue with that combo. You want to get the most out of bs and sometimes you overcap naturally, it’s truly unlucky

[pine grove]

I run Cheat Death. What's your ilvl? I've never not 5*'d a run since doing the bonuses and I've even had runs where I've died or gone AFK for 10 minutes.

[alpine latch]

I'm 229

And I get shit on