assassination

[tired jasper]

hey quick question is potion of phantom fire or potion of spectral agility better for assa rogue

[prisma monolith]

Using consumables will increase your damage, however the difference between oil/stone/potion combinations are very minor (within 0.5% of each other). You can sim the difference for yourself by pasting this pastebin underneath your /simc input, in the "advanced sim" section of raidbots: https://pastebin.com/Lbxc7afJ

[tulip nacelle]

!oil

slam on cd, regardless of cp, you should pool for envenom so you'd naturally pool for shiv if you did that

[gusty mirage]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-keyboard-smash-gif-15394889

^ you pushing shiv

on cd

[viscid spear]

I'm still worried about Obedience.
Word is Blizzard is nerfing the Tome from the Korthia Armanents so every caster/healer is forced to actually use the new trinkets.

[timber pawn]

Would make sense

[glossy wedge]

Why are you worried about obedience lol

I'm happy it's going to be good, allows sub to exist and means I chose right with venthyr, was not wanting to swap to necro

[timber pawn]

You are gonna have a bad time brother

Obedience gonna get nerf batted I'd bet

It's too strong as it sits

[glossy wedge]

I don't think so

I think necro sin mains are just salty and doomsaying it because they regret not going venthyr LOL

That's the vibe I'm getting

[timber pawn]

Why would they be salty sin is dimming higher than sub

[halcyon blade]

i dont see it as salty, more of a fear of putting in hours of time to swap over, only for it to then get nerfec and require more effort to swap back

[odd hazel]

“To strong” lmao

Get outta here with that meme

[glossy wedge]

@odd hazel exactly, obedience is fine

[odd hazel]

Compare it

To actual nerf worthy leggos

And it’s nothing

[glossy wedge]

^ it's like 10% tops variance, that's not unheard of

[lean thorn]

Sharpening stone or Shadowcore oil for daggers?

[odd hazel]

!Oil

[prisma monolith]

Using consumables will increase your damage, however the difference between oil/stone/potion combinations are very minor (within 0.5% of each other). You can sim the difference for yourself by pasting this pastebin underneath your /simc input, in the "advanced sim" section of raidbots: https://pastebin.com/Lbxc7afJ

[halcyon blade]

true, but with the nerfing of the neck in tav. and now the trinket from korthia, i dont think its as mocking worthy as you all act to think they might make changes to a top performing item

[lean thorn]

ty

[odd hazel]

It’s barely top performing. Doom isn’t that far behind. And yet celerity for outlaw is still better

[halcyon blade]

i dont think it will get nerfed, i just understand peoples fear of it

[glossy wedge]

@halcyon blade those nerfs are aimed at pushing people to value the raid trinkets/gear

[odd hazel]

Nah

People just hate a new leggo doing good

And it’s always like that with good things

[glossy wedge]

Yeah pretty much!

[odd hazel]

People are just irrational because something is doing good. It’s not like 50% ahead of everything else

Which some classes actually have

It’s like 5-10% better then other ones

[halcyon blade]

people are reacting to something that, to min max, feels mandatory

that requires alot of work to swap into

[odd hazel]

It’s not though

And not a lot of work at all

Nothing is mandatory

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[halcyon blade]

grinding 0-42 renoun might not be alot of work for you, but if you have limited playtime it might be.

[odd hazel]

You can do it in a day or two

[glossy wedge]

@halcyon blade well maybe you folks shouldn't have jumped gun for necro lol?

[odd hazel]

.^

[glossy wedge]

Plus we all aren't true rogues if we haven't swapped all 4 covenants by now amirite😂

[halcyon blade]

not if you dont have huge playtime is all i am saying

[odd hazel]

as I mean

[halcyon blade]

at any point have i said i am necro?

[odd hazel]

ThAt isn’t the player base though

And shouldn’t be changed due to a small portion

[red plaza]

https://mobile.twitter.com/maximum/status/1411399004110299136

max (@maximum)

Sims are for trying different builds for your guy, talents/trinkets/covs etc. They were never designed to give you an accurate reading of Dps compared to other classes. Even then the accuracy is not consistent across specs which makes these lists the biggest bait. https://t.co/kQ4BKmYun0

Likes

347

Twitter · Jul 3, 2021, 6:58 PM

[glossy wedge]

@halcyon blade why would you defend the position of wanting it nerfed then and stating people don't want to grind renown?

Regardless of the covenant people on one side or another would have to jump ship if they want to min max, you're likely just not happy because it is affecting you in this situation

[red plaza]

Also 5minute patchwerk

[halcyon blade]

I have simply been talking about the reaction of the players being one of concern for thier playtime more than one of 'salt' - i even said i dont think obedience is gonna get nerfed

[glossy wedge]

You have salt in your name though 😜

[ocean dune]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

The following is a general recommendation, but you will always get more accurate results through simming your gear
through Top Gear.
Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[halcyon blade]

i legit havent defended people wanting it nerfed, i have said that people are going to be worried as blizzard keep nerfing top performing things, using the necklace and trinket as examples (and if you want another, try the top leggo for NF being nerfed), and that most people are just scared to pull the trigger because of those snap nerfs

I think asking for something to be nerfed casue you dont want to use it is stupid

i was trying to show you that they might not be salty, more scared

[glossy wedge]

In general the sentiment from sin players has been: I swapped to necro sin prematurely and now do not wish for obedience to be bis because it will require me to swap venthyr/sub having a place when I want to be sin

[strange python]

I am necro since SL release because transmog > dps

[arctic hare]

What if we don’t careeee?

[granite thistle]

Does the Slice and Dice Conduit only heal when SD is used, or when it also gets refreshed?

[halcyon blade]

but that seems strange no, as they have already shown the willingness to change, and blizzard removed the betrayer status, so its easier than ever to do.

people who are emotionally locked into necro are gonna have always been necros

[oak sky]

Snd heals through the duration

[glossy wedge]

Again the nerfs to items from korthia/dungeon make sense, they are not trying to outshine raid items

That's different than Legos, and one which isn't simming higher than 5-10% margins

[oak sky]

So if snd is refreshed by cut to the chase it just keeps healing

[glossy wedge]

@timber pawn sub is ahead of sin friend

[timber pawn]

In ST no movement fights

[glossy wedge]

10, 623 sin vs 10, 938 sub

[timber pawn]

How many patchwork fights this coming tier?

[stark anchor]

yes, thats generally what people mean when they say sims :)

[glossy wedge]

We can't know how it fairs until the raid drops and we get averages of top parses etc, but you specifically said sin was simming higher

[halcyon blade]

i mean sims should always be taken with a pinch of salt

[glossy wedge]

For sure!

[odd hazel]

Are we still on this movement shit

We all suffer the same amount from movement

[oak sky]

Theres new sims i think sub was around 11900 and sin was around 11200 or something

With the daggers

[plush remnant]

What sims are we referring to? I remember seeing a pic passed around yesterday with sub on top ST patchwerk

[oak sky]

I think whispyr said hes posting new pins later

[timber pawn]

How would you think all specs suffer the same from movement

[glossy wedge]

It was in reference to the pins from both sin and sub channels

[timber pawn]

Sub has no damage over time where Sin has 40+,% dmg coming from dots and bleeds

[oak sky]

Thats a huge lie

[odd hazel]

Uh

[oak sky]

But its ok

[odd hazel]

Rupture sir

[glossy wedge]

Slap a rupture and then make up in burst damage?

[halcyon blade]

its like the simcraft sims show fury as top dps of the tier, who need to be in range to keep dmg, and everyone know that isnt the case when you compare it to a ranged or dot class

[oak sky]

The point isnt exactly the same suffering

Both of them suffer a lot from being off the boss during cds

[timber pawn]

Rupture is what 8-10% of your DMG as sub?

[odd hazel]

And 99% of our damage as sin is white melee

What’s your point

[glossy wedge]

Hmm damn you got us, I forgot for this raid tier we had to leave the boss fight for a marathon!

[odd hazel]

lolol

[timber pawn]

Le sigh ok whatever boys we will see what the tier brings

[odd hazel]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[kind talon]

@oak sky

:3

[glossy wedge]

We shall see indeed!
I'm personally happy for the split if it goes the way it's looking, playing a mix of specs is always fun

[fluid raven]

What item do we put the lego on?

[kind talon]

Back

[kind talon]

Absolutely agree 🙂

[oak sky]

:3

[kind talon]

Flying out tomorrow man

Gonna be back home :3

[fluid raven]

@blissful tide with haste/versa?

[oak sky]

Very good

[kind talon]

Crit haste cloak

Obedience

[blissful tide]

wrong clown

[remote vale]

Anyone know what crafted will provide best value assuming we are clearing heroic starting week 1? Fresh char so far so anything is an upgrade

[blissful tide]

[gusty mirage]

do you already have a legendary crafted?

if so, that one

[remote vale]

Doomblade back as necro sin yeah

[gusty mirage]

then yeah stick with doomie

[balmy condor]

[oak sky]

Is he talking about korthia crafted

[gusty mirage]

oh

true

[oak sky]

Wouldnt it be ring prob

[gusty mirage]

@remote vale ring or neck imo

[oak sky]

So unlikely to pull 2 rings

But you could maybe get KT neck which is better

[remote vale]

Im talkin about the new 230 crafted items buyable on AH yeah. You can only wear one of the new crafted items

[gusty mirage]

yeah being able to choose what stats your rings have is huge

plus the socket

yeah I'd do a ring or neck tbh

I personally went neck, cause I was rocking a 220 without a socket, and I have like 6 226 rings w/ sockets lol

[remote vale]

Figured, just know theres a handful of ring drops in raid but cant think of anything else

[oak sky]

My neck sucks and my rings are heroic inerva and a 226 with a socket

So idk what ill do

[gusty mirage]

they're not super expensive on area 52 us

like 70k a pop

[oak sky]

Haha

Money

[remote vale]

Rings and necks are 90kish on Tich right now but expecting them to tank a little by tues

[oak sky]

Im on illidan, hopefully they arent too expensive or I'll just save my money for a leggo later on

[gusty mirage]

yeah they'll go down for sure once raid opens up

[kind talon]

Yo

The cloak btw

Is like 6k

235

On Illidan rn

The base

[oak sky]

I meant

Like rank 6

[kind talon]

No I know what u meant

[oak sky]

Might end up a lot

[gusty mirage]

it definitely will

[kind talon]

Rank 6?

Buy mats

[gusty mirage]

vestiges require 40(?) korthia crystals?

[kind talon]

It’s like 20k

[oak sky]

I paid like 90k for my 235 legs in 9.0

That was a lot

[kind talon]

Minus crystals

U can get 40 crystals solo

And then buy rest of the mats

[oak sky]

Do i need a profession

[gusty mirage]

and do what with them?

[kind talon]

Get someone else to craft it for you

Obviously

[oak sky]

Mmm

[gusty mirage]

and they're going to still crack you lmao

[kind talon]

Crack you?

[gusty mirage]

if you think someone isn't going to charge you a ton to craft it for you, you're out of your mind

[kind talon]

Not in guild or thru friends

Lol

[oak sky]

...

[kind talon]

If u have literally all the materials

[oak sky]

Im gonna have to see what i can do once i have the cinders/ash

[kind talon]

Just saying

U can do it for considerably cheaper

[gusty mirage]

I know 0 people that can craft rank 4 legendaries because it costs way more to level up the craft than it just buying it

[kind talon]

Than what the ah price will be

Yeah I don’t either

But I will find

[oak sky]

Im gonna have to farm extra ash past just my weekly torghasts to have enough for obedience

[sweet timber]

hey guys, i wonder what legendary i should go for until i get "obedience" ?

[oak sky]

If you do more m+ go zoldyck if you do more raid go doomblade

[magic gale]

how do you guys use flagellation in m+ enviroment?

[gusty mirage]

on CD on a priority target/target with the most health

[magic gale]

thanks oxi

[quasi grotto]

to buy 230 boe or not buy is the question

[gusty mirage]

[magic gale]

shadowcore oil or shapening stones? 😄

[quasi grotto]

is there a way to see what item would be ebst for me to buy

[sonic spire]

Wait until you get heroic gear and then buy slots that you didn’t get to drop if they’re under 226

[quasi grotto]

im thinking that tbh, but ive got a couple pieces with stats id like t change up

[sonic spire]

True but remember the ones you buy give random stats, so the likelihood of you getting a nice crit haste piece is very low

You’d probably have to buy multiple to fish for stats

[quasi grotto]

do they? im looking at them with 2 stats

[kind talon]

Hell yeah

[sonic spire]

Depends on which piece

[kind talon]

Go for it bigdaddy

[gusty mirage]

Sharpening stones are probably better/more consistent, but you can test it yourself in an advanced sim:

!oil

[prisma monolith]

Using consumables will increase your damage, however the difference between oil/stone/potion combinations are very minor (within 0.5% of each other). You can sim the difference for yourself by pasting this pastebin underneath your /simc input, in the "advanced sim" section of raidbots: https://pastebin.com/Lbxc7afJ

[spiral warren]

Any ideas on why there's like a 50/50 split between Night Elf and Void Elf at the top of the rio leaderboard for assassin rogues? I thought the flat 1% stat in NE would be better along with shadowmeld for M+.

[kind talon]

Because racials don’t really matter

People play what they think is cool

That’s why

[spiral warren]

Fair enough, just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something.

[halcyon blade]

flexes in undead

[sonic spire]

You gotta play what the slutmog looks best on tbh

[oak sky]

Male belf 😳

[gusty mirage]

https://bloodmallet.com/chart/rogue/assassination/races/castingpatchwerk
It's for people who want that FAT 25dps increase

[young nacelle]

nightborne

[kind talon]

Hey oxi

[oak sky]

I wonder how nightborne priest is

[gusty mirage]

hi friend

[kind talon]

Night elf is bis for nightstalker gameplay

So shutup and pay for the faction transfer NOW

[oak sky]

Nightstalker

[gusty mirage]

This new and improved Poyboi is kinda toxic

holy

[kind talon]

Tbc guild changed me

They literally flamed me into almost quitting week1

I had a mental breakdown on comms

[thorny pond]

Sounds about right for the literal easiest raids ever

[crisp steppe]

xd

[kind talon]

GM still threatens to gkick me whenever I misspell his name

(It’s a joke haha)

[thorny pond]

Let’s scare off the hardest mechanic. Raid attendance

[kind talon]

But hey I have 100 parses though

Let’s go

[crisp steppe]

insane

u managed to compete with a bunch of giga boomers

[kind talon]

🙂

[gusty mirage]

[kind talon]

It’s funny cause

I’m not optimized at all

Just a better player and pushing my buttons correctly

Tbc players are actually

Negative iq

[crystal blaze]

!bislit

[plush remnant]

Did I hear there would be updated sim info pinned today?

[strange python]

Just click the sim link

[balmy condor]

I'm working on it right now

just finished a key

[sharp zodiac]

[native belfry]

Just tell us if we should switch to subs

[balmy condor]

the spreadsheet is already updated

pls

[strange python]

am just watching Ryfie doing a 20 key in sub, looks very nice

[native belfry]

i've timed +20 ToP yesterday as sin

keys are pretty ez rn

[timber pawn]

Vault rewards for Tuesday still locked at 226 aren't they?

[gusty mirage]

yea

but ideally you want to get at least an 18 done so you start the next season with a 15

[timber pawn]

True

[steel bane]

ilevel capped at +10 next week , right?

[timber pawn]

Think so

[gusty mirage]

yeah but it's more about the vault reward the week after

[native belfry]

yeah, but u'd be able to get a maximum GW reward from +15 for a mythic week

[thorny pond]

Farm your hearts out but starting mythic prog with full m+ 15 gear would be busted

[kind talon]

I mean

It’s basically same lvl as heroic gear isn’t it

Heroic raid gear?

Jw

[kindred rapids]

Lower

[thorny pond]

What does 10s give now base?

200?

[cyan dew]

Does the sylv daggers are still only giving ONE rogue the buff?

[thorny pond]

Unsure but we think it’s fixed

[cyan dew]

Hmm

[thorny pond]

Can’t test it

[kind talon]

Rn?

Or s2

[thorny pond]

Season 1 10s

[kind talon]

203

@maiden kelp

[thorny pond]

Wow

[arctic hare]

lol

[balmy condor]

fixed

[kind talon]

Wtf that’s a person?

Kekw

[cyan dew]

ty!

[arctic hare]

Evidently

[thorny pond]

So 229 from 10ams then

[kind talon]

Yes

[arctic hare]

It bothers me that its not 230

[thorny pond]

So we can get some gear

[kind talon]

Sucks for u frostie

[thorny pond]

Get me a phat phial

[kind talon]

I have a 226 phial

Kekw

[thorny pond]

Same

[torpid sluice]

How big is the chance that Obedience is getting nerfed?

[thorny pond]

But 229 is huge

[thorny pond]

No idea

Nobody has it

[strange python]

i hr@eard 50% lol

[torpid sluice]

Ye thats the scary part, it only happens at mythic week

[plush remnant]

Yeah either it does or doesn’t 50/50

[thorny pond]

Don’t be an @maiden kelp just craft it

Who gives a shit if it’s nerfed

[torpid sluice]

I mean, I'm still a Necro

That's the thing 😛

[strange python]

just get ur necro and venth to 40

ez

[thorny pond]

Or just play the game and quit worrying

We literally can’t control it

[kind talon]

Beach

229 only huge cause valor upgrade no?

[thorny pond]

Unless we collectively decide to tank our first mythic week

[kind talon]

3 ilvl diff not that biggo

[thorny pond]

Memeing bud

[kind talon]

But u can upgrade it can’t u

[thorny pond]

But yea a s2 phial will be nice for upgrade

Get me that 246

[kind talon]

So it actually would be huge

No meme

Lol

[glossy wedge]

@torpid sluice make your choices, so far there's no reason it would get a nerf it's only 5-10% variance, nothing crazy

[torpid sluice]

Can it be upgraded if we loot it during 1st week (with limited ilvl)

[thorny pond]

Yea when I farm valor

[torpid sluice]

10% is huge though 😂

[odd hazel]

10% isnt though

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[strange python]

someone did post an arcane mage legendary being a crazy difference from its runner up

a picture

way more than obedience and doomblade difference

[odd hazel]

^

this

stop looking way to much into it honestly

classes have leggos that are

better then the second best one they have by like 70%

so in that spectrum

no its not a lot

a lot for us?

meh

maybe, but no way is required

[kind talon]

It’s 3% better

Well

No

[strange python]

lmao

[kind talon]

It’s like 40% better than doomblades

[odd hazel]

489

to 709

thats not a lot

[strange python]

better perspective

[kind talon]

Arcane infinity is like

400%

Better

[strange python]

LOL

[kind talon]

Obedience is like

40%

So

[balmy condor]

NERFED FOR SURE DUDE HOLY OP CRAZY GIGA DAMAGE ITS INSAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANE

[strange python]

LMAO

[odd hazel]

[naive cypress]

When you are playing MA talent, and use vanish with full CP. Do you always Env -> Mut -> Env ? Regardless of CP? Or do you lets say Env -> Mut (3/6cp) -> Mut again?

[balmy condor]

you don't finish unless you're max-1

if you're playing deeper

you will always mut twice

[royal lantern]

whispr is slowly understanding why guy is.....guy

[naive cypress]

Alright, nice

[balmy condor]

oh I understand why guy is guy

I have guy moments

the general population is negative IQ

just how it is

[odd hazel]

i just dont get the

nerf it

response to obedience

[strange python]

i think ppl have PTSD from sub getting nerfed the past like 10 patches in a row

[balmy condor]

stifles choice

is the concern

[strange python]

so anytime we see some good stuff for us

[umbral sandal]

Hey! For assasination if you wanna craft Zoldyck legendary for m+ content. How will this effect the domination armor set? Should I craft them in legs or boots?

[balmy condor]

legs

more stats, and not on a dom slot

[kind talon]

I’d rather

Be able to choose between specs without gimping myself

Than choosing between legendaries or covenants

[arctic hare]

Agreed

[rapid flame]

Meaningful choice do you mean?

[balmy condor]

MEANINGFUL

[kind talon]

There is no

Meaningful

[odd hazel]

Meaningful is to opinionated to pin point in a game

[kind talon]

Doesn’t exist

The only choice is the one that does the most damage

[rapid flame]

MeAnInGfUl*

[kind talon]

Yep

[white igloo]

how many stacks of flagellation are you guys getting as assassination?

[odd hazel]

20+

i think the highest i've seen is like

[white igloo]

ok so 24 is ok

[odd hazel]

26

ye

[white igloo]

ok cool

[kind talon]

Woah

27

[white igloo]

and sub is more or less?

[kind talon]

Gg

Sub is like 27 or something

Around there

[white igloo]

ok nice. ty!

[kind talon]

Yeppers

[white igloo]

wanted to see how bad i was

turns out im average

[kind talon]

Lmao

Flag

Doesn’t say anything

About how good or bad you are

[white igloo]

XD

[kind talon]

Are you playing vigor or deeper

[white igloo]

vig

in raid

[kind talon]

[white igloo]

no?

[kind talon]

Sim urself

[white igloo]

youre giving me a complex

[kind talon]

Kekw

[odd hazel]

sim it really

[kind talon]

Do u have simc?

[odd hazel]

for some people its barely 50 dps loss

but it might be more for you

[kind talon]

Yeah you should see ur optimal talent choice

What’s ur full talent free?

Tree*?

[white igloo]

3312121

[final star]

hmm yes those are talents

Wait

[white igloo]

LOL

[final star]

331

Mad lad

Absolute mad lad

231 champ

[white igloo]

i was dropped on my head a lot

[final star]

You blindside with DS

EP with vigor

Blindside/Vigor was better at piss low gear

[white igloo]

interesting

[kind talon]

Kekw

[white igloo]

i'll have to change after this raid finder

farming that sweet sweet renown

[kind talon]

Just sim it

[naive cypress]

Is there a rule for how long you can hold shiv for vendetta?

[final star]

10s

[kind talon]

So u know how much ur cucking yourself

@final star

🥱

[final star]

🥱

Bye

[kind talon]

😦

Y

[final star]

Bad channel

[kind talon]

Gg

But I’m here

[final star]

Point proven

[kind talon]

Stay a while :V

[final star]

[kind talon]

🥱

[clear shadow]

for the 230 rings do we just get a crit/haste one?

[kind talon]

Yes

[naive cypress]

Remember that you can only equip one 230 crafted item tho

[clear shadow]

yeah

so i have the crit haste ring from plagefall and the haste crit one from top should i replace the haste/crit with the 230 ring?

[timid talon]

[kind talon]

Just sim all the 230 items

Lol

Chances are that the ring slot won’t even be best

Might be neck or armor

[charred wraith]

hard mode tazavesh neck though

[timid talon]

its not that good anymore

well its okay but not op like it was

[steep gust]

Is doomblade better on hands or cloak?

[timid talon]

cloak

[steep gust]

Oh. Pins say hands but I heard cloak from a guildie

[timid talon]

hands before domination shards yes

but now that its 9.1 its better on cloak

[steep gust]

Ty

[hoary merlin]

Hello guys, i'm a bit lost about Assa in m+ i'm necro and i can't figure which leg is the best, for m+ and Raid actually

[gusty mirage]

Zold for m+, doomblade for raid

!def

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Defensives usability: http://tiny.cc/q602uz

[hoary merlin]

Ok so you have to craft 2 legs

Any advices for the slots ?

[gusty mirage]

Correct, or if you’re not super serious about raid you can get away with just Zold

Doomblade on Cloak, Zold on legs. Crit/haste for both

[hoary merlin]

Ok ty mate 🙂

[dark swift]

If I want to go sub/assa with obedience which stats should I go with

Which should be decent for both

[timid talon]

crit haste is fine

[celest island]

want to reroll back to my rogue.. one that i have is in different realm and cant transfer him back.. what would be the best choice to get 60 fast.

[timid talon]

buy a 50 boost, then pay for a 50-60 carry lol

[shrewd night]

@balmy condor

!bos

[prisma monolith]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vQQUy8zeFKz-vhwoExtDchUlXoxiiHvw0UcqLGJGexgbZvmfy4D5ln_hzIE9_OfLXkJKD6XA4YYPAoP/pubhtml#

[shrewd night]

defensives also work as a command

[balmy condor]

?

!def

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Defensives usability: http://tiny.cc/q602uz

[balmy condor]

why are you pinging me about this

[gusty mirage]

we have two commands now

and a pin in general

[balmy condor]

why

[gusty mirage]

in case people type !bos instead

idk I didn't do it

[balmy condor]

I mean

could've added it as a synonym

[shrewd night]

Oh, did you already add it?

N e v e r m i n d t h e n

[vestal wren]

yes, we added it a while back

also with better formating 😛

[gusty mirage]

WOAH

[shrewd night]

I blame oxi

[gusty mirage]

toxic

I blame me too

[shrewd night]

FUCKING oxi

[gusty mirage]

I'll see myself out

[spice spire]

Don’t flame Oxi, he’s beautiful

Inside and out

[gusty mirage]

the almighty koffing has spoken

we must accept it as gospel

[shrewd night]

[spice spire]

That’s true. We only listen to CE gamers here, the CE gamer has spoken

[oak sky]

Oxi

[rapid flame]

went jc to craft myself 230 haste>crit ring, just sold 2 on the ah for 130k each lol

[viscid spear]

Making Doomblade on cloak

Haste/Crit still or something else?

[oak sky]

Yes

[viscid spear]

Just checking, thanks

[oak sky]

[timber jetty]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[dull osprey]

!pot

damn

What is the potion we use?

[limber swallow]

!oil

[prisma monolith]

Using consumables will increase your damage, however the difference between oil/stone/potion combinations are very minor (within 0.5% of each other). You can sim the difference for yourself by pasting this pastebin underneath your /simc input, in the "advanced sim" section of raidbots: https://pastebin.com/Lbxc7afJ

[hollow river]

blizzard trolling rogues putting the 239 Dom piece from Archivist on gloves....

[kind talon]

@balmy condor yo

wanna see some stonks?

rn?

also @oak sky bro check dis out

been in jail with this neck forever

🥜

🥜

awoooooga

[arctic hare]

Heh, nice

[oak sky]

What am i looking at

[kind talon]

i gained 100 dps

simdps

[oak sky]

Oh

[kind talon]

by replacing a neck

ye

[oak sky]

With the new neck

[kind talon]

1.5% dps

[oak sky]

Crafted?

[kind talon]

230 crafted ya

[oak sky]

I have a 207 crit vers neck rn

Its my worst piece

[kind talon]

yo

ur

about to stonk

so hard

only 15k per if u buy the mats

inshallah

mats are like 5k and i tipped the guy 10k to craft

[oak sky]

Might do

[rapid flame]

still selling crit/haste necks and rings for 130k on my server

[kind talon]

buy the mats

[rapid flame]

only 1 other seller at all

[kind talon]

and find someone crafting them

o

nm

nvm

LOL

[rapid flame]

they're 7k to craft on my server, very cheap 😉

[oak sky]

I only have like 100k

From selling a world boe

[kind talon]

7k to craft

but then u have to

tip

10k tip is very reasonable tbh

[arctic hare]

I mean

You don’t havvvvve to tip

[kind talon]

well

they wont trade

the piece back to you

if you dont pay them

[arctic hare]

I meannn, its your mats, but makes sense

This is why guildies are great

[kind talon]

so i guess its S&H lol

u have guildies with the recipe already?

sheesh

[arctic hare]

I have a friend who might be goin jewelcrafting lol

[kind talon]

u need to be tier 4

with the new rep

[arctic hare]

And how long does that take?

[kind talon]

tuesday to today

people got rank 4 pretty much now

yesterday / today

so like

3/4 days grinding

[arctic hare]

Whats the max rank, 4?

[kind talon]

6?

idk

[arctic hare]

We shall just have to see

God I have a LOTTTT of catching up ta do

[oak sky]

Is it archivists codex rep or deaths advance

[rapid flame]

archivist

[royal wasp]

Is there an FAQ for domination stuff

[torpid plank]

the wowhead article does a pretty good job of explaining it all

[hollow river]

looooool

[kind talon]

i nutted man

[fossil kiln]

hey for heroic week my rogue needs a leggo. do i make the doomblade one and if so what slot?

[chrome widget]

Cloak I believe

Yeah the 230 boes on my main server were selling for about 20k.. Then I log on my smaller server and they not even available yet

[hollow river]

yeah theres barely any on my server

120k+ a pop

debating if its even worth buying any

heroic gear will replacew

[swift sky]

definitely not worth 120k

[onyx fable]

Hi. I'm trying out assassination for the first time but I'm constantly 400 dps below the sim against a raider's training dummy. Can someone take a peek at what I might be missing? https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/9aqvqCY9TqLruLrirqt9zZ

[unkempt pilot]

how can you be 223 for 5k ?

there is something wrong

[arctic hare]

You cannot hit your sim dps outside of soecial moments

Your sim is under absolute perfect conditions

[crisp steppe]

Disabled buffs...

You can hit ur simdps

Upload logs

[arctic hare]

Its definitely possible, you can go above it relatively easy, but its usually when under a serious burst window, such as vendetta and other cooldowns

[crisp steppe]

No

[arctic hare]

Thats what I’ve noticed so far

[oak sky]

Well if you do it for 5 minutes

Then you should be able to get near it

[crisp steppe]

U can sim for the dummy situation

And then hit that number

[arctic hare]

Hmm, true

[kind talon]

sim for me dady

[arctic hare]

I guess it is for the buffs missing

[crisp steppe]

That's why his sim is low for 223

[arctic hare]

Wait, I think my sims higher, odd

Maybe, idk

[neon pasture]

Sim is an avg of several 10000+ attempts, if you have good rng you can beat your sim just fine on dummy

[crisp steppe]

@onyx fable are you getting parried. If not its prob rota

Yep

[unkempt pilot]

i'm at 5k, and under 200ilvl

there is something really wrong

[crisp steppe]

There isn't

[arctic hare]

Yeah, i thought something seemd off

[crisp steppe]

Just your understanding

[onyx fable]

yes I was getting parried

[arctic hare]

Oh, well thats why

[crisp steppe]

Parries happen when you atk from the front

[arctic hare]

His talents are the basic single build, so weird

[crisp steppe]

Significant dps losss

Ok ill explain again

[arctic hare]

Thats really good to know actually

[crisp steppe]

This rogue is simming without buffs, raidbuffs

That is why his simdps seems low

[arctic hare]

Ahhhhhhh ok

[rigid pine]

[tacit bay]

In a Patchwork sim you will benefit from the blindside execute mechanic, no? Won't get that on a dummy

[crisp steppe]

He does this so he can knoe how hes doing against a dummy

So adjust it

[arctic hare]

Then that means that raid buffs are absolutely friggin ridiculous

[crisp steppe]

Yes

[rigid pine]

Of course

[oak sky]

Well a lot of them we never get

[rigid pine]

A flask is 70 agility

That's HUGE

[oak sky]

Like windfury

[arctic hare]

True

Heh, heh, heheh, windfury

I haven’t tried that out with slice’n’dice

[crisp steppe]

Anyway try to hit ur simdps again but while atking from the back and see hoe that goes. Details might be off if ur vanishing too etc. You can adjust that in the sim too

[humble ginkgo]

5k at 223 gear seems odd tbh

oh nvm

[onyx fable]

My dps did go up about ~200 when I tried again for 5 min from behind. Thanks for the analysis! The rest must be a sub-optimal rotation.

[arctic hare]

No raid buffs apparently lol

[humble ginkgo]

yea

with raid buffs hes at 6.5k

[arctic hare]

Okay, that makes more sense

[crisp steppe]

Good to hear

[dense cedar]

time to deal 11k dps

[kind talon]

ok nice

[slim wagon]

What is the best way to Farm Renown? Spam Heroics? Low Keys?

[balmy condor]

all of it

[kind talon]

Whispy

I got 100dps today are u proud of me

:3

[umbral rapids]

clown

[kind talon]

Yo

[umbral rapids]

i'm venthyr

are u proud of me

[kind talon]

Me too

Yes

Extremely

[void pecan]

God damnit. Someone tell me what to do

[spice spire]

Gamers

[void pecan]

swap now or wait for tuning

[kind talon]

Your penis is girthy as fuck man

[spice spire]

Swap now

[kind talon]

Swap now

[spice spire]

No balls

[kind talon]

No point in waiting

U will just watch the world rot

[spice spire]

Worst case you’re on a top 2 spec for two weeks, best case you’re the de facto best spec

[kind talon]

Worst case you do the most damage for the entire tier

Best case you do the most damage for the entire tier

Gg

[viscid spear]

[arctic hare]

Pop

Out

Dmg

[drowsy parcel]

[void pecan]

It's done. I am a blood boi again.

[odd hazel]

as everyone should be

[umbral rapids]

that's BIG mood

[idle shard]

do I have to time the 18 key to get a 15 next week? Or just complete it

[balmy condor]

complete

[idle shard]

nice

[wary pawn]

any1 from EU knows if swapping covenant penalty is reset already? seems it is for NA

[umbral rapids]

it is

careful though afaik it only works with ONE covenant
like I was NF then venthyr then necro. I could go back venthyr no issue but NF will give me a the 2week questline

[wary pawn]

vampire we go boooooys

[alpine latch]

If we're going Sin/Sub, should we still go Haste/Crit?

For leggos?

[pearl pulsar]

so is obedience the best power for sin?

[arctic hare]

So far yes

[alpine latch]

Yeah, basically

[pearl pulsar]

so gotta wait a few weeks to be able to unlock that then

[alpine latch]

Mythic week we get it

[pallid panther]

No point wasting ash on new slot for doom until we get obedience right? Assuming our rng is trash for dom slot drops LOL

[strange python]

Im a bone boi

[elder gulch]

anyone know how low you can get vendetta CD using Dusckwalkers leggo?

[spice spire]

Not low enough to matter unfortunately - they really tried to make that work after the 9.0.5 buff and it was still way worse

[kind talon]

Shutup man

[umbral rapids]

?????

[kind talon]

Stop whining

Start sucking

Blood

[umbral rapids]

i was venthyr before

[kind talon]

Ur a vampire now

We infected u

Man

[timid talon]

[umbral rapids]

i played it for most 9.0.5

[modern heart]

[umbral rapids]

sbs wins fun gameplay it's not even close

[oak sky]

[kind talon]

Yeah

It does lol

[umbral rapids]

in m+ at least

[kind talon]

But flag does more damage so

Get bent

[umbral rapids]

on a single target it feels bad as fuck

[kind talon]

Not really

It was within like

Very small %

[elder gulch]

i want to give it a try but dont have the soul ash so was wondering if someone knew what the avg CD would be with that leggo

[kind talon]

With gemstone optimization

[shy dust]

i think it was down

to like 65ish seconds roughly

[oak sky]

Same as flag

Cant wait for 2 leggos but 1 is covenant leggo now

[kind talon]

[elder gulch]

that's quite nice

wonder how itll be with the new seasonal

[oak sky]

Probably worse than obedience and also worse than zoldyck

But go hf with it

If u got the ash

[kind talon]

And also worse than doomblade

[elder gulch]

well they do different things

[kind talon]

Ye

One is like 7% increase and the other is like 3% on average

But like

[elder gulch]

on what?

[kind talon]

If u could pair it with obedience it might be strong

Doomblade vs duskwalker

[elder gulch]

but on what sort of fight i meant

mb

[kind talon]

St

[oak sky]

Realistically you would just go to double throughput leggos tho

[kind talon]

Well

The damage would change

[oak sky]

But the combo could be better than its parts

[kind talon]

Ye

Exactly

Would have to see math

[oak sky]

We'll see when blizzard juices us in 9.3 or whatever

[kind talon]

But you would be able to sync every flag and vendetta

Without holding

[elder gulch]

cause having vendetta up for every mini boss + boss would be nice

[kind talon]

Kinda juicy

[elder gulch]

thats why i wanted to trry it

might be garbanzo tho

[kind talon]

U already do pretty much

But uh

It’s garbanzo

Think about it

It’s a 3% increase in singletarget but vendetta only buffs singletarget damage

[elder gulch]

hard to since new season hasnt started

idk how pulls will be

[kind talon]

So the value lowers the more targets there are

But it doesn’t matter how pulls are cause it loses hella value on aoe

It would have to be pure st and even then it’s worse than doomblade

[oak sky]

Whereas obedience buffs a stat which is always a dps increase

[elder gulch]

im not venthyr

[oak sky]

Ok then not obedience anyway

[kind talon]

Doomblade would be better for all situations sadly

I want it to work

[oak sky]

Well in m+ zoldyck is probably still bis, but i hope you have good results with duskwalkers if u try it

[kind talon]

Yep

[strange python]

Im stuck debating if I wanna stay necrolord go back to venthyr , really love necrolord but I think its probably best for me to just wait it out and see what happens

[elder gulch]

you should stay necro

[strange python]

I do alot of keys usually as sin or outlaw but that new sub build is fun just awkward for rotation

[glossy wedge]

If you want to be both sin/sub and care about min maxing venthyr, if you want to just play sin and have better defensives necro

[fluid apex]

could anyone explain to me how to work bone spike into the rotation? I have no idea what i'm doing

[jolly atlas]

As a combo generator?

[ebon patio]

@fluid apex In the outlaw spec channel there's a pin by solo explaining it. It should be the same for assa

[fluid apex]

aight, thanks, i didn't check the outlaw pin

[balmy condor]

it's not the same for sin

that's why it's an outlaw pin

we use bonespike during gemstone, to extend lbe, or to extend kevin

[spice spire]

Kevin good?

[sharp forge]

What spec should i go if i wanna just do high m+ and arena? wont do myth raid no matter what

[balmy condor]

if you want 1 spec, it would probably be sub

[sharp forge]

What about assa any good in m+ ?

[strange python]

I never know what people mean when they say "high m+"

[balmy condor]

its' the worst out of the 3

[strange python]

some would say 15's are high

[sharp forge]

i mean arround 22to 26

[swift sky]

if you are going that high you might as well just play outlaw, unless obedience is rly good that it will make sub the to go to m+ spec

[clear shadow]

is there a bis anima power list for the 1st boss of sanctum

[swift sky]

but outlaw is a meme in pvp

[sharp forge]

yeah thats my issue tbh

[balmy condor]

no

[sharp forge]

well what covent would u pick in my place

[swift sky]

i'd play necro and play sin in pvp and outlaw in m+ if i were your place

[clear shadow]

will there be one? cause idk which to pick

[balmy condor]

probably not, no

[swift sky]

but as i said who knows, will see how strong obedience is

[balmy condor]

seems like you need at least some people with the damage reduction ones for soaks

so it would probably get assigned, and if it's not assigned, you just take whatever damage ones you can

[swift sky]

i heard the immunity to stun anima is pretty good

it was immune to fear/stun or something

assigned to soakers

[balmy condor]

yeh

I mean you need the immunity for soakers

that's basically required for the mechanic

[oak sky]

The dr one is big for uptime

Afaik

[idle shard]

will you guys try subt?

[balmy condor]

I haven't played sin once this patch yet

[oak sky]

Im gonna play some sub once i can get back on my pc

[buoyant mauve]

if obe doesn't get nerfed, maybe if I cba to farm torg

[idle shard]

so u sub now?

[balmy condor]

yes

I'll play sin if I have to for raid

[idle shard]

what u mean if you have to

if they nerf sub or something

or sin just on top

[balmy condor]

if sin is better on a fight, I'll play sin

[shell ivy]

Is sub actually already better even for week one?

I thought it’s only coz of sylvanas dagger

[balmy condor]

sub baseline sims higher

[shell ivy]

What were the changes? Wtf

[buoyant mauve]

speaking of whats better on a fight - from an encounter standpoint - how is sin looking overall in sanctum compared to sub/outlaw?

[balmy condor]

it got buffed to hell

and obedience is much stronger

[shell ivy]

Don’t you get obedience on mythic week only

[balmy condor]

yes?

[balmy condor]

sin and sub both seem fine, outlaw seems fine too, but a little behind

[shell ivy]

So wouldn’t sin stay ahead for week one

[balmy condor]

I mean if you're going to take week 1 heroic that seriously, sure, maybe? sub still sims higher though

It comes down to fight at the end of the day

so I don't really understand what the question is

[shell ivy]

Oh I wasn’t really asking one, I was just surprised that sub was actually that much ahead already

[balmy condor]

yeah, 10% of buffs will do that

quite good now

[silk thunder]

How will valor work come Tuesday? Are they resetting it?

[balmy condor]

yes

[shell ivy]

Now I’m even more stuck with covenant choice

[balmy condor]

that's the play

[shell ivy]

Was easy to choose since I was only playing sin and outlaw

But sub aswell now 😭

[balmy condor]

then go kyrian I guess

[shell ivy]

Ill see how I’ll like sub, Im already not a fan of how it plays so I gotta learn it first to see if it’s worth the covenant hassle

Sin is still there so that’s good to know

[balmy condor]

I can already tell you if you don't want to play it, it's not good enough to warrant forcing yourself

[wild beacon]

it's worth a shot though, once you figure it out it might feel a bit better

[mental trout]

wow, i am much more behind when it comes to keeping up with rogues then i thought lol. so little time to even play, much less to read and watch videos =/. I thought Sin was simming much better/IRL would be a much stronger spec to play for ST then Sub. Apparently sub is just as good, if not better?!

[shell ivy]

Yea, I only really have pvp experience as subtlety so I gotta learn the basics again

So far I’m not a fan of the down times(?) it has when u don’t have symbols dance up but I bet I’m playing it wrong

[lyric cave]

!bis

[spice spire]

Not really a thing here. Just sim for upgrades

[shell ivy]

Although I’m still a sin in my heart so I hope it gets better too

[balmy condor]

we don't support bis lists

[idle shard]

should I play sub :oooo

lol

@balmy condor are the sub guides accurate?

or where do I look for info about opener and all that

[balmy condor]

yes

[indigo mulch]

I really like the new sheet you made whispyr 😮

wp.

[balmy condor]

ty

it's not quite where I want it

[mental trout]

so how bad/good will necro sub be for raiding if sub is going to be the way to go for raids? i understand as sub i wont be able to play Obedience if i stay necro (which i will bc of necro Outlaw/i love pvp). would that mean with out Obedience just rocking doomblade as Sin would beat out necro sub without Obedience?

[indigo mulch]

Looks more clean though, easier to see if you ask me.

[thorny pond]

Necro sub will be meh

Simply because SBS isn't a great mechanic for the spec and has no interactions like SBS does with Sin

[indigo mulch]

sbs is fun to play with tho

for some reason its very enjoyable

D:

[thorny pond]

Not as sun

sub*

[indigo mulch]

Well i don't evne know if i'll be playing sub during mythic prog

[balmy condor]

I used fuu's sheet during beta but it's so granular and just too many numbers that I just made my own

[thorny pond]

If you are firm on necro your better off off-speccing OL

[indigo mulch]

I suspect that i prob favor sin during progress even if i'm a venthyr boi

[thorny pond]

It has it's strengths for sure

[indigo mulch]

rofl

[thorny pond]

You just lose out on some insanity of ST

Seems like prio and burst are in demand this raid

[indigo mulch]

hmm

I dunno

I odn't feel like burst is super demand in this raid o_O

[thorny pond]

I'm not trying to convince you one way or the other, but if obedience goes live like this, this will be one of the more OP builds we've had in a while

[indigo mulch]

Yeah, but i also raidlead. So i wont be able to play perfectly.

So sin is prob better

[thorny pond]

Yea I was commenting as sin as venth

[indigo mulch]

Sin is just slower and prob suits me better when i have to look at what everyone else is doing 😒

[thorny pond]

8% is a bit of DPS to potentially leave on the table in a single target scenario

[indigo mulch]

Even if sub is 800 or 700 dps ahead very few people will be able to produce those kind of numbers during progress.

[thorny pond]

Again strictly commenting as sin rogue

The difference between venth and necro ST is around 8%

[indigo mulch]

Oh yeah

Venth is boring af though. :c

I like necro and gem. I dunno why

[frosty cedar]

venth is the best it goes boom

[thorny pond]

Because it speeds up the spec

and adds some meaningful ApM that the spec lacks typically

[indigo mulch]

prob

[thorny pond]

People are excited for sub because finally it is tuned correctly, may even be slightly OP, and the raid seems built around their damage profile a bit better than prior raids (thanks Zul!)

[remote vale]

Did I cuck myself by going necrobro for a raid alt or is it insignificant?

[thorny pond]

alt ?

nah

[cobalt pelican]

yep your character is unplayable now and you might aswell delete it

[winged basin]

is there a confirmed level in which keys are going to be given to us next week. Like if I do a 15 am I going to get a 10?

[cobalt pelican]

-3

[thorny pond]

literally -3

you have to start in normal and work up

[winged basin]

all good, solving an arguement

[thorny pond]

18 to 15

[gleaming fable]

does it matter if you time the key? did a scuffed ass 18 last night lol

[cobalt pelican]

yes it matters

[manic harness]

@thorny pond hi

[cobalt pelican]

keys are -3

if you deplete an 18 you get a 17

17-3 is

[manic harness]

@thorny pond sub is well tuned and suited for this raid? That's exciting. I'll take it to sub channel I guess though

[thorny pond]

Sorry was in sub

That's my opinion from my notes and testing

Sin is also well suited for it

But my argument is for sub not against Sin

[vague falcon]

@balmy condor btw, i figured out by now that the dslice sin sims in your sheet are using the no stealth conditions you used in those misc sims. you probably just mixed up some tabs. not sure if you bother to fix before doing a whole new batch

[balmy condor]

wat

it's right there

[vague falcon]

not sure if you even remember that i asked you about these dslice numbers yesterday

[main rose]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[vague falcon]

i mean .. maybe i am just not familiar enough with apl but it pretty much seems to me like you used the same input as for the no stealth sims