assassination

[solar bramble]

the combo point generation and upfront dmg is why I liked it. . . great for when things dont' live long enough to get up and get value froma full row of bleeds

we dont' have shrouded suffocation so opening with 3 hyper garrotes isn't an option atm either. . . just feelsbadman relative to outlaw (which I won't play. can't stand the playstyle)

[balmy condor]

We still open with 3 hyper garrotes from subterfuge though

They just do less damage

[solar bramble]

a lot less dmg

[balmy condor]

Sure but the playstyle is the same

The speed is the same

Probably faster actually

[solar bramble]

ya but you don't get any dmg output that way.

not really not comparable to outlaw

[balmy condor]

Currently sin does very comparable damage to outlaw

[solar bramble]

mine doesn't come close to my outlaw. nothing lives long enough

and i'm trash at outlaw

[balmy condor]

Then play higher keys

If things aren’t living long enough, you don’t need the damage anyway

[solar bramble]

but that just means i do no contribution and am being hard carried

[balmy condor]

You’re there for the boss damage

What does it matter if you’re just 3 chesting everything

[solar bramble]

if my trash dmg isn't even at a usable lvl from kill speed. the bosses wont matter at that dmg lvl either.

so i'm just a dramatically weaker outlaw at that point, which actually gets value on trash, and still does decent on bosses.

[green raft]

Wow play outlaw then

[solar bramble]

outlaw is horrible to play

it's rng on top of rng plus some rng . . . and we'll add in a bit more rng just to top it off

[balmy condor]

Then quit complaining I guess idk

You either can play something that pads on content you’re blasting already, but don’t enjoy

Or you can play something you enjoy playing, but don’t enjoy cause you’re blasting the content

Either way you’re unhappy

[green raft]

XD Then change your playstyle with assa. run diff leggos, different openers and shit... theres more than one playstyle for assa yknow.

[solar bramble]

it isn't the not enjoying it becasue i'm blasting, it's not enjoying becasue i really dislike the playstyle

of outlaw taht is

[balmy condor]

You seem to not enjoy sin either from the sounds of it

[solar bramble]

i enjoy sin when i can actually play it. but when it's dmg is too low relative to outlaw in all aspects i can't really play it

[balmy condor]

Then play sub

[solar bramble]

it's ST is higher sure, but if it's trash dmg is non existant

[green raft]

Ever heard of ambush? Try using it more

[balmy condor]

Wtf no

[shadow pivot]

I mean if you don't have enough time to deal damage on packs you're just running keys that can be blasted by 2 Dps instead of 3

issue isnt the spec

[balmy condor]

Take that garbage ability back to outlaw land

[shadow pivot]

s.priest /affli lock suffer the same condition

You basically cant' deal damage to packs in 14s

[green raft]

Dunno i dont play outlaw. I just do a lot of damage with my ambush with Mark of master assassin, that would solve the problem of actually being useful on trash no?

[solar bramble]

just let the leggo use 3 bonespikes again and i'll be content. . . they took something with so much potential and completely ruined it

[shadow pivot]

unless speccing into specific stuff such as Master Assassin + CT for sin, or Searing Nightmare for s.priest

[balmy condor]

Stop casting ambush

Please I beg of you

It hurts so bad

[green raft]

This is a theory lol, calm down

Just trying to help.

[solar bramble]

lol . . . ya why ambush when you can mutilate for basically full cp

[balmy condor]

If you’re gonna run MA play NS

And then MFD into a CT

Ambush is giga not the move

There’s a reason we don’t cast ambush ever

[green raft]

Burst damage instead of dots, thats my theory. For trash lol

[balmy condor]

But ambush is 1 target

[solar bramble]

the extra combo points from mutilate alone would end up doing more if memory serves me (in burst)

[balmy condor]

And mutilate is better

We have a command for it

!mut

[prisma monolith]

Ambush is currently only used from blindside/sepsis proc, not from stealth.
The reasoning is a little complicated, but the most important of them is the difference in combo points on crit (up to 4 vs 3).
Some other factors to consider are increased poison applications, blindside, and doomblade. This is true for all talent combinations and legendaries.

[solar bramble]

and a fan of knives is just auto full

[balmy condor]

The biggest “burst” we can do consistently for short packs in m+

Is running Nightstalker mfd

And then running master assassin

And then prepull mfd, open with CT

[sacred isle]

Don’t bring up fok combo point generation up with whispyr. He will get ptsd

[balmy condor]

2cp baseline or riot

[solar bramble]

lol ya it's not something i like tbh. the reliance on critting for the combo points is pretty harsh

[green raft]

Sorry whats mfd

[solar bramble]

mark for death

[balmy condor]

Marked for death

[sacred isle]

Worse rng then outlaw 🙂

[green raft]

Oh word

[solar bramble]

30 second cd, full combo poitns. so you get the auto crit on the initial CT hit as well as the first potions of the bleed.

portions*

[green raft]

i know the talent just wasnt super aware of the abreviation

[solar bramble]

i usualy prefer getting garrotes out to get me gcd capped with some energy intake. . . but things dont usualy last long enough

[green raft]

True

[balmy condor]

Would try the nightstalker thing

It’s a nice change of pace

The energy isn’t that bad either

Cause you get to fok, 100% crit, rup, fok, rup

[solar bramble]

it's one of the things i liked about the 3x hit bonespike. it let me get some upfront dmg and quickly spread out some garrotes and CT's. . . almost like a better version of FoK

[balmy condor]

And then you’re moving

[solar bramble]

not garrotes . . . . ruptures

[pallid hollow]

CT?

[solar bramble]

crimson tempest

[balmy condor]

Crimson tempest

[pallid hollow]

Ahhh ty

People actually play sin in m+? I thought it was outlaw territory

[solar bramble]

since bonespike gives you 1 extra combo point per application of it. 3 hits lets you multicast it as a builder early. to basically get high point ruptures/CT's out while having some initial spike dmg. as each spike does similar dmg to a shadowstrike

[green raft]

I do, its fun as hell

Kind of a raid spec but i dont really care

[balmy condor]

yep

[solar bramble]

i'd be ok if they nerfed the dmg of the 2ndary hits to balance the dmg. but keep it as 3 hits for the playstyle

that'd be reasonable at least

[pallid hollow]

CT for multi/m+ and then bomb in ST/raid?

[solar bramble]

i even like CT in raid if it has many add spawns. it's barely behidn bomb in ST as is

[pallid hollow]

Yeah fair 🙂

[green raft]

Yup i play bomb in m+ though

Mite b dumb

[balmy condor]

that's....

not advised

:P

[green raft]

XD

[solar bramble]

lol

[pallid hollow]

Literally decided on testing rogue as main for 9.1 like yesterday haha so I’m learning!

Doom blade or something else for m+? I’m assuming it’ll be deathspike in 9.1??

[solar bramble]

when CT is a dps gain over most of yoru abilities in ST outside poison blade uptime . . . to me it lets sin be a little more engagign. with CT sort of cycle and an envenom cycle. .

i use zoldyck

[balmy condor]

zold, also got a pin on it

[solar bramble]

atm

[pallid hollow]

Zoldyck for EVERYTHING? Or just m+?

[balmy condor]

m+

[solar bramble]

deathspike after it's nerf will be zoldyck . . . it's why i'm in such a pissy mood lol. . . i liked the playstyle of deathspike

[balmy condor]

doomblade/dashing for single target

[pallid hollow]

Okay

[solar bramble]

tbh you may even use zoldyck for the last 2-3 bosses of the raid. even with less dmg . . just because of the execute dmg might be more valuable than overall dmg. . . will depend though

[green raft]

Wanted doomblade so bad and was lazy when the layer it drops from was up.. sad face

[balmy condor]

you can get it from twisting corridors

just spam layer 3 twisting until you get the floor you need

run it, kill the boss

[pallid hollow]

My issue is 190/171 daggers and 2x 220 for@outlaw so I’m going outlaw in m+ atm lol

[worn geyser]

@balmy condor how big a difference do you reckon there will be between doom and dashing for ST?

[solar bramble]

it wont matter soon. m0 will drop 226's. so just spam some +2's

[balmy condor]

right now, 15 dps

[worn geyser]

ye okay

lol

[green raft]

I'll just build my zold its ok. Going night fae for that sweet poison tick o.O

[balmy condor]

oof

[solar bramble]

my sin for example i'll need to mass spam 2's for haste/crit gear in week 1. since i'm in full on pvp gear right now. which is very badly statted for sin

i'll probably do higher but 2's are quick

[balmy condor]

striking out quite a bit tonight @green raft

[soft shale]

ayayaya

[worn geyser]

Big reason why 9.0.5 logs has been dominated by doom compared to 9.1 ?

[green raft]

Well uh

Hmmm

[balmy condor]

pvp gear is fine btw

[worn geyser]

vs dashing that is

[balmy condor]

people just didn't bother building dashing

was also bugged early on in 9.0.5

[solar bramble]

it isn't the pvp gear whispyr . . . it's the complete lack of haste or crit as it's all mastery/vers which is just slow to play on sin

[balmy condor]

so by the time it got fixed, was all doomblade already

[green raft]

I reckon fae will be cool for arenas. With zold n stuff.

[solar bramble]

in my current stats it's almost a waste to even cast FoK in AoE. it wont crit . . . it's only boon is the poison applications for me lol

arena sin will 100000% be necrolord

imo

[balmy condor]

I mean sure if it's all mast/vers then that's cool, you can probably min-max for some damage on it, but if you got like 3-4 pieces of vers/mast you're fine

[green raft]

But if yall advise i get doomblade and stay necro... will do that right now cause that doomblade looks rad as frick

[balmy condor]

ilvl is king even with awful stats

[solar bramble]

i have complete mast/vers from sub rogue rbg's lol

[balmy condor]

yeh that might not be great then

[pallid hollow]

If we go Zold do we swap blindside to master poisoner?

[trim dirge]

Doomblade necro is supposed to be best for pvp as well

[solar bramble]

ya it's . . . not ideal. . . i was waiting for 9.1 to make the swap. since the ilvl difference wont be much (might even gain some). swappign to haste/vers

[vestal wren]

assassination has no "awful stat" iirc

[balmy condor]

mastery is pretty bad

[solar bramble]

oh the dmg on it is fine. . . it's purely the playstyle

[balmy condor]

a ton of vers is pretty bad

[soft shale]

yea but pvp gear goes into like 35% vers

so you also get super cucked there

[solar bramble]

my vers is . . . ya . . . a bit on the high end lol

[soft shale]

and then the rest you go mastery so even worse

[vestal wren]

its somewhat funny that mastery is now on all 3 specs somewhat not wanted

[soft shale]

haha yea lets hope they have some borrowed power ready for 9.1

[solar bramble]

it was fine for sub for burst because of MA finisher spams . . . but ya . . . post 9.1 oof

[vestal wren]

versa scales pretty linear so it only becomes bad with stat dr iirc?

[soft shale]

otherwise its on suicide watch

the thing about vers is the other stats become way better

[balmy condor]

yeah but a ton of vers also means a lack of other stats

[soft shale]

not that it is bad per se

[vestal wren]

oh ye

but that applies to all stat kinda

[soft shale]

that is a really problematic thins on jewelry

when you try to go from sub pvp to other things

its just so contrarian to everything else in pve in general

[balmy condor]

yeah but would you rather have 1000 crit/hast or 1000 vers/mast

there's a clearly better choice

[soft shale]

yea and it may be 300 dps or more in the end

i had some sims for fun for assa with the mastery/crit gear for m+

and it was like 400 dps less than the raid set

[vestal wren]

makes sense because both haste and crit interact with the spec

[humble ginkgo]

wasnt mastery wanted for sub early in the tier?

Because I made all my subtlety gear with mastery on it pretty sure based on the pins

unless I was dumb

[vestal wren]

no

[balmy condor]

mastery was for aoe

we never wanted it in raids

[humble ginkgo]

ah so that why I made MA with mastery

still havent changed it

[vestal wren]

^ mastery scales good in aoe, but even in aoe it wasn't significant better

[humble ginkgo]

For sin we stack haste right?

crit/haste

[soft shale]

mastery is primarily for pvp now

[balmy condor]

haste/crit yeah

[humble ginkgo]

ok

[soft shale]

along vers

[humble ginkgo]

I will have to regem to haste

since I am full vers

bc of MA

[soft shale]

just do a top gear

[solar bramble]

haste/crit just meshes perfectly with assassination. crit with FoK/mutilate for better CP's. haste for faster bleed ticks which generates energy. and faster energy ticks. .. they both smoothe out and help the spec dramatically

[humble ginkgo]

I wont gem into crit

bc I play MA in keys

[solar bramble]

the others are just flat dmg. and don't really synergize together so well. haste/crit kind of double dip with rogue (not fully but partially)

[humble ginkgo]

the crit loses value

[soft shale]

vers may be better than haste then

[humble ginkgo]

on assassination

[soft shale]

haste actually gets less value in m+

[humble ginkgo]

?

[soft shale]

try to sim dslice who knows

it might still pick haste gems

[humble ginkgo]

ye I will

[soft shale]

or crit even

[solar bramble]

idk if that'll be as much of the case in 9.1 th ough. depending on how much you pull with the big elites

[soft shale]

chances are it will pick crit

[humble ginkgo]

I wont ever play assa in m+ tho

so

[soft shale]

well even for cleave crit is better than haste

[humble ginkgo]

ah I see

[solar bramble]

if you kill 4 elites alone and the bosses. you still get a good value from haste on those. . . but ya haste is less valuable overall in m+ when you get gcd capped if 3+ targets and you're gcd capped with energy regen

[soft shale]

good shit is next raid there are lot of high crit items

pog

[humble ginkgo]

nice

[soft shale]

[zenith sable]

Remember when haste was the worst stat for assa

[soft shale]

so scrap some haste somewhere

[humble ginkgo]

Im hoping I can still play outlaw but if sin is ahead by like 10% on ST I wont play outlaw on ST fights

so im learning it now to get used to it

[solar bramble]

tbh if i can get crit to 30-40% that'd be quite good to run MA talent. that's a lot of crit to open a pull with

[humble ginkgo]

and 2t assa beats outlaw without a doubt

[solar bramble]

in trash

[humble ginkgo]

which is suprising to me

I simmed earlier and outlaw simmed 1.5k under sin in 2t

[solar bramble]

oh sin excells at 2 and 3 targets if they aren't too far apart

[balmy condor]

2 expansions ago :P

[humble ginkgo]

[solar bramble]

you get so much value from bleeds/poisons when you have them all rolling on multiple targets. . translates into so much energy regen it's kind of nuts

i love 2 target fights on sin. 3 not as much but still not so bad

timing on garrotes can get pretty tight on 3 targets

[zealous summit]

subterfuge makes 3 targets a breeze

[solar bramble]

and i do want some open globals that aren't just builders/bleeds for some envenoms

i'm talking like 3 bosses. not just 3 trash mobs that die fast

you'll only get subterfuge tripple garrote once every 2 minutes. and you don't wanna overrite till they fall off

tbh i honestly don't know if it's better to overrite at 3 bosses when it comes back up. just to ensure all 3 targets keep one on at all times. if you wait for all 3 to fall off. 1 will go without garroe for 6 seconds, the other for 12

that might offset the gain of subterfuge vanish

i'd need to crunch some numbers.

[balmy condor]

idk what the question is in there to be honest

[soft shale]

my boi is just rambling

just keep garrote on who you can

[balmy condor]

subterfuge triple garrote every 2 minutes doesn't really make sense cause you stealth before each pack

[solar bramble]

lol. if you are against 3 bosses and you use subterfuge to garrote all 3. . . is it fully better to wait out the entire garrote duration on all 3? or is it safer to overrite one of them at 6 and one at 12 seconds

assumign a council type fight

[balmy condor]

they're all gonna be at 6

[soft shale]

garrote has 6 secs cd 18 secs duration

[balmy condor]

if you have 3 targets, they're all ticking for 18 seconds

[soft shale]

my man

[balmy condor]

then they all enter pandemic

and you can vanish refresh them in pandemic

[gloomy knoll]

^

[river quarry]

Guys, please help poor outlaw to understand sin's rotation. These are my statements for ST raiding:

1. CP overcap is bad (example: i have max CPs and shiv is ready > i should use finisher first and shiv then)
2. During shiv i should renew my bleeds (rup/gar) anyway (sometimes i can't do even 1 envenom during shiv because of it, it sucks). Playing via PB
3. I should use vendetta+vanish at 0-1 CPs to avoid overcap because next mutilate will give me 4 of it. will be correct to macro vendetta+vanish and forget about separate vanish button in raid?
4. I should use vendetta by CD no matter how many energy i got atm

Anything wrong?

[solar bramble]

it's more the question for once you no longer have vanish.

[balmy condor]

you don't want to overwrite empowered garrotes

[gloomy knoll]

i think he's asking would you start overwriting them so you can maintain 3 garrotes

and not have them all fall off

but yea don't overwrite sub garrets

[solar bramble]

ya that was essentially what i'm asking

[balmy condor]

1. overcap with shiv is fine, shiv is a cooldown and takes priority
2. you should try to avoid it, but if it can't be avoided, throwing a rupture during a shiv is fine, garrote is a builder, kinda doesn't matter as much
3. doesn't matter, as long as you vanish during vendetta and use it for a combo of muts/envenoms, good to go
4. yes

[balmy condor]

yeah I get that, but you don't overwrite empowered garrotes, and since you applied them at the same time, you're going to have a period of time after where you have to rebuild the normal garrotes

[gloomy knoll]

yee

never rewrite the juiced garrets

as it is written as it shall be done

[solar bramble]

ya that was my curiosity. if the time when there were no garrotes on the 2ndary targets would offset the gain

lol

[teal bloom]

You should not macro vanish and vendetta together because sometimes you have to shiv a bit later during vendetta window so you have to delay vanish for a few seconds

[solar bramble]

subterfuge + iron wire is my favorite talent combo . . . but i'll try a nightstalker + MFD CT

for more upfront

[balmy condor]

oh yeah, didn't see that you wanted to macro it @river quarry, janiss is correct that you want to vanish during the shiv, so don't macro them

you cast the vanish during the vendetta, but not together

[solar bramble]

vendetta has a noticeable duration, you got some room to play with

[river quarry]

gotcha. can i macro shiv+vanish then?

[balmy condor]

uh

[solar bramble]

keep em separate

[balmy condor]

I guess you could in theory

but that's really awkward as well

and then it wouldn't work with subterfuge, or nightstalker

[solar bramble]

i wouldn't wanna have my vanish attached like that in normal content

[balmy condor]

would be an MA only thing

[solar bramble]

their are plenty of times outside bosses where i'll vanish just for the garrotes

[river quarry]

i see now, thanks

[solar bramble]

just w/e you do take ambush off your stealth bar till you're comfy with the build

put mutilate in it's place lol. . . . without blindside or NF covenant ability you shouldn't need ambush anyway

if you do use blindside just place it in some random place that dosdn't change on stealth bar

[balmy condor]

it's actually not worth with sepsis either

but I haven't bothered updating the command

cause no one plays fae anyway

[solar bramble]

i played NF for a bit as sub

knowingly took the dmg loss to have the blink for rbg's

[worthy glacier]

After gearing my rogue for weeks now and finally dropping a weapon my officer says 2 weeks b4 9.1 drops: assa is shit cuz if u wanna bring something that does lots of st u bring a sp which also has the advantage of being range. Now he wants me to play ret as my 2nd char.. Im kinda pissed

[balmy condor]

[soft shale]

nani

[balmy condor]

he doesn't want sin

so he makes you go RET?

[soft shale]

ahahaha

[worthy glacier]

Yes

[soft shale]

he wants the secret nf paladin tech to simp for the sps

[lusty dew]

time to look for a new guild friend

[soft shale]

a conossieur

[balmy condor]

he knows ret is worse right

[worthy glacier]

Idk i think he just doesnt like me and wants to fuck with me theres no way he can be srs

[teal bloom]

Unethical raid leader

[balmy condor]

I mean................

hungering is pretty single target

[worthy glacier]

Yeah sp is ahead

[balmy condor]

sure

I can't argue against the SP

that's just SP doing SP things

[worthy glacier]

So according to his logic if i wanna play st specc i roll sp

[balmy condor]

but swapping off of sin

because it's worse than sp

is a pretty weird move

[soft shale]

the question is was sp your main before?

[worthy glacier]

Nah i only play melee p much

Played dk this tier

[balmy condor]

I mean in cleave as well, like altimor

[soft shale]

oh then that is a reason why

[balmy condor]

you still see sin towards the top

[soft shale]

dk is still better than rogue if you count everything it can do

also frost destroys 2t cleave now

too

[hazy crater]

yikers

[worthy glacier]

Idk sin is gonna be fotm next tier in raid im quite sure they will even bring in wf

[soft shale]

yea but you are on something else if you think rogue>dk for prog

[balmy condor]

I'm not sure about that claim

[soft shale]

i mean no bias

[teal bloom]

Survival getting nice buffs in 9.1 for single target, all melee spots will be survival hunters :)

[hazy crater]

not sure I even want to ask but what world rank guild are you in

[soft shale]

we are talking objectively here

[worthy glacier]

Thats my 2 cents but he is former top 20 raider so im wrong i guess

[balmy condor]

yikes

[soft shale]

i mean he said nothing wrong until the ret part

but i think the ret is more on you

[worthy glacier]

Were gonna be competing for 100 @hazy crater

[soft shale]

maybe for plate gear trading

because they already have lot of leather

[worthy glacier]

Mh

I think ppl should play whatever they want in a guild thars world 100 or worse, not like our lives depend on it

[hazy crater]

True

[brisk forge]

ofc, but thats the player chooise, do w/e u like and if the guild isnt happy with it, find another one 😄 its all about the fun afterall

[soft shale]

i mean if what he has is a dk

and you wanna go rogue

that is like shooting yourself on the foot

[tired citrus]

I think dmg wise we should be fine right? The utility is the problem

[worthy glacier]

Im gonna stick with dk was about 2nd char

[soft shale]

ah yea

nothing special most melee have ranged alts

[worthy glacier]

I dont enjoy ranged dps tbh

Fuck that

[soft shale]

yea its a pain

[brisk forge]

BM ;p

[worthy glacier]

Im melee brain and will always be

[brisk forge]

almost as a melee xD

[soft shale]

some people did go monk/dh/warr to always have buff slot

[tired citrus]

Survival hunter pogchamp?

[azure flare]

wait wait

he wants you to play ret, a spec that brings close to nothing for the raid atm

over assa rogue?

so u can do even less damage?

[worthy glacier]

As my 2nd char yes

[azure flare]

get a new guild

real talk

[worthy glacier]

Hes onto something i guess

[soft shale]

the thing is ret does actually do a lot on raid vs rogue lets not kid ourselves

[azure flare]

it really doesn't tho

[tired citrus]

What guild is that btw?

[azure flare]

what does it bring over rogue

[worthy glacier]

Sequence thrall

[tired citrus]

Top 50/100

[azure flare]

hand of freedom other classes bring as well so its not even unique

[tired citrus]

?

[soft shale]

bop freedom impo

hallow

[azure flare]

ret doesnt use hallow

they're kyrian

[worthy glacier]

Pls dont send them death threats

[soft shale]

i mean warriors if they want to go full dps dont go necro

but they will because its more raid dps

[azure flare]

freedom sure, but u will have a monk in raid and they bring that as well

uh no, warriors are def sticking to venthyr

I mean all we have to do is look at current logs

[worthy glacier]

Yeah

[azure flare]

u dont rlly see a ret venth

same for a necro war unless he's prot

venthyr does more damage than the banner would give u

they already theory'd that

[worthy glacier]

Venth is gonna be bonkers

[azure flare]

necro war has plays in high m+ but night fae war stomps it

and the new venth war lego is looking to be the play as well if you're sticking to fury

[soft shale]

yea fury does seem good

[azure flare]

(im actually surprised it didnt get nerfed harder ngl)

[worthy glacier]

@tired citrus barely famed guild

[azure flare]

but they massacred our deathspike boi

[soft shale]

but on the point of rogue vs ret its like kindergarten

vs dk

[azure flare]

true

[soft shale]

and vs sp

[azure flare]

but have u seen how hard assa pumps next patch?

It's kind of insane

[soft shale]

dont worry sub does more

[worthy glacier]

Idk why u guys are still on the dk train

[soft shale]

but its kind of irrelevant

[azure flare]

sub is outperforming assa?

[soft shale]

only on st

[tired citrus]

Ye same with us top 150ish but on the ptr testing we did Sin was quite good

[azure flare]

aha

but yeah

on the topic at hand

when u look at ur raid team

you dont rlly go like

[soft shale]

its really first world problems the raid lead is having

[azure flare]

"bench the melee x or y because a or b ranged spec does more damage"

you have an amount of ranged ull bring

and an amount of melee

[limber lion]

Ye

[azure flare]

so you compare the melee to...well the other melees

and the ranged to other ranged

[limber lion]

You don't compete for a raid spot against the range

[worthy glacier]

Exactlyyy

[runic sequoia]

Pins say to our doomblade on cloak, currently only can go on shoulders/hands. Is this a change coming in 9.1?

[soft shale]

yes

[azure flare]

yes ^

[soft shale]

it adds 1 slot

[tired citrus]

And i played Sub in CN Progress it was fine aside SLG got famed last week

[runic sequoia]

Tyty

[limber lion]

Just gotta pump the hardest out of all the melees and we in boys.

[azure flare]

yeah and even then

unless they're a top 100 guild

they shouldn't be min maxing like this

[worthy glacier]

Even top 100

[tired citrus]

I seriously dont feel Sin is gonna be bad next patch 1 or 2 will be used imho

[azure flare]

our rogue went full sub and we got hall of fame either way

[worthy glacier]

Comp matters but not that much

[limber lion]

I'm pretty high up there and even we don't do mega minmaxing

To some extent for sure

[balmy condor]

that's fine

[limber lion]

[vital tapir]

what about midmaxing?

[soft shale]

spec/class elitism

[gusty mirage]

https://tenor.com/view/daddys-home2-daddys-home2gifs-stop-it-stop-that-i-mean-it-gif-9694318

[soft shale]

[vital tapir]

[north basin]

Lets do max maxing then

[gusty mirage]

[teal bloom]

Yeah why would I minmax when I can maxmax?

[worthy glacier]

Fuck that minmax nonsense we all bout da MAXMAX

[pallid hollow]

Max max = everyone ranged?

[teal bloom]

[gusty mirage]

https://tenor.com/view/work-home-karate-kid-i-hate-it-here-wanna-go-home-gif-4801336

[vital tapir]

I hate what I started tbh

I just wanted to meme

[soft shale]

as i said before we are prone to civil wars

[pallid hollow]

Let’s face it RtWF = spamming the most broken shit at that renown/gear level as they’re doing it under geared and missing borrowed power.

Most shit is@playable in 99% of all guilds. Just depends whether your RL subscribes to that or is a meta slave.

[vital tapir]

true

[worthy glacier]

Rtfw = midmax cucks

[vital tapir]

they do that bc they have to?

[pallid hollow]

Yeah basically

[willow eagle]

I think perception is the actual obstacle to overcome

[worthy glacier]

[pallid hollow]

And let’s face it most dps comes from good play. Shite players pull no numbers anyway as they’re dead or fucking up mechanics and missing uptime.

[vital tapir]

true

[willow eagle]

Some dps specs can slack tho, if you're the only warlock in the team, you will still be there even if you're a subpar player

[north basin]

We just need these sylvanas daggers to do enormous amount of damage, so we can convince everyone of our superior role and significant damage impact

[limber lion]

But an undertuned class is still undertuned, even in the hands of a demi-god.

[worthy glacier]

Or as certain lead developers put it : frankly, thats a skill issue

[limber lion]

Just need to get the dagger first :p

[willow eagle]

Daggers are still bad right?

[soft shale]

no they are really good

[willow eagle]

Unless i missed some tuning 2 days ago

[soft shale]

got a 500% buff

[willow eagle]

[north basin]

We wont have bonus roll in 9.1 ?

[willow eagle]

No

[soft shale]

yea hc ones now do 1700 damage and that is the one we will be rocking for a while

a looooong while

[north basin]

Coz i rememba they talked about bonus roll future implementation

[willow eagle]

Yoink that's an outlaw oh

[soft shale]

yea it works well with outlaw too

[willow eagle]

How does the proc on the dagger work?

[soft shale]

it procs a regular debuff on mobs

and finishers have 3% per combo point to do damage

it appears to stack until 4 but we do not know %heal breakpoints

each 25% would make sense

[willow eagle]

How does it work with 2 aame daggers

[north basin]

Some of us wont get 2 daggers in next 3-4 months, statistically speaking) thats sad

[azure flare]

what's the 500ms cooldown thing?

[soft shale]

no idea how it would work

[soft shale]

it if works on the damage neat

[azure flare]

what does 500ms mean

[soft shale]

but even the proc rate would be fine

[azure flare]

do i need 500 ping

[limber lion]

No.

[indigo mulch]

5s cooldown

[soft shale]

it means it could proc every 0.5 seconds

[limber lion]

It's a 0.5s cooldown

[balmy condor]

it's just an internal cooldown

[azure flare]

oh sick

ty

[balmy condor]

guys 0.5 seconds

500 mili

mili being 1000

[azure flare]

ah 0.5

kk makes sense

[limber lion]

Yeah you dummies

[balmy condor]

it's just a simple internal cooldown, lots of things have it

[limber lion]

Smh

[soft shale]

hahah

[balmy condor]

won't affect anything on the effect

[soft shale]

no one saw that shh

[indigo mulch]

Does the dagger share cd if you have two though?

[soft shale]

no idea

[balmy condor]

depends on how they added it in

it could be 500ms for each instance

[north basin]

And our regular between attacks delay under bloodlust and our initial haste are?

[balmy condor]

or 500ms for the effect total

[north basin]

Why did they even mention 500ms

[balmy condor]

if it's the latter, it wouldn't stack

if it's the former, it would

[soft shale]

blizz and their super tooltips

we can make a bingo for the dagger

[indigo mulch]

How did they add pox?

[balmy condor]

don't see why that matters

[soft shale]

does the % on proc is the only thing that works with both or also the damage or even neither

[north basin]

I mean they maybe added 500ms to avoid some imba haste stack damage combowombo?

[soft shale]

the last one would be so troll

[indigo mulch]

Its most likely pox sword with different stats.

[soft shale]

no it is to avoid being applied in aoe to all targets i guess

[balmy condor]

I don't get how that works, so I'm gonna say no

the ms is literally just an internal cooldown

stop trying to giga brain some shit

this is standard operating procedure

[soft shale]

but maybe the 500ms is only for the stacking thing and not the banshee debuff itself

[balmy condor]

it just happened to be in the tooltip cause jank

[soft shale]

so we give up yea

oh i know

[azure flare]

im assuming this can only apply to one target at a time if you'd fov ?

[soft shale]

maybe it has 500ms so it does not check every damage instance

IM A GENIUS

to get more stacks on a mob

[balmy condor]

we don't know

[azure flare]

oh okay

guess we'll find out

[balmy condor]

can't test the daggers on ptr

so it's really anyones guess

[soft shale]

yea but chances are its because of what i said

[azure flare]

soontm

[soft shale]

it has a 0.5 secs check to add more stacks

[balmy condor]

yeah

[soft shale]

so every damage instance does not send a call

to the server

[indigo mulch]

I would assume they opperate on the same internal cd. Just make sense.

[balmy condor]

that's how internal cooldowns work

[soft shale]

good thing is if its only what i said it could apply on aoe

because it would only check to add more stacks if it already had one

[indigo mulch]

I would hope its not like that but knowing blizzard its probably like that.

[soft shale]

the week of 7th of july

lets stalk rogues from here that get the drop

and make some lab rats

[balmy condor]

I assure you rae and tisu and push will be all over it

[soft shale]

or maybe next week blizz will just put the dagger on ptr npc

maybe its time to invest some $$ into rogue traders on mythic week

hmm how many mil would i need to entice some yellow traders

[north basin]

Its quite simple to understand tooltip til point of "its stacks 4times". Need to see how it will apply

[soft shale]

blizz and simple ahahahaha

[royal lantern]

blizz and tooltips that tell you how something works

ahahahahahha

reminder that the crucible of storms self dmg trinket had 3 different dmg numbers

the trinket said a number how much dmg you take

the debuff said another number

and both where wrong

[soft shale]

yea glorious shit

[north basin]

3% per combo its 5cp lets say envenom will have 15% chance to do shadow damage, so 4 stacks will be 60% chance or, or. Iam so eager to see it ))

[balmy condor]

reminder that flayedwing has 3 tooltips, one on the character equip, one on the buff on your character, one on the debuff on the enemy, and details/logs as a 4th number

and none of them match

[soft shale]

bingo on wich is wrong

lets gooo

[balmy condor]

love it

3 tooltips, and all of them are wrong

and all of them are different

[royal lantern]

just sim them

[balmy condor]

yeah thanks

ptr=1

it's all there

[royal lantern]

bro its so easy

just sim it

smh

[balmy condor]

ptr=1 is the magic cheat codes

you just add it

and it answers every question

like a magic 8 ball

[royal lantern]

ptr=1 is the sim version of the big red FIX BUG button all videocompanys have, and are just to lazy to use

[balmy condor]

true

[north basin]

They love to add stuff on mondays afternoons, hope tomorrow they shed some light on this topic

[balmy condor]

who is they?

[north basin]

Bliz

[balmy condor]

bro we haven't had a monday ptr update in like 3 years

what kind of crack you smoking

[north basin]

Lol

[balmy condor]

most of 9.1 has been a mix of wednesday/thursday/friday

[north basin]

I frequently read fresh bluposts on mondays

Or maybe site iam reading throw stuff on mondays)

[balmy condor]

and that's fantastic, I usually do my laundry on thursdays

but that doesn't actually mean anything

they can blue post all they want

[north basin]

Agree

[balmy condor]

if the patch comes out

and it's broken

then it's broken

[dawn ivy]

wait that means youre seeing the ptr recap every week and thinking thats the fresh news

[balmy condor]

yeah probably

[dawn ivy]

the new ptr builds have been a tuesday every week except like one or two wed/thursday

[north basin]

Probably this

And i had this perception for couple of years lol)

[dawn ivy]

to add onto the original mention, theres probably not going to be many changes if any at all because we know they released the most recent build as a legitimate release build

or at least id be surprised if there were any blindsiding changes

[north basin]

So no dager tweaks?

Or after heroic week

[dawn ivy]

dagger got giga buffed this recent build

[north basin]

Didnt see

[dawn ivy]

50% more proc rate and MUCH more dam

[north basin]

Need to check this out

The screen above recent?

Of dagger proc

[balmy condor]

believe so, yes

[north basin]

Would be funny if % of its damage profile will match more or less hunters orange bow

[dawn ivy]

currently the bow doesnt do that much for hunters unless the bow got tweaked along with the dagger and i havent heard anything

[willow eagle]

Still waiting on that smoke bomb

[dawn ivy]

pretty sure the "quiver" effect will do more dam

[balmy condor]

they said rogue utility, they said the thing

[willow eagle]

Ok but what was actually the purpose of the pvp smoke bomb changes?

[dawn ivy]

to tickle your expectations

[balmy condor]

some background coding change that wowhead scrubbed in their datamining

happens all the time

[willow eagle]

I see

[balmy condor]

they datamine stuff that isn't an actual change

[willow eagle]

No you see whispyr

[balmy condor]

they've for example datamined that shiv lasts "until cancelled", 5 times now

[willow eagle]

This is coding change to prepare the pve smoke implementation

Shiv did get a slight buff tho no?

[dawn ivy]

i mean sure thats not impossible for much later on in the future

[willow eagle]

Outside sin

[balmy condor]

I mean

it now applies both poisons

I guess that's a buff

now when you shiv things, they're also slowed for 3 seconds or whatever

kinda sick

[willow eagle]

It's weird for pve if you're sin I guess

[balmy condor]

it's weird in general

[willow eagle]

"hey can you shiv that target to slow and soothe him"

[balmy condor]

no one was asking for this

[willow eagle]

But shiv is a dps cd

[balmy condor]

it wasn't even needed

like who cares that it slows now and dispels

[dawn ivy]

feel the same about feint buff

[balmy condor]

half the fun was picking the poison you wanted

[willow eagle]

Isn't that insane for pve tho?

[balmy condor]

now it just does both

so who cares

[willow eagle]

Especially with hemotoxin

Pvp*

[balmy condor]

idk maybe

fuck pvp tho

[solar bramble]

hemotoxin to me sh ould be interesting . . . . i wonder if you'll end up with a teamfight sin rogue just for hemotoxin on kill targets

sharpening blade has such a long cd

in rbg's that is. . . while still having some minor back capping potential (but not as good as sub)

overall whispyr the MA + nightstalker's open burst with CT immediately isn't half bad. and still lets you get 2 full crit FoK for 2 full garrotes . . . you end up energy starved for a short bit doing that. But you have enough energy and CP to refresh CT by the time it's ready to reapply. . . just a slightly slower rampup in exchange for more upfront burst

[dawn ivy]

[low wedge]

Pvp change

[balmy condor]

no, the shiv change is overall

[low wedge]

Yee ik but it was mostly a huge pvp buff, in pve its extremly pointless

Like the change was needed in pvp

[balmy condor]

cool

[worthy glacier]

Pvp was fun like 10 years ago

[low wedge]

Still is imo, rbg and arenas are a blast. No more real world pvp tho :/

[willow eagle]

There never will be real world pvp again

[solar bramble]

sharding + flying etc. and lvling through dungeons more often than not. . and too many stealthies

i still kill things in the open world when i see it but not to the same level as classic

[nimble tartan]

just have another cool zone like timeless isle thats some fun wpvp

[rustic thunder]

what addon do you use to keep track of all the dots?

[limber lion]

Weakauras for your main target, Nameplates in AoE.

Personally use Plater for nameplates.

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[limber lion]

I use Afenar's WA set that I've modified a bit to suit my needs.

[timid talon]

Is it still not possible to test the sylvanas dagger on ptr yet?

[soft shale]

no

[timid talon]

Getting thirsty for any information, 2 weeks to go and we still don't know how it really functions

[soft shale]

early christmas surprise

[pine ore]

how good sin is good on 2+ target fights in 9.1? Aka is having sin in raids on those fights even useful or just bring another dk/whatever class?

also which slot do we craft new necro lego on - gloves?

[timid talon]

I mean unless you're going for world first you should just play what you enjoy, its not going to be like a survival hunter or 8.0 spriest so you'll be able to carry your weight if you're good at it.

Its not more or less useful than any other melee in that regard

[pine ore]

what about necro leggo - do we craft it on hands i assume, not on bracers?

[spice spire]

Due to domination slots if we were to craft it, it would be on bracers iirc

[pine ore]

yeah bracers then it is

[limber lion]

Very good, Sin excels in cleave. Falls off a little on multiple targets (like 5+) when compared to stuff like Outlaw and 9.1 Sub.

[pine ore]

yeah i mean considering we still have 0 utility - the damage better be at least top 3 imo

[drifting cloud]

thats not really how the game works

[timid talon]

Unfortunately

having said that though, i think we're in a fine spot for damage imo

nothing was really changed going into getting higher ilvl for us and we already do really well at our niche

[frosty bridge]

Doomblade on cloak for 9.1?

[timid talon]

yeah

[frosty bridge]

tyty

[rustic whale]

guys anyone here used Dashing Scoundrel vs Zoldyck for M+? I m not talking about sims , i m talking about real test. Anyone?

[quartz bear]

Why on cloak tho?

Could someone explain?

[cunning wyvern]

There are new strong sockets that can only be put in raid gear

So you want to put legendaries on item slots that dont have those sockets

[low wedge]

How strong are they? because there drops a cloak with high ilvl from last 2 bosses, and lego on big piece is more dps then on cloak, is the domnation sockets that good?

[slender berry]

have you read how dashing scoundrel works ? why would you wanna use that in m+

[quartz bear]

Yeah i know that but was under impression u can have only 3 of them, while having 5 slots

[cunning wyvern]

nope so

[quartz bear]

Or can you have all 5 socketed

[cunning wyvern]

the way they work is

there are 3 different kinds and 3 different types

you want to have 3 of a kind and 3 of a type

[lone minnow]

Yo boyz, what cov we thinking for 9.1? necro or venth

[slender berry]

for example 3 blood and 3 dps (of which 1 is a blood)

[quartz bear]

Oh ok so u can have all 5 slots socketed

[cunning wyvern]

So you'd end up with 5 sockets yep

[frigid kestrel]

Pins updated again, I love new patches , seeing that new pin alert gets me going

[timid talon]

domination sockets, cloak is also one of the few pieces without a boosted ilvl too

[frigid kestrel]

I might swap back to Venth, not sure I made up my mind in if I want to push keys with Sub or Sin yet.

TOP will more then likely always be a Sin key, ye?

[lone minnow]

If I only play sin, what would be best

[balmy condor]

necro prolly

[umbral rapids]

@balmy condor did you mean that necro wins on 2+ targets in the pin?

i can't read

[balmy condor]

[umbral rapids]

i prob just get doomblade if i'm only gonna raid on sin right ?

[proud rock]

can someone explain to me why haste is worse than mastery in aoe situations? i understand that the energy regeneration is not important in MT but is that the only reason?

[balmy condor]

kinda pretty much yeh

mastery increases bleed damage by more

[vestal wren]

you gain higher energy regeneration when you get multiple dots up

[proud rock]

and versatility does not increase any bleed/poison dmg, right? just the instant dmg from envenom, melee attacks and the instant dmg from CT for example, correct?

[vestal wren]

what means you gain less benefits from haste

[balmy condor]

vers increaess everything

[proud rock]

interesting, another question if i may: how does CT work huge packs? If i fight a pack with 16 targets and use it twice, will all mobs have the bleed or only the 8 closest to me or is it random?

[balmy condor]

its kinda half and half

it does sorta hit closest

but it's also kinda random

[proud rock]

weird but interesting to know thank you

[sonic schooner]

I found it totally random

Ok sire p1 every single of my CT don't hit site

Sire

[low wedge]

Btw is it 100% that domnation sockats are that important? I saw that the raid cloak is from the last 2 bosses (high ilvl) is 1 socket more important then the legendary being on a good piece + cloack from last boss?

talking about doomblade btw

[balmy condor]

sockets are bigger

[low wedge]

ahh ok, ty

[indigo mulch]

Ct is random but it prioritize mobs within range that does not hsve thr debuff

[fallen sapphire]

Is it OK to have doomblade still on gloves? I'm rerolling back rogue main and just got them to 225ilvl

[balmy condor]

sure but you're losing a dom socket

[sonic schooner]

Is it OK to like whispyr ?

[fallen sapphire]

Ok so at this point worth crafting again for cloak on the run up to 9.1?

[balmy condor]

can't craft till 9.1

[sonic schooner]

What are the comp for a r4 cloak 🤔

[indigo mulch]

Cant you farm ash in 9.1

[balmy condor]

illegal actually

[fallen sapphire]

Ah yeah, worth farming Ash before the patch or not?

[balmy condor]

ash is a free farm in 9.1

won't matter

[indigo mulch]

Aye

Going to be so much fun..

[umbral rapids]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[indigo mulch]

Did they add it to corridors yet?

[balmy condor]

dunno

[indigo mulch]

Since its farmable you might aswell add it to corridors after each boss thing.

[fallen sapphire]

Ah ok can just chill a bit then ha

[lean coral]

you want to do corridors?

[fallen sapphire]

Seems a silly design if most have to redraft their legendary again

*recraft

[lean coral]

its a way to keep people busy

having to refarm ash to recraft

i hoarded some up on alts after i saw it was gonna be transferable between toons

[quasi grotto]

what should i craft zoldy on taking into account 9.1?

[lean coral]

legs

[indigo mulch]

Why not? Might aswell add it there so you atleast have a choice on what horri le way to grind your new ash.

Kekw

[proud rock]

Does vendetta also increase the dmg of serrated bonespike?

[teal bloom]

It should because it's an ability

[quasi grotto]

im in 2 minds about switching to necro. i play sub for m plus normally and sin for raid. would it benefit me more to just go necro and learn sin in m plus

also are the changes for sub in 9.1 gonna make it a more viable in dungeons?

[drowsy parcel]

yeah sub in m+ is looking great

are you venthyr now?

[modern dove]

Hello, is there ever a point in aoe where your useing CT just for the instant damage? Assuming you have ruptures and SnD up?

[quasi grotto]

im currently venthry yes

[umbral rapids]

this summarizes it pretty well

[balmy condor]

Neigh

Like the horse

[quasi grotto]

yeah i see tahat, but i just wasnt sure if sub was gonna be viable in m+

[modern dove]

Thank you!

[umbral rapids]

whisp with blindside you just ambush at every proc ?

[balmy condor]

Yuhhhh

[quasi grotto]

or whether it was just gonna be better to play sin in m+

[balmy condor]

It’s probably better

Early sims got sub slamming that shit

[indigo mulch]

M+?

[balmy condor]

Yep

[indigo mulch]

Ohh how is necro for sub though?

[balmy condor]

Trash homie

[indigo mulch]

M+ that is

[drowsy parcel]

venthyr sub is gonna pop off both raid and m+

im on the fence to switch

[balmy condor]

Necro is dogwater on sub

[quasi grotto]

was meant to pop of for raid in 9.0 XD

that soon changed

[balmy condor]

Any necro sub players get reported and taken out back for the firing squad dude

[indigo mulch]

Sadge

[scenic root]

I enjoy sin in m+ and raid, should I stay necro or go venthyr. I'm thinking staying necro to help in aoe in m+.

[indigo mulch]

I guess i have to level another rogue then.

[balmy condor]

Hit the grind dude

[indigo mulch]

I so wanted to try sub in m+

[balmy condor]

Play venthyr

[indigo mulch]

But i guess i stick with my ele shaman to push keys thrn raid with my rogue =c

[balmy condor]

What’s stopping you from going venthyr

[indigo mulch]

I just like necro so much more.

[balmy condor]

Ah

[indigo mulch]

It feela better to play with.

And i find it slightly better to raid with.

[balmy condor]

Sometimes you gotta let go man she don’t love you like that

[quasi grotto]

suppose i should look at re geariung the sub then

[scenic root]

Does venthyr do alright in m+ as sin?

[balmy condor]

Meh

Depends on what alright is

[umbral rapids]

@balmy condor i'm gonna annoy like i did in bfa man. do you hold shiv for vendetta or hold vendetta for shiv ? i want to say hold vendetta 5 seconds waiting for shiv but idk

[balmy condor]

Oof pinned question number 2

[umbral rapids]

my bad

[balmy condor]

1 more that’s a strikeout home boy

[indigo mulch]

You can hold ahiv 10s for vendetta.

[umbral rapids]

D:

[indigo mulch]

Feom what i understood

[narrow girder]

how wide exactly are the covenant differences anyways? sure necro is ahead... but if its only a few%, i probably don't care

[balmy condor]

Probably all within about 5-7%

[red turtle]

do we know what spec will be played in 9.1 Raid? or at least what the go to will be?

[indigo mulch]

@balmy condor how much uptime on dots do you have in fights like sludge mythic?

[balmy condor]

Who knows

[balmy condor]

Unfathomably large dude

[scenic root]

I stopped enjoying outlaw. Tried it in a 18 and felt like a wet noodle. Maybe I'll switch venthyr and play sub in m+..

[narrow girder]

the only reason i think i want to swap out of NF right now, is sepsis sort of annoys me when it procs for the stealth bit.. and fucks up my bars

[bleak sky]

I'd say 5-7% is a pretty big diff, so if someone is still having doubts about changing covenants: do it

[balmy condor]

I’d tell you the number but it’s astronomical

[heavy coral]

Is it recomended to use CT on single target when talented?

[bleak sky]

yes

[balmy condor]

Yes, outside of shiv

[indigo mulch]

I guess my smol brain cant comprehend dem numbera.

[heavy coral]

[indigo mulch]

Numbers *

[balmy condor]

Idk like 98?

What’s a normal fight

Just do That

[indigo mulch]

I still missing 2-4% uptime then.

=c

[balmy condor]

Is it dropping

[fallen sapphire]

Where does it say current legos can be recrafted onto rings/cloak etc. ?can't see it anywhere

[balmy condor]

Or are you asleep for 15 seconds on pull

[balmy condor]

Wowhead has articles on it

[west geode]

If I have a bag FULL of anima items and I switch covenant I will still have them right?

[bleak sky]

Whispyr doing god's work this morning eh

[balmy condor]

Yeh

[indigo mulch]

I mean you dont reapply garrote suring shiv so it drops then. I guess

[balmy condor]

Bro I haven’t slept I’m cracked out of my mind

[west geode]

awesome good bye night fae!

[indigo mulch]

Ill cry to cev and see if he can look through the logs.

[balmy condor]

Speed racer dude sick movie

[narrow girder]

unless they fixed it, you can also cash out buying armor pieces with anima and do your swap, and then refund them if its only been 2 hrs

[fallen sapphire]

Could anyone provide a link please?

[balmy condor]

Pfff I gotchu

Just pay shipping and handling

[narrow girder]

if he orders $40 worth of articles, maybe shipping and handling can be free?

[west geode]

is there a membership?

[narrow girder]

whispyr prime

[balmy condor]

Aight ngl I’m kinda sweating this package international

Nvm https://ptr.wowhead.com/news/patch-9-1-ptr-build-38950-class-and-spell-changes-demon-hunter-talent-tuning-322739

Got it

@fallen sapphire

[strange python]

Hi, I’d like Push High Keys in rogue assa but I also raid at high level? The necrolord is the best choice to take or is it really far in mono compared to the venthyr?

[fallen sapphire]

Thank you ❤️

[elfin valley]

@strange python necro sin is quite close in single target to venth, and wins on 2+ target

[strange python]

Ok should i start craft leggo on cloak for 9.1 or not mandatory ?

[balmy condor]

M+ you’d go zoldyck

That’s on legs

[strange python]

Zoldyck > Necro leggo ?

[balmy condor]

Yeh

[fallen sapphire]

It's a ptr change so as Whispyr said it wont come into effect until 9.1

[strange python]

Ok thanks guys

[bleak sky]

what's raiding at a high level and what are high keys?

[strange python]

@bleak sky 24+ / Top 100 world

[balmy condor]

Damn this guy fucks

[bleak sky]

this guy fucks big time

[elfin valley]

big fucks

[strange python]

[hazy crater]

chad sin

[cloud reef]

is ep/vigor best with PI?

[balmy condor]

Probably ep deeper honestly

But shouldn’t matter

[sonic schooner]

i m too used to get PI now, when i m in a group without my priest i feel energy starved all the time

😔

[delicate cedar]

anybody know if pretty much on 9.1 release we'd be able to transfer soul ash over from one char to another, or is it gated behind something?

[mint anvil]

Welcome to my life.. My disc priest only used PI on himself for all of denny prog.. With a group with DKs, rogues, etc

[tulip nacelle]

unlucky

[frail fossil]

getting PI as rogue

[limber lion]

I've never gotten a PI. What does it feel like?

I might have gotten one or two pi's without me knowing, I don't really track that stuff

[drowsy parcel]

i have a wa with a drums of war trigger sound

almost shit myself the other day when i randomly received one

i forgot i had it

[mint anvil]

beats me, disc using it on himself

[cobalt pelican]

why do you say it like it's abnormal and a sin

[limber lion]

I thought it was pretty normal for Disc using it on themselves

I thought Holy was the one handing it out to everyone.

Who knows

[cobalt pelican]

it helps quite a bit with important ramps for disc, they can kinda give it away but especially on denath the only time you'd care about giving it away is p3 and the priest would be upstairs anyways

[limber lion]

Yeh, that's what I thought as well

[tacit wedge]

Hi
In AoE, i kinda struggle with Garrote uptime
I usually drop 3 empowered Garrote and 1 non-empowered Garrote, then start Rapturing, but if i dont refresh early my empowered garrotes, i'll quickly get behind in bleeds rolling
Should i let the empowered Garrote fade and refresh from there, or refresh as soon as possible to avoid losing too much energy gen. through venomous wounds?

[fallen arch]

Depends on how long targets live I’d say after the empowered garrotes run out

Never overwrite them tho with a ‘normal’ garrote

[jovial river]

Are people staying Venthyr as raider mains?

[plain thistle]

changed to necro months ago

[sacred isle]

Check pins

[jovial river]

You think it will be better for 9.1 raid?

ohh ok ty

[plain thistle]

for anything that isnt ST yes

and you dont lose that much damage in ST anyway

[tacit wedge]

isn't most fight including some cleave?

[fallen arch]

Hence we pick necro

[final sky]

so bascially, for m+ necro is the best way to go?

[plain thistle]

yes

[keen flint]

Shoulder or hand for the legendary in 9.1 ?

[scenic root]

Cape

For doomblade, at least as far as we know at this point

[keen flint]

y

[scenic root]

Because shoulders and hands have Dom sockets.

[keen flint]

yeah

that's sucks

[scenic root]

And nothing at this point says we can put Dom sockets on legos

[keen flint]

Okk

But

This leggo will stay bis ?

even if there is no socket on it ?

[scenic root]

[keen flint]

damn

wait

[scenic root]

Everything is subject to change

[keen flint]

We can't craft doomblade on cloak

[scenic root]

Not until 9.1

[keen flint]

oh

Perfect

[civic trellis]

is this the rota for cleave (2-3t) in raid? spread garrote, maintain rupture, take ep and ct as talents...

I am missing something?

[placid stream]

So bone spike scales with mastery right? But does it scale with Zold?

[tame cypress]

or with Doomblades?

[digital zodiac]

What are people thinking for 9.1?
Many making the change from Venth to Necro?
How much DPS increase actually is venth on ST, and Necro on 2+ targets

[limber lion]

The dot scales with mastery, and yes it works with Zoldyck

[limber lion]

Necrogang for 9.1. Necro has been the general choice for a few months now, even more in 9.1 with SBS benefitting from crit.

Venth is under 100 dps ahead in 5min single target

Necro is ahead by 250+ dps on 2t

[sonic schooner]

sbs dot giant crits

[limber lion]

It really depends on your profile.

Results vary on a case by case basis

[limber lion]

Yes, it works with Doomblade.

[wintry kayak]

I think ppl stay on venth cuz want play sub

[digital zodiac]

is assass looking BIS spec thought right?

[limber lion]

Maintain all bleeds and poisons on both targets, otherwise just muti/env your main target

[limber lion]

For raiding, probably. But Sub is looking really good for 9.1

We're still missing some sims and numbers

So it's almost anybody's guess at this point

[sonic schooner]

is it worth to get doomblade on both target or just too much efforts for nothing?

🙄

[limber lion]

Is this an actual question or troll?

Just to make sure.