assassination

[short token]

ok ty

[compact pumice]

Have I missed this before?:

Or is it new

[slow marsh]

Uhhhhhh

I thought it already did that

[stoic needle]

No

The bleed never crit

Only the conduit

So now the conduit makes it hit twice, and both ticks can crit

[compact pumice]

So, it sounds like quite a big buff?

[stoic needle]

Dunno how big exactly but it's definitely good

[compact pumice]

Was it added in todays patch notes?

[stoic needle]

Necrolord

[kind turtle]

Random: Lethal Poisons > Maim, Mangle for Denathrius?

[stoic needle]

Yes

[compact pumice]

But Necro was just slightly behind venthyr.

[stoic needle]

What covenant are you

[compact pumice]

It will definitely be ahead now

[stoic needle]

Definitely possible

[kind turtle]

Night Fae

[compact pumice]

Something that never could crit going to crittable is pretty much at least a 30% upgrade

Granted it's not doing huge dps

[slow marsh]

I mean necro is already ahead in the grand scheme of things

[stoic needle]

Lethal poisons is probs better overall yeah

[compact pumice]

but it's at least something

[kind turtle]

And both are better than Septic Shock for raid?

[stoic needle]

Sim it but 99% sure they are

[odd hazel]

Tbh, i'll be happy that necro will be better or atleast CLOSER.

so it'll even be a stupid choice not to just go necro

[kind turtle]

thanks

[odd hazel]

unless you really like vamp boys

how far was it behind?

less then 100?

[slow marsh]

I mean imo 80 ST dps doesn't warrant going venthyr when you consider how much more you do as necro in multi target

[compact pumice]

I mean if venthyr isnt even top ST then I dunno, it kinda makes the covenant just useless

[slow marsh]

But that's just me

[compact pumice]

Yeah

[odd hazel]

adding the possibility to crit, it will totally be ahead

[compact pumice]

say you're doing 100 more ST DPS as venthyr I actually like that tradeoff

[slow marsh]

Yes I agree. I'm saying I'm of the opinion that necro is already hands down better

[odd hazel]

its honestly the better all around CoV.

[compact pumice]

Still would be necro unless stuck on something like Sludgefist where Venthyr pulls ahead even more

[odd hazel]

:^) iceblades has offically made me want to go back necro. doing it when i get back on

[slow marsh]

Venthyr wins by 80ish dps ST but when you have a 2nd target necro jumps like 2-300

[odd hazel]

how big of a difference is the Conduit for necro compared to well-placed steel?

[slow marsh]

I don't remember I just know it's behind

[stoic needle]

It's better by about 10 dps or so

[slow marsh]

And boner conduit is better in multi target

[odd hazel]

@balmy condor opinion on the being able to crit?

so you might as well go sudden fracture?

[balmy condor]

The dot critting should be around 60 dps

[slow marsh]

Yeah for sure

[balmy condor]

Just on dot

[stoic needle]

If venthyr did more st by a decent margin it could be a choice for damage profiles but now idk if there's any point

[slow marsh]

Also, no changes?? My ass

[balmy condor]

You already Go sudden fracture though

[stoic needle]

Yeah I go SF for everything

[balmy condor]

It’s like another 0.8-1% for necro

[tulip nacelle]

it also changes nothing about sf

[balmy condor]

Depending on how much crit you have

[slow marsh]

Same

[stoic needle]

https://tenor.com/view/rub-hands-together-black-guy-gif-5110440

Any 30%+ crit gamers

[slow marsh]

I mean it pretty much means there's no reason to go venthyr at all unless you are messing with Sub or need it for keys

[odd hazel]

me osh

im 31% right now :^)

[stoic needle]

Who's ready for the two rings from 9.1 that will give 10% plus crit alone

[slow marsh]

I was 34 as venthyr now I'm like 29

[compact pumice]

Yeah, well unless venthyr gets some nice soulbind changes or something

[stoic needle]

34%

[odd hazel]

will IQD still be good with necro?

[stoic needle]

It's 2nd bis as necro

[odd hazel]

whats the BiS? Dread?

[stoic needle]

Yeah

[slow marsh]

Iqd is still good but my shadowgrasp is better

[stoic needle]

I still can't get a fucking dreadfire

I've given up

[odd hazel]

i have both sitting in my bags @slow marsh i'll prob sim just in case.

[slow marsh]

Phial SGT is bis until dreadfire

Or hate chain is prolly up there too and likely wins with multi target

[stoic needle]

Hateful chain with enough haste is equal to dreadfire

But an on use trinket has its own benefits

[odd hazel]

is 23% enough.

:^)

[stoic needle]

For damage amps like sludge

[balmy condor]

Depends on your haste levels what’s bis and what’s not

[stoic needle]

I don't remember the number

[slow marsh]

Yeah makes sense. Unfort we are locking on sire so no sludge reclears for me

[balmy condor]

No point caring

[slow marsh]

Remember that your 23 is 33ish with alacrity

[stoic needle]

Same

[slow marsh]

We are downing this weekend or I'm rioting

[stoic needle]

We had our first p3 pull yesterday

We got another week or 2 for sure

[slow marsh]

We had second week of early p3 pulls last week with the c team so I'm really confident with nerf and our normal team we get a good amount of p3 Friday and kill Saturday

[stoic needle]

Yesterday was one of our worst days too we were all playing like complete dogshit

But we still made it to p3

So I feel like we can kill him eventually

[harsh anchor]

Is there any way to "unlearn" a soulbind ability namely token of appreciation

[stoic needle]

No

[pure sinew]

Token of appreciation is broken

That's how you get 100 healing parse

[harsh anchor]

My M+ group members definitely don't return a token of appreciation when I use it though

[pure sinew]

I have a 99 parse for heals on my arms warrior

Every boss

[wind dune]

36 % crit here missed the crit gamers club 😦

[stoic needle]

You have ascended

[wind dune]

[vapid nimbus]

Is it worth neglecting slice and Dice to keep rupture and CT up on multi target situations? Also what's the minimum number of targets you want to use CT on?

[loud niche]

Is sin still within 1% dps sims of sub? please say yes?

[tulip nacelle]

sin is ahead of sub

you should always keep snd up by envenoming

[loud niche]

Really? Sorry been a bit outta the loop, I just pop back in from time to time trying to keep up somewhat

[tulip nacelle]

ct is worth casting on 1 target outside of shiv

yea sin got big buffs since launch

[loud niche]

Oh, I meant in 9.1

[tulip nacelle]

oh right

it's super close

[loud niche]

have we done sims for the new dagger effects?

[tulip nacelle]

My guess sin will still be prefered even if sub would do a bit better on st

[zenith yarrow]

Quick question : Should I press crimson tempest in single target situation? (boss in dungeons)

[tulip nacelle]

they got released today so no way they are implemented and simmed

[red plaza]

5 posts up 🙂

[faint harness]

It doesnt even have a value yet

[zenith yarrow]

lol thx

[faint harness]

Just says X

[loud niche]

o, gotcha

[vapid nimbus]

So I should neglect rupture to keep SnD and CT up?

[bronze wagon]

for pure ST is it still phantom fire and shadowcore oil?

[burnt star]

rofl.. forgot to switch to poison bomb for this shriekwing heroic

rank 6 still

[tulip nacelle]

not neglect, you still try to rup everything, but you keep ct and snd uo

[burnt star]

never let snd drop

[tulip nacelle]

agi pot and stones

[hollow river]

finally 4/10

[vapid nimbus]

Thank you, so what I'm getting from this, keep CT always up, even on single target in dungeons, use shiv on cool down to keep SnD up, and rupture in the gaps.

[hollow river]

you use envenom to keep SnD up

keep as many ruptures up as you can

but yeah slam shiv on CD and try to put envenoms on that target if you can if not i don't think it's too big a deal

i mean it is but if you have other prio you have other prio

[balmy condor]

if you're newer to the spec don't worry about CT single target

the gain is very very minimal

[gusty mirage]

You try to make sure you envenom every now and then to keep up snd. Minimum number of targets is 1 for CT

Damn I’m late to the party

[hollow river]

oh i thought this was aoe talk

[spice spire]

Same

[gusty mirage]

Back to my nap

[vapid nimbus]

Hahaha its AoE talk, but I was also wondering about dungeon single target so thank you guys.

[spice spire]

@balmy condor annoying question I’m sure but SBS bleed does not interact with dashing scoundrel, right?

[balmy condor]

correct

dashing scoundrel doesn't even affect bleeds

so there's 0 way it interacts :P

[spice spire]

Doesn’t it get energy regen off of bleed Crits?

[balmy condor]

poison crits

[spice spire]

Ahh

[gusty mirage]

Yeah our benevolent leader Whispyr did the math. Don’t worry too much about keeping up CT in ST 🙂

[spice spire]

I’m lit

I see

[hollow river]

really O:

[spice spire]

Fuck

[balmy condor]

it's like 15 dps

[hollow river]

that makes life so much easier tbh

[desert inlet]

leaving 15 dps on the table

[balmy condor]

I fucking hate CT single target in general

I wish they'd just buff PB

[hollow river]

me too

[balmy condor]

so we didn't have to deal with degenerate gameplay

[hollow river]

#removeaoecap

[gusty mirage]

I wish they’d make CT baseline and reinvigorate that entire row

[hollow river]

join the movement

[spice spire]

Is it unethical though

[gusty mirage]

So it’s not meh PB vs meme vs our only source of aoe

[balmy condor]

and then there's the people that are like "make CT give energy back"

fucking lunatics

[gusty mirage]

That’s a lot of energy

[spice spire]

If CT Gave energy back

[vapid nimbus]

So, I'm guessing I should SnD after the initial CT that followed the 4 garrotes.

[spice spire]

Our AoE/cleave goes omega braindead

[gusty mirage]

Listen you heathen, Whispyr put in good work to figure out the aoe apl changes. Don’t you dare

[balmy condor]

ye, first finisher in a dungeon is snd, and then you keep it up with envenoms for the rest of it

[spice spire]

I don’t want it to - I think our cleave is hella fun

Spamming CT, does not sound fun

[gusty mirage]

I know I still love you

[balmy condor]

we wouldn't spam CT

the only thing CT giving energy would do

is just make it a required talent in single target

[spice spire]

No u

[gusty mirage]

Yeah it’d be way too much energy in aoe

[balmy condor]

it wouldn't even change our aoe rotation

that's the point

our rotation would be the same

[gusty mirage]

Just energy capped the entire time

[spice spire]

Wouldn’t we just envenom more? Or still no?

[balmy condor]

no

literally 0 changes

[spice spire]

This is purely hypothetical and nonproductive btw

I’m just a shitter at this point

[gusty mirage]

Maybe it’d make tyler2’s CT spam less lulz

[balmy condor]

it doesn't change how much damage abilties do

you'd still CT like a dot

and between CT reapplications you would still rupture

envenom would still be less than a rupture

it's just more energy for the zoomer brains that can't imagine playing a spec that's under 300 apm

[gusty mirage]

God that’d be such a fucking mess

[balmy condor]

out here smashing adrenaline rush like we're playing osu

[gusty mirage]

The only perk it’d provide is initial application of dots would be quicker

[balmy condor]

reworking combat was the worst thing they did to rogues

[spice spire]

Holy fuck

[gusty mirage]

Budget fury warrior with pistols

[spice spire]

To the vault

[gusty mirage]

Well get your osu fingers ready, because that deathspike damage is about to be busted

[odd hazel]

Tbh I like outlaw but I liked the RNG of it

[balmy condor]

I'm not playing outlaw just because blizzard decides to come out with a legendary that's twice the strength of everything else

[odd hazel]

I started as sub, went to outlaw and was just....disappointed but I enjoyed it in Legion

[shrewd current]

I cannot stand the "shwing" noises of Outlaw

[odd hazel]

Now I’m a dirty sinner and will only play sin and sub

[sudden brook]

mad

https://tenor.com/view/lizard-dancing-lizard-cry-about-it-gecko-dance-gif-20175430

[tulip nacelle]

[balmy condor]

maybe I am

[gusty mirage]

I know I was pre-9.0.5

I grit my teeth and played outlaw

[odd hazel]

Sin just feels...smoother to play to me

[gusty mirage]

It plays slower so that’s natural. Outlaw’s a ton of fun when you get used to it. But my boomer hands can’t handle too much outlaw

[odd hazel]

I have a 216 outlaw set it just feels weird to play tbh

[shrewd current]

https://tenor.com/view/typing-fast-jimcarrey-bruce-almighty-emails-gif-7342750

^ Outlaw live footage

[odd hazel]

And ever since I got my sin set to 220 I can’t go back

[gusty mirage]

I remember going through details and seeing how many buttons I pressed and I’m like bro wtf

[odd hazel]

Carpel tunnel spec

[safe barn]

does remornia still takes my bleed damage while in massacre?

[balmy condor]

yes

[safe barn]

good to know

[storm zinc]

after getting venthyr to 40, is it recommended to pick up and start leveling another covenant?

[somber stump]

Idk, I'm still salty about snap shotting removal back in legion

[vagrant urchin]

For mythic donny, does evasion work for massacre? and does feint work for blood price?

[tulip nacelle]

no and no

[vagrant urchin]

oke thanks

[balmy condor]

snapshotting is giga jank

I'm glad it's gone

[odd hazel]

if you were wanting to do that, i'd get necro up to 31 atleast

it doesnt appear that the other CoVs besides venth/Necro are getting love.

[shrewd current]

depends on how you look at it. The Jailer is giving Kyrian a lot of love, particularly the Archon

[odd hazel]

fuck kyrian

kyrian is like what--- only good for pvp?

[soft shale]

no even for pvp its bad

[odd hazel]

i might have a slight bias against kyrian

[spice spire]

I love mini games 🙂

[balmy condor]

kyrian is a mangled mess anyway

[spice spire]

They’re so fun and random XD

[balmy condor]

miss me with that shit

[odd hazel]

Whispyr = kyrian lover

[spice spire]

Even when kyrian looked top I avoided it.

[balmy condor]

I started kyrian

[spice spire]

True

[odd hazel]

even when it was top it was barely ahead of NF

[balmy condor]

played 3 dungeons

and then swapped night fae

[spice spire]

R2 in covenant?

[balmy condor]

I think I was like

3 renown

[spice spire]

huge

[shrewd current]

such sacrifices

[odd hazel]

:^) i've never even touched Kyrian besides questing

[balmy condor]

I didn't even get to run in circles to collect little orbs before the rest of my party yoinks them

such a shame

[shrewd current]

im kyrian on a couple alts I think, but meh

[spice spire]

I just really hate the ability. It’s the only covenant I haven’t joined on rogue

[shrewd current]

the potion is nice though

[spice spire]

It’s fine on some classes, I just really don’t want my covenant ability to be a mini-game

Ye I have it for my prot pally and it’s big.

Just specifically this class

[shrewd current]

Divine Toll is so fun on paladin

[spice spire]

I’ve used it on 2/3 of specs. It’s good. Pally covenants low key broken though

[odd hazel]

the theme is just so meh

bland and over used

[shrewd current]

the wings transmog is really the only cool part of kyrian

[odd hazel]

Bone wings > kyrian

Vamp candles > kyrian

[shrewd current]

but yes, even that does not compare to venthyr and necrolord

[odd hazel]

maybe i should atleast give it a try on another toon

[spice spire]

Don’t go to krey for tmog advice, trust.

[shrewd current]

dont worry ive got my transmog down pat

uwu im the gwim weaper

[odd hazel]

i would be vulpera to spite you

[shrewd current]

vulpera master race

[spice spire]

Vulpera are chill the heck

[odd hazel]

atleast you arent nasty blood elfs

[shrewd current]

honestly vulpera have the #1 best utility in Shadowlands

being able to have HS in Oribos and Camp set up in covenant, can't beat that

[odd hazel]

why would you do Cov?

just do it outside the raid

[spice spire]

I deadass only hate mechagnome looks

Rest are deece

[odd hazel]

sounds like shit racials to me

[shrewd current]

they are quite monstrous looking

[spice spire]

Sounds like shit faction to me

[shrewd current]

like a fuckin walnut

[odd hazel]

Sounds like Mana junkies to me

[shrewd current]

nobody likes the look of a walnut

[odd hazel]

tbh, my mecha looks so much better in game then in that picture

[spice spire]

Don’t even use mana as a rogue GG

[odd hazel]

still a blood elf

dont even know your race

weirdpog

[shrewd current]

I went through a phase once

where every single one of my toons was blood elf

[odd hazel]

i get it, quake is just starting

we should be nice

[spice spire]

I actually cba to really care. You just never see a mechagnome Stan so it’s an EZ bully

[shrewd current]

facts

[odd hazel]

❤️ all fun and games till i come for yo ankles

[shrewd current]

he doesnt have any

wait, I got confused

YOU dont have any ankles

got you two mixed up

[loud niche]

I finally got my first 233 wep tonight Pog

[spice spire]

True @ my ankles

[odd hazel]

i mean

[spice spire]

W

[odd hazel]

i cant t-mog gloves, pants or feet

[shrewd current]

thats really the thing that made me lose interest in mechagnomes

[loud niche]

mechagnome racial is actually busted

[odd hazel]

its ight, its not great but its totally the best offensive one.

would like more utility tbh

[shrewd current]

like a kickass campsite

and a bag of tricks

[odd hazel]

and extra bag space

[loud niche]

i just want bigger numbers for my brain drug juices

[odd hazel]

tbh, you dont notice it

[shrewd current]

honestly the real reason Horde got Vulpera instead of Alliance is because Blizzard knew that Vulpera in Goldshire was a BAAAAAAD idea.

[loud niche]

i feel like i would, last i checked it was like 3x the value of orc racial

[odd hazel]

i honestly wish the mecha part was just a added customization

feels like a wasted spot

[odd hazel]

oh, yeah compared to horde its a lot i believe

[shrewd current]

yea it shouldve been a tick on the normal gnomes similar to hunched/upright orcs

[odd hazel]

if i was horde though i'd go orc/zand trol ( not sure if they can be them but i hope they can )

[spice spire]

Zand can be

I almost was a zand troll but decided be for mog

[odd hazel]

tbh, its hard because i lvoe the way the OG troll looks

BUT

[upper trout]

so if you have max-1 cp right as shiv comes off cd, do you shiv -> env or env -> shiv?

[odd hazel]

that new orc race? MMM

[odd hazel]

yeet, just throw that shiv off CD basically

[loud niche]

i was almost gonna be zand, but then went orc because it was more dmg, and i prefer the idea of this big badass orc being stealthy

[shrewd current]

the OG orcs have much nicer customizations these days than the Mag'Har

[spice spire]

Shiv > finisher

[odd hazel]

just

make sure you dont waste shiv on a target you wont be able to hit

[loud niche]

^

[shrewd current]

I cant decide if I want to put Doomblade on my gloves or shoulders, probably just going to have to craft both (one for pvp, one for pve)

[odd hazel]

i only will put doom on glvoes once i have a decent set of shoulders

[shrewd current]

only difference between the pvp and pve version is Haste/Vers vs Haste/Crit

but I guess Haste/Crit is still not bad for pvp either

[odd hazel]

oh

yeah

just make the other one for pvp

[shrewd current]

haste/crit will probably be better for pvp than haste/vers will for pve

(first priority should be to get lvl60 anyway LUL)

[hollow river]

Even if you have max cp you shiv->finisher

[balmy condor]

always shiv

shiv forever

shiv until death

[odd hazel]

have they added any thing new to test out in ptr whispyr?

anything useful i might add

[soft shale]

new m+ affixx

and also domination sockets although kinda fucky

[odd hazel]

whats the affix again? somethign to do with torghast powers yeah?

[soft shale]

nah they are totally new powers save 2 or 3

[odd hazel]

they are the same concept though yeah?

are they good? does it feel bad?

[soft shale]

some of them are really broken

[forest vigil]

what's the best lego for p3 M Sire? kinda looked at some logs and everyone is running doomblade>zoldyck - in logs it looks like doomblade is still just stronger in execute

[balmy condor]

for only p3, zold

[forest vigil]

just out of curiosity how close r they?

[balmy condor]

not TOO close

it's enough to probably warrant playing

but if you played doomblade for the rest of prog

might fuck your timings a little

so be careful with that

[forest vigil]

wordness was just curious, thank you

[sacred isle]

And with phasing now at 37 zoldryck gains some more value

[slow marsh]

People in logs are using doomblade because the overall raid dps / survivability doesn't warrant the need for execute. If you are progging you're fine to use doomblade until p3 and then if you are struggling with deaths / killing in time then swap to zold

That's my 2c anyways

Which after inflation is more like -4c so i'll paypal you later

[forest vigil]

hell yeah love to see it

[gusty mirage]

hey thats a rip off, paypal will rip us both off

[slow marsh]

Some of the powers are pretty nutty from what i've seen. We will likely end up having to have a list of the 'best' powers to take ala tier list or something

Or just answer what's better out of the three choices constantly

[slow marsh]

trutru

[soft shale]

people use doomblade for logs because it double dips on wracking pain

but if you're necro for p3 zoldyck is really really strong

you also get like 3 spikes with full cp

[lean coral]

got a 91 second dennis kill

pog

[final star]

sbs now affected bt crit

by*

that's big

[stoic needle]

[elfin valley]

seriously apologize for this question if its repeated. But in ST the idea of SBS is just on CD with low energy correct?

[lean coral]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/zuljin/shaydd

i suck at sun king dont look at that

[final star]

no that is incorrect

you spend all 3 during your first vendetta window, preferably during heimer crit window

then you spend 2 during the next heimer crit window

2 vendetta after

and rinse and repeat for the rest of fight

[elfin valley]

oh ok sorry for misunderstanding

thank you

[final star]

most efficient usage is mut > sbs > envenom

if mut gives 2-3cp

usually during heimer crit window I get 3+ from mut

if u get 4cp don't sbs since it will generate 2cp

[sick scarab]

shiv getting nerfed ? mm

[balmy condor]

what

there's no shiv nerf

[sick scarab]

Assassination
Shiv Shiv now also increases your Nature damage done against the target by 0% for 0 20% for 9 sec. Rogue - Assassination Spec. Rogue - Assassination Spec.

[balmy condor]

uh huh

and where in that is there a nerf

[sick scarab]

mmo champ

[balmy condor]

yes but there is no nerf in what you just copy pasted

that's why I'm confused

[final star]

[sick scarab]

me too

[balmy condor]

20% for 9 seconds

[sick scarab]

but now shiv is 35%

[balmy condor]

is what shiv is

[final star]

it's tooltip clarification

[balmy condor]

shiv is not 35%

[final star]

?????

[sick scarab]

tooltip say 35%

[balmy condor]

I fucking wish shiv was 35% homie

do you have WPS equipped

[final star]

are you using well placed stell

steel

[sick scarab]

ah treue LOL

[balmy condor]

man played himself

hate to see it

[sick scarab]

so fuyck me too early in the morning

[final star]

yeah

sbs being able to crit next patch

[balmy condor]

we got ZERO balancing changes

[final star]

stonks

[balmy condor]

on ptr

[sick scarab]

i see

[final star]

currently the bleed can't crit

[balmy condor]

pog 60 dps

[sick scarab]

i hpped for a some fae conduit buff 🙂

[slow marsh]

we got ZERO balancing changes

[final star]

[slow marsh]

sbs being able to crit next patch

[balmy condor]

that's a bug fix tbh

[final star]

Yeah

[slow marsh]

tru

[final star]

It's a good change

[balmy condor]

I mean

it adds dps

[slow marsh]

but it is more dps

so a change

even if not direct

[soft shale]

fractures stonks

[slow marsh]

we got ZERO direct balancing changes

[final star]

yup

[balmy condor]

fractures is already stonks?

[final star]

so far rogue has been almost untouched

[balmy condor]

why do people keep saying fracture stonks

[final star]

fracture is what we use already

except on sludge

[slow marsh]

Yeah

[soft shale]

because people are too hyped for lashing but fractures is the shadow mvp

[slow marsh]

Necro cleave stonks?

[balmy condor]

are we

what month is it

[final star]

I don't think I've seen anyone hyped for lashing

[balmy condor]

I'm so lost

[final star]

every mf loves necro now

[balmy condor]

is it march?

[soft shale]

ye time travel

[slow marsh]

lashing was hype like February

[balmy condor]

why are we hyping lashing

[slow marsh]

or whenever it dropped

[balmy condor]

why is fracture hype all of a sudden

[final star]

lashing was so start of 9.0.5

[slow marsh]

cuz ppl dont pay attention

In max's stream earlier people were dumbfounded that necro is best cov now

[soft shale]

necro just has everything

[shy dust]

Is it now

Necro is best covenant

[soft shale]

fleshcraft>>>gate

[slow marsh]

I would say so yeah

[soft shale]

they even nerfed emeni pop because it was doing 10k aoe damage ahaha

[balmy condor]

I mean that 150 we were talking about yesterday is close to like 80-100

[shy dust]

Yalls ability to play 9.1 raid and report back information

[slow marsh]

Unless you are going for RP or playing sub on the side

[balmy condor]

but

[shy dust]

Is impeccable

[soft shale]

it went under the radar for so long

[balmy condor]

idk

everyone looking at sbs crit

and they're giga hype

for very little reason

[slow marsh]

Yeah

[final star]

It is a minor dps increase

[slow marsh]

Its nothing to be hype about

[final star]

it's just "nice" to have

[balmy condor]

it's not even a %

[shy dust]

Assa should get a aura nerf

To compensate

[soft shale]

ahaha

[shy dust]

For necro only

[slow marsh]

Sub should be forced to go kyrian again

[sick scarab]

i wan fae buffs 🙂 i am the only fae survived :)!!

[soft shale]

i think nf is most likely than kyrian

[balmy condor]

[slow marsh]

sub will be fine next patch

[shy dust]

Fun is an opinion

Now good is just wrong

[slow marsh]

It was also really good at the start of xpac

[soft shale]

have you tried critting with evis just crit every time

kek

[shy dust]

So overall dps

[shy dust]

Is what matters for prog

I now know how to achieve CE

[balmy condor]

sometimes I ask myself why I open spec channels

[soft shale]

tbh outlaw would do 1k more overall but assa was kind of dead there

and even then before the grand 9.0.5 buff assa was astill decent on sire

[slow marsh]

because sometimes it is fun

[soft shale]

with zold

[balmy condor]

yeah but these takes are so fried

[slow marsh]

EU is waking up that's why

[soft shale]

what no one expected was necro being so good after the LBE people gave up saying its good for the raid

[balmy condor]

oh true it's EU time

[soft shale]

its always EU time

[balmy condor]

the early morning troll takes with the cup of coffee

[slow marsh]

yessir

[sick scarab]

i am not troll 😦

[balmy condor]

nor did I say you were

[sick scarab]

😛

but i like night fae so...

[shy dust]

So WCL is king

[final star]

if the shoe fits

[balmy condor]

don't you know that WCL overall charts are gospel

it's real data, how could it be misleading

[shy dust]

If it’s higher in overall dps for a fight

It must be better

[balmy condor]

I'm glad you understand

[shy dust]

There is no other metric to use besides overall damage

[balmy condor]

[slow marsh]

says the outlaw rogue

[soft shale]

tbh progress raiding for top 100 is really hard to measure most of the time unless you really keep track of it

[slow marsh]

kek

[balmy condor]

and he DOUBLES DOWN

[soft shale]

because of private logging

[balmy condor]

TRIPLES DOWN

[shy dust]

Did you prog council

Or sun king

Or sludge

Or did you just ride the bench

For all of those fights

[balmy condor]

well

that's what he's asking

[shy dust]

Given you just earned last month

[slow marsh]

I mean you could ride the bench and get CE on reclear beginning of may

[shy dust]

You could have very likely

[slow marsh]

That hhonestly answers nothing

You could buy CE in may

[shy dust]

I would like an explanation though

For how outlaw was a good spec on council prog

And sub wasn’t

[balmy condor]

"were you in on sludge, council, sun king?"
"bro sire kill"

[slow marsh]

That also could be a random screenshot

[final star]

you try and flex

[balmy condor]

it's a yes no question

were you in for prog

[final star]

and just dig a deeper hole

[shy dust]

Link your logs

[balmy condor]

on those fights

or nah

[shy dust]

Since you got an attitude like that

I’m curious how your logs look

[balmy condor]

no one asked for screenshots

just answer the question

[shy dust]

I’m asking directly for them logs my dude

Show me that greatness

[balmy condor]

ouch filter

[shy dust]

And yet you seemingly are still without knowledge

How could you consider outlaw to be better than sub on sunking prog

[slow marsh]

Its proof you did sire

[final star]

link logs

link logs tho

[balmy condor]

I mean

[cerulean nest]

https://tenor.com/view/whatsgoingonhere-kimkardashian-gif-9815097

[balmy condor]

if he thinks outlaw is better on sun king

then linking logs doesn't help

[fallow bay]

Quick question guys, why most people craft doomblade on hands and not shoulders

[shy dust]

Because it’s more damage

[balmy condor]

slg shoulders

[final star]

233 shoulders

slg

[shy dust]

If you double down on your opinion

You should be at least able to back it up

[final star]

Here is how to link logs

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/id/59188033

[balmy condor]

that wasn't the argument though was it

[final star]

you can laugh at mine

so can we see yours too

[balmy condor]

sludge was a pretty big wall

do you think outlaw is better on sludge?

[sick scarab]

anyone have tried the Judjemend of arbitere leggo in combo wiht ppl ?

i am just curious

[balmy condor]

awful lego

[sick scarab]

it is terrible ?

[balmy condor]

yes

[sick scarab]

fuck blizz then 🙂

[shy dust]

@sage cypress outlaw is much higher on council dps than sub

So sub is much worse for the fight right

Worse than you

[balmy condor]

did you just say rae is worse than you?

[final star]

[shy dust]

How can you come to that assertion

Mine was just a few days earlier than that

[balmy condor]

Rae killed that shit in like february bro

[cerulean nest]

just got here. is this guy who got carried to CE trying to spit game?

[final star]

yes

[shy dust]

I’m still waiting for your impressive logs

[final star]

still waiting for his logsa

you haven't backed up your claims

[shy dust]

It’s fine to be wrong just accept it and move on brother

[final star]

other than killing boss

[balmy condor]

I find it more productive to reflect on yourself rather than blame the people around you

just from personal experience

[final star]

at least I'm not claiming to be gods gift to roues

rogues

[sick scarab]

i seee new Bonded Hearts,, mm not bad lol

[arctic walrus]

who are you again? @sage cypress

[shy dust]

But then I asked you to explain how

Like there were multiple fights where sub was flat out better

Or had much more value for prog

[arctic walrus]

who's not calm?

[balmy condor]

calm it with the insults

[shy dust]

Yet you just sit here and spew WCL damage

[balmy condor]

you already hit the filter

oof

[shy dust]

It didn’t go to the gutter 2-3 weeks into the tier

That doesn’t even make sense

[final star]

oh dear

[cerulean nest]

lol

[balmy condor]

!warn @sage cypress I asked nicely to stop the insults

[final star]

He's really doubling down

[slow marsh]

lamao

[arctic walrus]

fuck em up @sage cypress

[final star]

quadrupling down

[stoic needle]

[arctic walrus]

say it with your chest

[sick scarab]

wtf this channel..

[cerulean nest]

imagine talking this much shit and not posting logs lmao

[shy dust]

Someone with an inflated ego

[balmy condor]

!mute 3600 I'll let @shrewd night handle you

[real solar]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/zuljin/gaust

[shy dust]

Hopped in and couldn’t handle being wrong

[real solar]

those are his logs

[arctic walrus]

whispyr why

[slow marsh]

h0onestly its too late for that here lol

[shy dust]

Truly a Savant of a player

[final star]

he's doing gods work

[balmy condor]

why what

[final star]

any sat gamers

[balmy condor]

did it not go through

[shy dust]

It’s nice to know that it is impossible to have a higher than 77.6 best on M

[arctic walrus]

there was so much left to drill into him

i only just got here

[slow marsh]

i mean when you only play the suboptimal spec...

[shy dust]

I forgot that sub got a massive nerf the 2-3rd week of raid

[arctic walrus]

why are you talking go jungle

[shy dust]

And just got removed from WoW

[slow marsh]

im mid actually

[arctic walrus]

please keep the channel on topic.

[strange python]

you muted jigglypuff @balmy condor

[balmy condor]

nah

[final star]

literally hovered over the x and it disappeared

[shy dust]

my messages

[slow marsh]

my head

[strange python]

https://tenor.com/view/filthy-frank-its-time-to-stop-stop-clock-time-gif-4932540

[final star]

the purge

[balmy condor]

yo can y'all shut up already

I'll purge it again

jesus

[slow marsh]

pls no mommy

[shy dust]

[slow marsh]

so how about those kyrian buffs

[real solar]

kyrians have the best covenant hall

pls make kyrian bis

[arctic walrus]

so conflict avoidant

[final star]

do not agree

the best hall is night fae for layout

[real solar]

you cant even mount in fae

[shy dust]

Night Fae sucks

[final star]

night fae does suck

[shy dust]

Because if you land in the pool when you jump after hearthing there

You just randomly cd

[stoic needle]

he PM'd me too

he big mad

[shy dust]

Dc*

[final star]

yes

ignore

ez

[stoic needle]

i tried to get him with the who asked but he blocked me before i could

[slow marsh]

damn im not memorable enough

[final star]

who are you again?

[slow marsh]

[shrewd current]

Well that was a fun read!

[final star]

[timid cloud]

[final star]

[shrewd current]

[stoic needle]

[tribal marlin]

me after a couple weeks away

https://i.imgur.com/EnREtZr.png

You know that I'll be that guy flexin' with that shit I'll got from 1st kill ...

Ok i'll get karm'd now

[oak sky]

ill be that guy stuck pugging heroic all tier with no guild and only getting 246 sylvanas daggies 😦

[slow marsh]

With the execute gems with the execute soul bind with the execute leggo??

[oak sky]

that actually sounds nuts though

[tribal marlin]

I saw the execute gem but I don't understand the tooltip

Blizzard and tooltip as usual ...

[slow marsh]

Yeah I'm trying to not get too excited about specifics until it's out but overall the concept seems really strong

[soft shale]

its not execute per se you just need to have more than 50% than their life

like if they're 30% you need to be 80%

i understood it like that

[tribal marlin]

oh ok

then it sucks

but (disclaimer : feelcraft spoted) I believe the Unholy shit is busted

the 3 gem set

Maybe the frost one can be busted as well. The frost gem sucks in ST , but there are tons of fight where you can take advantage of it

[soft shale]

the shadow one is stonks for sub

and even for assa thaat extra agi is so sweet

[tribal marlin]

So basically if I understand it correctly, you can get 5 gems

But because our class sucks, we need to play another legendary for it ?

[soft shale]

nah legendaries now have 3 slots

so all are safe

[tribal marlin]

oh ok nice

[soft shale]

they are introducing them still though

[tribal marlin]

But it mean we need to recraft leggo 😦

[soft shale]

well rank 1-4 are "free"

[gloomy fern]

[soft shale]

as old ash is not used for anything

and you can farm it

[gloomy fern]

no i have to run thorgast

[soft shale]

in corridors

[gloomy fern]

[soft shale]

just sell some carries while you farm

get some $$ for your trouble

[tribal marlin]

what will be the 3rd slot for Doomblade we know ?

[gloomy fern]

just goes slower cus u cant stealth to floor boss

[tribal marlin]

It still head/shoulder on ptr :/

@soft shale There has been no changes on Night Fae legendary, the change on new build is just another tooltip change right ?

I mean, it just affect the one ability you use with the sepsis "free", not all stealth ability while the dot is active I mean

(would be nut for sub)

[soft shale]

no idea havent even tried that new one

i mean it still seems ass

only spec it would be even decent would be outlaw

but they already have a better leggo that procs arush cele

so idk what is the idea

[tribal marlin]

Well if it would have worked the busted way, you could trigger it multiple time in a row as sub

basically gaining like 16sec of Vendetta + extend blade + adre rush all at once

would be, at least fun

[soft shale]

the best idea would have been to proc the cd every time you stealth so it would be decent in m+

[tribal marlin]

Oh you mean a totally different leggo like "Whenever stealthed, apply Sepsis to the target" or something like that ?

[soft shale]

idk that leggo is a trash fire

[tribal marlin]

yeah deffo, even if it works the busted way well ... it would be poor designed busted shit xD

[hollow river]

Woah 3 slots?

[tribal marlin]

3 slots ?

[hollow river]

For leggos

[tribal marlin]

Oh for leggo, idk doomblade is still hands/shoulder, I hope they will change this soon

[hollow river]

Where did they say it was gonna be 3

[soft shale]

many legendaries have gotten a 3rd slot

[hollow river]

On PTR?

[tribal marlin]

btw https://i.imgur.com/U928ior.png is busted as well

On PTR the only one that have 3rd slots are the generals ones (cross class)

[hollow river]

Also are there now more than unholy/frost/blood gems?

[tribal marlin]

Seems like you can only wear 5 gems i.e. all 3 "damage" gem + 2 qol gem (speed / heal stuff) to get the bonus set

[hollow river]

Right I knew that

[tribal marlin]

Unless you have a legendary that take a gem slot xD

[hollow river]

I saw something ^ about shadow

When I scrolled up

Idk I can’t wait for 9.1 I don’t think doomblade will make much of a difference tbh

Probably gonna use deathspike the majority of the time anyway

[gloomy fern]

[soft shale]

dashing also has stonks with more crit but doomblade is really powerful anyway

[tribal marlin]

Well if Doomblade make giving up on one of the 3 damage Gem

It substantially decrease its value

😦

[frail fossil]

the ST focused spec will mostly use a legendary that is a 0 st gain i see ok ok makes sense

[quasi grotto]

Question about zol legendary for SLG. I don't have the memory until that wing opens up ( didn't think it was recommended for the fight till I got there. Ooops)
But is the dps difference noticeable? Or hinder the raid without it. May jot get it in time

[balmy condor]

uh sir actually we get 2 extra spikes across the entire fight that's at least 5 dps

[frail fossil]

u can run twisting corridor to get memories not matter the week

[balmy condor]

^

[frail fossil]

what is this cheap really emote

[balmy condor]

[lean coral]

https://ptr.wowhead.com/news/sylvanas-raid-dagger-receives-unique-effect-banshees-blight-322668 pog

[hollow river]

Hmm no aoe fights in the game eh?

[tribal marlin]

Oh so that dagger effect is New

I tought I was just getting out of my cave when I saw it since I was away recently

[frail fossil]

are aoe fights a "majority of the time" ?

cuz u said we'll use deathspike a majority of the time

[hollow river]

Maybe for me they are?

Jesus Christ

[frail fossil]

[balmy condor]

leave some aoe fights for the rest of us

sheeeeesh

[hollow river]

Did I say anything about everyone else using it the majority of the time?

Or that it’s just gonna be better the majority of the time?

No

[balmy condor]

I mean that just seems like a really niche semantic to argue

[tribal marlin]

Hehe that's a big question. To answer you gotta ask you multiple other question.
How ST is important in X fight / in the Raid.
How AoE is important in X fight / in the Raid. (One fight can have AoE that can be done passively without having to build for it).
Are you good at AoE ? Is optimising for AoE makes you significatively better than other class at doing AoE in this particular fight ?

[frail fossil]

u never said anything abt it being a personnal choice to u, so we should've just guessed u live in an alternate reality where 8/10 raid fights are aoe ?

[balmy condor]

if I were to say "probably gonna use dashing all the time"

I would be quoted on that shit

for weeks

[hollow river]

Because you’re you.

[frail fossil]

if u were to say "i'll mostly run deathspike cuz i mostly do mythic+" that would be a fine statement

[balmy condor]

why does my personal opinion matter more than yours

[hollow river]

“Community figure”

writes the scriptures

[balmy condor]

I'm a community figure because I'm helpful and have a lot of numbers, not because my opinions are good

[frail fossil]

u said "i dont think doomblade will matter much because (u didn't use "i" or "we")gonna use deathspike most of the time"

[balmy condor]

I don't even raid mythic atm

[hollow river]

I was simply discussing the leggo slots/gems

[balmy condor]

yeah that's fine

[tribal marlin]

Maybe he'll use Deathspike most of the time, because most of the time he's doing content that involve AoE

[frail fossil]

yes that's not what he initially said tho

[balmy condor]

blanket statements usually come across not as a personal opinion

which is why we're having this discussion

that's all

[frail fossil]

^

[hollow river]

🤷

Don’t get why there was rudeness

[tribal marlin]

From what I've seen from the Raid (I did all M testes) there is a lot of AoE to be done, but not all is relevant. Kel'Thuzad is going to be the big padding fight, but there is a big ST burst dps requierement for melee as well

[final star]

The trinket I liked the most is the crit one

[gloomy fern]

[final star]

That gives agi on crit

[small island]

Is there a list of spells which are cloakable in castle nathria? doing my first raid tonight lul

[final star]

It procs out the fucking asshole

[frail fossil]

there wasn't any ?

[balmy condor]

I didn't see anyone being rude, but sorry if it came off that way

[tribal marlin]

Soooo yeah, I'll warn you right now. Kel'Thuzad is an Assa fight (you go down every 2mn, vendetta is insanely important), probably a CT fight because well it doesn't really matter in ST anyway, but definitely not a fight where you want to full commit in AoE 🙂

[final star]

What if

I hit biss

Boss

Boss die

[hollow river]

Picking apart someone’s statement as such, can come across as crass.

[tribal marlin]

Oh an there is a cheese as Assa you can vanish garrote 3 of the tank's add with Subter + Iron Wire and you basically cheese entierely one of the ability

[final star]

You kiss your mother with that mouth

[hollow river]

And I thought you had got into raiding mythic?

[balmy condor]

guild die

[hollow river]

Oh dang

[balmy condor]

need find new guild

[tribal marlin]

I already know I'll have hard time to convice people there exists some AoE fights in the world where Assa > Outlaw .....

[hollow river]

That was fast

[balmy condor]

yeh happens

[frail fossil]

[final star]

If you play mage

Join mine

[hollow river]

Everyone wants warlock, spriest, mage disc priest etc atm

Hardly anyone want rogue

[tribal marlin]

haha they'll change their mind

Rogue looks pretty solid for 9.1 raid tbh

[hollow river]

A lot of guilds already have 1-3 rogues lol

From what I see

[tribal marlin]

Yeah that's the issue with melee in general

Gotta see the damage of that dagger because "X" is yeah ...

but stonks for rogue deffo

[frail fossil]

rogue problem is not necessarily it's strength it's just melee spot are very limited and most will be taken by class bringing raid buffs

[tribal marlin]

Apart from Sylvanas this raid is mostly melee friendly

And we believe Sylvanas will be changed.

Kel Thuzad requiert at least 50% melee / 50 % distance in dps

You can "maybe" substitute melee with BM hunter, but that's the only range that can do the job.

[final star]

Sylvanas was melee friendly

[limber lion]

Fire mage is fine as well

[final star]

Once you understand how she moves

[limber lion]

And Sylvanas was not that bad for melee

It's just p1

[hollow river]

Don’t need any int buffs if you only bring melee

[limber lion]

Also, good morning gamers

[tribal marlin]

Phase 3 is not melee friendly at all, it's even melee prohibed, have you seen the streams ?

[final star]

[tribal marlin]

They basically dumped all melee

They played with litterally 0 melee when they realised it was not possible to bring any melee on this fight

[frail fossil]

we also had a very very limited sight on p3 which is most likely far from being finished

[final star]

I don't think they expected anyone to even get to it

[tribal marlin]

Yeah it's definitely going to change

[ornate lake]

SBS ticks that can crit? Sweeeet

[gloomy fern]

melee

[thin trout]

nice, dagger from sylvanas will be crit/haste with a damage effect

good tier to be a rouge

[gloomy fern]

based on dagger off stats

[thin trout]

yeahp

[balmy condor]

[thin trout]

give a man a fish, he will be happy for a day, give a man a fishing rod, and he will angry because he dont get free fish anymore

[placid dawn]

man, my guild is 200+ pulls into sire

it was supposed to be less pulls than slg

[tulip nacelle]

we had way more pulls on sire than on slg

[frail fossil]

sire is much harder than slg since the nerf

[tulip nacelle]

since slg is heavily nerfed I don't think that less pulls on sire is a thing anymore

[frail fossil]

yeah

[tulip nacelle]

but the sire nerf will help you out now

[placid dawn]

we had a ton of slg pulls

and we started after the nerf

it was actually sorta fun though, didnt dislike the fight

[frail fossil]

yeah and sire is much harder so that's not surprising to take more pulls

[royal lantern]

https://tenor.com/view/anna-lynne-mc-cord-no-haha-no-nope-no-way-gif-4514743

they just more or less reverted the dk nerf btw

unless rogue is litearlly the unbeatable #1 dps spec that pulls insane numbers

it will not be desirable in its current state

[limber lion]

I had 300 wipes on SLG, but killed Sire in 150. It fluctuates guild to guild quite a bit

Some people kill SLG in less than 200 but spend 300 on Sire

[final star]

I mean

Take the player not the class for most guilds

[tulip nacelle]

yeah it should be, not really a thing in practise as far as I've seen

[final star]

Depends if you're trying to get into a guild

[trim plover]

How are things looking in terms of covenant choice for 9.1? Feeling like I need to change now in prep for 9.1

[final star]

Or already have one

[balmy condor]

necro probably

[final star]

[royal lantern]

most guilds SHOULD do that

but dont

[final star]

My guild does that but we're plebs

[royal lantern]

the reality is: if you apply as the "wrong" class, they dont even look at you 99%of the time

[final star]

I mean melee spots are contentious

My guild is looking for 2x range dps of any class if you're decent

So like

There is guilds that don't specify

[trim plover]

Thanks. I figured this was the case but just wanted that extra clarification

[final star]

Most guilds do have a single rogue spot though

Two at a push

[pure moth]

Ive been apping to guilds that say rogue wanted. They respond back and say quite a few rogues are applying. So spots just go quick

[final star]

Yup

It's essentially the same as lfg

You're not the only one

[pure moth]

And i don't exactly have rekills on some later kills, making my experience lacking in comparison. So i won't be first choice.

[tropic ocean]

its a good time to apply though many guilds struggle attendance currently so if you make a good impression on reclear

in eu theres everyday multiple guilds looking for ppl to fill roster(in lfg) for reclear maybe try one of those and if you make good impression they might take you into guild

[exotic rose]

Hey guys, quick question, the top assa rogue on raider.io https://raider.io/characters/us/zuljin/Ryfie#season=season-sl-1 often uses Finality which afaik is only a sub legendary. Is the 25% extra damage on rupture better than say zodyac?

[tropic ocean]

rio is not an accurate representation of what items someone uses

[balmy condor]

he logged out as sub

[tropic ocean]

afaik it crawls from armory what you have equipped

[balmy condor]

you can check the stuff he used by checking a key

[limber lion]

Trust me, the man plays Zoldyck on most keys, Doomblade on ToP/PF

[balmy condor]

the key should be accurate

[exotic rose]

I was checking the key specifically.

[balmy condor]

weird

yeah if it's a sin key, he's taking zoldyck

finality is giga shit

[limber lion]

Could be that he's just messing around and trying different stuff

[balmy condor]

he definitely isn't

[limber lion]

I mean, looking at his halls keys it does show Finality as his lego

[balmy condor]

he's not taking finality into a 24 dude

[limber lion]

Yeah that's what I'm saying

[balmy condor]

you gotta be out of your damn mind to think that

[limber lion]

It's definitely a fuck up in raider.io's part

[limber lion]

.

[exotic rose]

Yeah, I thought it would be a reliable information source.

[balmy condor]

it is if it's reading the log

[limber lion]

You can ask the man yourself in his discord.

[balmy condor]

in this case it isn't

[exotic rose]

Thanks for the input guys, appreciate it.

[balmy condor]

you should check the keys

for the little verified check

in the top left

missing here

shown here

that check means it was read from a log instead of checked from armory

[exotic rose]

Oh! Thanks for that, I didn't know about that feature. 🙏🏼